0:00

Music From

0:16

the 11FS this is FinTech

0:18

Insider News live from the

0:20

Village Underground here in London.

0:25

My name is David Brey, CEO here

0:27

at 11FS and today we're going to

0:29

be covering Nationwide Agree's 2.9

0:33

billion acquisition of urgent money. J.P.

0:36

Morgan wants to launch biometric checkouts

0:38

and people are losing up to

0:40

50 billion in lost pension

0:42

pots according to new research. Discuss

0:45

all of this, I'm joined by

0:47

a group of fantastic guests. First

0:49

up, we have my colleague

0:52

and co-host for the evening Jamie

0:54

Campbell, who is head of VC

0:56

at 11FS. Welcome to

0:58

the show. Hello.

1:04

The restraining order means I can't go past this

1:06

line. Yeah, it's like an invisible barrier. How's it

1:08

going, Joe? Are you good? I'm

1:10

very good. It's quite weird. This is the first

1:12

time I've been on a

1:15

FinTech Insider anything being

1:17

an employee at 11FS. Yeah. Does

1:19

it feel like more pressure? Is it like

1:22

there'll be a HR moment tomorrow type thing?

1:24

Well, I feel like there's the ceremonial removing

1:26

of the hat which says I don't work

1:28

here. Is that thing? I don't

1:31

know. You've had that one all day. The hat

1:33

hair underneath it wouldn't be advisable, would it? I

1:35

don't know. Is that bad? No?

1:38

Okay, it goes off. Ooh.

1:40

Ceremony and everything.

1:44

How's it going? Busy week. Did anybody see

1:46

the slightly weird promo video of this that

1:48

me and Jamie did for tonight? We

1:51

did a walking down brick lane chatting

1:53

by a bagel. It was quite a

1:56

weird experience, wasn't it? It

1:58

was quite strange, but I got free. bagel out of

2:00

it. I got two free bagels out of it so

2:02

I was pretty happy. That's true. Yeah. You're doing a

2:04

thing for bagels. All right we better move on and

2:06

we can talk more later about the bagels. Next

2:09

up we have Georgie Frost, financial

2:11

broadcaster and journalist. Welcome to the

2:14

stage. Hello

2:21

Georgie, how you doing? I'm

2:23

saying Ellie Rona, I basically sort of see you

2:25

on the tilly like all the time.

2:27

It's very informative. It's where I get most of my information

2:33

about financial services. How you

2:37

doing? Yeah, probably better than

2:39

you if you're listening to me for all your

2:41

financial services information. Glad

2:43

to be here. Thank you very much for inviting me. All right

2:46

and we also completing the

2:48

lineup we have Alex Rivas-Gale who

2:50

is head of product Europe at

2:52

Clearbank. Welcome to the show. Hello.

2:58

How's it going Alex, how

3:00

you doing? We're all right. This is kind

3:02

of the first time I've ever done anything like. So

3:04

really a debut. So hi the friendly faces the audience

3:06

that I cannot see but very excited that they're here.

3:09

Yeah bright lights you can't see them at the back. And

3:11

to be fair it's you know they're judgy faces you can't

3:13

see it. Yeah thank God I can't see them. But

3:16

right we better go on because there's a bunch of

3:18

news and a bunch of things that we want to

3:20

talk through. This was a story that we first picked

3:22

up over our city AM but it's been covered in

3:25

much less reputable outlets as we

3:28

discovered backstage as well. This

3:30

was nationwide agreed 2.9 billion

3:33

takeover of Virgin money. So the board

3:35

of Virgin money have agreed a 2.9

3:38

billion acquisition for nationwide

3:40

the largest building society in

3:42

the world. The combined group will have 700 branches

3:45

and assets of approximately 366 billion

3:50

nationwide if anybody doesn't know who's

3:52

listening to this abroad is a

3:54

membership organization. Last year garnered praise

3:56

for distributing 340 million. 340

4:00

million sounds like a lot of bit but when you've

4:02

got 3.4 million customers everybody got 100 quid So

4:05

it's like it's like winning the lottery and

4:07

everybody else winning the lottery isn't it? That's

4:09

about 17 million customers, but 3.9 or

4:13

something committed to members. It's right You've

4:16

got to really commit to be a

4:18

member. Yeah, is it another hat ceremony?

4:22

However, the deal has been criticized apparently

4:25

for members not being giving a fair

4:27

say over the virgin acquisition I mean

4:29

maybe Jamie if we start with you on what

4:31

do you think from a is this a good investment?

4:35

It's a very good deal if you're

4:37

Richard Branson. I Mean

4:40

I checked I'm not like yeah, okay. Well,

4:42

you know, I I mean nation want to

4:44

clearly think it's a big deal I mean

4:47

they are paying a 38% premium

4:49

on the share price so they clearly want to

4:51

get this done But

4:55

it's a it's pretty unprecedented Knowing

4:57

that this will create the second

4:59

largest financial services group in the

5:01

UK And it won't

5:04

be a bank per se although there

5:06

is complications which we'll get into And

5:09

nationwide as a brand has this

5:12

kind of like warm fuzzy Glow

5:14

around it which other very large

5:16

banks don't really have so I think

5:18

it's an interesting Move

5:21

in in in that direction, but

5:23

in terms of is it a good deal?

5:25

Is it a good investment? Well the amount that they

5:27

paid for it if you look at other acquisitions that

5:29

have happened this year for it for medium-sized banks by

5:32

by larger banks the Tesco

5:35

Bank takeover by HSBC for 1 billion would

5:37

kind of would make it seem like it's

5:39

not a very good deal But

5:41

if you include that in 2019 under

5:44

the mortgage book was bought off of

5:47

Tesco Bank for 3.8 billion Then

5:50

actually starts to seem like a

5:52

pretty interesting and good deal Hmm.

5:56

Why Does it feel weird that a building societies

5:58

buying a bank? That's the bit that I? Find.

