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Welcome to Satisfaction Factor, the podcast where we explore how ditching diet culture makes our whole lives more satisfying.

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Welcome back to Satisfaction Factor.

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I'm Naomi Katz, an intuitive eating and body image coach.

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I'm Sadie Simpson, a intuitive eating and body image coach.

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I'm Sadie Simpson, a group fitness instructor and personal trainer.

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Before we dig into this week's episode, just a reminder if you'd like to support the show, we have merch.

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We have a handful of designs on TeePublic that can be printed as stickers, t-shirts, sweatshirts, mugs, tote bags and whatever else you like.

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T-shirts and sweatshirts come into sizes up to 5X and you can check that out at the link in our show notes.

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Also just a reminder that if you are looking for support in your anti-diet and intuitive eating work, I have availability for all of my coaching options.

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I have spots available for one-to-one intuitive eating and anti-diet coaching.

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That comes in coaching packages of six, nine or 12 months.

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I offer payment plans and other accessible pricing options.

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Those packages include weekly Zoom calls, voxer messaging, access between calls and copies of the intuitive eating workbook and the your Body Is Not An Apology workbook.

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You can get all the information about that coaching and submit your application at happyshapesco slash coaching.

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I also offer individual pay what you can coaching calls, called mindset reset calls.

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These are individual hour-long calls to discuss specific sticking points without a long-term coaching commitment.

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You can get all the information about that and sign up for a call at happyshapesco slash mindset reset.

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And lastly, I am currently trying to gauge interest for a fall cohort of my group coaching program, nourish and Bloom.

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That's a 40-week group program including weekly written content, monthly group calls, monthly journaling prompts and an online community space.

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You can get all the information about that at happyshapesco slash nourish and bloom waitlist.

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And if you're at all interested, please do get on the waitlist, as that's how I'm going to know if there's enough interest to run that fall cohort.

2:19

Yay, those all sound like amazing options, like you've got a little bit of something for everybody, if they want the one-on-one support or if they are possibly interested in the group or the one-off.

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Like it's great to have options.

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Yeah, I like to have all my bases covered and like all the levels of accessibility covered too, yes.

2:38

Yeah, that's awesome. We are talking about how straight-sized folks can best support and act in allyship with fat folks Good topic.

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So we talk a lot about how this work is like much bigger than how we feel about ourselves and how it has to include work on a societal level, because fat liberation and body liberation are ultimately about making the world safer and more inclusive for all bodies, and that job shouldn't rest solely on the shoulders of the folks who are most impacted by marginalization of bodies.

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So, like, yes, we talk a lot.

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We want fat folks to be able to advocate for themselves.

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That's super important and unfortunately, sometimes society is more willing to hear and respond to advocacy from people who fit their preconceived ideals.

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That's shitty and it's not fair and it's terrible, but it's also true, and so we really need folks in straight side bodies to help with this and to act in support and allyship and advocacy.

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And so today we want to give you some ideas of how to do that, because it's easy for us to be like do this, but you might not even know where to start.

4:06

Yeah, yeah. Well, it's good again to have some practical ideas, and I feel like a lot of the ideas that we're going to talk about today can possibly spark other ideas for other folks, maybe even things we haven't thought about or things we're not talking about on this episode, or maybe examples other people possibly have or can share.

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If you have examples, you're always welcome to come send us a message on instagram at satisfaction factor pod.

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But this is a good, I feel like conversation to have on a societal level.

4:34

So this is our little corner of society.

4:36

I guess that we can have this conversation I love, I love thinking of this as our little corner of society it's like a society, like like on Bridgerton, like we're going to be out in society.

4:48

Yes, for sure.

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The other thing that I think is important to say before we dig into this is that and we've talked about this before too weight stigma and thin privilege exist on a spectrum, exist on a spectrum and so like, yes, we're saying straight size folks, but what we're really talking about and this is really good advice for smaller fat folks and basically anyone who sits further toward the thin privilege side of the spectrum.

5:15

So like I identify as small fat and absolutely feel like this is advice for me as well.

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Yeah, yeah, cool, let's do it, let's talk about it, let's go through the list.

5:29

Fantastic, we've got 10 things here for you today, cause I like a nice round number list.

