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us should aim to and with Liz girl

1:00

boss is general manager and Victoria Proboscis senior

1:02

writer who both co produced this podcast. As

1:04

you may have noticed, we're moving away from

1:06

having just founders on the podcast because we

1:08

actually going to have more broad conversations where

1:10

I went in at work and the girl

1:12

was one point. Oh era. the very narrow

1:15

definition of success was to start your own

1:17

business and-it's not the case anymore, so when

1:19

we do have downers. On the podcast. Why

1:21

people that are going to get real

1:23

with us and share on his about

1:25

behind the scenes of being a founder?

1:28

Because otherwise most founder stories aren't that

1:30

relate well to most people. It's true

1:32

and that's what we loved so much

1:34

about Tory Robinson. and we're all malaise

1:37

story. So they're the cofounders of Boys

1:39

Lie That cool girl out where Brand.actually

1:41

went viral last summer. I'm sure you

1:43

see that when Ariane I'm addicts from

1:46

Better have rules war their one eight

1:48

hundred boy's life. Had he not. So

1:50

subtly shading ex boyfriend Tom Sand of

1:52

all. So I'm actually wearing one of

1:54

their sweaters today. It's as I was

1:56

a boy's life. For those who are

1:58

listening, it's like. and I always

2:01

get questionable looks from then when I wear it

2:03

out in public, which I love. They've

2:05

collabed with epic brands like Forbes,

2:07

Uber, Revolve, Urban Outfitters, and Paczen,

2:09

which solidified them as an industry

2:12

trailblazer. In 2022 alone, their brand

2:14

achieved $8 million in

2:17

revenue. But going back to the beginning,

2:20

Tori and Leah actually grew up living down the

2:22

street from each other in the same suburban town.

2:24

They never crossed paths, but in 2016, they

2:27

were both going through a breakup with their

2:29

boyfriends who happened to be best friends. They

2:32

formed an unbreakable bond and coined the

2:34

mantra, Boys Lie. They spent their

2:36

early careers honing their business savvy with

2:38

Tori working for her family's cosmetics manufacturing

2:41

company and Leah working as an account

2:43

executive at Yelp. Boys Lie actually

2:45

began as a cosmetics brand in 2019

2:47

and then pivoted into apparel. Now they're

2:50

best known for their perfectly oversized footsuits

2:52

with empowering and slightly cheeky slogans.

2:55

So I'd love to hear both of your thoughts on

2:57

this conversation. One thing that really jumped out

2:59

at me is Avery, you asked the question, how

3:01

much money did you start with to start a clothing brand?

3:03

How much money do you need to start a clothing brand

3:06

today? And they said $250,000. It was a friends and family

3:08

loan. Now granted, that wasn't

3:12

an upfront loan. Like it wasn't all at

3:14

once. It was given out over some period

3:16

of time. But that's a really big amount

3:18

of money. That's several years of salary for

3:20

most people. So I think that just goes

3:23

to show that, again, back to our conversation

3:25

around transparency and not glossing over these headlines

3:27

is that's real money. And I think if you

3:29

ever feel bad about having a good idea, but not being

3:31

able to bring it to fruition, maybe it's because you can't

3:33

do a friends and family round for $250,000. And

3:37

if you're looking to get venture funding, most venture firms won't

3:39

even look at you unless you've already done a friends and

3:41

family round. So that's

3:43

just something that we really appreciate about how transparent they

3:45

were. It doesn't mean that you need that much money

3:47

to start a clothing brand. They do get into that

3:49

as well. But what I took away

3:51

from the conversation is it's actually extended their failure

3:53

runway. They were able to make a lot of

3:56

mistakes and then recover from them. So they started

3:58

in cosmetics and then pivoted to clothing. That

4:00

allowed them to do that. At one point they alluded to spending $90,000

4:02

on a photo shoot. Again,

4:04

that could put most people underwater, but they were

4:06

able to bounce back from it. They were taken

4:08

advantage of by PR agencies and vendors and wholesalers.

4:10

At every step of the way, there was some

4:12

kind of setback. If you think about it, that

4:14

money just kind of allowed them to fail and

4:16

learn and fail and learn again to arrive to where

4:19

they are. And I think it's

4:21

important to acknowledge that multiple things can be true

4:23

at once. This doesn't mean that they're not hardworking,

4:25

they're not deserving of the success that they've had

4:27

or that they didn't necessarily work harder than other

4:29

people. It just means that they had a little

4:31

bit more room and bit of a

4:33

safety net to fail, which is really important

4:35

for any person that's starting a new

4:37

business or a new company or taking

4:39

on a huge risk. And I think

4:41

that another thing to acknowledge here is

4:43

that there are a lot of people

4:45

that are afforded a lot of capital, a

4:47

lot of money that completely fuck it up. So

4:50

there's nothing to be said about people that

4:52

are granted that additional support through

4:54

capital and they make wise decisions

4:56

with it. That is something you

4:58

either have or you don't have. From

5:00

this conversation, what I took away

5:02

from these two founders is that

5:05

they were constantly pivoting, constantly coming

5:07

up with new ideas, constantly evolving

5:09

their business so they can make the most

5:11

of that investment that people made in them, but

5:13

also the investments that they made in each other.

