0:10

Welcome to another episode of At the Table

0:12

with Patrick Lynchoni where everything we talk about

0:14

is related to organizational health and

0:16

the world of work. I'm your host, Pat Lynchoni, joined

0:19

by the regular crew who are all

0:21

doing great, they promised me, Cody, Bo,

0:23

and Tracy. We've got Karen sitting next to

0:25

me, Matt in the studio producing, and

0:27

Cody, we have an interesting topic today. What is it? Productive

0:31

eavesdropping. Yeah, we

0:33

talked about what should we call this? What is really the

0:35

right way to do this? It's

0:38

the eavesdropping is really a good thing

0:40

in our organizations. When

0:42

we know what other people are working on and we can

0:44

actually kind of listen in, and that doesn't

0:46

mean you have to have an open office. Sometimes you just need to leave the

0:48

door open. Or in our case, we've got

0:51

some places where people can kind of see in and hear

0:53

in if they want to. What

0:55

happens here is a lot of good things come

0:58

about because of this, and that's what we're going

1:00

to talk about today. Now, we're not saying that

1:02

privacy isn't important sometimes, but sometimes we misunderstand privacy

1:04

and think every time we have to have a

1:06

meeting, we've got to go someplace and be by

1:08

ourselves. A lot of times, it's

1:11

actually better to have people listening in, looking in,

1:13

and knowing what's going on. That's

1:15

what we're going to discuss today. What do you

1:17

guys think? I

1:20

think it's interesting. I actually immediately have a little

1:22

bit of pushback, and I'd love to lean

1:24

into when you talk about

1:26

productive eavesdropping. Pat, what would be

1:28

the resistance to this

1:31

idea? What

1:33

is the typical company culture or the

1:35

typical standard practice that somebody would say,

1:37

yeah, we don't do that? Well,

1:40

first of all, there is the idea

1:42

that eavesdropping is doing it against somebody's

1:44

will. You're being

1:46

sneaky. What we're saying is, no, be

1:48

open and invite people to eavesdrops, which

1:50

makes it not a negative thing. The

1:52

other thing is, people talk about this

1:55

as interrupting people, because the noise or

1:57

the ... It should be

1:59

quiet. It's not efficient and

2:01

it's not effective because people

2:03

are distracted. And we have

2:05

not found that to be the case at all. There's

2:08

a way to opt into this and to

2:10

opt out of it and to kind of

2:12

live in that space in between. So it's

2:14

efficiency and effectiveness. It's that you're violating somebody's

2:16

privacy. Yeah, and it feels

2:18

like it might seem dishonest to know that other

2:20

people are listening into your conversations. All of those

2:22

are very common, but I think they're not real.

2:24

And it's a good thing to kind of question

2:27

those. We found it to be really

2:29

productive to have people listening in on

2:31

various things. So I think, what do you guys think?

2:33

Did I get that right? It

2:36

makes sense to me. I think one of

2:38

the things that sounds interesting about it is

2:41

it is definitely counterintuitive. The idea of, hey,

2:43

we have closed door meetings. But when you

2:45

think about it conceptually, even

2:48

if the phrase knowledge is power is

2:50

a true thing, people wanna protect

2:52

people from having more information. But if you're

2:54

in a company, wouldn't you

2:56

want everybody to have as much

2:59

information as possible? And as long

3:01

as it's not insidious back channel,

3:03

gossip type meetings, if it's meetings

3:06

about how we're gonna execute

3:08

against our strategy and people

3:11

having extra context by way of just

3:13

being involved in the conversation or being

3:15

around the conversation, it should

3:17

be a good thing. Yeah, because

3:20

when we don't do that and we go into a

3:22

meeting and then we have to go debrief people, there's

3:24

no context for it. And we have to spend all

3:26

of our time kind of recreated, like how did the

3:28

meeting go? Oh, let me take

3:30

you through it all. Whereas if people are like,

3:33

hey, I could hear some of that, I could

3:35

tell you guys were really engaged or there were

3:37

some problems there and I listened into part of

3:39

it. Right away, we dive into it with context.

