0:00

While a Vietnam podcast is on break right

0:02

now, I'll be sharing these episodes with you

0:04

so that you can discover the real Vietnam.

0:06

Whether you currently live here already,

0:09

want to come visit or see more of this

0:11

amazing.

0:18

Welcome to the Vietnam is awesome

0:20

podcast. We'll help you discover the

0:22

real Vietnam with awesome experience.

0:26

I'm Niall Mackay, your host, and I've lived in

0:28

Vietnam since 2016. I'm

0:30

the host of a Vietnam podcast, a comedian

0:32

and brand ambassador for Vietnam. Is.

0:36

I came to Vietnam for a two week vacation

0:38

in 2015 and was immediately

0:40

taken back by the beauty, friendliness,

0:43

energy, and even the quirks

0:45

of Vietnam. I came back

0:47

in 2016 with my wife for six

0:49

weeks, and more than six years later,

0:52

we're still here. In this podcast,

0:54

I'll be talking to people from all over Vietnam,

0:56

working in tourism bars, results,

0:58

hotels, nightlife, and more to share

1:00

with you experiences that prove Vietnam

1:03

is. In this

1:05

episode, my guest has lived

1:07

in Vietnam for 10 years now. He's

1:10

worked at Paso Street Brewing Company for

1:12

eight and a half, most of those as the

1:14

sales director spreading amazing

1:17

craft beer across Vietnam. He's

1:19

also the co-host of

1:21

the Beer Stories podcast, which is

1:24

produced by myself and Seven Million Bikes podcast,

1:26

and shares stories of craft beer, predominantly

1:29

in Vietnam, but also around the world, highlighting

1:32

the amazing beer that we have here in

1:34

Vietnam. So thank you for joining me

1:36

today. My guest is Misha Smith.

1:39

That, uh, that introduction sounded more

1:41

impressive than I, than I'm impressed with myself. So I,

1:44

I appreci. What year did you

1:46

first come to Vietnam? 2013

1:49

June. So it'll be 10 years in, in June of this year.

1:51

So Tale is a bit about how Vietnam,

1:53

Saigon specifically has changed in the

1:55

last 10 years. I came here initially as

1:57

a, as an English teacher. That's what I was doing in South

1:59

Korea before I got here. Uh, but like you said,

2:02

I've been working at Pastor Street for, uh, about eight and

2:04

a half years working predominantly in

2:06

f and b. That's obviously where I've noticed the most,

2:08

uh, change. Like when I first got here,

2:10

there were, uh, like a handful

2:13

of Western style restaurant. Now

2:15

there's amazing international restaurants

2:17

from all over the world. Um,

2:20

like all different countries, all different kinds of cuisine. Uh,

2:22

winning your international awards and like being

2:24

mentioned as best of, uh,

2:27

like you couldn't get, you couldn't have a, the

2:29

only cocktail bar when I first got

2:31

here, it was called the Rumbar. It

2:34

was the sidewalk outside some lady's

2:36

apartment. An old lady

2:38

who made like bathtub rum and served

2:40

it in like repurposed old liquor bottles that

2:42

were definitely not rum bottles. I mean some of them might have been,

2:44

but uh, like that was a cocktail

2:46

bar 10 years ago in Saigon.

2:49

Now you've got these amazing bespoke cocktail

2:51

bars all over Saigon, over Hanoi,

2:54

uh, in Central as well. It's so

2:56

that for me, that's the biggest change cuz

2:59

you know, I'm right up against it is the f and b uh,

3:02

development here and just how amazing

3:04

it is and compared to how bare bones it was. Obviously

3:07

there was amazing food in Saigon,

3:09

Vietnamese food. But yeah, the,

3:11

the level of international quality

3:13

restaurants that there are now, it's, it's mind blowing

3:15

to think back to, like you

3:17

said, just 10 short years ago, what

3:20

it was like then versus now. The food and

3:22

beverage is just a great example

3:24

of the development of Vietnam and it's developed

3:26

in so many ways. So

3:29

this podcast, we, we are want

3:31

to encourage tourists to visit Vietnam. We're back

3:34

open now. You're one of the people. That

3:36

I think are the most enthusiastic about

3:39

Saigon. You, you love it here. For

3:41

you. Uh, why do you love Saigon?

3:44

I obviously, I've been asked this question a lot because,

3:46

like you said, my, my, my enthusiasm

3:48

and my love for Saigon is very apparent and it's,

3:50

it's very outward. Um, it's

3:53

just, and it's so hard

3:56

to like pinpoint what it is, but

3:59

when you, when you've traveled

4:01

a bit, you just, you

4:03

get a certain feeling when you go to certain. And

4:06

the first time I came here on vacation, I

4:09

just had this giddy enthusiasm,

4:11

this giddy feeling that I just couldn't, like, I had

4:13

this goofy grin on my face the whole two

4:15

weeks I think it was, and you just couldn't knock it off

4:18

my face. I was just like, th this is me. This

4:20

is me right here. I just loved it. And

4:22

you know, it's the energy of the city. It's the,

4:25

I was coming from South Korea where not

4:27

all the locals were super friendly to foreign.

