0:00

Hi everybody , welcome back to the channel . Today

0:02

I'm interviewing Francesca Amber

0:04

. Francesca is the host of the wildly

0:06

successful podcast Law of Attraction

0:09

Changed my Life . It's a show about manifestation

0:11

and where she talks to people about improving

0:14

their life situation . Two years ago , francesca

0:17

started the podcast during COVID and

0:19

has quickly grown it to over 5 million

0:21

downloads . She regularly charts

0:23

at number one for self-help in the UK

0:26

and has monetized her show to

0:28

well over a six-figure income and

0:30

has been able to make it her full-time

0:33

gig . We talk about a lot in

0:35

this podcast . We talk about how she started

0:37

on YouTube when she pivoted to

0:40

podcasting , unique values of podcasting

0:42

, the benefits of finding the

0:44

right niche for your podcast

0:46

. We talk about growth strategies the exact

0:49

ones she used to grow her podcast and specifically

0:52

how she built a community around

0:54

her podcast . And then we talk about monetization

0:56

strategies that Francesca used to

0:58

make over six figures in income

1:00

every year from her podcast . It's a

1:03

really interesting interview . I learned a ton

1:05

. Hope you enjoy it as well . Two things to

1:07

note about this interview Francesca is

1:09

based in the UK and I'm in Florida , so we had

1:11

to be a bit creative with scheduling . So

1:13

, if you notice , the lighting is changing on

1:15

my side throughout the interview . That's because the

1:17

sun had not come up until we

1:19

press record . And then , second , like

1:22

many podcasters , francesca does cuss

1:24

in her episodes , and so we have not

1:26

edited all of that out . If you're

1:28

listening with small children , or if

1:30

just cursing , offending , or you just don't like

1:32

it , this may not be the episode for you , but

1:34

we really think you'll enjoy it . And now I bring you Francesca

1:37

Amber . Hey everybody , welcome back . Today

1:39

I am talking to Francesca Amber

1:41

. Francesca hosts the highly

1:43

successful podcast Law of Attraction

1:46

Changed my Life . It's a podcast about

1:48

manifesting the good life and , as the

1:50

podcast description says , it's

1:52

not a cult . Besides

1:54

her podcast , she's also written a book , created

1:57

a successful YouTube channel , runs online

1:59

courses , an online book club

2:01

and tons of other things . So today

2:04

we're going to talk about her creator

2:06

journey and everything she's learned along the

2:08

way , so you can learn a lot too , francesca

2:11

. Thank you so much for joining me .

2:13

Thank you . I love being here . I'm a big fan of Buzzsprout

2:15

. If it wasn't for you guys , I wouldn't

2:18

be here , so I'm excited .

2:20

Oh , that's awesome . What ? So

2:22

I was kind of piecing together

2:25

what I call like your media empire

2:27

. You've been creating online for a long time

2:29

. Where did you get your start , or

2:31

what was the first thing you started creating online ?

2:34

So the first thing was YouTube . Over 10

2:36

years ago now , and I think this is because I

2:38

was consuming a lot of YouTube at the time and

2:41

I really just wanted to talk about the Law of Attraction

2:43

, which back then not many people

2:45

were talking about . Only a handful of people you'd speak

2:48

to would be like , oh , I've read the magic , not

2:50

the magic , the secret . But

2:52

that was kind of it . It wasn't as mainstream

2:54

as it is now , and so I just started

2:57

to create weekly videos , except for

2:59

when I forgot , of course , because I wasn't consistent back

3:01

then on how to manifest

3:04

and how to use the Law of Attraction in your life in

3:06

a very sort of crude , novice

3:08

kind of way . But people loved it and

3:10

it grew steadily and

3:13

I did that for 10 years .

3:14

Wow , for anyone who doesn't know

3:16

what is the Law of Attraction

3:18

.

3:20

So it's basically about how your thoughts

3:22

can create your reality and how so

3:24

many people just go through life accepting

3:26

what happens to them . But when you discover

3:28

the Law of Attraction you realize that things aren't happening to

3:30

you . You are actually co-creating

3:33

everything that happens to you , the good and

3:35

the bad . And once you realize that and

3:37

you also start to develop the tools to kind

3:39

of harness your own energy and harness your own mind

3:41

, you can start to use that for good and create

3:44

basically the life of your goddamn dreams

3:46

.

3:48

I read an article about

3:50

you in prepping for this interview . You

3:53

help

3:55

me understand this . You found

3:57

your husband years before you ever met

3:59

him and told people

4:01

and yourself that he was going to be your husband

4:04

. What is this story ?

4:06

Yeah . So I went and

4:08

did online dating , as we all do , and

4:11

I put in six foot six and above

4:13

, because you know what I was in my 20s . My standards

4:15

were high .

4:16

They've slipped since then .

4:17

I accept much less now . But

4:19

I put in six foot six and above and one person

4:22

came back on my search results and it was this

4:25

really tall guy next to a yacht . That

4:27

helped and I was like

4:29

this is my husband . As soon as I saw his picture I was like this

4:31

is my husband . And so I messaged

4:33

him , but he never replied because it turned out

4:35

that he was living in Australia at the time

4:37

. Whatever , he never replied . So I put his

4:39

picture on a vision board because I was

4:41

very into the law of attraction at the time . I was , you know , making

4:44

vision boards for my future husband and

4:46

I kept it for three years . And three years later

4:48

my friend is walking along the street and she just

4:51

sees this guy . She doesn't realize it's the guy from

4:53

my vision board and says oh , my friend loves

4:55

tall men . She's got like a weird fetish

4:57

for tall men . Do you want to go on a blind

4:59

date ? Now ? She's never done this for me before

5:01

and no friend has ever set me up with a blind

5:03

date , since it's the only time it's ever happened . And

5:06

when we meet up it's the same goddamn person

5:08

. And we got engaged six months later . He did

5:10

turn out to be gay , but that's , we

5:13

were still married for six years . Still

5:15

counts , counts

5:17

for something .

5:20

What would that mean to you ? That you I

5:22

mean you show up on a blind date and it's a person

5:24

that you've like . You know

5:26

what they look like , you've seen them before .

5:28

Do you know what I realized the

5:30

morning of the date ? Because he asked

5:32

if we could switch like Facebook

5:35

profiles , if we could see each other on Facebook

5:37

, and his profile picture was

5:39

the same picture that I'd had hanging up

5:41

in my wardrobe for three years and that's how

5:43

I knew it was exactly the same as because it was the same

5:45

picture . And even to this day he changes

5:47

his profile picture once every 10 years

5:49

, like it's just two years . But

5:51

it was insane and I remember telling people

5:53

like this works and the amount of

5:55

times I've said with my law of attraction journey , this

5:58

shit works , it works

6:00

. And I just told everyone I'm meeting my husband tonight

6:02

and , sure enough , yeah , six months later we

6:04

got married . And some people have said to me

6:06

since do you think that that

6:08

was a failure or you forced somebody to marry

6:11

you ? Absolutely not . Everybody is for

6:13

a reason or a season . That man changed

6:15

my life . Although we had a very unhappy relationship

6:18

, in some ways he was the person that was

6:20

almost like what my parents should

6:22

have done , like us , in a very unhappy nine to five

6:24

living like in the corporate world . I was just living

6:26

day to day and he was like you can quit your

6:28

job , you can travel the world , you can

6:31

create your own business , and I did all of that

6:33

under his guidance , and for

6:35

that I'll be forever thankful , forever

6:37

thankful .

6:39

Such an interesting story . I think

6:42

it was like a news article that I read . I was going

6:44

through it . I'm like whoa this interview to

6:46

be a lot more interesting .

6:48

It's crazy , he calls me a witch .

6:50

A witch .

6:51

He does call me a witch . He's like well , we all know you're a witch . I'm

6:53

like yeah , we all are , we're all witches

6:55

, You've just got to access it .

6:59

So , going back to the YouTube

7:01

channel , you started just because you were consuming

7:03

YouTube . What helped you make that switch from

7:05

being somebody who's just consuming

7:08

YouTube to somebody who is actually a creator

7:10

?

7:11

Well , I am a very creative person . By this

7:13

point , I had already written a book . But

7:16

back then , you know , I wrote a book in 2008

7:18

, where there were real gatekeepers to that

7:20

creative world . You know , you couldn't just get a book

7:23

published , you couldn't just create

7:25

things . And then , when I discovered YouTube , I was like

7:27

, oh , you don't need to wait for

7:29

an agent to find you or someone to

7:31

hire you to be a TV

7:33

presenter . You can literally create your own channel

7:36

. And that's what I loved about it was the

7:38

fact that those gatekeepers are really disappearing

7:40

and you could create something for yourself

7:42

. So I loved it .

