0:00

You know how it is. You're managing social

0:02

media, and you feel like you're lost in a maze trying

0:04

to keep up with all the shifts and turns in

0:06

the landscape. It's a lot, and we

0:08

get it. That's where Dash Hudson's Social Media

0:10

Trends Report comes in. This is the same platform

0:13

trusted by amazing brands like United

0:16

Airlines, Rare Beauty, and P&G.

0:18

Dash Hudson's all about delivering deep insights

0:21

and workflow tools, keeping you in the know and

0:23

saving you time. So you can get back to doing

0:25

what you love, making marketing magic happen.

0:27

And today, Dash Hudson's got an amazing offer

0:29

for you. They're giving you exclusive access to their

0:32

highly anticipated Social Media Trends

0:34

Report. This free report unveils the

0:36

social media industry's leading trends

0:39

and insights, such as the remarkable

0:41

impact of creators on brand engagement,

0:43

and the incredible 100% sales boost that

0:46

engaging content on TikTok can achieve. Download

0:48

their trends report and sign up for a free

0:50

14-day trial of Dash Hudson today at dashhudson.com

0:54

slash podcast. That's D-A-S-H-H-U-D-S-O-N.com

0:58

slash podcast.

1:01

♪ Ahhhhhhhh-ahhhhhhhhh ♪ ♪ Ahhhhhhhhh-ahhhhhhhhhhh ♪

1:09

♪ Ahhhhhhhhhhhhh-ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh ♪ ♪ Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh ♪

1:17

Hello and welcome back to another episode of Beyond

1:20

The To Do List. I'm your host, Eric

1:22

Fischer, and this is the show where I talk to the people

1:24

behind the productivity.

1:26

This week, I'm excited to share with you a conversation

1:28

I had with Joey Coleman. He

1:31

is the author of Never Lose An Employee

1:33

Again, the subtitle, The Simple

1:36

Path To Remarkable Retention.

1:38

And I've known of Joey for a very

1:40

long time because he had a previous book called

1:43

Never Lose A Customer Again, which

1:45

was very much in the marketing circles that

1:47

I moved through. And he's been in the customer

1:50

experience field for 20 plus

1:52

years, helping organizations create

1:54

remarkable customer and employee

1:57

experiences. So in this conversation,

1:59

we're focused on him.

1:59

focusing in on his new book and we're talking

2:02

about that crucial first 100 days

2:04

of a new job

2:06

where the employer has an important

2:09

job to make a positive first

2:11

impression. We also walk through

2:13

the employee journey through eight phases,

2:16

yes, eight phases as well

2:19

as the impact of remote work on

2:21

that onboarding process. We're going

2:23

to talk about the significance of that

2:25

acclimating phase in the beginning, how organizations

2:28

can avoid information overload and excessive

2:31

speed when they're doing onboarding. I have

2:33

been there. I know many of you have been.

2:36

So much information, so little time, not

2:39

striking that and not reversing that like

2:41

Willy Wonka, but also how the interconnectedness

2:44

of the customer and employee experiences

2:47

are crucial for organizations to

2:49

prioritize. They can't just pick one or the other,

2:51

they have to do both well. And

2:53

also we get into strategies and techniques

2:55

to create a meaningful remote onboarding

2:58

experience, making sure that new employees

3:00

feel affirmed and connected

3:03

even when they're not physically present in

3:05

the office. So I'm going to get out of

3:07

the way and just say enjoy this conversation

3:10

with Joey Coleman. Well,

3:13

this week it is my privilege to welcome to the

3:15

show Joey Coleman. Joey, welcome to

3:18

Beyond the To Do List. Thank

3:20

you, Eric. It is such a pleasure to be here. So

3:22

appreciate the invitation and so appreciate

3:24

everybody joining in. I'm glad that listening

3:27

to this podcast was on your to do list

3:29

folks who are listening. I'm glad that you made time

3:31

to listen to the show. Well done. Well

3:34

done. Thanks for the extra intro there. So okay.

3:38

Now, I know this is one of those questions that

3:40

you probably get asked a lot because I know

3:42

and knew of you before you were talking or

3:45

at least recently talking about the book, Never

3:47

Lose an Employee Again. You

3:50

used to be and still are somebody who talks about the customer

3:52

journey and business firing

3:54

on all cylinders and being good at

3:56

what they're good at in terms of serving their customers.

4:00

The other side of the house, or I should say the inside

4:02

of the house is where you're focusing right now. What

4:04

changed your perspective or your

4:07

dial on your telescope or your

4:09

microscope or whatever you want to call it? So

4:11

you know it's interesting, Eric. I've been in the

4:14

customer experience space for over 20 years. And

4:17

I had been in that space for about, let me

4:19

see, oh yeah, five minutes when I

4:21

realized that you can't have a great customer

4:23

experience if you don't have remarkable

4:25

employees who are going to help you deliver that

4:28

experience. So it's something that I've

4:30

always seen as part of the conversation. The reason

4:32

I decided to write a book specifically

4:34

about the employee side of experience

4:37

as opposed to just the customer side of experience

4:39

is because I think in most organizations

4:42

they see those two topics as being

4:45

totally separate. There's the people on our team

4:47

that work on CX or customer experience

4:49

and then there's the people on our team that work on EX

4:51

or employee experience. When the reality

4:54

is customer experience and employee experience

4:56

are completely intertwined. They're two sides

4:59

of the same coin. As we improve one,

5:01

we improve the other. As one goes down,

5:03

it drags the other down with it. Now

5:05

I know that you've got some interesting

5:08

kind of stats, I guess. This one shocked

5:10

me, the one about how many

5:12

people. It's like a pretty high percentage that

5:14

in their first chunk of time end

5:16

up not staying at a job they just

5:19

started. I think people would be pretty startled

5:21

to hear that. Yeah. All

5:24

industries globally, 40% of

5:26

new hires won't make the

5:28

one year anniversary. What's

5:33

crazier than that is 22% will leave in the first 45

5:35

days. If

5:38

you're talking about hourly workers, 50% quit

5:41

their job within the first 100 days. Depending

5:44

on the role you have, depending on the industry you're working

5:47

in, it is significant double

5:49

digit percentage of people who

5:51

are leaving almost as quickly as we

5:53

bring them in the front door. It's amazing.

5:56

I mean, amazing in a not good

5:58

way. It's a bad thing. kind of shocking

6:01

to hear those statistics. We think,

6:03

oh, well, that's just more of a now thing,

6:06

but I think that's probably been around for a while, right? We've

6:08

heard all the big stats, big numbers,

6:11

layoffs. We're like, oh, no, that's

6:13

part of that. The layoffs are part of that. No,

6:15

actually. Yeah. For

6:18

example, that 40% number started to cross

6:20

into 40% in about 2007. Let's

6:24

just base that in. In 2007, the number

6:26

was 40%. And

6:28

it's been growing since then, right? But

6:31

that's kind of global data looking at

6:33

it, and it's only increasing. I came across some

6:35

data, speaking of the now, two days

6:38

ago, brand new research released by Gartner.

6:40

I found that fascinating. Okay. Brand

6:43

new research. Gartner surveyed 3,500

6:46

people who had accepted a

6:48

job offer in Q1 of 2023. So

6:51

a couple months ago, Q1 of 2023, they

6:53

had accepted the job offer. Of

6:55

those people who accepted the job offer, 50%

6:59

did not show up for the first day of work because

7:02

they had accepted another job offer

7:05

in the interim period between accepting the

7:07

first job offer.

