0:01

we have 200 cases in are caseload

0:03

and any day, 10 cases could

0:05

be on counter and you set

0:07

the a half all of them

0:12

certainly

0:12

in the days when i was a child court

0:14

judge, i love those days of really

0:17

moving cases

0:17

through his to really

0:19

to connect with you

0:37

and hamada were in the business of

0:39

driving to have it and it's safe to say

0:41

freedom spot to make people happy

0:44

yep curve on a will give you a real offer

0:46

on your car in minutes then

0:49

come on and will pick it up and pay you

0:51

on the spot the carbonic has purchased over

0:53

a million cars happiness

1:07

hello welcome the best case worse case this

1:09

is jim clemente retarded be a profiler for

1:11

a new york city prosecutor writer producer of

1:13

cbs is criminal my dad still with criminal

1:16

minds on the new season sixteen

1:18

on power mouth plus de

1:20

france he couldn't be here today unfortunately

1:23

is really unfortunate well yes of course

1:26

it is but we do have

1:28

a very special gas and special great friend

1:30

of mine

1:32

barbara be hill

1:34

seafood them nice to see you

1:36

too can you tell our listeners and

1:38

viewers little bit about yourself

1:40

what yourself do and where now

1:43

sure i think you jam on get

1:45

to see you today and it's it's great

1:47

to to be here with you ah

1:50

, live in in santa fe new mexico

1:53

i am born and raised in new mexico

1:56

and and desert rat as

1:58

as you may say

1:59

i envy you

2:02

out near the water in los angeles

2:04

which is a beautiful wonderful

2:06

mattress we gotta you

2:08

know this from this is a serious

2:11

eat with this week

2:13

oh my goodness yes well

2:16

i live in santa fe new mexico as a sad

2:18

and i am the current

2:21

cabinet secretary of children

2:23

youth and families department which

2:26

is the child welfare system for

2:28

new mexico and , been

2:30

in this job for about a year

2:33

year retired from the new mexico's

2:35

supreme court where i was a

2:37

justice on the new mexico

2:39

supreme court for about nine and

2:41

a half a ah

2:44

served as chief justice of the court

2:46

as well as a an as justice

2:50

and before that actually was the

2:52

trial court judge of in

2:54

family court in juvenile

2:56

court for about a court years

2:58

so thin on the bed

3:01

i was on the bench for gosh

3:03

i guess it would have been about twenty two

3:05

years announce

3:07

my retirement last june

3:09

well that's it's as if you think

3:12

goes the time you spent on the

3:14

benches the same time i spent as

3:16

an f b i agent and twenty

3:18

two years and before that i

3:21

was i was in family court and

3:23

new york and prosecuting then

3:25

should grow up and or cases so

3:28

it was it was interesting

3:30

and so we had somewhat parallel

3:32

careers are in that i did and

3:35

focusing on crimes against children

3:38

child abductions and of course

3:40

my of be i career ah bowl

3:42

get into that a little later though

3:45

the

3:48

story that you have to tell today ah

3:51

at what point in your career the

3:53

sucker

3:54

it was at the end of my judicial career

3:56

would that's you know that i was

3:59

asked to

3:59

there are at all the cabinet secretary

4:02

about was last year oh how

4:05

are you what we're doing when you

4:07

got the call hundred

4:08

he was interesting i was

4:10

actually out my home in santa fe and

4:14

gov michelle and on grisham

4:16

com

4:17

me

4:18

okay i thought she was

4:20

going to ask me my

4:22

opinion or advise on the

4:24

appointment of my successor

4:27

on the footprint court and the conversation

4:30

was entirely diff

4:31

my grandma and i had thought it

4:34

was always so what was the conversation

4:37

hundred station was the adjusted

4:40

you know it would be of

4:42

you know he would be great

4:45

if you would consider surveying

4:47

in my cabinets ah in

4:49

this important position and and

4:52

she was she was and

4:54

convincing as could be ah

4:57

and

4:57

she's a she's

4:59

the a person who solves problems

5:02

works on issues of

5:04

, the better met him have so many

5:06

for the greater good and so so

5:09

i i responded by saying

5:12

i'd like to just did that with my husband

5:14

for and think about it over a day or so

5:16

and did so and so ,

5:19

so

5:21

you are getting ready to retire you thought

5:23

this was gonna be a sort of that by

5:25

call and thank you for your service

5:28

and you know ah

5:30

who do you think i should have a point in your

5:32

place that

5:35

maverick

5:36

the are you know how how did you

5:38

feel about that

5:39

well i was in shock quite

