0:00

[Music] Tanner Iskra: Oh, let's get it. Monday, October 11th, 2021. Born the Battle. Brought to you by the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs. The podcast that focuses on inspiring Veterans stories and puts a highlight on important resources, offices, and benefits for our Veterans. I am your host, Marine Corps Veteran, Tanner Iskra. However you're listening to Borne the Battle, be it Apple Podcast, Spotify, iTunes, iHeartRadio, the player inside the blog. Hope you're having a good week outside of podcast land. You know, I got out last week. I went to a winery, saw a little bit of history at Monticello. Thomas Jefferson, right? All three of our beautiful Declaration of Independence. Saw some leaves changing in the Shenandoah Valley. Highly suggest that you get out at this time of year. Just because summer is over, doesn't mean you can't be one with nature a little bit. One new rating. And one new review came in to Apple Podcast. Folks in the U S won’t see it as this came in from Canada, but I see you AK28495. Says five stars. “Informative and interesting. Great way to learn about both the VA and Veterans as different guests are invited to share their experiences”. Thank you for writing in AK. I'm guessing you’re a Canadian Veteran yourself. Glad to know that these stories connect with you as well. As you already know, I'm already looking for that next review, like AK here. If you haven't yet, please consider writing one for Borne the Battle on Apple Podcast. Doing so does help us climb higher in the algorithms, giving more Veterans a better opportunity to discover and listen to the interviews, our benefits breakdown episodes, and hear what's in our news releases. It's also the best way for me to communicate with you. Like I did with AK there. Appreciate in advance. Alright, here we go. News releases. We have three this week. First one says, “For Immediate Release: The Department of Veterans Affairs will resume over-payment notifications for new benefit debts and the deaths deferred from April 6th, 2020 through September 30th, 2021 due the COVID-19 pandemic”. And we've had a couple of episodes on this in our archives on Borne the Battle. Check them out when you get a chance. With the Debt Management Center. All right. Continuing with the information. “VA suspended debt collection April 6th, 2020 and will restart debt collection October 1st, 2021. However, VA will not deduct debts from benefits payments until January 2022. Collections on medical co-payments created prior to April 6th, 2020 and on new medical co-payments will also resume on October 1st, 2020. Debt notification letters sent to affected Veterans and beneficiaries will include options to request debt relief for those who continue to need financial relief from the impacts of COVID-19. The department will continue to provide debt relief options such as extending repayment plans, waivers and temporary hardship suspensions during these challenging times. It has been and will remain a priority of the department to work individually with each Veteran.” And again, listen to the two gentlemen that run the Debt Management Center in our archives here on Borne the Battle to get a sense of those two gentlemen and how they run things. “Veterans and beneficiaries with questions or requiring assistance on debt management can access the following resources: For debt information, review frequently asked questions, or to submit a request online, go to [Link: https://iris.custhelp.va.gov/app/ask/] or call 1-800-827-0648. For medical care and pharmacy services copayment debt, contact the Health Resource Center at 1-866-400-1238”. All right. Next one says, “For Immediate Release…” - it's funny. All these releases have tie-ins with Borne the Battle now. It's kind of cool. “For Immediate Release: The Department of Veterans Affairs expanded the Veterans Legacy Memorial site on October 2021 to include individual pages for nearly 500,000 Veterans interred in 93 state, territorial and tribal Veteran cemeteries. These pages joined the nearly 4 million VLM pages already on the site memorializing Veterans interred in VA's 155 national cemeteries. VLM offers family and friends a way to share lasting memories of a Veteran by uploading written tributes, photos, biographies, documents, and other information to Veterans’ pages”. Think of it as a Facebook for your fallen Veteran. “More than 22,000 submissions have been made to Veteran’s profile pages in VLM since the site launched in 2019. For more information contact NCA's Chief of Digital Services at [Email: [email protected]]”. And James and I did sit down and talk on a benefits breakdown within the past year. I think it was around the Memorial Day. Check that out if you get a chance. Kind of covers the whole basis of what the Veterans Legacy Memorial website is. Good stuff. All right. Last one says, “For Immediate Release: VA Secretary Denis McDonough said on October 5th that the department will embark on designing a new integrated access and care coordination model to better deliver seamless care”. What does that mean? We're going to find out. “Once the model is developed and implemented, with Veterans and Veterans Service Organization input, Veterans will see an integration of the care they receive through a VA medical center and in the community. A new coordinated care model will strengthen VA’s ability to serve Veterans. Veterans will continue to receive care via in-person and virtual care appointments, both within VA and in the community”. Which is important. “In Fall 2020, VHA conducted a functional assessment of clinical, administrative, and financial operations to identify improvements related to how VHA manages Veteran’s access to care. This assessment identified opportunities to reduce overlap and duplication within care access and financial functions. The model will employ a three-phase implementation plan that has already begun. The first phase involves realigning the financial functions of Community Care under the Veterans Health Administration’s Office of Finance and beginning of the design of the new integrated access and care coordination model. The second phase will include the realignment of the Office of Community Care and Office of Veterans Access to Care, establishing oversight for the completion and implementation of the integrated access and care coordination model”. It sounds like just a bunch of office realignments within the administration. “The third phase will include deploying the integrated access and care coordination in the field, with nationwide training of involved staff. VA will make adjustments to the model based on Veteran and employee feedback”. Sounds like something - sounds like something I would like to dig into deeper with the Secretary because I think, you know, community care is pretty important to a lot of Veterans. So, personally I'm curious to see where this is going. All right. This week's guest is a Navy Veteran. He is now a Special Agent with the DEA. And he came on Borne the Battle to really open up the eyes of the Veteran community to some of the things that him and his DEA compatriots are seeing out in the field in terms of counterfeit pills, how they're being sourced and how sometimes we need to be more aware of where we get our meds and what we put in our bodies. Share this episode if you can, with some of your friends as this one definitely opened my eyes. He is a Navy Veteran and DEA Special Agent, Bill Czopek. Enjoy. [Music] (TI): Agent Czopek. (BC): Special Agent Czopek. (TI): Special Agent Czopek. Where's that from? Where's that name from, Czopek? (BC): Polish. So, both of my parents came, immigrated to America in seventies and sixties. My parents met here, married, and had this beautiful child called Bill Czopek. So, here we are. (TI): So, before we get into the DEA and what you do, I'm sure you've heard the podcast before cause you reached out to me. I want to go back. I always go back. I always go way back, probably before 2003, when, when we both joined, when did you know that military service was going to be the next step in your life? (BC): I wish I could say I knew. I first got a taste of it after high school. When I went, I did a year at state college in New Jersey. It's called the College of New Jersey, and they had an army ROTC program. And I was getting out of high school. I was active in athletics, and I go to college, and I was missing something. And next, you know, I'm wearing the old Cammy uniform. They gave me, you know, an introduction to military lifestyle, get up early PT, the comradery. And I said, this is, this is, this is what I need. And then that manifested into, let me look, what other opportunities exist in the military? And then I saw, Hey, I can get a free education. I