0:02

You look like your head fell on the cheese dip back in 1957,

0:11

you're okay this one real fucking ugly oh you see i take these glasses off she

0:19

looks like a regular person doesn't she huh put them back on formaldehyde face

0:24

that's what we got enough out. Hey everybody, welcome back to another exciting episode of Citizen Frame.

0:41

I got some sad news. We actually recorded the full Monty, which we said we would

0:46

be doing for this week's podcast, and we did so.

0:49

Unfortunately, there was a technical glitch. I would obviously blame Trevor, but it was not his fault.

0:57

It was my own. I have a new mic here and something just didn't record right.

1:01

Now we go back and we record. But the one thing about our podcast, besides being prepped with some notes and,

1:07

you know, some, you know, information about the film and stuff,

1:11

we kind of just go with the flow.

1:14

The only editing we do is sound issues and so forth.

1:21

Because we don't, if we re-recorded it, it wouldn't be as spontaneous and it

1:25

wouldn't be, it'd just come up formulaic and. It wouldn't be the same podcast?

1:30

Yeah, it wouldn't be what we usually do. Cause anytime we fuck up stuff,

1:34

which is usually me, we like to keep it in there just because fuck,

1:39

it's just the way the conversation flew. Flowed. Keeps it more natural. See, flew, flow, I screwed that up, but I won't edit it. See?

1:46

Yeah. But we will do the full Monty again. We're just going to let it marinate

1:50

for a a while and redo it maybe in the end of the summer but meantime we're

1:56

gonna put our clothes back on for a while you'll be glad to hear and then we'll

2:01

do it again that was terrible dude I know I know bad joke,

2:06

Wow. Wow. I apologize. You know what?

2:12

I'm not going to end with that. Don't. I want people to know what I have to

2:16

deal with on a daily basis. But yeah, so we will get to it. So we had to quickly get one in that we're a

2:24

little more prepared for, one that we knew. And we decided to go back to what you guys have been asking us to do for a while.

2:30

And I don't know why it took so long to get to it. It is outside the box of

2:34

the gritty crime drama we've been doing, but it's definitely a pleasant one to do.

2:39

And that is looking at John Carpenter's 1988 cult smash, well,

2:45

cult hit now, which is They Live.

2:49

Yep. Yeah. Life's a bitch and she's back in heat.

2:55

There's actually lots of quotable one-liners in this.

2:58

Obviously the one about, you know, I'm here to chew bubblegum and kick ass.

3:03

You know, but there's quite a few others. Yeah, there's quite a bit. Most of it's improv by Roddy Piper himself.

3:10

Yes. So, They Live. This is co-produced by longtime producer and assistant director

3:16

to John Carpenter, Larry Franco. It was written by John Carpenter. However, it's based on the science fiction short story.

3:25

It was written by a man named Ray Nelson.

3:29

It was called 8 a.m in

3:32

the morning so there you go yep i

3:36

must be honest and say that i haven't read the short story but it

3:39

is one that i would like to you know yes he's

3:43

written quite a bit but film wise or something that was inspired by his work

3:48

this would be the only one well this very much plays out like an old sort of

3:53

pulp sci-fi story anyway an extended one even in an episode of the twilight

3:58

zone or outer limits or something like that. Yeah.

4:02

Yeah. The short story itself was written in 1963 around that,

4:05

you know, that's that era. And it is about a man named George, George Nada.

4:13

He wakes up to find that there is a great secret being kept from the world and

4:18

he's the only human to have found out the truth.

4:22

Obviously the, that's just the, this story He obviously expands on that,

4:28

John Carpenter's version, but we'll dive into it.

4:32

This cost $4 million to make. John Carpenter's stuff has always been lower budget

4:37

and has always profited. It made $14 million. Not a massive profit.

4:42

It wasn't a big hit, but it was a massive critical hit.

4:47

And, of course, like most of Carpenter's stuff, massive resurgence on video

4:52

format. Matt and again, like wash carpenter stuff. It's a cult hit.

4:59

I mean, I first saw it on video, like so many of the films we review on here

5:04

and that I watched as a kid. I would have watched them first on video.

5:08

And, you know, this is one of them. And yeah, the thing I love about Carpenter

5:12

and his films is that essentially, and I don't mean this in the best possible way, they're B-movies.

5:18

But they are just greatly entertaining and they most definitely deserve to be

5:23

cult classics, which so many of them are.

5:26

I mean, you can describe his vision as a B movie.

