0:00

All right , everybody , welcome to another episode

0:03

of Lonely Wrist . So

0:05

today it is just half of the Lonely

0:07

Wristers and we have Braavur

0:10

showing up from Sweden . Introduce yourself

0:12

, guys .

0:14

Yeah , hello , nice to be here . My

0:16

name is Magnus Eppelried . I'm

0:19

one of the founders of the brand .

0:22

Yes , and I'm Johan Salin

0:25

, and I'm also one of the

0:27

founders and owner of Bravo

0:29

.

0:30

So nice to be here . Thank you for coming

0:32

. I'm glad you guys showed up in numbers . This is the

0:34

first ever . Usually

0:36

it's me and Justin interviewing people , but now you

0:39

guys are showing up with strength in numbers , so

0:41

it's kind of awesome .

0:42

Yeah , we're outnumbering you right now

0:45

, yeah yeah , that's , all right , so yeah

0:47

, nice to be here that might compensate

0:50

for our english then , uh

0:52

you guys , yeah , all right I'm sure we

0:55

always say that we were .

0:56

We're very jealous about people

0:58

having english as their mother

1:01

tongue . It's so much easier , but we'll try

1:03

our best to express ourselves

1:05

anyway you guys are

1:07

doing fine .

1:08

So I obviously we met before we met in

1:10

, yeah , in california , and that

1:12

was when I was exposed to to your brand

1:14

and I I think you guys have really

1:16

something special . So , thank

1:19

you , the honor is mine as well to

1:21

for you guys to be hosted here , so what

1:23

was that ?

1:24

the first time you saw our brand

1:26

or did it was , it was so

1:29

like there's a huge problem with America

1:32

.

1:32

Um , obviously for

1:34

the there's a huge micro brand scene , like everybody

1:36

wants something unique on their wrist

1:38

.

1:38

Yeah .

1:39

And so the only outlet that you guys really

1:41

have to to get your watches

1:43

in front of people's eyes is events

1:46

like wind up and events like intersect

1:48

, where , where you know , micro

1:50

brands will show up , showcase their portfolio

1:53

, I mean , and it's really hard

1:55

for us to to like blindly

1:57

purchase something . Um

2:00

, there's kind of what we call like an

2:02

effort number here in america , um

2:05

, and that depends on on different

2:07

you know , different custom , like different

2:09

, different people . But you

2:12

know , for me , it's really hard for me to spend

2:14

more than 500 without I , without

2:16

me even seeing a watch in person , you know

2:18

so . If it's 500 or below , um

2:21

, you know so . Unfortunately

2:23

, that leaves you guys kind of in this weird little like

2:26

mark , because most of your watches , I think they

2:28

start at like 800 and go up to like three . You know

2:30

around 3000 . So yeah , it leaves

2:32

you guys in this weird little like like

2:35

pocket , you know yeah , and

2:37

that's why the wind-up events are so

2:39

great .

2:39

I think we we usually come

2:42

to the San Francisco event and and also

2:44

the New York event , and it's it's

2:46

a fantastic opportunity

2:50

for people to to see the watches

2:52

live from a lot , a lot

2:54

, a lot of brands , of course .

2:55

So I was looking for you guys . So I was at

2:58

Chicago this past year

3:00

and . I was like I was looking for you guys here

3:02

. I didn't see you guys , unfortunately . No

3:04

, no , and I was like I was looking for you guys here I didn't see you guys

3:06

, unfortunately no , no um , but but no , I think I think san

3:08

francisco and , uh

3:10

, in new york are great , great little events and

3:13

I I really hope that they'll do something here

3:16

, because I live in las vegas , so

3:18

las vegas is is a huge , huge

3:20

, huge watch community . Um

3:22

, you know , so I'm working

3:24

, like after I have a brand that comes on , they'll

3:27

come on and say , hey , like what can we do to get involved

3:29

in the vegas scene ? Like we want to come to vegas , like

3:31

we want people to get our watches on their wrists in

3:33

vegas , like what can we do ? Yeah

3:35

, and we're , you know , we're working

3:37

on creating a platform for

3:40

for brands like you to to

3:42

be able to showcase your watches in vegas

3:44

so stay tuned for that .

3:47

yeah , for sure . Also

3:49

, we uh really noticed

3:51

that the micro brand scene or the or

3:53

the micro brand community in us

3:56

is really strong compared to

3:58

europe . I mean , we don't have

4:01

any bigger fairs

4:03

in Europe to participate

4:05

in . We had like one smaller

4:07

one in Stockholm this

4:09

autumn , which was great , and

4:11

then obviously I have the big ones in Switzerland

4:13

, but otherwise we

4:16

have to turn to US to be able

4:18

to participate in a larger micro-brand

4:21

fair , which is kind

4:23

of strange share

4:27

micro brand fair , which is kind of strange .

4:28

Yeah , I think this is a great market to do it in because the watch , the watch scene , is so strong

4:31

here , like everybody is

4:33

so passionate about watches , at least

4:35

within the industry or the scene . The collectors

4:37

there's tons of collectors here . Um

4:40

, there's tons of tons of wealth and

4:42

tons of wealth of

4:44

knowledge

4:46

. People know what they want , people know what they're looking

4:48

for . People can see right through the micro

4:50

brands that aren't doing something unique . They

4:58

can kind of just skip right over them

5:00

and so you have a . It makes it a

5:02

little easier for brands like you who

5:04

are doing something unique , to stand out

5:06

. You know , from other brands that

5:08

are essentially just reissuing

5:11

a vintage diver , or you know taking

5:13

inspiration from the 50s or 60s and

5:16

you know , just creating a whole diver centric portfolio

5:19

where , you know , because that

5:21

is a low hanging fruit , you know , for

5:24

some collectors .

5:24

So yeah

5:27

, I think you guys are in a good spot . Yeah

5:30

, that was a bit . We

5:33

were struggling a bit or a bit hesitant also

5:35

in the start , how it would

5:37

work out to sell products

5:41

that are quite expensive

5:43

after all without

5:47

people having to see them and feel them in the hands . But we were pretty surprised

5:50

that , yeah , it

5:52

works out great . People are getting used to

5:54

buying really expensive stuff

5:56

over over the internet and get

5:59

them shipped , and most

6:01

companies also offer , like free returns

6:03

and we do as well so you can actually

6:05

have a look at the watch and try it on , and

6:08

if you're on a tap with it , you can just

6:10

just ship it back . So it actually works

6:13

quite well , also for a bit

6:15

more expensive watches .

6:18

And we , we , yeah , we , we do . We mainly

6:20

sell abroad as well . We , I mean

6:22

the U ? S is our biggest market , so , um

6:24

, most of our watches are or

6:26

, yeah , almost all the watches

6:29

are , are bought unseen , so

6:31

to speak yeah yeah

6:34

you guys don't have any um like

6:37

retail fronts ?

6:38

do you like any brick and mortars ? Is it just 100

6:40

online ?

6:42

yeah , basically , basically that

6:45

.

6:45

I think that's the best way to do it , as long as you give

6:47

people the opportunity , the platform which you do , to

6:50

see , try and enjoy your watches

6:53

. What else can us consumers

6:55

ask for ?

6:58

When we started it

7:01

was like 10 , 11

7:03

years ago when we launched our first collection

7:05

then we actually had a few retailers

7:08

we were sold , for instance , at barnes

7:10

in the us which

7:12

were like a great start for us . But

7:15

, yeah , after a few

7:17

years , we took the decision to only sell

7:19

online , both

7:21

to have better control

7:24

over the pricing of

7:26

the watches , but also

7:28

as it takes really a lot of time

7:30

to be out on fairs to

7:32

promote your watches to physical

7:36

stores and also , in a

7:38

way , it's easy to drown in

7:40

the store with all the other

7:42

brands . With big brands , the staff

7:44

really need to be educated and know

7:48

what to present for your

7:50

brand . So , yeah

7:53

, we didn't really think it was worth it , to

7:55

be honest , to be in

7:57

brick and mortar stores .

8:00

Not only that , but there's really a hidden problem

8:02

with that and you're starting to see brands

8:04

take it back . it's like like remove

8:06

this problem , but here

8:08

in in america there's been a resurgence

8:10

of brands opening their own boutiques

8:12

because let's just say your , your

8:15

, your watches are positioned in in you

8:17

know , barney's right there , where there's clothes and

8:19

other things right and um , and

8:21

your brand is really just kind of their existing

8:23

. You

8:33

know , a lot of these brands now are kind of as long as they have the market share

8:35

to build their own brick and mortar , then they're doing it Because not only do they create

8:37

that experience but they also own the customer . You

8:39

know , let's just say for example , somebody buys a

8:42

braver from barney's . Um

8:45

, then they're a barney's customer . They're not really

8:47

a braver customer . You know , in the

8:49

weirdest way , um , they

8:51

own one of your watches and they possess a part

8:53

of you , but , um , you

8:55

know you don't have much means to

8:57

to communicate with that customer unless

8:59

something goes wrong with the watch . You know , then they're like hey

9:01

, you know , so um yeah

9:05

so , yeah , you see a lot of brands that are

9:07

establishing these presences now to

9:09

to eliminate that that kind

9:11

of like huge gap in the market , because

9:13

that's where the long-term

9:16

value is , when you , when you possess that customer

9:18

or you , you have a relationship with your customer

9:20

, you know um , and

9:23

you know they can get into the future collections

9:25

. Or you know we'll talk about that here soon . And you know they can get into the future collections or you know we'll talk about that here soon .

