Lesley brings you a must-hear interview with Kelli Adame, a seasoned psychotherapist and relationship coach. In this episode, they delve into authentic masculinity and feminine energy. This discussion is packed with valuable lessons on overcoming common relationship hurdles through awareness—providing listeners with tools to foster healthier— more balanced connections. 

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In this episode you will learn about:

• Understanding health masculinity and its crucial role in relationships.
• The power of feminine energy for enhanced intimacy and connection. 
• Cultivating empathy in changing perspectives towards men
• Family dynamics and their influence on shaping limiting beliefs. 
• Honoring men and appreciating their role and contributions. 

Episode References/Links:

• Love Bravely Academy
• Love Bravely Academy on TikTok
• Kelli Adame
• 280. Create More Harmony in Your Relationship with Kelli Adame

Guest Bio:

Relationship Expert // Trained + Educated as Depth Psychotherapist and Relationship Coach. I'm an expert in helping women, men and couples navigate modern love and relationships. I specialize in the understanding and application of balancing Masculine and Feminine Energies, Communication, Dating well and building successful relationships and marriages. I help high-achieving women navigate the journey from single and dating to successfully married. And I help married individuals/couples improve the marriage they have. I equip, educate and encourage my clients to help them achieve their relationship goals. 

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Episode Transcript:

Kelli Adame 0:00  

If I could discern that he was a prince that could become a good king great, but if he's a selfish, Peter Pan, that's not good. You feel me? Because Peter Pan is a great playmate. He's a lot of fun. He's so fun, right? They can be so fun, you know, in bed. They can be so fun in playing in the world that they do not make good lifelong partners. You're signing up for a lot of pain. 

Lesley Logan 0:26  

Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I'm Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I've trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self-doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it's the antidote to fear. Each week, my guest will bring bold, executable, intrinsic and targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It's a practice, not a perfect. Let's get started.

Lesley Logan 1:08  

Hi, how are you, Be it babe? Okay. This is one of those special moments where we get to have one of our guests back because my gosh, she's just a thought leader and I love her grace and her support for all of us as a woman listening to this so we can really step into our hugely amazing power like us. If you haven't listened to the first episode with Kelly Adame, you should go listen to that one. Now you can listen to this one and go listen that one but it's trust me, it's going to be these back-to-back episodes are going to be really, really special for you. And today's topic of what Kelli Adame is so knowledgeable at which is masculine feminine energies in relationships. We're actually talking about how to spot like healthy, masculine energy, which I think is so important. And also like some of the downfalls as women is what we do, that doesn't cultivate that not to put blame on ourselves, because we're not I'm not at all, she's not at all, none of that's happening. But some of the things that we may have been raised to do that are not helping us in that area. And then also some things that we tend to do thinking that someday our prince is going to come. And so whether you are in a relationship, single, somewhere in between totally celibate and swearing them off forever, like there's so much in this episode, I think is really important because we all do have men and women in our lives. And we can really start to see where we can do some self-work on ourselves to continue to attract incredible humans in our lives. And also some permission to give ourselves to just stop doing things. Ladies, you don't have to do things all the time, we can just be in the feeling of it. So I really hope that this episode with Kelli gives you lots of permission. She's got some great Be It Action Items on both episodes. And I already want her back like I already want her back. So anyways, she is awesome. Here is Kelli Adame. 

Lesley Logan 3:04  

All right, Be It Babe, we've got a guest back already. I'm so excited. I'm so excited because I just got to re-listen to her first episode. And by the time this is out, it's already aired. And my husband Brad, listen to it two times. That's how much he fell in love with you. So Kelli Adame, you are back. You are the queen of all things when it comes to masculine and feminine energies and like really showing up in our relationships. And there's so much to talk about when we finished that episode, we wanted to talk we're like, well, we didn't even touch on this. So before we talk about what we're talking about can you tell everyone more about who you are in case it's the first time they're listening to your voice? 

Kelli Adame 3:40  

Yes. So my name is Kelli Adame and I'm trained and educated as a depth psychotherapist and a relationship coach to train sort of entrepreneur. So I've been in private practice full-time for 10 years, which has been amazing. And now I'm really pivoting to be more of an educational vehicle for people. Because I think a lot of the reason people struggle is because they don't know what they don't know. So I'm super excited to just be sharing more of what I know, that's been transformational in my life and in the life of just hundreds of my one-on-one clients, men and women. So I love it. This is like my just happy place. And I'm so excited to be talking more good stuff with you. 

Lesley Logan 4:19  

Yeah, I'm really thrilled and it's true. I think, well, y'all have to go listen to the first episode she had on we'll get that on the show notes because it it really was eye-opening for me to understand like, oh, okay, this is, this might be why there's friction in the household because we're both trying to like show up in this way and someone has to receive and someone has to cherish and there's got to be this thing and so, so what I wanted to focus on today was you know, we talked a bit more I felt like about feminine energy on the first episode and we talked a little bit like you mentioned, your husband is like, you know, a very integrated healthy, masculine energy who knows the work. And I was just like, so what is that because also I feel like especially today in politics, there's a lot in the news. There's a lot of talk about, like, toxic masculinity. And I'm like, okay, I think we're all, we can, we don't have to dive into that topic. But like, what if we actually focus on like, what is healthy masculinity? And what does that look like? And that kind of energy? Because that would be nice if you go, ooh, spotted, green light. Let's go. That's the one. 

Kelli Adame 5:20  

Yes, yes. No. 100%. So it's so interesting, because I think listen, I have come to a place in my own journey and in my work, I have such authentic respect for good men. Like, genuinely there's so much to be grateful for about good men in the world. And when I came to understand that and then experienced (inaudible), specifically, because I didn't always date good men just to be real, right? Like, when I really encountered that in a way that I was like, wow, I didn't even know this was a thing. Like I didn't even know I could be loved this way, pursued this way, feel protected, feel cherished, feel chosen, but but feel more of who I am not less of who I am in that dynamic. You know what I mean? So, yeah, so there is a lot of stuff about, you know, unhealthy men. There are a lot of unhealthy wounded men in the world. There are some just, conmen sociopaths, malignant narcissists. And you want to be able to identify those men so that you don't get oxytocin bonded and then taken down? A terrible, terrible rabbit hole of pain, right?

