0:00

Hi there. I'm Zach Raff and I'm Donald Phason.

0:02

We're real life best friends, but

0:04

we met playing fake life best friends

0:07

Turk and j D on the sitcom Scrubs.

0:09

Twenty years later, we've decided to rewatch

0:11

the series, one episode at a time and

0:13

put our memories into a podcast

0:16

you can listen to at home. We're gonna get all our

0:18

special guest friends like Sarah Chalk,

0:20

John c McGinley, Neil Flynn, Judy

0:22

Reyes, show creator Bill Lawrence,

0:25

editors, writers, and even prop

0:27

masters would tell us about what inspired

0:29

the series and how we became a family.

0:32

You can listen to the podcast Fake Doctors,

0:34

Real Friends with Zack and Donald on the

0:36

I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast

0:38

and wherever you get your podcasts. Yeah,

0:58

Hello, Hello, Hello everybody. How are you

1:01

doing today? I'm Ray Harkins

1:03

hanging out with a hundred Words or Less the podcast,

1:05

hanging out with you on your beautiful commute

1:07

to or your your jog or just whenever

1:10

you're listening to this. You know, I'm always curious

1:12

because you know, people email the

1:14

show and are like, hey, I have spent so

1:17

much time with you, and there are times where

1:19

I like to paint a picture in my head of like what it is

1:21

that you're doing, because I know what I do when I listen to podcasts.

1:23

Usually it's you know, driving or you know,

1:25

on my arm, morning walks and that sort of stuff.

1:27

So you know, you always feel like you're just hanging

1:30

out with somebody. So anyways,

1:32

we have an amazing, amazing

1:34

discussion today with Daniel Austin,

1:36

who plays in a band called Die Young,

1:39

a incredible hardcore band from Texas, and

1:41

he is also a very prolific

1:43

author and he also runs a

1:46

website and a uh I

1:48

guess yeah, I would call it company Vegan

1:51

Meathead, So he is into

1:54

weight training and he's been vegan for a long

1:56

time, and uh, he wrote a book.

1:58

He wrote multiple books. He had his

2:00

book called Vegan Meathead, but then he also

2:02

has books of poetry and

2:05

his first work of fiction, which is really really good

2:07

and you can find anywhere you buy books.

2:09

But um, yeah, he's just a

2:11

really really compelling person. I've

2:14

met him via my work at PETA.

2:16

I just found him to be an incredibly insightful

2:19

and intelligent dude, and so I wanted to have him

2:21

on the show. And that is exactly what we did so more

2:24

than him in a few minutes. You can email the show one

2:26

hundred words or less at gmail dot com.

2:28

Been getting some fun chats

2:30

and feedback from people tossing out some

2:33

guest ideas. Someone was like, hey, you should get

2:35

Ryan from carry On and I was like, yeah,

2:37

I've I've tried tried to circle around

2:39

him, but yeah, I just always love that that dialogue

2:41

that you get back and forth, and sometimes people

2:43

are kind enough to be like, hey, I actually

2:46

you know, bought your bands c d s

2:48

or whatever like and you just are able

2:50

to open up some interesting discussions

2:53

with people. So email the show, you could rate

2:55

and review it on whatever platform you are

2:57

using, whether it's Stitcher, Apple podcast, whatever

2:59

to is just contribute a little bit, because

3:02

yeah, it just makes the show seem more legit, and

3:04

I appreciate that. I'm

3:06

actually going to be if you are at NAM, which

3:08

if you don't not know what NAM is, it is a

3:11

huge, huge music uh

3:13

instrument industry convention

3:16

here in southern California. I'm actually going to

3:18

appear doing a live podcast.

3:20

It's actually my first live podcast at

3:23

the Gator Cases Booth. I don't have any details

3:25

beyond it's going to be Sunday, January

3:28

nineteenth, from noon to one pm.

3:31

So if you're at NAM, come hang out and you

3:33

can watch me interview. I'm actually gonna be

3:35

interviewing Josh Newton, who plays

3:37

in Shiner and also used to play and every Time I Die.

3:39

A really really fun uh discussion

3:42

I plan on having with him, and he's kind of enough

3:44

to yeah, drop by the booth and be able to record

3:46

a podcast. So yeah, if you're NAM, say what's

3:48

up, come see the show and uh yeah,

3:50

gator cases, thank you for having me out.

3:53

Um what else are inna tell you? I'm doing well? Thank

3:55

you for asking. I hope you were doing well. The New

3:57

Year We're we're in it, man, we're a couple weeks

4:00

into it. Everyone's killing their

4:02

news resolutions or whatever. I don't

4:04

know. I always find those New Year's resolutions to be, um,

4:06

not very helpful. I don't do them. Um. I

4:08

know some people need them as motivation, but

4:11

you know, I kind of just look at it. It's like oh, turning up

4:13

the page, and you know, maybe here

4:15

is some things that I can maybe improve on

4:17

this year. Um. I'm not necessarily

4:20

a goal oriented person. UM, I

4:22

don't need like these these things that I

4:24

am striving for. I just you know,

4:26

I want to be a you know, maybe more

4:28

healthy person, maybe want to be a better

4:30

person of those I care about. That sort of you know, generalized

4:33

stuff. But anyways, yeah,

4:35

so here, let's let's talk Daniel. Okay, great chat.

4:38

You will like it. I promise, Okay, I'll

4:40

talk to you after the episode is over. Like I always don't

4:45

off off,

4:49

I'm not calling obviously.

4:56

We first met when we both worked at Peter

4:58

the Animal Rights Organization, and I was already

5:01

familiar with Die Young just because you know whatever,

5:04

Like everybody pays attention to hardcore and it's just like,

5:06

oh yeah, like I like that Young. Um,

5:08

but I'm sure this is I

5:11

know, yeah, some people too. I don't know, it's it's kind of it's

5:13

kind of weird. But I'm

5:15

sure you experienced this when you first started to work at PETA,

5:18

where it was like you immediately

5:20

get introduced to all the hardcore kids that worked

5:22

there. Oh yeah, well you know that

5:24

was kind of Um. I was kind

5:27

of invited to work there by people

5:29

who like got Young oh

5:31

real, Like I don't know

5:33

how big of fans they were,

5:36

but they knew I was the singer of Die

5:38

Young and then and they were looking for

5:40

someone to tour their ass off and Peter

5:42

two, and they knew, oh, well,

5:44

that guy, you know, he like, he probably

5:46

doesn't make real money, so let's let's

5:50

he probably thinks Peter money is real money,

5:52

so you know, he can

5:54

tour, so right, let's let's put him

5:56

on the road. Yeah. You know what I was thinking

5:58

though, is we didn't properly

6:01

meet. But remember that to Die for

6:03

mattenee at in Long

6:06

Beach, Oh du yeah, where I split

6:08

my head open. Yeah, yeah, We'll find our truth

6:10

opened that show last minute, and you

6:12

guys played later that day and we didn't

6:14

eat that day. But that was the first time I ever saw you. That's

6:17

oh my gosh, I totally forgot about because

6:19

I yeah, I mean, I obviously remember that show because

6:21

I got my head split open by a tooth, but

6:24

I totally forgot that another like, you know,

6:27

I have the show poster, but I remember, Yeah, you

6:29

guys, like I didn't know that you were attached

6:31

to that band, but got it, okay, Yeah it was the

6:33

guitarist and that was my my high school

6:35

band. Those are those our third tour ever and I

6:37

believe our last tour just

6:40

just like every good high school band, it's

6:42

like, yeah, what or two tours?

6:46

But you know as we got you know, introduced

6:48

through Pete and you know, sort of

6:50

tangentially working alongside of each other. Um.

6:53

The thing that I was always impressed with and honestly

6:56

still i'm impressed with you today, just

6:58

you know, observing you from afar um

7:00

like you you hustle. You know,

7:02

you're a dude. And you know I say that and

7:04

I hate to use that word because a lot of people

7:07

and like you know whatever, you know, Silicon

7:09

Valley where it's like, oh, this guy's got hustle, you

7:11

know. I It's like it just sounds

7:13

it sounds dirty in a way where it's like, oh, you got hustle.

7:15

So you're just trying to I I don't really do it out

7:17

of opportunism. I'm I'm I

7:20

just frantically and

7:23

not content. Yeah,

7:25

you're just searching around. And

7:29

this may be too big of a question to kind

7:31

of start things off with, but you know, I think you can handle

7:33

it where it's like where um,

7:35

you know, because that that isn't something that is hardwired,

7:38

you know kind of in people, you know, people either

7:41

uh, you know, are just content to like working

7:43

whatever some you know, one particular

7:46

job and like you know have like uh

7:48

you know, maybe play video games on the side, but like

7:50

you know, you're involved with a ton of different

7:52

things. Um, where do you think that

7:54

kind of like, you know, did you, I

7:57

guess observe your parents hustling? Was that just

7:59

some thing that you always were? Where did that kind of come

8:01

from? You know,

8:04

that's an interesting question because,

8:06

um, the

8:10

older I get, the more I realized

8:12

that I have this industrious

8:14

nature that my father has,

8:17

which not everyone on his side of the family

8:20

has. And I remember, like last Christmas, I want

8:22

to visit my aunt, his sister up

8:25

in Ohio, and we were talking about

8:27

how insanely

8:30

industrious my dad is versus

8:32

the rest of the family. And

8:34

we don't know why. It's

8:37

just that guy who is my my dad

8:39

built homes and designs homes for a living, and he

8:41

also builds boats and

8:44

uh, he's a painter. And growing

8:47

up I didn't get along with him very well, so I didn't really

8:49

appreciate all he did. But

8:52

he's just a constant hustler and

8:57

I, you know, my my dad's doing

8:59

pretty well for himself. Now, so if I could find out

9:01

how to turn my hustle into actual money, that

9:03

would be great. Sure,

9:05

sure, so he just he

9:08

would you kind of peg him as sort of a renaissance

9:11

man of of building and like obviously using

9:14

his hands and art and yeah, yeah, he's

9:16

a very crafty person. Um. And

9:18

he didn't even go to school for any of it. He taught it

9:20

all to himself, reading books

9:22

as a kid. And then people as soon he was eighteen.