5:42

frankly you know i wish that i

5:44

love child welfare work

5:47

or child advocacy work and i was really

5:49

thinking about

5:51

i've served on the judiciary and now i'm

5:53

ready to be an advocate for kids

5:55

i'm ready to do something different more

5:58

on the frontlines of

5:59

wag

6:01

and when she called i didn't

6:03

it would be a did

6:05

you know little with

6:07

the very top of the front lines

6:10

and as about it wouldn't be right

6:13

that amazing so

6:15

although it is it is amazing

6:17

and his

6:18

obviously

6:20

it very neatly with your

6:23

your past you know your experience

6:25

the professional experience isn't

6:29

it though a very difficult

6:31

position did you consider that are all

6:34

hi

6:35

then at

6:37

the time realise how

6:40

difficult this job really is

6:42

in the you know

6:44

in many ways i knew it was going to

6:46

be difficult because

6:48

any child welfare system as we know

6:51

it has its challenges

6:54

ah that coming into

6:56

the job and and you have to understand

6:58

coming from the

6:59

the sherry

7:01

then coming into this role

7:03

is like

7:04

night and day will tell us about this

7:06

is like being in the judiciary

7:08

especially as a very top of the judiciary

7:11

i'm not mistaken

7:13

right that's my it's like

7:15

you're very quiet in

7:18

my workplace was in my workplace

7:20

my chambers it was

7:22

all very cerebral you know

7:24

intellectual time for reading

7:27

and contemplating the law course

7:29

you have a staff that serves

7:31

your your

7:32

needs

7:34

in writing and analyzing

7:36

cases you study legal

7:39

issues so it was very

7:41

quiet environment very

7:44

intellectual that

7:46

is not my job today

7:47

it really hits the my were one

7:49

more question before you go on

7:52

a you current job so the the staff

7:54

are you talking about would those be law clerks

7:56

we as big people like that

7:59

that would be young lawyers where

8:01

where there's no doubt see describe

8:03

what their job is

8:05

so there are jobs are to

8:08

research and helpful bright opinions

8:11

that you are assigned in with

8:14

that here you know the case

8:16

before you so each justice is

8:19

a flying the urge to write the opinion

8:21

of the courts the majority the

8:23

opinion of the court and so the

8:25

law clerks help you do that same

8:27

fate dirty

8:29

underlying research you

8:32

discuss the case with them as

8:34

adjust his you debate the case

8:37

and and then you proceed to write a

8:39

opinion what they're employed

8:41

in there

8:43

it just ends and and vice versa

8:45

so it's three

8:47

they just got a law school so they probably have

8:49

the cutting edge knowledge of the

8:51

new cases that have come down and so far

8:54

like get the bright ones don't you

8:56

you get the top of the class of

9:00

law school class in class

9:03

standing class standing

9:05

are bright

9:06

the advocated hardworking lawyers

9:09

and what i love about

9:11

the law clerks that i had in my chambers

9:14

is that i challenge them to think

9:17

outside the box and she really

9:21

think about resolving she says

9:23

in in the way that fair generation

9:26

and she will look at justice

9:29

men and and

9:31

and assisting me in that way

9:34

with their

9:35

younger perspective if you know what i mean

9:37

that's awesome and just there's

9:39

been a lot of talk lately obviously for

9:41

some good reasons i suppose of

9:44

about the supreme court a united states

9:46

the of nine justices their how many justices

9:48

did you have on your

9:50

we have five in new

9:52

mexico i was fortunate to

9:54

serve on the court said

9:56

have the first female majority

9:59

london because supreme court

10:01

the we actually had three

10:04

female justices for the first time

10:06

in the history of the state of new mexico

10:09

amo , court about was

10:11

an honor and

10:13

yeah it's and it's it's to say

10:15

that to the extent

10:17

the power chords are supreme

10:20

court state and federal

10:22

for that matter have

10:25

a diversity the people

10:27

who on the court i think we have better

10:30

opinions and better interpretation

10:32

for law because each

10:34

of those people bring a different perspective

10:37

of their background there bringing

10:40

their perspective on life

10:42

and that matters

10:44

well it's interesting because

10:47

there's been a a a fair amount of

10:49

talk recently about the the

10:51

number of justices on the

10:53

federal the us supreme court and

10:57

i'm not mistaken it was it

10:59

it had been by

11:01

a before and then it went to nine

