0:01

Hey everyone, you're listening to Code Switch, I'm

0:03

B.A. Parker. Now I

0:06

grew up on the educational side of black

0:08

social media and I'm forever

0:10

grateful because it taught me this word,

0:13

massage noir. It was coined

0:15

by the scholar Moya Bailey and it became

0:17

this gift of a word. The

0:20

term massage noir named my

0:22

experience as a young black woman, experiencing

0:25

racialized sexism and sexist

0:27

racism targeted towards my

0:29

blackness. Once I

0:31

could name it, I could see it and

0:33

I could put it out on the internet or on

0:36

the street. It's

0:38

that uneasy feeling that bubbles up

0:40

when you hear certain people's critiques of Beyonce

0:43

or when people look at Serena Williams'

0:45

tennis stats and don't want to call her the greatest

0:48

of all time or very recently

0:50

in the commentary around around making The Stallion

0:52

and

0:52

her assault. All

0:54

of it is misogynoir. And

0:57

this season of NPR's Latter Than a Riot

0:59

tackles what that means for hip hop,

1:01

past and present. So

1:04

we're going to play part of an episode

1:06

for you that dives into the way

1:08

the current hip hop climate shapes

1:10

women's bodies and the female

1:12

rappers who are fighting

1:14

back.

1:16

A warning before we begin. This

1:18

podcast is explicit in

1:20

every way. When did

1:22

you first start to think that surgery was

1:25

an option? What interested you in it? Honestly,

1:28

what interested me in surgery

1:30

was I was in a relationship and he used

1:32

to always make fun of my football.

1:35

And for y'all I don't know what football is, it's

1:38

fat upper pussy area. I

1:40

don't know if you curse on here, but that's what it is. Yeah,

1:43

you can curse, yeah. That's Dream Doll. The

1:45

Bronx rapper is short in height, only

1:47

about five feet tall

1:49

with a very curvaceous stature.

1:52

She definitely got that,

1:53

ah, ah, ah. I got the hookah, who

1:55

got the bottles, who got the ah, ah, ah. Got

1:58

a new bitch, got a new body. She's

2:01

open about how her body got that way. So

2:04

he used to always make fun of my

2:06

little love hand-dos

2:08

and stuff. So I was like, come

2:11

on. I was so young, I was in relationship. He's

2:13

making me feel insecure about stuff. And

2:16

then I wound up going to get me a nice little light bow.

2:19

And then I wound up leaving him after I got the

2:21

light bow. But I thought

2:23

about it after. Did I just really go get my

2:26

waist snatched with this man?

2:27

It wasn't just a whack boyfriend telling her how her body

2:30

should look, because those messages were everywhere

2:32

when dream was coming up. It was the early

2:35

2000s, peak of the video vixen era in rap,

2:37

where women with big booties would get name recognition

2:40

in songs, magazine spreads,

2:43

even awards for being super voluptuous.

2:45

Yeah. In the 2010s, celebrities

2:47

like Kim Kardashian and Nicki Minaj were

2:50

setting a new standard for an exaggerated

2:52

aesthetic.

2:53

Whether an artist or arm candy, Hip-hop

2:56

made it clear that having a baddy body

2:59

was required for entry. Do you feel

3:01

like getting some of these surgeries

3:04

was like cost for investing in yourself?

3:06

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.

3:09

It was definitely an investment for myself.

3:11

I've seen a change in my life and

3:13

it's fucked up, but it's

3:16

my story. So this

3:18

pressure that magazines, label execs,

3:21

and boyfriends put on Dream and people

3:23

like her, it's not coming out of nowhere.

3:26

It's a direct result of the male gaze.

3:29

The idea that everything women do is

3:31

in the eye of what cis straight men wanna

3:33

see. And from watching video vixens,

3:36

to working bottle service at a strip club,

3:39

to entering the rap game herself, Dream

3:41

definitely knew what straight men wanted to

3:43

see.

3:44

If you're a fire, it's no reason why

3:46

my talent, like my talent should always speak

3:48

first. And

3:50

I feel like it don't be like that. It's really

3:52

unfair. I just feel like

3:56

it's just always about was on the outside

3:58

first. Dream felt watched

4:01

by that gaze, and it led her to getting

4:03

lipo and then a breast enhancement. But

4:05

the surgery she really wanted though, was a

4:07

BBL.