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I feel like we've done a few recently that have been like seven or something like that and it's made me really uncomfortable.

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So I'm very happy that we have 10 today, top 10.

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Okay, so number one first and foremost, do your own work on unpacking your anti-fat biases.

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That's the hardest one and the most long term one, but it's also at the top of the list because it is absolutely the most important and most impactful thing.

6:08

If you have terrible feelings about fat on your own body, you are definitely projecting that outward in some way or another.

6:18

Aubrey Gordon talks about this all the time.

6:23

Your fat friends know how you feel about fatness, even if you think you're just directing it at yourself.

6:31

But yeah, if you hold negative feelings toward fat bodies, even your own, your fat friends and family know If being fat is your greatest fear and you're working to avoid it for yourself at all costs.

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There is no way that the fat people in your life don't know that their bodies are your nightmare and that's not good, like they know that you are not a safe person for their bodies and their lived experiences and stuff like that.

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So this is important because you have to start there.

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So doing the work to unpack and to let go of your own biases is going to minimize the harm that you do to fat folks, which you are doing, even if inadvertently, like nobody's, saying you're maliciously out there like making fat people feel bad and doing harm.

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But the reality is that if you are not a safe person for your own body, you're probably not a safe person for other people's bodies either.

7:43

Is it going to erase that harm or entirely prevent it?

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Probably not. I don't think there's really a way to do that.

7:51

Like, we all are going to do harm somewhere along the line, but it is going to minimize it.

7:57

It's going to help you to understand why things are harmful when somebody does bring it to your attention, and it's also going to help you understand why all the other stuff on this list is so necessary.

8:09

So, like this is, it's a place to start, but it's not the kind of thing where, like, you have to finish this part before you do anything else on the list.

8:18

This is something to do alongside everything else on the list.

8:23

Basically, yeah, yeah, if this was like a chart.

8:26

You would have this number, one thing, and then, everything else would like branch off the side and the nice little tree pattern or something I don't know.

8:33

Yeah, absolutely. And, um, you know you, it doesn't have to start with like you don't have to dive into like therapy or coaching or something like that.

8:43

Maybe at some point, that is something you want to pursue.

8:45

You can start with like reading books.

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Aubrey Gordon has two that are fantastic.

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Check those out. You know, your Body Is Not An Apology is an excellent book.

8:55

You can read the intuitive eating book, but I don't actually know how super important that is for this particular task.

9:02

There's tons of books on fat liberation, body liberation, anti-diet Anti-Diet by Christy Harrison is an excellent book to check out.

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There's, you know, you can start with things that feel approachable and just sort of crack your mind open a little bit and then start looking at maybe some of the more the deeper work of like coaching or something like that Thing.

9:30

Two, don't talk about your diet, your body size, etc.

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And shut down that kind of talk around you whenever possible.

9:39

Ooh, this is like a two-parter, yeah.

9:42

So here's the thing. Ooh, this is like a two-parter, yeah. So here's the thing, even if you are still doing the work and you still have some feelings about your own body and all of that stuff, frankly, even if you are still pursuing weight loss for yourself, you don't have to talk about it, yep, especially to or around the fat folks in your life.

10:08

We have talked about this before. Like body autonomy is everything. Like it is the root of all of this.

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So do what you feel is best for yourself, no judgment.

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But talking about it, especially without consent, is not a neutral or autonomous act.

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Consent is not a neutral or autonomous act, and so that's the part that we're talking about here.

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Like, ideally, it would be amazing if you did the work and got to the place where you also wanted to give up dieting and made peace with your body and all of that stuff.

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But even if that's not where you're at, you don't have to talk about it.

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And beyond your own diet and body talk, you can be the one to change the topic when it comes up in groups, rather than letting that responsibility fall to the person in the group who is maybe most harmed or most vulnerable to that conversation and, because society is what it is, would also probably be the most likely to be judged for changing the topic away from that.

11:08

So, like you, be that person, don't make them be that person yeah, well, this is something I mean.

11:14

This comes up probably on a weekly basis in in all of my jobs, in any group fitness class, sometimes in in personal training, depending on the scenario, but especially in a group class where there's different personalities, different viewpoints on bodies and body size and all that sort of thing.

