0:17

Hey, welcome back, Faithful Politics

0:17

listeners and viewers, if you're watching

0:20

us on our YouTube channel, I am your

0:20

political host, Will Wright, and I'm

0:23

joined by your faithful host, Pastor Josh

0:23

Bertram.

0:26

How's it going, Josh? doing well thanks

0:29

And this week we have returning to us,

0:29

Professor Robert Dietz, who is a

0:36

professor, former intelligence officer,

0:36

served as senior counsel to the director

0:41

of CIA and general counsel of the National

0:41

Security Agency, and has been on the show

0:45

actually before to talk about classified

0:45

items, specifically with regard to Trump.

0:50

But now we've asked that he return to...

0:53

give us his hot takes on the special

0:53

counsel Robert Hurt's report on the Biden

0:58

classified documents case. So welcome back to the show, Robert.

1:04

And shortly before our discussion, I

1:04

looked you up under Rate My Professor.

1:11

I don't know if you're familiar with this

1:11

website, but they score professors on a

1:16

five-point Likert scale. So any guesses on how you fare?

1:24

Yes, according to the Rate My Professor

1:24

website Robert Dietz is a 5 out of 5.

1:33

There you go. You're a 5 out of 5 in my book too,

1:34

Robert.

1:37

Just so you know. right.

1:41

So, okay. So, Biden classified documents case.

1:45

Yeah, last time we spoke, we talked about

1:45

the Trump classified document case.

1:51

And as expected with the Biden one, it's

1:51

like everybody's gone into their

1:55

respective corners. No surprise there.

1:58

They left us saying that Biden's

1:58

exonerated, the right are calling for his

2:04

cabinet to invoke the 25th amendment.

2:07

So I'd love to get your big takeaway and

2:07

then we'll kind of zero in on a couple

2:14

specific sections. Yeah, I think it really has, you know, I

3:42

mean, I've heard things about his mental

3:48

acuity right throughout the years, and

3:48

I've been listening to C-SPAN and all the

3:53

back and forth from all these different,

3:53

you know, panels that are saying, is Biden

3:58

really, is he losing this, is what's going

3:58

on here, why is there so much

4:04

Why are there so many issues here with his

4:04

mental acuity?

4:09

So can you kind of talk us through like, I

4:09

mean, obviously it's important a president

4:15

has mental acuity, but yet what exactly

4:15

did this report say, how did it cast

4:26

aspersions on his mental acuity and what's

4:26

the likelihood do you think?

4:33

I mean, what's the likelihood that this

4:33

was politically motivated as the White

4:37

House is trying to say they're just trying

4:37

to, you know, this person is trying to get

4:42

a better job in the, in the new

4:42

president's cabinet in the next term or

4:47

something like that. I've heard that thrown around. So what do you think?

5:18

Right. You're fine.

6:12

Yes. Yeah, so I guess walk us through maybe

6:22

your experience with reports like this.

6:30

I mean, you know, with a lot of the excess

6:30

commentary specifically focused on, you

6:37

know, his mental state of mind or whatnot,

6:37

like, is that normal?

6:43

Or did he put that in there just as sort

6:43

of like evidence on why we're not

6:48

bringing, we're not prosecuting, you know,

6:48

this case?

7:18

Great. Right.

7:44

Yeah, and so one of the main elements of

7:44

the report that a lot of people are kind

7:51

of coalescing around is like this line of

7:51

willfully retained and kind of using that

7:57

as the cudgel to beat them up.

8:00

So can you maybe like unpack?

8:03

What does that mean? Does it carry any weight?

8:06

And yeah, what should we make of it? Hmm.

8:18

I don't- So the highly classified stuff.

9:12

So something I keep hearing is something

9:12

along these lines, like Biden said

9:17

something about, hey, I wanted to keep

9:17

some things for posterity's sake, some

9:24

conversation or personal letter he had

9:24

with President Obama.

