“These rewards are more than just Amex, Chase, Citi,” says Brian Kelly, founder of the popular travel site The Points Guy. “Well over half of Americans have some form of rewards, often through their community banks — and to a lot of people, cash back rewards.” This bonus episode of the ABA Banking Journal Podcast — presented by Alkami — features a conversation with Kelly and ABA President and CEO Rob Nichols from ABA’s Washington Summit.

In this episode, Kelly discusses his personal story of getting involved with reward travel, his opposition to efforts to cap interchange or impose routing mandates on credit cards and the value that all kinds of consumers get out of card rewards.

• Read more about taking action on interchange and routing on Secure American Opportunity.