Episode 2. I caught up with Australian Writer, Producer and Director Lyndsay Sarah to hear her journey of shooting her first indie feature film and the challenges she faced.

Check out Lyndsay's work here

https://www.lyndsaysarahdoyle.com/projects

Transcript for our hard of hearing/deaf listeners

Gareth:Hey everyone, welcome to Action Cut and Everything In-Between, Episode number 2. Today I'm speaking with, Lyndsay Sarah. She is an Irish-Australian writer, director and filmmaker. After spending 10 years in television, she's decided to make her first feature film.

Gareth:Now, her background is similar to mine. She didn't go to film school, she didn't go to university. She's just self-taught. She's shot a number of successful short films. Room of Doors was one and that's on Amazon Prime. And then another short horror called Dirt, which is awesome. You've got to check both those out online. Without further ado, we'll jump right in.

Gareth:Okay, Lyndsay, thanks for coming on the show. I really appreciate...

Lyndsay Sarah:Oh, thank you.

Gareth:... you giving your time today.

Lyndsay Sarah:It's very precious, my time. But you're worth it Gareth.

Gareth:Oh, thank you. You're just at the end of your feature film, Guilt. Where is it now? Post production?

Lyndsay Sarah:We've currently finished the first draft, I'm going to say it's pretty much final edit because everybody seems to be happy with it. I haven't actually looked at all of it yet. But two of our producers have, and they're really happy. We're at the stage now where I'm going to have a little watch of it. If I have any notes or feedback or any kind of adjustments, then we'll all have a chat about that.

Lyndsay Sarah:But it's pretty much the end of the edit, the picture lock, and then it will move off into scene mix and then grade. Then we'll score it and all the rest.

Gareth:Awesome.

Lyndsay Sarah:But it's good. It happened in such, sorry I interrupted. But, it happened in such a short period of time. Like blink and you'll miss it is how it kind of feels. And because this isn't obviously my day job, is not a filmmaker. I wish it was. You work, you go and do your job, you go and do other projects and then you kind of go, "Oh wow, we just made a full feature length movie." I don't feel like I really had the time or the space to soak it all up.

Gareth:That's good.

Lyndsay Sarah:But that means-

Gareth:We'll get into that, I want to hear the story of it and how it all came about, as we go on. But give us a brief overview of Guilt. What's it all about?

Lyndsay Sarah:I will. Okay. I'll give you a very brief, brief, brief. Basically the plot it's about a female serial killer who targets child sex offenders. Then she finds out that one of her past victims had actually been falsely accused, and therefore becomes conflicted about what to do with her latest victim.

Gareth:Interesting.

Lyndsay Sarah:That's it very shortly summed up.

Gareth:Okay, nice.

Lyndsay Sarah:How the story came to be?

Gareth:Yes. I mean, take us back to how do you go from shooting short films like you did? You did some great shoots that I've seen. How do you go from that to deciding I'm going to make a feature?

Lyndsay Sarah:Well, I was fortunate enough to meet my Guilt co-director and cinematographer and one of the producers, Karl and Janet who plays the lead role in Guilt. I met them through a mutual friend. I've known them longer than I've known my husband. We met at a pub one night and I didn't really know about them, but our mutual friend had told Karl about me and how I was a filmmaker. I'd made short films.

Lyndsay Sarah:We just got to talking and we got to hanging out and then we said we'd work on a short project together. Karl had a couple of projects going, and so I went and helped on his set. Just helping around, just production assistant kind of thing. Then he came and shot one of my short films, that's on Amazon Prime and-

Gareth:What's that's called?

Lyndsay Sarah:That's called Room of Doors.

Gareth:Cool. Check that out.

Lyndsay Sarah:Room of Doors. Yes, it's a short reel. It's about four minutes long. It's quite fun. It went through the film festival circuit as well, and had a few screenings around the world. We shot that together and Janet actually played the supporting role in that short film.

Lyndsay Sarah:We just kind of, we've been friends for a few years and helped each other out on different projects. Then I think all three of us were at the stage where we're just ready to step up and tackle a feature film. We're all pretty determined and serious about breaking into the industry and continuing to make content.

Lyndsay Sarah:It was kind of just that it happened. We talked about it. Actually prior to making Guilt, Karl was going to produce another feature length, and he invited me on board to write the script. I wrote the script, and I think we were into the second draft of it. Then he turned around one day at my place and said, "Oh, but this won't be my first film. This will be after the first film."