5:16

There's really no such thing as an overnight success is

5:18

really what's clear from these conversations. And

5:20

it also gets into the changing role of

5:22

celebrity in fashion. Yes, you can draw a

5:24

straight line between Mariana or Gigi Hadid wearing

5:26

one of their outfits and it's selling out.

5:29

But that's not necessarily always true. I think

5:31

celebrity is so fleeting and who becomes famous

5:33

overnight is really different now. And I think

5:35

it wasn't just a celebrity wore my

5:38

item. It was a celebrity wore my item during

5:40

the height of their pop culture relevance, during a

5:42

phenomenon that everybody was talking about. So I don't

5:44

think it's even enough anymore to have a celebrity

5:46

wear your clothes because there's just too many celebrities

5:48

now and too many brands and attention spans are

5:50

so fleeting. I think they've been really smart

5:52

at kind of creating the new version of the revenge dress.

5:55

They're creating something that allows celebrities or just people

5:57

in general like Victoria is wearing a boy's life

5:59

hoodie today. It allows them to speak without saying

6:02

anything. I think that's really powerful. Anyone

6:04

that's a Vanderpump Rules fan knows this

6:06

moment and it was absolutely iconic. It

6:08

was the photo of Ariana leaving the

6:10

black SUV on the way to tape

6:13

the Vanderpump Rules reunion. She

6:15

was wearing a two-piece yellow tracksuit that said, 1-800-BOYS-LIE

6:17

on it. It

6:19

was just perfection. It broke the

6:21

internet. It literally broke the internet.

6:24

Absolutely. The thing is, at

6:26

this point, Ariana had said nothing. This

6:29

was her opportunity to say, hey, this

6:31

is what I think about this whole ordeal

6:33

that has the internet in a chokehold through

6:36

clothing. And Boys Lie created

6:38

that opportunity. You can't

6:40

make up that kind of marketing. You just really can't. So this

6:42

episode, I think, has a ton of great takeaway. Whether you want

6:45

to start an apparel brand, there's a lot of really great advice

6:47

if you want to do just that. And don't worry, you do

6:49

not need $250,000 to do it. They

6:52

do discuss that. But also, if you're a person

6:54

with a job, I think you will get a

6:56

lot out of this episode because there's a lot

6:58

here about the power of just being OK with

7:00

failure and acknowledging it and just letting go of

7:03

things that don't work for you anymore, ideas you've

7:05

tried that didn't pop off, strategies you've implemented that

7:07

weren't as successful as maybe you built them up

7:09

to be in your head. This is certainly

7:11

something I deal with as the GM

7:13

of Girlboss. Are all of my business

7:15

strategies or ideas bangers? No. And

7:18

I have to constantly remind myself that I have

7:20

to pivot and try again. And there's a phrase

7:22

that one of them says is like, all you

7:24

can really do is be better today than you

7:27

were yesterday. Do something today that improves upon the

7:29

day before. And that is just enough most of

7:31

the time. Yeah, Liz, honestly, this

7:33

is such a great lesson. So I am

7:35

excited for you to hear this conversation. And

7:37

with that, let's get into the puns. Welcome

7:43

back to Girlboss Radio, everyone. I am so

7:45

excited to introduce you to Leah and Tori.

7:47

How are you both doing

7:49

today? We are good

7:51

at surviving another day. Yeah, you put

7:54

it perfectly. I am really excited

7:56

to have this conversation with you when the Girlboss producers

7:58

had reached out saying We're going to be doing this. The be

8:00

meeting with. The founders of Boys Lives

8:02

like Amazing A mainly because I'm just

8:04

familiar with your products in your epic

8:06

clothing. I wanted to start at the

8:09

beginning before we get into the future.

8:11

What is you will want to be

8:13

when you grab. My, it's really a.

8:15

Superficial. I'm not gonna lie, But. I wanted

8:18

to day on reality tv. When I was

8:20

younger I was watching every shower as in

8:22

Jersey Shore, as watching The Kardashians as watching

8:24

everything Bravo and I was like one day

8:27

I'm gonna be a house last Salad way

8:29

wanted even as a nice cause athletes hands.

