0:02

Today's show is pre-recorded, so we're not gonna

0:04

be able to take your great calls, but stay tuned. This is

0:06

actually one of our best shows. Well,

0:15

this is it's it's alive and this. And every

0:17

Saturday at this time we have a really what I think are

0:19

helpful conversations. Lots of them. And I love

0:22

having them because I love to bring guests

0:24

to you that I think have insight, insights

0:26

and helpful information

0:28

and thinking that I help you really kind of, you know, live

0:30

on mission, show and share the love of Jesus and

0:32

more. And today's guest is going to do that

0:35

just as, as well. And

0:37

we're going to have a conversation really about,

0:39

about sometimes the challenges of just communicating

0:42

with people who are

0:44

not maybe followers of Jesus. I was I

0:46

was just recently had a conversation. Um,

0:48

I was I guess I probably give too much of the details,

0:51

but but just conversation

0:53

with someone who I was engaging in a business

0:55

transaction with. Um, that sounds

0:57

that sounds very high end. It was basically I was buying

0:59

something, um, and

1:02

it just started conversation. And the person,

1:04

you know, I always one of the things I try to do is just

1:06

as a spiritual discipline is

1:08

I ask the Lord every week for the

1:11

last Lord regularly, though, that every week I might

1:13

have the privilege of having a gospel

1:15

conversation with somebody just like, you know, people have spiritual

1:17

disciplines like praying and and reading

1:19

their Bible and maybe fasting on a regular basis. I

1:22

ask the Lord for the spiritual discipline practice

1:24

of sharing the gospel on a weekly basis.

1:26

And I found that that the Lord just opens

1:28

those doors when you're looking for him to open

1:30

those doors. So anyway, so I'm having this conversation

1:32

with this gentleman, and, you know, it's not just

1:34

me buying something, but it takes a few minutes. So

1:37

in the midst of that, he asks,

1:39

you know, well, you know, what brought you here? And

1:41

I said, well, I just I just moved here. So as

1:43

of right now, by the way, I am broadcasting live from

1:46

my new little mini studio

1:48

place at Mariner's Church, where so

1:50

thanks to Mariners Church, where I serve as a

1:52

teaching pastor and scholar in residence. So,

1:54

so anyway, so I just told him I just moved here and

1:57

he asked what I did. I told him I was the the

1:59

dean, that Biola University and

2:02

he kind of he almost had a familiarity with

2:04

that. But and then he started asking some

2:06

questions and then I told him I was, you know, I was teaching

2:08

pastor at this church. And he

2:10

he said to me, uh, you know,

2:12

I just said in the back room,

2:14

he said, I just had said, you know, God, I just had some questions.

2:17

I need some I need some guidance

2:19

and direction. It just seems like you're here.

2:21

And just like the Lord opened the door and,

2:24

um, and we able to have this conversation. But

2:26

what was important worth noting is that

2:28

that I wasn't at a place where

2:30

I, you know, could use a lot of religious terminology.

2:33

Um, there was, um, you know, I

2:36

come from, you know, I teach at a Christian

2:38

university. I'm a pastor. Right.

2:40

So, um, there was already

2:43

a communication gap, which I was very comfortable bridging.

2:45

But we we know that it exists.

2:48

And and we're going to talk

2:50

a little bit about, about how do we bridge

2:52

some of those, those gaps today

2:55

we're going to talk some today about

2:57

how the Lord opened and closes doors. We're going to

2:59

talk about the language of culture. The culture

3:01

is paying attention to in the language of Christ is

3:03

how it relates to prayer. We're going to talk about all these different

3:05

languages. Speaking these two languages makes us, in a

3:07

sense, bilingual. We're going to talk about

3:10

all these things. And our guest today is Shawna

3:12

Pilgrim, and she and her husband,

3:14

Ben Lee, co-lead epic Church.

3:16

She serves as the teaching on the teaching team

3:18

there at Epic and is network director for

3:20

Alpha USA. You've heard me.

3:23

I've had guests from Alpha on before. She

3:25

writes for, uh, really Everyday People, Everyday

3:28

Evangelist, she calls it on her blog and she's written

3:30

the new book, What We're Going to Talk About today, Translating

3:33

Jesus How to Share Your Faith in Language

3:36

Today's Culture Can Understand. We

3:38

actually have five copies of the book.

3:40

Now again, whenever I say that, they always

3:42

remind me, like my team always reminds me when

3:44

I say we're giving away five copies. Book is not calling up and saying,

3:46

hey, can I get a copy of the book? No, no, no, we're

3:49

giving copies away to the brilliant

3:51

callers and insightful questions

3:53

and people who call in. And that number

3:55

to call in, by the way, is (877) 548-3675.

4:01

So let's talk about, um, first about who

4:03

this book is written for or written

4:05

to. Shawna, thanks for joining us on the program. Tell us a little

4:07

bit about the book and your focus.

4:09

Absolutely. Ed, it's good to be on here

4:11

with you. Yeah. This book, I

4:13

really had two people in mind. And

4:16

even when I say that like the like,

4:18

actually, I have two faces that come, that come to

4:20

my mind. And it's the person who is

4:23

so entrenched in the church that

4:25

they're afraid and unsure how to engage with

4:27

culture. And it's also the person

4:29

who is new to Christ, and they're

4:31

so entrenched in the culture that they're trying to

4:33

figure out the language of the church

4:36

and of Christianity.

4:37

Yet I think it's an important distinction largely.

4:39

You know, I come from a mostly

4:42

non-Christian family, and

4:44

it's there it's almost like I got to change

4:46

language when I when I go

4:49

into some of those different settings, which I'm very

4:51

comfortable with, I actually find

4:53

enjoyable. You know, we both live in California.

4:56

This is not the Bible Belt. And

4:58

you're part of the California is much more unchurched than my part of

5:00

California. Um, so, so

5:02

so how do people get these

5:04

language patterns in the first

5:06

place? Um, why why does

5:08

it matter that we, we kind of think about those things?

5:11

Yeah. I love that Ed and my

5:13

my roots are in the. South. So I grew up in

5:15

the Bible Belt. I grew up as a pastor's kid.

5:18

So yes, even though I've written this book

5:20

out of the culture of San Francisco, it

5:23

was not my upbringing. My upbringing

5:25

was entrenched in the church. I was there,

5:27

you know, the saying, you know, every time the doors

5:29

were open. So I learned the language

5:32

of church, the language of Christ, at

5:34

a very young age. But it's been

5:36

living in the culture that I'm

5:38

in, that we're ministering in, where I've

5:40

learned to speak the language of the culture,

5:43

and it comes just from paying attention.

