0:06

I need your help today. We are going to get personal

0:08

with the radio backyard fence during this

0:10

hour. I received an email about a week

0:12

ago and as I read it, I knew I

0:14

wanted to bring this to our table.

0:17

I want to get your response and see if you've

0:19

ever been through something like

0:21

this. So as you respond

0:23

today, remember your story might be used to help

0:25

someone else who is right smack dab in the middle

0:28

of a loss. Season

0:30

of anger, of grief, struggle,

0:33

whatever you want to call it. And your perspective

0:36

could bridge the gap between where they are

0:38

and what God wants them to see about

0:41

where they are. It's coming up straight ahead on

0:43

Chris Fabry live. Welcome to the program. From the

0:45

heart to the heart for the heart. Our team

0:47

includes, but is not limited to Ryan McConaughey

0:49

doing all things technical. Trisha, our producer

0:52

in Chattanooga today game is

0:54

in the chair answering your calls.

0:56

Lynn. And since it's Friday,

0:58

that's right. It's time for the fabulous February

1:01

Friday. Sigh. Here's what it does one. We oxygenate

1:03

your blood. Two we get your endorphins

1:06

going. Three we raise your serotonin

1:08

level. Four we promote lymphatic

1:10

drainage. In five we stimulate your parasympathetic

1:13

system. That's why we call it the five lung languages.

1:16

We also stimulate your vagus nerve.

1:18

We help you release acetylcholine.

1:20

And don't you dare forget what it does to cortisol

1:23

dissipation. Taking four seconds of

1:25

air through your nose right now. Hold it

1:27

for seconds. And then as you release

1:29

that air through your mouth, push on the left

1:31

side of your ribcage to get rid of all that bad

1:33

carbon dioxide. Let's give

1:35

a march madness side today. Oh, the hopes

1:37

and dreams of the smaller schools against the

1:39

top seeds. Oh, the plans of the big schools

1:42

like Kentucky, who lost to

1:44

Oakland, whose coach has labored

1:46

and believed for 40 years

1:49

this size, for all who compete on

1:51

that stage. And it's for you as well.

1:53

If you've been through a situation where you lost

1:55

something good, something you felt called

1:57

to do, and then it was taken away and you

1:59

dealt with anger inside, give

2:02

a sigh today for the process, the good process

2:04

and the season that you are in.

2:06

There's something for your soul in

2:08

the rubble of your hopes and dreams,

2:11

and we'll hear about it straight ahead.

2:14

Did you hear The Michaels yesterday? We

2:17

were all in the same studio about

2:19

a week ago, and we recorded this,

2:21

and it was just so much fun. I hope that comes

2:23

through every time we had them on

2:25

and Tricia came in, she took some video

2:28

of the three of us, and

2:30

Ryan put together a back fence post

2:32

for people who are partners

2:34

of this program. We send that video

2:37

out every Thursday. It's not always

2:39

the two Michaels and me, but yesterday

2:41

it was. And I'm getting good response

2:43

from partners who say, well, it's great

2:46

to see you, U3 in action to see what

2:48

you really look like. And we have some still photos

2:50

in there too. If you want to become

2:52

a back fence partner and receive the back

2:54

fence post, give a gift

2:56

of any size each month and

2:59

you'll receive the video. You'll get a signed copy

3:01

of a novel. I wrote The Promise to Jesse

3:03

Woods, and you'll also be able

3:05

to receive our thank you each month

3:08

if you want to receive Glennon

3:11

Marshall's excellent book, Memorizing

3:13

Scripture and you're a partner with us, you

3:15

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3:17

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give a single gift and receive that.

3:22

Memorizing scripture. But hurry, March

3:24

is ending. Have I told you that yet? Next

3:26

Friday is the last Friday of the month.

3:28

Can you believe it? Here's how to

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get in touch with us. Just to send your dog

3:33

around Chris Fabry live.org.

3:36

Chris Fabry live. Org

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3:52

Friend. Partner. Thank you for

3:54

getting in touch with us and for the encouragement

3:57

that you give. We've

3:59

had some really good conversations this week,

4:01

but something has been rolling around my soul

4:04

as we hurtled toward Holy Week.

4:06

I got an email from a radio friend

4:09

and I'm going to keep him anonymous.

4:11

He works at a. I'll give you a hint.

4:13

He works at a terrestrial radio station

4:16

somewhere in the contiguous United States of

4:18

America. That's all I'm saying. He.

4:21

In this email, he compared me to another

4:23

radio personality and

4:26

he said some really encouraging things, including

4:28

that he thinks I have a gift of

4:31

radio hospitality,

4:33

which I'd never heard before. And

4:35

he also said broadcasting

4:37

Hyuga. If you know what that

4:39

term means, that Danish term

4:42

means it will make sense. And that was really

4:44

nice. And then he said

4:46

this. One last

4:48

thing. For a long time

4:50

I was mad at you. And

4:53

I had to go back, as it did for

4:55

a long time. What did I do? I

4:58

tried to think what I did, so

5:00

I kept reading and I will today.

5:03

For a long time. I was mad at you.

5:05

You didn't know it. But that's

5:07

a good thing. See, when

5:09

I began working at this

5:11

particular station, I took over in

5:13

the afternoons with music, which I love

5:15

to do, trying to blend a song and a spiritual

5:18

thought through the afternoon hours.

5:20

It seemed only moments before they

5:22

said there was a change in programming, and there

5:25

was a live talk show in the afternoon.