6:01

We. Just about this as anybody else

6:03

night. Because it's not. As usual

6:05

is the yeah so related the other way

6:07

that we haven't seen some and is a

6:10

sense it's a really as a big risk

6:12

ethics and a son was like you said

6:14

it's warm and fuzzy. It's of the right

6:16

things are tix the right boxes customs really

6:18

like it might concern as opposed to finance

6:20

innocence and simmer. Genesis is the customers and

6:22

how I feel about it. Ah but and

6:25

sense the reputation of nationwide to choose a

6:27

sign Quits. Left is

6:29

not doing a hadn't amazingly well

6:31

for a while. I just think

6:33

is. Yeah. I it's the

6:36

deal that I don't know who was actually

6:38

asking for really. And to not go see

6:40

or members committed or just customers or whatever

6:42

is what is the point of use a

6:45

mutual if you aren't going to go to

6:47

your customers. there are some presumably was that

6:49

we had to get this deal done really

6:51

quickly and if we'd have gone through all

6:54

three million or members committed members it would

6:56

have taken too long. someone else would a

6:58

common with an offer at fetch with such

7:00

as if you are too big now to

7:02

do what you say you do as a

7:05

mutual. What? Are you gonna be

7:07

like in six years time when he migrates

7:09

it is out and migrating customers across. I

7:11

don't know what could happen in subs of

7:13

what can happen to customers. anyone is a

7:15

virgin. Money Catherine the My when I say

7:18

let this is gonna be a slow burn,

7:20

it still needs read shareholders diverted and get

7:22

a say in this. So that's another smack

7:24

in the face of mass. Which

7:27

is a fan he he likes to

7:30

save. obviously he lowered given the okay

7:32

so S R V I was like

7:34

I wouldn't worry in the medium term.

7:36

same as the staff apparently. I think

7:38

the seven thousand three hundred stop aging

7:40

moneypenny. don't worry about it. This year.

7:43

Next year? Well, you know that. Tough

7:45

luck. So yeah, I think that in

7:47

the short term for anyone is going

7:49

to mortgage or any sort of banking

7:51

service with vetted money this can we

7:53

slow burn that? A senior at about

7:55

six years? What happens beyond then? Who

7:57

knows. But and censor things like movies,

7:59

right? Hayden is right. We know, looking

8:01

at the big high streets. And

8:05

I offer the i cannot imagine this is

8:07

gonna be at the consumer. I don't know

8:10

who this is gonna be good for except

8:12

like you said, Richard Branson, some shareholders and

8:14

at his attorneys crosby. Yeah. See,

8:16

that's quite good. Still a good job. At

8:18

in A yeah that the Dad Debbie yes

8:21

it yeah. I mean that they were making

8:23

hey they're making Megan Fox a easy a

8:25

fundamentally flawed model. Live my doing else can

8:27

people are Opinion: I know that sounds like

8:30

I'm advocating for some sort of dictatorship. The

8:32

we do not A lot lately. food eaten,

8:34

you know, outbreaks, it happens, and like we

8:36

vote every so often on who the political

8:39

parties should base. It doesn't seem to go

8:41

so well as a in a like so

8:43

easy. A good idea to ask the general

8:45

public how you should run your business. Who'd

8:49

like that one? Doesn't

8:53

raise it's I'm pretty sure we can think of

8:55

example the other way risk their work by of

8:57

let that is the most all of the business

8:59

and labor of as the big fans of it

9:01

they want to double the number of that assassins

9:04

of mutual say that the model of the business

9:06

is that the money comes and that invested back

9:08

in the customer providing better services This is three

9:10

billion of that's awesome as money going to something

9:12

that the customer service I. You.

9:15

Know like. According to the Nineteen

9:17

Eighty Six Building Society act, whatever that has has

9:19

to do it as a fat. But then I

9:21

go back to the point of what is your

9:23

purpose. Does tend to

9:25

be something and let's be honest nationwide

9:28

already. I think you know with paying

9:30

a sea of it's sort of customs

9:32

of getting see begun. I just I

9:34

just really don't see what's the benefit

9:37

of this is going to be. Fooled.

9:40

I swipe miss it will come out the

9:42

was listening yeah what would you recommend? I

9:45

mean you look at it though and look

9:47

at Nationwide. They're gonna become the second biggest

9:49

mortgage provide an eating overnight. What?

9:51

Does that mean for the and customer? What's the

9:53

customer experience? What is going to happen in those

9:55

sort of six years said the take a was

9:57

in happen. It's. me Maybe

10:00

it's a slow burn, but there's gonna be really

10:02

quick decisions on what tech do

10:04

we do? How do we operate? What

10:07

is the end customer experience? How

10:09

do we potentially consolidate and have a proper

10:11

operating model? There's some really big

10:13

things that will have to be decided and doing

10:15

that too slow is gonna

10:18

be at a consequence. Doing that too fast

10:21

could have a knee-jerk reaction and things could

10:23

fall over. So it's a very uncharted territory

10:26

of what does it mean to be a

10:28

building society and a bank. And

10:30

then you layer and talk what it means to have a banking license

10:32

and that comes with a whole raft

10:35

of complexities of regulator, capital

10:37

requirements, reporting, all of these things that

10:39

hasn't necessarily been the fiber of what

10:41

nationwide has had to do. So

10:45

uncharted territory and the biggest question I have

10:47

is what does this mean for the end

10:49

consumer? How does that impact them? And

10:52

the smooshing together of

10:54

members and customers and

10:56

what diverging money customers

11:00

become members? How

11:02

does that all work? Yeah,

11:05

if you look at the comments in their press

11:07

releases and stuff, they said there's no guarantee that

11:09

that's what's gonna happen. So what is gonna happen?

11:11

Are they gonna keep a separate section for them?

11:13

I mean, you spoke of that, to have a

11:16

banking license, it's a major distraction if nothing else.

