0:00

Hi there , welcome to Conversations where we

0:02

seek to advance your leader in team excellence

0:04

by discussing relevant topics that

0:07

impact today's organizations

0:09

. Welcome to the show . Hey

0:12

there and welcome to Conversations where today

0:14

we have Karen Tan , and

0:16

for more than 15 years Karen has collaborated

0:19

with global leaders to assist them

0:21

in creating a more substantial

0:23

influence . She specializes

0:26

in facilitating collaboration between

0:28

Eastern and Western cultures . Her

0:30

expertise has enabled leaders and

0:32

teams to successfully leverage

0:35

their cultural diversities to become

0:38

more creative . Karen

0:40

, welcome to the show . How are you today

0:43

?

0:44

Thank you , kelly , so great to be here .

0:46

Yeah , I'm glad you're here today . You

0:48

and I go back a couple years . We

0:50

met when we were both doing a

0:52

team coach certification

0:55

and

0:57

I knew when I met you that you

1:00

were kind of like a deep soul . Yeah

1:05

, I just love what you

1:07

brought to our group , to our

1:09

learning group , and I really appreciate

1:12

you and the work that you're doing

1:14

, and so thank you .

1:16

You're so kind , thank you .

1:18

So let's hear , maybe give us just a little bit

1:20

of a high view of what you're doing these days .

1:24

Well , lately I completed

1:26

a training in team coaching and

1:28

I have been working with leaders

1:30

and leadership development for many

1:32

years . But I realized that

1:35

even if you have the best leaders

1:38

, the team is like

1:40

a system and they have unique dynamics

1:43

. And so lately

1:45

I moved more into team coaching , helping

1:47

teams to become more successful

1:49

and more high performing

1:52

, because I realized that just

1:54

leadership development , even if

1:56

you have the best leader , it's not sufficient

1:58

. So I'm getting into that team

2:01

coaching space lately .

2:02

Yeah , and team coaching is

2:04

an exciting space right now . Yes

2:07

, it is . And I think for me

2:09

, the more that I learn about team

2:11

coaching and

2:13

the need for it and

2:15

why there is the need and the

2:18

many different facets of

2:20

team coaching , because I think people

2:22

are still they're

2:25

still not understanding exactly

2:28

what team coaching is and that can look

2:30

different , you know , have different flavors and whatnot

2:33

Exactly and I think that's the path that you're

2:35

doing , that work and

2:38

yeah , and you're pretty passionate about this .

2:40

Yes , very much so .

2:42

And why is that ?

2:43

Especially in the space of multicultural

2:45

teams . I

2:47

read tons of research that multicultural

2:50

teams , like global diverse teams

2:52

, are on the rise , and I realized

2:54

that a lot of the teams

2:57

are not tapping into the potential

2:59

with that diversity , and

3:01

so I believe that team coaching

3:03

can come in and help to

3:05

serve that purpose to help teams

3:08

to tap into the potential

3:11

of the diversity instead of allowing

3:13

it to be a liability

3:16

or a point of tension for the team

3:18

. Yeah , yeah

3:20

, I really

3:22

have that joy of working with a few

3:25

teams that I have seen

3:27

the transformation that the team has gone through

3:30

after working through the dynamics

3:32

and diversity .

3:34

Yeah .

3:34

Yeah .

3:37

There's a slide I used to use in

3:40

one of my presentations I should pull that up

3:42

sometime and take a look at it again

3:45

and it was all about how you

3:48

know teams . We often

3:50

think our teams

3:52

should be well-rounded

3:54

. However , it's important

3:56

that we look at them with jagged edges , like

3:58

a mosaic , and how

4:00

you know their differences come

4:02

together and because

4:05

of that , they're able to

4:07

do the good work in front of them and be more innovative

4:09

and whatnot .

