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1:01

is Hemant and Jessica, and

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you're listening to the Friendly

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Atheist podcast. Please go to

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Patreon donors. They include Lori O,

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Nadia L, Amy H, Joshua M,

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and Sweet Afton. Thank

1:26

you so much for your support. Is that the

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Joshua who's from Owensboro? Sure, why not? We

1:32

write thank you notes to a lot of our donors,

1:34

and I wrote a weird thing about Owensboro

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because that's where my best friend is from. Sorry, Joshua, that was a

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weird thank you letter. Excellent. Good

1:41

week. Hello. Hi. Are

1:44

we good to go? Should we just start with the crazy? Yeah,

1:46

let's jump in. So, listen, I

1:49

took notes. Look at my notebook.

1:51

The notebook says half-assed

1:53

ideas. And so they are. Excellent.

1:56

Let's do it. Let's

1:58

start with a rundown. of Mike

2:01

Johnson's craziness. Do we remember

2:03

Mike Johnson? Yeah, no, not Secretary of

2:05

State. Close enough. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Speaker

2:07

of the House. So we know he's

2:10

a Christian nationalist. We have discussed Mike

2:12

Johnson as a Christian nationalist, a guy

2:14

who just wants to merge God and

2:16

government. This week, because he

2:18

has nothing else going on, and Congress is

2:20

not in session, even though it is, and

2:23

has stuff to do, like not shut down

2:25

the government soon. Sure. He,

2:27

on Tuesday, appeared at an event

2:29

for the National Association of Christian

2:32

Lawmakers. Oh boy. Which is a

2:34

group founded by Jason Raypert,

2:36

the guy from Arkansas. Who

2:39

we mistakenly called Repair for a long time.

2:41

We didn't know who the Colbert thing was. Girl, no.

2:43

Yeah. NACL, because they're

2:45

salt of the earth, of course. And

2:49

Raypert's group is all about

2:52

Christian nationalism. We need more Christians

2:54

in government. Yeah. Because that's

2:56

the problem with government. Not enough bishops in it. I

2:58

would love to look at an overview

3:01

of states led by strong Christian leaders,

3:03

and just check out just poverty rates,

3:05

education rates, et cetera. I'll beat you to it. It's

3:07

all of them. And so they

3:11

appeared at this event, big event. A lot

3:13

of anti-gay stuff said at this event. But

3:15

the thing I want to highlight is that

3:17

when Mike Johnson spoke at this event, he

3:19

talked about the things that were going through

3:21

his head when he was about to be

3:23

speaker. Okay. And I'll give you, I'm going

3:26

to play a clip for you of what

3:28

he said. Wait, I forgot to get headphones.

3:30

Of course you did. So

3:33

as he was talking, he was explaining

3:35

that he thought he would always be

3:37

a supporting player in the Republican party.

3:39

You know, he would be the errand

3:43

to the eventual Moses who leads the

3:45

way. I don't know that reference. That's

3:47

okay. Now you do. And

3:50

so he was actually surprised. He said that

3:52

he became speaker because he thought he would

3:54

be a supporting cast member, right? Not the

3:56

lead actor. And so

3:58

this is what he's going to talk about. And

4:00

I just want to highlight the way he

4:03

says all this stuff because I'll

4:05

bring it I'll I'll zoom out once we hear

4:07

the full thing It's a couple

4:10

minutes to listen to but just listen to

4:12

the way this guy talks about how he

4:14

feels God spoke to him You

4:45

It's not funny but there

4:47

you go spooky is a

4:49

funny word inherently You

5:07

My close personal friend was deposed

5:30

You He's

5:45

bad at telling stories can I say this

5:48

You All

5:58

right, I'm gonna stop it there but Just

6:00

to recap here, God spoke to this man

6:02

in the middle of the night. A four-year

6:04

story that I could have told in two sentences. It

6:06

was a blast at the party. Oh, by the

6:08

way, you know where this party took place? The

6:11

Museum of the Bible. The place

6:13

in Washington, D.C. founded by the Hobby

6:15

Lobby family. Yeah, I forgot about that.

6:18

With a bunch of stolen-ass artifacts. Oh

6:21

my god, that's miserable. Anyway,

6:23

so Mike Johnson is saying... Wait, hold on

6:26

really quick. Talking about the worst

6:28

fucking part of Christianity is a

6:30

bunch of scavengers going through the

6:32

Middle East robbing people of their

6:34

artifacts and stealing them.

6:37

Bringing them back to a tacky museum

6:39

in Washington, D.C., which is just the

6:42

least Christian place I can think of.

6:44

It's five shades of irony. So Mike Johnson's

6:46

like, God spoke to me in the middle

6:48

of the night. Which, by the way, if

6:51

you said this about anything except God, we

6:53

would say this is weird and messed up

6:55

and maybe you should get checked out. But

6:58

nope. God spoke to him many nights

7:00

and he's like, I need you to

7:02

help me out. God's speaking, like write

7:05

things down, plans, procedures, ways to pull

7:07

the GOP together. Sure. And then God's

7:09

like, I need you to like support

7:11

this guy and then the dude fails.

7:13

Support the next GOP guy. Nope,

7:16

fails. So he's telling him to do all... God

7:18

is speaking to him to do each and every one of

7:20

these things. Support all these men. You're

7:22

not the main guy. Stand in the

7:24

background. Be the errand to their Moses.

7:27

Can you quiz notes who the fuck

7:29

Aaron is? Doesn't matter. Come on, dude.

7:31

Give me a little bit. Like, I assume. Do you know

7:33

you have no idea who he is? No, he's

7:35

he's the guy who is

7:37

basically Moses's assistant in the Bible.

7:40

Okay. Like his right hand

7:42

man through the desert wandering. Yes,

7:45

I believe so. I did make a whole video

7:47

series on this, but that was a long time

7:49

ago. But yeah, that's the idea. And so I

7:51

feel like if God has you

7:53

supporting these people and then these people lose

7:55

over and over and over. Yeah. Maybe that's

7:58

a sign, but nope, not a bear. not

8:00

to Mike Johnson. And

8:02

then finally after four

8:04

failed sneakers, he's like

8:06

now step forward, which

8:08

is ominous. And then

8:10

he was immediately elected, right? Because

8:13

they had no other choice. They

8:16

settled for Mike Johnson. Mostly because...

8:18

Just like God wanted. God

8:21

was like, Mike Johnson, they're gonna settle for

8:23

you. To summarize, he's saying,

8:25

you're everybody's sixth choice. This is the

8:28

Christian spin on his party's inability to

8:30

pick a leader after one extremist, Gates,

8:32

used his power to boot out Kevin

8:35

McCarthy, who was the extremist already in

8:37

charge, and then three other extremists couldn't

8:39

rally enough support within the party to

8:41

take the previous extremist places. And

8:44

then this guy, Mike Johnson, was so

8:46

obscured despite his own extremism that the

8:48

extremist party finally settled on him as

8:51

a choice of last resort. Because who

8:53

else were they gonna pick at that point? At that

8:55

point, we're talking warm body with a pulse. Yes.

8:58

And he was the warm body who had,

9:00

like, who was basically obscure because he had

9:02

been in the shadows for so long. So

9:04

I'm not sure this is like a sign

9:07

that God wants him to be Moses. It's

9:09

a sign that the Republicans couldn't get their

9:11

shit together to find someone who actually knows

9:13

how to do the job. And in every

9:16

story, a really

9:18

convoluted and hard to understand sign

9:20

that really doesn't mean anything in

9:23

particular, and it's pretty open to interpretation. Fair

9:25

enough. But a sign nonetheless. Yeah, I mean,

9:27

if if this is the sign God is telling

9:29

you, maybe the sign is maybe you're in the

9:31

wrong line of work because you keep failing. I

9:33

mean, if there's anything we've seen in the headlines

9:35

coming out of Washington, DC, it's that Republicans don't

9:37

know how to do any of this right now.

9:40

They just lost this week. Two

9:42

of their members, like Kevin McCarthy is leaving by

9:44

the end of the year. George

9:47

Santos got kicked out. That was great.

9:49

They're down to like a two vote

9:51

majority. And that's assuming everyone else stays

9:53

in place and stays in line. Which

9:56

anyway, so this is what he's

9:58

saying. He says I'm Moses. God

10:00

wants me to be Moses,

10:02

which is a weird thing for anyone

10:05

to admit out loud that God wants me

10:07

to be one of the main characters in

10:09

the book. Oh yeah, that really is

10:11

main character syndrome. God spoke to me.

10:13

And also, can you imagine if the

10:15

story of Moses had the GOP as

10:17

the followers, instead of whoever

10:20

is following Moses, like, just

10:22

complaining and swearing and undermining

10:24

at each other, and having

10:27

gay affair behind rocks? I

10:31

would actually watch that show. The GOP is

10:33

much whiter than everyone following Moses in

10:35

the desert. See? There's your metaphor. Moses

10:38

is the guy who led his troops

10:40

through the desert wandering for 40 years

10:43

aimlessly. Wow, that is a good metaphor.

10:45

That is the metaphor, not a guy

10:47

who parted the Red Sea and led

10:49

the way for everyone to go through.

10:52

Man, so maybe you should make a video, because

10:54

that's a strong metaphor you just wove

10:56

for me there, like it. Apparently God

10:59

chose Mike Johnson to lead the charge

11:01

against refugees and already marginalized people, because

11:03

that's all they're doing right now. That's

11:05

up his alley. Here's the thing to keep in

11:08

mind with all of this, though.

11:10

Like, white evangelical zealots routinely compare

11:12

themselves or their leaders to biblical

11:14

characters. Oh yeah. He's doing it

11:16

with Moses right now. Donald

11:19

Trump was compared to the

11:21

King Cyrus, repeatedly. I have to

11:23

say, I did not hear that. Who the fuck is

11:26

Cyrus? Cyrus is basically a non-Christian

11:28

whom God put in place to

11:30

help the faithful in the Bible.

11:32

Oh, like a steward of kind of sort? Yeah,

11:34

you're helping. You're not the ideal pick. You're

11:36

not the guy who fits the mold, but you're

11:39

still helping us out. They also compared Trump to

11:41

King David, who was basically a sinner who

11:43

was still anointed by God to do his

11:45

work. Did they find that

11:47

to be a problem back in biblical times too?

11:50

Did they? Okay, go ahead.

11:52

They also compared him to Queen Esther,

11:55

ironically, Trump. They compared him

11:57

to Queen Esther, who basically saved the Jews,

11:59

and they're like... See what Trump is doing

12:01

for Israel? He's like the queen, which I'm sure

12:03

he loved. Even Vivek

12:05

Ramaswami now has leaned into the King

12:07

David comparisons, or at least evangelicals have

12:09

said that about him. Like he's not

12:12

perfect, he's that kind of brown, but

12:14

maybe he's God's way of

12:16

working mysteriously. The point is

12:18

like, why is this part

12:21

of their rhetoric? Because if

12:23

you compare yourself to a

12:25

biblical character, it makes it a lot

12:27

harder to criticize you because now

12:29

you're not just criticizing me or

12:31

my ideas, you're criticizing the Bible

12:33

and God's plan and how dare

12:35

you. It's a lot easier to

12:37

ignore Trump's crimes and ignorance and

12:40

cruelty if you just believe God

12:42

appointed this imperfect person to fulfill

12:44

his goals. And if Mike Johnson

12:46

says God told them to be Moses, then

12:49

all of his rash, irresponsible decisions can be

12:51

overlooked by all the conservatives who might be

12:53

really upset that he's kind of caving in

12:55

and not shutting down the government or whatever

12:57

it is they want to do. So

13:00

by the way, all of it worked for

13:02

whatever purpose he was speaking for. Like

13:04

if he thought I just want to win Christians over to

13:06

my side, more Christians, as

13:08

if they're not already. He said

13:11

absolutely nothing of some sense. After he spoke, Jason Raper

13:13

showed up on stage

13:17

to give him some award. It was

13:19

actually a piece of the Ten Commandments

13:21

monument that Jason Raper put outside the

13:23

Arkansas State Capitol. But the first version

13:26

1.0... They're trying to make

13:28

their own relics in real time, gang. Version

13:30

1.0 of the Ten Commandments monument, a dude

13:32

drove into it at full speed and destroyed

13:34

it. A Christian dude, if I remember correctly.