11:19

What resources are gonna be pulled into just dealing

11:21

with the added admin of all of this? I

11:24

don't know. Yeah, I mean, ownership structure and

11:26

how that rolls up to the

11:29

parent being able to, or having to adhere

11:31

to all of that regulation. I mean, it

11:34

is quite an undertaking, but they haven't just been

11:36

like, it's not like me on Amazon at 10

11:38

p.m. and I'm like, yeah, fuck, I'll buy that

11:40

thing. They've clearly considered it,

11:42

haven't they through that process? Yeah, I mean,

11:44

they've looked at this thing, look, it's the

11:46

business blending that they're really interested in. I've

11:48

also looked and they said it's about credit

11:50

cards and nobody told me credit cards are

11:52

good for consumers. But they tried looking at

11:54

business lending Before and it kind of fell

11:56

by the wayside at the pandemic. They had the

11:59

knowledge and the input. Simpli for with

12:01

if they wanted to do this themselves know. I

12:04

mean can you can you think of any

12:06

and mrs away from poverty on the spot

12:08

for so by brace up on it's one

12:10

of us like a cop. really think of

12:12

any big mergers from like organizations that as

12:14

did at the end of it you gone

12:16

yeah like the are why was there this

12:18

worked out like the news and you think

12:20

of any. Can. Anybody in the

12:22

audience think of any. The. Resets is

12:24

in your favor. They doesn't say that there are

12:26

many air which is no. Is no.

12:29

It's not voting well for the outcome of this one.

12:31

potentially, is it? So, And that book people

12:34

vote with a see more they leave or

12:36

they go summer. And the not as

12:38

a big piece around a lot happens to the states.

12:41

Of these. Institutions so that's a

12:43

really interesting thing. A thing that does

12:45

that cause has Syrian people start to

12:47

accept because they're angry at nationwide Other

12:49

uncertain that birds money. So. What

12:51

does it mean for the and and consumers

12:54

yesterday? What are they thinking? Yeah I guess

12:56

what do you think? a lotta I mean

12:58

I guess we real skill points since I

13:00

can miss and describe it might put your

13:03

hands of Beauty Bank when they someones. Like.

13:07

I hope for your hands a busy bank with

13:09

Virgin. Birth

13:13

you guys and you guys get

13:15

together and like. As

13:18

I have a chat about including job grab

13:20

a go enjoy yourself right or I we've

13:22

adam Eve of his his Alma other stories

13:24

but again like so excited provides a bank

13:26

better than ever with on desserts are a

13:29

next story that we had was warned that

13:31

was picked up on are a bunch of

13:33

other places but Pigments Dive apparently was where

13:35

we pick one up on his Jp Morgan's

13:38

moons Boy metrics accounts in Twenty twenty five

13:40

so stay people can. Trace is planning

13:42

to roll were a new biometric check

13:44

out service with his merchant customers as

13:46

early as next year. The new service

13:49

can be used either any commerce or

13:51

of physical checkouts. Consumers are required to

13:53

complete and enrollment form with the bank

13:56

where they have latest sophie and enter

13:58

a payment card information. When

14:00

playing as he merged been using Jp

14:02

Morgan service. they can opt to check

14:05

out using their biometric information intimations point.

14:07

They even if it could be a

14:09

number of I guess because it's a

14:11

self, it's a picture subscription is it.

14:14

Oh was worried that I will never be

14:16

able to replicate myself if I stay here

14:18

like say I was like i'm like a

14:21

problem but maybe also would go to think

14:23

he didn't look like you're it doesn't work

14:25

like your passports a Thursday as much more

14:27

sophisticated than that I got. Come to say

14:29

to say that their payments unit has already

14:32

pointed to the service with food service providers

14:34

are in Texas earnest and price to engage

14:36

much more merchant air in the pilot This

14:38

year's the Bank as a huge pool with

14:40

merchants you could adopt the service In Twenty

14:43

twenty two alone they processed foods. And fully

14:45

point eight three billion transactions. They

14:47

probably know that in their necks

14:49

out with met was woof Two

14:51

trillion dollars apparently. I'm okay so

14:53

you would even come on this

14:55

one then. Rather

14:58

than from you guys on this one what

15:00

are you they would would you would you

15:02

use a since he said councillor I mean

15:04

is it seems like a good are as

15:07

as i especially if you're at Mcdonalds like

15:09

nine and you've got that vibe and job

15:11

or com remember my pin but I can

15:13

remember my face like that would be a

15:16

show of hands it and put your hands

15:18

up. A few would use this. I've

15:22

got. A. Lot of people put your

15:24

hands up if this terrified. What?

15:28

Is it about it that terrifies you madam?

15:40

like i say so having you dates around

15:42

senseless acts as a this interesting point isn't

15:44

it a one point convenience like how can

15:46

we convinced that lady to give up all

15:48

of a date or is it like freeway

15:50

fi the venue is like and i was

15:52

what what what do you think oh my

15:54

cod they say is sort of an advancement

15:56

from a technology perspective who would i feel

15:58

like i need to the money up the same

16:00

way every day in order to... I just got images of you

16:02

with your banking app just doing that. Yeah, pretty much. Like trying

16:04

to get a selfie out of it. I

16:06

think the lady there is echoing

16:09

what many people feel or not

16:11

actually as many people, not enough

16:13

people feel, your biometric

16:15

data is the most

16:18

important and I can't even sound like a cynical

16:20

old cow now, but it's the most

16:22

valuable thing you have. You lose your card, your

16:24

PIN, you just turn to a degree, you have

16:26

a social security number, right? These

16:28

things can be replaced. Someone hacks

16:30

into the central database where your fingerprints,

16:33

your, I don't know, your palm

16:36

vein information is, you're

16:38

screwed. It's hard to get new veins, yeah.

16:41

You know what I mean? But

16:44

don't get me wrong, we are already using it. This

16:47

biometric stuff is already there, you're using your thumbprint. What

16:49

it will take is just, you know, it's a bit

16:52

like when we use contactless and the tube went with

16:54

it and then after that we were all tapping and

16:56

going weren't we? I think it's just

16:58

about general use, do it when we open our

17:00

phones, we'll get there. I don't

17:03

think it will take much and then offer a 5% discount

17:05

for something and free Wi-Fi. We

17:07

sign up for everything, don't we, for that? That's

17:09

the thing, I'm pretty sure I've given away

17:11

every data point. Like I'd give

17:14

one of my kids if I could get

17:16

proper Wi-Fi, you know what I mean? Do

17:19

you know, is it just

17:22

reducing the barrier, you know, reducing the friction

17:24

to a level where people are like, yeah.

17:27

I really like the idea of people kind

17:29

of lining up a checkout and getting like

17:31

eye level with a POS machine, like, did that

17:35

work? Did it work? No, do it again, you know?

