Garen Van de Beek and Lori Shefa worked together for 23 years marketing and promoting hit shows at CBS. When both were leaving the company last spring, they decided they would prefer not to leave each other. So they launched new agency RM 15 (pronounced “room 15”) after the basement office they shared for years at CBS TV City in Los Angeles. Van de Beek and Shefa have a lot to say about the business of marketing network TV and about the changes that have arrived due to digital and streaming.

In this fun and wide-ranging conversation, they also reveal a few other nuggets, such as “what those digital people whose offices were on the roof of CBS doing for all those years” and “why showrunners and network executives should first talk to the marketing people before naming their shows.” (Looking at you, The Good Wife. Great show, less great title.) Tune in to this episode to hear more tidbits drawn from the more than 50 years of experience shared by these two pros.