0:00

Welcome, welcome, welcome. This is the

0:02

Distraction Pieces podcast episode 551 and

0:04

I'm joined today by

0:09

Andrew Haig. I

0:11

was so excited about this podcast. I was

0:13

a huge fan of 45 years. I think

0:17

it's genuinely a modern classic. Andrew

0:19

is a film director if you don't know.

0:23

And then I saw he had a

0:25

new film coming out, All of Us

0:27

Strangers, with just an amazing

0:29

cast. Andrew Scott, Paul Mezcal, Jamie

0:31

Bell and Claire Foy essentially. So

0:34

I was hugely excited about that and then I saw a preview

0:37

of it. And so as

0:39

this podcast comes out, it comes out

0:41

on Friday. It's going to be in

0:43

my films of the year at the

0:45

end of 2024. I adored

0:47

it. Loads of you all know as

0:49

an actor, as a writer

0:52

myself and as someone who's had a

0:55

film in development for a while to be a

0:57

director too. I'm a huge

0:59

nerd for this stuff. And Andrew Haig

1:01

is one of the people I nerd

1:04

out over the most. I really enjoy

1:06

the way he approaches the craft. So

1:09

to get to sit down and have a chat

1:11

was a massive buzz. And then it absolutely delivered.

1:14

I had a wonderful time. You

1:16

will hear at one point, Andrew talks about

1:18

his kind of his casting

1:21

process, often rather than auditions

1:24

being or more so

1:26

than auditions being sitting down and having a

1:28

conversation with someone, you know, finding out if

1:30

you're on the same wavelength.

1:32

You can probably hear me

1:34

grinning because as you can imagine,

1:36

Andrew is someone I'd love to work with. And

1:39

now we've sat down and had a conversation

1:41

for an hour and found that we're on

1:43

the same wavelength. So

1:46

when that opportunity comes down the line, we

1:49

could just fucking get straight in there, you

1:51

know? Easy peasy. Yeah, I think you're going

1:53

to really enjoy this if you're not familiar

1:56

with the works of

1:58

Andrew. which include

2:01

the fantastic series called The

2:03

Northwater. I think we talked

2:05

about the OA at all. We directed two

2:08

episodes of the OA, which I adored. 45

2:13

years is just something

2:16

else. I reference, I give a quote, actually I

2:18

don't think I explained it properly. I read out

2:20

a quote at one point, and you can probably

2:22

hear that I'm reading a quote, and it's from

2:24

Andrew's film, Weekend, a character,

2:27

I can't remember if it's Russell or Glenn, who

2:29

say in Weekend. But yeah,

2:32

most importantly of all, as I've said,

2:34

I think Andrew has made some modern

2:36

classics. And as I'm scrolling now and

2:38

looking on IMDB, the highest rated

2:40

film of his is All of

2:42

Us Strangers, and that comes out on Friday. So check

2:45

it out. We are brought to you

2:47

as ever by Speech Development Records dot

2:49

com. That's where you can get all

2:51

my merch, you can support the podcast and look

2:53

cool. We may not be

2:55

for you, and that's fine. The

2:57

whole range of stuff is always popular. We've

3:00

got hats, t-shirts, jumpers, all sorts of good,

3:02

good. You can also

3:04

support by going to patreon.com/ScrubiusPip.

3:07

That's where I give a lot of kind of, I'll

3:10

have some chats every now and then, some

3:13

preview moments. And

3:15

twitch.tv/ScrubiusPip, yo. That's

3:18

where you can come and hang out, chat, enjoy

3:21

yourselves. On Instagram there's

3:23

a Pips Twitch Clips channel, which

3:25

I highly recommend you follow.

3:28

It's good fun, and it'll give you a little preview

3:30

of what's going on on Twitch. It's not all just

3:32

playing computer games. Sometimes it's computer

3:35

games a lot of the time. It's

3:37

other stuff, it's watching things on YouTube,

3:39

it's chatting, it's engaging. So anyway, let's

3:41

get on with the podcast, because this

3:43

is episode 551 of the deflection pieces

3:47

podcast with the wonderful

3:49

Andrew Haigh. We

3:57

Supremely honor you. The Ya'll. Right!

4:11

I'm here today with Andrew Hi, how are you

4:13

sir I'm very good. It's nice to be is

4:15

a must be. Nice to be here right? Because

4:17

they must have been a point in the production

4:19

of this that you weren't sure if you were

4:22

going to get to talk about it because of

4:24

the right to strike and the actors' strike or

4:26

know I called the first time Andrew and Poll

4:28

could talk about it like in person to say

4:30

is been a weird time for making a film

4:32

useless. Basically that period. you sleep over it for

4:35

years and then you in that kind of limbo

4:37

of i'm not going to get to tell anyone

4:39

about this was a we will miss. Is not

4:41

only did that happen with the strikes, but

4:43

also would you make a film in general

4:46

normally is still no show that antibodies get

4:48

a soda. Talk about yes. And sometimes people

4:50

are very interested in what you do and

4:52

sometimes even if they liked the film for

4:54

whatever reason, it doesn't celebrate out enough that

4:57

you actually get talk about some. Over the

4:59

course of my career I feel like sometimes

5:01

I've spoken a lot about certain projects here

5:03

and other times it's a struggle to get

5:06

people to talk about the site. That has

5:08

been really nice surprise for this that everybody

5:10

does seem. To have talk about sex. And

5:12

then there was a strike and luckily the

5:14

right to strike ended just as I was

5:17

doing the premier in Telluride. so he meant

5:19

that I could stop. talk about said. Then

5:21

I was concerned that oh my god the

5:23

actors. This is gonna be me the whole

5:25

time. Yeah, boring everybody. but luckily now the

5:27

Axis can actually I have comes I said

5:30

about who I think the actors are amazing

5:32

and they speak amazingly. Been very excited to

5:34

talk to you specifically because our think Forty

5:36

Five Years is a modern classic and I

5:38

think you've done it again with all of.

5:41

us that strange has been talking about

5:43

whether people won't talk about your second

5:45

biggest struggle of independence cinema you can

5:47

make the perfect film as of soaked

5:49

in memphis party cooked confidant about this

5:52

on my turn off mighty can pull

5:54

your heart into now on guys to

5:56

see it owners un quote from a

5:58

character who claim the The problem is

6:00

no one's going to see it because it's about gay

6:03

sex. So the gays will come because

6:05

they want a glimpse of cock and

6:07

they'll be disappointed and the straights won't come because,

6:10

well, it's got nothing to do with their world.

6:13

They'll go and see pictures about refugees, murder

6:15

or rape, but not gay sex.

6:17

Fuck off. That's

6:19

obviously from your film Weekend.

6:22

In 2011, do you

6:25

think that's changed a lot now? I think

6:27

it's definitely changed. It has changed without a doubt. The

6:30

world is very different than it was 10 years ago. I

6:33

don't know. I still don't know if

6:35

necessarily it's changed quite as much as we'd like

6:38

to think it's changed. So

6:40

I still don't think people would necessarily, there's

6:42

a lot of straight people that aren't racing

6:44

to the cinema to see a film with

6:46

gay people in it. So I still think

6:48

it's not quite the same. And I understand

6:50

it as well. There's so much out

6:52

there. There is so much to see. And you

6:54

have to make decisions on what you think is

6:56

going to speak to you. And so

6:58

I think I'm a little bit softer about it all

7:00

now than I was back 11 years ago on

7:03

a main weekend when I was furious and

7:05

angry about everything. And now, maybe it's just

7:08

because I'm 50 and you realize that time

7:10

is limited. And you're like, well,

7:12

maybe there's other things I prefer to see.