17:37

Yeah. Like I feel like one of

17:39

those things is just like I would love to see this in

17:41

action so I can have like a strong

17:43

opinion on whether or not I would do

17:46

it. If it was like nice and...

17:49

You kind of see it in action, go to Heathrow Airport

17:51

and go and try to get your passport to checkout and

17:53

then you always get the seek assistance and then have to

17:55

go to the really long queue. It happens.

17:57

Yeah, but those things are massive mechanical perks though, aren't

17:59

they? because there's basically just a bunch of blokes

18:01

in the background looking at your phone anyway. It's

18:03

not, it really is. It's

18:06

not automated at all. It's just they can

18:08

do it easier if they flash it up. But

18:11

I think we all start to think about, we're trying to

18:13

combat fraud, great. One way to do

18:15

it is your face or your fingerprint or your palm, but

18:18

then the other piece is at what expense,

18:20

your privacy. So then I think it

18:22

goes into this really dangerous territory about how much information

18:25

are we willing to give, where

18:27

do we then keep our own privacy in this whole piece,

18:29

and so it's this very, kind of,

18:32

we're in the cusp of giving away

18:35

absolutely every piece of information about

18:37

ourselves. And our, you know, the

18:39

pendulum's obviously going that way and we're going

18:41

that, and it's combat fraud, grand,

18:43

great. But then, you know, obviously the banks who

18:45

are doing it have to have the right infrastructure.

18:47

Do they have the right security measures in place?

18:49

Do they know how to store this data? What

18:51

do they do with it? So there's a lot

18:54

of big questions on, you know, JP Morgan, of

18:56

course, not really, massive company, we'll

18:58

do great, we'll be fine, but maybe

19:00

some other players in the market may not have that

19:03

same infrastructure to support it. Yeah, yeah,

19:05

it does feel like, I mean, I know,

19:07

again, I feel like every three or four

19:09

episodes I talk about Dave Burch for some

19:11

reason, but he seems to appreciate it, but

19:13

he's been banging on about identity for like

19:15

a decade now. People should probably listen to

19:17

it at some point, but, you know, the

19:19

idea that there isn't any proper central identity

19:21

capability, but again, back to the story, you

19:23

know, we asked the UK population if they

19:25

wanted that, they sort of freaked out, didn't

19:27

they? And there was pitchforks and fires and

19:29

all sorts of stuff. So, but it seems

19:31

like such a critical infrastructure piece, doesn't it,

19:33

JP? You know, if we had a good

19:36

identity scheme, so many of

19:38

the things would be so much easier, wouldn't they? Yeah,

19:40

well, I mean, a lot of

19:42

the digital transformation that's happened in India,

19:44

for instance, you know, is built on

19:47

a digital ID system, and it's kind

19:49

of unlocked a whole load of amazing

19:52

capabilities. So it's not like it's

19:54

not useful, But

19:56

culturally, it's, you know, it's hard to get

19:58

people, you know, we've... Heard we had a

20:00

here you know we we in a we were

20:02

talking backstage and we all kind of agree that

20:04

it's It's a cultural thing where you don't want

20:06

to have you know. If

20:09

you either don't want to centralize the

20:11

the you know you i'd identity information

20:13

or you don't want to put lots

20:15

of of your Id your biometric information

20:17

in lots of different places in of

20:19

as both of those scenarios feel feel

20:21

wrong for some reason culturally with with

20:23

with with with what we're doing more

20:25

we're doing now is it is in

20:27

exchange value thing you know because actually

20:29

in a we every fix our about

20:31

facebook and google knowing everything about them

20:33

and blah blah blah but you know

20:35

pay me for my data goddamn it

20:37

like as a matter is. That a boy

20:39

as dense. I don't think the payoff is enough

20:41

because you're like you know the chip and pin

20:43

to contact less. you know if this is a

20:45

major, realize just how much effort it was the

20:47

pre opinion and they know what? Yeah than the

20:50

apple Pay already to bring my wallet out so

20:52

I can just gonna be a stroll on my

20:54

house and not really care about it. And I'm

20:56

not entirely sure this is as like that. With.

20:59

A natural step up in in an

21:01

experienced enough for hims what we like.

21:04

Want. To take that additional gam then and

21:06

back into and into into this experience of

21:09

it's it's people that most benefit as say

21:11

ironically the people are less likely to use

21:13

it. People who have pets older that will

21:15

forget that pin forget that cause this is

21:17

actually quite useful. Levin's make any sense of

21:20

getting and the other thing that we haven't

21:22

really discussed here is just was the costs

21:24

going to be on merchants for this in

21:26

a. Unless you

21:28

go in one movements like we all

21:30

have facial recognition and will have palm

21:33

identity and will they have assessed. As

21:35

counter space will they have the technology space of in

21:37

which one. Are they gonna bring this? Going

21:39

to is what I mean. We're supposed co

21:41

op the other day that got video cameras

21:43

now screens in front of wouldn't take much

21:45

to switch button identify a face but then

21:48

he said animal dystopian saying that you know

21:50

you get a puppy by drink for you've

21:52

had too much I can send in your

21:54

eyes like okay or we don't like your

21:56

services have enough money. In. A

21:58

common in. All

22:01

of these I would is inevitable to be

22:03

several gonna go that way. Or the every

22:05

story tonight. Basically Texas Down some sort of

22:07

Black Mirror episode of an Air which is

22:09

quite so. It's quite scary. Donnybrook A as

22:11

I am an easy easy is it. it's

22:13

a good enough experience. Improvement as you say.

22:15

Like going from contract was going to be

22:18

using a thing with my phone to actually

22:20

my say says everything like test I mean

22:22

and I honestly I mean as the celebrity

22:24

on stage then Ashley's your faces out there

22:26

on Tv all the time. so like owning

22:28

your face adult actually your face by like.