7:45

It really is the difference between I

7:47

don't know like mid 90s to now

7:49

. You know , at first started with text online

7:51

and then maybe podcasting

7:53

and then video and then self

7:56

publishing books through maybe Amazon

7:58

and online courses . The world

8:00

has gone , changed very

8:02

much . From there is a sliver

8:05

of people who get to decide what content

8:07

gets created and gets distributed , because

8:09

distributed , you know , distribution was

8:11

the choke point and now anybody

8:15

can go and start a TikTok channel and

8:17

, if it's good , really start

8:19

to take off .

8:20

It's incredible . It's given us all the greatest

8:22

freedoms , and that's what I love about Buzzsprout . As well

8:25

as that , it's such an incredibly

8:27

easy platform to use and you

8:29

know , I found myself in lockdown , pregnant

8:31

with twins , with nothing else to do , and

8:34

I was able to create the number one podcast

8:36

in the UK for self development . That earns me

8:38

more money than I've ever earned just

8:40

from using this one little free app , like

8:42

you guys taught me how to use it

8:44

for free . There's people that

8:47

charge hundreds of thousands of pounds

8:49

for courses on teaching you how to start

8:51

a podcast . You don't need that shit . You

8:53

just need to watch the bus sprout videos . It

8:55

takes about 10 hours . You need to dedicate a day to

8:58

it and then boom , you're done , and

9:00

I love that . We can all create whatever

9:02

life we want from our home . We don't

9:04

even need to leave our house .

9:07

That is an amazing testimonial

9:10

. You know , put that into a commercial

9:12

someday . So

9:14

take me from this YouTube channel

9:16

. You start building a YouTube channel . That's really

9:18

taking off . How

9:21

does that translate into COVID

9:24

lockdowns ? And then you decided to do

9:26

a podcast . Why did you not stick with

9:28

the YouTube ?

9:29

Well , there were several reasons . One was that

9:31

I had a daughter and as a

9:33

mum , I didn't have the same amount of

9:35

time as I used to have . So , setting

9:38

up a camera , setting up the lighting

9:40

you're a man , so

9:43

you won't understand this , but like doing your goddamn

9:45

hair and makeup , it's just an effort

9:47

and I just found that , trying to find

9:49

the creative resources in my brain to

9:51

think of what you wanted to do for the episode , to

9:53

put it together , to articulate it was

9:55

one side , but then actually looking like

9:58

a human as well , like I'm not

10:00

just sitting there in my pajamas . It was like a whole

10:02

different aspect and it was just it was too

10:04

much . But the other side of it as well

10:06

was I was no longer consuming YouTube

10:09

. So I'm very like with young

10:11

children . I don't really like to be looking at my

10:13

phone . I try to not look at my phone as much as

10:15

I can . And something I love , love

10:17

, love about podcasts is that you

10:19

can listen to a podcast whilst you're cleaning

10:21

. You can listen to a podcast whilst you're feeding your

10:24

children dinner . You can do it whilst you're driving . You can do

10:26

it whilst you're in the bath . It doesn't take

10:28

away your focus or your time

10:30

and that's what I absolutely love about it

10:32

. And I just decided like there was a point

10:35

where it was like , yeah , it's about the hair and makeup , but also

10:37

it's like I don't want my listeners or

10:39

my viewers to be ignoring

10:42

their children in the corner and sitting looking

10:44

staring into a phone . I didn't want that . I

10:47

want my listeners to be listening

10:49

to what I'm saying . You know we do a lot of stuff about energetic

10:52

cleaning and cleaning your front door and cleaning your window

10:54

and things that actually raise your vibe and make you

10:56

feel good . I want people to be doing that , or

10:58

getting out for a walk in nature whilst

11:00

consuming my content , and so for me and I'm

11:03

a massive fan of podcasts so for me , that was the only

11:05

way forward and I just stopped YouTube completely and

11:07

changed to podcasting .

11:10

Wow , yeah , I

11:12

really feel what you're saying , because potty

11:15

has . He's one of the few mediums that accepts

11:17

that you have a life outside of

11:19

the media you're consuming . Netflix

11:21

wants full attention Books

11:24

. You need to be focused and staring

11:27

right into the book when you're watching

11:30

any sort of social media . The entire

11:32

goal is to keep your attention as long

11:34

as possible .

11:35

Yeah .

11:36

And podcasting is saying I

11:38

know you do other stuff , that's cool , we're

11:41

just going to be talking in the background

11:43

. And I grew up you know the United

11:46

States a little bit different . We drive everywhere

11:48

and so we used to do long , long road trips

11:50

. You know eight , nine hours , all

11:53

the whole family in the car , and we listened to audiobooks

11:56

. And what was wonderful about

11:58

it was that it was a family shared experience

12:01

. We weren't all individually staring

12:03

into a device more

12:05

iPhones back then but you're not staring

12:08

into a device , you're not separate . We all were listening

12:10

to the same book and podcasting

12:12

still allows us to do that . Even

12:14

if maybe some of your younger children don't

12:17

catch all of the topics

12:19

that are being discussed , they're being introduced

12:22

into an adult conversation .

12:24

Yeah , definitely , and actually the amount of listeners

12:27

that say to me I listened to this

12:29

with my mom or I listened to this with my daughter

12:31

and it's something that they can bond over

12:33

, that's amazing . And , like I said

12:35

again , it's just not you sitting

12:37

looking into your phone , which I love .

12:41

So you're pregnant with

12:43

twins , you have the lockdown and

12:46

you decide that podcasting is for you

12:48

. What does the beginning of your podcasting

12:50

journey look like ?

12:54

So , yeah , I had basically nothing to do

12:56

. I was very , very

12:58

bored and my sister was the one

13:00

that just kept saying I don't think you should give up on Law

13:02

of Attraction , change my life . So many people loved it

13:04

. You loved doing it , but just do it as a podcast

13:06

instead . And so I'm a massive technophobe

13:09

huge . And so that put me off

13:11

and I joined a free webinar

13:15

type thing with this online person that

13:17

was like I'll show you how to start a podcast

13:19

. This girl did not show you how to start

13:21

a podcast . It was all one big advert to

13:23

sign up for 600 pounds and

13:25

basically she'll teach you how to start a podcast

13:28

. And so I just started Googling during

13:30

this webinar and I was like what is the best host

13:32

in the UK ? Like what should I use ? Because I had

13:34

no idea . And Buzzsprout just kept coming up

13:36

time and time again . And so I looked on

13:39

there and what got me was these easy

13:41

, like idiot style , absolute

13:44

idiot style videos that showed you

13:46

exactly what microphone you need to buy

13:48

, which is a $60 microphone from Amazon , which

13:50

I'm still using to this day I may be on my third

13:52

one , but still like it tells you

13:54

exactly how to edit , how

13:56

to upload it , which format to upload it in . It

13:59

was mind blowing for me . So I

14:01

spent an entire day , I spent 10 hours

14:03

watching those videos , writing notes

14:05

, and boom , I was away . I was doing

14:07

it and to begin with it was just

14:09

a real passion project . It was something to

14:11

take me out of this , quite frankly

14:14

, horrible situation . You know , I'd lost my business

14:16

. I was living in a new city

14:18

where I didn't know anyone , so I moved in

14:20

, got pregnant and then , boom

14:22

, you're locked down . You're not allowed to see anyone

14:25

. So I had no friends here , I had nothing , and

14:27

so it was really like an escape for me

14:29

to focus my attention on while

14:32

we were in this horrible pandemic . And

14:34

it was just a bit of a passion project . And then it just

14:36

grew and grew and grew .

14:39

One of the things that's I love so

14:41

much about creating content especially

14:44

even the content that we create for Buzzsprout as

14:46

our marketing channel , like our YouTube channel

14:48

and just any blogs or anything

14:50

is that you can just pour a ton

14:52

of work into something and then give it

14:54

away , and if

14:57

it's good enough enough , people will find it

14:59

that now

15:01

it makes sense for you to have spent , you know

15:03

, four months working on an

15:05

online course , or months

15:08

and months recording a few videos , or

15:10

years working on a podcast . Those

15:13

numbers start to make sense once

15:16

you get to a certain level of quality

15:18

. When we had to record

15:20

things for just a handful of people

15:22

or go give a seminar to maybe

15:24

a hundred people , the numbers

15:26

just don't add up . But YouTube

15:28

and podcasting and just online creating

15:31

really changed the numbers quite

15:33

a bit .