9:27

But you know , they can kind of progress through your portfolio

9:29

with you you know , so yeah

9:32

, absolutely , and we , I mean

9:34

it's really important that

9:36

, uh , to sell what should not

9:38

only be about like one time

9:40

buy , it should really be to establish

9:43

like a long-term relationship

9:45

and to have a good contact with

9:47

, with your audience , so to say . And

9:49

, as you pointed out , if you sell through

9:51

physical stores , then you don't have control

9:54

over that part .

9:56

Yeah , there's , there's

9:58

, there's a big portion . So you guys

10:00

may not know my past , but , um

10:02

, but I sold , I sold 30

10:05

, 30 brands at a retailer

10:07

, and so I was . I mean we sold

10:09

everything like we sold . We sold rolex

10:12

, we sold patek , I mean we sold jlc

10:14

, we sold zenit , I mean we sold

10:16

panera , we sold every , every watch brand you could

10:18

ever think of . And there's a huge

10:20

portion of the market here that

10:23

not only do they see it online , they

10:25

get their first exposure to it online , but

10:28

then they come into a store to try

10:30

it on , to get hands-on with it , because

10:33

this is something that you're wearing on your wrist

10:35

, it's something that's always in contact

10:38

with your body . There's

10:41

a huge portion of a feeling

10:43

that goes into it , not only like emotion

10:46

, but actually , you know , everybody really cares

10:48

about size , proportions

10:51

, you know , like like thickness , I mean

10:53

all these things are really important . They kind of go back

10:55

towards the bigger picture of does this

10:57

watch fit ? You know me

10:59

. Right so .

11:01

Right , yeah , definitely yeah

11:03

, for sure .

11:05

So tell us about howver

11:07

got started and tell us about

11:09

, like your early days yes

11:12

, you know I mentioned we .

11:13

It's like , uh , yeah , 10 , 11 years ago

11:15

, since we started

11:17

the brand we . We registered

11:20

the company in 2011 and

11:22

the first collection was launched in 2013

11:26

. So it's quite a few years

11:28

now that we've been running um and

11:30

I mean , yeah , we've been friends for many

11:33

years and we for many years we discussed

11:35

starting our own brand , uh

11:38

, which eventually led

11:40

to brother um , and

11:43

the first collection was a Swiss-made

11:45

quartz model , which

11:50

launched in 2013 . And then , since

11:52

then , we launched one more quartz

11:55

model , right , johan Until , we

11:57

jumped over to our

12:00

first mechanical watch , which

12:02

was back in 2017 . Our

12:10

first mechanical watch , which was back in 2017 , and that's

12:12

also the when we started assembling the watches in sweden instead of having

12:14

them swiss made . So we still use only swiss made

12:16

movements , but we assemble

12:18

all the watches in sweden with

12:20

our own watchmaker .

12:24

Tell us about some of the inspiration . Obviously

12:27

, brands just don't start overnight

12:29

. There had to have been a huge gap

12:31

in your eyes in the market

12:34

, so

12:36

tell us . What is it that

12:38

made you feel like you had to start ? Brava

12:40

?

12:42

Well , I think I mean neither

12:45

me nor magnus

12:47

are like watch guys from

12:49

from the start . We have both

12:52

the background from industrial design

12:54

, so we're working

12:56

with anything from like medical devices

12:58

to outdoor products . That's like our

13:00

daily work back then

13:02

. So it was not

13:04

obvious that we should start a watch

13:07

brand . We really

13:09

wanted to create our

13:11

own brand , but we were not sure about in

13:13

which niche it should be . So we discussed

13:16

anything from like

13:18

bags to shoes

13:20

and so on , shoes

13:28

and so on . But it was first when Magnus was about to buy a watch for himself , when we were

13:30

out looking and kind of observing that the watch

13:32

market seemed to be quite

13:34

conservative , both

13:36

in terms of design but also

13:39

how it was communicated

13:41

, like really traditional

13:44

yet fighter

13:46

images for the male customers

13:49

and mother of pearl and

13:51

sparkling diamonds for the

13:53

women , which we thought were

13:56

kind of outdated . So I

13:58

think that is like really the spark when we started

14:00

to discuss what about moving

14:02

into the watch market ? And

14:04

back then it was really

14:06

rare with micro brands . At

14:10

that point when we started to

14:12

discuss it , I don't even think like

14:15

Daniel Wellington had

14:17

even started yet . I

14:20

mean it was not that common as it is

14:22

today , but

14:24

we really wanted to create a

14:26

design-driven watch brand

14:29

with a good value for money

14:31

and a more modern

14:33

communication about the brand , but

14:35

since then it has , of course

14:37

, evolved quite a bit , yeah

14:40

, but I think that's quite natural

14:43

also that you need to try out different

14:45

directions before you find your niche

14:48

in the end .

14:50

Yeah , you guys . Something that's

14:52

really unique about your brand is you really

14:54

stick to like a specific sport

14:57

. Obviously , it doesn't take long for a consumer to

14:59

go to your website and see you guys are huge into cycling . For a consumer to go to your

15:01

website and see you guys are are

15:03

huge into into cycling , um

15:06

, you know what is it about cycling ? Um

15:08

, that fuels

15:11

the brand .

15:11

Well , that that was actually in , in

15:13

one way , the starting starting point for the

15:15

brand , because that's how we got to know each other

15:18

. We

15:22

were both me and Joe , and we're racing mountain bike back in the

15:24

in the 90s . Uh , we were competing every weekend

15:27

and we were like

15:29

rivals like rivals back then , uh

15:32

, but eventually we became friends . So

15:34

, yeah , in one way , it was the starting

15:36

point of the brand , uh , and

15:38

it's so . We've been riding , we

15:41

are still cycling quite a

15:43

lot and following the sport

15:45

sport of cycling , uh , so it's

15:47

a big passion for both of us , um

15:50

, and yeah

15:52

, for many years , we discussed that it would

15:55

be nice to combine our two

15:57

passions for watches and

15:59

cycling in in one way or another

16:01

. And finally , in

16:04

2020 , we launched our first

16:06

cycling-inspired collection , called

16:09

the Grand Tour Chronograph

16:11

Series . So that

16:13

was really the starting point of what

16:16

do you say ? Yeah , we started to develop

16:19

or turn the brand more and more towards

16:21

cycling and , in

16:24

one way , finding our own

16:26

unique niche . Um

16:29

, we find a lot of inspiration from

16:31

the sport . It's a . It's a sport , uh

16:33

, with a very long history and a

16:35

lot of tradition , a lot of

16:37

uh , what to say , like secret

16:39

codes or how do

16:41

you say it like you know

16:43

, for example , we have one

16:46

the

16:48

rider with the race number 13

16:50

turns the

16:52

race number upside down to

16:54

counteract any bad luck . That's a

16:56

like people have done

16:58

it for 100 years . Yeah , so

17:01

there are a lot of that type of

17:03

um symbols

17:05

and there are a lot of colors

17:07

and patterns and stuff to to pick

17:09

inspiration from . Basically , yeah

17:12

, yeah , no

17:14

, I mean that that's .

17:16

I mean it's actually quite cool how you guys have kind

17:18

of you know , put yourself in this

17:20

, in this niche , and you know , I mean

17:22

I , I , I would think , and it seems

17:24

like you know you guys have kind of

17:26

you know , positioned your brand and

17:29

it also seems like it's really an underserved

17:31

niche , you know , because I'm

17:34

sure cyclists you know modern

17:37

cyclists maybe use a smart watch , um

17:39

, you know , for their heartbeat and

17:41

all this and yada yada . But

17:43

the fact is like you guys are really

17:46

taking inspiration from not only the

17:48

uh , the use case of

17:50

of a cyclist , but you know

17:52

some of the colors in in , you know some of the

17:55

uniforms , like they're really kind of like high

17:57

pop , high contrast , like they stick out on

17:59

the road Like um

18:01

, so you guys are not only taking inspiration

18:03

from that , but , um , it's

18:06

a cool .

18:07

It's a really cool niche , I think for sure yeah

18:09

, yeah , thanks , and I

18:11

mean it's a lot about style as

18:13

well . You know , having , I mean

18:15

, you're supposed to have a white socks with a

18:17

certain length of the

18:19

of the sock , the right length of

18:21

the sleeve , and so there are so many

18:23

, so many aspects of this sport

18:26

and it's a lot about style . And I

18:28

would think that I mean

18:30

back in the days , all the riders

18:32

used a nice , nice watch , but

18:35

, as you say , nowadays nobody actually

18:38

needs a watch because you have a bike

18:40

, computer monitoring monitoring

18:42

the speed and the hot , uh

18:45

, heartbeat and everything uh

18:47

yeah but , but . But we

18:49

still think it fits very well for the sport

18:51

.

18:52

I basically I agree and

18:54

, um , you know your grant . I think your grand

18:57

tour , to me , your grand

18:59

tour collection , is probably

19:01

the most unique of your collection

19:03

. I could be wrong , um , it's just

19:05

my opinion , but it's it's actually

19:08

the collection from your brand that sticks

19:10

out the most um and

19:12

excites me the most so um

19:15

, yeah , that's good there

19:17

and yeah , for sure , it's the .

19:20

yeah , it's the . It's the collection

19:22

that stands out the most and together

19:25

with our new Team Heritage series

19:28

, I would say , which is our second

19:30

series inspired by cycling

19:33

, so we're

19:35

continuing our path

19:39

within the sport of cycling , basically .