4:11

It's beautiful . Yes , recently I just

4:14

read tons of research and I can post

4:16

that in the show notes . Yeah , I

4:18

can post the link to those articles . But

4:21

all the research sets that diversity

4:25

of teams directly

4:27

boost performance and innovation

4:29

and I feel like a lot

4:31

of teams are not tapping into that

4:33

potential and we

4:35

can help them to do that .

4:38

Yeah , what do you find when

4:40

you're thinking of teams who just aren't

4:42

tapping into it ? Are

4:44

they just not recognizing it

4:46

, are they ? What are you saying

4:49

?

4:50

I see some of the common challenges of

4:52

teams . First is totally

4:55

because they are achieving

5:00

the metrics like the KPIs , and

5:02

there is no severe conflicts

5:04

within the team . As our team

5:07

leaders , they feel like the team is performing

5:10

. However , because

5:13

also the additional factor is also because

5:15

their projects are always

5:18

fast-paced and the velocity of

5:20

the projects are often very

5:22

quick and with the

5:24

time zone differences Every time

5:26

the teams get together they

5:29

feel like they don't have the luxury to

5:31

really talk about team dynamics , alignment

5:34

, how to build team culture , and so

5:37

they don't really have the awareness

5:39

that they can tap into a lot more diversity

5:42

and the potential the team can have

5:46

. I would say lack of awareness is

5:48

one of the main things .

5:49

So it's important that , as

5:51

team coaches are working with

5:53

the teams , that they

5:56

open the door for that , for opening

5:58

up what is diversity ? What does

6:00

that look like ? What does it look like for our team

6:02

, even ? Right ?

6:04

Yeah , I worked as an

6:07

intercultural trainer for many years

6:09

and a lot of companies they're

6:11

providing intercultural training for

6:13

our teams . But that

6:15

is just creating awareness . It's

6:18

a good first step , but having

6:20

awareness is not enough , because

6:23

the team needs to use that

6:25

kind of awareness about their differences

6:27

and know how to tap into

6:29

their own dynamics and potential

6:31

. And that's where team coaching comes

6:34

in . After their awareness

6:36

, then they can come in and help build alignment

6:39

and also team conversations .

6:44

And I imagine , at least

6:46

in what I've done

6:48

, that team leader is

6:50

really important to the whole

6:52

problem when you're working with a team . What

6:54

have you experienced with that ?

6:57

Very much so , very much so

6:59

. However , the team leader , he

7:02

or she can serve as

7:04

a facilitator for those conversations

7:06

. Yet that was

7:09

because he or she is part of the team

7:11

. It comes with inherent

7:13

power , dynamics and differences

7:15

, and also inherent implicit

7:18

cultural biases , and

7:20

so the team coach , as a third

7:22

party coming in , can really

7:25

facilitate some

7:27

neutral conversations by

7:29

creating a psychological safe space

7:31

for the whole team .

7:34

And that's really important that psychological

7:36

safety when

7:38

you think about because

7:41

you've coached multicultural

7:43

teams and you have this world

7:46

view of culture

7:48

and the importance of it how

7:51

do you , as a team coach , maybe

7:54

recognize what this team is going

7:56

to need ? Is this something that

7:58

you research on the front end or you

8:00

just know ? Why don't you talk a little bit

8:02

about that ?