5:45

I love that it's not when

5:47

I say these everyday evangelists that I write

5:49

to, it's because we all get practice

5:51

every day, and practicing the

5:53

language of culture is just paying attention to who

5:56

we live around, what's going on.

5:58

Um, and learning to speak the language of

6:01

the people that we're around. I feel like

6:03

Paul, everything he wrote

6:05

in the New Testament, this

6:07

is how he did it. When he stepped into

6:09

a city, into a new culture, he

6:11

learned the culture, um,

6:13

how they did life and how

6:16

they did family, how they did art

6:18

and everything before he began to speak into

6:20

it. And so I think that's just the practical

6:22

way that we speak the language of culture.

6:24

It's not, um, it doesn't come with a

6:26

degree. It simply comes from

6:29

and like you said earlier, it comes from just engaging your

6:31

culture, asking God to open

6:33

up our eyes and lead us into

6:35

those conversations.

6:37

You mentioned Paul, of course, and

6:39

as a mythologist, I my heart warms

6:41

when anyone mentions Paul's attempt at communication.

6:44

Uh, in acts we see this the next, you know, 13

6:46

x 14. And again up in acts 17

6:49

at visiting Antioch. He speaks

6:51

the language of Jewish history at uh,

6:53

at Lystra. He speaks the language of really like

6:55

the farmers of of the harvest

6:58

and the this, the see and this and

7:00

this and the sun and the seasons, and

7:02

then it acts 17 is kind of the high point

7:04

of this. He speaks, you know, the he quotes Epicurean

7:07

and Stoic poets and philosophers. So I think it's

7:09

and you really point us to these things. And by the

7:11

way, the book is, is, is you get you could pre-order

7:14

the book right now. We're actually, uh, a

7:16

few days early. The book actually comes out on August

7:18

15th, which is my wedding anniversary. So I'm going to get

7:20

it as a special wedding anniversary

7:23

gift as well. But you can and

7:25

should preorder the book again. The book is called

7:27

Translating Jesus

7:29

and and I and I think I so I

7:31

really appreciate your your passion for

7:33

this because it seems to me

7:35

that as the world has grown,

7:38

uh, more secular and we I've put together

7:41

some research presentations for a

7:43

new thing on launching, uh, on kind of just

7:45

looking at data, data, data analysis,

7:47

kind of conversation. And I mean,

7:50

everywhere in the West, you know, you mentioned you're connected

7:52

with Alpha, and I was just over in the UK

7:54

and spent the fall there teaching, uh,

7:56

at Oxford and a lot of people. And Alpha is

7:58

very much more influential there. People in the US

8:00

may be less familiar, but I mean very

8:03

secular environment. And we're becoming

8:05

in the US every year,

8:08

1 to 2% less people identify

8:10

as Christian. We're becoming

8:12

that secular environment. So when I became

8:15

a brand new believer, you know, I grew up in a nominally

8:17

Catholic household. So I knew

8:19

there was a Bible. I just didn't think I could understand

8:21

it. I knew there was a God. I just didn't think I could know

8:23

him. And when someone showed me the Bible

8:26

and walked me through, I mean, I just trusted

8:28

and received Jesus because I was already

8:30

had a almost a knowledge

8:32

of some of these things. But today

8:35

I mentioned my friend at the beginning of the show. I

8:37

couldn't say to him, well, let me tell you about the

8:39

Bible verses that so, so and so. He said, do you

8:41

not believe the Bible? Of course I do. But he

8:43

doesn't. He just trying to figure God

8:45

out. So so the the gap,

8:48

the chasm between us really

8:50

requires some translation.

8:52

So it's interesting. It's right there. It's a very provocative

8:55

title or maybe not very. It's a provocative title. Translating

8:57

Jesus. What are we translating?

8:59

How does that what is what is that? How does that work?

9:02

Yeah, I love that because so

9:04

much of what you just said, it's it's

9:06

not so much having to know,

9:08

you know, Genesis to Revelation. It

9:11

really is connecting with

9:13

and remembering what Jesus has done for

9:15

you and telling that

9:17

story to someone else. I think,

9:19

and this is even what we use

9:21

at Alpha. It's sharing your story.

9:24

Um, it's sharing what God has done for you,

9:26

but in a way of like, hey, this is

9:28

what this is who Jesus is to me.

9:30

And so you're sharing your opening your, your very

9:33

life up to even,

9:35

you know, the person that you mentioned at the beginning, you're

9:37

sharing your very life with them. If this is who Jesus

9:39

is to me, this is where I go for

9:41

hope. This is how I have peace.

9:44

But it's looking for what

9:46

that person is going through. It's

9:49

looking for something in their story.

9:51

Even even in 30s you can know

9:53

something about someone else by paying attention.

9:56

And so if it's like you can just tell their

9:58

their hectic or their their frazzled,

10:00

or they're trying to rally their kids together

10:02

or whatever the case may be, it's looking for that connection

10:05

point and then pulling, pulling

10:07

the Jesus piece to make

10:09

that connection with them. And that's what

10:11

translating is. It's stepping into

10:14

their story. It's listening to

10:16

their story and what's going on in their life,

10:18

and begin just to pull Jesus into that conversation.

10:21

And the good news, the thing that's off of,

10:23

of our shoulders is that Jesus

10:25

wants to be in these conversations. He's

10:27

for those conversations. He's just

10:29

Jesus is waiting for us to step into them.

10:31

And I believe we have so many moments

10:33

through a given day where

10:36

our pastor, intersecting with so many

10:38

different people. And I think for

10:40

us as Christians, we let fear get

10:42

in the way of like, we don't know how it's going to be received

10:44

when all along, Jesus is so ready

10:47

for us to engage with them. And

10:50

they're the ones that are looking for hope. They're

10:52

the ones that are looking for an answer. They're

10:54

the ones that are looking for someone to listen to them.

10:57

Good word. Good work. Continue our conversation and really

11:00

invite your calls as well,

11:02

because I think there's really a time and a question

11:04

of how do we engage these conversations?

11:06

How do we step into these conversations

11:09

as well? Our phone number is (877) 548-3675.

11:13

I'd love to hear your faith sharing story.

11:15

We'd also love to hear maybe how you have

11:17

questions or questions you have about how to

11:19

translate these conversations. Well, our number

11:21

again (877) 548-3675.

11:35

Hey, we're back at stats are live. I'm

11:38

Ed Setzer, I'm the dean at the Talbot School of Theology.