Lesley Logan 6:30  

Yeah, we had (inaudible). Sorry, go ahead. 

Kelli Adame 6:33  

No, no, go ahead. 

Lesley Logan 6:34  

I was gonna say we had someone who, we had Rebecca Zung on recently, about narcissism. And she said this really poignant thing, she said narcissists don't pick up pick you because you're, they think you're weak. They pick you because you've got something that they want to like vampire off of. So like, so for the women, listen, if you're like, oh, my God, I'm the one who keeps picking the narcissist. Like, it's not that you're picking them. They're literally going she's got something I need to suck the life out of. So you have something they want to offer. But I think it's I love that you brought up like, you didn't always date those people. Because I think, especially in your work, people might be like, oh, she like never had a problem. She has no idea. It's like, no, I think we all kissed a fuck ton of frogs. 

Kelli Adame 7:16  

Yeah, yeah. 100% 

Lesley Logan 7:18  

Right? 

Kelli Adame 7:19  

And like, sometimes that's how we learn the hard way. 

Lesley Logan 7:21  

Yeah, like, it would be so nice if we didn't have to, but like, yeah, maybe it's because the fucking princess books told us to kiss a frog and it might be a prince. It's like going is this the one? 

Kelli Adame 7:30  

Well, it's like, if I could if I could discern that he was a prince that could become a good king. Great. But if he's a selfish, Peter Pan, that's not good. You feel me? Because Peter Pan is a great playmate. He's a lot fun. They're so fun, right? They can be so fun, you know, in bed, they can be so fun in playing in the world but they do not make good lifelong partners. You're signing up for a lot of pain and disappointment.

Lesley Logan 7:56  

And I think sometimes we can, I don't know, like, we can fall in love with the possibility of what they can become? 

Kelli Adame 8:04  

Oh yes, our Pygmalion project. I just love you and give you more and show you all my goodness and maybe like, you know, plant some seeds that I've learned in my personal growth and maybe get you into something like then we could just have this amazing relationship, you could just evolve so I could have what I want and I'm helping you don't you see that I'm helping you? 

Lesley Logan 8:23  

Yeah, and I feel like I feel like all it does is help them become who they're gonna be for someone else. I don't think it's always (inaudible).

Kelli Adame 8:30  

And, and, or, and, or you're actually not helping them as much as you think you are. A lot of times, you're feeding the part of themselves that they want to feel good. A man who's not integrated in his authentic masculine energy. He's more of like a selfish little boy. Right? He wants to feel good more than he wants you to feel good. So this is why when we, right? So this is when we talk about feminine energy, I tell them like you have to be authentically connected to what you feel. And you have to be able to cherish your own feelings, so that you can invite a good man to also cherish her feelings. But if you are constantly overgiving, and constantly performing and constantly trying to get a man to choose you or love you or you think that helping him is going to be, you're mothering him, he'll be grateful that you're mothering him because that feels good to him. But that's not going to make him die to his selfishness to love and protect and honor you. 

Kelli Adame 9:29  

Yeah, that's true. And also like, let's just be real. Nobody should actually want to sleep with their mother. So like on a romantic (inaudible).

Kelli Adame 9:41  

Kills the chemistry, right? Kills your chemistyr. Neutralizes your chemistry. Yeah, because it's incestuous. So when you get an (inaudible) stuff around this, right? So, but basically, when women move into like that mothering, overly nurturing, therapeutic, let-me-help-fix-you, that's still a form of masculine energy because it's still giving in an unbalanced way. So like when I want, when I'm, when a woman has small children, she has to move into masculine energy to keep those children alive, you know, while they're under the age of six until they're self-sufficient, which is why she needs a good masculine loving partner who's going to support her and support the whole thing. Does that make sense? Yeah. So it's, you know, it's nuanced. This is why like, to your point, a lot of people, especially right now are talking about masculine-feminine stuff, but they only know like one aspect of it, they don't have it integrated. They don't fully have an integrated understanding of it. And if you don't, you're gonna miss apply it. And it won't work or it'll feel manipulative.

Lesley Logan 10:41  

Can we talk about like, just like, what people think masculine feminine energies are and then like, or what? What's kind of going around as like, what's a healthy version? And like, what's actual, because I feel like what we talked about on the first episode kind of made things more clear. And I'm listening to different podcasts, and I hear these things. And I'm like, that's kind of like, almost like, I don't know, it just doesn't sound right. And then I definitely want to go into like spotting healthy, you know, energies?

Kelli Adame 11:07  

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm happy to talk about it, I think it's the thing is, is that there's other pieces that get integrated in this, but if let's just talk about like what good healthy, masculine integrated energy is. First of all, you have to understand that men go through a different journey than women do, psychologically to evolve, okay? And men really only become integrated healthy men three ways. They're either really well fathered by other good men, it doesn't have to be their biological father, it can be other men, who show them the way of what it means to be a man. That's why when you like, look at like tribal, you know, behavior. It's like, you know, once the boy is 12 years old, he goes out with all the men to hunt, and they take him through all of these different tasks that help him realize that he has what it takes to be a man. And then there's other men bestow on him that he is, does that make sense? And that's a process that men can take other men through. So this is where we get into a lot of the issues we have, because we have fatherless households, we have men who haven't been well fathered, or had father figures in their life. I do a lot that work with men. So I understand that profoundly.

Lesley Logan 12:13  

I mean, right there. I'm just like, well, I mean, several generations of like, not like, you know, I mean, even can just go back to like, World War Two boys were born. Their fathers, if they had them, went off to war, then they came back then they were like, we're looking at generations of like, probably not a lot of modeling that is healthy. So that's a lot of men who didn't have that. And that's, we're expecting something of them. I'm not I'm not trying to get people off the hook. People don't have to send me any DMs. But it is, it does make sense.

Kelli Adame 12:47  

Yes, well, there is cause and effect. And you can never say it's just one thing. But one of the major factors. And when I say to, to women, like there's a level of like, genuine empathy and compassion we can have for men, if they haven't been shown the way about how to be good men, or how to show up in healthy relationship, or how to cherish and love and pursue a woman why would they know how to do it? And you just expect them to know how to do it?

Lesley Logan 13:10  

Yeah. And you're also not saying like, we're, we're gonna we have to teach them that because as we already learned from the Peter Pan thing, that's not gonna work. So like, it's just having empathy is very different than like, let me fix it.