8:04

Great question , thank you . Well

8:06

, I think having an initial conversation

8:09

with the team leader and the team members are very

8:11

important . We do

8:14

assessments and also questionnaire

8:16

surveys , like personal interviews

8:18

, so that I get a sense

8:21

of what are the bottlenecks

8:23

or what are the pain points the team have . And

8:26

from there I would

8:28

pick some of the topics

8:30

that the team might

8:32

not be aware of , like

8:34

, for example , speaking

8:37

up in meetings right . Because

8:39

I want to share a case with you . This

8:42

is very interesting . I

8:44

work with a team that

8:47

has a team leader from

8:49

the Americas and team

8:51

members from Asia and also

8:53

some team members from Europe , the

8:55

YMEA and during

8:57

the meetings , the Asian members

9:00

they don't

9:02

really speak up too much . And

9:04

over time the

9:07

Western American leader he

9:09

was thinking okay , maybe the Asian members don't

9:12

have strong opinions because

9:14

they hardly speak up in meetings . However

9:17

, actually it's because of the educational

9:20

system that we are being brought up right . The

9:23

West , the education system , most

9:25

of the education systems are helping us

9:28

to cultivate that critical thinking

9:30

ability . We

9:32

question and we challenge , and it's perfectly

9:34

okay . But the

9:36

Asian education system is

9:39

really about absorbing information and respecting

9:41

the authority and processing that information . So

9:45

critical thinking and voicing

9:48

out challenging the authority

9:50

is not how it is to be , how it's how

9:53

we are being brought up . And

9:55

so if the team they

9:57

are not they realize that well , every

9:59

meeting we have a good outcome , we

10:02

have results from the meeting

10:04

, but they never tap

10:06

into the insights of the Asian team

10:08

members , not because they don't have it , but

10:10

because the way they express it

10:12

will be very different from the Western

10:15

team members . And so if

10:17

I come into the team doing an interview

10:19

, I would ask about what are the pain

10:22

points they have and ask

10:24

the specific Asian team members

10:26

or the American team leader

10:28

like

10:30

what will be something they would like to see , and

10:33

that way I can provide some

10:35

initial education and

10:37

then we will go into team coaching with

10:39

that kind of cultural awareness .

10:42

Yeah , yeah , those front

10:44

end conversations , particularly

10:47

assessments , are wonderful , but I do

10:49

love the combination of

10:51

having an assessment but then having

10:53

those interviews where I

10:56

mean that's discovery . You are discovering

10:58

things and it's only to help the

11:00

team and to help the engagement

11:02

that you're going to be working through

11:05

with them .

11:08

What do you love about the initial conversations

11:10

, the discovery process ?

11:13

Well , for me , I love meeting people

11:15

. That's why one of the reasons why I love doing this

11:17

podcast , because I get to bring people

11:19

on and really , you

11:21

know , hear what's important to them . And I think

11:24

I take that into those initial

11:26

conversations where I

11:29

need to continue to be curious , right

11:32

, because as coaches , we always have to , you know , get

11:34

curious . It's always , you know , top

11:36

of mind to get curious and trying

11:38

to figure out , without being

11:40

, you know , be making like too many puzzle

11:42

pieces , but just understanding each

11:44

individual and how that

11:47

then is a collective and

11:49

what are those themes . And I love when

11:51

I can , you know , pick out those themes

11:53

and see , aha

11:55

, you know , and making

11:58

that , as far as you

12:00

know , what are the next steps and

12:02

how is this team going to move

12:04

forward based on some of those

12:06

initial things , as well as a confidentiality

12:09

piece , I mean , it's , it's really

12:12

for us a holy ground where we

12:14

can keep what has been told

12:16

to us , you know , confidence

12:19

and and using themes , yes

12:22

, and bringing those out

12:24

in sessions . But really

12:26

some of those conversations

12:28

, we never know what's going to come

12:30

up in them as a coach . We

12:33

can talking about one thing and something

12:35

else comes up and really you're

12:38

into what are we hearing

12:40

and what is underneath all that

12:43

? That maybe we agree .

12:45

Yeah , I agree , it's exciting process

12:48

, it's adventurous .

12:50

Are there any other ? Are there any other

12:52

challenges that you've experienced

12:54

with with your team coaching ?