4:30

Whereas here, you know, Saigon being a very tourist city,

4:33

I got a genuine good feeling from

4:36

Vietnamese people, um,

4:38

about us being here and, and

4:41

you know, they're very welcoming and they're very helpful

4:44

and, and you know, even back then,

4:46

like the, the, the

4:48

nightlife was, you know,

4:50

it's not what it is now. There was, there was

4:53

still like a manic energy to it, like going

4:55

down Bo. Boon

4:57

was, was a, was trash. Like it was,

4:59

it was a, it was a dirty, nasty

5:01

neighborhood with, that's where all like

5:04

the petty crime happens in Saigon. Um,

5:07

but now it, it's super gentrified and

5:09

it's, it's worse. Like it's nicer

5:11

and it's worse. Yeah, true. So like

5:13

an I would hate to over romanticize boon. Yes.

5:17

But I mean, honestly at that, at, at that point,

5:19

like at that time, that's where we spent

5:21

most of our nights. You know, we started at one of the little

5:24

plastic chairs, either rounds of

5:26

beers or a bottle of Jameson's. Uh,

5:29

I think we called it the grocery store. Like

5:31

it was, I don't remember the exact address,

5:33

but the, it was uh,

5:36

a mother and grandmother

5:38

who ran it. And they were friendly to us

5:40

cuz we went there and spent a lot of money and we were polite.

5:43

Um, and that's all it was up and down the street was those

5:45

kind of places. But we had our favorite.

5:48

It's the energy that this city

5:50

has and gives me that,

5:54

that makes me love it so much. And also like

5:56

to speak up to the development. It's like

5:59

the old Saigon and the

6:01

new Saigon, like the kind

6:03

of competing tension there.

6:06

I love it. Mm-hmm. Like I just love watching it and

6:09

yeah. To, to have been here for 10 years. And I think

6:11

I have friends who have been here for 25 years, so like, you know, I'm

6:14

a relative novice. But,

6:16

uh, yeah, it's just, it's

6:19

hard to put it into words, but also,

6:21

so to, and to that point, every

6:24

single friend or relative

6:26

who's come here to visit me, I,

6:28

I think a lot, I think all of them didn't understand

6:31

why I loved it so much, and what it was about it.

6:34

Within, within hours,

6:36

they're like, oh, I get it. Yeah. Okay. Not,

6:39

and not just, they get it. Why? I love

6:41

it. But they loved it too. Yeah. Like everyone

6:43

who's come here has had a great. You

6:45

know, obviously partly cause I was there to, to guide them.

6:47

So if you're a tourist coming to Vietnam,

6:50

it would help to have someone here

6:52

who knows what they're doing a little bit. Then

6:54

also there's a fun of not knowing and just

6:57

discovering for yourself. So, For tourists

6:59

listening who thinking of coming here and then they're going,

7:02

boy, Vien. What's that? So do

7:04

you wanna explain a little bit about it, the pros

7:06

and the cons? Cuz it, it, it's got, I've spent

7:08

a lot of time on Boen when I first moved

7:10

here as well. And it is where a lot of backpackers

7:12

and, and young tourists are gonna stay. So

7:15

what, what, what do you mean when you kinda laughed about it

7:17

and mentioned it? So if you've never been here, obviously it's,

7:19

you're not gonna know anything about Bovie

7:21

or fam Nu Lao. So in the heart of district

7:24

one, which is downtown Seig, There's

7:27

a street called Bovie in an area called Family

7:29

Lyle. Um, and

7:31

it used to be really grimy

7:34

and dirty and uh, and, and,

7:37

but like energetic and lively. Now

7:39

it's more like nightclub. And

7:42

I know a lot of tourists do come down

7:44

here and, and stay there. I wouldn't recommend

7:46

it. It's not the best part of town and

7:48

it's also not like the most fun part of town. It's,

7:51

it's probably the cheapest and that's why probably

7:54

a lot of people end up there. Um, But

7:57

yeah, get, get, get

7:59

outta fam new la I would, I would, I

8:01

would advise tourists. It's, you

8:04

know, like if you've been to Thailand, like Cal San Road

8:06

mm-hmm. Like that's, that's kind of the, the comparison

8:08

everyone makes. But it's, it's an imperfect

8:10

comparison, but yeah. That's, that's, it's more

8:12

similar. It's a frame of reference. Yeah. Yeah. Well,

8:15

you know, we do a comedy show every Thursday night called

8:17

the Tourist Trap Comedy Show. And partnership

8:19

with Vie Hammer is awesome. And we are encouraging

8:22

tourists to come along to that. And so we actually go around by

8:24

Vhe every Thursday night and chat to

8:26

people and hand out flyers. Um, okay.