11:05

that true i think it's

11:06

nine for a while

11:09

on a long time there

11:11

is often discussion

11:14

between the political hardy's

11:17

and in

11:19

congress to expand

11:22

the number of justices

11:24

on the supreme court and so

11:27

often times when there's that political

11:29

divide

11:30

the about appointments and so forth

11:32

are that topic

11:34

come back and sweater they should

11:36

ban the numbers so that the party

11:39

in power at that's fine get

11:41

more of an opportunity

11:44

they were point my rights that them that's

11:46

probably your underlying reason for

11:48

it but at wasn't it base

11:50

i thought it was based on the number of districts

11:53

is that true for the numbers from

11:55

court justice is based on the number of federal

11:57

judicial districts

11:59

i believe

11:59

each chapter

12:02

is find a district in

12:04

the united states

12:07

you over see

12:08

in new mexico were part of

12:10

the tenth judicial district and

12:14

, enough find justice you

12:16

kind of overseas the federal

12:18

court i'm under the

12:20

supreme court in that says

12:22

right right so i guess

12:24

one of the arguments is that now that they're

12:26

more than nine the district's

12:29

us federal court districts but

12:31

there should be more

12:34

us supreme court justices but

12:37

that hasn't happened yet we'll see if it does

12:40

that so

12:41

so you were saying about your

12:44

he talked about your clerks and

12:46

your position in the cabinet that

12:49

you came in to tell us a little bit about

12:51

that what is was it like being on

12:53

a cabinet member or in the

12:55

state of new mask mexico

12:57

well i think it it is very

13:00

much influenced by the governor had that

13:02

you serve and i as i mentioned

13:04

earlier gov michelle on grisham i'm

13:06

very fond of and believe that she has

13:09

great ideas in the great leadership i'll

13:12

and and wants to solve

13:14

problems that new mexico pacers

13:17

so in that respect i i

13:19

really value being in this position

13:22

on it is right

13:25

and center chew policy the

13:27

development of good policy and

13:30

practice for kids who

13:32

are in need for at

13:34

risk youth and since you are abused

13:37

and neglected and families who are

13:39

in crisis so when

13:43

i was shifting are pivoting

13:46

from the courts to have more

13:48

advocacy hyper

13:50

role in this feel that i didn't

13:52

expect it to be so this

13:56

particular field it did a particular

13:59

role to

13:59

you can be and that i find it

14:02

very very professionally gratifying

14:04

that's great well you did mentioned

14:07

earlier that when you are on the court

14:09

you had a very quiet environment that you lived

14:13

that you worked in and that's

14:16

not the case is it any more would

14:18

like what is that like what's your day

14:20

life

14:22

them for that question i

14:24

that my day is probably start

14:26

at least this morning at seven fifteen

14:29

with my first meeting for us so

14:31

it's early and long and

14:34

busy every day

14:36

yeah

14:37

it reminds me of my days

14:39

as a trial court judge

14:41

where it was fast

14:43

moving and you and your experience

14:46

as a prosecutor and juvenile

14:48

court years ago i'm

14:51

you probably had that same rush

14:53

yeah have being

14:55

you know busy all

14:57

day every day

14:59

moving he says dresses damage

15:01

in a very very

15:05

very system set two hundred

15:07

case we're two hundred cases in our case load

15:09

and any day

15:12

then cases could be on the counter and

15:15

, decide to be on top of all of them he

15:17

didn't know which ones are getting had go to hearing which

15:19

ones were gonna go to trial which one's the witnesses

15:21

didn't show up was which one's the cops

15:23

all sudden got called out on emergency

15:26

it was insanity

15:28

that's very much like that i'm not

15:31

insanity but for

15:33

her quite close mr there are

15:35

some days the road and

15:36

here and family but i'm certainly

15:39

in the days when i was a trial court judge

15:41

i love those days of really

15:44

moving cases are a system and really

15:46

trying to that with you

15:49

and making sure that they received

15:53

much of my time and attention

15:55

of a judge that could influence

15:58

them to get on the right

15:59

open to support them and

16:02

in

16:03

the know

16:04

dealing with their issues

16:06

and and enter in of

16:08

that it blaze seller com

16:10

were i really loved it

16:28

you know when i was practicing

16:30

and family core when i was prosecuted chases

16:33

