0:02

Ringy ring , ringy ring , Hello

0:04

switchboard . Good morning , Hello

0:06

there . I'm wondering would you be able

0:09

to put me through to your operations director ? His

0:11

name's John Smith .

0:13

John Smith right , Well , we don't have anybody's

0:15

contact details here .

0:18

But you're the switchboard for your company

0:20

. Yeah , yeah , that's right , we're the head office

0:22

absolutely Okay , but you don't have any

0:24

contact details of any members of staff .

0:27

We're a fully hybrid workforce now . Did

0:29

you say John Smith . If you have his phone

0:31

number , you're absolutely welcome to call him if you have his

0:34

direct telephone number .

0:35

Well , I want to talk to him about an idea

0:37

that I've got for your organisation .

0:39

It sounds like you may not have his number , so do

0:41

you have his email address ?

0:45

Well , I've actually sent him an email , but I'm following up that email

0:47

with a call . That's why I come through to you as

0:50

a switchboard to then put me through

0:52

to that person .

0:54

Can I ask ? One of the questions I have here on the desk

0:56

is are you interested in supplying us with new

0:58

products and services ? Yes , I am , yeah

1:00

, okay , so what I can do is give you

1:02

the new supplier email that goes to

1:04

a team that will read your email .

1:05

That's info at new suppliercom

1:09

okay , and I

1:11

mean I'm happy to do that . How confident

1:13

are you that the team reading that email will understand

1:15

what it is that I

1:18

want ?

1:18

well , I ? I'm simply on the switchboard

1:20

. My name is tony . We field number

1:22

of calls . Their job is to look at new

1:25

people who are interested in supplying the company , so

1:27

that's what they do . I couldn't speak for them , okay

1:31

.

1:31

Is that all right ? Okay , I'll do that

1:33

.

1:33

Okay , thank you . Thank you very much for calling

1:35

Bye , bye

1:38

.

1:48

Bob and Jeremy's Conflab

1:51

the Reality Podcast . This

1:56

, ladies and gentlemen , is what we're going to be talking

1:58

about today . It's about businesses

2:01

. Businesses how do people

2:03

get through to you and how do you buy

2:05

what you need to run and improve

2:08

your business ? It's a really good question

2:10

and that scenario is one that we've come

2:12

across quite a few times , and that's what

2:14

we're going to be discussing on today's podcast

2:16

. Businesses how do

2:18

you buy ?

2:19

So here we are , bobby . It's pouring with rain

2:21

, and where are you and I based ?

2:27

Well , I'm based in Lewis in Sussex , which is a really nice part

2:29

of the world , and it's not raining here currently

2:31

, though it has been . What about ?

2:32

you , I'm in Bucks , I'm in Buckinghamshire

2:35

, near the town of Buckingham . But

2:37

the fact is , bob , you and I are both based

2:40

at home and

2:42

our listeners heard that little sketch and

2:44

the operations director you were after , he

2:46

too was clearly based at

2:48

home . So I'm

2:51

going to get a little quiz for you , bob , and you can answer

2:53

listeners as well . What percentage of

2:55

UK businesses are

2:58

fully ? We're all

3:00

at work . This is a company where you must come

3:02

into , think of different industries

3:05

and things . So what percentage is that ?

3:08

I mean it's going to have changed hugely in the last few

3:10

years . But let's

3:12

say 40% , it's 30%

3:14

Okay .