7:14

So I'm probably a little bit more generous

7:16

now and don't automatically see it as homophobia.

7:19

Yeah. And again, I think something

7:21

I talk about a lot, as an

7:23

actor who's got a stammer, and I've

7:25

never played a character who's got a

7:27

stammer, representation is important,

7:30

partly because of representation, because

7:32

of fairness, because of this. But

7:34

I think we see in recent times, it's

7:36

important just for quality of films,

7:38

because with the greatest respect, straight

7:41

white people have made a third

7:43

Ghostbusters reboot, which

7:45

I'm excited for, genuinely. I enjoy it. But

7:47

ideas are running thin, whereas

7:49

it feels like we're in a golden era.

7:51

For me, it feels like we're in a

7:54

golden era of queer cinema, because in this

7:56

year, past like 12 months alone, we've had

7:58

passages, blue jeans, rotting jeans. in the sun, bottoms,

8:01

femme, all of us strangers,

8:04

all really completely different films. None

8:07

of those are really that similar at

8:09

all, but also exciting and so engaging.

8:11

And I think it's because it's voices

8:14

that have maybe previously been kept from

8:16

the mainstream of cinemas. So

8:18

do you feel there's exciting stories

8:21

to be told there, as well as representation?

8:24

I do, and it's interesting that all of

8:26

those films, they are all very different, which

8:28

is what is so exciting about them. And

8:31

they're also not pandering to a mainstream audience.

8:33

They all seem to feel like they're making

8:35

films, the films that they

8:37

want to make, they are making. They're not saying, oh,

8:39

we need to tone this down or we need to

8:42

turn that down. They're being really, really honest, which is

8:44

the kind of films that I love to watch. And

8:46

that's what I'm actually really excited about, but

8:48

that is happening. And I'm the same as you. Representation

8:51

is fundamental and vital,

8:54

and you want to see yourself reflected

8:56

on the screen or someone that's similar to

8:58

you on the screen. But more than that,

9:01

it's just seeing different stories. And

9:04

that's what I love. It doesn't have to be

9:06

my experience, but if I feel like it's an

9:08

authentic experience of someone else, then I'd

9:10

like to see that portrayed on screen.

9:13

It doesn't have to be about my life or anything to do

9:15

with me, but that's what I love about

9:17

certain films and elements of cinema. Yeah,

9:20

I agree. And I think the representation

9:22

thing, I'm on

9:24

this kind of path a lot recently because it's been

9:26

something I've been thinking about working

9:28

with the British Tamron Association for this, but

9:31

representation is also for those

9:33

who just aren't exposed to

9:35

these things a lot. And one of the things that

9:37

made me wriggle with excitement in my seat when watching

9:39

all of us strangers was,

9:41

so I'm boringly straight, but

9:44

I've always had a lot of gay mates.

9:46

And before doing the podcast, I interviewed a

9:49

friend of mine just about his coming out

9:51

and about his sexuality, because

9:53

I just wanted to know, the

9:55

podcast has allowed me to have conversations you don't just have

9:58

with your pals. So that was kind of... stepping

10:00

stone for that. But one thing that

10:02

from where I'm from, again, a working class

10:04

area in Essex, that's very

10:07

sheltered from these things,

10:09

the scene in the bath really

10:12

touched me between Andrew

10:14

and Paul's characters and the

10:16

openness of inquiry of if

10:18

one was in to bum

10:20

to anal to bum stuff

10:22

to anal, which again,

10:25

my growing up was well, that's what gay

10:27

people like, isn't it? And just actually get

10:29

making gay friends like, no, some do something

10:31

with three people, some do some don't. So I

10:34

guess, are you intentionally trying to

10:36

put things in that will kind of educate

10:38

people as well? Or is it just now

10:41

these are the natural conversations? It's I didn't

10:43

know you'd be surprised at that kind of

10:45

thing. That's really interesting question. I think it

10:47

is both. I think it's a bit of

10:50

both. I'm always frustrated how when I see

10:53

a depiction of gayness

10:55

or gay sex or gay people, I'm

10:57

always like, you're not really telling the

10:59

truth about something. Yeah. And I'm always

11:02

amazed how little people understand about

11:04

queerness and specifically about gay sex sometimes. I'm

11:06

like, Oh, that's sort of what you think

11:09

we do. And that isn't always what we

11:11

do. Sometimes we do and sometimes we don't.

11:13

And, and so I'm always intrigued about this.

11:15

I remember when weekend came out and a

11:17

lot of people would come up to me

11:19

and said, Oh, I didn't realise that you

11:21

could have that men could have penetrative

11:24

sex facing each other. And I

11:26

was like, Oh, wow, really? People

11:28

don't think that and that's really beautifully

11:30

in passages this year as well. Yeah.

11:32

And that's so beautifully done. Yeah, stuff

11:34

like that. And it's like, Oh, God,

11:36

literally, people don't know what happens. And

11:38

then you have to sort of think

11:40

about, okay, what is the idea

11:43

that they think about when they think of gay

11:45

sex? And it's wrapped up in something that I

11:47

don't think is what gay intimacy and sex is

11:49

about. It's basically I think a lot of people

11:51

still think of it about power and domination and

11:53

a certain position and all kinds of things that

11:55

are happening. And I think that's not my

11:57

understanding of actually what happens for most queer

11:59

people. So I definitely like the idea

12:01

of sort of unpicking some of those little things and getting

12:04

them out into the world Because

12:06

it is about being known and I think the

12:08

film is about Somebody trying

12:10

to be understood by his parents But also

12:12

by the person he's falling in love with

12:14

and that person to understand him and I

12:17

think being known is So

12:19

important like it is the way to escape

12:21

loneliness is to be known Yeah, and if

12:23

you can have conversations with

12:25

people that you write like a podcast is a way

12:27

for two people to talk about things and you come

12:29

away from that Understanding each other better and

12:32

I think that films are the same thing

12:34

You are having a conversation with the audience

12:36

and you are hoping that that audience come

12:38

away Seeing the world

12:40

a little bit differently. Yeah. Yeah completely

12:42

well, I mean we've talked about how

12:44

you've just touched upon how These

12:47

discussions can inform us one

12:50

of the things that I think that I marvel

12:52

over in your work is your ability to Get

12:55

across the unspoken and the

12:57

silences and again It's

13:00

fascinating because and don't get me wrong

13:02

your dialogues amazing So it's these things

13:04

that you realize particularly in relationships and

13:06

particularly two people alone

13:08

together So much is unspoken

13:10

and so much is unsaid particularly the longer

13:12

a relationship goes on and I think you

13:15

really get that across Amazingly

13:17

and I want to kind of know what what

13:19

that looks like What does it look

13:21

like on the page and then what does it how much

13:23

of it is in? In

13:25

the room in the cast in in those

13:28

in those relationships A lot of

13:30

it is on the page like when I'm trying to

13:32

work out a scene I am trying

13:34

to work out always that what is the

13:36

character trying to express? What is the character

13:38

trying to show the other person and I

13:40

think I think a lot about it

13:42

I think especially maybe like British people

13:46

so much of how we Communicate

13:48

is through the unsaid or it's through

13:50

the meaning behind an actual sentence or

13:52

when we take the piss of someone

13:54

We're actually meaning something very tender

13:56

and friendly and delicate and sweet

13:59

underneath it I think

14:01

we're always saying something else all the

14:03

time. And so I'm always trying to

14:05

work out, okay, what is that? What does someone do

14:07

with their hand, which in the

14:09

way that they touch someone, that contradicts

14:11

what they're saying or what they're not

14:13

saying, whatever it is. So I'm very,

14:15

very careful about in the script trying

14:17

to understand the physicality of the scene

14:19

and what people are doing. And then

14:21

it is about allowing the actors

14:24

to bring that to life. And

14:26

it is about giving them the space,

14:28

even with the shot to allow that

14:30

to unfold. So, you know, it's

14:33

when you choose to cut. I always, when

14:35

I'm editing, it's like, I usually end up

14:37

staying longer on someone than you might normally

14:39

stay on them, in a shot, for example.