one of the judges they we had

16:35

ten i think we're

16:37

ten i'm not sure eight or ten judges

16:39

i can't remember right now but one of them was

16:42

judge judy sideline everybody

16:44

knows now is judge judy and

16:47

odd i could tell you every

16:49

bit of the personality that she shows

16:52

on that tv show came out

16:54

in her courtroom and although

16:56

i loved or because he really knew the lot

16:58

and she did not take crap from anybody

17:00

she didn't like defense attorneys to try

17:03

anything ah yeah you're

17:05

on a schedule and you at the key to that schedule

17:08

up but she also the

17:11

top on people on the people

17:13

game in front of work of she

17:15

wanted make an impression and yet wanted

17:17

to keep them from graduating

17:20

to criminal court ah

17:22

as they got older and but

17:24

i will say that she also

17:27

had

17:28

the most

17:29

incredible compassion

17:31

for the people that came

17:33

before her and see

17:35

really tried to help them

17:38

anyway she could and prevent

17:40

them from you

17:43

know going down or wrong path or staying

17:45

around

17:47

yeah i i i i

17:49

i can see that in her and

17:52

i've often been described as having

17:54

an iron fist and a velvet glove

17:56

because like sound very

17:59

i'm time are very

18:02

ah you know saw got

18:04

it right it laugh spokane idea

18:07

i can certainly be a pretty tough

18:09

on on on people

18:12

who are not being straight and

18:15

, think you have to be an effective

18:17

judge you have to have that sides you

18:19

you have to hold people accountable

18:22

and not let them get away with things

18:25

things they did it doesn't

18:27

matter you know your work doesn't matter

18:29

so i think that that's an

18:31

important attribute for any judges

18:33

to hold the line and be tough

18:36

as well as being compassionate

18:39

and so that balance that judicial demeanor

18:42

our best judges have that uber

18:45

judicial demeanor that

18:47

people respect them are

18:49

being tough and holding them accountable

18:51

but yet also having that human

18:54

side

18:55

and understanding our human

18:57

frailties

18:59

the do you do get involved

19:01

in now

19:03

in individual cases are are you

19:06

supervising the whole thing and you can't

19:08

kind of get into the gradual

19:10

so

19:12

well even in my

19:14

role as role as or my

19:15

that of a as as secretary

19:18

yeah was talking about today

19:20

as today

19:21

it's yeah it's it's it's

19:23

more i ,

19:25

overseeing the law suits

19:27

that on the

19:30

agency is agency party to

19:32

bear party to in

19:35

whole foods or any case so

19:37

the you have a more direct involvement

19:40

in specific cases but

19:42

as a matter of

19:46

corps and throughout the day it's really policy

19:48

is managing an agency

19:51

that oversees child

19:53

welfare

19:55

juvenile justice

19:57

a rural health services

19:59

for care

19:59

throughout the say whether they're

20:02

in our chair or not and

20:04

, with tribal communities

20:07

to ensure that we have good relations

20:09

with our our

20:11

, communities

20:13

we have twenty three different native american

20:17

problems tribes and nations

20:20

in new mexico making sure that we're

20:22

working with fan

20:23

to ensure that their kids have that

20:26

cultural connectedness

20:28

you to their community

20:30

on working with the legislature

20:33

on our budgets

20:35

and presenting are

20:37

the the legislature must approve

20:40

our resources

20:41

how then working with

20:43

the media making sure that where

20:46

i'm responses to media

20:48

requests and our were managing

20:51

r

20:52

some a parasitic and it's a lot

20:54

of moving parts

20:55

that sounds like and now i understand

20:57

why it is approaching

21:00

crazy it

21:03

when you when you talk about first

21:05

saw you have these are twenty

21:08

three different native american

21:11

it blows tribes and communities

21:13

and

21:15

they

21:18

is their separate agencies

21:20

that cover them or do

21:22

they all come under the same

21:24

the job will peerage

21:25

oh

21:28

the tribal community in new

21:30

mexico are all separate

21:32

and sovereign

21:34

from the road in new mexico the federal

21:36

government as well as each other's so

21:38

their sovereign

21:40

and

21:42

and we are

21:44

we being children youth and families

21:46

department of new mexico work

21:50

collaboratively with sam

21:53

whenever an indian child

21:55

hatch's our system we

21:58

are committed to making there were that

22:00

that indian child

22:02

oh

22:03

either placed with that