can get some great opportunities at the US Naval academy. And then I, and then the ball just kept rolling from there. (TI): Yeah. It's kind of hard to get into the Naval academy. How did you, how were you able to work that? Was the Naval academy like your first option for school? (BC): Yeah. So, I was in-state college at the time. So it was, I was in a unit basically, you know, a college setting, and I just said, I want to say I annoyed everybody, and I kept calling, and I was persistent, and that kinda got me in the door. You know, I think when you show at the end of the day that you're not going to quit, and that's held true in the military and my DEA career, it was, I want this and what do I have to do to get it? And so obviously I applied, I got a congressional nomination, as well as, you know, I went through all these different steps. So, it, it's a tedious process, but the point is, is I wanted it. And I tried everyone. I talked to; I tried to relay that. (TI): So, you didn't go into the Naval Academy right after high school, that's interesting. I've never heard anybody to do that. It's almost like you were a JUCO transfer. (BC): Correct. It is, yeah, I mean, you know, I think there's a high percentage that, I don't know the numbers are exactly, but there is a percentage of people who do go to college and then transfer. You know, and I was happy there. I was offered a scholarship with the Army ROTC at the time, and so, I had great options, but the point is I realized military was my future. I didn't know which service was my future. I didn't know what my exact career path was going to be, but I also knew, let me apply. Let me see what opportunities. So, I applied to both. I said I liked the opportunity, ROTC scholarship. I'd like the opportunity to go to Naval Academy. And when presented with both choices, I said, well, let me give the Naval Academy a shot, so- (TI): Very good. So, you served on the USS Peleliu, famous battle for Marine Corps history. Peleliu is a, an LHA, a landing craft, airfare landing craft. I know Marines that are familiar with it. They're familiar with, you know, and for their assault ships. What was your MOS on the Peleliu? (BC): So, I was a surface warfare officer, in short, I was a jack of all trades when it came to one day, you're in the combat information system, you're working radars, navigation radars, or you're supervising the air picture. You would, you basically learn every job on the ship so that when it comes time to fight the ship in times of war or, or whatever situation, you knew every job, so you could do every job. And so, you know, I would, when the captain was sleeping, I’d be up there at 2:00 AM on the bridge and we'd be launching air operations, pushing carriers or SH46’s or Huey’s or Seahawks offs. You know, I'd be managing the overall and amphibious operation picture. So, when we were launching LCAC’s or you know, we had Marines that were doing amphibious operations, that'd be ballasting the ship, meaning I'd be flooding the ship and de-flooding it to get a amphibious craft off. So, it was a, it was a great platform for that, just because you know, we projected a lot. If we had the capability to project a lot of combat power on that ship. You're talking about three football fields long and runway and you had about a thousand Marines on my ship alone. And it was impressive I mean, if you talk about American power in terms of military power, that was a great platform. (TI): Yeah. They're like a little mini carriers, you know, I think I was on one for about 10 minutes to film some Ospreys coming on and off out of the Mediterranean. I came in for I think we came in from mail and I somehow found my way to the bridge, I was trying to get, I was like trying to get to the top and trying to forget it a nice angle. And somehow, I end up on the bridge and I was like, and I was like, I know I'm like, guys, I'm here for 10 minutes. I need these shots. They were like, get them off the bridge, go somewhere else. And I was like, all right, let's go. I got my shots though. (BC): It's the only place that has windows and the whole ship, you know, and, and I didn't realize that till I left the Navy, and I did this Alaskan cruise once and, and I'm looking around and there's windows everywhere on this cruise ship. And I'm like, I'm like, wow, like there's windows on ships. And when you are in a battleship, there's no windows, there's a handful maybe, but the bridge is all windows. So, I had the best view in the house hands down. So, you know, that was always interesting. You're next to the flight line, you're, you know, you're looking over the water. It was, it was great. But you know, I had my share of funny stories on there too, as you know, being in the service. It's it, there is kinda, if I could share a favorite story. The first day, first day I reported 2003 and we were getting ready to deploy to the middle east and that time it was Operation Enduring Freedom and Iraqi Freedom. So, our mission there was to go to the middle east and fights theaters, security. And so, we're going to do a workup with one of the muses, Marine expeditionary unit 11. I believe it was at the time out of camp Pendleton cause the ship was out of San Diego. So, what happens is a lot of people inspectors come on board. And while I was the low ranking, man, I literally showed up, I was the new guy. So, they said, “hey, listen, you, were going to take your bed and give it to one of the senior inspectors”. I said, “okay”. So, they said, “take your stuff and go down to the brig” and I was like, “excuse me?” And they said, “the brig”. And I said, “okay”. And once again, brig for the non-military folks who are listening is that is a jail. That's a fancy, fancy nautical term for jail. And so, it's me and 10 other newer- (TI): Hey new guy, go to jail. (BC): Yeah. Go to jail. And I'm like, you know, the old joke of, you know, the Navy posters or military posters, see the world. Next thing you know, I'm in a prison cell looking around literally a prison cell. And I said, oh my God, this is, this is something. So, you know, the funny part of this story is, is there's 10 of us and within minutes. It, I watch a lot of TV, prison shows. We all started pulling prison rank. One guy was like well, I'm more senior so I get my own prison cell cause there's two private prison cells. and then there was a bay area, prison cells. And so, the more senior guys that were, you know, LDO’s would, they had their own rooms and us, you know, border bar ensigns are sitting there and we're in this bunk style prison and so I'm talking to one of the- (TI): Was this a joke? (BC): Oh no, no. That was the only birding space. The only beds available on the ship and it was on the bottom of the ship. The lighting was horrible, and you have to remember it's a jail setting, right? So, there's no, there is no privacy. Meaning when you do have prisoners there, you know, the toilets aren't covered, there's no shower curtains, you know, everything, suicide proof. So, there was no shower head. It was just a hole in the ceiling and water would spurt out and we take showers. So, you know, I started asking around, they said, oh, you know, has anybody ever been here before? And one of the senior guys who was like, yeah, someone's been in before Taliban members back in 2001 when we picked them up out of Afghanistan. So, I was sleeping in the same birding as the infamous American Johnny Walker Lynn, I believe that's his name, the American who converted to Taliban got picked up by US forces and got flown into the ship. And so it was, I was, you know, sharing a bed that was probably slept on by some Taliban members. So I was, that was my introduction to the Navy, and I said, well, I hope it doesn't get worse than this. (TI): This is what we think. This is what we think of you, ensign, as the new guy. (BC): Yeah. And, you know, here I am a DEA agent now. And, you know, I could, I guess, technically I was in jail. I, you know, so, it’s one of my favorite stories. So yeah, all the people, all the service members in there hanging in there, we know the battle you're going through so, I hope you don't end up in a brig, like my situation. So- (TI): Very good. Okay. So, two deployments, one to OIF and OEF. Now I was only on, like I said, I was only on a Marine expeditionary unit. I was only on an LHA for about 10 minutes. I, now you weren't doing any amphib assaults and support of those operations. How did the Navy support a Marine expeditionary unit during those operations? (BC): So, we were on the first expeditionary unit and so, instead of being a traditional ARG, Amphibious Ready Group, we were now combined. There's three different amphibs combined with a destroyer or a cruiser, a submarine, and some