8:31

as I got older. But yeah, there's the

8:33

process of. I think I've always wanted

8:35

to on clothing brands. I've always wanted to be

8:38

like much more higher and them what we're at.

8:40

Now I was like oh I wanted you guys

8:42

who are I want to be part of something

8:44

that's super lox and then I works for Tory

8:47

Birds in retail For a little bad I was

8:49

like I've never fucking working in retail ever again

8:51

as some socks and now here I am stuck

8:53

in retail. Retail Top. I mean, I

8:55

sort. Of my career in retail

8:58

and I was managing a team

9:00

of twelve people when I was

9:02

sixteen which is Wild Bow is

9:04

like I remain is twelve people

9:06

now and my differences. From.

9:08

The amount of employees that we have now

9:11

which is around twelve I feel like I've

9:13

acquired twelve New personality is the way you

9:15

speak in address each individual person whether be

9:17

on your team or even just a friend.

9:20

It's always different and it's. So.

9:22

Insane when you have twelve different personalities to

9:24

manage. I don't know how people do it

9:26

on a level of like seven hundred and

9:28

fifty employees plus. For. Folks that are

9:31

familiar with boys lies tell us a

9:33

little bit about. Your brand, Who you

9:35

are, what you do. So we

9:37

were best friends obviously before we were business

9:39

partners and we came up with this term

9:41

Boys I as he went through these horrible

9:43

break ups and when we decided that we

9:46

wanted to do something together we knew that

9:48

we wanted to make sure that what ever

9:50

we were doing was that and power People

9:52

because that's what that phrase was to I

9:54

Sell Blaze I we had say we're getting

9:56

ready We had say someone Street A over

9:58

it's one of our friends. fire from their

10:00

job. It was always boys lie, boys lie, boys

10:02

lie. And having known each other for almost

10:04

20 years now too, these words were not

10:07

an inside joke, but almost like a mantra

10:09

that we were growing into consistently over the

10:11

years as we became closer and closer. I

10:14

ended up right after college getting a

10:16

job that was in San Diego and

10:18

Leah was in New York at Yelp

10:20

and it was like my last moments

10:22

at home on the East Coast. And so

10:25

I was like, let's go out with a

10:27

bang. Let's fucking do it. That we did.

10:29

We somehow end up wasted in a fire

10:31

station in New York City screaming boys lie

10:33

to the streets on St. Patrick's Day. And

10:36

basically at the end of the night,

10:38

in a very drunken girly stoop of

10:40

a moment, we were like, let's do

10:42

something with this. Let's wait label for

10:44

cosmetics. Let's create a brand. We can

10:46

do clothing with it. And from there,

10:48

things spiraled. We started in makeup. We

10:50

did horrible. We completely failed in makeup.

10:52

We used the same business structure

10:54

as Pat McGrath where she had these merch

10:56

pieces that got the Pat McGrath name, I

10:58

guess, out there. She used to sell like

11:00

bombers jackets, but we had our makeup and

11:02

our clothing because you can wear red lipstick

11:04

and you don't essentially need to know what

11:06

brand it is. It's just red. The clothing

11:08

kind of became more and more popular. We

11:10

got DMs from Delilah Bell and Ming Lee

11:12

Simmons when we were still fully, mostly cosmetics,

11:14

but we had the two hoodies and they're

11:16

like, where can I get this? Where can

11:18

I get this? And so when we sent

11:20

it to them and they ended up posting

11:22

and tagging on their page, our inboxes slowly started

11:24

to blow up asking where can I get this hoodie?

11:26

So Tori and I are like, okay, so no one

11:29

cares about the makeup. No one's saying, Hey, where can

11:31

I get this lipstick? They're coming to us asking for

11:33

our clothes. So we were like, we need to just

11:36

change our entire business plan around and try

11:38

and go into the clothing aspect of things.