19:42

Yeah , tell us about the

19:44

team heritage . So , for let

19:46

me catch some of the viewers up , because obviously

19:48

we've had this discussion before the podcast

19:50

, but they are actually dropping

19:52

a watch . Uh , I need to look at the calendar

19:55

, obviously , but this is going to be

19:57

posted at the day or a few days

19:59

after their newest release , which

20:01

which is the Team

20:04

Heritage , which

20:11

is a cycling-inspired three-hander . Obviously , you guys

20:13

have kind of chosen different teams

20:15

You've got Team Renault , you've got Team Mercer

20:18

and then you've got Team Peugeot

20:20

. Peugeot , peugeot , peugeot , yeah , peugeot , peugeot , yeah

20:22

. So , yeah , peugeot , yeah , peugeot .

20:25

Yeah .

20:27

So yeah , tell us about the collection and thanks

20:29

for launching it with us .

20:32

Yeah , I mean the

20:35

Grand Tour collection . It's all

20:38

about the performance and

20:40

the thrill of racing , while

20:42

the Team Heritage is more looking back

20:44

to the golden era

20:47

of cycling , when it

20:50

was even more important to

20:52

have a nice style , a nice haircut

20:55

and so on , and

20:57

also that all the riders , basically

20:59

, were wearing a watch

21:01

back then . So

21:04

the Team Heritage is taking inspiration

21:06

, picking up inspiration from classic

21:10

cycling teams between the 1950s

21:13

to 1980s

21:16

, and also the format

21:19

of the case . It's kind of squarish

21:22

design of the case with quite thick

21:24

, thick , solid

21:27

steel surfaces , making

21:29

it , yeah , being well

21:32

suited to where we're , also

21:34

on on the bike , um

21:36

, but we really take

21:39

all the teams back

21:41

from the days as a source of inspiration

21:44

for this new collection . So initially

21:46

, we will then launch three

21:49

teams the Peugeot , as

21:51

you say , mercier and

21:53

Renault team and

21:55

they all have very

21:58

strong colors and patterns

22:01

on the team clothing , which we have interpreted

22:04

into the design

22:06

of the watches . So

22:10

I think it's really good to

22:12

have a strong

22:16

and clear source of inspiration that

22:19

can act

22:21

as kind of a guiding star

22:24

for us when we are developing

22:26

new designs and

22:28

, um , yeah

22:30

, yeah

22:33

, and the ambition is to .

22:35

I mean , as you mentioned , we're starting with three

22:37

different teams and the ambition is

22:39

to add more teams eventually . So

22:42

it's a , it's a really . I mean

22:44

. I think it's a cooler source

22:47

of inspiration than

22:49

we even thought from the beginning , because there are so

22:51

many cool teams , iconic

22:54

teams with jerseys with

22:56

strong colors and patterns

22:59

and stuff that makes

23:01

us come up with designs that we

23:04

would never have come up with otherwise

23:06

. I think .

23:08

I really dig the Renault watch

23:10

. Like I

23:12

love the pattern that

23:14

you guys have and it takes

23:16

a lot of inspiration from the older

23:19

jerseys . And

23:22

yeah , I mean it is a good

23:24

looking watch . It's a bold watch

23:26

. It's a bold move and

23:29

um and then , yeah , I like the

23:31

peugeot , yeah

23:33

yeah , yeah

23:36

, which is a bit more clean

23:38

and more graphical in its expression

23:40

.

23:41

So the the peugeot jersey was

23:44

all white with a black checker

23:47

pattern

23:49

. So that

23:51

model is more clean

23:53

or graphical

23:56

in its expression , but

23:58

still it's got , I think

24:00

, a quite unique look , because

24:04

that's a really important

24:06

point for us to create unique

24:08

designs and not create

24:10

something that looks like

24:12

something else on the

24:14

market . Basically , we want to create our own strong

24:18

visual language , so to speak .

24:20

Yeah , and you know , a lot of times you

24:23

kind of you can kind of corner yourselves

24:25

when you're doing these types of limited edition

24:27

or you know these really high

24:30

design centric time

24:32

pieces , because at some point

24:35

when you over design a watch , it it

24:37

it's not wearable . You

24:39

know , at least for for for my eyes . You

24:41

know a lot of people when they buy

24:43

a watch they focus on versatility

24:45

you know , yeah . So

24:47

you kind of have this balance of

24:50

like . Like , for example

24:52

, the Renault , I mean mean , and

24:54

even the mercer , like they

24:57

, they really pop on your wrist but they're

24:59

not over designed , if

25:01

that makes sense . But then you've got

25:03

. You've got . You know , the pj

25:05

um I'm I swear I'm

25:07

gonna mess that up every

25:10

time , but it's a tricky

25:12

name , yeah , but . But

25:14

. But this watch , like you

25:17

know , you would never know , just from

25:19

looking at it , like , where its inspiration

25:21

is , because it is a truly wearable

25:24

everyday watch .

25:25

Because of the white dial , yeah

25:28

, the black indices , I mean the

25:31

really yeah , that's actually

25:33

a really important point as well that you're that

25:35

you're mentioning here that , I mean , even

25:37

though we are definitely driven

25:39

by cycling we are inspired by cycling

25:42

and very passionate about it uh

25:44

, you should still be able to wear the watch even

25:46

if you're not into cycling . I mean , it

25:49

should still be a nice watch . So

25:51

so , in general , uh

25:53

, we work with quite

25:55

subtle details , uh pick

25:57

up like patterns

26:00

and stuff that , if you are into cycling , you

26:02

can spot these details and understand

26:04

the reference uh , but if

26:06

you're not , uh , it's still a

26:08

nice watch and something you can wear in your

26:10

everyday life so give

26:12

us I was just gonna say

26:14

give us .

26:14

I was just going to say give us a little taste . So you started off

26:17

with these three teams . What

26:19

other teams are you looking at to

26:22

expand the portfolio ? Ooh

26:26

, you don't have to answer . You don't have to answer . I

26:28

don't want to . I don't want to put you on the spot but no

26:30

, no , we have .

26:33

We have one team that is

26:35

already finished . It's

26:37

called St Raphael . We

26:40

don't have the launch date set

26:42

yet . Johan , right , no

26:45

probably next year

26:47

.

26:49

The launch date for the Team Heritage was

26:51

set to the 2nd of April

26:54

, which is just some

26:56

days before the start of a big

26:58

Spring Classic race called

27:00

Paris-Roubaix , so

27:03

most likely the

27:05

add-ons will be launched

27:07

at the start of the Spring Classics

27:09

next year . That

27:11

is the plan currently .

27:13

So you have a date in mind that you want

27:16

to wrap it all around , and

27:18

I'm assuming , I'm assuming

27:21

and this you know . So we've talked , we've

27:23

talked with other brands before and

27:26

obviously , are these , are these

27:28

like licensed , like did you guys have to go through

27:30

like a huge licensing thing to to

27:32

get , or how ?

27:34

does no okay , okay

27:36

, so so they I mean so they are not

27:38

connected to the teams , uh , in

27:41

any way , and the teams doesn't exist anymore

27:43

, uh , but I mean when

27:45

we , when we started working on the collection , I

27:48

mean the the dream for us would be to be able

27:50

to use actual footage of the

27:52

teams . There are are so much

27:54

cool pictures from

27:56

back then , but

27:59

obviously it's quite hard to get

28:02

the rights to use them , and

28:05

so we are

28:07

picking up colors , textures , patterns

28:10

and stuff from the teams , but

28:13

they are not connected to

28:15

the teams or licensed in

28:17

any way . And that's I

28:19

mean the naming of the models . They

28:22

are also like a discrete way

28:24

of what do you say , indicating

28:28

what teams we are inspired by . So

28:33

all the models have a three letter

28:35

name . So we have the pu

28:38

, uh mer

28:40

and the ren . So those

28:43

ref . The reference is that it within

28:45

cycling , all the cycling teams get

28:47

a , get a official

28:50

uh three letter code

28:52

for the team , which

28:55

the International

28:58

Cycling Union decides

29:02

, the three-letter code for the team . So

29:05

that's a nod

29:08

to the original

29:10

teams , basically . So those

29:12

three letters .

29:14

So we will not actually call it like

29:16

reno or perso .

29:18

It will be called rem , peu

29:21

and so on to

29:23

to yeah , navigate around copyright

29:26

issues I um

29:28

so whenever obviously , like I was looking through the collection uh , before

29:30

the podcast and I clicked into your little folders and I was like I

29:32

was like they can't . Uh , before the podcast , and I

29:34

clicked into your little folders and I was like I

29:37

was like they can't be calling a watch mer

29:39

, like what the hell does that ? mean you know

29:41

and then I and I was like , and then I I

29:43

looked at your you know your document

29:45

here , um , and

29:48

then , and then it made sense to

29:50

me , you know , obviously , because I'm not a cyclist

29:52

no , but , but , but

29:54

. But I think you guys slipped up here on

29:56

this document , because at the very

29:59

bottom of this document I

30:01

see a watch that is not in the document

30:03

. What is that about ? Hmm

30:06

, what's that ? It looks , I'm not

30:08

sure . Uh , it

30:10

looks like the PEU , but it looks

30:12

like it is in carbon

30:16

or ceramic .

30:17

No , no , that's actually the PEU . So

30:19

all the models come either

30:22

in a steel case or a black PVD case

30:24

. So , that's why you

30:27

have not seen all the

30:29

variants yet .

30:31

Okay , that's why .

30:34

So there will be a variety

30:36

of strap alternatives , of course , uh

30:39

, but also the the

30:41

choice between a stainless uh , what

30:44

is it like ? A raw steel case or a

30:47

pvd , black pvd case ?