13:36

Christian dude drove into it at full speed

13:39

and destroyed it. Raper kept some of the

13:41

bones of that thing, gave part of it

13:43

as a relic to Mike Johnson this week.

13:46

Version 2.0, of course, is still

13:48

up outside the Arkansas State Capitol and

13:50

being litigated still years later. Anyway, Raper

13:52

went on stage, gave him the relic,

13:54

and said, it's very obvious to see

13:57

you are one of us. Which is

13:59

a... everything to hear

14:01

at that particular event. So

14:04

creepy. So that's... So creepy. That's the week

14:06

in Mike Johnson and that's just one

14:08

event. He did a bunch of other crazy

14:11

shit in Congress, but whatever, not our

14:13

beat. Aw, my student got into her dream

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college. Congratulations. Congrats, child I've never met.

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looking for an early holiday present for

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my parents, who are notoriously hard to

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my kids from a recent hiking trip,

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that was it. They turned it

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the artist, or at least in my

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me, and I got an email

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asking if I wanted to make any changes to

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the first draft, and it looked fantastic, so I

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didn't even need to make any edits. And

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when I received the paintings, like, they

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17:19

Let's talk about the Mormon church. Oh, I love talking

17:21

about the Mormon church. Oh, this is messed up. Okay.

17:23

Here's the story you need to understand to make sense

17:25

of what just happened. Well, the Associated Press

17:27

put out a story this week that made

17:29

a lot of headlines. It's important to talk

17:31

about. Here's the backstory. The woman's

17:34

name is Chelsea Goodrich. She's 31 years

17:36

old. She was

17:38

31 years old. In 2017, when

17:40

she was 31, Chelsea

17:43

told an attorney for the Mormon church

17:45

that her father, when she was a

17:47

child, her father, who was also a

17:49

Mormon bishop at the time, had sexually

17:52

abused her. Is a Mormon

17:54

bishop an actual title of substance? It

17:57

is like elder. It's a

17:59

lay person. didn't go to like seminary

18:01

or whatever. It's a layperson who is bestowed this

18:03

position of leadership, which means you get to do

18:05

some shit on behalf of the Mormon Church. You

18:08

get to listen to confessions among other things. And

18:11

glad they don't have training for that. None. So

18:13

Chelsea Goodrich tells this attorney that her

18:16

father had sexually abused her. And

18:18

in fact, she knew that he,

18:20

the bishop, the dad, had

18:22

confessed all that to his

18:25

bishop. So she,

18:27

now much older, having

18:29

processed what happened to her as

18:31

a child, was like, I

18:33

need to talk to you because I'm filing,

18:36

I'm going against my dad in court. And

18:39

I need this bishop, his

18:41

name is Michael Miller, who's the bishop

18:43

who heard that confession. I want him

18:45

to testify against my dad. That like

18:48

he knew full well what he was doing and

18:50

why it was wrong. So speaking

18:52

to the lawyer was Goodrich, Chelsea, and

18:55

her mother. They were all meeting

18:57

with this lawyer for the church along

18:59

with that bishop to see if the

19:01

Mormon Church would allow Michael Miller to

19:03

testify in that trial. Now

19:06

to be clear, at this point, the

19:08

church was aware of what he had done.

19:10

The allegations were public. Like he had been

19:12

charged with this. They had kicked him out

19:14

of the church. So

19:16

that is important. Not only is he not a

19:18

bishop, he's kicked out of the church for good.

19:20

But the family wanted justice. I don't care what

19:22

your religious reaction is. We

19:24

want him in jail. So

19:26

them and putting him behind bars. That's why

19:28

they wanted this bishop to testify. I

19:31

guess how that meeting ended. Tell

19:33

me. The Mormon Church

19:36

lawyer, who by the way, was

19:38

also the head of the church's

19:40

risk management division. That

19:42

sinister. That risk management division

19:45

in a church. For the church, yes. Can

19:47

you imagine? They have,

19:50

that's the cubicles they are in.

19:52

Oh my God. Bring him young would

19:54

never. LOL, JK. He basically told the

19:56

family, sorry. Nothing we can do here

19:59

because of course. Of course, anything revealed

20:01

in confession is confidential.

20:04

The Church is protected by what's

20:06

known as the clergy penitent privilege, which

20:08

says anything you say in confession cannot

20:10

be used against you. It's a secret.

20:13

That's why it's confession. Among the world's

20:15

worst laws. Yeah. Now, her

20:17

mistake, Chelsea's mistake here, was thinking the

20:19

Mormon Church's lawyer would be concerned about

20:21

her safety. About her? Yeah.

20:24

No, his job is literally protecting the institution.

20:27

Listen, we all make those mistakes, honey. They don't

20:29

give a shit about you. None whatsoever.

20:31

I do. I love you. And

20:33

the thing is, of course, the job is protecting

20:35

the institution, but that may have been why her

20:38

dad confessed to his crimes

20:41

through an act of confession. As

20:43

a bishop, he knew as well as anybody they

20:45

can't use this against me, and I will feel

20:47

better about myself. This is the thing

20:49

that I always bring up when we talk

20:52

about this confession stuff, is that truly the

20:56

reason people go to confession is

20:58

confessing things can be an unburdening

21:00

of your mind and your heart

21:02

and whatever. And so

21:04

giving people who do terrible things outlets

21:06

like this to be like, whew, all

21:08

right, well, God forgives me, so I

21:11

guess I'm fine, alleviates their guilt so

21:13

A, they can continue doing the thing

21:15

they've been doing, and B, they don't

21:17

think that they are doing anything wrong,

21:20

these motherfuckers. I just, it's

21:23

just, it's just so bad. It's

21:25

just so bad on its face, and there

21:27

is just no way for anybody ever to

21:30

talk me into the idea that this kind

21:32

of privilege should extend any more than mind

21:34

us to my therapist or a teacher. It's

21:36

just, it's infuriating. As in they have to report it,

21:39

it gets written to law. As in

21:41

mandatory reporting. Yeah. So because

21:43

the church would not make that

21:45

bishop available to testify, prosecutors

21:47

said we don't think we have a

21:49

solid case against your dad given the

21:52

information we have, so they

21:54

dropped all charges. Oh, neat. Good.

21:56

Good job, Mormons. You're really fucking nailing

21:59

it again. did not go to

22:01

jail for this crime. He did not suffer in

22:03

any meaningful way because of what he did to

22:05

his daughter. In fact, I learned

22:08

he's currently working as a dentist in

22:10

Idaho. Oh cool. Just dentisting. Now

22:13

here's the interesting tangent to all this.

22:16

These people, they protect the

22:18

worst. Why does everyone see

22:20

the pattern of protecting the worst people

22:22

for the... Okay, fine. So we will

22:24

get to that. The interesting thing is

22:26

after this story that she was accusing

22:29

her dad of sexually abusing her. He

22:31

was a Mormon bishop. That was public

22:33

information because she went public with the

22:35

allegations. When another woman

22:37

found out about those allegations,

22:40

she accused the same dad of

22:43

drugging and sexually assaulting her separate

22:45

from everything we just talked about.

22:48

And this case, in her case,

22:50

as part of a plea deal

22:52

to allow him to avoid charges

22:54

of sex crimes, he

22:57

was sentenced to 90 days in

22:59

jail and three years of probation.

23:01

Why? Because he used like a

23:03

sedative that dentists have access to

23:05

to knock her

23:07

out. Basically this guy... Did

23:09

he lose his license? He's practicing right

23:12

now. Again, this guy

23:14

admitted to a drug charge to

23:16

escape the more serious sex crime

23:18

charge. Is it possible for a white man to

23:20

get arrested? Never. There are none. I'm

23:24

just... I'm just

23:26

astounded. The law specifically

23:29

includes an asterisk that

23:31

says does not apply. I feel like

23:34

I've been inundated with stories lately

23:36

of white men being absolute monsters

23:39

and then going off scot-free after

23:41

due process. And

23:44

the thing is, even if she wanted to bring the

23:46

thing, like the prosecutors, they did not explain why they

23:48

didn't have enough evidence or anything. But their

23:50

argument is, well, it's been this long. You need

23:53

an ironclad argument that you

23:56

know this happened, whatever. If it's

23:58

just he says, she said, it's... probably not enough.

24:00

I mean, I don't know what the reason

24:03

was. But the reason I bring all this

24:05

up, that's your backstory. That's not even the

24:07

story? The Associated Press, two

24:09

of their amazing reporters when it comes

24:11

to covering the Mormon Church, Michael Rosendez,

24:14

Jason Deere,n they published an article this

24:16

week that basically not only retold this

24:18

story that happened in 2017, the reason

24:20

they know

24:23

all these details and

24:25

some more details is

24:27

because they've got access to

24:29

a recording of all the meetings

24:31

the Chelsea had with these

24:33

more the Mormon lawyer and that

24:36

Mormon bishop. Like you could get in

24:39

these are secret meetings they had to discuss how

24:41

to move forward with this case. Okay. Obviously the

24:43

church didn't do what they needed to do, but

24:46

they recorded all these meetings. She recorded

24:49

it. Now here's what they said. One of the

24:51

things they found that we did not know before

24:53

is that the church who

24:56

knew publicly that the Goodriches,

24:59

Chelsea, her mother, he

25:01

knew they were recording this for their

25:03

sake. Like I don't know if it

25:05

was a two parties need to know

25:07

sort of state, but they recorded it.

25:09

So four months later after he said

25:11

yeah we he cannot testify at your

25:13

dad's trial, four months later he offered

25:15

them a disturbing consolation prize of sorts.

25:17

He said we will give

25:19

you, the Mormon Church leaders

25:22

have told me I can

25:24

give you $300,000 if

25:27

one you destroy all the tapes of

25:29

our meetings. Wow. Two

25:31

you promise not to sue the Mormon

25:34

Church and three you present

25:37

this conversation right here did not

25:39

happen. Is this

25:41

the mafia? Yes.

25:44

Like holy shit.

25:47

So that was on the recording. That's

25:51

why there's a new article about this. That

25:54

was on those dumb dumb.

25:56

So how did the AP report? partners

26:00

get a copy of his tape that was

26:02

destroyed. Because here's the thing. For

26:04

Chelsea and her mother, $300,000, they

26:10

could not turn that away. I would not either. They took

26:12

them up on the offer. However,

26:14

it turns out also

26:16

at that meeting with Chelsea and

26:19

her mother and the lawyer and

26:21

the bishop they needed to testify

26:23

was one of Chelsea's close friends

26:25

who was basically serving as her advocate

26:28

there. He also recorded the meetings and

26:31

he didn't sign shit. Yes, yes, yes,

26:33

yes, yes, yes. And he's the guy

26:35

who shared the recordings with the associated

26:37

press. Let's have a national holiday for him.

26:40

Eric Alberti. Eric? Eric?

26:43

Eric? He's a church member who attended. Eric, oh

26:45

my God, you are so fucking brave and

26:47

smart. Good for you. He said. Good

26:49

for you, yay. He said to the reporters going

26:51

into this meeting with the lawyer, I felt like

26:54

it would be very clear once everything's laid

26:56

out that, look, this is not something we

26:58

want to cover up when

27:01

they said getting this guy to testify. Right. And

27:04

he said, this is something that we want to

27:07

uncover now for a number

27:09

of reasons so that the dad doesn't

27:11

do it again so that she, Chelsea,

27:13

can move forward. Covering this

27:15

up did not make any sense. Whoa.

27:19

So that was the friend. Okay, so

27:21

what are the implications of that?