11:40

And thank God we did. But when we

11:42

started this, we had absolutely no idea what

11:45

we were doing. We had a really crazy

11:47

moment where Dee Dee Hadid stepped out and

11:49

our clothes had to tow. But basically when

11:52

she stepped out in it, the clothes blew

11:54

up overnight and we were like, Oh my God, we

11:56

need to pivot to clothing immediately. They're

11:58

Beautiful components. The way we still

12:01

have all of them so if anyone wants

12:03

to take them up our hands that listening

12:05

to that, please buy it. And I think

12:07

what we really wanted to make our brand

12:09

was wearing your heart on your sleeve and

12:11

showing your emotion without actually saying the words

12:13

of how you're feeling. So I think from

12:15

there we really built this customer base of

12:17

community that they're learning how to heal with

12:19

us and we became my older sisters and

12:21

therapist. Throughout the stencil know it's been cold

12:23

not only for us and we use our

12:25

different forms of heartbreak. Whether that be the

12:27

best friend, boyfriend, job, whatever it is. And

12:29

kind of put it into the graphics and

12:31

into this business that squeeze by and what

12:33

it is today. but we've been getting it

12:35

with celebrities again. But Gg moment really changed

12:37

our life and that was in the height

12:39

of her very public break up. It's not

12:41

only gave us validation as the brands but

12:43

what the brand representatives. And then we had

12:45

a recent moment with airy honor from Banner

12:47

Pump that was also same where it's like

12:49

these libraries, they can't really speak out, they

12:51

don't have press conferences but. They're. Wearing

12:53

items on their bodies that represents

12:55

their break up there. they're healing

12:58

Process sang it without. Having to actually

13:00

say it. So. I'm wanting to learn

13:02

a little bit more about the behind the

13:04

scenes of actually having a clothing brand and

13:06

being at the stays in your eyes. So

13:08

what was an early learning experience you had

13:10

with starting boy's life? There's a

13:12

couple I think trusting the wrong people we

13:14

have like a very specific type of budget

13:17

and when we would go into meetings we

13:19

are really naive to think that we were

13:21

just so or overnight and explode overnight and

13:23

we'd go into these meetings so confident with

13:25

the budget that we had rather than understating

13:28

it a little bit so that we could

13:30

still save some money and people in L.

13:32

I just took that like sharks and ran

13:34

and that was a big learning lesson are

13:37

learning curve for us on top of just

13:39

supply chain and inventory management. I think having

13:41

an actual products. That you sell that's

13:43

physical. There's a cycle of longevity that

13:45

it has on the shelves and being

13:47

able to properly cycle it through miss

13:49

really important because including right You need

13:51

to make sure that you have him

13:53

into a for Black Friday for and

13:55

sense for sales and you want to

13:57

make sure you have stuff for Christmas.

14:00

and little giveaways, all these little

14:02

things that get people incentivized to

14:04

purchase. It's really hard to decipher

14:06

the economics of what the

14:09

brand should be when you're fresh out of

14:11

college. I was a creative writing major with

14:13

a focus in poetry, no experience in that

14:16

kind of background at all in supply chain.

14:18

And we was communications, we had to kind

14:20

of learn by failure. So

14:22

when you're buying a quality piece of clothing, and you're

14:24

looking at the price tag, there's a reason behind that.

14:27

And so for us, when people reach out and they're

14:29

like, why is this this certain price point is because

14:31

we're literally making all of our items from scratch. As

14:34

relates to having funding, how do you navigate having

14:36

the capital, especially like earlier

14:39

on to buy, obviously,

14:41

a large order? This

14:43

is a great question. And I feel like we

14:45

have so many different creative people in LA, especially

14:47

that have reached out being like, how did you

14:49

start this brand? Or how do you know what

14:51

to do? Or how do you get going? The

14:53

first and most easy thing about writing

14:56

a brand, essentially, you have to consider how

14:58

much you're going to actually spend, I'm going

15:00

to be spending x, y and

15:02

z on a photo shoot, I'm freelancing a

15:04

photographer for this amount of money, I need to

15:07

buy a backdrop, little things like that you list

15:09

out and all these expenses as to things that

15:11

you need for your business. I want to make

15:13

100 hoodies, how much is that going to cost

15:15

me? How long is that going to last? These

15:17

are all the questions you again, just generally ask

15:19

and by writing out all your expenses, that gives

15:21

you a general gist of, okay, I know that

15:23

I'm going to spend this much. So how am

15:25

I going to make that back? And what is

15:27

the cost of my good need to be to

15:29

make that money back? We were lucky we had

15:31

friends and family who gave us essentially a loan

15:33

to get started. And we

15:35

kind of use that loan very slowly.

15:38

But again, we used it up to a point

15:40

where I was like, Oh my god, I don't

15:42

know what to do. We're closing shop. And basically,

15:45

when the GG moment happened, we exploded

15:47

overnight, we got so many funds

15:49

in that we were able to use that money

15:51

and recycle it to continue on and put it

15:53

back into the business and can continue to grow

15:56

with the friends and family loan just for folks

15:58

that are listening like how much was that? Was it 5,000, 10,000,

16:00

50? It was $250,000 given overtime. And do you think

16:08

that that's what people need to start a

16:10

clothing brand or do you think that they

16:12

could start with 10,000? I think

16:14

our biggest issue again is that we didn't

16:16

and we still don't know what we're doing

16:18

like every day on a daily basis. So

16:21

we're learning like trial by error type

16:23

of situation but if I started a company tomorrow

16:25

that was a new brand that I wanted to

16:27

call a girls life for instance, I could start

16:29

that with 10 grand and we would do just fine.