22:30

Basket will be a risk isn't

22:33

it was anything that was voices

22:35

yeah, mean. I'm dust

22:37

is one was is everywhere your

22:39

area, you one synthesizer away from

22:41

being redundant that point. Oh my

22:43

God. He absolutely so you know

22:45

deserves to sense of allowed herself

22:47

feel like I'm just really scared

22:49

Georgie on stage at that point

22:52

that. Out. Of

22:56

says concern that. The

22:58

said, I think it's it's inevitable. This is how

23:00

secure. Is can read that stuff and I'm. I

23:02

didn't. That will it bring added benefit? Yeah,

23:05

live really do think sites as someone who's

23:07

still stuck to the doctor to not use

23:09

my card. Tapping stuff

23:11

not my sign of allies and discover

23:13

that life couple months guy revolutionizing made

23:15

my life but. I

23:17

don't like carrying more sign around and pans something

23:20

for some of my own and the zebra would

23:22

ever see the idea of. What's

23:24

going. Hasn't it appeals? To

23:26

me that beyond that slays the convenience

23:28

of actors like you say, oh my

23:30

god have you ever tried to get

23:32

your face and one of those things

23:34

for like supposed Saturday's like ethic it

23:37

again on sea sauce made my identity

23:39

necessarily being like not that there's a

23:41

security element. That. We haven't discussed

23:43

that. Yeah, but it's a it's a weeds is

23:45

a weed thing that we're essentially trying to replace.

23:47

You know of five pound note to or ten

23:49

pound note essentially with us. To.

23:52

Rent piece of glass that you carry around with you

23:54

all the time you know? like at first especially work

23:56

and ram students like I would advise. Just moved around

23:58

with the phone. Now we are in. It says i'm

24:00

what he thing I mean is it, is it gonna

24:02

catch on. I. Think so as the

24:04

user experiences as imagine you're trying to check out

24:07

an ecommerce website in the non said the say

24:09

second this is stops working. You.

24:11

Just get over.net. Nothing to do

24:13

that. So are you gonna have immense amount of. It

24:16

admit that lead people to be decision

24:18

of a sudden not something even if

24:20

you declining revenues. And succinctly. Is

24:22

a pin The I thought we don't want to deal

24:24

with this and they move on to get another website

24:26

and if I would have they want to fight to

24:28

delete any com or say source. you're in the shop

24:31

analysts and it goes down and that's your only mechanism.

24:33

What would you do? And they don't

24:35

take any more. Six and to love

24:37

suppose? So I think of

24:39

is enough night. This is. Gonna.

24:41

Be the future. It's not going away.

24:44

By. I think the biggest thing is

24:46

that what happens if he starts working?

24:48

What's these experience? You. Know good

24:51

point sitting there fiddling around. sit your face

24:53

into a circle for ten minutes. You're not

24:55

gonna wanna buy that thing in your back

24:57

anymore. your says the noises his son. We

25:00

we actually are. Bizarrely, we actually did lodges

25:02

testing for this one sirloin. Reader.

25:04

Can be as go in Helsinki. We did open

25:07

to consult a lawyer and it was how we

25:09

allowed people to pay for the ball. And.

25:11

I was I aware of an attack the hello

25:14

Alice so I just for like you know testing

25:16

ago progressively drunk her in order to see whether

25:18

they were faced with the end of it was

25:20

actually been picked up on or anyone from the

25:23

way through. So were you know either success or

25:25

failure on her for which one of as it

25:27

should have him but Sir Roy we better we've

25:29

got a move on low and we're gonna we're

25:31

gonna farm on the first off the show so

25:34

coming up on since I guess any news we

25:36

discussing it Miss Intentions Anesthetics youngest homeowner all. Of

25:39

the. Say

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details. Will.

26:16

The next season Like and Forty News

26:18

where we are recording lives in the

26:20

Village Underground and London audience make some.

26:26

Added. That that never gets old

26:28

like says it's always has. I feel

26:31

I just throwing it into the middle

26:33

of sentences just as easy Paying attention

26:35

of estate butts us. anyway. the next

26:37

story that we had was one that

26:40

was covered in a bunch of places.

26:42

but only news pick this up. Absences

26:44

worth sixty billion at risk of being

26:46

lost as people lose track of parts.

26:48

Ah Rubik serve as David Henderson at

26:51

any suggesting this one of I rumbling

26:53

since Ah new research conducted by the

26:55

Center of Economics and Business. Research on

26:57

behalf of Pension Be shows that

27:00

oversees billion pounds of being lost

27:02

as pop for being scattered across

27:04

first of and places that people

27:06

are worth it is me is

27:08

estimated are opting for a million

27:11

Pension Pots and eve hey on

27:13

now Missing which seems a bit

27:15

calloused business at The number of

27:17

Pension Pots has risen since the

27:20

launch of the Author and Roman

27:22

and Twenty Twelve when employers are

27:24

required to enroll employees into pension

27:26

schemes. The research also suggested that

27:28

the total number of is expected to

27:31

rocket by a hundred and thirty percent,

27:33

up by ah to twenty to fifty

27:35

which is going from one hundred and

27:37

six million. Two hundred and forty three

27:40

million. Ah Giorgio in to come to

27:42

you as the probably the most sensible

27:44

one of those for of his of

27:47

his sister. Billions of pin number in

27:49

it. Has. Enormous number

27:51

is someone to blame like and

27:53

we we inside yes is our

27:55

but all the blame for as

27:57

well as a snow of endless.

28:00

We're to same apart. This is a good news

28:02

story. This is a projection about what is going

28:04

to be like. And twenty fifty is Rudy losing

28:06

a lot of money or with lots slot of

28:08

pot so ready. The

28:10

four point eight million I think

28:12

is over ten thousand pounds. For.

28:14

Enabling pop over ten thousand pounds have

28:17

been misplaced. I mean they're still there

28:19

for you. Didn't go anywhere is just

28:21

the site than the good news Story

28:23

I mentioned was also Roman which yes

28:25

you can argue it's not going to

28:27

be enough. They met with saving and

28:29

but it's a start. but as Spm

28:31

is what we know enough, not as

28:33

the state pension. Ah so it's good

28:35

that people are being rolled. Into.

28:39

Force. Nothing a rope and since the that

28:41

from the workplace but itself means that with

28:43

the average number of jobs that we will

28:45

have to her last time was currently by

28:47

eleven but I imagine and Pts it'll poverty

28:49

be more than that. There are gonna be

28:51

a lot of posts that they're missing. We

28:54

move, we went, we change house. really see

28:56

how sick cetera. And

28:58

what have you gotten? A lot to

29:00

do? Any kind of as a finance

29:02

admin? Oh My. God. So. In

29:05

a not to be dull and

29:07

boring has is actually one of

29:09

my first tasks of lockdown. Woohoo!