3:41

That is so much more efficient and effective than

3:44

me having to kind of retell the whole thing,

3:47

which usually I don't do very well because I can't

3:49

bring in all the details and all the context of

3:51

the meeting. Totally, and

3:53

I know you have some very practical examples

3:55

of how this would play itself out, like

3:58

the productive side of this, but even. before

4:00

that, I think like theoretically, you know, there's,

4:02

there's a couple things that make sense, which

4:04

is, one, implied in

4:06

this path is kind of what you just

4:08

said, but more explicitly stated is people are

4:10

bad at end of meeting discipline, and then

4:13

cascading the meeting, right. So if your company

4:15

were really, really good at that, if you

4:17

had like this muscle memory of we end

4:19

our meetings, well, we know what decisions we

4:21

made, we know who to go tell those

4:23

decisions to, you might not benefit

4:25

as much from this like idea of productive

4:28

eavesdropping, even though there's probably still some benefit.

4:30

And then another ancillary benefit is

4:33

around the idea that like, even

4:35

you know, when we talk about

4:37

meetings, having good productive ideological conflict,

4:40

it's so hard to translate the conflict

4:42

that happened in a meeting, outside

4:44

of that meeting. So, so even if

4:47

somebody is listening to a team debate

4:49

about what the right answer is, they

4:52

get the context of, Oh, we didn't all just get in a

4:54

room. A lot of times, what you'll hear is like, they come

4:56

out of that room, and they're like, here's what here's what the

4:58

decision is. And they don't say

5:00

we argued about this. And not everybody was

5:02

on the same page at first. And here

5:04

was another alternative we said no to. But

5:06

if people get a sense that they're outside

5:08

of that door, the doors open, and they're

5:10

like, man, our, our team really

5:12

wrestled through this and came up with this

5:15

idea on the other end. You don't have

5:17

to recreate all of that conflict. There's a

5:19

I think even that from a theoretical standpoint,

5:22

is really beneficial. Yeah, that's what I

5:24

mean by contextual understanding. I love that because people

5:26

go, wow, you guys were really heated in there.

5:28

I mean, like I'm doing a podcast right now

5:30

in a closed office. But because of the

5:32

nature of our windows and our door, people

5:34

can see in here. And sometimes they'll come up

5:36

after we go that sounded really interesting. I love

5:38

that one part I could hear. And if they

5:40

don't want to listen, they can kind of turn

5:43

away or walk away 10 feet. I like that

5:45

people can can kind of eavesdrop when they want

5:47

to, because it means more people

5:49

are on the same page. And like Karen

5:51

was saying, there's a lot of cross knowledge

5:53

across departments in our organization, because people can kind

5:55

of opt into things that they want to

5:57

know about. And I think they should have

5:59

the choice to do that. I

6:01

think that's a lot more efficient than sending

6:03

out an email or relying on some formal

6:05

communication system. Yeah, I

6:07

think that part of the reason people don't do this is

6:10

it's safer when you feel more in

6:13

control when you get to control all

6:15

the communication channels. And

6:17

so if you are a company

6:19

that's driven by consensus, or driven

6:21

by all top down communication, you'll

6:23

feel uncomfortable with this, because you're

6:25

letting people listen in on the

6:27

mess, the mess of in the

6:29

working genius language, what we would call it like

6:32

the invention and discernment loop, where we're figuring

6:34

it out in real time. And if you're a company

6:36

that says, Oh, when we send out the memo, that's

6:38

how you know what the decision was, you're

6:40

going to resist this. But it's better

6:43

for people to get to hear

6:45

the objections that you raised, the

6:47

emotion behind it, the way your

6:49

role modeling healthy productive conflict, and

6:51

then they can actually have a

6:53

little bit more security and stability knowing, oh,

6:56

they actually fought through this, they thought through

6:58

this, they didn't just make this in a

7:00

vacuum to try to have clean lines, they

7:02

said, we pursued what was going

7:04

to be the best idea. Totally.