7:10

50%, that's the now number. That's

7:13

the current number. That's

7:16

what businesses are dealing with today. That's

7:18

insane to me because I go on my LinkedIn,

7:20

and I know personally, privately

7:22

on other networks too, but on LinkedIn

7:25

specifically, I see friends sharing other

7:28

colleagues positions that they're looking

7:30

for. Like people are looking. They're trying

7:32

to get people to fill these spots. And then

7:34

also, I know of people who've been searching and

7:36

looking for most of this year.

7:39

So to hear that half of the

7:41

people that had said yes,

7:43

then didn't show up, I'm just like, what

7:46

is going on? I don't understand.

7:48

This is a great conversation, Eric,

7:50

and it's a perplexing situation. The

7:54

reality is the numbers show,

7:56

aggregately, across all people, that

7:59

we have more jobs than

8:01

we have employees to fill.

8:03

There are more open positions on

8:06

the planet than there are workers who

8:08

want to work those positions. We also

8:10

have a really interesting thing that's happened since COVID

8:13

in that pre-COVID, the majority

8:15

of people worked for an employer

8:18

that was located within 30 miles

8:20

of their home. Now, many

8:22

people work for an employer that isn't even

8:24

in the same state or the same country

8:27

as their home. This is kind of the benefit

8:29

of remote work and companies

8:31

and organizations getting comfortable with people

8:33

not being under the same roof working together.

8:36

The challenge though is to your friends and

8:38

the folks you know, and I know some too, who are looking

8:40

for jobs. There are some people

8:43

who for whatever criteria they have

8:45

established on their job search can't

8:48

seem to find work. And

8:50

this is the disconnect with employers

8:52

saying, we can't find good people, and the employees

8:55

saying, I can't get the job I wanna have. The

8:57

operative words in that are the job

9:00

I wanna have and good people,

9:03

right? So we can find people, but maybe

9:05

not the right ones. We can get a job,

9:07

but maybe not the right one. I think the

9:09

opportunity for us is to get clearer about

9:11

what we're looking for as employees and what

9:14

we're looking for as employers. Well,

9:16

I wanna come back around to the beginning here and

9:18

say, okay, you've got a brand new book out. It's called Never

9:21

Lose an Employee Again, The Simple Path

9:23

to Remarkable Retention. Now I know

9:25

books take a while, not just in the writing

9:27

phase, but in the planning and marketing and

9:30

eventually releasing phase. So this

9:32

has been in the works for a while.

9:34

So in light of all that, I'm

9:37

curious, at what stage in

9:39

the previous now were you

9:41

deciding this is the book and it needed

9:44

to happen now? So not long

9:46

after my first book, Never Lose a Customer Again

9:48

came out in 2018, I started

9:50

thinking about the next book. And part

9:52

of the impetus for the next book came from an email

9:55

I received from somebody who had read my first

9:57

book. And the email just said this, Dear

9:59

Joe. If you wrote a book called Never

10:01

Lose an Employee Again, I would buy

10:04

it and it was signed by the sender of the email.

10:06

I thought, well, that's interesting. I hadn't, to be

10:08

candid, thought of the simple task

10:10

of swapping out one word in the title and

10:13

changing to an N and saying, like,

10:15

oh, we could have the same book. But again, I knew that

10:17

employee experience and customer experience, too, sides

10:20

of the same coin. Well, I

10:22

subsequently received almost

10:24

a dozen emails that

10:26

were exactly the same. No additional

10:29

context, just, dear Joey, if you

10:31

wrote a book called Never Lose an Employee Again, I would

10:34

buy it. Now, the marketer

10:36

in me says, that is a buying sign

10:38

from the marketplace that there's an interest in this.

10:40

So I started doing some of my own research. I started

10:42

talking to other business owners I knew. I started

10:45

looking at this and I realized a couple of things.

10:47

Number one, employee retention was

10:50

a bigger problem than customer retention.

10:53

And even fewer people were talking about the issues

10:55

with employee retention than were talking about

10:57

the issues with customer retention. So I'm like, oh,

11:00

target rich environment, this is a big issue something

11:02

people need to pay attention to. I

11:04

then started realizing how many leaders

11:07

were struggling mightily with this.

11:10

They didn't feel they knew what to do. They didn't know how

11:12

to do it. They were lost in both strategy

11:15

and tactics and didn't have a formula

11:17

or a mode for doing this. I

11:19

then took the formula that we had applied for customer

11:21

experiences and started applying

11:24

it with some of my private coaching clients for

11:26

their employee experience. And the results

11:28

we saw, Eric, were incredible.

11:31

We took employee retention numbers through

11:33

the roof. We stopped having employees

11:36

quit. We had people that were able

11:38

to see increased profitability,

11:40

increased productivity, increased efficiency

11:43

because they weren't running a revolving door

11:45

when it came to their employees. That

11:47

led me to reach out to my publisher and say, I got

11:50

an idea for a second book, never lose an employee

11:52

again. So we signed the deal and

11:54

then COVID came along.

11:55

And when COVID came along, I reached out to my publisher

11:58

and I said, stop the presses.

11:59

printing yet, but I always wanted to say that. We

12:02

got to pump the brakes on this because I think the

12:04

landscape for work is

12:07

about to be changed in a way that is unprecedented

12:10

in human history and is going to change

12:12

the experience that people have with work

12:15

for the foreseeable future. And I'm

12:17

thinking decades, not quarters.

12:20

Thankfully we did. And it allowed us to

12:22

write more about remote work, think more about remote

12:24

work, factor these things into the book, into the concepts

12:27

we were exploring, and that's how we end

12:29

up in the now. So you got to see

12:31

things kind of shake loose, fall

12:33

apart to a certain extent, for better or for worse,

12:36

both really, and then kind

12:38

of take the pulse and then in a

12:40

way be part of the solution

12:43

with this book. At least that's

12:45

certainly been my hope, Eric, right? We try as

12:47

human beings wherever we can to be as much

12:50

of a part of the solution as opposed to being part

12:52

of the problem. And I like to think, and the readers

12:54

have responded this way and the folks who have implemented

12:57

the strategies and tactics in the books,

13:00

that they're seeing incredible results.

13:02

Okay, so I'm gonna try and stump you, though I

13:04

know that that's probably not gonna happen. Without

13:07

diving into the depths of

13:09

the book just yet, on

13:11

a very surface level, is there

13:13

some kind of just simple

13:16

disconnect you can point to between

13:19

what potential employees are looking for

13:21

and what potential employers

13:24

are willing to offer or are looking for?

13:26

Is that the answer here? Is the disconnect

13:28

the issue? And then how do we start

13:30

to even inch into, again I

13:33

don't assume that it's always the potential employees

13:35

fault, per se. I think maybe

13:38

more of the onus goes on employers, but

13:41

maybe not. So anyway, there's like five questions

13:43

in there. Take your pick. Let me see if I can

13:45

parse out one or two. So here's

13:47

what I think on this. It's kind of like when

13:50

you have two siblings that are fighting.

