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Operation Barbarossa: What's Plan B?

Operation Barbarossa: What's Plan B?

Released Tuesday, 30th January 2024
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Operation Barbarossa: What's Plan B?

Operation Barbarossa: What's Plan B?

Operation Barbarossa: What's Plan B?

Operation Barbarossa: What's Plan B?

Tuesday, 30th January 2024
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Episode Transcript

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Hello and thank you for

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listening to the history of World War

2:38

II podcast. Episode

2:40

453, Operation

2:42

Barbarossa, what's plan

2:44

B? Last

2:46

time during Operation Typhoon, the

2:48

plan to take Moscow, the

2:50

Panzers reached the capital's outer

2:52

limits. As we've seen on

2:54

November 27, the 7th Panzer

2:57

Division had crossed the Moscow

2:59

Volga Canal and created a

3:01

bridgehead. They were now only

3:03

22 miles or 35 kilometers from the Kremlin. Of

3:08

course, then the 1st Shock Army joined

3:10

by the 20th Army drove

3:12

them back. Next, even

3:14

closer to Moscow, the 2nd

3:17

Panzer Division reached Krasnaya, Poliana,

3:19

modern day Lovnya, just 12

3:22

miles or 19 kilometers from

3:24

the Kremlin itself. Typhoon

3:27

had been launched in early

3:29

October, but on November 7th,

3:31

Stalin ordered that the traditional

3:33

military parade take place in

3:36

Moscow for Revolution Day. The

3:39

troops and tanks and trucks marched

3:41

or drove through Red Square and

3:43

then directly to the

3:45

front. And it's a good thing they

3:47

did. The Germans were getting

3:49

ever closer, though pain and blood.

3:52

But as the 2nd Panzer Division

3:54

was halted, General Hautner ordered a

3:57

three-day rest. Then they

3:59

would finish. what they had started. Thus

4:03

had General Zhukov bested von Bock

4:05

to the north, south,

4:07

and now in front of Moscow.

4:10

But it might not have been

4:12

thus as the German generals were

4:14

telling von Bock that Field Marshal

4:16

von Kluge, commander of the 4th

4:18

Army, had been slow in sending

4:20

in one of his flanking attacks.

4:23

And after all the screaming reached von

4:25

Kluge's ears, he got his

4:27

men going, though offering up no excuse.

4:31

So on December 1st, von Kluge

4:33

ordered 20th Army, flanked by the

4:35

57th Panzer of only 70 tanks,

4:38

to move forward towards

4:40

Nairoh-Fominsk, just five miles

4:42

from the southwest corner

4:45

of Moscow's outer suburbs.

