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1:29

Hello, and welcome to the Blank Podcast,

1:31

the podcast where we talk to well-known guests about

1:34

their lives, their careers,

1:36

and navigating those difficult moments

1:38

along the way. I'm Giles Paley-Phillips,

1:40

and with me on this balmy,

1:43

sunny afternoon, evening, slash

1:45

night is Jim Daly.

1:49

Hello. Balmy

1:51

is essentially sort of code for sweaty, isn't

1:54

it? It's been a sweaty week and a sweaty weekend,

1:57

and I feel like I've sweated

1:59

through it. all my t-shirts and

2:02

I don't I don't know

2:04

if that's just me or if that's just like

2:06

the general public but I think I might be quite

2:08

a sweaty individual but it's

2:11

not pleasant. Well it's quite

2:13

close isn't it the weather's close so

2:17

that tends to sort of bring on the perspiration

2:19

quite a lot. Do you know what

2:22

my wife's dad used to call that when

2:24

he was around before he passed was

2:26

he'd say it was close

2:29

he'd say it was pothory. Have you heard that?

2:31

Pothory? How's that spell? Yeah I've

2:33

no idea. My wife says it

2:35

as a result I've never heard it before but I quite like it

2:38

I think it's quite that's quite a nice it's a fun

2:40

word to say I've never heard it before quite

2:44

like it and actually it does kind

2:46

of make you

2:47

it does kind of sum up that feeling of it being close

2:49

and sticky and what yeah pothery there you

2:51

go. Pother a choking

2:54

cloud of smoke. This

2:56

is definition

2:58

probably from pother meaning a

3:00

din or a fuss

3:03

so in this

3:04

connotation

3:07

if we if we children wanted to

3:09

know what was for tea mum would say

3:11

three

3:12

this is northern I'm going to the

3:14

accent three rounds

3:17

three runs around terrible

3:20

and a bite of earth's neck meaning

3:23

wait and see I

3:26

don't know what that's got to do with what's that got to do with pothery

3:29

I don't know it says this is the definition anyway

3:32

what is the meaning of pothering

3:35

when a fire is lit and there's a lot

3:37

of smoke and very little flame

3:39

but that

3:41

makes more sense because it's to do with heat and warmth if

3:44

you talk about what the fuck that was about maybe

3:47

you could pothery so best

3:49

of all pothering pothering

3:52

pothering no pothery

3:56

and it doesn't come up I've got humid

3:59

stuffy on

4:22

Two

4:31

totally different meanings

4:33

for this word, Putha. So maybe the Putha,

4:35

Putha.

4:37

To Putha, which is what I'm

4:39

looking up, is more of a slang term. Yeah,

4:42

I think so. It's just fun to

4:44

say. Well, would you say

4:46

Putha sounds very Southern,

4:49

well, it's very Puthary. It

4:51

does, well, anything does miss it like that. But

4:54

as you say it like, oh yeah, ew, it's

4:56

a bit Putha. Well,

4:58

it's like having a new WarnerCon podcast. Yeah. Yeah,

5:06

interesting. OK, so yeah, close.

5:09

I'll stick to close, I think. Yeah, fair

5:11

enough. Yeah, but it has been though. It's just, yeah, it's

5:13

sort of weather where you just, you

5:15

sweat to sort of sit on the sofa. But,

5:18

you know, at least it's warm and sunny and

5:22

better than the alternative. Yeah,

5:24

this is funny because when we

5:26

got talking before you joined us,

5:28

Jim, I was saying to Georgia, oh,

5:31

I guess this week, is Georgia Tennant, the

5:33

amazing actress and producer.

5:36

I was saying,

5:38

we

5:41

often start conversations in the UK with

5:44

talking about the weather. And

5:47

it's our sort of go-to, start-up

5:49

question I found. Yeah,

5:52

is that just, is that because we've got nothing else

5:54

to talk about? Well, because it's like an awkward,

5:57

or because it's a really easy entry-level question

5:59

has an opinion on. Well I wonder if it's because of

6:02

our changeable weather circumstances

6:04

like most days are different so it's something to sort

6:07

of discuss. Yeah

6:10

so like in Australia it wouldn't be like oh

6:12

the weather's day yeah it's hot again. Yeah if

6:15

you're in LA you'd be like oh it's sunny again.

6:17

Yeah. This

6:19

just wouldn't come up. Where's he? Like oh I

6:23

thought it was gonna be sunny. Yeah.

6:25

Well actually it's a bit puddler. I

6:28

think it's one of the things like everyone

6:30

can have an opinion on it. There's no it's not like you

6:32

wouldn't start a conversation about like oh

6:35

sorry the Prime Minister hey. You know it's too

6:37

highbrow. You need something that everyone can get on.

6:40

Everyone is affected by the weather. Literally

6:44

every single person in the world. One

6:46

of the few things where everyone can have an opinion on

6:48

without feeling stupid. Yeah. So maybe

6:50

it's that. Anyway we've

6:53

digressed very quickly from that conversation

6:55

because I pointed out that it was a bit of an obvious

6:58

go-to and then you joined us

7:00

and we had an amazing conversation with

7:02

Georgia. She was fantastic. We talked about all sorts

7:04

of different things including social anxiety,

7:08

her love of netball, a newfound

7:10

love of hers, having

7:13

her son when she was very young when

7:15

she was only just 16 and having the

7:17

sort of the fallout of that and you

7:19

know having to go out and work and finding jobs

7:22

being an actress and

7:24

then yeah all these different

7:26

things that

7:28

entail in like being the modern-day parent

7:30

as well. Yeah absolutely.

7:33

Yeah went to lots of different places. She was lots

7:35

of fun which I kind of knew she would be obviously

7:37

a huge fan of

7:39

all her work and she's done

7:41

so much stuff as well. We've been working for so long

7:43

and but I just thought

7:46

she'd be fun and lovely and she wasn't very funny

7:48

very very funny although we talked about using that as a sort of

7:50

deflection tactic when it comes to social

7:53

anxiety which I think a lot of people do but yeah

7:56

she's absolutely brilliant as I thought she would and you

7:58

know one of those people that...

7:59

a big family working hard

8:02

and she still managed to find

8:03

an hour for us as well so really appreciated

8:06

that was aware that she was sort of, because

8:08

although we went over the hour and chatted and stuff and she seemed

8:10

happy to sort of hang around and was just

8:12

you know a really really lovely person but really

8:14

appreciate her time because she got lots on

8:16

so yeah it was an absolute joy. Yeah really

8:18

good yeah I really loved talking to her and yeah we

8:20

I mean we discussed all sorts of things and obviously she

8:23

comes from a sort of acting

8:25

dynasty both her parents are actors

8:28

her husband's an actor so

8:30

but she was very much aware of that

8:32

and we talked about a bit about that as well and

8:36

sort of a bit of ownership around privilege and how

8:38

you know she knows how you

8:40

know how lucky she's been but she obviously works super

8:42

hard herself and you know is a very talented

8:45

individual in her own right. Yeah

8:48

yeah I thought it was really refreshing actually to hear when

8:51

we talked about Nepo or Nepo babies she

8:53

constantly thought it might be a better way to talk

8:56

about it but it was really refreshing to hear

8:58

someone sort of

8:59

talk about their privilege like that and recognize it

9:01

and acknowledge it and don't hear it very often

9:03

actually and I think someone who's

9:05

obviously unbelievably talented and works very hard but even

9:07

to sort of

9:08

you know talk about the I guess some

9:10

of the the chances you're born into

9:13

without really even asking for them but I thought it was refreshing

9:15

to hear

9:16

her talk about those privileges so yeah really

9:18

knew

9:19

she'd be lovely but was even lovelier than I

9:21

expected. Yeah well I think we should probably

9:23

dive in. Um

9:26

yeah I think we should we've teased it enough as ever

9:28

yeah with our with our with our wandering

9:30

intro with our pothery intros yeah so

9:32

I think yeah probably should okay uh

9:35

this is the fantastic Georgia tenant on

9:37

the Blackpool Coast.

9:39

Bedtimes.

9:52

Bedtimes yeah yeah

9:54

yeah so he so the other day I

9:56

was trying to persuade him to watch an 18

9:59

film. and

10:01

I thought you're a bad dad. I'm not a bad

10:03

dad. I wanna watch. I wanna watch. You're

10:06

not a cool dad. Yeah, I'm sorry, cool

10:08

dad. Yeah. I really wanna like bad Santa stuff.

10:10

Yeah, and he just wasn't

10:12

up for it. He just didn't wanna break the rules.

10:15

With his dad? Yeah,

10:17

with his dad. I mean, maybe that's the thing.

10:20

Away from his dad, that's the thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

10:22

That's true, actually. They were showing his dad he was breaking the

10:24

rules. Yeah.

10:25

Then it's not breaking the rules. No, that's

10:27

true. Maybe

10:30

I need to like do it more stealthily. Not

10:33

just say, let's watch this together. What was the film? What

10:36

was the film? Actually, it wasn't a film. It was Game of Thrones. So

10:38

it was a series.

10:40

Oh, maybe it's because there's quite

10:42

a lot of stuff in there that he doesn't

10:44

wanna watch with his dad. Well,

10:47

that's what he was. When we delved into

10:49

it a bit deeper, we

10:51

realized that it probably wasn't appropriate to watch it

10:53

together.

10:55

Just a bit icky, isn't it? Yeah. I

10:58

think after a while, I was thinking actually, probably

11:00

isn't gonna be very comfortable for

11:02

me either. No, no,

11:04

no. That's gotta be up. That's

11:07

gotta be up there in one of the most awkward situations,

11:09

I think, to be with your parents.

11:11

Yeah. Or your in-laws. Yeah. Or

11:15

in, well, yeah. Like watching a- I've

11:17

been doing all that quite difficult with anyone.