9:30

And he was just kind of keeping it, he

9:30

said, for posterity's sake.

9:35

And I keep hearing his cabinet, they're

9:35

trying to like...

9:38

say no, his mental cutie is great.

9:41

These documents were not, everyone's

9:41

blowing this out of proportion.

9:46

You know, they're not answering any of the

9:46

questions straight.

9:48

So like, what kinds of documents are we

9:48

actually talking about here?

9:54

And like, how is it, like, is it just like

9:54

letters, personal notes between him and

10:00

Ob- and Obama say, hey, I see you, I see you

10:01

Barack and you look great in your coat

10:06

today. And that's highly classified because it's

10:06

privileged speech.

10:10

What are we talking about? Hmm.

11:52

Ha ha ha! Yeah, so like

12:15

Oh, interesting. I mean, some of what I picked up from

12:20

reading the report was Biden kept notes in

12:28

a notebook. Some of the notes were classified, some

12:30

like weren't.

12:34

And I can just imagine myself in that

12:34

position, you know, I'm in a top secret

12:40

briefing talking about the president.

12:43

daily briefing or what have you, and I'm

12:43

writing notes.

12:47

And then I'm like, oh yeah, I forgot, I

12:47

gotta grab milk or something on the way

12:50

home. So then I write, okay, grab milk or buy

12:50

flowers for my wife.

12:57

How does the notes in a vice president's

12:57

notebook like go through the

13:04

classification process? I mean, I figured like a person in that

13:05

roles is jotting down notes on everything

13:11

and... and some of it may be classified and some

13:12

may not.

13:33

Yeah. Interesting.

14:19

So how much does intent play with decision

14:19

to not prosecute?

15:13

So like if you're thinking about Biden

15:13

forgetting when his son died, okay,

15:21

something along those lines, which is, it

15:21

feels like that's a major, a major thing.

15:27

Like how, how is it that a question like

15:27

that again starts to play in, which seems

15:33

like a very personal question.

15:35

How would a question like that even come up? Number one, I, and I know you weren't

15:37

there, but, but why in a legal like,

15:42

prosecution or investigation of

15:42

prosecution, why in this investigation,

15:46

why would they be asking questions like

15:46

that?

15:48

And then how come answers like that then

15:48

bear on his ability to perform in other

15:55

areas? Right.

16:46

Hahaha Hmm.

17:36

So it's like he noticed something.

17:39

And then once you notice maybe, right?

17:41

So much you notice something, then you can

17:41

kind of legally go down that you go down

17:49

that just like what like police would do

17:49

in a, in an in like an interview with

17:54

someone like a that kind of idea.

17:58

Okay, so when it Hmm

18:11

Hehehehe So.

18:27

So like the idea here, just so I'm

18:27

getting, this is really helpful.

18:31

Just so I'm getting this straight in my

18:31

mind.

18:35

We got a criminal investigation going on.

18:38

So let's say I'm here and I got, I don't

18:38

know, the IRS or someone's coming over to

18:43

my house. I'm not just gonna be treating it lightly.

18:47

Oh, I don't know, maybe sometime, and

18:47

maybe it could have happened there.

18:50

I wanna be like, and the idea is that.

18:54

he should have known and in this kind of

18:54

environment, for him to answer the way he

19:00

did, that was what was so concerning.

19:22

Right. Yes.

19:51

Yes. Yeah.

20:03

It's almost like it's better to say crazy

20:03

stuff in your old age than to misremember

20:11

stuff for something. Hmm.

20:16

Hahaha. Well... Hahaha.

20:21

Is it because you won't remember you doing

20:21

the show?

20:24

Hahaha. It's okay.

20:30

spoken like a true CIA lawyer.