5:27

They were going to air two

5:29

hours at the time. Two

5:31

precious hours of my music and

5:33

thoughts that I loved,

5:36

only to be relegated

5:38

in quotes, relegated

5:41

to breaks. Meaning,

5:43

you know, when we go to a break, then

5:45

he could he could talk, give

5:48

information or whatever. It's just

5:50

a short time. I

5:52

was not happy not being able to

5:54

do what I felt I was called to

5:56

do at the time. Now,

5:58

let me stop right there. And I

6:00

want you to think about a change

6:02

in your life and interruption in your

6:05

life. Maybe it was something at work

6:07

that you thought was going to be there for a long time,

6:10

something that got you up in the morning.

6:12

It's like, hey, I can't wait to do. You know, this is

6:14

the highlight of my day. I really like doing this.

6:16

You anticipate what might happen.

6:19

You want to do a really good job

6:21

at that and you excel

6:23

at that. Ever

6:26

have that taken away from you? How'd

6:28

you handle it? Maybe a responsibility

6:31

at church. And you were

6:34

relieved of your duties for one

6:36

reason or another. Or

6:38

in a family situation. The

6:41

underlying response is

6:43

I'm angry. And

6:45

ultimately, you know, if God

6:48

really is in control, you know,

6:50

he's he's part of the equation

6:52

at least. So?

6:55

So hold that in your heart for just a minute.

6:57

Have you ever been in a situation like that? My

6:59

friend continues. I

7:01

stayed at the station and

7:03

I'm so thankful I did, as

7:05

I've learned a lot about keeping doing

7:08

the hard thing because

7:10

it's what you're called to do, even

7:12

if the reasons you thought

7:14

you started for are no longer

7:17

there. So

7:19

he he stayed at the stage. He sounds

7:21

like he thought about leaving.

7:23

He's like, no, this is not what I signed up for.

7:27

But that phrase keeping doing

7:29

the hard thing. Have you ever been

7:32

there? Have you ever kept doing the hard

7:34

thing? Even

7:36

though there's hurt, disappointment,

7:39

loss. Or

7:42

today you're in a place where you're

7:44

trying to decide, do I stay here or do I go?

7:48

And you're just so mad at what has happened

7:50

that you can't see straight. This

7:53

conversation is for you. I want you to keep listening.

7:56

My friend then mentioned some relational

7:59

situations at work and at home,

8:01

and how this mindset of doing

8:03

the hard thing helped him endure

8:06

and persevere. So it informed his

8:08

life. And then he said this.

8:11

I also followed you closely,

8:13

listening to how you did your program

8:16

and how likable you were.

8:18

Boy, that was frustrating.

8:20

Exclamation point. It's so much

8:23

easier to not like someone who's a jerk.

8:28

Isn't it though? I followed

8:30

you through the tough season of having to wrestle

8:32

with mold and the ultimate decision

8:34

to relocate and essentially start all

8:37

over for you and your family. And

8:41

as I read that, you

8:43

know. When

8:45

people remind me, it kind

8:47

of comes back. I'm right back there. But

8:50

he encapsulated about 20 years

8:52

of my life in just that little sentence.

8:56

And trying to find the meaning of all

8:58

that, and he painted it really well. I followed

9:00

you through that tough season, wrestling,

9:03

the ultimate decision to relocate, essentially

9:05

starting all over for you and your family. Yeah,

9:07

that's that's basically what happened.

9:11

I don't like. Think about it. I like

9:13

to just keep moving. He

9:16

says. And now I'm thankful

9:18

you started the program. As

9:21

it's been a blessing to me personally as

9:23

I've listened to you interact with guests

9:25

with some amazing and sometimes

9:27

heart wrenching stories. That

9:30

it's a blessing to listeners as well,

9:33

is without a doubt as I see the comments.

9:37

I've come to feel like you're my friend. A

9:39

friend who I would enjoy chatting across the

9:41

backyard fence with. About

9:43

a lot of things or nothing at all. So

9:47

with an apology for my negative

9:50

attitude for a season. I

9:53

also want to share my thanks for

9:55

just being you. I

9:58

would imagine that we could continue to get

10:00

along just fine without

10:02

me sharing that story. But

10:05

then you'd never know how God used you in my

10:07

life in a way you'd never known. So

10:13

I wrote back and I shared. Immediately,

10:16

as soon as I saw it, it was like, this reminds

10:18

me of, you know, a similar situation

10:20

that I was in, a place where something

10:23

was taken away and I didn't understand it.

10:25

But looking back now, I can see

10:27

it better. But at the time it

10:30

was really hard. And

10:32

I wrote back, I think there's a program

10:34

here. You know how you dealt with change

10:37

or how you didn't like

10:39

something that happened, or you didn't agree

10:41

with something, and you kept with it and you stayed

10:43

with it, and what was going on inside

10:46

and how you did that. And

10:48

he replied and said, funny, I was thinking,

10:51

I bet this will make a great program. As

10:53

we've all experienced it. Just

10:56

not always sure how to deal with it. Yeah.

11:00

So here we are. One

11:03

person's story becomes your opportunity

11:05

to to encourage somebody else. Did

11:07

that spark anything in your heart? Have

11:09

you ever been there and experience

11:11

a season of anger that you slowly,

11:14

incrementally worked through?

11:17

How did you do that? Did

11:20

the person you were angry with ever

11:22

know it? Or

11:25

maybe you're still there. You haven't been able

11:27

to shake that anger.

11:31

You haven't been able to get to the point where you

11:33

can say. I think I'm

11:35

okay with this now. Did

11:39

somebody get a position that you wanted and

11:41

you really dislike them for getting that

11:44

promotion? But

11:46

you were able to grow

11:48

into the change.