9:25

Before he's eighteen, they were hiring him to build boats

9:27

or houses. Wow. Yeah,

9:29

you know, and he probably in the last generation where

9:31

you could get away with that.

9:34

Yeah. In his industry,

9:36

his reputation is so strong that people

9:38

don't care. And he doesn't have degree because

9:40

he can outbuild people

9:43

with degrees, you know. So

9:46

so you think just kind of the the observation

9:48

or the yeah, through

9:51

kind of osmosis, you watching your your

9:53

dad kind of you know, hustle I did. I didn't

9:55

grow up with him. My parents split when I was five,

9:59

and he was definitely a workaholic kind of

10:01

man, so he didn't he wasn't present

10:04

a lot in the family.

10:06

And uh, I think that's part

10:09

of why I and my mom had such issues. Um,

10:12

but well, I'm saying that when

10:16

you consider nature versus nurture, I think there's

10:18

some nature for

10:20

me to have that kind of personality

10:23

or drive. Um.

10:26

You know, like I I am

10:28

almost always doing things, you

10:31

know, like it used to be just a d percent band,

10:33

like when I was nineteen two, well

10:35

really from like high school until uh

10:40

jeez, my late twenties, when you know, we lay Die

10:42

Young down after like nine

10:45

seven seven years of Die Young. But you know, prior

10:47

to that, I had done Finer Truths for a few

10:49

years and I was real serious

10:51

at that, but I was limited by being in school. So

10:54

um, as soon as I was like a

10:56

legal adult, I was just a percent

10:58

with Die Young. But as

11:01

as I've gotten older and realized this music

11:04

thing is sometimes

11:06

it's a hobby that can pay for itself and that's cool

11:09

and uh enables me to traveling

11:11

with friends. But I've I've gone on my own tangents,

11:13

like with writing and then also like powerlifting

11:17

and vegan activism and things like that.

11:20

Um, I don't know, I guess I've just been

11:22

always restless. I have to find something to

11:24

bring meaning to

11:27

myself because just a day job of career

11:29

has never done that for me, and I

11:32

think a lot of people in in our sphere

11:34

of punk and creativity

11:37

and music or whatever, you

11:39

know, it's like these these hobbies

11:41

or these passions rarely support

11:44

us financially. So

11:46

we have to find ways to juggle a bunch

11:48

of things so that we can

11:50

on one end make money, on the other end

11:53

pursue what really is true

11:56

to our authentic selves. And

11:59

uh, I'm still trying

12:01

to find that balance. And sometimes, you know,

12:03

I appreciate you noting that I feel

12:05

like that. You think I'm always hustling them,

12:08

but yeah, I often stretch myself too thin. Um

12:12

yeah, do you do you feel that kind of um?

12:15

I mean, I think most people that, like you

12:17

said, kind of have that um,

12:20

you know, creative push to do a bunch of things,

12:22

like you know the phrase the jack of

12:24

all trades, master of none, Like you know, I

12:26

feel that way all the time, saying saying

12:29

And it's funny because I've heard people you

12:31

know of uh, you know, like

12:33

really successful you know whatever,

12:35

actors and other people who are you know,

12:37

considered you know, quote unquote successful

12:40

also feel that same way. So I think that,

12:42

you know, there's always that imposter syndrome, like

12:45

all those critical voices in your head.

12:47

I just don't think that. Like I don't know, it just doesn't

12:49

go away. No,

12:52

And and UM,

12:54

I guess maybe on some level as

12:56

I get older, I mean I'm thirty

12:58

six, almost thirty seven. Know, Um,

13:02

I guess I feel more of a panic to really

13:04

succeed at something, you

13:07

know, Like I have all these passions,

13:09

and I guess that's cool that, you

13:11

know. I I for the most part, I don't

13:13

just resign at the end of the day and watch Netflix.

13:16

Um there's something

13:18

that after work or whatever,

13:20

I have to do to develop myself

13:23

for some skill. But uh,

13:26

there's that great line and um True

13:29

Detective Season one that says life's

13:32

barely long enough to get good at one thing. Will

13:35

be careful what you do get good at. And

13:37

uh, I don't know. I feel like I still haven't mastered

13:40

one thing. But I don't really

13:42

it's hard to choose one thing. No,

13:45

it's I very much,

13:48

you know, empathize and identify with that too,

13:50

because I think that, Um,

13:52

you know, it's like I look at

13:54

people who have, um,

13:57

you know, people have had the experience

13:59

that you and I have had being exposed to a subculture

14:02

and you know, diving into it and

14:04

you know, soaking it in and just just experiencing

14:07

so much of it, you know, and learning so much

14:09

from you know, business aspects and all these other

14:11

things. And then you look at other people who

14:13

have just been like, Okay, you know, I went

14:16

to college, I got this job, like

14:18

you know, I'm coding, and like that's like all

14:20

that I do or whatever, and like they just

14:22

focus on that, and it's it's it's so interesting

14:24

because I'm like most of the people like

14:26

you and I and many others where it's just like, oh

14:28

yeah, we kind of just like I don't know, we

14:31

I mean, we focus and we know how to get stuff done,

14:33

but like we just don't. We just can't do one thing. Yeah,

14:37

And you know they say, in terms

14:39

of financial success, just get

14:41

good at one thing, right right,

14:43

you know whereas for me, I mean, I'm I'm

14:47

I guess when I was younger, I never cared about that

14:49

at all. But now, you know, as you get older, especially

14:51

a bet for you like your family and

14:54

uh, I just got rescue

14:56

dogs. But yeah, that's

14:58

important. Though there's still there's

15:01

still a fun a pretty heavy

15:04

obligation but I

15:07

find it it is more important to succeed

15:09

financially at something because you can't just keep

15:12

like throwing rocks in the pond, you

15:14

know. Um yeah, But

15:18

man, I

15:20

I can tell you that when I

15:22

did live off of Die Young for

15:25

the few years that we were going at it that

15:27

hard, Actually I

15:30

hated it. So

15:32

the thing that I love to do, I

15:35

bludge in to death. And

15:37

that's why we broke up those those four years

15:39

that we weren't a band. But do

15:41

you think that was what do you think it

15:43

was because the obviously

15:47

that became your job, like or

15:49

was that was there other

15:52

sort of think the other influences

15:54

that made you hate the thing? I

15:57

think mostly it was that, um,

16:00

we had gotten to a point where we were

16:02

kind of plateaued during the d I Y

16:04

circuit, and

16:08

looking back, it

16:10

would have been wise if we really had ambition

16:13

to carry on with the band, Like like we

16:15

kind of set out with two

16:18

start employing management or

16:20

a booking agent people to kind of finagle

16:22

us into new avenues to explore,

16:26

you know, like to help market the band. But

16:28

the band was never we

16:32

never looked at it as a business opportunity.

16:34

It was it was really at

16:36

us supposed to be a pure

16:38

expression of how much we hated the world.

16:42

Yeah, you know, so when

16:44

it started to be like, yeah, let's play this game,

16:47

we were like, no funk that we're just gonna keep playing

16:49

houses well,

16:53

and and that was so defeating.

16:55

It was just so like we watched other bands

16:57

that you know, couldn't even tune their instruments,

16:59

who had a good pro tools recording, just

17:02

ascend way further than us, And

17:05

we started to get passed up on these tours

17:07

that we thought we should be on, and we just

17:09

got really resentful of the whole fucking

17:11

game, even that even exists in underground

17:14

music, and and uh,

17:16

I just thought, I don't I don't want to be a part of this

17:18

ship. Yeah. And then also

17:21

we had that thing where you know, people like one

17:23

or two of your songs and you realize that's

17:25

all they're there for. It's

17:27

not your catalog and the

17:29

whole connection with like, you know, your

17:31

work. It's like, oh, we like this

17:34

one song where we can you

17:36

made a kind of ANTHEMICX so we can remember

17:38

those words part.

17:41

Yeah, And I realized, like people

17:43

actually aren't connecting

17:45

with this on the level that I want them to and

17:49

they it's almost like, you know, they want

17:51

us to play our one hit, like we're one hit

17:53

Wonders, And I was basically

17:56

just thinking, funk this all right? You

17:58

want bandmrch right, only place that

18:00

you should go to is rockabillya dot com.

18:03

Use the code PC one words

18:05

that's the number one zero zero words,

18:07

and you will get fift off of your order.

18:09

They have so much rad stuff right now.

18:12

They have grab bags where you're able to get

18:14

three long sleeves for twenty bucks, or

18:16

you're able to get like four T shirts

18:18

for fifteen dollars. How awesome is that you can

18:20

just completely outfit yourself

18:23

in new band merch and they

18:25

are the place to order it. It's all officially licensed,

18:28

quick shipping, great customer service, like everything

18:30

you want from a company they deliver. And

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they also have really really other cool things

18:35

besides merch. Like you into the Misfits,

18:38

how about they got action figures for the Misfits.