11:40

And for every Saturday, I'm your host

11:42

at this. And every Saturday

11:44

at this time, we're talking to Shawna Pilgrim

11:46

about her book, Translating Jesus. And

11:49

the subtitle is How to Share Your Faith in

11:51

Language Today's Culture Can Understand. As I mentioned,

11:53

the book is not even out yet. That's what we do. We bring

11:55

you stuff when the book's not even out. But if

11:57

you go to EDS or Live.com, uh,

11:59

it actually lists the program. You click right

12:02

there and you can preorder the book, and I encourage

12:04

you to do so, uh, as

12:06

well, we're going to have some calls as well. Want to

12:08

invite you into the conversation

12:10

again. Our number is 87754836758775483675.

12:19

Um, so I came to

12:21

Christ, um, kind of youth group

12:24

age. I got in trouble. My mother

12:26

forced me to go to campus. My punishment. She was a relatively

12:28

new believer, which, by the way, is the shudders

12:30

for every youth director out

12:32

there to have a kid sent to camp in

12:35

trouble for punishment. But there was. I heard the

12:37

gospel and really just was changed

12:39

by the power of that gospel. And

12:41

and then very quickly, um, really

12:43

was very passionate about my faith and obviously remained

12:46

passionate about my faith. But part

12:48

of the challenges is that, um,

12:50

you know, over time and in different

12:52

circumstances, I mean, it it is

12:55

a long cultural distance.

12:57

And increasingly people are even

12:59

negative towards this.

13:01

You know, 20, 30 years ago when I was sharing my faith,

13:03

it would be, you know, I mean, people

13:06

might be maybe question

13:08

or maybe not be sure, but today

13:10

there might be well, the church has done this harm

13:12

and more. How do you even have a starting

13:14

point for a conversation when we're starting an

13:17

increasingly negative setting?

13:19

Yeah. And, um, you saying that I remember

13:22

just recently being in a

13:24

conversation, um, with somewhat

13:26

of a new friend and she was

13:28

sharing just

13:30

she's left the church and she's

13:33

been hurt by the church, and,

13:35

you know, she even had good reasons for why she

13:37

stepped away. And, um,

13:39

but just to be able to stand in that moment with her,

13:42

I didn't need to give her church answers.

13:45

I didn't need to give her, um, you

13:47

know, all the reasons I think she needs to go back and

13:49

engage in church. What I,

13:52

what I'm finding in these situations is

13:55

Jesus is the connection. Jesus

13:57

is who were the church is pointing people

13:59

to anyway? The goal is not to point people

14:02

to church. We're called to point people

14:04

to Jesus. And I think as people

14:06

get introduced to Jesus and

14:08

who he is and what he's about, then

14:10

they come to understand that Jesus is head over the church

14:13

and I know the church. We've got

14:15

work to do. And, um, you know,

14:17

I believe we're leaning into that.

14:20

Um, but I think the goal is to point

14:22

people to Jesus. And just in that conversation

14:24

with her and holding the hurt

14:26

with her, um, and

14:29

just praying that that

14:31

that Jesus would heal, that

14:34

Jesus would comfort her family,

14:36

that Jesus would speak truth to

14:38

one of her teenage kids. That's really been

14:40

hurt. But putting inviting

14:43

Jesus into the center of that.

14:45

And then at the same time, like praying for the

14:47

church to come alongside her and for

14:49

her to find a church to connect to, I

14:51

think, again, it's just pointing. It's pointing people

14:53

to the person and the goodness

14:55

of Jesus. And so

14:57

many of these times, we can just let him take it from there

15:00

and let him do the healing and let him

15:02

do the reconnecting, um, and the

15:04

work in that person's life.

15:06

Yeah. You know someone who loves that loves the church. You know,

15:08

I serve as a pastor at a church. I

15:10

really, I sometimes want to defend

15:12

the church, but really, what I want to do

15:15

that really makes the greatest difference is to point people to

15:17

Jesus and then let them grow

15:19

in the knowledge of why the church

15:21

matters. Because I believe you can't. You can't love Jesus and

15:23

despise his wife, the Bride of Christ. But

15:26

they don't probably know that at first. And

15:28

in our culture, uh, we found

15:30

in this, you know, a part of the He Gets Us campaign

15:33

and, and all the research points to that. People are

15:35

open to Jesus, but not so much to the church. Of

15:37

course, that's been research we've talked about for for

15:39

decades now. All right. Let's take some calls. Let's go to Phyllis

15:41

in Chicago. Phyllis, you are live on

15:43

the air with your question of your comment. Go right ahead.

15:47

Yes. Hello.

15:47

Thank you so much for taking my call. My

15:49

question is, um, as a believer for

15:51

over 26 years, um,

15:54

I've read the Bible numerous times,

15:56

and so there's so much that I reference.

15:59

But if I'm in a conversation with an unbeliever

16:01

who doesn't even believe the Bible is true,

16:04

what do I use to

16:06

point to the validity of God in Jesus Christ?

16:08

Phyllis, that is a great question. Do I want you to hold on?

16:11

Because as soon as after Shawna answers,

16:13

we're going to give you a copy of

16:15

her new book, because that's, I think part will

16:17

answer a big part of that. It's called Translating Jesus, Shawna,

16:20

what do you think?

16:21

Yeah, Phyllis, I love that. And I

16:23

think, um, I think we find ourselves in two situations.

16:26

I think one, we find ourselves in a situation where

16:28

we might have a split second to

16:30

be able to have a conversation. And then there's some

16:32

where God brings people into our lives,

16:34

and we realize that we can journey with this person.

16:37

And I think when we're found, it sounds

16:39

like you're describing a situation where maybe you just have

16:41

a few minutes to be able to

16:45

introduce Jesus. I think three

16:47

simple gospel truths, um,

16:49

and if you're able to engage in this

16:51

with them, is that Jesus loves you so much,

16:54

Jesus loves you, and

16:56

we get to love him back. And the way we love

16:59

him back is understanding that what

17:01

Jesus has done for us, we get to

17:03

return that love by doing life with

17:05

him and inviting him into our lives.

17:07

And then because of that, we get to love one

17:10

another. We get to share his love with

17:12

everyone that we do life with. So

17:14

I think those three gospel truths, those

17:16

three sentences or ways we

17:19

can quickly at the same time, even

17:21

over a long term, um, unpack

17:23

that with someone who doesn't believe. But

17:25

again, I go back to the truth that

17:27

what Jesus has done in your life, Phyllis,

17:29

is worth sharing with someone else.

17:32

Um, it's not lost. It's not in vain. It's not

17:34

just for, um, inside the

17:36

doors of the church, but what Jesus has done in your

17:38

life. Phyllis, is worth sharing with someone.

17:42

Love. That love. Let me remind you a great call for us

17:44

and others as well. Our number is

17:46

(877) 548-3675.

