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0:34

Hello to all my non-linear thinkers.

0:37

It's beautiful, anonymous, one hour, one

0:40

phone call.

0:41

No names. No

0:43

holds barred. I'd

0:48

rather go one-on-one. I

0:50

think it'll be more fun. And I'll

0:53

get to know you and

0:55

you'll get to know me.

0:58

Hi everybody, Chris Gethard here. Welcome

1:00

to Beautiful Anonymous. I know

1:02

that some people just really like the phone calls, and

1:05

I totally hear you. If you're looking to skip

1:07

ahead to the phone call, you're going to want to skip about 13

1:09

and a half minutes ahead. The intro

1:12

today deals with the idea

1:14

of chaos. And I talk a little bit about

1:17

ambulance driving and a few other things

1:19

that you'll hear along the way. But

1:21

it's about 13 minutes of my strange little

1:23

rants that we've been experimenting with.

1:26

For anybody who wants to skip that, get right to

1:28

the phone call. Skip about 13 to 14

1:30

minutes. You'll get right into it. Enjoy.

1:33

Hi everybody, Chris Gethard here. And welcome to another

1:35

episode of Beautiful Anonymous, a show

1:37

where once a week we have a phone call with

1:39

a human being. And that's the show.

1:42

That's it. We put out the phone

1:45

number and then people try to call. And I

1:47

talk to one of them and they get to let me know who

1:49

they are. They get to let me

1:51

know some of their story. How they came

1:53

to be the person they are with the views that they have.

1:55

Sometimes it's funny. Sometimes it's dark.

1:58

We never know, but that's life, right?

1:59

It's a real-life show and I'm happy about

2:02

it and I feel the

2:04

support of all the people out there. This

2:06

is week three since we've gone independent

2:09

and I know I'm going to stop ranting about it soon,

2:11

but I just feel such a connection with this fanbase.

2:13

This lovely

2:15

group of listeners has stepped up and let

2:17

me know that they have my back and I see

2:19

you out there and I hear you and

2:22

I

2:23

can't tell you how much I appreciate

2:25

you all. I don't have

2:28

many shows coming up that I need to plug. Most

2:30

of my shows are in New Jersey and they're in small

2:32

venues and they've been selling out. Thank you, my Jersey

2:34

people, for having my back. You've

2:37

always understood me and always fueled me. I will

2:39

remind everybody, if you are in Southern

2:41

California,

2:43

September 7th, as part

2:45

of my new day job, laughingtogether.org,

2:48

this is a lot of work I've been doing. I've

2:50

been building it out with a mental health nonprofit

2:52

organization to start building out some artist

2:55

involvement in the mental health space,

2:57

especially in the mental health and education space. We

3:00

have a big conference for my

3:02

parent organization, Wellness Together. As part

3:05

of it, we're doing a comedy show I'm organizing. You

3:07

can come for free. It

3:09

features me, Christy Chielo,

3:11

who if you've followed my comedy over the years, you know she's someone

3:14

I'm super close with. Aparna Nancherla,

3:17

who's just an absolute

3:19

joy. Eddie Pepitone,

3:22

who is a legend amongst comedians

3:25

and who always brings an unpredictable

3:28

chaos energy. Nicole Byer,

3:30

who brings a similar just joy, energy.

3:33

You never know where it's going to go. These are headliners.

3:36

All people who care, all people who

3:38

are ready to contribute

3:40

to this conversation. Most

3:43

of the audience will be teachers and social

3:45

workers and administrators who work really hard

3:47

for mental health in schools. You can come for

3:49

free. I mentioned this last week. I

3:51

talked to them about how we need to shrink the space because it's

3:53

at the Anaheim Convention Center, which is massive.

3:56

They said, well, to hang the curtains, it's going to cost

3:58

us $10,000. I said, no,

4:00

no, no, no, no, no, no, no, we're not spending $10,000 on

4:03

curtains. What

4:05

we'll do instead is we'll just open the floodgates

4:07

and let anyone who wants to come come. So

4:10

you can come, hang out, fill the space. You

4:12

will have a chance to donate to Laughing Together

4:14

to help our initiatives towards helping mental health

4:17

in schools. Be very kind if you did, but you don't

4:19

have to. And in particular, I

4:21

know that times are tight for people. I

4:23

know that money and disposable income, especially

4:26

if you're somebody who wants to get a babysitter or

4:28

wants to get a dinner beforehand and go

4:30

on a date. For some people, times are

4:32

tight and these are not really attainable things.

4:35

I'm going to go ahead and put it out there. I

4:37

love the idea that you're going to see a whole bunch

4:39

of people of this caliber for free. And

4:42

if you're somebody who's like, I don't really

4:44

get to go out anymore because the

4:46

money's a little tight.

4:48

This show's for you. And don't feel bashful

4:50

about that for even one second. Would love to

4:52

have you there. I mean that legitimately.

4:55

Art should not be something exclusively

4:57

for the rich.

5:00

Now I'm off on one of my tangents again. These

5:02

intros, people have been saying they've been liking me long

5:04

intros, but I have to say this.

5:08

Artists and I

5:10

say this to remind all of us starting with me.

5:15

There's a right way and a wrong way to do things.

5:18

And respecting your audience is the right way to

5:20

do things. And one of the ways you

5:22

can respect your audience is to be mindful

5:25

of the knowledge that

5:30

everyone should have access to

5:32

art. Art should not be exclusively

5:35

the domain of people with disposable income.

5:37

It's becoming more and more so the past few years, especially

5:39

in the big cities. Not a

5:42

fan. So artists, know

5:44

your ticket prices.

5:45

Find a way to do a show for free once in a

5:47

while. Find a way to do a show with your

5:50

A material for five bucks or

5:52

ten bucks. Find a way. When

5:54

I go on the road, I sit here and I do a lot of math. What's going to make it worth

5:57

it for me to leave my family to help

5:59

pay the more

5:59

help pay the bills, help pay for Cal's

6:02

preschool, and all the things we

6:04

have to pay for

6:05

while not price gouging the audience. And I sit here,

6:08

I go, I'm going on the road, I feel like people can afford 20

6:10

bucks, but artists, you gotta do the research

6:12

too.

6:13

That's 20 bucks. But

6:16

are you working through a platform that charges

6:18

convenience fees and venue

6:21

fees? Are you

6:23

telling your audience it's 20 bucks, but when they

6:25

go to check out, it's actually 35? They

6:29

hide all those fees.

6:30

And I think a lot of artists know about it and don't

6:33

care, and if that's who you are, that's fine. But I think there's

6:35

a lot of artists who would really care who don't

6:37

even realize this is happening or take the time to find

6:39

out. And it's those people who

6:41

we've all gotta start teaming up. You need to make

6:43

sure that when your show gets announced

6:46

on sale,

6:47

if you tell whoever's organizing the show,

6:49

I want people to be able to afford it for 20 bucks.

6:51

I think a college kid might have 20 bucks. I

6:53

think a lot of people have 20 bucks, and if I'm flying halfway

6:56

across the country, then you can

6:58

make money. I can make some money and I'm comfortable

7:00

with that. You need to know if it actually shows up

7:02

as 29 bucks or $32.64,

7:06

these weird numbers they come up with after all these fees

7:08

and taxes. It's on all of us to

7:10

know.

7:12

To be able to help each other and to be able

7:14

to sacrifice a little bit for the idea

7:16

of inclusivity and making

7:19

sure that access is possible.

7:22

Because I gotta tell ya, it's

7:26

kind of this weird epidemic. That

7:29

our billionaires, the billionaires in the

7:31

days past were concerning human beings, but

7:33

at least they built us train stations.

7:36

At least they built giant houses

7:39

of art, like Carnegie built Carnegie Hall.

7:42

They gave us libraries and stuff.

7:44

The billionaires now are threatening

7:47

to get in MMA fights and then they don't even follow

7:49

through and get in the MMA fight. That's

7:52

the most interesting thing they do, is threaten to

7:54

punch each other in the face.

7:56

And then they don't even do it. And...

8:01

I don't love the idea

8:03

that tickets for shows in

8:06

places like comedy and music where there should

8:08

be some ethics and ideals are getting jacked up through

8:11

the roof and only the rich people

8:13

can afford

8:15

them. And I got no problem with rich people

8:17

inherently, but I don't have a particular

8:19

interest in

8:20

dancing on stage only for the pleasure

8:23

of people with a lot of disposable

8:25

wealth. That seems weird to me. So

8:27

anyway, point being, Anaheim Convention

8:30

Center, September 7th, you

8:32

can come to this show for free. And I love that

8:34

this is a way that we can provide that

8:37

option. And if you are someone who does have disposable

8:39

income and you want to put some of that money towards

8:41

laughing together and the initiatives we're trying

8:43

to build to help mental health in schools, I'd love it.

8:46

I'd love it. I'd love it. Maybe

8:48

I'll see you there. Everybody,

8:50

the theme of this week's show is

8:53

that the world is full of chaos. And

8:55

some of us are chaotic people. And

8:57

a lot of times we spend a lot

9:00

of energy figuring out how to fit into the box,

9:02

how to make things translatable,

9:04

how to make our personalities adaptable

9:06

to a world that works by certain

9:09

standards and a certain pace. And I

9:11

don't think that

9:12

this week's caller buys into

9:15

that anymore. We talk a lot about it. You'll

9:17

hear. It's a very interesting call. I think a lot of the fans

9:19

who have been listening for a long time are going to go, this one feels

9:22

old school in a very interesting

9:24

way.

9:26

It's a little scattered up top. There's points

9:29

where I was typing, we got a shared

9:31

document where I can type to Andrea and vice versa.

9:34

And I typed to Andrea at some point, I go, I'm having a little

9:36

trouble following this part. And

9:38

then you'll hear about halfway through the call, I start

9:40

calling that out and we start exploring that. And it actually

9:43

turns into sort of philosophical discussion

9:45

about the very nature of

9:49

conversation and why it always fits

9:51

certain prototypes and how

9:53

there's a lot of aspects to life that fit these

9:55

certain standards and rules and structures. And

9:58

maybe some of us just don't play by those.

9:59

rules even in conversation and it

10:02

gets pretty damn delightful

10:04

if you ask me. And I'll just say I'm

10:06

someone who even as I've gotten older and

10:09

more standard and I live in a suburb and

10:11

I mow my lawn now and I'm largely lame,

10:14

I think a lot of my adult

10:16

life and creative life certainly has been

10:18

about

10:20

chaos is out there at

10:22

all times.