11:35

But like it is definitely become a common practice for me to redirect conversations in group classes and not all the time, but in a lot of scenarios it's a good opportunity to just kind of throw in a little bit of education about, especially around movement as it is related to, like, body size and body size change and things like that.

11:56

But definitely redirection is is uh, it's my go-to, because a lot of times, like we're getting ready to start class and then somebody comes in and is like I started the whole 30 or whatever you know something, something, just out of nowhere, and it's like, okay, let's turn that music on and we're just going to get started, people.

12:15

Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I am sure that you deal with this all the time and it's a really good reminder that this works on a personal and professional level.

12:24

Like this like maybe you're like in your office in the break room and somebody starts talking about diet or bodies or whatever.

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Like maybe you're a teacher, it's like back to school time and like the kids in your class are starting to talk about this stuff.

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Like maybe you're a personal trainer.

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Like there's just there's a lot of contexts where this stuff Like um, maybe you're a personal trainer. Like there's just there's a lot of contexts where this works.

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And PS, we have multiple episodes all about strategies for disrupting diet talk.

12:56

So, um, definitely like, go ahead and listen to those episodes to help you do this part.

13:04

Yeah Well, I will say like I've also talked to folks that have listened to some of those episodes or maybe have done their own work, kind of outside of listening to the podcast, but other body liberation, anti-diet based work and folks have shared with me stories, though of how they have done this, like how they've been in conversations with their families or friends or coworkers or whatever.

13:24

How they've been in conversations with their families or friends or coworkers or whatever and they've been able to be the person to kind of change the subject or to redirect or whatever, and it just it feels really cool to be able to have conversations like that with other people.

13:35

So also on that note too, like if you're able to find other folks to kind of to share your wins, so to speak, is nice, because we don't often get a chance to have wins.

13:46

It's not like we're sharing like oh, I lost 50 pounds weight loss win situation, it's like the opposite of that so we have, if we have some sort of community and somewhere in some way to to discuss these topics is very helpful for sure, which you can always come and send us a message on Instagram and we will cheer you on for sure.

14:04

We will.

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Okay, action number three speak up when people say derogatory things about fatness, about fat people.

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Maybe that's jokes, maybe that's like outright malicious stuff, but regardless, speak up.

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One Like you.

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Be the one to say something like this is super, and this is incredibly important, even if there are no fat people around when it happens.

14:42

Right, because it perpetuates harmful stereotypes and misinformation.

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If you wouldn't stay silent when you hear somebody say something racist, don't stay silent when you hear something say something racist.

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Don't stay silent when you hear something somebody say something fat phobic, it's, it's the.

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The reason you wouldn't stay silent for one is exactly the same reason why you shouldn't stay silent for the other, because these are both like issues of systemic oppression, and these comments uphold that.

15:14

I like to think of it like how you said even if somebody in a bigger body is not in the room and somebody's making like snide comments, like imagine that somebody is, imagine that your friend who might be in a bigger body is there like would you want somebody to say something like that in front of your friend?

15:30

No, you would not want that to happen. So like, if it helps to kind of imagine something like, that helps me a lot.

15:37

Like if I'm in situations where it's maybe straight size, smaller people all in a room, maybe somebody makes a joke or something like that, to be like, oh my god, if they said that in front of so-and-so, I would, I would be livid, so right yes, and that's the thing is, like I don't care if I'm one-on-one with somebody like no, like that's not okay.

15:59

I'm gonna say something, and there's a lot of ways to handle that too.

16:02

Again, like, feel free to check out our past episodes.

16:05

One technique that I've really that I've seen a lot online lately that I really really like is asking them to explain why, like for a joke, for instance, to explain why it's funny.

16:18

Right, it's not something I've ever thought about, but it makes so much sense because, like, having to like put into words why this like horribly offensive joke is funny is going to like trip them up, especially because, again, like maybe this is naive, but I actually don't think it is.

16:45

I even people who are making jokes like this I don't think are doing it to intentionally be malicious.

16:51

Like I don't think they understand the systemic oppression part of this, the bias, the discrimination, like I think there's a lot of layers that they don't understand about it and I think sometimes don't even really understand how harmful the joke is.

17:11

But then you go to make them explain it and like that's going to be really uncomfortable and it's going to make them realize how offensive it is too yeah, that's a really neat technique because it's almost like a.