4:10

A BBL is a Brazilian

4:13

butt lift. That's when you turn your butt

4:16

to a gut. I mean, sorry.

4:19

That's when you turn your... That's when you

4:21

turn your gut to a butt.

4:24

How you do that? Lipo.

4:27

wherever you want to remove and you put

4:29

it wherever you want to put it or you could throw it away. It's

4:31

up to you.

4:32

Today BBL's are well known.

4:35

In fact in the past 10 years in the US

4:38

the BBL has become one of the most

4:40

popular cosmetic procedures. There's

4:42

tons of easy ways to find info about it.

4:44

But back in 2010s testimonials

4:47

and advice about getting the procedure were

4:50

hard to come by. When I first thought about

4:52

getting a BBL I I was asking people a lot.

4:54

I was like on RealSelf and I'm

4:57

a review queen. I'm gonna read everything.

5:00

So I was doing research for a very long

5:02

time. I felt like people

5:05

used their doctor as like the Krabby Patty formula.

5:08

And people don't wanna put

5:11

people on. I just was like, I wanna

5:13

talk about it, you

5:14

know.

5:16

But the secrecy did not stop dreaming.

5:19

in 2012 at 20 years old, she

5:21

got that work. I

5:23

went to Columbia and I

5:25

got my first BBL. I was just

5:27

a little scared a little bit because I heard

5:29

it's so painful.

5:34

But coming back from Columbia with that

5:36

waist teeny body dreamy,

5:38

Dream initially loved the results she got.

5:41

Like I got, I had these nice hips

5:44

and a little booty.

5:46

The fat litter really erased. I

5:49

would never forget. But

5:50

it didn't last.

5:57

I'm Rodney Carmichael. Sydney

6:00

Madden. And from M3R Music,

6:03

this is louder than a riot. Where

6:05

we confront the double standard that's become

6:07

the standard. On

6:09

every episode this season, we tackle one

6:12

unwritten rule of hip hop that affects the most

6:14

marginalized among us and holds

6:16

the entire culture back.

6:17

And one that a new generation

6:20

of rap refuses to stand for.

6:23

On this episode, we're gonna break down how the male

6:26

gaze, these those of us under it, objectified,

6:29

consumed, and shamed for not fitting

6:31

into the mold. This is called body

6:33

policing, and it happens everywhere, especially

6:36

in hip hop.

6:38

We're telling the stories of three artists who've

6:40

all dealt with their bodies being policed in different

6:42

ways. Dream Doll takes me

6:44

through the cost of chasing perfection. Someone

6:47

always has something to say. Everybody

6:49

has a comment on your body. It's

6:52

like, if you're not true, they're talking

6:54

about it. If you have surgery done, they have something

6:56

to say. It's just always something

6:58

to say.

6:59

Baby Tay teaches me

7:01

how to clap back at the haters. People think it's

7:03

fun. It's like, ooh,

7:05

let's all join

7:08

in and bash on the black woman, kiki,

7:10

kiki, kiki.

7:11

And Dochie breaks down how she took

7:13

on the patriarchy by baring it all. It's

7:15

something about the woman's

7:18

body specifically that

7:20

really triggers people. On this

7:22

episode, rule number three, Beauty

7:26

is in the eye of the male gaze.

7:47

So talk to me about Life in

7:49

Plastic 3. This is the finale. There's

7:52

not gonna be another one, right? No, this is the trilogy. This

7:54

is the finale, Life in Plastic 3. This

7:57

is me closing. This is my closure.

8:00

When I sat down with Dream back in September

8:02

of last year, she had just dropped

8:04

her third album in a trilogy called

8:07

Life in Plastic. If someone had never

8:09

heard of this trilogy before, why did you name it Life in

8:11

Plastic?

8:12

Yes. What's the metaphor to it? I named my

8:15

project Life in Plastic because

8:17

I feel like people just look at me like a pretty

8:20

face sometimes or

8:23

a nice picture.

8:24

I'm not just this girl from Instagram that

8:27

can sit there and smile and a bitch and wear nice stuff.

8:29

No, I got a story just

8:32

like everybody else.

8:33

I got a check for telling ya bitches. Talk

8:35

to me nice, so don't talk to me twice. Now,

8:40

maybe ya'll listen.