14:41

Because it's like, well, look, there's something happening

14:43

after they've said that line of dialogue that

14:45

they're doing with their eyes or their face

14:47

or a gesture with their hands.

14:51

That is saying something about the thing they've

14:53

just said. So I'm always looking for those

14:55

moments that sort of poke through the

14:57

scene. It's beautiful, the bits

14:59

that come once they've got their

15:01

lines out the way. Like when the acting

15:03

stops as such can be such a beautiful

15:06

thing. Yeah, because I think even when you're

15:08

an actor, you're not always thinking about what

15:10

is happening subconsciously in the performance or in

15:12

the character. I mean, obviously some actors do

15:14

a lot of the time, but things always

15:16

emerge. And I

15:18

always feel like it's moments of vulnerability

15:21

that emerges. Like someone can say a

15:23

line, and it's actually affected the actor

15:25

on a fundamental level too, as well

15:27

as the character. And you're seeing

15:29

some element of vulnerability. And I'm always

15:32

looking for those moments of vulnerability because

15:34

they are the things that show the

15:36

audience what's happening. That's

15:38

the moment that I care about, not the moments

15:40

of strength. It's the moments of

15:43

vulnerability. Yeah, I love that. Well, can

15:45

we talk a little bit about editing?

15:47

Because before I moved

15:49

into acting and podcast and everything else,

15:51

I was in music and I directed

15:53

a load of music videos that I

15:55

got a lot of credit for, but

15:57

something that was never really on the... that

16:00

the public got to see was the editing side of

16:02

it. A lot of them I edited and they're some

16:04

of my most beautiful memories of just losing

16:07

myself in an edit for like

16:10

time stops. Time stops, I forget I'm alive. I forget

16:12

to eat and go to the toilet and all this

16:14

sort of stuff because you can get lost

16:16

in that. And you obviously started off editing,

16:19

you edited a lot your early stuff and

16:21

then you worked with with Jonathan Alberts on

16:23

stuff as well. Talk to me

16:25

about that part of the process because we

16:27

see a lot about the director, the

16:29

man on set who's pulling all the strings and not so

16:32

much of what goes on in that dark room. Yeah,

16:35

so fascinating because it is you're so right. I

16:37

can get in in the morning and I'm always

16:39

there basically my editor goes crazy but I'm always

16:41

there like even I'm just letting him work away.

16:43

I like to be in the room but you

16:45

know you're there at nine o'clock in the morning

16:47

and you often leave at nine o'clock at night

16:49

and you're like where was the day gone? I

16:51

don't understand where the day has gone, it's just

16:53

vanished. And you can spend

16:56

hours and days and weeks on a scene.

16:58

You can constantly be deconstructing it

17:00

and putting it together in a different

17:02

way and the slightest change can completely

17:04

alter the emotional effect of the scene.

17:07

And then the hardest, I do find

17:09

it hard in the edit, I really

17:11

do because you it's so

17:13

easy to lose any objectivity. You have no

17:15

idea if something's working anymore. You just need

17:18

it 100 times and you're like well I'm

17:20

not feeling anything from this scene so have

17:22

we done something to the scene that is

17:24

now stopping the emotion come out in the

17:26

right way or is he just has

17:29

seen it 20 times? Am I numb now? Am

17:31

I numb to it? And of course you

17:33

are numb to it and you never get

17:35

back those first viewings. So it's really difficult

17:37

and I can find it very, you know

17:39

I'm honest, it creates a lot of anxiety

17:41

and the closer you get to basically showing

17:43

it to people, the execs, you know all

17:45

those people that then have ideas and notes

17:47

and thoughts and then closer to getting to

17:49

final cut. You're like oh god now

17:52

this is going out into the world. Have

17:54

I done everything I can do? Are there

17:57

other takes that I haven't discovered? Are there other moments? Because

17:59

you could edit. for the rest of

18:01

your life on one film. Forever. I could still

18:03

be editing this film now if I hadn't been

18:05

sort of, you know, made to stop or feel

18:07

like now's the time just to move on. I

18:10

always remember recording a

18:12

track with Steve Mason of the

18:14

Beta Band and other things. And

18:17

we recorded it in his studio in Scotland. Like,

18:20

I arrived in the night and we just were

18:22

in this studio for like 12 hours and then

18:24

we're like, I think

18:26

we're done and I'm going to drive back and

18:28

I was driving back to Essex. And

18:30

I remember about four hours in, he rang

18:33

me and I was like, I know, you're

18:35

not sure, are you? Because it's a really

18:37

odd track. It's about fame, but it's repositioning

18:39

it in a very odd way. And I was

18:42

like, I was just, he basically

18:44

rang Steve. Was that shit? Because in those 12

18:46

hours, we were in such a cocoon that

18:50

we're like, we think we've made something amazing. And

18:52

it was like, I had around the same, about

18:54

an hour before him, I'd had the feeling of,

18:57

have we just wasted, like, we think we've made

18:59

something amazing, we think we just wasted it. But

19:01

I then got back around thinking it was amazing

19:04

when he rang. So do you

19:06

and Jonathan go back and forth on that

19:08

at all? Where that's the person who's like-

19:10

Totally, yeah. And it's also like, it's so

19:12

interesting because when have you overworked it? Because

19:14

I think that's a real key. Like

19:16

there can be a magic sometimes in a

19:18

scene when you don't even really know why

19:21

it's working. And then the more

19:23

you start to intellectualize it and you think, well,

19:25

is that the right choice? Should

19:28

I have done something different here? Or should we

19:30

make this clearer? You can then start to fuck

19:32

it up, basically, by overworking it until it's suddenly,

19:34

all the sort of the magic suddenly deflates. And

19:36

you're like, I don't know what's happened now. Or

19:38

you could cut a scene. Technically, this should be

19:40

better. Exactly. Or you do a scene, you're like,

19:42

well, that's it, we've done it, this is brilliant.

19:44

We're in all the moments, we should be in

19:46

the moments when we should be there. And then

19:48

you watch it and you're like, yeah, but I'm

19:50

not feeling an oddness or strangeness that was actually

19:52

quite magical. In this film, there's a lot of

19:54

things that you're like, you're trying to make the

19:56

neurons feel slightly discombobulated, floating

19:58

above something. And so it's

20:01

really tricky. And then you sort of, you put

20:03

it aside. I think when you're in that situation,

20:05

Jonathan is very good at being like, we've got

20:07

to stop, let's move on, go to another scene,

20:09

let's put that aside, and we'll go back to

20:11

it. The worst is when you're absolutely convinced you've

20:13

done it. You've got like the opening is sorted,

20:15

right? We're fine. We know we've got it. Finally,

20:17

we got it right. And then you're gonna look

20:19

at it in three days and you're like, oh

20:21

shit. What the fuck will we be thinking? That's

20:24

completely not right. It's so clearly not right.

20:26

But I think it's really important, isn't it,

20:28

that you go down those paths and

20:30

you follow those routes and you go down things

20:32

that really might not work, but you've got to

20:35

see if they work and see if they're interesting.