13:52

I don't know about you, but I grew up in a family and one

13:55

of seven kids and my parents always

13:57

used to say things like it takes two to tango. It

13:59

takes two. to fight. It's not just one's

14:01

fault or the other, right? No matter what has happened,

14:05

99% of the time. I think the same holds true in

14:07

an employment context. We've got challenges with

14:09

the employees, we've got challenges with the employers,

14:12

and each are equally to be

14:15

praised and equally to be

14:17

criticized for some of the ways that

14:19

they show up. If I were to boil

14:21

it down to the fundamental disconnect

14:24

between employers and employees, it

14:26

can be summed up in the following sentence. If

14:28

I go and talk to CEOs,

14:32

leaders, business owners, the

14:34

common lament that almost all of

14:36

them have is, I wish my employees

14:39

cared as much about this business as

14:42

I do. Okay. But if

14:44

I were to go to the typical employee

14:46

in that business, I would find

14:49

a common lament of, I

14:51

wish my employer cared as

14:53

much about me as they care

14:55

about the business. This

14:58

disconnect, this fundamental

15:01

belief that those people over

15:03

there don't care about me

15:05

is pervasive in almost every area of our

15:07

life and it gets magnified in

15:10

the workplace. Here's what I know

15:12

to be true though. I've had the pleasure of

15:14

working with tens of thousands, if not

15:16

hundreds of thousands of businesses all around

15:19

the world. All the CEOs, all

15:21

the leaders that I've talked to actually

15:23

do care deeply about

15:25

their employees. But I think many

15:28

struggle with showing it

15:30

or saying it. And I think most

15:33

employees actually care about

15:35

the place they work. They want to contribute. They

15:37

want to be seen as providing value. They

15:39

want to create an impact.

15:41

But they're not particularly clear

15:44

that that is recognized or

15:46

wanted or appreciated.

15:49

And so I think that's the disconnect we're dealing

15:51

with. That does ring true to me.

15:53

I mean, I've been in a number of places and it's

15:56

been varying degrees

15:58

of, we care about you. We're a family

16:01

here and other different descriptors

16:04

and you know describing the mission statement

16:06

and our core values and This

16:08

is what we believe and you have worse

16:11

and we want to celebrate you and all these different things again

16:13

When I hear all that I'm thinking to myself Okay The

16:16

employer Wants them

16:18

to care about the business as much as

16:20

they do the onus for that I think comes more

16:22

on the employer To provide the onus

16:25

of doing that because I think sometimes the employees just

16:27

think no I'm looking for fit

16:29

I'm looking for meaning I'm looking for and

16:32

we've heard all this before obviously This has been yeah

16:34

part of the vernacular of the business world

16:36

as well as calling and all these kinds of great

16:39

words and The deep meanings that come

16:41

along with those however, I'm

16:43

speaking from personal experience here. So I really

16:45

feel like it's the Organization

16:48

a larger percentage. I don't know

16:50

how much larger But I think a larger

16:52

percentage of it and tell me if this is

16:54

ringing true at all I think the larger percentage

16:57

falls on them because it's their place and

16:59

it's their Facilitation of the inner

17:01

and outer workings of all of it.

17:04

Eric. I would agree with you I think the larger

17:07

percentage does fall on the organization

17:10

But before anybody gets super excited that

17:12

doesn't mean that the employees percentage is

17:14

zero or one percent, right? This

17:17

may be a fifty one forty nine

17:19

type thing. This may be a 60 40 type thing The

17:22

organization has the ability and

17:25

the resources to put into place

17:27

the systems the processes the frameworks

17:30

To allow an employee to develop

17:32

a career to allow an employee to impact

17:35

at a greater level than they could impact if

17:37

they were On their own however, it

17:39

is not enough for employees

17:41

to hit the workforce and be like I

17:44

want you to take care of me Mom and dad. I want

17:46

you to think about everything. So I don't have to think

17:48

about anything I want you to spoon

17:50

feed me everything we spoon feed a

17:53

baby But pretty quickly

17:55

the baby starts feeding themselves and

17:58

if we're still spoon feeding the ten-year old,

18:00

we need to have some conversations about our

18:02

approach to parenting. So I

18:05

think there needs to be some give and take,

18:08

but I do think the organization,

18:10

the employer, has to go first,

18:13

has to lay the foundation and say, this

18:15

is our plan for developing your career. This

18:17

is our plan for checking in with you to seeing

18:19

if you're happy. This is our plan to making

18:22

sure that you feel that next year

18:24

is more successful for you than this year.

18:28

However, you have a responsibility to

18:30

avail yourself of these opportunities. You have

18:32

a responsibility to tell us what you're thinking.

18:34

You have a responsibility that if something

18:36

isn't working, to raise your hand and say, hey,

18:38

this isn't working for me, instead of getting

18:41

jaded and poisoning your coworkers and then

18:43

turning around and saying, that's it, I'm out of here and

18:45

flipping your desk as you leave the office. Right?

18:48

So there's got to be some give and take from both sides. So

18:50

speaking of infancy, I think that that's a great

18:53

place to kind of say, you've got this framework

18:56

of the first hundred days, almost that infancy

18:58

of your employment, whatever the

19:01

establishment is. Can you break that down

19:03

for us, that first hundred days and why that's so

19:05

important? Yeah. So the first hundred

19:07

days is not only important because it's

19:09

an interesting short period amount of time,

19:12

but it's interesting because all the research

19:14

shows that our opinions, our

19:17

beliefs as human beings about whether

19:19

we want to stay with an employer, the

19:21

foundation for that is late in the first hundred

19:23

days. Does initial impressions

19:26

matter? That initial time of getting

19:28

used to a culture, getting up to speed on their

19:30

cadence and their operation of doing business,

19:32

connecting personally and emotionally with our coworkers

19:35

and our colleagues and figuring out what our

19:37

role in the culture is going to be. All

19:39

of those things happen very early on

19:41

in the relationship. Now the question then becomes,

19:44

Eric, is when is day one

19:46

of the first hundred days? Many

19:49

employers believe that day one is your

19:51

first day on the job. I wholeheartedly

19:54

disagree with that assessment. Day

19:56

one is when the prospective

19:59

employee... First says, I'd

20:02

like to explore employment

20:04

with this employer. So the first

20:06

time they come to the careers page or the about us

20:08

page on your website, the first time they submit

20:11

an application or a resume, the

20:13

first time they see your help wanted ad, when

20:16

their mind first says, hmm,

20:18

this could be a place for me, that's

20:21

when that 100 day clock starts ticking.

20:24

So when you think about your interview and hiring process,

20:27

when you think about the gap between when

20:29

they accept their job offer and they have to give

20:31

notice where they're working maybe two weeks and they're

20:33

going to come work for you two weeks later, in many

20:36

scenarios when they show up for the quote unquote

20:38

first day on the job, it

20:40

might be day 15, day 30 of that 100 day experience.

20:46

And everything you've been doing before then

20:48

has contributed to the connection

20:50

they feel to your organization

20:52

and your enterprise. Now how rigid

20:55

of a timeframe here

20:57

for that 100 days are we talking? And are we

20:59

trying to find out like, hey, so how did

21:01

you hear about us? Like if they get to the point of submitting

21:04

an application and they get to the point of getting an interview

21:06

and then they get to the point of an offer and

21:08

they accept it and then they show up and

21:10

we get to that other date that most

21:13

people would think is the start of the 100 days,

21:15

it could have been 30, 60, 90 days or even more

21:18

than 100 days already at

21:20

that point. So I'm curious,

21:22

what's the flexibility in terms of this timeframe?