27:24

So the implications are that that

27:26

conversation is just public now. Well, excuse me,

27:28

what's the fallout? Like what's gonna shake out

27:30

into this? In a statement to the Associated

27:33

Press, the church said the abuse of a

27:35

child or any other individual is inexcusable. Oh

27:37

my God, suck my dick. And

27:40

that John Goodrich, the dad, following

27:42

his excommunication, has not

27:44

been readmitted to church

27:46

membership, you guys. What else

27:48

could we do? We said he couldn't

27:50

come to our special club meeting, so

27:53

isn't that punishment? He's hidden from the

27:55

light of God and he can't see

27:57

our fancy temples on the inside anymore.

28:00

do think that kicking someone out of their club

28:02

is the worst kind of punishment. They literally think

28:04

hell is not having God's presence

28:06

not there. Like their barrier for

28:08

entry is wild to me. Yeah. Sexual

28:10

abuse they say is inexcusable but also they will

28:13

refuse to do the bare minimum to prevent sexual

28:15

abuse. Of course. Now there is an argument to

28:17

be made. Who could do anything about this? Yeah.

28:19

There is an argument to be made that like,

28:21

okay fine you don't have to

28:24

reveal what's said in confession because that's

28:26

what confession is. But

28:28

legally speaking couldn't you just say you

28:30

know what I'm gonna break this law

28:32

because it's good for everybody. And you

28:34

know what you mean? Like yeah. Yeah.

28:36

I'm gonna read a section of this

28:39

article. Okay. Reached by phone by

28:41

the Associated Press. Miller who's the

28:43

bishop who heard the confession. Miller

28:46

refused to discuss details. It's clergy

28:48

privilege she said if I

28:50

say anything John

28:52

Goodrich the dad can sue

28:55

me for millions of dollars. That can't

28:57

be true. That is what he said.

28:59

That might be true because in Utah

29:02

confession is exempt from all

29:04

those mandatory reporting laws. So

29:07

maybe he cannot be true.

29:09

That is wild. Maybe he's right

29:11

about that. However if you

29:13

were the church and you were saying

29:16

well we gotta do the right thing

29:18

here. Maybe you say we're the Mormon

29:20

church. We have back you up 30

29:22

gazillion billion dollars sitting in a giant

29:24

bank vault next door. Maybe we'll

29:26

take that hit on

29:28

behalf of the guy in our church. Like

29:30

we can go down in our Scrooge McDuck

29:32

basement and just like get a bucket of

29:35

gold coins for you and have them. And

29:37

that's worth it because what happened to

29:40

this woman is inexcusable. We just said

29:42

that. That was our word. It should

29:44

be to protect the young people in

29:46

our church. And if these guys are

29:49

going to be so fucking misogynistic at

29:51

least protect the women. Yeah.

29:55

That thing is the law as it stands is

29:57

on the church's side in terms of making sure

29:59

confessions. are exempt from the law,

30:01

but also the reason that law never

30:03

changes, especially in Utah, is

30:06

because who's lobbying to keep it in

30:08

place? It's the friggin Mormon Church who

30:10

owns Utah and the Catholic Church

30:12

in other states. Like yes, they're the

30:14

ones pushing to make sure this law

30:17

doesn't change. So you can say, yeah,

30:19

the law requires the church not to

30:21

testify in that trial, but also

30:23

the law is only there because the

30:25

Mormon Church wants it to be there. So they do

30:27

have blame it's a

30:30

point when you wonder, you ask if

30:32

the law is just right. Like lots

30:34

of things that are

30:36

kept saying, getting good trouble. The Mormon Church

30:38

is like, no, sorry, it's in the book.

30:41

No, you'll have to do the wrong thing.

30:43

What are we doing? What could anybody

30:45

do? The same AP reporters, by the

30:47

way, have been covering this particular topic

30:49

of sexual abuse in the Mormon Church

30:51

for a while. Now, last month, we

30:54

talked about how one of their other

30:56

articles where they wrote about how a

30:58

judge in Arizona tossed out a pretty

31:00

clear cut case of sexual abuse, precisely

31:03

because the judge said, sorry, the clergy

31:05

confession privilege rule says, I

31:07

have to side with the church on

31:09

this one. Like the church knows they

31:11

can get away with it, which is

31:13

also why bishops have access to the

31:15

internal customer service line for the Mormon

31:17

Church. And if you say someone just confessed to

31:20

me this horrible thing, what should I do? Who

31:22

air raid signal goes off and people fucking

31:25

pair storm into your windows. And who

31:27

answers the phone on the other end of the

31:29

line? It's lawyers for the church. Yeah, of course.

31:31

Who's job is protecting the church. And they duct

31:33

tape around your face and say, page

31:36

one of the manual, and there's only

31:38

one page in the manual says, oh,

31:41

the book says, just keep your damn

31:43

mouth shut. That's how we handle these

31:45

things. That's how the help line works.

31:47

It's called the help line. So as

31:50

the Associated Press also pointed out, 33

31:54

states offer an exemption for clergy

31:56

members. You know

31:58

what? Off the top of my head, I don't remember. I think

32:00

Illinois had an exemption for persium. I'm not sure. But

32:02

these are laws that require professionals like

32:05

teachers, like therapists, to report allegations of

32:07

certainly child sexual abuse to law enforcement

32:09

officials. And the Mormon Church, like we

32:12

said, and the Catholic Church, and Jehovah's

32:14

Witnesses, they have all lobbied lawmakers to

32:16

make sure that exemption doesn't go away.

32:19

Why don't they want it to go

32:21

away? Because they value secrecy more than

32:23

safety. Their dogma is more important to

32:25

them than another child potentially getting sexually

32:28

abused. The one that the Arizona

32:30

judge said, I can't do

32:32

anything about this because it was confessed in

32:34

a confessional. That was a case in which

32:36

children said, you got to stop this dude.

32:38

He confessed to the crime, like testify, let's

32:40

get him in jail. And then they said,

32:42

no, we can't do it. And

32:44

then more of the children

32:47

in his family were sexually abused. They're

32:49

now suing the church. That's what that

32:52

case is about. But again, like,

32:55

these people are so dead set on

32:57

saying confessions are a sacrament, basically, that

32:59

anything less the complete confidentiality, they will

33:02

say, is an obstacle to the

33:04

practice of our faith. I

33:06

mean, it's, oh, God,

33:08

it's just so, so

33:10

heartbreaking that these kids who are

33:12

suffering any kind of abuse,

33:14

whether it's sexual or physical or emotional or

33:17

mental, they're

33:20

not only being betrayed by their

33:22

parents or whomever is perpetrating

33:25

this, but they're just being failed over and

33:27

over again by the adults

33:30

in their life who are supposed

33:32

to protect the children. Like,

33:35

excuse me, I wasn't choking up. I just almost choked.

33:39

If the point of a church isn't

33:41

to keep its children safe, then what

33:43

is the point? Yeah, they

33:46

don't care. Now, the

33:48

Mormon church, it's despicable

33:50

for the Church of Jesus Christ

33:52

of Latter-day Saints posted on Facebook,

33:55

a much longer on Twitter, rather, they

33:57

posted a long response to the AP

33:59

story. this week that basically reiterates

34:01

their statement that I think they made

34:03

to the AP, but they

34:05

said things like he has not been, the

34:07

dad has not been readmitted to church membership. Guys,

34:10

we don't care if he's a church member.

34:13

Why do you think we give his shit if he can

34:15

go to your special house? They added

34:17

only the perpetrator, the dad, could

34:19

release the bishop from his obligation

34:21

under the clergy penitent privilege and

34:23

he refused to do so. Dad

34:26

wouldn't give us permission to tell everyone that he

34:28

confessed to his crimes. That makes

34:30

me want to punch somebody in the

34:32

stupid face. The church had

34:34

no role in influencing the prosecuting attorney

34:36

to dismiss the criminal case, even though

34:38

our bishop saying I can't testify is

34:41

the reason it was dismissed. Questions

34:44

about the status of the criminal case should

34:46

be directed over there to the local prosecutors,

34:48

they said. And then they added

34:50

in 2017, the church agreed to settle a

34:52

civil claim made by the survivor, that's the

34:54

$300,000 gift in a briefcase with glass of

34:56

glass. Nothing

35:00

in the agreement kept her from talking about the abuse

35:02

she suffered or the facts of

35:08

the case itself with anyone. So

35:11

like why are you mad at us? You're

35:14

a church, you're not supposed

35:16

to say we get

35:18

the bare minimum to care for somebody.

35:20

I'm not sure what else you expect

35:22

us to do. We only have literally

35:25

infinite money at our disposal. Like that,

35:27

I think

35:30

the thing that is like hashtag triggering

35:32

me about this is how exhausted

35:34

I am to just

35:37

watch people who have power

35:40

just throw up their hands like

35:42

what? What? Like you have

35:44

how many bridges have you burned? How many

35:47

lives have you ruined to gain power for

35:49

yourself and you're using it to what? Silence

35:52

a little abused girl? Congrats, dude.

35:54

I'm sure God is super proud

35:56

of you. That's definitely what he

35:58

had in mind. Mormon Jesus, very

36:01

happy. I'm just appalled, like how can

36:03

they look themselves in the mirror? These

36:05

fucking monsters! They can't.

36:08

It'll turn them to stone. That's how it

36:10

works. Pretty sure I read that in the Book of Mormon. Uh,

36:13

that's Medusa, not mirror. So

36:15

let's go to... different story.

36:17

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38:12

Did you ever do marching band? No,

38:15

I didn't. I was not good enough.

38:17

Okay, so I- We do

38:19

have listeners who are like big marching band. Hell

38:21

yeah. And I owe them a text actually. Sorry

38:24

guys. Freshman year of high school, I was

38:26

in marching band. It was fine. What? Wait.

38:30

Yeah. Don't skip over this. You played an instrument?

38:33

Trumpet, I'm very, very- I played the trumpet too,

38:35

high five. There you go. I quit in eighth

38:37

grade. It was fun. I

38:39

liked it and then I quit. But get

38:42

this, in eighth grade, when

38:44

I was about to go to high school in

38:46

a different state before my family moved, I got

38:48

to go to summer camp for the eventual high

38:50

school band I was gonna be a part of,

38:52

where you learn how to march for the football

38:55

halftime show and do your show and everything. And

38:57

here's the thing- Panis are dropping all over the

38:59

country. Well aware. Welcome to

39:01

high school for me too. So here's

39:03

the thing though, in eighth grade, when

39:06

I went to that summer camp, that band

39:08

that I would have been a part

39:10

of, had I not moved, they were

39:12

like an actual good high school marching

39:14

band that does like competitions and wins

39:17

awards and stuff. You were in, oh,

39:19

Kentucky? This was in Tennessee. But like

39:21

really good marching band. That part of

39:23

the country is into marching band culture. They're into college

39:25

football culture, which means they're in

39:27

the high school football culture, which means they have great

39:29

fans. If it takes place on a football

39:32

field. Yeah, we're all in. So here's the thing, I

39:34

learned how to march. I learned how to do formations.

39:36

I had the theme going. It was amazing. It's fun,

39:38

I bet. It's four year graft and

39:40

everyone has their part to play was very cool.

39:42

Anyway, like every high school marching

39:44

band kid who has done this before,

39:47

every college marching band person, they know

39:49

there's a theme to our halftime show.

39:51

Maybe it's something frivolous, fun, entertainment value,

39:53

whatever, there's always a theme. It's fun

39:55

because you have that theme going all

39:58

year long. Whatever. I've

40:00

never seen marching bands perform at like a

40:02

collegiate level. Oh, go watch the video. You're

40:04

in for a treat. Like they make a little

40:06

design. It's like, oh, it's a Valentine's theme. And

40:08

they make a heart with people. And then a

40:10

cupid. And it's an arrow. It's so fun. And

40:13

it's so precise. And it's really, really, really cool.

40:16

When it's done well, holy shit.