Kelli Adame 13:22  

Yeah, well, and also not just like criticizing the hell out of them. For not being what we think that they should be. Because by the way, we're probably we got our own stuff going on, you know what I mean? But I'm just saying, if you look at those things, it's not like just men are selfish (inaudible) is, there's reasons why men are, you know, have their own struggles. So now, I think everybody gets to take personal, none of us get to decide what we're born into what we get and don't get, but we do at some point, get to decide what we're going to do with it and take personal responsibility, get on a path of growth, healing awareness, and become better human beings. That's a personal choice. So you know, if you're 60 years old, and you're still being a super selfish Peter Pan, like, okay, I accept that, but I'm not enabling it either. You know what I mean? So, but I do think that men deserve the opportunity to be able to learn how to do that. So they're either really well fathered by good men, or they get on some kind of spiritual path that allows them to like, sort of slay their dragons, metaphorically, face their fears, look at those things that they have had to work through and become men through that process.

Lesley Logan 14:35  

Like a here's journey of something, but that's

Kelli Adame 14:37  

Yes, like a hero's journey. A hundred percent. So if a man doesn't get to do that, so there's that way, the other the other way, which is what's really specific to us and the way that I work with women is that the way women really become men is that they fall in love with a really well-integrated, feminine energy woman who requires it of him by the essence that she holds for herself. Oh yeah, so men will rise into king energy if he's in the presence of a queen, who invites that, but it's indirect. It's not direct. 

Lesley Logan 15:10  

Yeah. I love that because it's like full permission ladies to be here. Well-integrated queen self and demand that people rise to you. Yeah, I think that's (inaudible).

Kelli Adame 15:23  

It's not you trying to fix him, change him, telling him what to do. It's about you being integrated in the healthiest, you know, because it's like, whatever you are, it gets reflected back to you. Right? What you believe in where you are? That's your jam. Right? So if we, but it's counterintuitive, because we think, well, if I want that, this is what I need to do. And I'm actually, if you want that, actually, this is what you got to do. It's different than you think it might be.

Lesley Logan 15:47  

I know we talked on the last episode you had on like about Brad and I meeting and like, there was one time he called me late at night, he called and like, look, I thought he was the hottest thing like, of course, I was like, he's calling. It's in the middle of the night. I woke up and he like wanna hang out and I was like, yeah, you should have called earlier. I can't now. But if you call earlier, you know, next time, we can hang out. And he did after that. But of course, it's hard to be going, hh, my God, like, you know, am I gonna see him again? And it was just like, but I like I, you know, I wasn't perfect. And it was just like, okay. I'm not, no, we're not doing that. We did that when we're 22. We don't do that at 31. And it worked out. And he, like when we tell our story of how we met, he said, I call her one time and like, she literally said no. And so I called earlier the next time.

Kelli Adame 16:43  

Go figure. So amazing, right? I mean, it's kind of like behavioral psychology 101, right? It's like, you reward the behavior that you want more of, and you starve and ignore the behavior you want less of. And the thing is, is like, men don't need our help. Can I just respectfully say that? Like, if a man wants something, you'll find a way to make it happen, because he values it, and he wants it, including you. So he doesn't need you to help him, he doesn't need you to kind of be manipulative or position yourself or allow things that you shouldn't or lower your standard that doesn't help him respect him or honor him. And in my experience, men always value something that they've either had to work hard to achieve, or that they perceive has a high value, right? Like, I like going to the Dollar Store like anybody else. Like sometimes, I'm like, spent $10 and got all this cool little stuff, okay, but I don't value that the way I value my BMW. Right? So because I work hard to earn all the money to pay for that car that I enjoy. So I value it at a different level. So the idea is like, I remember reading this one similar analogy, it means a different one but you know, like an Olympic athlete, who wins the gold medal, the gold medal symbolizes and is so valuable to them because of everything that they sacrificed and all that that represents in what they achieved. So it holds a special place for them. But if somebody just gave them a gold medal, like somebody's hand-me-down gold medal, it wouldn't mean anything to them. Does that make sense? So it's the same journey. You want to create enough space for men to decide if they want you and be willing to take the risk and to pursue you but you want to reward them when they do that? Which you did. Right? So he wanted to see you. And you said, even though you wanted to, you loved and valued yourself enough to say no, right? Which by the way, is integrated with feminine energy, integrated, feminine energy gets what she wants by saying no to what she doesn't want. Right? So you did that. And then he learned, okay, if I want something different, I gotta do something different. So I really value this woman. I do want to spend time with her. So what do I need to do differently in order to have access to her? He did it, called you earlier and what happened? He won. He got access to you. That was the reward.

Lesley Logan 19:04  

Yeah, no, you're, it makes sense. I love that because it worked out. You know but like

Kelli Adame 19:13  

He offered it like a good masculine man. 

Lesley Logan 19:15  

Yeah. Yeah. 

Kelli Adame 19:16  

And that honored him. That honored him, too.

Lesley Logan 19:20  

Yeah, I think, and I like the way you said it. Like, it honors both people. And it makes, it helps both people. Like, we enjoy each other's company a lot better. And like, I had a trainer, because I said, oh, he texted me about this thing. And he's like, well, if you want to date him, don't teach him. That's what my trainer said, and I was like, okay, so instead of, like, showing him how to do the thing, because I can't I'm a fitness professional. I said do you want to take a class together which like, you know, doesn't mean I'm now I'm not actually like, we're going to someone else who's teaching it like it's not, you know, I'm not doing anything but it really helps set the tone of like, oh, I don't actually have to teach this person every like, actually have to do that, you know? And like, so it's hard because I think I don't actually I feel like women are almost raised to there's the rules, which seems all the book that every girl who was born in the 1980s, like mother told them about, which is like manipulation central. And so you think like, oh, if I manipulate them, then I get them. And it's like, that's not it. And then, yeah, there's a whole purity culture that makes you feel like you're completely the reason why they fall in. And so I feel like there's a lot of misinformation given to women about how their feminine energy is powerful, and how they can attract a really great person. But also, if you don't know what a healthy masculine energy is, you start to go, oh, this Peter Pan person, I can fix them. And I can do these things or this person's love bombing me, he must be in to me.