21:25

There's definitely some flexibility and we

21:27

want to bring some logic and some

21:30

empathy to the conversation when we look at

21:32

these numbers in these frameworks. But

21:34

I think if you're not sure, presume

21:37

that the day they submit their application

21:39

or send in their resume is day one.

21:42

If you're not sure, just start there

21:44

and then run it. And so if you've got an organization

21:47

where from the time somebody submits a resume to

21:49

the time you call them for an interview is 60

21:51

days, guess what? There are going to be a

21:53

lot of people that don't even want to come in for an interview. And

21:56

some people say to me, they're like, Joey, we just can't

21:58

get people to come for interviews. Awesome, what's the lag

22:00

time between submission and when you call them back?

22:03

Well, we've got a lot going on right now. Oh,

22:05

great, love the defensiveness that is coming into

22:08

the conversation already. How about we answer

22:10

the question? Oh, it's about 90 days. What

22:12

in your life do you say I'm

22:15

interested in and 90 days later

22:17

when they say, okay, I'm interested in you too, are

22:19

we willing to say, okay, great, let's start a relationship?

22:22

Very few things, okay, very few

22:24

things. So I think we need to pay attention

22:26

to that time. It's less to me about

22:29

what day is it and more about

22:32

what phase in the employee journey

22:34

are you in? And I detail in the book,

22:37

eight phases of the employee journey.

22:39

And I think the key thing organizations

22:42

need to remember is what phase

22:44

are you in right now and what phase

22:46

am I trying to get you to next? And

22:49

they come in a linear progression. And

22:51

where we get into trouble is when we try to jump

22:53

around and move too fast or jump

22:55

too far in the journey too quickly.

22:59

I wanna definitely jump into those eight phases.

23:01

One more thought here on the 100 days. So

23:04

in that initial 100 days, and I wanna

23:07

also couch that into where it falls

23:09

in the eight phases, obviously probably right up

23:11

front somewhere. But in those

23:13

first 100 days, what do

23:15

employers need to be focusing on

23:18

so that that first 100 days is going right, getting

23:22

a good kickstart to this relationship? I

23:25

think we can do a couple of things and we can dive deep

23:27

into the specifics as we continue the

23:29

conversation. But I think generally, I

23:31

would want employers to keep two basic

23:33

things in mind. Number one, it's

23:36

about the first 100 days, not

23:38

the first two days. Way

23:40

too many employers are like, let's flood

23:42

them with information on their first day at work

23:45

and their second day at work, and then push them into

23:47

the deep end of the pool and say, just swim and produce

23:49

and provide value for us. No, we have

23:52

to think more intentionally

23:54

about the time frames that we're

23:57

talking about and how much time we're giving people.

23:59

So we don't wanna... make it too much.

24:01

And we also don't want to make

24:03

it too little. It's not enough to

24:06

say, well, they applied 30 days ago and

24:08

they got the job and now they're

24:10

here at work. So I'll pay attention to the, you

24:12

know, the next two months and then that's it.

24:14

And then it's on autopilot and we're off to the races.

24:16

No, the first hundred days is about laying

24:19

a foundation. The research shows that if

24:21

on day 101, you're loving being

24:23

at work, the typical employee will stay there for

24:25

at least three years. That's what the

24:27

data shows. That's what the research shows. But

24:30

they're not going to stay there if on day 101,

24:32

you're like, my work is done here. We don't

24:34

need to do anything else to build personal and emotional

24:36

connection with our team. So the first

24:39

hundred days is really meant to kickstart the

24:41

conversation and kickstart your focus and

24:43

your intentionality. But once this

24:45

foundation is laid, we need to continue to build

24:47

on it going forward. Every

24:50

year, the number and scope of data breaches

24:52

worldwide is rising. And according to

24:54

the 2021 annual data breach report

24:56

by Identity Theft Resource Center, there

24:58

were 68% more breaches in 2021 than

25:01

the year before. Basically, in a nutshell, your personal

25:03

information is being sold or published online

25:05

without you even knowing about it. The good news is

25:07

you have the right to protect your privacy by

25:09

requesting data brokers delete what information

25:11

they have about you. The bad news is it's going to take

25:14

you years to do it manually. But that's where

25:16

Incogni comes in. Incogni reaches out

25:18

to data brokers on your behalf, requests your

25:20

personal data be removed, and deals with any objections

25:22

from their side. When I signed up for Incogni,

25:25

it was super quick and easy, and I saw them go to

25:27

work right away in my dashboard. I can see

25:29

the requests that are sent, the requests in

25:31

progress. I even started to see immediately

25:34

requests completed, which was great. And

25:36

the whole process is automated. Go to incogni.com

25:39

slash beyond and use code beyond for

25:41

an exclusive 60% off an annual Incogni

25:44

plan. That's promo code beyond at incognincogni.com

25:49

slash beyond for 60% off.

25:53

Take a minute to think about your favorite entrepreneur.

25:55

They wouldn't be anywhere without trusted partners.

25:58

And if your commerce platform scaring away

26:00

potential customers instead of converting them into

26:03

lifelong fans, you have to try

26:05

Shopify. Shopify is the commerce platform

26:07

revolutionizing millions of businesses

26:10

worldwide. Whether you're just getting started as a

26:12

garage entrepreneur or you're IPO

26:14

ready, Shopify is the only tool you need

26:16

to start, run, and grow your business

26:19

without the struggle. That's because Shopify

26:21

puts you in control of every sales

26:23

channel. So no matter what it is you're

26:26

selling, satin sheets, or an in-person

26:28

POS system, Shopify's all-in-one

26:30

e-commerce platform has you covered. And

26:33

once you've reached your audience, Shopify has

26:35

the internet's best converting checkout to

26:37

help you turn them from browsers to buyers.

26:40

There's just something to be said for a trusted

26:42

partner like how I hired an editor

26:44

to edit this podcast. They know what

26:47

they're doing. I have confidence in their ability,

26:49

just like you can have confidence in Shopify's

26:52

ability, because they power 10% of

26:54

all e-commerce in the US. They're a

26:56

truly global force powering all

26:58

birds, Rothy's, Brooklyn and

27:01

millions of other entrepreneurs of every size

27:03

across 170 countries. Plus, Shopify's

27:05

award-winning help is there to support your success

27:07

every step of the way. This is Possibility,

27:10

powered by Shopify. Sign up for

27:12

a $1 per month trial, period, at Shopify.com

27:15

slash beyond, all lowercase. Go

27:17

to Shopify.com slash beyond

27:20

to take your business to the next level today.

27:22

Shopify.com slash beyond.

27:27

Inflation. The new smartphone. A.I.

27:31

What do they all have in common? It's all

27:33

about the money. Economics is everywhere.

27:36

And everything. Fueling our lives even

27:38

when we least expect it. If you're a fan of

27:40

Beyond the To-Do List and are curious to learn

27:42

something new and exciting about economics every week, I

27:45

recommend you listen to the Planet Money podcast from NPR.