11:19

Yeah. So

11:22

I'm probably not a great judge of that. But

11:24

yeah, I imagine your parents are probably pretty

11:27

high up on the list of people you don't wanna watch that stuff

11:29

with. Yeah. Have

11:33

you ever had that situation? Great thoughts, podcast.

11:36

Do better. Well,

11:41

Georgia, it's lovely to have you on the podcast. Thank you so much.

11:43

This is kind of often how we start these

11:45

things. But we

11:47

do actually start properly by

11:50

asking a bit about our guest journeys,

11:52

how they got into what they're doing now. And

11:56

the first thing I wanted to ask you

11:57

was you were born on Christmas Day. And

12:01

I wondered if that's annoying, having birthday

12:04

on Christmas. Yeah,

12:06

I think it is now annoying.

12:09

I think when I was younger, everyone

12:12

sort of overcompensated for

12:14

my crap birthday. So

12:17

I used to have quite a good Christmas

12:19

day. And then when I was a child, I was

12:21

an only child. I've now got brothers

12:24

since I've thrown up. They're quite a lot younger than me. So

12:27

it was sort of all about me.

12:28

Yeah. And

12:30

so that was kind of great. And then as I

12:32

grew up, became

12:35

less about me as it naturally does, but

12:37

then because it is actually also

12:39

about everyone else, now it's just

12:42

not about me at all. Kids,

12:44

I mean, it's never about you

12:47

when you've got kids. So my mum very cleverly,

12:50

when I was younger, changed

12:52

my birthday to the

12:55

4th of July. Now she

12:57

could have changed it to a day that wasn't another.

13:00

Yeah, I was gonna say that's a bit harsh.

13:03

Yeah, come on mum. But

13:06

it also meant that I could have birthday

13:08

parties on my birthday that people

13:11

would come to.

13:12

Because obviously everyone's busy on Christmas day. So

13:15

I never had childhood birthday

13:17

parties in that same way. So we would have

13:19

them on the 4th of July, which

13:21

was at least sunny, back in the

13:23

day when the summers were hot. Yeah, I'm

13:25

just thinking there's no Americans coming. Yeah,

13:29

if I had to choose a day to have my birthday, that

13:31

wasn't my birthday, summer

13:34

would be a good time to have one, like you can have a barbecue,

13:36

have people in the garden. Well, that's it,

13:39

you know, and as a kid, you just wanted a bouncy castle

13:41

really. That was a good one. And

13:44

so I could get that. And

13:47

now I've had five kids, so I can't go and bounce castles

13:49

anymore.

13:51

Structurally,

13:53

it doesn't really work. You've not

13:55

been practicing those pelvic floors.

13:57

Five definitely

13:59

doesn't matter. how I do, no bouncy

14:01

puzzles. So

14:05

now it's just a bit, I mean,

14:07

my family sort of remember, my husband's great,

14:09

he'll at some point, once the

14:11

kids have gone to bed, do a happy

14:14

birthday. But as we discussed

14:16

earlier bedtimes, they get later, they get older. So

14:19

I think last Christmas, I think it was like 11, 15 p.m.

14:24

And it was like, happy birthday. So

14:27

my birthday lasted 45 minutes, which wasn't

14:29

ideal. It

14:32

is what it is when I came out.

14:34

So there's not really much I can do about that. No,

14:38

I mean, didn't the queen

14:40

have a second birthday as well? The queen had a

14:42

second. Yeah, I'm sort of like the queen and

14:44

like Jesus. Yes. Yeah,

14:47

yeah. Yeah, we're all into one. Yeah,

14:50

yeah. Yeah. So

14:54

yeah, I'm fine with it. Because

14:56

actually as you get older, birthdays are sort of less, they're

14:59

less important, aren't they? There's just a sort of thing that happens.

15:01

And, you know, I think in

15:04

my head, I'm going, well, if I didn't really have a birthday, I haven't

15:06

really got any older. So yeah. I've

15:10

got a big one next year and I'm deliberating

15:13

whether to go big or just to do

15:16

nothing. Is it the big four? Yeah.

15:19

Go big. Why would you not go big? Well,

15:22

that's kind of what I want to do. But

15:25

they have in the last, in my twenties I used

15:27

to go quite big. And then

15:30

one year I organised a mini festival called Jima Palooza.

15:33

Wow. So your biggest hit. With wristbands and everything.

15:35

Yeah. Who headlined?

15:38

Well, me. Oh, right. Did

15:42

anyone, did you invite anyone or was it just you? I

15:45

don't know. Yeah. There

15:47

were people there. And I was supposed to just facilitate me being sent a suspension.

15:49

I just imagine all these relatives just turning up and

15:51

like being given wristbands sitting in the garden,

15:53

like, handing

15:56

around the doobie. Handing around the doobie. They're

15:59

just...

15:59

Grand! Small

16:02

drag! Where

16:05

do you go from festival

16:08

though? Yeah, yeah. What's

16:11

next? It's been, that was 28 I think,

16:13

it's downhill. No, that was 30 I think. It

16:16

was downhill. But this is the next

16:18

big one? Yeah. Yeah, so now it's got

16:20

to be. Well that's it, what are you going to

16:22

do? I don't know. Right, good.

16:25

I was thinking dinner, I was thinking dinner. Oh,

16:28

dinner. Beautiful middle

16:30

aged of you. Yeah, yeah. With wristbands.

16:33

Yeah. That's

16:36

a bit of a come down, dinner.

16:38

Yeah. You're going to have to go. But everyone else,

16:40

all my other friends are 40s and late

16:43

30s, they're not going to, they're just going to go for

16:45

dinner. Yeah, but did they have a festival for their

16:47

30s? Yeah. I don't think, where

16:50

I live now is mostly new friends for the last couple of

16:52

years, so I'm still getting to. Oh, you did it. Yeah,

16:55

that's true, you got new, yeah. Yeah, we

16:57

do the festival. Every 10

17:00

years, it's Jim and Palooza again. Go bigger

17:03

this time though. Every 10 years. 70th

17:10

is going to be interesting. Could

17:13

do actually. Yeah, you guys have inspired me there a little

17:15

bit. Good. Well, yeah, exactly,

17:17

that's exactly what we're here for. Anyway,

17:20

back to you Georgia, I'm sorry about that. Yeah. Derailing

17:23

with Jim's birthday parties.

17:26

So yeah, so was performing and

17:28

drama and stuff, was that something that you,

17:31

because you started quite young, you were around in your

17:33

teenage years, you started actually. Yeah,

17:35

I was actually, my first job was, I was 12.

17:40

And I think, I

17:42

think it was, to be honest, like the only thing I

17:45

was good at. And so

17:47

I thought, well, if I'm good at that, I should

17:49

probably try and turn that into a career.

17:53

And then, I did

17:56

my first TV job when I was 12, which

17:58

was, I did. six months on

18:01

peak practice, which was like a show

18:03

set in there. I remember that show. Yeah. Do you remember that

18:05

one? Yeah. So,

18:07

and yes, so I had this amazing

18:09

experience when I did six months of not being

18:11

at school, which at the time

18:13

I didn't love. So that was great.

18:16

And I got to be around lots of adults and I got

18:18

on really well with adults naturally. And then being in an

18:20

environment where I got to sort of be a kid with

18:22

lots of adults who were also being kids, because that's ultimately

18:25

just what adult actors are.

18:27

It was amazing. And I thought, if I can make this into

18:30

a career, then

18:31

that's definitely what I should

18:33

do, because otherwise I'm going to have to do something which involves

18:36

a skill I do not have.

18:38

But then I obviously had to go back

18:40

to school and do my GCSEs

18:42

and all those things that you have to do. And

18:46

then I got pregnant with

18:49

my son. And then

18:51

it obviously thrust me into

18:53

a sort of adult world where getting

18:55

a job

18:57

was really important. So it was actually about

18:59

working for money to

19:01

be able to pay for him

19:03

rather than a sort of, what do I want to

19:05

be? Who am I? I was like, I need money

19:07

and pay rent. So I.

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Available at Ucora.com. Reply stop to

20:41

stop. Help for help. Very, very luckily, from this job

20:43

when I was 12, had an agent.

20:45

And I phoned up my agent and went, I'm

20:48

going to have to work. You just have

20:50

to get me whatever you can get me. And

20:53

then when my son was six

20:55

weeks old, I auditioned for the bill

20:58

and got the job. And so

21:00

then I ended up doing that for years, which

21:03

was sort of the thing that gave me

21:05

my drama school, gave me my social life, gave

21:07

me my income and allowed

21:10

me to be around for him and ultimately

21:13

buy a house and pay for it. So

21:15

it was,

21:16

I sort of, it was always my

21:18

passion, but it became

21:21

a job because

21:23

out of necessity, rather

21:25

than I think actors become actors because

21:27

it's sort of in their bones and they have to do it. And

21:29

there's a sort of, I was very lucky that initially

21:32

there wasn't a struggle. I sort of

21:34

was very blessed and I fell into this thing

21:36

and someone gave me a job and I could earn

21:38

a living from it, which is very, very

21:40

rare in this industry. It's not something that happens

21:43

a lot. So that's sort

21:47

of what happened. So I'm sort of half someone

21:49

who does it, who fell into

21:51

it

21:52

and half someone who always wanted it.

21:55

But so it, I think it gives

21:57

you a slightly. interesting.

22:04

I'm

22:05

quite happy

22:07

when I'm not doing it, because

22:10

it means that I'm able to be with

22:14

my kids and be around

22:16

and be able to sort of be

22:19

the other side of me. But equally when I

22:21

do do it, I sort of go, Oh, I love it. It's

22:24

quite, isn't it?