10:23

And a lot of times we're all just agreeing to pretend

10:25

it's not. And I think this call

10:27

is a good reminder that sometimes it's actually fun to

10:30

embrace the fact that it's there

10:32

and it can be useful and it can set us apart

10:34

and it can give things an energy

10:37

and a vitality that we weren't expecting even if

10:39

it makes it that we have to focus a little harder

10:42

or work a little harder in areas

10:44

of life. Chaos can be a good thing.

10:47

It's around us all the time. I know this, I've

10:49

been driving an ambulance. I've mentioned this

10:51

on the show. I volunteer to drive an ambulance.

10:54

On Tuesday nights in my town in New Jersey

10:57

and there's times, there was a time about

10:59

a month back where I got to call it 2.30, 3 o'clock in the

11:02

morning.

11:04

We get there and I will not

11:06

be able to say too many specifics because I really respect

11:09

HIPAA laws but there was someone who was in a

11:11

situation where they were fine but

11:14

there

11:14

was blood and they were

11:17

nervous. And we get there and we get to

11:19

work and we're helping them. And

11:21

I'm sitting here and I'm going, they have no idea. This

11:24

person sees me drive up in the ambulance. They go,

11:26

cool, the ambulance is here. These people know what

11:28

they're doing. And I'm sitting here in my head going,

11:31

I was watching the bear with

11:34

Hallie,

11:35

fell asleep on the couch in my underwear,

11:38

trudged off to bed at some point and then at 3

11:41

in the morning this alarm goes off

11:43

and then 12 minutes later I'm at

11:45

your house giving you comfort because you think

11:48

I'm someone who knows what I'm doing. No, I'm just another

11:50

idiot who's watching the bear

11:52

a few minutes ago and

11:54

I got out of bed and I'm so happy to help

11:56

but a lot of. lot

12:00

of this is me representing

12:02

something so you can convince yourself that

12:06

all of society is not held together by

12:09

scotch tape of bubblegum and

12:11

that we're not hanging by a thread and look the

12:13

caller the listeners of this show you guys have shown me

12:15

so much love over the years you've shown me a lot of love

12:18

but I think we'd all agree if you've been listening for a while

12:20

the idea that I'm part of the infrastructure

12:23

of a town and

12:25

that I am a person who's picking

12:27

you up in a moment of need and getting you

12:29

to a hospital and I'm part

12:31

of the bridge

12:33

that gets you there it tells you a few things right which is that life

12:35

is so much more chaotic because if these

12:37

people were to be like what do you do when you're not driving

12:39

the ambulance and I was like well I take

12:42

phone calls from people who survived bear attacks

12:45

they'd be like and you're responsible for

12:47

helping me I'd be like

12:49

yeah you wouldn't you did Alaska's

12:52

crazy you know Indiana

12:54

Jones isn't good at archaeology like

12:57

that's that's who I am so

12:59

point being there's chaos everywhere all the time

13:02

and

13:03

sometimes we learn for our own safety

13:06

and our own comfort how to shut it out

13:09

but I'm just gonna highly recommend embrace

13:11

the chaos once in a while allow it to bleed in

13:14

remind yourself that it's there learn to get

13:16

comfortable with it might be a moment of need

13:18

where being comfortable within chaos really helps

13:20

you and serves you and maybe you're someone like

13:22

today's caller who I think one of the major lessons

13:25

I took away from it because you're gonna hear there's so much

13:27

to say

13:29

in so many different directions and

13:31

so many things come up and some of them are dark and some

13:33

of them are silly and some of them are a little scattered and

13:35

some of them are focused

13:38

but I think all of them do share one common theme

13:40

which is at some point

13:43

some of us need to stop trying to

13:45

figure out where we fit and

13:47

we just need to take a deep breath and go or we

13:49

could just kind of ride this tornado

13:52

of life to wherever it chaotically

13:54

wants to toss us around and if

13:57

that leads to self-acceptance and happiness

14:00

It's a pretty good thing.

14:02

This call is a really great example of it. It's a

14:04

charming one. It's a little bit of a hard

14:06

to follow weird one at times, but we

14:09

get there. And I think a lot of

14:11

you are going to love it in a really old school

14:13

way. Thanks for listening everybody. Laughingtogether.org

14:16

if you want to know more about that show. And

14:19

again, oh, thanks to everybody in the Facebook group

14:21

who's been

14:23

getting really active lately. Thanks

14:27

so much to everybody

14:29

who's been supporting this new iteration of the show.

14:33

And thanks to everybody who followed our

14:35

new Instagram. We've got the new Instagram out

14:37

there. It's beautifulanonymouspod,

14:42

I believe. And we're posting the number not

14:44

just on X anymore,

14:47

but also in our Facebook group every time

14:49

we tape and

14:51

on our new Instagram, which is beautifulanonymouspod.

14:55

So if you want to follow any of those things, it's

14:57

a really good way to stay

14:59

connected to the community of the show. That

15:02

being said, hope everybody enjoys

15:04

and

15:05

enjoy the call.

15:11

Thank you for calling Beautiful Anonymous. A

15:13

beeping noise will indicate when you are on the

15:15

show with the host. Hi,

15:19

I think I'm maybe leaving a voicemail. I'm not quite sure.

15:22

It beeped. No, this is not a voicemail. I'm here.

15:25

Oh, you're here. Hi, Chris. Not

15:27

a voicemail. It's the real deal. Yeah. Hi,

15:30

how are you? I'm all right. How are you?

15:33

Great. I didn't expect you

15:35

to actually answer. I think that's how it kind

15:37

of goes for everybody, right? Yeah,

15:40

we just listen. Usually we

15:42

do a little more vetting,

15:43

but I'll tell you what happened. Okay. Well,

15:46

we had another caller on the line and there were all

15:48

sorts of technical difficulties. And

15:51

I'm not really sure what happened. But then we

15:53

said, all right, we got to just patch it. And if any

15:55

more come in, I guess we just got to patch them straight through.

15:58

Hence our call today.

16:01

I love it. I've had so

16:03

many weird times in which I've called. I'm surprised this is the one

16:05

I got through. I think the weirdest

16:07

one is probably answering while like jumping. Okay,

16:10

I jumped out of the shower. I was like calling while

16:13

I saw it, which is ridiculous. But this

16:15

time, no shower. Okay. Well,

16:17

I'm glad you're here. You got a good vibe. We'll figure this one

16:19

out. Thank you. Yeah.

16:24

Oh, geez. That's a compliment and a half. I'll take it. Your

16:26

audio sounds great for somebody who just randomly

16:29

got on here. Yeah,

16:31

thank you. Hold on. I got to

16:34

take a big deep breath. And

16:36

now we're back. How's your world today? What

16:40

was that? I said, how's

16:42

your world today? How's my world today?

16:44

I love how you phrase that. I'm a little stressed,

16:47

honestly, I'm a little stressed. My

16:49

son is going to a camp. And

16:52

they have an app where they post photos.

16:55

And twice this week, they have posted photos

16:57

on the app where like we get an alert of like,

16:59

hey, and usually it's cute. Here's what your kid's

17:02

up to. And it's like him running around in the gym or working

17:04

on an art project. And today was

17:06

the second time where they posted a photo and he's visibly

17:08

crying.

17:10

And he's been having a lot of anxiety, like

17:12

missing mommy on the way to camp. He's like, I really

17:14

don't want to go. I'm like, I know. And I've

17:16

asked him, like, is anyone saying anything to bother

17:18

you or doing anything to make you feel bad? Like,

17:21

is anything happening? He's like, No, I just miss mommy.

17:23

I'm like, well, that's the case. You

17:25

gotta you gotta go. And but

17:27

it's so it's like, I'm

17:29

not, I understand he's

17:31

been in this place. But more I'm just like, who's

17:35

posting the pictures and just okay

17:38

with posting pictures of him crying, like, that

17:41

feels like someone's asleep at the

17:43

wheel on some level. So I'm trying not to be a helicopter

17:45

parent. You know what I mean? I'm not trying

17:47

not to be like, hey, but I did send them a picture. I

17:50

have a message to the app today that's just like, hey, this is

17:52

the second picture where

17:54

my kids crying in the picture and you posted it

17:56

and it's

17:57

a little weird. What's going on? So

18:00

I'm trying not to be too crazy

18:02

about it. My artistic

18:05

brain is like, okay, cool. This is maybe

18:07

like their choice to show that it's okay to cry.

18:11

But at the same time, no, my heart

18:14

is breaking because I got a nephew

18:16

who is currently

18:17

struggling actually. It's

18:19

oddly enough today that I was talking to

18:21

him and he's getting

18:24

bullied by the teacher,

18:26

but

18:27

he got kind of given a really hard time

18:29

for looking out the window, right? I don't know if you remember

18:32

ever getting that, but you know, you got

18:34

to pay attention and someone with ADHD and

18:36

myself, I'm like trying to support

18:38

him, like, do not feel about about it. But

18:42

when she asked him, like, why are you looking out the window? He's

18:44

like, Oh, I put my thoughts out there. I have to pick which

18:46

one I want.

18:49

And it was like the most beautiful way they like

18:51

here thinking about it. Like he was basically just making

18:53

like an imaginary board

18:55

whiteboard in front of his, you know, the way he thought.

18:58

And

18:58

that's kind of just how his brain works. I just didn't like that someone

19:00

made him feel bad about it. Yeah,

19:03

yeah, it's a bummer. And

19:06

I'm like I said, I'm trying not to be histrionic. It's

19:09

not even that he's there and he's crying and he's upset.

19:11

Like kids are going to go through that. It's more like if

19:14

you got this thing where you take pictures and post

19:16

them over the kids, is anyone even looking at

19:18

these pictures? Because either the answer

19:21

is no, at which point that's a little weird or

19:24

it's yes, and we're okay posting.

19:28

And that's a little weird. This

19:32

is why I should work there. I'm way too analytical.

19:34

And like, I wouldn't say by no means

19:37

am I trying to be a perfectionist, but

19:39

I'm not person who like before I post on social

19:41

media, if somebody else is in the image, I want to make sure they

19:43

feel good about it and make

19:45

sure that this isn't just like

19:47

making them feel weird when they see it. You know, like,

19:49

I don't know how, how do you think your son's

19:51

going to feel about this when he sees that or if he

19:53

does? Yeah, it's all good anyway.