17:27

It turns it back on the other person and kind of makes them start to consider oh why am I saying this?

17:32

Am I just repeating it because somebody else said it, like whatever.

17:36

Yeah, and it's like it's not quite as confrontational as being like don't say that, which is fine, like I'm also fine with don't say that, but like it can also, just like you can kind of play dumb a little, you can be like I don't get that.

17:53

Can you explain it to me? Like why is that funny?

17:55

like you can kind of play dumb a little you can be like I don't get that.

17:58

Can you explain it to me? Like why is that funny? I like this.

18:01

I'm like jotting notes right now. I think that's a great technique, as always, I love options that like take into account people's abilities and preferences and communication styles and stuff like that, and so like, yeah, that was one that I really enjoyed.

18:13

Action number four send emails to people like to both tell them if their spaces are not inclusive and also thank you emails when they do provide particularly inclusive spaces amen, amen.

18:31

Like we love a good complaint letter, we love a good negative comment card, but we also love a positive.

18:37

Like we never it just in general.

18:40

We is like the universal we never did.

18:43

I say universal we. We never get like public compliments, like Google reviews or Yelp reviews or whatever.

18:51

Like heck yes, I love that Totally, that totally.

18:53

It's so funny. I've been sending emails about like lack of inclusivity for years, but I actually never thought to send positive feedback about inclusivity until a friend mentioned it like a couple weeks ago, that she does that and I was like, oh, like I love that like we've learned for years that positive reinforcement is more productive than negative, so like, let's keep reinforcing the good.

19:20

Totally. You know.

19:22

I also like I put this action item on here as send emails.

19:26

What it really is is give feedback. Personally, I like doing this in email format because I am pretty conflict avoidant and anxious, so like saying something in person does horrible things to like my adrenaline and my nervous system, like I'll be sweating for days.

19:45

My heart rate will not like return to normal for a week, like it's bad.

19:49

But an email is so easy, like everywhere has contact forms online, like so it's not even like you have to have a person to contact.

19:59

If you do, that's great, because that's probably going to get eyes better than just through a contact form.

20:04

But even a contact form is like something right.

20:07

The other thing is I personally like to phrase this as like I know that you want to serve as many people as possible.

20:17

I know that you want to foster an inclusive environment.

20:20

I know that you want to do this, so here's a way that you could be doing that more, so that like it kind of assumes positive intention rather than just like criticizing.

20:32

Yeah, I like that, and like I, I like that and like, I feel like people I don't know I feel like people respond better, if you're like, assuming positive intent on their end like and like because what are they gonna say?

20:47

Like oh no, actually I don't, I don't care about inclusivity.

20:50

Like that's not nobody, like people are gonna feel weird saying that.

20:55

I think a lot of this is just make people feel weird.

20:57

So they do what you want.

20:58

But not really Very bad consent stuff.

21:06

It's not that and yeah, it's truly.

21:12

It's not about manipulating people, but it is about doing things in a way where people are going to be more open to hearing what you're saying, to accepting the feedback that you're giving, and so, starting at a place where you're assuming positive intent is helpful, it like couches it in a positive light instead of just like criticism which people can like just shut down.

21:38

Yeah for sure. Um, action five decline being weighed at the doctor unless it's absolutely necessary.

21:47

Um, we've talked about this a million times.

21:50

We've done entire episodes about like medical stuff.

21:54

Definitely go check out out the Reagan Chastain episode for like how to go about dealing with this stuff.

22:02

In a perfect world, it wouldn't matter if we got weight or not.

22:04

Like weight could just be like a neutral piece of data that was collected but didn't impact anything.

22:11

But that's not the case. Weight is treated like the deciding factor in how most people are medically treated, which literally has life and death impact, mostly for folks in larger bodies, primarily for folks in larger bodies, but honestly for all of us in some way or another.

22:30

So the more we can push back against the idea that weight is a relevant measurement that needs to be taken at every medical encounter, the better that's going to be for everyone.

22:42

Which means, even if you personally are totally okay with seeing or knowing your weight, which is great, good for you.