22:26

I think that that's enabled me to have perspective

22:29

over it as a career choice, because I think it can

22:31

be pretty awful for a lot

22:33

of people. When

22:35

you aren't working, it's kind of the worst thing in the world. And

22:37

then of course, the moment you are, you sort of go, I

22:40

can't give it up. I've got to hold on to these moments. So

22:42

it's it, but it's,

22:44

yeah, I think it's a developing situation

22:47

how I feel about it. But certainly, it became

22:49

something I had to do because I couldn't do anything else.

22:51

I did not do well in my GCSEs. I

22:54

don't know what I would have done, had

22:55

I actually had to get a proper

22:58

job. I think that would have been tricky, and

23:01

would definitely involve me having to go back to school where

23:03

I wasn't happy. So I feel very

23:05

fortunate that I was able to do it.

23:08

Yeah, we talk

23:10

on this part a lot, Charles, don't we? But like, what is meant

23:12

for you will kind of find you at some point. And

23:15

sometimes that happens. Yeah,

23:17

sometimes that happens older and people discover what

23:19

they're about later on in life. And that's cool

23:21

as well. Like, you know, everyone's journey sort of different, but

23:24

becoming a parent, completely

23:27

changes things. And it really that

23:29

pressure to suddenly it's not all

23:31

about you. No, provide for this

23:33

thing. Yeah.

23:35

But for you to be that so young, that

23:37

must have been a lot because that's a that's that's

23:39

a weird time to be alive anyway,

23:41

when you're late teens,

23:44

early 20s, but then to have

23:46

that pressure on. It's

23:48

like everything multiplied. Yeah,

23:50

it's interesting, actually, because I was so young,

23:52

so I was 16 when I got pregnant, and I

23:56

hadn't obviously finished being

23:58

a kid myself. And

24:01

so when I found out I was

24:03

pregnant, I was like, oh, okay,

24:05

that's not what I planned for. But obviously

24:08

that's what I'm doing now. And so I

24:10

guess in that sort of way that kids

24:12

are quite resilient

24:16

and I don't think I sort

24:18

of really understood the enormity of it.

24:21

Really sort of ever with

24:23

my eldest, because it just sort

24:25

of happened. And then it became

24:27

a part of my life and my growing up

24:30

experience that I didn't really

24:32

know any different. And I

24:35

think actually when I then got

24:37

pregnant, you know, much later on

24:39

with my second child, that

24:41

felt like I'm sort of a bigger event

24:43

in my life almost. I

24:45

think I massively benefited from the fact that I

24:47

don't think I really thought it was that big a deal because

24:51

I was so young. So I think even maybe

24:53

if I'd been 18 or 19, I think

24:55

it would have.

24:56

And also because I wasn't giving anything up. I hadn't

24:58

experienced being an adult. I think that's the

25:00

thing with when you have a sort of life

25:02

before you have kids, the

25:05

idea of sort

25:07

of moving on to the next stage is

25:10

so much about giving up things and sort of grieving

25:12

for the life that you had before. And I didn't have

25:14

a life before I was I was at school. I didn't

25:16

like that.

25:17

So this was definitely going to be preferable to that. And

25:20

so I guess

25:22

I never there was no sacrifice in it.

25:25

So sort of not that I'm advocating

25:28

for 16 years to go and get pregnant. But I think in my my

25:30

sort of personal experience of it was that it massively

25:33

benefited me to not realize

25:36

what I was

25:37

potentially losing because I didn't

25:39

have it. It's a very

25:41

dramatic way of getting out of school. Yeah. Yeah. That's

25:45

how much I. I was

25:47

just thinking I should have tried that because I hate school as

25:49

well. It's

25:52

really it's so interesting to see that perspective

25:55

of it, though, that you're so right with regards

25:57

to when you the later you kind

25:59

of leave have.

25:59

children. There's so much more that

26:02

you're gonna giving up.

26:04

You know, personally if you're, you know, like you're sort of the

26:06

selfish sort of side of you. Like I remember when

26:08

we decided to have children it was like, should

26:10

we get a mortgage or should we have children? You know,

26:14

and we decided to have children. And

26:16

so it's like, yeah,

26:19

what kind of paths are you gonna

26:21

like cut off by doing this

26:24

thing? Yeah and you're able to

26:26

sort of go, I really liked being able to holiday

26:28

with my mates or just me and my

26:31

partner go off and do it. And it's like, well, I

26:33

haven't really had a partner. Like I wasn't,

26:36

I didn't know what that was. I had no concept

26:38

of of all of these things that, you know, and actually

26:41

it was the adults around me who were kind of

26:43

going for all these things that you're going to be missing out

26:45

on. And I was like, I mean,

26:47

I'll have them at some point, right? That's

26:49

not, because also when you're 16, life

26:51

is so long. There's like so much on

26:53

the other side of that that you sort of go, well,

26:55

I'll do all this stuff. It's not,

26:58

I'm not, I'm not stopping. I'm just delaying it a

27:00

bit. And actually that is ultimately

27:02

what's happened as I have sort of been able to

27:05

do

27:06

lots of the stuff I would have done when I

27:08

was, you know, 17, 18, 19. But I just

27:11

got to do it with my now 21

27:13

year old, which has been amazing. And I now sort

27:16

of look at him at 21, which is obviously, I know

27:18

I had a four year old,

27:20

terrible man's, at the time.

27:23

And I sort of look at him and I'm like, this is amazing. You can just

27:25

like go off.

27:26

And I'm so glad that he can do all of

27:28

that stuff. I'm not sort of sitting there going, Oh, I never got

27:30

to do it.

27:31

Because I sort of have, I've just done it slightly differently.

27:34

Yeah,

27:35

I just think when you're talking there about being

27:38

younger, I remember weird memories come

27:40

back to remember being in secondary school, like first

27:43

year, secondary school, so I suppose like year seven, year eight,

27:45

so I'm like 10, 11, 12, looking

27:47

at people doing their GCSEs. So that's like 16 year

27:49

old, 15, 16 year olds, thinking

27:52

these are these are basically adults, these kids,

27:54

they are so grown up, oh my god, and then you

27:56

get 16. Or even now look like a 16 year

27:58

old, I think fucking hell. just kids. But

28:01

perspective at the time is like these are

28:04

grown people who know the world. They're

28:06

so cool. The

28:08

perspective is just mad. I don't know. They're just

28:10

popped in my head. Yeah, absolutely.

28:13

And then and then now I'm still waiting for that moment

28:16

to happen where I'm like, I'm a grown up. Yeah.

28:19

I tell

28:22

you when that happened for me was when so

28:24

my daughter's three and a half

28:26

was when I must have taken it a

28:28

soft play or something and

28:32

or maybe with one of her classes and someone said something

28:34

like, oh, that's Maria's daddy

28:37

or that dad over there. Yeah.

28:40

I was like, I was like, what? See that old guy over there. Oh

28:42

shit, it's me. It was just being

28:44

described as, you know, Adele or a

28:46

man or a dad. Yeah. See

28:49

that man there with a blanket over his lap.

28:51

Yeah,

28:52

that guy. I've knocked my headphones

28:55

out. I don't know what happened. I've done it on

28:57

his podcast in 200. I was just saying, yeah,

28:59

it's

29:00

just like, look at that guy

29:03

with the blanket on his on his lap in

29:05

the wheelchair. That's that's daddy. And

29:09

he's only 30. Yeah, he's had a bad life.

29:12

It was he had this big festival. It

29:14

really took his time. Really

29:17

finished more.

29:19

Oh, man. But

29:22

I was also saying it was interesting you saying, obviously,

29:24

like thinking you had to get a job, that that kind

29:26

of parental thing like kicked in like the

29:28

idea of I've got to I've got to work. I've got

29:30

to look after this.

29:32

I got myself and my child. That

29:34

kind of kicked in fairly quickly as well. You

29:36

know, that's that sort of instinct to to

29:39

be a mother and look after your child. Yeah,

29:42

I mean, I think I was always quite

29:45

old for my years. I think

29:47

I was always quite practical.

29:49

So I sort of understood that

29:52

I needed to move out of home.

29:56

And find somewhere for us to live and be able

29:58

to sort of function.

29:59

I think also because there

30:02

was definitely an expectation that

30:04

it was going to be a disaster. And

30:08

I

30:08

never ever like to prove anyone right. So

30:12

I was like, right, not only am I gonna

30:14

do this, I'm gonna do it really well. I am going to

30:16

show everyone who's sort of doubting that

30:18

I've got this completely covered.

30:20

And so yeah, I think it was it

30:22

was probably it was

30:24

probably a bit of instinct, but it was probably just

30:27

because yeah, I

30:30

like to be right. I like to prove other people

30:32

wrong. And I didn't want

30:34

to live at home anymore. Because I that wasn't

30:36

fair on my parents who at that point, I

30:39

was sort of, they split up and I was living

30:41

a bit with both of them.

30:43

And my dad had two very

30:45

young kids at the time in his house.

30:47

And actually, my stepmom was pregnant

30:50

at the same time as me with my brother, so my

30:52

brother and my eldest son at the same age. So

30:55

there wasn't an option for me to live with them. And

30:57

my mother had had been

30:59

on her own for a couple of years. And

31:01

she'd been working incredibly hard sort

31:04

of doing that same thing. So I had a very good role

31:06

model in that respect, someone who was like, I've

31:08

got to keep a roof over my child's head. So I

31:10

was like, well, this is this is now what I have

31:12

to do.

31:15

And also I you know, I was really

31:17

pleased to not be in school

31:20

anymore. I loved school in terms

31:22

of my friends. And I

31:23

liked the sort of the safety

31:26

of that environment. But I never

31:29

felt like I was any good at any

31:31

of the things

31:32

I was being told I needed to be good at.

31:35

Except this one thing, which was drama.

31:38

And so my drama lessons and our school

31:40

plays were the only time I ever felt confident

31:42

in myself in the school environment.