15:34

Yeah , of course , because it's accessible to pretty

15:36

much everyone , except for my own mother , who

15:39

still can't work out access podcasts

15:41

. She's still never listened to a goddamn episode . But there

15:43

we go . But yeah it's accessible

15:46

to everybody , it's free . And I think

15:48

I remember when you guys , like

15:50

, created those videos , you were saying make

15:53

sure you do a podcast about something that you are truly

15:55

passionate about and you can speak about for a long

15:57

time . And I think that that is a common mistake

15:59

people might make is to if you are in the phase

16:01

of having a baby , you ain't going to want to talk about

16:03

having a baby forever . If you are

16:05

I know some people do them about grief and stuff you don't

16:08

want to talk about grief forever . But

16:10

I knew that talking about the law of attraction something that

16:12

I'd already spent 10 years creating content

16:14

about was something I could talk about all

16:17

day long . I could talk about it till the day I die

16:19

. And so it just kept

16:21

going and , like you say , those numbers just went up and

16:23

up and up and my library was building

16:25

. So not only were people listening to

16:27

the new episode I was bringing out each week , but people

16:29

were always going back and discovering the podcast

16:32

and starting from a fresh . And I've still got people

16:34

now that say I discovered your podcast last

16:36

week and I've listened to all 113

16:38

episodes and I'm like , good God

16:41

, do you not work ? But yeah , so it's

16:43

amazing that it's this whole resource

16:45

there , now that , yes , I do create

16:47

online courses . Yes , I have a Patreon

16:49

book club . That's , you know , a paid subscription . I have

16:51

all of these things . But if you have

16:53

nothing right now and you just want to consume

16:55

free content , it's all there . It's all

16:57

there . There's so much value there .

17:01

Yeah , so for I

17:03

haven't introduced this yet , but you have already

17:05

hit 5 million downloads in two years

17:07

.

17:08

Yes , what you're saying about that , is that

17:10

good Cause I asked Marshall what

17:12

I was like am I one of your best podcasters ? And

17:14

he would say Marshall owns Buzzsprout , doesn't he ? Does

17:17

he own it ?

17:18

Yeah , he's one of the co-founders .

17:19

Yes , One of the co-founders and I was like am

17:22

I your top podcaster ? And he was like I hate to

17:24

tell you , but no , but he's like but you are one

17:26

of our fastest growing , so I'll take

17:28

that . I will take that .

17:30

Yeah , 5 million downloads in

17:32

two years is exceptionally good

17:34

, especially at some

17:36

of the fastest . Growing are like the celebrities

17:38

who are already a celebrity , and then they're

17:40

like , oh , I'm talking to my celebrity friends on

17:43

a podcast .

17:43

Yeah .

17:44

And so , yeah , when Will Smith

17:46

starts a podcast , people know who he is

17:48

already . For people who

17:50

don't have this massive celebrity

17:52

presence , to go and start

17:54

a podcast and grow this quickly is really

17:57

, really uncommon . So what

18:00

do you attribute to your success ?

18:02

Shall I tell you it's the law of attraction

18:04

. Do you not think I law of attraction

18:06

this , I manifested this into my life . Do you think I would do

18:08

it if it wasn't going to be successful

18:10

? I knew that this was going to change my life and I visualize

18:12

all the time . You know , I have affirmations

18:15

that I play every single day while I'm having

18:17

a shower or doing whatever , and

18:19

it's I am the number one podcaster in the UK . I am

18:21

the highest paid podcaster in the UK and I

18:23

truly believe that one day I will

18:25

be that because it's what I affirmed myself . All

18:28

the time . I feel very busy

18:30

in my mind and in reality , although I do have a lot

18:32

going on , a lot of it is because I

18:35

see so much stuff in the future that I want

18:37

to do and I feel like it's coming . So

18:39

if you believe that it's getting bigger

18:41

and things are coming to you all the time , it will just

18:43

happen that way . But also , my content

18:45

is pretty goddamn good . I'm not going to lie , it's good

18:47

. So , yeah , I absolutely

18:49

I love it . I love it , love it . I would do it for free . In fact

18:52

, I did do it for free for so long

18:54

.

18:55

How I mean

18:57

you're creating the content , and we everybody

18:59

knows creating excellent content

19:02

is really , really important . That is

19:04

half of the equation . But

19:06

actually marketing the content , getting

19:09

it in front of people Podcasting

19:11

does not market itself like a YouTube

19:13

channel . When people are watching it a lot

19:15

, youtube starts recommending it A

19:18

social channel . When people retweet

19:20

you or they like something on

19:22

Instagram , then Instagram starts sharing

19:24

it more often . That doesn't happen in podcasting

19:26

. So how are you doing anything

19:29

on the marketing side , or is this 100% organic

19:32

? People are finding you .

19:33

No , I've never , ever paid for any

19:35

kind of advertising or marketing

19:37

or anything . To

19:39

begin with , it was just word of mouth and I think that

19:41

, using my existing Instagram

19:45

which was not anything crazy you

19:47

know , my personal Instagram had like 3000

19:49

followers on it or something but

19:51

just posting consistently about it , I think people

19:54

sometimes think you have to make massive moves

19:56

to be successful and really it's just about consistency

19:58

. It's like I show up every single day

20:00

. I show up and I talk about my

20:02

podcast , probably every

20:04

day on my Instagram , like in some

20:07

form or another , I will talk about , you

20:09

know , my book club , or I'll talk about

20:11

the podcast I'm recording , or I'll talk about just something

20:13

like today I'll mention on my stories that

20:15

I've just done this interview with you . It's about

20:17

every day showing up because I think people

20:20

are so scared . There's a great book called Bragg

20:23

Better by Meredith Feynman and

20:25

I listened to a podcast with her and

20:27

she said people mention what they have once

20:30

and then they feel like everyone's going to be sick

20:32

of them or they'll be bragging if they talk

20:34

about it too many times . But the thing is

20:36

, every time you mention something on your social

20:39

media , only maybe 1% to

20:41

10% of people are going to see it right .

20:43

Out of that half .

20:44

Half the people have probably got a screaming child in the background

20:46

won't even hear it .

20:47

Half of them will forget it .

20:48

So you have to mention what you have to offer

20:51

repeatedly , every day . It has

20:53

to be your obsession . This is not

20:55

just my passion , but my obsession . I talk about

20:57

it constantly and it is , I

20:59

think , because it is such a big part

21:01

of my life . I do a self-development

21:03

book club as part of the podcast and that in itself

21:05

is its own podcast , but

21:08

I really live that . So last

21:10

month we did the five second rule . So

21:13

you really live that five second rule

21:15

every day . So every day it's really easy to go on your

21:17

stories and say , right , I really don't want to work

21:19

out today , but I'm just going to go five , four , three

21:21

, two , one and I'm going to work out and you can talk about it . The

21:23

month before we did a Feng Shui book and

21:25

I could do stories and videos about

21:28

how I'm cleaning my front door and energetically

21:30

cleans in my house and redoing my love and relationship

21:32

corner . The content is there . You just

21:34

need to be open to the opportunities

21:36

and just talk about it , talk about it , talk about it

21:38

. Link back to the podcast , link back to the podcast

21:40

. Everything I do links

21:43

back to the podcast and that is my

21:45

number one priority , Even

21:47

though technically

21:49

I don't really . For a long

21:51

time I didn't even earn any money from the podcast . It

21:54

was all from these little side hustles to do with it . What

21:56

I have to remember is I can never get caught

21:58

up in the book club or

22:01

my online workshops or whatever it is

22:03

that I'm selling , because without the podcast

22:05

, none of that stuff works . So my number

22:07

one priority , all of my energy

22:09

, has to go into creating the best

22:11

podcast every single Friday and make sure

22:14

that that episode is going to make people

22:16

come back . It's going to make people share it

22:18

, and that's another thing my amazing

22:20

listeners do is they constantly share it with their friends . They

22:22

share it on their stories . I repost them

22:24

. Share , share , share , share . That's all it is every

22:27

goddamn day .

22:30

Word of mouth , as often cited

22:32

as like one of the best ways to grow a podcast

22:34

. Is there anything you do to

22:37

get help your listeners share the podcast

22:39

, because we all want that to happen , but

22:42

it often feels like it's totally out of our

22:45

control .