22:52

Again, like, ideally, that would be a neutral thing that we'd all be fine with, even if you're in a straight sized body and it's very unlikely that your doctor is going to make criticisms or, you know, misdiagnose or you know recommend weight loss as a solution.

23:13

Like, even if all of that is true, you're doing something good by declining to be weight, because it sends a message, it disrupts the status quo and when straight-sized folks do it, it also, again, unfortunately, can carry more weight.

23:32

No pun intended, but because it's not going to be dismissed.

23:38

The same way that it might be dismissed if somebody in a larger body declines to be weighed, where, like, that can be written off as like, oh, that person feels ashamed of their weight, that person is emotional, that person is irrational, that person is self-destructive, like, whatever.

23:54

It's just it's not going to be framed that way when a person in a smaller body declines to be weighed.

24:01

So it just it's a good thing to do as a practice when, again, when it's not medically necessary, which sometimes it is Okay.

24:11

Action six shop at places that have inclusive sizing, like, obviously, folks in larger bodies don't really have a choice about this one, but that's what makes it such a great act of allyship for folks in smaller bodies.

24:25

Like corporations don't do things out of the goodness of their hearts, they do things to make money.

24:32

They do things to make money. So if we all started shopping only at places with inclusive sizing, there would be a financial impact, yes, and there would be like financial motivation for these brands to offer more inclusive sizing.

24:50

And just like I want to say side note, but it's actually not a side note, it is literally the point of this action.

24:57

Item 3X is not all that inclusive.

25:00

I feel like it's a bare minimum, like it's better than nothing, but it leaves a lot of folks out, especially if sizing runs small, which a lot of places do, yes, run small, which a lot of places do yes, like I can wear a 2x from some places, which means that, like there are a lot of people who can't shop there at all.

25:27

Nope, um and like, honestly, even in places where I wear a like a 1x, which is like more standard, that's still like a 3X is just not enough of a range.

25:37

So, and especially because, like, the average size of like is like a US 16, 18, which is a 1X usually, sometimes a 1X is like a 14, 16, again because sizes are weird and sometimes they run smaller or whatever, but the point is like that's average and so if you only go up to a 3X, that's not a good size range.

26:04

Yeah, um, but 3x, I feel like, is like a bare minimum yeah um, but I hate when places are like where's clothing for all bodies?

26:18

we stop at a 3x and it's like no, you're not.

26:21

Like I've seen worse, but like this is definitely not all bodies.

26:25

Um, so yeah, like, even if you personally can shop anywhere if you have the means, because sometimes places with inclusive sizing are more expensive not always, but sometimes if you have the means, put that money into a place that has inclusive sizing leads kind of directly to action number seven, which is support fat businesses, fat media, like fat everything.

26:57

Basically, you know, buy things from fat creators, watch tv and movies with fat characters, especially fat leads, when you can find them.

27:06

Read books with fat main characters.

27:09

Like, show them, jerry, my my like 90s kid is coming out, but so I want to jerry mcguire this.

27:18

Show them the money. But like literally, like put the money in the hands of fat people.

27:26

And also show networks, production companies, like publishers, like all of these people, that there is money in positive portrayals of fat characters.

27:40

Um, it's similar to like, you know, the whole thing used to be like oh, there's no money in movies about women, there's no money in women's sports, and like, more and more, the public proved that wrong, yep, and so now we're getting more of those things and this is the same thing.

28:04

Okay, action number eight Don't sit in the armless chairs.

28:09

I feel like an umbrella thing like this is an example of like a much bigger thing.

28:14

But so, specifically, armless chairs, most places have very limited seating for folks in larger bodies.

28:20

Obviously, that's the larger like systemic problem and that's why what we talked about earlier, about like giving feedback, sending emails, is so important.

28:30

But there's like the systemic side of things and the personal side of things, and so this is a personal action we can take to make sure that those limited seats are available for the people who actually need them.

28:42

I don't know, at some point I don't know, maybe a couple of years ago I started to notice that I'd go into usually in a doctor's office, like waiting room that there'd be like a handful of chairs that were big enough to accommodate larger bodies, which great, and I would go in and like 90% of the time, there was some skinny person sitting in these chairs.

29:05

That sounds derogatory. It was more just that, like in the moment, I was like why there's like an entire waiting room of chairs that you could easily comfortably sit in.