31:45

So being able

31:48

to remove myself from that and put myself into

31:50

a world where I did feel confident, and I did feel like

31:53

I could do something well

31:55

felt like a really positive thing to be able to do.

31:57

I was very lucky that I was able to do it. But Yeah,

32:01

so I guess it was, I

32:02

just, I've never really wanted to rely on

32:04

anyone else. I've always been quite self reliant

32:07

in sort of every respect. And that was

32:10

probably the thing that kind of made me go, right?

32:13

Let's, let's sort this out. Let's, let's

32:15

get out there and be a mother.

32:18

Yeah, I'm the same thing, like, never

32:21

wanting to rely on sort of anyone else. And

32:23

but also I think the word I'm getting when you're describing

32:26

those sort of resilience, and

32:28

I think that's really like, that's key to for

32:30

any, any performing the entertainment industry

32:32

anyway, like, I think,

32:34

I think that's the number one skill really on

32:36

number one attribute. Yeah. And

32:38

it's just resilient. And actually, it's

32:41

a good skill for being a parent as well. Like you

32:43

just like head down,

32:45

keep going, you know, keep on trucking,

32:47

you just keep cracking on. So

32:50

I think,

32:50

yeah, I think you were probably always you're always destined

32:53

to go into entertainment because you

32:55

had the core skills

32:57

there as well as the, what's with the metaphor,

33:00

you know, the acting skills, I don't know what the word for that is,

33:02

but the, I was gonna say like, the

33:04

flamboyant skills is the wrong word. Yeah, yeah.

33:06

We're going flamboyant. Yeah. Yeah, let's use

33:08

that one. Yeah,

33:09

I think so. I mean, you know, in

33:11

in parenthood, and in the

33:14

sort of creative industries, you're dealing with a lot of

33:16

daily rejection, and both sort of

33:18

harden you up for the other one.

33:20

And so I think as long as you have

33:22

a sort of core belief that

33:25

you are at least trying

33:27

your best,

33:28

then I think that sort of prepares

33:31

you for the sort of the hardening

33:34

that I think you have to have for both of those two things. But

33:37

you know, I suppose I think

33:41

both of my parents were are

33:44

actors. And they, I think

33:47

when you have

33:49

parents who are in that industry,

33:52

you sort of you

33:55

feel like you are

33:58

allowed to be there.

34:00

in a way that is incredibly

34:03

sort of privileged. And so

34:05

I

34:06

think there was an inbuilt, and

34:09

whether, I don't know, maybe it's that, and also maybe

34:11

it's because, you know, a lot of people

34:13

when I was growing up would, the expectation

34:16

would be I would also be an actor.

34:18

So you're getting sort of confirmation internally

34:21

by going, there

34:23

is a job that I can do, which

34:25

is, you know, from a sort of outsider's point of view,

34:28

ludicrous that that is a job that you can do. You

34:30

can dress up and pretend to be other people, and people

34:33

pay you money for it, and

34:35

often quite a lot of money. And

34:38

so knowing that that is something you can

34:40

do

34:41

is one thing. Feeling like you're allowed to

34:43

do it because you see people doing it

34:46

as a job gives you a sense

34:48

of like, yeah,

34:50

I'm allowed to be in the room. And I think

34:52

that's the one thing that

34:55

people who don't have and who

34:57

don't grow up in that situation don't have. And I think

34:59

that's a massive disadvantage because to get

35:01

to that point, you have to sort of, you have to build

35:04

up. And I suppose that's what drama school does. And that's what the sort

35:06

of years of initial rejection from auditions does.

35:09

And that's why you are,

35:12

as someone who is,

35:14

who is, whose parents are in the industry,

35:16

you have a massive advantage because you're

35:19

sort of, you're kind of given the

35:21

sort of internal platform to go, this

35:24

is what I want to do. And for not a room

35:26

full of people to laugh at you and go, well, that's not really a

35:28

job because it's like, well, no, obviously,

35:30

obviously that's what you're going to do.

35:32

So I think that that's,

35:34

you know, there's a lot of, is it

35:36

Nepo baby or Nepo baby? Because

35:38

I don't really understand how you say it. I've

35:40

been saying Nepo baby. Is it Nepo

35:42

baby? Okay, I think I say Nepo baby,

35:44

but then nepotism is not nepotism. So- Just

35:48

makes it sound a lot fancier. Yes, exactly.

35:50

Yes. Whatever that word is,

35:52

is absolutely

35:55

a thing, but I think really

35:58

the underlying thing is that, is that sense of,

35:59

of sort of just feeling like

36:02

you're allowed to be in the room, which

36:04

is I think where the Nepo

36:07

baby thing actually comes in.

36:09

I think it's Nepo because it is from Nepothesis.

36:11

Yeah, I mean that does make my theory.

36:13

Yeah, it's not that's not how I want

36:16

to say it in my head. So you're

36:18

like, who is it Nigella when

36:20

she says Mikrowave? Yeah, Mikrowave. I'm

36:23

very much like Nigella. The

36:26

queen and the queen.

36:27

Yeah. So,

36:30

oh gosh. Anyway, I genuinely forgot

36:32

what the question was and I went off on a sort of... I

36:35

really kind of say one of them quickly going back to

36:37

the resilience

36:41

works as a parent and an actor

36:44

because I would say children are very much

36:46

like casting directors in that they can smell desperation

36:48

on you. Yeah,

36:50

that's true. That is true.

36:53

They really can. They can definitely sense it.

36:56

And as a parent, you

36:58

can, you're never prepared. Like you don't

37:00

get given the sides beforehand. You

37:03

don't know what the conversation that you're going to end up having

37:05

in sort of 10 minutes time is. Whereas with an audition,

37:08

they at least give you, you know, 48 hours prep

37:10

it.

37:10

Parenting is improv. Yes,

37:13

that's exactly it. And that looks terrifying. Yeah,

37:16

it does. So yeah. So yeah,

37:19

so I suppose, and

37:22

maybe there's a sort of a similar

37:25

thing with having a child so young, maybe that's a

37:27

sort of slight mirroring

37:30

in terms of being not being

37:33

able to, I now feel like because I've

37:35

been a parent for such a long

37:38

time, it's kind of the one thing that

37:40

I've always done. I feel like I've never not

37:42

been a parent and I still have a three year old.

37:45

So I feel like

37:46

it's never ending. You know, remember

37:48

that film, The Never Ending Story? Yeah. It's

37:50

like that. Only fun.

37:55

So I suppose maybe that's a

37:57

similar thing. I sort of feel like I've earned my

37:59

place. place in this world

38:02

because I've put the

38:04

work in on like the Nipo

38:06

Baby. My 12 year old Nipo Baby.

38:09

Nipo Baby sounds like a rapper or something.

38:11

It does a little bit, yeah. And now the

38:13

same Nipo Baby. Yeah,

38:16

maybe I should rebrand myself. Yeah, you could headline

38:18

Jim's 40th festival. Yes.

38:22

Oh no, I can't headline it. Obviously have to headline

38:24

it. I could be your support. Yes. I

38:27

don't know what my shtick would be yet. I'll work on it.

38:29

Support at Nipo Baby. Yeah.

38:35

But going back to I think going back to the thing

38:37

about having parents as as

38:40

performers as well, I guess there is that other

38:43

the other flip side of it is the

38:45

weight of expectation on

38:48

you, I guess, as yourself, but also

38:50

people

38:51

who are looking to put you in

38:53

in jobs and stuff. Did you ever feel

38:55

that heavy weight of expectation?

39:00

Do you know, I'm not sure that I did feel the

39:02

heavy weight of expectation. I think because

39:06

why didn't I feel that?

39:08

I think, well, I think I

39:12

have always I've

39:14

not got a very I've not got it. I've

39:16

never had an inflated sense of self. I've

39:19

always I feel like I've got quite a reasonable understanding

39:22

of my

39:23

talent pool. So

39:25

I feel like I go, I can do that. Well,

39:28

I can't do that. I don't want to do that.

39:31

And I really enjoy that. But but I'm not brilliant

39:33

at it. So I feel like I understand myself

39:36

relatively well. So and

39:39

my parents were at their sort of the

39:41

height of their fame. Incredibly famous.

39:44

So I think there was a sort

39:46

of I think I sort

39:49

of thought, well, I'm never going to be that. I'm

39:51

never going to be the person who's got a catchphrase,

39:54

the person who has to walk down the street

39:56

in a cap with their heads lowered. Otherwise, they

39:58

get stopped every five seconds. I

40:01

think I just thought I mean I enjoy

40:03

it. I'm quite good at a bit of it.

40:05

So I'll try and do that as a job.

40:08

So I don't think I had a

40:10

heavy way of expectation

40:13

because I think I had

40:15

a sort of reasonable understanding of what

40:18

I was able to do and was

40:19

fine with that. Never

40:21

felt like, oh I, you know, I'd love to be able

40:23

to, I mean I'd love to be Bonnie Langford. I'd love

40:25

to be able to be in musical, the musical

40:28

theatre would be my heaven.

40:29

Oh really, that's the one, that's the one. Oh my gosh,

40:32

I would love it so much.

40:34

But I can't sing and dance which does feel

40:36

like quite a sort of massive...

40:37

It's a little bit, yeah, it's a little

40:40

area of it that you have to sort of master I think,

40:42

yeah. What would be the,

40:44

sorry, going off segue here, what would be the

40:46

musical

40:47

you'd love, what would be the one? Chicago. Chicago,

40:50

okay. Yeah, yeah, probably

40:53

Velma in Chicago. Have

40:55

you seen on Apple TV there's

40:57

a show called Shmigadoon? Oh my gosh, I love

40:59

it. That's so good. He's

41:01

in the second series, it's based on Chicago. Oh yeah, no,

41:04

haven't seen that one yet. Very good. So I've

41:06

got a very extensive list of things I need to watch. I watch

41:08

it so much. But I'm a three year old so that doesn't happen. But,

41:11

so yeah, so I'd love to do that and

41:13

when I'm on my own I pretend I can and

41:16

that's enough. I sort of go, well, that's, in

41:19

my head I sound like her for a minute

41:21

and then,

41:22

but I'm not going to inflict that upon the world because I realise

41:24

I don't. I'm not going to, I understand

41:26

there are things I can't do.