3:16

So this could be hospitals , it could

3:18

be garages , it could be

3:20

all sorts of things where you are doing the work here Restaurants

3:23

, cafes , bars , soaps , train stations

3:25

, lots of stuff . But that's 30%

3:28

. So what percentage ? Question

3:30

two of businesses , organizations

3:33

in the UK are fully signed

3:35

up to hybrid working . It's

3:37

got to be 50% . At least it's 72%

3:41

, bob . Wow , yeah

3:43

, wow , yeah . Ons stuff we're giving

3:45

you here . So if

3:47

hybrid working is

3:49

the norm and

3:52

the 72% of companies who are signed

3:54

up to that , if you like , fully hybrid working

3:56

, the fact is , when you are

3:58

trying to get hold of the operations director

4:00

, who you think would love some

4:02

of reality trainings , leadership

4:04

programs , coaching , sales training , customer

4:06

service and it could make them much better , couldn't it ? oh

4:09

good , you're not going to get hold of him , bobby , whereas

4:11

you and I years ago , when

4:14

we were in the world of outbound calling

4:16

and we worked in offices

4:18

and contact centers , we could

4:20

ring businesses with a fairly reliable

4:22

. We'd get past a gatekeeper

4:25

. Of course we'd play those games . But if

4:27

we had an idea , if we had a product or

4:29

service that they should be considering

4:32

and we had a good , effective

4:34

opening our pitch was relevant and

4:36

we had done our research we might get a conversation

4:39

. We might end up selling them , reselling them

4:41

and becoming a supplier .

4:42

Well , I think , if we look back at

4:44

history and very recent history before

4:47

the internet , if you wanted to

4:50

buy stuff or needed to buy stuff for your

4:52

business , you had to

4:54

collate and assess

4:56

information . Now you did that in

4:58

a number of ways you either read

5:01

magazines which were about

5:03

those subjects , or you

5:05

went to exhibitions where you met companies

5:08

who were involved in those various topics , and

5:11

then you would select

5:13

ones that you needed to talk

5:15

to in more detail if they had a product or service

5:17

that you were going to need , and

5:20

then , over time , you would build up a network

5:22

of contacts that would be your default

5:24

go-to for those particular

5:26

products or services . Now

5:28

, of course , the Internet's come in and that's

5:30

changed things hugely . And

5:33

I was working in publishing when magazines

5:35

were desperately trying to play

5:37

catch up with the Internet in terms of products

5:39

and services and help people to

5:42

find stuff online that they might want

5:44

to buy services and

5:46

help people to find stuff online that they might want to

5:48

buy . And now what's happened , especially

5:55

since the pandemic , is that , because of hybrid working , you cannot just call somebody

5:57

and get through to them and have a conversation . It used to be the case that people would have answer phones and voicemails

6:00

that they would field for a long time . Now

6:02

they don't even need to do that , because if you don't

6:04

have their contact details , you

6:06

have no way of making contact

6:09

with that person .

6:10

Just sticking with what you've just said is , if

6:12

I was looking to buy that's how you prefaced

6:14

this I would build up a series of contacts

6:17

. I would read magazines . What

6:19

we're saying to you is that if you

6:21

were in a business that could

6:23

provide Bob , who was doing that work

6:25

as a buyer and thought he

6:27

might be in the market for your service

6:29

or product , Bob , during

6:32

his research , might receive an incoming

6:34

call from a salesperson saying

6:36

hey , I know that you're involved

6:38

in this and you make this , we provide this . And

6:41

he may not be expecting it and

6:43

he may not be in the buying market at that time , but

6:46

that's how salespeople operated . They would do

6:48

their research and they would be another

6:50

option for the person while they're looking to buy

6:52

. But I think what's interesting sticking on

6:54

this theme is how do you buy

6:56

? Now I would

6:58

say the shift is you no longer grab

7:01

your B2B magazine , you no longer

7:03

grab your directory . I was in directory business

7:05

. You happen

7:07

in your break to fly onto LinkedIn

7:09

.

7:10

Yep .