29:15

What was it that made you choose the one chair that would be accessible for somebody in a larger body, when you obviously do not need that?

29:26

Yeah, I feel like people are just oblivious, they just don't think.

29:31

Well and.

29:31

I can even think the last time we went to the pediatrician's office cause there's even different size chairs like the like kind of a double chair, single chair, armless chairs, arm chairs even in the pediatrician's office, and I remember my kid went and sat in like this bigger kind of double chair, and he was like, oh, this is this one's more like a couch I can lay down.

29:51

I was like no, let. And he's like, oh, this is this one's more like a couch I can lay down.

29:54

I was like no, let's just come over here and you sit in this chair and I'll sit in this chair Like it's.

29:58

You know, I didn't get into details with him in the moment, but I feel like as he gets older and is more aware, like that's a great opportunity to talk to my child about this as we're going into the doctor's office, because he like immediately was drawn to this larger chair and I was like that's not for you, son yeah, absolutely.

30:12

Um, first of all, I love that you did that and like, yeah, like when you're, when it's like a child, maybe that's not like in the moment at the doctor's office, like maybe that's not the time to have the big conversation, but like it does it, you still handled it.

30:27

And like later you can have a conversation about it.

30:30

Like absolutely, I am listen.

30:34

I don't want to be like I understand that.

30:37

Like we can't always see the reasons why people need accommodations, like a need for an armless chair or a larger chair outside of like body size, but that doesn't mean there isn't one.

30:57

So like I'm not saying like don't walk up to people in the office and be like, get out of that chair.

31:03

You don't know what people are, what people are dealing with.

31:07

It's the same as like don't harass people in.

31:09

Like you know disabled parking spots. Like because you don't know, you don't know why they're there.

31:14

Like just don't do that. But you personally can make a choice about not participating in that behavior.

31:22

Yeah, well, I think that that also opens up the idea and the conversation of being mindful of accessibility needs in general and public.

31:29

Like thinking about bathroom stalls and sink accessibility, parking situations and even when you're going somewhere with your friends.

31:39

Like not squishing three adults, large or small, like not squishing adults together in a seat is going to be uncomfortable, but also being mindful of people's body sizes.

31:50

But even thinking about, like whenever we're going on group trips or we're going on hangouts with people and we're carpooling, considering, maybe asking our friends maybe we have friends in bigger bodies, maybe they're more comfortable driving their own vehicle, maybe they want to be the driver for the other folks.

32:07

Or like offering the passenger seat to people instead of again like just trying to make people uncomfortable in a vehicle that they are not not comfortable in.

32:17

Yeah, absolutely. This is kind of why I said it was like the umbrella problem from like a bigger conversation, because, yes, like it's absolutely like, there's a lot of examples of the same dynamic where it's like you can you can be aware of the fact that other bodies might need different accommodations.

32:38

Right, um, I love what you brought up about parking like that's the other, like when you go to park, park in the center of the parking spot so there is room on either side.

32:52

Parking lots for folks in larger bodies can be really tricky and not great anyway, because a lot of parking spots are very narrow and the cars are close together.

33:02

But when people park stupidly and carelessly and right on the line, it makes it practically impossible.

33:10

You're literally trapping people in their cars or just making it so that there isn't a parking spot for them Because, like they probably know, oh I can't park in the spot next to that person.

33:21

But like what if they're already parked and you come and park, you know, right up next to them and now they can't get into their car?

33:29

Like be mindful of this stuff.

33:32

Like it's honestly what it really comes down to is just being mindful of the ways that the world is not built for folks in larger bodies and like be and and taking whatever actions you can to minimize that.

33:47

I feel like this is our one and only opportunity to capitalize on like a viral trend.

33:51

But we can be demure and we can be mindful about our surroundings.

33:58

Very demure, very mindful, not sitting in the armless chairs.

34:01

Right Action nine builds right on top of this one, which is thinking about your fat friend's comfort when you go places Seating, accessibility, sizing, things like that.

34:16

So like you be the one to tell the host at the restaurant that you want a table instead of a booth.

34:22

Like you call the theater to see what the seat sizes are and whether there's any accessible seating.

34:28

You get online and see what the layout and the seating at the bar and the restaurant is like before suggesting it as a hangout.

