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2:00

A

2:27

week and a half ago I heard scars from

2:29

my dogman encounters part one, but

2:32

guess was Trevor. On that show

2:34

when he got done talking about his fourth encounter

2:36

we were about an hour in so I decided to

2:39

call it. On tonight's show he's

2:41

going to talk about his fifth encounter and answer

2:43

some questions about all of his encounters.

2:45

So without any further ado let's get to

2:48

it now. My

2:50

fifth encounter happened

2:52

right before my 21st birthday. It

2:56

was September of 2018.

2:59

Me and

3:02

my girlfriend at the time,

3:05

she liked to go out in nature and she liked to go hiking

3:08

but she had war with them so

3:11

she could only do so much before her

3:14

back would start hurting. So

3:18

there's this trail in Fairmark

3:20

Cat State Park that

3:23

people who live around here know about it. It's

3:26

more of like the locals used

3:29

it to go hiking more so than the tourists

3:32

and stuff because they had specific

3:35

trails for those types of people.

3:38

So it was one of those off the beaten

3:41

normal trails. She

3:43

liked seeing nature. So I

3:45

washed mine and her clothes and like that

3:48

thing that gets rid of the human scent, the

3:51

body wash and the deodorant and

3:53

for the clothes and stuff so it gets rid of

3:55

like the human smell. The

3:58

hunters used to bring in the animals. So that's

4:00

what I did to mine and her clothes that

4:02

we were going to wear that day. So

4:07

we could actually see. Dear

4:09

and some of the birds and squirrels and so on and so

4:11

forth. So

4:14

we're hiking, I would say

4:17

we're probably. Not

4:20

even. Not even. Quarter

4:23

mile up the trail and when her

4:25

back started hurting and me and her

4:27

stop, she's like, I'm going to go get the

4:29

car and I'll meet you at the top. Because

4:32

there was like there was roads going

4:34

through because there was like it's

4:36

kind of like the halfway point between some of these

4:38

trails. This road where

4:41

you could park and hike down the

4:43

hill and then hike down the bluff

4:45

back up the bluff to go back to your car or whatever.

4:48

Or you could hike start from the bottom work

4:50

all the way to the top of the bluff

4:53

and then walk all the way back down anyway. She's

4:56

like, I'm going to go get the car and I'll meet you at the top.

5:00

I'm like, okay, that sounds good. I understand. You know,

5:03

you're hurting me and everything. I'll meet you at the top. So

5:07

she goes back down the trail

5:10

and I keep going. I'm still. Probably

5:13

a good 25 minutes from the top

5:16

or so. But there was

5:18

like an outcropping. It

5:21

was kind of like an outcropping in a bluff

5:23

where it had like it had to look like

5:25

a little cave that was like dug into the

5:27

bluff, but it wasn't like

5:29

an actual cave. It was more like an outcropping.

5:32

They had support beams

5:34

in it to help hold up the top

5:37

so people could sit in the shade on this trail. The

5:40

bench was like five

5:43

feet or so away from the trail

5:45

inside this little outcropping.

5:48

I got to that point

5:50

and I'm like, okay, I'm going to stop, take a break,

5:53

get a drink of water. So

5:57

I go in there and I sit and I'm just listening to nature. One

6:02

minute there was birds and then all of a sudden it

6:04

was dead sound like you could hear like a pin

6:06

drop sound. So

6:10

I'm like, this is

6:12

weird, but nothing

6:14

out of the ordinary because I knew there was coyotes.

6:17

I grew up in this area, I knew there was coyotes. And

6:21

coyotes aren't dangerous unless they're in a pack

6:24

where it's a mother. So

6:26

I'm like, okay, it must be just a

6:28

coyote or a pack of coyotes just passing

6:31

through. They're not going to bother me in this

6:33

outcropping because I'm not going to

6:35

make any noise or give them any reason to bother

6:37

me. I

6:39

would say 30 seconds

6:44

to a minute, the

6:46

smell of like rock, like

6:52

a carcass being out in the sun on the

6:54

side of the road for months,

6:59

even 10 days in the hot sun, kind

7:02

of rot smell. When

7:05

I smelt it, my

7:08

blood went cold. I

7:11

felt like my

7:13

soul was getting sucked out of my body.