40:18

It's great. OK. Those messes, though,

40:20

are fun also. So

40:23

here's the thing. Of all

40:25

the ways we've talked about pushing religion in

40:27

public schools, you think about which ways do

40:29

they do it. Yeah, sure. We have coaches,

40:32

chorus, and kids into praying with them. You

40:34

have people trying to get 10 commandments on

40:36

classroom walls. We talked, I think, last week

40:38

about saying Christian prayers over the intercom. Stuff

40:40

like that. That's typically what you see. I

40:44

don't remember seeing one like this before, because

40:46

at a high school in Arkansas, they

40:49

just obviously ended their football season not

40:51

that long ago. But apparently,

40:53

this is Lake Hamilton High School in

40:55

the city of Pearcy. Their marching

40:57

band's halftime show? Guess what the theme was?

41:00

Jesus. Christian tent revival.

41:05

I want you to come around here. Every word got better.

41:08

Come look at the picture from

41:10

the halftime show so you can describe

41:12

it to all the people who have

41:14

no idea how you do a Christian

41:16

tent revival halftime show.

41:20

So we have one picture here that you will

41:22

describe in a second. And

41:25

you could see that they had places to sit

41:27

on, that they have

41:30

choreographically moved in the

41:32

shape of a giant cross. But tell us about

41:35

the banners that they are holding up. I've

41:37

never been more happy. One

41:39

says sinners repent in all.

41:42

Sinners beware. God damn it.

41:45

Oh, that's so good. What's the other one?

41:47

Repent now. Repent now. And then the other

41:50

one was just the tent revival. Holy

41:53

shit. There's actually another

41:55

one you could not see. It's

41:57

hard to read, but something about

41:59

blast. Oh boy. And

42:01

then the bench, I guess benches? They looked

42:04

like wooden pallets. Yeah, they were little benches that I think

42:06

they make the tubas sit on. But yeah, the

42:08

pallets were moved around to a

42:11

25-yard cross. Yeah, it's a

42:13

pretty big cross. It's pretty big. The

42:16

ladies are wearing long skirts and like

42:18

very, what would you wear in a

42:20

barn for a tinctrifival? Honestly, I would

42:22

not mad at the dress. Let me

42:24

look again. Imagine what you

42:26

think, fire and brimstone preachers and the

42:28

women who listen in those churches would

42:30

be wearing. Okay, so they're wearing girls.

42:32

They're wearing like little sassen

42:35

people. They're wearing like a little

42:38

peasant top. So it's square neck and a

42:40

little puffy sleeve. And then they're tucked

42:42

real tight into a nice like

42:45

A-line navy skirt. And then there's

42:47

like a matching little scarf

42:49

kind of tied around. It's a

42:51

V-neck. And the boys are also

42:53

wearing vests and suit jackets, which listen,

42:56

marching band as is, is very uncomfortable

42:58

with the clothing and whatever you have

43:00

to carry to put a suit

43:02

jacket on top of that. Yikes. But also, honestly,

43:04

now that I think about it, what our marching

43:06

band were was highly militaristic in a way that

43:08

maybe we shouldn't encourage. So,

43:10

oh, the other banner

43:13

that I could not read in the

43:15

picture is the path to righteousness. Oh

43:17

boy. Uh huh. Oh boy. Yeah. By

43:22

the way, the flags, there's also

43:24

a color guard as part of this

43:26

halftime show. And I do know how

43:28

to spin a rifle. I'll tell you

43:30

that right now. The color guard's flags

43:32

are like colored orange, yellow, red, very

43:34

fire ish symbolic. There you go. So

43:38

by the way, this is great. The

43:40

hyper gendered clothing here. Imagine if you're

43:42

a queer kid who is in the

43:44

band, like you're probably going to have

43:46

to pick one or the other, which is probably awkward. That's

43:48

very funny that that's your first thing

43:50

is like, someone pointed this out to me.

43:52

I got a gender defy, as opposed to

43:54

like the threat of burning howl

43:56

is not sort of the overarching

43:58

problem here. the thing I

44:00

watched the whole show during one of

44:02

their football games that's up on YouTube.

44:04

Not to take away from queer kids

44:06

who have to like make weird choices

44:08

about Jesse, but guys, they're threatening you

44:10

with internal damnation. So

44:15

I watched the whole halftime show and the thing is, it's

44:17

a kick-ass marching band. They're very good at what

44:20

they do. I don't doubt it.

44:22

They have nothing else to do in that

44:24

town. So there was

44:26

a guy on TikTok, one of many, who was

44:28

like, what the hell did I just watch? But

44:31

he pointed out that the way

44:33

he was introduced to this is

44:35

not because he was watching the

44:37

football game. It's because he was

44:39

watching the Bands of America Grand

44:41

National Championships, which is like the

44:43

Super Bowl for marching bands. Gang,

44:45

we have tournaments for everything. We

44:47

have cornhole tournaments, USA. So he's

44:49

like, is this a marching band

44:52

routine or about a tent revival?

44:54

I want to be clear on public school. This is very

44:57

much a public school. So

44:59

after this was brought to the attention of

45:02

the Freedom From Religion Foundation, they have this

45:04

week sent a letter to the school district.

45:07

And what the letter says, among other things,

45:10

religion is a divisive force in public

45:13

schools. Choosing a religious

45:15

theme and props for marching band

45:17

performances alienates those non-Christians, students, teachers

45:19

and members of the public whose

45:21

religious beliefs are inconsistent with the

45:23

message being promoted by the school.

45:26

These students certainly should be commended for

45:28

their hard work that led them to the

45:30

semi vinyl of Bands of America Grand Nationals.

45:34

But there are plenty

45:36

of appropriate secular alternatives that the

45:38

band director could select that would

45:40

utilize their clear work ethic and

45:42

talent more appropriately. I

45:46

spoke to Kat Grant, who is

45:48

an equal justice works fellow with

45:50

FFRF. And they told me, this

45:52

is not the only religious themed

45:54

marching program they've seen. the

46:00

only one titled Revival, which

46:04

surprised me. I had not known this is

46:06

a new way. They're getting religion in the

46:09

public schools. Every episode was just these stories.

46:11

This is so much better than me getting

46:13

mad. One thing I did check

46:15

out. I'm waving fire

46:18

flags. Fire flags. So again, the

46:20

high school band I was a part of,

46:22

we did not do Grand Nationals or anything

46:24

like that. But if you go to the

46:26

competition's website, it turns out there's a nonprofit

46:29

group that oversees this competition. Guess what that

46:31

nonprofit group is called? Oh boy. Music

46:34

for all.

46:36

Which just seems very

46:38

ironic given this particular thing. So ring it a

46:40

bit. Who thought, you know what we should do

46:43

for a theme? No, everyone else is doing Star

46:45

Wars and like the Game

46:47

of Thrones theme. Let's do

46:49

fundamentalism. Oh boy. Who's idea

46:52

was that? Oh, if you had

46:54

to choreograph a marching band, what would you do?

46:56

My answer is I would make them do Tetris.

46:59

I have seen that. You're

47:03

lying. I thought that was just

47:05

original. Go Google marching band Tetris.

47:09

They beat you to it. So good.

47:12

Well, then you say one. What would yours be? Never

47:16

thought about it. Don't know. You're so good

47:18

at improv. I know. I

47:20

do like the entertainment themes like

47:22

pick something funny. Do video games,

47:25

whatever. Everything everyone knows because

47:27

the point of a halftime show is

47:29

just entertain the audience. Yeah. That's it.

47:31

Let's let tubas do their little dance

47:33

and like we'll move on. An ocean

47:35

thing. Oh yeah. Because they can do

47:37

like fun with like the waves. That's what I would

47:39

do. Yeah. With the big instruments, let's

47:41

make them move more. Marching is

47:43

hard enough as kids. You

47:46

didn't mean like up and down. I meant you're looking at, it's

47:48

like you're looking at a cutout of a, you're looking at a

47:50

fish tank. That's the field. Oh. So

47:52

they're just, when they move right to left, they're going

47:54

up and down. I have some vision. I mean, at

47:56

this point you could do a Satanism theme. I

47:58

mean, truly. We're gonna be a good

48:01

we want to try to bait some like anti

48:03

ACLU plays we can just do that and

48:05

see how that goes That

48:07

would be pretty fun. I'll do another fun one

48:09

for you. Yeah. Let's keep this train rolling.

48:11

You remember Kirk Cameron Oh So

48:15

back to you those baby blues right now Anytime

48:19

conservative Christians say you know the

48:21

secular thing that's popular. We have

48:23

an alternative to it and it's worse

48:25

It's always worse Noticeably

48:28

work boy bands move they have

48:30

boy bands Movies

48:33

you can always tell a Christian theme

48:35

parks our can counter compared to Disney

48:37

World Which is what they want to

48:39

be like it's always worse than the

48:41

original they can't compete and how could

48:43

they because in rock They're great their

48:45

mission is we gotta stick Jesus in

48:47

all these places where you don't need

48:49

Jesus I will say the

48:51

only church thing that the thing that's better

48:54

with God than was out wrapping Mm-hmm.

48:56

I want my stuff. I Just

48:59

you like your rapping for Christ, you know, it's

49:02

sort of my jam. Okay,

49:04

I've heard way too much Christian rap Why

49:07

why did you pick this life for your time? I

49:10

asked myself that every day Thanks

49:15

mom, yeah, okay, so Kirk Cameron, how

49:17

is he entering this right? Cuz he's

49:19

already done bad Christian movies He's

49:21

already done bad Christian everything on

49:25

TV Right on

49:27

bad Christian TV secular

49:29

TV Has

49:33

he done bad reality TV Oh His

49:38

latest gambit is to offer

49:40

a right-wing Christian ish alternative

49:42

to my cast network to

49:45

scholastic book fairs That's

49:48

so funny this just came a scholastic

49:51

book fairs just came up recently Are

49:54

those two things those are very

49:56

much less I fucking tell us what

49:58

a classic book fair is People who

50:00

don't live anywhere in the United National

50:04

thing yeah, pretty much a national getting

50:06

his grubby hands I hold a hundred

50:08

scholastic holds up more than a hundred

50:10

twenty thousand book fairs every year With

50:13

over a thousand books to choose from

50:15

on a rotating base So what

50:18

I need people to understand is that scholastic fair

50:20

is not just a day. It's like a month

50:22

You get Like

50:25

the chintzy is little pamphlet with so it's

50:27

a place that comes in for I think

50:29

two days And

50:31

they set up a classroom with like a

50:33

shit ton of books. Yes, like we will

50:35

bring all the books to your school

50:37

We'll send someone there to collect all

50:39

the money It's

50:42

the books your kids love so yeah And

50:45

so we got these like it was like kind

50:47

of newspapery and God my friends and I would

50:49

like mark those things Like you

50:51

would not believe and then you go in and you

50:53

get and you tell your parents daddy I want this book mommy.

50:55

I want this many money, and it is You're

51:00

at an age where it's kind of you one of your first

51:02

financial transaction You know like right like the first

51:05

time you're in a quote-unquote store by yourself, and

51:07

you have your ten dollars And I told mom

51:09

I was gonna get there and seen Barry said

51:11

oh, maybe I'm gonna get Anna Morrison said those

51:13

are wildly different Actually, that was a weird comparison.

51:16

I made but I Love

51:18

that's like genuinely. I'm getting such an

51:20

a Get

51:35

to I mean everyone it's kind of a

51:37

win-win for everybody because they get to sell

51:39

their books across get their kids introduced All

51:41

these books. Oh, it's the best they get

51:43

all these new eyeballs 50%

51:46

up to 50% of the proceeds goes back to

51:48

the school so the schools like yeah come on

51:50

in sell books Give us some of the money

51:52

that sounds great. I don't think it's been

51:55

like proved to be nefarious or anything It's

51:57

not it's what I mean. It's what it's a straight. Oh

51:59

It's something that remains wholesome. Thanks

52:02

fucking advice. It was

52:04

wholesome until all those right-wing

52:06

conservative groups said like books are

52:09

bad for kids. Yeah. Because they include characters

52:11

who are not Jesus. They do. The learning.

52:13

They do learning. And we hate that. Yes,

52:15

this one has a character who is gay

52:17

and that's going to make my child trans.