8:28

And it's, it's fun. Before

8:30

it gets dark. There's a big difference. As

8:32

soon as it gets dark, all the, all the volume

8:35

goes up to 10. It gives a night. Yeah,

8:38

and like before it gets dark, we walk around and we

8:40

have awesome chats with people. We hand out flyers,

8:42

meet people from all over the world. So that's interesting. I,

8:44

it's been a while since I've driven down there

8:47

with any purpose. Like, so during the day it's

8:49

like people having lunch, having beers

8:51

on the street still, or, yeah, it's pretty, it's

8:53

pretty quiet. I mean, not quiet, sorry. It's still

8:55

people driving Bikes people everywhere.

8:58

Right. But it's kinda nice people are out on, because

9:00

the, the bars are open on the street, so people are,

9:03

Casual evening be okay. The music

9:05

isn't too loud, and all of that stuff. And,

9:07

and Misha mentioned Family Loud,

9:09

there's lots of bus stations that leave from there, or Busies

9:11

depart from there. So it's kind of like a big tourist hub.

9:13

Someone told me you can get a bed and a hostel for $5

9:16

a night. So it's definitely like if you're backpacking,

9:19

it's a good place to be. Just

9:21

as it gets later, it gets loader. Um,

9:23

there is a lot of petty crime like Misha, me

9:25

mentioned. I've known friends to have their bags stolen,

9:27

phone stolen, so you still need to watch out. I

9:30

was down there one time, uh, sitting

9:32

on my motorbike, parked on the side waiting

9:34

for uh, um, a delivery

9:37

and, uh, this like

9:39

nice looking foreign girl,

9:42

long blond hair sundress. She

9:44

was walking down boian with

9:48

a handful of. That she'd

9:50

obviously just gotten out of an atm, like just

9:52

counting it casually. And

9:54

I looked at her and like, Hey, you

9:56

don't wanna be doing that around here? And she looked at

9:58

me like I was a, like I was a jerk. I

10:01

was like, sorry. Hey, if you don't want the advice,

10:04

keep walking. There's a tip for tourists. Anyone listening,

10:06

thinking to come in Vietnam, come to Vietnam. Don't

10:08

walk about with your phone in your hand, like away

10:10

from your body. If you're gonna have your phone in your hand, keep

10:12

it close to your body or keep away from the street. Don't

10:14

count cash. Around

10:17

Boyen, I mean, is probably one of the safest

10:19

countries in the world. Most places you're fine to

10:21

count your cash. Yeah. Boy vie though. Just

10:23

you're, you're making yourself putting, putting a target

10:25

on your back if you do that. It's, it's, so

10:28

yeah, to your point, it's still the

10:30

most concentrated area where petty crime happens.

10:33

Mm-hmm. And a lot of people that

10:35

I've spoken to associate Saigon

10:37

with petty crime, which is just not true. Like

10:39

you said, it's one of the safest places. Except

10:42

for like certain areas. Yeah. Where you just have to be careful.

10:44

Yeah. And it's, if, if you are thinking of coming here and you're

10:46

worried about the crime, it's very opportunistic.

10:49

It's if you're gonna have your phone in your hand or

10:51

your bag, someone may just drive by and snatch

10:53

it, but that's just, it doesn't, it's

10:55

not too bad. So please still come and. I

10:58

mentioned do a comedy show every Thursday. So go to the

11:00

Vietnam is awesome website. You can find it. They're

11:02

the tourist trap comedy show and, and

11:04

book your tickets for that. So what

11:06

recommendations would you give to tourists to do

11:08

in Saigon? The one I did wanna mention, what's

11:10

called the Quang Mop, it's still

11:13

dirt cheap after all these years. It's

11:15

best to go with a big group of people. Um,

11:18

the menu's only in Vietnamese, so if you're a

11:20

tourist coming here, you might need a, a

11:22

Vietnamese guidebook and look in the food section to

11:25

see what you. But yeah,

11:27

just order as many dishes as

11:29

you think you can eat. Uh,

11:32

it's right on the river. It's nice. It's the,

11:36

the family who owns it. Like they're

11:38

all there every night. The husband and the wife

11:40

and all their kids. I've kind of like watched

11:42

their kids grow up from afar. You know, they were tiny

11:45

in height when we first started going,

11:47

and now they're, now they're all pretty big. So,

11:50

yeah, that. Anytime

11:52

a friend comes to visit, that's, I always make sure we take

11:54

them to, to quang up for at least one dinner.

11:57

Uh, I think you said in the, in the,

11:59

uh, in the open something about

12:01

like the real Saigon or the real Vietnam that's

12:04

as real as you can get. Like short

12:07

of going out into the countryside

12:09

and like, you know, drinking

12:11

sugar cane juice with old ladies by the,

12:13

by the canal or something like by

12:16

the river, I guess. Within city

12:18

limits. That's as real of a Saigon

12:20

as you're gonna get. And just up and down that, uh,

12:22

street psa, there's

12:25

a ton of other places like it. Uh,

12:27

my friend Sean, when he first moved here, he was living in that

12:29

area, so him and his buddies like tried all

12:31

the places and that was the winner. That was

12:33

the one that like they stuck with and

12:35

then obviously introduced me to it. And now I try

12:38

to spread the word as much as possible cuz the,

12:40

the old man who runs it is an awesome dude.

