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solution. Hello

1:13

everybody, and welcome to another week of

1:15

one words of Lesson podcast. I'm Ray

1:17

Harkins, you're ever present host, and

1:19

also my son is here. Hello. My

1:22

son is liking to record these intros with

1:24

me as well. But what I'm here

1:27

to tell you is that we've got a great show this week.

1:29

Of course, it's a great show every week, right

1:33

Uh, this week in particular, it is Brent

1:35

Mills, the vocalist from a band

1:37

called Grey Haven from Louisville, Kentucky. They

1:40

put out record on Equal Vision

1:42

that is really good and they have some cool touring

1:44

coming up and they're just going to be in your face

1:46

a lot more, which is a good thing. And I

1:48

really enjoyed the band. Uh. My

1:51

close friend of mine manages the band, asked

1:53

me if I would like to have someone from

1:55

the band on the show, and I was like, you know what, let's dive

1:57

in. I like the record sold

2:00

on got you gotta talk about some other things first,

2:02

But first of all, the feedback

2:04

that I got from last week's episode was spectacular.

2:07

You really really enjoyed the discussion

2:09

that I had with Scott Krausse from Earth Crisis

2:11

about their individual records.

2:14

And you know, it was a long one. It was like a two hour episode.

2:16

But um yeah, I just I don't know.

2:18

I heard from people who hadn't heard from in

2:20

quite some time saying, hey, great show,

2:22

and you know, whether it's over text or email or

2:25

Instagram or whatever the case may be. Um,

2:27

I just really appreciate that. So keep sharing that

2:29

episode. It's a really good one. So I

2:31

would encourage you to do that. Um

2:34

what else do I have to tell you? You can

2:36

of course rate review

2:39

this particular podcast on Apple

2:42

Podcasts, Sitchure wherever you listen to it. The

2:44

more feedback you give from that perspective,

2:46

it differentiates us from all the other shows

2:49

that exist out there. So yeah, please do that. And

2:51

of course you can always email this show one hundred words

2:53

podcast at gmail dot com.

2:55

Um. Yeah, that's that's That's all I want to tell

2:58

you. But Brent Mills,

3:00

like I said, is the vocalist for grey

3:02

Haven, really good bands. I got to dive

3:04

in deep with him about the Louisville

3:06

music scene and then, um,

3:09

the competitive nature that sometimes exists

3:11

with bands, because like you know, when you're a

3:13

smaller slash mid level band,

3:16

sometimes you sometimes you feel weird when

3:18

your friends bands get a tour and you're like, oh

3:20

man, we should have got that tour and yeah,

3:22

all that stuff. But yeah,

3:24

Britt and I go in deep on that. So

3:27

that's what we got. And uh, yeah, I'm not gonna

3:29

not gonna beat around the bush. Here's the conversation, okay,

3:31

and I'll talk to you of course after the episode is over.

3:42

Yeah

3:47

I had that. Yeah,

3:53

so are

3:56

a very good mutual friend of ours. Mr Tom Williams

3:58

was the one who put you guys on my

4:01

radar, and um, you know, I checked

4:03

it out and I was I'll

4:05

be you know, very honest in saying

4:08

that the you know, the progressive

4:10

metal moniker that gets you know, placed

4:13

on you guys. Um, you know, sometimes

4:15

I'm just like, oh, oh, I don't know if

4:17

i'm because I'm what, I'm a punk and hardcore kid.

4:19

So like, I like very

4:22

select bands that are kind of lumped

4:24

into the genre, so to speak. And you

4:26

know, that's funny when they when they say progressives,

4:28

because I'm like, well, I don't I know

4:30

a lot of prog bands, but I

4:32

don't think we found a lot like them.

4:34

But I guess I understand that we don't

4:36

make any sense either. No,

4:39

And honestly, I mean that that's a very valid

4:41

thing where the you

4:44

know, usually when you collect people

4:46

together that start, you know, making music,

4:48

like through whatever prism they view

4:51

the world in, you know, whether it's like oh yeah, I'm

4:53

a metal kid that I play pop punk or whatever. It's like

4:55

that happens all the time. Um But

4:58

like you said, there are certain classifications

5:01

that definitely can prevent people

5:03

who probably would like your band, but it's just

5:05

like oh yeah, oh progressive metal band,

5:08

whereas like if you're just called a metal band,

5:10

people might check it out, like does

5:12

that do you find that happening to you guys at all? Or

5:14

is that something that kind of just like sticks in your

5:16

head and you're like, well, I can't do anything about it.

5:19

Well, it's kind of funny because so

5:21

many different people will say so

5:24

many different things to us about

5:26

like whatever um

5:28

box there they're trying to put us in with

5:31

with their words. But I feel like everybody

5:33

that's even saying that it is just going off

5:35

whatever recent thing they read

5:38

or something probably like whatever was attached

5:40

to us when they read it

5:42

might make them use

5:45

that word when they're talking to us. But I feel like everybody

5:48

understands that, like we don't really know what's

5:50

going on. It's just a lot of different avenues

5:53

happening in the in the

5:55

world that is Turnhaven. So it's like whatever

5:58

genre gets tacked on, it's

6:01

fine, Like I don't really care. I don't think any

6:03

of us really care. We're not really aiming

6:06

to be Um,

6:09

we're not trying to please any of those genres,

6:11

so it doesn't really matter, you know, Sure,

6:14

sure, yeah, I mean that's not that's not the aim.

6:16

But yeah, yeah, I was just writing

6:19

wild. Sure.

6:22

Yeah. It's like whatever whatever label

6:24

gets put on us, like we will, you

6:27

know, we'll accept it to a certain extent and

6:29

then as long as you like it, like that's all we care about.

6:31

Yeah. Sure, if you want to like throw us in

6:34

just some random categories, we'll try and

6:36

like own it for effect, Like sure we're pop

6:41

not sure, Sure, yeah, you're like that's

6:43

that's something you can't control, so that's what

6:45

other people put on you. Um,

6:48

I'd like to focus on Louisville

6:51

because I mean clearly that's where you guys are from and where you're

6:53

based. Were you born and raised there or did

6:55

you come up elsewhere? Yeah?

6:57

I think, um, we all

7:00

pretty much um

7:04

Kentuckiana, you know, like Ethan

7:06

and make our both from southern Indiana, but spent

7:08

a lot of time down in Moible like growing up

7:10

and stuff. And me and Johnny were born and raised

7:12

down here, so we've

7:15

all the music scene was happening like in

7:17

the Leivell so we all kind of integrated

7:19

to that. So as far as coming up in music,

7:21

I think we all would would classify

7:23

Louisville of our our home. Sure,

7:27

and the we're like

7:29

your own personal experience where you like actually

7:32

raised in the city or you raised in kind of the suburbs

7:34

surrounding Louisville. Yeah,

7:36

like different little suburbs

7:38

and small neighborhoods and stuff like. We moved around,

7:41

not a lot, but enough

7:43

to where like I went to three different elementary schools,

7:46

you know, um,

7:48

and then we moved in middle school,

7:50

and then we moved and I was in high school, but I was

7:52

kind of around the same area

7:55

still the whole time. I still went to school

7:57

with rously the same people even though

7:59

we moved. Um,

8:02

but I was in the city

8:05

frequently just because

8:07

it was only like fifty

8:09

minute drive from wherever I was living.

8:13

Sure, sure, yeah, so you experience,

8:15

I mean, it definitely

8:17

seems to be the case with a

8:19

lot of Midwest towns that you know, even

8:22

if you don't live, you know, in the central

8:24

downtown area, it's like you obviously

8:26

end up there because that's where you know things

8:28

are to do. Oh yeah,

8:30

Yeah. It's not like Chicago or New York, where

8:33

you like, the city so massive that there's

8:35

so many people that actually

8:37

just live in the actual

8:39

city. I know, there's neighborhoods

8:41

that are in downtown and stuff like that, for sure, like

8:44

large blocks of neighborhoods, but

8:47

um, for the most part, it almost seems like the

8:49

city of Louisville is all the big building

8:52

but they need to call the city and then all the small

8:54

neighborhoods. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. I

8:56

mean I've always personally had an obsession

8:59

over that city just because as it has such a

9:01

rich musical tapestry that's been

9:03

weaved over it. Like I mean from I'm like thirty

9:05

eight years old, so I started to get into punk and hardcore

9:07

and like you know, I don't know, the mid nineties and

9:10

like a label like Initial Records

9:12

where it was just like and then Crazy

9:15

Fest and like all the things that were happening in that area.

