0:00

How did you meet Michael Jackson? So,

0:04

next thing we know, he's doing crazy stuff

0:06

like dangling babies over balconies and Bashir's filming

0:08

it and there's doctors around everywhere, it's all

0:10

out of control but this was not Michael

0:12

Jackson, this was Michael Jackson who was high

0:14

as a kite on drugs. Isn't

0:17

there been five allegations of young boys coming forwards

0:19

and Michael has played with them? You want to

0:21

go down that rabbit hole? Yeah, I want to

0:23

find out. If there's five people coming forward and

0:25

there's allegations coming out, there must be something there.

0:27

I'm glad I've got platforms like this where they

0:29

don't get edited because I say this on TV and

0:31

then the final version doesn't ever get used. As I'm on

0:33

the phone to Yuri, Mark Lester rings me up and I

0:35

went and Mark called and got my heart wet and I

0:38

thought, geez, Turdyce, it's not good is it? Because now, Michael's

0:41

dead. Who

0:44

killed Michael Jackson? Welcome

0:50

to the Eventful Lives podcast. I'm your host,

0:52

Dodge, and I'm the founder of Bournemouth Sevens,

0:54

the world's largest sport and music festival. On

0:56

this podcast, I speak to proper characters of

0:59

all lived eventful lives. Do us a favour

1:01

and hit that follow button and be sure

1:03

to check us out on YouTube, Instagram, Facebook

1:05

and TikTok at Dodge Woods where we've now

1:07

had over 100 million views. Matt

1:11

Fidesz is best known for being Michael

1:13

Jackson's bodyguard. We dive deep

1:15

into working alongside the biggest pop star

1:17

of all time and the allegations made

1:19

towards Michael towards the end of his career. The

1:22

controversial stories of Neverland and how

1:24

Matt built his multi-million pound business.

1:27

This is the eventful life of Mr.

1:29

Matt Fidesz. Matt,

1:32

welcome to the show, mate. It's great to be on

1:34

Dodge. Yeah, very much looking forward to this one. Let's

1:37

roll our way back. Where did you grow up and how did you

1:39

end up becoming Michael Jackson's bodyguard?

1:43

I grew up in a place called Swindon

1:45

in Wilkshire, the south of the UK. And

1:50

how did I end up become Michael Jackson's

1:52

bodyguard? Well, there's a bit of, as you can imagine,

1:54

a bit of a journey to get

1:57

to that stage. But yeah, I

1:59

mean. The long and short

2:01

story is that, we do the

2:04

shorter story, but I've

2:06

basically been bullied at school like a lot of

2:08

people who go on to be successful entrepreneurs and

2:10

do well for themselves. There's some kind

2:12

of pain barrier that pushes them to go on and do

2:14

well. And I had this school, Billy, who was a

2:17

bit of a nuisance. We're talking

2:19

about like kicking me under the table, dodge,

2:21

you know, kicking my shins, stealing my milk

2:24

and all this type of stuff which

2:26

you laugh about now, don't you? He's actually a good

2:28

friend of mine now. He's my Auntie Billy ambassador

2:30

for my martial arts brand.

2:34

And we met on national TV. But

2:37

yeah, that pain from being at

2:39

school, which I didn't feel served

2:41

me whatsoever, led

2:43

me to become a martial

2:46

arts fanatic. Just

2:48

at the time, it was Taekwondo. So

2:50

at school, I was being told what I can't

2:52

do, mistakes I was being made, things I'm not

2:55

good at. And then in the evenings,

2:57

I go to my martial arts class. And I've been told

2:59

that, look, Matt, you're good at this. And

3:01

I was already flexible. I could already do the splits

3:03

and the high kicks. And I'm a tall guy, got

3:05

long legs. And yeah, I

3:07

do believe a lot in genetics and stuff when it

3:10

comes to if you want to be a champion

3:12

or if you want to excel at it.

3:14

Genetics is a big part of that. I

3:16

can never be a non-law school snagger. But

3:18

the Taekwondo martial art involves a lot of kicking. And it

3:21

was something that I was just good at for once.

3:24

Wasn't my parents ideal thing?

3:27

My mum's one of 14 children. They

3:29

all university graduates. One of 14. Yeah.

3:33

Wow. Yeah. Wow. From

3:35

Ireland. One of 14. And

3:38

they've all literally got university degrees, you

3:40

know. So that was kind

3:42

of the path that we were hoping I

3:44

would go down because I was one of the oldest

3:46

grandchildren, the third oldest grandchildren.

3:49

And then my dad come from a get

3:51

a trade background. So he worked at the

3:53

Brunel Railway right back to

3:55

my great, great, great, great

3:58

grandfather. So there she was. I become

4:00

an electrician or a plumber or something like that. So

4:03

when I said to them I wanted to become a martial arts

4:05

instructor, they were absolutely

4:07

horrified to say the

4:09

least. Where did you

4:11

take your journey then, personally, apart from the

4:13

business I said on the business, what journey did you

4:15

go on in martial arts? I

4:18

did everything. I was a Bruce Lee utter

4:21

fanatic. I mean back

4:23

then we didn't have TVs, you're a similar age to

4:25

me. We didn't have TVs in our

4:27

rooms or stuff like that. It's like one TV in a

4:29

household. So I used to get up early in the morning

4:32

to watch the latest John Claude Van Damme film

4:35

at 4am before school or watch Bruce

4:37

Lee. I wasn't supposed to be watching it because I

4:39

was like 9, 10 or

4:41

something but it inspired me. But

4:44

I studied everything from juditsu to

4:46

juditsu, aikido, taekwondo, you

4:48

name it. I did different styles of

4:50

karate. But my love was

4:52

taekwondo. I just loved kicking

4:55

people in the head. I

4:57

just loved it. I was good at

4:59

it and I loved doing all the

5:01

spinning kicks. I don't know what

5:04

it was for me. It was the

5:06

progression. I wasn't making any progress at

5:08

school at all. From an early age I knew school was

5:10

a waste of time for me. There was nothing

5:12

there I was going to learn that was going to benefit me that

5:15

I could see. I remember being in my mathematics

5:17

class and they were teaching me one of

5:20

the GCSE questions which actually ended up

5:22

in the final GCSE paper

5:25

which is a secondary school qualification for those people

5:27

who don't know high school. Which

5:29

is how many different ways can you put 50p

5:31

into a red phone box? Which

5:33

when we were growing up dodged that was a

5:35

thing. Now they're like museum pieces aren't they? It's

5:37

like 220ps and a 10 and I owe 5-10ps.

5:40

I just thought this is utterly ridiculous. And

5:42

actually in the exam paper for my GCSE

5:44

exam I wrote that. I put a

5:46

stupid question next to it because I thought how is

5:48

this going to benefit me? I just

5:50

knew from the age of 12-13 I wrote down a series of

5:54

goals in my exercise book in my mathematics class

5:57

that I want to be the most well known

5:59

martial arts instructor in the world. I wanted to be

6:01

a millionaire by the time I was 20. I had a Ferrari

6:03

by the time I was 20 because I was growing up. One of

6:05

my brothers was very academic and

6:08

he studied car designs. There's always pictures

6:10

of Ferraris all around his bedroom and so

6:12

on and it inspired me to be

6:14

able to do that. And other

6:17

things too like I wanted to have

6:19

a six pack, big packs and do

6:21

the size splits like John Claude Van Damme, some of

6:23

the city stuff that Marshall isle

6:25

understand. Yeah,

6:28

all of those goals came true. They all came true

6:30

by the time I was 20. By

6:32

the time you were 20, yeah, I was done. I

6:35

was a millionaire by the time I was 19. How do

6:38

you get a millionaire before 1920? Well,

6:40

they really have a lot of choice, Dodge, because left

6:43

school with no qualifications whatsoever other than the

6:45

Marshall Arts black belts. And

6:49

my parents called it legalised violence.

6:51

My dad was quite aggressive

6:54

about it. He can't be doing

6:56

this legalised violence. He didn't want it. My

6:58

instructor let me train for free because he

7:00

saw the potential in me. My

7:02

grandfather, my dad's side, he took me into his shed

7:05

and gave me a right turn on officer. How

7:07

are you, Matthew, how are you going to make money throwing your legs

7:09

in the air? You know, he can't do that. He's the electrician or

7:11

plumber. But that just motivated me, I

7:14

think because of the bullying background to go, I want to

7:16

do even more. So I

7:18

moved away. I lived in Swindon. We

7:21

have a thing, the tradition of the Marshall Arts.

7:23

I don't want to open up on my instructor's

7:25

doorstep. It's disrespectful. So I moved

7:27

away to a town called Broughton

7:29

in North Devon near Barsteball.

7:32

I mean, it's 10,000 people in this

7:35

little village Broughton. Half

7:37

of them are old people, retired. And

7:40

I just put posters up. I was very good

7:42

at doing a certain kick, a flying kick, which became

7:44

my logo. I put posters up

7:47

everywhere. I understood from a young age that you

7:49

had to be aggressive to get in marketing, to

7:51

get out to get eyeballs on you. And

7:54

I'd start my classes and I'd collect three

7:56

pounds in an ice cream container. And

7:59

then I'd take a look at it. I did that twice a week in

8:01

Brawnton. Then I worked at North Devon Legit Center as

8:03

a lifeguard, it's the other qualification I had, for

8:05

two pounds, 75 an hour, which was painful. And

8:08

I lifted a bed set, 30 pound a week. And

8:11

it was a painful journey. I got evicted from

8:13

three bed sets, couldn't afford the 30 pound a

8:15

week, because evicted for what? For

8:18

not paying the rent, couldn't afford it. Christmas

8:20

come round, my family did feel sorry for me and

8:22

they sent me hampers and

8:25

food through for me. My, yeah, it was pretty painful, man.

8:28

I was like, it's done. I've got to make this thing

8:30

work. It's actually my girlfriend at the time,

8:32

she said, you keep talking about this

8:34

martial arts thing and you've

8:36

got all these goals. And she brought me like

8:38

a briefcase, it was like a symbolic thing to

8:40

come on, get on with it, stop messing around,

8:42

do something here. And you can

8:44

call it law or attraction or whatever you want. But one

8:47

of my training partners, a

8:50

guy called Lee, he was in

8:52

America and he just got back and

8:54

he paged me. It sounded like we were really old

8:56

when he 44, pages was how I

8:59

launched my business. So Matt called

9:01

me ASAP. So I went from the bed

9:03

to the red phone box, I called him up and said, Lee, what's going

9:05

on? So Matt, I've just come back from

9:07

San Francisco. You would believe

9:09

what's going on out there. You've got multi-millionaire

9:12

martial arts business owners. But

9:14

we have this tiny thing that we will

9:16

not compromise our standards for any amount of

9:18

money. It's been like bodybuilders and

9:21

the quality of their gym for the size of

9:23

their muscles. They think they're gonna have bigger muscles,

9:25

they're gonna get more students. You're gonna produce more

9:27

champions, It doesn't

9:29

work that way. So I said to Lee, I don't

9:31

wanna compromise my standards. Now trust me, they got the

9:33

standards and they got the money. So

9:36

I saved up my two pounds, 75 an

9:38

hour from the lifeguard and did a bit of extra casual

9:40

work. And my three

9:42

pounds in the ice cream containers and

9:45

I had enough money to get a ticket to

9:47

San Francisco. And I saved in this rough place

9:49

in San Francisco. And it's

9:51

a three day conference. I had over a

9:53

thousand martial arts business owners all over America.

9:56

So America Back then was safe to say, we're like 20

9:58

years ahead of us. The we

10:00

took an early two thousand and now we saw him

10:02

Live in the seventh know seven o'clock here. And

10:05

the as the owner of this conference

10:07

sees normal saw a guy is a

10:09

business grew Geico Nicholas cooking in Us

10:11

and he was in his eighties and

10:13

I saw him in a lot lobbies

10:15

the Hyatt Hotel and I'm. Because. I'm

10:17

not really young or like seventeen.or

10:20

I approached Amazon. wish the casino

10:22

for come from the Uk to

10:24

learn on introduce myself. And. He

10:26

was so impressed he said that America's

10:28

different to that You are You cave.

10:31

you successfully stab you in the back.

10:33

him up and market I wanna sit

10:35

down with you. The encouraging that he

10:37

said i'm really impressive approach make is

10:39

to stars A multimedia addy Saddam. We.

10:41

Might as well make you. Famous

10:44

of the most successful person in

10:46

this industry for safer for him.

10:48

There's like a case study. So

10:50

Mr. Genus took me under his

10:52

wing and he mentored me personally

10:54

so I joined this organization this

10:57

business organization in the steaks. He

10:59

said study the three days off.

11:01

Of this information are back then there was

11:04

no pets in.said i've got two events now

11:06

as pitch concept pitch it was just content

11:08

information with a even up the word content

11:10

that it was just network in that information

11:13

saw combat of oldies notepads of information and

11:15

mrs you seen as said that some of

11:17

it might work and maintenance of a ton

11:20

of we don't know would ever tried before

11:22

like a little island when I have a

11:24

buffer by expanding that control maps and he

11:26

told me to follow us after two weeks

11:29

his hobby to follow the most successful marshals

11:31

business oldest. Harrys in the

11:33

States. Source get up a for am

11:35

in the morning and I was following

11:37

them. Around America, study and

11:39

what they do. Their habits, how they

11:41

saw classes, what was different, how to

11:44

retain members, how they had a credible

11:46

service. And. I bought about to uk.

11:48

I. Saw it, what some visited. The first challenge

11:51

I had salt collector the three pounds into an.