11:50

Maybe that person became a friend of yours.

11:52

Maybe that person became. I

11:55

owe so many stories I could go to right now.

11:58

Was there a place when you allowed your

12:00

heart the room to struggle?

12:04

Tell me your story. How long did it take?

12:06

What was the process? What were the steps?

12:09

How did you do the work that you needed to inside?

12:12

You'll give you the number. (877) 548-3675.

12:19

My guess is somebody listening today

12:21

has just gone through some kind

12:24

of loss like this, and

12:26

it is really difficult right now to even

12:28

listen to me talking on the radio.

12:32

Because you're so angry. What

12:34

would you say to that person? Respond

12:37

to the story I've just told at this

12:39

number 87754836758775483675.

12:58

That was one of the best emails I've ever

13:01

had. So encouraging and so

13:03

real and honest and vulnerable.

13:06

And that's one of the reasons why I wanted to read to

13:08

you. And and now my mind is spinning.

13:11

I, uh, I

13:13

went to the National Religious Broadcasters Convention,

13:16

just, you know, flew in, flew out. They

13:18

won't let me stay there very long. Um,

13:20

but I saw someone

13:22

who.

13:24

Had.

13:25

And I, you know, I know I know a lot of people

13:27

in the in the whole industry. So, you know, there's

13:29

a lot of stories from from a long time ago.

13:32

But I saw someone and I remembered

13:34

this person and this person.

13:36

Boy, there was one point where this person fired

13:38

this person and there was acrimony. And

13:40

did you hear what it says? You know, it's

13:42

just ugly. It was messy. It's

13:44

awful. And

13:47

so I saw one of the people and I said, hey,

13:49

where's so-and-so? And,

13:51

uh. And he

13:53

said, oh, well, we're rooming together.

13:57

They they not only have,

13:59

you know, we're speaking to each other, they've become

14:02

really, really good friends.

14:04

And I and that's one of the things I

14:06

want to talk about today is only

14:09

God can give the space

14:11

to do that. I mean, okay,

14:14

if you're not a Christian, you you can patch

14:16

things up together. I'm not saying that,

14:18

but I think only God can

14:21

do the kind of work that I'm talking about on

14:23

the inside that will

14:25

will draw you to

14:27

somebody else, even when you're mad at him.

14:30

Um, so your call,

14:33

your story

14:35

might help somebody else today. And we're going to start

14:37

with Mary in Indiana. Hi, Mary.

14:39

How are you?

14:41

Hi, Chris, thank you for taking my

14:43

call and and for everything

14:46

you do. I agree with the gentleman that wrote

14:48

you the letter that I enjoy

14:50

listening to you so much. Ah.

14:53

That's very encouraging. Thank you. Mary.

14:57

So my, um.

14:59

Precise story that would relate to this

15:01

is I was a massage

15:03

therapist for many years, and

15:06

I would play Christian instrumental

15:08

music, and there would be many times

15:10

where people would be, I know

15:12

that song, and

15:14

they'd share a little from their childhood

15:16

or grandmother that they knew the

15:18

song from. And I would maybe ask,

15:21

well, what took you away from that?

15:23

And it was a way for me to share,

15:25

and, uh, physical

15:27

problems took me away from that job.

15:29

And and it's I

15:32

struggled because that was my way of

15:34

sharing Christ in so many ways.

15:37

And I also couldn't help with

15:39

the children at church anymore.

15:41

And so it was a

15:43

difficult time to learn how to

15:46

re relearn a

15:49

way to share differently. And

15:51

just going through all the physical stuff

15:53

I had to go through during that time as

15:55

well. In and but

15:57

through this pain of the

15:59

pains and still pushing

16:01

on and still helping people,

16:04

I've learned I can still share.

16:06

Just in talking, I can still

16:09

share. Just

16:12

in sharing my life, and that I still

16:14

rely on on God to

16:17

direct me and

16:19

that he's there still and

16:21

I feel like it is still helped many people.

16:24

Um, friends, you know, some

16:27

of the other day made a comment

16:29

that said something to the effect of she wished

16:31

she had my life. And I was like, wait,

16:33

you want to be in pain 24 over seven?

16:36

That's what you want. I'd rather work.

16:38

And it was kind of like a

16:41

okay moment, but.

16:43

But I'm grateful that God is still

16:46

using me. Be

16:48

it different way, smaller ways,

16:50

good days and bad days,

16:52

because I have all of those with the pain.

16:55

And, um, and I'm

16:57

just grateful that I've learned to

16:59

lean on him still.

17:01

Um, gratitude and merry.

17:03

I can't believe that, because that was the one place

17:05

that I wanted to get to today. And because

17:07

when you get to the place of gratitude

17:10

in the middle of the

17:12

lament that you're talking about, because

17:14

there is that, you know, this is not there

17:16

anymore, but in the middle of the lament

17:18

that you can get to the gratitude. It's

17:20

the same thing we were talking about in the Psalms

17:22

a little earlier this week, the

17:25

the massage therapy that you did,

17:27

though. See, to me,

17:29

your profession can

17:31

sometimes become who you are. Your

17:33

identity is so wrapped up in what you're

17:36

able to do and help people,

17:38

etc. etc. when that's taken

17:40

away, you have to fight

17:42

for your identity and to to

17:44

really believe in who

17:46

you are, right?