5:30

I would describe Moore as Carpenter as an A-list director with B movie intentions.

5:37

Yep, yep, yeah. He doesn't sell out. Now, he's never sold out.

5:41

Yeah, so he could go play with the big boys, but he's always been a little more grounded.

5:47

It kind of sounds like he's been screwed over a bit with some of his films not

5:51

being hits. hits, like for instance, he wanted to do a couple of films,

5:54

but he couldn't do them for certain reasons. The thing bombed on him and that didn't help.

5:58

Who knew the thing would be crowning success.

6:02

Yes. But that was then, so we kind of stepped away from it. I think,

6:06

I really think he's just stepped away from Hollywood. That's not because he didn't want to keep, he didn't want to keep filmmaking.

6:13

I just don't, I think people weren't understanding his style when it tweaked

6:18

into the nineties with movies like Vampires, Ghost of Mars, even the newest, even escape from LA.

6:24

Yeah. For some reason, his be kind of visionary, uh.

6:31

Didn't translate well as the 90s became a darker

6:33

tone era so i think that's what happened carpenter but

6:37

but then as time has went on they've increased the popularity again it's like

6:41

you know peaks and troughs you know yeah i was in the 90s yeah he wasn't as

6:46

popular perhaps but then he his popularity has increased oh john carver never

6:51

went away no he never went away but he's yeah yeah he's He's,

6:55

his stuff is all cult status. I mean, everything he's done.

7:00

But I love that. You know, and so he's, he's found his, maybe he can,

7:05

he's pretty much retired from filmmaking now, but yeah, I mean,

7:10

his, his stuff is longevity, his stuff you can watch over and over again, even his later work. Great stories.

7:16

As silly as Ghost on Mars is,

7:20

it's got got rewatchability um as cheesy it is in vampires vampires is actually

7:27

fun a big following and that's very good and james woods is so fun in that movie as well.

7:33

Well like i say he's never sold out and he's

7:36

always stuck to what he obviously enjoys and where

7:39

he feels most at home at he's never went for big budget

7:42

mainstream and you know what good you know i did go

7:45

big budget once and unfortunately it was

7:48

a failure but rumor has

7:51

it it was because of chevy chase it was very

7:54

difficult to work with more well partly he is very

7:57

difficult to work with yeah i don't know what happened on set so i won't you

8:00

know go after chevy chase or anything but carpet always works with the same

8:04

team usually works with universal it has a good relationship with all the people

8:09

he works with so when you put a little tension on the set that he probably We

8:14

just wasn't on, it was uncomfortable with it maybe,

8:16

but we're going to has it. Sam Neill was very cool on the set.

8:19

This movie is called Memoirs of a Visible Man.

8:22

Yes. Actually a very clever film for its time. We'd like to revisit it again.

8:28

But it's definitely the one where Carpenter decided just to go back to what was for him.

8:33

And then I believe he jumped in the mouth of badness, going back to more ground

8:37

and working with Sam Meehl again. Yes.

8:40

How much we covered on this podcast? Yes, we did. Yes, we did.

8:45

Because it's John fucking Carpenter. John Carpenter is, if not my favorite director of all time.

8:52

So, but everyone knows that. All right. You could certainly be a blur with myself.

8:56

So we got Roddy Piper, the man with no name.

9:01

He does not have a name, this character, but in the credits,

9:04

the king, carpenter just gave him one. He's called Nada.

9:08

He's just named after the last name of George Nada, who was featured in the original short story.

9:15

And then you've got our boy from the thing, Keith David, who I've always liked

9:20

to see in films, plays Frank. Totally. Meg Foster, I can't act at all, but she's Something about her. Her plays Holly.

9:28

Peter Jason is always fun to watch. He's Gilbert.

9:30

And then you got George Buckflower, the drifter. Now George Buckflower has a

9:34

smaller part in the beginning, but we'll get to it. He has a bigger part near the end.

9:38

But the reason I mentioned him is because he's in all the Carpenter stuff.

9:42

And also, and also he also plays another homeless guy in Back to the Future.

9:49

Yeah. He's red. Yeah, that's right.

9:53

George Buckflower just passed away. not just recently, but you'll know him from

9:57

all the, you'll see his face, you'll know right away, Carpenter,

10:00

he's got that raspy voice and

10:02

he's always been the one, he's my favorite line in Carpenter's The Fog.

10:08

He's the fisherman who says, there's no fog bank out there.

10:12

See the movie, you'll get what I'm talking about. But, so it was nice to see him.