19:56

So I'm trying not to be crazy. I go into crazy

19:58

dad mode. The problem is I'm pretty.

19:59

chill but when I get pushed

20:02

too far then I become like

20:05

70s like Charlton Heston

20:08

like what's going on? Why are you posting

20:10

pictures of myself? Like I go from chill to crazy

20:14

way too fast. So anyway what's up with you?

20:16

How's your world?

20:18

Yeah I'm just coming out of a depressive episode.

20:21

I get to rock that bipolar too.

20:24

No it's good it was actually a relatively

20:26

short-lived one for the

20:28

length of ones I've had at the time and

20:31

oddly enough this is gonna sound weird but I actually thrive

20:33

in my depressive episodes like where

20:36

I kind of connect back with myself and like remember

20:38

or

20:39

like find the parts of me that like don't feel great

20:41

so then I can get out of it and then kind of work on that when I'm

20:44

on the other side of it.

20:45

But it was new

20:46

stuff. It was irritable

20:48

I think. I'm feeling a little bit of that too like

20:51

I started to get really not just irritable for

20:53

myself but anybody that was like treating my people poorly

20:55

I was like not today.

20:57

Yeah yeah I

21:00

have to say I love hearing you say that you have

21:02

some strategies and ways to connect with your depression.

21:04

That

21:06

sounds very positive. You strike me as someone

21:08

who has worked hard on it and I commend

21:10

you for that. Well

21:12

oddly enough that's actually a big part

21:14

of like I think when I've ever left a voicemail

21:17

or I got patched through and

21:19

talked to someone I always thought

21:21

it was like my call would be too heavy

21:25

because like one of those things you know I feel like whenever you

21:27

get through you're like alright cool what makes me stand

21:29

out? What's my thing?

21:33

But I think those I think the wildest thing

21:35

was

21:36

kind of where it all began which is back in

21:38

NYC getting my butt kicked.

21:41

You know moving from New Hampshire

21:43

to Big Loud City at 18. That

21:46

city ate me up pretty good and like just a couple

21:48

years.

21:49

And yeah

21:51

yeah it's getting some pretty gnarly but you

21:54

know content wanted for anybody but surprise surprise

21:57

I'm still here but

21:58

the first time I ever tried to go

21:59

not being here and I was kind of,

22:02

not that I wanted to die, I just didn't really

22:04

want to live either. Oddly

22:06

enough, when I didn't, I called my mom

22:09

and she was in the

22:11

process of doing the exact same thing. No

22:15

way. And my call stopped

22:17

her from viewing. So yeah, some

22:20

dark lottery numbers here. She

22:23

was living the door closed car on, tired

22:26

vibe. And ever since we've been

22:28

doing a number system,

22:30

they're kind of going through tend to

22:32

check in with each other and anything below

22:34

four is like, let's get on a phone call.

22:39

Yeah, my ride or die buddy.

22:41

But that was like a what, 14 years ago. And

22:44

I think it started with

22:46

the one guy who was overrun with like

22:48

a closet for a therapy office, like trying

22:50

to help every student for a school because

22:52

yay, underdeveloped like the

22:54

systems for mental health at the time to

22:58

let's try like every therapist I can get to. And

23:01

now I have like, I hear you talk

23:03

about how much you love your therapist and you're still working with

23:05

her, correct?

23:06

Yeah, since 2007.

23:09

That's so cool. I really wish

23:11

I could maintain the one I have now because

23:13

she's the first person to ever give it to me straight.

23:16

Like, she probably

23:18

shouldn't have said this, but she's like, I want to

23:20

be honest with you, you've been here for 10 minutes and you

23:22

think kind of an asshole, both to yourself

23:25

and a little bit to me.

23:28

I don't know if that's necessarily

23:30

like the most professional thing, but it's kind of

23:32

what I needed to hear. If

23:34

someone said that to me in session one, I'd

23:37

instantly be like, well, now we have a problem

23:39

where I'm weirdly in love.

23:42

Because that was, that's what

23:44

I need to hear almost all the time. Right?

23:49

Yeah.

23:51

I'm an improviser as well.

23:53

And we just finally got our coach and I

23:56

was like, I want her because she just called all of

23:58

us out in like the most likely Jetway

24:00

and she's like you gotta stop steamrolling

24:03

people. You have really wild ideas and they're

24:05

great We got a lot of people on the team happen too,

24:07

and I'm like, oh I need more people to just give it to me real

24:11

Yeah, this is I mean

24:13

this is heavy but it's real life I have

24:15

to ask So first of all, let me say

24:17

before anything else.

24:19

I'm really glad you're still here really glad

24:21

your mom is still here, too Sorry,

24:23

you both. Oh so much that yes. Sorry

24:26

you both went through that and

24:28

It's become a very important Part

24:32

of my life to remind

24:35

people that there's help out there and From

24:40

hotlines to therapists to

24:42

groups to online

24:45

options to Medicated

24:47

or not. There's so many ways for

24:49

help and I just want to make sure everybody listening

24:52

Here's that and I do

24:54

have to ask so

24:56

You know as as someone who has had those

24:58

thoughts myself as someone

25:01

who has Flirted with actions

25:03

myself who's on record about it. I I

25:07

Know that for me There

25:10

is a there's an omnipresent

25:12

feeling of loneliness in those moments

25:15

and I feel like a lot of people express this

25:17

that there is a This loneliness

25:20

that feels like it can drive

25:22

you over the edge, you know that it can break

25:24

you And for me anytime I've been

25:26

at my worst

25:28

that's been a factor in it,

25:30

so I Can't

25:33

imagine the intensity of

25:35

calling my mom

25:38

who it sounds like you know,

25:40

my mom is Someone

25:42

who has had to deal with a lot being

25:44

my mom over over the years But who

25:47

has also stepped up and who I

25:49

go at the end of the day

25:52

Break glass in case of emergency. I got

25:54

my mom and If I

25:56

was to be in one of those moments

25:58

and call her and realize she was in the exact same

26:00

place. I can't imagine

26:02

the feeling of there's this,

26:06

I imagine fear. There's

26:09

a immediately flipping

26:11

towards like, wait, what?

26:13

I have to protect you. And the terror

26:17

of that the heartbreak of realizing your mom is so at

26:19

the same way. But it,

26:21

there's also some element of almost

26:25

feeling like, oh,

26:27

I've been wandering through this void

26:29

alone.

26:31

But I'm not alone because you're here,

26:34

you're here too. So I also have to imagine

26:36

there might be some really mixed up feelings

26:39

of,

26:40

I don't know what you'd say gratitude, being

26:43

grateful to realize

26:45

someone else's in it, even though it's really scary

26:47

and horrible that when your closest loved ones

26:49

has felt that way too. I need you to

26:51

walk me through it all because I can't

26:53

totally imagine the complexity

26:56

of the emotions you had on that

26:58

day.

27:00

Well, at 21, I did not know myself

27:03

very well. And mom

27:05

popped into mom mode. And she did not

27:07

tell me I didn't find that out for a few weeks afterwards

27:09

that she was in that case, she just flipped gears.

27:12

She put her own feelings to the side, you know, mom's gonna be sometimes.

27:16

She's a good parental unit in the sense that like,

27:19

she just always shows up and brings her best.

27:21

But at the same time, I'm at the point

27:23

now 36. I'm trying to

27:26

make space for her on the other side of all this to just do

27:28

that for herself. Like,

27:30

I don't know, I'm in a place

27:33

now where I want people to choose themselves first and take

27:35

care of themselves first. I usually

27:37

tell people when they apologize for not being

27:39

there, I'm like, Hey, your time and space exactly that it's

27:41

yours. Like, it don't mean anything.

27:44

Even saying that to my parents this past trip,

27:46

I went home to see them after a couple years of avoiding

27:49

home to tell them that, you know, you don't

27:51

mean anything, I don't want you anything. This is like a choice

27:54

to spend time with each other and give each other our love.

27:57

And I think that means so much more. when

28:00

it's a genuine choice. So

28:05

it's been rough. Unfortunately, the rougher one was the

28:07

most recent

28:10

time when she was not quite

28:12

there, but she had a heart attack two

28:15

years ago and then when she didn't deal with it

28:17

too well, she was great.

28:19

She called me and got my sister again on a

28:21

freeway call. She was like, I'm not safe. So

28:24

she did the right thing. She called me.

28:29

That's a hard one. I know

28:32

that she's struggled with mental health pretty much her entire

28:35

life and I didn't

28:37

get it. Like she just disappeared in her room

28:39

for like two weeks and I was just like, what's with this like

28:41

impromptu vacation in a room growing

28:44

up? But it all kind of started

28:46

to make a little bit more sense, especially when I started

28:48

to feel those feelings myself. But

28:52

yeah, I was, we'll call it gnarly to say the

28:54

least. But it is,

28:57

I do have a weird gratitude that I have like a, I

28:59

guess I'll call her my suicide buddy. I

29:01

don't

29:04

know how to say it. It's, it's a, it

29:07

brought us to a new level of connection that I wasn't

29:09

really prepared for.

29:10

Yeah, that's, I

29:13

mean, everybody has parent

29:16

stuff, right? People have daddy

29:18

issues, mommy issues,

29:21

but that night will define your mommy issues.

29:23

You know,

29:25

that becomes like, it's

29:27

weird to say, but it's like, it's

29:29

like, you

29:32

got your birth and that's a time where

29:34

you and your mom are connected in a certain way. And then

29:36

not everybody gets a night like you had and

29:38

that connects you in a whole different way. And

29:41

that, that night is defining, but

29:44

I'm glad you both made it through.

29:47

I actually just had a wonderful

29:49

like fringe show that someone

29:51

also with ADHD went all about

29:54

celebrating like his journey and kind of worries

29:56

that now and ended up crying and connecting

29:59

with the fact that he just took the moment to

30:01

be like, can we all just like genuinely, you know,

30:04

just look at his person and just really tell them you're glad

30:06

they're here. It was really

30:08

beautiful. I felt

30:10

it, you know, the way he brought up his

30:13

attempts obviously broke me because it was a similar attempt.