12:44

Big smile on his face every year. Now when I go for,

12:46

for my birthday, and then anytime in between. Um,

12:50

and yeah, it's, the food is phenomenal.

12:53

Like it, the quality of the

12:55

food for what the actual

12:57

place looks like. You, you wouldn't believe

12:59

it if you found it anywhere else. But you

13:01

know, in Saigon it kind of makes sense. And do

13:03

be ready to be aware

13:06

of what you're ordering because this just happened to me

13:08

like two days ago and I've been here seven. Restaurant

13:11

near me ordered what I, the

13:13

English translation on the menu said Tie leg

13:16

of chicken. And I ordered it

13:18

and it came out and it was chicken feet, which

13:21

I don't eat. This is also why the,

13:23

the translate apps are, you know, just unbelievable

13:25

technology but not perfect because, yeah.

13:28

So I looked up the translate app and

13:30

Chenga, which I knew meant chicken feet,

13:33

uh, versus Canga, which is chicken

13:35

legs, chicken wings. Chicken.

13:37

If you type in chicken leg, it comes

13:39

up changa as well. So changa also

13:42

means chicken leg and chicken feet. So

13:45

Gora beer, which is obviously your other passion

13:47

other than Saigon. Yes. Give us

13:49

a quick overview of how that changed,

13:52

when that changed and, and what Kraft beer is

13:54

now like in Saigon. So I've

13:56

been living here for about a year and a half. Uh,

13:58

when I first saw an ad on Facebook for

14:00

Pastor Street Brew. And I remember

14:03

it was a Friday because Fridays were the only day I had

14:05

off. And the advertisement for was

14:07

for the opening the following Friday.

14:10

And I was angry that I had to wait a week because yeah,

14:12

like my last job in Toronto before moving

14:15

to Asia, was bartending at a craft beer bar.

14:17

Loved craft beer. Korea

14:19

was just starting to get some craft beers, like just as I

14:21

was leaving. There's a big scene

14:23

there now. Um, but yeah, coming here that was

14:25

like the missing piece of the puzzle was good. Um,

14:29

so yeah, the, the following Friday, it was

14:31

January 2nd, uh,

14:34

2015. And I remember because

14:36

I, I and my friends liked

14:39

to drink on January 1st instead

14:41

of like, like, we'll wake up hungover on after

14:44

New Year's. I'm like, let's get some day drinking

14:46

in. Like, we all take the day off work and it's January 1st,

14:48

right? Um, so I had a massive hangover

14:50

on the second when I went. So I got there

14:53

a little bit later than I was planning. And,

14:55

uh, Bethany, one of the co-founders

14:57

who was behind the bar at the time, she

14:59

said I was the third person through the door. And that made me

15:01

really angry that I wasn't, that I wasn't the very

15:04

first customer. But then, yeah, three

15:06

weeks later I was, uh, volunteering behind the bar

15:08

for free beers. Uh, cuz

15:10

they were short-staffed and, and I was offering

15:12

to work a real

15:14

shift for free beer. They're like, yeah,

15:17

yeah, yeah. Cause I was there every Friday. It was my only

15:19

day off. I was. Pretty much all day

15:21

on Fridays, depending on my friends and how much money

15:23

they had, if they could afford to stay. Cuz again, at the time

15:25

it was, it was, uh, quite expensive

15:27

compared to the, the other beer options.

15:30

Um, and yeah, at the time, uh, you know, like

15:32

Platinum was a thing, fuzzy

15:35

logic. Like there were a couple other craft beer

15:37

companies already in Operation

15:39

Saigon Cider, uh, always gets

15:42

lost in the, in the story of craft beer in Vietnam

15:44

cuz it's a cider, but also because it's, uh,

15:47

it's a little more. So they had

15:49

four beers available and one was Jasmine ipa.

15:51

That's the first beer I had. That's the last

15:54

beer I had. I obviously tried them all, but like, that's the

15:56

one that really stuck out. Just

15:58

having an IPA in Vietnam was amazing. And also

16:00

it was a, it was an amazingly done ipa.

16:03

So Alex, uh, one of our other co-founders,

16:06

he was the brewmaster at, uh, one

16:08

of the most well respected breweries

16:10

in one of the most competitive beer markets in the States in

16:12

Boulder, Colorado. Uh,

16:15

so having him come over, it

16:17

really. Just it,

16:20

it gave us a legitimacy that not

16:22

a lot of craft breweries are gonna have in Vietnam. And

16:25

of course now there are Western Brewmasters

16:27

who have very impressive resumes. But

16:30

Alex was kinda the first one to, to

16:32

come from the states and make

16:35

like really authentic craft beers

16:38

with just high quality uncompromising.