7:07

And and you can go tell them,

7:10

we really thought through this, we had

7:12

great conversation and discussion and debate. But

7:14

when they actually have a flavor of

7:16

that from themselves, that's, that's way more

7:18

effective. Yeah,

7:21

you know, I think of Danny here in

7:23

our office, we have a big open office

7:25

here. And she quite literally sits right in

7:27

the middle of everything. And

7:29

I think about how Danny picks

7:31

up so much through osmosis. And

7:34

Bo and Cody, you guys are the

7:36

beneficiaries of that being in

7:38

Utah, she'll pick up on conversations, and she'll

7:40

convey a message to you. And then

7:43

I'll connect with you 20 minutes

7:45

later, and you'll say, Oh, we already heard.

7:47

And that's, that's just, that's incredible.

7:50

You know, just this morning, this happened, we were about to have

7:52

our our weekly Monday leadership team

7:54

meeting. So the five of us and we were

7:57

going to our various computers, because we do this

7:59

now we We had a podcast about this, how

8:01

we all go on our own computer and do it

8:03

like that. I

8:05

was going to have it where I am now, where people

8:07

can hear. I thought, yeah, everything on the agenda is stuff

8:09

that if they caught a whiff of it, that would actually

8:12

be great. We're just going to go through our things. Then

8:14

I thought, oh, no, we're going to be talking about compensation.

8:16

I'm going to go move to a room where

8:18

I'm going to be private because that's a part

8:20

of this. I think it's better to make your

8:22

standing position, I'm going to leave the door open

8:25

than it is to make the standing position, I'm going to

8:27

close it. I will close

8:29

the door when I need privacy and confidentiality.