41:28

So I suppose that's it, I don't

41:31

think. And also my, I think

41:33

when you're sort of that famous, it's also you see

41:35

the horrible bit of it. And I never

41:38

really wanted that.

41:40

I'm quite a private person. So

41:43

I think, you know, and

41:46

the sort of stuff that comes with that can be intrusive

41:49

and upsetting and whilst I was very

41:51

resilient,

41:53

I didn't want that for me. I sort of wanted

41:55

it to be my job and then I wanted to

41:57

have my son and that be the other bit.

41:59

life.

42:02

So I was sort of fine. Yeah.

42:03

That feels like quite a unique

42:05

perspective in the creative industries

42:07

because I think a lot of people are, I

42:11

don't want to use the word desperate, but I mean like

42:13

a lot of people want to have high ambition, I

42:15

guess is probably the better way of putting it,

42:18

and will do kind of whatever to get there in some

42:21

respects. Or they feel like

42:23

they can do lots of different things. So it's nice

42:25

to think that you're happy

42:27

and settled in what

42:29

you feel you're good at, and you're

42:31

happy with your journey and your path. Yeah.

42:34

And there were definitely bits of my life where I sort

42:37

of, I will do things that

42:39

I'm not good at

42:41

because I want to do them even though I'm not good

42:43

at them. So it's not like I'm sort of going, well, I will only

42:45

do things I'm good at. Like I recently, it's

42:50

actually been a couple of years, started doing

42:53

adult netball.

42:54

And which, yeah,

42:56

well, no, no, no, no, it's not cool. There's

42:59

nothing cool about that. And

43:02

I'm not good at it. And I'm, you know, well,

43:05

I'm not awful, but I'm not, I don't, I'm

43:07

not a sort of overachieving adult netballer.

43:10

I play with a lot of women who are very good.

43:13

And we almost always lose,

43:16

but I'm always left with a great sense

43:18

of achievement that I've done it,

43:21

even more so probably because I'm not very

43:24

good at it.

43:26

So that's,

43:27

you know, I sort of get that bit of it from other

43:29

parts of my life that aren't my career thing.

43:34

And I have different, you know, I do different things

43:36

for work. I don't just act.

43:38

I produce and

43:40

I write. And so there are different

43:43

things that I feel

43:45

give me different

43:46

parts of

43:49

my sort of personality, they sort of scratch

43:51

those itches, it's not necessarily just acting.

43:54

And because I suppose that's that like what you were saying

43:56

earlier, that this sort of my journey

43:59

to whatever.

43:59

my career was going to be happened

44:02

very quickly, very early, because it had to happen.

44:04

And so I didn't really get the bit where I got to kind

44:06

of explore what the other options might be. And

44:08

I think that's what I'm sort of doing now,

44:11

going, Oh, maybe I want to try this, and I want to try that.

44:15

And, you know, some of the things I'll be good at,

44:17

and some of the things I'll be terrible at, but I'm sort of going to try

44:19

them all. Because if I find it fun, then

44:21

why not really?

44:23

Yeah, I mean, there's a beauty in doing

44:25

things that you're bad at, I think, and for fun. I

44:27

mean, on a

44:28

sort of similar note or not, I am also bad at

44:30

singing. But I

44:33

have inflicted that on the world. Right.

44:35

Online and on stage. Okay. To the

44:37

tune of hundreds of millions of views. So I have

44:40

forced people to this.

44:42

You've succeeded, though.

44:44

Hundreds of, but that that must

44:46

mean people are getting joy from it. Yeah,

44:48

I think I think that you are wishing

44:50

them to get.

44:51

It's your I think I think the fact that I'm

44:53

not very good at saying it adds to the joy. It's comedy. I

44:55

think like it adds to the you're making people laugh.

44:58

That's it. Yeah. Yeah. But I enjoy I love it. I

45:00

really love like sitting there. I literally have my microphone here

45:02

and like singing my little parody songs and stuff like it

45:04

is. I generally get a

45:06

joy from it. I think there's a real beauty in just leaning

45:09

into that thing that even if you're not good at

45:11

it, just finding joy from it. Because when you

45:13

are in entertainment industry, that

45:15

those lines can be blurred after a while if

45:17

you are. And that's what I was struggling with with

45:19

comedy

45:21

was not knowing if I was good at it. And my constant

45:23

search. Am I good? But I enjoy it. But

45:25

I am I good at it? And should I be better?

45:27

And then it gets really

45:30

tangled. Yeah. And

45:32

then it messes with your mental health and it can be a real just

45:35

a difficult path to tread. Yeah.

45:39

So I think it's lovely that there

45:41

are things where you can just go, I just I purely

45:43

do this for fun. And it's a real

45:46

release. But it brings on to something else

45:48

that you you're talking earlier about

45:51

allowing yourself to be in the room.

45:53

And I really resonated with that because the word I got from that is

45:55

like permission, giving yourself permission to be there. And

45:58

again, I think that in the entertainment industry,

45:59

or actually probably we have people

46:02

that listen to this that do all sorts of things in any industry, once

46:05

you give yourself permission to be there, I think

46:07

you really open up

46:09

the possibilities of what you can do, but it's

46:11

a big, that's a big door to step through sometimes

46:13

that people find really hard. Yeah, yeah,

46:16

it is really tough. Yeah,

46:19

and I think that's why there's, you know, you

46:22

know, people don't sort of like to admit

46:25

to having a sort of privilege and being

46:27

born into a sort of certain type of

46:29

family, but

46:31

it does and that's,

46:33

it was sort of built into

46:35

me and

46:37

will be inbuilt into my kids and

46:39

it's very important that they know that that is

46:41

inbuilt into them and that does bring a massive privilege.

46:44

And from that, they then have to work really

46:46

hard to prove that they deserve to be there.

46:49

Like I feel like, you know, I have spent,

46:51

you know, since I was 12 years old trying to prove

46:53

that I can act well enough to be able to

46:56

be on the telly. And I

46:58

think it's, I think it is really

47:00

grossly unfair to not acknowledge that privilege

47:02

because I think it's

47:04

important for you

47:07

as the person who has it and also everyone

47:09

else to sort of,

47:10

it's a bit empress new clothes, isn't it? To sort of go,

47:13

no, it's not, it's like, and

47:18

I don't have it in lots of areas and I do, there

47:20

are lots of areas that I feel

47:22

like I need, that

47:25

I don't belong in the room and I'm terrible

47:28

socially, I'm awful, like, you

47:30

know, I have sort of,

47:32

I have wonderful, wonderful friends who now

47:34

know me incredibly well, but it's taken me such

47:36

a long time to sort of make these wonderful friends because

47:38

I was so socially awkward and I would literally

47:40

walk into a room and I'd be like, I can't make eye

47:43

contact, I don't know, I don't know how to be. And

47:45

so,

47:46

you know, sort of, it's taken me a really long

47:48

time to kind of get a group of friends, this

47:50

is where the netball came in, you see,

47:54

allowing myself to be sort of ludicrous

47:56

and crap at something, got

47:58

me my friends.

47:59

So I think

48:02

I do get that sense of not

48:05

feeling like you've got permission

48:08

to be in a room.

48:09

I've just luckily not had that

48:11

in terms of my job. In a way, I feel

48:13

like as I've got older, there's a bit more

48:15

of that. And that is that's absolutely because of this

48:18

slight debate where you kind of go, well, hold on a minute. But

48:21

you know, I'm nearly 40. I'm like, well, if I'm

48:24

if I haven't earned it by now, I'm probably never going to earn it. At

48:26

which point that's like fine. You know, I can't

48:29

sort of,

48:29

you know, not everyone's going to like what you have to offer.

48:32

But I've you know,

48:34

it's it's it's been a wonderful career

48:36

to me so far. And that's, you know,

48:38

I've been I feel incredibly lucky to have had that.

48:41

But yes, I'm terrible. I'm terrible socially.

48:43

Are you terrible socially? I sort of think people

48:46

who do podcasts might be terrible socially.

48:48

You're getting those vibes from

48:50

us. I

48:53

mean, I love I love the backdrop of

48:55

your of where you're podcasting from.

48:58

It very much gives me that vibe. But

49:01

are you good socially? So

49:04

I always thought I was quite bad socially. But and

49:06

I think one of these things with lockdown, isn't you

49:08

kind of start to piece together

49:11

like how you work as an individual? And

49:13

I always thought I was quite shy, introverted.

49:15

But it turns out I'm not. I'm actually quite an extrovert

49:17

kind of person. I need to see people every day. I

49:20

always go down to the local coffee shop in town. I

49:22

go to every day and I've got

49:24

to know lots of people in there and I just have conversations

49:26

with whoever. Whereas my

49:28

my wife and kids have all realized that they're super

49:31

introverted. They just like. Oh, that's interesting.

49:33

Yeah. Yeah. So they're like, they just

49:35

like my particularly my

49:37

eldest is very introverted. I

49:40

mean, it's hard to get them out

49:42

of the room. So it's funny how that happened. So

49:44

I think, yes, I had a perception of myself

49:46

that has been challenged and changed.