Lyndsay Sarah:I was like, "Oh, why are we writing this?" Like, "Let's go and come up with the first idea and then go and make that." We threw around some ideas. I already had some scripts kind of half written and going and I thought this might be good. Then we came with some other ideas and then Janet, actually came up with the idea of the character, the lead character in Guilt. That's sort of where it all came from.

Gareth:Cool.

Lyndsay Sarah:She wanted to play a female... well she's female, so yes, she's going to play a female. She wanted to play a serial killer that targeted paedophiles. And it kind of came out of there.

Gareth:How long did the script actually take to write?

Lyndsay Sarah:What's unique about the production of Guilt is that, we had this looming deadline because Janet had actually gotten her Green Card to move to America. When they issue the Green Card, they give you a date you have to be in the US. And that's non-negotiable.

Lyndsay Sarah:We basically had, I think it was June, July, August, September, four months before she moved to America. It wasn't so much like I had that luxury of really writing the script and developing it. Then we all had the luxury of time to go into pre-production, all that kind of thing. We gave ourselves, actually I think it was five months. We had five months to basically write, go into pre production, shoot, and then Janet could leave anyway. But...

Gareth:Rolling from script to shoot day one, how long do you think?

Lyndsay Sarah:I wrote the script I think in two months. There was a bit of a gap there at time trying to work out our schedules before we actually went into pre-production. But, I think we had about two months from having a script we are happy with, to then organizing a feature film shoot. Then going into shoot. I think it was about two months. Organizing cast, crew casting, crewing locations, permits, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Gareth:Yes, it's massive. I can't believe that you guys pulled it off in such a short amount of time.

Lyndsay Sarah:Well, that's when I say blink and you'll miss it. That's how it feels.

Gareth:Now that it's all shot on in the can, how does it feel? How's does it feel now watching it back, seeing kind of the final edit?

Lyndsay Sarah:Well, I'm yet to see the final edit, but I've gotten to see a bunch of the scenes, the more prominent scenes. Yes, I don't know, I just feel time went so quickly and it's almost like everybody was in panic mode, and I didn't really get to lap it up and savor it. I don't quite have any kind of, I guess, emotional attachment.

Lyndsay Sarah:When I do see the scenes I go, "Cool, that's awesome." But it feels like I'm watching another film that I wasn't a part of, if that makes any sense. Just because we didn't have that time to breathe and really savor it. But I mean, it looks cool and it's a really interesting story, and I think people will like it.

Gareth:It's funny when I see the behind the scenes pictures of my film, kind of, I don't even remember shooting that, what happened that day. I think you just so into it on the day and so stressed and you're thinking about a million things, you don't have time to just sit back and enjoy it. Do you?

Lyndsay Sarah:Well, you go into overdrive, I think. People like to know that you were on my set?

Gareth:Yes. We can say that I actually helped out. Couple of days and I'm actually one of the SWAT team, as well for your filming action.

Lyndsay Sarah:You took a few days?

Gareth:Yes. I took a few days.

Lyndsay Sarah:You deserve more credit than a couple of days. You're a big help. But what was I going to say about that is I've lost my train of thought... well, you're in overdrive and I kind of, you put your little hat on and you get to work and you don't really get to... I don't know. I don't remember half of it either.

Gareth:Yes, in the moment it feels, but you're not actually...

Lyndsay Sarah:In the moment?

Gareth:In that moment, yes.

Lyndsay Sarah:It's like the whole fight or flight thing. It's like you're just reacting. You're not quite, it's not like this whole. Be present, be in the moment. You're not like, What can I feel? What can I smell? What can I hear? You're not kind of savoring the moment. You just like we've got this whole shit load of stuff that needs to be done, and we need to go and do it. No time to waste.

Gareth:That's it. What do you think you've learned then, from shooting your first feature? From what you've said so far, it sounds like time is a big thing. Give yourself probably a bit more time?

Lyndsay Sarah:Time is a big thing. Yep. Prep work is a big thing. I'm super organized and so it's quite natural for me to organize something short periods of time and with little time. I think kind of probably in a sick way, I don't want to say get off on it, but I kind of enjoy that buzz. It's a bit of a thrill. The whole like, "Oh my God, we've only got a day to do this." It's like boom, boom, boom, boom. I really enjoy that.

Lyndsay Sarah:But I would say that next time, I would want just want more time before having to get onto set. The thing is, when you're on set and you're filming, there's so many things that are out of your control. That's why you got to be super organized.