20:37

Like do some strange montage in a certain scene

20:39

because it feels like it could work. And then

20:41

if it doesn't work, it doesn't work. You can

20:44

always go back. Yeah, I completely agree. And again,

20:46

it's getting that indescribable

20:48

thing in there. It's not a technical

20:50

thing. I said, particularly with all of

20:52

us strangers, there is just this air

20:55

and these feelings of mild confusion. Me

20:58

and my brother discuss a lot, the modern,

21:01

particularly British and American obsession in film and

21:03

TV with tying everything up in a bow

21:05

and explaining everything. And the way that we

21:07

describe it is you can go to an

21:09

art gallery and you can love a painting

21:11

and not know why, not know anything about

21:13

it. And I think European cinema

21:15

still holds on to more of that, but I

21:17

think a lot of cinema walks away from that.

21:19

I think you're great at that. I think there's

21:21

so much in all of

21:23

your work that you do leave

21:26

questions in there. You do leave,

21:28

but not in a Lynch way.

21:31

And again, I always anger people because I'm convinced

21:33

Lynch does a load of stuff and then allows

21:35

his audience to find the reason for it. And

21:37

then goes, yep, that's what I mean. That's what

21:39

I was doing. Not in that way, like leave

21:42

gaps there that in the world

21:44

clearly have an explanation. We've

21:46

just not turned the camera onto it, if you know

21:48

what I mean. So how important is that, I guess,

21:51

and again, that might come in in the edit, that

21:53

might come in in the script on going, how

21:56

much do we need to lead people along on this?

21:58

And how much do we need to just... Show

22:00

them something. Yeah, that's very true. It's almost

22:02

about like I want you to feel and

22:04

if you can feel something That's more important

22:06

than than than like tying everything up or

22:08

have some kind of logic I also think

22:11

that the minute you tie something up in

22:13

a bow, let's say it's over. You're done.

22:15

The film's done It's finished. It's done It

22:17

doesn't exist in your mind anymore and it

22:19

is a bit like a song like a

22:21

song I love songs that I mean, I

22:23

love a like, you know 12 minute

22:26

song Yeah, sort of goes

22:28

to places really like is it not over yet? Oh, no,

22:30

it's not it's coming back again It's doing something else so I

22:32

can listen to like, you know a

22:34

30-minute song that just is endless and I

22:37

sort of love the way that it oscillates

22:39

and Moves and changes and then

22:41

you finish you like what am I just listen to?

22:44

That's what I want movie to do when you

22:46

come out of the cinema and be like I

22:48

know I've watched something that sort of Makes sense.

22:50

I'm not like what the fuck is this but

22:52

at the same time it's leaving it Perculating

22:55

is making it continue on in your head It is

22:57

like a dream like, you know You wake up from

22:59

a dream and you're like sort of has

23:01

got a beginning actually in the middle of

23:03

an end But I don't really understand fully

23:05

what it's about, but I know that it's

23:08

made me feel something I feel afraid or

23:10

I feel sad or I feel happy whatever

23:12

it might be But I'm

23:14

not entirely sure why and so I like that.

23:16

It's so funny when I was at school A

23:19

teacher said to me you've got an English teacher

23:21

my English She said you've got really good ideas

23:23

Andrew, but you're not very good at expressing yourself

23:26

And I actually think that that is a is now a

23:28

bonus Not not a hindrance

23:30

and I was always like I'm trying to

23:32

be clear Why am I not getting my

23:34

ideas of course? And now I sort of

23:36

lent into that because it's all right that

23:38

your expression of your ideas feels more like

23:40

an Exploration than it does

23:42

a treatise. Yeah on an idea Yeah And

23:45

that's what I like the films to feel

23:47

like and I love seeing other films that

23:49

do the same thing and I'm like I

23:51

don't really know what the conclusion is to

23:53

that, but I know that it's doing something.

23:55

Yeah Again, I think

23:58

I spoke with with emerald of

24:00

funnell about this and how often

24:03

with modern critics there's a demand for

24:05

what are you trying to say with

24:07

this film and she's very much

24:09

like, I'm not, I'm making a film, I'm making

24:12

a piece of art, I want you to feel

24:14

things, I'm not trying to come, I'm showing you

24:16

something and going, look at this, rather than going,

24:19

I've solved a problem guys. Yeah, because it's always

24:21

like, you know, I've been in so many sort

24:23

of Q&A's and interviews and stuff and it is

24:25

like, what do you want people to take away

24:27

from the film? It's such a big question and

24:29

I understand the question, I really do understand

24:31

why someone asked that question, it makes complete

24:34

sense and then often you end up like

24:36

intellectualising what you are trying to get people

24:38

to take away from the film and in

24:40

reality it's so much more complicated than that

24:42

and often you sort of, you know what

24:45

the themes are that you're trying to explore

24:47

in the film, I know what the things

24:49

are that interests me but I'm

24:51

trying to explore them within the film.

24:53

Yeah. You know, I'm not saying this

24:56

is what the film is about, it's

24:58

like I'm exploring very complicated, messy emotions

25:01

that I'm trying to understand, which is why

25:03

I make films to start with, is to

25:05

try and understand those things. I don't have

25:07

the answer, you know, I don't have the

25:09

answer. But I love how much of that

25:11

comes in post rationalising, like

25:13

I've currently got a film in development and

25:16

there's so much kind of in pictures in

25:18

that, I'm explaining all of this, I'm like,

25:21

well the reality is I just want to tell this

25:23

story but to get it over the line, I've now

25:25

over intellectualised it, the point I'm trying to make is

25:27

this and what I'm trying to get across is this,

25:29

it's like, no I just want to tell my little

25:31

story. Yeah. That's all it is but I can't walk

25:33

into you and say, I've got a little story I

25:36

want to tell. And they want to say, and they

25:38

ask, what's it like? Give us some other films that

25:40

it's like and you're like, do I really have to

25:42

give you other versions of something that this is the

25:44

film that it is? And you often end up writing,

25:46

I mean I've written a lot of scenes in my

25:48

films in the past that aren't in the final film,

25:51

because they're there because the reader needs

25:53

to understand more. And

25:55

you realise that you're like, well, no, you're not

25:57

going to need that but then you put the

26:00

The main and because you know you want to

26:02

get the film my easy skyn over the new

26:04

gonna get it over and sometimes you put more

26:06

explanation in the you need to put in the

26:08

scripts you put lines of dialogue in the doom

26:11

know you put him in a suit and if

26:13

you do sit in the not gonna be in

26:15

it but sometimes you just sit across the line

26:17

semis and isn't it the again as much as

26:20

i kind of a sound as if I'm i'm

26:22

of about in it's I'm fascinated by the the

26:24

don't supply between art and commerce and in this

26:26

industry because it is a commercial industry is a

26:28

huge there's loads of money involved. But most

26:31

people are the best people involved in it.

26:33

I just trying to my car and it's

26:35

whoop is a finding that hours because it's

26:37

a my younger days I would be far

26:39

more owner vr is the are is this

26:42

in as I get older it's horrible I

26:44

get to make the our if I make

26:46

this concession the that concession doesn't change this

26:48

or she cites if I can trick them

26:50

decision to to this I get it might

26:53

be out I want to buy yes yes

26:55

you can expect people I mean look I

26:57

don't expect people to give me ten million

26:59

dollars. Just to make something just don't know

27:01

on my desire to make it because I

27:03

want to make peace about like I do

27:05

understand at Just Like It's and Lots of

27:08

Money you know whatever the budget of a

27:10

So my courses and lots of money and

27:12

so you have to understand that it's not

27:14

just for you, you're making something that is

27:16

for the cinema that is going to an

27:18

audience and six sometimes has to make still

27:20

even concessions. This it just like trying to

27:22

understand though lots of those stories the would

27:24

like to tell that and never be able

27:26

to tell because nobody's going to want pay

27:28

for them because no one's. Going to go

27:30

see a supply and I get that it's

27:33

I will walk you do a call on

27:35

the moment of the day so you have

27:37

to confine the stories that speak to you

27:39

that ah personal and feel like you can

27:41

tells didn't even you exploring something are also

27:44

would someone give me money to to make

27:46

them think right in kind of correct in

27:48

the words and sessions they occurs when those

27:50

things do come to conference a bus ride

27:52

as a move when there's an idea that

27:55

your son passion about by the north South.