16:41

And yeah, it was, it

16:43

was a revelation for. Um,

16:45

and then obviously I had passion

16:47

about the beer and the brand, so I started working

16:49

there. And then, uh, yeah,

16:52

more and more I was, I was, I was

16:54

giving up teaching shifts. I mean, once they started

16:56

paying me, obviously I wasn't, I wasn't gonna turn

16:58

down a paying job for a non-paying one, but

17:00

once they started paying me in money instead of beer, I

17:03

started like picking up a couple more shifts

17:05

during the night, during the week, uh,

17:07

teaching a little bit. And then the sales job

17:09

came up, the opportunity came up. Uh, our

17:11

third co-founder, the one, the one I haven't mentioned yet, John,

17:14

he offered me the job and,

17:16

uh, and I, I jumped at him. You know, you're gonna pay me to drink

17:19

beer? Yes, yes.

17:22

Um, and yeah, that's, I mean, from

17:24

that now there are, I think the last count

17:27

there were like 70 craft breweries

17:29

operating in Vietnam, uh, from

17:32

very small businesses to very, very

17:34

large. Um, yeah, it's amazing

17:37

that we're craft Vietnamese craft beers being

17:39

exported to other countries. Um,

17:41

it's, it, it's, we

17:43

have, not we, pastor Street, but we,

17:46

Vietnam have a reputation in

17:48

Southeast Asia as being one of,

17:50

if not the best countries for

17:53

quality and variety of craft beers. Um,

17:56

and yeah, I'm just really pa I'm just

17:59

really proud to be, uh, part of the, part

18:01

of that whole, uh, Revolution.

18:04

Not a movement. A movement ends. It's a revolution.

18:06

Keeps, keeps going round and round. It's also

18:08

really exciting, like you mentioned with Vietnam

18:10

there, because let's be honest, Vietnam does

18:13

have a reputation for maybe poorer quality

18:15

or, uh, low grade exports.

18:17

It's not got the highest reputation internationally.

18:21

Yeah, I mean, I think as,

18:23

as much as that, whether or not that's

18:25

true and as much as, as, as it is true

18:27

in certain circles, I think that's just people who have never

18:29

been here and don't know anything about it, you know, like. Like,

18:32

uh, Fuqua Pepper is

18:35

widely regarded as the best pepper

18:37

in the world. You know, you've got, uh,

18:39

Maru Chocolate, which was an inspiration for us

18:42

just as a business model. They're making

18:44

some of the best chocolate in the world right

18:46

here in Vietnam. Mm-hmm. Look, we're Vietnam's

18:49

famous for having amazing fish slots like so, and

18:51

coffee as well. Like, you know, coffee's very

18:54

high quality coffee all over. So would

18:57

I expect my friend sitting

18:59

on his couch in Toronto to. About

19:02

those locally

19:04

made products? No, of course not. I didn't know anything about

19:06

them before I came. Um,

19:08

but once people get here and realize,

19:11

wow, this is a lot going on here. Mm-hmm.

19:14

And even like the, I

19:16

mentioned it a couple times at the top, but the

19:20

quality and quantity of world-class

19:23

international style restaurants here. I

19:26

don't think the world really knows about it yet,

19:29

but they're gonna find out. Mm. Well we got Michelin coming

19:31

this year. There you go. Yeah, yeah, there you go. And I've

19:33

talked about this before, uh, at quite length,

19:35

so we won't go into it too much, but Vietnam,

19:38

I think worldwide is now, um,

19:41

the perception is changing. It's coming into its own.

19:44

And you can see that through, um, designers

19:46

like fashion designers. Who

19:49

just won an Oscar. I've just had an author contact

19:52

me from Hawaii, who's Vietnamese, who's just

19:54

published a book and wants to be on podcast.

19:56

You've got the actor that was in the Star

19:58

Wars. I, I'm, I know Sayng. Wyn, as

20:00

you mentioned, coffee. She's exporting

20:02

Vietnamese coffee beans to New York

20:05

and roasting them in New York and like produc

20:07

promoting. Vietnamese coffee beans

20:09

as a premium coffee bean. I see it

20:11

more because of like what I do with the podcast and who I

20:13

talk to people. But I think when other people I talk

20:15

to and you and you mentioned all those things there, when you

20:17

start to connect all the dots, Vietnam is becoming

20:20

more of a premium brand. Yep. So,

20:22

but that's an amazing thing that's changing in

20:24

the last 10 years from, you would see Vietnam

20:26

as like maybe pure quality.

20:30

And now it's becoming like, no, Vietnam

20:32

is producing some amazing things. Yeah.

20:34

Like I don't talk to a lot of people

20:37

back home about Vietnam unless

20:39

they ask me or unless they're coming. So

20:41

I don't really know what the, the global perception

20:43

is. You know, I'm, I'm inside of it. I know, I know

20:45

what we think. Um, but yeah, the,

20:47

the fact that, you know, 12

20:49

years ago there were no

20:52

big Vietnamese restaurants in Toronto

20:54

where I'm, where I lived. And

20:58

then going back after my first time coming here, it was like

21:00

there was foot shops on almost

21:02

every corner and bon me places.

21:04

And obviously they were charging outrageous price compared

21:07

to here and way nowhere near as good as here.