20:33

I love that. So, Robert, one of the biggest things that

20:36

a lot of people that I talk to,

20:41

specifically like Trump voters, are, you

20:41

know, why aren't they prosecuting Biden,

20:51

but they're doing it for Trump? And I feel pretty okay answering that

20:53

question, but a lot of it is just like,

21:00

we'll read the report. you know, and nobody's going to read the

21:01

report because nobody has that kind of

21:05

time or interest or passion in knowing

21:05

what the truth is.

21:08

So, like, maybe you can kind of help

21:08

explain, like, what are some of the

21:14

fundamental big picture things that really

21:14

separate, you know, the Jack Smith

21:20

prosecution from the Robert Hirs

21:20

prosecution?

21:37

Hmm Yeah.

22:41

Hahaha! Yeah.

23:05

Yes. I can neither recollect nor recall ever

23:09

doing such a thing.

23:17

You know, one of the things that comes

23:17

out, Robert, in this is like, oh, well,

23:21

there are best practices versus legal

23:21

guidelines and legal, not even guidelines,

23:27

legal, like actual law, which what are we

23:27

dealing with here?

23:33

Are we dealing with they didn't do the

23:33

best practices or are we dealing with

23:38

Obviously, I mean, you're saying criminal

23:38

investigation.

23:41

So there's some law, you know,

23:41

specifically said broken.

23:46

What do we say to the best guidelines?

23:49

What do we say to the best guidelines

23:49

argument?

24:37

Hahaha Hehehehe

24:54

I mean, my wife, so my wife was saying,

24:54

look, we, um, she's like, we get, we get

25:00

trained. We go through hours and hours and hours of

25:01

training on that.

25:04

We can't say anything or answer any

25:04

questions during the standards of

25:09

learning. S O wells, right?

25:11

You can't say anything. She's like, how is it that I get this much

25:12

training and then we could go to a

25:17

president and say that they can claim.

25:21

ignorance or they didn't know or accent or

25:21

right that's

25:44

Yes. Hmm.

26:06

Yeah. Yeah, make that case for us.

26:14

Yeah, I mean, even more if you would like,

26:14

almost like bringing out the seriousness

26:21

because it feels like it's all just like a

26:21

joke.

26:23

It feels like it's just like a media joke,

26:23

but that's not what I'm hearing and that's

26:31

not what is reality. Hmm

27:50

Mmmm Hmm.

28:30

Yes, it does. Yeah, yeah.

28:33

So I want to go back to the Trump thing

28:33

again, because the report went out of its

28:42

way to delineate the difference between

28:42

Biden's classified stuff and Trump's

28:49

stuff, and even included a bit of a

28:49

history lesson, which I had no idea about,

28:55

like Reagan and Carter, all these other

28:55

instances.

28:58

Like, what—

29:01

What did that actually add to the report?

29:04

Because my reading, and obviously I'm not

29:04

a legal person, but in my reading of it,

29:09

it's almost like he's telling himself why

29:09

he shouldn't prosecute, but I'm sure

29:15

that's probably not right.

29:27

Yes. Hmm.

30:30

like, do you think that, you know, when we

30:30

get to the point where Jack Smith is

30:35

writing his final report, that we that

30:35

he'll include something about Biden?

30:47

Yeah, that's true. Hehehe

30:52

Hmm True.

30:56

Good point. Oh, go ahead, Josh.

30:58

Sorry. No, I just, I keep like thinking about how

31:00

important it is that when like someone

31:10

like me in the public, right?

31:12

I don't know. I don't, I don't understand how these

31:13

depositions work, right?

31:18

I've never been in a deposition

31:18

personally.

31:21

Most of the people voting out there have

31:21

not been in a deposition personally.

31:27

How important do you feel like it is that

31:27

this report is taken like about Biden is

31:35

taken seriously and that it's and that

31:35

it's basically disseminated and given the

31:41

results to the American public and voters

31:41

and does it need any explanation with it

31:50

because what you're telling me it's it

31:50

makes so much more sense than what I hear

31:55

on C-SPAN and Fox News and you know all I

31:56

hear is like just sound bites it feels

32:01

like on there and I don't know.