30:18

Yeah, it's amazing what your rapid

30:20

fire brain can tell you and it's

30:22

when the hyper fixation is on the negative, it's

30:25

bringing just some pretty rough places. But yay

30:28

therapy, actually you're catching me at an interesting time. I would

30:30

say like two weeks ago, she's like, so

30:32

it's really like burdening you. I'm like, to be honest with you,

30:34

I finally just got to the point where I know I'm worthy and I'm sick

30:37

and tired of everybody not catching up.

30:45

Right? Just wake up, put your feet on

30:47

the ground. That's enough. I was

30:50

a comedian. I finally got to the point where I'm kind

30:52

of tired of being funny.

30:53

So

30:57

you got to a point that's a community where you're tired of being funny.

31:01

I almost want to stop improv forever. I've

31:03

been like, I, as much as I love my team, I'm

31:06

exhausted by the fact that I've kind of over the last

31:08

five years built a sense of like,

31:10

Oh, I found my thing. Yay. Like, you

31:13

know, chaos brain fits here. But

31:16

if you put too much of everything into just one

31:18

outlet, I wonder, I'm like, what happens when this

31:20

goes away? Yeah.

31:24

But yeah, you know, you pointed out kid

31:26

issues, yay, trauma

31:28

and growing up and trying to earn

31:30

your space through, you know, entertaining

31:33

their house guests. No joke,

31:35

actually, sometimes even making them blue Hawaiians and being

31:37

that kind of messed up, but part of the party and

31:42

just doing a song and dance, doing old Howie Mendel

31:44

routines that they loved and sounding

31:46

like a mon helium or whatever to get by to

31:48

be a

31:49

good time, but

31:51

I

31:52

don't need to be a good time. I just need to be here.

31:54

Yeah, yeah.

31:58

Yeah. I've also fun with comedy too.

32:01

I've had to redefine my relationship with it so

32:03

many times because you do sometimes get

32:05

to those moments

32:07

being a depressed person

32:09

where you're like, ooh, I'm

32:12

trying to spread joy because

32:16

of the absence of actually feeling

32:18

it. And

32:20

that's a bummer thing. Like

32:23

you said, there's a lot of song and dance going

32:26

on. And some of

32:28

this is just because I don't want to go home and go to bed

32:31

and think about how I'm feeling.

32:33

I'd rather make everybody else feel good than ever

32:35

think about how I'm feeling. So that's

32:38

I think a natural part of the cycle.

32:42

Yeah, I hit the wall of exhaustion. I'm

32:44

actually just talking, it's fine

32:46

to talk about it now, but I'm just reflecting on how

32:49

exactly it's been living on my shoulders. It's

32:51

like this need, actually this person,

32:53

I hate it. They use my analogy at the show. They

32:55

said that they always felt like they were constantly running down

32:57

a hallway with doors that never ended and

33:01

that they just kept opening doors, running into them,

33:03

thinking it was safe, and then realizing they were in the wrong room, backing

33:06

out right back to the hustle of running down the

33:08

hallway. And it's

33:10

just that level of anxiety over whether

33:13

I'm running away from the place that's

33:15

not acceptable for people or trying to

33:17

find a place that works,

33:19

that's what I'm packed up. I'm

33:24

gonna pause right there. Because

33:27

that's a heck of an analogy. And it's one of those things that

33:29

as someone who has had depression, I'm like, oh yeah, running

33:31

down an endless hallway full of limitless

33:33

doors, none of which lead to a satisfying destination.

33:36

Yeah, no, I get that. But for other people, they might

33:38

just be going, how

33:39

are you just moving on from that?

33:41

That's terrifying imagery. Well, yeah,

33:43

I mean, I've seen it in my own head too. I

33:45

know my version of that. Caller, we're

33:48

in it together. For anybody else who

33:50

was shocked by that, God bless you if

33:52

you've never had thoughts or emotions

33:54

like that. Hey, I've broken up the momentum.

33:56

Let's get some ads out of the way. We'll

33:58

be right back.

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35:09

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gonna go ahead and get back to the phone call.

36:52

It's just that level of anxiety over whether

36:55

I'm running away from the place that's

36:57

not accessible for people or trying to

36:59

find a place that works.

37:01

That's what I'm tired of. I

37:02

don't know. I'm finally

37:04

at the point where it's just like, I'm doing small things.

37:06

I'm back to doing embroidery again. Trying to

37:09

make

37:10

a new podcast

37:12

that feels fulfilling because it's connecting

37:15

with other comedians about what their relationship

37:17

is with it. And

37:19

even just like, yeah, we've been

37:22

following the mentality of Susan Messing. Don't

37:24

chase the funny, you'll never catch it. And

37:28

it's been really great to just try to stop trying to

37:30

make people laugh, but instead just encourage them

37:32

to like authentically.

37:34

Did you? Does that make sense? It

37:36

does. Totally. I hear

37:39

you. I'm also wondering, you said you're also getting

37:41

back into embroidery?

37:44

Yeah, it was my pandemic

37:47

hobby. I just picked up. I started making cool. I'll

37:51

just goofy stuff like a stoop kid

37:53

from Hey, Arnold, but now wearing a mask because

37:55

he was back to being terrified to leave his home. I just

37:59

got weird and started like something I'd never

38:01

done before and I dropped it for like a year

38:04

and now I'm back to keep my hands busy

38:06

trying

38:08

to stay sober and it's actually been

38:10

helping to keep my

38:12

mind and my hands busy.

38:15

I love that. I love that.

38:17

Yeah. Embroidery, improv,

38:23

mental health, I'm into it. And did you, you said

38:25

you saw a fringe show. Are you out in Scotland

38:27

right now?

38:29

No, I am over

38:31

in Minnesota. So they

38:33

definitely did a wild card run this

38:36

time around with a lot of heart-hitting. Like

38:38

I don't know what it is but I feel like everybody came out on the other side

38:40

of this, well first off the pandemic isn't

38:42

over, but the other side of like you know being in their

38:44

houses and going back to seeing people again

38:47

with being like what if all my art was

38:49

just like 10% funny and then like 90%

38:51

heartbreak. That

38:55

was a lot but

38:58

you know between stories about what is the hero, kind

39:01

of like oh

39:03

geez I think the funniest

39:06

one was how to do a swimming

39:08

lesson without water instead of a theater

39:10

that was actually really delightful. But yeah

39:12

people got weird with it but I ended up walking out

39:15

of it was kind of like a what is life? Like

39:17

that moment when you walk out of like a really good movie that

39:20

takes you out of the universe for a second. I'm

39:23

still having that like almost conjure up feeling

39:26

which I would imagine you understand a little bit.

39:28

It's

39:29

like now what do I do?

39:31

Yeah. So

39:35

where are you at today? I want to know where you're at. I

39:37

like it. I mean and you are sorting it out. You have ultimately

39:39

been saying that but it sounds like you're kind of in this

39:42

new transition right? Of like seems

39:44

like comedy was a thing that was really floating

39:46

your book making you feel connected to people. It seems

39:48

like maybe that is not

39:51

giving you what it used to. Embroidery

39:54

is back on the table in a way that's interesting

39:56

but I don't know if that's going to become the new

39:58

thing. I want to hear

39:59

I want to hear a little bit more. Tell

40:02

me more. So

40:04

thank you really encouraging friends. The one

40:06

who made me go around my laptop after saying

40:09

for years I wanted to do improv was

40:11

like you're signing up today. Tough love, friend. Love

40:14

him forever. I'm for doing that. He

40:16

applied the same thing years later. I just went

40:18

back to school after a 13-year gap. I

40:21

left school. It didn't go well in New York,

40:23

but I'm back at it. And

40:26

I'm finishing up a graphic design degree. I'll

40:30

be enough not really going to use it too much, but I

40:32

ended up falling in love with UX. Thank

40:36

God, before I found out how much money it costs. So

40:39

I can actually authentically love it without that

40:41

being the primary drive. But some

40:43

friends of mine have encouraged me to try to get into

40:46

making apps for other folks with cognitive disabilities.

40:48

And I didn't know you can get paid by the government to

40:51

do that. So

40:54

I want to start being more on the front end and

40:57

the need finding and the aspect

40:59

of genuinely talking to people to try to build an app

41:02

that doesn't just make you buy things constantly in advertisements,

41:05

but instead actually wants to help you.

41:07

I like that idea. I found a little bit of

41:09

purpose in that. That's feeling good. I

41:11

like that idea. Let's talk about New York

41:13

a second. That city can really, that

41:16

city can chew you up, right?

41:19

Yeah. If it wasn't the

41:22

Bubba Gump shrimp job that

41:26

broke my heart in half, it was

41:29

definitely the, oh, jeez,

41:31

we'll call it the Apple business. I'm not sure if

41:34

I've killed the statute of limitations

41:36

on that one. I don't know how long it's been. But

41:39

yeah, I didn't get the R rate position. So I was like, all right,

41:41

well, I'll call your enemy and I'll sell

41:43

apples to everybody. And I did that for 10

41:45

years. Let

41:48

that be my personality for a little while.

41:53

But yeah, I don't know. This is

41:56

going to sound really silly, but you know what Rips sticks

41:58

are?

41:59

What are?

42:02

Ripped sticks.

42:04

No, no, I don't know. They're, they're

42:06

a little skateboards with like the two, like

42:09

they just have one wheel on both ends, like

42:11

a bar in the middle and you like wiggle and they're

42:15

not probably that popular anymore, but in 2006 as an

42:17

adult, I

42:20

thought it would be good to use those to go sell

42:22

apples. And I was kind of just like ripping around the street.

42:26

And it was like a really weird person that Corky,

42:29

just live in that life. But yeah,

42:32

you become everybody's best friend until you don't

42:34

have any to offer. So I did that.

42:38

Oh, geez, constantly. I think that actually

42:40

might be part of the reason why I ended up dropping out between that

42:43

and a fault with duty being an addiction.

42:47

You know, I just started the

42:49

flat line. I don't know what, actually not cultivating

42:51

a personality. Yeah,

42:56

man, I don't know. That city is like, when

42:58

I first went, I had no sense of my identity.

43:01

You know, at this point I'm pretty open. I'm like, I'm queer, I'm non

43:03

binary. Trying to live my best life

43:06

about, well, trying

43:08

to be more authentic, more honest.