4:47

This advance also included the 9th

4:50

Army Corps. The

4:52

first day of this attack seemed

4:54

promising, as the Soviet 43rd Army

4:56

was roughed up and bypassed. Soon,

4:59

the men of the 258th Infantry

5:01

Division were engaging the Soviet 5th

5:04

Army that was acting as a

5:06

second echelon of defense. As

5:09

the 5th Army had been

5:11

protecting the Minsk-to-Moscow Highway, this

5:13

was quite dangerous for the

5:15

Soviets. With the mud rising as it was, one

5:17

of the few main and raised highways was

5:19

the only way to get around, and the

5:22

Germans seemed to be on the

5:24

cusp of controlling one. Either

5:28

this was easy enough to predict,

5:31

or Zhukov was learning his German

5:33

generals. When the sun rose

5:35

on the second day of the attack, Zhukov sent

5:37

in the 33rd Army, led by

5:40

Lieutenant General M.G. Yefrenov,

5:43

and these men were supported by

5:45

the 5th and 11th Tank Brigades,

5:48

plus one tank and two ski

5:50

battalions. As these

5:52

units entered the target city, narrow

5:54

from Minsk from the east, their

5:57

T-34s went prowling for

5:59

the German soldiers. an assault gun or

6:01

StuG. These were based on

6:03

the Panzer III and Panzer IV

6:05

medium tank chassis, respectively. But, as

6:08

they did not have a regular

6:10

tank turret, its main weapon could

6:12

only be aimed by moving

6:14

or turning the entire vehicle,

6:16

which was pretty good for defense, but

6:19

not offense, as the Germans were about

6:21

to find out. But

6:23

to give any chance to the

6:25

Germans was to draw the ire

6:27

of Zhukov or Stalin, so the

6:29

Soviet Air Force was sent in

6:31

to demolish the buildings of the

6:33

town. Soon the T-34s

6:36

had a better line of fight

6:38

and started slamming shells into the

6:40

enemy vehicles. The Germans

6:42

retreated, and none too smoothly. In

6:45

fact, they were sent back to

6:47

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6:49

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this, on December 2nd, von

7:25

Bock, being a politician, told

7:27

his generals von Kluge, Hoppner,

7:29

and Reinhardt that the enemy

7:31

was about to break. They just had to

7:33

keep up the pressure. The

7:35

generals were starting to wonder what

7:37

von Bock could see that

7:39

they did not. But then von

7:42

Bock, becoming once again a serious

7:44

military man, told OKH

7:47

Chief of Staff Halder that

7:49

he doubted the success of

7:51

Operation Typhoon. One

7:53

mistake piled atop another. But

7:57

let's remind von Bock how we got to

7:59

this point. After the

8:01

battles of Viasma and Briansk, the

8:03

Panzers had the Russians reeling

8:06

and panicking. By the

8:08

second week of October, Viasma was

8:10

under German control, but then, without

8:12

really planning on it, it was

8:15

more of a need after weeks of battle, most

8:18

of Army Group Center took a

8:20

much needed break, one that

8:22

went on longer than planned. This

8:25

allowed the Russians to also rest and

8:27

bring up more men, and

8:30

when von Bock did get back to attacking,

8:32

he did so in

8:34

a sequential way, a piece at

8:36

a time, mostly due to a

8:38

lack of supplies, which allowed Zhukov

8:40

to do the same thing. He saw

8:43

an attack and rushed reinforcements there,

8:45

enough to either stop or slow down

8:48

the Germans. It wasn't pretty,

8:50

and many men were lost, but

8:52

it was effective, and now, the

8:55

other mistake. When the

8:57

Panzers rolled in close to Moscow,

8:59

as close as they ever would,

9:01

Guderian, Hopner, and Reinhardt all begged

9:03

von Bock to let them be

9:05

the one to deliver the death

9:07

blow, the one that would see

9:09

the Panzers rush into Moscow. Basically,

9:12

what they were asking for was the

9:15

supplies to do it, because von Bock

9:17

could not give everyone the supplies they

9:19

needed at the same time. But

9:21

for all those begging, the honor,

9:24

if you will, went to von

9:26

Pluge, who, quite frankly, did

9:29

not know what to do with it. The

9:31

German generals complained about each other, to

9:34

each other, and to von Bock. Meanwhile,

9:37

von Pluge, not taking guff

9:39

from anyone, complained back. Von

9:42

Bock, it turned out, was the ringmaster

9:44

of a circus that was

9:46

completely out of control. And

9:49

Chief of Staff General Franz Halder

9:51

should have seen this coming. Back

9:54

in mid-November, he, Halder, had

9:56

held the Orsha Conference near

9:59

Smolensk. And he got to

10:01

see for himself that yes, German troops

10:03

and panzers were moving forward, but

10:06

the price had been high to get there

10:08

and would probably be higher still to

10:10

keep moving. So Halder's

10:12

idea was to threaten

10:15

Moscow versus taking it, forcing

10:18

Stalin to bring in more and more

10:20

troops to defend a town that would

10:22

never be attacked. But

10:24

Hitler stepped in and said,

10:26

no, the war needed Moscow

10:28

to be taken. So

10:30

Army Group Center went ahead, though

10:32

it did not have the means

10:34

to do so in an effective

10:36

or realistic way. The

10:38

other thing that caused the panzers to be held

10:40

back at arm's length was simply

10:43

Zhukov. Before late November,

10:45

the Russian defenses were in tatters,

10:48

certainly in front of the capital,

10:50

but six weeks after

10:52

Zhukov was allowed to be in

10:54

control, he had mastery over the

10:56

front, the information, and once more,

10:59

he had Stalin's confidence by then.

11:02

Thus was an experienced man behind

11:04

the wheel, though Stalin would

11:07

still occasionally call for massive offenses

11:09

of their own before they

11:11

were ready. But the time would

11:13

come when the Soviets were ready and

11:15

that order would be given out. And

11:19

the last part, of course, was in

11:21

Von Bock's Very Diary, written down on

11:23

November 29th, by then far

11:26

too late to change Hitler's mind.

11:29

That the Russians obviously had

11:32

huge reserves, that is huge

11:34

enough to stop or

11:37

to counter typhoon, but surely

11:39

not enough to launch their own massive offenses,

11:43

right? No, the Germans

11:45

had time. Yes, they had been

11:47

stopped, but this wasn't over. In

11:49

time, the attacks would start up again and

11:52

he was right, but it wouldn't

11:54

be his offensive that he had

11:57

to be concerned about. In

11:59

truth, Moscow had war games.

12:01

All of this they knew or

12:03

guest to The Germans would be

12:06

able to make substantial gains in

12:08

driving east, but they did not

12:10

anticipate them knocking on the Kremlin's

12:12

door. Since. The panic but

12:15

the German tied had been

12:17

painfully deflected and now they

12:19

sat there rusty. the supply

12:21

lines spotty at best and

12:23

their flights were all but

12:25

surrounded on three sides. Yes

12:28

this have been planned for and

12:30

during the first few days of

12:32

December issue cause explain to Stalin's

12:34

which he wanted to do. And.