22:46

I think that the only way you can

22:48

guarantee that is to create such good

22:50

content that people want to share

22:53

that they are listening to it . I have a friend

22:55

that has a bit of a failing business

22:57

and she was like sending me

22:59

these stories and begging me to repost them

23:01

on her things . She's like can you share this with

23:03

me ? And it's like I didn't

23:05

share it because it's like begging people to share

23:08

your stuff is never going to work . Just like

23:10

if you start a business and you beg your family and friends

23:12

to make an order with you , that's never going to be sustainable

23:14

. And so I actually don't ever

23:17

ask my friends or family or anyone

23:19

to listen to my podcast or share my

23:21

podcast , because that's not sustainable . What they'll

23:23

share one time and it's inauthentic , it won't work

23:25

. So people , I

23:27

want people to feel a moment in

23:29

that podcast where they're like this

23:32

has changed my life , this has changed my life . I've

23:34

had people message me saying there was a moment

23:36

in that podcast where I realized that I had to leave my husband

23:38

. There was a moment when I realized I was in a toxic relationship

23:40

. There's a moment when I realized I

23:43

have to quit my job . I have to change my life . That

23:45

is what will make people share , and they'll share it in

23:47

an authentic way . And not only will they do it once

23:50

, they will do it repeatedly . They'll become your

23:52

loyal fans . And so that's all

23:54

I do . I don't beg for people to do anything

23:56

. I don't ask .

23:58

That's wonderful . One of

24:00

the pieces of advice I often give

24:02

, kind of related to this , is when

24:04

you're picking your topic . The topic

24:06

for your show has to be so

24:08

honed in , like very specific

24:11

. You know what you're teaching , you

24:14

know what you're discussing , so that when somebody

24:16

is listening to you they go oh

24:18

, this podcast is for

24:21

my friend Jeremy . I'm

24:24

going to tell him about it because we've talked about

24:26

the law of attraction and

24:28

so I know I've got to share with him . This

24:30

is a podcast about rebuilding

24:32

vintage land cruisers and he has

24:34

an old land cruiser . I've got to tell him about this

24:36

podcast . These shows that

24:38

are like hey , I just

24:40

got to talk to interesting people who

24:43

do interesting things . Yeah

24:45

, everybody's interested in that , and

24:47

thus no one springs to mind

24:49

as I need to tell it , this one

24:52

person about this podcast . But

24:55

when , the more specific the show , the

24:57

more recommendable it really becomes

24:59

.

25:00

I agree , but don't you think ? I think people are scared

25:02

of niching

25:05

too much . They're so scared because they

25:07

don't want to shut people out

25:09

, and I feel like you're exactly right

25:11

. I feel like I often

25:14

say , oh , it's mostly women

25:16

that listen to my podcast . It's something like 98%

25:18

women and then like 2% gay men

25:20

. But it's like sometimes I still

25:23

feel like there's a book I really want to do in

25:25

my book club . Right , that is all about how

25:27

to manifest using your menstrual

25:29

cycle . It's all about periods . But I know

25:31

I've got out of the 3,000

25:34

members , I think I've got about seven men and I'm

25:36

terrified of ostracising them . But

25:38

the reality is this podcast

25:40

is by a single woman who

25:42

is a single mother , who has been

25:44

in very difficult relationships

25:46

, and the more that I talk about that and sometimes I

25:48

still get scared I think , oh , is this putting people off

25:51

that don't have children , that aren't single

25:53

, that aren't women ? You can't be scared

25:55

of that , because you will find your

25:57

people . You'll find your people more and more and

26:00

, like you say people that listen to it , or say my friend

26:02

Deborah is about to go through a divorce . She's

26:04

like doing whatever , I'll recommend

26:06

it to her . And so , yeah , I think

26:08

, even me . I still get scared

26:10

to niche down too much

26:12

and ostracise people . But you have to really

26:14

. And you know what ? The gay men still listen

26:17

. They still listen , they still love it , even

26:19

if I'm talking about periods .

26:23

It's so wild to me . There's seven

26:25

, eight billion people in the world . There

26:27

are millions and millions of people interested

26:29

in almost everything , and

26:32

yet when we're building up our own

26:34

content , we start having this , you

26:37

know belief , pop into our brains that well

26:39

, if it's not applicable to my

26:42

cousin and it's not applicable to

26:44

one of my coworkers , then this probably won't

26:46

be successful . And I think it comes

26:48

from we all used to consume

26:51

media that was approved

26:53

by gatekeepers , that was on TV

26:55

, that was mainstream

26:57

, and when things are mainstream they

27:00

have to be brought appeal . But now

27:02

, when we're in a world of kind of like internet

27:05

abundance , anything can

27:07

be a show . You would never

27:09

have a show on the BBC about the law of

27:11

attraction . You wouldn't have a

27:13

show on you know

27:15

news in the United States

27:17

about rebuilding old land cruisers . Those

27:19

aren't going to exist . But

27:21

as a podcast those can be wildly

27:24

successful because the audience can

27:26

be so much smaller as a percentage

27:29

, because we're reaching such a larger group

27:32

in the world .

27:33

Yeah , no , I love it .

27:35

So a couple of times you've talked about making

27:39

money from your podcast . So

27:41

can you talk and walk

27:43

us through a few of the ways you've

27:46

set your podcast up to make money and

27:49

just teach us anything you can

27:51

about how to start monetizing and turn

27:53

a passion into something we actually

27:55

do full time ?

27:56

I love this because I am like a serial

27:59

entrepreneur at heart , even though half time I don't

28:01

know what I'm doing . So that was the thing . So

28:04

from the beginning , I noticed the numbers were creeping

28:07

up and the podcast was . I think it was number three

28:09

in self development within the first couple of weeks , which

28:11

I was like what and it's been number one

28:13

in the charts pretty much most weeks

28:15

for the last two years . But I wasn't

28:17

making any money from it because , until recently

28:20

, buzzsprout didn't even do their

28:22

advertising , so I was

28:24

making no money from it . So I realized quickly

28:26

that I had to figure out other ways . So I think

28:28

one of the first things that I ever did was

28:30

I created a notebook that

28:32

just said shit , I'm manifesting in 2021

28:35

, and I sold like a thousand of

28:37

them , my God those

28:39

trips to the post office were wild . I was

28:41

literally handwriting the addresses . I was working

28:44

hard , not smart , and

28:47

I just started to sell a few little products . So

28:49

I did notebooks . Then I created these

28:51

manifestation boxes where I basically found

28:53

all these different little things and bits and pieces

28:55

, and I got some worksheets printed and I put them together

28:58

into a box and sent it out as like a little

29:00

subscription box , and I love doing

29:02

that . But all of these things were very labor

29:04

intensive , incredibly labor

29:06

intensive . But again , I was in lockdown

29:09

with newborns . I had nothing else to do so I was like why

29:11

not ? And then I started to really

29:13

hone in on the things that were really working for me . I

29:15

only have one product that I sell

29:17

, like one physical product I sell , which

29:20

is gratitude necklaces , and

29:22

they are different necklaces that say different

29:24

affirmations like love , thankful

29:27

, gratitude , blessed , all these things , and I

29:29

absolutely love them . I've

29:31

now got to a point where I don't do them in my

29:33

kitchen anymore , time lapsing myself wrapping

29:35

them up for content . They're

29:37

in a warehouse and they're all taken care

29:39

of and that's incredible . I'm really proud of those

29:41

. And then I started creating

29:44

digital products , which is where shit got real . So

29:47

my first ever course I

29:49

did was a New

29:51

Year's Day goal setting party , and

29:54

so I discovered lots

29:56

and lots of stuff around

29:58

how to set goals and actually achieve them . Like

30:00

so , many people were mocking the whole New

30:02

Year , new Me type thing and

30:05

you shouldn't mock people that are saying New Year

30:07

, new Me , because these are people that genuinely want to change

30:09

their lives and they have all the best intentions in

30:11

the world to quit these toxic habits

30:13

or quit these toxic relationships , but we

30:15

just don't have the tools to actually

30:18

see it through . And so I was like I have all

30:20

this information , I know how to do this . Why

30:22

don't I share with people what I do ? On January , the first

30:24

? We won't call it a

30:26

course or a workshop , we'll call it

30:29

a party , and I sold tickets

30:31

for £20 . I sold

30:33

£50,000 of tickets and

30:35

it was a three hour party on New Year's

30:37

Day .

30:38

Wow .