43:11

But then it was, oh, geez,

43:15

you're gonna sound really dorky. And then it was just, I

43:17

wanted to do all the things everyone told me

43:19

to do as a man, which was get lots

43:21

of women who wanted me to get a high rise apartment,

43:24

you know, make lots of cash.

43:27

And that's how I proved my worth, but I

43:30

didn't want it. It doesn't feel right.

43:33

New York, it's tough too,

43:35

because if that is the thing that you have in your head

43:38

of like, I want to go out

43:41

and be this alpha male that I'm

43:43

supposed to, and go

43:45

out and try to pick people up and try

43:47

to get a nice place and try to gather some

43:49

money up and be a little flashy

43:52

and show it off in the apartment I live, New

43:55

York's perfect for that if you want it to be. If

43:59

that's what you're looking for.

43:59

New York can send you down that road, but

44:02

if it's not who you're meant to be, it can

44:06

be a real rocky

44:08

ride chasing that stuff.

44:12

Yeah, I didn't feel right because I grew up with a jackass there and

44:14

all my friends wanted to basically be of

44:16

a phone and take up space and not consider

44:18

other people's feelings and I was a kid who was like, oh

44:20

my gosh, this is me.

44:22

What was that? Wait, wait,

44:24

wait, wait, wait. What was that? Sorry.

44:27

I turned into Mickey Mouse and or some sort of weird character,

44:29

but I was kind of was always like,

44:31

I don't know, guys, seems kind of mean. It

44:34

was like the oddball of like trying

44:36

to find morality out

44:38

of my group.

44:41

So when I went off to college, I was like, well,

44:43

what if I also just kind of leaned into being some

44:45

like callous, like everybody else

44:47

here

44:48

and put myself first in a

44:50

way that was just like,

44:52

I don't know,

44:53

screw everybody else. Just

44:56

yeah.

44:58

Oh, God, thank God I met my art

45:01

school ex-fiancee because I started hanging

45:03

out with that crew and it's a ex-

45:05

you know, kind of libertarian raised individual.

45:09

Our libertarians, you live your life, but being

45:11

from the live, free or die vibe and

45:14

kind of having that like, it was indoctrinated

45:16

into me. My art school wildcard

45:19

brought a little bit of a

45:21

well, how do I, how

45:23

do I show up for people? What

45:25

do you look like?

45:27

Maybe words matter because they have weight and they

45:29

impact our society. Like all of my,

45:31

I hate to say it, but a lot of my like

45:34

big growth came off the backbone of those

45:36

folks. I'm grateful,

45:39

but also I have a lot of sorrow that

45:41

sometimes it came at the expense of people educating

45:43

me when they probably didn't want to. But

45:46

yeah, I got my first steps there towards

45:49

a direction that actually felt authentic and

45:51

honest.

45:51

So it was the art school weirdos

45:53

that rescued you from the Wolf of Wall

45:56

Street life. Yeah,

45:58

pretty much.

45:59

that in Massachusetts. I'll

46:02

give Boston a hard time sometimes, but I

46:04

found the right community, became a spoken word poet,

46:07

started navigating my feelings, been written word

46:09

and sharing them with others and kind

46:13

of stopped apologizing for having feelings

46:15

and tried to make more space for people to not have

46:17

to do so themselves.

46:19

Wait, you did spoken word and improv?

46:23

Yeah, I gave up spoken word when I moved to

46:25

Philly because I

46:28

wanted to trade in the points for

46:30

the traumatic trauma for just

46:32

genuine laughs. I

46:35

tried to do it when I got to Philly, but I

46:37

got my ass kicked pretty hard and

46:40

got pretty defeated at a competition

46:42

and realized that I was trying to

46:44

win with pretty surface level poems.

46:48

So I don't know, just kind of realized that, well,

46:51

in the same way that I'm kind of burnt out on comedy, just didn't

46:53

serve me anymore. So I still

46:55

write, but I just don't

46:57

go up there and go, here's my heart on

46:59

the platter. Can I get a 10 please?

47:03

You said you went to Philly, you were doing spoken word competitions

47:06

in Philly?

47:08

That was in Boston. I did that for like five years.

47:10

Oh, in Boston? Yeah,

47:13

I know I'm skipping all around kind of how my

47:15

brain works. But also, I'm

47:17

a traveler, I keep

47:19

hopping to different cities.

47:21

Wait, so did you say Philly at some point or not?

47:25

I did. Yeah, actually, so before Minnesota,

47:28

I did Philly, which is pretty great.

47:30

That friend that I talked about that convinced me to, well,

47:34

basically just lean into myself. He's

47:37

when I left my ex fiance back in Boston, I moved

47:39

into a co-hop. And I met this guy

47:41

who all it took was one hot box in his closet,

47:44

and both mutual distaste for that apartment to be like,

47:46

Hey, do you want to randomly move into a place? And

47:49

then we like hit the ground running best friend style. And

47:51

after a year, he's like, I'm kind of over Boston.

47:53

I was like, me too. You want to non traditionally

47:55

move to a completely different state randomly, even

47:58

though everybody will think that's weird. And we like don't care.

48:01

And it was gonna be Seattle but last minute we're

48:03

like we got each one person in Philly let's

48:05

do that instead.

48:06

I have to tell you something

48:09

with great affection. I'm gonna

48:11

tell you something with great affection. You're

48:13

a very fascinating person and I like

48:15

your vibe and everything you're saying but

48:18

your brain doesn't work in like a linear narrative

48:21

does it? No no

48:23

no no. Yeah I didn't

48:25

realize I only got diagnosed with adult

48:27

ADHD. No it doesn't it really doesn't. No it's

48:30

all good I just have to mention at some point that

48:32

like it's funny to hear you say

48:34

like you are into improvising which is

48:36

just following things where they go and finding

48:38

it on your feet and you did spoken word

48:40

which is you know like a nonlinear

48:43

presentational

48:45

art form because even in the phone call

48:48

there's often times where I will ask a question and

48:50

the beginning of your answer will deal with the question

48:52

and then by the end we will have gone on a real

48:54

journey but it's only been 10 seconds and

48:57

it's very fun to sit back and try to

48:59

sort it out. No I'm saying it

49:01

I promise you with a lot of joy

49:04

but I also I do feel like I need to say

49:06

I bet there's a lot of listeners

49:09

right now giggling going yeah this

49:11

is not this is a lot of times people

49:13

will call this show and it will be like here is the linear

49:15

narrative that unfolds over the hour and

49:18

for you I feel like it is it is almost

49:21

in a way

49:23

like a free association

49:25

poem style call which

49:28

does tie into what it sounds like a lot of your

49:30

artistic pursuits have been in life.

49:34

It's actually pretty surprising one of the first weeks

49:36

I took a design thinking class and I just went back and then

49:39

there was a forget what his name is but you

49:41

know whatever some guy who's big and he works

49:45

like IDO why am I blanking on his name somebody

49:47

yell at me later but

49:50

he I got told by a teacher like improvisers

49:52

had a heads up right with associative thinking

49:54

because we've been doing it for a while so they're able to bring that

49:57

into human-centered design and

49:59

if this is what else is true was like a really surprising

50:02

tool that I didn't know I was building for going

50:04

back to school. But yeah, I'll

50:06

follow the associative. I don't care to go to agency. And

50:10

luckily, I've built enough support systems and friends. Like

50:14

my co host and bestie of my podcast

50:16

is like, he's that person who never shames

50:18

me for being nonlinear and

50:21

meeting that like, line, where was I supposed

50:23

to talking about?

50:25

But I

50:27

just, I just point out, I'm leaning

50:30

into myself. I have to say, even

50:32

that response

50:35

to me mentioning that you are not a totally

50:37

linear person was

50:40

in its fact, sort

50:42

of like, had a rhythmic beat

50:45

quality that did bounce around

50:47

to four or five different things within

50:49

the course of just saying, Oh, yeah, this

50:52

one's fascinating. I feel like I can just kind

50:54

of kick back

50:56

and follow your rhythms. But I don't

50:58

expect I'll go for it.

51:01

Yeah, what were you gonna say? No, I want to know

51:04

so bad.

51:06

I was just gonna say, it's so funny, because

51:08

I'm over here. And I don't know if it's the rejection

51:10

sensitivity aspect of my brain or what have you,

51:12

but I'm over here empathizing with you

51:14

being like, I wonder how Chris is doing with this? Like,

51:17

I usually walk away from all of my conversations going,

51:19

did I make their day worse? Did I just leave them with

51:21

less than what they had? How much energy bar did

51:23

I just drain from this person? So

51:26

how are you feeling?

51:31

Let's pause right there. That's awful nice. That's

51:34

just stopping and checking in with me. Not

51:37

everybody does that. That's really kind. It's

51:40

quite cool. Thank you so much, caller. Here's

51:42

how I'm doing. I'm someone who feels like

51:44

my life might be enhanced by goods or perhaps

51:47

services. Maybe they even have promo

51:49

codes attached. What a dirty

51:51

capitalist trick I just pulled. We got to do

51:53

the ads. We'll be right back.

51:58

Thanks again to all our advertisers, now

52:00

let's finish off the phone call.

52:06

I usually walk away from all of my conversations

52:08

going, did I make their day worse? Did I just leave

52:10

them with less than what they had? How much energy

52:12

bar did that just drain from this person?

52:14

So how are you feeling? No, don't be self-conscious

52:17

about it. I'm feeling great. I mean, I'm very

52:19

lucky. My job is to talk to people and

52:21

to talk to somebody who is

52:25

already laid out in a short amount of time,

52:29

embroidery, improv, spoken word,

52:32

a really terrifying night of suicidal

52:34

ideation shared with one's mother, how

52:36

that leads to a relationship where you lean

52:39

on one another, how New York can break you, how you've

52:41

also lived in Boston and Philly. And

52:44

this, I mean, that's

52:46

not even close to the sum total of things

52:48

you've managed to bring up. And

52:50

we are halfway done.

52:53

So- August, you wanna just take

52:55

some heavy breathing and just chill here together

52:57

for a little while? No, I love it. I

52:59

love the challenge. I love it. Cause

53:02

someday, like sometimes I meet past callers,

53:04

right? And sometimes they'll come up to me and they'll

53:06

very quietly say like, oh, I was the

53:08

person who blank. And they'll describe it in

53:10

one sentence. But if I ever meet you,

53:13

I think it would be almost impossible. You

53:15

know what it is? I've never, I mean, we've

53:17

been doing this almost 400 episodes. And

53:20

I can say that

53:21

this is the closest I've ever had

53:23

to a phone call that feels

53:26

like looking into a kaleidoscope. That's

53:29

what I would say the experience is.