9:17

It just It just blew my mind

9:19

because it was like, you know, most people look at the Midwest

9:21

as being that, you know, they clearly they call it

9:23

the flyover States, and it's like, but

9:26

there's so much exciting things happening,

9:28

and like Louisville was like totally at the center of

9:30

you know, so much creative energy.

9:33

Yeah, my parents were teenagers

9:36

in the nineties and very like um

9:38

stuck on the music scene

9:41

that was happening, And my mom tells me

9:43

stories all the time about the like

9:45

the glory days of the local bands and immovable

9:49

mentioning bands like Flint and Evergreen

9:51

and eleven eleven and all those kinds

9:53

of bands, Like it's it's cool.

9:55

I always like known about it. And my parents

9:58

played music and stuff too, so like it's

10:00

always been um, very

10:02

special to me to be like around

10:05

Louisville. We get to play music in Louisville.

10:08

My dad likes to point out

10:10

different little hallmarks that he thinks are cool

10:12

because he has you know, little

10:14

history lesson notes to give me when

10:16

we do anything that parallels or play

10:19

somewhere that he's like, oh, it's cool you played here

10:21

because of whatever. Wow,

10:24

that's that's pretty cool. That they were

10:27

aware of a lot of

10:30

that. You know, even though you know, a band like Slint

10:32

was you know, obviously pretty kind of popular

10:34

at the time, but you know, they still were underneath

10:37

the surface in many different ways. So that's cool

10:39

that your parents were really keyed into that. Oh

10:42

yeah, it makes for it

10:45

made for some interesting car rides. Like as a

10:47

child, you know, like writing

10:49

around in the in the soundtrack You Got with You

10:51

is like sun Springs and Flint

10:54

and everything. I don't

10:56

really understand, like this isn't

10:58

on the radio. How do I hear this music? Like

11:01

it didn't make any sense to me growing

11:03

up, But yeah, that that stuff

11:05

is um yeah, I mean Spiderland

11:08

is like, you know, an incredible record,

11:10

but like you know, to a five or six year

11:12

old, it's like, what the heck is this? Yeah,

11:16

Well, when you're a kid, like everything so kind

11:18

of um, especially I guess

11:20

as you get older and you're so distant from

11:22

it, it kind of feels like a dream. But like

11:26

being a kid, like everything is so new and like music

11:29

like that, it's so entransic,

11:31

you know, so like being a kid wandering

11:34

around and hearing those songs and you can't remember

11:36

where you heard them when you're like a teenager, and

11:38

like there was a good block of

11:40

time where I was separated from that record because I didn't

11:42

know what it was. Like my dad would play

11:44

it all the time, but I had a period of time where I

11:47

wasn't around my dad for a while, and

11:50

it really wasn't until I think him

11:52

and I had reconnected and he had just put it on

11:54

once and I was like, oh my god, like whoa

11:58

hold on? Needs to those songs? I haven't heard some of like five

12:00

or six, and they were so impactful,

12:02

like I remember what's going to happen next? And yeah,

12:05

that record is incredible. Yeah, no,

12:08

that's really that's such a Yeah,

12:10

that's just a really cool experience. I like that story

12:12

because yeah, it doesn't you know, it's

12:14

not that's not right comment, like, yeah,

12:17

I can't it just the concept of

12:19

of my mother listening, like I always

12:21

remember I tried to like

12:24

and I'm sure you experienced this maybe to a

12:26

certain extent or you had friends that did this where

12:28

it's like, you know, once you kind of dove into the independent

12:31

music scene and you started to like, you know,

12:33

get into a bunch of different bands or whatever, Like I

12:35

so actually this ties back to Louisville, I

12:37

remember, or Louisville. Sorry, I don't want

12:39

to sound like a West Coast person. Louis

12:41

Louisville. There we go, right,

12:46

thank you. But I remember getting

12:48

into Elliott and that record False

12:50

Cathedrals. Uh. You know, it's a beautiful

12:53

record, and I just remember being excited because

12:55

I was like, I think my mom will be into this, and

12:57

then like I bought it for her and like I gave

12:59

it to her and she listen to it. She's like, what is

13:01

this. I don't understand this. I'm like, damn it, it's

13:03

beautiful. Mom. Yeah.

13:05

Yeah, I had that

13:08

that moment with my mom. Once I got to

13:11

be like a teenager and I started, you know, getting

13:13

into all the music that I was separated

13:15

from that was new, like all the stuff that was happening

13:17

when my Space was coming up. And I remember

13:19

trying to show my mom some of that music and she was

13:22

like, what happened to you? What

13:24

did you? What? Bad? Did you

13:26

show her? What? Like? You had to show her? Remember,

13:29

I think I started to show her like Blessed

13:31

the Fall or

13:34

something like that. You know, of

13:36

course, showing her a Schilent drive for

13:38

the first time was cool. Yeah, she was

13:40

super starked on that, especially

13:42

too, because I liked I Honestly, I really

13:45

like that you mentioned those bands because like in

13:47

your head, you know clearly you liked the

13:49

you know, aggressive parts of it combined with melody,

13:51

like you know, it all makes sense and

13:54

like in your kid brain you're like, oh,

13:57

like there's pretty singing. So like my parents

13:59

probably would like this, like listen and

14:01

they're like, what the hell is this? I

14:04

was just so excited that it was something

14:06

I hadn't heard before, Like it was that

14:09

my theme was kind of coming up. Like obviously

14:11

they borrowed a lot from metal cores that was

14:13

going on like in the early two thousands,

14:15

and then put their own, like the emo kind

14:17

of twist on it that turned that into what

14:19

it was. But I wasn't aware of that. It's like

14:21

fourteen fifteen, you know, like

14:24

I had no concept of what early two thousands

14:26

medal cores was. No. I was just saying stuff

14:28

on my face and there.

14:31

Um. So when my mom was like, hey,

14:33

listen to this music I've never heard before, she was like, pressed,

14:36

this stun that's

14:39

so good. I love that. H

14:42

What was what was like the makeup of your household.

14:44

Like you know, you mentioned you spent

14:46

some time away from your father, Like did you have brothers and sisters?

14:48

Were your parents divorced, Like what was the scenario?

14:51

So, I mean, like I said, they were teenagers

14:54

in the nineties and I was born in so

14:56

they were very young whenever. Whenever they

14:58

had me, her mom was like fifteen,

15:01

my dad was seventeen. So you know, teenagers

15:04

and kids don't don't really mix. So

15:06

they just didn't didn't work out after

15:09

a year or two, and so

15:11

I pretty much love with my mom

15:13

and uh, she had had boyfriends

15:15

and stuff. So like I have,

15:18

I have four brothers. Actually I have three

15:21

brothers that I grew up with UM

15:24

in the house with me at all times. When I have another brother

15:27

with my dad, Um, he

15:29

lived kind of with on my dad's side the

15:32

whole time. So my household grown up

15:34

mostly was me and my mom and my three

15:36

brothers, a bunch of dogs and cats and

15:39

uh, for the longest extense of

15:41

it, my youngest brother's father aid

15:44

my whole brother, Hayden, his dad lets live with us

15:47

for like sixteen seventeen

15:49

years or so, Like they just split

15:51

up a few years ago, So that was mostly

15:54

what I was around. Wow.

15:56

Yeah, so a lot of stuff going on, Yeah,

15:59

a lot of a lot of lot of things, right,

16:01

yeah, a lot of Like did you I

16:04

mean I had a similar experience, except

16:06

it was you know, I lived with my mom and then

16:09

you know, spent time with my dad. And I always remember

16:12

how you know, like ages

16:14

eight to like I don't know, twelve or so, when

16:16

you started to understand, like you know, the

16:18

human to human relationship of people dating

16:20

and all that sort of stuff, and like my dad would

16:23

you know, like take me on dates and stuff like that

16:25

just to you know, like the minister golfing or whatever.