30:39

Yes , that was the first thing

30:41

I ever did . Do you know what Every

30:43

single person that did it was like ? It was absolutely

30:46

incredible . They got so much from it , they loved

30:48

it . People still message me now saying we're

30:50

on month six or a month eight . This has

30:52

happened . This has happened . It's been incredible . I'm

30:55

actually in the process of turning that workshop

30:57

into a book so that it's a

30:59

lot more widely accessible for people . I plan

31:02

on doing that workshop every January 1st , because do you know

31:04

what ? That's what I do on January 1st ? I

31:06

sit at home with a glass of rose

31:08

or a bottle and I put ambient

31:10

music on , I intentionally light a candle and

31:12

I plan my year . So I thought , why not share

31:15

it with other people and help other people ? That's

31:17

just a thing . So once I did that

31:19

, I realized , wow , I really can

31:21

share my expertise

31:24

and make money from this . I can start

31:26

to earn a living from this podcast , even if

31:28

it's not directly , like I say , from directly

31:30

from the main podcast . And so

31:33

I started doing that . I've created just a handful

31:35

of workshops . I've done maybe two or three . I did

31:37

one about setting up a side

31:39

hustle , like manifesting your perfect side hustle

31:41

, things like that . Then

31:43

that's when the amazing

31:46

thing happened , which is I started my

31:48

Patreon book club . So

31:50

there is a book called the Magic , which

31:52

is a 28-day manifestation process

31:54

, and I talked about it loads on my

31:56

podcast . I was like , every time I

31:58

do this process , something wild will happen . I'll get

32:00

pregnant , I'll divorce someone , I'll

32:03

move house , like something life-changing

32:05

will happen , like something really big . And so

32:07

many people were like , can we do it with you ? And I just

32:09

I couldn't figure out how I was

32:11

like I don't know how I would facilitate

32:13

that , I don't know how you could do it with me

32:15

. And that's when I discovered the Patreon app

32:17

where people could basically pay a monthly

32:19

subscription and they could do the book

32:21

with me . I would do a podcast every day , keep

32:23

motivation and morale high and keep people

32:25

going . And so that was

32:27

the idea was just to basically

32:30

do this one month and do one book . Well

32:32

, over a thousand people signed up and

32:35

that was the first proper money that

32:37

I had earned since my salon closed

32:39

in lockdown . Like that was the first money that

32:41

I had earned in nearly a year , and

32:44

I now had two newborn babies a six

32:46

year old , and I was just . I didn't know what to do

32:48

and I saw it and people got so much

32:50

from it and not only people . I

32:52

got so much from it . Having that accountability

32:55

of I have to do this because this is my

32:57

job . I have to keep up with it . We're

33:00

now 25 books in . I've been doing it for 25

33:02

months . We now have over

33:04

3000 members and

33:07

it's incredible , it's absolutely incredible

33:09

the transformations that people have

33:12

had from that book club . It's

33:14

truly life changing , like I say not just for them but

33:16

for me as well , and that is really like my

33:18

bread and butter , that is like my main

33:20

income , that's what I spend

33:22

. Probably I'd say 80% of

33:24

my working time I spend on that

33:26

. And it would be really tempting , with

33:29

each book , just to , at the beginning of the month

33:31

, back to record all of the podcast episodes

33:33

and just do it . But I don't . I

33:35

really live the book , I embody

33:38

it . I do the processes Because otherwise

33:40

you can't really say this

33:43

book's gonna change your life and then

33:45

if your life isn't changing , it

33:47

won't take that long before people are like she's

33:50

just recording episodes and just like

33:52

she's not actually doing it , like what in her life has changed

33:54

. But I think the reason people resonate with me is because

33:56

they've seen me go from

33:58

literally being a single

34:00

mum of three young children . I mean , when I first started this

34:02

I was pregnant and I genuinely didn't know

34:05

how I was gonna afford to do

34:07

anything . I didn't know how I was gonna afford to live a normal

34:09

life again . I lost my business . I'd lost

34:11

everything pretty much . I didn't even know if

34:13

I was gonna be able to keep my house . And now , through

34:16

25 , 26 books , we

34:18

have worked on mindset , we've worked

34:20

on wealth , we've done a lot

34:22

of work with wealth , we've done a lot of work with basically

34:24

all aspects of self development , and people can see

34:27

that I now am richer than I've ever been

34:29

, I'm happier than I've ever been , I'm

34:31

thriving , I'm traveling

34:33

, I've got three children on my own . I'm bloody

34:35

doing it , man , I'm living proof . And I think that's

34:37

what people wanna see is . They like to see the transformation

34:40

and then they get on board with it . I

34:42

don't even have to really sell the book club . People see

34:44

it and they see what I'm doing every month and they're like

34:46

I want a part of that . I want my life to glow

34:49

up and then here we are .

34:52

One of the threads I keep seeing through all

34:54

of these different ways you've monetized from the

34:56

book club to the physical products , to

34:58

the courses , to the New Year's Day party

35:01

all of them are

35:03

that you have a very specific audience

35:05

, that you have put

35:07

something out into the world and said here's

35:10

what I wanna be interested in . I'm into this law

35:12

of attraction . I think that this would be

35:14

really good for your life and

35:16

the people who are interested in that find

35:18

you . And then you say , okay

35:21

, we've now built a community

35:23

around a specific idea , and

35:27

then so this makes sense for us all to

35:30

have the same workbook or the same

35:32

journal , or

35:34

the type of jewelry that I would like is actually the

35:36

type of jewelry you like . You've created

35:38

a validated audience that

35:40

you know things that

35:42

they will probably find valuable

35:44

. And so when you start posting

35:47

things like hey , we're gonna try a book club

35:49

that you can actually get a thousand people

35:51

to join . If I started a book club right

35:53

now , I have not built

35:55

a community around books or around a specific

35:58

topic , and so the chances that I would

36:00

get a thousand people to sign up is zero

36:02

. And so I love how kind

36:05

of building the podcast and building the Instagram

36:07

community , have really

36:09

easily moved right

36:12

in to monetizing all

36:14

of this audience .

36:15

Yeah , and I think that that only works if

36:17

the community is genuine , and

36:20

I think that there's a million books out there and

36:22

there's a million posts on how to build a community

36:24

. But , you can only build

36:26

a community if your intentions are pure . When I started

36:28

this , I was finding lockdown hard and

36:31

I just thought I do know tools to help get

36:33

myself out of this . I'm sure this could help other people

36:35

too , and I think it's through genuinely

36:37

wanting to help other people , especially people that are

36:39

similar to , maybe , single mothers , people in the same

36:41

situation . I think that is what genuinely

36:44

builds a community . And

36:46

do you know what ? The community , especially the book club

36:48

community , are incredible . There's a woman that recently

36:50

, whilst doing one of the books , realized I

36:52

need to leave my husband Like this is a really toxic

36:55

relationship . I need to get out with my children . The

36:57

book club members fundraised

36:59

over $3,000 to help

37:01

her leave her husband and to get out and to go

37:03

to a thing . And there's people that can't afford

37:06

the book one particular month . Other people will say

37:08

give me your address , I'll send you a book , I'll

37:10

buy it on Amazon and I'll send it to you . That is

37:12

the kind of people you know I do in the name of the book

37:14

club , which is that's what we call ourselves the book

37:16

club bitches . I do a charity

37:18

donation every single month to a different

37:20

charity . That kind of resonates with whatever we're doing

37:22

. That is the kind of community that we've

37:25

built and I think a part of that is

37:27

you have to be really real and

37:29

honest and I have been through

37:31

a goddamn journey with these people

37:33

and I think because particularly the

37:35

Patreon it's behind a paywall you feel like

37:37

you can be a little bit more honest with people

37:39

and you know people have seen me cry

37:41

and be genuinely like devastated

37:44

, to go through the hardest of times and I think if

37:46

you're honest with people and you're not just sitting

37:49

there saying , if you do these 10 tips , you can

37:51

have a yacht this time next year , you can

37:53

buy a dream house . I'm not saying that Sometimes I'll

37:55

say this shit is not working for me . I

37:57

feel really down . This hasn't worked . This is

37:59

where my life is going badly , this is where it's going

38:01

well . People respect that , but

38:03

that has to be a two-way thing and I

38:06

respect them as well . I will never

38:08

sell something that I don't feel

38:10

is genuine or good

38:12

for them . I'm not gonna suddenly start

38:14

doing really high priced

38:17

. I don't know things I don't believe in . I just

38:19

don't Even down to the things that I do

38:21

affiliate marketing with . The only things

38:23

I promote are things like Hello Fresh , which I genuinely

38:25

think have taught me to cook and help me to

38:28

improve my health , and

38:30

these vitamins that call better you , that

38:32

are like oral sprays , because I've got Crohn's disease

38:34

and I can't digest vitamins through

38:36

my stomach . It's the whole thing . It's like things

38:38

that I'd see them and I'm like that would really

38:40

help people . You're never gonna find me

38:43

doing an advert for vaping

38:46

. Do you know what I mean ? It doesn't matter how much money it

38:48

is , I just won't . So I think that

38:50

respect goes two ways . If you respect your

38:52

community , they will thank you forever

38:54

and they will pay for things and they will

38:56

be happy to be a part of it . But

38:59

that respect goes both ways . I have to respect them as well

39:01

and not ever try and push something that I don't

39:03

believe is good for them .