7:17

And the smell kept getting stronger and stronger.

7:22

And then next thing I hear on

7:24

top of the smell was boom, boom,

7:27

boom, like elephants

7:30

walking, kind of sound. It

7:32

was shaking the ground. It was shaking the top

7:34

of the outcropping. And

7:37

I just hear it and it starts getting all, it

7:40

starts walking over top of this outcropping.

7:45

And I'm like, I'm

7:48

too scared to leave this outcropping

7:51

or to run when I first smelt it. I'm

7:53

like,

7:54

I'm going to be better off staying right here.

7:58

I think that was just the prime instinct

8:00

will be like, you're better off not

8:03

trying to run because then that makes you look

8:05

like prey. And if you

8:07

make any noise, you're going to be prey. So

8:12

first thing I see after

8:16

hearing and smelling all this, I

8:18

see one claw

8:21

or paw or hand with

8:25

black daggers just

8:27

wrapped. It looks like it's right,

8:31

right or left hand wraps around

8:33

the top of the outcropping and

8:36

has the daggers pointing in. I

8:42

stop breathing. And

8:46

then the other

8:49

hand comes around that

8:51

top of the outcropping. And

8:54

then I see its

8:59

head start coming down. And

9:03

it kind of peered into the

9:06

outcropping. And

9:08

it was sniffing the air

9:10

as it was looking into the outcropping.

9:14

And it had like the wolf-like

9:16

face. Its

9:22

eyes

9:28

looked like a kind of like

9:32

reddish color.

9:35

And it had the normal wolf-looking

9:37

face. It had like the doverman

9:40

pincher ears on top. But they were

9:42

kind of more, they weren't up, they

9:45

were slanted back. And

9:48

then it jumped down.

9:54

And it shook the top of this outcropping.

9:57

Like a little peb of rock. probably

10:00

the size of like a quarter. Fell

10:04

and hit me in the head. But

10:06

I couldn't react because my

10:08

body just went into instinctive, be

10:11

like the rest of everything around you, be silent,

10:13

be still. And

10:15

it's standing on this trail, blocking

10:18

the entrance to the outcropping. The

10:21

entrance of this outcropping is like five

10:24

feet away from where I'm sitting.

10:29

And it's like kind of not standing

10:31

completely up on

10:34

its hind legs, but it's like

10:36

kind of hunched,

10:37

like hunched over, but its front arms

10:40

weren't

10:42

touching the ground and the front hands

10:47

or paws or claw, whatever,

10:50

weren't touching the ground. They

10:53

were like hovering like two or three inches off

10:56

the ground.