8:43

Dream used the Life in Plastic trilogy to

8:45

tell her a story. And a big part of that story

8:47

began when she started getting work done on

8:49

her body. So I always thought about Dream

8:52

Doll, the doll you would dream

8:54

to be. That's

8:56

what I did when I kind of created my character.

8:59

Life in Plastic has songs like Barbie

9:02

Girl that talk about becoming

9:04

a fantasy. Thanks in part to surgeries

9:07

like the BBL, Dream Got Done in Columbia.

9:10

B B B B B

9:12

B B B B B

9:15

B B B B B

9:17

B B B B B

9:20

B

9:20

B B B B B

9:23

B B B B B

9:25

and keep the ideal body.

9:28

In Life in Plastic 2, she talks

9:31

about that frustration. They

9:32

don't see my potential, my pictures

9:35

off IG. Cause fuck likes,

9:37

it's no love left inside me.

9:41

I had these nice hips and

9:43

a little booty

9:46

and it literally erased. I

9:49

was working out and it was like, my hips

9:51

was going. I was like, I need something

9:53

that's going to stick.

9:55

What happened to Dream's results is pretty common.

9:57

It's actually the natural progression of most BVLs.

10:00

Do you perform Brazilian butt

10:02

lifts at your practice? I absolutely

10:04

do. I just finished doing a procedure about

10:06

two hours ago. That's

10:09

Dr. Kelly Bolden, a licensed plastic

10:11

and reconstructive surgeon in the Washington, D.C.

10:13

area.

10:14

Dr. Bolden has been practicing since 2011. Now,

10:18

at the time that Dream got her first BBL,

10:21

she didn't know what it would take to keep it looking like new. Dr.

10:24

Bolden says in a world where surgery is seen as

10:26

a quick fix, that aftercare and maintenance,

10:29

it often gets overlooked. The biggest portion

10:31

of upkeep is maintaining a stable weight because

10:34

significant weight loss or weight gain can affect your

10:36

results. With BBLs or with fat transfer

10:38

in general,

10:40

the average person will keep anywhere

10:42

between 50 to 70% of

10:44

the fat that you graft. So

10:47

depending on what shape

10:49

and size you're looking for, some people will require more

10:51

than one procedure. And needing multiple

10:53

procedures can also increase the risk.

10:56

According

10:56

to the Aesthetic Surgery, Education

10:58

and Research Foundation, BBLs

11:00

have the highest mortality rate of any

11:03

cosmetic surgery in the U.S. The

11:05

unreliable long-term results can also

11:07

lead people to look for alternative solutions.

11:10

When Dream couldn't keep the weight on where she wanted it,

11:13

she ended up choosing a more drastic option.

11:15

So I went the legal

11:17

route and it was not the best

11:20

decision. I do not recommend getting

11:22

butt shots. Please don't ever

11:24

do it. It is so painful. It feels like

11:26

you got ran off of my truck.

11:28

No, I know you've definitely heard of butt

11:30

shots before. Remember Nicki Minaj's

11:32

verse in Ask where she said, it's finally solved?

11:46

Unlike a BBL that injects someone's

11:48

own fat from another part of their body, butt

11:51

shots are injections that can be made up of

11:53

any number of foreign materials. things

11:56

ranging from hyaluronic acids, which are FDA

11:58

approved, to... silicones,

12:00

gels, or mineral

12:02

oils, which are definitely not. They

12:04

do give you tremendous amount of volume,

12:06

but they're very dangerous because, again, your body recognizes

12:08

them as foreign material, and

12:11

it tends to wall them off,

12:13

especially when you're not doing it in a medical

12:15

setting because a lot of times they don't tell you what it is.

12:18

It can have very, very catastrophic complications.

12:21

And Dream found herself on the bad side

12:23

of those complications.

12:24

She ended up in the hospital. What was

12:27

the pain like? Whatever

12:31

the highest number you could put is the highest number. Highest

12:34

number. Like during the pain, I

12:36

couldn't take the pain. And

12:39

I was like getting fevers

12:41

and I'd be in a hospital and

12:44

nobody knew, they didn't know what was wrong with me.

12:48

Cause I didn't feel comfortable telling them I did

12:50

that. Yeah.

12:53

This was a turning point for Dream where

12:55

she felt the cost of trying to achieve the unattainable.

12:58

Dream realized that going under the knife illegally

13:01

was giving the male gaze more than it's pound

13:03

of flesh. So I just tried to find somebody

13:05

to take it on. They were like, that was a problem.