18:40

They carry so much great stuff. Go to

18:42

their website check it out, be able to find

18:44

whatever it is you're looking for and use

18:47

the code PC one hundred words and it

18:49

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18:52

They are the real deal, and you should

18:54

order as much as humanly possible from

18:56

them, like maybe once a once a week, maybe once

18:58

every other week. Okay, thank you

19:00

very much, Rockabilia, Now on with

19:02

the show. Well, I I totally understand

19:05

because it's like, especially to where, you

19:07

know, when Die Young was the most active

19:09

kind of in the you know, mid two thousand's

19:11

as it were, there was you

19:14

know, there was that idea that things

19:16

could start to turn for bands

19:19

that were you know, playing hardcore where it was like, okay,

19:21

you had the early two thousands where you know, metal cores

19:24

started to explode and bands started to you

19:26

know, quote unquote make a living or whatever. Um.

19:29

And then then it was like,

19:31

you know, the mid two thousand's is where everyone was kind

19:33

of like trying to figure out what

19:35

that actually meant. And so many and

19:37

like you said, so many bands existed

19:39

on so many different levels where it

19:41

was like, yeah, you could be successful, like you

19:43

said, like you guys were just you know doing d

19:45

I Y tour. And when I say just, I don't mean that in

19:48

a disparaging way because like that is a lot

19:50

of hustle um

19:52

and it's but

19:55

then so many bands, like you said, you know, kind

19:57

of like built off the shoulders of

19:59

all the bands and early two thousands and just immediately

20:01

kind of like, oh, we don't you know, we'll do one, D

20:03

I Y two or whatever. But then we can immediately you

20:05

know, level up and then you know it's

20:08

just like, oh, oh, I guess that's an option.

20:11

Yeah. It was weird. I remember that time

20:13

specifically because we we quit our jobs

20:15

at the end of two thousand five and

20:17

spent a couple of years going full force, like

20:19

a full time band, touring internationally.

20:23

Um. And the only place we ever

20:25

had an agent was in Europe, so everything

20:27

we booked all over the world was just me. Um.

20:31

But I remember the end of two thousand five we did

20:33

we did a West coast tour. It was actually to go play

20:36

We weren't officially on the trial Reunion

20:38

in two thousand five, but it was that pre show.

20:41

Oh yeah, sure, and we and we wanted to go see

20:44

the Reunion show, which was one of the

20:46

best shows ever. Um.

20:48

But that tour we were just like, man, we're

20:50

doing so well. We don't

20:53

know what to think about this.

20:56

This is fucking weird that people

20:58

are buying all this stuff must and

21:00

the shows are good. So maybe

21:02

we should quit our job next year, and

21:06

and you know we did, and you know, we played like a

21:09

year for like two years in a row, and

21:12

it exhausted us. Sure, and

21:14

uh, I mean definitely two of the craziest years in

21:16

my life because you know that's that's when we played all

21:18

over like East Asia and uh

21:23

Alaska, you guys

21:25

just random place. Yeah, And you guys,

21:27

you guys remind me too of you know, when

21:31

most Precious Blood, you know, started

21:33

to like their ambition was very much

21:35

in similar to years where you guys were

21:37

like, let's play anywhere and everywhere

21:40

as much as humanly possible. And honestly,

21:43

like, not many bands have that, I

21:45

guess Drive or Spark where it's just like, oh yeah, like

21:47

I would like to play Africa, or like you said, you played east

21:49

Asia. Um, and it's

21:52

like I said, not many bands do that. And it's

21:54

just cool that you guys were really focused

21:57

on just being like, well, let's let's let's try to take this as

21:59

many places upon Well.

22:01

I think part of me as

22:03

a young man was so

22:08

I don't know, kind of disappointed. You

22:10

know. I tried to go to college and

22:12

I hated it so much. I quit after a year,

22:15

and because because after I did my first

22:17

tour with Final Truth Um

22:19

the summer that I had graduated high

22:22

school, and that ruined me

22:24

because I made I couldn't focus in

22:26

that first year of college because all I could do with daydream

22:29

about going back on this war, get

22:31

the get the taste, yeah, and when

22:33

college and live up to my expectations. And I

22:35

was spending all this money to go to a working you

22:38

know, working um pretty close

22:40

to full time. I feel like I

22:43

just didn't feel like it was worth the sacrifice because I didn't

22:46

even know what I wanted to be. All I knew I wanted to do

22:49

was play music at the time, and

22:51

I wasn't really thinking about the future, and

22:55

it was kind of all I mean, the name Died

22:57

Young was just kind of like I don't care, you

23:00

know, I don't care what my future is. I

23:02

just want to go do what I want to do. And

23:04

it's kind of how I came up with the band name

23:07

M and

23:11

I guess I never I

23:14

had some disillusionment about careers

23:16

and money and things like that because I felt like they were traps

23:19

and I thought I just want to go

23:22

see the whole world playing music, so

23:26

as much as possible. It was in

23:28

in the In the beginning, Die Young was built

23:30

on this premise of um,

23:34

let's play like old school influence hardcore

23:37

or like punk influence hardcore. I I thought

23:39

of Bad Religion's albums suffer because

23:41

it's so lyrically strong and

23:44

every song sounds exactly the fucking

23:46

same, right, And I

23:49

thought, yeah, so because Final Truth was basically

23:51

a metal band, we were influenced by Earth

23:53

Crisis, one King Down, turmoil, and we

23:55

we were young, but we wanted to be more like musicians.

23:57

But it took us forever to write a song. With

24:00

Die Young, it was like, let's

24:02

play you know,

24:04

you heavier than suffered by Bad

24:06

Religion, But with that same premise

24:09

of these songs are

24:11

easy to play, and we can write

24:13

a million of them real quick and

24:15

get anybody to play them and just

24:17

go. That was the point. Let's just

24:20

go, you know, And

24:23

that's what we did. Yeah, No, for sure,

24:26

the and you know you

24:28

being I presume you were born and raised

24:30

in Texas. Yes, yeah, born in

24:32

Houston, raised in Houston. I've lived

24:35

a few other places now, but most

24:37

of my life was in Houston, right, And so

24:39

you know, Texas is such a Yeah, I don't need to tell

24:41

you it's a weird state because you've lived there and

24:43

it's it's it's

24:46

depressing to drive through because you know, you can fall

24:48

asleep on one side and then eight hours later

24:50

you're still in the same state. But you feel like you've

24:52

like the scenery has not changed whatsoever.

24:55

Um And granted that's of course, like you

24:57

know, on the forty but

25:00

um, you know, so what is

25:02

your relation to you

25:04

know, I guess that the state at large, Like,

25:06

you know, do you you obviously are

25:08

connected to it? Um? You know, do you feel

25:10

like it's home? Do you recognize the weirdness? Like where

25:13

do you kind of sit with that? Yeah?

25:16

Totally. It's full of contradictions, which

25:19

you know, and dichotomies, which I think makes

25:21

it a really interesting place. Because as much as people

25:24

sometimes think they hate the idea of Texas,

25:26

and because people in Texas are like nationalists,

25:30

Yeah, we want to get out of here, right, Texas

25:34

is its own country

25:36

and fund the rest of the world. Texas is right,

25:39

don't mess with Texas. That's it, you know. I mean,

25:41

yeah, it's just it's just this strange

25:43

attitude. Um. And I remember when I started

25:45

working at Peter, people were like,

25:47

you're not a normal vegan, You're a Texan vegan.

25:51

Really people, because um,

25:53

I was like the guy in the tour van that was

25:55

like, no, we've got to get to the gym. That's

25:59

so funny. And you know, I just had this attitude

26:02

of like, we're vegan,

26:04

so you know, we're superior,

26:07

and um we're

26:09

and you know, I I guess I just had

26:13

this attitude of kind of like, I

26:17

don't know, like some kind of macho vegan or something,

26:20

which I've totally continue

26:22

to let persona

26:25

with this vegan meathead thing I do. But

26:28

but you know, like people were just

26:30

hanging around vegans from other parts of the country.

26:32

They were just like, we don't know vegans

26:35

like that. That is so

26:37

I honestly you're saying that

26:39

I never would have reflected on that, but like,

26:42

yeah, no, I could. I could see where people would be like,

26:44

oh yeah, like you probably

26:47

could typify that in

26:49

different places. And I attribute

26:51

it to to just being a Texan

26:54

and that kind of bold personality that people

26:56

will associate with Texas because because

26:58

also you know, growing up, well, I

27:00

went vegetarian was like fifteen, but I

27:02

didn't go vegan tools like twenty

27:05

two something like that. And

27:10

but also, you know, Texas has its

27:12

stereotypes about barbecue

27:14

and cattle and meat, and so

27:19

I think that to be a vegan from

27:21

Texas you kind of have to be a more adamant,

27:24

like one up the meat eaters

27:26

in Texas kind of attitude, you know.

27:28

So I could see that maybe

27:30

that's part of that persona

27:33

for me. Also is that

27:35

you know, you're you're always kind of contending

27:39

with the culture at large where

27:41

you come from. And

27:43

uh, in some ways, I still I think you

27:46

know that that attitude

27:49

is within me, like the Texan kind of

27:52

fuck you were from Texas, you can't tell us what to

27:54

do. But at the same time, it's like, I'm

27:57

not a fucking cowboy. Uh,

28:00

I don't like that kind of barbecue fuck

28:03

you and van from Texas? Right. Well,

28:06

yeah, no, I I can understand that because

28:08

it definitely is a sort of um,

28:12

I mean, there's an attitude that clearly exists in

28:14

Texas. And then there's also you know, when you're specifically

28:17

focusing on, you know, the punk and hardcore subculture.

28:20

Um, you know, Texas has always been such a really weird

28:22

scene where it's like, you know, you have your

28:24

disparate pockets of towns

28:27

that I mean, you could play you could obviously

28:29

do a two week tour of Texas and play yeah.