17:50

Again that's (877) 548-3675.

17:55

Uh, Shawn, a lot of times when people ask me

17:58

around this topic is they just say, well, if I can just work some Bible

18:00

in or if I can just slide some

18:02

Bible in. Just just so we're clear. I

18:04

deeply love the Word of God. I love, you know,

18:06

I teach and preach it. Um. And more.

18:09

Um, but in a world that doesn't accept

18:11

the authority of the Word of God, we're

18:14

sort of in some ways like a like an

18:16

early, the early Christians who were

18:18

talking to Romans who would have no context

18:20

of the Hebrew Scriptures or more. And

18:22

so, so for me, and sometimes

18:24

people will go to me, well, you know, God's word will never return

18:26

void, which I actually think is

18:29

is accurate and understood in this context.

18:31

So is it best for me to try

18:33

to just keep working in Bible verses? Or

18:35

how can I translate who Jesus

18:37

is and build that bridge?

18:39

What's your thought?

18:41

Yeah. So in the book editor,

18:43

um, it's three sections. The book

18:46

is divided into three sections. We meet at the gate,

18:48

we meet at the cross, and we meet at the

18:50

table. And I have a chapter in all three

18:52

sections that's called Read the Scriptures

18:54

because you're exactly right. Like the Word

18:56

of God is what we need. Um,

18:59

and that's where we get our strength. But

19:01

I also believe that the Word of God

19:03

gives us so many stories of

19:05

how, first and foremost, people were

19:07

called to engage with one another. And

19:10

that's where when they see the love of Jesus

19:12

in us, that's when some.

19:15

And eventually we'll get to a place

19:17

where they're open to the scriptures. But

19:19

I think initially and you described our

19:21

culture, this, this pre-Christian,

19:24

um, culture that we're a part of.

19:26

And I remember engaging with a few

19:28

friends around the table at Alpha that we do

19:30

at our church. And I

19:32

had three non-Christian friends say these

19:35

three things when it comes to

19:37

how would they want to be told about Jesus?

19:39

How would they want to be told about Christianity?

19:41

One person said, tell me your story.

19:44

Tell me who Jesus is to you and why

19:46

I should believe him. Someone said,

19:48

explain to me the facts. And again,

19:50

that's where I mean, you

19:53

know this far better than I do editor. But sometimes

19:55

when I'm in the facts, I just

19:57

have to tell him what I know, what I know to be true.

19:59

And then thirdly, someone said, invite

20:02

me to what you're a part of. And

20:05

that's where they're. We're inviting them to Alpha. We're inviting

20:07

them to church. We're inviting them into our

20:09

home. Um, but those were

20:11

three responses from three

20:13

non-Christian friends that I've been doing life

20:16

with over a few months. Tell me your

20:18

story. Explain to me the facts

20:20

and invite me into what you're a part of.

20:24

Okay, so. So, uh, what

20:26

you've said a few times that you can tell

20:28

kind of your story, your stats or a story

20:30

or a short story. You can tell your

20:32

story. And of course, the challenge is,

20:35

is that we want to have an objective standard.

20:37

We we don't want to I mean, because, I mean, Mormons

20:39

would say, tell your story. Scientologists would say,

20:41

tell your story. I mean, it's literally in

20:43

both cases, that is the the

20:45

message that they use is to tell your story. You

20:48

had a heart warm feeling, whatever. What else may be.

20:50

Um, so our story then can be

20:52

on the same level as everyone else's story,

20:55

but you also take that next step about

20:57

sharing some of those facts. So how

20:59

do you go from, um, you

21:01

know, kind of that personal testimony,

21:04

which again, I hope your church or

21:06

you somewhere along the way you've learned to write and share your personal

21:08

testimony. But two well, this

21:10

is actually what we believe is true

21:12

everywhere for everyone always. How does that

21:14

work?

21:16

Yeah, I'm so glad you brought that up. Because when

21:18

I even say tell your story, it's

21:20

often not saying, when I was eight,

21:22

I placed my faith in Jesus.

21:24

Um, often it's not that part of the story that

21:27

you're initially connecting with someone, but

21:29

I remember being at a Starbucks

21:31

and engaging with this guy

21:33

named Pete, and we were talking

21:35

about him being in town, taking care of his,

21:38

his aging father. And I

21:40

just I knew he was getting ready to head back to back

21:42

to Florida and leaving his dad here, and I just

21:44

let him know. I said, hey, I'm going to give you

21:47

my number. I live right down the street

21:49

if you need, if you just

21:51

need to like me to go and check in on him

21:54

or, you know, just make sure he's okay, let

21:56

me know that. And I'm in that genuinely,

21:58

I could I live far away from my family

22:01

and just knowing that someone is in town if you ever

22:03

needed to get Ahold of them. And so as we

22:05

were engaging on that, that opened up

22:07

the door for him to say, wow,

22:10

like, who would who in their right mind would

22:12

ever think to offer you, you know, their phone

22:14

number for this purpose? But when he

22:16

when he said that and I began to explain how

22:18

I move far from family, but we

22:20

moved to San Francisco because we believe God had

22:22

sent us there, that was the part

22:24

of the story that I use to connect

22:26

with him. I didn't tell him my

22:28

salvation story. I

22:31

was able to tell him like, why God's called us to this

22:33

city. So when I talk about like telling your

22:35

story, it's telling that part of the story that's connecting

22:37

with that person in what they're

22:39

going through right there. And

22:42

when I say explain the facts, it's

22:45

also just, yes, there's there's so

22:47

many facts just from Scripture, but

22:49

there's also facts of what Jesus has done

22:51

in my life that no one can argue.

22:54

And I can say that like we

22:56

have found family and community

22:58

in San Francisco. That's a fact. And

23:00

so when I say explain the facts, it's also

23:03

those kind of facts, if that makes

23:05

sense.

23:06

No, it makes a lot of sense. And then, uh,

23:08

and so, you know, at some point we want

23:10

them to know that,

23:13

for example, you know, God is,

23:15

you know, omnipotent and

23:17

omnipresent and and Jesus

23:19

died on the cross for our sin and in our place,

23:22

we want them to move into those

23:24

awareness of facts and eventually the place that you

23:26

know God. God uses the church and the Word

23:29

of God is authoritative in their lives. So

23:31

what does that process look like? Let me let me just take

23:33

a pause, do and mention for folks as well that

23:35

we're going to take your calls in just a minute. But let me remind you, we're at

23:37

(877) 548-3675.

23:41

That's (877) 548-3675.