aviation units. So, at the time the mission package was different, we supported certain Operations out of Basra. We did, put Marines in Basra and which, that's the Southern tip of Afghanistan. It borders the, you know, there's not a lot of coastlines in, in Iraq, so Marines did go there. There were combat operations going on there at the time. Um, and one of the key things I learned, it was the pipeline. There's two pipelines that go from Iraq and they go bottom of the ocean giant, giant metal pipes and may come out of two terminals, ABOT and KAAOT, I believe. And I got to go on those and the amount of oil that goes out of them and then goes on these, waiting on these giant ships, commercial oil tankers. And so, we provided security for that as well, just because that was the lifeline of, of Iraqi economy at the time. So, that was one of the many missions that we supported at the time. So, we did go to off the coast of Africa, we intercepted a Dhow which, you know, it's basically just a commercial vessel, a fancy word for fishing boat and that had about two tons of hashish on it and that was leaving the Middle East going to Africa. (TI): Oh geez. (BC): Yeah. So, from what I recall, likely what was happening, it was probably a drugs for weapons swap. So, two pounds of drugs go to Africa and return. They supply either weapons and or certain amount of money back on the ship, which would have went back to the Middle East and the cycle continues. So that was important and that was actually, that was really fun because Marines are good at blowing up stuff and I said, well, what are they going to do with the ship? And, and I'm pretty sure some Marines, like I have an idea and they put about, I don't know, 20-30 pounds C4 on that ship and that thing went straight to the bottom of the sea. So, kudos to all the Marines listening- (TI): Really? (BC): Yeah. It wasn't like, hey give the Navy guys, the explosives is like, no, no, no, we have plenty of Marines that are volunteering to blow up that ship. Just because once again, you can't tow. Well, what do you do with the floating ship? You can't, you can't let it just float there it’s navigational hazard. And so, I got to watch a bunch of Marines blow up the ship. I think they shot it two just to poke some holes in it. So, it went down so- (TI): How big was it? (BC): It was probably about 80 feet in length and so fairly good size. I mean, you, you do, you know, it had once again, two tons, so about 4,000 pounds of, of hashish on it. So, there's, there's probably some fish in that area that they were hallucinating or high off of that two-pound hashish, so- (TI): Piracy was big around the Horn of Africa back then, big time. (BC): Yeah, it was, it was/ We did end up going to the Red Sea for a little bit, which, um, once again is, you know, so we did the Arabian Gulf, uh, off the coast of Africa, Eastern Africa, into the Red Sea and back multiple times. So, it, it was an eye-opening experience and going through the Strait of Hormuz, those photos don't know, you know, that's an interesting experience as well. Cause it's a, it's a choke point, it’s a funnel and you're on high alert, right? So, at the time tensions were not maybe what they are now, but at the same time, you never knew. Right? So, we, we did, you know, it was, we always had to be careful. We never knew what was going on in the area. Any given time, so- (TI): Very good. Now while you were in, can you either give me a best friend or your greatest mentor? (BC): Great question. I had the executive officer of a ship, and he was a pilot, which is funny because you have a, the number two in command you know in charge of a ship and his leadership style, I felt was, had a long-lasting impact on me. Very laid back. Nothing seemed to get him upset. He understood people and that's what I think his, his best trade was, he knew people would work for you if you give them respect, right? He didn't have to tell people he had power. You know, I think there's a line in the Game of Thrones, the HBO series is, if you have to tell people you're the king, then you're not the king. (TI): Exactly. (BC): And I saw that with him, as everyone knew, he knew who's a number two in charge. And his position ironically, was to be one of those people that, that would get, I don't know how to say this, but get into somebody butt and, you know, and really push them and kind of be like the whipping boy and he did not do that. He was quite the opposite and that was like the traditional role. Well, if you're the executive officer- (TI): You’re the hammer. (BC): You gotta be mean to people and he, and he, he said, you're the hammer, he stepped, but he didn't do that. He stepped back and his, you know, he, he still held a high standard and he, he expected a lot from people, but, you know, that kind of just give me your best every day. And if you do that, I'll be happy with you. It stuck with me and so it still resonates with me today. So- (TI): That line was from a time when Lannister during Game of Thrones and I, every time I see somebody try to exercise power in that way, I just say it. I just say it out loud. I don't even care. That’s one of my favorite lines from the show. (BC): Absolutely. And it holds true, holds true in law enforcement, holds true in the military, holds law, holds true in business. (TI): Right, so very good. So, you got out after six years, that put you out in about 2009. If my math for Marines is right, you joined the DEA relatively quickly, it seems. For those that want to do something like that, when they get out, FBI, they want to go FBI, CIA, ATF, DEA, heck even the United States Postal Inspector Service, which is a thing, found out about them. We had an interview with one with one of them in the archives. If you’ll listen to this, you can listen to them. How’d you go about starting a process like that? (BC): Go online, look at the requirements. If you are a current service member or veteran, you have a tremendous head start amongst other people, either between your veteran points that you get in the hiring process, coupled with your experience, the things, the values you've learned in the military. Those will give you a head start in the process, as well as more likely to get hired and then lastly, the security clearance. So, just once again, if anybody's even thinking about it, I highly recommend it and I could get into more detail with that- (TI): Go ahead, please, get into more detail- (BC): But the system now is on its, we've switched, and the majority of federal agencies have switched to USAjobs.gov, [Link: http://USAjobs.gov ]. So, in the past, you'd have to go through the respective agency, DEA, FBI, ATF Department of Commerce, Postal Service, all the federal agencies, Homeland Security. And you would talk to the recruiter, what you still want to do, but now you would go on USA, jobs.gov, [Link: http://USAjobs.gov ]. You would apply if you meet the requirements and that would start the application process, and then that would push you back to the recruiter who would then begin the process of doing a physical test, getting your background information, educational background, and then the process goes on and on. So, once again, that starts there, but the point is, is why would you want to apply? And that's the better question of talking to Veterans. There's two advantages. One is your time in the service counts towards VAcation time, sick time- (TI): Retirement. (BC): It also helps with your pensions. So, you do blood, sweat, and tears in the service for how many years depends on a person, 3, 5, 10, 15, you don't want that time to be wasted in terms of it's not a waste, but if you can add that towards your pension and the federal government, why not do it? And the way the system is set up is for example, myself, I'm a veteran with approximately, eight and a half years of military service. I still have to do a total of 20 years as a special agent in a DEA, but the minute I hit that 20-year mark, they're going to add that eight and a half years to my pension. So, I would get a 28-and-a-half-year pension. You do have to buy those years back, meaning you pay a small amount, but it's based on how much you earned in those years and it's a very small percentage compared to what you would get on the end of that pension. So, you may buy five or six years and it'll cost you a few thousand dollars, but if you look at what it would give you in terms of pension wise, you're going to get more, it's a no brainer to do it. So, that's why that pushed me a little bit towards federal law enforcement, versus state or county, where those benefits, that's not the same system. So, I highly encourage anybody listening who's a veteran, who’s currently serving and looking at transition just to give