10:17

I haven't seen The Fog in years. I'm going to have to revisit it.

10:20

The Fog is, I watched The Fog once every every couple of months,

10:25

if not more. So it's a fucking great.

10:27

I remember, you know, really enjoying it as a kid. I found it really spooky.

10:33

So the film itself is, I don't know how to go with it, really.

10:40

See, you brought in Rodney Piper. In the 80s, you had all these wrestlers,

10:44

like now, where you've got UFC people and wrestlers like The Rock,

10:49

John Cena, Bustista, you know, really finding their niche and doing well,

10:54

and they deserve it. Kudos. In the 80s, they tried to do that. It didn't really translate as well.

10:59

Rodney Piper. I think Andre the Giant was a wrestler, but he did The Princess Bride.

11:04

And then you had Hulk Hogan, obviously Rocky III at the time.

11:08

So you have these wrestlers now doing their transition into acting,

11:13

which actually I could see because especially for the action film,

11:16

because people don't realize this, well, I'm sure most of them do actually,

11:20

that a wrestler is an actor because everything they do is staged.

11:25

But it's- It's staged very well. I mean, these guys are pretty much stunt workers.

11:30

Totally so it does make

11:33

sense uh and and i will

11:36

say ronnie piper not the

11:39

greatest actor of all time but man is he likable

11:42

and that's what you get with most of these guys who hit the screen just like

11:46

schwarzenegger and van damme they're just there's a presence there that you

11:50

just like yeah i agree you know he is totally likable but let's just say his

11:55

performance certainly in this This isn't exactly nuanced and he doesn't have

11:59

a great dramatic range, but you know what?

12:01

You know, we're not watching this for sort of, you know, sort of heavy acting chops.

12:08

No, no. I mean, you know. You can hear Carpenter's style in his music.

12:13

Yes. He teams up with his buddy Alan Howa for this score and they play this

12:18

din, din, din, din, like this Ennio Morricone score.

12:22

Yeah, like Western type. Yeah. Yeah, as he's coming into town,

12:26

here comes this drifter, the man with no name, technically.

12:29

Stranger comes to town. Yeah, so, and that's what they're playing with.

12:33

I know Carpenter so well that everything he does is based...

12:38

Usually on, you can just see it, whether it's high Eastern or something, Rio Bravo or high noon.

12:45

I mean, this even has a very magnificent seven feel.

12:48

Yeah, there's two of them, but it's pretty much a one-way trip.

12:54

So it's... Concerning the acting, Keith David definitely sort of carries it very much.

13:03

Well, at very least in the scenes that he's in, of course, you know, he can act. Yeah, yeah.

13:08

And then you've also got Peter Jason who plays Gilbert. He's,

13:11

you know, he's worked with Carpenter.

13:14

Uh-huh. Holly, Holly's just, what do you call it? She appears alien just anyway.

13:19

You know, she's like an alien clone of, you know, Vision of the Body Snatchers

13:22

version of Kirstie Alley. Yeah. But she's got those, she's got those fucking eyes.

13:27

Yeah, it's weird. It's alien-like, you know? Yeah, exactly.

13:33

So I like the opening shot when Roddy comes into town And right off the bat,

13:39

the great thing about Carpenter is that we're about to watch be hokey, cheesy, fun,

13:48

but at the same time, there's a really good story here.

13:53

It's clever. It's a satire. Yes. And so he knows how to pepper in little moments.

13:59

And it happens at the beginning here where it's about consumerism and how much

14:06

we are easily hypnotized or the subliminal messaging that comes through the TV.

14:12

When Roddy Piper walks into town, there's a man to sit there glued through a storefront TV.

14:20

Yeah. And he's not moving. His eyes aren't, he's not blinking.

14:24

Rankings is memorized and all it is is an advertisement of some sort that's

14:27

on the tv and even even as well whenever before he sort of goes to the sort

14:33

of shanty town whenever he first sort of sleeps rough but at the start one of

14:39

the other homeless guys is basically watching the tv as well through somebody else's window.

14:45

Yeah, and then you have, let me ask you this though. When he goes to the homeless place.

14:50

Yes. There's a blind preacher there. Yes.

14:53

And he's mimicking or he's lip syncing to the words that this evangelist.

15:03

Yes. Is on the TV. How is he doing that? Is that because he wrote them?

15:08

Because he's, that's again, the one talking on the TV is whenever the transformations break through.

15:13

Yes. You know, from the, basically, for want of a better phrase, the Rebels. Yes.