23:45

So keep taking us down that journey a little

23:47

bit further to understand, uh,

23:50

at what point do I call people to

23:52

the truths of responding to

23:54

the truths of the gospel and more?

23:55

Yeah, yeah. And I think this is

23:57

where it's messy, but it's good. Messy,

24:00

if that makes sense. And because

24:02

you're first of all wanting to connect with

24:04

where they are and what they're open

24:06

to, and the goodness of

24:09

God is that he meets people

24:11

right where they are. And so

24:13

engaging, um, and that's the beautiful

24:15

part, is that Jesus is in these conversations

24:18

that we're having with them. But I think,

24:20

um, when I just recall conversations

24:22

that I'm even currently in with

24:24

people in my city, it

24:27

is helping them make that next step and

24:29

believing that next truth.

24:31

Um, but it's on. It's on their level.

24:34

Um, again, I bring up that that pre

24:36

Christianity that we're, we're, we're living

24:38

in right now. So much of this is introducing

24:41

them to the Trinity,

24:44

introducing them to God the Father, Jesus

24:46

the Son and the Holy Spirit is introducing

24:48

them to to

24:50

the reality of the crucifixion

24:53

and the resurrection and what Jesus has done

24:55

and how he's made a way for us to know

24:57

him. And that by us knowing him,

25:00

it unlocks. I talk in the book

25:02

about how it's a narrow

25:04

gate and you

25:06

find it, but so much, so much

25:08

of our culture wants this freedom

25:11

on this side of the gate. When

25:13

Jesus calls us to go through the narrow

25:15

gate and that's where the freedom is,

25:17

the freedom comes on the other

25:20

side of our relationship

25:22

with Jesus. And again,

25:24

that's again that unlocks the story. It unlocks

25:26

the story of what he's done in us, and it also

25:29

unlocks the story that God has

25:31

for them.

25:32

Love it. Love a good conversation. Continue

25:34

our conversation with Shawna Pilgrim and her

25:37

book is Translating Jesus How to Share

25:39

Your Faith in a language Today's Culture

25:41

Can understand. We got some calls lined

25:43

up. We're going to jump on those in the side. Our phone

25:45

number for you to join us is 87754836751.

25:50

More times you can write down (877) 548-3675.

25:59

Today's show's pre-recorded, so we're not gonna

26:01

be able to take your great calls, but stay tuned. This

26:03

is actually one of our best shows.

26:13

Hey, we're back at Stats are live.

26:14

We're having a really, I think a helpful conversation. We've

26:16

got some folks lined up on the call. So I'm guessing

26:18

that's an interesting part of the conversation.

26:20

Coming up again, our number is (877) 548-3675.

26:26

We're talking to Shauna Pill Green. She she works with

26:28

Alpha. Some of you familiar with Alpha USA. It's

26:30

the most widely used evangelism course in

26:32

the world. And I had the privilege

26:35

of sitting down with, uh, uh, Nick and Pippa

26:37

Gumbel in their home when we lived in the UK.

26:39

And just to hear their story and to hear their heart

26:41

for, I mean, everything's just driven by

26:44

a passion for evangelism.

26:46

So I love the fact that, uh, Shauna, who's actually

26:48

along with her husband Ben, co-leads Epic Church.

26:51

Uh, she is um, she's written this

26:53

book, focus for Everyday Evangelists,

26:55

which again, when you hear evangelist, I know what you think.

26:58

A lot of you think that's not me, but

27:00

actually a big part of her point is that's actually

27:02

you. And the book is translating Jesus

27:05

How to Share Your Faith in a language today's culture

27:07

can understand. Again, the number

27:09

8771 to encourage

27:11

you to call in 5483675.

27:14

We're going to go to Maggie here in California

27:17

with us. And and Maggie, you're

27:19

live on the air listening on K wave. Go ahead with your

27:21

question or your comment.

27:22

Hi. Um, I'd like to ask because

27:25

I get very confused, um,

27:28

when I share the gospel

27:30

with family or with friends and

27:32

some occasions not all of them, but some

27:34

occasions they do, um, you

27:37

know, get up and leave or whatever, or,

27:40

um, you know, they make, make you,

27:43

um, seem like,

27:45

you know, you're you're wrong by sharing

27:47

it, you know, because they're from another religion

27:49

or whatever, or, um, at

27:51

what point? Should

27:54

you stop?

27:57

For, uh, sharing with them. And

28:00

then just pray for them, because it's

28:03

clear to me that we should never

28:06

stop praying for them.

28:08

It's a good word. Maggie. I want you to hold on to. We're going to

28:10

give you a copy of Shauna's book

28:12

as well, which does deal with how prayer

28:15

relates in there as well. The book is translating Jesus,

28:17

Shauna, what do you think and how would you respond to Maggie?

28:19

Yeah. Maggie, I first of

28:22

all, just thank you for your bravery and

28:24

the love that you have for your family

28:26

and wanting them just to know the love of Jesus.

28:29

Maggie, I would just encourage you and

28:31

encourage all of us, myself included.

28:33

There's a beautiful thing that

28:35

that Jesus does, and he listens.

28:38

He really listened, um, to

28:40

other people. And so I think our challenge

28:42

as Christians is we we want

28:45

to have an answer for everything. And one thing

28:47

I really pushed back on in the book is

28:49

the practice of listening and

28:51

just engaging in quiet,

28:54

where we don't always have to have an answer

28:56

and we can listen to them. And

28:58

John Stott and Ed, I'm sure you recall

29:01

just his love for evangelism,

29:03

but John Stott teaches the

29:05

art of double listening, where you're listening

29:08

to your family and

29:10

what they believe and what they're sharing. At the same time,

29:12

you're also listening to what the spirit

29:14

is teaching you and what he might want

29:16

you to say. Or maybe he just wants you

29:18

to pray. And so I agree,

29:20

Maggie. There's times where God opens up the door,

29:23

and that's when we just walk in and we're ready to

29:25

have that conversation for however

29:27

the spirit leads. And then there are those moments

29:30

where the door is still closed, and

29:32

that doesn't mean we don't do anything.

29:34

You said it, Maggie. That's our call to prayer.

29:37

And just believing that the Holy Spirit can soften

29:39

the hearts of your family.

29:41

Yes, so so good. And of course, and Maggie's

29:44

sharing in this case as well, you

29:46

know. Do you just you you

29:48

give up do you keep praying. And I would

29:50

be a view that you want to continue to pray and continue to look

29:52

for opportunities and just see what the Lord

29:54

ultimately what the Lord ultimately opens

29:57

those doors are not.

29:59

Exactly. And I think I think Ed,

30:01

um, no, I was just going to say you're

30:03

exactly right. I think, um,

30:06

God is working in ways that we can't see.