27:57

It sits on the right level of the

27:59

commercial side. You receive a more exciting

28:01

because you're on this this could be something

28:03

that I would be. So it's a walk

28:05

in a say in cinema freezer and express

28:07

you do a lot you know it with

28:09

a always happens the else be some young

28:12

the filmmakers layla obscure is I've been given

28:14

notes by people and you like economy and

28:16

you've got to take notes from people from

28:18

execs from people and let someone have a

28:20

really good and some of them and not

28:22

good and the and you have to decide

28:24

what works and use got to understand that

28:26

is not what making something so if none

28:28

of those people are going. To want to

28:31

support it seems like you need like I'm

28:33

really happy. I feel like you know the

28:35

people that made this film with me care

28:37

about the film and because the care about

28:39

the film. they want to get out the

28:41

world in the best where they can. So

28:44

it's me working with them in a way

28:46

that we all care about it. You can't

28:48

speak dead, everybody's because India and never make

28:50

another fucking film. Urban Blight know to know

28:52

what you're too difficult to outwit and the

28:55

Is society got to understand that it's not

28:57

just you that is doing the film, it

28:59

is other. People's that of mean you can't be

29:01

true to what you want either. For lack of

29:03

actually made concessions on this film I feel like

29:05

the film is the film I wanted to make

29:07

but it's also the film that other people wanted

29:09

to. My. Yeah. At the same time

29:12

as a beautiful or a pilots have

29:14

told once on the podcast that cost

29:16

any your life correctly his case. Because

29:19

then if the people that Uk and and

29:21

north south of the people he respects and

29:23

and and lumps and there's no bad months

29:25

as exciting as positive I'm on the of

29:27

lucky the I'm at the early stage west

29:30

and will happen to pay any the industrial

29:32

me act inside for wow that at the

29:34

moment only share any scripts with people that

29:36

I know for fact the better than me

29:38

discouraged from of the three via I'd love

29:41

your notes of your spices you can really

29:43

go to get everything he's what is what

29:45

doesn't work is what thou Spencer said in

29:47

the early days was really. Insecure about giving

29:49

things and so actually I'm I'm I'm not

29:51

very good getting better us that would like

29:54

early cups of the film a may be

29:56

protected as the one show it to I

29:58

don't So to lots of people. I've

30:00

got other filmmaker friends, you show me the

30:02

cuts, the best films yes and they're quite

30:04

open. that I'd still have is resistance and

30:06

that is my own saved and security bubbling

30:08

to the surface. But I don't want you

30:10

to think that it's not good because I

30:12

want you to think that I'm a good

30:14

filmmakers so I still like I'm aware. I

30:16

still have my see his yeah I'm a

30:18

nicer send it to produces medicine into execs.

30:20

It's like. Me to

30:23

preview for his film which had never done

30:25

before and it was pretty terrifying and experience

30:27

as oh no I didn't I'm not enjoying

30:29

this this this thanks but the bigger the

30:31

film gets the more you have to set

30:33

the Uk to has to do it easy

30:35

I don't are not Panem on the other

30:37

side of that and of I've mentioned this

30:40

in an ones by worked. Up

30:42

on. A show called to boot with Tom Hardy

30:44

and Stephen Graham who who was insane enough is

30:46

enough Ocean who was amazing as well and Tom

30:48

Woods send me early caps every now and then

30:50

and I it's kind of ask him to stop

30:52

them not know what to say when it's finished

30:55

because if I wasn't in it I would be

30:57

going to see a show this gov Tom Hardy

30:59

and Stephen Grimes were very a bus even own

31:01

a things last I want to see the finished

31:03

version of such know when it's it's not only

31:05

say oh there's only so. Far

31:08

to watch early tough sledding even when I'm

31:10

make films as as you know what genetic

31:12

you. Like is it not letting because of

31:14

it's an early taught to his does not

31:16

worth some never very good actually giving notes

31:18

that people can sum of money and I

31:20

never would say to my partner hoping for

31:23

years own show to him and his was

31:25

done. This is the first time I've shown

31:27

like the first talked to my partner winner

31:29

and use the Us like tech to and

31:31

has been helpful actually much more were distance

31:33

will leave one extra acted stress to pick

31:36

moment. Congratulations have to put aside good work

31:38

on that type of you Find me a

31:40

note eight years of my I did says.

31:42

The person that means to me I

31:44

can find Sun early we suspect something

31:47

since severe for they were. I mean

31:49

I want to talk little bit about

31:51

actors cause again t in most of

31:54

your work is relationships and I want

31:56

to know how he sees sign the

31:58

Andrew Impose. It is Tom

32:01

and And And and Charlotte's Andrew

32:03

a jury Me and clear in

32:05

this this they relationships or tea

32:07

party find that is he rehearsals.

32:09

Is it putting people together? Is

32:11

it interaction? What's your your message

32:13

here It's like I really as

32:15

of a single about it. Recently

32:17

enough have been talking about say

32:19

and back costing and I do

32:21

feel like your job as a

32:24

director is to be like you're

32:26

running estate agency and you have

32:28

to try and work out. Whether

32:30

these people make sense together on whether they

32:32

will like each other oh isn't of posted

32:34

like each other Words: they wasn't like each

32:36

other or they'll find something a bit said,

32:39

something challenging with in that relationship apps but

32:41

it's about working that out. So when I'm

32:43

casting or obese don't want to go progressed

32:45

and spotlights complete said subset of the give

32:47

someone the com act I'm going to. people

32:49

the all I know a good for easy

32:52

to tell you what some of that comes

32:54

with a good actors in line so that

32:56

is a damn and what's the into these

32:58

that they don't I'm gonna watch. Them on

33:00

like red carpets. I'm the new books

33:03

them in all different environments and sign.

33:05

Understand who they might be as people

33:07

and I also think that it's about

33:09

as he will put, it's a chosen

33:11

in their life. Like for me, for

33:14

example, with forty five years, the fact

33:16

that Charlotte had chosen the projects in

33:18

Apostasy chosen all the projects the Tom

33:20

Cody had chosen though the Phils he

33:22

made when he was young. I'm like,

33:25

okay, I understand the person you are

33:27

just because you're films on your choices

33:29

define you. As a person deserves yards

33:31

which is define who we are. So then

33:33

it's so to make sense they make sense

33:36

together and it was the same with this

33:38

it's like I just looked at everybody babbel

33:40

they've done before. You know if the fact

33:42

that James Bell had made has made really

33:45

interesting choices you need his career he notes

33:47

since busy area and so now he's always

33:49

taken in of he doesn't do the obvious

33:51

would sometimes he does big than systems have

33:53

a small things he makes which is it

33:56

seem directors and so you know I bet

33:58

you he is an of. And

34:01

I heard any. Is it not really? Incredibly decent

34:03

guy who's also a really good actor. So you

34:05

tom work the Sat on a bus I want

34:08

but that's a big i want the.to be that

34:10

kind of person and I'm on the month to

34:12

be this cannabis and then you would you put

34:14

them together the you've made to what sessions and

34:17

so far I thought I as have made the

34:19

right decisions and before I ever I don't like

34:21

to just offer somebody a row at this exact

34:23

details of someone about I want to sit with

34:25

them and talk to them yeah and understand Why

34:28

do you want to do the film like. What

34:30

does it feel that you wanted it? Why?