13:09

You know, it's a foreign object, so you

13:12

gotta remove it one day. After this scary,

13:15

painful experience, and realizing

13:17

she put more value in these standards

13:20

than her own health, Dream was determined

13:22

to never repeat this mistake. And

13:24

to show other girls who wanted to get these surgeries,

13:27

the whole process, not just the pretty results.

13:30

You have to get your massages with her, okay?

13:33

In 2019, she started vlogging her whole

13:35

journey to remove her shots and get a new

13:38

BBL. And this shit hurts. Out

13:40

for the most disturbing part of the day. Getting

13:43

my shots removed was the best thing that I ever

13:45

did in my life. And that's why I vlogged

13:47

a lot about surgery because it's like,

13:50

even like with removing like anything,

13:52

like butt shots or anything, like people

13:55

don't talk about that. It's crazy. And

13:57

when you take it out, it looks disgusting.

13:59

and then we.

14:00

looks like Chicken Grizzle. That's

14:02

what my sister said it looks like. I

14:04

probably over told my experience when I

14:06

was in Columbia, even when I

14:08

was in a recovery house, you know, being

14:10

a little bit too

14:13

free-smeached. But

14:15

I just felt like maybe it

14:17

took me to go through

14:20

it to like want to help other people. But

14:22

now I'm 100% product free. And

14:28

I'm just trying to help any females out there that I did

14:30

make the mistake that I did. So

14:33

far, Dream has had four rounds of removal.

14:36

And the openness in her vlogs has helped

14:38

to demystify butt shots and removals

14:40

for a lot of people. In fact, others

14:43

have started to come to her for advice. Even

14:45

people, girls that I thought they didn't like me, they're like, girl,

14:47

can you please help me? Okay, still

14:50

help them, because I have a good heart at

14:52

the end of the day. And

14:55

no one helped you, right? So you wanted to help others. No

14:57

one helped me, and that's why I think I did

14:59

it. Because it's like, no one helped

15:01

me, but maybe this might help somebody.

15:04

And talking with others helped Dream too, because

15:06

it gave her a chance to reflect. I went

15:08

through the stage of wanting a big butt and

15:10

big boobs, you know,

15:12

really embellish my body. To

15:15

now, I just want to remove everything

15:17

and be back to my, It's like,

15:20

I wish I could rewind by the time and get my natural

15:22

body back. Like I really want my

15:24

natural body back and I'm trying what is just like,

15:27

it's not easy. As

15:29

she's gotten older and left toxic

15:32

exes in the dust, she's

15:34

caught on to the catch 22 of it. Dream

15:37

sees the power that her body gave her and

15:40

she sees the power she gave to the male gaze. So

15:42

looking back, would you not get any surgeries at all?

15:45

Is that what you're saying? I don't know because I don't

15:47

know I'll be where I am today. Yep.

15:50

I think it's really brave how you talk about this. Yeah,

15:52

I don't care. You could judge

15:55

me. It'll matter.

15:56

So that's really what Life in Plastic 3 is

15:58

about.

16:00

acknowledging that Catch-22

16:02

and moving through it anyway. And then

16:04

Life in Classic 3, the cover art described it. And Life in Classic 3

16:06

is the doll head done, the finished project.

16:09

It's wrapped up, Sarand wrapped.

16:12

That's why I'm Sarand wrapped on a thing.

16:15

You know, now she's ready to brush her hair. She

16:18

got the nail polished. She's

16:20

polished and she's ready

16:23

to go out there and venture and to

16:26

a new world. I wanted to

16:28

let her go.

16:29

And that's how I came up with Misunderstood. I

16:32

try to take a jab at being vulnerable

16:34

just because there's some people that still discovering

16:36

me even after hearing me today.

16:39

Like, you know, people still discover me. They don't

16:41

really know my story. So

16:43

I wanted to reintroduce my story

16:45

to the fresh, fresh years and

16:48

be vulnerable. Before

16:49

I get any of it, I need some ass and some

16:51

tits. I ain't ashamed of it. I learned

16:53

the game from me. Double

16:55

D, Dream Doll made my name from

16:57

me. I really had

16:58

to learn, like, you can't do anything for

17:00

anyone's pleasures. You

17:13

have to just love yourself and do

17:15

it for yourself.

17:16

If you want to get that BBL, baby, go get that BBL.