53:32

It's just kind of like- Oh, that's not fair. I can't tell

53:34

you my name and there's a pun in there. Oh my God,

53:36

nevermind. There's a kaleidoscope

53:37

pun in your name?

53:40

Oh, it's just, you're making a pun with

53:42

them. Okay, my name is Scope. I'll just go

53:45

with that. That's a lie, but we can't, we can't,

53:47

we gotta be anonymous here. But I just love that that's

53:50

what you said. That's honestly, you just kind of filled my heart

53:52

with that. It's very accurate. Twist

53:54

me around, I'll give you a bunch of wild colors and kind

53:56

of, it's gonna be fun, but all a little

53:58

bit disorienting.

53:59

Yes, and

54:02

like really beautiful and it

54:06

always has its own logic but the logic moves

54:08

and shifts in front of you and you just sit back

54:11

and watch it. You don't try to dictate it or predict

54:13

it.

54:15

Now I got to figure out how much of that is choice.

54:20

I'm being called out this past year. Someone

54:22

had to give me positive feedback in school. They said that

54:24

I'm a good conversationalist and

54:26

I'm like,

54:27

you mean the person that's completely uncontrollably

54:29

blurting out words constantly because I can't stop

54:31

it. Keeps

54:35

things interesting. I bet you keep people on your toes

54:37

but you seem like generally pretty positive at this stage

54:39

of life. I mean, listen, anybody who deals

54:41

with bipolar and I say this as someone

54:44

who has been, had a variety of

54:46

diagnoses over my years including that

54:48

one. There's also going to be stormy days and

54:50

there's going to be days where it's difficult but you

54:53

seem like at this stage of life,

54:55

I

54:58

would have to imagine that you bring like real kind

55:00

of trickster, a real

55:03

trickster energy into the proceedings quite often

55:05

and I could see why people would like that conversational

55:08

side of you especially if they're in some environment

55:10

with you that feels boring. I feel like you're someone who

55:12

your brain cannot settle for boring or

55:15

obvious and I bet you're always shaking things

55:17

up. No, I don't do weather conversations. Yeah,

55:19

I

55:20

bet. I bet. I

55:23

bet.

55:25

I kind of start in the middle. That

55:28

kind of happens a lot where I'm kind of just like, well, I asked you

55:30

if it has your will.

55:31

I've been asking that for years because I feel like people

55:33

will give me the little bit more of an honest answer

55:37

than just, how's your day? How

55:40

are you? Because we're all equipped to give

55:42

the next sentence. You

55:45

know, fine. Okay. I'm good.

55:48

It should be

55:49

worse. You've mentioned a few of the activities

55:51

you do or arts you pursue and

55:54

practice. I don't know if you've mentioned

55:56

your profession yet. If you have, I've

55:58

forgotten it amongst the... many other

56:01

things that have been brought up.

56:03

So I actually just left yesterday.

56:06

I only gave a one week notice. I'm not used to being

56:08

that person, but I did it at a company

56:10

that's a co-op that

56:12

is full of like misfits and outcasts.

56:14

Like I think we're like 75%. Like,

56:17

I don't know, we're all like the weirdo weirdos

56:20

that got rejected from really traumatizing

56:22

jobs and tying one, cleaning people's houses.

56:26

And it actually was like,

56:29

I've worked there on and off. Like, I think this was

56:31

my third time going back. And it's

56:33

been a pain in the butt because

56:36

my back hurts, my knees hurt. That

56:38

part not so much a big fan of, but I

56:41

get to like learn like

56:43

a little bit about my environment more through being in people's

56:45

homes. I had a try to be too nosy,

56:48

but it was a really unique way to

56:50

like slow things down and

56:52

like observe humanity a little bit again. Cause

56:54

you get to do like these walkthroughs and you're like, oh, cool

56:57

book. Oh, who are you?

56:59

Like,

56:59

what am I around?

57:03

And that's been pretty, a unique

57:05

job after like mostly 15 years of

57:07

like food service. It was a hard

57:09

left. I

57:11

really liked it for what it was, but

57:14

I'm just sleeping on with physical labor. No more for me.

57:17

I'm telling you, I'm laughing so hard

57:20

and I am. What did

57:22

I say? I'm soaking in your joyous

57:24

energy. Cause a lot of people, if

57:27

I had just based on your answer, I would say

57:30

a lot of people, if I said to them, so

57:32

like, what's your profession? You'd say, oh, well

57:34

right now I'm actually joined this sort

57:37

of collection of oddball people, but

57:39

we clean houses. And that's the answer, right?

57:44

That'd be a normal answer. But your answer was probably

57:46

close to three entire minutes long. And

57:49

I loved it. And I loved it so

57:51

much. But again, again,

57:54

I would, I think

57:56

there are probably people listening who

57:58

when I said.

57:59

You are part of a collective

58:02

of oddball people that pick

58:04

up your day gig money cleaning houses that there's

58:06

people who there's Some

58:09

people listening who went wait what? Cleaning

58:11

house. I didn't even hear that in there

58:14

And I love it. I want to I want to play a

58:16

game part. Can I play a game with you?

58:20

Yeah, let's do it. I love good.

58:21

I want to ask you very simple questions

58:25

cool,

58:26

and I just want to see

58:28

if the answers can be simple and I

58:30

only want to play it though if You understand

58:33

that it's in place of playfulness and not

58:35

judgment at all because I am giggling

58:37

and loving it. Is that cool?

58:39

Yeah, no my favorite exercise and improv is to give

58:42

me my limitation was five words, so let's

58:44

do it. Okay, okay What's

58:47

two plus two? Or

58:53

Was that hard for you to just say

58:55

the number four

58:57

It actually felt comforting then I could just stop and

59:00

then I felt good about knowing the answer Okay,

59:03

okay Let's tell me every

59:07

every color in the rainbow Which

59:10

should be how dare you put me like this. I'm a queer

59:12

person. You're really gonna put me on the spot like this

59:17

No, that's pretty easy. Let's see

59:19

we got red we got blue we got green Yellow

59:23

we got purple snuck in there.

59:25

We should have put pink, but we messed up

59:27

I'm forgetting orange. Yeah,

59:29

I

59:30

think I did it. I

59:32

Love that answer and again, so really

59:35

ready because most people go with the traditional

59:37

roeigy biv Red

59:39

orange yellow green. No, I don't violate you

59:41

don't prescribe that's uh, that's a cheat

59:44

sheet that you know You're not hanging on to that cheat sheet.

59:46

We're gonna figure it out fresh every

59:48

single time We're gonna think of a rainbow. I'm gonna

59:50

say it out loud and we don't need the cheat

59:52

sheet. No. Thank you We don't we don't prescribe

59:55

to that infrastructure around here

59:59

I would love a cheat sheet. I actually that's how I got through

1:00:02

high school My mom actually taught me to cheat

1:00:04

she'd even a couple times have me stay home So

1:00:06

I can get the answers because as

1:00:09

a fellow I think ADHD er and a non-traditional

1:00:11

person who had to navigate this world through That wasn't

1:00:13

set up for them She was

1:00:15

like alright. Well if you're gonna have to do it. Let me tell you

1:00:18

Let's come up with some mnemonic devices for the answers

1:00:21

you got ahead of the test

1:00:23

That makes so much I

1:00:26

love it. Yeah, I

1:00:28

love it Can you tell me

1:00:30

I think it's working. I'm

1:00:32

loving this game Cool

1:00:37

Traditionally a lot of people say that there's three

1:00:39

branches of the federal government Can

1:00:42

you walk me through your perception of how the federal

1:00:45

government works? Oh?

1:00:47

Don't you do this to me? I don't really

1:00:49

that well right so there's really gonna

1:00:51

move back to us like

1:00:54

history class about US history social studies there's

1:00:58

Why am I thinking why am I gonna say legislative?

1:01:00

I'm gonna sound like that's one of mine now. That's one of

1:01:03

them. That's

1:01:03

good

1:01:04

cool Then there's the

1:01:07

ridiculous thing where we got like 10 people. They're supposed

1:01:09

to speak for everybody right or is that legislative?

1:01:12

What 10 people do you

1:01:15

judicial judicial judicial

1:01:17

nailed it yes? Boom,

1:01:20

I love it when I can peek into the back parts of my

1:01:22

brain. You said there's a third one I'm

1:01:25

gonna say world domination. I don't know what are we trying to do over

1:01:27

here? Executive

1:01:29

which is the world domination one? Yeah,

1:01:34

I don't have executive functioning so why would I actually

1:01:36

remember that word? Oh

1:01:41

Man, I'm being brought back to my days

1:01:43

not even as an improviser, but as an improv teacher

1:01:46

Where I can say I already can tell

1:01:49

You would have been one of my favorite students

1:01:51

in the class if I taught you and

1:01:54

I would be constantly trying to figure

1:01:56

out

1:01:57

How to get it where other people could?

1:02:01

plug into your reality

1:02:03

and to see how you could meet them in the middle on that. I

1:02:05

can feel it. And that's a beautiful thing. I'd

1:02:07

also have a lot of heart for you.

1:02:09

You got to reign this person in on a one on one class.

1:02:12

Yikes. I

1:02:14

actually, it's funny. We, my team,

1:02:17

we started as 10. Now we're down to six. And

1:02:20

with the coach that we're getting, they were like pointing

1:02:22

out to like, all right, cool. Like, so what matters

1:02:24

is your energy. I'm like, Oh no, we got rid of those people. They're gotten. You

1:02:27

can only have one of us on the team. Like, it's

1:02:30

just, I know my place. Like I don't even, I have people

1:02:32

that have had a major conflict with them. And I really

1:02:35

sit with it. I'm like, Oh, because you could be

1:02:37

my sibling. You could be my twin. That's why we're

1:02:39

fighting. We don't like ourselves a little bit right

1:02:41

now. And that's why we're fighting.