17:48

Yeah, that that's a I cried

17:50

a lot because I loved what I did,

17:53

and I am still able to share

17:56

at least information with people

17:58

on, you know, well, you can do this or

18:00

that, but, you know,

18:02

yes, it was very I cried

18:04

so much because I loved my job

18:07

and I loved that I could play Christian

18:09

music and and.

18:11

And your job was worth the tears.

18:14

So I want everybody to hear that because

18:16

there, there is this proclivity.

18:19

We have this danger. We have

18:21

to rush toward everything being

18:23

fine when it's not inside

18:26

Romans 828 and put that

18:28

over your life. And I'm just going to say this

18:30

as many times as I can to push down the feeling

18:32

that I have and and

18:35

the Psalms. We learned this from

18:37

the Psalms as well as all of

18:39

Scripture is you do not spike

18:42

what you feel. You bring

18:44

what you feel to the one who knows

18:46

you best and loves you most. And

18:48

that's what you did. Mary, that's a great start to

18:50

the program today. Uh, Brian's

18:53

in Tennessee. Brian joined the conversation.

18:56

Hey, Chris. Thanks for having

18:58

me on this. Uh, this

19:01

afternoon. I was just thinking about,

19:04

uh, in here, the conversation. You

19:06

know, that time in life when,

19:09

uh, you know, you're called to

19:11

do something for God,

19:13

or you believe that he's calling you to

19:16

do something, and it just doesn't

19:18

seem to work out. And you ask

19:20

the question, do you think

19:22

they knew that they were mad at you? Well,

19:24

yeah, I think he knew I was mad at him because

19:26

he's a god and he knows everything. But,

19:29

you know, I was I truly

19:31

believe that I was called to, uh,

19:34

start a ministry. And you go

19:36

through all of the labor of

19:38

beginning to do this, what

19:41

you think is for the benefit of God,

19:43

and it doesn't come to pass.

19:45

And, um, and

19:48

although my spouse was supportive,

19:50

it felt as if she wasn't all

19:52

in. And there was

19:54

frustration there was was

19:56

was just difficulty. But at

19:59

the same time, God has spoken to her

20:01

that I have something bigger and

20:03

interestingly, not

20:05

more than, you know,

20:08

5 or 6 months later, we're

20:10

uprooting everything that we've known

20:12

as home for the last 50 years.

20:14

And now we're residing in

20:16

the Tennessee area, and we've been here

20:19

nine, almost nine years,

20:21

and this is home now. And the

20:23

blessing has been a

20:25

hundred times what we probably

20:27

would have experienced if we stayed in Missouri,

20:29

because it's unmatchable

20:32

on a matching. Unmatchable

20:34

to what, uh, you know,

20:36

we experience in those 50 years where

20:38

we were just in this routine, but

20:41

now God is truly blessing and open up

20:43

doors. And we have, uh,

20:45

a small group that's in our home

20:47

that meets 20 or 30 people, which

20:49

is larger than than many

20:51

churches. And so it's just amazing how,

20:54

how how God, I

20:56

mean, we have to be content in

20:58

what God is providing be for

21:01

us. And, and and

21:03

so it took me a while to get over the frustration

21:05

and anger to see God was really doing something

21:08

greater.

21:08

So you you put

21:11

your finger on the nerve of the of the sovereignty

21:13

thing, you know, and and then all the questions.

21:15

Did I miss hear you? Did I not hear

21:18

you right? Is this really what you wanted?

21:20

My guess is that things

21:22

didn't go the way that you thought they were

21:25

going to go, and the expectation that you had

21:27

back there informs

21:29

what you're doing today. That

21:31

if that if things don't go,

21:33

you know, it sounds like things are

21:35

going well, but if something doesn't go quite

21:37

as well as you want it to, it's

21:40

okay. You're going to you're going to move through

21:42

that because of the other experience.

21:45

Egg. Egg? Exactly.

21:48

Uh. I mean, all all

21:50

of that was necessary to

21:52

understand how to really share him

21:55

in this season of life.

21:57

Because if we wouldn't have gone,

21:59

gone through that, if we wouldn't have had

22:01

that, that experience of walking

22:03

with him and a difficult time,

22:06

how can we really share the joys

22:08

of walking with him and

22:10

and the good times?

22:11

Yes.

22:13

Great call. Thank you for doing it,

22:15

because you get into the spiritual aspect of

22:17

this and the practical aspect of

22:19

what do you do? What do you do

22:21

with all of the the struggle

22:24

and the loss that you and maybe this program

22:26

today is for you?

22:28

If you know somebody who's going

22:30

through a loss like this and

22:33

as you're listening, you're thinking, oh,

22:36

you could be somebody in ministry, you could be

22:38

somebody down, somebody at your work

22:41

that you just moved

22:43

toward and allowed to

22:45

start to talk about some of these things.

22:49

(877) 548-3675.

22:52

Israel is also in the

22:54

the Midwest. Hi, Israel. Go right ahead.

22:58

How are you doing? Good afternoon. Can you hear me? Okay.

23:01

I sure can.

23:03

Hi, this is Carl, and I caught the

23:06

tail end of what you were talking

23:08

about. Anger. And

23:10

I wasn't sure if you were saying whether

23:12

the anger is towards, like, God

23:14

or a person. So I just wanted to

23:16

clarify that before I, uh, before

23:18

I spoke.

23:19

Well, I think it could be either way,

23:21

but I think ultimately,

23:23

if you really believe that God is in control,

23:26

he is part of the equation of

23:29

allowing whatever is going on

23:31

in my life, in my life, and

23:33

in your life as well. So I have to deal

23:35

with him. Uh, at

23:37

the end of the day, I have to deal with the, you know, the people

23:39

in my life that I have anger

23:42

toward. But I really need to deal

23:44

with him if he is in control

23:46

of all of this and has allowed, at least

23:48

allowed it to happen, does that help?