33:30

Right? Hahaha

33:50

It astonishes me as well. Mmm.

33:57

Yeah, it's so true. Yeah, you know, I was joking with somebody

33:59

recently.

34:02

I was like, I just want to vote for

34:02

somebody that's like under 70 and has not

34:07

had a special counsel appointed to

34:07

investigate them.

34:10

I was like, I feel like that should be a

34:10

pretty large like, but, ah, geez.

34:18

You know, in their report also, the

34:18

special counsel, her...

34:25

was writing about Biden's time in

34:25

government and basically was alluding to

34:33

the fact that this guy has been around

34:33

secret materials for his whole life.

34:38

There's a good chance he could not have

34:38

known that the notebook with the

34:43

coordinates where they were going to go

34:43

get Osama were located.

34:50

How convincing of an argument is that? And you know, with, I mean, you've been

34:52

around classified documents your whole

34:54

life. Like is it easy to just become

34:55

desensitized to the fact that something's

34:59

classified? Hmm.

35:22

Interesting. So you know.

36:14

Yeah, it's so true. I mean, if Nikki Haley had only called the

36:15

National Guard on January 6, you know, who

36:21

knows?

36:30

I want to talk a little bit about Biden's

36:30

ghostwriter because reading the report, I

36:36

got to admit, I felt a little bad for the

36:36

person.

36:44

No, no, it was like, it seemed like he

36:44

just got mixed in or rolled into something

36:50

that he had no idea what he was getting

36:50

into.

36:53

I mean, I'm sure he's getting paid lots of

36:53

money and he'll forget it all.

36:56

But like, the report mentioned how he, you

36:56

know, when he heard about this

37:01

investigation that he like deleted a bunch

37:01

of stuff off his computer.

37:05

So That's not good.

37:09

No, I mean, yes, it does show, but it's

37:09

one of those like, how is it that he's not

37:19

being prosecuted when, I mean, he

37:19

literally, he knew that he had classified

37:25

stuff on his computer and then he deleted

37:25

it.

37:28

Like, how was that not, you know?

38:33

I mean, you know, people like on the left

38:33

would say, well, that's kind of what

38:38

they're doing with like the January 6

38:38

stuff, right?

38:40

Like they're prosecuting all these people

38:40

that were, you know, peacefully protesting

38:47

or touring the Capitol. Dude, they were touring the Capitol,

38:50

obviously.

38:53

Well, that's what the videos that, what's

38:53

his fricking name said.

38:56

I don't even remember the guy's name,

38:56

Hannity.

38:59

And no, is it Hannity? I don't remember.

39:01

One of those clowns. That's what they said, dude, that they

39:03

were letting everybody in.

39:06

You know, this is so, what this brings to

39:06

me is that it really highlights the

39:12

disparity to me between people in those

39:12

positions of power.

39:20

And for lack of a better term, the regular

39:20

peons like the rest of us.

39:27

For instance, we've had Reality Winner on

39:27

this show who, what was it, five years, 10

39:32

years? How long did she get? Five years in jail for having, I mean,

39:34

probably a fraction of the documents or

39:40

whatever it was that either of these

39:40

presidents have.

39:44

Now, what... And I'm asking for your personal and legal

39:46

opinion, whatever mix thereof.

39:55

When you have someone with that kind of

39:55

power, obviously they can't be...

40:02

Can they just be treated like me?

40:04

I mean, I know no one is supposed to be

40:04

above the law and I get that.

40:08

And yet at the same time, they have access

40:08

to things that I don't have access to.

40:12

They have... understandings of things that I don't.

40:15

They make decisions that are way more

40:15

impactful and way more people than I do.

40:24

What's kind of the balance there, do you think? Have you ever seen, and have you seen that

40:26

balance done well and struck well in your

40:31

time in Washington?

42:13

Yeah, there's a part in the report, it's

42:13

in the executive summary.