16:27

Um. But I remember how like it

16:30

was just a weird experience. Like I don't know if I

16:32

mean, it sounds like you probably had maybe not

16:34

going out on dates or whatever, but like you know, similar

16:36

ish experiences. Oh

16:39

yeah. And it was always just kind of a little bit confusing,

16:41

you know, like there would

16:43

be someone around for a while and get attached to

16:45

them, and then there would be some reason that

16:47

they would be gone. Um, usually

16:50

valid reasons. Um there was because

16:52

my parents grew up super young and we

16:54

were broke. You know, there's just that typical archetype.

16:57

I guess it's just people

16:59

that got into the wrong things found in the drugs

17:01

and stuff around. So like when those people

17:03

would cause problems, my mom didn't want that to

17:06

be around us anymore. So that was great.

17:08

But um,

17:10

it wasn't really too awkward, like I remember, growing

17:13

up was actually pretty cool. Like ninety

17:15

percent of the time, it was pretty cool, but it was just

17:17

always different. And when I reconnected

17:20

with my dad that that was exactly

17:23

like you said. It was around when I was like eleven

17:26

eleven or twelve or so, and I had I

17:29

guess that's just the waters. It's cool with my parents,

17:31

and I started seeing him every weekend. And

17:33

at the same time, I had decided that I wanted

17:36

to start playing playing music, so

17:38

I got a guitar. My opah actually

17:41

got me a guitar for Christmas. About first guitar,

17:44

and when I would go to see

17:46

my dad every weekend, even like teach me songs

17:48

and stuff. So that was where

17:50

we like really bonded. And

17:53

of course that's when he starts telling me all these

17:55

stories about growing up and Blueville

17:57

music scene, and I just like fell

17:59

in love with it all. Agree again, like I loved it as a kid,

18:01

but I was away from it for so long and then showing

18:03

me resonect that I've had like a new appreciation

18:06

for it. Ben heard any of those songs,

18:08

Like I said, it's like a good eight

18:12

years or so between I've ever heard any farms.

18:15

It was really cool. Yeah, No, that's

18:17

a that is a cool experience. And also it is a cool

18:20

experience when you are able to, um,

18:23

you know, like reconnect with a loved one in

18:25

a way that you

18:27

you know, didn't originally understand,

18:30

Like oh, like wow, I can bond with this

18:32

person over you know, sports

18:34

or guitar whatever, like just once

18:36

you like actually create a relationship as

18:38

opposed to like just being a member of the

18:40

family. That's when it it's like, oh, this is

18:43

like special, this is really cool. Yeah,

18:46

there's a really special connection between like

18:48

me and my mom, my dad, um

18:50

all through music. Like I think we're really

18:53

really close because of it, because we were all

18:55

like super nerdy about it and like we'll seek

18:57

out about records and like me

18:59

and dad are both like um

19:02

collectors of sorts when it comes to vinyl

19:04

and posters and stuff like

19:06

that. So I feel like it's

19:08

this unspoken competition. Sometimes

19:10

when I go over there and he's like, look what I just got, and

19:12

I'm like, yeah, well look what I just got.

19:16

It's it's fun, you know, like, yeah, you're

19:19

right, you're you're both into the same things, which is like,

19:21

you know, that's a real Yeah, it's a bonding

19:23

moment and it it also

19:26

and I'm sure you noticed this too, like the

19:28

moment that you start to view

19:30

your parents as like human, that's

19:33

when it's like, oh yeah, like they don't

19:35

like they don't know what they're doing either, Like I don't

19:37

know what I'm doing. They don't know what they're doing, Like

19:39

we're all just makes

19:42

sense when you accept that your

19:44

parents and and the rest of your family and everybody,

19:47

when you open up and realize that everyone is

19:50

just a human trying to figure it out, it

19:52

makes a lot of a lot of things makes sense. And you

19:54

can forgive a lot of things that way too, you know, like

19:57

going back to chy to just being a little bit crazy

20:00

easy, like my dad being gone for a while,

20:02

Like it was once I realized, like,

20:04

my that's just human, and like some

20:07

things were out of control, So them were some choices

20:09

you Mabel Good somewhere and here

20:12

we are and now we have a great relationship. So like

20:15

I don't need to hold onto anything like that,

20:17

like you're a human being

20:19

or seventeen. I don't know how I would kid of that at

20:21

all, Like totally,

20:23

yeah, yeah, yeah, I think you have to.

20:26

I think it's weird too that

20:28

we like almost separate

20:30

that, you know, like there is

20:32

this thing that people kind of put on you,

20:34

the oh you you can't. They

20:36

almost humanize your parents sometimes, you know,

20:38

it's just just an authority figure half the time,

20:41

like supposed to love care for you when you listen

20:43

to them. Well yeah, but like I

20:46

should learn from them

20:49

from their mistakes too, you know, like's

20:51

not I don't know, it's just the

20:53

whole. Yeah, no, it's

20:56

totally. It's like you you

20:59

you love and back your parents, and you look

21:01

up to them and you look up to them as role models

21:03

and then you know, when you find out their flawed

21:05

individuals, it, you know, you have to recalibrate.

21:07

You're like, okay, well they make

21:09

mistakes, and you know, I think to your

21:12

point, when you are honest

21:14

about this with your children

21:16

at whatever age, and just like oh

21:18

yeah, like I I you know, I know

21:21

more than you because you're like, you know ten,

21:23

but I still there's a lot of

21:25

things I don't know, you know, just like that

21:27

sort of level playing field where it's like, yeah, I'm

21:30

more advanced than you, but that doesn't mean that I'm

21:32

perfect, because clearly I'm not. So that's cool.

21:34

It's just I like that that that relationship

21:37

you were, that real relationship you're able to create, that's

21:39

cool. It's it's hard to like kind

21:42

of explain it something because I feel like it is a little

21:44

bit of the unique scenario where like my mom and

21:46

I kind of grew up together, you know, so like we

21:50

we felt really probably more equal

21:52

than most like parents and their

21:55

kids do because we both had to like hold

21:57

ship down, you know, Like my mom was

21:59

relying on me a to like help out without

22:01

like you need to help me keep some order

22:04

around. So like, um,

22:07

she was super honest with me about everything always

22:09

growing up like probably more southern more parents

22:11

would be with their kids, and that helped

22:13

me understand my mom is

22:15

like a human being, like for the majority

22:18

of growing up, like I

22:20

could like understand some of the things

22:22

that we had to we had to do totally.