34:32

And that's when you sorts of know whether

34:34

they're right for the wrong because they understand

34:36

the in a way. That means they really

34:39

care about the material and they get the

34:41

material, may understand the material and then usually

34:43

because I slowly build my car stop like

34:45

when play or I met class he knew

34:47

that Andrew was gonna play Adam to she's

34:50

like a wannabe his mom I want to

34:52

work with answers a death switch weapons address

34:54

and this is the reasons why. Want to

34:56

have an answer and then you at all

34:58

acoustic and work together Because. They want to

35:01

be in of a films in a school

35:03

was the same yes am and and you

35:05

so excited that he got to be the

35:07

pool was gonna play harry that are like

35:09

was a gun in I'll mm it's speaking

35:11

to Charlotte say I'm thinking and offering it

35:13

or wanting to me Tom caught me on

35:15

issues like thought about it was like yes

35:17

perfect. As a like that's what

35:19

you want it. it's like getting the

35:21

right people together. I love that he

35:23

is somehow comes across on the screen

35:25

that won't for my excitement. Oh to

35:28

be in the room to give a

35:30

particularly in all of us strangers. Every

35:32

time Harry was on screen I was

35:34

grinning and you'd look and you'd see

35:36

to Andrews greediness were any such that

35:38

there's that whoop it's it's it's affects

35:40

everyone we feeding the same as as

35:42

is being felt on the screen as

35:44

it moves is really nice with for

35:46

it because I think that's. What I'm

35:48

always trying. the tone of even just

35:50

working that I'm trying to create a

35:52

sudden. They can be exhausting trying to

35:55

be warm and friendly the whole time,

35:57

but you need that. I have I

35:59

soon. If you don't have the environment

36:01

onset like things don't work and people

36:03

don't feel comfortable and they don't feel

36:05

safe or the other, they deserve zoom

36:07

after. Best said trailers. whatever is that

36:09

tournaments a nice and that's good stories.

36:11

You don't want that. You want people

36:13

to want to be upset. You want

36:15

the crude. Want to be upset. See

36:17

what the actors to be excited when

36:19

they step on the set? Not like.

36:23

Taking too long with us to so

36:25

much of my energy will most of

36:28

say is about creating the by environment.

36:31

And then this sort of acting of it

36:33

all often takes care of itself. Yeah it's

36:35

a his what you do before and after

36:37

that is the most important thing and it's

36:40

but realizing sometimes us a nothing to the

36:42

actors that it needed and it's sometimes they

36:44

need help or they need to be guided

36:46

or the need to have to talk to

36:49

act as won't talk and talk and talk

36:51

about something some actors.mistook buy anything and just

36:53

i feel at my job is to be

36:55

said to be a therapist and work out

36:58

who needs worked at what time of. When

37:00

do I step in? When to? I'd

37:02

step away. Yeah it's interesting. Book comes

37:04

across on screen as well as well.

37:06

I think of the kind of said

37:08

his mccain things can be masks and

37:10

covered up A book came to mind

37:13

as you would talk about. you want

37:15

the acts as to feel comfortable on

37:17

the set. Feel happy visit glance some.

37:19

The and again is true and a sex scene or

37:22

the end of a set. A sexy. As

37:24

a glance out the pool gives the

37:26

is so tender, unruh, uncomfortable and that

37:28

reflects all of that. I think is

37:30

not because again the sex scenes are

37:33

probably often the most nervous beats to

37:35

come on say and do so. And

37:37

as you see the whites things particularly

37:39

kind of sex scenes have been presented.

37:42

At times. it's very much is the

37:44

sex scene. Where is this. This

37:46

felt as odd as he says it

37:48

felt much just another scene and it

37:50

was just teach you more of how

37:52

comfortable with these two people are instantly

37:54

with each other from the first time

37:56

even when he first as up with

37:59

the door there's a little bit of

38:01

and trepidation they still are. Kind.

38:03

Of Relax and as an award for

38:05

the comfort base lot more slots. Excited

38:07

I forgot? no no you don't come

38:09

in Mrs. Or. The synergy. So yeah

38:11

I guess who that comes at a lousy

38:13

to buy that I'd love to that some

38:15

is the best moments of that seen as

38:18

the moment to that seats because it's so

38:20

open. And tender and generous.

38:22

And it's either is looking at him

38:24

in that moment to say i don't

38:27

be anywhere else but here right now

38:29

is with you and I'm looking in

38:31

your eyes so you know that and

38:33

we can feel comfortable about this about

38:36

what are what was happening and that

38:38

it's always those moments and you know

38:40

that that's in splits that he looks

38:43

up in that moment and I selected

38:45

some was like a surprising moment somehow

38:47

because you feel like all set seem

38:50

to have. A moment of connection when

38:52

two people looking at each other but

38:54

they often don't know you end up

38:56

feeding. It's all about the physicality, not

38:58

about the emotion behind whatever that sexing

39:00

is is about. yeah, sex scenes or

39:02

wanted to The only things that have

39:04

their own son. John Ross said everything

39:06

else is seeds but now it's the

39:08

sec. This is like see everything else

39:11

might say in a sex scene and

39:13

everything else is just say it's such

39:15

as idols and what Cineplex What was

39:17

it like for the actors? No one's

39:19

like no one of asked. What with

39:21

talent to speaking in that suggests it's on.

39:23

It comes to sexy just like how with

39:25

the actors and you're like no one asked

39:27

them that normally may have any of this

39:29

is one of the things that my me

39:31

so happy watching the queue and I of

39:33

Poland and true cause as someone who owns

39:36

like I didn't get to cards, drama school

39:38

or anything so moved interact in and I

39:40

adore it Back there was a point where

39:42

someone was asking how do you get emotional

39:44

but you to from necessary accuracy or to

39:46

or from this mess and I am too

39:48

kind of. Several know the characters sides so

39:50

I'm. Sad must always been. I've always felt

39:52

if the zebra hims good and you can

39:54

find the characters are don't need to draw

39:56

from some heartbreak of my own that Terence

39:59

is hop broken in that moment. Something that's

40:01

exactly those two is not how to be

40:03

accessed through. How did how did Tae soo

40:05

how to carry that? I'm feeling good. Such

40:07

a mosaic as as soon as the empathy

40:09

bet it's Maheu understanding another person and then

40:11

trying to betray that to the what to

40:13

the world and that is always what it

40:15

what it's about. A My So at that's

40:17

why people are confused. on a film set

40:19

you can have a really emotional scene and

40:21

then car and then the violent attacks but

40:24

they are stored. You then go and have

40:26

a good night and one of everything's fine

40:28

but it is. they are. They are understand.

40:30

The a good actor understands what the character

40:32

is fattening and then can it can express

40:34

that like that is will. Good acting. Watching

40:37

is nothing for hundreds in sync as it

40:39

does. It is a personal thing for him

40:41

to, I know it is, but it's also

40:44

his skill as an actor that is being

40:46

able to betray all of the things that

40:48

is betraying in the film, not just because

40:50

it's similar to his own selves. Yeah, you

40:53

know that as mean an effect on our

40:55

if you put me in front of the

40:57

camera it would be a disaster However close.