12:58

I'd love to hear . Another huge area is

13:00

how East and West

13:02

handle disagreements . South

13:06

Americans are very emotionally

13:08

expressive and Asian

13:10

team members usually they are very

13:13

little , you

13:15

know , emotionally expressive , and so

13:17

oftentimes disagreements

13:19

are really a healthy thing for

13:21

the team . Right , because it brings

13:24

out diversity , is

13:26

the point where the team can really

13:28

explore new ideas . But

13:31

if the team members

13:33

they , they don't understand

13:35

each other , it

13:37

can become a point of tension or even

13:39

escalate it become a point of conflict

13:42

. So I have Asian

13:44

team members who told me well , I really

13:46

feel a lot of tension when

13:49

my South American colleague

13:51

was so emotional in

13:53

a meeting , and

13:56

so I think that's a point of

13:58

challenge for many teams in

14:01

how they handle disagreements .

14:04

Yeah , and another

14:06

great opportunity for a coaching

14:08

moment . I

14:11

just step in there and

14:13

I think that's one thing that a lot of people don't

14:15

understand about team coaching is that we're

14:17

able to coach in the moment and

14:20

have those you know pauses , even call

14:22

those timeouts within teams

14:24

and just you

14:27

know , see what is happening in the room

14:29

and and sometimes even

14:31

call it out , depending on situation

14:35

, and then that way

14:37

we're able to help people understand

14:39

more in the moment instead

14:41

of , oh , remember that meeting two weeks

14:43

ago when this happened . It's

14:46

already passed .

14:48

Yes , yes . Or even

14:50

building team alignment , like right

14:52

at the beginning , by asking simple

14:54

questions like how do

14:56

we want to be together when things

14:59

become difficult and

15:02

have members talk about how

15:04

they want respect . What does

15:06

respect look like in different cultures

15:08

? That

15:10

would be some great conversations for teams

15:13

.

15:13

Yeah , and always at the front

15:15

end . So we know and even

15:18

for us as a coach , we know that this

15:20

is the expectation of the team . The team is

15:22

creating this . We're not coming in

15:24

and saying , okay , this is how it's going to be

15:26

, folks , but it's more that . Okay

15:28

, let's unpack this and let's

15:30

find out how this team is going to operate

15:32

, moving forward .

15:34

Totally yeah , and

15:36

they promote engagement and ownership

15:38

. Yeah , yeah .

15:39

Absolutely and

15:42

fully getting some of those quieter voices

15:44

, if there is psychological

15:47

safety that's been created

15:49

, getting them to

15:51

voice how they would

15:53

like to respect . Because , as you said

15:55

, respect especially is very

15:58

different east to west . Very

16:00

much so .

16:01

Yes

16:03

, very much so . Yeah , we're

16:05

getting into some profound topics

16:08

here .

16:10

We've talked about a lot of things here

16:12

today , karen my gosh . We've

16:15

talked about diversity coming into it

16:17

and the differences and really

16:19

the importance of having a

16:22

team be collaborative , helping

16:24

them create psychological

16:27

safety , helping them have

16:29

those front end conversations with you

16:32

as a team coach , as well as when

16:34

you come in with a team , and having the team

16:36

kind of unpack these things about how

16:38

the team is going to operate , moving

16:41

forward . So how

16:43

can team coaching help beyond

16:45

that ? Is there anything else beyond it ? Because

16:48

the field is just so vast

16:50

and wide with the things

16:52

that we are able to show up and do

16:54

. So what maybe is

16:56

something that you haven't mentioned

16:59

, that you would love to mention around

17:01

team coaching ?