27:47

Planet Money's a different kind of world where the complex

27:49

economy actually makes sense, where

27:52

human stories supersede abstract theories

27:54

and listeners can learn, laugh and be

27:57

entertained. true

28:00

story behind the recent film Dumb

28:02

Money about when a group of amateur investors

28:05

rallied around the stock for GameStop back in 2021

28:08

and Planet Money spells out what that means

28:10

for the rest of us. Will AI take over our

28:12

jobs? Why are Christmas trees so dang expensive?

28:15

The Planet Money team lives to tell a good story

28:17

in around 30 minutes and it's econ for

28:19

the rest of us. Listen now to Planet Money from NPR

28:22

wherever you get your podcasts. Okay,

28:26

so the word first, obviously that implies

28:29

it comes right up front. Where

28:31

does that 100 days fall in the eight

28:33

phases? Is it the first thing or is it part

28:35

of the first thing? Kind of, let's walk through

28:37

these eight phases, give a good like

28:40

overview of what we're finding in each of these phases.

28:42

Absolutely. So Eric, let me give you a speed

28:45

overview of the eight phases and

28:47

just for everybody listening those they all start with

28:49

the letter A and the idea behind

28:51

that is because if you get each of these

28:53

eight phases right, it's like getting straight

28:55

A's on your report card from your employees. They're

28:58

loving the experience, they're feeling good, you're firing

29:00

on all cylinders. All right, the first

29:02

phase is the assess phase. This

29:04

is when a prospective employee is trying

29:07

to decide whether or not they want to work with you and

29:09

we're trying to decide if this is the person

29:11

we want to hire. They're assessing our company,

29:14

we're assessing them as a candidate. In

29:17

the assess phase, they're looking at your job description

29:19

or your job posting, your classified ad. They're

29:22

submitting their resume or their application.

29:24

They're going through your interview and hiring

29:26

process. That's all happening

29:28

in the assess phase. We then come to phase two, the

29:31

accept phase. The accept phase has

29:33

two component pieces. We as the employer

29:35

say, I accept that this is the candidate

29:37

we want, so we're going to extend an offer

29:39

to you. That candidate ideally

29:42

accepts our job offer. They

29:44

sign on the dotted line, they officially transition

29:47

from being a prospective employee to being

29:49

an actual employee. We then come

29:51

to phase three, the affirm phase.

29:54

The affirm phase is all about

29:56

the emotional feeling that someone has

29:59

right after they accept. accept the job offer. In

30:01

a customer context, many of us are familiar

30:03

with the phrase, buyer's remorse. When

30:05

a buyer begins to doubt the purchase decision

30:08

they just made. Allow me to introduce

30:10

you to a phrase that you might not be as familiar

30:12

with, which is new hire's remorse.

30:15

It's the exact same scientifically

30:18

proven emotional experience

30:20

that happens when someone

30:22

accepts a job offer and then

30:24

begins to doubt the decision

30:26

they just made. Most

30:29

organizations aren't doing anything to

30:31

affirm the person's choice, which

30:33

is why I see earlier statistic 50% of

30:36

the people went and accepted a different job offer

30:38

because somebody came with something better, something

30:41

more interesting, something more intriguing. We

30:43

then come to the fourth phase of the eight phases,

30:45

the activate phase. This is

30:47

the first official day on the job,

30:50

the first official day at work. So again, not

30:52

day one in the hundred days. Day one in the hundred days

30:54

began when they submitted the application, right?

30:56

When they saw the ad, when they said, this

30:59

is a place I want to work. This is

31:01

often day 15, day 20, day 30,

31:03

depending on where we are in the process. When they

31:05

show up for that first day on the job, though, the

31:08

question is, what are we going

31:10

to do to make that day absolutely

31:12

remarkable?

31:13

Because what we know for a fact is at

31:15

the end of that day, that employee is going

31:18

to go home to their significant other, their spouse,

31:20

their parents, their children, their roommate.

31:23

On their way home, if they live alone, they're going to call someone.

31:25

They're going to say, hey, you know, I just finished

31:28

up. And what is that loved one going to

31:30

say to them? The first question, how

31:32

was the first day on the job?

31:35

We as an organization should be thinking

31:37

strategically about what

31:39

we're doing to get them to answer that question

31:42

in the way we'd like them to answer it. Because

31:44

if I were to take anybody listening, Eric, and

31:46

say, think of a job you had in the past

31:49

and tell me about your first day on the job.

31:51

Most people can describe in detail what happened

31:53

on their first day on the job, because it's that

31:56

memorable. It's a core memory

31:59

in our brains. So what are we doing to make that

32:01

great? We then come to phase five. Okay,

32:03

by the way, look at this. We're halfway through the eight phases

32:06

and it's you've just shown up for your first day of work. Phase

32:08

five is the acclimate phase. It begins on

32:11

day two, your second day at work and

32:13

it continues for weeks or even

32:16

months as you get used to this new

32:18

position, this new business, this

32:20

new culture, this way of operating. You're

32:22

learning about the requirements of the job. You're learning

32:24

about the role you play in the organization. You're

32:27

learning about the responsibilities

32:29

you have for the rest of the team and how you're

32:31

gonna deliver on your work. And you're learning about the

32:33

relationships you have with the other people

32:36

in the organization. Most organizations

32:39

approach this time period with

32:42

way too fast of action and

32:44

an overload of information. Let me tell

32:46

you everything you're ever gonna need to know about this position

32:49

on the first day at work and then second

32:51

day, just go figure it out. It'll be fine. No,

32:54

we need to pump the brakes. We need to space

32:56

it out. We need to bring these people

32:58

into the fold over time and that time

33:00

is weeks or months. Now, usually

33:03

to your point earlier, that hundred days is

33:06

ending somewhere in the acclimate

33:08

phase or maybe in this sixth phase,

33:10

the accomplished phase. The accomplished

33:13

phase is when an employee achieves

33:15

the goal they originally had when they decided

33:17

to come work for us. See, every employee

33:19

has a vision of what this new position

33:22

is gonna be like. The question is, as

33:24

employers, are we tracking what

33:26

their goals are? Are we paying attention

33:28

to their progress towards those milestones

33:31

and are we celebrating with them when

33:33

they accomplish their goal? We then come

33:35

to phase seven, the adopt phase.

33:37

This is when the employee becomes loyal to us

33:40

and only us. They're committed. They're not

33:42

gonna respond to that inquiry on LinkedIn. They're not

33:44

gonna pick up the call from the recruiter. They

33:46

are committed. The challenge in the adopter phase,

33:48

Eric, is that most of our adopters are

33:51

our most loyal, our most valuable employees

33:54

and in many organizations, we woefully

33:56

take them for granted. We do not

33:58

show them the type of attention care they deserve

34:01

and then when they quit, it is

34:03

absolutely devastating to our business

34:05

because not only do we lose a linchpin

34:08

in our organization, the brain

34:10

drain, the knowledge gap, the information

34:12

that they leave with can be crippling.

34:16

Last point we come to, the last of the

34:18

eight phases is the advocate phase.

34:20

This is when the employee becomes a raving

34:23

fan singing your praises far and wide. They're

34:25

going on Glassdoor and they're writing reviews. They're

34:27

looking to hire for a new position. They're

34:30

referring friends and candidates to apply

34:32

for that position who they know would be a great

34:34

fit for your culture and your organization.

34:37

These are the eight phases and if we pay

34:39

attention to these eight phases, we

34:41

can build long-term engaged and

34:44

retained team members. Wow.