Lyndsay Sarah:The most you can do prior to getting onto set is prepare and organize yourself, so that if anything does go wrong and set you're ready for it. I think what I would want next time around is definitely more time to spend with the script. I mean, we did a good job.

Lyndsay Sarah:Myself and Janet developed that script together. We did a good job. I'd go away and I'd write and then I'd pop in a couple of weeks later to her and she'd have a read, then we'd have a chat. I'd go off again and write some more. I just would like more time to breathe in between each process. I think. Not kind of go write up the script, straight into pre-production, straight into shooting, straight into post. I've wanted to be like, "Ooh." You just, there's breathing room in between. Because I think you probably get to enjoy it more, maybe.

Gareth:Yes, definitely. All right. What's your plan for distribution once it's all... done, you're happy with it. It's all ready to go? What's your distribution plans?

Lyndsay Sarah:A couple of our team, Karl and Janet... did I mention who Karl was?

Gareth:Yes, you mentioned in the beginning Karl and Janet.

Lyndsay Sarah:Co-director cinematographer. Karl and Janet went off to the American film market, which you went to as well, end of last year. They kind of did their thing, organizing meetings and chatting with people and finding distributors who were interested in what we had. Now we didn't have a finished, polished film, then. This was just sort of like we had put some scenes together and we had some production stills, and the script was provided and all that kind of stuff. They had a ton of meetings and just found a bunch of people who are interested in seeing it when it was finished.

Lyndsay Sarah:Now that it's going to be finished probably in a month or so. We then will get back in contact with those interested parties and send them a screener to have a look at. Then basically go from there. If you know people are still interested, then we'll set up some meetings and perhaps we'll fly over to the US, and meet with people in person.

Lyndsay Sarah:If nobody's interested, that's fine. Fuck you. No, I'm kidding. We'll probably head back to the American film market this year in November with our finished product and kind of re-introduce it to the market now that it's finished and all polished and looking shiny.

Gareth:Very nice. What advice do you think you'd give someone who was thinking about shooting their own feature film?

Lyndsay Sarah:Well, first of all I would say shoot some short films. That's your playground. That's basically where you learn what not to do. It's also a great place to make some friends. To network, to meet some people that you could possibly potentially then go and make a feature film with.

Lyndsay Sarah:You can stuff up on short films. It's not a huge risk and you're not losing a lot. I know it's still time, it's still energy it's still money. You still want to do it right, but it's not the end of the world if you stuff up.

Lyndsay Sarah:Now, my short film, Room of Doors, that's on Amazon. I had actually shot that film six, eight months prior. I had made a terrible mistake with casting and didn't realize at the time until we're on set and all of a sudden this particular human being decided she didn't want to act anymore. She wasn't basically performing the way she did during the audition.

Lyndsay Sarah:She basically stuffed me around for about three or four days. We basically went away after shooting as much as we could with her. And I sat in with the edit for about a month before I went, "Yes, this is terrible. I cannot cut around bad acting. I need to do this again." Yes, that set me back a few months of organizing and shooting and using everybody's time. It also set me back a couple of grand, a few grand.

Lyndsay Sarah:But, I learnt heaps from doing that. How important it was to actually have the right people. You're not always going to get it right, and sometimes you think you have it right until you get to set. Then you kind of, it's out of your control and it's not like you can go. Okay, everybody go home after an hour.

Lyndsay Sarah:It's like you've organized this whole shoot and you've got people and you've got locations, booking permits and you got catering and all the rest of it. And people have given up their time. Sometimes you just got to go with the flow.

Lyndsay Sarah:Six, or eight months later, we shot that again and it actually came out much better, and obviously has done very well for itself, which I didn't think would happen had I gone ahead with editing the original. That's a little fun fact there. But once again, it was a short film. There's not much to lose.

Lyndsay Sarah:You hear about these big huge budget productions that they make mistakes like that. Like Game of Thrones. The girl who plays the dragon girl Daenerys, they actually had cast somebody else prior to her and shot I think about three or four of her scenes for the first episode of the first season.

Lyndsay Sarah:Until somebody from the network or somebody up there went, "This is the wrong choice. We need to recast this role." That's something like Game of Thrones and you see how explosive and expensive that production is. Imagine being that person who chose to cast her and then they had to go recast it. And that's when they get Emilia Clarke and re-shoot all those scenes all over again.

Lyndsay Sarah:Now that's a big risk, not a short film. Not stuffing up on a short film. Go make a short film before you make a feature film, unless you've got money to blow.