49:50

Yeah. I don't know about you, Jim, but you always

49:52

seem quite affable to me. So I was

49:55

actually I was thinking about it. I'm

49:57

sure just asking the question. I was always. very

50:00

awkward socially as well and still I'm a bit and I

50:02

actually just put on a mask

50:04

and just pretend to be confident and

50:08

I find, I don't know if you find this of like the

50:10

netball group or like friends as you get older, every

50:13

single time I get a new group of friends and I've met

50:15

some like amazing dads here out

50:17

in the sticks

50:20

when we moved out, I end up

50:22

falling into the same role in every friendship group which

50:25

is the sort of funny quirky

50:27

funny guy kind of thing. I don't

50:30

know if I would like it but like

50:32

I wonder if I met some friends new

50:34

friends and like tried just being like a reserved

50:37

intelligent, I mean it's not in me but like I

50:39

mean yeah you know what I mean like someone

50:42

else. That's a different mask. Yeah

50:44

that's right that's multiple masks.

50:48

I just end up being the same person.

50:52

Is it like where's

50:54

Jimmy? It's more just like I

50:56

don't know silly jokey sighted

50:59

stuff dedicating but I've got better at that as I got older

51:01

like less, I'm more confident now but just I don't

51:04

know. What's your defense mechanism

51:06

isn't it? Funny that's the, that's

51:09

why everyone does that. Yeah because

51:11

I hate awkward pauses in conversations,

51:13

I hate quiet moments and that comes from my mum 100%

51:16

so I fill it with

51:18

red comments and jokes and blah blah

51:20

blah blah and whatever.

51:21

And also you were saying earlier you don't like asking

51:24

for help from other people which is the sort of

51:26

not being able to be vulnerable that

51:28

all ties in with

51:30

vulnerability, wall comedy, funny.

51:32

How does it manifest? I was gonna say sorry George

51:34

I was gonna say how does it manifest with you at those

51:36

moments? The

51:40

socially awkward thing, well I think I've

51:42

leaned into being socially awkward now. I think

51:44

I just sort of thought well I should just own this situation

51:47

and sort of go and

51:48

sort of brand myself as that

51:50

person which in a way sort of releases you and stops

51:52

you being that person. Yeah

51:54

I think I do use comedy as a defense

51:56

mechanism. I developed

51:58

a sort

52:03

of funny persona. I

52:06

mean, it's like, yeah, I mean, it is me, but

52:08

it's a way of

52:10

sort of saying

52:12

the things I want to say whilst

52:14

not making it all good for anyone else. If

52:16

I can say the things but kind

52:18

of, then I can say, I can get it out, they can hear

52:21

me, but it's also, everyone can have

52:23

a lovely little laugh and they don't have to feel like there's a

52:25

burden on them, probably.

52:27

Which I think

52:29

is pretty, I think it feels quite healthy.

52:32

I've also started talking quite a lot about

52:34

the,

52:36

in the sort of moment that I'm feeling

52:38

socially awkward going, I feel very socially

52:40

awkward right now. And to sort of,

52:43

which allows everyone to understand

52:45

the

52:46

sort of,

52:47

and then sometimes in a social situation, I will just

52:49

go, I'm

52:50

leaving now, I'll see.

52:51

And then everyone

52:53

else feels safe to do. And

52:55

then I just leave them with the social. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

52:59

But it

53:00

is, it's a, I think I, it was always

53:02

shyness when I was a kid.

53:05

And then you're not really allowed to be shy as

53:07

a mother and as a

53:08

grown-up. So

53:11

it's, I think I went through quite a few years

53:13

of being someone who was

53:15

a bit too serious

53:18

almost to kind of be like, well, this is what, this is

53:20

what grown-ups are, right? This is, I think

53:22

as I've got older, I've become more

53:24

childish because I felt more confident

53:27

in sort of who I am. And that

53:29

has manifested itself in playing sort of childlike

53:32

sports with grown women.

53:35

I did, we did netball at my primary school,

53:37

which is just looking. I never understood

53:39

how it worked, to be honest. Oh, it's,

53:42

you

53:42

should definitely play it. You should go

53:44

and find your local team. I don't even know the

53:46

position. Goal attack, right? That's

53:48

the only, only position I know. Goal

53:51

attack. What does goal, so they, obviously

53:54

they attack the goal in some

53:57

way. Well, you're picking up quickly. I know.

54:00

to do that from the name to

54:02

be a goal

54:04

attack the goal with the ball yeah put it in

54:06

then that needs to be a skill set you I do not

54:08

have that skill set right I say well away

54:11

from your goal attacks and your shooters

54:12

okay so you're more defense

54:15

orientated are you I'd

54:18

listen you know I like a center

54:20

but I can only do a quarter because you

54:22

know I'm not as fit as I used to be because you

54:24

know I'm not

54:26

12 you need to be fixed to your netball because

54:29

you can't move there's a lot of pivoting Jim

54:31

there's a lot of pivoting and come

54:33

on you can move

54:34

because how would the game work if you come on

54:36

it's not completely static because if you like

54:41

everyone's just well yeah what happens on the ball

54:43

when you drop the ball you

54:45

know let's go pick it up you

54:48

can't pick it up again if you drop the ball someone else has to fit

54:50

yeah you can't again no you

54:52

can run just not with the ball

54:54

between catching the ball

54:57

you do a lot of running a

54:58

center especially does a lot of running

55:00

I'm more of like a goal defense right

55:03

that's I think where I sit happiest so

55:06

you're defending the goal I'm taking it yeah

55:09

I'm not really tall

55:12

enough but you know my friends they let me they

55:14

let me play that they're all much taller than me

55:18

I have again derailing it I do have clothes

55:21

though that I don't that I don't wear because

55:25

there's too nice is that

55:27

well well no it's not well

55:29

it is objectively weird yes but

55:32

I can I can get I understand that

55:35

I can understand the

55:37

but you never wear them presumably you're right

55:39

I basically go through a

55:41

stage where life I buy I don't

55:43

really buy clothes and I get more or think I'm addicted to vintage

55:46

like I think I might form the first

55:48

like vintage anonymous group because I'm like literally

55:50

I had to delete it off my phone

55:51

yeah actually that is a better show yeah

55:53

I decided a couple

55:59

years ago never to buy any new clothes because like obviously

56:01

there's too much and the water, damn

56:03

it, all that stuff. So only a bar of vintage but

56:05

if I buy something nice it

56:07

will then sit in my wardrobe for like six months

56:10

and I won't wear it because I want to get dirty. Yeah.

56:13

Then I'll look at it in six months and I'll think oh fuck I never wore that jacket

56:15

and then I'll put it on like oh it's a really nice jacket

56:17

and then I'll wear it solidly for like three

56:19

weeks. Yeah.

56:21

And it will get dirty then it'll get cleaned it goes back in

56:23

the cupboard and then the whole thing starts again.

56:26

Okay so you are at some point wearing

56:28

the clothes. I thought you were going to say oh so you

56:30

are weird. Yeah. That's confirmed.

56:33

Yeah. But the thing is with your with your cap

56:36

you're never wearing that. No. I

56:39

think you're putting it on a mantelpiece somewhere or you're

56:41

framing it. Yeah it's more of a decorative kind of thing

56:43

it's like getting a trophy. It's

56:45

like the last day at primary school when

56:48

everyone signs your shirt you're never going to wear that again. You're

56:51

actually probably going to bin it actually but like you know you. I've

56:53

still got mine. Have you? Yeah.

56:57

I was going to get it out the other day because

56:59

my son's just done that for his God he's just

57:01

done his GCSEs and had the last day of school

57:03

and he had all the markings on

57:05

his shirt and I thought I'm going to get mine out. And

57:08

there was some quite profound things written on mine.

57:12

One of them was like. What was that? Was

57:14

there a lot of penises? There's a few penises there was someone

57:16

a joke someone had painted a cucumber

57:18

must have been in art.

57:19

So the fact she painted a whole cucumber

57:22

or

57:23

a courgette or something. There's a story. Yeah.

57:27

But one of them was like I never knew you but I'm

57:30

wishing you well in the future. Love

57:33

so and so. Mrs. Brown. Yeah.

57:36

The headmaster. But

57:38

yeah it's quite it was quite nice I

57:40

thought. I hope that person's doing well.

57:43

I hope

57:43

they're having a very very

57:46

very nice life. Have you looked them up

57:48

on Facebook yet? No but I will

57:50

possibly after this. Yeah yeah. Yeah

57:53

yeah. I'm just thinking because you do. I

57:57

was like should we do that if you leave a job. Like

57:59

but you do cut. because you get like a card and everyone signs

58:01

it but no one puts anything as profound as that ever

58:04

they just put oh thanks for the cup of

58:08

tea's yeah

58:11

maybe a couple of penises though

58:12

yeah yeah that instinct

58:14

ever goes away does it yeah no it doesn't

58:16

it doesn't why is that so Marty

58:19

why is it so fun when I used

58:21

to play Sunday League back in

58:23

Surrey in Oxford near I

58:25

grew up

58:27

we used to paint the lines on the pitch ourselves because

58:29

the

58:30

face we were using the pitch like didn't do it

58:33

and every week without fail we would line

58:35

the pitch and then just throw a massive penis next to

58:38

it because why wouldn't you yeah

58:40

quite yeah yeah

58:43

I did that today yesterday

58:46

they got um

58:47

they got what's it called when a pilot is made

58:49

to take a detour when they want

58:51

to land um I

58:52

can't what that's called whatever that is and

58:55

he got so annoyed with the fact he wasn't allowed to land that

58:57

he drew a massive penis

59:00

in the sky so that oh

59:01

my god that's incredible amount of skill

59:03

great I know yeah but also

59:06

probably like a much bigger detour yes

59:08

yeah yeah yeah yeah oh I've run out of

59:10

fuel now um

59:13

as the plane's going down yeah it was totally

59:17

worth it uh as

59:19

you said that I got what's that song castles in the sky

59:21

because I just got a

59:23

penis in the sky oh

59:26

dear one of your parody songs going to enjoy

59:28

this I've been good for this podcast has gone I knew

59:30

but this is where I was gonna go

59:33

well Georgia what an

59:35

evening well spent yes um

59:37

exactly

59:38

most of my kids are in bed by now so this has worked out

59:40

really yes yeah I was gonna say we can keep going if you

59:42

exactly same time

59:45

tomorrow

59:47

yeah we had they said they wanted to do a part two

59:49

I mean yes exactly I

59:52

know they loved so much we only got

59:54

up to age 17 so I feel

59:56

like we haven't covered a lot of stuff because we've talked about um

59:59

with I do railed it. But it is fun, it

1:00:01

is fun to talk about. The

1:00:03

last thing I wanted to ask you about was filmmaking,

1:00:05

because you've started doing a bit of filmmaking. We've

1:00:08

talked a bit about, you know, diversifying

1:00:10

and what you're doing and finding new

1:00:12

things that you enjoy doing. Have

1:00:14

you enjoyed that experience and is that stuff you

1:00:17

want to do more of? Yeah,

1:00:19

I've really enjoyed it. I've

1:00:21

enjoyed it much more than

1:00:23

I thought I was going to. I think I'd sort of thought,

1:00:26

you know, being on a set and sort of seeing what producers

1:00:29

do, I think I sort of thought I could do that. That's a bit like being

1:00:31

a parent. A lot

1:00:33

of responsibility and everyone's getting cross with

1:00:35

you.