any law enforcement agency a look and you can apply with all of them, that's what I did. I applied with ATF. I applied with HIS, I applied with DEA, and we are hiring right now, and we have a multitude of positions. You don't have to be a special agent who carries a gun and a badge. You could be in, if your backgrounds in Intel, we have Intel positions. If you're a tech operations specialist, if you're good with electronics, we have those positions. Communications, we have those positions. Administrative support, we have those positions, so go to USAjobs.gov, [ Link: http://USAjobs.gov ] or contact a local recruiter. (TI): Gotcha. So, yeah, no, it's good point that you made about the, uh, the, uh, buying back of your time too, because I did that. I mean, you can do it with any federal service, whether you're at your agriculture or DOD or Homeland Security or whatever you want to do., VA. Uh, I had to buy back 11 years, so it was a little more spendy for me but at the same time, like you said, on the backend, I bet you have, I have 11 years of retirement already going into going into my, you know, 20 or 30 years. I mean that's already there. So, uh, yeah, definitely on the back end, it's worth it. It's a little bit upfront, but it's definitely, like you said, you'll, you'll recoup that in your retirement, if you end up making a career out of it, very good, point you made there. Appreciate you doing that. Now you, you know, I was looking at the, the DEA, before I started this interview, doing my research and it makes sense, but I didn't know that around 30% of the offices in the DEA are in 69 countries. They're all foreign offices. Why so many? (BC): Our mission is to target large scale drug trafficking organizations and there's often a misconception about DEA. I’ll hear sometimes people think we sit out of marijuana dispensaries and target people who use a certain drug, or, you know, for lack of better term, people that misuse drugs. We're looking at cutoff the head of the snake, right? We're looking to go to the source of the drugs. Oftentimes those are in foreign countries, throughout the United States, and we liaison with their law enforcement host country agencies. And so you have to have people there in order to, to work those cases, because the cases we work are essentially international because US consumes, Americans consume a lot of drugs and the majority come from overseas. So, with that being said, you need DEA personnel there. (TI): I saw a program. I think it was on Discovery or something. It was like the life of a ghost gun, and it was, I mean, it was, it went from like the Philippines to the US. It did a couple of crimes and then it went to Mexico or South America, and it showed like the EVAluation of the pistol. I think it was like a 1911 or something like that throughout the entire. It was really interesting how they, how they wove it, and they wove it with like personal stories of people. You know, of course it wasn't that particular gun, maybe, but they kind of wove be like this one gun through like these multiple lives, like where a gun could go. You talk about being drugs, kind of be in the same way internationally, kind of give me the life of like a drug where it could come from and where it could end up. (BC): Absolutely. So, one, you're talking about organizations that are Fortune 500 companies. So, I think when you talk about, where drugs come from, these, there's multiple sources depending on the organization. So, let's take, we could pick a, we could pick a drug- (TI): You’re in the southwest right now. So, pick, pick one that's, that's familiar to you right now. (BC): Right. Biggest one being right now is fentanyl, which for those not familiar, it is a synthetic opioid, meaning it's not made from a plant it's made in a laboratory setting and I wouldn't say laboratory. I would say made in a garage or a warehouse and some third world country, some country that is not the US. And so, for example, currently we're in the midst of an opioid epidemic. The fentanyl that we're seeing is being sourced from Mexico. The chemicals used for the production or how it's manufactured typically come from India, China, or Stroh countries, meaning they chemicals will get pushed through a country where it's not made there, but it diverts around it, so it doesn't alert law enforcement, right? So, if we think fentanyl is made in the chemicals come from China, Indian and law enforcement's looking there, they, the chemicals may go to a different country to come to Mexico or the US. So anyway, there's a big supply chain to make these drugs come through. So, for example, fentanyl it's manufactured in Mexico. (TI): So basically, it's like a, it's like a car part, like a brake pad is being made in Indonesia, like a headlight is being made in China, and it's all being assembled in Mexico. (BC): Correct. And the path depends on where it's manufactured within Mexico, for example, but that drug is going to change hands likely 20, 30 times before it ends up in the United States, in the user, because there is a path of its once again, going back to the Fortune 500 company model is they're very compartmentalized. There is one person's job is to receive the chemicals. There's another person's job to take those chemicals to the manufacturing lab. In the manufacturing lab, there's a chemist whose job is to make fentanyl. Once that fentanyl is manufactured, someone else comes, their jobs to take it from the lab to a storage house, from the storage house, it's transported to the south of the US border, where it's stored in another drug house. There's people that are responsible for crossing it into the United States. They hand it off to a cell within the United States that say, for example, in Phoenix or Tucson area, which are big metropolitan areas here in Arizona, someone receives those. They'll go either to a distributor, or they'll go to a drug house and then from there they're distributed to the United States. So, there's a large chain of people involved and, it’s organized. So, if we intercept the one person who's transporting it, they might not know exactly where, where the drug stash house was it came from or exactly where it's going to. So, you know, to answer your question is the package drops- (TI): They don’t know what two steps back is- (BC): Exactly. They don’t even know might know even know what one step forward is. To be honest with you to, they say, all I know was I supposed to come here and drop it off to someone. I don't know who that is. I don't know what they look like. And so, they do that for a reason. They compartmentalize their organization to limit exposure or risks to us dismantling them. And you've seen that with terrorist organizations. All the military Veterans probably realize that as well, it's similar and there's a reason for that, is it ensures that they could continue to get their drugs in this country. And that's true for a lot of once again, not just drugs coming from Mexico, but drugs coming from Central America, South America. Fentanyl used to come straight from China to a lesser extent now, synthetic drugs come from Europe, to also drugs coming from Canada. So, the issue is it's we consume too many drugs and they, if we're willing to pay for them, someone's willing to smuggle them in this country. (TI): Yeah, very good. So, for like say one kilo of fentanyl, changes hands 20 to 30 times, like you said. How much money could be made from like say one kilo? Like all through all those exchanges if you add them all up. (BC): So, if I had a kilo fentanyl right now in Phoenix, Arizona, I would pay anywhere from $30,000 to $40,000, depending on who is selling it to me. I could take the kilos fentanyl and turn it into anywhere from half a million to a million pills, blue oxycodone pills. I could sell those pills depending on what region of the United States, anywhere from on a retail level, a street level from $10 to $30. So, I, my output between buying a pill machine and buying the kilo, I'm probably $50,000 just to do the process, but my return on investment is a million dollars and that's just one kilogram. So, you can, that's the name of the business? The drug business is a funny business, its about money, and the second thing- (TI): And we're not talking about the backtrack of the process of the handoffs, how much those costs to, like getting it from China to Mexico. Like if we were to add them all up, what would you say? It would be for a kilo of fentanyl, you know, million at the million at the street level, but backtrack, it added all up. What, what are we talking like tens of millions, five million for just one kilo? (BC): You know that’s hard to say because the scales of economy, you know, they're, they're not buying, when they