23:52

If that does help. So I'll begin.

23:54

I will say I

23:57

have had issues with anger for

23:59

for a long time. I would say right now I'm

24:01

not angry at God. I

24:03

feel that the Lord has put something in my heart

24:05

and that's why I called today. I

24:07

put something in my heart to do,

24:10

and right now I'm doing it living

24:12

my life. But at the same time, I hold

24:14

a lot of anger towards a person. And that would

24:16

be my ex-wife. Uh, my

24:18

ex-wife was, uh, was a Christian,

24:21

is a Christian, a professional, a professing

24:23

Christian. And, um, we

24:25

were married for we were together for

24:28

eight years and married for seven, and

24:30

I filed for divorce, and

24:32

I didn't want to do that. Um,

24:34

you know, we we did all the things, and we were church

24:36

going family. My kids are in the car right now

24:38

listening in, and we were we were church people,

24:40

whatever you call church people. And I'm not a church person

24:43

anymore. I won't deal with church people

24:45

because to me, Christians hurt people, and

24:47

because I was hurt by a Christian for a long time.

24:50

And I won't sit here and say I'm a victim because I hurt

24:52

my wife. And I did nasty things to my wife

24:54

and said vile things to her. But

24:56

at the same time, it's like that

24:58

anger towards her is more so.

25:01

For years I was threatened with divorce

25:04

by her and this is

25:06

a Christian and my first

25:08

wife passed away. I'm I

25:10

was widowed and so I remarried

25:13

and I put all my love into

25:15

this relationship and for her for

25:17

years, and then threatened me with

25:19

divorce. And then finally,

25:21

I had to file for divorce because I didn't want to

25:23

do that. Yeah, and that's

25:26

how I hold a lot of anger towards her.

25:28

Because I can hear it in your voice as well. And I want

25:31

you to hang on. We have a a break we need

25:33

to take right here. Take a break. I

25:35

want you to, uh. And I'm so glad that your

25:37

kids are with you. I mean, that

25:40

that just makes this situation even

25:42

more real. I want to talk

25:44

with you in the break. Let's continue. This is

25:46

Chris Fabri live on Moody Radio

25:48

(877) 548-3675.

26:05

This is Chris Fabri live on Moody Radio.

26:07

If you're just joining us at the very beginning

26:09

of the program, I read an email

26:12

from a radio colleague who

26:14

said, uh, for a long

26:16

time I was mad at you. You

26:18

didn't know it. And it was something

26:20

that was going on at the station

26:22

when my program came on

26:25

and took him out

26:27

of doing what he thought he was

26:29

there to do, and it was very

26:31

frustrating for him. But he

26:33

stayed and he talked about

26:35

the sets of really nice things. And,

26:38

um, I wanted to see if if

26:40

you've had the same kind of situation at all

26:42

in your life. And so then we're

26:44

just minding our own business, and Israel calls

26:47

and talking to he.

26:49

He pushed the the

26:51

anger button, the anger button

26:53

with people in his life,

26:55

with Christians, with church

26:58

people, in his life, with his ex-wife.

27:01

And that you're in the car with your kids.

27:03

And I want to wave to him, Israel.

27:05

I'll do that. I don't know how many have, but I

27:07

think it's really great that as a dad, you

27:10

got those kids there with you and that they're listening

27:12

to our conversation. Um,

27:15

but I what I hear coming

27:17

from you is

27:19

not that you're trying to push

27:21

God away or

27:24

hold him at arm's length or even,

27:27

you know, you wouldn't have called this program if

27:29

you didn't. You know, if all Christians

27:31

were verboten to you, you

27:33

wouldn't have called this program. What it sounds

27:36

like to me is you're

27:38

you're struggling to get your head,

27:40

keep your head above water with

27:42

everything that you're doing now,

27:44

as well as all of the pain.

27:46

I know that you told me in the break

27:48

that there's you lost a child

27:51

in your life. So there's a

27:53

lot of there's a lot of anger

27:55

and swirling of

27:58

the spiritual thing is swirling

28:00

here as well, that I think a lot of people

28:02

identify with that church hurt.

28:05

And so I'm not I'm

28:07

not going to give you any quote unquote

28:09

advice here just to

28:11

ask you, is that how you

28:13

feel? You're kind of trying to keep your head above

28:15

water.

28:17

Can you still hear me?

28:18

I sure can.

28:21

So I would say in the sense, yes,

28:23

it would be to keep my not

28:25

necessarily like to keep

28:28

my head, but to really stay in line

28:30

with whatever the set of heart spirit

28:32

has put in my heart. Like

28:34

at the point when when I filed for

28:36

divorce, because that was put in my heart

28:39

to do to to bear it. And

28:41

like I tell my children now that I do

28:43

penance, I used to be Catholic.

28:46

I was married Catholic. So now I

28:48

do penance for the things

28:50

that I feel that I've done wrong. And

28:53

but that was just what was put in

28:55

my heart. And I just want to make

28:57

sure that that I'm doing the right thing. Because

29:00

how can I really serve God and yet

29:02

carry so much anger? And,

29:05

you know, even now, like when, you

29:08

know, we I, we, I meet with

29:10

my ex-wife now for my children's

29:12

benefit, uh, weekly.

29:14

So we have a weekly session. To

29:16

me, it's a complete waste because

29:19

we did all these things as married.