16:31

Mm-hmm. And you have to understand too when

16:34

you first start your company if you're starting

16:36

a clothing business, you're gonna spend if not

16:38

all of it if you have $10,000

16:41

for example to cover all your costs even if you

16:43

have employees to cover the cost of production, the people

16:45

that you're paying, shipping, your website, any socials or ads

16:47

that you're spending with, you're gonna spend a lot of

16:49

money but you're gonna have to wait for that to

16:52

come back and it takes time. So it might be

16:54

scary when you look at the bank and you're like

16:56

I have no cash in right now but it flows.

16:58

So like once you do get your product off it

17:00

comes in it's just not going to come in as

17:02

quickly. It's a gamble. Also when you're designing something and

17:05

you're like I love this I would buy this tomorrow,

17:07

you also don't know if other

17:09

people are gonna love it as much as you do. So

17:11

it's really it's a risk but you have to take them

17:13

because you're always going to get something that's gonna stick and

17:15

people are gonna be obsessed with it. Yeah

17:17

you talked about having some unfortunate experiences with losing

17:19

money and I want to get into that but

17:22

I think before we talked about early learning experiences,

17:24

you had said a bunch of times already we

17:26

don't know what we're doing and I think that

17:28

a lot of people are in that place. What

17:30

are some things that you know now that you

17:33

wish you had known earlier in your journey with

17:35

Starting Boys Live? When we first started

17:37

we were yes people so everything that was thrown our

17:39

way yes we're gonna do this we're gonna do that

17:41

oh a $90,000 photo shoot sure that's

17:45

gonna make us our money back. We had

17:47

no idea so not only did we have

17:49

the wrong people advising us on where to

17:51

be spending our money and how to do

17:53

certain things we didn't know ourselves so we

17:55

made a lot of mistakes now I think

17:58

what I've learned is to not. say yes

18:00

to everything. And saying no is kind of scary

18:02

because you might be losing out on some type

18:04

of business opportunity. But I think if we didn't

18:07

say no to certain things that we were offered

18:09

in the past, we would have not been where

18:11

we are today. I think everything's

18:13

negotiable. I wish I did tell my younger

18:15

self, everything is negotiable, even if you feel

18:17

like this person saying no, if they're not

18:20

willing to like somewhat compromise where both sides

18:22

end up a little bit unhappy, but ultimately

18:24

at the end of the day, we'll make

18:26

it work type situation, you get

18:28

a little bit of what you want. I think that's where

18:31

I wish I knew that. What's interesting too

18:33

is that people that said no to us in the

18:35

beginning are now emailing us wanting to work with us

18:38

today. We've noticed that a lot as well. What's

18:40

an example of a time that you said

18:42

no to something and you're like looking back

18:45

and being like, yeah, I'm really happy that

18:47

we said no to that specific opportunity, whatever

18:49

it was. We had one PR

18:51

team that really wanted to work with us said that they're

18:53

going to do this, this and this for us. We're going

18:55

to hit all these tears. We're going to blow you guys

18:57

up. They were very expensive. Little did

18:59

we know that working with them not only

19:02

was unfortunately a waste of our dollars, but

19:04

they did not care about what they were

19:06

saying in the initial pitch. They were not

19:08

fulfilling the things that they said that they

19:11

would. We thought because they

19:13

represented such huge, huge brands, oh my God,

19:15

we're swimming in a pond with all these

19:17

big players right off the bat. And that

19:19

is just such a, again, naive learning experience

19:21

to think about because literally they were just

19:23

like, Oh, we're just catching a check in

19:25

from the small brand. I don't care if they exist or not. What

19:28

advice do you have for people that are starting a clothing

19:30

line that are just getting started? Just

19:33

don't stop doing what you're doing.

19:35

My one thing is, is like, one,

19:38

you could be better than you were yesterday. So no

19:40

matter what, that's my goal. I put blinders on and

19:42

I'm just like, how can

19:44

we do more than we did yesterday? I'm

19:46

not comparing myself to other brands. That's, I

19:48

feel like the first thing for boys' lives

19:51

growth alone, but also like you're going to

19:53

constantly get kicked on your ass. You're just going to

19:55

lose all day long. You're going to get doors shut

19:57

in your face. You're going to get rejected. And it's kind

19:59

of how do you take that rejection?

20:01

I think this brand for me has just taught

20:03

me how to be a good loser and There

20:06

are very few people who know how to

20:08

lose. I agree I would say

20:10

also if you are starting a

20:13

clothing brand when you first start don't overwhelm

20:15

your customers So when we first started with

20:17

makeup, we had all these SKUs, you know,

20:19

we had 10 lip glosses 15

20:22

lipsticks all these different shades highlighter eyeshadow.