buy chemicals or they buy, we call them precursor chemicals. They're buying them by the 20-foot container, and so, but what I would tell you is, if you can make a drug in a lab, and this is what we're seeing in DEA is it's very profitable versus, a decade or two ago, drugs are made from plants, right? Heroines made from the poppy plant, cocaine's made from a cocoa, that's more intensive process when you can buy some chemicals at a very cheap price and set up a makeshift lab and you can mass produce drugs, you're going to make money. You're going to make so much money, that you're just going to keep doing that and doing that and with money comes power, right? So, you know these organizations become very powerful quickly because they have the money to conduct operations, to buy weapons, to do these things. So, you know, to answer your question, it's very hard to say what it costs along the way but what I can tell you is it's very profitable for each process along the way. (TI): No kidding, no kidding or else they wouldn't be doing it. Now you're working out of the Southwest. Cartels are a huge thing in that part of the world and now they're, I mean, they're pretty ruthless. Do you worry about personal safety, when you're, when you're doing these investigations, because you do international investigations, you do domestic investigations, safety for those close around you? And if so, how do you mitigate that? (BC): I do. I'm more concerned though with my community and Americans as a whole. You know, I'm fortunate, I have a lot of training. DEA has provided countless hours of firearms training and I've about 10 years on now and so, I know I could get myself in a situation and out of the situation if I needed to. So that gives me some confidence, it doesn't mean I'm by any means invincible, but you're right, there's a risk of the job and I accept it and that's just part of the job, right? Just like being in the military, is there's a chance that you'd be put yourself in harm's way and that either caused you to get injured or worst case you pay the ultimate price with your life. So, with that being said, yes, I recognize that, but there's a greater mission and I think that's protecting Americans and specifically young adults, teenagers. That's what drives me every morning is knowing that there's a fight to be had. There is a, there's a mission every day, waking up and that's taken streets off a way out of the hands of teenagers, young adults, Americans, as well as arresting people that seek to cause harm to this country. (TI): Very good, appreciate you. I appreciate that. I just want to get that out there. Now you're, you're targeting counterfeit pill manufacturers currently, and online drug vendors. I want to talk about counterfeit pills first because I've heard less about that. You know, I’ve heard, you know, how does that work? Do they make pills like placebos or is it pills that you're talking about earlier with fentanyl? Are they trying to assert, are they trying to make legitimate drugs that are circumventing the FDA? Or is it more stuff like the Molly and the fentanyl that you're talking about? (BC): So counterfeit pills, what we mean by that is the pills are intended to look like pharmaceutical grade drugs. In reality, they have, sometimes they don't even have the same active narcotic, and they are ten to a hundred times more deadly because the dosages aren't, there's no quality control. Right? (TI): They’re totally circumventing the FDA. Like just that whole process. (BC): Oh, absolutely. They're trying to trick people to thinking, oh, I've taken this pill from a pharmacist or a doctor. This pill must be like that one that I got from the doctor or the pharmacist and that's so far from the truth. And that's why, what motivated me to come on this podcast today and talk to Veterans and talk to anyone listening is those counterfeit pills are not the same thing. You know, it's like buying bootleg, bootleg liquor, or buying some counterfeit product, it's made to look like it but the quality is not the same. It's not the same product, especially in a drug world. If you take a pill that you bought or you, a friend gave you. Did it come straight from a doctor? There's a good chance in 2021, you will overdose, and you may die. And I'll say that again, if you take a pill and it doesn't come from the VA, if it doesn't come from a, an outside provider, primary care, from someone who is a qualified medical professional, and you take that pill, you may overdose and you may die at, and if you don't do that, there's a good chance you’re gonna develop a substance abuse addiction to that drug. (TI): Are you seeing Veterans in, as the users for some of this stuff that you're seeing- (BC): DEA doesn't once again, target people who use drugs, our interaction is somewhat limited. You know, I'm, I'm arresting people who are associated with transnational organization, higher level, so I can’t answer that question. (TI): Let me rephrase that. No wait, let me rephrase that. Are you concerned that Veterans are the end users of this stuff? (BC): Absolutely because I think Veterans have the risk due to their medical injuries. Listen, I'm a veteran, I've taken more Motrin 800 than I'd care to admit, while I was in the service. Arthritis back pain. I can't meet one veteran who doesn't have some ailment from serving years and years and doing battle. You know, wearing a 50-pound battle pack is a grunt or an infantry manner, I don’t know. So, the point is I think we as Veterans, we have a lot of injuries and you have to treat those injuries, right? And sometimes that's using pain medications. What that can lead into is maybe a doctor stops providing a veteran, a pain prescription, or that veteran develops injuries or more pain and they need to, you know, we're all humans. We don't want to hurt. So, we're going to try to stop what’s hurting us. And if there's a pill, my concern is a veteran says, well, my friend gave my friend uses these, I know he gets them from a street vendor, a street drug dealer. He's okay. They say, well, if he's okay, I'd be okay taking it and well, guess what, nope, those pills aren't made the same there. They're made in warehouses or on the side of mountains throughout these different countries I mentioned and next thing you know that veteran overdoses and may potentially die. So, I'm especially concerned about Veterans because I know some of the injuries and some of the pain and, and it may not be injuries. It could also be social or mental health issues that lead people to substance abuse and so Veterans are also at risk because what PTSD and some other traumatic injuries. So, the message really has to get out to Veterans to say, keep working with your doctors, keep working with those qualified medical professionals, do not get drugs anywhere besides there, and I know it's a challenge, but does it mean you, you could go get drugs from your friend those days, those days are long gone. (TI): So, yeah it sounds like a it's totally changed the game and it's something you need to think about. I, I honestly never considered that I'm very much of the homeopathic type and I try to stay from pill away from pills and drugs, my entire life and I don't like things that alter me. I, you know, I'm coming, I come from Seattle, from Washington state, west to Seattle. So, it's, I'm always looking for the hippie treatment, right? Even though I'm, you know, I I've left that type of lifelong time, I've left that live long time ago, but I still look like permitted medicinal and alternative methods, interesting stuff. I've never really considered where, what synthetic pills are or where you get them, but I do know that a lot of Veterans are looking at it that way. So, it's good that you you've come on here and explain that I've never even considered considers that considered that myself. So, online drug vendors, now are we talking like silk road type of stuff? Is this how Veterans and other Americans are getting these drugs? How has that evolved? Cause I know 10 years ago, maybe more at this point, you know, the big spotlight was silk road, dark web, that sort of thing. What's coming currently on the online drug trade and how is it evolving? (BC): So, you're referring to silk road. Those that don't know silk road is an online drug market, basically a E-bay style format. You log on any laptop, if MiFi or Wi-Fi connection and a laptop, you could log on to these dark net drug sites and that's all it is. It's an eBay for drugs. You can buy heroin, cocaine, amphetamines, any drug that you can imagine is on there, and it has a anonymous feature to it. And that's why these websites are gaining popularity because with cryptocurrency like Bitcoin or Monero, you can get online, you can buy these