Gareth:That's it. Time management.

Lyndsay Sarah:Yes.

Gareth:Shoot a lot of short films, get the right people on board. I suppose that goes for crew as well. Doesn't it?

Lyndsay Sarah:Prove us wrong.

Gareth:Short films is a great way to see who you're going to bond with on set, because you spend so much time with these people, and a lot of the time with yours, I'm with mine. Where we've had to stay overnight as well in the location. You need to be able to have breakfast, lunch, dinner with all these people. You're spending a hell of a lot of time with them. You've got to make sure that you're jelling with everyone who's on your set.

Lyndsay Sarah:Absolutely. Especially, when it's a short film, you're not very well known. There may not be money involved. It may be unpaid. Kind of, you can test people to see how much they're willing to give of their time and their energy to you when there's no money involved and there's no status involved.

Lyndsay Sarah:If somebody goes, "Oh, sorry, if it was paid, I'd do it." You go, "Well, fuck you. When I do have money I wouldn't be hiring you." All those little things that you can learn along the way as well.

Lyndsay Sarah:I was going to say something else about the short film. Well, if somebody has made short films and then they want to make feature, I'm hoping by the time they decide to go and make that feature, they've actually created strong bonds and connections through doing the short films.

Lyndsay Sarah:Making a feature film is pretty much the same as making a short film times 20. If you've gotten it down part doing a short and you're confident and you're ready to go, it's the same thing. You've got to have a good script. Good actors, good crew. Be organized. Not hard a hustle, and take on multiple jobs yourself. Don't kind of go, "Well, I'm the director. That is it."

Lyndsay Sarah:Learn to cook if you have to. Go do the location scouting, if you have to. Be your own first aid, whatever. Take on multiple jobs because you can't, especially if it's an indie project and you'd never done it before, and you don't have much money, you can't be hiring or even depending on other people all the time.

Lyndsay Sarah:Especially, for a short film, if somebody says, "Yes, I'll come help for two days and I'll work for free, and I'll be a production assistant, that's different from a feature film and asking someone to give up three or four weeks of their life for free. People go to work. People got to live.

Gareth:Yes. That's awesome.

Lyndsay Sarah:I think that, that would be it. Just be super organized. Show a bit of humility, I think as well. You're never too good for a job. Just do all the jobs. Do them well. Lead by example. Create a comfortable, and safe and creative environment. I guess create what you would want to walk into. If you had been asked to come help on a feature film, just create that kind of environment.

Gareth:Yes, absolutely.

Lyndsay Sarah:I think that's it.

Gareth:What about in terms of the actual script itself? What would you say to people to try and avoid. That's made life difficult with the actual shoot because a lot of indie features are going to be low budget. What's been some of the biggest problems to face, kind of with that side of things?

Lyndsay Sarah:Well, I'm very much into performance and story based stories. Don't create some kind of CGI monster or alien or a spaceship or multiple car crash into a helicopter. Restrain yourself when it comes to what you go out and shoot. Because, if you can't make it look $1 million, I think it will affect how your film looks overall. And the production quality of your film.

Lyndsay Sarah:We've all seen those bad low budget films with some kind of reptile that's not a real reptile, and they haven't had the budget to get the best in the industry. But in saying that, I mean if it's your dream to do like your first indie feature being about the Reptile Man, then just go make it happen for yourself.

Lyndsay Sarah:I don't know, that's kind of stuff I'd avoid. I'm very much into performance based. You want to get yourself some good actors who aren't afraid to let loose and look a bit ugly. I know that all actors are self-conscious but not self-conscious where that's going to affect their performance.

Lyndsay Sarah:Get a good story first. As long as it's a good story, I think that a lot of that low budget elements are forgivable. If you don't really have something interesting and unique that people haven't seen or heard before, I think it'd be very hard to stand out in the crowd of millions of other low budget indie films that are out there.

Gareth:Yes, sure. When you're writing, do you come up against these things where you think, "Okay, now she's going to jump in a helicopter and fly away." And then you're like, "Oh no, hang on."

Lyndsay Sarah:Well, the thing with me is I'm a writer first before I'm a filmmaker. The reason I got into actually making films was because I was told once, the best way to have your writing considered and taken seriously in the industry is to have had it produced. Which sounds a bit like a catch 22, how can I get it produced if it hasn't been produced? Does that make sense? You know what I'm saying?

Gareth:Yes.