15:18

Well, basically, he's probably, I think it's probably because he's heard that

15:21

recording. That's a recording. I think he's heard it before. Oh, okay. Okay, I thought it was live.

15:28

Revolutionary gang who know the score about the aliens.

15:31

I think. I mean, it's not fully explained, but I can only assume it's maybe

15:35

because it's a recording and he's heard it several times before.

15:38

It was probably there when it was recorded, even. Okay. Okay. And the story's pretty quick It's pretty simplified right away When Gilbert tells.

15:49

We have this meeting And you find out that All they have to do is shut the signal

15:55

down It's so simple I know But still clever?

16:00

Yeah it is, that's what I was saying All they have to do is Break down the satellite

16:06

dish On top of this radio station,

16:09

Which could just, you know know sounds like a pretty simple

16:12

yeah but it's not about that i mean while the main sort of objective is simple

16:18

it's more about his journey and i mean it's quite a short film as well an hour

16:23

and a half just and but it's but there's all that clever commentary about sort

16:28

of mindless consumerism and all the rest.

16:33

When Nada finds that the church is kind of like something's going on in the

16:38

church. Yeah. And he finds the glasses.

16:42

Yes. And this is where things turn a bit. And this is where,

16:45

once we're into, we're already introduced to Frank, which is Keep David.

16:51

Yes. And, but he finds his glasses and he goes for a walk and he puts them on

16:56

and he sees everything black and white. Again, Carpenter being so stylish.

17:01

I think one of the reasons he went black and white and

17:04

not for the obvious reasons it's you know black and white it's because

17:08

when he when he puts on the glasses it looks like

17:12

something from the 50s oh yeah

17:14

totally i mean this is this is very much got sort of

17:17

1950s b-movie vibes about

17:20

it and obviously carpenter you know going by his other work you know like the

17:25

thing and stuff obviously carpenter is a big fan of this type of story so yeah

17:29

yeah i mean even the spaceships and all that you don't see whenever they have

17:34

the glasses off you know are very 1950s-esque.

17:39

Yeah and that's what he does throughout this entire film is

17:42

that he pretty much shows his

17:44

love for the area he grew up with or the cinema he's

17:48

done it with the salton precinct 13 he's obviously the thing

17:51

which is a remake i think from in the world skip to new york

17:54

even has this kind of vibe to it it's

17:57

like a western escape from new york it's you know yeah i mean everything he

18:01

touches and big trouble on china is a perfect example i i would say as well

18:08

whenever i was watching it for this particular time for the podcast i was thinking

18:11

ruddy ruddy piper is Is basically playing Kurt Russell,

18:17

playing this type of role here, you know, not as good as Kurt Russell,

18:21

you know, obviously, but it's very much, you can 100% imagine Kurt Russell in this role.

18:27

Okay. Let me ask you this. When he's got the glasses on and he sees the alien and we see,

18:36

we see subliminal message consume by obey all this stuff.

18:43

And the dude, the alien man, is reading the paper.

18:48

Is he reading a real paper or is he seeing obey, conceal?

18:53

Well, he's an alien, so maybe he's reading the real text. I don't know.

18:58

That's a good point, isn't it? Because he's an alien. I think the sort of subliminal

19:02

stuff is more for the humans to basically brainwash them because they're basically

19:06

using Earth and the humans before moving on to another planet,

19:11

as it's basically said later on.

19:13

So yeah maybe he's just actually reading the news

19:16

you know i like

19:20

the scene where he goes into you know like after that's very straight after

19:23

this he's into the shops and he's like he's seeing

19:26

them all getting their hair done and stuff and they're it's actually

19:29

quite creepy because in the start going for him i think that

19:32

this could have been expanded upon more this this particular scene

19:35

where they go we've got one who can see and

19:39

they all start moving towards him it's actually very creepy well instead

19:42

of them going for him the police come well the

19:45

alien police it's it's kind of a the one drawback i

19:48

have with it is he seems to get away quite easily

19:51

yeah i mean he fucking robs a bank and shoots people

19:53

to shit out of people and stuff yeah there's really no

19:56

at this point threat and he's

20:01

the more of the threat to me if this

20:04

film and i really enjoy this film you know

20:07

there is being honest and being sort of

20:10

like super critical there is a lack of

20:13

tension and threat at times you know oh there's

20:15

no tension or threat yeah but what what

20:18

it does have though is just a good fucking time yeah it's good stuff even at

20:25

the end it sucks when these two get it and so especially david for some reason

20:31

it so it it's done it does Does his job. Yeah. So.