29:12

Ah yes he spends and

29:14

base. Or there are other

29:16

consolidation you cannot see guys your current some

29:18

providers he wants it of Pennsylvania. I just

29:20

decided I would because I know them and

29:22

like the groups and and to solve their

29:24

weapons has had about five of them Now

29:26

I really liked it or like three or

29:29

four like the way it works but more

29:31

expensive. But I'm not a review of printed

29:33

base but the research is by pension base

29:35

so it would explain why a kind of

29:37

companies are office pensions and Consolidates is talking

29:39

about this. I'm making a big deal but

29:41

it is a big deal and I say

29:44

it's about engagement. This. One thing that we

29:46

all need to do is engage with our

29:48

pensions and before you go for. A

29:51

is it's a ticking time bomb. I to

29:53

say an eye on the same. For some

29:55

it's about fences. The best fun as soon

29:57

as I am the biggest for in the

29:59

room right? Oh my god it her again

30:01

with a gleam and game that's enough that

30:03

you do is take action and these parts

30:05

of the cassette they just sit around and

30:07

to get set the into they would have.

30:09

You don't claim s the government property get

30:11

it. From the fence or that

30:14

rather I get it or leave my family

30:16

fight die and as such a crazy say

30:18

that the free pension tracing service you need

30:20

must have insurance number your workplace or the

30:23

pencil provide a bit more lights for we

30:25

know where he works and. Hopefully.

30:27

They can find it for you than a sub. See what you wanna do

30:29

with it then? but that. That's. That's

30:31

the the as a foreign language, the average

30:33

the movies you used. Hopefully they can find

30:36

a D. I think that's the thing is

30:38

like always so disheartening about this is like

30:40

I'd on sci regulated Which means that everything

30:42

I have to say mean hopefully likely be.

30:44

As I say let us some of that

30:46

should be every kind of for you by

30:48

conquer and one in every single item I

30:50

will be Pension Pot the original. You know

30:52

I agree on the right exactly what it

30:54

is secretes the images. somebody sort of going

30:56

down the back of a sorry for trying

30:58

to find that creed they lost domain but

31:00

sense is a some. Is this just sort of

31:02

silly ways for people to don't know anything about financial

31:04

services or my the be somebody on our planet with

31:07

a nice jacket on that's my been exactly this is

31:09

typically such great also be may as well as I

31:11

am I i think he sort of i you buy

31:13

a could also be nice. I just think the

31:15

big thing we look at his most. it's paper

31:17

based still. so to Atone Road to get a

31:20

massive packet in the mail comes your house at

31:22

free at attention. He put that in a drawer.

31:24

Live human slack you go somewhere else is lost.

31:26

That packet and the next thing you know we.

31:28

Oh sugar. I don't know.

31:30

have not Pension Pot and I'm personal

31:32

anecdote the happened to me and I'm

31:34

still hunting down is missing Pension Pots

31:37

for my first thought when I moved

31:39

here in the Uk team. So fun

31:41

than incidences emphasising not well to seems

31:43

a little bit hazy. It's very paper

31:45

based. consolidation has happened to the some

31:47

for the great providers, the healthy consolidates

31:49

some people you don't what do you

31:51

do when it goes missing and who

31:54

do you call it when tensions Also

31:56

another concern and it goes into this

31:58

kind of black hole. Though I

32:00

think the big thing is is how do we

32:02

lean into making this? Smarter. More

32:04

like having better. Technology Having an old

32:06

Digitize stop sending leaflets in the

32:08

mail because I don't think that

32:10

necessarily helps and and kinda look

32:12

at the future. Of this shop. So

32:15

it sounds like I'm the one is going

32:17

out and save pension Dashboard which I was

32:19

really. I really didn't want to be the

32:21

better they said it. but because Georgia didn't

32:23

say I think maybe I should. Melodies and

32:26

space. Yes, this is a space. But

32:28

it's like this is the kind of this

32:30

is. This. Is the thing that

32:32

we're trying to that they want to

32:34

avoid by creating a Pensions dashboard? The

32:36

problem is that we've been talking about

32:38

this thing. For. A

32:41

of his ages. Ages ages ages

32:43

and you that when when I

32:45

was working at Buys we. Either

32:48

we were doing a lot of open banking based

32:50

stuff and we heard the murmurings of pensions as

32:52

horizontal. That could be an interesting thing to get

32:54

involved in, the, So we ended up in some

32:56

of these, like. Very. Weird

32:59

committee rooms ways you know,

33:01

representatives from pension providers in

33:03

the south. Anything like. This

33:06

is this. Is different to bring this is

33:08

different to banking is is a different like

33:10

like behavior to banks being around and open

33:12

banker you know pst to get a committee

33:14

and they're all a bit upset that you

33:16

know for they will will do it because

33:18

you mean told them. Then.

33:21

Not gonna do this by this is

33:23

never gonna have unless it's like a

33:25

very strong legal reason that makes them

33:27

do it. They're just never going to

33:30

play ball. This is never really gonna

33:32

happen at about what? Why is that

33:34

those suckers? Just you know. I mean

33:36

I've sold drugs before. bouncer is it.

33:38

Is it like term You know When

33:40

Peter Express says of amateur they like

33:42

argued over. Use this voucher. Enjoy. You

33:44

know, lights at like two Pension Reuters

33:46

presume a lot of people in know

33:49

they're going to use those mentions that

33:51

fool economics. Of far as right, Oh, is

33:53

there an evil overlord I sort of putting

33:55

on my side as I have? I don't

33:57

know, but I think that it is. Probably.

34:00

Down to incredibly antiquated businesses. You

34:02

know, whether it's incredibly complex, sell

34:04

on an activity that happens without

34:06

you knowing you know someone would

34:08

sell your pension to another person

34:10

and that happens in the background,

34:12

which is why I'm in Georgia.