Kelli Adame 20:52  

Yes, you don't know how to discern this is what I say to women. I'm like, Look, you don't know what you don't know. So let's talk about what does actually healthy masculinity look like. So healthy, integrated masculine energy in a man towards a woman, like who's interested in you he's going to, he's going to initiate, he's going to pursue, he's going to ask for your number, he's going to text you first, he's going to let you know that he's interested, he's hunting. Right? And you and you do have to have respect for men that there's an enormous amount of risk of rejection that men take. And that, you know, so like, even when I was single, and men, hit on me, or men asked me on dates or whatever, even if I wasn't interested, I was always incredibly respectful and gracious, just because I didn't want that man to not be willing to pursue women in general. I wanted to still reward the courage that it took to do that. And I wanted ultimately to still be pursued by the man that I wanted to be with. Does that make sense? So I think that's just something we should have respect for. But when a man wants to do that, and he takes that risk to hunt, then then if the reward is when you give back to him by saying yes, and giving him access to your time, your attention, your energy, a date, or whatever, so he's going to initiate he's gonna pursue, he's gonna say I want that. Masculine energy says oh, I want that I'm going to go after it. Right? And so it's energy that leads, that initiates, that takes action, that pursues, it's also by nature protective, so it wants to protect women, children in the planet. Right? And that's where it gets that's where there's a level of kind of where they're self-sacrificial in that, but it gives them a sense of purpose and meaning as a man. Does that make sense? Which is I say this to women, too. I wrote about this recently. Like a man needs to see that there's a place for him in your life and indeed, for him in your life. I had a client recently who was in a relationship and they broke up and she was devastated. And he basically said to her, I think we're too much of the same player on the same team. So he was very ambitious and strong and driven and so was she, but it was like, they were like two men running a race together as teammates. And for him, he wanted a queen, but her conditioning and her life, you know, was to pursue, pursue, pursue and be successful. So she thought, like, this is great. We're like, compatible, and he was going no, I want a compliment. I don't want someone who's exactly like me, or does that make sense? 

Lesley Logan 23:18  

Yeah, it does. I'm someone who like was raised to be independent. My father taught me how to make friends (inaudible) at like, fucking four. Yes. Stove on with a little stool, you know, did my thing with my spatula. He, like he royally what he really absolutely wants me to be independent and not, you know, be reliant. However, he also taught me like, these are the things that I get to see in a man who wants to date you and so like, he's like, he will stand on the outside of the sidewalk because you should not get wet. And he will do these things. So there was that modeled for me but because of this, like self-reliant that I was taught, and because I had student loans, and I, like I been paying my bills since I was 15 years old, you know, like I so when, so I definitely was not actually doing the great job of making sure that the partner I was with before which, none of them were right for me. But I also wasn't helping because I wasn't needing them. And so when one time Brad had texted me he's like, hey, I know you're gluten dairy free. I'm at the store. I got these things. Is there anything else you'd like? And I said I could really and I like it was so hard for me, you guys, it took everything I need to do this. I just go yeah, I could. I would really love some sparkling water can you grab that for me, please? Like it was everything in my soul to just ask for sparkling water but I knew from all the stuff that I read. I was like, he needs to feel needed. He needs to feel like he is doing something for me. So what could he do for me right now? We could just do that. And it's still something I have to practice in my adult life because we work together, we live together and like it's so easy. But, you know, like the other day, my client came in the house and she saw, I'm like working on my reformers like, oh, he's also the repairman of the reformer and like he's so many things. He also repaired my computer today, he also did these things like I wouldn't be able to do without him.

Lesley Logan 25:23  

But I think it's hard when you are raised that way we live in a society where we, you know, often have to be because you might be single for a really long time. So there are some things you just have to be able to do on your own, but also be able to let someone feel like they have a place to cherish you and do things for you.

Kelli Adame 25:42  

Yeah, I think what you're hitting on is like so central to a lot of the work that I do and teach and encounter and with my own experience, right? So my mom was a corporate businesswoman. She broke glass ceilings, she did amazing things. I'm always so proud of her for that. And, you know, she wore power suits and chopped off her hair and she was very masculine in her energy. She didn't model that feminine energy for me, right? She modeled like, perform, work, make money, go handle business. And I have a dad that I love, my father. He was a firefighter. And he was tough. He had no sons. I was the oldest daughter. So I'm like that firstborn hero child, overachieving, all that like a lot of women I worked with.

Lesley Logan 26:22  

Hi, totally see you.

Kelli Adame 26:23  

Yeah, like soul sisters, here we go. And my dad was hard on me, he would say because I wanted her to be tough. I wanted her to know that she didn't need a man. And it didn't mean that he didn't want me to ever be with a man. He just didn't want he, in his mind as a parent, he was trying to prepare me for all things. Does that make sense? And so yeah, I became very good at being responsible and self-sufficient and hyper-independent and could achieve all kinds of things. But I ended up feeling lonely and disconnected and struggling with why can't I find a relationship with a good man to make that work and feel loved? And like, am I going to be able to, like get married and have children? And is that like, you know? And that was, I think that's kind of an epidemic of a lot of women that I work with, right? So it's like we're taught. And it depends on your family, if the currency in your family was performance, like the currency of love, was performance. So you get love and praise if you get good grades, and you achieve this and do that, then we that's what we think love is and that's part of what we bring into our relationship with men. Oh, let me perform. Let me show you how great I am. Let me do all these things so that you can see I want you to choose me. But that's not what a man falls in love with.

Lesley Logan 27:33  

Right.

Kelli Adame 27:34  

Does that make sense? 

Lesley Logan 27:35  

Yes, I you are making so much sense. Because if performance and those actions are the masculine energy, and to go back to that couple were the guys like, hey, you're an awesome teammate on my race, but like, I'm not, I don't want to go to bed with you. I don't want to be married to you like this isn't the relationship I'm looking for? It's no wonder that if that's what you were raised with, of course, that's what you're doing at home. And you're thinking what this is what gets me love. This is what gets me attention. And it's like and that 

Kelli Adame 28:04  

And it's so well intended. 