21:09

But yeah. Well, yeah. The one my mom took

21:11

me to, uh, behind her apartment,

21:13

uh, I realized when we walked

21:15

in that it was, it was a Korean family running in

21:17

this Vietnamese restaurants and I was like, I'm

21:20

glad you like it, mama. Come to Vietnam

21:23

sometime and we'll get you a real bullet for it. I heard

21:25

my sister message me from Melbourne. Tell me she

21:27

went to an authentic Vietnamese restaurant. And

21:29

she, and it was run by a family from Saigon

21:31

and she sent me the menu and it had pad Thai

21:33

on the menu, red curry,

21:36

green curry, Chinese noodles. I

21:38

was looking at the menu and I was like, Lindsay, none of

21:40

this is Vietnamese, but No, but they said

21:42

they're from Saigon. I was like, well, I, none

21:45

of this is Saigon food. Right. Well,

21:47

to that point, the, the, I'm using

21:49

air quotes, the Vietnamese restaurant that my mom told me to. It

21:51

was a Vietnamese, Thai, Korean, like

21:54

they had three menus. Yeah. It wasn't like a fusion of any

21:56

of those things. It was just, Different

21:58

menus from three different countries run by a a Korean

22:01

family. Obviously everyone knows the food in Vietnam

22:03

is amazing. We've talked about this I think on the previous

22:05

podcast. Come here for the food that you all have

22:07

seen on Instagram and all the Vietnamese

22:09

food that you want to try. Ban me and fur and

22:11

all of that. And, but if

22:13

you want to come here and try some restaurants

22:16

that are probably gonna make it in the next Michelin gate

22:18

and some high class quality food

22:20

that still won't break the bank and come

22:22

here to to Vietnam. And then just to wrap.

22:25

Obviously craft beer has just exploded

22:27

here. I've, I've been a fan of craft beer pretty

22:30

much most of my adult life. I have similar

22:32

experience to you. I came here on a, a vacation,

22:34

as I mentioned, at the top of the podcast. Paso

22:37

Street was the first place I went to. One of

22:39

the coolest things ever was, uh, after

22:41

I came here on vacation, then I moved here, stayed

22:44

here, became friends with Misha Smith.

22:46

I found a picture that I took

22:48

when I first went to Paso Street for

22:50

the very first time, and in the

22:52

background serving beer behind the bar

22:55

was Misha Smith, which, there you go. That

22:57

still gives me goosebumps. I think that's just one of the coolest

22:59

things ever. I mean, I don't even think we interacted

23:01

that time. Here we are now sitting doing

23:03

a podcast about craft beer. And I remember

23:06

I've got pictures of the menus, still had Jasmine ipa,

23:08

still had passion fruit. And one thing I did wanna

23:10

mention on that was one of the things about

23:12

craft beer in Vietnam, and not all of them, but

23:14

most of them, past street, is definitely

23:16

known for this, is using local ingredients.

23:19

So when we mention Jasmine Passionfruit,

23:21

dragonfruit, these

23:23

are all local ingredients that you guys have, have

23:26

made an effort to use in ubi. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. A hundred percent.

23:28

That was John's, uh, that was

23:30

John's. Mission from the

23:32

beginning. And his whole idea was

23:35

making classic craft beer styles with

23:37

fresh local Vietnamese ingredients. So,

23:40

I mean, we need to import the hops,

23:42

the multi east, but we want to have one

23:44

flavor of Vietnam in all of our beers

23:46

and like really showcase what Vietnam's

23:48

all about. And that's, that's always

23:51

been our. Mission

23:53

statement, I guess. Well, I mean, my favorite

23:55

beer is their PLO ipa. Mine

23:57

too. Yeah, plo, you can't, I mean, I'd never heard of

23:59

Pello too. Right, right, right. Well, that's it. Like, you

24:01

know, grapefruit IPA is a style that

24:03

you can get in Australia and America, but here, you know,

24:06

we have PLOS instead of grapefruit, so we just. And

24:08

they're delicious. And I'm still waiting on Mango

24:10

Lago coming back one day. That wasn't my, it's,

24:13

we just had a meeting yesterday. It's on the,

24:15

it's on the schedule. Nice, nice. So just quickly

24:17

before we wrap it up, tell people if the visiting

24:20

tag gone, what, obviously past those street

24:22

where, what locations, where should they go? What if

24:24

they're in, they're probably gonna be in D one and

24:26

what other craft beer bus should they check out? Cuz I know

24:28

there's a new one that's just opened I want to check

24:30

out. Yeah. Specifically if you're coming and

24:32

you wanna go to Pastor Street Burn Company. I mean, just Google

24:34

it. We have five locations in Saigon. Uh,

24:37

one in Hanoi. And always

24:39

looking for more. Uh, but yeah, just Google

24:41

it and whichever one's closest. They're all fun

24:43

locations and they have all got a bit of a different vibe.

24:46

Uh, so yeah, I'm not gonna name all the

24:48

addresses, but yeah, just, yeah, put it in Google

24:50

and uh, find the one closest to you. Um,

24:53

for other craft beer bars, we mentioned Malt

24:55

on Mackay T Boy, they've got a great craft. Beer selection.