17:19

And that's that.

17:23

For Dream, the surgeries are not

17:25

the root of the problem. the pressure.

17:28

And she's working on tuning out that pressure and

17:31

focusing on what she wants. What's

17:33

right for her music, her career,

17:35

and her body. Natural or

17:38

not.

17:39

But there's nothing that male gaze aids

17:41

more than being ignored. One

17:44

Atlanta artist learned that the hard way.

17:47

After this, baby take.

17:53

I'm never going to put a knife to this body

17:56

because it's like for what? did

17:58

a great job. Baby

18:00

Tate, and she is not aspiring

18:02

to the industry standard that says you gotta have

18:04

your stomach on flat flat, ass

18:06

on what's that?

18:07

I wanna be that representation to

18:10

let people know you don't have to. And

18:12

you can still be as glamorous as

18:14

you want to be without fitting

18:17

into literally this cookie cutter image.

18:20

Tate turns her middle finger to the male gaze

18:22

on the regular. The Atlanta artist

18:25

brings that energy to her music too. She's

18:27

unapologetic in praising herself, her

18:30

body, and her all-around bad ass-ery.

18:38

One of her biggest songs to date is all

18:40

about self-affirmation.

18:49

But something that happened in 2021 made it clear the

18:53

male gaze was still gonna come

18:55

for her joy. Let's start

18:57

at the very beginning. Do you remember getting

18:59

the call or the invitation

19:02

to perform at Afropunk?

19:03

I do remember being excited about Afropunk

19:06

because I'd always been to Afropunk

19:09

and loved going. And this

19:11

was my first time doing Atlanta

19:13

on the big stage. And so I was super excited about

19:16

it. And if you've ever been to Afropunk,

19:18

especially in Atlanta,

19:20

the scene, the outfits,

19:23

it's just so free. It's so

19:25

free. Yeah,

19:26

Afropunk. I mean, it's like a festival

19:28

made for us by us. And

19:31

the lineup for Atlanta that year was fire. Wale,

19:34

Rico Nasty, Foushe. You

19:37

know, the Cats that go, they on a different level

19:39

too. Baby Tate was just the same.

19:42

She had her original fit laid

19:44

out in her mind like the first day of school. I

19:46

started, you know, getting outfits together.

19:49

I had ordered these bubblegum

19:51

pink Rick Owens boots and I was like, I'm gonna

19:53

wear these. And I think

19:55

I had an outfit that I was going to

19:58

wear at a different show, but I was like, No, I'm gonna wear it.

20:00

afro punk with these boots and it's gonna be perfect. Until

20:02

those bubblegum pink Rick Owens boots

20:04

showed up the day before in the wrong

20:07

color. And I was so sad because now

20:09

my entire outfit is ruined and now I have to

20:11

find something else to wear. So she called up a

20:13

designer to get a whole new fit last

20:16

minute. And the next day they came

20:18

through with a backup. A custom made

20:20

cheetah print fit and a matching

20:22

floor length puffer coat. Bow.

20:24

Now this fit was

20:27

not meant for the body shy. It

20:29

was a halter neck crop top with

20:31

matching low-rise pants made of this

20:33

skin-tight stretchy material

20:35

and a black G-string. Tape

20:37

literally had to squeeze into it and

20:40

it was designed to be bold and revealing, leaving

20:42

parts of a midsection totally exposed.

20:45

It was very, very weird trying to get

20:47

it on. I'm literally just like twisting

20:50

these two, basically these two chaps

20:53

that were supposed to go around my neck and

20:55

then have like these, this little

20:57

thong

20:57

piece. The tape was trying to live out her

20:59

Disney Channel dreams and serve

21:02

sexy cheetah girl, but the vision

21:04

wasn't quite coming together right.

21:06

We were literally running late, so I was like,

21:08

I gotta go, there's nothing else I can do, there's nothing

21:11

else I can wear, I have nothing else. So

21:13

it wasn't, the way that I'm wearing

21:15

it was not how it's supposed to look. Like,

21:17

I don't think my stomach was supposed to be even out like that.

21:20

As Tate scrambled to get ready, out

21:22

in the crowd, a photographer named Megan

21:24

Sumpton was just pulling up.

21:26

This was my first time at Afropunk. As

21:28

far as festival atmosphere, it's probably one

21:30

of the coolest I've ever been in because everybody

21:33

was just being themselves. Honestly,

21:35

I think I arrived

21:35

right as

21:38

she was going on stage. I walked

21:40

into the pit.