30:09

And, uh. Yeah. Maggie, I'm praying for you.

30:12

Good word, Maggie. If you hold on to the line, too, we're going to give

30:14

you a copy of Shauna's book, Translating

30:16

Jesus. Let's go to Daisy in

30:18

Long Beach. Also listening on K, we

30:20

love being on K wave, and that's my local

30:23

radio station now. So I've kind of moved from Chicagoland,

30:25

Wbai, and now I'm

30:27

here in K wave land, and there's over

30:29

200 other stations that folks listen around the country.

30:32

So we're thankful for all of you. You can call in. Let me

30:34

tell you one more time. The number

30:36

it is (877) 548-3675.

30:39

But Daisy, you are live on the air from Long Beach, California.

30:41

Go ahead.

30:42

Yes. Hello. Hello,

30:45

everyone. My question is that, uh,

30:47

many times I come across patients in

30:49

my work area, and as

30:51

I go about one on one, I can see

30:53

a lot of spiritual need. And

30:55

sometimes, you know, I have said, uh,

30:58

you know, this is kind of like I introduce

31:01

myself, you know, that's the job that I have

31:03

in policies, you know, on a personal

31:05

way. I don't want to share my faith with

31:07

you, but I am a woman of faith. And I tell them,

31:09

you know, and I started talking about Jesus

31:11

Christ and depending on the situation. But

31:14

many times, I wonder, I don't want to

31:16

get in trouble. I don't want to get fired because I

31:18

share my fate with patients

31:20

in work settings. So how can I

31:23

be more careful? And I understand

31:25

that when God uses you and he speaks, you know he he'll go

31:27

ahead and do it. But I just want it to be a little bit

31:29

more careful about it.

31:31

Yeah, yeah. It's Daisy. It's a great.

31:33

Question. Hold on to we're going to we're going to give you a copy of

31:35

Shauna's book. But hold on for just a second. And

31:37

Shauna, part of her question too, if I understand, is

31:39

has to do with, you know,

31:41

her setting, you know, when she can and

31:43

when she can't, uh, openly

31:46

share her faith. Talk us about that.

31:48

I love that, Daisy. And I love that you're

31:50

you're looking for opportunities. And I

31:52

just believe that God's going to unlock those for you

31:54

and is unlocking those for you. Um,

31:56

I have a friend, Javier, that works at a local

31:58

high school here in San Francisco, and

32:01

he he finds himself

32:03

in situations like that all the time. But one time,

32:05

his friend, uh, a coworker

32:07

went, uh, was fixing something

32:09

with the lights and made it work. And he just made a

32:11

comment. He's like, Hallelujah! And

32:14

it caused that faculty member to turn around

32:16

and say, are you a believer?

32:18

And it was because of him saying that that

32:20

it unlocked just an opportunity

32:22

that he didn't even realize was on his on his

32:24

staff. And so I just believe,

32:27

um, Daisy, through your creativity

32:29

and the work of the Holy Spirit in you, that

32:31

God's going to lead you into these conversations where

32:34

you're going to be able to say something and

32:37

God's going to show you who

32:39

it is you can say something to. I remember

32:41

being in the hospital and visiting a friend,

32:43

and the doctor walked in, and

32:46

my friend could not communicate at that

32:48

time, but by squeezing

32:50

my hand, I just took that squeeze

32:52

as just a nudge from the spirit

32:54

to have a conversation with the doctor.

32:57

And I just told the doctor,

32:59

I said, hey, I'm a person of faith. Um,

33:01

and just began having that conversation with her, and

33:03

she let me know that she was an atheist and

33:05

didn't want anything to do with it. But

33:08

over time, she saw God at work

33:10

in my friend's life. And

33:12

so I believe that you're going to see those opportunities.

33:14

And, um, yeah, I'm just trusting

33:17

God to protect you when you're able to have those conversations

33:20

and even just simply saying, hey, I'm a person

33:22

of faith, like you said, can I pray with

33:24

you? Or is there something I can pray for?

33:26

You're not even having to pray at work, but it's something

33:28

that you can even do in your heart or

33:30

even take home with you when you're off the clock.

33:33

Yeah. And I would say to the we all you

33:35

know, nowadays people get rightfully concerned

33:38

about some of the legal implications or the work

33:40

or the you end up in the air conversation.

33:42

So particularly you mentioned you're in the health care field

33:44

as well. Keep hanging on to remember afterwards my

33:46

producer is going to come on. Tricia McMillan, by the way, is filling

33:49

in today for Karen Hendren and doing a great job.

33:51

She'll come on in just a minute and give you a copy of that book.

33:53

But I want to say to you to that, that that

33:56

typically many work environments

33:58

overreact. And there's actually a

34:00

group of conservative and liberal legal

34:02

organizations put out this thing together.

34:04

And you know what you can say and how you can share

34:06

at work. And it included like,

34:08

like organizations like the ACLU, but also

34:10

included like Christian organizations. And

34:13

it's actually surprising the

34:15

kinds of conversations you can have. Not

34:17

in general, though, you know, going from

34:19

health care situation, health care situation, and an

34:21

unsolicited invitation to, for example,

34:23

trust and follow Jesus. But

34:26

as you live who you are and those opportunities

34:28

are there, remember that first Peter chapter

34:31

315. Uh, be

34:33

prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give

34:35

the reason for the hope that you have. If you,

34:37

in the case like that, in a job situation where you

34:39

live, uh, filled with joy,

34:42

even even saying hallelujah at a moment or two

34:44

where God bless you, uh, and people ask

34:46

more questions, the door then becomes

34:48

open for you to have, uh, more

34:50

conversations as well. And, and

34:52

you can actually Google online to

34:54

find out, you know, what's appropriate to share at work.

34:56

And there's actually some good, uh, legal

34:59

direction and guidance that's out there

35:01

that actually, for most people and most employers

35:04

is a bit surprising. You just

35:06

can't do so in a situation where somebody,

35:09

uh, has to listen or it's related to

35:11

their future employment advancement

35:13

or more. But again, we don't have time to back all

35:15

of that. But again, that's available online

35:17

as well. Okay. We've got one more segment and

35:19

we're going to go right to your calls. (877) 548-3675.

35:24

We're having a great conversation with Shawna Pilgrim.

35:26

She's written Translating Jesus How to Share

35:28

Your Faith in Language Today's Culture

35:30

to understand. (877) 548-3675.

35:33

Give us a call.