24:58

Be a Craft is probably the best place to

25:00

go to try a range

25:02

of craft beers. They've got some of their own, and

25:04

then at least one beer from almost every

25:06

brewer. In the country. I mentioned

25:08

there's almost 70 now, so obviously they don't have every single

25:11

brewery represented. Um, but they do

25:13

a pretty good job. They've got 50 taps, I think they've 50 taps

25:15

at their D three location. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's another

25:17

one, BIA Craft. They have, uh, locations

25:19

all over the, all over the city. So just Google

25:21

that if you're coming. Um, and then, yeah, one

25:24

that I, that I, I do like to mention, uh,

25:27

cause it doesn't get enough love is a Turtle

25:29

Lake Brewing Company. They're up in Hanoi

25:31

and they don't have much distribution, so they're not really

25:34

well known Insig. But for me, they're

25:36

making some of the best craft beers in the country.

25:39

Uh, but you can only get them at their tap room. So again,

25:41

Google that, find it if you're in. Yeah.

25:44

And then, uh, yeah, I was just there yesterday. I went

25:46

to Steers Man's new tap room. Uh,

25:49

it's in kinda the heart

25:51

of D one as well, uh,

25:53

in Decal, which is the ward again,

25:56

you can Google the exact address. Um, but

25:58

yeah, they just opened up and, uh,

26:00

it's an awesome location. It's a cool venue.

26:03

Uh, they make some nice beers as. And,

26:06

uh, yeah, it's, it's awesome to see, uh,

26:09

like smaller local breweries getting some shine.

26:12

So yeah, the, the owner of, uh,

26:14

of Steersman, we actually had on, uh, on our

26:16

other podcasts, which I don't think we talked about

26:18

yet, uh, beer stories. So I mentioned

26:20

Alex, one of our co-founders. Um, him

26:23

and I have been doing this podcast, beer stories

26:25

that you produce. Um, and

26:27

yeah, we interview people about, Some

26:31

brewers, some owners. Uh, one

26:33

of our funnest episodes was, was, was with,

26:35

uh, a customer, a regular customer at

26:37

our tap room. Um, but yeah, check that out

26:39

on Google, Spotify, uh,

26:41

apple, apple Pods, wherever

26:43

you find your podcast. Um, yeah,

26:45

so we've, we've wrapped season one and we're just

26:48

about to start recording season two. And, uh, really

26:50

looking forward to getting back into the studio with you. Well,

26:52

we're gonna finish up with the final questions

26:54

that I ask everyone. Okay. At the end of every.

26:58

Michelle, what is a good 24 hour

27:00

itinerary in ho Chi Min? That's

27:04

a great question. Um, so I would

27:06

say to, if you wanna experience

27:08

it the way that, uh, God intended,

27:12

uh, start with a bowl of faba for breakfast.

27:15

Um, and then I haven't been to the reunification palace,

27:17

but I've heard from all of my friends who have been that it's

27:19

awesome. So maybe bang that out after

27:22

breakfast and then for

27:24

lunch. I would say you gotta find

27:26

a little, uh, calm stand or bon

27:29

me, depending if you want, if

27:31

you prefer rice or bread. Um,

27:33

and then after that I would say go to,

27:35

uh, a craft beer bar and,

27:38

uh, enjoy some of the local craft beers in

27:40

Vietnam. Um, and then

27:43

for dinner, I think we, we

27:45

went over earlier in

27:47

the. Is

27:50

the best Vietnamese barbecue you're gonna get in,

27:53

uh, in Saigon. So basically just

27:55

eat and drink all day in Saigon. Hey

27:58

bud. That's what I do. And

28:01

so obviously we are talking about it from

28:03

our point of view, but what is life like for

28:05

locals in Saigon? Yeah.

28:08

Um, It's kinda hard for me to answer

28:10

that question cause there's, there's

28:12

obviously, you know, I have my Vietnamese colleagues,

28:14

which are quite a few. Uh,

28:16

so, you know, I work in an office. So for

28:18

them, they go to the office every day. Uh,

28:21

they either order food from our

28:23

place or they bring in some homemade,

28:26

uh, Vietnamese food that they've got from

28:28

home. There's such a wide gap

28:30

in, uh, in income here.

28:33

So when you say life for a local,

28:35

such a broad spectrum. It's

28:38

hard to release. And also, obviously I'm not a local,

28:40

so I, it's hard for me to put myself

28:42

in their shoes cuz

28:45

I wouldn't even know which shoes we're talking about.

28:47

Yeah, I, I understand what you're saying as

28:49

well. I was thinking it's, uh,

28:51

you could just definitely, as we've already

28:53

talked about in this episode, no matter

28:55

your income or your, or what

28:57

you do here is just fast paced, energetic,

29:00

always go, go, go. You're awake at six.

29:03

Uh, drinking coffee at 10:00 PM

29:06

and just life never stops here, it seems.