11:53

Ice. cream box of put them on direct debits

11:55

to time was cool standing orders was while the

11:58

first guy to do that the uk and I

12:00

stabilised myself in income then, five to six thousand pounds

12:02

a month, my overhead's a fifteen pound a night, twice

12:04

a week, and I got

12:06

out the bedsits, got into a rented house, and

12:09

I thought I'm on to something here, you know, I'm

12:12

on to something finally. Then I

12:14

was looking for the big building in the town called Barnstable,

12:17

and you imagine, I was

12:19

this guy with a ponytail walking

12:22

in, the ponytail thing, I read somewhere, you'd look old

12:24

if you grew a ponytail, so that was like my

12:26

symbolic thing. I thought it was my lucky charm, if

12:28

I cut it off, the success would go away. I

12:31

walked into this estate agent, which was under the

12:33

building, we still got it today, and

12:36

I said to him, he's called Richard Smith, I said, Mr Smith,

12:38

I'd like to rent your first floor, please,

12:40

off your seats for lease, and he said,

12:42

oh no, no, what are you going to do? He

12:44

said, I'm going to teach martial arts, you know, you can't do that, you're not going

12:46

to be able to pay the bills doing that. But

12:49

luckily for me, my mum was a lawyer, a

12:51

property lawyer, a real estate lawyer, so she knew

12:53

all the estate agents. So she called up this

12:56

guy, this estate agent, and said, who's the landlord,

12:58

I said, look, I think my son's on to

13:00

something here. He's doing all

13:02

right. He's hiring this village hall for

13:04

£30 a week in Bronson, just

13:06

10,000 population, 100 members, paying him £59, £69

13:09

a month on direct debit. Why

13:12

not give him six months free rent? Let him

13:14

sort the building out, do all the decorations, and

13:17

give him a chance. And

13:19

that's exactly what we did. The biggest problem I had was I

13:22

was 17, I couldn't sign the lease. So we

13:24

changed my girlfriend's name at the time

13:26

to Fidesh. She signed

13:28

the lease, got me in six months

13:31

free rent. And I remember it's so clear, Dodge, because

13:33

I questioned myself. We

13:35

wanted to open in January to get

13:37

that New Year flood of New Year's resolutions to

13:39

join my martial arts school. Couldn't afford maps, so

13:41

we had the cheapest carpet you could get down

13:44

on the floor. And

13:46

it was New Year's Eve. And

13:48

the building's right situated on the square in the

13:50

front of Baswell, where all the fireworks take place

13:52

and everyone's singing that song. And

13:55

when it strikes midnight, I was looking out the window, the

13:57

fireworks are going off, and I was decorated again. What am

13:59

I doing here? This I'll say an absurd.

14:01

The masses do the opposite. I'm seven. long

14:03

story short. Pineapple. The local

14:05

paper. They. Didn't obey

14:07

the right upon me and I'm.

14:10

Within. Six months had several under members

14:12

pay me for family members anything for

14:14

fifty nine sixty nine am often we've

14:17

got join if is exam fees of

14:19

merchandise and the vast was a million

14:21

pounds a year. Sonos a nonprofit. Net.

14:24

Profit Milk and I doubt I'd my rent

14:26

was two hundred pounds a month for like

14:28

two hundred twenty bottom of the building Semi

14:30

people. did you need to get. So.

14:33

Of mill net profit six seven hundred with

14:35

all the income streams that we have within

14:37

the yeah settler sixteen countries within at this

14:40

the stuff a lot from the states. Yeah,

14:42

I. Can't. Take. Credit a million

14:44

pound net profit any one day I'll smash

14:46

our the pun on bloody more than that

14:48

because after this after the first and I'm

14:50

talking know a lot we know to a

14:52

business to get some money pantone over the

14:54

first year or two year texas to one

14:56

still on com Net net as a loveless

14:59

L autos right away my eyes to say

15:01

to people because. My. Franchises

15:03

they don't know how good I gotta they

15:05

work and eighty five percent profit. He gave

15:07

me a room with no equipment and I'll

15:09

show you how to make America. Yeah I

15:11

just need a group that they're either. you

15:13

got to be an amazing room. Most my

15:16

facilities Runoff Turtles love our facility Rica for

15:18

free as well. So what was? Well I've

15:20

how was your last dollar? Then you come

15:22

in. you hit a mere. We've hit the

15:24

jackpot early doors. what the I was eighteen

15:26

does ha ha You hit the jackpot. What

15:29

were you personally like for that amount of money

15:31

come from nothing to also never mill in the

15:33

bank. Cocky. About me. Well can

15:35

I Not be okay? I

15:38

was cooking god knows I now Example: are

15:40

you looking back and average explain you looking

15:42

back petite us over it wasn't a top

15:44

know I won't call back them with i

15:47

i like his arms a car. yes

15:50

and i am sure added pub ah

15:52

to provide good reason i thought someone

15:54

was a looking back i'm matt back

15:56

then explain the character you would say

15:58

now I didn't know

16:00

any different. You remember this, right? So I didn't

16:03

know what a normal 18 year old should

16:06

be doing because my net

16:08

circle of friends was not 18 year

16:10

olds. I was mixing with the guys

16:12

I met in America. They wanted to

16:14

better themselves and become multimillionaires. So

16:17

what you would see is a

16:19

guy who is ridiculously

16:22

tuned in to trying to keep in 99.9% perfect

16:24

shape. I would go to

16:27

the gym relentlessly even if it was 10 o'clock, 11

16:30

o'clock at night, training

16:32

like in that case. I got pictures of me training about

16:34

it then. I look at it and think what did I

16:36

put myself through? Driving

16:40

a Ferrari 355 Spyder. You put yourself a

16:42

Ferrari. Yeah, it was part of my goals.

16:44

Do you remember? A mass pass. What colour?

16:46

Red one. Had to be red, didn't it?

16:49

And it's funny, I just put my wife one for Christmas

16:51

and it's exactly the same store and the

16:53

same staff that remembered me when I walked in and

16:56

they tell that story to all their staff all the

16:58

time. Matt Fidesz walked in when

17:00

he was like 18, 19

17:02

and we just thought he wanted a picture of a car and he

17:04

walked out with a... Do you remember what you paid

17:06

back then? Yeah, I kicked myself.

17:09

I think I paid 120 but I sold the damn

17:12

thing for about 36,000. Now it's

17:14

worth 200,000. What made

17:17

you want to go and get a red Ferrari

17:20

at the age of 18? I'd be looking around thinking people are

17:22

going to think I'm a plum. Were you thinking

17:24

that or were you just like, no, I don't care. I don't

17:28

care. Especially being in like, Devon.

17:32

If you were in London you could blend in a bit more

17:34

but you're in Devon. Is the

17:36

only Ferrari there? Yeah, I'm sure. Well, you

17:38

know the funny thing is, Dodge, I used to always

17:41

be upset with the public. I said,

17:43

why is Barnstable always giving me a hard time? I

17:45

don't understand. I've got thousands of

17:47

members here now. So I went and did five

17:49

schools. So you've got Barnstable, you've got Brawnton, Ilfricoon,

17:52

Biddeford, South Molten, Torrenton. I did all those locations.

17:54

So you scaled up from that one? Yeah, I

17:56

thought I was on a lucky thing but then

17:58

I was on a lucky thing. So

18:00

I pretty much own North Devon's martial arts

18:02

thing. Yeah, I've been gossiped about talks about

18:04

what I can understand It's the hate

18:07

people are defeating kill Matt Fidesz. We didn't have the

18:09

internet back then we had my space So we have

18:11

blogs who are talking about me. I can't

18:14

understand it I look back now and I get it

18:17

I'm driving around in a brand

18:19

new Ferrari 355 spider in the winter with

18:22

my top off oiled up

18:25

For this with a duros hair down And

18:29

my best mate to Yuri get a Michael Jackson and everyone wonders

18:31

why they can't relate to me You

18:34

know, maybe so, how did you how did

18:36

you go from that then? How

18:39

did you meet Michael Jackson and what

18:41

age did you meet him? So I was

18:44

in the reception of my main martial arts school so the

18:46

basketball one was like the hub where all the staff would

18:48

meet up and Then we do staff

18:50

training that I go off to the locations each

18:52

evening One of the parents was a guy

18:54

called Nick Constable. I need to look him up. Actually, I'll keep

18:57

talking about recently See how he's doing it wouldn't

18:59

fit him. None of this would have happened. He

19:01

came up to me He says hi Matt. I've got a daughter

19:03

and a son who works who trains with you I'm

19:06

a reporter for an agency called

19:08

Southwest news agency. I distribute stories

19:11

Do you mind if I do a story on you? I knew

19:13

you're bullied at school and You

19:16

got no qualifications everyone was

19:18

against you they all knew my story because the local paper

19:20

featured it and Take

19:23

some pictures you in the car. I Say

19:25

yeah, okay, because when you're just question a why

19:27

did I go and get the Ferrari? Why

19:30

do I want a body like that? So I wanted

19:32

to prove everyone wrong my bully my parents my grandparents

19:34

my family I wanted to have it

19:36

all the body the shape the car what could really

19:38

upset people the most And

19:41

that's the art to have been successful. You do upset a lot

19:43

of people on the way It's egotistical

19:45

symbolic reasons to help fulfill

19:49

my painful childhood You can't

19:51

do that you can't do this you can't do that looking

19:53

back now I I realize it's more probably one of

19:56

the stupidest things I've done and it would have upset

19:58

a lot of people but at the

20:00

same time I wouldn't change it because I wouldn't be who I am now. So

20:03

this reporter interviews me, takes me right back

20:05

to being bullied at school, secondary

20:07

school, no qualifications, parents, don't

20:09

want nothing to do with me, as far as in the bed sit they want nothing

20:11

to do with me. And

20:14

why did your parents do more than anything to do with

20:16

you? They wanted me to be a vet or

20:19

a doctor. They wanted to follow the

20:21

family tradition. There's only one

20:23

person in my family who was for

20:26

it, which is interesting. It was my grandfather, it's

20:28

called Sean Norris. So

20:30

he had the 14 children, my mum's dad. Now

20:33

Sean Norris was seven times Irish

20:36

weightlifting champion and he got picked

20:38

for the Rome Olympics in 1960. So

20:41

after all those 14 kids, he used to think

20:43

of me, he hopes one of them would have that

20:46

athletic drive to be like him. And

20:49

he trained me, I was very lucky, from 13 to

20:51

18 he was my

20:53

mentor from the training side. So

20:56

he took me under his wing, which

20:58

was interesting because my other cousins, they

21:01

got it hard. He's a very religious man from

21:03

Ireland. So that's the way he's been brought

21:06

up. I didn't get any of that from him. I

21:08

had special treatment from him because he

21:10

saw in me something in himself. So

21:12

he took me under his guidance

21:16

to grow up. He

21:18

believed in me. So only, it's only my

21:20

granddad who actually thought you could

21:22

do something with this. Do you know what?

21:24

The truth is my parents never actually came

21:26

to watch me train, watch me take

21:28

part in the class, never. But

21:30

my grandfather would get on the bus and he would come and

21:32

watch. I still have vivid memories of that now. Did you used

21:34

to fight? Did you used to go back and find your bullies?

21:37

Yeah, well we did on the media. We would get to

21:40

that part. I always used to think it in my

21:42

head. Actually it's one funny

21:44

story before we forget about it. So when

21:46

I, well everyone likes a Mackie

21:49

Dee every now and then, doesn't they? But

21:51

I went to McDonald's in Swindon and

21:53

I had, it was a lovely sunny day. I had the Far

21:55

East, the roof down, the 355. I

21:58

go through to the dry fruit. one

22:00

of the bullies, not the main capitalist, but

22:02

one of them secondary school, handed me my

22:05

Howl female while I was in

22:07

my Ferrari 355 and I was staring at him

22:09

and he's like, how the heck did that happen?

22:11

That was the biggest a few moments you could

22:13

imagine, you know? Were you a fighting man? No,

22:16

how tall are you? Six foot four. Six foot

22:18

four. So you're a big strong man, but when

22:21

you were going there, were you a fighting man going, you

22:23

know what, if you can start on me, we'll deal with

22:25

this. Or were you just doing your

22:27

concentrating on your mixed martial arts and your and

22:30

building your business? Well, one

22:32

thing that my particular martial arts

22:34

director always taught me is that if I got into

22:36

fights and stuff that were not part of our championships

22:39

and I'll be out. Yeah. Okay. So comes down to

22:41

discipline, isn't it? It comes down to discipline, dodge, and

22:43

then later in my life where I become a lot

22:45

more known, if I was in

22:47

a place when I was going to be attacked, then

22:50

the world's so crazy now, probably that to take

22:52

a bit of a beating because

22:54

the way the world is, I'd love to put Matt Fidesz

22:56

in jail for beating someone up, throw the towel at me.

22:59

So I should know how to recognize and avoid

23:01

situations. Obviously, it's my family members, it'd be very,

23:03

very different. And that's actually happened before in certain

23:06

places. But so where did you

23:09

meet Michael Jackson then? Okay, so

23:11

this report, he did the story. Nothing

23:13

happened. I thought it'd be for the local newspaper

23:15

went away. They think my short three or

23:17

four days later, landlines with

23:20

ringing off the hook, like proper.

23:22

Remember, this is back in

23:24

98. This is where mainstream media was 20 million

23:27

copies per day for each edition of each Daily

23:29

Mail and Sun and Star. It

23:32

was mad. What's going on? I can't understand

23:34

it. Turns out I'm on the

23:36

front page of every single tabloid and broadsheet. Bully

23:38

Boy becomes millionaire had a picture of me when

23:40

I was vulnerable, young, seven years

23:43

old, picture of me doing a punch and

23:46

a picture of me in my car. And it tells my whole story.

23:48

Now what happens on the back of that

23:50

when you get that kind of media attention, the

23:52

researchers TV programs, they go through

23:54

the newspapers or social media nowadays,

23:57

and they look for good stories. So I went on

23:59

TV. shows like Trisha which had 20

24:01

million 30 million viewers morning TV show

24:04

Esther Ramsen, Killroy, Richard and

24:06

Judy and it just blew up. I

24:08

became the most well-known martial arts guy

24:11

in the UK who was making all this money and

24:13

no one can understand it especially my my

24:16

peers in the industry because I was the first

24:18

guy to commercialize martial arts again what's he doing

24:20

he can't do that he can't be

24:22

making millions out of martial arts, he's not supposed to do that so

24:25

I had an awful lot of hate too but a

24:27

guy was watching me on

24:30

Esther Ramsen's show and it

24:32

was Yuri Geng and

24:35

Yuri Geller is more famous in the UK for

24:37

benders spoons and stuff but all around the world

24:39

he's super famous a bit like the Tony Rollers,

24:41

he only believes you use 10% of your mind

24:44

and you can access different areas. Is that what he's

24:46

known for is it? Yeah I mean it's like Tony's

24:48

got the firewalk, Yuri Geller's got the spoon bend there

24:50

right? But behind that he's

24:52

published like 60 international books in different

24:54

languages he's a Pokemon card,

24:56

Nintendo, he's world famous so he wanted

24:59

to meet me and he wanted to

25:01

make a series of videos where

25:03

he would do positive mindset to stop bullying

25:05

because bullying was a massive problem back then and

25:08

I would do the physical moves and we're going to

25:10

distribute it to kids all over the UK for your

25:12

charge on VHS we didn't get around

25:14

to doing that video we did a fitness based one where

25:16

he did motivational mind

25:19

stuff and I did like Kid

25:21

Boxer-O-Bix and that went to number one it

25:23

was huge all around Asia and so on. We

25:26

became very close friends and

25:28

people might not do this but he's

25:30

extremely successful like super wealthy his house

25:33

like a 20 million pound replica of the White

25:36

House in the southern London next to George Clooney's

25:38

home so being around that environment

25:40

all the time was very motivating for me. I

25:43

became close friends who's godfather to my

25:45

oldest daughter Madison and

25:49

when I go walk when I go to see him

25:51

it always ends with a walk he always believed in

25:53

walking two hours a day on the River Thames and

25:55

around his land and phone calls would come in from

25:58

very famous people royalty and presidents

26:01

and so forth but I've

26:03

never heard any phone calls from Michael Jackson or

26:05

no one so Nor would I

26:07

even think be looking for that now? I

26:09

went back to Barnsville one day and Yuri

26:12

Getta would ring you unusual times of

26:14

the day lot of these big stars do because

26:16

they got Companies in Australia. They need

26:19

to stay wait for TV shows. So I thought

26:21

phone call coming at 3 a.m. On the landline

26:23

he said to me Matt you got to come

26:25

to my house now and If

26:28

you don't you'll regret it for the rest of your life. I

26:31

can't tell you why I Say

26:33

Yuri you need to tell me why what am I

26:35

supposed to tell my overhead? He's over my habit is

26:37

bed over there said you I've

26:40

not put you wrong so far. I love

26:42

you Bye put the phone down I'll

26:44

accept my missus and I thought She's

26:47

gonna be well it's massive argument man.