20:25

It was overwhelming as a brand new

20:27

brand So if you're gonna start with

20:29

clothing start with two SKUs see how

20:31

they sell if they sell out That's gonna

20:34

make it cool the consumer Themselves

20:37

they're much more simple than that. They

20:39

need one direction one focus one home

20:41

for what they want I wish

20:43

that we had started just in the clothing alone,

20:45

obviously and you learn for a good reason But

20:47

Jerry Lorenzo from fear of God He only started

20:50

with one hoodie and it took him a year

20:52

and a half I want to say I could

20:54

be wrong on the time frame But a pretty

20:57

good amount of time before he released another color

20:59

hoodie So the focus

21:01

point always stayed honest and

21:03

organic and it was easy

21:06

For the consumer to say oh, that's the

21:08

fear of God hoodie. That's the one that I want because there

21:11

was only one You

21:13

listened to your consumers early

21:15

on right? I think that sometimes people have

21:17

an idea and with makeup and cosmetics initially

21:19

for both of you They're like, well, no, this

21:22

is what we set out to do We're gonna

21:24

keep pushing but your consumers were clearly like reaching

21:26

out and they were like, we're gonna get this

21:28

hoodie I want this and you're like, okay, we

21:30

gotta listen they're talking to us and asking about

21:33

this This is an opportunity to pivot and

21:35

I think with that, how do you know when

21:37

to pivot? When we

21:39

had enough demand for it, we were getting all

21:41

these messages too But we also at the time

21:43

we didn't just have clothing on deck

21:45

We had to make it from scratch too.

21:47

So we had to tell everybody hey, we

21:49

don't have these units in I know that

21:51

you're all dying for them. It was Tori

21:53

and I actually talking to the customers through

21:55

our Instagram too So we'd either send video

21:57

messages or even just write. Hey, this is

22:00

and Leah or Hey, this is story, Hey, this is Leah. And

22:02

they were willing to wait. And I

22:04

think just the clothing became so popular and because

22:06

we had to make it by order, like

22:09

a pre-order situation, it made us kind of

22:11

realize, okay, the focus really should be in

22:13

clothing. It doesn't mean we're giving up, we're

22:15

just trying something new. Sometimes

22:18

you can quit or fail at something

22:20

and it doesn't necessarily mean that it

22:22

wasn't successful. It just means it ended.

22:24

I have a friend that recently

22:27

ended something and she was like,

22:29

it was still a wild success

22:31

for me. And I'm proud of it. It

22:33

just needed to end. And that was that

22:35

chapter. And I think that that's like a

22:37

really cool way to kind of approach something

22:39

also, just like neutrality towards these moments as

22:42

well. It is what it is. And it doesn't mean that

22:44

it was like this catastrophic fail. Like ultimately,

22:46

this is a part of your story and it

22:48

led you to where you are today. So

22:51

I think while change is scary, people don't

22:53

realize it's a good sense in some ways

22:55

to be uncomfortable and not know what's gonna

22:57

happen next. It's a really good mental

22:59

health moment, what you were just talking about with your friend

23:01

too, because if I were gonna

23:03

start my own business and I

23:05

was scared of failure, hearing you say that,

23:08

her being confident and just saying, you know, it

23:10

is what it is, I'm still so proud of

23:12

it. It just had to end. That takes away

23:15

from the fear of failure. Because at the end

23:17

of the day, people wanna see you fail. Not

23:19

everyone's on your side. Not everybody is gonna be

23:21

rooting for your success. Our friends, even when we

23:23

first started the brand, not everybody believed. Some

23:26

of my closest friends from home thought we

23:28

were gonna fail. The rumors obviously circled back.

23:30

It hurt our feelings and whatnot. And we

23:32

were down really bad when this also happened.

23:34

But the second we started winning, it was

23:36

like we all of a sudden had an

23:38

arena filled with people cheering us on, who used

23:40

to hate us. And I feel like again, a

23:43

lot of people don't have this

23:45

knowledge or education of knowing how to fail.

23:47

And it's not something you learn in a

23:49

class, because a class is just pass or

23:51

fail. You get held back, you can

23:53

change your major, whatever. But really truly failing,

23:55

you almost surrender to just life.

23:57

And once you're able to laugh.

24:00

About those failures in those fears that

24:02

you had. You're not afraid of anything

24:04

anymore. Failure. To me as a guest

24:06

is a means you had. The opportunity to sale at

24:08

all lot of people that aren't even. In

24:10

positions where they feel of anything because they're not.