34:14

Mentioned this to backstage reason even

34:16

Adams hurdles. You. Know this Henson tracing

34:18

to unlimited heard of it I often

34:20

service feel as exactly like how do

34:22

you know I don't even know about

34:24

it but I think when it comes

34:26

when you saying yeah hopefully they can

34:28

they can locate said it sounds like

34:30

sometimes. You. Know they complicated because of

34:33

this continuing like Enable Us insurance number. You

34:35

have to say that the processors numbers Christian

34:37

Fundamentalists are going to help you find that

34:39

salaries as I am your father is I

34:42

guess. We found that

34:44

I would we say very quickly because I've been

34:46

struck own sums Isis has to have another thing

34:48

is not right for for what it's double checked

34:50

d sick is excessive sets of the unknown I

34:53

know you enjoy it made sense and I'm not

34:55

has give financial advice or not provide access or

34:57

sentencing hearing this focus group river. Yeah

35:01

we we do have to put those disclaimers are

35:04

every so from are also I'm like the weapons

35:06

yet I like. You

35:08

never know. Soon as I as on come

35:10

get me feel good I mean is there

35:12

it is there more responsibility on those organizations

35:15

to make this easier as well So you

35:17

know your your point on. I mean Pinches

35:19

is an interesting Mombasa in line to payments

35:21

council when nobody wanted to do anything as

35:23

well. You know so it's isn't just somebody

35:25

needs to make them do this and are

35:27

and act about summer. Is there an evil

35:29

overlord? Paisley towards new figure. It's me

35:32

the government says at a government know

35:34

incentivized enough to make people do something

35:36

about this. This does not benefit the

35:38

governments of people to have a poor

35:40

retirement acetone. So. Outside you

35:42

know or don't think. I really think you

35:44

have far ahead the forward to sink into

35:46

the next lesson. Can something be done? Absolutely

35:48

that with. All. These ideas will take

35:51

time, commitment, take money, take admin worth, access,

35:53

access us as have been a lot to

35:55

talk about. Pop for Lice: Jeremy Hunt Civic

35:57

found the fast but then you have issues

35:59

way as. Are you gonna

36:01

have a less competition in the market, etc

36:03

etc. Is this gonna be west for consumers?

36:05

Are those with with for pensions gonna be

36:08

stuck with a rubbish ones eccentric cetera et

36:10

cetera. It's a headache, no one wants to

36:12

touch it and you could probably use the

36:14

ultimate the pretty much every area of our

36:17

lives that the minnesota come into politics and

36:19

money. And where do you start?

36:21

So I think that's the big things as

36:23

the his message to be able to solve

36:25

this thing isn't someone did, Can we The

36:28

magic wands and is all sorted? It's It's

36:30

extraordinarily antiquated. It's paper based. there's lots of

36:32

old systems that are going beyond this, and

36:34

it's complicated as. Things. Get thoughts on

36:36

and it changes the so. They're

36:39

going to have to be an evolution as how's

36:41

the this actually move forward? I mean, you with

36:43

the other industries in the financial services ingrained, you

36:45

don't. Like. The Crypto and all of

36:47

these really cool things that basketball tensions a

36:49

come to such. So the starting line, the

36:51

back and so. We. Have says

36:54

look at the financial services industry to

36:56

all lean into this together. It won't

36:58

be sort of this one. Person.

37:00

Coming and in solving it. When. I were

37:02

to say really quickly if you are an

37:04

employer years. To. Better.

37:07

My really like how your stuff about

37:09

pensions educate them about it gets them

37:11

are like a park when they arrived

37:14

and when they leave tell them all

37:16

the options that they can do. You

37:18

can set your pot with you potentially

37:20

in his own. New place, except or

37:22

educate his staff, because ultimately we can

37:24

sell governments there, we can stop his

37:27

stuff rather be waiting. Bloody. Long

37:29

time and it is our

37:31

teachers. That month's or a pool or

37:33

up for a feature, so as I

37:35

said if you're an employer, please doesn't

37:38

say much educate yourself on this. For.

37:41

For like a guy or of i'm

37:43

in Florida i'm eating so much marmalade

37:45

america so i was listening a that

37:47

i feel seen my bad. Of

37:51

a damaging it thrive. We better move on so I

37:53

don't think we've had our say on that one. It

37:55

sucks you need to find your pension one day on

37:57

he to do better with my last which is good.

38:00

Right oh isn't he is now primary city and

38:02

finally where we take bit of a look at

38:04

something a little bit or of peace and system

38:06

of i would have been to do a little

38:08

bit of a of hands against we do like

38:10

a little bit participation ah how many of you

38:12

of homeowners began to be the road or your

38:15

own home. I. Say like this is

38:17

like stealing your dates for this states is like

38:19

ah I what were you. Pass code

38:21

names are just so Keep your hands

38:23

up up again at Insights On down.

38:27

And keep your hands up if

38:29

he bought you first frame under

38:31

the age of forty. Guys.

38:35

Are under the age of thirty. Are

38:38

you lying about your age? Or

38:41

under the age of twenty five. Do.

38:45

You have which pirates know. How

38:48

about under the age of ten? You.

38:53

Lost without the context of this story. So

38:55

this was Pixar Others as you guys read

38:57

this in in Metro and eight year old.

39:00

It as year old has

39:02

become a stray be as

39:04

youngest Pomona after investing her

39:07

pocket money in property. So.

39:11

Excited to learn is s ce que

39:13

the I Q the Simpsons meme were

39:15

all the kids are looking back over

39:17

that says for a pod to say

39:20

the thing. Yes, Say three

39:22

years at three years ago eight

39:24

year old rebates and I feel

39:27

bad now. Sinai sell it as

39:29

they somehow listen to this looks

39:31

like that daddy's i'm appalled cause

39:34

I'm hurts You older siblings lumped

39:36

together six thousand a s de

39:38

from pocket money success Explain vulgar

39:41

married at to purchase a four

39:43

bedroom home. I

39:46

mean I was the deposit right? As

39:48

I say a four bedroom and a

39:50

prayer and others vs on some them

39:52

the cynical journalists on this one either.

39:55

Parents added see the deposit. Two thousand

39:57

pounds these for three is applicable Christmas

39:59

money. In a treacherous.

40:01

Really? A when he happens to be a

40:03

proper the.have to be property. Best that with a book.

40:06

I. Saw

40:08

a The Predator off the Kids

40:10

center on ago. Ah, leave. it's

40:12

exploitation near a money is. It

40:14

is the South as much as it's a money should be that.