20:37

It's a pretty. But it's a pretty weak death scene. For Nada as well. At the end.

20:43

Yeah. But. I think that's. I think that's the way they wanted to keep it.

20:49

I really do. I really do think that's Carpenter.

20:51

Sticking with the simplicity of certain scenes.

20:55

Like they would do back in the. Like.

20:58

Like the fifties. Yeah. The grocery, I mean, it does pick up the violence quite a bit, actually.

21:04

Oh yeah. So he does, he peppers it on, he peppers it in quite a bit.

21:07

The grocery store scene is funny. I mean, when he walks in with the girl and he goes, yeah, he goes,

21:12

Jesus, he goes, your head looks like it fell into the cheese dip back in 1957.

21:17

And then he turns to the normal woman and he says, you, you're okay.

21:22

This one, real fucking ugly. That's right.

21:26

And then he goes it's you know with the watch he goes i've got

21:29

one that can see you know i think it's her or

21:32

one of the other ones and then it starts that's when they start sort of

21:34

moving towards him yeah um and then you're obviously he

21:37

like fights the cops and stuff and you know whenever they

21:40

come after him but like you say it's all a bit too easy you know well yeah well

21:45

it he gets away with it a couple times because they didn't expect it coming

21:49

then he goes into the bank and he blows the face off one of them so it's brutal

21:54

and i think that's That's why it was black and white when you were seeing that

21:58

shot, because otherwise you'd be pretty brutal.

22:00

So I think that's why some of the violence is.

22:04

Well, it's possible. I know that Quentin Tarantino had to do it,

22:08

or well, he did it anyway with the first Kill Bill.

22:10

You know, that crazy idiot battle where it's just a bloodbath.

22:14

Well, he had for the Western world.

22:18

I actually have watched the color version of it that was released in sort of the Asian market.

22:24

But for the western world version it was filmed and it had to be put in black

22:29

and white due to the I know it's comic book violence but it is you know over

22:32

the top blood splatter and heads rolling you know so maybe yeah it could be the same case here when,

22:39

he has to escape from all this chaos he kidnaps Holly right how convenient and

22:46

oh yeah she just happens to work at the TV station as well really convenient.

22:50

I mean I, She should have sold this better. She's so bland. Now, I don't,

22:56

and obviously this is Carpenter's direction to tell her to be emotionless because

23:00

she's pretty much like a robot. So I don't. Is she like an android?

23:04

What's that? She's like an android? A robot, yeah?

23:07

Yeah, like I just said. Thank you. I was agreeing with you. Yeah,

23:11

but you'd have to repeat it. Is there a fucking echo? What? Is there an echo? People, you see? You see? Obey, consume.

23:23

You know, don't ask questions. Put your glasses on and fuck off.

23:28

So yeah, but that's my point. The point is that is obviously corporate would

23:32

tell her just do it emotionless. Okay.

23:35

Because the big twist that she's involved in all this.

23:38

She's a conspirator. But. Yeah. But a double agent too.

23:42

I see the problem I have with that is that it doesn't work for me because A,

23:46

I wouldn't give a fuck if she was, cause I don't like her already.

23:50

Uh-huh. and yeah that's it

23:53

i mean also it appears she also has super strength as

23:55

well because you can throw rowdy roddy piper

23:59

who's built like a shit brick house a massive and

24:02

he's about twice the size of her but she can like casually with like the flip

24:05

of a hand throw him outside or throw him through a window yeah so yeah she chucks

24:10

him out the window and then when we see him see when she sees him later he's

24:14

like she's like oh yeah i thought i killed you sorry about that and he's He's like, yeah, we're cool.

24:20

And what I don't get, the way she just, the way she presents herself is so boring.

24:26

It's the complete opposite. Is he a body catcher? Yeah. Like he's a clone?

24:29

It's the complete opposite of what we got, what we get from Frank and Nada's character. Yeah.

24:36

Yeah, well, I think they have a connect again, you know, and he's lively,

24:40

whereas Roddy Piper, not the greatest actor, but he has that presence, like you say.

24:46

But yeah, but also what really myths me, I don't know, it's just a bit of a

24:49

sort of plot convenience thing, but despite her being completely emotionless

24:53

and trying to kill him, he falls in love with her, love at first sight. What?

24:58

You know? Oh, I don't think he did that. We'll have to go back for Holly. You know, all this.

25:03

Really? You know, why?