Lyndsay Sarah:I decided to go write stuff and produce it myself. My writing always comes before my filmmaking. I'm never short on ideas, but what I then think is doable, I can pick out of all these different script ideas that I've come up with. I might be writing something that's like an action adventure, and it's happens around different parts of the world and there are big action explosion scenes.

Lyndsay Sarah:I wouldn't stop myself just because I couldn't at this point in time make that film. I just keep writing it because I could then option it to Hollywood, and say will you buy this script? Then I would go and focus my filmmaking efforts on something that's a lot more achievable with the means that I have right now.

Lyndsay Sarah:That's one of the pluses to being a writer-director-producer. Is that I can kind of decide what... I can still write, but it doesn't necessarily have to be for myself. See, because I've always been told, if you're writing something, never to think about the final destination of the script. Just write. Whatever comes out just right and let that sort of the story be told.

Lyndsay Sarah:Develop the script and never mind what will happen to it at the end. Never mind about the business. Don't even think about the industry when you're writing the script. If somebody is a writer and filmmaker, or they've got something that they want to make, always put the script in the story first. Then the rest comes later.

Lyndsay Sarah:If you finish it and you go right, "Well, that's not achievable with my means at all." Because of the explosions into five helicopters, then think of something else and write that instead. But, you should never avoid writing just because you don't want to hear that.

Lyndsay Sarah:You don't want to say, "Oh, well, it's not going to be made. I can't make that. I just won't bother." That's why a lot of people don't get off their ass and go and make films, because they think it's too hard or it's not achievable. But it is, it just takes time. You just got to be patient. I don't think I gave any advice in that. Did I?

Gareth:No. That was great. That was awesome. Yes.

Lyndsay Sarah:All right.

Gareth:Very good.

Lyndsay Sarah:I was like, I don't think I've helped anybody.

Gareth:No, that was very good. Listen, what's next for you now?

Lyndsay Sarah:Me personally?

Gareth:Yes. On your film making journey-

Lyndsay Sarah:On my journey.

Gareth:Guilt's going to be going into it's distribution and post production stage and all that. Kind of aside from that, are you working on anything else?

Lyndsay Sarah:I am.

Gareth:What's your future plans?

Lyndsay Sarah:I'm always working on something. Like I mentioned before, I'm a writer, so I'm always writing. I'm also a aspiring author. I'm not just film related, I also want to write books. I'm always kind of dabbling in some novel ideas aimed at young adults. I was a big fan of The Hunger Games.

Lyndsay Sarah:I'm sort of in that kind of sphere where I'd be trying to get young adults to get off Instagram, and read more books and use their imagination, and sort of, I love that kind of adventure. Sci-Fi fantasy genre in books. That's one of my things. I do a lot of writing and sometimes I'll be writing a script one day and then later on that night I'll start writing a chapter in a novel.

Lyndsay Sarah:There's pros and cons to that as well. I might mention with having too many ideas, you need a lot of discipline to focus on one. Lots of writing. I hooked up with a... what would I call them? They're a theater type group in Sydney, and they asked me to write a theater production for them.

Lyndsay Sarah:I've done a couple of, sorry, I'm about to burp. Cut. I've done a couple of... we're on to the third draft. Now with that it's going to be a musical. It's really cool. They've got aerial artists, and fire twirling and back-flipping and all this crazy kind of stuff. It's kind of like a Romeo and Juliet story.

Lyndsay Sarah:It's based on this very ancient Persian poem about these two lovers who aren't allowed to be together, and it's got a sad ending. They also want to make it sort of comedic, as well. A bit of comic relief in there. I've been working on that, the past couple of months. We've just put it on hold for now, but I'll get back into that, soon-ish.

Lyndsay Sarah:I probably will go into production with something next year, but I haven't decided which story yet. We've got a few scripts going at the moment that potentially could be my next one. I'm not kind of rushing into it, I've learned. I don't want to rush. I just really want to get the scripts into a really good place where, other people would be interested in coming on board and putting in some money.

Lyndsay Sarah:I think, I'm going to spend this year... I mean, we're halfway through the year already. I think the rest of the year, which is a good enough time just to spend on really honing these story ideas and getting them to a good place. And then, I'll probably choose one that I think speaks the loudest to me and then start looking at going into production with that next year. If not, I'll sell it to someone else.

Gareth:Nice. That's awesome. Now, I suppose you're going to be enjoying kind of the journey that Guilt takes now and watching how that-

Lyndsay Sarah:I think so.

Gareth:Travels and turns out.