29:22

You know, if we really wanted to work things out,

29:24

we would have did it, you know, as far

29:26

as to benefit our children. If you really believe

29:28

in the Christian doctrine that God hates

29:31

divorce. So that's that's where my

29:33

anger lies, is like that. I spoke

29:35

to her and I love him

29:37

for doing this to our family. Because

29:40

it was good to torture me with

29:42

the horse for years. But when I responded

29:45

to it, then all of a sudden,

29:47

you know, I was a good man to her, and I

29:49

would find someone else when it was okay to torture

29:52

me. But then when I responded

29:54

with divorce and is how dare you, you

29:56

know, and that's where my, my bone to pick is

29:59

with with Kristen. Because my idea of

30:01

a Christian is buried by her. Not

30:03

is this is this what it is

30:06

that, like my pastor used to say, everyone

30:08

falls short of the glory of God? To me, that's a

30:10

poor excuse for for Christian behavior.

30:12

Then, of course, everyone

30:14

falls short of glory. But that doesn't entirely

30:16

usually treat people poorly. And that's

30:19

where I'm at now is when I. When

30:21

I went to a church, it was a revival church.

30:23

I was there for two minutes and I left. As I

30:25

said, I've been there, done that, and I've had

30:27

people pray for me and look at the end

30:29

result. But I'm

30:31

trying to say, how do you? Because

30:33

I know what the Lord wants me to do.

30:36

How do you then? How

30:38

do you get to the place where you are

30:41

forgiven? Where and unless?

30:43

Let's take your wife out of the equation right now. Let's

30:45

just talk about you. How? And I don't

30:47

think there are any coincidences here that that

30:49

you call and that you got through here today.

30:51

How do you get

30:53

to a place where you

30:55

know that you stand before God

30:58

and you're a fully forgiven

31:01

and you're fully righteous

31:03

in his eyes because he's

31:06

holy and you're not and I'm not.

31:08

So how do you get to that place

31:11

where he accepts you?

31:14

It's funny you mentioned that, like, as

31:16

you were speaking, you know, I have a time

31:18

in my car for my son is real. My daughter

31:21

just bring it. And

31:24

I got to a point where it's like, is this

31:26

really what you want? Like, am I supposed to

31:28

go for all these things for whatever

31:31

you want me to do? And

31:33

I started farming. Um,

31:36

I have, like, a farming cohort that I'm a part

31:38

of here, Darian. And it's

31:40

like, just do those things, and then you're going

31:42

to see. That was put in my heart.

31:45

And that's all I do now. I

31:47

work towards that because when

31:49

I stand before the Lord, I really

31:51

want to hear as well down in that. And

31:54

I'm doing my best. How can I hear well

31:56

done when I have all that in my heart?

32:00

Okay, so you've you've put

32:02

your finger on. You're

32:04

not there and you want to be there.

32:07

And the chasm is

32:09

between you and God because

32:11

of the anger, because all the stuff that's going on

32:13

in your life and no

32:15

amount of penance that you do,

32:17

no amount of good things that

32:19

you do to make up for the bad things,

32:22

no amount of love that you show

32:24

to to anybody in order to

32:27

make up for the, you know, the anger.

32:29

You can't do that. You can't climb

32:31

that mountain. Because

32:34

as I said earlier, you know, he's holy and you're

32:36

not. So the

32:38

the answer to the question that you're not really

32:40

asking me a question, but I'm going to take

32:42

you there anyway. The answer to

32:44

the question is how do you stand before him?

32:47

And he says, well done, thou good and faithful

32:49

servant. What you do is you

32:51

receive what he is offering you

32:53

right now for

32:56

your life, the forgiveness

32:58

that he gives you because

33:00

of what his son did for you.

33:02

And my guess is you're going to say, well, I know

33:04

that. I've heard that that's that's,

33:07

you know, Jesus righteousness on me

33:09

imputation. I get that you've

33:11

been around long enough to hear about that, right?

33:14

Of course.

33:15

Okay. So when when

33:18

Paul writes, there's therefore

33:20

now no condemnation

33:22

for those who are in Christ Jesus.

33:25

Why do you still feel condemned?

33:30

It's more so that the things that

33:32

were put in my heart, like I explained

33:35

this to my wife at one time when we were married,

33:37

that the things that the Lord put in

33:39

my heart to do, and she said they sounded

33:42

evil, that they were from the devil. And

33:44

I'm like, but this is what this is

33:46

what it is like. You know, I'm

33:49

going to be really honest with you, Chris. I

33:51

feel like to me is to really

33:53

challenge Christians and

33:55

what Christians put out there and

33:57

project to people, you know, because

34:00

I remember clearly having

34:02

the word used against me. And

34:05

to go. I go now, I go in assembly

34:08

and I go in fellowship with other Christians

34:10

and I pray with other Christians. But in my heart

34:12

when I'm there, it's like these people need to

34:14

know that there's

34:16

a different way that that that establishment

34:18

that is there, whatever you call

34:21

the church itself, it's broken.

34:24

It's yeah, I get it. It's full of broken people,

34:26

but the broken people hurt people. So,

34:29

you know, I don't hear anything from the assembly

34:31

that I was in and they were my brothers

34:34

and sisters. Where are they at? I

34:36

don't hear from them. So it's like church

34:38

people do hurt people, but at

34:40

the same time it's like, okay,

34:43

we hear all those things and we hear all

34:45

that line of forgiveness. And it's like, I

34:47

keep hearing the same thing from God in my heart

34:50

to just keep doing what I'm doing, even

34:52

if it sounds crazy and bad. Yeah,

34:55

I don't know how that sounds to you, Chris. Have

34:57

you ever heard anything like that?