25:06

He's a good guy i know not if

25:09

you were working in the bank that day you know but

25:13

he only killed aliens oh that is true

25:16

no he didn't kill any

25:19

humans i know that i know but it's still quite graphic ah fuck them they're

25:24

aliens fucking assholes so let's talk about the famous was supposed to be a

25:30

few seconds fight scene they trained for a couple weeks for a couple of months And yeah,

25:37

so this is weird because, well, I think only Carpenter could pull this off, maybe Tarantino.

25:46

And the reason I say that, it's brutal, but it's slapsticky.

25:51

It's dragged out too much as well, I think. It's what?

25:54

Dragged out too much. Well, that's what I think.

25:59

I think it's a little too much. But when you ask people about they live,

26:05

they say two things they love about it.

26:08

I'm here to kick ass and chew bubblegum and I'm all out of bubblegum and the

26:13

fight sequence, they love this scene.

26:16

And I think it's kind of overdone.

26:19

It is overdone. And it's not so much overdone, but overly long. It's too long.

26:24

It goes on for ages. It's like, eventually like, well, what do you think overly done means?

26:30

Means well yeah well yeah well overly

26:33

done could also mean like overly acted or whatever you know

26:36

so it could mean several things actually god

26:39

but anyway where's podcast ever well no it's not you know but anyway it's it's

26:46

also it's almost like a fucking advert for wwf as well you know because yeah

26:51

sort of slick moves in there yeah you can tell roddy piper helped out a bit it there,

26:56

some of the stunt work and all.

26:59

It was fun, but I was looking at my watch and I mean, don't get me wrong,

27:07

the outcome of it works because when he makes him put on the glasses finally-

27:13

And he's like, what the fuck? Them walking out of the alley and they're just

27:16

beating the shit out of each other. That is funny.

27:19

So maybe the payoff works for having to be so long because the payoff is funny.

27:25

Yeah. Yeah. But I mean, it could have been edited, I think.

27:28

Also, what that sort of meant for me as well is whenever, and it is funny,

27:32

whenever they're walking down the street to go to the hotel together.

27:35

After, you know, he finally got him to put on the glasses and they're really

27:39

badly injured. And even when they're in the hotel room, they're really,

27:42

really like, you know, beaten up and bruised and cut and all sorts.

27:46

Then they just get a quick shower and then they're like completely cured,

27:49

fixed again, you know, back to normal.

27:53

But see, isn't that what makes Carpenter so good? Because he can get away with this.

27:59

No, no, no. I mean, I still enjoy it. Yeah. No, I'm not saying anything negative.

28:04

Are you listening to anything that's coming out of my mouth?

28:06

I am. I'm agreeing with you. Are you listening to me? No. No,

28:09

you're not. You just. Oh, my God.

28:13

Anyways, let's get. Yeah, well, Carpenter can get away with it because Carpenter can.

28:19

And I do think Tarantino will get away with it because it's.

28:25

I don't know. There's something about it where if there's any other film,

28:30

any other filmmaker that is, and they just did a six minute fight scene way over the top.

28:36

They're wounded and busted we're having a good laugh with them we're walking

28:40

and they can barely stand up and then two seconds later they're like okay let's go fight aliens.

28:45

I think it's because with Tarantino and Carpenter I think it's because it's

28:51

almost like it's self-aware and it's also homage to sort of old sort of B-movies

28:57

that would have done those sorts of things as well people are, the audience,

29:01

people like ourselves are sort of in on the joke with them which is pretty cool,

29:06

Yeah, a carpenter and Tarantino can bring people in like that.

29:09

Yes. Even when he got Rowdy Piper as the lead, and God love him.

29:12

God rest his soul, by the way, he passed down too long ago, a couple of years back.

29:17

But yeah, it's just, there's a, and I use the word a lot, and I'm going to say

29:22

it, there's charm, and it's the charm that makes it.

29:26

Yeah, enthusiasm. It's just there's something about it. It puts a smile on your

29:31

face. Totally, yeah, yeah, definitely.

29:33

So they, when they meet Gilbert at the hotel, and he tells him about this big meeting.

29:40

And then Holly shows up. I'm like, what the fuck's going on here?

29:44

There's actually a really good scene. It's quite a surprise whenever the bomb

29:49

goes off and they're attacked by the alien sort of cops.

29:53

Yeah, I have that on my notes. This is where the killing kind of goes to an art.

29:58

This is the rating starts kicking in a bit because the last act of this film

30:03

is all aliens is getting blown up and this part, the humans are getting it.