34:47

Okay, so now I've got a better picture or at

34:49

least the listener has a better picture of where that

34:51

hundred days that we spent a bunch of time on, where

34:53

that kind of drapes over like

34:55

a tablecloth, could be like the first five,

34:58

six phases basically. Absolutely,

35:01

absolutely and sometimes it might be shorter

35:03

than that. Sometimes it might dip longer. Sometimes

35:05

you might have reached some of the adoption

35:07

level behaviors in the first 100 days

35:10

but in most organizations and I'm going to

35:12

define most as north

35:14

of 90% of the companies I've

35:16

seen around the world, that hundred days

35:19

is happening, that finish line of a

35:21

hundred days is happening somewhere in the acclimate

35:24

phase or maybe just

35:26

the very beginning of the accomplished phase because

35:28

here's the other nuance Eric. When somebody

35:30

hits their first accomplishment, what do they do? Well,

35:33

they pick a different goal. Well, now that I've

35:36

gotten used to this job, I've got a new

35:38

goal. I want to be promoted to

35:40

run this department. So

35:42

now their goal changes, that

35:44

moves out further and in some

35:47

ways we push them back down into

35:49

the acclimate phase as they're

35:51

trying to acclimate to the things they would need

35:53

to be able to do to achieve that next

35:55

goal. And so what are we doing

35:58

to kind of ebb and flow? with

36:00

our employees on an individual level,

36:03

which is why this stuff becomes so challenging as

36:05

your organization scales. You've got three

36:07

employees, you can kind of pay attention to where they're at.

36:10

You've got 300 employees, you better

36:12

have a department that's paying attention

36:14

to where they're at. Yeah, it

36:16

becomes a different set of priority

36:19

when it comes to that, when they're in that kind of

36:21

acclimate phase and it's, you know, okay,

36:24

acclimate and then what was the next one?

36:27

Achieve? Accomplish. Still

36:29

an A word, same thing. Still an A word and it's the exact

36:31

same thing, whether they're achieving or accomplishing, that's

36:33

where we're at. Disregarding the final

36:36

two or three, accomplishing and

36:38

acclimating cycles, you know,

36:41

over and over again. You don't want to be complacent as

36:43

an employee, you don't want them to be complacent as

36:45

an employer and so you want them

36:48

to be continually hitting new goals and making

36:50

new goals and then hitting them and achieving them and so on. Absolutely.

36:53

And Eric, after they get comfortable, they start to vacillate

36:56

between adopt and accomplish.

36:59

Because they're bought in, they know how it works. Oh, I'm

37:01

a doctor, I'm not going anywhere. But

37:03

what's my goal for this quarter? What's my goal

37:05

for this year? They're back and forth between

37:07

I'm committed, I'm bought in, but I still

37:10

need to feel a sense of progress. I

37:12

still need to feel a sense of momentum and accomplishment

37:15

and as organizations, we want to be

37:17

tracking that and celebrating it

37:19

with those folks because if we as

37:22

an organization don't celebrate

37:24

when they accomplish the goal, they're probably

37:26

not going to celebrate either. And if there's

37:29

nothing to celebrate about the work you're putting

37:31

in, it's real easy to leave

37:33

and go work somewhere else. And

37:35

that's totally true and I've seen that happen as well.

37:38

I think for me as well as others, I

37:40

couldn't help but also think of

37:42

this kind of overarching

37:46

themes the wrong word, but new reality, I guess,

37:48

that now covers all

37:51

eight phases, but especially

37:53

the early phases, four, five,

37:55

six, when it comes to remote

37:58

work and that new dynamic. I mentioned

38:00

being added in to all

38:02

of this. What are some of your thoughts on how

38:05

these first four, five, six phases

38:08

get affected by, I'm thinking specifically

38:10

of affirmation, how do you affirm

38:13

somebody when they're not coming

38:15

into an office? I'm going back to the scenario

38:17

you said where they can remember their first day, they

38:19

do their first day, and then someone asks

38:21

them, how was your first day? Meanwhile,

38:24

they sat in the same place that they

38:26

woke up in that whole day. Yeah,

38:29

no, this is a great point. So we're in that

38:31

first day on that job, that activate phase.

38:33

How do we activate it? How do we energize it? How

38:35

do we make it so remarkable? Two

38:38

thoughts on that, Eric. Number one, many

38:40

of the folks that are pushing for this return

38:42

to office are saying, well,

38:45

it was so much better before. Well,

38:47

what did your company do on an employee's

38:49

first day pre-COVID? Was

38:51

it that memorable? Was it that remarkable?

38:54

In most companies, statistically it wasn't. No

38:56

one knew they were starting, their computer wasn't ready,

38:59

their desk wasn't ready. They came in, we took

39:01

them into a conference room. We said, hey, here's some paperwork

39:03

to fill out about your insurance and your 401k. We're

39:06

gonna have you watch these sexual harassment videos

39:08

that were filmed in the 70s. You stay

39:10

here and sit awkwardly in this room by yourself and watch

39:12

these videos, take this quiz, and I'll come back in two

39:14

hours to take you to lunch with somebody

39:17

who, by the way, is not really on

39:19

your team, but it's somebody who we found who wanted to go to

39:21

lunch with you today, and they're not really

39:23

gonna have a lot to talk about, but they'll make sure you get

39:25

fed, and we'll pay for it, yay, and

39:27

then you'll come back and we'll bring you back to the conference

39:29

room again, because by the way, your desk still isn't ready,

39:31

and we don't have your computer hooked up, and IT is behind

39:34

things. So, you know what, why don't you just take these binders

39:36

home and read them, and we'll see you tomorrow. That's

39:38

what most first days look like in most

39:40

large corporations pre-COVID. So

39:43

let's not make it seem like it was so remarkable

39:45

and amazing pre-COVID, and that if they were just in

39:47

the office, this would be so much better. How

39:49

do we handle this in a remote scenario? Well,

39:52

what happens if on the first day

39:54

on the job, instead of making someone

39:56

spend eight hours on Zoom or

39:58

Teams or whatever, video conferencing tool

40:01

you're using, we say, hey,

40:03

we're gonna have a blend of different interactions.

40:05

We're gonna do a quick little call here with a whole

40:07

group to greet you and to welcome you. Then

40:10

you're gonna have a separate call with one person. And

40:12

then maybe, by the way, we have found out that

40:14

there is another employee who

40:17

lives within 20 miles of your house

40:20

and they're gonna come and take

40:22

you to lunch. And we're gonna do

40:24

some things that combine the physical

40:26

world with this digital world

40:29

we live in. What's the analog experience?

40:31

Can we send you gifts? Can we send you things

40:33

that make the experience more exciting?

40:35

There's a company that I profile in the book called

40:38

Budai Media. And Budai Media

40:40

has 30 employees based

40:42

in 17 time zones around the world.

40:45

They are a fully distributed company and

40:48

in the affirm phase. So after you've accepted your

40:50

job, but before your first day on the job, they

40:53

send you a package in the mail. And the package very

40:55

clearly says, do not open until we tell

40:57

you to. Save this for the first day. So

41:00

you get to the first day on the job, you get on the

41:02

Zoom call, there's all the other people they introduce

41:04

you. There's some give and take, everybody goes around

41:07

and says some fun things about themselves, not their

41:09

name and their title, but like, oh,

41:11

what are you binge watching on Netflix right now?