41:00

To how did you might be to make

41:02

specific says eye contact yeah oh how post

41:04

law the story. For. You to choose

41:06

to tell them for this one does too

41:08

hot personal. So I guess how person is

41:10

it and then how is it when you

41:12

you get to hand over and it's not

41:14

person many mode of a sudden if that

41:16

makes sense. Yeah it's really weird. Well as

41:19

much as to the last summer pounds him

41:21

does that. Key Elements is clearly not autobiographical

41:23

but there was so much of it that

41:25

is. Yeah, that is about me and the

41:27

things that he talks about and lots of

41:29

is possible in I am Nino, that's my

41:31

childhood home. The be shot in the Zola,

41:33

the sense of worth, a worthless affect. the.

41:35

You sure in your childhood home Max? Yeah

41:37

one and it was a weird saying and

41:40

in I I feel like I'm always banging

41:42

on about it now and it's not even

41:44

like it didn't feel as big when I

41:46

was decided to do that as Wire A

41:48

may feel like it is now says. I

41:51

just felt like he was way to me

41:53

to access the material in a way that

41:55

feels lucky to be grounded and I could

41:57

have the story based in some reality even.

42:00

It feels like it's not. In. The

42:02

to realistic story of yet. but it's

42:04

funny because you end up you know

42:06

in the film you express something personal.

42:08

And. Then when you have to talk

42:10

about the film, people are keen

42:13

on the specifics of what his

42:15

personals and then suddenly you end

42:17

up starting to feel a little

42:19

bit uncomfortable. About things that you

42:21

end up talking about, relationships with your

42:23

parents, Reno all the kind of things

42:25

that that I can somehow sometimes find

42:27

myself. Talk about opening. Today's when you

42:29

said the two days after they could

42:32

supply blacks have the discipline of the

42:34

money. Talk about to let it was

42:36

you will as down the line that

42:38

it's being filmed and this on you

42:40

tube him and you're like ah and

42:42

that's the one bit they're going to

42:44

use. The bit that madness uncomfortable and

42:46

now I'm be that's out there and

42:49

it starts to make me feel uncomfortable.

42:51

Down the line you feel like just a

42:53

little bit crisis sometimes because you know on

42:56

a pretty private person and I live my

42:58

life like a live as I live my

43:00

life and then some you can feel like

43:02

ah i've i've three my like out bad

43:05

up just trying to make a film and

43:07

film is the thing not made you ah

43:09

as he can stop still a little bit

43:11

uncomfortable Plan: so interesting hearing you say that

43:13

are could she said earlier about how when

43:16

you're selecting your act as you can't have

43:18

no them through their their catalog but. We

43:20

were one of the thirteenth. The

43:22

research for this. Is not a

43:25

lot when you wikipedia by Snuff out is not

43:27

have information that I felt I know you through

43:29

your film so that as it was one of

43:31

they were nobody did go to. that is topic

43:33

all a bit of a panic from I know

43:35

is this I want to talk about this and

43:37

that I think that's that's what third love you

43:39

kind of just wish he could just be the

43:41

film's yes because they will understand why com I

43:43

think of the lights on now have saved. I

43:47

thought, you know him through his films,

43:49

even when it's film about Emily Dickinson.

43:52

You So let's you understand the director and I

43:54

think I met I met him once, sat at

43:56

a party for like two seconds. But and I've

43:58

I've done think I've really. That many beers,

44:00

interviews, whatever. But I'd love to have so

44:03

many of his films and you feel like

44:05

you understand that person through the films and

44:07

it's the same when you see be smart

44:09

or listen to music or whatever it might

44:12

be you understand the person, food, musical, the

44:14

whatever, the workers and. I'd sort

44:16

of love that that's the sort of

44:18

strange connection that you can have with

44:20

films and music and and all. But

44:22

the weird thing about the world is

44:24

now you also that have to talk

44:27

about something like this conversation is nice

44:29

because it's like an actual conversation. It's

44:31

a proper conversation where you discussing things.

44:33

when you doing a five minute sound

44:35

bites on a red carpet you're like

44:37

us off guard, another oh so you

44:39

shot in your house. What was that

44:42

like yeah and you like ah sounds

44:44

like spider want to talk. About this

44:46

is why us are in the guys as

44:48

at a sound good to me on these

44:50

junkies have given me a decent amount of

44:52

time or is a bright of have to

44:54

have been on the other side of the

44:56

sum of money. On to his wouldn't albums

44:59

and stuff. Earnest Simon is over and over

45:01

again. Where's this Because have an actual sits

45:03

at mouse And before we wrap things up,

45:05

what's the difference? Same as a director between

45:07

shoots him in your child had sunk Because

45:09

I think you've done the extremes in your

45:12

childhood home tissue in the North West L

45:14

a C program and I've built. Up and

45:16

lucky enough to what of in three times

45:18

or woods where become quite close he was

45:20

sent me pictures and videos of the time

45:22

as I don't guys were no in a

45:24

comfortable situation as so you're out in the

45:26

ice. You'd. You'd live in the

45:29

film as don't have a Tv show

45:31

essentially how do those things safer from

45:33

your little child at home to literally

45:35

after the ice on a ship? they

45:37

basically said about the sciences s and

45:40

that's the weird thing is I like

45:42

putting myself and actually everybody else into

45:44

a slightly uncomfortable strange place and so

45:46

being up in the level of that

45:48

tv show would have been so much

45:50

easier to show in a studio. Yeah,

45:53

I will miss at weaknesses in a

45:55

studio dismissed effect so much. Know I.

45:57

Want to get on a ship? I don't want us to be

45:59

on it from. Mum. Outlets. See

46:01

in the you know the arctic sea.

46:03

let's do that and act as it

46:06

can be drawn since I'm going to

46:08

be mouse or the ordinary my god

46:10

i remember as a slice he's were

46:12

actually did get an acoustic an adult

46:15

being up there and it felt like

46:17

it said into of experience of the

46:19

projects and it was an amazing spirits

46:22

be amazing and then shooting in my

46:24

house for like the exact opposite but

46:26

almost exactly the same same time zone

46:28

guys in this massive environments. Which

46:31

was daunting and terrifying and filled with

46:33

existential dread and then going into the

46:35

deepest recesses my memory which is terrifying

46:37

and full of the deepest existential dread

46:40

is just in the house, not floating

46:42

on a piece of i semiotic say.

46:44

So I sort of lasted the way

46:46

that they felt the same. and the

46:48

place I don't like is on a

46:50

film set in a studio and we

46:53

did some for this department as as

46:55

to react to that was fine but

46:57

I don't like that I don't want

46:59

either blood. that volume. And it's too

47:01

easy and I'm behind a monitor.

47:04

City could attach an uncomfortable and

47:06

is an element of wanting to

47:08

feel uncomfortable because if you do

47:10

feel uncomfortable you have to work

47:12

through it. Do And I still

47:14

at. That's what it's about. It's

47:16

about Light As a quote by.

47:19

Com. Uma. That's. A. Red

47:21

as the ot relatively recently and of

47:23

butcher it but it's something to do

47:25

with V. Liberation comes from not glosses

47:28

over the paid but like diving into

47:30

and looking deeply and as not the

47:32

quote but really that's sort of what

47:35

it's saying and I select you fastest

47:37

for yourself in sometimes and I like

47:39

to throw myself in sometimes so I

47:41

feel uncomfortable because that can be west.