30:07

And there's women getting shot in the back as they're running away and they

30:12

don't pull any punches here. No, it basically is just to put the point where it turns into Assault on Precinct 13.

30:20

Yeah, I saw that, especially in the alleyway. Yes, I saw that. It did have glimpses of that.

30:26

And I do love, oh, we got this watch and it makes them transport.

30:30

Like, no way. Yeah, but we don't know the code. So Frank and Nada are running, and they drop the watch.

30:38

Oh, here's your destination.

30:41

Oh, what is that? Oh, you must have set the – so come on.

30:46

I don't, but again, it's part of the sort of – it's tongue-in-cheek.

30:50

Almost remember then on the joke yeah and then they they jumped in the little

30:54

hall and then boom they're the headquarters i love i absolutely love whenever

30:59

they go to basically the alien airport you know where the people are could just

31:03

like being zapped off into space you know yeah.

31:07

Where they weren't on the top tower where are they looking out of what window was that,

31:13

who knows you know don't make sense you know what i mean it's

31:16

just it's they're they're they're fucking out in space

31:18

now you know it's it's no longer who knows and

31:22

i love even you know their former mate

31:25

who's basically portrayed them but yeah you know the the homeless guy

31:28

yeah i love her he says yeah where instead

31:31

of explaining it he says that's just something to do with folded up space time

31:35

or something you know what i mean it's just like again that's a joke to say

31:38

is we're not even going to try and explain this shit yeah well you just run

31:43

with it you can get aware of this the The Hollywood one line fix,

31:46

right? Yeah. And I love that. I love when he's just named the homeless guy, but Buck Flower,

31:53

who's the one who betrays him. He's in his tux.

31:57

And I love how. He's sold out completely. I love how there's nobody in the corridors

32:03

and these guys have got fucking, they're armed to the teeth.

32:06

They walk into a formal dinner of some sort and none of them says anything to him.

32:11

And Nicholas Buck Flower, he's like, Like, oh, hey guys, what's up?

32:16

Are you here for the meeting? And they're like, uh, yeah, sure.

32:19

Can I invest for the occasion, he says, or something like that.

32:23

And then they ask him, why are you doing this? And he says, oh,

32:27

it's for fame and stuff and wealth.

32:31

And so wait a minute, they did say, he said something about they're treating

32:37

this planet as a third world.

32:40

They're just using us for the resources and then leaving?

32:43

Pretty much so and then he says so why not

32:46

get rich off the back of it by helping them out he sold out completely

32:49

so he has but won't they if he

32:52

what resources are they taking i believe

32:55

it's i don't even think that's fully explained but

32:58

it's something like just natural resources and i think

33:02

well won't we die then and what's what's what

33:04

good is that gonna do him well i don't know maybe he's planning

33:07

on being whisked off you know and space airport and the

33:10

tv station you know to their planet which

33:13

again just totally reminded me of the twilight zone and that famous episode

33:18

of the twilight zone to serve man oh yeah yeah people are going on holidays

33:22

to the alien planet but with a very dark twist you know so when they start blowing shit up and yeah.

33:32

And going through the corridors, blowing everyone away. Everyone's getting shot

33:36

and they got contacts on now.

33:39

So, and. Again, convenience, so they don't have to wear the glasses.

33:43

Well, that actually works for me. I was aware of that. And then. Oh no.

33:46

So they, they, they go in and they start blowing everyone away and then he'll

33:51

stop and talk to a secretary. Oh, hey, lovely. Listen, do you know how we can get to the blah, blah?

33:56

And she's like, yeah, I just go this way. Thank you. Oh, she's, he's, he's human.

34:00

That's why he's talking to her so nicely. And then he'll blow the shit out of

34:03

someone else. Yeah, like a myth. So you know the ones he's killing are the baddies.

34:08

Yep, the aliens. Yeah, I thought that was kind of funny.

34:12

And then he'd start, you'd be like, yeah, blowing everyone away.

34:14

And then two seconds later, oh, hey, sweetie, do you know where I can get a.

34:17

You expect to be on the charmer? It's quick, but it's a cheat and it works.

34:25

Again, I don't think I'd appreciate it in other films, but this one,

34:29

we're going with it, right? And it's when Frank gets it, man, right at this point, I can't remember what

34:39

I felt of Holly when I first saw it. Did I figure it out or not?

34:43

It's not really a big plot twist, but she just walks up behind him.