52:19

I don't know their logic. It doesn't make

52:21

sense. But. Well, they're correct. They

52:24

involve LGBTQ characters and

52:26

by they I mean like

52:28

books. Involve like

52:30

LGBTQ characters or plots that

52:33

involve racism or age-appropriate discussions

52:35

about sex or questions you

52:37

might have about stuff. Conservative

52:40

groups don't want any books available to

52:42

any kids. And they'll go out of

52:44

their way to make that happen. That

52:46

is happening now. So Kirk Cameron who

52:48

says Scholastic is they

52:51

are controllers in part of the

52:54

woke matrix. That's a direct

52:56

quote from him. That is.

52:58

Wait. Did you say did you say

53:00

elastic controllers? They are controllers

53:02

in part of the woke matrix.

53:04

I don't know what that means. I

53:07

mean those are definitely the whole buzz. I

53:09

have not heard matrix being

53:11

used. That genuinely

53:13

is a concerning thing to hear because

53:16

that starts to feel out of touch

53:18

with reality in a way. Well. And

53:21

it's beyond a Christian fundamentalism. Let's

53:23

keep a close eye on our

53:25

friend Kirk. So he's pushing. Not

53:28

well. He's pushing a different group

53:30

saying schools don't do Scholastic book

53:32

fairs. Why don't you do Skytree

53:34

book fairs. Skytree. What

53:37

does that mean? It's just

53:39

a different company. And if you look at

53:41

the biblical reference. No. They're

53:43

like we're also a book seller. And

53:47

we also have lots of books available for

53:49

kids. Just go last Excel. Any

53:52

books that talk or discuss that religion

53:54

or Christianity or is there. I

53:57

don't I don't know much about the company like

53:59

is there an overture. policy I wonder.

54:01

It's what's popular what we think will sell. I mean it's

54:03

a company. And there hasn't been a

54:05

controversy of they refuse to sell to

54:07

carry something. Not that I know of. So he's going

54:10

after Scholastic for no specific reason. Because

54:12

they're the king of the hill and

54:14

he's going after them because he's like

54:16

this is they're selling books with characters

54:18

or concepts that we think are immoral.

54:21

I just wanted to get context

54:23

of like if he was baited

54:25

into something. Well, well, oh boy.

54:28

Skytree happens to. We

54:30

talked about Brave Books, which

54:32

is the company that puts out Kirk Cameron's

54:34

children's book that he didn't write, but he

54:36

just took his name on. Well, Brave Books

54:38

has like its creative

54:42

expanded Marvel universe. And

54:45

so in their universe of

54:47

Freedom Island, Skytree is

54:49

a place in that cinematic universe

54:52

of Skytree books. So these

54:54

two companies, it's free. You just

54:56

made up. No, no.

54:59

What? Freedom Island is the imaginary

55:01

universe where all of the Brave

55:03

Books books take place. And

55:05

by Brave Books, I mean, they publish

55:08

Kirk Cameron's book that's written by like

55:10

a ghostwriter, but it puts his name

55:12

on it as well as books by

55:14

Dan Crenshaw, the Republican

55:16

congressman Dana lash, the NRA

55:19

spokeswoman, Dinesh D'Souza, Kevin Sorbo,

55:21

all the right wing crazy

55:23

activist types with the foot

55:25

in Hollywood ish. All

55:27

them who are complaining about not

55:29

having a platform while I constantly have to watch

55:31

their stupid face. Ever. Right. Yeah. Go. Yeah.

55:33

That's brave books. Skytree is named after

55:36

a place in Brave Books. I see.

55:38

And those two companies are linked. Basically,

55:40

Skytree book is a company that exists

55:42

to sell Brave Books, which is a

55:45

conservative media outlet. The Oderobudo. So that's

55:48

like her Cameron wants schools

55:51

to replace Scholastic with

55:53

this, which is like saying

55:55

you don't need a Walmart in your town.

55:57

I got like a very tiny bodega, right?

56:00

right here with three items

56:02

inside. And it's the same

56:04

thing. Just taking.

56:06

That's such a good comparison.

56:09

That's exactly what it's like. Like, oh, I

56:11

have this little cart. Like, I have a fruit cart.

56:13

Like, I'm sure there's some nice shit

56:15

on the fruit cart. But also, I could get fruit

56:17

in there as well. Yeah. And

56:20

so Skytree is now celebrating that last

56:22

Saturday they had their first book fair

56:24

in a public high school in Virginia.

56:28

And this is a school board where

56:30

they have removed books when conservative moms complained

56:32

about it. Kirk Cameron was there for the

56:34

book fair. And the thing is, if

56:36

it was just one book fair

56:39

replaced, like, no one would care. But the

56:41

goal here is obviously world

56:43

domination. Yeah. The book's offered

56:45

by Kirk Cameron's group here. And he's on their

56:47

advisory board. Yes, love to hear about these guys.

56:50

It's all quote unquote traditional themes

56:52

with stock characters. Like, they never

56:54

discuss any aspects of humanity that

56:56

you know they don't understand. And

57:00

the thing is, I've seen some of their books too.

57:02

I've read some of their books. They're

57:05

children's books, yeah, because they

57:07

have animal anthropomorphized animals

57:10

and, like, simple language.

57:12

But they're not creative. They're not memorable.

57:15

They just think if you write a

57:17

regular story with a couple of animal

57:19

characters, that's all you

57:21

need to do. Do they at least

57:23

rhyme? No, they're just shittily written books.

57:27

They're not memorable. Your kid could read that

57:29

book and would think nothing of it. But

57:31

they will not remember that book. I

57:33

mean, yeah, so much of what kids consume is

57:35

just like in one ear out the other. It

57:38

is content for the sake of content. There's

57:40

nothing about those books anyone cares about. Oh

57:42

my god, content for the sake of content is a.

57:45

Is the name of our podcast. First

57:48

of all, how dare you. I prepped

57:50

for like five minutes before this podcast by

57:52

opening a bottle of wine for you. Thank

57:54

you. Go ahead. Skytree Books,

57:56

another problem with them. They will not. I

57:58

forgot. Done with it. They

58:00

will not tell you what books they are

58:03

making available at their fairs. So you have

58:05

to go in line? Like that little flyer

58:07

you mentioned? The most important part? Yeah, they

58:09

don't put that out there because I think

58:12

if you saw what books they were promoting

58:14

or who it's by, everyone would be like,

58:16

wait a minute. Yeah, I don't know. So

58:18

they just don't do it. According

58:21

to an article about this, Skytree Book

58:23

Fair Coordinator, whoever, whoever, provided

58:25

a short list that included,

58:28

quote, brave books. And

58:33

they included... Is that all they brought? Do they

58:35

have licensees in rights or anything? They included a

58:37

couple other books that they have nothing to do

58:40

with like Daniel Tiger books which are popular with

58:42

kids. Like some other ones.

58:44

This is from the article. She

58:46

also mentioned, quote, Star Wars. Though

58:49

it was unclear what book she was referring

58:51

to in the sprawling universe owned by Disney.

58:54

The Star Wars book, you know. The

58:56

Star Wars book. My favorite

58:58

book. We read it every Christmas. Also

59:01

from an article, Brave Spokesperson, Aaron Kierkowski

59:03

confirmed that Skytree carries its books along

59:05

with over 20 other

59:07

publishers but did not provide

59:09

the names of those companies upon request. I do

59:12

not feel like enough publishers if I'm being honest.

59:14

Like they probably don't want to release the

59:16

list because their game plan will become too

59:18

obvious. Like are there religious

59:21

books in the mix? Yeah, probably. What's

59:23

the ratio of like explicitly conservative books

59:25

to ones without an explicit political or

59:27

cultural agenda? We don't have to tell you

59:29

that. What they will

59:32

say is we will not

59:34

carry anything published by Scholastic. So

59:38

take that Scholastic. Take

59:41

that. Like the biggest

59:43

fucking publishing company in the world. We

59:45

will not carry anything. What

59:48

we carry. We won't carry

59:50

anything that's not age appropriate or

59:52

uses sexually explicit language or

59:54

images or causes gender confusion

59:57

or that's racially divisive. Which

1:00:00

is a weird way of saying

1:00:02

like no gay characters. We will

1:00:04

not mention anyone's skin color cost

1:00:07

cost Like

1:00:09

we're that's all no that's

1:00:11

divisive if you bring that

1:00:13

up And

1:00:16

age appropriate again, what's age appropriate in

1:00:18

their minds purity until marriage? So what?

1:00:22

Are you there goddess me Margaret? No, that's

1:00:24

for the heathen You say age appropriate, but

1:00:26

you're also telling children that they're damaged to

1:00:28

hell and they're born center as I learned I

1:00:30

watched the marching band has It's

1:00:41

so good, I love them so I'm

1:00:43

not worried that Skytree will replace scholastic They

1:00:45

have nothing of value to offer But you

1:00:47

can bet some of these school districts with

1:00:49

right-wing school boards who are gullible enough to

1:00:52

believe children are under threat Yeah, they have

1:00:54

exposure to books will accept

1:00:56

this offer to come to their school Skytree

1:00:58

said in a statement we have over 100

1:01:01

schools lined up to host book fairs

1:01:03

this spring Which is

1:01:05

more than one a lot

1:01:08

less than what was it? 120,000

1:01:10

but there they got a start not somewhere else, but it's

1:01:13

not zero as

1:01:15

one librarian put it on Twitter Skytree

1:01:18

book fairs and brave books seem to

1:01:20

be targeting the parents not

1:01:22

the children Yeah, which is true like the

1:01:24

books might sell but the kids won't be

1:01:26

excited to read them and doesn't that negate

1:01:28

the whole Point of book fairs, so

1:01:31

that's interesting, but they don't care about book fairs,

1:01:33

right? They don't care about Educating

1:01:38

these children they care about homogenizing

1:01:40

like what is available to human

1:01:42

making sure kids read only what they have

1:01:44

pre-selected for them Hmm, it's

1:01:46

so absurd. So here's one more addition Like

1:01:51

it's so like shoveling during a blizzard

1:01:53

like that's a give up the fight

1:01:55

dude There's other people than white people

1:01:57

around here like that's not

1:01:59

changing One other side piece to this. There's

1:02:02

a wonderful substat called Popular Information

1:02:04

written by Judd Legum, a

1:02:07

really great reporter. They actually wrote about Skytree

1:02:09

as well this week, but they had a

1:02:11

different thing to focus on, which is that

1:02:14

in the Conroe Independent School District

1:02:16

in Texas, there was a

1:02:18

clip. It was actually published by

1:02:20

Skytree Books on Twitter, and

1:02:23

they said, I'm reading the tweet. We

1:02:25

keep hearing kids are old enough to

1:02:27

choose books responsibly, but this

1:02:29

clip from a school board meeting

1:02:32

in Texas proves otherwise. Find out

1:02:34

how one innocent kiss in a

1:02:36

scholastic book led this young lady

1:02:39

to porn addiction. And

1:02:43

they have a one minute clip of a

1:02:45

woman talking about, we can't,

1:02:47

I don't have that here. But basically all she

1:02:49

said is she read a book when she was a

1:02:51

kid. It had this, I saw the

1:02:53

book, it's like a prince kissing a prince.

1:02:55

It's nothing. It's a kiss. And she said,

1:02:58

that made me curious. And then I began

1:03:00

searching for that stuff. And that led me

1:03:02

down this path to porn addiction or something.