7:11

Or you flick open some

7:13

form of other social media and

7:16

you're in the market for whatever

7:18

product or service it is , and

7:20

you're hit with other options . And , of course

7:22

, when you fire up your computer in

7:24

the morning , whether it be a laptop or a desktop

7:26

, you will be receiving a

7:29

vast amount of emails saying , hey , we

7:31

make rivets , hey , we

7:35

provide whatever . And

7:37

so it seems to be that the buyer of

7:40

business to business services either

7:43

is very happy with their lot or satisfied and just

7:45

keeps signing the check . The direct

7:47

debit goes out each month for the product or service that

7:49

they are buying to enable

7:51

them to be in business , or they are

7:54

receiving emails , social media , some

7:57

form of direct mail , but how many buyers

7:59

are receiving incoming calls

8:01

? Based on the statistics that I shared

8:03

at the beginning , the answer is very few

8:06

, because when you buy

8:08

data and that's another email I receive each week

8:10

do you want to buy some data ? I'm not

8:12

offered mobile numbers , and if your

8:14

operations director's at home , bob , I've not

8:16

got his home phone number , I can't buy that and

8:18

I also can't buy his mobile . I can buy

8:20

his switchboard number and I can buy his

8:22

email .

8:24

Do you think that it means that

8:27

businesses by and large

8:29

are buying

8:32

the products and services they need poorly

8:35

based on past

8:37

experience , rather

8:39

than looking objectively

8:42

at what it is they're looking to buy and garnering

8:45

the relevant information to make a better choice

8:47

?

8:48

I think , if we look at human nature , I think there's a huge

8:50

amount of apathy that takes place both from

8:53

a buyer of a business or a consumer

8:55

. Look at how many people reinsure inferior

8:57

insurance products or they just stick with

8:59

their existing supplier . I think of the

9:01

US Charlotte-based sales

9:04

trainer , jeffrey Gittimer , who always says hi , are

9:07

you satisfied with your current supplier

9:09

? Yeah , I'm actually , yeah

9:11

, relatively satisfied , relatively

9:13

satisfied . You're happy to just be

9:15

satisfied . I prefer it when customers

9:18

say to me I'm over the moon . There's

9:20

no way I'd switch . By the sounds of things , things aren't good for

9:22

you . Let's have a conversation . Most people

9:24

are just I'm satisfied with my current supplier

9:26

Great .

9:28

Well , it would be nice to have that conversation , to

9:30

even hear that . Yeah , it would . And

9:32

I think that's the other side of it is

9:34

that , if you think to yourself right

9:36

, I'm in a position now where

9:38

I don't need to receive calls from people

9:40

trying to sell me things because I'm so important

9:43

, so busy , that I'm going to focus

9:45

on the things that I really need , to focus on the

9:47

fact that those people trying to sell you things could

9:50

actually help you achieve those goals and

9:52

could help you do what it is you need to do

9:54

. That's something which you are then

9:56

selecting when to engage

9:58

with that process and , if you can , you'll

10:00

delegate it to somebody else to do because you

10:02

think it's in some way beneath you . Is that the case

10:05

? Wow , it's quite heavy , isn't it

10:07

? It is , but I think it's true because

10:09

I I think if , when I think back to when I

10:11

was in business and managing

10:13

people and having to buy things

10:16

for exhibitions and stuff like

10:18

that , you know we were given budgets to spend

10:20

and there was all that sort of thing , there was no problem getting hold of people

10:22

. There was no problem getting hold of people . There was no problem getting

10:24

hold of information . People called you back

10:26

. People were desperate to sell you things and

10:28

were very effective in that

10:31

, and I now wonder

10:33

whether there is a kind of a bit

10:35

of a schism taking place where maybe

10:38

the reason that you're in a senior position where you can spend

10:40

money is because you have a network of people that

10:42

you use and that has value

10:44

to the organization . So they think , well , actually , well

10:47

, yeah , we'll promote that person because they know all

10:49

these different companies and people that they have a relationship

10:52

with . That means we don't have to go out and do

10:54

that work . That saves us money . And

10:56

I wonder whether people are rewarded

10:58

for the value of the networks that

11:01

they have . That's's another really interesting concept .

11:02

That's an interesting concept . I think , yeah

11:05

, when people are bringing in brilliant suppliers or

11:07

changing an element

11:10

of what they buy a new ingredient , a new

11:12

item , a new tool , a

11:15

new widget , whatever , and yeah

11:17

, they've got access to their network . I'm

11:20

sure that's what a lot of industries

11:22

trade on that . If I employ somebody

11:24

, he's got a good network

11:27

. We might win some more business through them

11:29

. Interesting isn't ?