40:17

He enjoys services. It is nothing to be

40:19

proud of. It's nothing in I

40:21

get is it's customize. On

40:23

my older it's services of this it's

40:25

ah and advisor some and in and

40:28

your life. When. He has been showing

40:30

up as a thought much about the story clearly

40:32

but you know a obviously was a lesson in

40:34

this. This. Guy's nothing to be proud.

40:36

Of that you spent save all of your pocket

40:38

money. At the age. Of six of spies

40:40

and yup, and of employees with opponents

40:43

without. Now I just love that you're

40:45

so pissed off about all and I

40:47

don't write as funny as high rise

40:49

funny and story of the nine hundred

40:51

of the I was like oh my

40:53

god why I find we the baddies

40:55

says if I gave my daughter's six

40:57

friends she would buy a house with

40:59

last I suppose I should buy a

41:01

lot of tic tacs you know, like

41:03

that's what a base and like some

41:05

squished memories or something similar you know,

41:07

reimbursed for the I do your parents

41:09

are like a fan of well as

41:11

a good or bad like really bad.

41:13

Is somewhere in the middle isn't as you

41:15

feel bad for not giving you a year

41:17

old daughter a house that Movement has said

41:20

yeah I can point Workout is a four

41:22

bedroom house and and as for a nickel,

41:24

six thousand pounds good my are worth about.

41:26

Nine. Hundred and fifty thousand for the done,

41:28

right? Yeah, there's a lot of sense since. And

41:30

secure. The other thing, the thing when I

41:32

read this is like what happens He got a rental properties

41:35

show up in your landlord a is all your life. Or.

41:37

I pay as you can negotiate that

41:39

runs yeah how do you do with

41:41

as a phone call your own, renting

41:43

a place and your monthly so really

41:45

did or adam yeah month my landlord

41:47

is a you know what? I. Thought

41:50

yards this episode I feel like they have

41:53

really defend you face a solo. Odds are

41:55

even zoc I run out up. You

41:59

mean sausage? Yeah yeah

42:01

so do some signs in the best. I mean

42:03

what would say when you were when you without

42:05

a so when you with ten pocket money will

42:07

we were we spending on. When

42:10

i was when as a his own gas

42:12

or the at the end of the road

42:14

where my school was was a was at

42:16

with a corner shop and they had the

42:18

most amazing pick and mix. but penny

42:20

sweet badly to buy tickets when he p like

42:22

pre mixed bag. Just. You to do

42:24

that was a time like know? Yeah, I'm always

42:27

on the books Cds. With

42:29

Islam Nice as a good size. A good

42:31

one for back right? I have. No idea

42:33

is is going to translate but in America we

42:35

had pugs. Is anyone remembers in the data. Disks

42:41

and then you get something called the Slammer

42:44

that with metal. A. We just. Did.

42:46

Blue circle with a metal. Portrait

42:48

How tragic. The Ninety's last semester to

42:51

receive our son were also another about

42:53

Tragic. I was like Super Incentives is

42:55

on the block and there was like

42:57

there was a round of applause for

42:59

Pope. Or

43:01

like we pulled stories about it. I'm you

43:03

know for next headline pious the others on

43:05

this story I much really looking forward to

43:08

when like revolution that seen offering of is

43:10

like the mortgage the mortgage products who fight

43:12

with really get on. this is it is

43:14

the new markets and to be plumbing so

43:16

much stuff into their apps now. Says go

43:19

now remove his his retention had my sister

43:21

has a year old says we sit around

43:23

and as you com own a property in

43:25

this country Mr by some sort of. Ownership

43:28

of the companies settled. It's Zetterberg Conservation

43:30

of yes we have interest or something

43:32

underrated sorry a boring per cent or

43:34

Miller says this on ruined it. Now

43:36

be part of sense and what he

43:38

does. Well I like the idea that

43:40

this was like an argument over breakfast

43:42

babbel our hands. You know it was

43:44

like you send your old enough to

43:46

live in your own house and. Then he

43:49

ends up investing in the housing giving them and

43:51

then it will The children live by in a

43:53

book or yeah I might be different. see of

43:55

the brewery household over breakfast on sing it about

43:57

what is your dirty birds, are you mad at

43:59

the pound? The just that the dinner table like.

44:02

And. As anything she has move I'll be

44:04

on a lot. although they do they know

44:06

how to cook service will not hear about.

44:08

Definitely let me get on. I think it

44:10

just all feels like a threat that go

44:12

out. kind of bizarre. But anyway Alma no

44:15

be better to include the show tonight or

44:17

that does conclude this live episode of in

44:19

Seconds or the News For everybody who's listening

44:21

to this way can people learn a little

44:23

bit more about all the good stuff you

44:25

do? Judy, where can people are more. Online

44:28

I don't know. didn't want the names of

44:30

months exhausted of lives in recess it but

44:33

I was too busy of a super senior

44:35

year old. Kids by properties. ah Google for

44:37

things in London and we will go. We'd

44:39

search history of estate. Better sanity be on

44:41

she's on this. ah I wake up People

44:43

are most. Clinton also linked in about

44:46

her bank as well so basically linked

44:48

in for me and are into their

44:50

bank and website. Their. Goods Jamie where can

44:52

people in a little bit more by. Well.

44:55

Darling said like like everyone else

44:57

but also if you are an

44:59

early stage syntax business. Is. Is

45:01

a plug. Of. Ah if you're

45:03

know he says been sick business you

45:06

can now send a protective eleven of

45:08

us. Go to

45:10

elevenofas.com/the Sea. And.

45:12

You'll be able to get in touch with

45:14

me directly. Through. That. Very.

45:17

Very good answer Me I'm was pretty

45:19

was looking on makes a mistake decision

45:21

for me over there old three. honestly

45:23

if you're in the range from you

45:25

ever the ball virtually as wealth and

45:27

signed me Thank you for everybody listening.

45:30

We really could not make the so

45:32

without you guys And remember if you

45:34

want to join the discussion on anyone

45:36

I've added you can find his on

45:38

pretty much every social media channels. Email

45:40

his own part of that eleven a

45:42

personal call from it's policy everybody.