30:49

so that's why I was

30:51

zooming into it like trying to like

30:54

that is a good looking

30:57

watch , like that exact configuration

30:59

with the gray strap . Pvd case

31:01

Woo .

31:02

Looks good . Yeah , it's cool . It's cool Actually

31:04

.

31:05

Tell us about . So , tell us about

31:07

the Swedish soul , swiss

31:09

heart , kind of thing . Like you know , you guys have

31:12

kind of coined this little phrase that

31:14

you , that , you , that you print on all your watches

31:16

.

31:17

Um , tell us how that came to

31:19

be , because that's a very bold way to say

31:21

you guys are swedish , but it's also a very bold way

31:23

to say you're making swiss watches yeah

31:27

, I mean , as we mentioned , we are

31:29

doing all uh , all assembling in

31:31

sweden , as we have a watchmaker

31:34

here in our workshop where we

31:36

are building all the watches per

31:38

customer order actually , and

31:41

all the movements are Swiss-made

31:43

. So we thought that would be a

31:46

little bit different compared

31:48

to the classical Swiss-made version

31:50

or made in Sweden . I mean , we

31:52

could put made in Sweden , but we think

31:54

this describes the combination

31:57

of our company

31:59

in a better way . So the

32:01

Swiss heart , which is representing

32:04

the movement , obviously

32:06

, and the soul is Swedish

32:10

, the mentality , the ethos

32:12

, and and so is Swedish

32:15

. So I think that's a little nice

32:17

detail that sums up the

32:20

company in a quite good way .

32:22

I , I love it . So

32:25

obviously there I have a few

32:27

questions that kind of segue from that . So

32:29

, obviously , like when you're making a watch

32:31

within your your you

32:33

guys are , I'm assuming , both swedish . You

32:35

guys are both native swedish , yes

32:38

and um , so obviously

32:40

there has to be some association with it and these

32:43

countries set and we've talked about this on

32:45

some of the other podcasts , but these

32:47

countries set , uh , criterias

32:49

that have to be met . Um

32:52

, you know , for you , you guys to get , like

32:54

the , the moniker Swedish , swedish made

32:56

. So

32:58

what is that for ? For

33:01

Sweden ?

33:04

I know we looked it up back in the day , so I don't have the

33:06

exact phrase , but it's

33:08

like the last major

33:10

step when the

33:12

final product is taking its shape

33:15

, something like that . So from

33:18

a legal perspective , we could put Made in Sweden

33:20

on the watch as

33:24

the final assembly and testing

33:26

and everything is done in Sweden . So that

33:28

would be fine . So it's not as in Switzerland

33:31

, where a certain percentage of

33:33

the cost needs to be produced

33:36

in Switzerland and so on . So

33:38

from a legal perspective it would be

33:40

okay . But we

33:42

source the components from different

33:45

parts of the world . Of

33:47

course the movement is like the cost

33:49

driver , but a lot of the

33:52

main part of the components are produced

33:54

in in asia , the , the leather

33:57

is mainly from sweden and

33:59

so on .

33:59

So it comes from different places

34:01

around the world obviously , um

34:04

, I mean first of all , sweden is

34:06

is a beautiful country . For people who have

34:08

never been , you should totally go . I

34:10

spent quite a lot of time myself personally

34:13

in Stockholm and um

34:15

, and something that you see around

34:18

Sweden , at least spending time in Sweden

34:20

is . Everybody and

34:22

every brand is proud

34:24

to be Swedish like a

34:26

hundred percent , you know so

34:28

and and and

34:30

in Sweden is obviously a country that

34:32

takes a very strong sense

34:34

of pride in design . So

34:38

how has being Swedish influenced

34:41

the brand ? I know that sounds so weird , but

34:44

from an American perspective , the first

34:46

thing that comes to mind from Swedish

34:49

. I think you guys are already going to know what

34:51

I'm going to say . Ikea are

34:57

already going to know what I'm going to say , um , ikea , but yeah , you know so . So even in american

34:59

, american minds , sweden has has a really strong design

35:01

, uh , like heritage

35:04

. So how has being swedish

35:06

influenced the brand ?

35:09

difficult question . Joan

35:12

actually grew up in the small town

35:14

where IKEA was founded

35:16

.

35:16

Okay , yeah

35:20

, but all my everyone in

35:22

my family was working at IKEA , including

35:24

me , so yeah , Wow , wow . And

35:26

my mother were designing

35:29

fabrics at IKEA

35:31

as well . So , yeah , we have a strong connection

35:37

to . Ikea , but I think we have a good answer there .

35:45

No , but I mean , if we look at how we started back

35:47

in 2013 , I think our design and the

35:50

look of our watches were more

35:52

Swedish back then , more

35:55

minimalistic . But

35:57

I mean the last few

35:59

years we have , I

36:01

wouldn't say that we represent the

36:04

typical Swedish aesthetic

36:06

nowadays or Swedish design

36:08

. But

36:11

I mean , yeah , we

36:13

put a lot of effort into details

36:15

and maybe that's part of our Swedish

36:19

heritage . I think there's a very

36:22

big focus on fine

36:24

details and also materials

36:26

within the Swedish design

36:28

tradition .

36:30

And I think one really important

36:32

part is to find the right balance

36:35

between being

36:39

too loud and bold versus

36:41

something you want to wear on every

36:44

day , For

36:57

instance the Persho version on the new Team Heritage is

36:59

inspired by this really bright yellow and black and

37:01

white pattern on the jersey . No Renault , yeah Renault . Sorry , If you're trying that

37:04

pattern and colors directly to the whole

37:06

dial , it would be way too much . So

37:08

that is an example of finding

37:10

the balance . So instead we put it in

37:12

like in a lower layer so

37:14

it creates like a nice illusion

37:16

that it's floating a bit , but it also

37:19

calms down

37:21

this , this pattern .

37:22

so maybe this can be a

37:24

representation of the scandinavian

37:26

way of finding like a good

37:28

balance between making

37:31

it interesting but not too much

37:33

yeah , when , because when I

37:35

think about swedish design um

37:38

, maybe it's just because I've been to sweden , but

37:42

you know , I think ultra modern

37:44

, you know . I think about

37:46

like , like sustainability

37:48

, um you know

37:51

, and then I , I

37:53

ignore the fact that IKEA furniture is

37:55

made to shit , but besides the point

37:58

, but , but no , I

38:00

mean you think a lot about sustainability , you

38:02

think a lot about design , you think a lot

38:04

about the material use , and

38:08

then , yeah , I mean just that DNA

38:10

, that that Swedish DNA

38:13

that defines what it is to be Swedish

38:16

. I don't know what that feels like , but I've seen

38:18

it and I've experienced it .

38:19

Yeah , yeah , and I also think

38:21

I mean it's a lot about quality

38:25

. I think as well Because

38:27

we noticed that we I mean

38:29

when we started again when we started the brand

38:31

. We noticed when we spoke

38:33

with like Again

38:37

, when we started the brand . We noticed when we spoke with American press and

38:39

magazines and stuff or people in general Sweden , despite

38:42

being a very small country , it

38:45

seems like people have

38:49

a good image of Sweden

38:51

and products from Sweden , both

38:54

when it comes to quality and and design

38:56

.

38:56

So yeah , or maybe

38:58

they are mixing it up with Switzerland

39:01

yeah , it could be that's

39:03

very , very common .

39:05

No , I um I .

39:07

I will say I um

39:09

I . I just came back from Switzerland

39:11

three weeks ago and

39:14

you know , obviously I was going there and I was

39:16

touring a bunch of factories

39:18

. I mean , some

39:20

of the people that are listening probably already know but I

39:23

was at Zenith , I was at Panerai , I was

39:25

at Bouvet , I was actually

39:27

with Ferlin Mari , which is a good friend of mine

39:29

, andrea and

39:31

then I went to IWC and

39:33

so we went to all these like really kind of

39:36

like iconic swiss brands

39:38

, um and and

39:41

you know , for some of the people out there

39:43

that that follow our channel , obviously I've been

39:45

doing a lot with uh , with jj

39:47

, uh , and and

39:50

so , yeah , I mean I

39:52

I would like to see more watch brands coming

39:54

from Sweden . Like

39:58

, what do we have to do to get more Swedish watch brands

40:00

? You know , or at least you

40:02

know .

40:04

So , yeah , I mean , we don't

40:06

have a long history

40:09

in watchmaking in Sweden , so of course , ultimately for us it would be

40:11

great to source everything in Sweden . So , of course , ultimately for us it would

40:13

be great to source everything in

40:15

Sweden , but we don't have manufacturers

40:18

of like sapphires or dials or

40:21

stuff like that . So

40:24

the easy way of course to contact

40:26

like a Swiss manufacturer

40:30

who can produce the watches for

40:32

you . So I guess that is also why most

40:34

micro brands are either Swiss

40:37

made or , yeah , no name

40:39

, yeah , asian , no

40:41

origin on them . And

40:43

, as mentioned , we also started with

40:45

the Swiss made watches

40:48

, but of course

40:50

they were also produced in

40:52

Asia . All the components and the final

40:54

assembly was done in Switzerland

40:56

. And we've

40:58

been working with a lot of product development

41:01

projects where you source the products

41:04

directly in Asia . So

41:06

we thought , why pay a lot

41:08

of money for somebody else

41:10

to source your production in

41:12

Asia ? Somebody else to source your production

41:14

in Asia ? And , yeah , we reached out and visited

41:16

several manufacturers

41:18

in Asia directly to find really

41:21

good quality and then assembling

41:23

it in Sweden ourselves instead .