22:26

No, that's cool. And so, like you said,

22:28

music was such a you know, integral part to your life,

22:30

and you know your parents raised

22:32

you around it. Um And

22:35

like you said, you know, once you kind of got into the

22:37

you know, the MySpace era of those bands

22:39

and stuff like that, was that when you kind of felt

22:41

like you started to you know, I guess author

22:44

your own taste in a way, was that the first time

22:46

you kind of felt like, oh, wow, I'm finding out about

22:48

these bands that oh yeah, okay. Like

22:50

a friend of mine had come up to me

22:53

on the bus in middle school and like it was really

22:55

funny because he just walked up to me, was like, hey, you play

22:57

guitar? Right, said yeah he was my

23:00

cousin just got a face for Christmas,

23:02

and I just got a drum set. You want to start

23:05

a band? It's like yeah. So I

23:07

started playing with these kids, and they

23:10

were the ones showing me that, like they

23:12

were still local bands and mobile,

23:15

you know, like you could go to shows. Like they

23:17

went to shows all the time. They had friends that played

23:19

shows and bands, and I didn't

23:22

know that that was the thing. I didn't know I could drive

23:24

thirty minutes to a venue and and hang out

23:26

with kids. Listen to music and watch

23:28

shows as often as I wanted to. So that was life

23:30

changing. Um. But

23:32

then also you know, they were teenagers finding

23:34

out about new music, so they were the ones showing

23:36

me like my space and where

23:39

to find these bands. And I would just

23:41

constantly be asking me like who is this, Like who

23:44

are you listening to? Like how did you find that? And

23:46

oh yeah, it's I was addicted for

23:48

a while, you know, like anything that remotely

23:51

sounded like it had breakdowns

23:53

and screams and it was it had you

23:55

know, thirty likes on my Space whatever

23:57

I was about it, I was like trying to find any

24:00

and everything I could. You know, it

24:02

just felt like an inmless well of new

24:05

music. It was awesome. Yeah,

24:08

that's really I love that

24:10

feeling, you know, just the enthusiasm of you talking

24:12

about it right there. It really, Um,

24:14

it is so exciting when you, you know, lift

24:17

up that rock and you start to find all

24:19

these bands and then you start to feel like you go

24:21

down rabbit holes where you're just like, wow, dude,

24:23

I'm like seven steps removed

24:25

from the band that is like huge,

24:27

and then like you're talking about where it's like, dude, I just found

24:29

this band. That has like four plays on my

24:31

Space and like they're so unique,

24:33

you know, so good. Yeah, some of

24:36

them were so good, you know. Yeah,

24:39

it's it's incredible And and

24:42

did you find you know, because most people

24:44

opine about the idea of you

24:46

know, music discovery changing

24:49

over time, where it was like, oh, yeah, you had to read

24:51

the thanks list and like, you know whatever,

24:54

do a lot of research to that. But

24:57

you know, in my opinion, even though like

24:59

I exist did in that era of reading thank

25:01

you lists, like I also found the

25:03

idea of digitally tripping across

25:05

these bands kind of just as exciting and

25:07

obviously easier, but like, I don't know, like

25:10

it's just a different experience. Yeah,

25:12

I mean, I feel like it's inevitable

25:15

that things and mediums

25:18

um are going to change always,

25:21

you know, like the way people find music

25:23

is always gonna evolved, because I

25:25

just I think that our our

25:27

mediums are forever going to be evolving, you

25:29

know, like we're I don't know how

25:31

people are gonna find music in the future with

25:34

some weird ether as

25:36

touchscreen touch lists whatever.

25:38

I don't know. I couldn't even begin to tell

25:40

you what kind of no device she

25:43

will have. But like

25:46

some people get really um upset

25:49

that that's how people find music. But how

25:51

are how else are they opposed to like the bands

25:53

that we're talking about and the scenes

25:55

that we're talking about. And these kids,

25:58

they're like thirteen fourteen years old, like they have the

26:00

Internet, they have the fuff, They have their phones

26:02

at their fingertips, and their friends are telling them to

26:04

go YouTube this. They're gonna soundtop that. Well, you know

26:06

they're gonna do that. There's no zeines um.

26:10

I mean, there's not no zine. There's plenty of d I Y

26:12

zines out there now, which I think is awesome that's

26:14

coming back. But that was the staple. Like you've got

26:16

a magazine, You look through the magazine, you saw the

26:19

new releases and if

26:21

they were like the artwork is cool, the

26:23

band name was cool, and you wanted to find

26:25

out about it, like you figured out a way and go find that CD.

26:28

Um. At least that's what I've heard. I didn't get to do that. I

26:31

was all all my online space

26:33

for the most part, but that was it. Go

26:35

to bands, fund their friends friends

26:37

list, and just keep going down to click on all

26:40

eight and open up eight tabs and just check them

26:42

out. Like I

26:44

don't know, Yeah, it's exciting, totally

26:46

exciting, like it was, especially

26:48

when you're young, I guess addicting

26:51

it feels like magic because half of

26:53

us, I feel like in the age group

26:55

that we're at, like probably

26:58

just now getting a laptop, probably having

27:00

like a family computer in the living room

27:02

or something like that, when you're looking through these bands, like for

27:06

sure, yeah, I know my own computer sitting

27:09

at the library like on my face,

27:11

trying to find new music. Totally

27:13

totally yeah, And it's it's it's it's

27:17

all just a different discovery tool and

27:19

discovery mechanism and like, yes, in certain respects

27:21

it was easier, but it's not to say that

27:23

you weren't putting work into

27:25

it, because you were. You're totally

27:28

working. Don't give people enough

27:30

credits about being just as excited, um

27:33

now about music as they were in any other

27:35

generation. Like we there's different ways

27:38

that we operate, but like I don't think

27:40

that kids nowadays are any less

27:42

excited about music than any other generation

27:44

prior, like especially

27:47

right now, like right now, there's so

27:49

many cool fans happening

27:52

and like actually like growing

27:55

right now, like it

27:57

seems, and some of the bands that have been around for

27:59

a while, taking a hiatus for coming back like

28:01

he is Legend and Daughters making

28:03

an appearance again

28:06

on the scene is in pain and

28:08

they're fucking putting out

28:10

some of the coolest stuff that they've put out, like

28:13

music right now is incredibly exciting.

28:16

Yeah, totally, I agree. Yeah, you just gotta

28:18

you just gotta look for it and stay engaged. That's the only way.

28:21

Support for today show comes from Sonos,

28:23

who is the best thing ever. My son would

28:26

agree, But

28:29

we have our entire house outfitted

28:32

with Sonos. We have it in the

28:34

downstairs living room, we have it in my

28:36

son's room, and we also just

28:39

recently got a Sonos bar for our TV

28:41

that sound spectacular. We're get

28:43

still getting it dialed in in regards to

28:46

um you know how it's working with our TV and the rest of our

28:48

system. But man, it is so easy

28:50

to set up. You can open the box

28:52

and within five minutes you will

28:54

be connecting it to your existing

28:57

WiFi network and streaming your

28:59

favorite music through there. It has changed the

29:01

way that I listen to music, and I

29:03

think it will change yours as well. So please

29:05

go to Sonos dot com check out their entire

29:08

line of speakers. It's

29:10

amazing. And they also have this really really cool feature

29:12

called true Play in which

29:14

you set up your speaker and you

29:17

tune it to that particular room. You use your iPhone

29:19

and you walk around using the microphone

29:22

and it uh, you know, detects

29:24

the contours of the room and it tunes it perfectly,

29:28

so your speaker will sound absolutely

29:30

incredible in that room. So so nos is

29:32

hands down the best speakers I have ever

29:34

listened to in my entire life. And yeah, there's

29:37

no reason that you should not have one, two,

29:39

three, four, maybe even forty

29:41

in your house. Okay, I know it's a little exaggeration,

29:44

but still, sos is the best sons

29:46

dot com and you will find the speaker

29:49

that will make you listen to music in a different way.

29:51

Thank you very much, SOS. So I'm gonna guess

29:53

that, like once you started to you know, take

29:55

a deep dive and you know, really really get into

29:58

music and you know, start to go to shows and experience

30:00

all of that, did the idea immediately

30:03

kind of click in your head that yes, I'm going

30:05

to play in a band that is like my goal or

30:07

did that just kind of come about sort of casually

30:09

over time, I think,

30:12

Um, I'll talk about this a lot. Like I

30:15

was like ten eleven years

30:17

old watching probably

30:20

some tape that my dad put together

30:23

and then's a bunch of Nirvana performances.

30:26

But like I remember watching this tape every weekend

30:28

with my dad's and I was just like, I'm gonna do

30:30

that like period, Like

30:33

I don't really give a ship about

30:35

literally anything else. That's

30:37

what I'm gonna do. Um,

30:39

And my dad ryd of gave me the tools to make

30:41

that like real. Like when I would tell him I wanted

30:43

to play music, He's like, well, if you gonna play music, you need

30:45

to learn how to play music. And

30:48

he would keep me in check. But I would come to his house

30:50

like every weekend and not have any

30:52

progress on the guitar, playing

30:55

the riff the same way I played it last weekend.

30:57

Told me like, if you're not practicing, and I

30:59

can tell I mean he uh.