26:50

I get in the car But he

26:52

already he's property mad He's teaching me all the

26:54

time stop buying these Ferrari's by houses and he

26:56

made me buy five houses per month I

26:59

hated him for 11 for it now. I drove to his home

27:01

gates opened up about 6 30 in the morning and Went

27:04

down to his driveway. There's nothing no real

27:07

signal There's three black SUVs outside and I

27:09

walk in the living room and

27:11

this frail guy walks up to me He bows

27:13

and he goes hi master for this. My

27:16

name is Michael Jackson. Please do meet you sir They're

27:18

gonna you are what the heck are you doing here?

27:20

And about then Dodge? I forced there's a lot of

27:22

prank TV. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, and I was in

27:24

the limelight then so I thought Yuri's

27:27

stitching me up before like Jeremy B. Norby. I

27:29

demand Yeah, it's a candy camera.

27:31

Oh this type of thing. Yes.

27:33

Yeah, that's a few minutes. I realize this

27:35

guy was the real deal Yeah, and

27:38

he said He

27:41

said I want to do a deal with you man So what's

27:43

that? I'll teach you the moonwalk if you

27:45

teach me how to break boards and it turned

27:47

out He was already a black belt.

27:49

So his dad Joseph Jackson made

27:51

sure all the Jackson 5 because they're famous are

27:53

so young They studied martial arts. They studied kung

27:56

fu and he wanted to go to second degree

27:58

black belt along with his friend

28:00

Mark Clasto who played the original Oliver Twist and

28:03

funny I thought I'd dodge it in that

28:05

don't I? Yeah yeah

28:07

and so that was the

28:09

plan that's why he wanted to meet me

28:11

but we just hit it off we became good buddies

28:13

good friends and we stayed up for

28:16

like three days and we're laughing and joking and I

28:18

took him around ready in my car and my convertible

28:20

and people just thought it was a look-alike he would

28:22

come and stay with me in basketball people who was

28:25

a look-alike and who's gonna believe in

28:27

18 year old hanging around with a megastar like that you

28:29

know and he kind of felt secure with me

28:31

too because of the martial arts side of it I

28:34

could tell early on he had bigger plans

28:36

that things were not good

28:38

in his camp he lost

28:40

his long-term bodyguards and

28:42

he was having these like temp bodyguards it cost

28:44

about 150,000 a month he told me and he

28:46

couldn't answer his phone around him and

28:48

stuff like that he was finding it hard so me

28:51

being a nice guy I said look Michael I'll take

28:53

over your personal protection

28:55

for free for free

28:58

for free I did even money yeah I

29:00

think that's part of the reason it worked

29:02

yeah I very much believe in non-transactional relationships

29:04

because you monetize things it can become an

29:06

issue I think that's why I

29:08

stayed the full ten years as his mega and

29:12

yeah he jumped at it

29:14

you know he just jumped at it plus I supplied

29:16

my family my brother-in-law and one

29:19

of my brothers and I got access

29:21

to all this team of instructors so

29:23

I said whatever you are in the world you know

29:25

just give me a buzz and I will

29:27

make it happen he took it a little bit too yeah

29:30

I didn't mean it like like whatever

29:32

he's doing but didn't he like

29:34

you straight away do you think only

29:37

because Yuri Gallo yeah told him you could

29:39

trust this guy okay he's a millionaire yeah

29:41

nothing from you Yuri let me

29:43

in his world yeah how come

29:46

they let you in so easily and so quickly someone like

29:48

Yuri and then all of a sudden you're meeting Michael Jackson

29:50

and then what was going through your

29:52

mind you must have been helped on me I'll meet you Michael

29:54

Jackson here this is mad well

29:56

what's going through my mind is how the hell am I

29:58

gonna go home to basketball explained to tell everyone

30:00

what I've done at the weekend. And

30:03

no one was going to help me. Like,

30:06

Yuri, how do I explain? What do I tell my brothers?

30:08

What do I tell my mom and dad? Well,

30:10

I say, you can't tell no one anything. So

30:12

I can't even

30:14

tell them the truth, because they think I'm flipping lost the plot.

30:18

So this secret went on for, I don't

30:20

know, maybe a year. And

30:23

in the end, I said to Michael, we're in New York. I'm like,

30:25

you've got to help me out. I

30:28

can't keep lying to everyone where I am. So

30:31

I just told them, your friends are Michael Jackson.

30:33

I said, I can't. I think I'm crazy.

30:35

I'm in Barstable. You've got no idea. There's 30,000

30:37

people that live there. They hate me enough as

30:39

it is, because of me frohring, me perm hair.

30:43

They don't get it. I'm not from Barstable. I'm from Swindon.

30:45

They don't like that either at the time. Funny, when I

30:47

go back now, they love me. They shake my hand on

30:49

Matt. You put Barstable on the map. Back

30:51

then, they wanted to kill me. And he got it.

30:53

He said, oh, I've got a book launch to go to soon. Why don't you

30:56

come along with me? And that was it. Me

30:59

and him went to this book launch. And then

31:01

I was at 20 Stone in London.

31:04

And it's for a friend of ours. And

31:07

we turned up unannounced. Paparazzi was just

31:09

outside the hotel anyway. And

31:11

because I'm the big guy, I was 20 Stone,

31:13

a muscle bad. I've done my arm around him. Protected

31:16

to my mate. He was quite vulnerable. And

31:19

it was done. That was it. Then it was everywhere.

31:21

I was pictured everywhere. Yeah, the

31:23

unofficial bodyguard. And then the bodyguard. Funny,

31:26

because you should say to me, if you're going

31:28

to be my friend, your life will never be the same again. I

31:30

never really believed much of it, Dodge. But when he

31:33

passed away, he used to irritate me. I had

31:35

counseling over the fact that whenever people write about

31:38

me now, they put Michael Jackson's

31:40

bodyguard. When he was alive, it was Matt,

31:42

the martial arts guru, or martial arts businessman.

31:46

But when he passed away, it became bodyguard.

31:49

And I had to learn to live around. I understand how it works.

31:51

And I was good friends with Alfred Presley's bodyguard.

31:53

He had the same problem. He

31:56

just got to learn to live with him. But yeah, he

31:59

warned me that would happen. Jackson not as a

32:01

bloke. Nothing like the

32:03

media portrays. if I love the

32:05

guy. And. A

32:08

very humble, very sweet, naive.

32:11

Threatening. Foyer. And

32:13

that was also his biggest problem is that

32:16

he. He was too nice

32:18

right? Eighty six overs over Brothers I've You

32:20

take your main to me wants a mess

32:22

around to raise top fries terrain How he

32:24

went face to face with Steven Seagal once

32:26

because the vehicles as I make about his

32:29

brother Michael is that movie premiere. And.

32:31

Jamais trying said to me said I wrote

32:33

my first stop austerity stephen in the face

32:35

it's are you know what out I was

32:37

gonna do but er det supt be like

32:39

Germain and Seat so that different a cat

32:42

from. The. Thought of as Mike was

32:44

very sensitive. Prices. That

32:46

guy. For. This mega stardom.

32:49

That. Yeah did you were you around when you

32:51

haven't was it was given any death threats was would

32:53

have chosen a good I it wasn't Yeah breathe I

32:55

know like you do now are just like an instagram

32:58

things and they allow is like notes on the the

33:00

door. And we're going to keep that

33:02

the kids. Million. Pound

33:04

ransom if he if one of the

33:06

newspapers or the time were offered us

33:08

all the time or many powdery get

33:11

pitch of his chosen en masse reached

33:13

but mass on into so they have

33:15

a normal life go to the playground

33:17

and plays normal kids are out that.

33:20

Turn. It into. Chaos

33:22

Chaos scene of fans everywhere mins. Pepper

33:24

acetone that up. yeah every day they'll

33:26

be something and he used to test

33:28

this or that too. Much.

33:30

Used to test our laws. He's very clever. Well I

33:32

was a there was a minute because it is. He

33:37

would be repeated by he knew. No.

33:39

Different than be a Michael Jackson. So.

33:43

i struggled my rehearsal marriage or

33:45

first march we were struggling to

33:47

make it work like eight years

33:50

in and maybe party the reason

33:52

was because asked working too hard

33:54

or three amazing kids beautiful daughters

33:56

and we decided to go to

33:59

wherever you lands, the Rottie or Tenerife,

34:01

something like that, Canary Islands to try and

34:03

repair the marriage. And

34:05

two days in, Michael calls

34:07

me and says, I'm in New York,

34:09

I'm coming to England, I need you to pick me up from

34:11

terminal five. I

34:14

said, Michael, I can't, I mean, I'm trying to save

34:16

my marriage, but he's not used

34:18

to people saying no to him, you know, so I

34:20

didn't want to say no to him because I knew

34:23

there's no one else he could trust. There's nobody,

34:25

he's a very small inner circle. He's

34:27

already booked the, his Concord flight he had back then,

34:30

and he was coming in. So I said to

34:32

my ex-wife, I said, uh, and I

34:34

said, I need to go back, Michael's coming to London, he needs me.

34:37

It's important, and that didn't go down well. And

34:40

then straight away, I came up with this

34:43

idea that there'd be no flights available. So I

34:45

had a quick look and it looked quite difficult to get a

34:47

flight back to England. So I called Michael

34:49

back up, said, Michael, I can't come, there's no flights. Ah, I'll

34:51

sort that off with you. He said, Michael

34:53

Jackson, I think you can do anything you want. So you sorted

34:55

out the airplane and he got me back and

34:58

picked him up from the airport. My wife went back to

35:00

Barstable and I lived with

35:02

him for a couple of weeks

35:04

at a hotel in London, a room office suite. He

35:06

felt a bit guilty a few days in. I said

35:09

to him, you do realize that I

35:11

was trying to repair my marriage then. You

35:13

just disrupted the whole damn thing. And

35:16

he called Marcy up and he invited her and the kids to come

35:18

and stay in a hotel suite and took him

35:20

shopping the hamilies and stuff like that. There's

35:22

loads and loads of stories about him. Was

35:25

he gay? No, he wanted you to

35:28

think whatever you thought. He was brainwashed

35:30

by Motown records at five

35:32

years old that you mustn't

35:34

ever get married. You mustn't ever show

35:37

your sexuality, be gay or

35:39

straight because you'll kill your family.

35:41

So like an old school thinker. That's the way

35:43

Motown brought them up. So when

35:45

Tito Jackson got married, he's the first of the Jackson

35:47

Five to get married. Michael was crying all the time

35:49

and was angry with Tito. Then Jermaine got married and

35:51

he thought that

35:53

was the end of the Jacksons, the end of the Jackson Five. So

35:56

he kept this protective barrier around him to

35:59

not allow him to be married. let anyone

36:01

in. Obviously he's public where he's married to

36:03

Lisa Marie Presley, half of his daughter. Did

36:05

he do that for show to marry Elvis

36:08

Presley's daughter? Or was that genuine love? Absolutely.

36:10

It was. Yeah, I mean my best mate

36:12

was the same age as his best mate.

36:15

Yeah, I mean I thought the best way to say it

36:17

but he used to... When you stay with Michael you have

36:20

these big presidential suites and you have rooms off his living

36:22

room and yeah you'd be

36:24

awake all night hearing, you know, them at

36:27

it. That's what

36:30

I used to say to Michael, you guys have a baby man, he'd be

36:32

like, hee hee hee! It'd be

36:34

more credible. But that

36:38

era, Mark Lester was around,

36:40

I mean it was proper marriage. It

36:42

was proper marriage. It's the only person he can relate to if you think

36:44

about it. But just through so much

36:46

fame. Yeah, he knew how her dad's

36:49

life was, Elvis and

36:51

Michael knew he could trust her. And

36:54

yeah, right until his death she

36:56

was always on the phone. Give

36:58

an example of being a bodyguard for Michael,

37:00

the craziness that you come across. Like the

37:02

crazy fans, did you used to carry a

37:04

gun with you? What

37:06

were you keeping an eye out for? Did you have earpieces in?

37:08

Just give me an overview of what it would be like. Yeah,

37:10

it depends what we're doing. So if we're here on a private

37:13

visit then it would just be me, him and one other. And

37:16

then my brother-in-law, Craig, used

37:18

to come and stand by... Because

37:20

it wasn't a normal bodyguard relationship, so

37:23

I was his mate. So I'd be inside the

37:25

room with him. When we talk about

37:27

room with hotel suites, like 10, 20,000

37:29

pound a night hotel suites. So

37:32

Craig, my brother-in-law, used to be outside

37:35

and he would step all night making sure

37:37

no, the public, the fans would get to

37:40

us while we were sleeping. It

37:42

was, to be honest, Dodge, it was

37:44

boring. Yeah. Because we couldn't do much. And

37:46

when we did, it was a complete chaos scene. So

37:49

there was loads of footage of me and him out there

37:52

over the years. One

37:54

time he came into my room, he said, I want to go

37:56

to HMV, the record store on Oxford Street. I said, do you

37:58

want us To... Ranger late at night

38:01

so we can shut it down for you.

38:03

So now let's just go. was okay and

38:05

South Beach as it's He wanted to check

38:07

if is music has been distributed by Sony.