drugs. You can either pay with those cryptocurrencies, or you could still use cash, which is a somewhat anonymous form, and you could send money to these drug dealers, and they'll mail you drugs to your front door. (TI): Just like the VA. Just like the VA. (BC): Yeah. It's, it's Amazon prime, right? And so, of the drug world we've become, so let me make a few clicks on the computer and I could get anything I want that holds especially true for drugs today, which is scary because tell me, there's not one person who hasn't had a bad day that, you know, you, you want to feel better, right? And I'm thinking about the veteran that wakes up in pain and his back is hurting and he's got, I mean, he's in excruciating pain and he ran out of his medicine from the VA. I'm just, it's a scenario, right? Yeah. Well, what's to stop him from going online and clicking on downloading some software or going online, paying some unknown drug dealer and next thing you know, he has a bunch of pills sent to his front door and in his mind, he says, okay, well, he has a legitimate, legitimate need for them, but he's getting them in an illegitimate way. That is very risky, very dangerous because the reality is those pills have fentanyl in them or methamphetamine or some unknown drug that will likely cause them to overdose. So that's the concern and I'll take it one step further and it's not just logging online now. It's you could go to Snapchat; you could go to Instagram, and you have drug dealers who are marketing or advertising drugs online. So, if you don't even have a laptop, you could just grab your smartphone, download one of those apps, those social media apps, if you know the right words to search. You could say, okay, you just connected yourself with a drug dealer and he could, and then next thing you know, you're doing a trench drug transaction online or on the, on, on your phone. So, the world is fast now for drugs. (TI): That is amazing, that they're that brazen. That they're pretty much coming out of the dark web and going into Instagram and Snapchat. I that's, that's amazing. It's amazing. (BC): Yeah. Drug dealers have learned that technology can buffer or aleut, helped them allude law enforcement. Now they're wrong in a lot of ways, I will tell you if you sell drugs online or on social media, we might not arrest you today. We're not gonna arrest you tomorrow, but we're going to arrest you one way or the other. And I tell you, cause I've conducted a few online drug investigations myself firsthand, and we've arrested plenty of people who hide behind a computer. It's one person and they think, well, I'll never get caught and until they get caught and they're sitting in jail for 10 or 15 years and there they destroy their own lives. But the reality is going back to what we're talking about is technology gives accessibility, meaning they can sell and market their drugs through to consumers and it also protects them in a lot of way, because a lot of the technology nowadays is military grade encryption, right? So, when you talk about, the online drug markets, the dark net, there's a lot of layers and it's very challenging for law enforcement to penetrate those layers. Same with social media apps, you know, Snapchat, if I'm not invited into a group, it's very difficult for me to see what's going on in that group as law enforcement. So not to say there's not ways to do it legally and with court authorization, but the point is, is technology of affords protections or helps drug dealers hide what they're doing and that's the scary part and followed by its, they opened a lot of doors. So maybe that drug dealer five years ago had 50 customers. Now with Snapchat and Instagram and the dark net, maybe he has 2000 customers. That's scary to me. (TI): Absolutely and you think about the different things, the different social media platforms that come out with, now the audio rooms that, that a lot of the social media platforms are coming out with a community and some other ones that were really, it’s just an audio chat room. I remember, you know, I mean, guys, criminals are in inventive. I mean, at some point they were using World of Warcraft for like to organized terrorist operations, you know, it's just amazing how technology can be used and, and like, you gotta be really on top of it, to really catch these guys. I don't know, you must have some good, you must have to hire some good social media, like savvy tech folks to really, to really get and all that, interesting. What else is there about the drug scene? The drug economy in America that Americans maybe don't know about but should. (BC): I would say the illusion first and foremost, and then we touched upon a little bit, but pharmaceutical drugs could be just as dangerous as street drugs when they're abused. And, you know, I didn't really know that going into DEA, but 30 years ago, pain pills weren't prescribed like they are today. You know and there's a lot more of them and they're readily available and pharmaceutical companies and manufacturers are making billions of pain pills a year. We have to ask yourselves when it is enough or how much is it is too much. And so, where that goes is this, it starts innocent. People are prescribed pain pills, and they say, well, there's nothing wrong with it, I was prescribed with it. Right? I just said that myself. It's okay, if you're you have legitimate medical need and you're under the care or supervision of a medical professional to take those drugs. Fair enough. The problem is when you start abusing those drugs and people don't realize, well, okay, they came from a doctor, so it's okay. We'll know there they're very powerful drugs. I mean, oxycodone, hydrocodone, all these drugs can lead into substance abuse and what happens eventually is say, you do you start abusing, let's just take a painkiller, like hydrocodone, you take two a day in the morning to roll out of bed. Well, eventually your body gets used to it. Then a month later, you need three pills. The next month you need five, six pills just to function, just to roll out of bed because you feel like you're going to vomit, you're nauseous. Eventually you're going to run out of money, and you can't get those pharmaceutical pills. So, you might talk to somebody say, hey, I could give you one pill of fentanyl that costs $20 bucks versus the $200 you're spending every morning to roll out a bill. So, you went from seven pills to one pill and you're not only spending $30. And so, now people are going from prescription pills, starting their abuse there and going to street drugs and next thing you know, you're abusing heroin, fentanyl, cocaine, anything that at that point to make you feel better to roll out of bed so you could function. So that's what I think once again, we have to be very careful about, and I'll tell you right now, I was visiting some family and I went to multiple houses because we have multiple family members and I went to get, because cause were staying there, so, I put some of my toothbrushes and toothpaste in there and I see medicine in the medicine cabinet. So, things like that have to change. We have to realize that the medicines in our house, may be the gateway for a life of substance abuse. And so that's, I'd say that's one of the biggest things, is that the perception that those drugs aren't dangerous, and they can be, they can be if they're abused. So, you know, all the Veterans out there, it's just be careful with your meds. (TI): Yeah, Mikayla Vega really, really warned against that in his episode. If you go listen to, if you're listening to this, that that's a really good episode to kind of caveat off this subject in the archives. A Navy seal was on a lot of pills and eventually found more homeopathic ways to, to deal with his PTSD and pain. Really good episode. You know, I really think 10 year and I said, that's in that episode, I think 10 years ago, 15 years ago when, when we were first starting coming back from war and I think this was more of an American epidemic too, than it was just for Veterans. People just didn't really know, we didn't really know how to deal with the influx of mental health, of physical health that was happening at that time and there was an answer. There was these opioids and I think since then the VA and the rest of America had recognized like, oh my God, what have we done? And have really curved that I think I read in a news release probably about six months ago that the VA has, has curved successfully curved about 60% of opioids that they were prescribing 10 years ago. So, you know, hopefully we've, we've kind of as a, as a country learned from that and it starting to try to curb that in a way. Are you seeing that at your level? (BC): Yes. A quick note, the VA actually has a podcast