22:06

community in their home community

22:08

or that the try

22:10

the real

22:12

the important boys

22:15

that child care

22:18

it if the child is place in our custody

22:21

that really making sure that the tribal

22:23

government

22:24

the am consulted

22:26

in that fair the news about

22:29

where that child should being is

22:31

taken into consideration and

22:34

howard word i'm caring

22:36

for that child so it's a it's

22:38

a process that i love

22:41

i , our native america

22:43

i grew i grew up as harshly

22:46

in a and indian boarding school

22:49

in new mexico on

22:51

and so i love our native american

22:54

communities i'm on my longest

22:57

the oldest friend or indian

23:00

people in new mexico and

23:02

so i really relate to it due

23:04

to my background and it's one of

23:06

them

23:08

wonderful character my job is working

23:10

with our native ,

23:12

community in fact this morning i was

23:14

on it to our meeting with tells tells

23:17

pueblo in northern new mexico

23:20

about this very issue how do we work

23:22

together

23:24

well i know that

23:26

many , the tribes in

23:28

in the united states states

23:30

many the reservations are severely

23:33

under funded and so i'm sure

23:35

that services are a

23:37

few and far between it's

23:41

luckily recently it's

23:44

become much more the

23:46

of a public being

23:49

people are now understanding this learning

23:51

about this because ,

23:53

has been really shameful

23:55

i think how some

23:57

of the people who live on

23:59

the reservations are

24:02

or treated or the services

24:04

they're not getting

24:06

right

24:07

you're absolutely right german the and i think

24:09

i'm in order for us to do this

24:11

work well to ,

24:14

kids on the right track and and get

24:16

him healthy if they've been traumatized

24:19

it's really it's of

24:21

making sure that they're connected

24:24

the their ethnicity

24:26

their culture at their community

24:28

making sure that we're

24:31

do it in a respectful manner is not

24:33

a snake and new mexico coming in and

24:35

telling us a tribe you have

24:37

to do a b and c but rather we listen

24:40

to what the tried me and

24:42

, of the things that we're doing is really trying

24:44

to facilitate barriers that

24:47

tribes experience with the

24:49

be i a or the federal government

24:52

making sure that we can facilitate

24:54

you know better relations

24:58

between government agencies

25:01

our agencies our form of government

25:03

would be

25:04

additional communities

25:07

well

25:08

thank you for doing that and i hope that

25:10

they that , legislature

25:13

gives you the resources you need to

25:15

take care of them are asking judge

25:18

did

25:19

honor of you aware of the show

25:21

recently called i just killed my

25:23

dad and is , few

25:26

episodes about a young man

25:29

who was seventeen at the time called

25:31

nine one one and said that he just shot

25:33

his father and that he waited patiently outside

25:36

for the empties and the pleased to com

25:38

and was extremely cooperative

25:40

with not bad

25:42

they had a very flat assets to and

25:44

he wasn't that forthcoming

25:46

the

25:47

the the series

25:51

really pointed out a number of things

25:53

were with us young man

25:56

the boy who who became a young

25:58

man

25:59

this was fail that

26:03

you pay he was taken from his mother

26:06

the he the the father

26:09

had enough just to get out the mother

26:11

had taken him and then see

26:14

, a custody battle and was

26:16

appointed full custody and then he

26:20

lied to the court in louisiana

26:22

and got the get back without

26:25

disclosing that the custody already been

26:27

awarded to her and

26:30

then he kept him at home any

26:33

never put him in schools them from the time

26:35

he was very young boy and

26:38

was isolated and never would love to have

26:40

friends and and all this stuff

26:42

over years just built up more

26:44

and more and more and

26:46

there was finally he when he when he

26:48

got a job

26:50

there's finally a woman who started

26:52

looking into this because he saw

26:54

the lacking he didn't know what high five

26:56

in was he didn't know his birthday

26:59

the didn't know his mother's name

27:02

and so see thought

27:05

there's something going on here

27:07

and she actually did something and

27:09

it's those cases that i'm that i'm talking

27:12

about there are neighbors there are people

27:15

around in that community

27:16

what can they do who who

27:19

do they call what what they do

27:21

absolutely and that's so

27:23

important it's it's a matter of having

