0:04

Hey there , king and Kings family , welcome into

0:07

another episode of Beyond Sunday Sermons

0:09

. This is the podcast where we get an opportunity

0:11

to kind of unpack a

0:13

Sunday sermon a little bit further and kind of talk

0:16

about some stuff that maybe got left out or , in

0:18

the case of this series , kind of look

0:20

at some different perspectives on

0:22

staff , because we had a series a

0:25

little bit ago called Favorite Verse and

0:27

we had our preachers got

0:29

a chance to kind of detail their favorite

0:31

verses , their favorite passages and talk about why

0:33

they were impactful to them . And we

0:36

took a look at this podcast . We were like , hey , let's

0:38

talk to some more staff about this . So I'm

0:40

really excited about this one today because this

0:42

guy to my right is super

0:44

cool . Can't wait to introduce you to him .

0:46

Which one ? Oh that directly

0:48

to my right . As far to my right , that's

0:50

whatever that's executive director Mike

0:52

White , that's a promotion I

0:54

think he just gave me director of ministry . I

0:57

can be an executive director .

0:58

I just gave you Julie's job . You did .

1:00

Sorry Julie , I just want you to know this way .

1:02

Sorry Julie director of ministry , mike

1:04

White , and to

1:06

my direct right is

1:08

our worship director , mitch Bollig

1:11

. Also little known fact

1:13

about him . I mean maybe a little known for out there

1:15

. But what would you say ? 80

1:17

, 85% of your wardrobe is from Timu

1:20

, I would say a good hmm

1:22

, 84.72%

1:26

is definitely Timu .

1:28

And you've developed a really rough skin condition since

1:30

you've been buying off Timu , right Not ?

1:31

true , not true . My skin's gotten

1:34

much better , actually glowing . So if you

1:36

use my code , which we will make

1:38

sure to provide for you , then you too

1:40

can have such link down in the

1:42

description .

1:43

All right , I suppose we should actually talk about the Bible

1:45

at some point , as biblical as

1:47

Timu is . So we

1:50

asked you , mitch , what's your favorite

1:52

verse , favorite passage you said Matthew

1:54

11 , 28 to 30

1:57

. So I'm going to read that . This is the NIV

1:59

version . Come to me all

2:01

you who are weary and

2:03

burdened , and I will give you rest . Take

2:06

my yoke upon you and learn from me , for

2:08

I am gentle and humble in heart and

2:10

you'll find rest for your souls , for

2:12

my yoke is easy and my burden

2:14

is light . So

2:17

obviously you

2:19

know that's a pretty popular verse . That's a very impactful

2:21

and meaningful verse to many people

2:24

. What is it about that

2:26

passage that really sticks out to you

2:28

?

2:29

Yeah , I think for me , the reason why

2:31

it's so special and so

2:33

meaningful is that

2:35

really played a big role

2:37

in in my salvation

2:40

and in my early days , when I

2:42

just became a Christian , that

2:45

particular verse was so significant

2:48

. It was like my whole life

2:50

I felt like I was always searching

2:53

for something , searching

2:56

and there was like this hole inside

2:58

of my heart and

3:00

when I came to Christ it was like that

3:03

hole was finally satisfied

3:06

, like finally I found purpose

3:09

and meaning for life . And

3:12

so , yeah , I think that just that verse in general , because

3:14

of that meaning , it really played

3:17

a big role for me in just the idea

3:19

of Jesus saying come to me all

3:21

you who are weary , the

3:23

invitation for all people , all

3:26

people everywhere , that

3:28

the answer is found in Jesus and we

3:30

just need to go to him . Go

3:32

to him .

3:34

What did that feel like for you

3:36

, mitch ? I don't know if you grew

3:38

up in a Christian householder or not

3:40

you can give us a little bit of your background if you want but

3:42

like to recognize that

3:44

you have this hole in

3:46

your life and there's you feel like there's

3:48

something significant that needs to go there and

3:50

you just can't figure out what . And

3:53

then , when you come upon it and maybe you came upon

3:55

this verse , maybe it was something else that

3:57

sparked that in you , but when you realize , yeah

4:00

, jesus is what fills that hole , what I

4:02

mean ? What was that realization like for you ?

4:04

It's just like peace , you know having total

4:07

peace , because when you come

4:09

to the conclusion of the

4:11

thing that I've always been searching for and what I've

4:14

been seeking for the

4:16

reason why I'm so restless

4:18

like now I can find my rest in

4:20

Christ . It's just

4:22

like solid . You're solid

4:24

now because your life is now built upon the

4:26

solid rock of Christ .