10:57

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It was kind of, it had,

12:29

it

12:34

had matted like blood on its hands

12:39

and arms. Kind

12:42

of like on the under part of its like jaw

12:46

and

12:48

kind of up underneath like where its

12:51

nose was. Had

12:53

like matted blood

12:56

and, you know,

13:00

visceral. And

13:04

it was sniffing the air and then it would bend

13:06

down. That touching its front,

13:10

Paul's touching the ground

13:12

in front of it. It would start sniffing like towards

13:14

the ground. Then it would go back

13:16

up, start sniffing the air. I

13:21

felt like I was in a freezer. That's

13:24

how cold my blood was going. It

13:28

had the body of

13:31

like a body

13:34

builder. It was

13:37

take the biggest body

13:40

builder you could think of, whether

13:43

it's from the eighties all the way up until

13:45

now, it was that ever

13:48

bit of that bit. Its

13:51

arms, its

13:53

arms could easily reach me. If

13:57

it knew it probably knew I was

13:59

there. but if it if it could

14:02

I'm just by the length of the arms

14:04

it could easily reach

14:06

in there and grab anything that could be

14:08

in there its

14:11

fur was like black and then as it came

14:13

down its back there

14:15

was like kind of like an arrow

14:17

and then

14:20

it had like you could see like

14:22

a skin it was

14:25

like black skin it had

14:28

like nicks

14:31

and cut scars on it like you

14:33

know when you you know you're running through

14:35

the underbrush you're getting cut by like thorns

14:37

and stuff like that and

14:40

if

14:41

it being that big it

14:43

probably is hitting sticks and stuff too

14:46

and it's probably scratching it and leaving

14:48

scars and whatever

14:50

it's hunting could also put up a fighting league

14:52

of scars so

14:57

then it comes down and it basically

15:00

had a strip of fur lining its spine

15:04

and then it went into its like tail and it was

15:06

kind of like a wolf

15:10

tail but not

15:13

as bushy and

15:17

then down to its lower

15:19

parts it had

15:21

like the dog-like legs and

15:25

its genitalia were huge

15:29

and it was a male its

15:33

teeth were like yellowy white

15:36

stained a little bit if

15:40

it was standing completely straight up

15:42

I could it was probably easily eight nine

15:44

feet tall but

15:47

it was like kind of hunched over so I

15:49

can't I don't really know

15:54

and it sat there it felt like a turnipy sniff

15:56

in the air and then

15:58

sniffing the ground.

16:01

Even

16:01

if

16:03

I wanted to run, I couldn't go nowhere.

16:06

I was enclosed. I had rock

16:08

walls of this outcropping

16:10

on either side and I had a wall behind

16:12

me. And the only entrance is

16:14

where this thing was standing. And

16:18

like I said, it stood there and it felt like

16:20

an eternity. It

16:23

could have been easily five minutes. But

16:26

it felt like an eternity.

16:33

And then it finally

16:35

caught whatever scent it was looking for and

16:40

took off. I

16:43

still stood there. You

16:46

could still smell it. And as the

16:48

smell started fading away, once

16:54

the smell faded away, I was

16:56

like started breathing

16:58

again. And

17:02

then slowly

17:05

the birds started

17:07

coming back and you started

17:09

hearing the normal nature sound. And

17:12

as soon as I started hearing the birds chirping

17:14

and nature sounds coming, I grabbed my stuff

17:17

and I just ran up the rest of the way.

17:19

And then as soon as

17:22

I got in the car, she was

17:24

asking me what's wrong. I'm

17:26

like, I don't want to talk about

17:28

it. Even if I told you, you wouldn't believe me anyway.

17:33

I mean, her had a big argument in the car because

17:35

I wouldn't tell her. And

17:39

then we finally left and started

17:41

going home. And

17:44

that was my last

17:47

encounter. Trevor,

17:49

I can't even imagine going through half of those

17:51

encounters. Those were so

17:53

intense. Holy cow.

17:56

Trevor, do you think having that first encounter

17:58

when you were six, shape the development to

18:01

the adult you are now? In

18:04

a way, yes, Vic. I'm

18:07

not quite sure how to describe

18:10

how it's impacted, but I think

18:12

it had a part of it. Would

18:14

you say it's for the better or the worse?

18:18

When it comes down to any

18:21

kind of life impact, it doesn't matter if

18:23

it's worse or better, it makes

18:25

you either stronger because

18:29

of the encounters or

18:31

if you take it with a grain

18:33

of salt and you're like, okay, it

18:36

happened, I can't control it. I might

18:39

as well learn to accept it and grow from

18:41

it. I like that, that's

18:43

a great way to look at it. You

18:46

said that you had to stand on your bed to look out

18:48

the window above the bed when you had

18:50

that first encounter. From outside,

18:52

how far was it from the porch up to the windowsill

18:55

of that window? The

18:57

window I was talking about is the little basement

19:00

window that

19:02

was on the side of the house and it's like a

19:04

clean drop. The

19:08

actual front window, I

19:11

could actually stand up in front

19:13

of it. It was like a normal sized living

19:16

room window on the front

19:18

of the house. And then on the side

19:21

facing the abandoned house, there was like a little

19:24

basement window that had

19:27

my bed underneath it where I had to stand up

19:29

onto it to look out towards

19:32

the abandoned house and down. Oh,

19:34

I see, okay, I have that mixed up.