8:31

Other than that, I think let

8:34

your issues breathe and let people get

8:36

to catch a whiff of them. I

8:39

think an ancillary benefit is we

8:41

are all guilty of eavesdropping even when it's not

8:43

invited. If you

8:46

don't have that kind of culture, what you'll

8:48

force somebody to do is to pretend that

8:50

they don't have information they actually have. You'll

8:53

decrease your efficiency because you'll come out of a

8:55

meeting and they were listening in on that phone

8:57

call or they heard maybe

9:00

intentionally, maybe not intentionally. You'll have to recap the

9:02

whole thing. Whereas, if you have a culture where

9:04

it's like, hey, we're kind of messy around here,

9:07

we invite you to listen into conversations, there's

9:09

going to be some that are private, but

9:11

we love you listening in. You'll speed up

9:13

the over communication and the cascading communication because

9:16

people will say, yep, I heard it, I

9:18

got it. We can move on. Yeah,

9:20

Karen just wrote something that is so important to

9:23

this. We reward curiosity. We want

9:25

people to want to know what's going on

9:27

in the company. That's

9:29

very different than wanting to know something they're not

9:32

supposed to. Most things that we

9:34

talk about, we want people to know. When somebody says,

9:36

that's why we have a lot of our conversations in

9:38

an open office, our creativity

9:40

place over here for the content team

9:42

is two couches and some chairs. I

9:45

love it when we're talking content and

9:47

three people come over just to listen

9:49

because they're curious as to like,

9:51

we're going to have to support this stuff. We're going to

9:53

have to work on this stuff later. Let's

9:55

watch the sausage being made and we

9:58

reward that. organization

10:00

that's set up to keep that apart from

10:02

one another, you make people feel guilty for

10:04

wanting to know stuff. I think

10:06

another benefit is sort of the tangential

10:08

or again ancillary development for people is

10:11

if you are limited by how many

10:13

meetings you can be in. But so

10:15

often, professional development is being invited into

10:17

a conversation and being able to hear

10:19

and see again context for the organization,

10:21

how are we making decisions and

10:24

creating this sort of open door culture allows

10:26

for more people to be able to listen

10:28

and be developed to be able to understand

10:30

and think how does the CEO think and

10:33

how are they making decisions and they are

10:35

getting more and more exposure to that kind

10:37

of thinking that helps them grow as a

10:39

professional. It's interesting,

10:41

I'm thinking about the listener who

10:43

is listening to this and thinking like man

10:46

there are so many meetings that go on in

10:48

my organization that I don't care to

10:50

eavesdrop in on. Like all of our meetings are

10:52

boring. It's almost like

10:55

that when you talked about this idea

10:57

that people might sit outside the door,

10:59

it would be a really interesting way

11:01

of assessing how many good meetings you

11:03

have is like how many people are

11:05

crowded around that conference room. If

11:08

the answer is not many or zero, it's like

11:10

you are probably having really boring, not that interesting

11:12

and mundane meetings. And

11:17

so they think this

11:19

is sort of predicated on the idea that the meetings

11:22

that you are having actually matter and

11:24

they matter to the other people in the office. And

11:26

if you are listening to this and being like actually

11:29

I don't think anyone would benefit from productive

11:32

eavesdropping on this meeting, maybe

11:34

you need a better meeting. Yeah,

11:37

and Karen just wrote down, have the kind of meeting

11:39

other people want to hear. I

11:41

think that what's interesting is I've thought

11:43

this for years, for a couple of decades now, I go

11:45

to our clients meetings and I was thinking if

11:48

the next level of management could

11:50

just be outside with microphones that

11:52

would go through the glass and they

11:54

could see and they actually

11:57

were sitting there witnessing the meeting. How

12:00

different that meeting would probably be i

12:03

think people would feel a need to actually pay

12:05

more attention could be setting example for the people

12:07

that are there and i think that they would

12:10

probably not tolerate it being boring because i would

12:12

want to board the people that were watching there

12:14

something to be said for knowing that you're being

12:16

observed and that raises your

12:18

game now granted that doesn't go for

12:21

when there needs to be confidentially but

12:23

i think confidentially is so. Much

12:26

rarer than people think it is we go into

12:28

our meetings and if ninety percent of what we

12:30

need to talk about would be great for other

12:32

people to hear. Will have a confidential

12:34

meeting and will leave them out of that ninety

12:36

percent to protect the ten and i'm not i'd

12:38

rather people be really intentional about when they're confidential

12:40

and other than that keep things.

12:44

Open air. I love

12:46

that picture you just painted pat like and i

12:48

think we've talked about this before you and i

12:50

was like especially the leadership team. The

12:53

stakes of the meetings that they're having it's

12:55

almost as if they should have their meeting

12:57

in a giant glass container in the middle

12:59

of a football field and every other employee

13:02

is in the stands you know like if.

13:04

Like you're making decisions on behalf of the

13:06

whole company and if they

13:08

had that mentality how much better

13:10

with those meetings be of like

13:12

boy we owe it to all

13:14

the people in the stands to

13:17

make sure we're having. Highly productive

13:19

you know great conflict really driving

13:21

towards the most important decisions instead

13:23

of. Oh we're gonna show

13:25

three powerpoint slides with almost no

13:28

emotion behind this like like just that alone like

13:30

you said if they thought that they were being

13:32

observed how much better these meetings would go. That

13:35

is so interesting kodi because we

13:37

have three years i've been talking about in the book death

13:39

by meeting that CEOs will say hey i hate going to

13:41

meetings and i say well that would be like football players

13:43

and i hate games or a teacher saying i hate class.