4:29

What about ? Was there a restlessness in you ? Or

4:31

I mean , you talked about finally coming

4:33

to receive . There's a hole in me where you try

4:36

. I guess part of my journey is trying to find other stuff to

4:38

fill that . Was that part of your story too

4:40

, or not so much .

4:42

Yeah , I think for all of us , like we're always trying

4:44

to fill , like try to find

4:46

meaning or purpose in life , whether that's through

4:48

like success , or through our work or

4:51

through our career , like we're always trying

4:53

to find that purpose , and

4:56

then when you realize that it's in Christ , it's

4:59

like you have that , that complete

5:01

satisfaction in him .

5:04

And then for you , was it a slower

5:06

process of coming to faith , was there ? I

5:09

don't know what would describe what that was like . I

5:13

mean , I grew up in the church .

5:15

So I always had like a Christian background , parents

5:18

in ministry , but

5:21

for me , like early on , I really tried

5:23

rebelling against the church because I didn't want anything to do with , like my

5:27

parents' faith , you know , and

5:30

so I was very like rebellious

5:32

. So it was kind of a long

5:34

process , but at the

5:36

same time , at the same time , I received

5:39

God's grace when I was pretty young , at 14

5:41

. So at the same time it was also

5:43

like it happened to be pretty early on too , that's

5:46

cool .

5:47

What I love about the verse that you picked

5:49

? and what you just said Mitch was like and

5:52

you kind of touched on this too , Mike is like when you feel

5:54

that there's that hole , there's something

5:56

missing , and

5:59

you're trying to fill it with other things , that's a burden

6:01

. That goes right to when

6:03

Christ says come to me all you who

6:05

are weary and burdened . That's tiring

6:07

. It's a burden to try

6:09

and figure out what is this . I mean it's

6:12

just constantly on your mind like I

6:14

know I'm here for something more

6:16

, there's something that I'm missing out on . What

6:18

is it ? I mean , that's something that gets lodged

6:20

in your brain . You can't get it out , and

6:22

then to have that realization

6:25

that actually there's no

6:27

job , there's no success , there's

6:29

no significant other , there's nothing that I

6:31

can do that is going to fill

6:34

that hole . But it's Christ

6:36

who takes that , he literally

6:38

takes that burden off your shoulders . It's

6:40

just such a beautiful metaphor

6:42

, I think .

6:43

Yeah , I think that grace is such a foreign

6:45

concept I know early in my

6:47

faith life I don't think I lived out of grace

6:50

. I think it was predicated on my performance

6:52

and that's not a good way to get

6:54

us out the way of Jesus . And

6:57

so it became this guilt inducing way

6:59

of life where I would fall short , I

7:01

wasn't good enough and I'd feel guilt and shame

7:03

. Then I'd try harder again , but

7:05

like learning to receive grace then

7:08

that's what Jesus is all about . But that's hard

7:10

. Did you experience that too ?

7:11

Right for me ? Yeah , totally , for

7:14

like , the first few years after becoming a Christian

7:17

like almost became a Pharisee

7:19

, like right away , and

7:21

it was very much workspace , and

7:24

not just workspace , but almost

7:26

out of like fear-based fear

7:30

of God , and not like the good fear of God

7:32

but the bad fear of God For sure . Yeah , and

7:35

there's a great quote I'm not sure who originally

7:37

said it , but they said that there's two

7:39

types of Christians in the kingdom

7:41

there's workers and

7:43

there's lovers . But lovers

7:46

will always get more work done than workers

7:48

. And when we

7:50

experience God's grace , like we

7:52

actually really have to abide in that grace

7:54

, like we can't rely on

7:56

our own strength , our own ability , because

7:59

we know that even our righteousness

8:02

is like filthy rags before and all . Holy God

8:04

. So I'm thankful for

8:06

the grace of Christ because he's

8:09

done it for us .

8:10

Yeah , there's that freedom when you receive it . I don't . There

8:12

might be a one-time salvation moment , but I

8:14

think in my journey there's an over

8:17

and over going back to the grace of God , because I think it's so

8:19

easy to slip into performance , either

8:21

to elevate myself to a self-righteous position

8:24

or a shame position , if

8:26

that makes sense .

8:27

So so , mike

8:29

, you're kind of the context king

8:31

. I know you're really good .

8:34

Also , I wanna make sure we discover that Mitch is a

8:36

lover on the podcast . Today is what we

8:38

discovered .

8:38

That's right right .

8:41

Anyway uh

8:43

context scheme . Yeah yeah , you're just

8:45

very good at looking at the

8:48

verses around a passage and kind of

8:50

figuring out , okay , what's going on here , what

8:52

? Time and place you know

8:54

if . Jesus speaking . Who's he speaking to ?

8:56

So we've got Jesus speaking here .