19:37

How long do you think it might've been standing there watching

19:40

you before you actually saw it? Honestly,

19:44

Vic, I don't know. It could have

19:46

been there for as

19:48

long as an hour before

19:51

I would notice it, I don't know. You

19:55

don't know and probably don't want to know, do you? No, not really. really

20:00

don't want to know how long it was standing there.

20:03

Yeah, I can't say I blame you. You

20:06

did say it had six-inch claws though.

20:08

Were they hooked or straighter like

20:11

Grizzly's? They

20:15

kind of were like kind of straight

20:18

and then kind of curved down

20:20

towards like the tips. Grizzly's

20:23

claws do that in a way. I kind of wonder if there's

20:25

a comparison there. Did

20:28

its facial expression seem to change

20:30

when it saw that you could see it? If

20:33

its facial expression changed, I didn't

20:36

see it. My brain was just trying to make sense

20:38

of the whole situation. Oh

20:40

no, I understand you're only sick, so

20:43

you're just doing the best you could to hold it together.

20:45

How far was your house

20:48

from the woods that wrapped around it? Um,

20:55

I would say about 10, 15 feet,

20:57

maybe 20. Wow,

21:03

close. Yeah, that's really

21:05

close. How big were those woods? Um,

21:11

those woods kind of had like a valley.

21:13

Like there was a creek and then had like

21:15

some spots were like easier

21:18

to traverse and then there was stuff

21:20

that was like it kind of had the

21:22

limestone bluffs sticking out. So

21:28

with it being on the river and

21:30

it not being as settled because

21:32

of the

21:34

building constraints,

21:36

I would

21:39

say probably a thousand

21:43

acres because if you're going

21:46

from where it started,

21:51

all the way down towards like the turnabout

21:55

that's down that road,

21:57

it was what I would say about it.

22:00

100 acres, 1,000 acres, I don't really remember.

22:06

Then it was like, I think 100 acres

22:10

across. I

22:15

could go in the woods and then I could walk

22:18

that many acres and then I would be in

22:20

somebody else's backyard.

22:23

From listening to you describe that woods and

22:25

everything you had in it, it sounds like a great place

22:27

for a dog man to run around and make a living, unfortunately.

22:31

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In 2009 when you had your second encounter, how many years had gone by?

24:08

That's a tough question, Vic, because I don't... my

24:10

brain doesn't process numbers

24:13

very well. Oh, that's alright.

24:15

That's not a problem. When you first saw

24:17

that second dogman, you're outside with

24:20

it. How close did you say you were to it

24:22

when you hit it with your flashlight?

24:25

Eh, because I had a military

24:27

grade flashlight, so I could actually

24:30

see up to 100 yards, if not 150 yards

24:32

away. It

24:37

was about 50 to 60

24:42

yards away from me. Which

24:44

probably felt like 6 feet. Yeah.

24:48

Yeah, I bet it did. You

24:50

said you saw it holding its tail underneath its

24:52

butt. How would you describe its tail, though?

24:56

See, Vic, I grew up around... I

24:58

used to raise dogs and cats, so I

25:01

know kind of how they wrap their tail

25:03

underneath when

25:05

they're frustrated or mad,

25:07

so... I

25:09

would say the tail was probably...

25:12

it kind of looked

25:14

like a... kind

25:16

of the husky poof on

25:19

the tail, like the Siberian husky

25:21

poof. How long would

25:23

you say it was? I

25:26

would say roughly... 4 feet or

25:31

less. Well,

25:35

that's pretty long, but if

25:37

you're talking about something that size, that

25:39

fits. Looking back

25:42

on what happened that night, do you still think it was trying

25:44

to get into the camper with you, Trevor,

25:46

or do you think it was just trying to frighten

25:48

you?

25:49

Honestly, I think it was probably

25:52

just frightening me after talking to you

25:54

about it... in private.

25:58

I think it was just trying to scare me. me. If

26:01

it really wanted to get in there, it could have easily

26:03

gotten in there. Especially with

26:05

the claws that they have, they

26:07

could easily tear through that.