21:42

Everybody

21:46

was like hyping her up, like yelling

21:50

her name or

21:52

just like singing the words

22:00

to her song. Megan loved how free Tate

22:02

looked. Sporting a candy striped pink

22:04

wig and some fly ass sunglasses. Tate

22:07

rapped, sang, and got the crowd going

22:09

wild.

22:22

I hate to call people, oh you're so confident.

22:24

I know that's annoying but I guess that's

22:26

what just stuck out in my head.

22:29

She's on stage in front of all these people

22:31

with her stomach out and like people

22:33

are like really judgmental. She

22:36

doesn't have a six pack or she doesn't have extremely

22:38

flat stomachs so the fact that she

22:40

came out here just shows like what kind of person she

22:42

is. Just like a carefree

22:45

like kind of like I love my body and that's

22:48

what it is. Tate was given

22:50

all that totally unbothered. I'm

22:53

not about to back down. I'm not about to say oh I

22:55

can't perform because my stomach's out. No,

22:57

I'm about to go in on that stage and I'm gonna kill

23:00

it. Period. So that's what it

23:02

was. And when I came out, oh

23:04

my God, everybody in the crowd was screaming.

23:08

And I think people seeing me out

23:10

there like that in person was

23:13

like, wow. This girl right

23:15

here really just came out like

23:17

this with this long puffer coat.

23:20

I looked great, honestly.

23:21

My name is Baby Tate. You know, today

23:24

I pulled up the

23:26

Pink Pussy Cheetah-licious drip. Yeah!

23:28

It's good! But

23:31

normally, you know, I pull up in a

23:33

little rainbow Cadillac. And

23:37

for me, I was having a great time. I

23:39

was on top of the world after the performance because people

23:42

loved it.

23:48

After Tay said, Megan took her

23:50

camera, circulated through the festival a

23:52

little bit. I was trying to find people to take pictures

23:54

of, like, with their outfits, and I happened

23:57

to turn around and she was standing

23:59

there. and she had like a

24:01

line of people waiting to meet her. And

24:04

so I was just like snapping pictures of them like

24:06

meeting her or talking to her and you're

24:09

hearing the conversations and you know they're like, oh my God,

24:11

you know, you look good sis. I'm so excited

24:13

to meet you. And I

24:16

even asked her, I said, hey, can I

24:18

take some pictures of you? And she was like, sure.

24:21

I was like, your set was really dope.

24:28

So the festival's a wrap. Megan

24:30

flies home, still vibing from her first

24:32

Afro punk.

24:33

When she sits down to edit her photos from the festival,

24:36

Tate stand out.

24:38

She looks like a boss, totally in command.

24:41

But it still doesn't stop Megan from worrying.

24:44

And I honestly was hesitant

24:46

on posting them. And

24:49

that is simply because I know how harsh

24:51

people are. Certain

24:53

ones, I was like, maybe I'll leave these out or

24:55

maybe I'll crop it. I know how critical

24:57

people are of women in hip-hop. I

25:00

watch it all the time. I

25:03

was like, I do not want to add fuel to the fire to

25:05

where she's getting dragged.

25:07

I actually had picked some different ones than the

25:09

ones I ended up posting, and they were

25:11

cropped, tighter, so it didn't

25:14

show her stomach. I know that

25:16

sounds bad, but I really just was like,

25:18

I do not want any problems.

25:21

Like I know how mean people are online.

25:24

So I was like, I don't want it to be because

25:27

of me. If that ain't the male gaze

25:29

on 1000, Megan's looking out

25:31

for baby tape by self-censoring her own

25:33

photography. Cause she knows the

25:35

trolls will be lurking. So did

25:37

it make you upset that you had to like police your

25:40

work like that? Because you knew that it

25:42

would be criticized by

25:45

the internet?

25:46

A little bit. Cause it's like

25:48

you would like to freely post the work

25:50

that you did and they

25:52

were nice pictures it wasn't like she

25:55

looked bad to me or anything

25:57

She didn't look bad.

25:59

While Megan Hill back- her photos, baby Tate

26:01

let them rip. She posted the full photos,

26:04

uncropped. It wasn't until I posted pictures

26:06

on my Instagram that

26:09

you get the trolls and the haters because

26:11

that's where they live on the internet. They don't live

26:13

in real life. It just blew up into

26:16

something even bigger and getting comments

26:18

from people that don't got nothing to do with nothing.