1:03:04

What does porn addiction mean? In

1:03:07

her mind, I don't know. But here's the

1:03:09

reason I bring that up. Her name, the

1:03:11

woman that spoke, is Lana Burkhart. And the

1:03:13

reason she was mentioned in this article in

1:03:15

Popular Information, because one, she said

1:03:18

that book that she read, it's called it's

1:03:20

called Drama. She said she wants that out

1:03:22

of kids hands. She wants the district to

1:03:24

remove that book from the shelves. Oh, and

1:03:26

by the way, remove all scholastic books from

1:03:28

their library. Okay,

1:03:30

baby, baby meat bathwater. And the

1:03:33

book fair that you have with

1:03:35

scholastic, what she didn't

1:03:37

mention, and what Skytree didn't mention when

1:03:39

they posted that clip of her speaking,

1:03:42

and what Popular Information did mention,

1:03:44

is that Burkhart's rant,

1:03:47

the Burkhart, the woman who delivered that

1:03:50

rant is the public relations coordinator for

1:03:52

brave books. She

1:03:54

works for the company. My

1:03:57

God. And Skytree is like this. young

1:04:00

lady had a thing and you should

1:04:02

all watch what this young lady like

1:04:04

she's a random woman who just happens

1:04:06

to I promote their entire

1:04:08

mission. I am so embarrassed for her that

1:04:10

my skeleton has just departed from my body and

1:04:12

it is currently waiting for me on the

1:04:15

moon for when this episode is over.

1:04:17

Oh by the way I am so

1:04:20

embarrassed for her I oh my

1:04:22

god I'm cringing oh wait wait

1:04:24

I got one more I got one

1:04:26

more for you. Popular information also found

1:04:29

she was home schooled why

1:04:31

would she have asked her to a

1:04:33

scholastic book fair? Oh girl

1:04:36

and she assigned she gave

1:04:38

her real name apparently

1:04:40

she gave her name so

1:04:44

it worked though her little rant and

1:04:46

the promotion by Kirk Cameron's group here

1:04:48

worked because the conro school board's lead

1:04:50

is talking poor women into

1:04:55

being like yeah I was totally addicted

1:04:58

to porn because I read a book

1:05:00

and there was a smooch and that's

1:05:02

it and now I'm addicted to porn

1:05:04

hi I'm Jess it's me here's my

1:05:06

address porn addiction at just shot drive

1:05:08

like to

1:05:10

what well

1:05:13

here I'll tell you to what these

1:05:15

people these grifters the conro school board

1:05:17

heard her little rant and they voted

1:05:19

to restrict that book called drama from

1:05:21

all students in eighth grade and younger

1:05:24

and one of the school board members

1:05:27

Melissa Duncan she suggested hey

1:05:29

you guys why don't we

1:05:31

replace scholastic with sky tree

1:05:33

book fairs and what

1:05:35

did burkhart say to that in response

1:05:37

all glory to god so

1:05:40

it worked her little rant

1:05:42

the astroturf rant it worked

1:05:44

it's so embarrassing it's

1:05:46

so okay I just want to can

1:05:50

we just take a step back to where we were a

1:05:52

couple minutes ago with the Mormon church yes so

1:05:55

the people in charge

1:05:57

of the Mormon church are like

1:06:00

Yeah, sometimes kids get molested, but what

1:06:02

are we gonna do about it? And

1:06:04

then these people are like, um,

1:06:07

if children think about

1:06:09

a gay person, it's gonna ruin their

1:06:11

entire life and their pee pee is

1:06:13

gonna fall off. Yeah. Like, is this

1:06:15

weird? Like, what do you think kids can

1:06:17

handle or not? So you think a

1:06:20

kid can probably break through being molested

1:06:22

by their father, but

1:06:24

they're really gonna hit a stumbling

1:06:26

block on a YA novel. Yeah.

1:06:29

They have such little faith in their kids

1:06:31

and their kids' abilities and their minds. Well,

1:06:33

and their own teaching and their own

1:06:35

ability to instill, like, a moral backbone

1:06:38

into their kids. Mm-hmm. Like, I feel...

1:06:41

That's them for you. Fucking people.

1:06:44

I was having so much fun a couple minutes ago, remember?

1:06:48

I'll give you a fun name to work with for the next one.

1:06:50

Oh, great. Thank you so much. You're welcome. This

1:06:52

next story involves an Oklahoma

1:06:55

man. Oh. His name...

1:06:58

His name... Dusty

1:07:00

Deavers. Now,

1:07:02

that is an

1:07:04

out-standing cowboy name. Yes. So

1:07:06

he is... Dusty

1:07:09

Deavers. Woo! He

1:07:11

is running for... I'd read that romance novel. I'll tell

1:07:13

you what. Stop it. Sorry,

1:07:16

he's a monster. As a friend pointed out,

1:07:18

should have had a B in his name

1:07:20

over and over. That's

1:07:22

the porn name you want. There

1:07:24

it is. He's running for a

1:07:26

vacant Oklahoma state senate seat. He

1:07:28

is the Republican nominee in this

1:07:31

very safe red district. Mm-hmm. And

1:07:33

one of the things worth pointing out is,

1:07:36

okay, so this guy's about to be in

1:07:38

the state legislature. It's all but guaranteed, it

1:07:40

seems. It seems.

1:07:42

The election, special election, is on

1:07:44

Tuesday. So, it's coming

1:07:46

up. Last year, he

1:07:49

delivered a sermon where he

1:07:51

railed against... Oh. Ooh,

1:07:53

ooh, ooh. Girls

1:07:56

were in pants. Close. Yeah? No.

1:07:58

Oh. In vitro, fertile... And

1:08:01

I'm gonna play this clip for you because the

1:08:03

language he uses is wild. Okay?

1:08:09

Part of which is anyone who gets

1:08:11

IVF done because you have infertility. By

1:08:13

the way, in vitro fertilization

1:08:15

basically is the procedure where a

1:08:17

sperm and the egg are joined

1:08:19

outside the body in like

1:08:22

a petri dish, laboratory dish, and it

1:08:24

helps couples who are infertile struggling with

1:08:26

other health problems and that's all well

1:08:28

and good. The problem for

1:08:30

the anti-abortion crowd is that in the process, the

1:08:32

embryos that are not

1:08:37

implanted inside a uterus later may

1:08:39

be discarded, they may be placed

1:08:41

in a freezer, and they think

1:08:43

that's murder. So this

1:08:45

is what he's railing against. Let's

1:08:48

play the clip and you can hear for yourself how

1:08:50

he talks about all this. Okay. I

1:08:52

want to ask and answer the

1:08:54

question, what must you and I do

1:08:57

to love our IVF

1:08:59

embryonic neighbors as ourselves?

1:09:01

Oh boy. Oh

1:09:04

boy. Today is with our creator's

1:09:06

help. Wait for it.

1:09:08

Graciously to bring before your conscience

1:09:11

the harsh realities of IVF so

1:09:13

you will respond by faith, in

1:09:16

faith, by loving your embryonic

1:09:18

neighbor. Embryonic neighbor. Still

1:09:21

going. Well, we've

1:09:23

heard why it should matter. Oh, let's hear about our neighbors. The

1:09:25

needs of our embryonic neighbors

1:09:27

unnecessarily are being led to

1:09:30

slaughter every year by IVF

1:09:32

and assisted reproductive

1:09:34

technologies. Wait for it. And

1:09:37

countless others are cryo-incarcinated in

1:09:39

frozen prisons. Oh my God.

1:09:41

We are creating cryo-orphans for

1:09:43

the sake of biological offspring.

1:09:47

Cryo-orphans. Oh

1:09:49

my fucking Christ.

1:10:00

in your own image leading you

1:10:02

to flirt with means of procreation

1:10:04

that fail to uphold the sacredness

1:10:06

of human life that

1:10:08

would lead these embryos or your

1:10:11

children to death or a

1:10:13

freezer or deliver them up to

1:10:15

destructive experimentation in the name

1:10:17

of science. Here's

1:10:19

the worst part. What? If discontentment is

1:10:22

driving you to accept the destruction or

1:10:24

freezing of your own embryonic

1:10:27

children you are

1:10:30

waging an assault against

1:10:33

God your creator And

1:10:36

you're doing it through his image bearers Wait,

1:10:41

is he not better than 10,000 children

1:10:43

who look like you and carry your

1:10:45

DNA? All

1:10:49

right So let me

1:10:51

recap for you there to me. Uh-huh January

1:10:55

of 2022 with that chairman disassociating

1:10:57

from my body right now. I'll

1:11:00

recap for you man. Just

1:11:02

try to call Embryos

1:11:05

say it again embryonic or

1:11:07

fail our embryonic neighbors.

1:11:10

They are being slaughtered and

1:11:12

others Slaughter they are cryo-incarcerated though. That's

1:11:14

not the word he used because he

1:11:17

doesn't know the big word in frozen

1:11:20

prisons cryo-incarcerated and

1:11:23

we are creating cryo orphans do you

1:11:25

think they use a Do

1:11:28

you think he's a Judas cryo embryo? Do

1:11:30

you know what that is a Judas goat?

1:11:32

They lead the other goats to slaughter That's

1:11:34

what I'm imagining It's a little

1:11:37

embryo that like leads all the other embryos to

1:11:39

slaughter then comes back and gets rewarded and then

1:11:41

brings the next round That's a real thing. By

1:11:43

the way in goats. Anyway, like a horror movie.

1:11:45

It's true. So it's our monsters. I love them.

1:11:48

Nice And he also

1:11:50

says anyone who has IVF is waging

1:11:52

an assault against God and you're doing

1:11:54

it Through what does

1:11:56

this mean his image bearers, which is

1:11:58

like you wanted children who look

1:12:01

like you and your partner so that's

1:12:03

why you had IVF instead of adopting

1:12:05

or anything like that so not only

1:12:07

are you like sticking a middle finger

1:12:09

in God's face you're doing

1:12:12

it through kids who look like

1:12:14

you and what's more

1:12:16

important is it better isn't God better

1:12:18

than having 10,000 children who

1:12:21

look like you and carry your DNA

1:12:24

why do you want those kids by the way how

1:12:26

many IVF babies does he think people have yeah

1:12:28

first of all that's why second of all

1:12:30

what there have to he

1:12:33

has to be speaking to somebody statistically

1:12:35

who has used IVF or was born

1:12:37

via IVF right like I

1:12:39

mean this is just a straight-up sermon in

1:12:41

church to the wife but like certainly

1:12:44

like certainly there is somebody who

1:12:47

in the people in the reach

1:12:49

of his voice had to have used

1:12:51

it or have

1:12:53

been born by it and like

1:12:56

how could you possibly reconcile that

1:12:58

in your brain we

1:13:00

talked a few weeks ago about a woman

1:13:03

who tried to rent space in a Catholic church

1:13:05

and then they googled her and found out oh

1:13:07

wait she supports IVF and the Catholic church does

1:13:09

not and she didn't know

1:13:11

that but now she's making a big stink about

1:13:14

it as she should but that's the thing like

1:13:16

these people they only ever care about imaginary beings

1:13:18

that are not born yet it's so what

1:13:20

was the phrase like the this is a

1:13:22

phrase the unborn don't have

1:13:25

any need the unborn are a really easy

1:13:27

population to go to bat for because they

1:13:29

don't ask for anything they don't cost anything

1:13:31

you don't have to build infrastructure for them

1:13:33

they can just be these little precious angels

1:13:36

that were the big bag of atheists are

1:13:38

all in your mind which by the way

1:13:40

in Christianity if

1:13:42

those babies are aborted or

1:13:44

die they go straight to

1:13:46

heaven so explain to me

1:13:48

why that's worse

1:13:50

so you're saying we should burn up

1:13:53

all petri dishes in the name of Christ

1:13:56

I mean sure I don't give a shit at this point like

1:13:58

if they're they're medical But

1:14:00

to your point there are definitely conservative Christians

1:14:03

who have used IVF So

1:14:07

the thing is all of this is

1:14:09

especially relevant at a time when Oklahoma

1:14:11

bans all abortion from the moment of

1:14:13

fertilization That's the

1:14:15

law in Oklahoma with the one exception being

1:14:18

when the mother's life is in danger Which

1:14:20

means you get to make that call make

1:14:22

that call how far along the death spectrum?

1:14:24

Does she need to be before they step

1:14:26

in yeah, as if death is just like a

1:14:28

binary and not like a process The

1:14:31

state's Republicans who are in charge there.