26:10

Then

26:11

press sheet, steel, like

26:14

it probably with butter. It's

26:16

good you understand

26:18

that. There's only one reason why you're

26:20

still here today and that's because it didn't want

26:22

to actually come in and get you. Like

26:24

I told you that night if it wanted to,

26:27

it could have snatched that door right off of the wall.

26:29

So the fact it didn't do that tells

26:32

you it didn't want to actually get in. It just wanted

26:34

to get a rise out of you. You

26:36

never did tell your stepdad about what happened that

26:39

night. How close did you come to telling

26:41

him though? I

26:43

never told him. I never wanted

26:45

to tell him. But

26:48

I started sleeping in in the farmhouse

26:51

with my grandmother after that if

26:53

I stayed out there by myself. Yeah,

26:56

you probably wouldn't have responded very well to it

26:58

if you had told him so. Don't

27:00

blame ya. Was the dogman

27:02

from your first or second encounter more

27:04

frightening to look at in your opinion? My

27:08

second. Yeah, sounds like

27:10

it was. That whole hyena look

27:12

that's pretty freaky. It

27:14

sounds to me like your second encounter shook you

27:16

up more, quite a bit more in fact, than your first

27:19

one did. Is that an accurate assessment?

27:22

Yeah, because the first

27:25

encounter it just seemed like it was curious.

27:29

More so than

27:31

wanting to get a rise or whatever.

27:34

And the second one gave you that mindset that it was

27:36

coming to get ya. So I can

27:38

understand why that shook you up more. When

27:41

you had your third encounter, you were heading down the road

27:43

with your friend. What time would you say

27:45

it was when that encounter happened though?

27:47

In

27:49

between I

27:51

would say midnight and three

27:53

as a rough estimate

27:56

because I don't remember exactly

27:58

what time it was. So

28:01

pretty late. How far

28:03

were the dogmen from the road you're on? I have

28:07

pretty good night vision for my

28:10

eye. Being able

28:12

to see in the dark pretty well. So

28:15

I could see like

28:17

spot shadows and movements up to about

28:20

the farthest I've

28:23

done is 50 yards. So I would

28:27

say that we're in between 50 and 20

28:32

yards away. Well

28:34

that might seem like a good distance, but when

28:37

you're talking about dogmen that's still way too close

28:39

for comfort. Do you still

28:41

think it was foolish to stop the car the way you

28:43

two did? No,

28:46

because he was curious

28:48

and it was, I just

28:51

wanted to make sure my eyes weren't playing tricks on

28:53

me. Well also

28:55

too that car gave you a false sense of security.

28:58

A lot of eyewitnesses have a false sense of security

29:00

when they're in a car or truck, but

29:03

when it comes down to it if a dogman wants to get

29:05

you in a car or truck it can easily do that.

29:08

But when those encounters happen in

29:10

almost every case they don't try. When

29:13

you had your third and fourth encounters you weren't

29:15

alone. How much easier was it

29:17

for you to deal with those encounters compared

29:19

to one, two, and five considering the fact

29:21

you had company?

29:25

I didn't feel as crazy thinking

29:27

about my the previous

29:30

encounters after those

29:32

two. I didn't feel like I was actually

29:34

just, it wasn't a figment of my

29:36

imagination. You know, I've

29:38

actually seen it with two different

29:41

people and they've actually seen it.

29:44

So I didn't feel so crazy. Oh

29:48

sure, for that reason and several

29:50

others. Yeah it's just normally easier

29:52

in general to have an experience like that if you

29:54

have company with you, but

29:57

it's best by far to not have a dogman

29:59

encounter if you of course.

30:02

When your friend's girlfriend stopped the car

30:04

when you had your fourth encounter, you said you were

30:06

about 10 feet from them and

30:08

that she freaked out when she saw them standing

30:11

there.

30:11

When she was freaking out, was she screaming

30:14

or trying to stay quiet? She

30:17

was not

30:21

like actually like high-pitched screaming.

30:26

You know like the it's like the stunned

30:29

scream that you get when

30:31

somebody like startles you. That's

30:34

kind of what it was and

30:37

then she just started crying. I think at

30:41

that point she was didn't care if they

30:43

hurt her or not. She just her brain just

30:46

could not compute with it. Poor

30:49

thing sounds like she really took that hard.