34:35

Like you make sure the stores you're visiting on your shopping day carry their sizes.

34:40

This one's a little tricky, but whenever possible, make sure the furniture in your house has inclusive weight limits so they don't have to worry about that when they come visit.

34:51

That is very hard because weight limits on on affordable furniture are not great and like and furniture is super expensive.

35:01

So like. This one is like a when you can, when at least, at least keep it in mind while you're shopping.

35:08

But like it's hard and like and like.

35:10

That's just. That is a systemic problem that is not necessarily yours to solve.

35:15

So it's just a do what you can, but ultimately, like fat folks do so much labor to research this stuff before going places.

35:25

So like help them out, like share some of that burden, like the fact that they are the ones most impacted by this doesn't mean that they should also carry all the labor of it.

35:38

And actually looking into this stuff and planning for it and taking it into consideration is going to show them that you see them and you care about them and, like all of that stuff, that they're not an afterthought and that you understand some of their lived experiences, and that's huge.

36:00

Well, and this happens quite a bit also in my personal training sessions and in group classes but being more mindful of like words that I'm choosing to say that feels more comfortable for people.

36:12

Not only that, but like equipment use, like when I'm thinking of certain pieces of equipment, some things just aren't going to work for certain bodies, like barbell deadlifts, for example.

36:23

Sometimes if people have a bigger belly that maybe sticks out more towards the front, it is not going to be that comfortable for some body types to do to conventional deadlifts with a barbell.

36:34

Or maybe, like we need to readjust somebody's stance or we need to choose something different, like dumbbells or kettlebells or different things like that.

36:41

But definitely being more mindful of that in a fitness scenario has been, like, very, very important for my work, for sure, but not only that, like being considerate of equipment and being an advocate for that, like whenever I know that the gym is considering purchasing new treadmills or bikes or ellipticals or whatever.

37:05

Like reminding people like let's check the weight capacities of these things because we need to be able to serve lots of different body sizes on this equipment yeah, that is huge and like honestly it's so.

37:18

Like, on a personal note, it's something that I continue to be very frustrated with in the pilates world, because it is just amazing how often things are cued in a way that like does not accommodate for having a belly like at all and like how often it's like, and it's cute in a way where it's like it's not a suggestion and it's not like a there's no alternative cuing or anything like that.

37:46

It's just like this very specific, like regimented way of cuing things and it's like I know better.

37:53

So I still do what I need to do for my body, but like there are other people in this class who might not know that, so yeah, ps, uh, I can.

38:04

Lindsay, who is fat body Pilates on Instagram, does workshops like every few months on, like making Pilates queuing and like equipment modifications for fat bodies.

38:20

So like, if any Pilates instructors are listening to this, definitely go follow her, definitely take those workshops because it's a practice making those adjustments, and so like having much like this episode, like having somebody to be like okay, cause you might even.

38:36

Like your intent is there. Like you want to create an inclusive environment but you don't necessarily know what's inclusive and not inclusive, or like how to go about doing that.

38:45

So like, let somebody teach you.

38:47

Yeah, yeah. Well, that's really important and even I mean this applies specifically to teaching a fitness class scenario, but I feel like it could be replicated in other areas but like being able to change the plan that you have in your brain, like not only in a fitness situation, but like going out with friends or choosing a different restaurant or whatever, like you may have a set plan and once you get there it might not be the right plan.

39:15

So being able to be flexible because I know there was one time I had a plan to use a couple of different balls, like the big stability, like the big yoga balls, and then even like the smaller, like squishy Pilates balls in a class and it was not accessible for people and slash or it freaked people out Like people were, even if they were maybe at the cusp of the weight capacity of the ball.

39:40

They were like, fortunately, verbally told me they're like I'm scared, I'm going to pop this ball and I'm like we can change the plan.

39:47

But kind of being more mindful of that on the front end can save people like stress from having to tell me that they're that on the front end, can save people like stress from having to tell me that they're afraid that the ball may pop or something like that, and that may, you know, be helpful for other people in the class too.

40:00

Absolutely and like, on the one hand, like don't assume people's abilities, but on the other hand, when like, like if you can anticipate some of that stuff, so that they don't have to say, like I'm afraid I'm going to pop this ball, or like again, I'm afraid I'm going to break your couch, or like something like that, that's nice.