31:01

He really made me work on it as

31:03

a discipline. But he like also he

31:06

was in bands. He had been on a tour

31:08

too, you know, he kind of dipped his feet into

31:10

being able to do that. So it's like all of these things

31:12

you're talking about like are

31:15

real, Like you might not jump on

31:17

MTV like as soon as you start doing it, and

31:19

you definitely don't want to, but um,

31:22

it's a real thing, like people are working musicians

31:25

that tour and enjoy themselves.

31:27

Like it's it's definitely very real. So my dad

31:29

was really supportive the whole time, and as

31:32

soon as I started talking about it, it was just like staying

31:34

in that fire. For sure, that's

31:37

funny, mom too, But

31:39

like it was always something I

31:42

was interested in, and once

31:44

it became viable, as

31:46

he took it and run with it, like I

31:48

didn't have any interest in anything else. Sure,

31:51

no, that's cool. It's yeah, it's

31:53

a you know, clearly an opposite

31:55

reaction from the way that many parents

31:58

treats like yeah, hey I'm playing

32:00

a band. Most parents like that's cool, but just

32:02

like don't let it, you know, like

32:04

go go badly or whatever. Oh

32:07

yeah, they're very vultible about like this

32:09

is a hobby until it's not. But I

32:12

just didn't ever agree with that, which

32:15

I mean I agreed with it. I understood while they were

32:17

saying that, like you don't want your kids

32:19

just going out there and being a little bit blind, like

32:21

I'm gonna be a rock star and let themselves

32:24

kind of go to ruin. But uh,

32:28

they're pretty healthy about it. Like I went to school,

32:30

you know, like I did all the things that was supposed to do,

32:32

and as long as I was doing that, they let

32:34

me do whatever I want as far as music

32:36

goes, that was our our deal.

32:39

That's struggle and you're

32:41

all right, sure, yeah,

32:44

And so I'm gonna guess that Gray Haven was not

32:46

your first band, Like you probably played in a

32:48

bunch of bands before that. Oh

32:50

yeah, like that middle school band I'd

32:53

mentioned before, and then like I had a bunch of basically

32:56

different reincarnations of that with the same

32:58

people that it all pretty much sounded

33:00

like middle kid middle kid music. You know. It wasn't

33:03

than anything, um

33:05

very cool, but it was always

33:08

cutting our teeth. Like everything that I

33:10

had been a part of. We at

33:12

least tried to play shows, and that

33:14

was something that I, um, I wasn't

33:16

used to before that. So from then it was like,

33:19

okay, picking up new pieces

33:21

of this puzzle every time I tried to do this thing.

33:24

So that time Great Handing came along, it was probably my

33:26

fifth sixth like band

33:30

and were Yeah, we had

33:32

toured a little bit in a prior band

33:35

and kind of knew what we were doing a little

33:37

bit enough that we thought we could like maybe

33:40

do this one right

33:42

from the beginning, you know, like maybe

33:44

we could like start

33:47

off on the right foot this time instead

33:51

of just like going into the fire

33:53

and just kid sucked up the whole time. And they're like, oh,

33:55

that was fun for a minute. It took years

33:57

to be fun totally

34:00

totally, So what, um what, I

34:03

guess what stylistically was that

34:06

that band that you know, you guys were

34:08

playing out a little bit and you know, what what were

34:10

you going for? I

34:12

think that's kind of been a consistent theme

34:15

that, Um, we've never really thought

34:17

about that, Like every

34:20

kind of group up been and it's just kind of been

34:22

whoever is in the room doing whatever

34:24

instruments they pick up and

34:27

seeing what happens. Um, when

34:29

I would show up at vand practices, it's my dad,

34:31

and like we would have jam sessions

34:33

and stuff on the weekend. That was kind of always

34:36

how it went, just like don't even think about it, just like,

34:38

let's just play something. If you have something, if

34:40

you're working on, let's let's dam it. And

34:43

um, I think I've brought some of that mentality

34:45

to every every

34:47

band I've been a part of two Like, we don't

34:49

really have to think about it too too much, Like

34:51

let's just kind of start

34:54

throwing ideas out there and if we like something

34:56

collectively, then we'll move forward. Because

34:59

if we all four like it, then it represents

35:01

all four of us. Then, Um,

35:04

that's that's pretty much our sound. Then, you know,

35:06

like sure what you're

35:08

doing right? Well, it definitely sounds

35:10

like you guys are are what I would

35:12

classify as like you know everything

35:15

but the kitchen Sinc. Band where you know, you guys

35:17

are you guys throw a bunch of riffs and a

35:19

blender, uh, you know, kind of cut like honestly,

35:21

they're band like the kinship that

35:23

I see with bands from like

35:25

the late nineties where it's or late nighties really

35:27

two thousands, like um, that band

35:30

God Forbid, like their first record determination.

35:32

Um, there's a lot of similarities I see with you guys

35:34

and them. And there's this other random band that I

35:37

highly doubt you have heard just because they you

35:39

know, they really didn't do very much. Is this band called

35:41

Locked in a Vacancy there from the New

35:43

York area. But it was just like the

35:46

whole palette of like

35:49

heavy music from yeah, like

35:51

you know, anything under that umbrella you

35:53

guys would throw into there. And it sounds like that

35:56

has always been kind of the case even before

35:58

Grey Haven. Yeah,

36:00

I mean we did it super poorly always,

36:04

and we could. We could definitely start

36:07

mentioning we might not have pulled it off bet a

36:09

couple of times with some of the stuff we do with Great

36:11

Haven, but we we we definitely always tried,

36:14

and it was always very much so like

36:17

we were committed to whatever we were doing, like

36:19

whatever ideas we decided we were gonna

36:22

like actually do and work on, committed

36:25

to making it sounds the best that it could.

36:28

Uh, And that's that's the fun of it, you know.

36:31

I was always a big fan of bands that like didn't

36:33

really give a shit about um,

36:35

this song or that song. Was just like, this

36:38

is just what we're doing. Sometimes

36:40

that works, sometimes it doesn't, you know. But

36:43

I think one of the things that made

36:45

that super easy too is a lot of me

36:47

and my friends grew up with just

36:50

being a huge system of a down fans and

36:52

like hypnotizing mesmerianes are so

36:55

insane, Like I don't

36:57

even know how to describe those records to this day,

36:59

I don't know what record that the

37:02

parallel those two records, and

37:05

I would think that almost our whole group would agree

37:07

at least at least there's

37:09

just nothing else that sounds like that. Yeah,

37:13

so we kind of thought it was like fine, sure,

37:16

no it Yeah that

37:18

Honestly, that's a very interesting prism because

37:21

I think a lot of people can look

37:23

at System of a Down now and obviously

37:25

appreciate what they did and you

37:27

know, put them up in

37:29

the same you know ecosystem as bands like Rage

37:32

Against the Machine and all that sort of stuff. Um.

37:34

But yeah, but it is interesting because it's like most

37:37

people, like, as System of a Down started

37:39

to you know, pop with Toxicity and stuff like that, people

37:41

were just like, this is

37:43

this, this is terrible, Like I don't understand

37:45

this at all, but like, but

37:48

the fact that it was so massively successful,

37:50

like it broke a lot of people's brains and

37:53

uh, yeah, I just I see what you're talking about

37:55

though. Oh it was enormous.

37:57

Like I remember being talking about

37:59

being kid again, like my

38:02

mom was the one who bought Toxicity and brought it

38:04

home, Like she's the one that put

38:06

it on in the car was like, listen this fucking record

38:08

I just found and me and my brothers

38:10

were like losing our ships. Was

38:13

five, six years old, like just losing

38:15

our minds to that record. So like

38:18

I remember being in middle school and my friend Matthew

38:20

wrote down in my agenda when Hypnotized

38:23

came out and I went and got it like that day.

38:26

Um yeah, they were. They were

38:28

huge for me and they were just enormous. My

38:31

my dad actually took me to see them for work

38:33

tour I was six fourteen.