11:30

it . The other side of it is that

11:32

I receive emails , as you do

11:34

, every day , and those that's

11:36

because we're a small business owner and

11:38

so we're on lists somewhere

11:41

and we get through these emails

11:43

. Now , most of these emails 95

11:45

of them are untargeted

11:47

, unspecific , broad-based marketing

11:50

emails that some businesses might

11:52

be interested in . So I get one

11:54

regularly from a company trying to sell water

11:56

for my office yeah well , we do

11:59

still have an office , but we don't need a big jug

12:01

of water in it , and if

12:03

they bother to do any research , they take me off their

12:05

list . But that's the kind of thing I get . I

12:08

get a lot of stuff from software

12:10

companies saying you need

12:12

to be selling our learning

12:15

management system yeah , with your training

12:17

to people , which means they want me to

12:19

become a reseller of their software . Effectively

12:21

, you know they get quite a lot of that and

12:23

I get loads of people saying let's

12:26

value your company for you , let's buy your

12:28

company for you , let's find a way to sell your company .

12:36

This podcast has been created by Reality

12:38

Training . We're a UK-based training

12:41

and leadership brand who work across many

12:43

sectors to improve businesses

12:45

and their people . Our tagline

12:48

is selling certainty , because

12:50

that's what we do Give you more certainty

12:52

in how you do things and give you

12:54

certainty about how you sell things

12:56

. Find out more at realitytrainingcom

13:04

. So we've

13:07

got this idea of selling and

13:09

if we start with a buyer's perspective

13:12

, they are doing research

13:14

online primarily for things

13:16

they need for their business , and they might

13:18

receive an email , social media , direct

13:21

mail and some phone calls , but we can't reach them

13:23

on the phone . That's the point . That's what we're saying . They can't

13:25

be reached on the phone . Them on the phone . That's the point . That's what

13:27

we're saying . They can't be reached on the phone . Now

13:29

the other thing that's taking place is

13:32

marketing , marketing and companies

13:34

are going . How

13:39

do we get people to be aware of us ? How do we get them to be interested in us ? How do we get them

13:41

to try us ? How do we get them to repurchase ? How do we get them to be loyal ? So this is constantly

13:44

returning and if they're

13:46

trying to hit the business marketplace , it's

13:49

just the same . They're looking at email marketing

13:51

, they look at social media and

13:53

they might look at certain

13:56

very targeted , paid for advertising

13:58

to enter into a marketplace

14:01

or a community where

14:03

their buyers are reading or listening or whatever it

14:05

might be be

14:15

. But we could argue that this podcast episode is stating that perhaps the outbound channel of winning

14:17

business and we're only talking about winning , by the way , we're not talking about once

14:19

they're on your database , because then you've got their number and

14:21

your supplier and they might say I don't want to buy it this month but

14:23

you can call them , we're talking about winning new

14:25

business via the outbound

14:28

action of a telephone is

14:30

diminishing returns not

14:33

your best bet ? We

14:35

could argue some companies might even not

14:37

have it in their mix of business building

14:40

activity whatsoever . Could

14:43

we argue that turning up in a car

14:45

to an office or

14:47

to a building or an industrial estate , whatever it is , is

14:50

actually more likely to

14:52

result in an activity than a cold

14:54

call where they may or may not be there because they might be working

14:56

at home .

14:57

Well , the other side of it , of course , is that for larger organizations

15:00

, they will have procurement departments

15:02

. So anything that you need to buy , you

15:04

go right , guys , I need to buy this sort it for

15:06

me and they'll go and do it , but that

15:08

then also means that you're

15:10

dealing with a department which is

15:12

slightly disconnected from your

15:15

area or the bit that you you really need it for . That

15:17

doesn't mean they're necessarily going to do a bad job , but

15:19

it just does mean that you're again , you're

15:21

slightly further away from that relationship

15:24

, from that conversation . Should we do ? Three is

15:26

the magic number , because I've got some big questions , so

15:28

let's play three is the magic number

15:30

, because I've got some big questions , so let's play

15:32

.