39:05

Yeah , I think that is so important . I mean , we've

39:07

seen in podcasting people

39:10

who do kind of go on this fake journey for

39:12

a bit . You can't really keep that

39:14

up a whole long time . You know , if you're doing

39:16

45 minute episodes every week , you

39:19

can only keep that facade up for some amount of time

39:21

. After a few months

39:23

it's gonna show through . Okay

39:26

, that's not really who this person is . They're

39:29

telling me to buy this thing , but it

39:31

doesn't even look like they're actually using the thing they're

39:33

telling me to buy . Or they're recommending

39:36

a course on how to

39:38

do a particular thing , start a YouTube

39:40

channel , but they don't even have a YouTube channel

39:43

and all of the

39:45

kind of . Just the fakeness

39:47

starts to really show

39:49

through and what you end up with

39:52

is an audience that's churning through

39:54

pretty quickly . You might be getting a lot of new people

39:56

, but as soon as people kind of see

39:58

through the lies , they just move on and they go . Okay

40:00

, this was all a scam the whole

40:02

time . It's much better to

40:05

really be living than

40:07

telling authentically , like here's what I'm

40:09

interested in and trying to teach . When

40:11

you're doing that , you're going to attract people and then

40:14

they will not end up leaving

40:16

to go somewhere else .

40:18

Well , I think that's what is the power

40:20

behind sort of like micro-influences

40:22

, and I only realized this recently

40:24

how much more powerful you are

40:26

as a micro-influencer if your following

40:29

is engaged and loyal . So we

40:31

all know like the Kardashians are really big celebrities

40:34

that will promote this , that and the other , and

40:36

actually I bet their follow through rate like

40:38

is really low compared

40:40

to you know , because people are just like , oh

40:42

, they're selling another thing . And I realized this when

40:44

I had a really , really big guest on my

40:46

podcast . She had that 1.2

40:48

million followers and in my mind I was

40:51

like , oh my God , if even 1%

40:53

of her followers listened to the podcast , and

40:55

then my numbers would be bigger

40:57

than ever , and even if 1% of that 1%

40:59

joined my book club , I'd be a bloody millionaire

41:02

. And actually , what happened ? Nothing

41:04

. Having that person on my podcast with

41:06

1.2 million followers , I had no

41:08

higher engagement than normal . I had

41:10

no higher sales

41:12

than normal . Nothing happened . And I realized

41:15

that's because the people that follow someone

41:17

that's been on reality TV or someone that's

41:19

, you know , Kim Kardashian . I think I might follow Kim

41:21

Kardashian . Am I super invested in everything

41:23

she says and would I buy everything that she promotes ? Hell

41:26

no . But if I'm following a small podcaster

41:28

, you know I can think of several podcasters

41:31

I follow who are , you know , under

41:33

100,000 followers . If

41:35

they suggest something , I'll probably

41:37

go and buy it , because there is just that real

41:40

connection , and I'm already thinking . There's a podcast

41:42

called Nachbut . There are several things

41:44

that she has recommended that I've gone and bought

41:46

. She's got like 26,000 followers on Instagram

41:49

and I think that that is a lot more powerful

41:51

than someone like Kim Kardashian doing a sponsored

41:53

post . How many people really click through

41:55

? I don't know .

41:57

Yeah , I mean what you're hitting on there is we

41:59

follow people for different reasons . So

42:01

there's some people that I , you know you

42:03

may follow just because they were

42:06

kind of wild on that reality

42:08

show you watched and you're just kind of like

42:10

watching the drama . You're

42:12

not actually listening to what they have to say about

42:14

the world . There's people you may follow

42:16

because they're really attractive

42:19

, and so you're just trying to see what

42:21

tips they have for being attractive . And

42:24

then there's other people you're paying attention to because

42:26

you know they have excellent taste in

42:28

books or they're really

42:30

really good at something you're trying to learn , and

42:33

those are the people who are going to have influence over

42:35

purchasing decisions . And

42:38

so again , this kind of comes back once

42:40

again to picking the

42:42

right niche , the right thing for you to talk

42:45

about with a podcast or any other . Creation

42:47

really allows

42:50

you , opens up a lot of doors later

42:52

on because you really identified an

42:54

audience that you want to speak to .

42:56

Yeah , that's true .

42:58

One of the things . I don't know how

43:00

comfortable you are with this , so you feel free to shut

43:02

it down and we can edit it out . Of

43:05

all of the different areas

43:08

that you have monetized , can

43:10

you talk a little bit maybe not in exact

43:12

numbers , but like order of magnitude which

43:14

of these have been most successful and which of them

43:17

have been ? It's nice

43:19

that you set it up , but they're not the

43:21

main drivers of income .

43:24

So one of the books we did actually

43:26

was called the

43:28

One Thing , and it was all about how we dilute

43:31

our energy and our focus over things , whereas if

43:33

you actually look , quite often one thing will

43:35

earn , say , 80% of your income or 80%

43:37

of your results . And so in the process

43:40

of doing that book , I was like , right , I need to re-look

43:42

at things , and I found that I was spending

43:45

a lot of time creating content around my gratitude

43:47

necklaces , whereas in reality my gratitude necklaces

43:50

probably make me 800

43:52

pound , a thousand pound a month , whereas

43:54

my book club is like my real

43:56

, that is my main thing . That was earning

43:59

me . I mean , right now I think it earns me 27,000

44:01

pounds a month .

44:02

And that's on a consistent basis .

44:04

It's been over 20,000 pounds a month for over

44:06

a year now . So that is my

44:08

real , my

44:10

main focus , my main priority , because it's very

44:12

consistent and I think that that speaks

44:14

for itself , that of course , people are always coming and going

44:16

, but there's a real , constant fan

44:19

base there . There's constant members that

44:21

are not leaving because they're seeing the changes

44:23

in their lives and it

44:25

is a real . You know what ? It's such

44:27

a bloody genius idea , even if I do say so myself

44:29

, because everybody wants to read books

44:32

, right , and it's a very different hobby . One

44:34

hobby is buying books . It's a completely different hobby

44:36

to actually read the books and to do them

44:38

. You know , they're two completely different things . And so

44:40

many people have good intentions that they want to

44:42

read a self-development book , but

44:44

we just don't . And I was included . I didn't . I said

44:47

I've got three young children , I haven't got time to read a book . So

44:49

, finding something that will

44:51

capture people's imagination and

44:53

they want to listen to the podcast , they want to

44:55

be entertained , and so they will keep up with the book because

44:58

they want to keep on with it it's bloody

45:00

genius . It's genius and it works . So that

45:02

really speaks for itself . But

45:04

then , yeah , things like the Goals Workshop . That

45:07

was incredible to do 50,000 , I think I

45:09

earned 50,000 pounds . That was in like one month

45:11

. I released it two or three weeks before

45:13

I actually did it . So that was incredible . But

45:16

that's really like a one-off thing . It would

45:18

have been really tempting to do a new course every

45:20

two or three months , but I don't want to do that

45:22

Unless I feel called to talk about something

45:25

. I'm not going to do it just for the sake of

45:27

it . So the courses are incredible . Something

45:29

that I released recently is

45:32

subliminal audios . So this

45:34

has gone wild , right See

45:36

? Have you heard about subliminals ?

45:38

No .

45:39

Oh man , this is going to change a lot .

45:40

Are these like the tapes that you could get

45:43

in the 90s on , like it would talk to you

45:45

while you slept so that you could lose weight or quit

45:47

smoking ?

