This episode features Rob's interview with guitarist and songwriter John Kadlecik, who comes roaring out the gate with some strikingly candid commentary on previous songwriter collaborations. John talks about how it feels as though "ancient intelligence" takes over during improvisation, about how while in Furthur he was able to find his space between the approaches of Bob Weir and Phil Lesh (from tempo to touring preferences) and playfully speaks of Mickey Hart "raiding" a Hunter lyric John had put to song. John talks about his early days, particularly one early teacher's response to John's interest in learning how to improvise on violin. He also talks about his various pre-Dark Star Orchestra musical outfits, and some of the decision points behind initially committing his musical life to, and the eventual evolution of DSO. John and Rob move through a ton of topics, spending a bit of time on JK's <em>On The Road</em> release in general, with John shedding particular light on the story behind "The Hanging of John Collins" in particular. We even learn of how John attended Phish's Clifford Ball as a guest of the band's drummer Jon Fishman, of how JK was surprised to learn that his own musical ethos was in some part an echo of that of Bach, about his experience playing Radio City Music Hall with Furthur in the immediate wake of Weir and Lesh learning of the death of "Bear" Owsley and about the time John met John Barlow. The episode ends with a skeletal version of "So Blue" which John wrote with Robert Hunter

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