15:33

three is the magic number .

15:38

So my first question

15:40

is how do

15:42

you buy for

15:44

the business ?

15:45

Very reactionary and mostly

15:47

influenced by you

15:50

telling me what you think I might need

15:52

. So , listeners , my favorite call

15:54

. I was once walking the dog and Bob said now

15:56

Jeremy , how would you like a

15:58

new car ? And

16:01

I was going what , hey , we

16:04

could do this company car scheme . Hey

16:06

, jez , have you got a watch ? Jeremy

16:08

, your sound booth , what

16:11

you need is a kit . I

16:13

think you probably know the answer is I don't buy a lot

16:15

. I'm more interested in low-cost cac

16:17

like stationary . That gets me excited

16:19

. But I

16:21

think I buy books online

16:24

. Yeah , through various book sites

16:26

. I look at and I buy

16:28

. Yeah , it's just . I don't

16:31

go to any specialist exhibitions . I

16:33

can't think of a major investment

16:35

trip that we've made to really

16:38

calculate something . I think even

16:40

our most recent business service that

16:42

we bought into accountancy was an online

16:44

discovery . No , no that

16:46

was an email from them actually , so that was email marketing

16:48

. But no , that's how I buy

16:50

.

16:51

Okay .

16:52

My question to you is slightly different what's the best

16:54

way to sell to you as a business-to-business

16:56

customer , a business-to-business company

16:58

? So slightly different , but thinking of how

17:00

should people sell to you .

17:01

Well , if you have a supplier

17:03

who understands what

17:05

it is you actually do and how you operate

17:07

, then it would be a hell of a lot easier for them

17:09

to sell , because if

17:12

they knew what we were and how we operated

17:14

and how we do things and what our priorities were

17:16

, they could go ah , here's a solution for

17:18

you . But no one ever does that . I mean , when was the last

17:20

time anyone ever said to us you're a training

17:22

company ? No one , ever , absolutely

17:24

. And even if they do , they don't ask

17:27

, they don't say who are your customers . No

17:29

, no one's that interested , which is shocking

17:31

, really for any B2B . I'd

17:34

like them to understand us

17:36

.

17:37

And then they might . Sounds to me you'd be okay having a phone call if they

17:39

gend up .

17:41

On the few occasions I've had good phone calls

17:43

, I've really enjoyed them Because it

17:46

is an experience . It is good to be sold to , it

17:48

is good to realize that there is persuasion

17:50

in the world , but it's rare . So

17:52

that's the truth . The way that we want it to

17:54

be done is different . Question two Is

17:57

similar but slightly more nuanced . What

18:00

product or service would

18:03

you love someone to call you about

18:05

and try and sell you ?

18:07

It would be a form of technology

18:09

where me

18:11

looking online and clicking is not going to help

18:14

, but they would ask me questions and personalize

18:16

the technology to me . So some kind

18:18

of clever podcast-y stuff , some

18:20

kind of email-y system , some

18:22

kind of marketing dashboard , but

18:25

really personalized to me

18:27

, having fully as you've said , fully understand

18:29

what we do and how we do it , I'd love

18:31

to be sold tech products in a brilliantly personalized

18:34

way over the phone . That'd be lovely .

18:36

Excellent , and that's interesting

18:38

that you've gone down that road . That's really good

18:40

.

18:41

My question to you is slightly different . Can

18:43

you remember the last thing

18:46

you sold over the phone , outbound From

18:48

a single call , not necessarily a single

18:50

call , but you got in touch with someone over the phone and they

18:52

responded and they bought .

18:55

Well , I can remember , speaking

18:57

to customers , that we've sold training

18:59

programs yeah , but that that's existing .

19:01

I'm talking about brand new . Brand new in you go

19:03

, boom , boom , boom . There

19:06

you go . It's hard , isn't it ?

19:08

it's I think , I think when we used to

19:10

do open courses yeah

19:12

maybe one or two of those possibly

19:14

was a call like that . Yeah , but

19:17

12 years ago . Yeah

19:19

, it's rare , isn't it ?