45:48

Yes , yes , but they were affirmations

45:50

. But do you know what they worked ? They

45:52

actually do work . There's a lot of scientific

45:54

evidence behind them . Google evidence

45:57

of subliminals . Do you know ? There are huge companies

45:59

. I think Apple used subliminals , mcdonald's

46:03

used them in that advertising . There's quite a few . If

46:06

you Google it , there's a lot of big , big

46:08

brands that use them . It's illegal

46:10

in certain countries to use them in adverts

46:12

now , but people do so . Basically

46:15

, they're audios that are an hour long

46:17

and you can either hear the affirmations

46:20

or you can have them subliminal , which is that

46:22

the music is higher and you can't actually

46:24

really hear them with , like , the naked

46:26

ear , but they're going in subconsciously and

46:28

I have them on creating

46:31

wealth , perfect health , fertility

46:33

, finding your soulmate

46:36

, happiness , success , all these

46:38

different things . I've even got them for children to feel confident

46:40

at school and be be well behaved

46:42

, like going to bed eating their greens or that

46:44

shit that you want your children to do . And do you

46:46

know what I released those ? They've gone wild

46:48

. They've sold . They sell about 20,000

46:51

pounds a month and they are three pounds

46:53

each .

46:54

You do the maths .

46:55

That's 20,000 pound a month and they

46:57

are literally I can't actually work that out , but it's a

47:00

lot of subliminals and that , again

47:02

, is one of those things where number one , I

47:04

wouldn't sell them if I genuinely didn't think

47:06

that they worked and I didn't use them myself . Number

47:09

two , the people are

47:11

the best advertising . The people that buy

47:13

them are my best advertising . I get messages

47:15

every single day saying you won't bloody

47:17

believe it . I bought your wealth subliminal . The other

47:19

day . I've been listening to it every night . Today I got

47:21

a pay rise , or today I came into whatever

47:24

, I came up with a business idea and I'm now

47:26

you know whatever , and so I just

47:28

screenshot them . I make them anonymous , so

47:30

I get rid of their name and whatever in their profile picture

47:32

and I repost them on my stories with the

47:34

link to it and

47:38

the testimonials sell them . I

47:40

don't have to market them , I don't have to pay

47:42

for advertising . I don't have to do any of that stuff because the

47:45

results speak for themselves . So that has been

47:47

an unexpected hit . I

47:49

love them .

47:51

That's incredible . One of

47:53

the ways we I mean the way we got connected

47:55

is that you also started using BuzzFraher

47:57

ads a few weeks ago and

47:59

quickly became . You

48:02

definitely popped up on our radar once we started doing

48:04

a payouts to your PayPal address

48:06

. So can you tell us a little bit

48:08

about how you've used BuzzFraher

48:10

ads ?

48:12

Yes . So when I discovered that they

48:14

had started that , I was like oh

48:16

my God . Finally , because

48:18

I have tried to get advertising on the podcast

48:20

for the longest of time , with

48:23

varying degrees of success . So I have people

48:25

email me and then it's a whole thing

48:27

backwards and forwards how much they're going to charge . It's

48:29

just a whole thing . I've tried that thing

48:32

pod corn . It's just a ball

48:34

lake . It's great for people that have the time . I

48:36

personally don't have the time for all of that . What I

48:38

loved about BuzzFraher ads is that they

48:41

just get inserted in it's dynamic content . I

48:43

don't have to do a goddamn thing . All I have to do

48:45

is approve the adverts and say if they fit

48:47

with my audience or not . So I

48:49

absolutely love it . And then they just

48:51

pay you , which is great , it's true passive

48:54

income . So I'm here for it . I

48:56

did have one or two people message saying oh

48:59

, I really hate that you have an advert in

49:01

the middle of your podcast and it's like you know what ? I'm

49:03

creating all of this for free . So if

49:05

you are watching ITV and you're watching

49:07

Love Island or something , you would have

49:10

to sit through adverts . So if you are not willing

49:12

to support a single mum creating this content for

49:14

free for you and you don't want to listen to a 30 second advert

49:16

, shame on you . So

49:19

, yeah , we've got past that , though

49:21

. Now People are used to them now and

49:23

, yeah , I absolutely love them . I think it's a great idea . But I was

49:25

saying to Marshall , I do think it

49:28

needs to be not other podcasts advertising

49:30

, it needs to be brands Like

49:33

imagine if you started to get brands

49:36

small businesses , big businesses advertising

49:38

you would be away . You and me would be on

49:40

a yacht in Ibiza .

49:43

There . Maybe by the time this

49:46

video is out , there will be brands in your

49:48

bus for ads . So that is absolutely

49:51

the plan for the future .

49:53

I'm so excited he keeps promising it . I'm

49:55

waiting for it .

49:58

Can you , can you tell me a little bit about the

50:01

actual workflow that you're using for bus for

50:03

ads ?

50:04

What have I got to share my secrets on how I'm the top

50:06

earner ? So

50:08

, yeah , when they first started , I got a little

50:10

bit obsessed with it and I just keep

50:13

a tab open , yeah , on my browser

50:15

and just every single time . And you have , I would check

50:17

it like twice a day and every time a

50:19

new advert came up I would check it and I would

50:21

just accept it , because I think obviously a

50:23

lot of the advertisers were podcasts

50:25

or maybe people with quite small budgets

50:27

. So I quickly realized that if I'm one of

50:29

the first people to click on it , I'm

50:32

going to be the person that gets those ads because their

50:34

budget is going to be gone in a certain number of days

50:36

. So I was quite like I

50:38

was . I was hot on like clicking yes

50:40

, please , online . And

50:43

yeah , I think by the second month I don't $5,000

50:45

in advertising , which was incredible , to go

50:48

from absolutely nothing . I think the first month was like

50:50

$1,500 . You know , $1,500

50:53

. That's not far off what I was earning in

50:55

my first full time job , you know , 10

50:57

years ago when I started work . So that

50:59

is not a small amount of money . And then , yeah , it went up to $5,000

51:01

and hopefully it will just continue to grow .

51:05

Yeah , you mentioned a second

51:08

ago about trying to work

51:10

out advertising yourself , and

51:12

so one of the things that a lot

51:14

of people are often weighing is when

51:17

you do the advertisements all yourself , you

51:19

source them , you go back and forth , you do a host read

51:21

ad , you bake it into the episode

51:23

, you can often get a

51:25

higher CPM the actual amount

51:28

paid per thousand listeners but

51:30

you trade that off with , obviously , the

51:32

work spent sourcing those

51:35

ads . How have you managed

51:38

that trade off ?

51:40

It is an absolute nightmare

51:42

. Do you know what ? I actually even hired a

51:44

professional to try and get me sponsorship

51:46

for the podcast and she failed . She

51:49

didn't get it . She did not get it . We could

51:51

not find there's something about my podcast

51:53

that , like I don't seem to get people

51:56

wanting to sponsor or help . I

51:58

don't know . We just found it really , really difficult . They

52:00

want to know your engagement rates , they want to know this , they

52:02

want to know that it wasn't worth the

52:04

amount of work for a one

52:06

or two episode deal , what for me to record

52:08

to show that it's

52:10

just not worth it . So I

52:12

kind of gave up and my kind of midway

52:15

thing was that I teamed up with a couple

52:17

of brands to do affiliate marketing , and one of them

52:19

was with you guys . If I recommend Buzzsprout

52:21

, I get I think it's $15 or 15 pounds

52:23

, which is amazing Because , again , it's one

52:26

of those things that I would naturally recommend . I

52:28

talk all the time about . If you want to start a podcast , use

52:30

Buzzsprout . Like I'm an idiot and I managed to

52:32

figure it out in my little 10 year old laptop

52:34

, so you should be able to do it too . So

52:37

I did it with Buzzsprout , I do it with Hello Fresh

52:39

, I do it with this other

52:42

company that does vitamins

52:44

, and that's a really easy way to do it . So

52:46

with Buzzsprout you can insert dynamic

52:48

content . So I make a pre-roll and a post-roll

52:51

. Don't know why you don't have a mid-roll , don't know , but

52:53

I don't know if that's coming . But

52:55

I created Adverts one time

52:57

on there that were for my not my own

52:59

brand , but they were for these companies that

53:02

I'd have affiliate marketing with . Then I would put

53:04

a link in the show notes down below and

53:06

I would earn a decent amount of money from that . You

53:08

know I did that with Hello Fresh and I would earn about 700

53:10

pounds a month from doing that . So that was a great

53:13

kind of midway solution until

53:15

Buzzsprout ads came up . And

53:18

I still do use those . I still do use the

53:20

pre-roll and the post-roll for both those

53:23

affiliate marketing things but also for my own things

53:25

. You know , if I'm , I have a workshop

53:27

that's a manifesting money workshop . I

53:29

have a whole spoken advert

53:31

for that and I sometimes will put that as my pre-roll

53:34

for a couple of weeks and , yeah , I

53:36

see results from it .

53:38

Yeah , the nice thing about using dynamic content

53:40

over baking things into episodes is

53:42

back catalogs account

53:45

for a lot of podcasts over

53:47

half of their downloads .