38:38

Man, like that. They were one of those bands

38:40

that like, we

38:42

don't obviously strive to

38:44

sound like them, because that would be painfully

38:46

obvious and horrible. We would just not do

38:49

that justice. So but

38:51

they're definitely like when we think we're

38:53

getting a little too out there, I can kind of be

38:56

like, whoa, I mean, look

38:58

at all the bands that we love some Stillinger

39:00

and System and Conferge and Daughters

39:03

and stuff, and we're like they did they

39:05

like, we're not trying to do that, but like they

39:07

went there, let's let's uh,

39:09

let's go for it, you know, let's

39:12

just do our saying see

39:14

if it works. Totally, no,

39:16

totally totally that and it's. Um.

39:20

So you know, at most bands

39:22

that kind of exist in the space that you

39:25

do where you know, like you you've done

39:27

touring, you know, you put out a record on a reputable

39:29

label, and you know, you guys still

39:32

are not at and not not at

39:34

home anywhere. You know, like there's no bill

39:36

that there's no bill that you play on where it's like, oh,

39:38

this makes like complete and total sense. Um,

39:42

it's you know, I'm sure you guys

39:44

are obviously used to that at this point. Um,

39:46

does it become I guess, uh,

39:49

not frustrating, but it's to become like kind

39:51

of you know, uh, man, that's a that's a bummer

39:53

that will we can't find like the complete

39:56

right fit anywhere. Um, or

39:58

maybe you do find a fit and it you

40:00

know, like you're not able to do as many dates

40:02

as you'd like to do with a band. Or is it you know you

40:04

guys are just following your north star of being you

40:06

know, metallic weirdos. Yeah.

40:09

I think we definitely take the north

40:11

star approach for sure, because we're

40:14

always kind of um,

40:16

we're always just kind of sticking to our to ourselves.

40:19

Um as far as I mean, we're not gonna

40:21

change anything, you know, so if we're not going to change

40:23

anything, you might as well own it. And

40:26

honestly, I don't think we really

40:29

experienced a lot of moments

40:33

where it's it's actually felt like,

40:35

uh, it's gotten in the way of anything. I

40:38

mean, there's there's definitely shows

40:40

where we'll play

40:43

a primarily like hardcore show and we're

40:45

the one weird band on the bill, and

40:47

uh, you know, sometimes people don't

40:49

really know what to make of it. But and

40:52

that that can feel like, oh, man, like there's

40:55

there's a lot of people here and it seems

40:57

like maybe more people

40:59

than we thought Warren't is. Uh, Warren't

41:01

is on board. But we almost get,

41:05

um, the opposite response once we

41:07

stopped playing and start talking to people, Like

41:09

people were like, no, yeah, I just didn't know what the hell

41:11

was going on, you know, but I liked it, And

41:14

it's like, oh, well, I can understand that.

41:17

Um, But we we kind of really enjoyed

41:19

the multi genre aspect. You know. We've played

41:22

shows with indie bands and we

41:25

love that, and we like playing with our friends

41:27

and super heavy bands and those shows are super fun,

41:29

and I mean, I don't know, I kind

41:31

of love the fact that we can play anywhere

41:34

and we either like freak people out or they're

41:36

just all about it and that I love that actually,

41:38

like I kind of I kind of love just

41:43

yeah. I mean you might as well, like if you're gonna

41:46

hate it, like that's cool. We at

41:48

least we did the best we possibly could. I

41:50

remember there was a show we played in Texas when we're like

41:52

really still, like this

41:54

is a few years ago, so we weren't playing

41:57

birthday shows if we played this hardcore show. And

42:00

I mean we played the best we could. Man. We had

42:02

a good set. We were we were pretty tired. I

42:04

felt really good about it, and like I looked up

42:06

before we played and they were probably like twenty some

42:09

people in there. And then like that time we got

42:11

done with like the third song, I think there are five people

42:13

and they were I was like, all

42:15

right, I mean, weren't

42:17

this is the best that we can do. Man, we're

42:20

I think we're killing it right now. Yeah,

42:25

like we're we're trying over here, like there's there's

42:28

no shortage of efforts. Yeah,

42:30

it's not about it. That's fine. Yeah.

42:33

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43:45

No, that's I like

43:47

that I mean, yeah, you do. At

43:50

a certain point, like you you start to be able

43:52

to pick up people

43:54

that understand where you're coming from. And I think

43:56

that when you are a band, like

43:59

what you guys do, you inspire

44:01

a reaction, you know, either extremely

44:03

positive or extremely negative. And I think

44:05

that, you know, at the end of the day, that is a

44:08

crucial piece of creating art.

44:10

Like if you're not creating a reaction, then you

44:12

know, you're just falling right in the middle. It's no one

44:15

cares. Yeah, you definitely

44:17

don't want to, um, like just put something

44:19

out that's just gonna sit in the middle, and

44:22

you know, never do anything, you know, like just

44:24

kind of be something that someone noticed

44:27

and it's just nothing in

44:29

their in their mind, you know, at least

44:31

if someone sees us and they absolutely hate

44:33

it, and someone mentions us thinking like oh yeah, I fucking

44:36

hated that, man, I like obnoxious

44:38

and this and that like awesome and that's

44:41

fine, or or the opposite,

44:43

you know, like, um, when people come up to us

44:45

and tell us that they really like it, I'm always just incredibly

44:48

grateful because I know it's we

44:50

do get thrown on really random bills and I don't

44:53

understand who's out there listening,

44:55

you know, and so every every

44:57

person that tells us that they like it, I'm just like, yeah,

45:00

God, like another way, Yeah there's another one on our

45:02

tribe. Yeah. So,

45:05

as you started to get out there and tour, do

45:07

you like touring? Because I know some people

45:09

have a mixed relationship

45:11

with it where they understand it's you know, part of getting

45:13

your band out there. And then some people you

45:16

just don't like it because of the um you

45:18

know, they're natural introverts or whatever. So like where

45:20

do you sit on the spectrum? Um?

45:23

I do feel a little introverted. So the

45:25

social aspect of touring is a little

45:28

um it's it's really nice,

45:30

but it takes me a minute to kind

45:32

of get into the group, you know,

45:35

Like I always feel really

45:38

nervous to meet like the other bands that we're touring

45:41

with that every single time we go out, I almost

45:43

feel like I make like fifteen best friends.

45:45

Everybody we were retorted with has been really

45:48

really awesome. Um So I do love

45:50

that. I love me

45:53

meaning a bunch of new people and seeing all the

45:55

the sites, Like, traveling is one of

45:57

my favorite things in the world. Should

46:00

shows are super fun. I just feel

46:02

like I get like, um,

46:05

I don't know how to handle like talking to a bunch of people who

46:07

want you know. Then,

46:09

like I was showing merch for a long time, so tour

46:11

was a little bit more more

46:14

stressful. But since we've kind of brought someone else

46:16

to do that, like I get to a take, take

46:18

a decompression break right after we play for

46:20

like five minutes and made all the difference in

46:23

the world. I mean, I love it as a whole for

46:25

sure. It's my favorite thing in the world.

46:27

Like get to play music every day and hang

46:29

out with your friends every day. You're seeing a new city

46:31

every day, Like when you have

46:33

money for the first week and try out a bunch

46:35

of local restaurants

46:38

and then you realize you can't because it's week two and

46:40

you're having more money. Yep,

46:42

totally yeah, you're like run into that, mall

46:45

right. But I mean yeah, I

46:47

kind of like the chaos of it, you know, like

46:50

I kind of, um,

46:53

there's there's a part of me that really gravitates

46:55

towards towards a bunch of chaos. Um,

46:59

So I do tend to really like it, even

47:01

when it's a bit frustrating, you know, when

47:03

bands breakdown or shows,

47:06

the cancel, you get stuck or any of that kind of stuff.

47:08

Like it's frustrating, but it's

47:10

not one of those things that it

47:12

comes with the territory, you know. So a lot of

47:14

things about touring that suck, like the

47:16

heat and cold, it just comes with

47:18

it. You kind of learned to be like, well, it's about

47:21

it tonight, Hopefully it'll be

47:23

better in the morning. Yep, no, totally.