19:20

12 , 15 years . Is that yeah ?

19:21

yeah .

19:21

So there you go . So we see the difficulty of

19:24

outbound ourselves . And also

19:26

we wage our bets on developing

19:28

existing relationships and referrals more

19:30

than winning cold over the phone .

19:32

Well , that's because just to

19:34

win cold over the phone isn't possible

19:37

if you don't have email marketing , if you don't have

19:39

other forms of social media to

19:42

back it up .

19:43

Yeah , let's go to question three , and then I think I'll

19:45

share with the listeners some of our own experience on

19:47

a recent project .

19:48

Okay , what's the most

19:50

common B2B emails that you

19:52

get ?

19:53

We're opening an office in your country . We're

19:55

very impressed with your track record .

20:03

We'd like to talk to you and I don't even know what they do , and they're replicated in

20:05

in linkedin as well . Uh , that's good . Yeah , that's funny , isn't it ? Yeah

20:08

, I have a bit of a funny thing I occasionally

20:10

do on twitter where

20:12

I will say something like

20:14

reaching out to you oh

20:16

yeah , I don't think so , or

20:18

loved your li

20:21

profile oh yeah , yeah , like

20:23

hell , got a couple of samples

20:26

to share with you . Where's

20:28

that come from ? This is literally out of the blue

20:30

. No contacts at all , no context

20:33

. No , I'd love to find out more about

20:35

you . No , none of that , just straight

20:37

in with . I wanted to reach out

20:39

, which is one of the oddest expressions

20:41

I have heard . I

20:44

don't want you to reach out to me . If you want my

20:46

help , reach out to me . I'll help

20:48

you . But you know , don't reach

20:50

out to me in a kind of altruistic

20:53

way . You're going to do me a favor . By reaching

20:55

out to you , you're becoming my you

20:58

know my friend . In some way it's a bit like

21:00

how are you to somebody that you don't know ? You

21:02

know it's not entirely genuine

21:05

. So there we are okay .

21:06

B2b startup . I'm a b2b

21:08

startup and I haven't got a single

21:10

customer . What would be your recommendation of what I spend

21:12

time on , of trying to win my first customer ?

21:15

data . Data is the most important

21:17

thing .

21:17

Get some data .

21:19

Not just getting data . Define the

21:22

data that you need . Define the

21:24

organization , the

21:27

level of person that you're going after , the

21:30

type , the size of the organization , where

21:32

they are , geography , the demographics

21:34

. All that stuff is absolutely

21:37

essential before you do a thing . Yeah

21:39

, because you could spend a fortune on developing

21:41

great looking marketing . Well , if you haven't got a decent

21:43

list , doesn't go to the right .

21:44

No point , no point well , let's talk

21:46

about our recent project . So we created a thing called

21:48

project outbound . We developed

21:51

two people and we must

21:53

be six months into it now something , something like that . What

21:55

we have discovered is getting the

21:57

data right , the companies who could be

21:59

in the market . What we do is important . We

22:02

cannot currently . We haven't

22:04

managed to get anybody on the phone , have we ? We

22:06

haven't been able to get through to somebody . We've got through to

22:08

receptionists . Details

22:10

left , but there's also

22:13

not only they're not there , but there's now a

22:15

much more enforced of not putting through

22:17

. That's stronger than ever before

22:19

. Even if your idea is brilliant and could help

22:21

them , it

22:26

seems that there's a real gap in that , and so the crafting of very good emails

22:28

and the other marketing that's available to us is where we find ourselves

22:30

, and we just thought that spreads across

22:33

all businesses . So any business must be finding

22:35

themselves in this position , probably especially

22:37

so if you're not a regionally based

22:39

business . So if you supply

22:42

to companies in a region

22:44

, you're in a marketplace and there's lots of companies

22:46

that could buy your stuff and you are some

22:49

form of fairly common

22:51

service or high frequency purchase

22:53

consumable . Great , you

22:55

know who might be in the market , but we can sell

22:58

our stuff to anybody anywhere , and if we marketed

23:01

ourselves regionally , I'm sure we'd go bust in minutes

23:03

because we have to be available

23:05

to all . So it's a challenge

23:07

.