on opioids. It's a four-part series. I listened to it, and I learned a lot from it. And, but yes, the focus is educating people, educating Americans about drugs and how much we consume and why we consume them. I think that's the biggest thing is the idea of recreational use versus medical use and if you don't have to take a drug, listen, I'm not giving a medical advice. If you're a doctor, DEA has never been trying to get between a doctor and a qualified medical professional, but we've also seen the dangers of when people don't, when they skew or they step outside those lines and I'm telling you right now, everything's different, from last year, to this year, versus five years ago and it scares me because we're walking in the blind. You take cocaine nowadays, someone recreationally been using it for 10 years, their stories are happening right now. Incidents where people take cocaine, they thought, oh, it's just cocaine. I've been taking it for 10 years from this dealer and it's laced with fentanyl, and they die. Right? So even people that, you know, recreationally have been using drugs, are dying and it's just, everything has changed. There's nothing. What, you know, in the past is not what the same is now, and same, this is a topic that is very sensitive amongst states, but marijuana, marijuana, potency for me to talk to somebody who maybe used marijuana in the seventies or eighties, it was around four to 5% THC. That's how, you know, strong you say marijuana is right now it's in the 20%, you know, there's some manufacturers dispensary, you know, in the low thirties, and then you starting to get into edibles or waxes or oils and those going from 60% to nearly pure THC. So once again, it's not me or the DEA telling you as an adult, what to do, but be aware that the dangers of drugs in 2021 are much different than they were years past. (TI): Yeah. You're not getting the pure Colombian cocaine that you're getting back in the Narcos days; it sounds like the game's completely changed. Looking at like going back to the online drug trade, are they and counter fit pills, are they making it look like it's coming from Johnson and Johnson? Coming from Pfizer? Are they, are they putting the stamp on there to where you don't know? (BC): Absolutely. So, the most popular drug right now is oxycodone 30 milligrams and the real ones come, the legitimate ones, which come from medical, from the pharmacy themselves or a doctor, look nearly identical from the ones that are coming from these makeshift labs throughout these countries I mentioned. So, for someone who's not knowing, yes, you might not be able to tell the difference. I could tell, cause I've seen thousands of thousands and most law enforcement can, there's usually a difference in color or how they crumble, but the point is if you can't compare them, then you wouldn't know. And so, I'd say 99% of people don't know- (TI): 99.9% of people don't know. (BC): There you go. And the other drugs, so I mentioned oxycodone 30 milligrams, the stamps are identical, the colors identical. Other drugs we're seeing that are being counterfeited is Xanax. They're also known street names is bars. Those are counterfeited popular amongst college students, young adults, teenagers. Adderall, any drug, that's a pill, and these transnational criminal organizations, these drug cartels can make money off, they'll counterfeit it. So that, that's what I'm saying, if it doesn't come from a doctor, assume it's counterfeit and assume it doesn't have the drug. Like for example, Adderall, if you go to online dark net, if you go to social media and you get Adderall likely the chances of that having methamphetamine are probably pretty high in it. So, it won't actually have the act of drug the Adderall has in it it'd be methamphetamine. So, they're substituting drugs to give you the same effect. Same with Xanax, Xanax, it will either have and, or have methamphetamine or fentanyl in it. Once again, the drug dealer is trying to use the cheapest product he can to make a pill to make the most amount of money. So, he's not going to get that the real active ingredient that, and say, for example, Xanax, that's the brand name, the active drug is alprazolam. He's not going to seek out alprazolam and he's not going to pay a premium for it. He's just going to take fentanyl, throw it in a mixer and produce a pill. He's making money. He doesn't, he doesn't care about you or your family or community. He wants to make money, I mean, tons of money and that's, that's how he does it. (TI): You know, you've brought up a lot, a lot of really good stuff in this episode. If I was a veteran or heck if I was a parent and I want to learn more about this stuff as, you know that's coming into America, about what we talked about today, where would you find resources on that? (BC): The easiest way is just to go to a web browser, to take, for example, Google and search DEA and you can either put the name of the drug, or you could put parents guides to drugs. We have other websites that are designed specifically for those age groups. So, if you have a child who's in college or secondary academic institution, campus prevention, that's another one you could Google. If you have a teenager in high school, justthinktwice.gov, [Link: http://justhinktwice.gov/ ]. And what I love about that website is you log online, and they'll ask you, would you like, would you like text messages or would you like emails and every week they'll send you information, a hyperlink about a drug or about a danger or drug trends. So that way you're staying up to date, right? And I'll the funniest line, and this is from GI Joe, but knowing is knowing is half the battle, right? And so, you have to keep yourself educated so you could protect your loved ones, yourself, and family members. So dea.gov, [Link: http://dea.gov ], click on resources and under publications, you'll find the list of great resources that are free, downloadable and you can get active texts every week. (TI): Okay. In addition, if you go to blogs.VA.gov, [Link: http://blogs.VA.gov], and you go to this blogs episode, I'll make sure that we take some of those resources and you can send them to me after the episode and we'll put them in the blog as well. (BC): Thank you. (TI): I've personally learned a lot in this episode. Bill, what's one thing that you, that you learned during your time and service that you apply to what you do today? (BC): Don't quit. Don't quit because life's a game up and downs. I, this job, and I've seen that every day is the people that succeed the best. I think Veterans know this is, you're gonna have good days, you're gonna have bad days, but if you don't quit on any of those days, you're going to win, eventually. And that's what has helped me in my career with DEA and I've seen that with other agents and DEA personnel is you know, we lose sometimes with drug dealers, meaning we don't arrest them every day, but I know the next day I got another shot at a drug dealer, arrest them. And if I can't get them that day, I'm going to get him another day and that mentality will make you succeed. (TI): I think, it was from the Rocky movie. I always look at that. It's not about how hard you hit, it's about hard how hard life's get hits, and then you, you keep getting up, how many times you get up. (BC): Absolutely. (TI): Bill, is there a veteran non-profit or a veteran in the community, in the veteran community whom you've worked with or had an experience with that you’d like to mention? (BC): I generally I like to thank the Veterans that, organizations that bring Veterans outdoors, and there's several of them, and for me specifically, I worked with, Arizona Elk Society. They do hunts for heroes. There is a program in Iowa, same thing. They took out myself and some other Veterans hunting in Iowa and the experiences were long lasting. I still think about them to this day. I think the point is, they put Veterans and took them outside of their day-to-day life and put them in this positive environment to interact with other Veterans, and that was priceless. And so, I think every organization that just tries to help Veterans by whatever they do, horseback riding therapy, outdoor adventures hunting, and there's countless ones. So, you know, the wounded warriors, all those they're all great. (TI): Very good, very good. Bill, is there anything that I haven't asked or that I've missed about anything that we've talked about today that you'd like to share? (BC): You know, as Veterans, we have to protect our families. We have to protect our communities and we have to be active, and part of that is you have to protect yourself and you have to make yourself healthy. And I think that's kind of going back to the drug message of in order to protect