38:09

had a baby to speak with. i'm sorry

38:12

turn up dismay him a one off a

38:14

bodyguard got this type. ah damn he only

38:16

wanted them as go to the Michael Jackson's

38:18

Actually have a love to suck up all

38:20

these albums and I'm sorry Walton Fast. And

38:23

I'm. Of the escalator. We.

38:26

Get some I could access at sector

38:28

they saudis people at book forever fellow

38:30

run dangerous and will like. Because.

38:33

I you know it's a little and he was

38:35

just checking their all that and I'm within. Like.

38:38

Five minutes or the escalators was

38:40

shut down. All the people on

38:42

the tills, the staff that. Obama,

38:45

Michael to trying. Cat. For

38:47

to get a picture and and

38:49

then we heard. That. The

38:51

place for comment. An Ox Orcs history of

38:53

been shut down. And. Could we

38:55

please move with Mr. Jackson to the fire exit

38:57

the back of Hmv I may sound the far

38:59

except we all go pitches that so my to

39:01

resist. Mike was on there for two and a

39:03

half hours on a please help us get out.

39:06

Yeah. Several men so I am I crazy

39:08

about what is White Glove More by is also

39:11

classes on his thoughts, hands and stuff. was also

39:13

showed us what you want to choose to say.

39:15

As I used to say to me mack if

39:17

you want people to be interested he have to

39:19

be interesting So he was playing that taper one

39:22

day there's they can I was we really liked

39:24

this. Meet him by some like why you got

39:26

sick you type last as on you. Think.

39:29

Is so I guess that's why speak people say

39:31

curious. I stay relevant. I

39:33

once I'm sure I was a conscious about.

39:35

of sorry to be stories.about that is nice

39:38

fallen off business rock gotta understand that because

39:40

the michael idea behind a door he looks

39:42

normal course he's out surgery done but if

39:44

you took everyone off hollywood is not a

39:47

surgery that will be anyone left for did

39:49

you when you have with indecisive used know

39:51

you see black or white or that time

39:54

so he added kids skin condition which is

39:56

now. Can. finally size been comfort

39:58

were buying off a year by the

40:00

coroner for he did his autopsy, Michael

40:03

Jackson has a skin condition called vitiligo.

40:05

So not all of his body was

40:08

patchy, he used to call himself spotted cow, so

40:11

he didn't bother colouring his legs or nothing like

40:13

that but it's always a work in progress, he'd

40:15

have blotches superior, it's not in the frillaria. They

40:17

tried to cover it with makeup but

40:20

for a guy who's a black guy it was difficult

40:22

when they got to the stage in the air where

40:24

he's dancing and sweating on stage he had to make

40:26

a decision so he decided to cover

40:29

it with easier makeup white

40:31

makeup but now his legs and stuff are all,

40:33

he used to call it spotted cow yeah

40:36

yeah he used to

40:38

tell me one of his greatest loves like water

40:40

parks and stuff like that couldn't do that anymore

40:42

and wherever the sunlight you all see pictures of

40:45

me with an umbrella over his head yeah because

40:47

he's so prone to skin cancer, vitiligo takes your

40:49

pigment out. So you say, are you saying he

40:51

got a skin cancer the reason why? No he's

40:53

prone to skin cancer. Okay but how can we

40:55

check, what phase were you at

40:57

when he was changing or completely changed?

41:00

Okay so we have this thing here Mark,

41:02

so Mark goes back right until the off-the-wall

41:04

era. Who's Mark? Mark Lester's Oliver Twist yeah

41:07

okay yeah yeah black beauty all those big

41:09

hits yeah so they're both the same age,

41:12

grew up together, read about each other in magazines so

41:15

whenever I want to know anything about black

41:17

Michael I'll speak to Mark yeah

41:19

yeah I'd have to go back to

41:21

Mark about those type of things.

41:24

I only knew him when he

41:26

was, as you would remember

41:28

him basically but yeah all

41:30

this plastic surgery stuff he went to great effort

41:32

to make himself look a lot worse

41:34

because he wanted to make the media coverage. Are you

41:36

sure though, I'm sure you don't want to make yourself

41:38

look worse. He's sure he's not spent so much money

41:40

that they've spent so much work in him that he

41:42

might have got addicted to it that his face has

41:44

gone point A what

41:47

it was just very odd. There's

41:49

some truth to that yeah but I'll give

41:51

you a story that will show you some

41:53

context behind it is that when

41:56

we're in London one time I don't Know if

41:58

it doesn't happen anymore. but every day the. Newspaper used

42:00

to get pushed on the hotel suite

42:02

and every single edition of have a

42:04

newspaper ad america of a coma his

42:06

p i recall we say mouth can

42:08

you go to the mail or the

42:10

sun and eight pages nine to twelve

42:13

hours cause is nectar about Mr Jackson

42:15

on our sneak in our my room.

42:17

Take him out. What used to get

42:20

up late anyway? Two o'clock in the afternoon

42:22

and and I'm. Leave the papers time

42:24

for him to reach used to like, keep it up

42:26

to date information and will continue stories. By

42:29

side dishes on like a Tuesday or something. I

42:32

counted everyday the way that Saturday night.

42:35

We. Went for dinner Muhammad or

42:37

five thousand upset and. We.

42:40

Sat by the fire Michael com a

42:42

sea lice Sydney the Fire Sonics, Tomatoes,

42:44

newspapers that A so I said I

42:46

said my cooler your and repeated men

42:48

in Black suits your your pet Public

42:51

property pitches F u two men are

42:53

back to Rip Will Smith guess yeah

42:55

I like see stuff about myself My

42:57

A Whisper de Maya is a map

42:59

when I get newspaper. I. Never

43:02

don't jump from pages nine. To.

43:04

Twelve are like to read my own stories that

43:06

I plan. Not. Allow you

43:08

behind door number. So. You it

43:10

behind it generate so he knew what was

43:12

going on. It's own is the man who

43:14

is manipulated he hated once I became out

43:17

the the early days or is very. My.

43:19

Ex wife was terrible faces there is no

43:22

Shalom. Stops there and I became

43:24

our the hotel room you know just how

43:26

to the just at the nursing yeah even

43:28

for the. A. Knows that was

43:30

a lot wiser to a knows that with

43:32

somebody pointing their was he thinking. What?

43:36

He. Was bullied or by. People.

43:39

Around him for a young kid and he was

43:41

say is that to and I was sorry that

43:43

would. Get. to him as

43:45

he did break his nose and he took his opportunity

43:47

to improve it a little see a lot to resolve

43:49

the carried on i'd every spoke to of i says

43:52

he does because he maya right there was no says

43:54

we the only thing they are you know it's all

43:56

i know you could talk about botox i think but

43:58

then you could even yeah Talk about

44:00

it. He came out of his room one day and he had

44:02

all this sticky tape on his freaking nose I was

44:05

like, ah, so we're going to see

44:07

Kofi Annam United Nations to

44:09

talk about some project to heal the world and

44:13

It's embarrassing. Come on. My Michael was my mate, you know, I

44:15

was an employee of it is nothing I'll

44:17

staring at his nose like you serious and

44:19

he's consciously it's a map. Don't worry

44:22

This is just allergy tape and

44:25

it will guarantee me billions of dollars of publicity of the

44:27

next few days It was satisfied. The

44:29

puzzle does a waiting for me out there. I'm

44:32

okay. My nose is not falling off It's just

44:34

makeup and allergy tape Okay,

44:36

you clever dude went out there

44:38

and then next few days front pages everywhere Michael

44:40

Jackson's nose falling off It was just allergy tape.

44:43

How mad is it you being like mates with

44:45

the biggest name on the planet? It was about

44:47

then it was quite normal. But

44:50

now I look back again. Yeah Well,

44:52

I was part of this with so much Michael was

44:55

you call it mastermind nowadays. He called it network

44:58

but the network I was around sitting dinner tables

45:00

with dara hannah and David

45:02

Blaine, you know and Michael Jackson

45:05

and Britney Spears and that was

45:07

my that was my weekends The

45:09

phone calls used to come in to me with basketball. I

45:11

used to walk around on my

45:13

hands free walking around test goes with this

45:15

superstars on the phone and This

45:19

is a normal is it so what years we

45:21

talking here we talking late 90 still? Yeah, 98 to

45:23

2009 Okay,

45:26

crazy stuff. Okay, and at that time

45:28

was there a lot of allegations? Yeah,

45:30

was Michael Jackson a kiddie fiddler? Okay,

45:32

so back in 1993 also at school

45:35

though There

45:37

is a big famous allegation from

45:39

a guy called Jordan Chandler Yeah, the

45:41

young boy and the parents

45:43

filed it they didn't file the

45:45

criminal case They filed a civil case, which

45:48

is interesting if you think about it, you got

45:50

kids dodge. Yes. Yeah, I've got six kids, right?

45:52

So about you Oh, so and filling my kids.

45:54

I want them or back hung back. Yeah, of

45:56

course. Yeah killed I would not want them. I

45:59

would not so money. So Michael

46:01

was in the middle of a

46:04

tour called Dangerous, halfway through the

46:06

tour. Billions

46:09

of pounds of investors, lots of

46:11

staff on there,

46:13

two jumbo jets of equipment going around

46:15

them. And he was

46:17

struggling to cope with his allegations. So

46:20

it was took out

46:22

of his hands. Michael wanted to fight

46:25

the allegation, but there was

46:27

a problem. The boy would not file

46:29

a criminal case. The parents would not file

46:31

a criminal. All they wanted was money. So

46:33

first of all, the Chandler's approached, that's the

46:36

surname, Jordy Chandler,

46:38

Evan Chandler, the

46:40

dad approached Michael, wanted him to fund

46:43

a movie. And Michael didn't want

46:45

to do it. He said, no, I don't want to

46:47

fund movies and stuff. And then there's a recording somewhere

46:49

out there saying, if I go through with this, I'm

46:51

going to get Michael Jackson big time. It's so strange.

46:54

I'm glad I've got platforms like this where it don't

46:56

get edited. I'll say this on TV. The final version

46:58

doesn't ever get used. But it's actually

47:00

recording there saying, I'm going to blackmail this guy. I'm

47:02

going to get him. And if I go through this,

47:04

I've got Michael Jackson big time. And he went through

47:06

it. Now, the truth is Michael Jackson did not pay

47:09

this lad 20 million, whatever his

47:11

insurance company gave him no damn choice. He

47:14

signed all kinds of paperwork and contracts while he's

47:16

on tour. And today,

47:18

I've got this billion dollar

47:21

tour or setup. They need him back

47:23

on the road again. A lot of

47:25

paying them. And you've got this 20 million issue

47:27

here, which he's insured against trials

47:30

get settled all the time. So

47:32

court cases get sold all the

47:35

time. 90% of them don't go to

47:37

trial. Most of them settle on the

47:39

eve of the trial. Michael was persistent in saying, nah,

47:41

nah, nah, nah, forget the

47:43

tour. I want time to file a criminal case.

47:45

I want to go to court. But

47:48

there's no way I'm making this this family to

47:50

the criminal case. So the insurance company says, sorry,

47:52

Mr. Jackson, we're going to sort this

47:54

out and you'll get back on the road. Right. That's the

47:56

truth to it. Okay. Now that opened up a can of

47:58

works because then everyone thought, on a minute. This

48:01

is an easy target. That

48:04

lad's got 20 million. So in 2005 the

48:07

trial happened then. I knew this

48:09

time. So from 1993 this went on. 93. And

48:11

then you're going to 2005. Nothing happens

48:14

since then. So there's nothing in between. Nothing. And

48:16

Bear in mind over 10,000 children get

48:19

put into Neverland because he built Neverland for

48:21

Make a Wish Foundation. So just for the

48:24

listeners and viewers out there,

48:26

explain what Neverland, have you been to Neverland?

48:28

Many times. Yeah. Explain what Neverland is like.

48:31

It's like a recreation of Disney World and

48:33

then you have his home which is adjacent to it.

48:36

So it's not connected to it. You can't just pout

48:38

yourself. You've got a train station there, you've

48:40

got a zoo there, museum, your

48:42

own theater and so forth.

48:44

But yeah, it was pretty

48:47

damn awesome. It's his own world. You

48:49

guys can do nothing. He's

48:51

doing it. Even when he was there, Dodge, right? Actually,

48:54

sorry for Mike because when

48:56

he used to go and walk outside, I

48:58

realized that we had security following

49:01

us. And I said to Michael,

49:03

I said, Michael, what are you just tell those guys to leave you

49:05

alone? You're at home. So he said, trouble

49:07

is about this ranch is like thousands of acres and

49:09

people parachute in and

49:12

they say they've done it by accident, but they're trying to meet

49:14

me. One of them could have a gun or a knife or

49:16

something. I said, okay, he didn't even have

49:18

privacy in his own home. And they

49:20

go on about this sex abuse room.

49:22

What a joke. So Michael Jackson's

49:24

bedroom is like a mansion. It's

49:27

the only place that guy's

49:29

got any peace and quiet to himself. If

49:31

someone breaks the boundaries of Neverland, the

49:34

head of security at Neverland, I would hit a button and

49:37

Michael would have to run like hell, wherever he is

49:39

on the ranch, into the panic room.

49:42

I've got a lot of, I won't name him to

49:44

be fair, but I've got a lot of celebrity friends,

49:46

A-list friends, billionaire friends, they've all got panic rooms. And

49:49

it's set up so that it's hidden away and

49:51

you're in there and you've got enough there to

49:53

survive for a couple of days or so, until

49:56

the whole ranch or premises can be searched

49:59

and you can let the or personnel,

50:01

who you're protecting. So

50:03

many times people would parachute or break the

50:05

bandages into Neverland. The fans would do anything

50:07

to get to him. And he

50:09

would have to spend hours in this panic room, which is just

50:11

off his bedroom. That was built before

50:13

he bought Neverland. It was called Sycamore Valley

50:16

back then. He filmed a music video with

50:18

Paul McCartney called Say, Say, Say. And

50:20

he liked it, the peace and quiet, it was up

50:22

in the mountains, miles from anywhere. It's like a three

50:24

hour drive to Los Angeles. So

50:26

he kicked that out with all the stuff

50:28

that he would like, games and stuff, because

50:31

he knew he'd have to spend some time in there. It was inevitable,

50:33

someone was going to breach the boundaries. So

50:35

when you hear all these stories where people say, oh,

50:37

kids have stepped in his bed, or they've

50:40

been in his bedroom, give me a break, man.

50:42

I mean, it was just young boys and loads

50:45

of complete monsters. Michael Jackson did have

50:47

a problem with young boys.