34:46

It's like a really weird cut. She comes up behind him. It cuts away. Yeah, and it cuts away.

34:52

And then she shows up on the roof without Frank. And then obviously Nada puts

34:57

the pieces together, but it's a nice cheat.

35:01

But it shouldn't work, but it does. Does it make any sense what I'm saying?

35:05

No, no, I know what you're saying. It's basically, I mean, yes,

35:08

he's killed off screen, especially, which is a bit weird considering all the

35:11

violence that we've just witnessed. So, you know, maybe the effect or whatever, you know, didn't work right and

35:18

they didn't have time to shoot it again or Keith David wasn't available or whatever.

35:21

So they just, you know, made that quick edit. Who knows?

35:24

I mean, generally, this film, there's a lot of, you could pick holes in this all day.

35:29

But I'm not picking a hole at it. That's my point. No, I know that.

35:32

It works for some reason.

35:36

Yeah, yeah. I mean, I think with this film overall, it gets away with a lot

35:42

because it is so likable, essentially.

35:47

Yeah, yeah. I know, but I don't know. And I think as well, again,

35:54

come back to the, I think we're in on the joke with Carpenter.

35:58

It's a nudge and a wink and homage to sort of B-movies, 50s B-movies and all sorts.

36:03

It's that old saying, you're laughing with it, not at it. 100%.

36:09

But yeah, so they live. Yeah, I have. And I revisit it once every few years. Same here.

36:16

But it's, of all my Carpenters, it's not one of my favorites.

36:20

Which the last couple we did was In the Mouth of Madness and just this one.

36:24

And there are two, there'd probably be two, even though I love all the Carpenter

36:28

stuff, period. All of them. Yes. These two would be at the bottom, believe it or not. Really?

36:33

Yeah. This would be one of my favorite Carpenters? Yeah, this would be, there's some, there's, I just can't, you know,

36:39

Salted Priest, like 13, The Thing, Halloween, Big Trouble in Old China,

36:44

Escape from New York, Escape from LA, Starman, Christine.

36:49

Christine i mean prince of darkness these are

36:52

far superior films yes yes i know that they're

36:54

they are far better films and they're most definitely

36:58

far better carpenter films you know in terms from a

37:01

technical part of you but again this one is just it's just so like it puts a

37:05

smile on my face yeah yeah you're right and like i said just because it's lower

37:09

my carpenter scale my carpenter scale is fucking everything's above you know

37:13

way above water here so So it's not an insult, but you're right.

37:18

At the end of the day, it's just good comic book fun.

37:22

And the aliens look cool as fuck as well. You know, with their sort of,

37:26

they look like basically zombies, because that's obviously a play on people

37:29

who are sort of brainwashed by consumerism, that they're basically zombies.

37:34

I just like the fact you need them on my skinless.

37:37

Yeah, you know. Yeah, they're quite ghoulish looking. And, I mean,

37:41

it even ends on a big joke where, you know, it's basically the fella and the

37:45

girl's having sex, and he's an alien. He goes, and this is when we're going to see them all. He goes,

37:50

what's the matter, baby? Or something like that. There's Siskel and Ebert are in it as well.

37:55

As the movie reviewers are complaining about too much violence in films by Carpenter

37:59

and Romero. Yeah, that was funny.

38:03

Yeah, don't get me wrong. It's definitely a good time.

38:07

And it's nice taking a break after seeing, talking about that,

38:11

just depressing down her dead man's shoes as good as it was.

38:17

Yes. All right. Oh, in terms of toneness, it's like a world away. Yeah.

38:22

So next up, we're going to be going back to the gritty crime with the long good

38:27

Friday with Bob Hoskins and the very young Helen Mirren.

38:33

And so join us for that one. And the new issue of Phantasmagoria is out now.

38:38

It's available on Amazon worldwide and, of course, locally here in Forbidden

38:41

Planet and other stores within the U.S.

38:44

Yep. You could give us a shout here. citizenframe underscore

38:48

podcast on instagram and of course facebook give

38:52

us a shout they live was a recommendation a few

38:55

times by a couple different people and so we

38:58

do honor most requests if they come through and we'll certainly try to tackle

39:03

them in a quick and timely manner we will update as long as we don't fuck up

39:10

the recording again and trevor doesn't echo me,

39:16

At Trevor doesn't echo me. You know what? I opened the window on that one. I fucked up.

39:22

I opened the window on that one. All right, guys. Listen, take care of yourselves. We'll chat soon.

39:27

Music.