1:14:33

They say the bans on abortion do not

1:14:35

apply to IVF procedures

1:14:38

well Why a lot

1:14:40

of it's not their strong what makes a difference? But

1:14:43

this guy is about to join that legislature And

1:14:46

if he raises a fuss that we

1:14:48

need to make the abortion ban even

1:14:50

more extreme Then what's

1:14:52

stopping them from going even further?

1:14:55

There's nothing Witness

1:15:00

takes over some state and they

1:15:02

blend they banned blood transfusions Like

1:15:05

we can't just let people's weird

1:15:07

specific whims dictate law Yeah,

1:15:11

he's about to join the legislature and some

1:15:13

of you don't want to vote because you're not

1:15:15

excited about Joe Biden Fucking

1:15:17

god, I I will not hear

1:15:19

it. I will not hear it

1:15:21

this election cycle I am exhausted

1:15:23

and it hasn't even

1:15:25

started. I will not hear anti-democratic

1:15:27

bullshit from people on the left

1:15:30

I'm too fucking tired and too

1:15:32

fucking scared Go ahead

1:15:34

according to I assume dusty Divers and

1:15:36

his people the only I forgot here

1:15:38

that don't name Three

1:15:41

seconds the only acceptable pregnancies have

1:15:43

to occur between a man and

1:15:45

a woman who are not

1:15:47

related maybe within

1:15:49

the context of marriage and You

1:15:52

know the age of marriage. I don't

1:15:55

know what it is in Oklahoma may

1:15:57

not be They're not

1:15:59

too concerned can only conceive in

1:16:01

the missionary position. That's the law. That's

1:16:03

how it works. It's just,

1:16:07

it feels like the kind, when

1:16:09

they do things like this, it feels like the kind

1:16:11

of person who has a, like

1:16:15

has a speech of argument and it

1:16:17

gets backed into a logical corner and

1:16:19

it's like, no, fuck you. No, I'm

1:16:22

going all in. Yeah, I, yeah,

1:16:24

yep, yep. IVF embryos are also

1:16:26

children. What's up now? I'll

1:16:28

look at his campaign website. This

1:16:31

is obvious, but he's fully opposed

1:16:33

to gun safety measures, vaccine mandates,

1:16:35

environmental concerns, basically all the ways

1:16:37

that would make sure actual humans

1:16:39

have a healthy, happy life. He

1:16:41

opposes all of that. Do you want

1:16:43

to hear something real gross? I was

1:16:45

driving down 88 today and I

1:16:47

saw a big black pickup truck with

1:16:49

a bumper sticker that had a bullet.

1:16:51

I assumed like an AK bullet. And

1:16:54

it said on top, I promise just

1:16:57

the tip. So

1:16:59

anyway, gun control now. That

1:17:02

guy probably has an AK 47. Lovely.

1:17:06

Neat. Right wing watch also found a clip

1:17:08

of Dusty Deavers speaking. And he's threatening everybody

1:17:11

on the highway. Why does nobody take

1:17:13

that seriously? You can't just blanket threaten

1:17:15

everybody. Go ahead and done. Deavers said in

1:17:18

a recent appearance on some interview

1:17:20

show as a candidate, he said,

1:17:22

quote, I want to see pornography

1:17:24

abolished. I want to see no

1:17:26

fault divorce. Come back to at

1:17:28

fault in divorce, meaning it would

1:17:30

be harder to get to work. And

1:17:33

even public shaming for those who

1:17:35

are at fault in divorce. I

1:17:38

want to see abortion abolished. I'm so sorry, I yelled

1:17:40

right into the mic. Public

1:17:42

shaming for the faulty

1:17:45

and divorce. Because as you know. So if a guy cheats,

1:17:47

he wants him to put a fucking sandwich board like

1:17:49

Bruce Willis. Yeah, and as everyone

1:17:52

who's been divorced knows, it's

1:17:54

only ever one person. Always.

1:17:57

I've never heard of cancer.

1:17:59

people being wrong or just not right

1:18:01

for each other. God, could

1:18:03

you imagine anything so horrible? There's always a good guy

1:18:06

and bad guy. And then he added he doesn't

1:18:08

believe in separation of church and state because

1:18:10

Christ is the ruler of all the kings

1:18:12

of the earth. You didn't have to tell

1:18:14

me. And therefore civil government must always operate

1:18:17

under the presupposition that Christ is Lord. That

1:18:20

guy is going to be in the Oklahoma legislature after

1:18:23

Tuesday or whenever he's sworn

1:18:25

in on a stack of Bibles. I hate

1:18:27

this. Yeah. Good time. I hate this

1:18:29

place. One last story for

1:18:31

you. I figured I will end on

1:18:34

a happy note. The

1:18:36

question mark in your voice leads

1:18:39

me to be very suspicious. No, this

1:18:41

is, this is, uh, I was surprised

1:18:43

by the story. It was a good

1:18:46

surprise. Uh, there is an

1:18:48

all women's Catholic school in Indiana, uh,

1:18:51

St. Mary's college. Wow.

1:18:53

That must be the only St. Mary's college in

1:18:55

the United States or Ireland, but they're actually

1:18:57

facing a lot of backlash right now because

1:18:59

they said beginning in the fall of 2024,

1:19:01

they will begin accepting trans

1:19:04

women. Hey,

1:19:06

that's great news. Right.

1:19:08

So apparently back in

1:19:10

June, this school whose mission by

1:19:12

the way, is to quote, empower

1:19:14

women through education at all stages

1:19:16

in life. They said, we're updating

1:19:18

our non-discrimination policy so that admission

1:19:20

would be considered for anyone quote,

1:19:23

whose sex is female or who

1:19:25

consistently live and identify as women,

1:19:27

which it says trans women. I sure love this

1:19:29

a whole lot. Yeah.

1:19:32

So that part, at first I'm

1:19:35

like, wait, that seems unusual for the

1:19:37

Catholic anything. Um, I was wrong. Like

1:19:39

that was actually not shocking. Private Catholic

1:19:41

schools, this is what I found out,

1:19:44

routinely open their doors. I

1:19:46

should say this is not surprising.

1:19:49

Private Catholic schools routinely open their doors to

1:19:51

students who are not Catholic and

1:19:54

people who oppose Catholic doctrine and who don't

1:19:56

fit the church's idea of a true Catholic.

1:19:58

I got my grad school. from

1:20:00

a Catholic institution because none of it mattered because

1:20:03

I just got my I took my classes and

1:20:05

then I left you know what I mean yeah

1:20:07

not weird um but that's

1:20:09

how Catholic institutions colleges especially that's usually

1:20:11

how they work in practice like there's

1:20:13

a divide between what they do and

1:20:16

like the church hierarchy and it's kind

1:20:18

of necessary because if the church said

1:20:20

you can't come to mass or do

1:20:22

the rituals right if you don't agree

1:20:24

with us on abortion or gay people

1:20:26

or trans people whatever then those churches

1:20:29

would be much emptier than they already

1:20:31

are if the Catholic

1:20:33

colleges and and universities and

1:20:35

stuff they don't require you

1:20:37

to abide by their thinking is well we

1:20:40

have certain principles we as a foundation yeah

1:20:42

on our faith but after that we function

1:20:44

as a regular college pretty much it's not

1:20:46

like you have to go to mass or

1:20:48

something um so and

1:20:50

as I've said many times here before

1:20:52

many practicing Catholics who call themselves Catholics

1:20:55

in the US they are far more

1:20:57

tolerant than the Pope or the Vatican

1:20:59

61% of US Catholics

1:21:01

support marriage equality the church says you

1:21:03

can't 76% of them believe society should

1:21:07

be accepting of homosexuality even

1:21:11

though the church says homosexual acts are

1:21:13

intrinsically disordered when it comes to trans

1:21:16

people the church says they don't exist

1:21:19

the Vatican says trans identities

1:21:21

seek to annihilate the concept

1:21:23

of nature but 37% of

1:21:26

US Catholics do acknowledge the existence of

1:21:29

trans people which is low but that

1:21:31

is in line with America but it's

1:21:33

also 37% higher than what

1:21:35

the Vatican was right so the point is

1:21:38

for this college to admit trans women it's

1:21:41

not that radical for a big

1:21:43

Catholic institution because Catholic institutions do

1:21:45

this sort of thing and this

1:21:47

is what I found out according

1:21:49

to the website campus pride there

1:21:51

are 22 historically women's colleges that

1:21:54

do admit trans women and

1:21:56

that includes all women's Catholic

1:21:59

schools like in

1:22:01

Minnesota, the College of St. Benedict

1:22:03

and St. Catherine University, and in

1:22:05

Wisconsin, Mount Mary University, three other

1:22:07

Catholic women schools that already admit

1:22:10

trans women. And they don't lose

1:22:12

their Catholic certification or whatever, or

1:22:14

is this what we're getting to?

1:22:16

We're getting to it, but like, the

1:22:18

truth is they function pretty much independently.

1:22:21

They are not run by the church.

1:22:23

Yes, of course, because the diocese covers

1:22:25

churches, and

1:22:28

I guess I know. But not necessarily, like

1:22:31

the colleges would function separately. But then

1:22:33

what makes the college Catholic? They

1:22:36

can say we're a Catholic school or we're under

1:22:38

this order or whatever. And they don't have to

1:22:40

be, or to aim? But the Vatican doesn't control

1:22:42

us. That's why the

1:22:44

professors might, they might have to sign some

1:22:47

statement of faith or saying like, yeah, I

1:22:49

accept whatever. That this place does

1:22:51

that. Yeah, that this place does, it's not

1:22:53

liberty. Like you don't have to abide by

1:22:55

every. Yeah, there's not like a social code

1:22:58

without like women can't wear pants or whatever. But the Katie.

1:23:01

Trousers. Katie Conboy. Katie

1:23:03

Conboy is the president of St. Mary's

1:23:05

College. And she said that, you know,

1:23:07

they put together a task force that

1:23:09

considers, how are we gonna handle this

1:23:11

when it comes to housing considerations,

1:23:14

community education? They're gonna figure

1:23:16

this out. But she said,

1:23:18

I relied on an executive team and

1:23:20

others to make sure our message is

1:23:22

not only in line for best practices

1:23:24

for college students, but that it encompasses

1:23:27

our commitment to operate as a Catholic

1:23:29

women's college. And she said,

1:23:31

the school's 33 board member, board

1:23:33

of trustees fully supports the change. They're

1:23:36

the ones who approved it. And then

1:23:38

just to kick everyone while they're down,

1:23:40

she's like, I'm just doing what Pope

1:23:42

Francis wants because her letter to students

1:23:44

said, the Pope advocates for love as

1:23:47

the appropriate approach to those who are

1:23:49

different from ourselves, which is

1:23:51

a, Wow. For

1:23:53

what it's worth. Woo. Pope said

1:23:55

earlier this year that gender ideology, this

1:23:58

is a direct quote. Ideology. ideology

1:24:00

is one of the

1:24:03

most dangerous ideological colonization

1:24:06

I think it's the guy driving around my

1:24:08

neighborhood with a fucking AK on his back

1:24:10

or whatever they put them but then

1:24:12

in October the Pope also said trans

1:24:14

people in certain situations could be baptized

1:24:16

they could be godparents they could serve

1:24:19

as witnesses for Catholic weddings which not

1:24:21

exactly an ally he's not really affirming

1:24:23

but that is a far cry from

1:24:26

saying trans people don't even exist which

1:24:28

is the rule book it's not zero

1:24:30

yeah so the school doesn't think they're

1:24:32

being hypocritical because the Pope has repeatedly

1:24:35

differentiated between caring for people who are

1:24:37

LGBTQ like remember who am I to

1:24:39

judge and affirming who they are which

1:24:41

he does not do but if

1:24:44

you're running a Catholic College then

1:24:47

allowing then allowing people who are

1:24:49

trans or who identify as trans

1:24:51

into your community you're not actually

1:24:54

breaking any Catholic rules you

1:24:57

know what I mean now if you

1:24:59

said for example yeah we have an

1:25:01

LGBTQ group on campus a lot of

1:25:03

Catholic schools across the country have that

1:25:05

because being gay not

1:25:08

a problem but that's a

1:25:10

far cry from saying yeah we support

1:25:12

same-sex marriage they can't do that yeah

1:25:14

they won't say we're okay with gay

1:25:16

sex they won't say that they won't

1:25:18

they won't the Catholic schools will not

1:25:20

do it but like having

1:25:22

gay people on campus not like

1:25:24

what's the line between I we

1:25:26

can accept trans girls too well

1:25:28

they're not really saying we're accepting trans

1:25:31

we're saying if you say you're trans

1:25:34

all right we'll take you into our school

1:25:36

like we're not saying no to you because

1:25:38

you identify as trans that's actually

1:25:40

different from saying if we affirm

1:25:43

that you are trans and notice

1:25:45

the language here Wow that's slippery

1:25:48

language it is but technically what

1:25:50

rule are they violating of the church

1:25:53

but so if I interview for that

1:25:55

college and they say I'm a lesbian

1:25:57

that's fine that's fine yeah but you

1:25:59

said they can Allow gay merit

1:26:01

or gay sex or whatever you that

1:26:03

you want to work for them and you

1:26:06

say you're lesbian fine But if

1:26:08

you say oh, I'm in a same-sex

1:26:10

relationship or marriage then they're like well

1:26:12

now you violated or doctor That's for

1:26:14

students for students. It's probably more lenient

1:26:16

like that's the thing. That's

1:26:18

why a lot of these Catholic Here's

1:26:21

another here's another example for you.