35:45

Hey Rebecca Setser live and continue

35:48

our conversation about really about sharing

35:50

the gospel, but also in

35:52

and around a brand new book that was so brand new, you

35:54

have to preorder it. But that's kind of cool. It's called

35:56

translating, translating Jesus how to share

35:58

your Faith in Language today's culture

36:00

can understand. You know, I've served

36:02

the last seven years leading the Wheaton College Billy Graham

36:04

Center. I'm deeply passionate about

36:07

people sharing the gospel, yet it seems we've

36:09

kind of almost in a lull of that. Not

36:11

not like a year low, but like a decades

36:13

long lull. Uh,

36:15

when I was a new believer, uh, I can remember

36:18

in the 80s, even the 90s, people

36:20

having evangelism training. And there was, you

36:22

know, I mean, people would do whole semesters of evangelism

36:24

explosion or Christian witness training,

36:26

all these different things. And now,

36:29

man, most of the time people are talking about

36:31

evangelism. It's almost like they're like, well, we don't do

36:33

it that way. They're all it's almost a defensiveness

36:35

that's there. So I was really appreciated translating

36:38

Jesus How to Share Your Faith in a language

36:40

Today's culture can understand. Shawna. Pilgrims.

36:42

Our guests. We're just going to hit the phone calls and it's kind

36:45

of rapid lightning round. So Dan, we're going

36:47

to go to you. And so we're going to go to

36:49

you and we're still going to work through.

36:51

But we need folks to be really

36:53

quick in their questions or comments and then let Shawna

36:55

respond quickly as well. Dan, you're up

36:58

first. West Chicago. Go for it, Dan.

37:01

Uh, thanks for, uh, quick comment.

37:03

If you have people read the Bible, um,

37:06

instead of quoting it to them, it goes a lot further.

37:08

My question is this how do you answer

37:11

somebody who says, if you have a loving

37:13

God, how come you don't accept

37:15

them for who they are? Well.

37:17

It's a great question. Don't stay on the line to remember. We're going to give you

37:19

a copy of the book as well. Oh, sorry. Go ahead. But but,

37:22

Shawna, go ahead. What's your answer?

37:24

Well, Dan, if I understand you correctly, like

37:27

Jesus loves everyone, which we're called

37:29

to love everyone, so there's no one that we don't

37:31

accept. So I think the simple

37:33

answer is like, you know, if you've heard that

37:35

the correct thing is like, no, I

37:37

love you. I love you with the love of Christ.

37:40

To the Gospels for everyone.

37:42

And then discipleship is going to grow and people are going to

37:44

be changed as well. Let's go all the way up to

37:47

New Hampshire to Angela. Your live

37:49

on the air. Angela. Go ahead.

37:52

Hi. I've been a Christian for

37:54

ages, and I just.

37:56

I'm just trying to. Okay,

37:58

so I don't mind being around people

38:01

and I care for them and

38:03

they can share their story with me

38:05

and I'll pray with them. Or

38:07

just like I met a friend for her birthday yesterday

38:10

and we talked about prayer and, you know,

38:12

things that are bothering us, and we related

38:14

it to Bible verses. But I don't

38:17

have that joy when I'm with people.

38:19

And when I see them, I it's

38:21

almost like there's a wall there. I don't have that joy.

38:23

I care about them and I love

38:25

them, but I don't have

38:28

that joy, like when I see them. And I can tell they're

38:30

like they have like the spark when they see me.

38:32

And I'll try and like, but

38:35

I don't have that joy and I don't.

38:37

Am I missing something? What

38:39

am I doing wrong. Because. Okay.

38:43

Yep. So hold on. Well, first of all, introverts are good.

38:45

I'm married to one. But. But hold on, we're gonna get out of the book

38:47

after Shawna answers. But, Shawna, what do you

38:49

think? She doesn't have that joy to engage people. But

38:52

there's a sense that we want to show and share

38:54

the love of Jesus.

38:55

Yeah, Angela, first of all, don't be too hard

38:57

on yourself because I think we all as,

39:00

um, those of us who have been Christ followers

39:02

for a long time, I think we come in some of those dry seasons.

39:05

But I would just really encourage you

39:07

just, um, David says, God, restore

39:09

to me the joy of my salvation

39:11

and renew a steadfast spirit in me.

39:14

So I just pray that God would restore

39:16

the joy of his his salvation

39:18

over your life, and that you would reconnect

39:20

with what he did for you. And if

39:22

what he did for you is

39:24

true, then he's done it for everyone

39:27

else. And so I do pray that that

39:29

joy returns.

39:30

And let me say to Angela that as somebody who,

39:32

like I mentioned just earlier this week, I

39:34

had this conversation with a stranger, and

39:36

now we've exchanged phone numbers and emails

39:39

and I'm gauging about what am I look like

39:41

for spiritual questions and more. I

39:43

know that for introverts, that maybe sounds

39:45

like a bit of a horrifying interaction.

39:48

Uh, my wife's an introvert. I have three daughters,

39:50

and we debate whether one of

39:52

them is, but one of them certainly is an introvert. And

39:54

I would just say to, you can do so in the context

39:56

of relationships too, but just don't just don't

39:58

only have relationships with Christians,

40:01

but build some relationships with non-Christians

40:03

and share the gospel in the context of a of

40:06

a friendship that the kind of friendship that introverts

40:08

have, that my wife has these deep friendships with

40:10

people where I tend to, you know, kind of blah.

40:12

Hi, everybody. That's kind of more me as

40:14

well. But great question. So hold on the line. We're going to give you a

40:16

copy. Uh, we're going to go up to

40:18

Calgary Roseanne. It's a mystery to me.

40:20

How are you listening in Calgary when all

40:22

of our stations are in the United States? How are you listening?

40:25

Well, I get it on your app.

40:28

Wonderful. Well, there you go. A good promotion

40:30

for you. Make sure you download

40:33

that Moody Radio app. All right. You're live on the air, Roseanne.

40:35

And in Calgary. Go right ahead with your question or your comment.

40:38

Oh, well, um, I have a

40:40

difficulty because I'm the first Christian

40:43

in my family, and so there's a lot of negativity

40:45

to begin with. But, um, I

40:47

just wanted to know, how do you, um,

40:50

communicate to other people that they

40:52

don't even want to hear you say,

40:54

God bless you? Like it's

40:57

it's quite a difficult situation.

40:59

Yeah.

41:00

Now, hold on to line. I remember we're going to give you a copy

41:02

of the book, but. So go ahead. You

41:04

want to say a little more. Go ahead.

41:06

Oh I think I had a.

41:07

Sister go to Canada.

41:10

Has the maid here?

41:12

Medical assisted. Um,

41:15

death. And I

41:17

just had a sister who passed away through that

41:19

from her cancer on the third.