1:02:45

I love it. The world needs

1:02:47

people like you. The world needs people like you who

1:02:49

vibrate

1:02:51

with some static

1:02:53

that

1:02:55

doesn't fit into other people's

1:02:59

regular perception. I

1:03:01

know that was a very hippie dippy thing that I just said,

1:03:04

but I love it. Did you not hear

1:03:07

half the stuff I've said on this? Like,

1:03:10

no, I'm right there with you. Finally,

1:03:14

I found my people. I would

1:03:16

say I probably have about five people

1:03:18

that I genuinely trust.

1:03:20

And I feel like I'm allowed to exist around and

1:03:22

not even that I'm allowed to exist around, but I'm allowed wanted.

1:03:25

I

1:03:26

don't even have to feel like

1:03:28

it's a problem. I'm just home.

1:03:30

And

1:03:32

they're down with the beautiful chaos.

1:03:36

The beautiful chaos. We could all use a

1:03:38

little bit more of that in our life. Life is so

1:03:40

much structure now. So

1:03:43

much structure. Starting

1:03:45

with childhood experiences for kids

1:03:47

now and work experiences

1:03:49

for people and

1:03:51

checking in on apps all

1:03:53

the time and being able

1:03:55

to have our phone know the location

1:03:58

of our home. our loved ones

1:04:00

phones and vice versa everything is order

1:04:03

and structure and you're

1:04:05

a little bit of that chaos energy you're a chaos

1:04:08

bring her in a in a non-malicious

1:04:10

way and I think that's really necessary to have

1:04:12

in life. Thanks

1:04:15

Chris. You're saying a lot of stuff

1:04:17

that I'm like just trying to really take and

1:04:19

like receive. I'll

1:04:21

give myself a C-minus right now but

1:04:24

like that one hit so I'll give myself at least

1:04:26

an A-minus on that one.

1:04:32

I'm just gonna ask. I almost cried. I'm

1:04:35

sorry that you almost cried. C-minus or A-minus

1:04:37

in relation to what specifically?

1:04:41

Being the ability to take a compliment

1:04:43

to take someone's like

1:04:45

like I don't want to say approval

1:04:47

but like you're messing

1:04:50

you're down with this like like

1:04:52

yeah not even to stand with it but you're like you're

1:04:54

gassing it up you're saying keep doing this this is

1:04:56

good and to

1:04:59

have a voice that's constantly is like is this too

1:05:01

much is this okay

1:05:03

I'm like filling my world

1:05:05

right now with a lot of people who are like no you're

1:05:07

good and I guess also with

1:05:10

Chris Chris Gethard who is also hopping

1:05:12

on that team so thanks.

1:05:13

Well you know there's

1:05:17

certainly situations in life where I've had

1:05:19

to learn how to rein it in and learn

1:05:21

how to find stability

1:05:24

and I'm

1:05:26

aware of that and I've worked hard at it but I

1:05:28

would also argue that there's a lot of situations

1:05:31

where from a young age

1:05:35

people are just told okay

1:05:38

there's gonna be a box and you're gonna fit into it

1:05:40

figure out what your box is pick the box go

1:05:42

figure out how to fit into it and

1:05:45

there's a lot of people who

1:05:48

I just think will never successfully do

1:05:50

that and those people are sometimes sometimes

1:05:53

wind up living sort of quiet

1:05:56

sad lives or wind up

1:05:58

living chaotic lives. So

1:06:02

I even

1:06:04

as I've gotten sort of older and more

1:06:07

lame and more boring on personally and

1:06:10

now I'm just like a guy who lives in the suburbs

1:06:12

and works on my lawn a lot I will say

1:06:14

I always root for the people who

1:06:16

are aware of oh no you're gonna drive

1:06:18

me crazy if you try to fit me in one of those boxes.

1:06:21

So I'm just not gonna work with that system.

1:06:24

I'm just gonna

1:06:25

I'm just gonna find the counterculture

1:06:29

and the music and the art and

1:06:32

the the things that offer

1:06:34

safe harbor for people like me to

1:06:38

exist without the whole box idealology

1:06:41

like that's that's

1:06:44

something that I always root for and appreciate

1:06:47

when I see it. I'm

1:06:50

gonna give a little bit more love to that roommate. One

1:06:54

of the first things he did for me that made me feel good was

1:06:57

I was stressing out about how I've always been like

1:06:59

clothes messy not like food messy in my room but clothes

1:07:02

everywhere

1:07:02

and I was having a hard time about it and feeling really silly

1:07:04

and

1:07:06

it's like well you don't like doing laundry that often

1:07:09

just get a second hamper and

1:07:11

it changed the game. I was like what

1:07:13

people don't have two hampers that's insane.

1:07:16

But now I got two hampers and it's

1:07:19

fine. That's

1:07:22

a metaphor but basically that's what I'm trying to do out here.

1:07:25

That's a whole metaphor for life right? Some

1:07:28

people figure out how to do laundry at

1:07:30

the rhythm that's expected. Other

1:07:32

people just need a second hamper. I think

1:07:34

there's an actual legitimate life lesson

1:07:37

in there for all of us of

1:07:39

some of the people we meet in this world don't

1:07:42

tell them why waste your breath

1:07:44

yelling to do laundry. Just convince

1:07:46

them to just throw it in another hamper and

1:07:48

if that feels to you like the problem only gets

1:07:51

twice as big that's

1:07:52

okay. They'll

1:07:55

sort it out. They're a two hamper person.

1:07:57

You don't live in a two hamper world. You don't

1:07:59

need to understand.

1:07:59

Understand it To

1:08:03

understand someone else's will for a second

1:08:06

hamper just let them live with the second hamper Or

1:08:10

also at a certain point then just have to buy more

1:08:13

socks and underwear But yeah, that's

1:08:15

also the second part of it I think that the most

1:08:17

one was I knew I was really depressed when I ended up wearing

1:08:19

a bathing suit as underwear last week You

1:08:22

were it as underwear with pants over it because

1:08:24

I've done underwear I've done a bathing suit where I go the

1:08:26

bathing suit has built an underwear So I guess I'm wearing a bathing

1:08:29

suit today. I've never yeah Oh, yeah

1:08:31

No

1:08:32

Do you did you wear pants over it because now this

1:08:34

is creating a logic flaw my my work Oh because then

1:08:36

I would feel like I had on Underwear

1:08:39

shorts and pants which would probably

1:08:41

drive me past the brink. Oh

1:08:44

With sensibility issues that I have I

1:08:47

did it and I hated it all day and it was yes with

1:08:49

pants over it And it does have that like netting

1:08:51

so it was like all right. I'm basically wearing underwear and shorts and

1:08:54

pants This is insane and all

1:08:56

day out and about I'm like

1:08:57

They know people know They

1:09:00

must know I've

1:09:03

been there People know

1:09:05

that I have slightly different shades of sock

1:09:08

that one sock is like gray and one stock

1:09:10

is darker gray

1:09:11

Guess what?

1:09:15

They both lost their mate in the laundry process

1:09:18

I can't find them convinced myself This

1:09:20

was better than dirty socks. So I'm wearing clean

1:09:22

socks, but they know that I have slightly

1:09:25

different shades of sock That

1:09:27

is the type of thing that would make me unable to

1:09:29

function for an entire day

1:09:32

It's funny actually my improv team has complimented

1:09:35

me on like

1:09:38

Like having this match stock like I am

1:09:40

also there like right now my current

1:09:42

Sock selection is pretty

1:09:44

rough. So I was like screw it. Everyone's got

1:09:47

every one of these pairs It's that's down to one So looks

1:09:49

like it's gonna be peaches on this and then avocados

1:09:52

on the other and we're just gonna live today You

1:09:55

don't fit in any of the boxes anymore you

1:09:57

join a renegade house cleaning service you

1:09:59

live

1:09:59

in collectives

1:10:02

and bounce from city to city, even

1:10:05

in issues that are less facetious. You're

1:10:07

non-binary. It feels like you are

1:10:10

someone that has... That's what I'm learning from

1:10:12

this call,

1:10:13

is even in conversation style,

1:10:15

you're like, ah, I'm

1:10:18

not going to bother trying to fit into the standards.

1:10:20

I'm not going to bother. Who cares? Like,

1:10:23

you're not someone who looks at a coloring book and goes,

1:10:25

cool, those are the lines where I'm supposed to draw. You're

1:10:27

someone who looks at a coloring book and goes, oh, these are

1:10:30

interesting suggestions they made.

1:10:33

Well, you got

1:10:35

to call me out so clearly. I'm not kidding. I

1:10:37

actually have a coloring book that does actually do exactly

1:10:39

that. And like chaos with like oil pastels and

1:10:42

it got real dirty. It's messed up in there.

1:10:44

It's a coloring book designed

1:10:46

for chaos?

1:10:49

I mean, I don't, I think they were literally,

1:10:51

I mean, originally, I don't think we designed them for kids.

1:10:54

I think that's one of their primary personalities

1:10:57

pretty early is just like, well, I guess I got to keep

1:10:59

tabs on this like wildcard running

1:11:02

around and trying to, you know, the objective that

1:11:04

I would imagine as a parent's like, just don't let your kid

1:11:07

die. It's like a major part of parents from

1:11:10

all the wild stuff that's out here. But

1:11:12

yeah, instead, give them a coloring book. And

1:11:15

I don't know, are there parents who yell at their kids for

1:11:17

not coloring in the lines? I hope not anymore.

1:11:20

I don't think they would yell at them,

1:11:22

but I think there's still parents who might look at it and go,

1:11:24

oh, you did that wrong. I

1:11:28

think you are an example of someone where it's like,

1:11:31

by whose standard, what's

1:11:33

the metric by which we're measuring that? Because

1:11:37

there's always an argument to be made.

1:11:39

It's my theory on you, my friend.

1:11:43

Yeah, I don't think I'm ever going to meet that metric. I'm

1:11:46

just at like, I would say 25% of me

1:11:48

is still lingering on trying.

1:11:51

So close to the precipice of graduating

1:11:53

that I'm kind of nervous that

1:11:55

I'm going to have to put myself back in that

1:11:57

box, especially as like a queer.

1:11:59

non-binary person who is actively avoiding taking

1:12:02

any hormone replacement because I just right

1:12:04

now, especially just I don't have it in me to

1:12:07

literally put myself at a disadvantage right

1:12:10

off the get-go into trying to have a professional

1:12:12

career.