41:26

Well , not only that too , but there's so

41:28

many challenges and we've some

41:31

of the people who have kind of progressed through our episodes

41:33

of podcasts will kind of follow

41:35

along with me . But there's a lot of

41:37

challenges that

41:40

brands get faced by making watches

41:42

in Switzerland and

41:46

obviously Swiss watches are known for being

41:48

high quality , but it's

41:50

not always the case . But

42:15

it's not always the case , you know , because it is debatable that some of

42:17

the movement technology that's coming out of Japan is just as good

42:19

as some . Everything has to be considered to follow that swish , that swiss kind of moniker

42:21

that we talked about , um

42:23

, and and some brands just stray

42:25

away from it because it it doesn't

42:27

mean it's a better watch .

42:29

You know , I think that's kind of what I'm going for um

42:31

, yeah , and also the fact I

42:33

mean , in our case , I mean being a small brand

42:35

, a micro brand uh , it's also

42:38

for us much easier to have

42:40

. We have much better control of the quality and

42:42

we , we can also I mean we

42:45

assemble all the watches they're

42:47

made to order , basically . So so

42:50

we , we , we make

42:52

the watches that are actually sold . So

42:54

that also makes it easier

42:57

for us not having to have a lot

42:59

of different color

43:02

options already assembled . But

43:04

we assemble the versions

43:06

or the models that we actually sell

43:08

, so that's a very important aspect as well

43:11

.

43:11

That is such a cool . So I was working with

43:14

a micro brand from switzerland

43:16

and um , and you know

43:18

, when I was going through the discovery process of them

43:20

, like understanding like what was unique

43:23

about them , um , because it was , it

43:25

was my job to help kind of communicate that messaging

43:27

to the us customer and

43:29

um , you know they were , you know I was

43:32

like , oh , how many watches do you have on

43:34

hand at any given time ? They're like zero . You

43:36

know we don't have any , any inventory . So , like

43:38

, you know , when an order comes

43:40

in , you know , like , the watch is

43:42

made on the spot to order

43:44

. Yeah , um , and

43:46

they were never even talking about that and I think that's

43:48

so important . You know , because here

43:51

in , if you look

43:53

at like the american kind of manufacturing

43:56

model , like everything is produced in bulk

43:58

, they want to get the costs . Really

44:00

it's really tiny and you know they like . You

44:03

know like , if you go to any store ever

44:05

, like you'll just see hundreds of something on

44:07

the shelves and that goes

44:09

away from the sustainability . People

44:11

don't appreciate it , because a lot of times you

44:13

have a lot of issues with quality control , because it's been sitting

44:15

there , it's been handled , it's been tossed around

44:18

, it took a long time , you

44:20

know , to get there . And so you

44:22

know their approach was we have a movement

44:25

and we design a watch around a movement and then they

44:27

buy the movements in bulk and then you

44:29

know they'll , they'll assemble the watch , you

44:31

know , to whatever the customer's

44:33

order is , um , and

44:36

we kind of were like why don't you like

44:38

talk about this ? You know , because people

44:40

care about this . It's like , um

44:42

, it's like getting like

44:44

uh , like I don't know like you go to the bakery and

44:46

like they have a little sticker on it and it says like made

44:49

this day this time . You know

44:51

, like it , it , it

44:53

brought me into those those feelings

44:55

and uh , and so ever since

44:57

then they've kind of rechanged their brand and now they're

44:59

, they're advertising and people like

45:02

come back and anyways

45:04

, it was , it was successful , um , but

45:06

that's that's such an important thing , you

45:08

know , because obviously you guys are a small brand

45:11

. You know you don't have 30

45:13

million warehouses . You know to to leave your stock in . You don't have

45:15

. You know you don't have 30 million warehouses . You know to to leave your stock in . You don't have . You know you're

45:17

not producing 30 million watches a year . You

45:19

know like , like , you

45:21

have to be kind of frugal with how you

45:23

, you know , build your inventory and

45:25

how you distribute your watches . You have to be strategic

45:28

, or or else you know the brand

45:30

that we know and love , called braver , will no longer exist

45:32

, right so yeah , exactly

45:34

, yeah

45:36

, sorry .

45:37

Yeah , it also has a

45:39

very like a personal aspect

45:42

to it as well , which is very important

45:44

, I think as well . It's . Actually the watch

45:46

is actually made for a specific , specifically

45:49

for for the customer ordering

45:52

it , so that's also a an

45:54

important aspect , I think yeah

45:56

, I mean you're , you're really nowadays , you're

45:58

really used to .

45:59

When you buy something online , you get like a

46:01

email a few hours later that it's

46:03

already shipped , and our

46:06

philosophy is that , like , good things are worth

46:09

waiting for , in a way , and it

46:11

actually emphasizes

46:14

the craftsmanship that goes into making

46:16

a watch and , as manu say , it's made specifically

46:19

for you . We can offer

46:21

some degree

46:23

of customization to your watch . If you want , like

46:25

a special surface

46:27

treatment , we can do like finishing

46:29

of the watch case and so on , as we

46:31

are making it for you anyway . So

46:34

I mean , you can see it

46:36

as a drawback that we are small , but

46:38

instead we want to , yeah , see

46:40

it as a positive , positive

46:42

aspect , being a small land

46:44

making it more personal and

46:46

more options .

46:48

Actually , so let's say an order

46:50

comes in from the moment that order comes in

46:52

to the time you dispatch the watch . What

46:54

is ? What ? Is that , that time period

46:57

?

46:58

we normally say around 10 to

47:00

14 days that is not too

47:02

long .

47:03

I mean especially to assemble a

47:05

watch , you know . I mean to make sure it goes

47:07

through all the quality control process

47:10

.

47:10

I mean , you know people

47:12

want to do like a full control

47:15

, running test of the time

47:17

deviation and , if needed , to

47:19

adjust the movements and do a new control

47:23

and so on . So , yeah , it actually takes

47:25

some time and we don't want

47:27

our watchmaker to

47:29

get to high blood pressure

47:31

.

47:32

Yeah , and

47:36

how many watches do you guys

47:38

sell a year approximately ? around

47:42

200 watches

47:44

somewhere around there , so really

47:46

really , really limited yeah

47:48

well , that's , that's the cool

47:50

thing , um , and you know

47:52

, again , I I lean on cause I've talked

47:55

to , I've talked to a lot of brands and everybody

47:57

has a unique kind of

47:59

story and a unique thing . Um

48:01

, but you know , the chances

48:03

of seeing a braver on somebody else's

48:05

wrist is smaller , of

48:07

course , because of the amount of output

48:09

you put out , but then it also

48:12

can bring you together , you know . Know , because

48:14

you guys target a unique customer

48:16

, you guys are huge into cycling , it's

48:18

, it's pretty safe to say if

48:20

somebody else is wearing a braver , then they

48:23

they're , they're in the cycling community , or

48:26

you know , um , maybe they're

48:28

from sweden or or I mean you

48:30

have this , and so their , their

48:32

customer , their , their archetypes , like

48:34

, their customer personas , like are

48:36

one-to-one , you know . So , like

48:38

this , this other brand that

48:41

we , that we've interviewed , like

48:43

they put together , um , like

48:45

events for all of their , uh

48:48

, all of their , their watch owners , because

48:50

they're like the same type of customer

48:52

profile and everybody

48:54

gets along , everybody's like best friends

48:57

and they feel like they've known each other for

48:59

decades and it creates this weird

49:02

kind of community . Yeah , you know

49:04

that's cool and

49:07

yeah , I mean . Obviously I think , as

49:10

you kind of progress as a watch collector , you

49:12

want to see unique watches

49:14

and unique watches tell a unique

49:17

story , and so you

49:19

know it's , it's . It's

49:21

a higher probability that me wearing a

49:23

braver is going to get more

49:25

attention than me wearing like , like

49:28

a Rolex or or whatever Right

49:30

, so like . I think

49:32

that's cool , you know , and it definitely

49:34

doesn't have to do like volume is not important

49:36

. It's more about identity than it's about volume

49:39

. I think , yeah , definitely tell

49:42

, tell us about the current

49:44

collection that you guys have , um

49:47

, and tell us kind of like how each

49:49

of these collections kind of expanded on

49:51

the portfolio nobody

49:56

wants to answer no no

49:59

so uh , you

50:01

mean the the full collection , basically yeah

50:04

, yeah , I mean , obviously you guys have the grand

50:06

tour , now you have the team heritage

50:09

and then you have a few three-handers here

50:11

.

50:12

Yeah , that's right . So I mean

50:14

I mean , as I mentioned , the Grand Tour chronographs

50:17

and the Tim Hardidge . Those are the newest

50:20

collections . But then we also

50:22

have , actually from the

50:25

very first mechanical watch we launched

50:27

was a model called BW003

50:30

. That's a three-hander , it's

50:32

a 9mm case and

50:36

it's featuring a Swiss

50:38

made Celita SW300 movement

50:40

. So that's

50:42

one of the , or that's the

50:45

first mechanical model we made .

50:48

Then we have like sorry , yeah

50:50

, and I just mentioned that the ambition when

50:52

creating the BW003

50:56

, which is also the base for the model

50:58

called Scandinavia , the idea was

51:00

really to , or the ambition was to create

51:02

really like your everyday

51:05

companion . So we put

51:07

a lot of effort into making it as slim

51:10

as possible . So that's also the reason why

51:12

we chose the 300 movement , because it's

51:14

one millimeter thinner

51:24

than the SW200 . And , for instance , I could also mention

51:26

like the dials are . They are all curved towards the periphery as well , as the

51:28

second hand is also bent to follow

51:30

the curvature of the dial , and

51:32

also it's's a

51:35

double-domed sapphire that follows

51:37

this curvature . So , yeah , really

51:39

put a lot of effort into making

51:41

it as slim as

51:44

possible , this model . So

51:47

that serves the base for three

51:49

models actually the 003 , the

51:52

Scandinavian model , and also our GMT , which is based

51:54

around the 003 , the Scandinavian model , and also our GMT , which is based

51:56

around the same case but with

51:58

some different design

52:01

of the of the vessels , for

52:03

instance .