50:50

He had a problem with women. The guy

50:52

loved women. My biggest problem, me

50:54

and Mark Lester and everyone around him was trying

50:56

to sneak women in and out, not breaking his

50:58

image. He loved women, women

51:00

from South Island. Tito Jackson, he said it

51:03

publicly now too, with

51:05

Nigel Farage, he said, you want

51:07

to test if my brother is gay or if

51:09

my brother likes little boys. You

51:11

go and send your wife or girlfriend to

51:13

Neverland with my brother Michael for a day.

51:15

See what happens. You won't come back. You'll

51:18

charm them. That guy, he just had to

51:20

live and breathe being Michael Jackson. And

51:22

now it's backfired in a social media age. So

51:25

was he taking young boys to his bedroom?

51:27

No. So when you were at Neverland, you

51:30

never saw him take boys to his bedroom?

51:32

No. So when you're at Neverland, you

51:34

have, the first one is

51:37

putting the context, you've got 150 security staff,

51:39

okay? Cameras everywhere watching, I think you go.

51:42

And Michael's bedroom is

51:45

on two floors, two

51:47

bathrooms, jacuzzi, arcade games.

51:50

It's kitted out. Like I said, it's the only

51:52

place he doesn't need security. That's

51:54

there. When you walk up, the people that can

51:56

make a big deal out of this, but I could name him but I

51:58

won't. I haven't got it to my mind. but there's not

52:00

a big superstar. There's a long corridor

52:02

to get to his bedroom,

52:05

quarters, and you

52:07

walk over like a security map, and

52:09

it triggers a lob. So Michael and I, someone's approaching just

52:11

to be on guard and be careful just in case he

52:14

needs to go to that panic room. Now,

52:16

he has, there's a lot of Jacksons, and

52:19

male and female, and they gravitate towards Michael.

52:21

So when people go on about young boys,

52:24

I've got over 100 hours of footage, Dodge. In fact,

52:27

I'll give you some for this episode so

52:29

you can get out there. I've got over 100 hours of

52:31

footage where young girls are sat on his lap. People

52:34

gravitate to him. He's the biggest star in the

52:36

world. His nieces, his

52:38

nephews always gravitate towards him. He felt

52:40

like he could trust kids because kids

52:43

weren't asking questions like, when's your

52:45

next album coming up? Fruit is good. Can you teach me

52:47

this? Can you teach me that? They didn't want money. Kids

52:50

and animals he could trust. And it

52:52

wasn't just kids in the bedroom. It would be his

52:54

older nephews and so on and people. It'd

52:57

be friends of mine who'd been there with him.

53:01

My children have spent time with him. It's

53:03

complete nonsense. So when we talk about, he talks

53:05

about in his bedroom, a lot of his

53:07

stems from the Martin Bashir Stitch-Up program. Where-

53:11

That was 2002? 2002, he filmed it. 2003

53:14

is when it came out. And he

53:16

said, Martin Bashir interviewed him and asked him

53:18

if he's had kids in the bedroom. Yeah,

53:20

I know. Martin Bashir did more than that.

53:23

Let me just take that back a bit. Michael

53:26

wanted to finally get out the truth

53:28

about his private life. He understood finally

53:30

that there's this big miscommunication

53:32

between his reality and world and

53:35

what people thought of him. People had

53:37

drummed it into his head. He realized that he

53:40

needed to get, especially a message

53:42

out there. Show, stop all the hiding

53:45

the image. Who

53:47

is the real Michael? Behind doors, wait, just put

53:49

some jeans on, a T-shirt on, drinks some whiskey

53:51

and dances around. That's Michael he knew. He

53:54

knew he had to get out. So he was

53:56

looking for documentary makers. Now

53:58

the most famous go-to person. Michael Jackson at

54:00

the time was Yuri Geller. His

54:02

best mate Michael Jackson was best man at Yuri's

54:05

wedding. I was there I was responsible

54:07

for getting him there and looking after him on the day. So

54:10

Yuri put the word out we

54:12

had three people who really wanted this

54:14

documentary we had Louis Faroo from

54:16

the BBC who was desperate for it he

54:19

actually went on to make one and try and find Michael but could it

54:21

in the end. We had Sir David

54:23

Frost now Michael Jackson met Sir David took for

54:25

Frost a couple of times. One

54:27

time at Yuri Geller's wedding in Reading and

54:30

we had this guy called Martin Bashir. We

54:33

didn't think much of it we thought Sir

54:35

David Frost would be the man to go

54:37

with very trustworthy man lovely bloke did a

54:40

good job you know never been a

54:42

controversial very good friends of Yuri.

54:45

So we had these three

54:47

people so Yuri said to Michael got

54:49

Sir David Frost got Louis Faroo and

54:52

we've got Martin Bashir. He said he goes Martin Bashir

54:54

so you know the guy who did Princess Diana said

54:56

I want to see him and

54:58

that was the downfall. So Yuri

55:01

said I recommend you see Sir

55:03

David Frost too because okay maybe after Martin Bashir

55:05

he's Sir David Frost. Louis Faroo did bless him

55:07

he didn't even get a look in he's actually

55:09

pushing little notes of smiley faces underneath saying please

55:11

Michael have an interview he tried everything to convince

55:14

my brother-in-law to get access to him he

55:16

did it without Michael in the end. So

55:18

anyway we go to it's a Wednesday afternoon

55:21

at the Renaissance Hotel Hire-Houlburn and

55:23

this guy turns up in the lobby Martin Bashir. I'll

55:25

go down and meet him. Yuri

55:27

was there too. We were introduced

55:29

into Michael upstairs in the hotel suite we sit

55:31

down. Michael wanted me to sit down and get

55:34

my opinion on it as his mate and there's

55:36

two others in the room with him. Bashir,

55:38

pitch Michael on I Am gonna do the

55:40

most incredible documentary about your life talking about

55:42

the music about your dance how you make

55:45

records your concert tours we're going to clear

55:47

up all these rumors about your relationship your

55:49

girlfriends you're going to interview your girlfriends they've

55:51

actually gone and published books from these girlfriends

55:54

and here's music to his ears but he was

55:56

still a bit suspicious he's very paranoid with Michael's

55:58

Dan might and Bashir and I've been

56:01

telling this story for so many years now with

56:03

facts and it's out there it's great he gets

56:05

out this crumpled letter from Princess Diana and

56:07

it's handwritten it said hi

56:09

Martin thank you for changing my

56:12

image you've turned it around I trusted

56:14

you and look what's happening the public adore

56:17

me thank you so much I love you

56:19

Diana Michael read that he was sold because

56:21

he was best friends with Princess Diana that

56:23

was it that was the end of it so

56:26

at that point he said okay

56:28

deal done shook his hand and

56:30

Yuri was like they want to meet anyone

56:32

else no I want to go with Princess

56:35

Diana guy me and Yuri Geller left the

56:37

room thinking that Michael Jackson being the big

56:39

corporation he is with high Bashir up into

56:41

all these legal documents documents and

56:44

they won't be an issue but that's not how the

56:46

Michael Jackson camp worked back then so

56:48

we left him to it next thing we know he's

56:51

filming and he's doing crazy stuff

56:53

like dangling babies over balconies and Bashir

56:56

is filming it and stuff and there's doctors around

56:58

everywhere it's all out of control and wonder

57:01

what on earth's going on but yeah

57:03

long story short Bashir and I

57:05

know this because I've got friends who are there at the time

57:08

so going back to that documentary the hip piece Bashir

57:12

would say why don't you sit next

57:14

to that boy Michael get yourself a

57:16

little closer you've got nothing to hide why

57:18

don't you hold his hand that's good let's

57:21

talk about the sleeping you sleep in his bed don't you then

57:23

the boy was said no he doesn't sleep

57:25

in the bed he sleeps on the floor then he edit that

57:27

bit out and a micro doesn't say no I sleep on the

57:29

floor not on the bed and everything

57:31

was manipulated around around

57:33

it and like the bird in scene

57:35

with with the baby dangling the sipping box I

57:38

gave him something but I was there I was

57:40

in the living room with my left at the

57:42

time the box I gave him something it was

57:44

hyper he was completely off his head he

57:47

just like so he would have to

57:49

normally go and dance with I believe it was called effadrin

57:52

he gave him some kind of drug he was not

57:54

himself at all and he's showing prints up to the

57:56

fans he's showing Paris and he's showing

57:58

blanket to the fans came back,

58:00

shot the doors and

58:03

then before we knew it, America was

58:05

ringing and they're saying you need to up your game now

58:07

because the world media is saying they put

58:09

its baby at risk and no

58:11

one wants to tell Michael the truth and the crowds

58:13

are just growing outside. The media satellite dishes with helicopters

58:15

are going around and funny enough the

58:17

German media at the time was saying Michael Jackson

58:20

shows you new baby. It shows you the different

58:22

cultures of media. New baby to the world but

58:24

the UK in America or you

58:26

know getting child welfare to turn up at the

58:29

hotel. He wasn't just showing into the world, he's

58:31

dangling the baby over the balcony right? Yeah.

58:35

That's not right. It's not right. I don't

58:37

justify that. I'm 5 or 6 kids and

58:40

I'm not going

58:42

to justify it in any way but what I will

58:44

say is the picture that's used, if you

58:46

go and visit that hotel, the

58:48

picture that's used where he looks like he's completing

58:50

that case, this hotel's got a

58:53

balcony, he's got maybe like a megastar hotel and

58:55

it's got a ledge so there's

58:57

no way that baby could have fallen onto the

58:59

floor and I think but I still justify it.

59:01

I'm a dad, I certainly wouldn't put my kid

59:03

anywhere near a damn balcony but this was not

59:05

Michael Jackson, this was Michael Jackson who was high

59:08

as a kite on drugs. Medication has been given

59:10

him to a dot by a dot sir. Five

59:12

minutes before because Martin Bashir wants

59:15

some good footage. Have

59:17

you seen Martin Bashir since? I would love to see

59:19

Martin Bashir. What would you

59:21

say to Martin Bashir? I'll bump him in the face.

59:24

I'll do a few nights in the cell, absolutely, from

59:26

what he put my friend. He killed my friend, he

59:29

lied to us, he was supposed to deliver

59:31

a VHS tape to Michael to

59:33

approve in Miami and

59:35

he did a sign off. As a sign off, yeah.

59:37

Michael was going to get to watch it. There's no

59:40

contracts in place or nothing but that was

59:42

a deal. He followed him for seven months, always

59:45

in contact and then

59:47

on the last day of filming he sat Michael down

59:50

in Miami and he went for him.

59:53

What about your nose? Why are you white? What

59:55

about the 93 case? He was like, whoa,

59:57

why are you doing this, Martin? This is

59:59

not your... And he's ring

1:00:01

and us up Science, racial, my Bashir, today's

1:00:03

and a movies asking me crazy questions that

1:00:05

we didn't We didn't think for one minute

1:00:07

might be she was gonna stitch him up

1:00:09

because we believed in the Princess Diana thing.

1:00:12

Now we got ours a stitch up so

1:00:14

have you know not would never with of

1:00:16

Michael you not to do it is Mike

1:00:18

was our requests you get a guess a

1:00:20

Blameless Ivory to do some my budget Michael

1:00:22

wanted to go to share your he wanted

1:00:24

to David Frost the yeah I saw a

1:00:26

cold Mike we want me Juri watched it

1:00:28

together. Nice. House and Sutherland's

1:00:30

amps. first half an hour was okay

1:00:32

that a stock and worse and worse

1:00:34

a Michael it was a be broadcast

1:00:36

the market a week later Michael was

1:00:38

waiting for storing him is that miami

1:00:40

a sob gets the and we think

1:00:42

while what was in. A

1:00:45

coma call myself a crime. you already got wind

1:00:47

that was part of a so I can't believe

1:00:49

is Matt betrayed me. Or that

1:00:52

he. Gave. A few hours, the quarterback

1:00:54

is of rights. you and Yuri as someone

1:00:56

else who's in the room at a time.

1:00:58

You witness that initial. Meeting. Because

1:01:00

you don't need a contract the former contract to

1:01:02

be verbally you heard what he pitched May what

1:01:05

you said to me wasn't going to fill my

1:01:07

kids he felt on my kids and and the

1:01:09

ways edited it as well. I'm are sort of

1:01:11

Illinois name she called Michelle Boots and London or

1:01:14

want you to go to my attorney lawyer in

1:01:16

London and will you give a statement of May

1:01:18

So myself and Uri Geller added someone else or

1:01:20

when I suppose we should. We gave a witness

1:01:23

statements about what happened, not meet and have a

1:01:25

nice also. Time was up today and we try

1:01:27

to get the program stop to be showed anywhere

1:01:29

in. The world it turned out I

1:01:31

can't remember exactly, but. My

1:01:34

Bishop Neverland put something in front of Michael.

1:01:36

Michael so used to sign in things he

1:01:38

just signed a bear might even thought of

1:01:40

around for several months he didn't think of

1:01:42

any got editors are think is a waiver

1:01:44

to rights. So. There was nothing

1:01:46

we can do. Michael Jackson's Lot Legal Team

1:01:49

Michelle Boots is Loy! Try to stop. That.

1:01:52

Going out on the basis of our witness

1:01:54

statements, we were very concerned about the final

1:01:56

moments or the injunction was was allowed. At.

1:01:58

A went out. And. Joy to. Actually,

1:02:01

Destroyed and now the i think there is no

1:02:03

else is out there for you to baby debate.

1:02:05

big news pauses, stuff does it now sort of

1:02:08

a passionate about as big momma he dies and

1:02:10

I and I heard a noise Me he did

1:02:12

a documentary the was real is really happy cause

1:02:14

he realized oh hang on a better the whole

1:02:16

time on the share. With. Film it.

1:02:18

He had his own cameras rolling. Sir.

1:02:21

Michael How this all comers. Film.

1:02:23

And everything for whole seven months. So

1:02:25

when you hear my insane the so

1:02:27

Good with kids makes me cry When

1:02:29

you're at Neverland will you do forty

1:02:31

six kids sick kids to Devon and

1:02:33

as a crazy the credible such an

1:02:35

amazing that you go that on got

1:02:37

the first is so they did. I

1:02:39

am. A program

1:02:42

called Michael Jackson the Thirty Two never

1:02:44

meant to say and they released or

1:02:46

the footage from the cameramen and a

1:02:48

contradicted every my bisher. Sad to say.

1:02:51

You. Think that's right my code and as such

1:02:53

as I resigned Are you so amazing and goes

1:02:55

for a bit of resigning? A lie? Five really

1:02:57

views whereas. Why? Is on

1:02:59

a small Roka understand he. The.

1:03:02

Biggest face in the world or the time.

1:03:05

You're. Is made. His golf team around him

1:03:07

is worth billions to deter why was no

1:03:09

one there for him at that time to

1:03:11

lend to name's. Michael. The she

1:03:13

get away with all this yeah I do.