your family, you have to be healthy. And so, you can’t abuse drugs. You can't recreationally use drugs because you're going to actually do the opposite, is you're going to destabilize your family, your friends, your loved ones. And so, if someone's out there and they don't feel like they have a purpose, I mean, there's good missions in the US. If you're trying to transition, law enforcement wants you. I'll tell you right now, their DEA wants qualified professionals and I actively try to recruit military members, Veterans, and I know law enforcement throughout United States will gladly accept you because you have the right tools, you have the right character, the values that we want. So, you know, you can, you can serve your community by joining law enforcement, or you can serve your community in a lot of different ways through organizations, but the point is, find your purpose. Just because you left the military doesn't mean the mission stops. (TI): Outstanding. Well, Bill, I’m glad we finally got to make this happen. I know we’ve crossed paths a couple of times on LinkedIn. We’ve covered a lot of ground. I appreciate you being here. I appreciate what you do and till next time y'all have a good one. We're out. [Music] Man: Strength is something earned, not given. Dedication means pursuing your passion, everyday. Healing is something we do, together. And together, we put Veterans first. Search VA careers to find out how. [Music] Tanner Iskra: I want to thank Bill so much for coming on Borne the Battle. Again, it really opened my eyes to some of this. For more information on the counterfeit pill industry, go to dea.gov/onepill [Link: www.dea.gov/onepill ]. That's all. That last part is all one word. This week's Borne the Battle Veteran of the Week is from our VA Veteran of the Day program. Every day, our digital media team honors a Veteran on all of our social media platforms and with a blog on blogs.va.gov [Link: www.blogs.va.gov ]. You can nominate the Veteran in your life by sending in a short writeup and about five photos to [email protected]. Even though he was a recent VA Veteran of the Day, this Veteran was also a guest on Borne the Battle. It's in our archives, Episode 149. As tensions were rising in Europe, William Bonelli knew that news of the war was coming. Instead of waiting for the draft, he enlisted in the Army Air Corps due to his interest in airplanes and passion for all things that flew. He served as an aviation mechanic for planes, including the B-17 Flying Fortress. After Benelli completed basic training, and in September of 1940, he went to Hickam Field in Hawaii. On his way to a camping trip, Bonelli drove past a car with antennas parked on the beach. The next day, on his way back to base, he saw unrecognizable planes flying towards Honolulu. Bonelli joked that they were at war, since he could not identify the planes. Then in the distance, he witnessed the attack on Pearl Harbor. Following the event, he was convinced the men he saw inside the car guided the enemy planes. Bonelli joined the military with the intention of becoming a pilot. After assignment in Fiji, he attended flight school in Hobbs, New Mexico, in 1943. While stationed in Italy in 1944, Bonelli was the group and squadron leader of the 77th Bomb Squadron 463rd Bomb Group. Later that year, German fire damaged aircraft as he flew over Czechoslovakia. He was shaken up after the attack but created a new strategy, he believed, saved many lives in his squadron for the sortie missions over Germany. All in all, Bonelli completed over 30 sorties over Nazi-controlled Europe and was a squadron commander and lead pilot for 21 of them. When the war ended, Bonelli was permitted to fly a B-17 to Egypt and Israel to sight-see. Of course, right? His love for aviation prompted him to continue serving in the Army Air Forces, which later in his career became the Air Force. During the cold war, he served in England. Benelli then went to Hobbs and accomplished his dream of flying the Fighter Bomber 84 Thunder Streak, which had the capability of delivering nuclear bombs. He took as many aviation classes as he could during his service and even learned how to fly a helicopter. He was also a flight and mechanics instructor. Remember that mechanics background. After 20 years of service, Bonelli retired in 1960 at age 39 as Lieutenant Colonel. Following his retirement from the military, Bonelli worked in FAA. He spent most of his life in Oklahoma. In 2019, he earned an honorary degree from Valley Forge Military College. Unfortunately, Bonelli passed away at a hundred years old on May 12th of 2021. Now I find, I personally found out, through this Veteran of the Day that William passed away. Since I did an interview with his hero, I just wanted to give you a small exerpt from William himself from Episode 149: “’I was a Staff Sergeant Mechanic on the B-17 and the B-24.’ ‘So you were a mechanic during Pearl Harbor as well.’ ‘Oh yes.’ ‘Oh, wow. So this is before your flying career. So in Fiji, they asked you if you wanted to be a pilot.’ ‘PJ, they opened up the door and I submitted my application again. I have reason to believe that my immediate commander did not – Back in Honolulu, I applied, and I have a reason to believe he negated that he didn't want –’ ‘He didn't want to let you go.’ ‘That's right. I can understand. But then I think that's wrong and I'm angry about that to this day. But anyhow, I got around him, and Fiji, as I – that's another story I don't want to take up too much of your time.’ ‘No, no. You can take up as much of my time as possible, sir. Absolutely.’ ‘You want me to tell you the story?’ ‘Sure. Yeah, absolutely. You know what? Now that you put – ‘You know how I got around my commander?’ ‘Yeah, let's hear it.’ ‘Okay. It's the most beautiful story of my life.’” Army and Air Force Veteran, William Bonelli. We honor your service. [21 gun salute] That's it for this week's episode. If you yourself would like to nominate a feature Borne the Battle Veteran of the Week so we can all learn their story, you can. Just send an email to [email protected], include a short writeup, and let us know why you'd like to see him or her as the Borne the Battle Veteran of the Week. And if you like this podcast episode hit the subscribe button. We’re on iTunes, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, iHeartRadio, pretty much any podcatching app, known to phone, computer, tablet, or man. For more stories on Veterans and Veteran benefits, check out our website blogs.va.gov and follow the VA on social media: Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, YouTube, RallyPoint, LinkedIn, DEPTVetAffairs, U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs [Link: www.blogs.va.gov ]. No matter the social media, you can always catch us with that blue checkmark. And as always, I'm reminded by people smarter than me to remind you that the Department of Veterans Affairs does not endorse or officially sanction any entities that may be discussed in this podcast, nor any media products or services they may provide. I say that because the song you're hearing now is called ‘”Machine Gunner,” which is courtesy of the nonprofit Operation Song. It was written by a Marine Veteran Mark McElhenney, Nashville Songwriter Jason Sever, and Mykal Duncan. Have a great day. Thank you for listening, and we'll see you right here next week. Take care. [Music] (TI): Okay, I want you to start from the beginning of this story, like the most somebody’s made in one day. (BC): I interviewed someone I arrested. They were telling me about how much drugs they sold. I said, “What’s the most amount of money you’ve made in a day?” He said, “I made $175,000 in one day.” I said, “How did you do that?” And he said, “Someone flew in from Canada and wanted to purchase 10 kilos of cocaine.” I’m just using nominal figures, right. (TI): Yeah. (BC): I can’t go too into details, but at the time a kilo of cocaine was going for about 25 to 30,000 in Los Angeles. So the individual came, from Canada, had a suitcase of money, he gave it to this individual that I arrested, that individual went to a source, a drug source, gave the money to him, got the cocaine, gave it to the Canadian guy, and his brokering fee, meaning all he did was connect some dots - connect the money to the drugs - and he made 175,000 for just doing one transaction. And the light went off in my head, that moment was - I understood everything I need to know about drugs is, you can make a lot of money selling drugs and that’s why these people, these predators, sell these drugs because it’s about the money. And that was one day, I mean imagine if for the rest of the year he did how many more transactions, I mean he probably grossed a million dollars, easy, within six months.