52:04

And the Scandinavian model . Actually

52:06

. I mean , we discussed earlier

52:09

a little bit about our Swedish

52:11

background and our design

52:13

heritage and so on . And

52:17

the Scandinavia was created . To what do you

52:20

say ? Yeah , as a celebration

52:22

of

52:24

our Swedish design heritage , basically

52:26

so that one's quite minimalistic

52:29

in its design .

52:31

Is that what the X represents , like

52:33

the X on the dial ?

52:38

Yeah , exactly that's . Is that what the the x represents , like the x on the dial

52:40

, like , yeah , exactly that's . Uh , actually

52:42

the the four different uh flags , so it's a swedish , uh

52:44

norwegian , um finnish and um denmark

52:46

, denmark . Yeah , yeah , yeah

52:49

it's a good looking watch

52:52

.

52:52

Um , yeah , it's

52:55

a good-looking watch .

52:56

Yeah , sorry .

52:58

No , go ahead .

52:59

Yeah , so those models are more

53:01

, I mean compared

53:03

to the newer models

53:05

they

53:13

are much more , yeah , more graphical

53:15

and more minimalistic in their expression .

53:16

What is the best seller from you guys ?

53:17

guys like what's the most popular collection for

53:21

you guys it's the

53:23

grand tour series for

53:25

sure , and and specifically the

53:27

la corsa rosa model , which

53:29

is inspired by the , the euro

53:32

d'italia , um , so

53:35

it's got the the race

53:37

giro d'italia has a

53:39

pink leaders jersey for the

53:41

, the cyclist leading

53:43

the race , so it's

53:45

got , uh , pink accents on on the

53:47

, uh on the dial , and it's been , yeah

53:50

, very popular , I think , and has

53:53

got a lot of attention , which

53:56

we didn't , which we didn't think from

53:58

the beginning , maybe that we

54:00

that it would do so well yeah

54:03

, the one that stuck out to me is , um

54:06

, obviously , like , we talked about this

54:08

before we recorded , but when I met you guys in san francisco

54:10

, I was walking around with

54:12

my friend jessica from zenith and you know

54:14

zenith is obviously known for creating

54:17

iconic chronographs and

54:19

uh and her and I were really kind

54:21

of in love with the la

54:23

corso rosa 3 .

54:26

Um , it's just , it's

54:28

it's , it's bold , but it's not

54:30

too bold , and it , it , it , it

54:33

, it I don't know how to describe it , but it's uh

54:35

, like you would never

54:37

see . It's just , it's

54:40

an unmarked , remarkably , um

54:42

, like I'm fumbling

54:44

my words because it's so hard to describe but

54:48

it's like an unmistakable , like

54:51

identity . Like you know

54:53

, you've got the , the , the

54:55

pbd case , and then you've got

54:57

, you know , the gray dial with the , the tricolor

55:00

pink and blue and purple like sub dial

55:02

, and and , yeah , it's just , it's

55:05

just such , such a good one , such

55:07

a good one .

55:09

It became quite cool

55:11

, as you say , and especially it

55:13

has like a sandwich style construction

55:16

, so the indices

55:18

are cut out and then it's a custom

55:20

colored super , super luminova

55:23

paint underneath , which is , yeah

55:25

, the same pink color as the latest

55:27

jersey , which is then glowing

55:30

in the dark , which is kind of cool

55:32

when it transforms from bright

55:34

pink into this green-yellowish color

55:37

in the dark .

55:38

But it's a really nice

55:40

contrast between the sparkling

55:43

graphite gray and these really

55:45

bold accents and

55:49

something that you don't see a lot of people do

55:52

is make

55:54

smaller chronographs like

55:57

this there's a 38 millimeter

55:59

case , so you've got

56:01

38 millimeters of real estate to figure

56:03

out what to do with and how to distribute it

56:05

. Um , and

56:07

most of people don't , you know , most people listening

56:10

don't understand how challenging

56:12

of a project that is to do

56:14

a 38 millimeter chronograph

56:17

no , that was

56:19

a challenge and I mean , that was basically

56:21

the the smallest size

56:23

we could make it .

56:25

Yeah , and I think

56:27

that's one of the most common

56:29

reactions for people that

56:31

might have seen the , the chronographs on

56:33

images , and then they they

56:35

get to see it live and they

56:38

are yeah surprised about

56:40

how compact it is , because

56:42

it's , yeah , it's quite rare actually yeah

56:45

, and I mean it is , it's decorated

56:48

up too .

56:48

I guess what I love about it , like that's what you know you

56:51

guys , you could tell I mean

56:53

some thought went into it . The case shape is

56:55

beautiful , it curves in all the right

56:57

places and , uh

56:59

, and yeah , I mean you guys aren't scared

57:01

to show off . You know the type of engine

57:04

, the type of movement you guys are using the solita

57:06

, the 511 um

57:08

and yeah , I mean just the

57:10

. Even the fonts on the dial , you know um

57:13

, were something that we were talking about , like

57:15

the way that the

57:17

like , when you look at this , the seconds

57:19

, uh , sub dial , like the way the

57:22

text is spaced

57:24

, it's just really cool

57:27

.

57:29

Thanks . Tell us the

57:31

design of the later watches . I

57:38

think this is like a part of our journey with the brand that we came to the conclusion okay

57:40

, if we're making 200 watches , it doesn't really

57:42

make sense that we are making something

57:45

discreet , reminding

57:48

of a lot of other watches .

57:49

So we really want to make

57:52

something that stands out

57:54

in a good way , but

58:04

otherwise , it doesn't make sense for our brand to exist

58:06

if we don't contribute with anything new on the market . Yeah , can you walk us through

58:08

what the design process is

58:10

like for you guys ? This

58:15

is something that we started off really

58:17

early in the podcast . Our

58:20

listeners are kind of more not only are they watch

58:22

geeks , but they're more entrepreneurs and

58:25

they're creative individuals . So

58:27

they really really , really love it when we

58:29

kind of go into the creative segment

58:31

of our podcast . Um

58:34

, you know , how does the creative

58:36

process start for you guys , um

58:38

, and how does it become an actual watch

58:41

that you can put on your wrist ?

58:43

I would say that we usually

58:46

start to define a

58:48

concept of

58:50

the watch before starting with

58:52

the design . So , for instance , the

58:54

Team Heritage , the concept was

58:57

finding inspiration from classic

58:59

cycling teams from the past

59:01

, so that frames it quite

59:03

well . And then we also

59:06

define things like what kind of watch is

59:08

it , what is the value proposition , what is the

59:10

pricing of the watch ? Um

59:12

, and then this act really as a good

59:15

guidance for when we start with

59:18

the designs . We have a clear source

59:21

of inspiration that we can

59:23

start off from . But

59:26

yeah , maybe people find that

59:28

odd that you start

59:30

off with defining

59:32

the concept before actually starting with

59:34

design .

59:36

Yeah , and that's actually something I

59:38

mean . As mentioned , the brand has evolved

59:41

during the years and we are turning

59:43

more and more focus on

59:46

the sport of cycling and picking

59:48

up inspiration from the sport

59:50

, and that also helps us in in

59:52

the , in finding inspiration

59:54

and creating the design and

59:57

, uh , in in a very good way , I think . So

1:00:00

that's also a big help , and I mean

1:00:02

me and joan , we , we work . Usually

1:00:05

it takes quite a long time to , I

1:00:07

mean , finish the design work

1:00:09

. We work together quite closely

1:00:11

and do a lot of iterations

1:00:14

and

1:00:16

I mean in the end

1:00:18

, when we have the final results , so to

1:00:21

speak , we

1:00:23

can never say that , okay , that detail

1:00:25

was my , my um , my

1:00:28

idea or my design , because

1:00:30

it's always , it's going

1:00:32

back and forth between between the two of

1:00:34

us and we're constantly , I

1:00:36

mean , doing iterations and doing small fine

1:00:39

tunes and working very closely

1:00:41

together , um , so that's

1:00:43

working very well , well , very well , I think

1:00:45

are there ?

1:00:47

are there any um elements

1:00:49

that you guys hope to to

1:00:51

like incorporate into some of your

1:00:53

your watches in the future ? Maybe elements

1:00:56

, maybe complications , maybe materials

1:00:58

? Is there anything out there that you guys are looking

1:01:00

at that you're like this needs

1:01:02

to be in a braver ?

1:01:06

we , we are working with a few

1:01:08

, uh , professional cyclists

1:01:11

, pro riders that are racing at

1:01:13

the at the very top level

1:01:15

in the world , and I

1:01:17

mean we have discussing about

1:01:20

making a , because the pro riders

1:01:22

are very concerned

1:01:24

about the weight and

1:01:26

I mean the bikes are supposed to be

1:01:28

as light as possible and so on . So

1:01:31

we have discussed like

1:01:34

a really lightweight watch

1:01:36

or something like a climb

1:01:39

bus watch . Um

1:01:41

yeah , do we have other other

1:01:43

ideas ?