28:31

Yeah, it's

28:34

really interesting because East Texas,

28:36

like you've got Houston and Dallas. Um,

28:43

Dallas always had its uh.

28:46

I think people have stereotypes about the hardware

28:48

scene being more Christian and conservative and

28:51

a lot of really suburban, like sheltered

28:55

kids from conservative households, whereas Houston

28:58

has always been like the more

29:00

working class, especially

29:04

with Die Young being from Houston.

29:08

When I started getting on political soapbox

29:10

with Die Young, people in Houston it's not

29:12

the they ne sarily disagreed. It's just they

29:14

don't like being told what to

29:17

think or what to do or or

29:19

just challenge. People in Houston are like, we've got

29:21

jobs. Unlike the rest of the country.

29:24

We go to work. Just leave us alone, very

29:28

very like blue collar like, look, we're

29:30

doing all right. Just don't disturb

29:32

our fabric reality here right

29:34

to wrote the boat dude. Yeah, And then

29:37

you go to Austin, where it's like Peter Pan

29:39

syndrome out the assid it's you know, it's

29:41

so more open

29:43

to the arts and um,

29:47

non traditional modes of being

29:50

an adult, Like you can be a kid in Austin

29:52

for the rest of your life and people won't bat an eye.

29:54

It's you know. Um.

29:57

And then once you go like Santonio

29:59

Corpus, Chris the Laredo, I

30:01

mean, it's very much just Mexico,

30:04

yep. Um, and people are

30:06

so warm and welcoming and they

30:09

circle pit and

30:12

and they just are there to have fun and they're not judgmental,

30:15

and um,

30:18

that's like a different planet. And then you know, I lived

30:20

in West Texas for about

30:23

a year out by Big Ben

30:25

National Park, which is for people who don't know,

30:27

it's I think it's kind of like the equivalent of the Grand

30:29

Canyon, but in Texas just you

30:31

know, um, it's a really

30:35

magical, isolated, off

30:38

the beaten path kind of place. And

30:41

um. That and that's like travel back

30:43

into the when people think of cowboys

30:45

and Indians and all that ship in Texas. That's

30:47

what West Texas in a lot of ways

30:50

still is, you know, like like uh,

30:52

No Country for Old Men, the movie or

30:55

Hell or high Water. I mean that's the kind of

30:57

Texas that is still out in West Texas.

30:59

It's it's it's like going through

31:01

a time work and that's a really interesting

31:03

I actually it's probably my favorite

31:05

part of Texas because it's just so different,

31:10

Like you can't replicate it as the East

31:12

side of Texas. Sure, sure, no, that's

31:14

really that's really interesting. Um.

31:17

And like you mentioned your you know, your

31:19

parents separated when you were five. Do you like,

31:21

what was your family structure, like brothers and sisters and stuff

31:23

like that. That's kind of interesting.

31:26

I don't have any full blooded um

31:28

brothers and sisters. I mean, they're all my brothers

31:30

and sisters. But my parents

31:34

got around, got

31:36

it. Yeah, So I

31:38

have a sister who's nine years younger than

31:40

me that my mother had, and we

31:43

grew up together because I grew up with my mother when

31:45

my parents split, um,

31:48

my dad had two boys with

31:50

a woman who later died. Um.

31:53

And when my brothers are seven and nine years younger

31:55

than me. And then

31:57

there was a sister that I found

31:59

out about out in my mid twenties

32:02

that my dad had

32:04

I guess with like a one night stand or something

32:07

when he was still with my mom,

32:10

which might have precipitated the divorce.

32:13

Um, but I didn't know about this sister. Until

32:15

I was like twenty six years old. So, um

32:19

so, I got two sisters and two brothers, and

32:21

we all except for the one sister

32:24

with my mom, we all grew up separately. But

32:26

you know, I was nine when that sister was born,

32:29

and um so

32:31

I was I was very

32:34

isolated. I was, you know, like a latch

32:36

key kid. And uh,

32:39

I spent a lot of time as a kid

32:41

by myself because I didn't grow up in a household

32:44

with brothers and sisters. And

32:47

because of that, like, did you you, um,

32:49

I guess what kind of kid did you find

32:52

yourself? I mean, how I know you to be

32:54

as always? Um, you know, like you're

32:57

your friendly, but you're not you

32:59

know, loud. I you know, like you're not uh

33:02

you know, you're not the sort of guy where it's just like you

33:05

know, immediately people are just like, oh dude, Daniel,

33:07

just like calmed down, like you're yelling

33:09

all the time or whatever. You know, um whereas

33:12

I've been accused of that before. So you

33:14

know, did you find yourself kind of being you know,

33:17

more introverted and obviously inside your

33:19

head when you're a sports guy or well,

33:21

you know, when I was a kid, I did play uh,

33:23

sports until my dad got me a guitar in

33:25

fifth grade when I turned to eleven, because

33:29

um, you know, I was getting into music then, and it

33:31

would have been like radio rock like Nirvana, Pearl

33:33

Jam. There was a lot of that Seattle stuff that

33:36

kind of turned me onto the kind of more

33:38

aggressive rock. Um. But yeah,

33:40

I got a guitar when I was eleven, and I feel

33:42

like, uh, into my early

33:45

teen years, that's where a lot of my

33:47

creativity went. Because when I grew up,

33:49

I was I like to draw, and I

33:51

was into comic books and

33:54

those kinds of things. And then I did play in

33:56

like Little League sports that my parents put me in and

33:58

I was okay, But um, music

34:01

is what kind of When

34:03

I got a guitar and I started studying records

34:06

and in music and taking

34:09

guitar lessons, that's when I really kind of sat

34:11

in my own world at home.

34:14

And I mean I had friends, but I've

34:17

always been the kind of person when it comes to friends,

34:19

it's quality over quantity.

34:22

So yeah, like when you say I'm the guy

34:24

if I walk into room, people aren't you know, it's not

34:26

all about me and not the cinem for attentions because I

34:28

usually like to talk to two or three people and have

34:31

really high uh

34:33

quality, deeper conversations.

34:36

Right, and you're picking your spots as opposed to like, all

34:38

right, I gotta make the rounds and let everybody know

34:40

that I'm here. Yeah, but you know, I like

34:42

I spent a lot of time by myself as

34:44

a kid, playing guitar, writing

34:46

songs. Um.

34:48

I used to before I had

34:50

a computer or anything. I would make little

34:54

tapes of just like

34:57

like bands that I would imagine. No, I would just record

35:01

guitar tracks and then draw like

35:03

some artwork and fit it into a tape

35:06

case. So I

35:08

love that. Yeah, do it. I was just

35:10

dreaming about being a musician

35:12

when I was like twelve years

35:15

old, you know. Um

35:17

so, but I spent it takes a lot of energy and

35:20

concentration to that. So I was by myself

35:22

a lot. And um right,

35:24

you were created? Do you do? You do you remember

35:26

any of the names of your fictional bands that you've created?

35:29

Well, you know what's funny is the

35:32

first band that I think, I Well,

35:34

there was Dirt Dude.

35:36

That's a pretty good wow. I

35:38

like that. And then there was low

35:40

Life, which actually was the first incarnation

35:43

of Finer truth in like eighth grade,

35:45

which we actually played a show in

35:48

a friend's garage for his birthday as

35:50

our first year. We had five original songs

35:53

and we

35:56

played a Toady's cover of

35:58

Tyler by the Toady as

36:01

the closer, but

36:03

the our original songs were I

36:05

don't know. In eighth grade,

36:08

I did discover Earth Crisis on that oz

36:10

Fest video, so I was getting into heavier

36:12

music like that, but mostly like I

36:14

was in middle school, was listening to Metallica,

36:18

Panthera, got into corn and deaf

36:20

tones and

36:22

uh, I don't know what the funk you would

36:25

call that bay. It was like a career. It was a middle

36:27

school garage rock band that had all

36:29

these strange influences

36:32

from you just try to throw to

36:35

Metallica too. I mean even

36:37

at that point, I remember one of the songs we played

36:39

at that that garage birthday

36:42

show was me trying

36:44

to sound heavier like Earth Crisis. But

36:47

you know what I mean. But yeah,

36:51

it was just a mish mash as a kid, because you know, you

36:53

don't have all this pretense as a kid. You just your

36:55

mind's open. Yeah, there's

36:57

no you are not having

37:00

to fit into any sort of definitions.

37:02

You're just like, I like this music and I want

37:04

all of it to sound like this. Yeah. Yeah,

37:07

And so that band was called Low

37:09

Life, and then,

37:11

um, we reinvented ourselves

37:14

as more

37:16

of a hardcore type band because I gotten into Earth

37:18

Crisis and sick of it all and bands like that, I think

37:21

by like by ninth grade, and um,

37:23

we started playing local clubs

37:25

as Finer Truth, but

37:28

we weren't a straight edge band at that time

37:30

because most of the guys

37:33

involved didn't even know what that was. It was like me and the singer

37:35

and knew what that was, and he wasn't straight as

37:37

But by ninth grade, I started claiming a straight

37:39

age and so we we we let go of

37:42

that version of Finer Truth

37:44

and I assembled a band to

37:47

be a straight edge metal core

37:49

band by ninth

37:51

or tender. I was sixteen when we when Final Truth

37:54

played our first official show. It was on my

37:56

birthday. Um,

37:59

so would have been in the sophomore in high school.

38:02

Yeah that sounds about right. Yeah, and

38:04

uh, it was on my birthday and we played our first official

38:06

show. Is Final Truth Houston, straight edge hardcore

38:11

so so good. Um,

38:13

and so you know, as you started to you

38:16

know get. I mean, you were completely immersed in

38:18

music, and like you said, you, um, you know, you

38:20

didn't really care for school so to

38:22

speak, did you? Um? I

38:24

guess did you run into that in high school because

38:26

you were so distracted by you know, playing shows and

38:28

stuff like that, or did that really happen,

38:30

you know, once you went away to college where you're just like, oh, dude, I

38:32

don't I don't care about school anymore. Yeah.