40:24

That's nice to do for people.

40:25

Yeah, having said that, that kind of brings us to our action number 10, which is ask your fat friends and family what they need.

40:36

Yes, just ask people.

40:38

Like it is. It's actually okay, like I know you don't want the burden to be on them to like educate you or and we do want to take the burden off them to do the endless research and like all of this stuff.

40:50

We do want to try and anticipate some of the stuff.

40:52

That's like more obvious, that we know, but like it's also okay to say, hey, what do you need from me?

41:00

Like what can I do to make this easier for you, to make this better for you, to support you, like that's a beautiful thing to do for somebody.

41:08

I think so too, and I love this. One like this is my favorite one of all of them, because I feel like we tend to be afraid that we're going to offend somebody, that if we ask them what they need, but it's like it's literally not offensive.

41:22

We have this fear that we're going to make somebody uncomfortable and it's the opposite.

41:27

Like anytime I have ever done this, it has literally been the exact opposite of being offensive is made people feel more comfortable, more heard, more respected.

41:36

It's. It's been a great situation every time.

41:39

So just just ask people.

41:40

Yeah, totally. I agree, like on the when people have asked me what I need for things, it's like I'm terrible at answering, but I also like feel very cared for and, like you know, and again like respected, heard all of that scene, all of that stuff, and it's like that's, that's really nice and it's also just like, again, it's just like an acknowledgement of live, of their lived experience.

42:07

It's just like letting them know that you know that like shit is hard.

42:14

Yes, yeah.

42:16

Right, like, and that you are, like, willing and able to share that burden with them or, like you know, share some of the work of making things less hard.

42:27

Yeah, that's, that's a big deal for people.

42:31

So, yeah, like, that's finally like actually talk to and communicate with your friends and family.

42:38

A million other things that could go on this list but, again, I like a nice round number.

42:45

But if you listen to this, if you are in a larger body and there are other things that you wish that your friends, your family that, like people in smaller bodies would do to like, help, support you, to act in allyship, send us a message, let us know.

43:09

We will share it on instagram. And, like you know, let people know.

43:13

If you are a person in a smaller body who does things to support and act on the allyship that's not on this list, send a message, let us know.

43:24

We will share it on instagram. Like, I would love for people to have more resources of like where to start and what to do with this stuff.

43:34

Awesome. Well, Naomi, what's satisfying for you right now?

43:37

This is so ridiculous. But here's what's satisfying me right now Calvin Klein came out with their 2024 campaign and it's Jeremy Allen White again, and I just I'm very happy, I'm very happy about it.

43:52

There's even a dog in some of the pictures, and it's just. I just I'm very happy, I'm very happy. There's even a dog in some of the pictures, and it's just.

43:56

I mean, is there anything better? Like no, I'm.

43:59

This is my summer made. It's good.

44:02

That's a. That's a pretty good one right there.

44:06

What is satisfying for you right now.

44:08

Recently I had a birthday and my mom got me a very exciting birthday present.

44:15

She got me, like one of these massive tubs of cookie dough from Sam's Club for part of my birthday present and I'm like what?

44:24

That's the perfect birthday present for me. And I can eat some of the cookie dough and I can make some cookies and they just keep on coming.

44:30

So that has been a very satisfying gift for me.

44:34

First of all, I was totally. My first question was going to be whether you bake the cookies or eat the cookie dough.

44:38

So I love that you do.

44:40

My second question is what kind of cookie dough?

44:43

Oh?

44:43

chocolate chip like just good old fashioned chip.

44:45

Pillsbury chocolate chip cookie dough.

44:47

Awesome. I love that.

44:50

That is a really good birthday gift.

44:52

It is. It is a very good gift.

44:54

The gift that keeps on giving until we run out of cookie dough.

44:57

Right, but then you can get more and it's fine.

45:01

Well, if you enjoyed this episode, be sure to leave us a rating and review on Apple podcasts or Spotify.

45:06

Those ratings and reviews help us reach more people and it just helps get the anti-diet message out into the world.

45:13

We are also on Instagram at satisfaction factor pod.

45:18

That's it for us this week.