1:01:43

Johan , no , I wouldn't

1:01:45

say . I mean we're

1:01:48

not really into developing

1:01:50

any complications ourselves

1:01:53

. We think that we're good companies

1:01:55

doing that . We want to make life easy

1:01:57

for our wearers

1:01:59

, that they can service the watches anywhere in the

1:02:01

world . That is also why we choose well-known

1:02:03

movements . That is also why we choose well-known movements

1:02:06

. So it's more about the

1:02:11

material of the case and

1:02:13

, as Magnus mentioned , to make an

1:02:15

optimized cycling watch that

1:02:17

is reliable , that

1:02:24

can withstand a lot of vibrations and

1:02:27

so on , but otherwise nothing

1:02:29

in particular .

1:02:30

We are quite design-driven , I would

1:02:32

say as well , and

1:02:38

, as Johan mentioned , we're working with reliable and well-known movements and

1:02:40

so on . Yeah .

1:02:41

So obviously you're talking about weight . There's two materials that

1:02:43

immediately come to mind obviously titanium

1:02:46

, the other one carbon , then the

1:02:48

, the third one , maybe even ceramic

1:02:50

. Um , you

1:02:53

know , so you don't , you don't have a lot of options there

1:02:55

, obviously carbon being number one

1:02:57

and then titanium being number two and then ceramic

1:03:00

, because of cost limitations , um

1:03:03

, but they're very challenging

1:03:06

materials to work with , as I'm sure you guys

1:03:08

know yeah , yeah , definitely .

1:03:10

I mean we are still on

1:03:12

the . I mean these are , yeah

1:03:14

, discussed discussions we're having , uh

1:03:16

, so it's nothing that we're working

1:03:18

on right now , uh , but I mean that's

1:03:22

the type of materials we have discussed .

1:03:24

Yeah , naturally .

1:03:27

What's been the biggest

1:03:30

challenge that you guys have faced

1:03:32

as a brand and

1:03:36

how ?

1:03:37

did you overcome that challenge ? I would say

1:03:39

it's related to finding the

1:03:41

right partners , suppliers

1:03:43

. It's a

1:03:46

really small brand , small volumes

1:03:49

, strange demands

1:03:51

, really high demands

1:03:54

, high quality demands . It

1:04:01

was quite difficult to find the right partners

1:04:03

because they need to put a lot of effort into our

1:04:05

projects and they knew that the volumes were

1:04:07

small . So I

1:04:09

think that is like the number one challenge

1:04:12

that we have had , and probably

1:04:15

the same for a lot of other micro brands

1:04:17

companies . But it's

1:04:20

yeah , we've been in the

1:04:22

business for quite a few years now

1:04:24

, so we have good

1:04:27

, established connections with the

1:04:29

, with the suppliers now , but

1:04:31

I would say that is , yeah , absolutely the

1:04:33

the most challenging thing when

1:04:36

you start off , would you agree

1:04:38

?

1:04:38

magnus yeah , definitely . Yeah

1:04:41

, that's a I mean , that's a very

1:04:43

challenging part . If

1:04:45

I should

1:04:49

add anything , I think it's

1:04:51

always

1:04:54

a challenge to be

1:04:56

seen , basically To

1:05:00

get people to know that we exist and

1:05:02

find our watches . That's

1:05:04

, of course , also a a big challenge

1:05:07

being a small brand with limited

1:05:09

marketing budgets and so on . Yeah

1:05:12

, but I totally agree with joan as well

1:05:14

, but that's also a challenge for

1:05:16

us and so , yeah , definitely

1:05:20

hopefully we can help with the the be

1:05:22

seen part .

1:05:23

So that's why that's , why that's our goal . Yeah

1:05:26

, yeah , yeah , yeah and

1:05:28

and then , yeah , I was waiting for because , you

1:05:31

know , most people don't I , I guess maybe

1:05:33

they're scared to talk about it and you guys don't

1:05:35

have to . But , um , you

1:05:37

know , starting a watch brand takes

1:05:40

a lot of money , like it takes a lot

1:05:42

of initial capital to get going

1:05:44

, and so I would say

1:05:46

seven out of 10 times people

1:05:49

say , oh , it takes money . We

1:05:53

started off and we were just coming out of

1:05:55

college or we were broke and

1:05:57

we literally had no idea

1:06:00

how to get the money to start to build

1:06:02

a watch brand . Then it kind

1:06:04

of came the . You

1:06:07

know the , the challenge that you guys

1:06:09

faced , which is finding suppliers and partners , um

1:06:12

, but that can be

1:06:15

a little bit easier of a challenge versus raising

1:06:17

capital , getting money and , and

1:06:19

you know , having financial resources to support

1:06:21

the brand you know , yeah , that

1:06:23

is a really big challenge and , to

1:06:25

be honest , it is from time to time

1:06:27

still challenging when you need to buy like

1:06:30

100 chronograph movements .

1:06:31

At the same time you need to buy 200

1:06:34

other movements and 300

1:06:36

case sets

1:06:38

and so on . So it's really a big

1:06:41

variations of over the year and we

1:06:44

don't work like with a

1:06:46

, we'll say , campaign

1:06:48

or kickstarter kind

1:06:50

of business model . We actually

1:06:52

produce all the watches , launching

1:06:54

them and then we sell them . So

1:06:57

, absolutely , this is a

1:06:59

challenge you need to need

1:07:02

to fight with , and from the start

1:07:04

. We need

1:07:09

to fight with and from the start . We first couple of years we didn't take out any salary

1:07:11

. We put in our like savings into the company . So

1:07:13

I think it was like five years ago

1:07:15

we could actually start working

1:07:17

with it . So

1:07:19

since maybe four years

1:07:22

now , both of us are working

1:07:24

full-time with the watches

1:07:26

. So it has been a long journey

1:07:28

, a lot of hours spent

1:07:30

outside your like your regular day job

1:07:32

. Yeah , absolutely . So

1:07:35

that is also a good lesson

1:07:37

that you should do something which you really enjoy

1:07:39

and are passionate about . Otherwise

1:07:42

you will not manage

1:07:44

for for , yeah , so

1:07:46

so many years before you can live on your

1:07:49

hobby , so to say .

1:07:52

Yeah , yeah , it's an important

1:07:54

thing to do what you're passionate

1:07:56

about and

1:07:58

, especially , as you know

1:08:00

, we're creatives

1:08:03

here as well . You know , obviously , like we're doing

1:08:05

video content , we're doing podcasts . You know we're doing video

1:08:07

content , we're doing podcasts , we're doing blog posts

1:08:09

, so we're expressing

1:08:11

ourselves creatively , similar to you guys

1:08:13

, and

1:08:16

it's a challenge because you

1:08:19

have to be creative and you have to push the envelope

1:08:21

, but you also have to stay

1:08:23

true to your heart . I

1:08:26

can't even tell you how many times brands have

1:08:29

reached out to us and said , like , hey , here's what

1:08:31

I want you to write , you know here's what I want you

1:08:33

to talk about and I'm like you

1:08:35

know , sorry , sorry , like you're talking to the wrong

1:08:37

outlet here , like we're you know

1:08:39

, you know , if we're lucky

1:08:41

enough to get our get our hands on a watch , like

1:08:43

you know we're we're going to talk

1:08:46

about what we want to talk about , yeah

1:08:48

, and and then you know we're

1:08:50

we're very community centric . You

1:08:52

know , like we're we're very communal

1:08:54

focus . Like we talk about we

1:08:57

don't talk so much about the products , like we talk more

1:08:59

about the uh , the collectors

1:09:01

and the journey that collectors face

1:09:03

. You know , because you see a lot of other outlets out

1:09:05

there and they're talking about , you know , press

1:09:07

release , boom , boom , boom , boom , boom . It's just like 10 press releases

1:09:10

and so you know you can go to their website

1:09:12

and see , oh , like these are all the watches that were

1:09:14

released this month . You know , and you

1:09:16

know we're we're very alternative in

1:09:19

that sense that we talk a lot about the

1:09:21

decision making of the collector , their journey

1:09:23

, um , you know , strategy . I

1:09:25

mean we're very community focused and we're

1:09:28

not so much brand and product

1:09:30

focused , um , and

1:09:32

that's how we kind of segmented

1:09:35

ourselves differently and that you know

1:09:37

, like for the longest time we

1:09:39

were um and we're transitioning

1:09:41

now , but we were , we were viewer powered

1:09:43

, so like we started off kind of like

1:09:46

on 100 donations like

1:09:48

we had there . we saw people that were like , hey

1:09:50

, you guys are watch , guys , you guys know

1:09:53

the industry , you know the scene , you know the products

1:09:55

, like we want your perspective , um

1:09:57

, and so we had a flood of donations that

1:09:59

came in and that that powered us

1:10:02

for this whole year . You , you know um

1:10:05

, like , and now , now

1:10:07

we're kind of facing that point where , like , um

1:10:09

, you know the , the people that donated

1:10:11

from the start are kind of like they're just , you know , they're

1:10:13

just enjoying the content , they're caught up in the enjoyment

1:10:15

of what we're producing and um and

1:10:18

so , and so , yeah , that those donations have

1:10:20

kind of like , kind of like dried up , and so now

1:10:22

we're kind of transitioning more into , you

1:10:24

know , using partners to advertise , um

1:10:27

, and things like that . You

1:10:29

know , opening up new channels you know , like youtube

1:10:31

is is a new channel for us and a new

1:10:34

platform and , uh , you know there's challenges

1:10:36

there , um , that we face , um

1:10:39

but yeah , yeah

1:10:41

, I guess it's similar to building any

1:10:45

brand . Yeah , of course .