1:03:15

I thought the bob bar my not or

1:03:17

so I feel some get on a boss

1:03:19

in my early twenties I said look I'm

1:03:21

Mike was old on forty four now for

1:03:23

you would have been like when he did

1:03:26

a documentary before Israel modi be today. Sixty.

1:03:28

Five Citizens projects matter? Yeah,

1:03:31

Two. Cents or to those I've we I would

1:03:33

be so I didn't feel like always in

1:03:35

a position to be able to say i

1:03:37

Well when I did say something called gets

1:03:39

shut down pretty quick and. The.

1:03:42

My the shit that you are right there were

1:03:44

some people are rounds. he could have stepped in

1:03:46

as had whoa. Was. Going on here

1:03:48

yet, I why you ask in a

1:03:50

mess for, and he had to do

1:03:52

it himself bucks by that's Hi Martin

1:03:54

already gained his trust. I.

1:03:56

Am a bot. Michael went for about ten managers and

1:03:58

a time I knew him. Okay, like one per year

1:04:00

and ones he really trusted they would people just get in

1:04:02

his ear and say oh you can't trust that guy no

1:04:05

more and he'd be like really and that'd be it come

1:04:07

out of his life that's how

1:04:09

this allegation came about 2005 this boy

1:04:11

this boy and his family isn't there

1:04:13

isn't there been five allegations of young boys

1:04:15

come forwards and they've they've been at Mark

1:04:18

always played with them no is there

1:04:20

not five separate occasions Jordy is it this this

1:04:22

far you got wade and wade and james yes

1:04:24

you want to go in that rabbit hole yeah

1:04:26

i want to find out what's going on there

1:04:28

because listen i understand you're

1:04:30

his tight mate and understand your passion yeah

1:04:33

yeah yeah if there's five people coming forward

1:04:35

and these allegations coming out there must be

1:04:37

something there so the first one

1:04:39

Jordy turned and we cleared up what happened there and

1:04:42

that's on tape we're going to get this

1:04:44

guy because he he turned down the movie deal so

1:04:46

that first just hold on for the first one that first

1:04:48

lad there what was he saying happened to him because

1:04:50

isn't it something like Michael Jackson slept in

1:04:52

his bed at his mum's house for 30

1:04:55

days and molested him yeah i

1:04:57

don't know the details of it but you do know jordan chandler's

1:04:59

come out since and said it's not true and

1:05:02

his dad shot himself on the back of it

1:05:04

his old man committed suicide yeah yeah but it

1:05:06

made this much press i'm

1:05:09

sorry honestly if you google it you'll see jordan chandler

1:05:11

has come out and said my

1:05:13

parents after michael died my

1:05:15

parents told me to say that to

1:05:18

get money and i feel ashamed of

1:05:20

myself and it made that much press his

1:05:22

dad was so worried killed himself jordan

1:05:25

chandler never had a relationship with his parents ever

1:05:27

since he was the payoff right he

1:05:29

he divorced his parents how old

1:05:31

legally how'd you do that you can do

1:05:33

it in america you can do anything in moo

1:05:35

yeah of vaguer's anything we saw jordan chandler divorced

1:05:38

his parents his dad was so

1:05:40

worried that people were going to come

1:05:42

after him or michael's people were going to come after him

1:05:44

after michael died he killed himself what

1:05:46

was why would why would as a parent you

1:05:49

allow michael jackson to sleep in the same bed

1:05:51

as your kid in your house yeah look that's

1:05:53

that's that's weird one it's weird for michael jackson

1:05:55

your mate going to do that sleep with a

1:05:57

kid in his bed yeah number two as a

1:05:59

dad It doesn't even cross

1:06:01

your mind. It doesn't matter who you are. Yeah. What's

1:06:04

going on there? Why? How? When? I never witnessed any

1:06:06

of that because I was in my era. I was

1:06:08

still at school myself. I certainly didn't

1:06:10

see him sleeping in bed with any children,

1:06:12

not even his own children. Did you see kids at

1:06:14

Neverland when you were there? Did you still keep at

1:06:17

Neverland? I take it. Yeah, yeah. Did

1:06:20

you ever see kids stay over the night there?

1:06:23

No. Only in the guesthouse.

1:06:27

And then what they would try and do, they would say to their

1:06:29

mommy, Daddy, oh, we want to stay with

1:06:31

Michael. It's hard to explain,

1:06:33

Dodge. If you go, we used to

1:06:36

go out, went to Universal Studios, and

1:06:40

Michael, we lost

1:06:42

Prince, his son, just by chance.

1:06:44

The fans got all a bit excited, people recognizing

1:06:46

him, only for a few seconds.

1:06:49

And then someone in the crew had found

1:06:51

Prince and brought him up to us, and

1:06:53

Michael wanted to thank the parent personally. He's a

1:06:55

nice guy. He said, come here, and he did

1:06:57

a picture of them, he said, thank you so much for finding my son,

1:07:00

and so on. You're pushed

1:07:02

back by the fans. Now, that lady said, do you mind

1:07:04

meeting my children? She said, of course you can, bring them

1:07:06

over. When it came to the

1:07:08

point of us having to break that away, like

1:07:11

three hours later, she turned on us. I

1:07:13

just found Michael Jackson's kid, who would say,

1:07:15

I deserve to go to Neverland. I mean,

1:07:18

it's hard to explain. They were like glued

1:07:20

to him. Lisa Marie

1:07:22

Prezner used to say, when people were

1:07:24

around the house, even she was out of the bed, she couldn't

1:07:26

get her to look in. People just want to be with Michael,

1:07:28

you know, it was the thing. I

1:07:30

understand that, because I've seen that. Mark's

1:07:33

got like four kids, and one

1:07:35

of them are boy. But at least

1:07:37

Neverland was built for

1:07:40

Make a Wish Foundation. He wanted to give

1:07:42

back. So over 10,000 children

1:07:44

were busting every year to play

1:07:46

on amusement parks, get access. If

1:07:49

he was around, he would come and say hi. But

1:07:51

that would be as much as it would go. That would be it.

1:07:54

But looking in, not knowing him, if he was that kind,

1:07:56

and he's that minted, and he's still got a kid to

1:07:58

play, he's still got a kid to play. mentality because the

1:08:00

way he grew up with the pressures of you will be

1:08:03

doing that, you will be singing, you will be doing this

1:08:05

to the Czechs. That just seems like

1:08:07

a hot bed, the perfect scenario for a kiddie fiddler to

1:08:09

put a fun

1:08:11

fair and animals and all that and in

1:08:13

the house they've got games and a massive

1:08:16

bed in a room and all the kids are there

1:08:19

sleeping over. That's just like looking back. That's

1:08:21

like you think how did Jimmy Savile get

1:08:23

away with all that? Do you know what

1:08:25

I mean? Looking in. And I'm sure you

1:08:27

may know different and I don't know

1:08:29

much about Michael Jackson apart from him being a superstar singer but

1:08:32

when I look in I think that's

1:08:34

like he's teed up. Well

1:08:36

I always say someone moved next door to me and

1:08:39

they built an amusement park and

1:08:42

a guy who appeared to live on his own, remember he did live on

1:08:44

his own, he had a girlfriend or wife

1:08:47

who he wanted to keep secret, then I'll

1:08:49

be the first person to call the police and

1:08:51

say right, something's going on. But that's just not

1:08:53

Michael, you've got to understand Michael. His brothers used

1:08:56

to explain it really well to me because when

1:08:58

they grew up they were in a two bed

1:09:00

house in Gary, Indiana and

1:09:02

at night time the daughters, the sisters,

1:09:04

you just convert the bed

1:09:06

into a like a girls room in the living room

1:09:08

and then the boys had these like multi layers of

1:09:11

bunk beds where Jermaine would be in bed with Michael,

1:09:13

Amal and be in bed with Tito and Jack, he'd

1:09:15

be on top and that's just the

1:09:17

way he knew. That's family. I get

1:09:19

that, all your brothers, that's family but

1:09:21

there's a different twist. Most of the

1:09:23

time you're talking about when kids are

1:09:25

in his bedroom, his huge

1:09:28

size of a mansion bedroom, it's his

1:09:30

nieces and nephews and then

1:09:33

you're going to have families and stuff who'll

1:09:35

be in there and their mums and dads

1:09:37

will be there at time as well and

1:09:39

maids and stuff coming in and out, feeding

1:09:41

them, bringing their drinks. Michael Jackson's not making

1:09:43

them tea and coffee every night, getting food

1:09:45

for them. He slept with kids in his

1:09:47

bed, they slept overnight in his bed while

1:09:49

the parents might be staying in the outhouse

1:09:51

somewhere. Not in his bed, he was never

1:09:53

sleeping in the bed, he was asleep on

1:09:55

the floor. How'd you know? Because

1:09:58

I was there at the house. And he said this on

1:10:00

camera too many of the times. No, what I'm saying is it's easy

1:10:02

to say if you're in a room, oh, he slept on the floor,

1:10:04

the kids were on the bed, everything's fine, it's fine. Well, the kids

1:10:07

would say too, wouldn't they? Yeah. this

1:10:09

has been, since he's died, he's come out that

1:10:11

FBI studied him for 10 years at

1:10:14

the highest level, followed him, studied him, how people

1:10:16

would pretend to be people. And then

1:10:18

you had the trial in 2004, and

1:10:21

he was found not guilty in 14 class by

1:10:24

the toughest court in the land. And

1:10:26

the other thing dodged too, I don't know if you

1:10:28

realize this. So in the 93 case, the

1:10:31

same district attorney who wanted

1:10:33

to get Michael, Michael Jackson fought

1:10:35

because of racism. Now there is some truth to

1:10:37

that. So I've been with the Jacksons in Los

1:10:39

Angeles, and they do get sore out. They

1:10:42

do get sore, abusive, racist, and worse. It's quite

1:10:44

shocking to me, I couldn't believe it. So I

1:10:46

can imagine what Michael was experiencing. They didn't want

1:10:48

him living there at all.

1:10:50

So this district attorney is called Tom

1:10:53

Sneddon. Tom Sneddon failed to get

1:10:55

Michael Jackson 93. That would have been his trophy.

1:10:58

He had another chance, because in 2003, they

1:11:01

changed the law because of the Geordie Chandler

1:11:03

case. No longer did you just

1:11:06

file for money. You have to file

1:11:08

a criminal case force, then go for money. So

1:11:11

that created a bit of an issue. So the family,

1:11:14

this time, went to Tom Sneddon

1:11:16

and said, we think someone's been

1:11:18

going on with our son Gavin, who's

1:11:21

been staying over at Michael's house, and

1:11:23

he got all excited about it. I mean, if you watch

1:11:25

the press conference, who got all excited? Tom Sneddon, the district

1:11:27

attorney. If you watch the press

1:11:29

conference, it's not normal. Normally, they'll tell

1:11:32

you, he got up in front

1:11:34

of the meeting, he said, we got him, we finally got

1:11:36

him. That's what Tom Sneddon said. They

1:11:41

got the same legal team as 93, and

1:11:44

they got Tom Sneddon, the district attorney, to

1:11:47

bring this case against Michael. They

1:11:49

raided Neverland. I think it was 90 cars,

1:11:51

either the 90 cars. I remember seeing it

1:11:53

on Sky News. Yeah, to raid Neverland. Yeah,

1:11:58

it just all turned out to be complete and utter. nonsense

1:12:00

yet again and

1:12:03

finishing up on that subject too

1:12:05

up until it's called Gavin Avizo this

1:12:08

guy who so Michael

1:12:10

got found not guilty on 14 counts

1:12:12

and that was completely did he ever get

1:12:14

found guilty on anything nothing at all nothing

1:12:16

at all no just being an idiot with

1:12:18

naive with that all the non guilties did

1:12:21

he pay anyone off no

1:12:23

so there's no payment whatsoever so you

1:12:26

know what you can have no but

1:12:28

I'm saying there'll be ways

1:12:30

to pay people off did he pay any

1:12:32

of the families off to

1:12:34

not get to get a not guilty no

1:12:36

that was properly done for the criminal the hardest call

1:12:38

and with a district attorney who was just about to

1:12:40

retire wanted to make a name for some because he

1:12:42

looked like a fool in 93 because

1:12:44

of the the boy wouldn't bring a criminal case

1:12:47

they wanted to get Michael but he had nothing

1:12:49

on him when Gavin's mum was called Janet Jackson

1:12:51

for a star but Michael went

1:12:53

through far he bought the parents houses and cars like

1:12:55

this my point that there we go that so

1:12:58

he's buying the parents of these kids houses

1:13:00

and cars and slipping the money and dadada

1:13:04

is that like yeah but it's just what I find it

1:13:06

I find it odd looking in having this conversation about it

1:13:08

because story I'm thinking how old are these

1:13:10

kids 14 14 10 Gavin 12 13 yeah and the parents

1:13:16

go well give us free house every day and what

1:13:18

was Michael thinking why they're giving it why is Michael

1:13:20

giving the parents buying them a house why but

1:13:22

on the other side of that too I was seeing him

1:13:24

write checks for us to pay

1:13:26

for hundreds of funerals people that couldn't afford to

1:13:29

bury their loved one I'll get that and pay

1:13:31

for operations I get that and

1:13:33

so he did all that too yep I get that yeah

1:13:35

I get all that because you're looking after the people

1:13:37

but actually your kid can

1:13:39

stay with me 12 but there's a house so

1:13:41

there is a holiday the Avida family

1:13:43

were at war there's the vore thing going on yeah

1:13:46

they were out at home Gavin was

1:13:48

saying about the parents might go to local

1:13:50

for a tea home so Michael felt he

1:13:52

could solve that problem now what happened thought

1:13:54

is that the accountants at some

1:13:56

point said enough enough you know because

1:13:58

he is quite well published The with the right

1:14:01

well financially or he was at the toy

1:14:03

in ages the Embraced with album. What you're

1:14:05

talking here is as to whether Trouser got

1:14:07

two thousand souls or yeah I ever two

1:14:09

thousand so two thousand offers a cabin with

1:14:11

on about what am I might come back

1:14:14

for Neverland that he says that the that

1:14:16

our family they pull all that causes the

1:14:18

of these are family gotten something they write

1:14:20

the place or the go karts to bump

1:14:22

arise so that kid those one who's acute

1:14:24

yeah accounting article but muslim by the whole

1:14:26

family's in of an unpleasant he was doing.

1:14:29

A. Thing you saw the cancer Yes and

1:14:31

he he was in our hospital. And.