8:57

What's the context around this passage ?

9:00

Let me throw my phrase out . You've heard it before , I don't know if

9:02

you have . I stole it from someone years ago . A

9:04

text without a context is a pretext

9:07

for a proof text . Yeah , think

9:09

about that one a few times . But it's just saying

9:11

that we can take one word or one

9:13

verse out of scripture and then

9:16

apply it to whatever we want . So a classic

9:18

one is , uh , john 11

9:20

, I think 35 , where it says Jesus wept . So

9:23

if you just looked at those words you would say , well , is

9:25

he an emotional wreck ? Did he hurt himself

9:27

? Did he watch romantic comedy , like what is

9:29

going on ? Right , but then exactly what

9:31

Dan's saying in the quote , you got to back up and read

9:33

the verses before that , the chapter before that

9:36

, the book , the whole book . And so I

9:38

mean we can go back to the being of Matthew and see

9:40

context . You see the Christmas story , you see

9:42

Jesus birth , we see

9:45

him entering into ministry , baptism , calling

9:47

disciples , sermon on the mount , and then , even

9:49

if you look at chapter eight before that

9:51

, so that ends the sermon on the mount , says

9:54

he's preaching like no one's ever seen before , and

9:57

then he goes and does a series of miracles

9:59

in chapter eight . And if you notice , at the end

10:01

of some of those there starts to be

10:03

conflict with the religious leaders because he was

10:05

different . And so you see the healing of

10:07

the paralytic and it says the Pharisees , teachers of

10:09

the law , said this guy's blaspheming Go

10:12

over to the end of nine

10:14

, the Pharisees saying it's demons

10:16

who drive this out . And then there's this beautiful

10:18

picture at the end of Matthew nine . Jesus is

10:20

preaching and it shows him like on a hillside

10:22

looking out over the crowds and

10:25

he says it was the word Zach used

10:27

a few weeks ago splognitzel , my , he has

10:29

compassion , he's seeing the people

10:31

.

10:31

Good .

10:31

Down his gut right , and

10:34

he's seeing the people and they're helpless . They're

10:36

like sheep without a shepherd . So

10:38

then it says the harvest is plentiful , the workers

10:40

are few . Then he sends his disciples out

10:42

, he instructs them , and then that's when we enter

10:44

into chapter 11 . And

10:46

then what's fascinating , 11 is we

10:48

see John the Baptist right here , who

10:51

was the precursor of the forerunner to Jesus

10:53

, pointed all the way to him

10:55

and then he was actually imprisoned . And

10:58

then what you see here is his disciples

11:01

sent by John , who's in prison . They

11:03

come to Jesus and they're like what's going

11:05

on here ? Like we don't think

11:07

our guys should be in prison Are you the one or is there someone else

11:09

? Because they had expectations that

11:11

Jesus would perform a certain way , the Messiah , and they thought

11:14

it'd be total freedom , right . Then Jesus quotes

11:16

Isaiah 61 , but leaves out the freedom for

11:18

the prisoners . And he keeps going on

11:20

and he almost has this confrontation moment with the crowd

11:22

. And he says John came and

11:25

he was what's

11:28

the word he used , saying a dirge like

11:30

he's at morning . And the Son of man

11:32

came with freedom and eating . Like neither

11:35

one of us were good enough for you , like we can't

11:37

make you win . And all

11:39

throughout this he's pointing to the religious leaders who are

11:41

imposing . This is where the word yoke could

11:43

come in . It's one translation of yoke rules

11:46

. They were putting rules on the followers

11:49

of God at that point and they were hypocritical

11:51

. And so even in Matthew 23

11:53

, he points that out and says you're overloading

11:55

the people with all these rules and yet you can't

11:57

keep them . So he's seeing the people

12:00

, he has compassion on them , and they put

12:02

a yoke of teaching on the people . That's

12:04

unbearable . And then he says take

12:06

my yoke upon you , learn

12:08

from me , I will give you rest . You're

12:10

being burdened by the religious leaders

12:12

. There's freedom , like you were saying . In

12:15

taking my yoke upon you , there's a couple of ways you can look at

12:17

yoke . Anyway , that's probably too much , but no

12:20

, that was great .

12:20

No , context is great . I mean

12:23

, I'd love to get both your thoughts on

12:25

this , mike . You brought it up a couple of times

12:27

, the word yoke is used multiple

12:29

times in this verse and of course we're

12:31

not talking about egg yolk or anything . We're talking

12:33

about the rest

12:36

, not restraints , but the things

12:39

that were placed on oxen shoulders

12:41

so oxen could pull large

12:44

machinery carts , whatever it might be

12:47

, yep . So when you look at the word yoke

12:49

as Jesus uses it a couple of times

12:51

, you said there could be a couple of meanings .