1:10:46

You put a lot of time and effort into it

1:10:49

before you can actually harvest for

1:10:51

the effort you put into

1:10:53

it , and it can take quite some

1:10:56

time , but

1:10:58

you're doing a great job , thank

1:11:00

you , thank you .

1:11:01

Sure , we have our

1:11:03

last and final question for you guys

1:11:06

and

1:11:09

you guys , a lot of people will stay silent on this , but sometimes we do get

1:11:11

answers on this one . Yeah

1:11:14

, um tell us what we , we

1:11:16

can expect from from you guys

1:11:18

in the future . You know what ? What should we look out

1:11:21

for ? Um , you

1:11:23

know if , if you were to say , hey

1:11:25

, in the next decade we want this

1:11:27

from braver um , you

1:11:29

know what ? What would

1:11:31

that be ?

1:11:34

oh difficult . So it's a , it's a long

1:11:36

in the long perspective sure

1:11:39

, yeah , yeah , exactly oh

1:11:43

, I think , uh , one

1:11:45

one thing that would be cool , I think that , uh

1:11:47

, which we discussed a little bit before about

1:11:50

stores and retail

1:11:53

, selling through retail and stuff is

1:11:55

that it would be nice to have like , yeah

1:11:58

, maybe a few of our own

1:12:00

stores , uh

1:12:02

, where we can , um

1:12:05

, that embodies our brand

1:12:07

. That would be , I

1:12:10

guess it would be some kind of mix of a for

1:12:14

watch and cycling nerds

1:12:16

.

1:12:16

Maybe that

1:12:19

would be nice , I think yeah that's

1:12:23

my spontaneous idea

1:12:26

at least you

1:12:28

could have a bike and a jersey and then

1:12:30

a watch next to it . Like every

1:12:32

single you know , watch is designed with

1:12:34

this bike and this jersey in mind .

1:12:36

That'd be cool yeah , exactly something like

1:12:38

that .

1:12:39

Uh , because , yeah , that that would be really

1:12:41

nice , I think yeah , I , I

1:12:44

think we , we have found

1:12:46

our niche , uh

1:12:48

, our combination

1:12:50

of the two biggest passions in

1:12:52

life . So we are really , yeah

1:12:54

, happy during our

1:12:57

work days when we are able

1:12:59

to to combine these interests

1:13:01

. So , absolutely , I say

1:13:03

that we continue in this direction to find

1:13:06

inspiration from the world of

1:13:08

cycling and

1:13:10

that doesn't necessarily mean that the

1:13:13

people that want to buy our watches are

1:13:15

also into cycling . You could be either a cycling

1:13:17

nerd or a watch nerd and appreciate

1:13:19

the design in a way , but I think

1:13:21

really , that we found a clear niche

1:13:23

to move forward and expanding

1:13:26

our collection within . So

1:13:28

that is what you can expect from

1:13:30

us . And , of course , to see us around during

1:13:33

like wind-up shows and similar

1:13:35

events and , yeah

1:13:37

, really , really happy to

1:13:40

meet people out there .

1:13:43

Yeah , and also continue to try

1:13:45

to create unique designs .

1:13:47

Basically , that's a very

1:13:49

important mission for us there

1:13:52

, there , there has to be and

1:13:54

this is again you . You've kind of inspired me

1:13:56

to follow to ask another follow-up question okay

1:13:59

, but there has to be like

1:14:02

a milestone moment for you

1:14:04

guys where you're like , okay

1:14:06

, if we're shipping a thousand

1:14:08

watches a year , or you know , this

1:14:10

person gets our watch

1:14:13

on their wrist , or like there has to

1:14:15

be a milestone moment for

1:14:17

your brand . So

1:14:19

maybe you guys haven't thought about this , but is

1:14:22

there a ? Is there going to be one of those milestone moments

1:14:24

where you're like , oh shit , we

1:14:26

did this . Obviously , you guys are producing

1:14:28

watches and you guys are selling watches , but

1:14:30

there's got to be something in your mind

1:14:33

, as

1:14:35

if Michael Jordan started to wear his first pair

1:14:37

of Nikes or something . You know what I mean . What

1:14:40

would that moment be for you ?

1:14:42

I think it would be to again

1:14:45

related to cycling to have

1:14:47

our own cycling team

1:14:49

at a very high level or be

1:14:51

a partner of a cycling team . That

1:14:55

would be very cool . I think we

1:15:03

have actually been a partner of a professional cycling team

1:15:05

a couple of years ago .

1:15:10

But I mean to be like what I call it .

1:15:12

It a naming partner team . Yeah , I'm sorry , sponsoring partner . Yeah , yeah , exactly yeah

1:15:14

. For a team that , actually , where

1:15:16

our , our brand name is in , included

1:15:18

in the in the team name , would be very

1:15:21

cool , I think that'd be pretty

1:15:23

amazing so that's

1:15:25

probably a dream what

1:15:28

about you , johanna ?

1:15:28

I saw you're trying to get some words out there no

1:15:31

, I mean I was thinking like about

1:15:34

a specific rider who would be

1:15:36

cool to be seen on . We have some pro

1:15:38

riders wearing the watches , but there

1:15:40

is like one big star and my favorite

1:15:43

rider . It's called Mathieu van

1:15:45

der Poel and

1:15:50

that would be really , really optimal to be seen on his

1:15:52

wrist . So let's hope for that

1:15:54

. And one of the Team Heritage

1:15:56

models was

1:15:59

actually the team his grandpa used

1:16:01

to race for , so

1:16:04

maybe there is a chance I'll shoot him a text

1:16:06

message all

1:16:18

right , guys , thank you so .

1:16:19

So , so much for your time . Um , I know we've went over a lot here in this just over an hour . Is there anything

1:16:21

you know ? I would like to give you the platform . Um

1:16:24

, is there anything you feel like we didn't touch ? That's

1:16:26

important , maybe initiatives , goals

1:16:28

? Um , I mean , is there anything you

1:16:31

feel like we kind of missed over here ?

1:16:36

I don't think so I mean we're oh sorry

1:16:38

, john could it be

1:16:40

, uh , that we missed talking about our

1:16:42

new vintage team car ? Yeah

1:16:46

, that's right please yeah

1:16:48

, I mean talking

1:16:51

about the like , creating

1:16:53

a concept before we start with the design . We

1:16:55

also decided really early

1:16:57

that we need to have a dedicated

1:17:00

team car for the new team heritage collection

1:17:02

collection . So we

1:17:04

acquired an old volvo 145

1:17:08

from from the 70s which

1:17:10

is under transformation now to to

1:17:13

be like it's called , yeah , service car

1:17:15

for , for , uh yeah , old cycling

1:17:18

team .

1:17:18

So the plan is to take

1:17:20

it down to europe and

1:17:23

, yeah , visit some

1:17:26

of the big cycling races with

1:17:28

it , and also to promote the brand of course

1:17:30

that that sounds like something

1:17:32

you need to document , so I hope

1:17:34

and I cross my fingers that you guys

1:17:36

are going to film that , because I would love to watch

1:17:38

that like just the process of

1:17:40

building the car and bringing

1:17:42

you know some of the design into it , maybe

1:17:45

some of the paints , and maybe you know some of the

1:17:47

decals and whatever you guys do like , I

1:17:49

think that would be crazy

1:17:51

so do

1:17:53

us a favor and film it and then I will happily

1:17:55

put on the podcast or the uh , the website

1:17:57

and I will happily , you know , share

1:18:00

that journey with you guys and everybody else . Right

1:18:02

, you know , because that's you know , we talked

1:18:04

about this a lot um , if you

1:18:06

look at , like vlogging , for example , is really

1:18:09

popular back in the day , but then you look at , you

1:18:11

know , people who have grown with you

1:18:13

. You know , like , if you look at I know this is

1:18:15

a really weird example , but if you look at the

1:18:17

kardashian tv show , you know like

1:18:20

people have grown up with the

1:18:22

kardashians and like they've , they've witnessed

1:18:24

their journey and they've , they've faced challenges

1:18:27

with them on TV , um

1:18:29

, and the same thing for any reality TV

1:18:31

show . So , like , you know , that is

1:18:33

where you know you guys will , we'll start to

1:18:35

get your , your cult status , you

1:18:37

know .

1:18:40

So , yeah , that's right . That's right . Yeah , we

1:18:42

will definitely share our

1:18:44

our trips with the car

1:18:46

. Yeah , for sure well

1:18:49

, thanks again .

1:18:49

So much for coming on . We're gonna wrap this up . Uh

1:18:52

. Thanks to uh , to magnus and johan

1:18:54

from . Bravo , I appreciate you guys . Thanks for

1:18:56

outnumbering me , thanks for for showing

1:18:58

up in uh in crowd and uh . Thanks

1:19:00

for uh for taking some of our challenging questions

1:19:03

and uh and I personally

1:19:05

I'm personally looking forward to what you guys

1:19:07

are doing . I'm a huge fan . I'm humbled

1:19:09

that you guys have spent some time with me and

1:19:13

you know we're going to follow up

1:19:15

with you guys here soon . Obviously

1:19:18

, we're going to stay in touch and you know we're going to be

1:19:20

communicating

1:19:22

and staying in touch and distributing

1:19:24

and helping you kind of , you know . You know

1:19:26

, reach your goals for the brand .

1:19:30

We're a partner .

1:19:32

We'll definitely talk here soon guys .

1:19:34

Definitely .

1:19:35

Thanks a lot mate

1:19:38

Take care , guys Take care Ciao

1:19:41

.