1:14:33

He wanted to meet famous people out there or

1:14:36

trying to get to Michael Jackson and had no

1:14:38

way of games. And the one day Chris Tucker

1:14:40

Chris Tucker Rush hour feel Chris Tucker you want

1:14:42

to be Chris Tucker Chris Because I know Michael

1:14:45

let me try and go on the fires Micro

1:14:47

any chance you can meet this kid is tight

1:14:49

angle on to live. And. A

1:14:51

range for him to meet him soon

1:14:53

as possible. Whatever a celebration of again

1:14:55

a micro push around that is Wiltshire

1:14:57

paper tough treatment. The feudal was organized

1:14:59

seventy for this can out expensive survive

1:15:01

but when when Michael call for this

1:15:03

is probably one of his faults his

1:15:05

party's found to be to change every

1:15:07

couple of weeks and. Where. Michael

1:15:09

costs on the chances for advice

1:15:11

to stop. Now Gavin with another

1:15:13

baby. Gavin would ring up. And

1:15:16

he was either Michael, stop Animal or messages

1:15:18

are being left with Acid is and it's

1:15:20

purpose is to say that the computer Michael

1:15:23

bought him for his homework isn't watch him.

1:15:25

So. I would say. To. Take it

1:15:27

to social get effects of Michael's it is

1:15:29

so out the bill. Now I want to

1:15:32

speak to my cohort of Peter Mackay he

1:15:34

got becoming a on the and I am

1:15:36

they never spoke ever again and after that

1:15:38

first started to come in for the found

1:15:40

were going to say this were gonna do

1:15:42

this and I'm yeah other before you know

1:15:44

bank decided okay so we weren't surprised the

1:15:47

governor visa other with com um but it's

1:15:49

the whole family's he made a mess Thousand

1:15:51

families.on a year. But we were

1:15:53

surprised because of the viper family. they were. We're.

1:15:56

Is what nonsense. We have

1:15:58

about make it tough decision about that because I was. at the

1:16:00

height of my career. I caught a million

1:16:03

children training me in the biggest kids

1:16:05

organization in the world, aligning myself to the

1:16:08

most famous man in the world, being a

1:16:10

huge childhood patient. But I knew damn well

1:16:12

it was going to be okay. Will

1:16:16

you know damn well in the

1:16:18

hope that you don't want to lose your mate or

1:16:20

actually knew damn well he's definitely not like that. I

1:16:23

knew my mate would never commit suicide on that thing.

1:16:25

But I knew he was definitely like that

1:16:27

because I remember my children were around him, I was around

1:16:29

him, I always know who's in his room at any given

1:16:31

time. Even when I

1:16:33

wasn't with him I knew where he was and how to reach

1:16:36

him. How did he react then when all this was going on?

1:16:39

How did he react? When

1:16:41

he hears the news coming out again, oh my god this

1:16:43

could ruin my career. Is he more worried about his career,

1:16:45

more about his personal profile? What was going on in his

1:16:47

head? He's more worried about his fans. He just

1:16:49

loved his fans, his children. He just fell to his knees.

1:16:53

He was in

1:16:55

Las Vegas making an amusement

1:16:57

video called One More Chance. We

1:17:01

got news out that Neverland got raided and

1:17:04

he just fell to his knees and started screaming oh no

1:17:06

not again, not again, please. And then

1:17:09

he heard it was Thomas Nedden, this was turning again. But

1:17:12

no he had to fight this time. This

1:17:14

time he had enough. Now I've got the chance.

1:17:16

Now they've changed the laws and to get

1:17:18

my money they're going to have to win

1:17:20

this case. I'm going to fight this one. And they

1:17:23

had nothing on him at all. Nothing.

1:17:26

Should never have gone to court in the first place. What

1:17:28

did they think they had

1:17:30

on him? Using alcohol to

1:17:33

get them drunk and abuse them. I'll

1:17:36

tell you there was literally nothing. I

1:17:38

mean it was just a laughing story. When they

1:17:40

put the mum on the stand, the

1:17:42

question being was you knew this was all going on but

1:17:44

you still let your child go and stay at Michael

1:17:47

Jackson's house. That's odd as

1:17:49

well, isn't it? Yeah. I think you're about the girlfriends

1:17:51

of the woman too. They did have a leg

1:17:53

to stand. I was just the jury that just threw

1:17:56

him out. I think it was a hundred percent of the jury agreed

1:17:58

with the verdict. Mike

1:18:00

completely ruined him completely

1:18:02

ruined him and then we had a we had

1:18:04

it again which we were we were not a

1:18:06

budget subject yeah documentary came out leave in Neverland

1:18:08

yeah in 2000 and I

1:18:11

believe is 18 yeah and

1:18:14

that came out of the blue now Wade is the

1:18:16

same age as me I've met Wade so

1:18:19

I know of him Michael made

1:18:21

his career literally and

1:18:24

James I don't know James but again he's similar age

1:18:26

to me James did

1:18:28

the Pepsi commercial advert and so forth

1:18:30

now Wade was the star witness along

1:18:32

with Macaulay Culkin in 2004 yeah so

1:18:34

when Tom Maserati the

1:18:37

barrister decided who to put first he put Wade

1:18:39

Robson on first because Wade has been known

1:18:41

since he was four years old and stayed

1:18:44

at Neverland multiple times and I had

1:18:46

his family give testimonies and

1:18:49

it was incredible I mean Wade has knocked it out the

1:18:51

park what if Wade so who

1:18:53

was Wade in this whole so wait

1:18:55

Wade the dancer choreographer when

1:18:57

Michael was on tour in Australia he

1:18:59

would get it would invite some of the the

1:19:02

adults and kids on to stage to

1:19:04

do the last number with him it's like a dream

1:19:06

come true and there was a competition

1:19:08

to meet Michael Jackson and Wade run it and

1:19:12

funny enough the second

1:19:14

person was my mate Peter Andre

1:19:16

was this by chance yeah honestly

1:19:19

yeah yeah yeah Peter Andre was

1:19:21

second runner-up he's off

1:19:23

from Australia so yeah Wade won it

1:19:26

and yeah he got on

1:19:28

stage and Michael Fattie's very talented

1:19:30

encourages Korea they were nagging

1:19:32

Michael all the time to come to Neverland and come

1:19:34

to America and he would make

1:19:36

it happen and he built himself a

1:19:38

very successful dancing career how old was

1:19:41

Wade at the time when Michael invited him to

1:19:43

Neverland? Oh six five

1:19:45

six yeah extremely

1:19:49

extremely and not just might not just Wade his

1:19:52

sisters and everyone else too yeah

1:19:54

his family mum yeah

1:19:56

all of them so the interesting thing here so he was

1:19:58

the star witness Macaulay Culkin obviously, same

1:20:01

age, some age to me as well. Right,

1:20:05

Macaulay Culkin, the Home Alone. Home

1:20:07

Alone, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1:20:10

And then Michael, let's

1:20:12

zoom forward a little bit. So

1:20:14

trials over, done with. Then

1:20:16

we get messages that Wade- Trial was

1:20:18

what? So Michael gets found not guilty

1:20:20

of trial by station. Of

1:20:23

Wade? No, no, no. There

1:20:25

was no, Wade was defending Michael. Defend, okay.

1:20:27

In 2018, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. Wade

1:20:30

and James were defending Michael's exit. Yeah.

1:20:34

And anyway, trials over, Michael goes to Bahrain,

1:20:36

found not guilty, get on with his life,

1:20:38

stopped rebuilding his career. And

1:20:41

we stay in contact, we went and visited him, me

1:20:43

and Martin, last room, Bahrain. I

1:20:45

hung out with him, he was doing great, ready to come back with

1:20:47

a vengeance for the O2 gigs. Then

1:20:49

we get a message, right? Which didn't mean

1:20:51

nothing about then. It was fine,

1:20:53

but now it just means a lot. Wade

1:20:56

wanted to ask permission. So

1:20:58

Michael, could he get married

1:21:00

at Neverland? Okay, now

1:21:02

this was 2007. Yeah,

1:21:04

Michael died in 2009, something like that.

1:21:06

2006, 2007. So we

1:21:08

asked Michael, Michael said, I've not been there

1:21:10

for a while. Not up to standards like

1:21:13

it should be. What's it

1:21:15

been up to standards? Because he's not been back there since the

1:21:17

raid took place. He felt it wasn't a home for him anymore, didn't

1:21:20

want to go back. So it

1:21:22

wouldn't look the part. So we just kindly

1:21:24

decline it for now. Wade was

1:21:26

pretty persistent that I want

1:21:28

to marry my fiancee at Neverland. Because for what it

1:21:30

all means to me. You think

1:21:32

about it, right, Dodge? In

1:21:34

2012, he came out with these allegations that he was abused

1:21:36

at Neverland. You know how I would want to get married

1:21:39

at a place you get sexually abused at? I

1:21:42

know what happened. It's all out there

1:21:44

in the mainstream media. So basically what you're saying is

1:21:46

you want to get married there, but after Michael died

1:21:48

in 2009, in 2012, you're saying he then made allegations

1:21:50

against Michael. Exactly,

1:21:52

him and James. Why? Well,

1:21:55

I asked the lawyers this. I said to him, how can

1:21:57

he go on oath And defend him? On.

1:22:00

A fourth encounter Gov is I'm James

1:22:02

Save shock yeah and now say I

1:22:04

was abused or whatever. Think I said

1:22:07

that there was a lie and apparently

1:22:09

Los Angeles' as like a seven year

1:22:11

statute of Limitations I was. You get

1:22:13

past that, they can't comment you. Yeah,

1:22:15

sorry, he has her white. He also

1:22:17

performs at a tribute returning Jackson. Two.

1:22:20

Weeks after my core stuff and he did a

1:22:22

big tribute in a. The. Books home

1:22:24

as well. Went to the funeral and

1:22:26

as so full retard started tribute to

1:22:28

him but then he tries for my

1:22:30

projects the state to get in the

1:22:32

Las Vegas show. To. Be

1:22:34

the the main cause of a similar could what we

1:22:36

to do this know what to do it by the

1:22:39

make Mccrystal militant dance moves and to the estate they

1:22:41

want they want to use and I just had some

1:22:43

an awesome night and he was angry about that because

1:22:45

about Michael. there was no money coming in and so

1:22:47

forth. So.

1:22:49

That least two thousand topic comes out

1:22:51

at them to the program comes out

1:22:53

flowers Long If it's like flowers you

1:22:55

to get convinced that Michael Jackson's joblessness

1:22:57

or a search. The Roman well they

1:23:00

fail to mention in that documentary is

1:23:02

both those guys and avid forties was

1:23:04

sir in the Michael Jackson the site

1:23:06

for hundreds of millions of dollars. That

1:23:08

was a mentioned this i had of immense yeah

1:23:10

I think people to flick the channel yeah lots

1:23:13

of that nonsense yeah well as a prevention they

1:23:15

would start with this isn't the case is back

1:23:17

in two thousand and five that would affect think

1:23:19

the towel over and on. Them

1:23:21

or turned out is the As are

1:23:23

amazing Michael's fans they go on it

1:23:26

and some private investigators call it to.

1:23:28

So James safe Chuck. Accuse.

1:23:30

Michael Jackson the of of sexually abuse

1:23:32

of them are the Neverland train station

1:23:34

is very specific specific about that inside

1:23:36

the know what I'm trying say and

1:23:38

how old would he have been then

1:23:40

what does I decided to play this

1:23:42

as he resign he was young boy's

1:23:44

twelve thirteen anyway. They. Dug out

1:23:47

the. There. Was something there

1:23:49

was an issue Lives retailer got married.

1:23:51

I never lancer one of many husbands coverage

1:23:54

on it was and as an aerial assault.

1:23:57

And A So Neverland and.

1:24:00

Though translation that I not gone investigative

1:24:02

journalists were suspicious and getting on a

1:24:04

second and he took out the planning

1:24:06

file. It turns out the train station

1:24:09

one have been built until James safe

1:24:11

shot was about twenty seven twenty eight.

1:24:14

So you can have been molested and replace.

1:24:16

It didn't exist, There was even I will

1:24:18

leave a full of the planning application wasn't

1:24:21

even in Elizabeth Taylor Shot shows you how

1:24:23

marriage is no argument peloton. There is no

1:24:25

train station and I apply but now is

1:24:27

down from four hours down next to nothing

1:24:30

and the zebra mussels made on that rip

1:24:32

in our part time lies and so forth

1:24:34

and they lost their appeal for just for

1:24:36

a while. I. Think

1:24:39

the try again know the both gonna. Go.

1:24:41

After them again blasted Michael Jackson's estate

1:24:43

even though isn't yet a sperm. Both.

1:24:46

Yeah you they went. They appealed the decision

1:24:48

to get that they lost their case and

1:24:50

now they that somehow change a lot things

1:24:52

that they can go again. Said. As

1:24:54

soon old companies around Michael Jackson's

1:24:56

estate is a multi billionaire yeah

1:24:58

he die Five hundred million in

1:25:00

that nice worth billions and death.

1:25:03

Yeah. So these what he thought it was

1:25:05

Five hundred million in debt? Yeah now is worth

1:25:07

billions. Eyes with billions. To

1:25:10

sources besides one point two billion dollars I

1:25:12

believe pronounced i'm what is that Money goes

1:25:15

who set with my eyes to shows of

1:25:17

the Prince pass from the beginning on whether

1:25:19

prince person biggest even they don't they have

1:25:21

heard harvest or a security detail and. By.

1:25:24

Two inches higher at level and Europe. Or

1:25:26

that America Rivera mistakes and state Zelda. But

1:25:29

there was. Some.

1:25:31

Awful died in two thousand and nine. So if

1:25:33

we go once all these court cases and child

1:25:35

molestation did it as if he must have been

1:25:37

and will pull place to just as well as

1:25:39

we saw him before To does not fully past.

1:25:42

He looks frail. He looks about six. Don't

1:25:44

lay out a little. it elves what pick?

1:25:46

What? Have you seen his decline since the

1:25:49

source? Two thousand and five up to two

1:25:51

thousand and nine years that might was never

1:25:53

the same. Our tire a guy what he

1:25:55

called made he said i'm gonna go back

1:25:57

on saw. I. Said.

1:26:00

Okay, the for this is Tom. I'm gonna

1:26:02

do it differently. I want to breed Princes

1:26:04

Records to Prince. Was resident at the outer

1:26:07

ring if a twenty one night on the

1:26:09

right and he got a Guinness Book book.