41:22

And, uh, it's been really difficult

41:24

because I was shut right out even from

41:26

knowing what was going on. So it's,

41:28

uh, you know, if they

41:30

don't want you, they just don't talk to you. So

41:33

it's been a it's been a rough road for me.

41:35

That was the third death in our family. And we

41:37

had two deaths, two weeks. And so,

41:40

um, I'm just, you know, I'm really concerned

41:42

because they're getting up there, too. And

41:44

my oldest sister will be 82, and,

41:47

uh, we've already

41:49

lost some other members of our

41:51

family. So I just,

41:53

you know, my my heart is

41:55

because of the urgency of the hour as well.

41:58

And it just I feel kind

42:01

of up against the wall. And I'd really like

42:03

some other advices to know how

42:06

and when to say things.

42:08

Yeah, well.

42:09

Let's have to jump in and share some of that as well. But

42:11

let me mention to Roxanne, Roseanne. Excuse

42:13

me, stay on the line, Roseanne, because on the other side,

42:15

we're going to give you as soon as you hear Shauna's answer

42:17

right after, Trisha will come on, give you a copy of the book.

42:19

So, uh, what do you what do you think, Shawna?

42:22

Yeah.

42:22

Well, Roseanne, first, I'm excited you're

42:24

getting a copy of the book because I have so many

42:26

stories. I love to tell stories, and

42:28

there's stories all throughout the book. But

42:31

first of all, I want to remind you that you bring

42:33

light into those conversations

42:35

because of who Jesus is to you. You bring

42:37

that light into those conversations with

42:39

your family. And then as far

42:41

as what to say to me,

42:43

this is the best line I can think of. And that is.

42:47

I love you too much not

42:49

to tell you who Jesus is.

42:51

I love you too much not to tell

42:53

you who Jesus is for you.

42:55

I love you too much not to tell you

42:58

what Jesus has done for you. And

43:00

I think just let that be a launching

43:02

pad for what you get to say to them. After

43:04

that. You love them too much.

43:07

Roseanne. Not to tell them

43:09

about the love of Jesus. That's for

43:11

their lives.

43:13

Hmhm love it, love it. And too. And you know, she's just sharing

43:15

that as folks are getting older too. Uh, sometimes

43:18

people are more open, sometimes they're,

43:20

they're less open. But again, your loving

43:22

witness will also

43:24

make a difference as well. Okay, we're just a few minutes

43:26

left, but I want to get to Tom in Chicago,

43:28

Illinois. Tom, you're live on the air from Chicago. Go ahead.

43:32

Well, thank you so much for taking my call.

43:34

Um. Great program.

43:36

Uh, Shawna, just just

43:38

an awesome book. Uh, I haven't

43:40

read it, but I can tell you that, uh, it's

43:43

just so timely. Um, so

43:46

my thing is that I came to

43:48

Chris late in life. Faith in Christ late

43:50

in life. Uh, grew up in a family. Uh,

43:53

you grew up in a Catholic,

43:55

had a Catholic upbringing. So

43:57

there's a lot of, uh, you know,

43:59

I would call it apostasy. I'm not sure if

44:01

I can say that on the air, but, uh, and

44:04

I just. I'm strong with some family

44:06

members, uh, early on in my

44:09

walk and, uh, how

44:11

my question is, how would I how would you recommend

44:13

that I follow up with them in

44:17

conversation? What would I look for? You

44:19

know, what would someone look for? I

44:21

know that I kind of.

44:22

Tom I'm sorry. Tom. We only got about a minute left.

44:24

Tom. So I need to interrupt you so we can get

44:26

Shauna. Time to answer. So just hold on just a second.

44:29

Shauna. Uh, we got about a minute left,

44:31

so again, you know, he doesn't

44:33

come off too heavy to his family. How might he approach

44:35

those relationships?

44:37

Yeah. My encouragement. Tom, if you

44:39

feel like. And I found myself in these situations

44:41

too, where you've done a whole lot of the talking,

44:44

um, myself included, I would

44:46

say just take some time to listen. And

44:48

I think that will surprise them, but make some

44:50

time to listen to them. Let them

44:52

tell you their story. Let them tell you what's

44:54

going on in their lives. And I

44:56

would just say, practice this

44:59

thing that Jesus modeled and just be a

45:01

good listener. Um, for a while.

45:04

Yeah.

45:04

And that that can open doors for

45:07

subsequent conversation as well. I want to give you 30s left,

45:09

would you encourage our listeners to try

45:11

to speak those truths, to build those

45:13

bridges, to show and share the love of Jesus? 30s

45:15

left.

45:16

Absolutely. And my encouragement is

45:19

that we get to talk to Jesus about

45:21

our friends and family and our people,

45:23

and we also get to

45:25

pray to Jesus about our friends and family

45:27

and people. And we do this so that our

45:29

people will start talking to Jesus.

45:32

We have the delight of being able

45:34

to share Jesus with everyone we know,

45:36

and it's happening all around

45:38

us. We just need to pay attention.

45:41

Good word. And our conversation today has been with Shawna

45:43

Pilgrim. And if you go to Ed Stetson

45:45

Live.com, you can link right to

45:48

the new book. You can pre-order it right now as

45:50

well. Get glad to give away five copies, but

45:52

it's called Translating Jesus How to

45:54

Share Your Faith in Language Today's

45:57

culture can understand, and that's a real huge issue.

45:59

Again, I'm digging into some statistical stuff for

46:01

a presentation this week, and we're increasingly

46:03

find ourselves in a post-Christian, secular

46:06

environment. And I'm encouraged

46:08

that Sean is helping us to think about how

46:10

to engage that context. Well, so thanks

46:12

to Sean for being our guest. Also thanks to our

46:14

team here. I've already mentioned Trish

46:16

and I've mentioned, well, I should say Charles

46:18

in charge of the phones. Charles been working the phones

46:20

today. Courtney Young and Lynne

46:23

have also been serving our engineer,

46:25

and Lynn sometimes serves on the phones, but Charles

46:27

was there today. Courtney, thanks for your good work

46:29

as well. Turning tune in next week I'm going to

46:31

talk to pastor and author David Mathis.

46:33

It gets his third time on the program. I really like David.

46:36

He's going to talk about the pursuit

46:38

of humility in our walk

46:40

with Christ. To hear today's program again,

46:42

go to live.com or on the Moody

46:44

Radio app you heard from Calgary. He listens on the Moody

46:46

Radio app. You can as well.

46:49

And you can also listen to this program anytime you want. If you

46:51

missed it on Saturday, remember Ed Stetson

46:53

live with the production of Moody Radio administrative Moody

46:55

Bible Institute.