38:35

No. I I graduated with honors

38:37

from high school and I kind of did high school

38:39

in my sleep, okay, And um uh,

38:43

I think part of that is at least I wasn't distracted

38:45

by drugs and partying because I had found straight

38:47

edge, and um,

38:50

the only distraction I really ever had was you

38:52

know, I mean, at best, you can kind of

38:54

play shows on the weekend when you're in high school. So

38:56

I mean, uh, I

39:00

didn't. I didn't have too many distractions

39:02

in high school, I think. But then once I had the freedom

39:05

as a legal adult to just not go back

39:07

to school anymore, I was

39:09

like, why would I do that? Yeah?

39:12

And I remember, you know the summer that I

39:14

told my parents, um

39:17

on two separate occasions, because they were had

39:20

been long since divorced. But I

39:22

traveled out to North Carolinas and my dad told

39:24

me, and I'm not going back to school. I'm

39:26

just gonna play in a band. He

39:30

was just shaking his head, like that's a really bad

39:32

idea.

39:35

Uh. And but you know I

39:38

did it though, because I went home that fall and

39:40

we started Die Young and by December

39:42

we were touring and

39:45

we didn't stop since then. And by the

39:47

end of the original run of Die Young,

39:49

like Die Young and It's Prime, we

39:51

had played like thirty five countries and

39:55

um, we really, we really

39:57

did it. You know. We put out a lot of records,

39:59

uh, with

40:01

with labels that we wanted to put them out. We

40:03

toured with a lot of bands, and yeah,

40:06

you did. You did the damn thing. We did

40:08

the damn thing when um,

40:10

you know, and when you were doing that, like you said,

40:12

you know, you were at the kind of the center

40:15

of the you know, business aspect of

40:17

the band from booking shows and like you said, probably dealing

40:19

with record labels because you guys put out records with Eulogy

40:22

or was it a hand of hope, I can't remember now,

40:24

it was we did graving images

40:26

on Eulogy. Um.

40:29

It was like, they came out early two thousand seven, so we

40:31

recorded in two thousands six, got it.

40:34

That was when Eulogy was making their big comeback as

40:36

a hardcore label, like they kind

40:38

Wisdom and Chains. They had signed Turmoil,

40:40

but nothing came of that record. It's

40:43

like I think they recorded it and

40:45

then it never came out. Yeah, I saw

40:47

I signed into Century Media, so it was great, and

40:50

then you put out what those three songs. I put up those

40:52

three songs and the discography that was my that was my

40:54

love letter. Yeah, hey, way

40:57

to go. Thanks, I'm proud of it. Anytime

40:59

you did a mule things are there. I remember because I was

41:01

like, man, now they're getting all the good bands. Um.

41:04

But yeah, I mean I remember that year they signed Kingdom

41:06

and No Score and so, I mean they were trying

41:09

to get back away from because they

41:11

had been very I think for a bit opportunistic

41:14

with like pop punk and Christian metal

41:16

core to make some money and

41:19

then they you know, kind of lost the street cred

41:21

and then they went on the signing spree of like

41:24

real hardcore bands. But then

41:28

streaming happened in the whole music

41:30

industry. Yeah,

41:33

yeah, but so did you? Um,

41:36

you know, because you were doing all this. I know it's

41:38

a function of the band to do this,

41:40

so you don't really necessarily think of it as kind

41:42

of the business aspect. Did you, um,

41:45

I guess, enjoy a lot of that or did

41:47

you just do that because no one else was

41:49

going to do that? I

41:51

think I did it because, um,

41:55

I'm a maniac who just naturally

41:57

tries to do every myself,

42:00

which is probably as a fun as I get older, a little

42:02

bit of a weakness. Uh

42:05

you know, I mean, because I would write all the songs too,

42:08

Like I recorded all the guitar up

42:10

until this like New Incarnation that Die Young,

42:12

where we actually have new guitarists who

42:14

can outshred me by far. So I let

42:17

them do it now. But all

42:19

those years, man, I was writing it. I

42:21

was booking, I was writing the lyrics, I was

42:23

doing the artwork. I was making

42:25

the T shirts. I

42:27

was insane, um and

42:31

I felt, you know, there was there was bands

42:33

that we would play with. I would look at, especially

42:35

as I got older, and I thought, oh man,

42:37

look at them collaborating. How cool

42:39

is that? Oh wow, Yeah, there's this

42:42

is like the idea of a non

42:44

non dictatorship, not like, you

42:46

know, I I tried to be a benevolent

42:48

dictator. And I think that most of the guys who

42:50

have been in the band, like the twenty something of

42:53

them, would agree that I was. There's

42:55

only a couple that I had it out real bad with. But

42:57

um, you know,

43:00

I think that was a weakness on my

43:02

character. By growing up

43:04

such a loaner, I felt I had

43:06

to do everything. Sure.

43:10

Sure, you know now the

43:12

dynamic in the band, because we still play, I

43:14

think people aren't aware that we still play. Yeah,

43:16

you guys are out You guys are out there when you have opportunity.

43:19

We only played one show this year. We put

43:22

out a single and we played one show this

43:24

year. But last the few

43:27

years before that, you know, we put out records and probably

43:30

play like twenty shows a year on average. Um.

43:33

But the dynamic we have now is that everybody

43:36

helps with the songwriting, and

43:40

I'm not because I have so many other things

43:42

going on. I really delegate things to guys

43:44

in the band, and and they they want to

43:46

do it too, Um, which I enjoy

43:50

that they want to do things

43:52

for the band. You're

43:54

like, wow, this is a collaborative nature. Well,

43:57

you know, there was a lot of guys who came in and out of the band

44:00

act in the touring days, I think just wanted the

44:02

opportunity to tour, and they probably

44:04

would have toured with any band, um,

44:09

and maybe they developed appreciation for how Di

44:11

Young did things by the opportunities

44:14

that they got, you know, living through them.

44:16

But uh,

44:18

these days it's kind of like, hey, guys, can we

44:20

do this? And somebody or somebody says,

44:22

hey, I got this riff and they you know, we you

44:25

know, group texting has really changed the dynamics

44:27

of bands. You know, we didn't we didn't have that back the

44:30

mid two down goople and group texting each other.

44:32

You know, we had clips of songs

44:34

and ship you know. Um,

44:38

so things are a lot more available for each of us

44:40

to contribute. It's easier

44:42

for I think everybody to contribute now, and I

44:45

like it more. It's just, you know, the band is

44:47

fun now. That's why we're not um,

44:51

we're not trying to play a million shows. And

44:53

when we write songs now, kind of like how I said,

44:55

when we started, it was all

44:58

about go, go go, you know, keep

45:00

it simple so we can go. Now

45:03

it's like we don't have anywhere to

45:05

go. We're not trying to play

45:07

all these shows. So when we write a song, it's

45:09

like our our newest best

45:12

effort to write an

45:14

interesting song. So there's a lot more

45:17

detail in the musicianship and

45:20

what we're trying to articulate versus just the

45:23

one, two, three, four go attitude that we

45:25

had in the beginning. So the band is kind of

45:27

done. Yeah, Well it's

45:29

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45:32

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46:50

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46:53

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48:04

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and find out more. You've

48:08

You've always struck me too as just kind of

48:10

you know, with the nature of how you've

48:12

pursued your your projects. Um,

48:15

you know, always a bit of a nomad

48:17

where it's like, you know, I mean clearly you've toured for

48:20

a majority of your life with the band, and

48:22

obviously when you're working at PETA two and stuff

48:24

like that, Um do you

48:26

think like? But clearly

48:28

touring of any shape

48:31

or size, UM is a certain

48:33

beast, you know. So how is your relationship

48:36

with touring? I guess evolved,

48:38

like you know, would you like, would you flip a switch

48:40

and if you could too, or two hundred days

48:42

out of the year that you would now or you

48:45

know what? What's your relationship? Like? You

48:49

know? I got more

48:53

into the idea of having an ordered

48:55

life, um, And I think, well,

48:58

initially when I left, we hung

49:00

Die Young up the first time and I

49:02

started twining for Peter too. I had to

49:04

be on someone else's schedule, you

49:07

know, um, and

49:10

it wasn't like a nine to five, but

49:12

we were kind of work in those hours and still

49:14

having to drive. And then I

49:17

found that as I got older, sitting in a van,

49:20

I needed to stimulate my body more.

49:22

So I got into working out. And

49:25

then I found that working out really

49:27

leveled me out and it helped me feel better

49:30

and it made me better at my job. And then as

49:32

being an advocate for animals, the

49:35

response I got from people, I

49:37

think just the way I carried

49:39

myself and especially you know,

49:41

ten years ago, people if they saw

49:43

vegan who looked like they were in shape, they were like what we

49:46

don't think people would ask me, You're

49:48

not really vegan, are you? You know, so

49:51

it motivated me to keep going with the fitness

49:53

aspect, and um, eventually I got

49:56

into powerlifting, which, um,

49:59

you know, you

50:01

have to really regiment your eating,

50:05

your sleeping, in your time

50:07

in the gym, and that really

50:09

taught me how to discipline myself to

50:12

plan out my

50:15

my weeks. And

50:18

now when I travel with young if you know,

50:20

we didn't do anything much this year, but I

50:23

have been traveling doing the vegan meat head stuff

50:25

where I speak at like bed fests or I have some

50:27

kinds one

50:29

off events where I'm lecturing about a

50:32

vegan strength diet. Um.