41:13

What's your favorite board game to play? What's the best

41:16

book you've read in the last six months? We're getting

41:18

a feel for who they are as people and

41:20

as individuals and as humans. And

41:23

then they say to this employee, open

41:26

up the box and the employee

41:28

opens the box and inside is a mug. Now

41:30

the mug doesn't have the logo of the company on

41:33

it. The mug has photographs

41:35

of all the Budai Media employees

41:38

on it, including the newest tire.

41:40

And as the employee picks up their mug to

41:43

show on camera, they see that everybody else on

41:45

camera is already holding a mug and

41:47

they raise a glass and they toast this person on

41:49

their first day. That's how you can create

41:52

an analog experience that transcends

41:55

remote work in a digital era. I'm

41:57

not saying you have to do mugs with your whole

41:59

team. What I am saying is you

42:01

should think strategically and

42:04

intelligently about what you

42:06

can do to build personal and emotional

42:08

connection with your folks who are working

42:11

remotely. Man, that's a great story

42:13

and the impact that that can have and again, there's

42:15

so many different permutations, options

42:18

that can be done. I'm thinking of because

42:20

my daughter just started college for the first

42:22

time a few months ago is sending

42:25

them the acceptance letter

42:27

for their offer so to speak and or

42:30

sending them a t-shirt, a sweatshirt,

42:32

send them the box of swag for the

42:34

company. You receive

42:37

that in the mail after you've accepted

42:39

or honestly, if you've not yet

42:41

accepted but they really want you, that's

42:44

going to lock you in. It's like,

42:46

oh my gosh, look at this amazing swag. Pick the

42:48

right swag obviously. One of the case study

42:50

companies in the book is Lego and what

42:52

Lego does is when they send you the job

42:54

offer, not only does it come with a

42:57

letter of like, hey, we'd like to extend you this offer, it

42:59

comes with some logo sets and

43:02

a little message that tongue in cheek says, come

43:04

build something special with us. Love

43:07

it. Now we're embracing the brand.

43:10

We're embracing the spirit and the energy of

43:12

the brand and saying, you're now part of this.

43:15

The buy-in has to start earlier

43:18

than most companies are starting it. Most companies

43:20

are waiting until you've passed your probation

43:22

period before we're going to invest in you. No,

43:25

we got to start investing in them. If they

43:27

are good enough for us to extend

43:29

an offer, if we think they are valuable

43:32

enough to extend an offer, the

43:34

investment should begin with

43:36

that offer and it should

43:39

continue every day until we have

43:41

a reason not to invest in this employee

43:43

anymore. Well, we should probably

43:46

stop using – I have hated this word – your probation

43:48

period. Oh, it's ridiculous. What am I,

43:50

a criminal? Come on. Exactly.

43:53

And that's a problem. Most organizations are treating their employees

43:55

that way. Most organizations that come in, oh, we're

43:57

going to have a probationary period to test this

44:00

is like and you're not going to get your health

44:02

benefits until then and you're not going to qualify

44:04

for vacation until then. How

44:06

about this? How about in the same way that

44:08

you have me on probation, I'll put you on probation.

44:11

I'll decide which of the assignments you give me

44:13

I want to do. That would be laughable

44:16

if an employee said that. And yet we

44:18

seem to accept that a probation period for

44:20

the employee is appropriate. Why?

44:23

The probation period should be the application

44:26

process when we're figuring it

44:28

out or if you really want to have a

44:30

probationary period, don't call it probation.

44:33

Say, here's what we do. We have independent

44:35

contractors and we have full-time employees.

44:38

Your first experience with us is

44:40

we are going to do three independent

44:43

contractor jobs. You're going to be paid,

44:45

we're going to ask you to do some work and we're going to

44:47

evaluate your work based on

44:49

those three jobs. If after those three

44:52

jobs we feel that you're performing, we

44:54

may extend an offer for full-time employment

44:56

or we may continue to extend offers for

44:59

independent contractor project

45:01

employment or we may say we're

45:03

parting as friends. But

45:06

this idea of you're a full-time employee

45:08

but you're on probation, just stop. We

45:10

can do better. Well, and I think it kind

45:12

of goes into the, I never loved the term

45:14

quiet quitting when it first came out, honestly,

45:17

because it seemed like, well, duh,

45:20

I've seen people doing this for years. It's

45:22

not anything new. Yeah, this is a new phrase

45:24

for something that's been happening for decades. Yeah,

45:27

bare minimum is not even, I think, adequate

45:29

to describe it. I think it's doing your job

45:31

description and not trying extra

45:34

to advance or whatever. It's basically

45:36

saying I'm not acclimating and

45:39

I'm not achieving or I did

45:41

it wrong again. It's not achieve, it's accomplishing.

45:43

So good. It just locks in that way. Maybe

45:46

we'll rename it. It's something for me to

45:48

take under advisement. There you go. I think

45:50

it's almost just a, hey, I'm going to do what

45:52

is expected of me. I'm not going to fall below

45:54

an expectation bar, but I'm going

45:56

to reach that point where, okay,

45:59

well. I've not been given any

46:01

incentive to acclimate

46:04

and accomplish. So I'm not going

46:06

to enter into that cycle right now and

46:09

waste energy. A hundred percent. And

46:11

let's take it one step further. What

46:13

is the game we are playing with employees

46:16

when we say, here is your job description

46:19

and what I want you to do? And

46:21

when you do that and nothing

46:23

more, we deem that as bad.

46:26

I'm sorry. How did we decide that that's

46:28

bad? If there's something you want me to be

46:30

evaluated on, if there's something that you need me

46:32

to do, put it in the requirements,

46:35

put it in the job, put it in my task. I

46:37

don't know about you, but I liken this stuff

46:39

to dating, right? Because so much

46:42

of it, the analogy is so clear in dating. You

46:44

start dating someone and you have an expectation

46:46

of how you're supposed to show up and an expectation

46:49

of how you're hoping they show up. And if those two expectations

46:52

align, match made

46:54

in heaven. We're feeling good. Life is happy,

46:56

right? But it is completely ridiculous

46:59

for me to have expectations

47:01

for someone that I haven't expressed

47:04

and I haven't shared with them, especially

47:07

in a work context. If I

47:09

expect you to be at your desk

47:11

at 8 a.m., I should say, and

47:14

we expect you to be at your desk at 8 a.m.

47:17

If I never say that, who am

47:19

I to get upset if you don't show up at your desk until 8

47:23

We need to get clear on what the actual expectations

47:26

for our team members are and explicitly

47:28

state what those expectations are. And

47:30

we also need to recognize that our employees

47:32

have expectations for us too. And

47:35

that's more than fair. And those expectations

47:38

can go beyond, hey, you're going to pay me

47:40

every two weeks. We can expect

47:42

other things from our employers. And

47:44

employees listening, that's a responsibility

47:47

that you have. Remember we were talking earlier

47:49

about that, who's responsible for it? This falls

47:51

into the portion that you're responsible for to say, hey,

47:54

my expectation is that

47:56

I'm working here and I'm contributing

47:58

and I'm learning. And a year

48:01

from now, I want to be further ahead in this organization

48:03

than I am today. And two years from now,

48:06

I want to have had a promotion. And four years

48:08

from now, I want to be running a division.