24:12

Even trying. Not. Only did we

24:14

manifest without dow and take the right actions

24:16

to make it happen. We took everything that

24:18

everybody was saying like they can't do it,

24:21

they can't do it and we were like

24:23

watch as. I. Will do whatever it takes

24:25

I will make it's some way. it might not be

24:27

this direction but I can make like a whoop and

24:29

make a u turn and figure it out. I

24:31

have like a bene mean it's a business and a

24:33

me. And I've been in it's

24:36

problem a one when competition with

24:38

this person since the beginning of

24:40

starting by company bloom and it's

24:42

been such as helpful and like

24:44

fun to play pool motivator we

24:46

are or were basically. And competition

24:48

in till. I got to the point where I was

24:50

like damn. Like I dislike road rage off

24:52

the track. I'm is another race now so

24:55

this is where I don't agree with this

24:57

Petty Instagram quote of like comparison is a

24:59

big a C for joy because I do

25:01

genuinely believes that comparison in some cases. If.

25:04

You're in a good mindset to be

25:06

a really great motivator for some folks.

25:09

People. Don't think about it, even down to a

25:11

product level of things. you wouldn't be wearing headphones

25:13

that you're wearing today. If somebody said, how can

25:15

I make this product better, how can I do

25:17

what I'm doing and make it better. You wouldn't

25:19

get new cars, You wouldn't get new clothes, You

25:21

wouldn't get new anything if you couldn't. Readjust

25:24

and really amplify something that

25:26

has already been out there

25:28

before. Tell me a little bit

25:30

about some of the challenges that you've had with Capital.

25:33

We. Have a very big plant that's in outsell

25:35

and basically when we got on board with

25:37

them years ago, we signed a terms and

25:39

conditions agreement because they were so back at

25:41

me and I. Were big Yes as that

25:43

basically said it. if they choose to cancel

25:45

their order. That. We already have

25:47

made. they can just scan for

25:50

us so we produce all these

25:52

tote bags. and they put in

25:54

this huge purchase order and leonardo like dancing

25:56

around were like finally they are to be

25:58

so fact so excited months

26:00

go by, production goes through, the bags are

26:02

ready to ship from our manufacturer

26:05

and the customer's like, I don't

26:07

want them anymore. This

26:09

is a really bad situation. I was like,

26:12

how am I gonna sell 10,000 totes? It

26:16

was insane. It was the biggest amount of

26:18

quantity of an accessory we've ever ordered in

26:20

the first place and so now we're sitting

26:22

here completely screwed over with all of these

26:24

units and all these different colorways left basically

26:26

like, okay so now we're gonna have to

26:28

sell all of these and that's crazy. So

26:30

even going back to when you're starting a

26:32

clothing brand when I was talking about start small

26:34

and don't overwhelm your consumer, that's also because

26:36

inventory can kill a business. If you're sitting

26:39

on thousands and thousands of units that are

26:41

just not moving, that's money sitting there being

26:43

wasted depreciating over time. Most of the time,

26:45

I mean if you're lucky which would be

26:47

amazing, it might become popular again but once

26:49

it's been up on our website for weeks

26:51

and weeks and weeks, people aren't coming to

26:53

this site being like, oh I want this

26:55

now. At that point, how can we as

26:57

the first time doing this strategically make this

27:00

work? What are the ways that we can

27:02

create different outlets? We could have a sale

27:04

for these items. We could do gifting. How

27:06

much loss are we gonna take on gifting to get

27:08

it popular again? How many times do we need to

27:10

gift it out? Could it go for an event? Could

27:13

it go into other budgeting outlets where we could use

27:15

it? And actually now that the tote bags have sold

27:17

out. Literally the biggest nightmare I've

27:19

ever dealt with because it's also not only

27:21

that but actually saying you to get creative. If

27:23

it's sitting there, not only is it wasting away but it's

27:25

taking up space in your warehouse and you're being charged for

27:27

every single square foot of space. I

27:29

want to talk to you a little bit about moving units. Do you

27:32

think that it's possible to grow a

27:34

brand in today's day and age without

27:37

the support of mega celebrities? So

27:40

the market's changing and it changes every day

27:42

and you never really know what to expect.

27:45

I think at the time,

27:48

we were very much so graced with

27:50

having a celebrity wearing our items and

27:52

that goes with Ariana too. Very graced

27:55

with that moment, with who it was,

27:57

with the position she was in. We

27:59

were really lucky. And

28:01

I think now I see

28:04

your Alex Earl, the D'Amelio

28:07

sisters, there's like a new sense

28:09

of celebrity. They have a certain

28:11

type of buying power, seating celebrities.