1:00:36

I might try that. And then I sort

1:00:40

of started working with this guy

1:00:42

called Finn Glynn, who I went to school with

1:00:44

when we were 12. And

1:00:47

he had started a production company.

1:00:50

And he I sort of met up with

1:00:52

him and he was like, what do you want to do? And I was like, I think I want to be a

1:00:54

producer. And he was like, I mean, okay,

1:00:56

good luck. Want me

1:00:58

to help you with that? Do you want to like have a chat about it? And

1:01:00

then I ended up

1:01:02

sort of going in on a company with him for

1:01:04

a couple of years. And we made we made

1:01:07

a film together. And it was

1:01:09

such a lovely experience. And we sort of we

1:01:12

came up, you know, he came up with the idea, we developed

1:01:14

the idea, my best friend wrote it and directed

1:01:16

it. And it was, it was

1:01:19

just a joy from beginning to end the whole experience

1:01:21

whole. It was a sort of massive creative journey.

1:01:24

And at the end of it, we got to sit in a cinema

1:01:26

and watch it. And it was like, Oh, my gosh, this is amazing.

1:01:29

And it is, it's such a sort

1:01:31

of privilege to be able to make a

1:01:33

whole film from a sort of seed of an idea

1:01:36

to the bit where people in the room are sort

1:01:38

of reacting to it. And so

1:01:40

that definitely gave me the bug

1:01:42

for

1:01:43

making things.

1:01:46

And then during the pandemic, and then it's

1:01:48

between then I did a couple of other things. And we did me

1:01:51

and my best friend who's the writer director,

1:01:53

we did short films and we sort of kept

1:01:55

that ticking over whilst also being actors. And

1:01:58

then during the pandemic, there was

1:01:59

Obviously, there was nothing. Suddenly, 24

1:02:03

hours into it, and I got a text from Finn

1:02:07

saying, are you

1:02:09

busy? I'm like, depends

1:02:12

what you mean by busy. And

1:02:14

then he was like, are you up for

1:02:16

working?

1:02:17

I was like, yes, I am. And

1:02:20

that was day two of lockdown, so

1:02:22

day one of homeschooling, by

1:02:24

which point I was already sort

1:02:26

of

1:02:27

going, I mean, why did I have

1:02:29

so many children? Yeah, that was hard. Yeah,

1:02:33

I mean, a

1:02:34

terribly privileged life

1:02:37

to say it, but that is one of the worst

1:02:39

experiences I've ever gone through. It

1:02:42

hasn't involved sort of health because

1:02:45

it was just it

1:02:46

was such a massive responsibility and so wildly

1:02:49

out of my skill set. And I

1:02:51

just thought, you know, there was no we didn't know how

1:02:54

long it was going to last. We were being

1:02:56

told this sort of, oh, it's only going to be for three months.

1:02:58

But we all knew that was a lie. So

1:03:01

that was that was pretty bleak. And so when the opportunity

1:03:03

came up to develop a show

1:03:06

that was very much

1:03:08

legged upon.

1:03:09

And yeah, we just sort of this

1:03:13

was this was staged,

1:03:14

which came we just we did

1:03:16

a pilot episode

1:03:18

just to see if it could work. And when

1:03:20

we edited it together, we were like, oh,

1:03:22

maybe this maybe this could work. This is something that,

1:03:24

you know, people, because they haven't really got much

1:03:26

else to and new

1:03:28

stuff to watch at the moment, maybe they would be interested in this. And

1:03:30

so we sent to the BBC

1:03:33

and the BBC were like, we've got no content.

1:03:36

Yes, make that. And in

1:03:38

a really bizarre, never happens

1:03:40

in the real world way. They just let

1:03:42

us make a TV show without interfering

1:03:46

at all. Like we we we just had

1:03:48

them this finished series and they went, yes,

1:03:51

great. And then put it on the telly. And that

1:03:53

never happens.

1:03:56

And then we were lucky enough to make three

1:03:58

seasons of it,

1:03:59

which. was, sort of each one was

1:04:01

more joyous than the next. It took us to sort of incredibly

1:04:04

bizarre meta places. It opened

1:04:06

up,

1:04:07

you know, up until then I had

1:04:10

been in a very private, you

1:04:12

know, marriage

1:04:14

in that we didn't have our

1:04:16

photograph taken together, very consciously

1:04:19

kept, we've kept all of our, we still have kept

1:04:21

our kids out of that sort of world. But, you

1:04:24

know, we didn't really kind of do

1:04:26

the couple thing and then suddenly we

1:04:28

were in our house filming ourselves

1:04:31

being a couple and then offering it up to the world.

1:04:33

And so that was quite a massive

1:04:36

leap in terms of the way

1:04:39

that our

1:04:40

lives changed in that sort of time.

1:04:44

So it's, that was a very

1:04:46

different creative journey than Yumi

1:04:50

and Him, which was the film I had made

1:04:52

prior to that, which

1:04:55

was much more sort of traditional kind of, you know, indie

1:04:57

movie situation. So this

1:04:59

was quite weird and it, but

1:05:02

it has

1:05:03

sort of changed my life in

1:05:05

a very, very positive way. And I'm

1:05:07

very glad that I got to do it. And I'm very glad I

1:05:10

got to experience all of the different, because, you know, we were, we

1:05:12

were the directors,

1:05:14

the writers, the producers, the makeup

1:05:17

teams, the costume, the set, the continuity,

1:05:19

we got to do all of those things, because

1:05:22

we had no one else to do them. Very,

1:05:25

very glad that those people exist. And I

1:05:27

was like, those things, but it was a really cool

1:05:29

thing to get

1:05:33

to experience that at a time where there

1:05:35

wasn't much else that was cool in the world. And it felt pretty

1:05:37

scary and bleak

1:05:38

out there.

1:05:40

So that's sort of,

1:05:41

it's a great show. I mean, firstly, Finnegan

1:05:44

is a brilliant name, isn't it?

1:05:47

Yeah. Strong. That's like

1:05:49

movie star level. That is. It really is. Yeah.

1:05:53

Stage is brilliant. And like,

1:05:54

this is meant as a compliment. And as

1:05:57

I'm saying, I feel like it might come out wrong, but.

1:06:00

you can tell that they let you get on with it and make

1:06:02

it because... That is a compliment.

1:06:05

That is a compliment. That's

1:06:08

chunky editing, yeah. That

1:06:12

is David Love. Because

1:06:14

you can feel the warmth. You can feel the warmth in

1:06:16

every scene. And it's just... Yeah,

1:06:19

it's a beautiful show. And you can

1:06:21

tell that love sort of comes across... Yeah,

1:06:24

on set. On set, exactly.

1:06:28

It's a sort

1:06:30

of cool group of six people who

1:06:33

all had to become lots of different things. And

1:06:36

we hadn't met Simon Evans, the

1:06:39

writer-director. But

1:06:43

we didn't meet him for a year.

1:06:46

We'd already made... I think maybe we

1:06:48

definitely made one season. I'm not sure if we made the second one, actually,

1:06:50

by the time we met. But we hadn't seen each

1:06:52

other in person in

1:06:53

real life. And I just remember sort of seeing him and

1:06:55

just going, Oh my God, it's so weird that your head

1:06:57

goes all the way round. So I remember

1:07:00

the sadness. It was such

1:07:02

a sort of bizarre experience

1:07:05

to know these people so

1:07:07

well.

1:07:08

I mean, you know, me and Anna had met for

1:07:10

five minutes before we then played

1:07:13

people who knew each other really well. And now we

1:07:15

know each other really well. So it's

1:07:17

so difficult to know what became what and

1:07:19

because of what. The

1:07:22

lines are very blurred. It's very meta, both

1:07:24

on screen and off screen.

1:07:26

But we've sort of... Michael

1:07:29

and David had known each other from Good Omens season

1:07:33

one, and they got on very well. But they

1:07:35

weren't sort of... They were mates.

1:07:36

No, they are mates. They

1:07:39

are like...

1:07:40

Yeah. I mean, they are

1:07:42

very interlinked now forever.

1:07:45

Yeah. For many

1:07:47

reasons. But

1:07:49

it's a sort of lovely... Now

1:07:51

what we showed you on screen in season one

1:07:54

is actually all real. And that's

1:07:56

a wonderful thing. I get another thing that's

1:07:58

come out of it that's so great.