50:35

I I hate

50:37

touring now. It's because it sucks with my

50:39

schedule and my ability to eat the right food.

50:43

Um, more than three days at

50:45

a time. I am just like God,

50:47

I need to get to fuck home and get back on schedule.

50:49

You know, I really like the schedule now. So

50:53

I'm glad I got the touring out of my system

50:55

when I was younger, because now you

50:58

know, I'm I'm competitive of in the powerlifting

51:00

world. I usually do like

51:05

a qualifying meat and then some kind

51:07

of a championship meet each year. Um,

51:10

and I have to stay really strict with

51:13

everything to be able to keep doing that

51:16

and um, but I find it really

51:18

rewarding and it helps me feel good and like

51:20

I said, it levels me out. So you know, when

51:22

I think back to the

51:25

the two hundred days a year on the road with Die

51:27

Young, I mean, God's the worst schedule

51:29

for your body and your mind. I mean, and like

51:31

I said, how I had come to hate the band. I also

51:34

think I was mentally in a really an

51:36

emotionally in a really poor place.

51:38

Because you

51:41

get done playing a show at midnight, then

51:43

you pack up, then you go eat, then you

51:45

go to someone's house and you talk to them till four am,

51:48

and then you get up at noon and

51:50

you eat garbage on the road, and then

51:53

you go to a venue and you get there at six or

51:55

seven pm, and then you sit around the venue. There's

51:58

a lot of idle time. It's a lot of

52:01

junk food and just

52:03

a the most fucked up sleep schedule.

52:06

UM. I found that the

52:09

more I ordered my schedule

52:13

the better I felt. So

52:15

I just felt in a sense happier

52:17

at least more leveled out with

52:21

the fitness discipline and the eating discipline and

52:24

and sleeping more like a normal person.

52:27

Um. So, as I get older, I don't

52:29

miss touring. I mean I still traveled quite

52:31

a bit, most mostly for the Veghan

52:33

meat head stuff and um,

52:36

but I really try to manage it in

52:38

a way that I can

52:40

keep the fitness stuff first,

52:43

so I don't so I don't get off track with that.

52:46

Um. You know, Die

52:49

Young's done a

52:52

couple of tours in the last two or three years

52:54

that were like seven to nine days each

52:57

and man, that was kind of like my max at this

52:59

point given all the other things I'm

53:01

juggling. Yeah, You're like, I can't,

53:03

I can't be out for this long. Yeah. Yeah, you know, like

53:05

an overnight drive man like that. I used

53:07

to do that three nights a week whatever

53:09

and you know when about my business.

53:13

But an overnight drive for any

53:15

of us now being in our mid thirties, it just rex

53:17

us for the whole week totally, totally. It's

53:19

like, I'm not I'm not used to this, you know. Yea,

53:22

even if it's like a two hour drive from like, you

53:24

know, New York to Philly. It's like, oh jeez,

53:26

man, that's forever, or just

53:29

just the mental stress of traffic. I mean, I

53:31

just can't. I can't deal with that. Um.

53:35

And you know, kind of the idea

53:37

of you being you know, so involved with

53:39

animal rights and your you

53:42

know, mission to share the

53:44

idea that you can clearly be a healthy

53:47

vegan, you know, a strong vegan, and

53:49

all this stuff has you know, been

53:51

such a core component of who you are

53:53

for as long as I have known you to be. Like you said,

53:55

you know, you were working out as you were touring

53:58

with Peta two and stuff like that. Um,

54:01

you know, I guess where did you get kind of

54:03

bit by the bug of um, you know,

54:06

working out and being fit. From that perspective, it's

54:08

clearly not everybody likes to do that.

54:12

I think it was a combination of several things in my life.

54:14

Like when I joined Peter two, I actually had

54:16

just ended a like six

54:19

year relationship that I had

54:21

been in my whole early twenties. Was like

54:23

my first serious relationship, and uh,

54:26

getting back out into the single world. It

54:29

was a very sobering experience, you know.

54:31

Um sure, and you know, you get

54:34

reintroduced to in securities you forgot that

54:36

you have because you used to have something. You know, I used to have

54:38

someone that was just kind of accepted

54:40

me no matter what. But getting

54:43

back out into the like dating

54:45

world, you start to get more self

54:47

conscious and so and then also

54:50

as you get older, especially in your late

54:52

twenties, you start to notice my metabolism

54:54

not the same as when I was twenty one, and

54:57

uh, I don't know that

55:00

was a motivator to

55:03

get more fit. But then also, like I said, when

55:05

I was working with Peter, actually I met my

55:07

friend Billy, who was

55:09

a vegan bodybuilder or somewhat

55:12

like not like a professional, but he was on the

55:14

team that I started with at Peter too, and

55:17

he was one of the most fit vegans I've ever met.

55:19

And we started working out in the

55:21

weight rooms at hotels and stuff with dumbbells

55:23

and nothing super serious. But

55:26

I like the way I felt, I like aspiring

55:28

to something like to make myself better. And

55:31

like I said, when I was out in the field talking about

55:33

campaigns with people, especially

55:35

representing Peter because it's such a divisive name,

55:38

um, I found that the more fit

55:41

we were, the

55:43

more willing people were to

55:45

ask us questions and be curious and

55:47

just you know, it just didn't fit their stereotype

55:50

of what a vegan was, so it made

55:52

them curious. And I

55:54

think that was also a motivator to keep going

55:56

down that fitness path. UM.

55:59

And I aventually I found you know, I'm not I'm

56:02

not really cut out to be a bodybuilder. Too

56:05

hairy, and

56:07

and also just the way

56:11

uh fat sits on my body,

56:13

like to cut all that, I

56:15

start to feel really unhealthy. But

56:17

I I discovered compound lifts and that led

56:19

me to powerlifting. And um,

56:22

powerlifting is a great sport because

56:25

you know, when you lift heavy, you can't lift every

56:28

day. Your body will just shut down. Your central nervous

56:30

system shuts down. You can't recover, So

56:32

you can only do heavy lifts three

56:35

or four days a week. You know, the rest of time you've got to

56:37

spend focusing

56:39

on recovery, which means time out of the gym.

56:41

So that means you have ample time to still

56:43

have a social life or a creative

56:45

life. UM. Whereas I think

56:47

body builders and cross fitters and things like that,

56:49

they spend so much of their free time in

56:51

the gym and that was another reason I

56:53

didn't really like those sports, and I

56:56

lean towards power lifting. Um,

56:59

but man, I got

57:01

bit by the fitness bug was a Peter. And

57:04

it's interesting because music led me to Peter,

57:07

and then Peter led me to fitness. And

57:09

now you know, I've got the book The Way that Vegan

57:11

meet Head and I've toured all around the

57:13

continent talking about vegan

57:16

strength diet and uh, I've

57:18

been competing in power listing like five years

57:21

now and I continue to improve at it.

57:23

Yeah. Um no, it's really cool. It's

57:25

really cool because yeah, one connects to the

57:27

other in very obvious directions, and it's

57:29

it's you know, it's like you're you're

57:32

using all of these things as building blocks

57:35

to um, not only the next thing, but

57:37

then you know, makes you a well

57:39

rounded person where people can kind of be like, oh,

57:41

yes, I see you. Not only have you been doing this for a long

57:43

time, but you have this previous experience that makes

57:46

total sense of why you would do this. Yeah.

57:49

Yeah, So it's interesting. One thing

57:51

just led to another, and strangely, it all

57:53

started with music and that led to

57:55

activism, and activism led to athletics.

57:58

Yeah, there you go. Um, and

58:00

something that I've noticed too. I mean, like you've mentioned on

58:02

more than one occasion, and you know, you

58:05

you know, you're a writer, you have published books,

58:07

you have published you know, poetry, and it's one

58:09

of those things where most people, um,

58:12

that would just look at like, you know, one

58:14

sliver of your life where it's just like, oh,

58:17

okay, here's here's this you know, really buff

58:19

dude that's a vegan, uh and he's a poet,

58:21

like, get the hell out of here. Like, you know, you

58:23

always it seems like you always enjoy

58:26

defying conventions, whether that's you know,

58:29

being a vegan from Texas or you

58:31

know, all of these things. I'm

58:33

sure that that has also played a part

58:35

in your you know, ability to sit

58:37

down and write a novel and your ability

58:39

to you know, pen poetry and stuff like that. Um.

58:42

I'm sure you just get kind of a kick out of the way

58:44

that people, uh you know are are surprised

58:46

by these things that you may be shared with them. They're just like,

58:49

dude, there's no come on, Daniel, you wrote

58:51

a book, Dude, Like come on, you

58:53

know what I'm saying. Yeah,

58:56

And that goes back to it, I guess when we're

58:58

talking about the industrious

59:00

nature, like

59:03

maybe I get some of it from my father. Um.

59:07

In other ways, it's just I haven't

59:09

been content, and

59:11

so I'm just restless and trying to

59:16

find ways to express myself to deal

59:20

with whatever pain of consciousness,

59:22

the pain of failure, the pain of whatever

59:24

we encounter in life is challenging. UM.

59:29

I don't know. I sometimes I think me,

59:33

maybe it's too much. People are just kind

59:35

of like, what the funk is this guy doing

59:38

writing about? You know, the first

59:40

book I wrote was The Way of the Vegan meat Head. But it was

59:42

because when I got into power lifting, people were

59:44

asking me about how I do it.

59:47

It wasn't a book I actually wanted to write. It

59:49

was a book people are asking me to do.