47:26

Yeah, it's all I mean touring,

47:28

even though it's not real life, it

47:30

is a microcosm of real life because

47:33

then you're you know, you're experiencing all

47:35

of the things the highs and lows that people experience

47:38

on any given day, you know, even if

47:40

it's because most people don't realize

47:42

that I haven't been on tour that you

47:45

know, it's painfully boring

47:47

and routine, Like you're just a

47:49

lot of driving and like you're hanging out

47:51

in places you don't know anybody,

47:54

and like, yeah, it's you know, it's not as glamorous

47:56

as obviously people you know commonly are

47:59

only so fun. You

48:02

only throw the frisbee around. You'd

48:05

be here at the venue at two o'clock. The show is not till

48:08

nine, Like what the stuff were I supposed to do for

48:10

the next seven hours? Right, Yeah,

48:13

there's a there's a lot of time to kill and yeah,

48:15

I don't have any way to kill it because it doesn't

48:17

seem like we're near anything to like go walk

48:19

there. Yeah. I've started

48:22

to bring things with

48:24

me to make tours more more

48:27

enjoyable, hands and more productive, Like

48:29

I I do some

48:32

graphic design work on the side and there

48:34

with with bands, and got

48:37

into the habit to try and pick up projects

48:39

right before we leave so that I have something

48:42

to do. Like in my downtime when

48:44

I was sitting around, I can just pull my laptop out

48:46

and start photoshopping for a while. And I

48:49

really like that. Yeah, and it gives

48:51

me like I don't have anywhere else to be, I don't

48:53

have anything else to do, Like I'm

48:55

not, you know, bailing

48:57

on anybody by doing this for four

49:00

hours, Like I'm actually just enjoying

49:02

myself for a while. You

49:04

know, I'm bringing some books and stuff and um,

49:08

my friend of mine just told me a tip to

49:10

bring hammock on the next

49:12

one, so that might yeah,

49:16

right, a comfortable get a comfortable spot.

49:18

Yeah, yeah,

49:21

Um, you know, a lot a lot has

49:23

been you know spoken about, you know,

49:25

of your first of your last LP, you

49:28

know, talking because clearly the focus of

49:30

it was you know, the drug epidemic and you know, opioids

49:32

and how that stuff has affected

49:34

your community and how it's affected you know, your

49:37

own personal life. Um,

49:39

you know, you yourself, Like did

49:41

you just basically kind of see

49:44

the experiences that people had with

49:47

drugs and drug abuse and

49:49

just kind of like lean on those experiences

49:51

so you didn't fall into it? Or like how

49:53

did that kind of you know, how did you

49:55

kind of stay above it in many

49:58

respects from that perspective? Um,

50:01

I mean, honestly, it's just it's

50:04

just kind of scared the hell I didn't, you know, because

50:07

my mom being as honest as she

50:09

was growing up, like she told me all

50:13

the time, like you have a

50:15

you have addictive genes, you know, so

50:18

if you do some of this stuff, like you're probably

50:21

really really gonna like it and you're

50:23

probably gonna end up with a problem,

50:25

like so just think about that, like,

50:28

um, and then I always kind of stuck with me

50:31

and my mom also knowing what she

50:33

did growing up and

50:35

how she really wasn't told the

50:37

right things here and there. Um,

50:40

sometimes she would just assume that like I was

50:42

already in the middle of doing stupid chair

50:44

like smoking cigarettes and you're like nine or

50:46

something like that. Like I didn't. I didn't do any of that, but

50:48

my mom would sometimes make like, uh

50:51

jokes about I'm already doing that or like

50:54

just kind of checked me and see, and I'd be like

50:56

always kind of but it was kind

50:58

of frustrated what she would do that like smart man, like I'm

51:01

smarter than that like doing it.

51:04

So there was a part of me, I guess

51:06

that always like I wanted to keep

51:08

that up too, you know, like

51:10

I didn't even It

51:13

wasn't even until I really started like going out with my

51:15

friends that I realized like, oh, well, I'm like twenty

51:17

years old, Like I can have drinks with my

51:19

friends. It's fine. But um,

51:23

as far as anything like hard

51:26

like that, It's just it's always always scared

51:28

me. I never realized like or understood

51:30

like why why people

51:32

would want to do that. It wasn't until

51:35

I got older that I realized how people got

51:37

um involved in that almost

51:40

involuntarily sometimes, And you know, I became

51:43

really compassionate with about it because

51:45

I had seen so much of my family and friends

51:48

and UM to

51:50

be affected to buy it. And it was always

51:52

the top people of conversation, you

51:55

know, in some form or another. So it just was

51:57

always around. So I always was

52:00

associated with the negative effects of

52:02

it. You know. It wasn't watching people get high

52:04

and thinking that it was

52:06

fun. It wasn't fun for me, you know.

52:09

So I just I

52:13

already knew what I would look like, you know, like

52:15

seeing someone else strung out on pills, Like I already

52:17

know what I would look like and how I would be acting.

52:20

And I hated that. I hated seeing

52:22

that kind of behavior. So I didn't

52:25

want to put myself through

52:27

that. Sure, yeah

52:29

you saw, yeah, you saw the kind of writing on the

52:31

wall, and you saw the experience that people had with

52:33

it, and it wasn't It wasn't

52:35

glamorized at all. No, And

52:37

I mean I was like a little kid sometimes and and

52:39

seeing and noticing and understanding

52:41

what was going on and being like, you

52:44

know, fearful of it as a chat was a really deep

52:46

rooted kind of like gut feeling

52:49

that I was not, um

52:51

not a fan of. So I just it never it just never

52:54

interests me to do anything

52:56

that I deemed was like actually

52:58

super harmful. You know, like I'm

53:01

not straight at b means, but I'm not one

53:04

of those. I just never was appealing

53:06

to me to chemically alter like my

53:08

brain too much, like you know,

53:11

because that's what most of that stuff is, so powerfully

53:14

mind altering, like it

53:17

gets you hooked. Yeah, absolutely, that's

53:19

the that's the point. Um,

53:22

this kind of is a little sort of big picture, but

53:24

you know the idea that you know, you guys are

53:26

definitely on a smaller tier of

53:29

bands and you know, getting out there and touring

53:31

like you know, you guys are hard working and you take all

53:33

the opportunities that you get. But you know, there's

53:35

this weird kind of competitive nature that

53:38

exists with bands where it's like, oh

53:40

man, that one bank got that tour, I wish we would

53:42

have got that or whatever. Um, you know,

53:44

do you kind of like have you noticed

53:46

that? Do you find that in yourself? Is it just

53:49

you know, kind of uh the function of the business

53:51

as it were. Um, you know, I'm

53:53

just curious for your perspective because obviously you

53:55

guys are trying to get out there as much as you possibly can.

53:59

Yeah, It's it's interesting

54:01

because now that we're like kind of in it and

54:03

can see the inner workings of some

54:05

of it. It makes you understand, um,

54:09

have some of these things get put together. So

54:12

I mean, yeah, our mutual

54:14

friend Tom that he manages us. But Tom's

54:16

also not a booking agent, you know, so Tom

54:19

will help us as much as you can.

54:22

But like, because we don't have a booking agent

54:24

when I'm not really getting

54:26

some of the opportunities

54:28

is quickly and stuff that some of the other bands and because

54:31

they have someone that that's their exact job. Um.

54:35

And it's it's interesting because like we have to

54:37

be super grateful for everything that we

54:39

do get because it is kind of like people

54:41

like making sure that we can be a part

54:44

of this thing. And it's super awesome

54:46

to have people in our corner that

54:48

hard that let us get on the

54:50

tours that we can get on it. So it's super sweet,

54:53

Um, I think, Um,

54:58

it's it's just part of that. I guess, like you

55:00

have to cut your teeth in certain

55:02

ways too, Yeah, and talk to the right

55:04

people and find the right person for

55:06

certain jobs. And we just have them like I

55:08

got you know, I guess gotten there yet, sure,

55:11

but I don't really I don't get frustrated too much

55:13

about I do understand it's just kind of our

55:15

course, you know, like we've done

55:18

everything our

55:21

way and like people are doing everything that they can for

55:23

us, so you know, it's just is

55:26

where it is. But I mean there's

55:28

a bunch of cool stuff going to happen, so I'm

55:30

definitely not upset, Like I know,

55:32

I know what's on the horizon. So like the

55:35

question is kind of interesting

55:37

to get asked right now, since I've been asked probably

55:39

a few months ago, I probably would have had that without

55:43

the positive tale, yeah, because

55:45

I wasn't wasn't aware. But you

55:47

know, there's there's cool things in the works. I think that we're

55:50

about to be a lot more active and stuff.