12:53

What do you ?

12:53

guys see there .

12:55

Right . So so I'll share now Whatever

12:57

you got on this too . I think one way

12:59

you could do it is rabbis

13:02

. Back then Jesus was the exception , so

13:05

typically a student would go and apply

13:07

to be a rabbis disciple

13:09

follower and be taught . You'd have to be smart

13:11

enough and recite the Old Testament and know the traditions

13:14

and things like that so you would actually apply . But

13:17

Jesus is the other way and he actually chooses

13:19

and says you come with me , right , which

13:21

is totally backwards . But then rabbis

13:24

had different interpretations of the

13:26

law , the oral tradition , stuff like that , and

13:29

so it was seen as taking on a rabbis yoke

13:31

so you would learn from them and you would learn their

13:34

religious tradition , their practices , stuff like that . So

13:36

that's one way of seeing a yoke was like you were taking on this

13:38

rabbis theology essentially

13:40

in practice . Or the other way , which you alluded

13:43

to , was the animal , and so you would

13:45

. You would use an ox or

13:47

a yoke for two ox oxen

13:49

typically and you would put them

13:51

together and they would work together in plowing

13:53

the field , and one was traditionally

13:56

an older , wiser ox

13:58

, and so they would pair the younger ox

14:01

with the older , wiser one so they could

14:03

learn from them and

14:06

as an ox . You would see , maybe that is a burden where

14:08

you're restrained , but like when we're

14:10

actually united with Christ . With

14:12

that yoke it's like total freedom

14:15

, yeah , if that makes sense , which is kind of an oxym

14:17

paradox kind of stuff , I don't know . Thoughts

14:19

.

14:20

Yeah , I've always have Understood

14:22

it as the illustration of like

14:24

the instrument used for the oxen

14:26

. So that was cool hearing the other other

14:29

side that you've had to . I

14:31

think what Jesus was trying to get out by

14:34

like Jesus always talked in parables and

14:36

was always giving illustrations Was

14:38

that this was like the burden of

14:40

the Pharisees .

14:41

Mm-hmm .

14:42

That was yep . That was placed upon the people's

14:44

shoulders .

14:44

I'm here .

14:45

He's saying my yoke is easy , so

14:47

we have this , this freedom now in

14:50

Jesus and that's what's wild

14:52

grace that you said you a

14:54

yoke is sort of restricting .

14:57

So like you're , like that doesn't make sense and I think we we

14:59

rebel against restriction , but actually when there's

15:01

clarity and rules and boundaries

15:04

and guidance for life , it's actually freeing

15:07

because you know how to live in that system .

15:09

in some ways , right , and I don't know if you

15:11

guys have ever driven overseas in a

15:13

country where they don't have a lot of laws

15:15

. Yes , pretty wild . Like

15:18

we Wasn't in the Philippines

15:20

back in February and I always thought

15:22

that Omaha drivers were bad .

15:24

I was like oh no over there .

15:26

I don't know how people do it , but I mean they live

15:28

somehow . I mean people no one died , but

15:31

it was just wild with how people drive

15:33

everyone's honking their horn . People are

15:35

just going when they want to , but

15:38

it's good for us to have laws

15:40

in place , to have red light , green

15:42

light , those kind of things in place

15:44

. I think that's the same illustration

15:47

to talk about . You know this Like

15:50

discipline , that the Lord gives us instructions

15:52

, like God has a way for us to live our

15:54

lives and it's actually Though

15:57

maybe to the natural mind it seems

16:00

restrictive right , it's actually freedom . Yeah

16:03

, and that's how God actually made us to live , yeah , yeah , I think you're

16:05

totally right .

16:06

Gonna be all you were weary and burdened , and so that's what

16:08

they

16:11

were weighed down by the rules and laws of the religious

16:13

leaders , and it's a self-righteousness . They

16:15

couldn't do it , and so

16:18

he's given the exact opposite .

16:18

There's this grace I'm offering to you to

16:22

give freedom , and I think , and you guys can- correct

16:24

me if I'm Misinterpreting

16:27

this , but I think part of it too is just we

16:29

all carry a yoke through life and

16:33

it's kind of like yeah , we , one oxen , can use

16:35

a yoke and can pull it , but it's not gonna

16:37

be very effective . You're doing all the work yourself . It's

16:42

bulky because you got half of it dragging

16:44

on the ground now and Jesus is saying no , let me come alongside you

16:46

. That's

16:49

good . I'm gonna partner with you . I

16:51

can make this . I'm bigger than you , I'm stronger than you . I

16:55

can make this so much easier for

16:57

you . Just come to me and I

17:02

want to give you rest like I have

17:04

this gift for you just receive it , yeah right and I think that's what

17:06

our Western culture Puts on us too .