1:26:11

A Reckless Michael loves his get his Pickle

1:26:13

English Ice A Passionate A Nice The most

1:26:15

charities are operated at the Gizmo. I'm sorry

1:26:18

to all our be Prince. I. Wanna

1:26:20

see if I can do and I offered hemisphere

1:26:22

we could tell he needed the money he some

1:26:24

I chose of a young and are still alive

1:26:26

still to appreciate. Or. That that he

1:26:28

does not seen him perform of i'm sorry

1:26:31

told us he could videos or Rena. I

1:26:33

would my family move him with his family?

1:26:37

And. Would more or less his family just

1:26:39

molested or parcel mark scare them article parents

1:26:41

to my cause of might because also go

1:26:43

past of us is all a bit were

1:26:46

very interesting other that I get it yeah

1:26:48

so he he didn't want this time round

1:26:50

Michael did a what are the children stuck

1:26:52

in a Dorchester hotel the lines with hotel

1:26:54

suite not for like six or seven months

1:26:57

where they can't go out so we are

1:26:59

a house is putting always now just outside

1:27:01

of sorry he picked it we did it

1:27:03

by Skype. he furnish that how he wanted

1:27:05

it and we're going to. Get by the

1:27:08

river thames so we can avoid or pop razzi

1:27:10

and come in the back to the oh to

1:27:12

read each night. and the plan was to do

1:27:14

sponsor one night day off so the next. So.

1:27:18

Or plant calls me outside got the name

1:27:20

is called this is it So i i

1:27:22

called Uri Geller hundred number call him I

1:27:24

said i you're like was gonna be there

1:27:26

to it was show called this is at

1:27:28

risk his ear this will be as as

1:27:30

Norway's I do a residency just nothing ever

1:27:33

Zola we saw him on selling yeah when

1:27:35

up and stuff a lot is no way

1:27:37

in about an hour. Yeah. I

1:27:39

know up a dentist or he a march thousand and

1:27:42

nine. He came a state of the lanes brah. Mos

1:27:45

less the live with him. At

1:27:47

the time that are the hotel

1:27:49

automatic his daughter get multimillion Pappas

1:27:51

around the cabbies spotted point or

1:27:53

move from. Have. Left the bodyguard

1:27:55

ever in two thousand and four. Yes, he

1:27:57

has a nation of Islam Protective is why.

1:28:00

I used to advise from a distance, but I was his

1:28:02

mate on the phone if he needed me. I'll go and

1:28:04

see him when he was in town, wherever he'd be in

1:28:06

the world, and staying in phone contact

1:28:08

with him. I'll go and see him with Mark Lester.

1:28:11

So he was in London. I went

1:28:13

to see him initially, so I got a

1:28:15

phone call, I was in Barnstow saying, you need to come to

1:28:18

the Langsford now, something wrong with Michael. And

1:28:21

this was the day he was going to announce the O2 concerts, and

1:28:23

I get there. And I

1:28:25

got the lift and I get to his hotel

1:28:27

suite, and a representation

1:28:29

from the entertainment company,

1:28:32

they said, you need to go

1:28:34

and sort your effing famous friend

1:28:36

out. And I said, which one? Mark

1:28:39

Lester or Michael Jackson, they said they're the really

1:28:41

famous one. And I go in there, and Michael's

1:28:43

left on his bed like this, and he

1:28:46

had half a bottle of whiskey. And

1:28:48

Mark was there trying to sober him up with water,

1:28:50

and he was nervous, you know? And

1:28:52

it was due on the O2 arena, it was like two and

1:28:54

a half, three hours late already. So

1:28:56

we'd pour water down his neck, and he'd come

1:28:59

around, and he was so scared what the public

1:29:01

opinion was going to be about him. Was he

1:29:03

going to sell any tickets after that damn trial?

1:29:06

Or was he going to get shot, assassinated? So

1:29:08

we had to get him on his coach, we got him on the coach, we

1:29:11

get there, and he

1:29:13

gets on stage, I mean, he

1:29:15

was still a bit intoxicated, and

1:29:18

he saw the roar of the crowd, and he became

1:29:21

MJ again. You know, he came out, we get

1:29:23

back on a bus, he falls asleep, we get

1:29:25

to the hotel, he's nervous, I said, well, you're

1:29:27

okay. And he goes, yeah, how's it

1:29:29

going? Oh, Michael, they've all sold out. Gone.

1:29:33

On the way home, they've sold out two minutes, all ten shows have

1:29:35

sold out. AG wants to talk to you about

1:29:37

putting another 40 on. Tears are

1:29:39

rolling down his eyes, couldn't believe it. Wow,

1:29:41

they've really gone, Matt? Yeah, minutes.

1:29:44

Wow. And then the AG, they had a meeting with him, and he came

1:29:46

out, and he said, I'm going

1:29:48

to do 50 shows, I'm going to beat

1:29:51

Prince. And then they

1:29:53

put him on sale, a few minutes, all gone. AG

1:29:56

told me they could have sold 300 shows, that

1:29:58

the demand was unbelievable. crying

1:30:00

and sobbing he couldn't believe it. I

1:30:02

went home at that point and

1:30:04

I said to him you gotta put some weight on

1:30:07

man. How what size was he? How tall was he?

1:30:09

How frail was he when you what's up what was

1:30:11

he? He's taller than you think. I think he was

1:30:13

like 5'11 5'10 I remember. He used to

1:30:15

hunch over a lot. People always think he's a

1:30:17

little Mike because of Jackson 5 but he's actually

1:30:19

quite tall guy. Frail

1:30:21

at that time he was I was concerned about his

1:30:23

health. Yeah I gave him a hug before I went

1:30:25

home and he's like a bag of bones. So

1:30:28

I went back and then luckily

1:30:30

on the Thursday he was

1:30:33

due to fly out on the Friday morning. On

1:30:36

a Thursday Mark Lester calls me the Oliver Twist

1:30:38

guy's best mate. He says Matt we've got nothing

1:30:40

to do tonight. Me and

1:30:42

Michael are going to watch Oliver. He was actually on on

1:30:45

the West End at the time the play and because

1:30:48

he's there Oliver Twist it's a big deal you know.

1:30:50

So do you want to come to watch Oliver with

1:30:52

us and then come back have some food at the rest

1:30:54

of the hotel suite. From Barnstable

1:30:57

to London it's a couple hour train ride.

1:31:00

I said to him I'll skip Oliver Twist that's not

1:31:02

my thing. No disrespect Mark that's your thing and Michael

1:31:05

being mobbed you know. Let me

1:31:07

let me settle my kids down a bit spend some time with them. I've got

1:31:09

a few things to do with my business and I'll come up. I

1:31:12

go to Langsford I'm so glad I did and

1:31:14

I get there Michael's favorite meal

1:31:16

is fish and chips. That proper English style. Go

1:31:18

on Michael. Yeah so we get in the car

1:31:20

we go to a nice bridge we went to

1:31:22

to a fish and chip shop and he likes

1:31:24

to go in he likes to see the way

1:31:26

it's all wrapped and sometimes they're

1:31:28

recognizing with the sign in and

1:31:31

then we go back and we sit on the floor we start

1:31:33

on the floor at the Langsford Hotel. Me and Mark just

1:31:35

as they come back watching Oliver we have fish and

1:31:38

chips and it's quite freaky. It's one

1:31:40

of the last face-to-face conversations we had he said

1:31:42

he said Matt am I going to

1:31:44

be okay? I said you're going

1:31:46

to be fine so you need to put some weight on we're

1:31:48

going to do your diet and nutrition plan we're

1:31:50

going to get you weight training. We actually introduced

1:31:53

him to Louis Louis Faroo the trainer of Arnold to

1:31:55

try and put some muscles that didn't go very well.

1:31:57

Louis said it's like he wanted a friend to combine

1:31:59

in. to talk the whole time. But

1:32:02

you'll be okay. We're all going to move in with you Michael

1:32:04

to make sure you sleep, you eat and we'll look after, we

1:32:06

keep the media away, don't worry. I'm

1:32:09

worried I'm going to be killed by a shot. He

1:32:12

said he was paranoid that he was going to get shot. Yeah,

1:32:14

actively. Because then America's guns.

1:32:16

UK, the guns that took off you, we're

1:32:18

body guards about guns. It's very strange. In

1:32:20

the States they've got guns. Are you not

1:32:23

allowed to carry? No, you don't get left

1:32:25

at the airport. Only royalty. Yeah.

1:32:28

So yeah, when you're in trouble over in

1:32:31

London, you get two panda cars with two

1:32:33

cops thrown up, pushing everyone back. In the

1:32:35

States it's like arms turned like, get back.

1:32:37

We used to find that fascinating. Is that

1:32:39

all they sent me? These two little panda

1:32:41

cars and two overweight cops? So America is

1:32:43

very different. Yeah, so I'd be

1:32:45

chatting away and then he turned to Michael and he said,

1:32:48

you're my children's Godfather. I think it happens to me on

1:32:50

stage. He promised me to look after my kids and

1:32:52

he said, of course I will. And the ironic

1:32:54

thing, he was killed by a shot in the end, but it

1:32:56

was a shot of anesthetic,

1:32:58

wasn't it? Who killed Michael Jackson?

1:33:02

Well, there's a lot of debate about it, isn't there?

1:33:04

But the guy who got done for it is Dr.

1:33:06

Conrad Murray. He did two years

1:33:08

in jail for involuntary manslaughter. I

1:33:11

got messages from Dr. Murray when he come

1:33:13

out of jail. And...

1:33:16

Have you seen Dr. Murray? You've seen him face

1:33:18

to face? Not since, no. No, okay. I've

1:33:21

posted him on the phone. So

1:33:23

we have the same agent in

1:33:25

Australia. So I do my media work, he does

1:33:27

his stuff. So it's still to this day, he believes he's

1:33:29

done nothing wrong. So

1:33:31

Dr. Murray was just like the

1:33:34

kids that flew in Vegas. And one

1:33:37

of the other bodyguards, we can't just walk up

1:33:39

with Michael Jackson's children at surgery. Don't work, GP

1:33:41

surgery, don't work out that way. So

1:33:45

one of the other bodyguards, the

1:33:47

Americans knew of a doctor who we could trust.

1:33:49

Turned out to be Conrad Murray. And they became

1:33:51

friends over a couple of years. So

1:33:54

I knew of him, but

1:33:56

not to this extent. So

1:33:59

he reached out to me. He gave an interview to

1:34:01

the Sun newspaper and he said

1:34:03

in Michael's final days All

1:34:06

he was crying out for was Matt Fidesse and Mark

1:34:09

Lester to come and visit him because he was lonely

1:34:11

He had no one there his

1:34:13

family were cut off Numbers were changed

1:34:15

even though where he was staying or nothing the

1:34:18

whole promotion company was running his life It was very

1:34:20

hard to get to Michael and he

1:34:22

was on copious amounts of drugs as well. It turns out he

1:34:24

was yeah crazy amount

1:34:26

of drugs That was to

1:34:28

make him sleep. Yeah, and it's like if you

1:34:30

have an operation you'd knock you out of a

1:34:32

propofol and Yeah,

1:34:36

so we didn't think anything off

1:34:38

we didn't know we were getting messages from the stakes

1:34:40

all the time saying Michael's not Telling to rehearsals, but

1:34:42

that's just Mike. You know, he just used to say

1:34:44

I've been doing this in source five I don't need

1:34:47

to be moonwalking all the time and I

1:34:49

know my songs I wrote those songs and but they

1:34:51

were quite tough on him But on

1:34:53

a Tuesday night before he died he called

1:34:55

me and he was erratic like completely erratic

1:34:57

Just like he was in a hotel in Berlin

1:34:59

outside And I said to him

1:35:01

like have you taken something? So don't worry the doctor gave

1:35:03

me something they said they're gonna pull the show So

1:35:06

he's given me effigyron, which is what dancers

1:35:08

would take a lot bodybuilders take it like

1:35:11

a step up from caffeine. Yeah, and It

1:35:14

was the fact that he said a doctor gave it to him

1:35:17

and he was about to go on rehearse I

1:35:19

felt I was okay, but then he asked me do I

1:35:21

know where Joseph is? And that

1:35:24

was strange because it's very well known that him

1:35:26

and Joseph Jackson his father didn't have a very

1:35:28

close relationship So

1:35:30

I didn't know where he was. He's in Las Vegas. So

1:35:32

I gave Michael Joseph's his

1:35:35

father's used to call him Joseph

1:35:37

Joseph's number then he

1:35:39

wanted marks number he clearly didn't have much

1:35:41

numbers available to him and It

1:35:43

turned then he spoke to my daughter Madison for

1:35:45

a bit He tried

1:35:47

to speak to Lola, but she was very young She struggled

1:35:50

up and I said you're okay because

1:35:52

I need someone to come and sort this shit out Over

1:35:55

here. The only person who can sort

1:35:57

this out is Joseph. It's okay Mikey

1:35:59

and you promise you're going to be right because I'm

1:36:01

going to rehearsals, they're making me go, they say if I

1:36:03

don't perform well tonight they're going to pull the plug on

1:36:05

the whole thing and apparently that

1:36:07

night he did the performance of the Lifetime, unbelievable.

1:36:09

You could tell he was a guy if you

1:36:12

knew him with speech and slurping

1:36:14

and so on. Anyway he did

1:36:16

call Joseph up, unfortunately he got the answer from the message,

1:36:19

he did call Mark Lester, he had the same conversation

1:36:21

Mark he had with me, he said I couldn't leave

1:36:23

my three kids and just abandon my business to

1:36:26

come with him to Los Angeles plus I was worried I

1:36:28

wouldn't be able to get past these new bodyguards who

1:36:31

represented music company and Mark

1:36:33

was a single dad, he had

1:36:35

four kids he couldn't just leave everything and go so

1:36:38

we were like of course you're going to be right Mike we'll

1:36:40

see you next week in London it's all set up don't worry

1:36:43

so I came off the phone I felt fine I

1:36:45

just I said to my uh me

1:36:47

rehearsal wife at the time I said he's

1:36:49

nervous he'll be okay I just thought

1:36:51

Dodge he will do one two shows and

1:36:54

that'll be it. Could he just had a massive

1:36:56

medical done and a big insurance on him that's

1:36:59

what I thought he would do. So

1:37:01

did Mark as well we didn't think he was that day if

1:37:03

we thought he was going to die a few days later then

1:37:05

we would be down on the next plane you know but yeah

1:37:08

and the family were getting noise that things were

1:37:10

not good at the house too so

1:37:12

all the staff have been changed all been gone.

1:37:15

That's the Tuesday night and on a Thursday evening

1:37:17

I just come back from work at

1:37:20

my office I sit down Madison sitting on

1:37:22

my lap and then Yuri Geller calls

1:37:24

me and he says Matt I've

1:37:27