55:52

So um, I'm super

55:54

hopeful and super excited about the

55:57

stuff that's coming. But so when I see bands um

56:00

getting on tours now, I don't

56:02

ever really like put it um,

56:05

especially if we didn't even get like if

56:07

we weren't even talked about, like in

56:09

in the putting together,

56:11

and that's where like I just get stoked,

56:13

like I'm trying to see like if a tour is coming

56:15

near Moivill and if I'll be home, so I can

56:17

maybe go catch it. You know, like if my friends are

56:20

coming through that I haven't seen in a while, you know, I'd like

56:22

to go go see them. Um,

56:25

yeah, no, I I understand, right. Yeah,

56:27

it's like obviously it's all about perspective

56:30

and the idea that you know, even getting brought

56:32

up in these conversations for tours

56:34

you're excited about, so yeah you can't. Yeah, yeah,

56:36

yeah, I just something

56:39

that

56:41

that would really kind of start to bury you if

56:43

you were really really stuck in that, like

56:45

with music, you know, like you kind of have

56:47

to be supportive because if you start

56:50

really getting into

56:52

the weeds on wishing and

56:54

being entitled and you know, kind of

56:57

thinking all we should have got that over that band because

56:59

of X Y and the we got

57:01

more likes than them, or like man, like

57:03

it's that's so arbitrary, Like things

57:06

are what they are, and like when you get

57:08

to the opportunities that are yours, like change

57:11

them. But if you didn't even get the opportunity, like be

57:13

happy for for who did. Sure,

57:16

Yeah, no, I understand what you're saying. That's cool. It's a

57:18

that's a good way to look at things, like not only with the band,

57:20

but just you know, life in general. H

57:25

The last thing I want to hit on was the fact that you know,

57:27

I mean clearly the band isn't

57:29

your sole source of living. And you know, you guys

57:31

build your life around the band to where you can

57:34

tour and you can be you know, kind of mobile

57:36

and duck back into your lives at home and stuff like that.

57:38

So you know, like, what do you what

57:40

do you personally do you know at home obviously you

57:43

know, pay your bills and stuff like that. It's

57:46

kind of funny because if you ask three of

57:48

us, we're all going to say the same thing. We

57:52

we worked with Ethan's stepdad.

57:54

We worked at an auction house here and

57:57

nice the bridge, uh,

58:01

and I pretty

58:03

much just take pictures of stuff

58:06

all day for the most part. They

58:09

call me a direction photography you up here

58:11

some fancy way of paying tictics

58:13

dunk bringing

58:16

people like like we're going into a house

58:18

and you know, take the stuff that we think is valuable

58:20

and we'll catalog it here and throw it online Attle

58:23

auction um And

58:25

we have auctions every week and people come to come up

58:27

every Monday, and it's pretty cool, like and

58:31

then you guys can just you guys can just basically

58:34

you know, take off for when you have tours and then come back

58:36

and you gotta you got a gig. Yeah,

58:38

that's that's the beautiful part is he's

58:40

he's it's

58:42

just honestly incredibly supportive

58:45

of what we're doing. Even though he employees

58:47

are three, like three of us, three out of the four of us.

58:49

I mean it can Ethan. It's

58:52

still baffles me how supportive

58:54

he is, like that the man would go out

58:57

of his way for us. Yeah,

58:59

he loses three, he loses three employees.

59:01

What he have

59:03

like we only have like ten like

59:06

a you know, o whole goodness. So like

59:08

when we leave, it's it's pretty pretty big.

59:10

But he's still just you know, he understands

59:12

this is this is our grind,

59:15

Like the business is his and

59:17

he's in it, and he

59:19

understands that this is ours. And

59:21

he's talking to us all the time about

59:24

how to try and be smart and

59:26

um, you know, bottow

59:28

up on phone calls and emails

59:30

and make sure like you're responding to people, like to

59:32

take this stuff super seriously because if this

59:35

is your thing, like you have to uh

59:37

and it's awesome to have an adult that's around

59:40

not that we're not adults, but you know what I mean, like a

59:42

parent who's around us

59:44

every day, who's also like very

59:47

encouraging. You know, he's one of the most

59:50

positive people I've ever met. Being around

59:52

that kind of attitude all the time is also

59:55

really sweet. Sure yeah, rubs rubs

59:57

off on you because it's like, oh that's great. Yeah,

1:00:00

yeah, I like it. I guessed

1:00:02

to wake up every day, um

1:00:04

and and pretty much do what

1:00:06

what what I want to do. My job is

1:00:08

something I enjoy and when I get off work

1:00:10

at photoshop, and then whenever I'm not doing

1:00:12

that, we do great haveing. So it's

1:00:15

pretty cool. Yeah, it's a good continue

1:00:17

right now, things are things are all right, sure,

1:00:20

right now, it's a good it's a good balance. Yeah, yeah

1:00:22

exactly. Yeah. Yeah, Well,

1:00:24

dude, thank you so much for letting me pick your brain. I really

1:00:26

enjoyed this this chat. So that's

1:00:29

good. I'm glad you enjoyed it. Yes,

1:00:33

great chat. Thank you very much, Brent.

1:00:36

Thank you very much to his manager Tom

1:00:38

Williams, who is just a spectacular human

1:00:40

being. Thanks for teeing up this idea, and I

1:00:42

was glad that we were able to do that. Next

1:00:44

week we have a banger of

1:00:46

an episode Anthony from

1:00:48

Ceremony he comes on the show.

1:00:51

They just released a spectacular

1:00:53

record on Relapse Records called Into

1:00:55

the Spirit World, I think if I'm not mistaken, but

1:00:57

all I know is the record is really really good. And Anthony

1:01:00

approached me with the idea of coming on the show, and I

1:01:02

was like, hey, yeah, let's do this. And I discovered

1:01:05

a lot that I did not know about him, which is of

1:01:07

course the whole reason that the show exists.

1:01:09

Right. Um. Yeah,

1:01:11

So, like I always tell you, please

1:01:13

be safe everybody, and I'll see you next week. And

1:01:16

special shout out to sons who is

1:01:18

They just make the best speakers around and

1:01:20

you can set them up within five

1:01:23

minutes of opening the box and connect

1:01:25

them to your WiFi speaker and or your

1:01:27

wife and network and it will be all dialed

1:01:29

in. Go to Sonos dot com and you can learn about

1:01:31

their entire product line. But I love

1:01:33

them very much, My son loves them,

1:01:36

and there's no reason that you shouldn't introduce a

1:01:38

few into your life. Okay, thank you Sonos. You've

1:01:42

been listening to the Jabber Jaw podcast network

1:01:45

jabber john Media dot com. Hey

1:01:56

Miles, it's Jack from

1:01:58

work. Yes, Hi, did you know that

1:02:00

we host a daily news and culture

1:02:02

podcast where people can go to get caught

1:02:05

up what is happening? Are you

1:02:07

yes? Are you confused about that? You're talking

1:02:09

about the Daily's I guess make sure you

1:02:11

knew and that everybody knew that

1:02:13

you could listen to us every day,

1:02:15

twice a day talk about what

1:02:18

is happening and they could learn

1:02:20

everything without feeling the

1:02:23

life drained from their soul. Yeah.

1:02:25

I think at the Daily Zeitgeist we like to give

1:02:27

people a balance of just enough news

1:02:29

that they feel informed and just enough

1:02:32

laughs that they're not overwhelmed. I can have a decent

1:02:34

day after listening. So guys, listen to The Daily

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Zeitgeist on the I Heart radio app, Apple

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