13:46

Or a surgeon say i don't like operating

13:48

on people that's what we do but i

13:50

think the reason why we don't like it

13:52

is because we don't think anybody really notice

13:54

what we're doing. And yet

13:57

when i think about like when i watch tv

13:59

basically worse. seeing people usually talk

14:01

to each other. And there's

14:04

TV shows about business where we're watching people in

14:06

meetings all the time, whether they're a private meeting

14:08

or a public meeting. But since we know that

14:10

there's a bunch of people watching on the show,

14:12

they make it interesting. Well, I

14:14

think that if more people knew that

14:16

the way they were performing was being observed,

14:19

they would probably, it would probably be more interesting. They'd probably

14:22

lean into it and make it good. So

14:24

maybe this is actually, and I didn't

14:27

know this when we started talking about

14:29

this, maybe making eavesdropping easier is gonna

14:31

raise the bar in the way we

14:33

actually honor the importance of what we're

14:36

talking about during meetings. Pat,

14:40

I know that when we hit record, you had

14:42

already written down some like, we

14:45

talked theoretically about this, but what are

14:47

like practically, you even

14:49

put some language to and like teased

14:51

out, here are some practical ways that

14:55

this productive eavesdropping helps people outside of

14:57

the meeting. Yeah, and we've

14:59

talked about a lot of it. There's a lot more

15:01

productivity because people hear things and act on them quicker.

15:04

Communication becomes more fluid because it's not

15:06

a formal process, where even if people

15:08

forget to go, people,

15:11

it's in the air and they inform

15:13

one another. There's more cross knowledge. Silos

15:15

get broken down because people hear things

15:17

across different divisions, which is great. There's

15:20

more contextual understanding about how it was

15:22

talked about. But there's one last thing

15:24

we haven't talked about and

15:27

that is, I think when I know somebody's listened to my

15:29

meeting, it's weird that I

15:33

feel like there's a certain degree of empathy

15:35

that comes with that. Like I'll walk out

15:37

of a meeting and they'll go,

15:39

wow, that sounded hard. Or,

15:42

wow, you guys were really into it

15:44

in there. And they have an idea

15:46

what was going on. And it's nice

15:48

to be able to come out of

15:50

the meeting and have people understand what

15:52

just happened, rather than me feeling

15:54

like I have to go recreate it for them

15:56

and I think, oh, they're not interested. I won't

15:58

even do that. So

16:01

I think that there's all kinds of, I

16:03

really don't understand why we wouldn't want

16:05

to do this more. I think there

16:07

should be more windows and more open doors

16:09

in offices and far fewer offices that are

16:11

closed off with a door and people don't

16:13

know what's going on inside of them. I

16:16

think that that works in the inverse also, Pat,

16:18

that you've done this just a couple times, you

16:20

know, when you're walking by a Zoom screen and

16:22

we're on Zoom, and you'll say, hey, take your

16:24

earbuds off, I want to hear what you guys

16:26

are working on, or I'll be here at the office

16:28

and I'll hear some voices that sound familiar and I'll go

16:30

pop in and just say, hey, tell me what you guys

16:33

are working on. I don't need to stay for the whole

16:35

meeting, but I think it creates empathy

16:37

from the team leader to be able to say, oh,

16:39

thank you so much for being diligent and

16:41

doing that work. That sounds hard. That sounds

16:43

like good work. Thank you for being in

16:46

the weeds or for thinking about the context or

16:48

for caring for our customers. And just a couple

16:51

minutes of the boss eavesdropping

16:53

on a meeting can create empathy

16:55

and understanding and context that way.

16:58

Yeah, I totally agree. And you just reminded me

17:00

of something, Beau. I think there's three things that

17:02

we think are so important that we

17:04

should never violate them. And it's a bad trade

17:06

off. And all the good things that we're talking

17:08

about right now that we

17:11

do them because we think confidentiality should

17:13

never be breached. And

17:15

so we go way over the top on that.

17:17

We think people shouldn't be interrupted when they're busy

17:19

and we go way over the top on that

17:21

and people shouldn't be distracted when they need to

17:23

focus. And again, we go way over the top

17:26

on that too. Yeah, confidentiality is important. It's good

17:28

for people to have focus and not be interrupted.