30:52

I'm so glad you were there with her. If you wouldn't

30:54

have been there with her and she had that experience alone,

30:56

can you imagine how much harder it would have been for? Yeah

30:59

and not only that having

31:01

a kid in the car on top of that, yeah no.

31:04

Yeah that wouldn't have been good at all. You

31:07

said that one of them was 10 to 11 feet tall

31:09

and the next biggest one was about 8 to 9 feet

31:12

tall. The other two were only

31:14

about 7 feet though. Did

31:16

you get the impression that you might have been looking at a family?

31:20

To answer your question, Vic, yes. I thought

31:22

I was looking at a family. Well

31:24

that's something when Junior is about 7 feet tall.

31:27

Did any of them have expressions on their

31:30

faces? They look kind

31:32

of pissed off. Pissed

31:35

off slash kind of got like the curious

31:37

look.

31:39

If they were pissed off it makes you wonder why they

31:41

ask where did you out of the area.

31:43

But they might have done that just to get rid

31:45

of you. It's hard to say. Were they

31:47

all making direct eye contact with you too

31:50

or were they looking elsewhere? The

31:54

two smaller ones kept looking back

31:56

behind them. Huh,

31:58

wonder what that was all about. Then

32:00

again, they might have been looking for other dog men, it's

32:03

hard to say. You

32:05

did say they looked like prototypical werewolves.

32:08

Did they give you the impression that they were the embodiment

32:10

of evil, or did you get the impression

32:12

they were just animals? I

32:15

think they're probably

32:17

animals more so than a supernatural

32:23

being like a werewolf or

32:26

a shapeshifter. Well,

32:28

there are a lot of eyewitnesses who describe them that

32:30

way as just being flesh and blood animals out

32:32

there making a living the best way they

32:34

know how.

32:36

So you're not the first to describe

32:38

them that way. What kind of

32:40

posture did they have standing there with

32:42

them more stooped over or standing up

32:44

straight? The two

32:46

bigger ones were standing up straight.

32:50

The two little ones were hunched over, ready to fight

32:52

something. I

32:57

don't know. I can only

32:59

imagine what it must have been like to see that, to

33:01

see them standing there. That's

33:03

just too much. While

33:06

they're escorting you out of the area, how fast

33:08

would you say you were going? If

33:11

I had to guess, we were probably going 60

33:14

plus. Wow.

33:19

And you said they kept that speed up for about a mile?

33:22

Yeah, they stayed behind the vehicle though.

33:25

They never really got up on the sides of the vehicles.

33:28

So they were going a little... If

33:30

they wanted to match the car for speed, they

33:32

could have easily, and then some.

33:35

But I think they were just staying

33:37

behind

33:39

for whatever unknown reason. Probably

33:42

just to keep an eye on you. Leftovers?

33:45

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33:47

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34:45

It's a given that some of the listeners are wondering

34:47

why you didn't pull your phone out of your pocket and take

34:49

pictures of them, Trevor. What would you say

34:51

to them in response to that?

34:55

In that situation,

34:57

you're not thinking about your phone. You're

35:00

not thinking about anything. You're just thinking on

35:02

trying to comprehend the situation.

35:05

And I didn't have a

35:07

cell phone until I

35:11

had an actual camera working on it. I

35:13

didn't have one until I was close

35:16

to 18. Well

35:18

even if you did have one in your possession, if you

35:20

think about what was actually going on, it's

35:22

hard to expect anyone to pull a phone

35:25

out and be concerned about taking pictures.

35:27

You're worried about saving your hide, so

35:30

who could expect you to take pictures?

35:33

In September of 2018, when you had your

35:35

fifth encounter, you were hiking with your

35:37

girlfriend. Had you been hiking at that

35:39

place before?

35:41

I've gone hiking at that place many,

35:43

many times

35:45

before this.

35:47

And it was like a kind of well-worn

35:51

animal trail.

35:52

Because a lot of mushrooms go out to

35:55

Piermar Cat and they'll use the game trails.