1:26:23

Okay, um, they actually have no

1:26:26

surprise They have an anti-abortion group

1:26:28

what registered student group on campus?

1:26:31

Few years ago, there were groups

1:26:34

and by the way, I should say

1:26:36

same areas They also have an LGBTQ

1:26:38

Center on campus because again center. Yeah

1:26:41

because it's not weird to say Yeah,

1:26:43

gay people need to save space People

1:26:46

need to save space But

1:26:48

when a pro-choice group said we

1:26:50

want to form on campus Multiple

1:26:53

times that same school said yeah. No

1:26:55

you can't do it. Is

1:26:57

it because about the church

1:26:59

Catholic churches? Anti-abortion now the

1:27:01

kids the students I should say the

1:27:04

students who said we're not actually doing

1:27:06

anything that the church Opposes because we're

1:27:08

not saying you should have abortions We're

1:27:11

saying there are lies being

1:27:14

spread about abortion and

1:27:16

we want to correct like the

1:27:18

right-wing misinformation Stuff

1:27:21

like that, which yeah, that's fair But

1:27:25

the school said no So

1:27:27

here's the question why did they say

1:27:29

no to the pro-choice group that was

1:27:31

there to just spread correct information as

1:27:33

opposed to Advocate on campus

1:27:36

more or less and this is why did

1:27:38

they say no at st. Mary's a couple

1:27:40

years ago? Okay, but now they're doing this

1:27:42

new Dean does that mean they have shifted

1:27:45

like their beliefs Have they gotten

1:27:47

more liberal or it's a lot of the

1:27:49

same people are on campus. So that's interesting to note Now

1:27:52

as far as their relationship with the Catholic Church

1:27:56

Kevin Rhodes who is the bishop who runs

1:27:58

the Diocese of Fort Wayne and the South

1:28:00

Bend, he is absolutely

1:28:02

furious about this change. He said,

1:28:04

it is disappointing that I, as

1:28:07

Bishop of the diocese in which

1:28:09

this college is located, was

1:28:12

not included or consulted on a

1:28:14

matter of important Catholic teaching.

1:28:17

I urge the Board of Trustees to

1:28:19

correct its admissions policy in fidelity to

1:28:22

the Catholic identity and mission it is

1:28:24

charged to protect and to

1:28:26

reject yada yada yada ideology. Listen, as somebody

1:28:28

who grew up in the greater Chicago area,

1:28:30

I would not go against 32 angry Catholic

1:28:33

women, not in a million

1:28:36

years. Now for

1:28:38

what it's worth, the school's leaders said

1:28:40

this week we are going to have a meeting

1:28:42

with him to discuss how we came to our

1:28:45

decision here, but they didn't say we're going to

1:28:47

reverse course. We'll inform you

1:28:49

not ask for your permission, that kind of thing. But

1:28:51

according to one Catholic publication, there are

1:28:54

things he could do if he wants

1:28:56

to retaliate, and they include, after

1:28:58

a formal warning, he could prohibit

1:29:00

the university from identifying his Catholics.

1:29:03

Okay, okay, alright. He could prohibit,

1:29:06

like, allowing them to do sacraments

1:29:08

on campus or any public celebrations

1:29:10

of mass at the university. Like

1:29:13

he could say, well, all the things that

1:29:15

make you technically Catholic that we have control

1:29:18

over, we're going to revoke

1:29:20

your right to do that. And at that

1:29:22

point, you have to wonder, from his perspective,

1:29:24

will anyone at the school give a shit? That's

1:29:27

about what I was just about to

1:29:29

say. Like how many people seek out a

1:29:31

Catholic university because they're uber Catholic instead

1:29:34

of... For whatever reason. DePaul is

1:29:36

right here in Lincoln, Paris. And that's the question,

1:29:38

like, they can still call themselves St. Mary's. Yeah,

1:29:40

and do it every once. Catholics don't own the

1:29:42

word saint. So the thing is, even

1:29:44

if you say... This is my honorific St. Jess. If

1:29:47

they say it's no longer Catholic, yeah, they might lose

1:29:49

some donors and whatnot. But how

1:29:51

many students are going to disappear and what would

1:29:53

change? I don't know. So, like, his threat

1:29:55

is very... Not in 2023. Nothing's

1:29:57

going to change. The

1:30:00

tools that he has at his

1:30:02

disposal are kind of minimal. And

1:30:05

also, by the way, the school... Yeah, he gets for a pretty good

1:30:07

fit, Hamish. The school's actually doing just

1:30:09

fine. They have about 1,600 students total. It's

1:30:12

a small school. They also have an

1:30:14

endowment of over $200 million. Oh,

1:30:17

ha! So they're doing

1:30:19

okay. Hey, Catholic Church, I know you

1:30:21

have all your gold thrones and rubies

1:30:23

and stuff, but like... There are gold

1:30:26

toilets in the bathrooms at the school. I

1:30:28

assume. I assume. What else

1:30:30

would you do with 200 mil? Mm-hmm.

1:30:33

Gold toilets. Gold heated toilets. Can

1:30:35

you imagine? Nice. Well,

1:30:37

lucky we are to be alive right now.

1:30:40

Yes. It's what Hamilton dreamed of. Uh-huh.

1:30:43

Is that it? That's it. I feel like you

1:30:45

just ran out of gas. Like your batteries just

1:30:47

died. They are dying slowly. It is the end of

1:30:49

a long day. So I have no good news for now.

1:30:51

Yeah. I want to

1:30:53

read, and I hope it's okay. I didn't explicitly

1:30:56

ask for permission, but she posted it in the

1:30:58

group. A witness named Whitney said... So

1:31:02

last week we talked about homeschooling and how appalled

1:31:04

I was that like these kids are just fully

1:31:06

teaching themselves. Mm-hmm. So

1:31:09

Whitney said, I laughed out loud when Jessica was astonished

1:31:11

that the homeschool girl was teaching herself. My

1:31:13

homeschooling from about grade three or four onward

1:31:16

consisted of my mom giving me the student

1:31:18

workbook and the teacher's guidance telling me to

1:31:20

set my own curriculum and grade my own

1:31:22

work. As a child with

1:31:24

raging undiagnosed ADHD, girl, I feel you,

1:31:26

I homeschooled myself until grade eight when

1:31:28

I went to a charter

1:31:30

school for high school and promptly

1:31:33

failed the math entrance exam hard

1:31:35

because I couldn't multiply anything more

1:31:37

than two digits. I remember seeing

1:31:39

the administrator trying very hard to

1:31:41

hide their shock at how badly

1:31:43

I did in the exam. It

1:31:45

was mortifying. And a bunch

1:31:47

of us did like care emojis, and then she

1:31:49

responded. That awkward moment

1:31:51

when you tell a story from your childhood that you think

1:31:53

is funny and everyone just stares at you and gives you

1:31:55

a hug, which is like

1:31:57

so relatable. It just really does.

1:32:00

made me laugh. Anyway, that's in our Facebook group and I

1:32:02

hope that was okay that I read that. You

1:32:05

can find us at patreon.com/friendly atheist

1:32:08

podcast. We have our discord group.

1:32:10

There's the Facebook group if you

1:32:12

look up the podcast on Facebook.

1:32:14

You sure do. We have an

1:32:17

email address. FriendlyAtheistPodcast at gmail.com.

1:32:20

And you can always leave

1:32:22

us a review. If

1:32:25

it's good. Oh, I read

1:32:27

this one already. It's okay. My favorite part. So here

1:32:29

it goes. No, I did that one already. Okay, I

1:32:31

guess I ran out. Then leave

1:32:34

us more positive reviews. Yeah,

1:32:36

okay. Thanks. Oh, bonus. Oh, yeah. Okay. We're

1:32:38

really doing well today. Okay. I have shit

1:32:40

to talk about in the bonus. Yeah.

1:32:43

Here are the things I want. Let's open your half-assed ideas

1:32:45

booklet. And that is what it is. First

1:32:48

of all, I forgot to say

1:32:50

I was on a podcast called

1:32:52

Your Therapist Needs Therapy. They generally

1:32:54

interview therapists. LOL, I am not.

1:32:57

But I work with, I

1:33:00

spoke about the work I do with equestrian

1:33:02

therapy and that kind of stuff. And it

1:33:04

was great and lovely. We talked for like

1:33:06

90 minutes. I genuinely don't remember. Like he

1:33:08

said I could talk about horses and I

1:33:10

just blacked out and came to 90 minutes

1:33:13

later. I also want to The whitest thing

1:33:15

you've ever said. Like

1:33:17

genuinely at one point he's like, are different

1:33:19

breeds like different? I was like, Are you

1:33:21

asking me to talk about horse brains? My

1:33:24

six year old heart and like horse girl heart

1:33:26

is singing. I also

1:33:28

want to talk about I'm learning

1:33:30

about the Hatfields and the McCoys. I don't know if you

1:33:32

know anything. Okay. Speaking of the whitest thing you've ever heard.

1:33:35

Left podcast on the left is doing a

1:33:37

thing about them. And they're only one episode

1:33:40

in and I am riveted. I did not

1:33:42

know anything. I didn't even know if they're

1:33:44

real people or not. I have like a

1:33:46

couple of factoids I want to tell you

1:33:48

that are just so interesting. I also want

1:33:50

to talk about a movie

1:33:52

I rewatched this weekend with my friend and

1:33:54

I had one of my quarterly sleepovers with

1:33:56

and can't recommend them more highly a movie

1:33:59

called fighting. with my family, which

1:34:02

stars, oh shit, I can't think of

1:34:04

her name. She was Danny in Midsomer

1:34:06

and she was Amy in Little Women.

1:34:11

She's the blonde, she's a

1:34:13

really gruff voice. She

1:34:15

did Zach Brass for some reason.

1:34:18

She was also in, and it doesn't

1:34:21

matter, we'll figure it out together. But

1:34:23

she was in a movie called Fighting

1:34:25

with My Family, which is about, it's

1:34:27

a true story about this girl from

1:34:29

a small town in the UK from a family

1:34:33

who loves pro wrestling. And

1:34:35

she auditions for the WWE and

1:34:37

gets in and it's just her

1:34:39

story and it's wonderful.

1:34:42

It's just like a feel good

1:34:44

like family sports, drama,

1:34:47

it's funny, it's charming as fuck. I just

1:34:49

absolutely adore it. So I'll talk a little

1:34:51

bit more about that in the, although I

1:34:53

kind of do it all right now. Anyway,

1:34:55

we will talk to you next week. Bye.