17:10

It's all about you and your performance and

17:12

pick yourself up by your bootstraps and just work harder and try harder

17:14

and the kingdom's like Upside

17:17

down and it kind of flips that and that's the challenges .

17:19

That's the challenges . Like

17:21

here's Jesus saying come to me all

17:23

you who are weary . But how

17:26

often are like for some people

17:28

, we don't want to come to Jesus . Like

17:30

we want to do it ourselves . We would rather

17:32

just hey , I'm

17:34

gonna try my best . Or I don't want to humble myself

17:37

to say I am broken , I am weary , I'm

17:39

at the end of myself right now , but

17:42

that's what it takes .

17:43

What's the root of that ? You kind of said it , but what's

17:45

the root of that inside of each one of us ? What do you

17:47

think or do you ? Can you resonate with that at all ?

17:51

I Don't know if it's in our I

17:53

don't want to say it's in our nature , but

17:55

maybe it's just part of our culture , I

17:58

know . For me personally , I can say that

18:01

, like when it comes to receiving

18:03

gifts , yeah , I'm not very good at

18:05

it , I love to give gifts . Especially

18:08

like this time of year , I love giving

18:10

people gifts .

18:10

No more office . Man Drop them off , yeah

18:12

, okay .

18:13

Well , maybe some text here Teemo . Texas

18:15

gear coming up . But yeah

18:18

, like giving gifts is easy for me , but when it comes

18:20

to like receiving a gift , that's a whole

18:22

, whole another story , because I rather be

18:24

the one helping someone else . You know what I mean , yeah .

18:27

Yeah , I would say , for me it's pride .

18:29

It's a pride thing .

18:30

Yeah , I think it's hard to admit weakness

18:32

. It's right to accept help . It's hard , I

18:34

sure a message a long time ago , but I

18:36

once experienced foot washing and

18:39

having your feet washed by someone is

18:41

gross . It's real gross first of all

18:43

, but it's very humbling . It's very

18:45

vulnerable . You're giving a gross part

18:47

of yourself to someone and it's like huh

18:50

. But in some ways that's what you're

18:52

doing here is giving all of yourself to Jesus and

18:54

there's no way into the kingdom except humbling

18:57

yourself and emitting your brokenness and need right

18:59

. You know right . It's hard for us in our culture in

19:02

our pre-show meeting .

19:03

Mitch , you said , the first three words

19:05

in this passage were just Really

19:08

really impactful when it came to your salvation

19:10

. Come to me . What

19:13

is it about those three words ?

19:16

When I hear that I I picture

19:18

Jesus knocking

19:21

at the door , my heart , and

19:24

. That just the whole thing of that

19:26

. Jesus is always there

19:29

, that he's always inviting us , no

19:31

matter how far you've gone , no

19:34

matter what sins you've done , like there's no

19:36

sin that you could commit . That's , that's

19:38

greater than God . And

19:40

Jesus is constantly

19:42

saying come to me . Like

19:44

even as a Christian , when we fall down

19:47

into sin , god's still there , saying come

19:49

to me , come back to me , my child . And

19:52

so I think that's that's the huge part that

19:54

really ministers to me the most .

19:57

I Think it was so radical During

19:59

that time period too , because you see the

20:01

religious leaders get angry

20:04

with Jesus and his disciples . They're like he's

20:06

eating with tax collectors in the sinners , like what are you

20:08

doing , bro ? But

20:10

that's the all portion and that that's who

20:12

came to him is those are marginalized

20:15

and pushed out in the fringes of society , and

20:17

that's , that's the all that's everybody

20:19

. He said he came for the sick sick

20:21

, gotta admit You're sick , and hey , we're all sick is

20:23

whether you know it or not , right ? Yeah , it's

20:25

good .

20:26

And what's what I really

20:28

like about the language that Jesus uses

20:30

is he says come to me . It

20:33

requires action on our part . He's

20:35

not saying I'm coming to you , although

20:38

he does , and he , he , he

20:42

holds his arms out and embrace for us , but

20:44

it's us that has to take . He's never gonna force

20:46

it on us . It's us that has to take that step

20:49

and and come to him

20:51

. And it brings to mind Mike you just preached

20:53

on revelation a couple weeks ago and

20:55

you were talking about

20:57

. In

20:59

Revelation 3 , jesus

21:02

says here I am , I stand at the door

21:04

and knock .

21:07

He's there , he's there , he's letting it know

21:09

, he's knocking .