34:58

Yeah, you know, I have, I

35:00

have, I've heard of a tinge

35:03

of that. And I think it's

35:05

your heart is leaking through

35:08

and it's a good leaking,

35:10

you know, the, the, the hurt

35:12

that you've had the,

35:14

of this intimate relationship

35:16

that didn't continue that

35:19

you really wanted to. And

35:21

then the the, the people

35:24

who are supposed to be there, who are

35:26

supposed to love you through it

35:28

and help you through it, weren't

35:30

there. And I'm. There

35:33

are people listening right now, Israel,

35:35

who will say, I've been there too,

35:38

and I, I can't do that again.

35:40

I can't go back there and I can't. I'm not going to

35:42

put myself through that. I totally get

35:44

that. But I don't want you

35:46

to miss. And it almost sounds like,

35:48

you know, you're you're so open

35:50

to God's work in your

35:52

life because you keep talking. You keep coming back

35:55

to that. I think you know his

35:57

love. I think you've tasted

35:59

of that. And I

36:01

just want to keep nudging you toward

36:03

that, that even though there

36:06

are hypocrites in the church, you know, even

36:08

though there are people who can be really

36:10

mean to you, that

36:12

is not a representation

36:15

of who God is in,

36:17

in your life and to you and

36:19

what he wants to be to you.

36:22

And the way that I the reason that I

36:24

can say that to you is because

36:26

of what happened on a hill

36:28

in Israel, that

36:31

the place not the person, but

36:33

in Israel a couple thousand years

36:35

ago. What happened

36:37

in a garden? The same

36:40

of sweat drops of blood

36:43

that Jesus had

36:45

when he said, Psalm 22, My

36:48

God, my God, why have you forsaken me?

36:50

You feel that way.

36:52

He identifies with that,

36:55

and he went all the way to the cross

36:57

and to the grave in order to

36:59

purchase this relationship

37:02

with God where you don't earn

37:04

it anymore, you don't pay penance

37:06

for it. He did it. Jesus

37:08

paid it all. He did it. And

37:11

I don't want. The dangers I said

37:14

a minute ago, is to rush

37:16

somebody like you from

37:18

where you are to where I want you to be.

37:21

I'm. I'm not trying to do that,

37:23

but I just want you to hear

37:25

from my voice and maybe the

37:27

people who are listening right now, who will who

37:30

will call. What would you say to Israel

37:32

if you could sit down with a cup of coffee?

37:35

You've heard what's gone on in his

37:37

life. You've heard the hurt in

37:39

his in his church experience.

37:41

What would you say to him? 877548367518775483675.

37:51

Hang on. Israel, I talked to you in the break

37:54

and we'll continue here at the radio

37:56

backyard fence. Can

38:13

you tell about Marco? He typed

38:15

into his search engine three words.

38:18

Info about abortion.

38:20

Marco had been in prison. He traveled

38:22

a hard road and was just trying to make

38:24

some good decisions in his life. But his girlfriend

38:27

told him one day I'm

38:29

pregnant and he was scared.

38:31

Getting a job after serving time is not

38:34

easy. How is he going to provide

38:36

for them? Abortion

38:38

seemed like the best option, so he hit enter.

38:42

On those three words. Info about

38:44

abortion. Near the top of the online

38:46

search were three more

38:48

words pregnancy decision

38:50

line. The ad said

38:52

it was a hotline offering a private place

38:54

to talk about abortion. So

38:57

we call that number and you can

38:59

read the rest of his story in

39:01

a free download. CNet has a

39:03

devotional, A lifeline of Hope.

39:05

These pro abundant life stories

39:07

will encourage you about the lives

39:09

that are being changed every

39:12

day. Go to Chris Fabry Live org.

39:15

Click the green connect button. You'll

39:17

see a welcome to you. And there's a way you can

39:19

receive that free resource, a

39:21

lifeline of Hope. Click the

39:23

green button at Chris Fabry Live

39:26

org. So

39:28

Israel and his two kids made

39:30

it home. I was talking with him in the break and

39:33

they have a dog too. I heard the dog in

39:35

the background. And

39:37

I wonder. I wonder what you

39:39

would say to him

39:41

in his situation. Just a little

39:43

snippet that you've heard in his life.

39:45

I want to pray for him before we end here today. But

39:48

Ellen is in Minnesota. Ellen, go

39:50

right ahead.

39:52

Hi. Uh, yeah. Israel.

39:55

Don't lose hope. Um,

39:57

I understand having,

40:00

um, been in

40:02

a similar situation with

40:04

friendships. Um, and

40:07

like that, longing for

40:09

people to fill you up

40:11

and people to make

40:13

us feel whole and to fill the voids

40:16

in our life. Um, people

40:18

are broken. And friends.

40:21

Friends don't cut it.

40:23

Family doesn't cut it. Church

40:25

friends don't cut it. Um.

40:27

Only God can love us so

40:29

completely and so perfectly.

40:32

And I think that when we're searching

40:34

for, for for love.

40:36

For real love, I think

40:38

that, um, Satan uses

40:41

this and gets in the way, um,

40:43

and distracts us. I think

40:45

God wants us to focus

40:48

on the love that he's going

40:50

to provide so perfectly to us.

40:52

And, um, I

40:54

think that he lets us experience

40:57

these times of loneliness, um,

40:59

to pull us closer to him

41:02

and so that we become dependent

41:04

on him as our sole source

41:06

of love and forgiveness

41:09

and acceptance and fulfillment.