17:30

Sometimes I would gladly trade off the

17:33

over concern about those things

17:36

for a place where people were

17:38

informed, curious, talking about

17:40

things and understanding one another. I

17:42

think the benefits far outweigh the

17:44

costs, but from a legalistic standpoint,

17:47

we almost always err on the side of the

17:49

other things. Pat, do you think

17:51

big companies are more susceptible to what

17:53

you just described there? Yeah,

17:56

I think so because the way they're literally structured.

18:00

I think the physical environment of companies, when they go

18:02

in and build them, they're like, we gotta have a

18:04

lot of offices and a lot of doors and a

18:06

lot of conference rooms. And frankly,

18:08

unless you, like throughout my

18:10

career, unless you work in a cube, which

18:13

is the lowest people on the pole,

18:15

everybody else wants an office and it

18:17

actually is not necessarily a

18:20

benefit. So I do think it's

18:22

the way we structure offices. And I think for companies

18:24

that can't go out and do a big remodel, just

18:26

leave your doors open more. And

18:28

just say, hey everybody, I'm going into that meeting. If

18:30

anybody wants to hang out outside my office and get

18:33

a whiff of what we're talking about, I'm fine with

18:35

that. You know, I

18:37

think that we should stop apologizing for

18:40

creating a little bit of distraction, a little bit

18:42

of an interruption, and we should stop over

18:45

worrying about confidentiality. Now that doesn't mean we

18:47

shouldn't keep certain things confidential, but again, it's

18:49

probably a 10 to one ratio. And I

18:51

think we live as though it's a, it's

18:54

the opposite. You

18:56

know, I feel like this conversation keeps getting better

18:58

and better because as I hear you talk more

19:00

about this, Pat, I think how

19:03

fundamentally this is tied to organizational

19:05

health even, the idea

19:07

that we talk about building

19:09

trust and vulnerability. And oftentimes

19:12

when we're with teams, they'll ask us

19:14

like, hey, can we have, can you

19:16

do a one-on-one with everybody on the

19:18

leadership team like before we have our

19:20

meeting? And we'll say, no, of course

19:23

not. We want you to have all

19:25

of those conversations in the

19:27

room. Like we encourage you to have this

19:29

in the room. And like in some ways,

19:31

the only reason for closed doors and

19:35

one of the implications is that you're going

19:37

to say something different in a room with

19:39

a group of people that you wouldn't say

19:41

outside of that room with a different group

19:43

of people. When we talk about minimal politics

19:46

in an organization, we talk about it as

19:48

meaning that you don't change how you show

19:50

up or act or what you say based

19:52

on who's in the room. And

19:54

some of this closed door meeting policy Sort

19:57

of infers that that's the case. There's

20:00

even been times where like I've you know

20:02

talked about oh in our lives in the

20:04

open office context and I remember was one

20:06

of our colleagues came up or like hey,

20:08

are you sure you should be talking about

20:10

about that outs out here in the opens

20:12

Like I've already talked about about this one

20:15

on one you know he already knows I

20:17

have these things that I said I don't

20:19

need us, I don't need to. You know,

20:21

be careful with what I'm saying to them

20:23

saying the same thing in every room. And.

20:26

You know, It. Really interesting that even

20:28

underneath all of this it feels like so

20:30

tied in the organizational health and the ability

20:32

to be vulnerable and open and just saying

20:35

what you mean in every room. And it's

20:37

a it's I think it's a politics conversation

20:39

at the end of the day to. Yeah

20:42

you know site where was just thinking about

20:44

two Koreas. It's not just audio essential of

20:46

visual to like a It's so funny. when

20:48

you in the old offices it was always

20:50

like you have to go through the door

20:52

mahogany door and talk to the receptionist and

20:54

get through the venue. Go into the Ceos

20:56

office or maybe two offices in the anti

20:59

chamber you know and it's like. People.