29:08

Yeah, a hundred percent. So, I remember,

29:11

uh, one time my friend Willis came

29:13

to visit from Toronto and he's a, he's

29:15

a small business owner. And, uh,

29:18

at the time, this is before grabs, so it was just

29:20

the Salem drivers on

29:22

their street corners waiting for a, a

29:24

fair as it were, little bon

29:26

me stand little, uh, noodle

29:28

noodle carts that get pushed. And

29:32

after a few days it's just, you know,

29:34

getting into the routine. Willis turns to me, he is like, man,

29:36

everybody here works for themselves. And

29:39

I'm like, yeah, I never really thought about it, but

29:41

yeah, that's true. And he is like, nice is awesome.

29:45

Yes, Vietnam is awesome. That

29:48

is true. No, I like that one. Um,

29:50

and then why is Saigon

29:52

a good place to. Um,

29:55

I mean, I hope we've covered it like,

29:59

like we said before, like just the energy of the

30:01

city. Uh, you mentioned,

30:04

you know, the fast pace, it's go, go, go all

30:06

the time. Uh, and you know, some

30:08

people wouldn't like

30:10

that kinda lifestyle, but for me it's, it's,

30:12

it's I toxic and I, I

30:14

just love feeding off the energy of the city,

30:17

uh, you know, into work in the morning. Lunch,

30:21

wherever, and then, you know, just

30:24

get out and see a, see the world

30:26

going by. I remember the, the

30:28

first time I came on vacation driving,

30:32

I was on, I wasn't driving on the back of, of

30:34

a Salem driver's motorbike. And

30:37

we were going around the loop around, uh, Ben

30:39

10 market the roundabout there. And

30:42

every time I, after I moved here, every time I drove

30:44

around that roundabout, I remember that first time I was just

30:46

like, can't believe I live here. This is amazing.

30:50

I love it. And last question,

30:53

uh, travelers, tourists, they've come

30:55

to Saigon, where should they go next?

30:58

Yeah, so I mean, I've got a few. It

31:01

kind of depends on, on your

31:03

own, uh, speed. So

31:05

like, I, I really love going to Niang, uh,

31:08

for a beach city. Um, the old

31:10

town in Hoyne, it's one of my favorite places in

31:12

Vietnam. Um, but if

31:14

you really wanna go some. Small

31:18

and remote and quiet and awesome. Uh, there's a

31:20

place called Queen Y, which is also in

31:22

central Vietnam like we got

31:24

there, uh, the first

31:27

time we took a train from Denang cause that's where we're

31:29

coming from. Uh, you can fly from, from

31:31

Saigon. It's just this awesome little beach

31:33

sale and I'm so

31:35

be and content and chilled out. Every time I go

31:37

there, I need to go there.

31:39

It's one place. Have not one place. One.

31:42

One of the places have not been. Oh,

31:46

it's amazing. It's like you just, you get

31:48

there, you turn your phone. And just

31:50

the, the stress of life just comes off of

31:52

you. Well, Misha, this has been awesome. Thank

31:54

you very much. Uh, if you are listening from anywhere

31:56

in the world, you can find all the links to what

31:58

we've talked about in the show notes. So if you wanna go check

32:00

out any of the tap rooms, VNA is awesome.

32:03

We just published an article about the best craft

32:05

beer balls. In Saigon and that actually

32:07

covers a lot of the places we've talked about. So thank you

32:09

very much for listening. I hope you guys, uh, enjoyed

32:11

this and that you're gonna come to Saigon and have a

32:13

great time. And does every chance, if you're in

32:15

a craft beer bar, you're gonna bump into

32:17

Misha Smith somewhere. So look

32:20

out for Misha and uh, you might even see

32:22

me as well. So thanks very much. Cheers.

32:25

Thanks for having me on. If you are

32:27

enjoying this podcast and you know what to do, it's

32:29

such a cliche, but go hit the subscribe or

32:31

the follow, or whatever it is you need to do from whatever

32:33

app you're listening to so you can get notifications

32:36

for future episodes and keep listening. Every,

32:38

every episode we're gonna be interviewing someone

32:41

from somewhere different in Vietnam and talking about

32:43

life there. So we hope you're enjoying it

32:45

as much as. And

32:47

then if you wanna book a tool to go out

32:50

and explore Vietnam, then make sure you go

32:52

to the Vietnam is Awesome website, which is

32:54

just Vietnam is awesome. Dot com.

32:56

You'll find a whole bunch of tools and trips there

32:58

that you can book, and so you can go out and explore

33:01

and also including my comedy

33:03

show. So I am also a comedian if you didn't

33:06

know that. And we do a comedy show here in Saigon

33:08

every Thursday called the Tourist

33:10

Trap Comedy Show. We talk

33:12

about what it's like to live in Vietnam and life in

33:14

Vietnam. You the funny side of it. So

33:16

if you are Saigon on a Thursday night,

33:19

go on. The Vietnam is awesome website and you can

33:21

book your tickets for that show. So

33:24

a massive thank you to the Vietnam is awesome

33:26

team for putting this podcast together and

33:28

to Lewis Wright who composed and performed

33:31

the music for this podcast.