59:52

The other stuff like the new novel

59:54

called Canefield and the

59:56

poetry stuff was stuff that kind of more

59:58

naturally comes out of me because it's about me

1:00:00

trying to process my own experience, UM,

1:00:05

in my intimate life and my personal

1:00:07

life or my upbringing things like that.

1:00:11

UM. But you know, there's

1:00:13

there's so much. The world is so full

1:00:15

of everyone offering their contributions

1:00:17

into the forum of fail whatever books

1:00:20

and feelings and thoughts and so I think,

1:00:23

especially with social media now, it's so it's

1:00:26

so easy for everyone to just put their thoughts out

1:00:28

there. So no one's really asking

1:00:30

me for a

1:00:33

novel or poetry.

1:00:35

But um,

1:00:38

the poetry is not far off from Die

1:00:40

Young lyrics. You know. Um,

1:00:42

I didn't want to get just pegged as the vegan

1:00:45

guy, protein

1:00:47

guy, because yeah, there's so much there's so many more

1:00:49

dimensions to each of us than just like

1:00:51

the one thing that society says, Ah,

1:00:53

this is what we use them for. Um.

1:00:56

So whether people discover

1:01:00

or that side of me or connect

1:01:02

with it or like it or not, I

1:01:05

felt that, well, yeah, this is just what

1:01:07

naturally kind of comes out of me. So I need

1:01:09

to put it out there so I can get on with the next thing.

1:01:13

Um, like, for example, that the new novel

1:01:15

Cane Fields, which covers

1:01:19

a lot of kind of developmental

1:01:22

relationship stories that

1:01:24

and it shows how they linked into my creative

1:01:27

life with the bands. Um

1:01:29

it's all fictionalized, of course, but in a lot

1:01:31

of ways it is kind of a confessional memoir.

1:01:34

But um that you

1:01:36

know, I started writing that before I started

1:01:38

writing The Way that You Can Meet Ahead. And then in

1:01:40

the midst of all the things going on my life. People were

1:01:42

like, hey, if you can you lift,

1:01:45

tell us how, tell us how you know?

1:01:48

And so then I was like, wow, it seems

1:01:50

like people really wow, people

1:01:52

want something from me finally, so

1:01:54

here I guess I'll put this out, you know, But

1:01:57

I never wanted to be just that, so these

1:01:59

other things were I guess.

1:02:02

I mean, I feel like good art comes from a

1:02:04

place where you have to do it for yourself, and

1:02:06

whether other people connect

1:02:09

with they're not. It's really not on

1:02:11

you because to put

1:02:13

out something authentic you

1:02:16

can't worry about that. But

1:02:18

at the end of the day, as an artist, whether you're viable

1:02:20

or not and whether you can have the means

1:02:22

to continue doing it, it uh

1:02:25

depends on whether people consume it and connect

1:02:27

with it or not. But you

1:02:29

can't control that outcome, you know, Like

1:02:32

I never want to tailor what I do

1:02:36

um for success, even though you

1:02:38

know, I just get older. I think having some kind of success,

1:02:41

even if it's in a day job

1:02:43

kind of career, it becomes more important,

1:02:46

you know. Um. But and

1:02:48

that's why I've kept a day job so

1:02:51

that I don't have to compromise the art. Yeah,

1:02:53

sure, sure, And what and what

1:02:55

have you What have you done from that perspective,

1:02:58

from what do you do for your day job? Yeah?

1:03:01

Uh well, you know, I mean I did spend

1:03:03

a number of years in the nonprofit world

1:03:06

in animal rights, and I stumbled

1:03:08

into a job with Dell. Yeah,

1:03:12

like sales liaison work, um,

1:03:16

a number of years ago, and uh, you

1:03:19

know, there was some I got laid off this

1:03:21

year and so my new job is like

1:03:24

a quality analyst assisting the

1:03:26

v A and helping, uh evaluate

1:03:29

medical records for veterans

1:03:31

so that they can hopefully

1:03:34

get covered on the vigas time.

1:03:36

You know, that's a that's a whole just

1:03:39

a mess I can imagine,

1:03:42

you know. Um

1:03:44

so, uh yeah, that's that's

1:03:47

where I'm at right now. But um,

1:03:50

I kind of I've never

1:03:52

had like a career. I thought I was going to

1:03:54

pursue animal rights. And maybe you can relate because

1:03:57

you're not with Pete anymore. Correct. No, I

1:03:59

mean I do some consulting work for them. But that's that's

1:04:01

the expect because I think once you've once you've worked

1:04:03

for Peter, you always kind of are in their orbit. So

1:04:05

they need they need help. They're like, hey, could you do this?

1:04:08

Yeah, yeah, but I understand. But most

1:04:11

people I almost look at time in the

1:04:13

a are like animal rights nonprofit

1:04:15

world as like military

1:04:17

service. It's like for most people is not going

1:04:20

to be a career, but you do it out

1:04:22

of a service to something greater than you, especially

1:04:25

when you're younger. Um,

1:04:28

and then it wears you out and you just can't

1:04:30

do anymore. Well, well, I think

1:04:32

from from where the position

1:04:34

that that you were doing, where you were, you know,

1:04:37

face to face with people every day, day in and

1:04:39

day out, speaking about you know, your

1:04:41

experience with you know, veganism and answering

1:04:43

questions and all that. Yeah, that to me

1:04:46

is not a sustainable thing, like you know, right.

1:04:48

Well, I came back and I actually worked in email

1:04:50

marketing for Yeah, I remember that a

1:04:52

while also, um,

1:04:55

and that was also exhausting. Well,

1:04:58

it's because it's something that know

1:05:00

that the organization and many

1:05:02

other nonprofit organizations. And

1:05:04

frankly, when you have people who

1:05:06

are passionate about a thing and you they

1:05:09

come in the doors because they're so excited to work

1:05:12

at wherever it is, um, you know, it's

1:05:16

it is tough. Like I mean, I saw that a day

1:05:18

in and day out, even working at a record label. It's

1:05:20

like you know, people, you know, people would

1:05:23

come in and work for like, you know, two

1:05:25

dollars an hour. I mean I'm exaggerating, but like

1:05:28

they when you are involved

1:05:30

with the thing you're passionate about, you have to be careful

1:05:33

to not um, not only not burn

1:05:35

yourself out, but then also not be exploited

1:05:37

to the extent where you're just like, oh, I don't feel

1:05:40

like I'm even getting remotely fairly

1:05:42

compensated or whatever, right right,

1:05:44

um? And I find in the you

1:05:47

know, I don't anyone listening to this. I don't want to discourage

1:05:49

them from going and working in the nonprofit

1:05:51

world because it's so important. Same

1:05:54

um, But I think

1:05:56

for in man, my head is off to

1:05:59

all those ends of ours. It have stayed

1:06:02

and made careers out of it because they

1:06:05

found a way to balance their

1:06:08

personal needs with you know,

1:06:10

the needs of like you know, the animals or the

1:06:13

the dispossessor or whatever whatever

1:06:15

you cause we're fighting for and then you know they need somebody

1:06:18

to do that. Um.

1:06:21

But yeah, for sure, at the end of the day,

1:06:23

we've got to make an evaluation of is

1:06:27

this a life that we

1:06:29

can personally be sustained

1:06:32

with? And for our own health

1:06:34

and our own sanity. Can we do this? And a lot

1:06:36

of people can't, and a lot of people just I

1:06:39

think it's fair to say that it's not the

1:06:41

best life for most people and for the people

1:06:43

that can stay at it, you

1:06:45

know, Like I know, we both know people that

1:06:47

have been there over a decade maybe something close to

1:06:50

two. At this point, it's like, wow,

1:06:52

what a hero. You know, well, and it's

1:06:54

it's the the idea of compassion fatigue,

1:06:56

you know. It's like I mean, especially especially

1:06:59

at Peter Or it's just like day in and day out, Um,

1:07:01

you know, you're confronted with all of these things and

1:07:04

it's, uh yeah, it becomes draining

1:07:06

where you're just like, ah, man, I

1:07:08

can't like you know, you're being

1:07:10

exposed to the stuff you're already aware

1:07:13

of, and you're like, I don't want to I don't want to see this

1:07:15

undercover footage or whatever. You know. It's like, yeah,

1:07:18

it's and that's so you know, I've found new ways

1:07:20

to advocate for myself, you know, And now

1:07:22

what I'm doing is trying to kind of uh

1:07:25

lead more by an example, to show people how

1:07:28

easy and fun and advantageous

1:07:32

it can be. Too to be a vegan

1:07:34

if you do it right, if you plan it right, and

1:07:37

um, I've distanced myself

1:07:40

from all the horror. Yeah, well

1:07:42

you're trying to demystify something like

1:07:44

you're, like you said, you're answering questions,

1:07:47

um, from people who are are curious because

1:07:49

of your actions and the way that you are as an individual,

1:07:51

in the way that you present yourself. So it's a whole different

1:07:54

Yeah, Like it's a different people. It's

1:07:56

a dynamic that I can currently live with

1:07:58

better than the last. Yeah,

1:08:01

for sure. Um, but we all got

1:08:03

to find that balance we do. Yeah, yeah, and you

1:08:05

only know when you try the things exactly.