47:44

Something interesting is discovered. Ah

47:46

and to be the thing that that

47:48

makes the put it's interesting is it's

47:50

was always fascinated inside me in any

47:52

creation of our and I put it

47:54

down to the fact that whoop when

47:56

we happy when things opposing we try

47:58

spend as much time. The price is

48:00

possible when we're uncomfortable we get out of

48:03

it as quickly as possible so when you

48:05

have been in a safe space to see

48:07

to look back at that and study that

48:09

and deconstruct that's and then if you need

48:12

to put yourself back in there is uncomfortable

48:14

position is where the interested in stuff comes

48:16

out right this way to make your life

48:18

yes I am and especially you always the

48:21

as the or bit like of an outsider

48:23

in the world. would you consider an outsider

48:25

for lots of reasons and don't for like

48:27

fitted to the world you know you can.

48:30

Sometimes is trying to nor your feeling

48:32

of isolation you're feeling of being an

48:34

outsider bits for me I wanna like

48:36

dove into that cents on the ones

48:38

trying to understand it worked it out

48:40

and sometimes you need to like fools

48:42

things and make things complicate in order

48:44

to to get to that space. What

48:47

kind of films do you enjoy? Our

48:49

recent oh are classically and is a

48:51

thing I don't feel ask enough in

48:53

these conversations. This teach all of us

48:55

it is the towards on. I really

48:57

think it's about the mood that I'm

48:59

in. A really do think

49:01

there are lots of times when the last

49:04

thing I want to watch in the world

49:06

is like a burden so but there were

49:08

other times when that is precisely the film

49:10

I need to watch a d to watch

49:12

closing whispers right now because any to watches

49:14

and the know be another time when I

49:16

might. you know what I need to watch

49:18

Christmas vacation Yeah and that is the film

49:20

I need now as it's always by we

49:22

strange when he sort of talk about your

49:25

favorite films of films that means to you

49:27

because sometimes like a rubbish film is the

49:29

film that you. Need to works in

49:31

that moment. I think Christmas I

49:33

will. Definitely what's crap. On

49:35

television on our what's weird tv shows on

49:37

televised about life supermarkets in the eighties yeah

49:39

Chosen one of the has a to and

49:41

as and then other my eyes lit up

49:43

that you could say out our exactly my

49:46

enough as others have it is other not

49:48

a science you like You know what I

49:50

need to go much hundred twenty days of

49:52

sodom what of has his name that expect

49:54

to be a file to preselected yeah I

49:56

think I'm going to what crap t and

49:58

then I'm going again was. That in the

50:00

cinema Yeah I love it. will I usually

50:03

in the podcast ask him the will lox

50:05

ahead to the feels like a natural points

50:07

to end Barney to give full disclosure They

50:09

in this instance is to try and get

50:11

headstone cases. Anything I can be involved in.

50:13

So so what is ahead of what was

50:16

the next plan to this is obviously been

50:18

a long time coming in than that see

50:20

our the strikes and how it will come

50:22

out. All you to think about what's next

50:24

to a destiny of always the more Sonic

50:27

is the most of the make the most

50:29

if you have. In the seats are

50:31

lined up like a the early days

50:33

was like well maybe one of the

50:35

project my happens now this I will

50:37

actually three things could happen and the

50:40

strikes has made a mess of everything.

50:42

sketches all over the place and night

50:44

availabilities changed. I basically got three projects

50:46

all sort of at a similar levels.

50:48

script written, could go sides, get financing,

50:51

Financing is sorts of their but like

50:53

would knocks on dates and so I'm

50:55

not really sure what the next will

50:57

be. I know that it will be

50:59

one of those these two he protagonists.

51:02

yeah a company took the what those

51:04

exact from a sauce but I really

51:06

want to make something basically the end

51:08

of. Next. Year sensible of

51:10

with him Twenty four foot twenty four

51:12

tunnel vision and and on a want

51:15

to make something that but it could

51:17

be that is elizabeth earlier than and

51:19

but also when he made a film

51:21

that sort of like has had a

51:23

conversation with an audience that same people

51:25

are talking about it the next thing

51:27

you do a my a case of

51:29

as waist now going to be in

51:31

relationship to this people are going to

51:33

say oh it's not like this oh

51:35

it's too much like this more I

51:38

wish it was more like. That or

51:40

was it so different? Whatever might be

51:42

a soon. As I used to think

51:44

about what makes sense of forty five

51:46

years example was not assume that people

51:48

sort of wanted me to make up

51:50

the weekend. right? Though laos to

51:52

do another thing about they people and as I know

51:54

where the this is make sense on how to fight

51:57

a little bit in order for that to be the

51:59

next film nine. We really tricky

52:01

want to work out what is next

52:03

for that's roundabout way of saying as

52:05

I really knows but when I was

52:07

about these options is nothing sign that

52:09

he finds again I'm wrapping up from

52:11

is still a d find having multiple

52:13

projects a good way to get anything

52:15

complete. it's if you know I mean

52:17

because if you get stuck somewhere you've

52:20

got somewhere else to go in be

52:22

a productive or yeah I think it

52:24

is that this this this as a

52:26

isn't that you can get to when

52:28

you for that this is helpful. For

52:30

me but also because of right my projects.

52:32

And there's also a bunch of other projects

52:34

that I'm trying to write the could come

52:36

off the bat and like as a book

52:38

or one of adapt and is that but

52:41

of. Is only so much time

52:43

is is that and sometimes people sort of

52:45

suggests science the like your taxes Tv shun

52:47

and like a says it's gray I'm a

52:49

taxi to the math but ah how on

52:52

earth I could actually do it because it

52:54

was to dismiss him missing business and also

52:56

he got to be really aware of not

52:58

always working like you've got to be like

53:00

why am I doing this again I not

53:02

this doing this to keep making things I

53:04

don't want to just make things for the

53:07

sake of it's a why am I doing

53:09

this what's the reason and like at some

53:11

also have. A bit of a light. Sometimes

53:13

I had a like an actual holiday of

53:15

an adult and what was owed me to

53:18

the simplest most but I am not a

53:20

proper holiday Physios years and years and a

53:22

suddenly this is how they have a Holiday

53:24

Inn. I dislike. Will. Actually or bad

53:26

time. Work it out. What is the

53:28

and wanting to do this say and

53:31

what is the bike and students? And

53:33

simple and to take time off

53:36

from find that spices writer, director,

53:38

editor, faster. if

53:41

you didn't throw three minutes like can't sit

53:43

still for two seconds of a city worker

53:45

access to a bone steaks i've well i

53:47

appreciate you taking the time to those been

53:49

implemented an absolute joy real pleasure thank you

53:52

so much You've

54:08

been listening to Scroobius

54:10

Pitts distraction pieces. There

54:13

we go, I hope you enjoyed that as much

54:15

as I did. You probably didn't enjoy it as

54:17

much as I did but I hope you enjoyed

54:20

it to a near level to the amount that

54:22

I did. Go and see all

54:24

of us strangers. So good, so

54:26

good. Go and watch it in the

54:28

cinema and don't read anything about it beforehand.

54:32

We carefully avoided spoilers

54:35

I think in this conversation. So yeah,

54:37

and if you've not seen 45 years,

54:39

get it watched. It's

54:42

really the epitome of the telling

54:45

stories without dialogue or

54:48

telling crucial parts of the story

54:50

about dialogue. It's fantastic.

54:54

So I will see you all next

54:56

week when I've got another wonderful guest.

54:58

I've got one of

55:00

my favourite comedians on next week

55:02

and the week after I've got

55:04

an amazing inspirational dude, a stuntman.

55:06

Yeah, there's some great episodes to

55:08

come so start getting excited. I'll

55:11

see you next week. Until then, stay safe

55:13

and stay sane. Cheers. Good

55:23

news. Ad-free

55:27

listening on Amazon Music is included with

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55:32

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