23:08

I don't know that this is cultural

23:10

. I think in other countries perhaps

23:13

they haven't quite gone down this fully automated

23:15

road yet , but I

23:17

do remember there was some really

23:20

good ways of getting through to people when

23:22

you had receptionists who could put you through

23:24

. So there were a number of techniques

23:26

you could use to get past that gatekeeper

23:28

to get to the person that were pretty good . Now

23:31

they've gone . Ah , we

23:33

don't give that gatekeeper that facility .

23:35

No .

23:36

Therefore , there is no way that you can do that .

23:38

No .

23:39

And it's almost like come on then , are

23:41

you going to get past that ? Well , we'll think of another way to stop

23:43

you getting through to someone . Well , in

23:45

that case , what damage are you doing

23:47

to your business if they're not able to find

23:49

out what is available to them ? It's a

23:51

really interesting perspective , because you're

23:54

thinking , when I'm freeing up my people's time to do their jobs

23:56

, but what if ? But they're not hearing

23:58

the pitch . They're not hearing the pitch , they're not hearing the

24:00

product they're not aware of the service and

24:03

it's a block .

24:04

Without even listening , it's a block without even

24:06

engaging . Yeah if we look at our

24:08

youth , so the largest

24:11

bracket of people who are not

24:13

working from home are aged 16

24:16

to 24 . They , they are out there

24:18

, so they are doing things that are maybe more practical

24:20

, more manual or more

24:23

lower earning type work , whether that's

24:25

cafes or whatever it might be . What's

24:28

interesting with this hybrid thing and the reason why

24:30

we can't get hold of people is , when

24:32

you hit the 50,000 pound salary

24:35

mark 27%

24:37

is that that is the highest bracket

24:40

of working from home . So well , over a quarter

24:42

of people who on that money are at

24:44

home and that means that they've built

24:46

themselves a facility , a capacity enable

24:49

them to earn an income , or now they need

24:51

to earn less , or whatever the situation

24:53

is , because their age is probably commensurate

24:56

with this is I don't need to go

24:58

out to work anymore because I've found a way of earning

25:00

money being based at home and I don't have to interact

25:02

with the populace . So the other problem

25:04

with not buyers

25:07

not seeking to have conversations is we're

25:09

creating a more insular world where people are

25:12

not understanding the breadth of variety

25:14

and the big brands can

25:16

play because they can still run their ads , they

25:18

can still do their big branding , their

25:20

big out of home , branding , all of that stuff

25:22

. So you

25:24

know arguably to be a B2B

25:27

supplier , business gosh

25:30

, you might need to have such a compelling

25:32

proposition and if you weren't local

25:34

or reasonable or of mass appeal

25:36

, you'd really have to cut

25:38

out your marketing exercise to not lose

25:41

all your money in year one and

25:43

find sugar . Who have I got to win as a

25:45

first customer because you couldn't just

25:47

do what you and I grew up doing . Here's

25:50

a phone . Here's a list of numbers

25:52

. Get at it and you know what . You'll

25:54

make something . If you look at the ratio of sales , I

25:56

made a day in my directory selling days , you

25:59

made two a day almost without

26:01

fail . That's two sales a day just

26:03

hitting the phones , yeah , and those

26:05

sales could be for 10 grand , 50 grand , whatever

26:08

, just from hitting the phones . That

26:10

facility doesn't exist .

26:11

I don't think no I remember selling advertising

26:14

for years where the process

26:16

of getting through pitching

26:18

your media , putting

26:21

together a brief proposal and

26:23

getting a decision within a few days was pretty

26:25

common . But then over

26:27

time , the larger the organizations

26:30

you dealt with , that decision making

26:32

process took longer and longer and longer

26:34

, and agencies didn't

26:36

help that process either . I

26:38

haven't been in advertising for years now . I'd be fascinated to see

26:40

how different it is now in that respect

26:42

.