26:21

And the comments kept coming too. She can lose 10

26:23

pounds. You should work that belly off

26:26

though. And most of these comments, they

26:28

were from other women. That's the thing about

26:30

the male gaze. It doesn't care whose

26:33

eyes it's looking through. Shit, sometimes

26:36

internalized misogynoir comes for the girls

26:38

too. A lot of times people just enjoy

26:40

disrespecting women, especially

26:44

black women. It's just like a, a

26:47

battle that

26:49

we have to go through, just because,

26:52

especially now with social media, people

26:54

think it's fun. It's like, ooh,

26:57

let's all join

26:59

in and bash on the black woman. Ki-ki-ki-ki-ki.

27:03

Whether you go the surgery route or you rocking

27:05

the body guy I gave you, you damned if

27:07

you do and damned if you don't. It's like

27:09

there's no way for women to just be.

27:12

And for us, it's like,

27:15

you all are having fun, but this is my

27:17

life. This is my livelihood.

27:19

This is my mental and emotional

27:21

health and people don't care.

27:25

You not about to talk to me crazy and just walk

27:27

away. No, come back to your phone. I

27:31

want to say something too. She came

27:33

back for the trolls hard. She

27:36

lit one coming up so bad typing,

27:38

girl, you should mind your business and work

27:40

your money up so you can stop wearing synthetic

27:43

wigs. Don't tell me what to do with my body.

27:45

You feel the face, creepy looking grimly.

27:47

I started off on the low road, I'm not gonna lie.

27:49

I definitely did, I was clapping back at people like, you

27:52

need to go feed your kids, I don't know why you worried about what I'm eating.

27:54

I was definitely clapping back.

27:56

Megan was watching all this go down on

27:58

the TL. Reaction- Lace's

28:00

photos went exactly like she thought

28:02

it would. Let's focus on the

28:04

music. This is what can rap, like for

28:06

real. But we can't even get past that, cause we're so

28:08

busy. What was she wearing here

28:10

and why? Or what, like what is this outfit?

28:13

Or what does she look like? Or have

28:15

you even seen when people have had bad makeup days,

28:18

a bad hair day, and it's just like, they're torn apart.

28:20

What about that rapper that got a bad lineup?

28:22

You don't hear nothing about that. That's a lot of bad

28:25

lineups in hip hop. Right, so

28:26

we don't hear about that though. We're going to hear about how

28:29

her lace wasn't melted

28:30

though, and who did her makeup.

28:33

So when you saw Tate posting so openly and

28:35

clapping back on the trolls and all that,

28:38

did that kind of give you the go-ahead to go ahead and let your

28:41

pics out?

28:41

Yes, I saw it. She was trending. And

28:43

I was just like, what is she trending for? And then I

28:46

went and looked. I was like, oh, wow. As soon as I

28:48

saw it, I said, OK, let me go ahead then.

28:50

Because she's with it. So that's

28:53

when I actually posted my carousel. People were like,

28:55

thank you for posting these, because now we can see

28:58

what a real body looks like.

28:59

And the comments of support kept rolling in,

29:02

not just from Tate's fans, but from big

29:04

names that Tate's a fan of.

29:06

Rihanna reaching out to me was totally

29:09

left field.

29:13

Oh yeah, you heard right, Rihanna.

29:15

I was not expecting that at all. And

29:19

she was, you know, I think

29:21

the biggest artist to reach out to me,

29:23

but I definitely had a lot of different other

29:26

peers that reached out and just saying like,

29:28

you know, your body is beautiful, sis.

29:30

That moment really almost definitely did

29:33

a 180 from what people thought it was gonna do. They

29:35

thought I was gonna be crying in the

29:37

RR, crying on the bus and

29:40

going to the doctor, getting surgery,

29:42

nope.

29:43

So Tay posted a new pic on Instagram. We

29:46

asked her to read the caption for us. As

29:49

Queen B once said, Wanna

29:51

see some real ass? Baby, here's your chance.

29:54

Shout out to all my natural belly bodies.

29:56

I see you, I am you, I love

29:59

you. No matter

30:00

what my body looks like, it is mine

30:02

and I love it. Please go project

30:04

your insecurities onto a piece of paper,

30:07

burn it and throw it away. Then go look

30:09

in the mirror and tell yourself how much you are loved.