Lesley Logan 28:07  

It's so well-intended. My parents, listen, thanks, guys. (Inaudible)

Kelli Adame 28:11  

Yeah, love my parents. Shut up. They know, we've been through a lot of healing, but I'm just saying. And I remember feeling that way. Like, I'm doing everything I know how to do. And I know, like, I don't understand, like, you know, I always remember just feeling like, am I Is there something wrong with me is there or just do all men suck? Like, it's like, it's this. And of course, it's hard, you get better you struggle with limited beliefs. And usually we all have things we lived through, right? So like, I survived child abuse, you know, sexual abuse very young, so that also really colored, you know, the way that I didn't feel safe with my body. And I didn't really feel safe with men subconsciously. So that was, that was an element of healing I had to do too. So, you know, it's, it's not always just one thing, but I'm saying but that's why it's worth doing this kind of work, you know, and growth to figure it out.

Lesley Logan 29:01  

Yeah, I love it. I love that you brought up it's not just one thing, it's not just some like, just because someone didn't have a father, raising them doesn't mean that they're not going to be integrated. And it doesn't, it doesn't mean or that they have that, that they're going to be set for life. Like it's a culmination of your entire childhood and people praise you and what that is. And it's hard, like it's so hard to be an adult person. And, and to also like to also be in relationship because now you're not just thinking about you, you're thinking about the other person and how that goes. And I think you know, as we're talking about this, I guess I'm, I had a couple of women who are like high achiever women professional clients, and they're like, I can't tell a man what I do for a living or like I had someone else who's like, I can't tell them I have two houses like too soon because it's a turn-off. And I was like, it should not be a turn-off. Like if it's a guy's healthy. I'm like an awesome dude. Like, shouldn't be like wow, I'm like on a date with a woman who's like, owns her own home in LA like, are you fucking kidding? That's a big deal. But is that wrong? Like, is it a turn off when like, like, should a healthy integrated guy be turned off by someone who now is a pretty badass bitch at work? 

Kelli Adame 30:15  

No, no, no. I recently wrote about this too because I think somebody asked me like, are men intimidated by strong women and successful men? I was like, no, I think that's like a myth that women have perpetuated to help give them an understanding about what they're struggling. But the reality is, a man who is healthy and integrated in himself is not going to be threatened by your successes and your brilliance and your talents. He's going to be like, she's amazing. But it's not purely why he's going to fall in love with you. He's gonna fall. So it's not that a man cares that you're successful in your masculine energy, he just wants to know that you can be soft with him. He just wants access to your feminine heart and soul and emotions. And like he just wants to know you can soften and move into that feminine energy with him. You can kick ass and take names all day long and build a seven-figure business and have three houses. Great. But are you able to honor the masculine in him?

Lesley Logan 31:15  

Yeah.

Kelli Adame 31:15  

Or are you trying to? Does that make sense? So what happens for a lot of women is that when you are, so a lot of that is just not knowing how to shift into the feminine energy, where you can call in a man who's not going to be threatened by that. Typically, you're going to be when you're that strong, and you're showing up in that masculine energy with men, you're either going to attract men who want to take advantage of you. Right? They want a sugar mama. Plenty of those out there. This little boy, mama helped me feel better. Right? 

Lesley Logan 31:44  

I had a friend and he was living his best life for several years. And then one day, she's like, okay, I'm done with you little house boy. And he's like, I'm homeless now. I'm like, I don't feel bad for you at all, you lived the best life for three years. You owe her a lot. 

Kelli Adame 32:00  

Yes, yes, no, but that's like mama taking care of a little boy. Put a roof over your head and pay for your food and your good time and (inaudible). So you're the primary giver, he's the primary receiver that's going to create either a parent-child dynamic over time, it's going to neutralize chemistry again, that's also Peter Pan. He's fun for a while. Yeah, not a good longtime partner. The issue for women is that I don't care how strong a woman is, she needs to feel the strength of her man. So as women, when we in our core, we crave security and safety differently than a man does. So for us, it's like, even though I'm super self-sufficient, and I'm strong and I can go do all these things like I there's a part of me that wants to just like, relax into the masculine of my husband and let him lead certain things and feel protected and know that you can be there for me, I don't most women I encounter if you're functioning in the masculine energy full time all the time, you're exhausted or your adrenals are drained or you have over-producing cortisol. You're if not, we're not designed to do that. So most women, I know, they're like, I'm tired. I have, like, I  decision fatigue, I run a business, I run a team, I run all this stuff, I take care of all these other people I would love to just be taken cared of in some way. It doesn't always mean a man has to make more money than you. Does that make sense? 

Lesley Logan 33:25  

No, because they could be, you could have a house husband, who is taking care of everything for you and the kids and you come home and there's no responsibility at home. And then you can, you know, you can absolutely I think that's an option. 

Kelli Adame 33:37  

And you can you can negotiate. But it's also it's, it's not just that it's just that a man knows who he is and he understands what his worth and value and purpose is and that he's not intimidated by your success. And if a man is then he's, he's probably just not a good fit for you. Because either he has his own wounding or he has his own unfulfilled things in his life that he needs to go feel purpose and fulfilled about first. It's true that most men don't take a queen unless they have their kingdom in order. So women will typically like take a relationship on in any phase that they're in because we're wired for relationship. And we're more monogamously wired men are more polygamously wired. So a man has to die to his selfishness and die to your responsibility to take on one woman and he has to choose you and go wow I'm willing to give up all other vaginas for this one because I think she's really worth it. And so there's a there's a there's a sacrificial nature and not that he wins when he does that if he chooses a good woman. Does that make sense? Yeah,

Lesley Logan 34:41  

Yeah. Okay, so yeah. So fun. Okay, so (inaudible) how does it, I know I think my wheels turn out like visually for you. So how does this work in like today's dating online like it's so, right, because like it's so hard. Like, there's these dating apps, if you like, you almost have to, like DM the guy first or like, are you just gonna sit there and wait? Like, how does? How does this work in, in today's like I so, I want to talk about that because I know we have a lot of single listeners. And like, that's where they're meeting people. It's online, like, they're not going to a bar and meeting people. No one's like doing that anymore. Or, you know, I mean, I'm very lucky. I'm the old story because you're like, how did you and Brad meet? I'm like, believe it or not someone introduced us. You know, it's very rare. So like, what is how do you how do you operate in your feminine and find a good masculine energy in like the space where like, they kind of are thought they are used to women just reaching out to them?