26:43

But at the same time , those are important choices

26:46

that you're making there and

26:48

I think on the outbound call

26:50

and the skill of it , it is a skill . I

26:52

think an american trainer I saw the other day said outbound

26:55

calling isn't a cadence , it's

26:57

a skill . I agree it's not . I call

26:59

one and I do that . Then the second call does that

27:01

. I agree it isn't that . It's a real skill . But

27:04

if you're trying to call people who've never

27:06

heard of you for the first time and they're not on your database

27:08

with the very fact of hybrid working

27:11

, they're not there . So

27:20

it's almost from the start your odds are very poorly stacked against

27:22

you . Yeah , you're going to ring someone who won't be there and you won't be given

27:24

their number . So I'd love to hear have some interaction from listeners

27:27

saying well , no , no , it works for us because

27:29

we do it this way . I'd love some kind of responses

27:32

to this , because when I look online I see trainers

27:34

selling cold call training , of course , because

27:36

they're trying to make an income out of it . We've

27:38

produced an entire set of systems

27:40

and packs around this and all sorts . But

27:43

we're not talking about calling an existing database

27:45

. We're talking about winning business . Who

27:47

doesn't know you from Adam on the first call

27:49

and it's just a muchos challenge

27:52

. Well , I hope that's been an enjoyable short

27:54

little episode for you .

27:55

Yes . You've enjoyed that I hope , bobby , been

27:57

an enjoyable short little episode for you . Yes , You've enjoyed that

28:00

, I hope Bobby . Yes , and I hope it stimulates thought , and that particular area is one

28:02

that I'm sure we're going to return to , because I have a feeling

28:04

it will change still more in the next few years as

28:06

we become more we need a new channel

28:08

.

28:08

We need a new B2B channel that is

28:11

just wonderfully communicative

28:13

and interesting . Maybe the

28:15

Zoom world can pop up and people can

28:17

have zooms and they're more engaged to do

28:19

that because they want to talk on the mobile . Who knows ?

28:21

maybe part of somebody's job description

28:24

at a certain level must

28:26

be to allocate time to

28:29

listen to perspective

28:31

yeah incoming suppliers

28:33

, because that then keeps

28:35

you informed , keeps you interested , and

28:38

it will eventually and I'm sure at some point you

28:40

do that , but maybe that needs to be part of the job description

28:42

is to say you must make sure you so

28:44

imagine , you know , in our very first

28:46

thing , at the start of the episode , I gave you an email info

28:49

at new supply .

28:50

Imagine if they said there's a number you call and

28:53

this is the prospective number that

28:55

you call if you want to try and sell us something . That'll

28:57

be answered by a professional buyer . I

29:00

wish you luck . Now we're talking and then you ring and you

29:02

go hi , what's your name ? My name is Mary and I buy

29:04

the stuff for this company . Okay , I'm selling training

29:06

. Okay , let's talk Brilliant , and

29:08

Mary would , at the end she'd either educate you and

29:10

say you know what you

29:12

? Let's have a meeting . I'll put you through to the operations

29:15

director . Imagine that a phone number

29:17

. Maybe we could create a business

29:19

where we offer companies we'll take their

29:21

incoming calls for them to sieve

29:23

through to find them the very best suppliers that

29:25

they aren't hearing from through

29:28

any other form of marketing .

29:29

It probably exists . There must be brokers who do that now

29:31

. Do you think so ?

29:33

Yeah , you call this guy . If you're looking to sell us yeast

29:36

, call this guy .

29:39

Well , again why you would want to buy that for your company

29:41

, unless you're a baking company .

29:43

I was thinking of bakery .

29:44

Or a brewer , in fact

29:46

. Anyway , well , thanks for listening . We'll see you on another

29:48

one soon , but in the meantime , I know you're

29:50

going to be listening to this through the spring

29:53

. Have a great one , and we will speak

29:55

to you soon bye bob

30:07

and jeremy's conflab the

30:12

reality podcast .