42:27

I think he has actually. Oh wait, you didn't?

42:30

but I read enough about Reagan and Carter

42:30

to be an expert and to write their

42:37

autobiographies. So in this quote, it says, but addressing

42:44

those risks through criminal charges, the

42:48

only means available to this office is not

42:48

the proper remedy here.

42:56

And I was reading that wondering if that's

42:56

like an implication that, yeah, sure, we

43:03

can't prosecute them, but, you know,

43:03

there's things that you folks reading this

43:09

can do. Like, I don't know if that's just regular

43:10

language that gets put in there, or if

43:13

that's sort of a broader implication that

43:13

we can't do anything here, but maybe you

43:17

guys can. Oh, no, I'm sorry.

43:25

I'm sorry.

43:27

So in the executive summary, Robert Hurd

43:27

talks about why he's not prosecuting.

43:32

And he says, but addressing those risks

43:32

through criminal charges, the only means

43:36

available to this office, he's basically

43:36

saying it's not the proper remedy here.

43:44

So the question is, is that just normal

43:44

template language?

44:14

I'm gonna go. Right.

44:19

That's true. And to the point of a lot of liberals

44:20

saying that he's been exonerated, is that

44:27

it? That's not inaccurate? Okay.

44:40

That's what I thought. Yeah, that makes...

44:51

Well, I mean, because it's like, I don't

44:51

know.

44:55

I voted for Biden, sure. But if I had the choice to vote for

44:56

somebody younger and not under special

45:01

counsel investigation, I'd probably vote

45:01

for that person.

45:06

But it's like, when the Mueller report

45:06

came out.

45:11

A lot of people on the right are like,

45:11

yeah, see, Trump's exonerated.

45:13

Now I'm like, no, he's not. Like, read the report.

45:16

Like... People just take whatever they want.

45:34

So, actually on that, and then I have

45:34

another question.

45:38

What is the difference between innocent

45:38

and not guilty?

45:41

Help us understand that for the regular

45:41

people who all we do is watch cold case

45:47

and that's the only time we ever get any

45:47

of this, you know, any understanding of

45:52

what's happening. What do you mean by that?

46:40

And that's in. So, I mean, that's a really, really

46:46

important point that I think, Robert,

46:51

many, many people do not follow that line

46:51

of reasoning that I know.

46:56

When someone's, hey, I've been exonerated

46:56

or I've been found not guilty, but what

47:02

I'm hearing you say that simply has to do

47:02

with the evidence they had, couldn't make

47:07

an airtight case or something, like

47:07

couldn't bring it to that place where

47:12

there was no reason, like it was beyond a

47:12

reasonable doubt, like you said.

47:39

I'm out. Hahaha!

48:00

Man, that's good. That's good. That'll preach.

48:02

You just gave me my sermon for this

48:02

weekend.

48:13

Hey, it's all right. I love that.

48:16

You know, I want to real quick talk about

48:16

the 25th amendment because people,

48:21

sometimes they know the first.

48:25

If they're conservative, they know the second. That's for sure.

48:28

They're going to say, I know the second. Give me my guns and probably misinterpret

48:30

that.

48:33

What is the 25th amendment?

48:35

Why are some Republicans calling it to be

48:35

invoked?

48:38

What would that even mean if it was?

48:42

What are we talking about here? Yeah.

49:32

I feel like there is. And so we have the 25th amendment being

49:39

invoked.

49:42

And then what is the amendment?

49:44

What is it the, is it the Civil War?

49:47

Is 14th amendment that they're trying to

49:47

get against Trump, which is about

49:51

insurrection, correct?

49:54

And so we have an- And so, you know, I just gotta ask, since

50:02

I asked about the 25th, what do you think

50:06

about this and go on whatever record you

50:06

want to, what do you think about the 14th

50:11

Amendment argument when it comes to Trump?

50:14

I just gotta get your opinion on that.