1:08:08

Um. The last thing I want to hit on was the um,

1:08:10

you know, I'm sure with the vegan meathead stuff

1:08:12

that you know, you're interacting with a

1:08:14

lot of people. And I don't use this disparagingly,

1:08:17

but like, you know, civilians, it's like, you know, these are people

1:08:19

were clearly not in you know, indoctrinated

1:08:22

with all of our you know, ins and outs of subcultures

1:08:25

and being exposed to the idea of veganism when you're

1:08:27

like, you know, fourteen years old or whatever. Um,

1:08:30

you know, so how interesting

1:08:32

is it for you. And I'm sure, how

1:08:34

funny is it that these, um,

1:08:36

you know, these questions come up to

1:08:38

you that are like the most type, especially

1:08:41

the protein one where it's just like I'm sure you answered that four

1:08:43

hundred thousand times in a given year. Um,

1:08:46

you know, so how how do you kind of uh,

1:08:49

you know, handle that? Is it basically just kind of

1:08:51

like you know, you have your sort of like all

1:08:53

right, well, here's here's my talking points. I know how to answer

1:08:55

this one or whatever, and not in a dispassionate

1:08:58

way, but just in a all right, I'm I'm used to

1:09:00

this line of questioning. Well, I think

1:09:02

it's refreshing because it's so new

1:09:04

for all these other people. I mean, you just have to

1:09:07

realize for millions

1:09:09

of people, they're just now finding out

1:09:11

what veganism is. So, um,

1:09:15

I try to lay it out in a way.

1:09:17

I mean, when I give lectures about it,

1:09:19

it's pretty stuck. You know. I go by my power

1:09:21

point and I already know what I'm gonna say, and it echoes a

1:09:23

lot of whatever I said in my book. And

1:09:26

um, what I like the most

1:09:29

is the question and answers, you know, where it's

1:09:31

more of just a dialogue UM

1:09:36

because it's it's just surprising to see

1:09:38

what angles people are coming at it

1:09:40

from. You know, it's really weird to me that for

1:09:43

most people I'm meeting out at these veg fests

1:09:45

and stuff, Propagandhi and Earth Crisis aren't

1:09:47

household names, you

1:09:50

know. Uh. Yeah, that's how I grew

1:09:52

up in hark uh in animal rights

1:09:54

is like, and when I started working at PETA's,

1:09:56

like everybody was there because of those bands,

1:09:59

totally totally, Like, I don't know, I don't think

1:10:01

that's necessarily the case anymore, you

1:10:03

know, because times change.

1:10:06

And but

1:10:10

you know what I find the most challenging actually

1:10:12

is just speaking to anyone about

1:10:16

things that aren't vegan related

1:10:19

and things that aren't kind

1:10:21

of uh

1:10:26

anything I would talk about and die young, you know, which

1:10:28

kind of would be almost like this Bill hicksie

1:10:30

and kind of sinister

1:10:34

commentary about society. Because

1:10:37

what I've got into now with like the novel writing

1:10:40

is um storytelling. And there's

1:10:42

a storytelling group in Memphis. It's kind of like the Moth,

1:10:44

but it's I'm living in Memphis right

1:10:46

now, and they have a thing called Spilt which

1:10:48

I've I've attend there events

1:10:51

and it's just storytelling. And

1:10:54

the guy that runs and he does workshops, and I've

1:10:56

gone through his workshops and we work on telling

1:10:58

stories because that's something I want to be good at,

1:11:01

um because I'm speaking front of people all

1:11:03

time. But I've I've gotten up in front of you

1:11:05

know, these crowds of strangers just to tell

1:11:07

a random story and tried to

1:11:10

make the story compelling, and

1:11:12

I found it just telling an experience

1:11:14

in a story kind of format was

1:11:18

caused me so much more anxiety than

1:11:20

talking about vegan protein or

1:11:23

getting a vasectomy in which I tell people, or

1:11:25

shoplifting, which I would talk about, and Die Young shows

1:11:28

all the time, you know, all these like really taboo kinds

1:11:30

of things, and I like to shock people. But when I

1:11:32

got out, and that's like the real

1:11:34

civilian uh

1:11:37

communication experiences, just you get up

1:11:39

and share an experience in your

1:11:41

life with a room full of strangers

1:11:44

and you try to make it something that they can relate

1:11:46

to. Man that man,

1:11:48

I was so much more nervous doing that

1:11:50

than anything I've done for viging

1:11:52

meat head or Die Young UM.

1:11:56

And it's it's kind of weird that talking

1:11:58

about more common experien variances it

1:12:01

was more difficult, sure,

1:12:04

sure, yeah that it's like the

1:12:06

the things that are you know, clearly,

1:12:09

especially in your head, more nuanced,

1:12:11

where it's just like, well, you know, veganism is something that's

1:12:14

I've been wrestling with for many,

1:12:16

many years. But then like, you know, these

1:12:18

these emotions that other people can

1:12:20

have about the thing that you speak about is

1:12:23

difficult to navigate. Yeah, yeah,

1:12:25

I guess you know, when it comes to vegan subject

1:12:29

matter, I feel like an expert. I'm just in such

1:12:31

a comfort zone. I can get

1:12:33

up in front of two people and just blah

1:12:36

blah blah, this is what I do, make

1:12:39

some stock joke, and it all goes over. Well,

1:12:42

it's very routine. Um.

1:12:45

And then you

1:12:48

know, when it came to Dion, you know, you're playing in front

1:12:50

of mostly young men who

1:12:52

are angry just like you, and you

1:12:54

say the controversial, fucked

1:12:56

up thing that no one else in the world would appreciate.

1:12:58

But then you know, you you're agitating this

1:13:01

crowd of hardcore kids and they're kind

1:13:04

of you know, they're in your plane of consciousness,

1:13:07

so it's not it's not that

1:13:09

vulnerable, really, um,

1:13:12

I think and young I always tried to go to a vulnerable

1:13:14

place, like talking about depression or suicide.

1:13:17

Um, you know, because we had we had

1:13:20

a guitar player who I

1:13:22

think, I don't know if it was an intentional suicide,

1:13:25

but he overdoes some drugs a

1:13:27

number of years ago, and

1:13:29

I started talking about things like that more and

1:13:31

the way we felt about it as his friend

1:13:34

on on stage, and I found that a lot of people

1:13:36

will come up and share stories afterwards,

1:13:39

and that was nice and cathartic. But

1:13:42

uh, I don't know, I felt

1:13:44

a I guess I felt a comfort because even though

1:13:46

I feel very alienated in the hardcore scene, especially

1:13:48

as to get older, it's still my tribe. You know,

1:13:50

I still kind of know the

1:13:54

wavelength that we're on when I'm at

1:13:56

a show. You know, for sure, it's like when

1:13:58

you've been experiencing it as long as you have, Like

1:14:01

there's a familiarity no matter. You know, if

1:14:03

you didn't go to a show for fifteen years, you could

1:14:05

probably still jump

1:14:08

in and still recognize shades of

1:14:10

it from you know, your massive

1:14:12

year absence. But you haven't been that, so yeah, you're

1:14:14

you're still going to feel that, so yeah, yeah,

1:14:17

And and and then getting up in front of total

1:14:19

strangers who you have none of that basis

1:14:22

with that I found

1:14:24

is much more difficult, And that's kind of like one

1:14:26

of the challenges that I'm

1:14:28

trying to try

1:14:31

trying to, uh,

1:14:33

added to my list of trades I'm not a master

1:14:36

of. Um sure, that's

1:14:38

kind of where I am now because with the novel and the poetry

1:14:40

and stuff and those, those are the kinds of writing that

1:14:43

I'm pursuing more heavily

1:14:46

right now. Um. I

1:14:48

guess trying to tap into the

1:14:50

basis with wider group of people is

1:14:53

something I feel I need to be able

1:14:55

to do, but it's I

1:14:57

find it strangely more more challenging.

1:15:00

Yeah, yeah, no, it is. Yeah. Anytime you're trying

1:15:02

to, you know, extend your reach into

1:15:05

other things that are clearly unfamiliar,

1:15:07

it's like, well, yeah, it's all an experiment,

1:15:09

that's for sure. Yeah.

1:15:12

Well, Daniel, this has been awesome. Thank you

1:15:14

so much for coming on. It was really enjoyable

1:15:16

for me. Likewise, man, thank

1:15:18

you so much for keeping this thing going. And

1:15:20

I'll be listening to all your episodes. That

1:15:24

was that. Thank you very much Daniel for coming

1:15:26

on the show and sharing all that stuff

1:15:28

because uh, yeah, I just I appreciate

1:15:30

when people trust me and

1:15:32

want to come on the show in

1:15:34

order to you know, express whatever it is that's

1:15:37

on their mind and be able to talk about things that

1:15:39

you know, they might be a little uncomfortable share

1:15:42

or whatever. But yeah, thank you very much. Daniel appreciate

1:15:44

it. And like I said, go check out all of his books.

1:15:47

Go check out vegan meathead dot com. It's really

1:15:49

really compelling, approachable

1:15:51

stuff if you're into nutrition

1:15:53

and health and weightlifting and all that stuff.

1:15:56

Um, he is an expert at that,

1:15:58

and uh, I encourage you to check out his

1:16:01

stuff. Next week we have

1:16:03

Scott Hobart, who plays in a band called

1:16:05

Giants Chair. They were a

1:16:08

pretty they loomed pretty large in my life in

1:16:10

regards to the sort of mid nineties Emo

1:16:12

stuff, and Giants Chair has

1:16:14

returned. They've they're releasing a new full length.

1:16:16

And I wanted to have Scott on

1:16:18

because you know, the band hadn't

1:16:20

really done anything and close to twenty

1:16:23

years, and then they started playing some shows and realized

1:16:26

it was fun and decided to put a record all that

1:16:28

fun stuff. So yeah, if you're a fan of mid

1:16:30

nineties emo, the next week is absolutely

1:16:32

for you, and I fall very much

1:16:34

into that camp. So anyways,

1:16:36

until then, please be safe. Everybody.

1:16:40

Hi there, I'm Zach Braff and I'm Donald phase

1:16:42

On. We're real life best friends, but

1:16:45

we met playing fake life best friends

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