48:10

These are my goals. Help me to understand

48:13

the path I need to do to get to that goal.

48:15

And we may say, Hey, Joey, that path is unreasonable

48:18

for four years. That's a nine-year

48:20

path at our organization. Or we might

48:22

say, Hey, Joey, if you really perform, that's an

48:24

18-month path. Here's what the

48:26

criteria are. Here's what we're looking for. Here's

48:29

what you need to do. I think it's all based

48:31

on that clear, open, honest

48:34

communication that said

48:37

these changes that we're looking to have

48:39

happen aren't going to happen by turning

48:41

the page and getting to the end of the book. Now

48:43

you've got to start implementing it, of course. But

48:46

as we wind down here as an employer, let's

48:48

address this in both sides, like we did from the

48:50

start. Employers and employees

48:53

picking this book up and starting

48:55

to make the changes. What are the first

48:57

initial things that you would suggest

49:00

both sides of that start to get

49:02

working on? Well, to keep it clear, let's

49:04

focus on the employers first, and then we'll come

49:06

back to the employees. So the first thing an employer

49:08

can do is to map out

49:11

the existing employee journey. What

49:14

are you currently doing right now? So many organizations

49:17

have grown and more than evolved in

49:19

a way that even the senior leaders

49:21

have no idea what's happening in

49:24

the application, hiring,

49:27

onboarding, training, educating,

49:29

continued engagement process. They're so

49:31

disconnected from it. So the first thing we can do

49:33

is map out what's going. Align

49:35

that to the eight phases we talked about earlier,

49:38

and you'll pretty quickly find areas for improvement.

49:41

I'd be willing to bet that most people, when I went

49:43

through the eight phases earlier, any employers

49:45

listening were going, you know, we really don't do anything

49:48

in the affirm phase. Even in the acclimate

49:50

phase, we measure that in hours, not weeks

49:52

and months. You already are thinking

49:54

of things. So the first step, get

49:57

a feel for reality, and then start

49:59

to chip away. at the things you need to do

50:01

to be more clear in the expectations. On the

50:03

employee side, same thing.

50:06

When you are applying for a job,

50:08

when you're going through the onboarding process, take

50:10

a vested interest in your own career growth.

50:13

Make it clear to the organization from

50:15

the beginning what your goals are, what

50:17

you're hoping to do. Ask the kind of

50:20

questions to say, if my goal

50:22

is to get promoted here, what

50:24

would I need to do? What would I

50:26

need to be showing you? What proof

50:29

points would you need? And what is a reasonable

50:31

expectation for me to have as

50:33

to when I will have been able to

50:35

show you enough to merit

50:38

a promotion? Have those conversations

50:41

during the interview. Have those conversations

50:43

with your manager. Get really clear

50:46

on what it is. If that's your goal.

50:48

If your goal isn't promotion, if your goal is,

50:50

I just want to J-O-B. I just want to be able to go

50:52

to work and do my job. Well then, fine. Be clear

50:54

about that. Say, hey, so that you know, I'm

50:57

here to be a fantastic,

51:00

reliable, consistent worker. I'm

51:02

not interested in climbing a ladder. I'm

51:04

not interested in advancement

51:07

in terms of title. I'm interested

51:10

in advancement around my

51:12

own abilities and my efficiency

51:15

and my productivity. What would

51:17

you recommend I need to do to be able

51:20

to consistently show you value in my

51:22

role? Most managers, when asked

51:24

that question, are gonna be like, oh my god, finally.

51:27

Finally, someone that's willing to do something

51:29

around here. And they will be very excited

51:32

to have that conversation with you. Love

51:34

it. It's a great place to start, but obviously,

51:36

I want to get people funneled into starting

51:39

to do that, which means grab the book, but also find

51:41

out more about the book. So Joey, where

51:44

can people go? Find out more about you, where

51:46

you're gonna be speaking, slash, dive

51:48

into the book. So let's talk about the book

51:51

because you can get that real fast and real easy,

51:53

wherever you like to get books. So I always

51:55

like to share with people the title of the book

51:57

is Never Lose an Employee Again. It's available...

52:00

It's available in hardcover if you like to actually hold the book

52:02

in your hand. It's available as an e-book

52:04

so you can highlight in your Kindle or your Nook. It's

52:06

available as an audio book so if you've enjoyed

52:08

the sound of me talking to Eric on

52:10

our call today, I actually narrate the audio

52:13

book so I will read the book to you. It's

52:15

available wherever you like to get books. If

52:17

you want to learn more about my work, my talks,

52:19

my workshops, the consulting engagements I do,

52:21

the best place to find me is on my website

52:24

joeycolman.com. That's

52:27

J-O-E-Y like a baby kangaroo

52:29

or a five-year-old you know. Coleman,

52:33

C-O-L-E-M-A-N like the camping equipment but

52:35

no relation. Joeycolman.com.

52:38

There you'll find information about how to never lose a customer

52:40

again, how to never lose an employee again,

52:42

speeches, workshops, support

52:44

materials, implementation kits so you can

52:46

take what we learned today in

52:48

the podcast and actually apply it in

52:51

your business with worksheets and workbooks, all

52:53

kinds of stuff there for folks to check out. Is

52:55

it bad that I just pictured a young kangaroo

52:57

on a campsite enjoying his time?

53:00

It was very intentional, Eric, and I'm thrilled

53:02

to hear that it worked. Awesome.

53:05

Well, I'm going to leave you with that mental picture

53:07

but just, Joey, thank you so much for sharing

53:09

your expertise and your

53:12

insight and your knowledge here and

53:14

I know this book is going to be a

53:16

big impact on this new

53:18

world of work we've got going on. Thank you so much. Oh,

53:21

thank you so much, Eric, and thanks to everybody for listening

53:23

in today. I hope you enjoyed listening

53:25

to our conversation as much as I enjoyed having

53:28

it with Eric. Well,

53:30

that's another podcast crossed off your listening

53:32

to-do list. I hope that you enjoyed this conversation

53:35

with Joey Coleman as much as I did. He's

53:37

got great energy and great

53:39

insight and experience to share. If

53:42

you happen to be someone in a job

53:44

search mode or if you happen to be

53:46

an employer looking to hire the right people,

53:49

this book is perfect for you. You

53:51

can grab it through the show notes at beyondthetodolist.com

53:55

and if you are somebody who is

53:57

in either one of those boats or you know someone

53:59

who is... Do them that favor of

54:01

sharing this episode with them so that they

54:03

find out about this amazing book. Hit

54:06

that share button wherever you are listening to

54:08

this, your podcast player app of choice. Let

54:10

them know about this book, conversation,

54:13

and insights. Thank you so much

54:15

for sharing. Thank you for listening, and

54:18

I will see you next episode.

54:55

Are you ready to create more predictable income

54:57

and sustainably scale your online business? I'm

55:00

Abigail Pumphrey, host of the Strategy Hour

55:02

podcast, and I'm on a personal mission to

55:04

help more small business owners become financially

55:06

free. Explore what matters most to your

55:08

online business with episodes like Leads

55:10

on Autopilot, how to go from layoff to replacing

55:13

your corporate salary, and more personal conversations

55:15

on leaving a legacy and the five psychological

55:18

reasons we want to be remembered. Listen

55:20

and subscribe to the Strategy Hour wherever

55:22

you listen to podcasts.