17:03

I would also love to tap into your wisdom here

17:05

, because I work with a lot of

17:07

multicultural teams . I believe that

17:09

cultivating that awareness probably

17:11

is the first step , even before

17:13

team coaching happens . Because

17:15

I believe that , just

17:18

like a fish , if you are in the

17:20

water , you don't really know that

17:22

you're in the water until you

17:24

are being told that this is water

17:26

. So I feel a lot

17:28

of teams , when they work with each other , because

17:31

of that inherent cultural biases

17:33

, we don't really know

17:35

how to leverage

17:38

the differences in teams

17:41

. So I believe helping

17:43

to create that awareness is really the first step

17:45

. Whatever we talked

17:47

about just now coming in to

17:49

assess the team , helping the team

17:51

to have honest conversations and

17:54

alignment I believe that probably is

17:56

the essence , the core of

17:59

the process . But more

18:01

so , I feel like team coaching probably

18:04

goes further in helping

18:06

the team members to really step up

18:08

, to feel that , okay

18:10

, I play a role in the system

18:12

and I have

18:15

the responsibility and

18:17

the power

18:19

to help the system to

18:21

become more effective . And

18:24

I think in the process of

18:26

helping team members to have honest conversations

18:28

, we are also empowering them

18:30

to take ownership , more ownership

18:32

of that system , which I'm really

18:35

excited about .

18:37

And systems is

18:39

something that I don't think . Most

18:43

teams , leaders

18:45

, and wherever

18:48

you are on the hierarchy chart if you are on

18:50

a hierarchy chart I don't think we think

18:52

about that enough . Yes

18:54

, who are we impacting

18:56

? Yes , and

18:58

who are those ? And I know some people

19:00

don't like the word stakeholders , but stakeholders

19:03

just means who are the people that you're serving

19:05

and how is the work that you are

19:07

doing impact them ? Or

19:10

lack of work , or

19:12

lack of conversation , lack of relationship

19:14

? You know , it all is just

19:17

really , really

19:19

intriguing . I think that's why I love team coaching

19:21

so much and really being embedded and

19:24

watching the journeys , because

19:26

, just like you you

19:28

said in the beginning , the transformation that

19:30

you've seen and that's what coaching

19:32

is about . It's not about having the answers

19:34

for these teams , it's really about being

19:37

. These teams start to formulate

19:39

for themselves and see

19:41

how they can then express

19:43

themselves as a team holistically

19:46

and moving forward together and helping

19:48

in that system for sure

19:50

.

19:51

You said it so well Leadership

19:53

development and leadership coaching . We

19:56

empower individuals for

19:58

them to really be transformed and scale

20:01

that up . You know , and you see

20:03

that in the team is really exciting .

20:08

Some Karen , great conversation

20:10

today . Of course , I'm as passionate

20:12

as you are , so no

20:14

surprise there that this is going to be , you

20:16

know , just great information for people who

20:18

don't know about team coaching

20:20

, want to hear more , and I would love

20:23

to point them in your direction . So

20:25

how can people connect with you

20:27

, karen Tan , if they would

20:29

like more information about you and the services

20:31

that you provide ?

20:33

For sure . I have a website , thinkimpactco

20:35

. I'm gonna give that year

20:38

end . You can put that in the show notes and

20:40

also I will provide my email . So

20:42

if people are interested , I

20:44

offer free complimentary

20:46

assessment with the leader

20:48

and just to get to know what

20:50

are their needs for the team . So welcome

20:53

to connect with me if you're interested

20:56

and are you a- , Dan ? I

20:59

am , I am . I also put the

21:01

link from my link in your show notes .

21:03

Perfect , That'll be great , all

21:06

right . Well , karen Tan , it's

21:08

been a pleasure to have you on today . I

21:10

appreciate your knowledge , your

21:12

expertise , all you are doing , because

21:15

you're reaching around the world , and I just love

21:17

when I get to just collaborate

21:20

with a coach like you who

21:22

has that , and I know that

21:24

there's a different lens that

21:27

you see things out of . So I

21:29

certainly appreciate it and I know that our

21:31

listeners are gonna appreciate that . Wow

21:33

.

21:35

Thank you , kelly . You are so kind

21:37

and you know it's always a pleasure

21:39

to talk with you . You're inspiring

21:41

. Thank you , oh , you are welcome .

21:43

And thank you for that . All right . Well

21:46

, until next time . You keep doing great

21:48

things and we'll see you soon , you

21:50

too .

21:50

Bye-bye . You

22:26

, you

22:55

, you

23:25

, you

23:55

, you

24:25

you

30:55

.