Kelli Adame 35:41  

Yeah, well, so this is one of the things is we've, we've conditioned men in a way that's not to our benefit or their benefit. And the way to reverse that is to stop doing it. Does that make sense? So I think it's true that we have kind of convoluted that and there are plenty of men that will just wait on on their laurels for a woman to pursue them. Which, what you have to understand is whoever pursues and initiates first is signaling that they want to sit in the masculine position. So, so feminine energy members, she is, she loves herself, she values herself and she can be patient, passive, available, and connected to generating happiness in her own life, which is very magnetic, and waiting for men to come pursue her. I was just talking to a client this morning, I was like, you're like the doe, you know, the deer that's in the meadow that's just loving the forest and eating the grass. And you know, and there's a hunt, there's somebody's gonna come hunt you because that's his nature. So it's sort of like, but you're not, you're not worrying about trying to help him hunt, you're not trying to hunt him first. You're not trying, do you see what I'm saying? You're just trying to look good, smell good, feel good. You know, and for women, I say like, look, do your work. Where do you have, you know, some limited beliefs and some wounding and some conditioning and some things that you need to sort of clean out to make yourself fully available? There's a lot of women who are actively dating, but they aren't actually available because they haven't done that work. Does that make sense? 

Lesley Logan 37:14  

Oh, yes. Oh, yes. 

Kelli Adame 37:16  

Or what you're mapping to is a relationship blueprint that's maybe somewhat dysfunctional because of whatever dysfunction you inherited in your family. So like, for example, like, I have women that had maybe a father that they loved, but maybe he was a high-functioning alcoholic, right. And so they learned to kind of take care of him and, you know, cherish his feelings, and but he was emotionally unavailable to her, then she's gonna go out and map subconsciously, to other men who are emotionally unavailable. You might have a low, low-key drinking problem, because it's like, oh, that's familiar. It's home. That's what your psyche knows. But what's happening is you're not getting your needs met, you're not feeling pursued, you're not feeling cherished, you're not getting a commitment but you have a blueprint that's mapping you subconsciously. Same thing with a narcissist, someone will map to narcissist, if they had a narcissistic parent. So I'm just saying, sometimes the work is more just spending some time tending to yourself. It's a loving decision. Yeah. And so tend to those things, learn those things and learn what it means to fully embody your own feminine energy. And then because it doesn't matter, it could be online, you could still be introduced, you could be meeting somebody at a store, you could be whatever. When you're integrated in that energy, you're going to attract something very different.

Lesley Logan 38:30  

Yes.

Kelli Adame 38:30  

And you don't (inaudible) and they can find you anywhere. Oh, they can find you online, in the airport in the...

Lesley Logan 38:40  

You guys, the girl who, the woman who introduced Brad and I, she only had met me twice. And him once like, you know, like she, and she met us at very specific times in our life. Like, when I met her, I was leaving my partner of five years. And she was like, hey, do you wanna do this thing? And I was like, fuck yeah I want to do the thing. I have no friends, I lost a partner, and I was of course, I dated him two weeks into moving to L.A. So I lost all the friends, too. So yes, I'm in. And I was like a tourist in my own town. And I was, you know, it was like, I was like, okay, I used to be a fun person, like, this person is (inaudible) me. So I became this. And I was doing a lot of work on like, why do I keep choosing the same person, like, let's talk about that. So it was like, so she met me at that place. It wasn't any of my friends I know for, you know, 14 years or anything like that. And she'd only met him one time and he had been going through something. So we met and we were at that thing and so I think you're spot on that when you if you actually focus on working on yourself and taking yourself to the fullest thing. Even if you're alone a little longer than you think you'd want to be you're gonna be the best fucking version of yourself and you'll just attract the most amazing person and go to you. It's so funny how people want to rush that. Like, because also like it never shocked like I'm never surprised if people are like, oh, they move really fast on that. I'm like, no, they were very integrated people on their own thing. And like it moves faster when you like, don't have a lot of shit to deal with.

Lesley Logan 40:09  

Totally, 100%. It can happen fast. My husband and I knew of each other for about 10 months, but we didn't, we weren't friends, we had some mutual friends. And then he realized he wanted to pursue me. And so then he started to do that. And then I mean, within three months, we were, like, seriously committed within six months, we were engaged in less than a year we were married.  

Lesley Logan 40:35  

Yeah, yeah (inaudible). 

Kelli Adame 40:37  

Because I had done all of it's like, the whole be it till you see it. Like, that's it. And it's not, and I want them to hear this. It's not that you're broken, and you're wounded. And there's something wrong with you. This is like the journey for all of us. And we live in a time where we're very blessed, okay, like, as women, we can go do whatever it is that we want to do professionally, academically, in a world, which is a gift. But you have to know that we suffered some losses around our romantic relationships. And so it's worth going and learning and committing yourself to that journey to have what you want. It's like I said at the beginning, if you want something, what are you willing to do to get it? Why do we think we should just automatically know how to have successful relationships? Or why do we think we understand men? There's so much about men, I love to teach women because I think they genuinely just don't understand. And they're measuring men by their own yardstick which is never gonna work.

Lesley Logan 41:27  

And like I was listening to like, I don't know, it must have been like, The Daily or something like that. But it's like a podcast about women and men and things like that. And like, today, women can do everything, you could buy a house, you can actually have a baby, you just like have a donor sperm, like you can do all these things. And so, yes, part of it, I do think requires a level of standard that they're like, hey, I would like you to meet me at this level. And I do think that somewhere along the way, there wasn't as the same amount of like, that I got so much like, you can be anything you want, you can do everything you want. Like I don't know that my brother got that same. Like, you got this speech that I got, you know, so I feel like there is yes, no, that doesn't, it's not does not mean you get to like, I'm not saying go date the wounded guy. But I am saying like, having that empathy and like, what can like, one of the reasons why I do this podcast is like, what can we do for the men in our lives to, you know, encourage them to find this integrated healthy, masculine energy where they can like really feel like they shine and really attract a great queen that they want to attract. I think that that's part of it is, you know, honoring who we are, I think we can actually instead of fixing them, we could just it sounds like we could just like really work on ourselves because part of the journey was if they meet the queen, they'll rise up to it. And then you know, for those of you who have, you know, sons and brothers, it's like helping them identify like, you know, where they can go to get growth, and it doesn't have to be you. 

Kelli Adame 42:56  

Well, but you have to be careful about that. 

Lesley Logan 42:58  

Okay, tell me. 