41:11

People are always going to

41:13

disappoint us, but God never

41:16

will. And, um, I hope for

41:18

Israel that he can, um,

41:20

let that need

41:22

for, uh, people

41:24

to fill him up, um,

41:27

fall away and to

41:30

allow his fulfillment to come

41:32

from God, because people are always going

41:34

to, um, disappoint

41:36

us.

41:37

What I hear you saying is there's

41:39

an awful lot of hope here,

41:41

and I don't think you're

41:43

trying, Elon, as I wasn't trying

41:45

to minimize the pain

41:48

because that, you know, you have hope

41:50

because it's all going to get better and it's all going to work

41:52

out well. I don't know how it's all going to going

41:54

to happen here, but

41:56

the best place that you can be

41:58

is in with

42:00

the father's love washing over

42:03

you. It almost sounds like his

42:05

his tank is is empty

42:07

and is run on empty and fumes for

42:09

an awful long time. And,

42:12

uh, okay, I'll leave it right there. Linda in Vermont.

42:15

Linda, what do you want to say to Israel?

42:18

Hi. Um, I would love to just tell

42:20

you, Israel, that there are

42:22

many, many broken people. We're all

42:24

broken. This world is broken.

42:27

Um, but to maybe, you know, just

42:29

trust the Lord. Trust in Jesus.

42:31

He has a plan for your life, and

42:34

it may not, you know. I mean,

42:36

it may not be looking for another partner in

42:38

life. It may not be, um,

42:41

searching for love in that way. But

42:43

if you just look for

42:45

the love in Jesus and how he died on

42:47

the cross for us because he loved

42:49

us so much, we just have to continue

42:51

to trust him and

42:54

trust the fact that he does love

42:56

you. And he does hear your tears. He

42:58

hears your voice, he hears

43:00

the pain in your heart, and

43:03

he wants you to have a good life.

43:05

He wants you to be, uh,

43:07

to feel, um, confirmed

43:09

in his love. Um, and, and

43:12

I've gone through a terrible divorce myself,

43:14

and I was very angry

43:16

because I didn't want a divorce, and

43:19

and it took me almost 17,

43:21

18 years to get over this,

43:23

but but it's been a long

43:25

time of praying and

43:28

trusting that Jesus has a plan for

43:30

me. And and

43:32

I had my children around me. And

43:34

so I concentrated on loving

43:37

my children, building

43:39

my children up in the Lord, and

43:41

going to church together. Find a church

43:44

where you feel comfortable. Um,

43:46

I'm Catholic and I. I love being

43:48

Catholic. I just take

43:50

my children and we pray together.

43:53

Um, you know, it took a while to teach, you know,

43:55

over the years to pray all

43:57

together as a family, but

43:59

just work on that, and and it will

44:01

come as real, and I do. I hear your pain.

44:04

Yeah.

44:04

It's a process. What you're saying, Linda.

44:07

Thank you. What you're saying is it

44:09

is it is this long process

44:11

that God is committed to in your life,

44:14

for your life, and

44:16

for the hope that he has for you?

44:19

And I think that the anger,

44:21

because we kept coming back to the anger. And

44:23

that's a great place to end

44:25

here today. Uh, something

44:27

I've picked up from other guests who've been on.

44:29

When that thing comes up,

44:32

when that thing rises up

44:34

inside of you, here is a

44:36

really good opportunity for you

44:38

to invite God into it, rather than

44:40

following the anger and the emotion

44:43

which is real, you

44:45

just invite God into it and you say,

44:48

you know, here I am angry

44:50

again at my ex-wife

44:52

or at the church or Christians or

44:54

whatever. Here it is

44:56

popping up in my life again, and I'm

44:59

going to let allow this

45:01

room in my life to

45:03

point me to you. How do I

45:05

how do I handle this? What do I do

45:07

with this anger that I have?

45:09

And then I look at the scripture as I'm reading

45:12

the scripture and I see the

45:14

different places. You know, there are some angry

45:16

people in the Scripture. It seems like

45:18

some of the disciples dealt with some

45:20

of that anger as well, and vitriol.

45:23

And you see how God changed

45:25

them. He changed Paul from somebody

45:28

who persecuted killed Christians

45:30

to somebody who was given

45:32

that message. So God, would you do that in

45:34

my heart today? Would you

45:36

would you soften my heart where

45:38

it's it's hard. It has had

45:40

to be hard because of all the pain

45:42

that I've been through. Would you soften

45:45

that heart? Give me a heart

45:47

for my kids. Give

45:49

me a heart that pours it out in

45:52

love to them I

45:54

can't, I can't receive

45:56

the love that I need from the

45:58

other people. But would you show me that

46:00

love so that I can pour it out to them?

46:03

And I pray, father, that you would take

46:05

Israel's call here, and that you would

46:07

not only comfort him and draw

46:09

him closer to yourself, but also

46:11

others who I'm seeing on the phone

46:14

lines are feeling exactly

46:16

the same way. Thank you that

46:18

you went to the lengths you went to

46:20

to show us how much you do

46:22

love. You didn't just tell us you cared,

46:25

you showed it on Calvary.

46:27

You gave us resurrection

46:29

power from the empty tomb

46:31

and we celebrate your son.

46:34

Give Israel hope and comfort today,

46:36

I pray, and anybody else who's in that situation,

46:39

in the name of Christ, Amen.

46:43

God bless you, friend Chris. February Live is a production

46:45

of Moody Radio, a ministry of Moody

46:47

Bible Institute.