1:12:14

I'm afraid I'm kind of hopping back in the box a little

1:12:16

bit. I'm trying to keep that down. I'm

1:12:18

trying to keep it to a 25. It's not even diminished

1:12:20

that a little lower, but more

1:12:23

people out here are telling me like, start

1:12:25

a collective, get a bunch of weirdos. You have

1:12:27

your own design company. Why would you care? Yeah.

1:12:31

And can I ask how old you are? You may have

1:12:33

mentioned, but I don't know how old you are these days. I

1:12:36

am 36. I just had my birthday this

1:12:39

summer. 36, right? So

1:12:41

it is, it's hitting that age. That's an interesting

1:12:44

stretch of life for a lot of

1:12:46

us. Because I know that for me, I had

1:12:48

a lot going on. That

1:12:51

was the year I launched this show.

1:12:53

And there was all these scattered

1:12:55

things I was trying to keep track of and that I was

1:12:57

kind of, you know, let me go try this

1:12:59

for a while and also be working on this and this

1:13:01

and that and all that. But that is the age

1:13:04

where you start to realize like, how

1:13:06

would I phrase it? That 36

1:13:13

is an age where you

1:13:16

can still live youthfully and young,

1:13:18

but where you know that

1:13:20

you're not a kid anymore. The people around you know

1:13:22

you're not a kid anymore. And you're aware of that, nor would

1:13:24

you want to be. And when people hang on to that

1:13:26

notion, it can be very sad.

1:13:29

But

1:13:33

they're artificial

1:13:35

or not, it does feel like there is

1:13:39

some Rubicon that

1:13:41

happens around that age where you are deciding

1:13:47

which direction you're ultimately going to go and where

1:13:50

it feels like there will be some finality

1:13:52

to it. Some of that's real,

1:13:54

some of that's not. But it is an age where

1:13:56

it starts to feel like, okay,

1:13:59

am I ever going to be that person who settles down

1:14:01

because I haven't been yet. It feels

1:14:03

like if it doesn't happen soon I wonder if I'm just

1:14:05

not going to be one of those types of people. And

1:14:08

if I do, am I going to be okay

1:14:10

with that? How's that going to happen when I consider

1:14:12

that my values aren't the traditional,

1:14:16

that my thought patterns don't match the standard?

1:14:19

So it is that's an age that I remember very much

1:14:24

trying to sort out my version of some of these feelings.

1:14:27

Although it sounds like

1:14:29

very different paths were walked. I do remember

1:14:31

that age stressing me out is the short

1:14:33

version of what I'm trying to say.

1:14:36

No, I hear you. When 35 was like this comfortable,

1:14:38

like, all right, I'm only halfway through my

1:14:40

30s. That's when I started my pun

1:14:43

joke about like, yeah, I'm pushing 30 the other way

1:14:45

because all my friends are happy in their 40s. And by that

1:14:47

I mean they're kind of in a place where they're like, why

1:14:49

am I apologizing? Or why

1:14:51

do I have to spend time explaining myself to

1:14:54

this person? I'm just going to walk over here and do my own thing. That

1:14:56

it's just like I have this envy about it. And I'm so

1:14:58

close, I feel like on the precipice of

1:15:01

just existing

1:15:03

as an unapologetic energy out here in this world.

1:15:06

I just want to keep getting in that direction. I

1:15:09

don't think it's a destination. I know it's not linear, just

1:15:11

like me. And

1:15:12

it's going to be always a constant state of checking

1:15:14

in and trying to balance myself out and just

1:15:17

be okay. But it

1:15:19

just sounds like a nicer way to live. I'm

1:15:21

trying to get there. I

1:15:23

love that an unapologetic

1:15:25

energy.

1:15:27

It's a really good thing to try to get to. I

1:15:33

like it. How do we

1:15:35

do it? How do we do it? What's the

1:15:37

trick, everybody? What's the one or

1:15:40

two things? Because honestly, as someone,

1:15:43

again, with ADHD, I thought I can accomplish

1:15:46

one or two things at a time. You give me more than that, it's going to be a nightmare.

1:15:49

I love that. Knowing that the feedback

1:15:52

has an actual prompt that to any listeners,

1:15:55

how did you get to the place where you stopped

1:15:57

apologizing? I've

1:16:00

totally gotten there on my best days I have

1:16:02

and then I fall right back into it I'd

1:16:06

be really interested to you people who

1:16:08

go here's how I stopped apologize. I think here's how

1:16:10

I stopped the self-doubt from dominating here's

1:16:12

how I stopped questioning

1:16:14

and just Became comfortable

1:16:17

with the the idea of

1:16:21

Acceptance of myself and

1:16:24

in a total sense Oh

1:16:29

That's gonna be weird to sit with right when

1:16:32

well, you don't have the thing to grasp like the negativity

1:16:35

aspect so easily like

1:16:37

I like to I like to station a lot How

1:16:39

good is this gonna be fun like a station a lot have everything

1:16:42

I need right next to me whenever I'm working on something But

1:16:45

a lot of times the thing I can grab is

1:16:47

pretty not great for me I

1:16:50

like I'm trying to get to the place where like that

1:16:52

negativity and the Comfort

1:16:54

of just being so self-deprecating is like

1:16:57

harder. It's like in the other room like I would have

1:16:59

to get up to go get it

1:17:02

Cuz I might be convincing enough for me to

1:17:04

be like, yeah, it's not worth it. Don't go get that right

1:17:06

now

1:17:07

Yes,

1:17:12

it might be a metaphor for the weed I'm missing

1:17:14

so much for this last week Did

1:17:19

you see the weed you said the weed?

1:17:21

Yeah, I'm after 15 years of

1:17:23

trying to pretend like I didn't have an addictive relationship

1:17:25

with it I'm trying to take the reins And

1:17:29

I know it's healthy mindset

1:17:31

and good for some folks, but

1:17:34

I've been using it specifically to just give

1:17:36

myself permission to Well,

1:17:38

I guess veg out and play online Dominion

1:17:41

until I pass out I Just

1:17:44

not think about anything at all. So

1:17:46

this past week has been

1:17:48

me sitting with

1:17:50

The thoughts that have been trying to catch up with me

1:17:52

and it's a lot So

1:17:56

I'm a little scattered

1:17:58

For you with less

1:18:00

than two minutes left to just sum it up by going, I'm

1:18:03

a little scattered is really

1:18:05

a beautiful button to

1:18:07

put on things. I mean, I'm glad that you're clear

1:18:09

headed. I'm glad that you saw that it was a

1:18:12

relationship that wasn't the healthiest, you

1:18:14

know, to get as high as you can

1:18:16

and just play video games until you finally pass

1:18:19

out and go to sleep. It's fun,

1:18:21

but also it's good to notice if

1:18:23

it's starting to feel like a coping mechanism or

1:18:26

a way to dodge having some honest conversations.

1:18:28

So I'm glad you're getting there.

1:18:31

It's coming with help. Yesterday I called someone and said,

1:18:34

hey, could you do me a favor? Can you just listen to the five

1:18:36

reasons? I did improv again. These are

1:18:38

five things. I was like, here are five reasons

1:18:40

why I don't need to go pick up weed right now. And

1:18:42

that was enough to get me to, all right, cool. I'm

1:18:45

just gonna come home now.

1:18:46

All right. All

1:18:48

right. And is this something you're hoping sticks

1:18:51

permanently or is it just, I need a break

1:18:53

to kind of see what this relationship is

1:18:55

and then I can maybe redefine it?

1:18:58

I think it's the latter. I forgot the exact term

1:19:01

that we used, right? When it's like, I've

1:19:03

had this high pressure and shame at Ralph.

1:19:05

I was like, this is the time I'm gonna quit and I'm never gonna do

1:19:07

it again. And then you fall short

1:19:10

two days later, two months later, whatever it is, it's

1:19:12

like an opportunity to beat yourself up. But at this

1:19:14

point I'm like, yeah, how do I, I

1:19:16

don't understand why. If I can understand the why,

1:19:19

then maybe I can actually look at it as, I

1:19:22

do like the permission to let my body relax.

1:19:24

I like the physical when I find the right stuff that

1:19:27

makes me well, especially as a trans person, not

1:19:29

feel so upset existing in my body. And

1:19:31

it helps for that, but it's the part where it knocks

1:19:33

you out in the brain part that I wanna get rid of. But

1:19:37

I'm a little bit hesitant to do the body stuff too,

1:19:39

because it's just gonna make me

1:19:41

want to reach for the easy solution

1:19:43

too. So I think I'm just gonna stay

1:19:46

away from it for a while until

1:19:48

it's a

1:19:51

little bit more structural here before I

1:19:54

allow that back into my world.

1:19:56

Well, that's our 60 minutes and

1:19:59

I have to. Thank you for

1:20:01

taking us in so many different directions. There's

1:20:04

obviously so many other things we could have spoken about,

1:20:07

but it was really,

1:20:09

really fun to strap in and

1:20:11

follow the momentum wherever it went. And

1:20:14

thank you for creating such a fascinating

1:20:16

momentum and such an unpredictable momentum that

1:20:19

led us into so many different things.

1:20:22

First, thanks for riding the rollercoaster. Um,

1:20:25

I, I always appreciate it. Pop

1:20:28

along and go with me and I don't have to feel, uh,

1:20:30

well, I only felt guilty about it for the, what, the first 15, 20 minutes.

1:20:33

Um, so

1:20:35

thanks for getting, you know, on and out,

1:20:38

you know, just, well, thank you for listening. Uh,

1:20:40

you know, that's literally what you do. And

1:20:43

I'm sure everybody that's ever left the call has

1:20:45

that immediate feeling of just, I feel

1:20:47

heard and it's really nice. Call

1:20:51

her.

1:20:54

Thank you so much for

1:20:56

sharing of yourself, for being curious

1:20:58

about my world, for letting us go in so many

1:21:01

different directions, some of them dark, some

1:21:03

of them light. Can't thank you enough. Really

1:21:06

means the world. I have to thank

1:21:09

our producer, Andrea Quinn. I have

1:21:11

to thank Shell Shag for providing our

1:21:13

theme music. If you want to know more about me, including

1:21:16

my live touring dates, chrisgeff.com.

1:21:19

And Hey, if you like the show, please

1:21:21

hit that button that says subscribe, favorite,

1:21:24

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1:21:24

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1:21:26

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1:21:33

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1:21:36

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