Kelli Adame 42:58  

Right? Like I would say the way that you honor a man is respect him. Ask him what he thinks and listen. Let him understand, learn, commit yourself to learning and understanding more about the masculine journey and masculine nature, right? So a man has to do good in order to feel good. That's where they want to fix things. They want to solve problems, they want to win. Men are wired, evolutionary biology, they want to compete, control and conquer, they want to win. And that's why they like competitive sports, (inaudible) playing video games. That's why they like solving problems, that's the way that they're wired. So give them the opportunities to do that in ways that makes sense and respect and appreciate them when they do it. When your husband fixes your Pilates machine and fixes your computer and manages like, the beautiful wrap on your car for the tour is like, babe, look at this. I'm so excited. Look what's happening. Look what I did, look what I managed. It's like, oh my god, it's amazing. And we all benefit from that. So it's like, don't patronize them like, oh, let me help you you know, become your best self. No, that's, it's, I don't like it. It's emasculating. It's disrespectful. Well intended. Do that with your girlfriends. Go get into some therapy or do some work on yourself, girl. But your man, honor and respect him and appreciate what he does do in the world, I say, even though I'm happily married any opportunity that I have to respect and appreciate a man I do it. It's not just a man. It's it's all good man. We want men to change, feed the the higher nature of them, honor and respect them. Like I was making a joke because I'm born and raised in San Diego, but we recently moved to (inaudible) in Idaho. My husband got an amazing job. And every time I go to Costco, I do not I don't know what it is. This never happened when I went to San Diego. Every time I go to Costco, I'll finish loading my car, and I have a cart and there was always some gentleman that's like, hey, can I take that for you? Hey, I got that. Now the guy that works at Costco, just some every day, man that just sees me with a cart, and he's like, hey, can I do it? And I'm like, oh my gosh, yes. Thank you so much. I really appreciate that. I allow myself to receive and in small ways. And then I'm grateful for it. 

Lesley Logan 45:13  

Yeah. Okay, so I feel like you may have touched on something, because one of the last questions I had for you, because my gosh, we could just I just fucking, I'm obsessed, I'm just gonna have to, like, join everything that you do, and just, you know, but I feel like there's a lot of people are probably in relationships right now. And they're not willing to give up on them. There's and, and I feel like what you just described that we could do is like, if you were feeling like your, your partner is or even a man in your life is not fully healthy, integrated masculinity. It's like, rewarding the good behaviors of the thing. Like we talked about at the very beginning of episode, but like, respecting them and letting them fit and celebrating when they win and that kind of stuff. And I so like 

Kelli Adame 46:00  

Just genuinely appreciating the stuff they do. We tend to criticize what we don't like, but we take for granted what we're getting.

Lesley Logan 46:07  

Oh, yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. That's so true. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I feel like every sitcom of the '90s was like the wife criticizing the thing that they don't like, I feel like oh I'm perfect, right there.

Kelli Adame 46:22  

Totally. But yeah, we could get into a whole tangent about that. But one of the things like working with a lot of men, and a lot of men will say to me about relationships, when they're in with women, they'll be like, I just don't feel appreciated. I don't feel like what I feel like no matter what I do, it's not fair enough. And so why is a man going to give up options for all other women to be in a relationship with a woman where he doesn't feel appreciated? And he doesn't, he feels like he can't win. Again, he wants to win with you. But he's not a woman, you have to help him know how he can win with you. So my husband will ask me, what do you need from me? It's my responsibility to figure out what would feel good to me or what could you do that could help me? And then I can respectfully ask him if he's willing to do it. And then he gets to decide it's his choice. But if he does it, I'm very grateful. And we both win. That's the dance that's so beautiful in terms of the masculine and feminine polarity. 

Lesley Logan 47:19  

Yeah. And you all have to go listen to the episode that Kelli was on before because in your Be It Action Items, there was this really great thing of like, really understanding what would make you feel good? And because then you can, you know, that takes introspection and time and experiments, and I was sharing, I was like, oh, yeah, there was a while back. I was telling my therapist years, like probably like 2020 as like, okay, so I'm really good. In the fifth gear, I'm really good when shit hits, like the fan and like, super grip on the floor falls out. But I feel like now that I like, I'm in my home, my dream home, I should probably like, get my foot off that gas pedal. And I'm like, not really sure how to do that. And she was like, well, what are some things that make you feel good? I'm like, so that's a great question. No clue. So how do I find this out? So she, like, is there a list? Like, is there a list of things like high recovery professions overachiever, and she's like, you're gonna make a list. And then every time you have this free time, you're because if for me, I needed to like, just enjoy free time. But I gave this advice. So you guys can use this for figuring out what make you feel good is like make a list when you're feeling good of all the things that can make you feel good. Don't do it when you're feeling bad, when you're feeling good. And then when you like, have no idea what to do or won't feel good. Yes, look at the list and see which one actually feels good in that moment and try it out. 

Kelli Adame 48:40  

Yeah. 100% like, open up a little note, you know, in your phone, and like start making a list. And then when you're doing something, it doesn't make you feel good. Just add it to the list. And then you have a place to choose from that I always tell women to like, again, if we were conditioned to like you and I were to be you know, good performing masculine. We don't even know I mean, I talked to him all the time. And I'm like, what makes you feel good? They're like, I don't know. I like well, what are you feeling? And then they tell me what they're thinking. I'm like, okay, but that's a thought like, how are you actually feeling? They don't really know. Because so much of the conditioning has been about being productive, being productive, being efficient. And we feel like if I'm just sitting around or I'm connected to my emotions, that's a waste of time. That's a waste of energy. And I think it'd be further from the truth. Your emotions are just as valuable as your rational thoughts. And you have to give them integration. That's you integrating your healthy masculine and feminine energy within yourself. So you want a man who's well-balanced you got to be well-balanced. That's the be it till you see it. 

Lesley Logan 49:38  

Yes. Yes. Oh my gosh, I gosh, I can keep talking to her. We'll take a quick break and then we're going to find out where people will find you, follow you, or work with you. And then if you have more Be It Action Items for us we'll take those too. 

Lesley Logan 49:49  

All right, Kelli, where do you like to hang out? Where can people work with you? I mean, like we all need like a VIP day with you.