21:09

He's letting it known that his presence is there , but

21:12

he's never going to . Yeah , barge

21:14

that door in , he's never even yeah

21:16

, he's never gonna open the door himself . He's

21:19

gonna wait patiently For

21:21

us to open the , and it might take years

21:24

before that happens , but he

21:26

wants us to come to him , to

21:28

come to that door twisted .

21:29

Now open it and say come

21:31

on in , man , I want to see what you've got for me . It's

21:34

good , I'm gonna open End of that section

21:36

. I'm curious what you guys think on this . Gentle

21:39

and humble and heart , you will find a rest

21:41

for your souls . Why

21:44

do you think he points specifically to

21:46

souls ?

21:47

Hmm , we're talking about shoes like

21:49

our foot , s O L E or

21:51

a different . Oh , okay , yeah , yeah , we're talking about different Okay

21:54

okay cool . Um , I

21:57

think and this is kind of what I

21:59

see out of that is , um , like

22:02

in this life I mean , jesus even tells us this

22:04

that we're gonna still have trouble yeah , we're

22:06

still gonna Experience . And

22:08

I hope , like when people hear , like

22:10

, my testimony of what I've shared , like just

22:13

because we're Christians now Doesn't mean that

22:16

we don't face difficulties , doesn't

22:18

mean that we don't experience Pain

22:22

and in this life or in this world , but

22:24

but we do have rest for our souls

22:26

and so deep

22:28

within us we we have that eternal

22:31

, like Eternal

22:34

satisfaction in Christ , like we

22:36

know that our , our life is secure , that

22:38

our life is held in God's hands , no

22:41

matter what we face , even during difficult

22:43

times . Yeah , we still are

22:45

gonna face those .

22:46

I Don't know about

22:48

you guys , but I know , especially

22:50

during Chaotic , hectic

22:53

seasons , when it feels like things

22:55

are spiraling out of control a little bit

22:57

, that's when it's hardest

22:59

to get into the word and to pray

23:01

. But I know that when I , when

23:04

I just Block off some time

23:07

and maybe it's only a couple minutes , but

23:09

if I just sit there and I'm intentional and

23:11

I open up my Bible and I just say Jesus

23:14

, I'm here , man , if you want to say

23:16

something to me , awesome .

23:18

I want to I want to listen .

23:21

Those are the times when I , just

23:23

I feel this Peace

23:26

that cannot be explained

23:29

by any human emotion . No

23:31

human interaction , not even with

23:34

my wife , gives me that sense

23:36

, but it's just like . Okay

23:38

, yeah whatever's happening right now , I've

23:41

got the all powerful

23:44

God , the creator of the

23:46

universe , on my side . I've got the Holy

23:48

Spirit living inside

23:50

me . Yeah , whatever's happening outside

23:52

. It might not

23:55

look great , but it's okay . I

23:57

can handle it right , that's and

23:59

that when I see rest for my

24:01

soul , that's what I right think

24:03

about those moments were just like . Everything's

24:07

not okay , but it's okay

24:10

.

24:10

Yeah , yeah , I think Jesus

24:13

is pointing to our greatest need

24:15

as well . I think we we

24:17

confuse things and we see physical

24:20

needs as the ultimate . And

24:22

I heard someone years ago I don't know the exact quote , but he said

24:24

we , we live like we're bodies

24:27

with a soul , but we're

24:29

actually souls with the body

24:31

, and so it's saying that the core of who

24:33

we are is like our spirit , our soul . Yeah , and

24:35

so he's actually giving rest at the deepest

24:38

core level of who you are and

24:40

all the physical stuff is good , but he's going

24:43

deeper into the core . Like you said , say , identity question

24:45

. We're seeking approval , seeking success

24:47

and satisfaction through different things , and he's

24:49

finding identity Rest in the greatest part of

24:51

who we are , kind of thing .

24:53

Yeah , I wanted to get you

24:55

guys's opinions On this because

24:57

, mike , you've had over a decade ministry

25:00

. Mitch , you've worked at several churches

25:02

. Your whole career , almost , has

25:04

been in ministry . I'm still pretty new

25:06

to this , but I've experienced it as

25:08

well . It can sometimes

25:10

feel kind of difficult

25:12

to separate those two

25:14

things , to separate your faith life and your

25:17

job , because all of a sudden your job involves

25:19

your faith life and involves researching

25:22

the Bible and reading the Bible

25:24

and talking about God and sometimes it feels

25:26

like those private moments

25:28

that you like to spend with God you're

25:30

just like well , I do that at

25:32

work . Those two things aren't separate anymore

25:34

. Do you guys kind of feel that

25:37

push-pull as church workers ? Oh

25:39

, totally .