21:01

Want to see how people are asking and what

21:03

they're doing? And. I don't know

21:05

as as I can see where this audio

21:07

sometimes might be distracting although I still think

21:10

you should probably to air on that sites.

21:12

But even the fact that people can walk

21:14

by and see. The. Executive team working

21:16

on things is good suit like we

21:19

have a a good client in Tennessee

21:21

Cody and the to Ceo share of

21:23

the office which is just a big

21:25

fish bowl. And everybody

21:27

can walk by any time and see that they're

21:29

busy, that they're working on stuff. and I think

21:31

it actually lends itself to a much more. Cohesive

21:34

and you know, trustworthy environment because

21:37

it doesn't feel like people are

21:39

trying to be secretive. So.

21:41

Even a visual. Even try his

21:43

nephew. well I think is a good idea. Or.

21:46

I I don't think we have to see more than that's

21:48

talk. Go back to your office and say hey, I

21:50

don't mind when you guys listen to what I'm doing. You.

21:53

Might think I'm trying to keep her from doing that. I

21:55

don't want to distract you but I'm still keep in the

21:57

door open. I'd like you start listening more and the things

21:59

I'm doing. And. If the doors closed, well,

22:01

then you just gotta get one of those glasses

22:03

and hold it up against that was and listen

22:05

to it that way. But

22:08

anyway, all right you guys, we have an

22:10

unpaid add to do today. What is it

22:12

though? Encodings on you guys. We did a

22:14

anti on Paid Out and I don't know

22:16

if there was any feedback about my disdain

22:18

for puzzles. So if you didn't hear a

22:20

hey Puzzles and you can send your hate

22:23

mail to Cody a Table group.com. Or

22:26

back on the positive train today. Okay,

22:28

so. It's Spring Break see them

22:30

and we had made no plans or so

22:33

we're kind of scrambling. Maybe you're in this

22:35

vote Whether it's spring break or summer. And.

22:37

I remembered that one of our families new

22:39

favorite finds is a new hotel chain that

22:41

we love. And. It's called Large

22:43

Camps L O G E. And

22:46

here's why I love about it is it's

22:48

very family friendly. They actually rooms that of

22:51

like bunk beds in them and hammocks and

22:53

they're all I can kind of family friendly

22:55

adventure spots. So for me. It's

22:57

hard to find time to build a make sure the

22:59

were gonna get sick. be able to read the kayak

23:01

for rent the bikes or whatever. And this

23:03

is are super cool hotel chain that does all that

23:05

for you. It's not like an all

23:07

inclusive resort, it's just like a place with

23:09

a fire pit and a cool family style

23:11

beds. And they take care of some other.

23:14

Problem. That honors you guys have ever experienced as you

23:16

go to. someplace. You want to

23:18

take your family? then you find a oh

23:20

I was to make reservations for the paddle

23:23

boards and I'm done any about so large

23:25

camps. Really? Like what they're doing. They're

23:27

a bunch of them across United States and

23:29

I just think they're model is really neat.

23:32

Than. Has had as well. As we said

23:34

it's spelled L O L O G. That's

23:37

not lows her. Becomes.

23:40

For maybe I'm pronouncing around wrong of

23:42

realm. Round. Of

23:45

sister for that. Magazine

23:47

agree with Regards. Yeah, I like that. I think

23:49

that's a great idea because I am definitely the

23:52

one is like we had to reserve those Oh

23:54

no. So. Very good up. Check

23:56

him out and then I don't even know who use the gear

23:58

sometimes so than they have. Somebody was like

24:01

hey, Here's how you do this:

24:03

Love. It. Lotta Champs Los Camps. We

24:05

don't know what a new set of skills

24:08

as a whole. Different banks That sounds cool

24:10

to see our eyes? Well thanks everyday for

24:12

joining us. Remember to eavesdrop on each other

24:14

more, it's a good thing to do and

24:16

we'll talk you next time. On at the

24:18

table struggling.