Kelli Adame 49:58  

Yeah, oh my gosh. I love it. Well, I told you it's like really exciting time like, because I'm, I'm pivoting now to really teaching so I've created what's called the Love Bravely Academy that's launching October 23rd. So it's a transformational education, you know, experience so there's group and one on one but it's a lot of equipping and teaching, all these things that we're talking about out in a (inaudible). So you can go to lovebravelyacademy.com and then you can follow me on Instagram at Kelli Adame. So it's K-E-L-L-I-A-D-A-M-E. And I always say love bravely and expect miracles because it's worth doing the work and being brave and loving yourself and learning to love well because you get the miracles and the blessings that you take it's like taking your own hero's journey. You know what I mean? 

Lesley Logan 50:45  

I do. I love this. Okay, that will be out when the episode comes out, you guys.

Kelli Adame 50:51  

In November I'm going to launch the Love Bravely podcast. So, I'm trying. Yeah. Come follow. And I'd love to have you on at some point. It would be so fun.

Lesley Logan 51:01  

Oh my God. In already. Yes. But I love it because I want to just like I think like little nuggets of reminders because especially it's like a hot like a recovering infectious overachiever. As someone who's like raised like, do I have to constantly remind myself like, it's okay to need help right now.

Kelli Adame 51:19  

Yes. No, and this is my heart. I love working with high achieving women that are navigating the journey from single and dating to successful committed monogamous relationship and marriage. Like I want it to take you, you know, your heart's desire those but we you know, but we don't get there alone. I didn't get there alone. I'm very so I'm just trying to give everything that I've learned and integrated to as many people as I can. 

Lesley Logan 51:42  

Yeah, I mean, in. Okay. Yes. All that we'll make sure it's all in the show notes. So make sure your podcast is in there as well. But that so that we can all go listen to it? And yes, anytime you let me know, I'm there. Okay, bold, executable, intrinsic, targeted steps we can take to be it till we see it. Anything you got for us today? 

Kelli Adame 52:00  

Yeah, well, so in terms of honoring the masculine, I think that's a good place, like look at where you're maybe being critical where you're trying to teach, preach, you know, change a man and be willing to maybe not do that. And ask yourself, where can I be grateful like any place that you have men in your life that are doing something as insignificant as opening a door or doing something massive, like, tell him, thank you, and that you appreciate it and how it makes you feel. That's the next piece. Like when you do that it makes me feel loved, cherished, supported. I'm grateful. Thank you. Right? Honor that in a man. I think that's super important, I think continuing to try to do an hour a day of checking in around just feeding your feel-good time. So like, I have a new thing that I'm doing. It's called feel good Fridays. So I basically take half of Friday off, and all I do is schedule things that helped me to feel good. I get my hair blown out, I get my nails done. I go for a walk in nature I call a dear friend I haven't talked to in a long time I write a card like a heartfelt card to somebody. I do. Does that make sense? So just figure out what it is that feeds your feminine energy and protect time on your calendar to literally do that. And ask yourself, how does this make me feel when you're trying to make decisions? How do I really feel? Does it feel good to me? The answer is yes. If it doesn't feel good to me the answer bravely is no. 

Lesley Logan 53:28  

Yeah. I love it. I love it. I love your feel good Fridays. We have FYFs around here so you guys you can do your Fuck Yeah Friday, right? It's just like celebrate what you rocked, you know? And also and then go do some feel good Friday.

Kelli Adame 53:41  

Do what makes you feel good. 

Lesley Logan 53:42  

Yes. Because also like the more you do those things, the more you realize what doesn't make you feel good and it makes it easier for you to ask for those things when you need them. Like I feel like I feel like it's hard for people like I don't know what I need that that's like that's your that's your homework.

Kelli Adame 53:59  

That's the first step, that's the first step. Yeah. And I think part of that is just committing to that being consistent because you're gonna rewire the neurological pathways in your brain. So you know it's all of that but yeah, and I think so those are those are the things I think those who have this conversation make the most sense. I can give you a million but I don't (inaudible) like I'd rather give you like few that you could just really go (inaudible).

Lesley Logan 54:24  

My ladies vote take a million and like whereas as helping them become recovering perfectionist overachievers, we'll take those. We'll start there.

Kelli Adame 54:33  

That's what I say all the time. Progress not perfection. You know what I mean?

Lesley Logan 54:37  

Yes. Yes, I do. We always say perfect is boring around here. Like nobody really wants to be friends with perfect.

Kelli Adame 54:44  

Why laugh because, yeah, no, of course who wants to be with a saint? But I have a client I remember, she always tells me what happens with a lot of what we'll talk about and I'll explain something that's happening and it'll get illuminated and we'll be like, okay, great. And then I go what do I do everything is what do I do? Okay, now what do I do? I go, just be with what we just illuminated for a second. Watch the part of you that's so quick to what do I have to do just marinate in what you're learning, listen to this podcast and just take a few minutes and just take all of that in, you know? And then and then go do something. Feel good to do good, ladies. 

Lesley Logan 55:22  

Feel good to do good. You guys. I hope this is as enlightening for you as it's been for me. I've been looking forward to this interview since our last one. I'm just so excited to know you. I can't wait for our paths to cross again. Y'all, how are you going to integrate this into your life? How are you going to receive it? We want to know. Make sure you tag Kelli, tag the Be It Pod. And until next time, Be It Till You See It. 

Lesley Logan 55:46  

That's all I got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It Podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate the show and leave a review and follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to your podcast. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over at the Be It Pod on Instagram. I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us and others Be It Till You See It. Have an awesome day. 

Lesley Logan 56:14  

Be It Till You See It is a production of The Bloom Podcast Network. If you want to leave us a message or a question that we might read on another episode, you can text us at +1-310-905-5534 or send a DM on Instagram @BeItPod.

Brad Crowell 56:29  

It's written, filmed, and recorded by your host, Lesley Logan, and me, Brad Crowell.

Lesley Logan 56:34  

It is transcribed, produced and edited by the epic team at Disenyo.co.

Brad Crowell 56:38  

Our theme music is by Ali at Apex Production Music and our branding by designer and artist, Gianfranco Cioffi.

Lesley Logan 56:45  

Special thanks to Melissa Solomon for creating our visuals.

Brad Crowell 56:48  

Also to Angelina Herico for adding all of our content to our website. And finally to Meridith Root for keeping us all on point and on time.

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