25:41

It goes back to , as we're going through Revelation

25:43

right now , to not lose your

25:45

first love . And when we

25:47

work especially

25:50

if you're working in ministry , you're working in church

25:52

like it can be really easy to lose

25:54

your first love because

25:56

, like what you're saying , you begin to maybe stop

25:58

spending time alone with God

26:01

and you're only concentrating

26:03

on work , and that goes all the way back

26:05

to what we said at the beginning about

26:07

there's lovers and workers

26:09

, but the lovers always get more work

26:11

done than the workers . I

26:14

think the key to not

26:17

facing burnout because , ultimately , if you

26:19

keep going down that path , that's what happens is you

26:22

just burn out . It's eventually

26:24

. You're no longer living

26:26

and serving in ministry , you're no longer

26:29

going from the overflow of

26:31

what God's pouring inside of you , but

26:35

now you're just . You're empty at this point , and

26:38

you're trying to , you're trying to pour out , but there's

26:40

nothing in it , because you're not spending time with

26:42

the Lord . But I think

26:44

the secret , though , is in

26:46

.

26:47

Oh , you have the secret . Wow , here we go .

26:49

You've been waiting for it . The secret's coming out

26:51

today .

26:51

The secret everybody right now . Share

26:53

right now . This is the secret . Gotta share this

26:55

. It's in Isaiah , the

26:58

secret's in God's word . Believe it or not , could

27:00

you imagine that , like my goodness , god's

27:02

just given us everything else ? It's

27:04

in Isaiah 40 . And

27:07

first , starting , verse 29, . He gives power

27:10

to the weak and to those who

27:12

have no might . He increases strength

27:14

. Even the youths shall

27:16

faint and be weary , and the young men

27:18

shall utterly fall . But

27:20

those who wait on the Lord shall

27:23

renew their strength . They shall mount

27:25

up with wings like eagles . They

27:28

shall run and not be weary . They

27:30

shall walk and not faint . That's

27:32

the key is just waiting on

27:34

the Lord . And that

27:37

brings up the whole question of what does waiting look like ? What

27:39

is waiting on the Lord ? What does

27:41

that mean ? What does that look like ? But I think

27:43

that's the real secret is whether

27:46

that's through prayer , like

27:49

how you mentioned , dan , just sitting before

27:51

God in prayer , maybe

27:54

just opening the word of God and spending time reading

27:56

his word . That's where our

27:58

strength really comes from .

28:00

Yeah , I think we see waiting as a

28:02

passive activity , as the

28:04

opposite of that . You're not in a waiting room waiting

28:06

for something or whatever else to come get you . It's waiting

28:09

is a very active activity

28:11

. And to your question , I think

28:13

I probably take it for granted

28:16

how easy it is to come and do these things or talk through scripture

28:18

or pray with somebody , because it's so

28:20

proximate at a church context . But just

28:22

what you said , if you're not feeling yourself

28:24

in some ways , you're going

28:26

to go dry and you're going to see the results on the outside

28:28

. You're going to see the fruit at home with your

28:30

wife and kids or whatever it is , and

28:33

with the coworkers . It's going to come out . So

28:35

you've got to feed yourself first .

28:37

When I was a worship leader , my

28:39

pastor , former pastor Steve Sweat if you're watching

28:41

shout out Go . Steve Manu

28:43

fell ship . He told

28:46

me one time he read this

28:48

passage to me and he

28:50

was like Mitch , because

28:52

I was a worship leader and he was like , if

28:55

I would be , he basically I'm going to kind

28:57

of paraphrase how he said it , but he basically said

28:59

I'm not going to be a successful

29:01

pastor if you're

29:03

doing all of this work as a worship leader

29:05

but then by the end of your life you don't follow

29:08

Christ . You're

29:10

doing all this work , but are you

29:12

waiting on the Lord ? It's good , are

29:14

you actually spending time with Jesus

29:16

? And so for him he always made

29:18

that like a priority for me to

29:21

go . This needs to be first

29:23

in my life . And so I really appreciate

29:25

, like those words he gave me yeah

29:27

, it's cool .

29:30

As we wind down here , I wanna rewind

29:32

a little bit to something you said , and it

29:34

was way at the beginning , probably about half an hour ago , mitch

29:36

, but you mentioned when you first

29:38

became a Christian

29:40

. You kind of acted like

29:42

a Pharisee and we

29:45

talked in our pre-show meeting about

29:47

Pharisee Christians . What does that

29:49

term mean and how can

29:51

we avoid falling

29:53

into that trap ?