Lyndsay Sarah:Well, like I said, with the whole savoring the moment thing, because it feels like it all just happens so quickly and there was no savoring. I feel like, now with it going off into the world, and who knows what will become of it. But hopefully there will be that period where I get to then, sink into the moment and really enjoy it. Hopefully it gets some good reception, and I can enjoy that as well.

Lyndsay Sarah:Take your time people. I feel I'm meditating talking about this, but it's so important to enjoy it. I think that's one of the main things I learned from doing it as well. I mean, you are on set with us. We had some pretty funny days where we're all just cracking up laughing and I remember, I just have double over with tears coming down my eyes.

Lyndsay Sarah:I was just laughing so much. But apart from those hilarious moments, there was a lot of stress and I'm a very high stress person. But I think coming out of that I learned that... did I really enjoy the process? I enjoyed days on set and hanging out with the cast and crew. But the whole process, did I enjoy it fully to what I could have. I'd have to say, no.

Lyndsay Sarah:I kind of forgot most of it, or was such in overthinking mode, that I didn't get to be present with it. That's definitely a big lesson I've learned. I want to enjoy my career. I don't want it to be, because it's such a hard industry. I'm going to walk from that now for a while. But anyway, sorry, you're stuck with me, so listen to me.

Lyndsay Sarah:I think it's such a hard industry to break into, and there's so much competition and people can feel very alienated and they're all alone. And it's so big and it's so overwhelming and they'll never make it and they'll never be anybody.

Lyndsay Sarah:It's a shame because it's so much fun making films and being on set and having a finished product and being like, yes, and feeling really proud of yourself. I want to enjoy my career because, if I'm not enjoying pursuing my career, then I'm not enjoying my life, am I? Because I want that to be my life.

Lyndsay Sarah:I don't want to have this miserable high stressed life and existence and then look back in 50 years and be like, "Uh." I just remember being really stressed because I was so desperate to make it. There was no enjoyment. That's one of my big things, take home messages. Enjoy, it's supposed to be fun because it's creative. What other industry do you get to just make up stories and then play with each other on set, and have a lot of fun. No other industry exists like ours. There we go. I am the Dalai Lama.

Gareth:Well, that's awesome. Look, if people want to find out more about you and get more wise wisdom, how can they find you and check out your work?

Lyndsay Sarah:Sure. Well, I do have a website, but there's not that much about me. I think you're better off looking on Instagram for me. You can find me... I changed my Instagram handle. You can find me @ Ms, M-S. Lindsay, L-Y-N-D-S-A-Y. S. Sarah. S-A-R-A-H. That's me on Instagram.

Lyndsay Sarah:I post lots of film stuff, but also just stupid stuff that I'm doing. And for Guilt, if people want to follow the progress of the film, they can find Guilt at guilt.feature.film.

Gareth:They you go.

Lyndsay Sarah:I'm running that little page. I mean, the more people who pop on and follow, obviously the better. But, I'll just keep posting pics from certain behind the scenes and it's progress.

Gareth:Awesome.

Lyndsay Sarah:Yep.

Gareth:Well, listen. Thank you so much for today. I really appreciate you giving so much time.

Lyndsay Sarah:Thank you.

Gareth:It's been awesome to hear your story and best of luck with Guilt in a calm way to see how it goes being on set and stuff. I've seen a lot of the rushes and some of the scenes that are being put together. And it just looks awesome so far, I can't wait to-

Lyndsay Sarah:Yay.

Gareth:To see how its journey turns out and hopefully we'll get to catch you up in AFM this year because I'm thinking to go in as well.

Lyndsay Sarah:Oh, look I saw when I go, and I'm so sad that I missed that last year. Actually it was such a shame that I missed out last year. I wanted to cry. I might have cried actually, that I did, but anyway, don't tell anyone. Oops.

Lyndsay Sarah:Yes, it'll be great to go back and with a finished film and actually be like, "Right, this is everything now." You don't have to guess about what happens. You don't have to sort of, you're not too sure how we're going to cut it or finalize it. Or, what music choices we're going to make. This is it, this is how it looks. Please love us and buy it.

Gareth:Perfect.

Lyndsay Sarah:Thanks.

Gareth:All right, Lyndsay. Well, thank you.

Lyndsay Sarah:You're very welcome.

Gareth:And everyone, thanks for listening and make sure you check out the links that Lyndsay mentioned earlier. And yes, let's all support indie film.

Lyndsay Sarah:Yo hoo.