27:26

eyes and ears when you do suspect

27:29

something , ah

27:31

as you've just described this young man

27:33

experiencing that

27:36

that person

27:38

all the end and started investigating

27:41

what was going on but you

27:44

know a new mexico we have we have

27:46

a statewide central intake number

27:49

and eight hundred number that people call

27:51

it bears

27:52

the suspicion of child abuse and neglect

27:54

in that i would urge every person

27:57

across the united states to be familiar

27:59

with their local call

28:01

in number at a suspect abuse or neglect

28:03

on the part of families and and

28:06

and children in you mention

28:08

this case and gym

28:10

one

28:11

when i started my career as

28:14

a lawyer i wanted to be a corporate lawyer

28:16

i have an accounting degree and

28:19

in the day i was assigned was

28:21

child welfare cheese to go down

28:23

to the local courthouse

28:25

the case that was my first case

28:28

i have a lawyer in this

28:30

field where a mother

28:33

oh two parents were divorced

28:36

thing and the father

28:38

hook the children away two boys

28:40

from the mother and ,

28:43

her of abuse and neglect neglect

28:45

she was not an abusive parent

28:47

but he had convince the local

28:49

town welfare system that indeed she

28:52

was a bad parent in was hurting her

28:54

son's long story

28:56

short

28:59

one of the hearings and bombing that case

29:01

and i was shocked i he was not from there in which

29:03

our welfare and and i represented

29:05

heard the mother and at one hearing

29:07

she said look

29:10

i don't get my boys bad

29:12

that not as important can be

29:14

as if you protect them from

29:17

their father and from any

29:19

further abuse and from that point

29:22

forward point was

29:24

i was share this was going to be

29:26

my life's work

29:28

do you recognize

29:30

that that meant that she was not abuse

29:32

her act see

29:34

it it was let you know

29:36

it was like idol

29:39

having nice children with me as not as

29:41

important as you protecting them and

29:43

that that's the now that's

29:46

the sign of a mother who loves

29:48

their children and

29:50

it reminds me of your story

29:53

where his father it take

29:54

the boy an isolated

29:57

him to such agree

30:00

you know ethnic

30:02

lag patch that was the same situation

30:05

watch parents are work

30:07

using the children against each other

30:10

wow

30:11

wow thank you for touch share in that store with

30:13

us

30:14

like you judge be here for

30:16

being here and telling

30:18

us so much about your career

30:20

and your efforts to try

30:22

to help children in the state new mexico

30:25

and i'm sure there's a ripple effect across

30:27

the country and around the world when people

30:29

are taken care of they grow

30:31

up to be

30:32

that are people and they helped the world so

30:34

thank you for that

30:37

thank you hm for all you do as

30:39

well for for the work that

30:41

you've done throughout your career and for this

30:43

work ah enjoy

30:45

the opportunity to our

30:47

we really loved having you and ups

30:49

and sir frenzy is kicking

30:52

yourself that she was and year and that's probably

30:54

good thing on but ah

30:56

now i love francis sort of

30:59

for we will definitely

31:02

have you back in the future and hopefully

31:04

we can talk about doing more things

31:06

together it'll be great it

31:08

in our i will till next time

31:11

thank you everyone for watching and listening

31:14

this is best case worst case signing

31:16

up

31:26

is it

31:28

xd production produced by

31:30

a frenzy hakes josh murphy

31:32

and to implement at empire studios

31:35

l a engineered and edited

31:37

by matt gurgle music composed

31:39

and performed by simba somebody

31:42

and hosted by wonder if you can

31:44

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31:48

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31:50

podcasts and wherever you listen

31:53

to podcasts

31:56

you are do something about child sexual abuse

31:58

darkness delight canal

32:00

the you know the more than ninety percent of the time

32:02

children are sexually abused by someone

32:04

they know

32:05

it isn't about stranger danger

32:07

it's about learning the true risks darkness

32:10

the lights training can help prevent recognize

32:13

and reacts to child sexual abuse

32:15

in your commute

32:16

the when you make you make to

32:18

get involved kids can be productive snorts

32:22

with you

32:23

see the www

32:25

dot d to l dot org

32:27

to take the [unk]

32:28

training and learn more that's the

32:31

the number two l dot org