29:55

Yeah , I think that would . If I were to define

29:57

a Pharisee Christian which

30:00

is so ironic like you wouldn't think

30:02

that you could be as a Christian , you wouldn't think

30:05

you could be a Pharisee . But

30:07

I think what the trap is is

30:09

that we say with our mouth that we

30:12

follow Christ or that we're Christians , but

30:15

our heart and our action looks

30:17

very different , and so

30:20

that for me personally , it was like a very

30:22

much my salvation

30:24

felt more like a workspace salvation , Like

30:27

I didn't really understand that God's

30:29

grace was enough for me , but I felt

30:32

like I had to do works

30:34

, whether that be evangelizing

30:36

, and also

30:38

just like not showing love towards

30:40

people , like being very rude

30:43

and cynical and prideful early

30:46

on . And yeah

30:48

, and that's not a good . If you have those ingredients

30:51

, that's really not good because

30:53

you might think that you're following Christ . But

30:55

then when you realize like who the Pharisees

30:57

were in the Bible they

31:00

were Jewish religious

31:02

leaders that were waiting for

31:04

the Messiah you would think that they were , they

31:07

should be waiting and expecting the Messiah , but

31:09

when the Messiah came , they crucified

31:12

him . And so we

31:15

definitely don't wanna do that as Christians is

31:17

when we're supposed to be following

31:19

in Christ's footsteps but then we actually

31:22

end up fighting against Christ

31:24

by how we're living and how we're treating

31:26

other people Like . That's

31:29

not good .

31:29

Yeah , I don't know about you , dan . I

31:31

know I had a self-righteous phase college

31:34

, was it ? So my faith came alive and I

31:37

think I began trusting in my own religious

31:39

actions and not in Jesus'

31:42

work . And so there should

31:44

be no such thing as an arrogant Christian , because

31:47

the root of our faith is you're actually trusting

31:50

in someone else's actions that

31:52

you've done nothing with , so you're trusting

31:54

in Jesus' work on the cross . So it's nothing

31:57

of myself , so no one can boast , as what Ephesians

31:59

says . So there's no room

32:01

for arrogance , no room for pride . I'm not better than anyone

32:03

else because I'm having a real life , fully on Jesus

32:05

. And if you look at the religious leaders

32:07

, you can look in Matthew 6 , where he talks

32:09

about giving , praying , fasting

32:12

, and he says they do it all to be seen by people

32:14

. You go to Matthew 23, . It's

32:17

the seven . Woes , woe to you who do this

32:19

right . This is they tie up heavy loads

32:21

, put them on men's shoulders , but they themselves

32:23

are not willing to lift a finger to move them . That's

32:26

what he's speaking against these burdens that they're putting

32:28

on people . They're showing you how great I

32:31

am and not helping you do things .

32:33

It's fasting , praying in the streets .

32:34

Praying in the streets . All visibility , all about

32:37

me , and that's the thing . There's

32:39

no arrogance if you . It's all about Jesus

32:41

.

32:41

And you hear a lot of people criticize Christians

32:44

and say Christians are all judgmental . Of

32:46

course that's kind of

32:49

based off misinformation . All Christians

32:51

are that way and if we're truly following

32:53

Christ like , we're not gonna be like that . But

32:56

I think that when people identify

32:58

a Christian as being someone , that's judgmental

33:00

. That's where you tend to see

33:02

like the Pharisee , the

33:04

Pharisee DNA .

33:07

Yeah , I agree , makes a lot of sense . I

33:10

think we've unpacked these

33:12

verses really well . We've had

33:14

some really good discussion here . Any

33:16

closing thoughts ? You guys might have

33:18

anything that you wanna leave people

33:21

who are listening or watching this as

33:24

we close on the podcast today .

33:27

I think we'll circle it right back to that verse

33:29

where Jesus says come to me all you who

33:31

are weary . So if you're weary today

33:34

, then our prayer is that you

33:36

would come to Jesus , that you would humble

33:38

yourself today , and all

33:40

you have to do is just invite him , Invite

33:43

him , say Lord Jesus , I'm coming to you

33:45

right now , and you'll find that he's already there

33:47

.

33:48

Yeah , I think there's a unique work rest dynamic

33:51

in our culture today . We're used to working

33:53

and working , and working , but we don't rest well

33:55

. So you gotta rest for

33:58

salvation and that's the humility portion you're saying

34:00

, coming to him frequently , so

34:03

that's where that rest for our souls is . So

34:05

I think I just wonder what we're working for for

34:07

identity , for success

34:09

, adoration , whatever it might be , but rest

34:11

in Jesus . Be encouragement from this verse . Good

34:14

stuff , Mitch .

34:15

Beautifully said guys . All right , we'll close

34:17

the podcast there . King and King's Family

34:19

, let's keep living our lives beyond

34:21

Sunday MUSIC

34:37

.