30:11

Heart emoji.

30:16

When I had that moment at

30:18

Afropunk and people were talking about my outfit

30:21

and my body and my stomach, since

30:24

then I have not worked out a

30:27

day. Like not one day have I worked

30:29

out. and almost have done it purposely. Like,

30:31

you know what? Actually, I was working

30:34

out, but now y'all gonna have

30:36

to see this flab on my stomach. Y'all

30:38

should've just been quiet. Yeah. Because

30:40

now you gonna see it for real. But

30:43

I'm gonna get back into working out because it is something that I enjoy,

30:45

but just for

30:46

a time I was like, that is crazy that

30:48

y'all even did that to me. So I'm gonna just live.

30:50

I'm gonna just live my life because I should be able

30:52

to. There are so many literally

30:55

obese male rappers that

30:58

nobody bats an eye. Nobody

31:00

says a thing to them, and they

31:02

shouldn't. Because at the end of the day, it's

31:05

nobody's business. We are not doctors.

31:07

I

31:11

don't like to say body positivity because I think

31:13

that adds a bit of

31:15

false

31:17

expectations into it because nobody

31:19

has to be positive about your body. I don't have

31:21

to think your body looks great, but what I do have

31:23

to do is accept that that's your body. There you

31:25

go. and you have to accept that this is mine,

31:28

and I have to accept my own. So I

31:30

like to say it's all about body acceptance

31:32

for me.

31:33

And, you know, self-acceptance,

31:36

it's like, do you like it?

31:39

Okay, cool. You like it, I love it, baby,

31:41

okay? And for

31:43

me, it's just like, I'm gonna walk out,

31:46

and I like it.

31:50

The male gaze is a shape-shifter,

31:53

a slippery trickster, and it polices

31:56

in ever-changing ways. For

31:58

Dream, it took the form of her... toxic

32:00

pre-teen boyfriend, criticizing her body

32:02

in a way that never really left her. For

32:06

Tate, it was a nameless, filter-faced

32:08

mob on the internet that couldn't handle

32:10

even an ounce of body fat. But

32:12

what happens when the male gaze goes

32:15

corporate, built into your

32:17

contract and all up in the frying print?

32:24

You'll hear the rapper Dochie answer that

32:26

question in the rest of this episode

32:28

of Louder Than a Riot. You can find it

32:31

and follow the rest of the season on

32:33

NPR.org or wherever you get your

32:35

podcasts. Lada the

32:37

Narayet is hosted by me, Sydney Madden

32:40

and Rodney Carmichael. This episode

32:43

was written by myself, Rodney and

32:45

Gabby Volgarelli. And it was produced

32:47

by Gabby Volgarelli and Sam Jay Leeds.

32:49

Our senior producer is

32:51

Gabby Volgarelli. Our

32:53

producers are Sam Jay Leeds and Lano Sondresen.

32:57

Our editor is Saraya Shockley with

32:59

additional editing from Sam Jay Leeds. And

33:02

our engineers are Gilly Moon and Josh Newell.

33:05

Our senior supervising producer is Cher Vincent.

33:08

Our interns are Jose Sandoval, Teresa

33:11

Shieh, and Pilar Galvan with

33:13

help from Jerusalem Truth.

33:14

And the NPR execs are Keith

33:17

Jenkins, Yolanda Sanguini, and

33:19

Anya Gruntman.

33:21

Original theme by Casa Overall, remixed

33:23

by Susie Analogue. The scoring for this

33:26

episode was provided by Susie Enelog

33:28

and Casa Overall.

33:29

Our digital editor

33:31

is Jacob Gans, and our fact-checker

33:33

is Greta Pittenger. If

33:35

you liked this episode, if you want to talk back,

33:38

hit us up on Twitter. We're at Louder

33:40

Than a Riot. And if you want to email us,

33:43

we're at louder at NPR.org.

33:46

From NPR Music, I'm

33:49

Rodney Carmine. And I'm Sydney Madden. And

33:52

this is Louder Than a Riot. A

33:54

special thanks to Olivia Chilcote and Jess

33:56

Kung,

33:56

who produced this episode of Code Switch. It

33:59

was edited by I'm Dalia Mortada. I'm

34:01

BA Parker. Hydrate!