53:49

Yeah .

53:50

And so if you're going to just say , hey

53:52

, I'm going to do this course next

53:54

week , well , that isn't

53:56

accurate for half of the people who ever listened

53:59

to it , because they're listening to an episode

54:01

from two years ago and maybe it is something

54:03

they'd be interested in . But now they realize

54:05

, oh , I've missed out on this

54:07

opportunity . When you're using dynamic

54:10

content , especially when you're talking about timely

54:12

things or advertisements

54:14

, you can update the rates

54:16

as your podcast changes sizes

54:18

and you can let people know

54:21

this is happening now . So

54:23

, no matter when you listen to this , it is

54:25

true like this course is happening

54:28

next week .

54:29

Yeah , and I think it stops your old episodes

54:31

from feeling dated . I think if you do have

54:33

an advert that's like it's 2021

54:36

next week , so we've got a new year's deal

54:38

for you , like nah , it just makes it

54:40

feel super dated . So , yeah , I think dynamic content

54:43

is the way forward . For that reason , but also

54:45

just because , yeah , the sheer work

54:47

involved . I don't have the time to be

54:49

going backwards and forwards and negotiating with people

54:51

recording an advert . Do

54:53

they like it , do they not ? I ain't got time for

54:55

that . Insert that stuff in . Don't

54:58

let me know , give me the money .

55:03

Oh man , fritz , this has been an awesome interview

55:05

. I know that we're kind of coming up on . The end of your time

55:08

is before we go . Is there anything

55:10

, any advice you would give to a new podcast

55:12

or somebody starting to create things online ?

55:15

I would just say number one use Buzzsprout

55:17

, because it honestly is that I genuinely

55:20

touch wood . I've never had a

55:22

technical issue with Buzzsprout ever

55:24

in my life and I deal with

55:26

a lot of apps and technical difficulties

55:29

. My whole website has just gone down , so it's like to

55:31

never have a technical issue . That

55:33

is absolutely incredible . That's why I recommend it all

55:35

the time . But use

55:37

somewhere like that . Use the advertising

55:39

, use the dynamic content things and , like

55:41

I say , if you don't have sponsors for the show , there are

55:43

ways around it . You can start to earn even

55:46

a small income by doing affiliate

55:48

links , creating your own pre and

55:50

post role things . Create

55:52

a podcast about something you're passionate about , because

55:55

anything's exciting for the first

55:57

week , the first three weeks . But

55:59

you need to have something that when you are

56:02

on your deathbed and you're really ill or

56:04

you've just got back from a three day bender

56:06

in Ibethrin , you just want to sleep . You've got to have

56:08

something that you really want to talk

56:11

about and it makes you get out of bed and record

56:13

every single week , because if you're consistent

56:16

over a period of time , it will

56:18

be successful . It will be . You have to believe it

56:20

will and it will . So as

56:22

long as you've got the belief and the consistency

56:24

, buzzsprout is the perfect partner

56:26

to take you there , because

56:29

without that , like you say , the distribution

56:31

, I could never get it out there . And don't

56:33

think that by DIYing it at home on

56:35

your own it's ever going to hold you back , because look at me

56:37

, number one in the UK for self development

56:39

pretty much every week , and it's just me

56:41

at home doing it with my 60 pound microphone

56:44

on a 10 year old laptop . Look at

56:46

me living my life .

56:47

What am I doing ? So ? Yeah

56:49

, just do it . You don't know how much

56:52

joy it brings me to hear you

56:54

say all that , but also that you are using the Samsung

56:56

Q2U , which we talk about all the time

56:58

. So many people . They

57:00

use the lack of specific

57:03

tech to be the explanation

57:05

for oh , this is why I'm being held back , when

57:07

really so many

57:09

of the top podcasters are using

57:11

really basic

57:14

and cheap and inexpensive tech . All

57:16

the stuff , the microphone I'm using right

57:19

now . This stuff is more expensive

57:21

but it's not needed , so

57:23

I love that you're doing it with the $60 microphone

57:26

and the 10 year old laptop . That's incredible .

57:28

Do you know what ? I'm such a technophobe ? I

57:30

have a brand new MacBook that I'm using right now

57:32

, but I can't switch from my 10 year old

57:34

. I can't . I can't because I'm such a technophobe

57:37

, so because you guys told me to buy this microphone

57:39

, that's what I'm doing . I'm still using it two years

57:41

on . But that is genuinely what

57:43

I loved about it is . It's so easy

57:45

to give up when you hit a thing

57:48

in the road where you're like , oh , I can't figure this

57:50

out , I can't do it . But you

57:52

guys did genuinely make it so easy

57:54

for me and I was saying that to Marshall , like I'm so , so

57:56

thankful because without you lot , I couldn't

57:58

have done this and it has truly changed my life

58:00

. So anyone listening can

58:03

do this as well . You don't need a studio

58:05

, you don't need anything . You can just do this

58:07

from home . And , yeah , do

58:09

it and use my referral code . Put it in

58:11

the link .

58:14

We'll do it . If you're watching this on YouTube

58:16

or you're listening to the podcast , we

58:18

will put your referral link down .

58:20

Oh my God , will you ? Yes , oh

58:22

my God , let's see how many I get . This is interest

58:24

, oh this is great

58:28

.

58:28

Thank you so much for coming on and chatting , podcasting

58:31

and creating and just

58:34

everything , for being really open , also

58:36

about the monetization . I think that's

58:39

an area that's really nerve

58:41

wracking for a lot of new podcasters , because

58:43

we see some of the big shows doing

58:45

it and we know early

58:48

on like it's hard to figure

58:51

out . What does this look like for me in the future ? Can

58:54

I ever quit my job ? Can I ever take

58:56

this full time ? So thank you so much for all

58:58

of the advice and everything you gave us today

59:00

.

59:00

Thank you . Actually , do you know what one thing I've

59:02

just remembered is ? I remember in your series of videos

59:05

where you are like how to start a podcast

59:07

, one of the things that I never forget this you said never

59:10

start a podcast if you want to use

59:12

it to earn money and like make

59:14

it your job , because the vast majority of people

59:16

don't . And guess what bitches I

59:18

have .

59:20

I always remember that .

59:21

You're really wrong .

59:21

Yeah , there's

59:25

too many people who get it , who

59:27

have been sold a course on

59:30

starting a podcast that claims

59:32

day one you'll be monetizing , and

59:35

I just can't help to

59:38

. I can't accept telling

59:40

somebody something that may not be true for them . And

59:42

so to promise somebody , hey

59:44

, go ahead and do this , you'll be able to quit your

59:46

job , it's just dishonest

59:49

, yeah . But what is true is creating

59:51

anything , even if it's for a small audience

59:53

, is good for your soul , like

59:56

it's good for you to be creating things and

59:58

to put it in your voice out into the world

1:00:00

. Even if it's just for

1:00:02

you to learn what is meaningful

1:00:05

to me and to be working on

1:00:07

it , that is still valuable , even

1:00:10

if it doesn't turn into hundreds

1:00:12

of thousands of dollars a year .

1:00:14

So it doesn't have to be your job . It could , like you say , it

1:00:16

can just be your passion . You know , we did a book called Working

1:00:19

Hard Hardly Working by Grace Beverly and she says

1:00:21

that your income

1:00:23

doesn't have to be related to your passion

1:00:26

and actually you can work your micro passions

1:00:28

into your income . So say , for example

1:00:30

, if you had a pet shop , right

1:00:33

, and that's your living , it's been in your

1:00:35

family for three generations and that's how you earn

1:00:37

your income , you really can't quit it . But you

1:00:39

love podcasting or you love whatever , there's

1:00:41

nothing to stop you working micro passions into

1:00:43

that existing job . So you could say to your boss

1:00:46

or whatever you could say how do you feel about me starting

1:00:48

a podcast about working in a pet shop and about

1:00:50

all the different pets ? we have and about do you know what I mean ? Special

1:00:52

animal care , or you could start YouTube shorts

1:00:54

on that . So yeah , like you say , you don't have

1:00:56

to turn this into your living . You can always

1:00:59

insert your little micro passions into your existing

1:01:01

job . It's basically for anyone . It's

1:01:03

just try it . It's a great laugh .

1:01:07

Thank you so much for spending this time with us . I really

1:01:09

appreciate it and hope that

1:01:12

everyone who watches this just gets as much as I

1:01:14

did . So thank you so much .

1:01:16

Yes , thank you , thank

1:01:18

you .