1:07:59

So yeah, I feel very, I'm

1:08:02

very lucky that that

1:08:03

all happened, which is awful when you're talking

1:08:06

about a pandemic. But that

1:08:08

is what came out of it, whilst lots

1:08:10

of awful things did for us.

1:08:13

It was the little chink of sort of light and hope

1:08:15

that I think then other

1:08:17

people felt that there was a little bit of

1:08:20

joy every now and again would pop into their living rooms

1:08:22

in little 15 minute bursts that was,

1:08:24

that felt important. People talk about it

1:08:26

having been an important thing to them. And that is

1:08:29

again, because you can do that once in your life that

1:08:31

someone can say to you, that really saved me

1:08:33

from quite a bleak place. It's like that job done. That's

1:08:35

all you need to

1:08:36

do. I think that was a thing, wasn't it? During the

1:08:38

pandemic, was really digging into the kind

1:08:40

of stuff that we love, the creative stuff that we love,

1:08:43

books,

1:08:44

podcasts, movies, TV

1:08:46

shows, you know, wherever it might be, music.

1:08:49

That was the stuff that got us through that time.

1:08:52

Yeah,

1:08:53

yeah, absolutely. Yeah,

1:08:55

it certainly got me through the making of it and

1:08:58

all the other things that I watched on the telly

1:09:00

and,

1:09:01

you know, a sort of podcast, I

1:09:03

hadn't gotten into podcasts at all, I became obsessed with

1:09:05

podcasts, just that sense of being able to connect

1:09:08

with things. And, you

1:09:10

know, I think it did give people a realisation

1:09:13

into how important the creative industries are

1:09:15

at a time when, you know,

1:09:17

they were and are still under attack a

1:09:19

lot. But I think that was it

1:09:22

was really important for everyone to experience

1:09:24

that.

1:09:24

So yeah, very lucky that I was part of that. And it was

1:09:27

it was all of it was wonderful.

1:09:29

It's that it's connections, isn't it? Made us appreciate

1:09:31

connections when we didn't

1:09:34

really have any. Yeah. And

1:09:36

speaking of this connection

1:09:39

today, we've loved it. So

1:09:41

in my head, that link is a lot better. I

1:09:43

was lovely. Yeah, it was like a Hallmark

1:09:45

card. That was like, yeah, I

1:09:47

feel like I could have done it better. But I'll take that thing

1:09:50

as I'm obsessed with Hallmark movies. I'll absolutely take that.

1:09:52

Yeah,

1:09:52

roll with that. Well, thank you so

1:09:54

much for having that was really that was really lovely. No,

1:09:57

thank you. Thank you. I'm getting

1:09:59

choked up. No,

1:10:02

thank you so much. No, it's been absolute pleasure.

1:10:04

Thank you so much for coming on. I know it's been a Friday

1:10:07

night, which, you know, I'm sure there's probably

1:10:09

lots of more interesting things you could be doing on a Friday

1:10:11

night. Listen,

1:10:12

I'm just going to go back

1:10:14

into the kitchen and there's dinner made for me. Lovely.

1:10:18

At which point, perfect. Yeah. Well,

1:10:20

thank you so much. Thank you. And

1:10:23

it hasn't been socially awkward for one minute. No,

1:10:26

it hasn't actually. It's been really lovely. It's

1:10:28

been lovely. I mean, Jim was a bit socially

1:10:30

awkward, but you were fine. Yeah, I think

1:10:32

we all sort of raised that. Yeah, we just we just masked over

1:10:34

that. Yeah, you guys, what I do is I told you social

1:10:36

circles. I

1:10:39

just I'll be awkward so no one else can.

1:11:03

Georgia Tenet on the Black podcast. They were a fantastic

1:11:06

guest. I hope I've come in at the right point because I couldn't

1:11:08

quite hear the intro music, but I was judging my intro

1:11:10

by Charles nodding his head along to the

1:11:12

music. There you go. That's how tuned

1:11:14

we are. I was watching the nod, thinking

1:11:17

I think it's ending about now. Absolutely

1:11:19

now. I couldn't hear it for some reason. I

1:11:22

think my my friends are giving up on me. Yeah,

1:11:24

Georgia. Lovely person, some lovely

1:11:28

insight, really honest bits about her life.

1:11:30

You know, very interesting life so far and

1:11:34

some fantastic shows as well. Yes,

1:11:36

we've put on some huge shows in

1:11:38

a real real A-list star

1:11:40

this is. And she's given us time and been absolutely lovely with

1:11:43

us. And I just said before, talking about sort

1:11:45

of privileges and netball

1:11:47

and

1:11:48

social anxiety. Yeah, it was a great great

1:11:50

chat. I really loved it. I knew it'd be good, but

1:11:52

I think it surpassed even my expectations.

1:11:55

Yeah, fantastic. And I mean,

1:11:58

both big fans of stage, which is.

1:11:59

the show she produces, which they

1:12:02

started in lockdown. So they found

1:12:04

that project in lockdown and

1:12:06

it sort of helped them get them through that

1:12:09

moment. And probably helped a lot of

1:12:11

people who were watching get through that as well. We

1:12:13

all need these kind of distractions during that time,

1:12:15

during the pandemic. And

1:12:18

we talked a bit about how art and creative

1:12:21

fields kind of helped a lot of people as

1:12:24

a distraction, but for her, David

1:12:27

and Michael

1:12:28

and everyone who worked on that show, it was

1:12:31

something they could work on during the pandemic and give

1:12:33

them that distraction that they needed. But yeah, that's a brilliant

1:12:35

show. And obviously it's come back for a third season

1:12:38

recently as well. So if you haven't seen

1:12:40

it before, do go and check out Staged.

1:12:42

It's really, really fantastic.

1:12:45

We haven't seen it. What were you doing during the pandemic?

1:12:48

It was one of the things that gets us going. No,

1:12:52

sorry, that's very judgy of me. A lot of people did lots

1:12:54

of different things during the pandemic and had lots of

1:12:56

varying experiences. So

1:12:59

that was me being a little bit facetious there.

1:13:02

Yeah, it's a fantastic show. So good. And

1:13:04

it's really lovely that she was saying that David and Michael sort of become

1:13:07

friends through doing it. Or actually both couples have become

1:13:09

friends through doing it, which is really nice. So it's just,

1:13:11

yeah, nice vibes that show. And it's nice to hear

1:13:14

that they were real vibes. So

1:13:16

yeah, if you haven't watched it yet, do

1:13:18

go check it out. Yeah, definitely, definitely do.

1:13:20

Yeah, well, that was a fantastic episode and really,

1:13:23

really loved talking to Georgia and yeah,

1:13:25

look forward to whatever she does next.

1:13:28

Sure, it'd be great. Sure, it'd be great. Speaking

1:13:30

of what we're doing next, we're back next week. Yeah,

1:13:33

we are. It's what we do. Yeah,

1:13:36

relentless. Yeah,

1:13:40

that's one word you could use to describe the podcast.

1:13:43

Is it good? No, interesting, not

1:13:45

really. Relentless, yeah, that's the word.

1:13:49

Yeah, can you sum up blank in one

1:13:51

word?

1:13:52

Relentless. Relentless. They

1:13:56

don't listen to what the world is saying about them. They just

1:13:59

crack on and that's... we love about them. Well

1:14:01

do you know what I heard a thing with the

1:14:04

mighty Rick Rubin the other day he was talking on a

1:14:06

podcast, everyone who doesn't know

1:14:08

who Rick Rubin is do go and check him out he's one of the foremost

1:14:11

music producers in the world but he's

1:14:14

a bit of a guru these days on creativity

1:14:16

and he was saying that

1:14:19

whenever you're making any kind of art or

1:14:22

creative endeavor it should always

1:14:24

be for your enjoyment first

1:14:27

and the audience is second

1:14:29

so I think you know hopefully there

1:14:31

are still some audience people that like us

1:14:34

but

1:14:35

you know we've said every week Jim this is very

1:14:37

much our little thing that we

1:14:39

enjoy doing every week.

1:14:41

I think that's a good mantra

1:14:43

to live life by and there are people listening because

1:14:46

I checked the numbers last week

1:14:48

people are still here so that's good but

1:14:51

yeah I think that comes across in the episodes I think

1:14:53

that we are enjoying doing it and I think that hopefully

1:14:55

that's

1:14:55

yeah hopefully that's reflected and mirrored back

1:14:58

with our listeners. Absolutely. If not

1:15:01

then just

1:15:02

don't listen that's awful that's awful

1:15:04

way to end the podcast. No thank you very much

1:15:06

and thanks to our patrons as well who actually we're

1:15:09

not very good at

1:15:10

shouting out are we but they're

1:15:12

still here. But we will we will in future

1:15:15

but we do love our patrons and if you do want to become

1:15:17

a patron of the podcast you can.

1:15:19

Yeah

1:15:23

patreon.com slash the Blank Podcast.

1:15:25

Yeah and for the

1:15:29

price of a coffee every month you get extra content

1:15:32

get no ads so

1:15:34

look what more could you want. Get it early. Get

1:15:37

it early as well so look if

1:15:40

you want if you want blank without

1:15:43

any advertising with

1:15:45

a bit of extra stuff and on a

1:15:47

Monday instead of a Tuesday then

1:15:50

just you know have one less coffee this week.

1:15:54

Exactly. Or just do that anyway because

1:15:56

it's good for your health. Yeah that's true. Right.

1:16:00

I'll see you next week. We've done it again. We've

1:16:02

done it again. We've done our YouTube sign off. That's

1:16:04

gone on 15 minutes too long.

1:16:07

Thanks Giles. Thanks Georgia. Thanks

1:16:10

listeners. Thanks patrons. Yeah and you know

1:16:12

as always just remember...

1:16:14

Oh yeah, I cancelled so I thought you were doing

1:16:16

it. Yeah, good advice. Bye.

1:17:02

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