50:21

Thanks for watching! It's yeah.

50:35

Yeah. Right.

51:08

Mmm. Yeah, that makes sense.

51:13

And even that idea of being unfit for

51:13

office versus being an, because it doesn't

51:18

say anything about running for office,

51:18

right?

51:21

I mean, I know that's maybe, I don't know,

51:21

that's like splitting hairs, but it's, but

51:27

it is like, can you actually keep someone

51:27

from running for something?

51:33

That I don't. Yeah, I mean that to your point exactly.

51:40

Yeah, I mean how do you, because that's,

51:40

we can't, anyone can quote unquote run for

51:45

president, right, if they meet the certain

51:45

constitutional requirements.

51:53

I guess that's true. Right?

52:27

Yeah, interesting.

52:30

Yeah. How much do you think the Deep State had

52:30

to do with the writing of this report?

52:48

Sorry, I had to ask because I mean,

52:48

they're responsible for all the

52:52

investigations against Trump, you know, I

52:52

mean, you know, I figured there was like,

52:56

well, I don't know what the antithesis of

52:56

the deep state would be like the

53:05

Hmm. Don't forget the Dead Sea squirrels.

53:11

They had something to do with it too. Yeah, it's the shallow state.

53:24

Hehehehehehe Hmm.

53:33

Yes. I think he's just being silly on that one.

53:53

You know, I, he's just being, you know, I,

53:53

so I do, and I really, number one, I love

54:01

talking with you. I haven't had this much fun in a while.

54:07

The second thing is that, so we have this

54:07

election coming up, right?

54:15

We're looking at these two candidates.

54:17

looks like there's no, I mean, I said it

54:17

was some report that I heard over half

54:22

Democrats are concerned about President

54:22

Biden and they're concerned about him

54:27

coming up and they're 70 something.

54:30

They're throwing these poll numbers out,

54:30

you know, poll numbers can be argued and

54:33

all that, right? It's a large number.

54:36

So I'm just like, what do you think?

54:41

How are you feeling about this upcoming

54:41

election?

54:45

season. What are you most concerned about as we're

54:45

moving into this?

55:28

I understand. Oh yeah, they don't pay?

55:39

Do whatever you want with them. Yeah, I was telling my wife recently that

55:52

even though it would be super chaotic, I

55:59

mean, he could always at the convention

55:59

just say, hey, you know, I'm not going to

56:03

run and instead you should, you know,

56:03

like, vote for Gretchen Whitmer or whoever

56:08

it is. So you know, that's what it is.

57:35

Yeah.

57:37

Yeah, no kidding. So Robert, my last question is more or

57:39

less just what else about the report

57:45

really kind of stuck out to you that we

57:45

didn't already discuss and what do you

57:49

think that this kind of portends for the

57:49

future of classified material handling?

58:10

Hehehe Mm-hmm.

58:56

Okay. Were those yellow pads filled with all the

58:56

notes from Biden and Obama?

59:16

Yeah, I mean, like, I know I said that was

59:16

going to be my last question, but what do

59:21

you think the odds are of Obama having

59:21

classified documents on his home?

59:27

Yeah, me too. I mean, because it's all a culture thing,

59:28

right?

59:32

Like, if you have a culture of not wanting

59:32

to take care of classified documents,

59:35

like, that's going to be somewhat

59:35

systemic, I'd imagine.

59:42

Hmm. Yeah.

59:50

I'm sorry. Well, I will.

59:55

And on that note, thanks again, Robert,

59:55

for joining us.

59:58

This has been a fun chat and I'll try not

59:58

to remind you that you're on the show the

1:00:04

next time I reach out to you. I'll make it a surprise.

1:00:07

I feel like you haven't met me before,

1:00:07

but...

1:00:15

All right. Thanks. Thanks so much. And we'll see our audience.

1:00:18

See you guys next time. Take care.

1:00:20

Bye.