35:58

So a lot of those trails... that the

36:00

deer have worn, mushroomers

36:03

are used, and then that's

36:06

what that was. The actual regular

36:08

traditional hiking trails, they're

36:11

marked and they have maps

36:13

along at different

36:15

points. So

36:19

considering the fact you've got hiking trails going

36:21

all throughout that area, how big of a

36:23

forest is that? The

36:26

last time I, because I went camping

36:28

out there when I was in Boy Scouts and the

36:31

park ranger told us

36:33

that it was like 8,000 acres

36:36

plus. Wow

36:38

that's big, that's a lot of woods. Oh it's

36:42

like woods and cliffs. Yeah

36:45

that's great habitat for them.

36:47

As that dog man was standing there at the opening

36:50

of the cave, was it growling or making

36:52

any other sounds?

36:54

No it was silent, like it was stalking

36:56

something. Hmm makes

37:00

you wonder what was stalking. Your

37:02

two friends are actually the reason why you contacted

37:05

me. Did they have much trouble coercing

37:07

you to do that or did you jump

37:09

at the chance?

37:11

They bugged me about it but

37:13

they didn't

37:14

push me to talk about it. There's

37:16

like we recommend you try talking

37:18

about your encounters since,

37:21

because the only time I really talked about

37:24

those encounters was you know, I

37:27

literally had to be either had

37:29

to be drunk or high off marijuana to

37:31

talk about it. Well as

37:33

you know a lot of eyewitnesses have a lot of trouble

37:36

talking about their encounters so it's

37:38

understandable why you would as well. Unfortunately

37:41

your friends used to pressure you to talk about your

37:44

experiences. How much harder

37:46

did that make it for you to come to terms with them though?

37:49

They just knew that it

37:51

bothered me talking about that stuff

37:54

and I'm a pretty open book but

37:57

the fact that I didn't talk about it with

37:59

them

38:00

And they're my like, you

38:02

know, they're my best friends. They know they

38:04

could literally write stories

38:07

of my life.

38:09

They know a lot more than

38:11

what my parents even know.

38:14

And the fact that I didn't want to talk about

38:17

those encounters with them.

38:20

They knew there was some it needed

38:23

to be resolved. Well,

38:26

it goes without saying, I'm so glad they care so much

38:28

about you. Sounds like they're really good friends

38:30

to have.

38:32

Oh, they are. They're wonderful people.

38:34

It sounds like it. Yeah, I'm so

38:36

glad they talked you into reaching out to me. Thank

38:39

goodness for that. Trevor,

38:41

you've had encounters in your bedroom and

38:43

outside in the woods out in the countryside.

38:46

Would you say one kind of an encounter is inherently

38:48

worse than the other to have?

38:51

It varies, really. It varies

38:54

to person to person. Like my bedroom

38:56

encounter compared to being trapped in a

38:58

freaking cave

38:59

or in a little outcropping.

39:02

I would say the outcropping trapped

39:05

with no sense of security

39:07

or barrier between me and, you know.

39:11

It's a lot harder to deal with. Yeah, that

39:13

makes sense.

39:14

What's about time for us to get out of here, Trevor?

39:16

But before we do, do you have any closing comments

39:19

you'd like to share?

39:21

Don't go looking for these.

39:24

And for those who may

39:26

comment, some of these places

39:29

are no longer taken

39:31

out by weather or been torn down.

39:34

And don't go on private

39:36

property.

39:37

No matter where you go, don't

39:39

go on private property.

39:42

Go to jail and get a shot ain't worth

39:44

it. Especially if you don't have

39:46

permission.

39:48

You're right. No, it's not worth it. I

39:51

can't thank you enough for coming on and sharing

39:53

the details of all these experiences with

39:55

us. It was clearly a very

39:57

difficult thing for you to do, but I think you're going to go on private property.

39:59

I'm so glad you did decide to come forward. Thanks

40:02

again so much for your time. Thank you, Vic.

40:06

Oh, you're welcome. Thanks

40:08

again so much, and have a great night.

40:30

Thanks again.