12:37

The Soviet premier said. Yes,

12:40

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13:15

is where we are going to

13:17

leave Army Group Center for now

13:19

so we can catch up with

13:21

Armor Group South. And it was

13:24

Armor Group South. There was to

13:26

make a thousand year reich possible

13:28

how by taking Ukraine's farmland it's

13:30

minerals. And it's industry. Year

13:34

before we leave Von Box soon

13:36

not to be in command of

13:38

Army Group Center. It's worth noting

13:40

a few things. At first,

13:42

yes, things were going well for Armor

13:44

Group Center. Sure there were some with

13:47

just a call and even tactical mistakes

13:49

made along the way. It's what, but

13:51

having five hundred thousand men under one

13:53

commands will do that. So. Momentum,

13:56

it seems has covered up several

13:58

hiccups that would soon. Be

14:00

exposed, what with a lack

14:02

of supplies, a lack of

14:05

replacements, and a staggering lack

14:07

of respect for the Communists

14:09

machinery to recruit outset and

14:11

move around. millions of men.

14:14

And equipment. Yes, at

14:16

the end of the day, it's

14:18

simple to see that Armor group

14:20

centers part of barbarous Us became

14:22

less focused as the men get

14:25

closer to Moscow. It's like after

14:27

the great victory at Smolensk even

14:29

die as much. There seem to

14:31

be no solid. Already. Thought

14:33

out plan. Of what to do

14:35

next. And for every

14:38

German victories there was time

14:40

last recovering from said victories,

14:42

but it seems that the

14:44

Soviets used that time. Better

14:46

than the Germans did. And

14:49

with multiple views of what to

14:51

do next within the German camp

14:53

and even them changing from day

14:55

to day, the mentality seems to.

14:58

A return to basic thinking.

15:00

I eat. Take. The

15:02

enemies capital. But. As we

15:04

have seen, that did not happen.

15:06

The Germans had lost the momentum

15:09

which is often sustaining in desperate

15:11

times. But now it was the

15:13

Germans asking themselves while they arrested

15:15

for a few days. Late.

15:17

With the Russians do, how badly

15:20

are they really beaten? The.

15:22

Answer would come in the next few days.

15:25

Another. Reason the Germans just realized that

15:28

they had bit off more than they

15:30

could chew was simply it's their string

15:32

of victories. How could it

15:34

not seem to those staff officers and

15:36

Berlin's that all they had to do

15:39

was push pins and mats and draw

15:41

arrows. That. Their men could go

15:43

anywhere and through anything. Confidence

15:46

is one thing, planning on

15:49

never losing that something else

15:51

entirely. as for

15:53

the question of supplies is worth

15:55

remembering that that has three parts

15:58

the creation of the supply the

16:00

transport of the supply, and finally

16:02

its delivery. Even in

16:05

late 1941, Hitler had not yet

16:07

turned the country over to

16:09

a complete war footing. There were

16:11

still domestic goods being made, and that

16:14

was because Hitler wanted the people placated

16:17

as much as possible. More

16:19

supplies might not have helped in the delivery

16:22

of them, but having them around

16:25

is never a bad thing. And

16:27

lastly, and the most shocking, is

16:29

that Berlin, certainly Chief of

16:31

Staff Halder, was shocked, even

16:34

stunned, by their own initial

16:36

successes, and this caused them

16:38

to second-guess themselves. Which is

16:40

why the number of changes to goals. At

16:43

first, not Moscow, and then Moscow,

16:45

and then Kiev, and then go

16:47

destroy more Russian armies, only to

16:49

return to taking the capital in

16:51

a flanking move that again ultimately

16:54

failed. But it had

16:56

been Hitler who finally quieted

16:59

his bickering generals by

17:01

making the decision himself. It

17:03

would be Moscow. But

17:06

even here, Hitler was playing

17:08

politics. No, it was

17:10

not necessarily an automatic victory if

17:13

Moscow fell, but it

17:15

might push the Turks over the line

17:17

into coming into the war on

17:19

the Axis side. And perhaps if

17:21

Finland saw Russia on its knees,

17:24

they would try harder. These

17:26

possibilities were hovering

17:29

in Dafira's mind. But

17:31

despite so much, the Germans

17:33

had achieved incredible things. They're

17:36

overwhelming victories in a

17:38

general sense, like Adminsk,

17:41

Ivanskow, Eman, Smolensk, Kiev,

17:43

Vyazma, Bryansk, Melit-Pepol, and

17:45

the Crimea. Any one

17:48

of these could have been a back-breaking

17:50

defeat for Moscow. But

17:52

none were. Why? Because

17:55

Stalin would never give up. He

17:58

could be killed, he could be overthrown. He

18:00

could be defeated on the field, but

18:02

he would never stop fighting. Fighting

18:05

is all he had known since a

18:07

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