28:13

I think there's more interest now

28:15

in the DIY type of situation

28:17

where it's like really relatable to

28:20

not be a celebrity. I feel

28:22

like now the celebrity status

28:25

or quota isn't matched

28:28

the same to some people that are

28:30

just incredibly relatable. Boys, I had a

28:32

balance. We and I were showing ourselves

28:35

packing out these boxes in a

28:37

warehouse and that rawness of us

28:39

giggling and like not even polyvagging these

28:41

clothing items, it made the brand really real

28:44

for other people. And those same people who

28:46

followed us through that, that were fans at

28:48

that time, are now our biggest fans, some

28:50

of our biggest customers that we have today.

28:54

Going off of what you're saying too about relatability,

28:57

even today in this age with influencers and

28:59

celebrities, just because you're looked at by millions

29:01

of people on a daily basis doesn't mean

29:03

people are actually buying what you're wearing. I

29:06

might be following somebody, I'm not going to name names,

29:08

but I love the aesthetic of their Instagram page.

29:11

I like watching their family and their blogs

29:13

or whatnot, but I'm not buying clothing that's

29:15

on their body. With Ariana, we had no

29:17

idea what type of impact that was going

29:19

to have. And it was so clear to

29:21

us how much buying power that curl has

29:24

because our 1-800 sold out

29:26

the next day. And it was also what

29:28

she was representing. So the clothing itself with

29:30

Ariana, for instance, it made a statement. With

29:32

Gigi, it made a statement. And that

29:34

statement is something you can't sell.

29:36

That's a service. That's not just a

29:39

product. So I feel like us giving

29:41

that to people puts a price tag

29:43

that you can't really measure. So

29:47

it's more impactful. I

29:49

was actually talking about this on Instagram.

29:51

If we think about some of the

29:53

earlier days of like paparazzi shots, Princess

29:56

Diana basically built the blueprint for this

29:58

communicating with fashion with artifacts. No. will

30:00

ever not know or remember the

30:02

revenge dress post breakup. I

30:05

guess what excites me most too

30:07

is that our clothes beyond just

30:09

like a revenge dress, they're not

30:11

revealing. They're fucking comfortable as fuck. I

30:14

love that too because again, her revenge

30:16

dress was amazing. Like gorgeous. It looked

30:18

unbelievable but stepping out in an oversized

30:20

sweatshirt and sweatpants too, it also just

30:22

says, I don't fucking care. Look at

30:24

me now. Before we

30:26

move away from this conversation about Ariana,

30:28

I wanted to ask how did that happen? How

30:31

does a company like yours land

30:33

the opportunity to be essentially a

30:35

conversation piece and participate in this

30:38

iconic moment? We got

30:40

a reach out from her stylist. My immediate doubting

30:42

was like, this isn't real. No way is a

30:44

spam because her email didn't actually match with the

30:46

one that we had originally had. When we found

30:48

out it was real, I was like, we need

30:50

to put her in the most boys live front

30:52

facing item ever. So we were trying

30:54

to decide which one to send. That set was the one

30:56

we decided on. We didn't know if she's gonna wear it

30:58

or not. Yeah, I think the other side is we've gifted

31:00

so many people, so many

31:03

different things. This is a very easy

31:05

example. But Kylie Jenner, we've gifted

31:07

her a gazillion things.

31:09

And basically, just because

31:11

you also send out a gift to somebody, you guys

31:13

don't owe each other anything. They don't have to wear

31:16

it. It's just, I hope you like this. If you

31:18

like it, that's great. You wear it. If you don't,

31:20

you don't. Do you both feel like

31:22

you're successful? Yes, I

31:24

couldn't have dreamed for where

31:27

I'm sitting right now to be better than

31:29

what it is. It's just on a daily

31:31

basis, you get so involved in everything. Sometimes

31:33

it's really hard to realize all the milestones

31:35

that we've hit without actually speaking about it.

31:38

I think also we get to celebrate

31:40

it more because we're best friends. And

31:42

I wouldn't recommend going into

31:44

business with your best friend or anybody's best friend

31:46

who's listening to this. I'm really lucky that in

31:49

this boys' life situation, I get to

31:51

celebrate those wins with you. And I

31:54

couldn't imagine doing it on my own.

31:56

I've met so many entrepreneurs in LA,

31:58

and I'm like, I don't know

32:00

how you have reached

32:03

your level that you've reached

32:05

just so solo dolo. I

32:08

wouldn't be able to be present ever. Me

32:10

either. I completely agree. I'm doing

32:12

it solo and I can say it's really hard. Yeah,

32:15

it's hard. Well thank you so much for

32:17

sharing your thoughts with us today. I really

32:19

appreciate it. Before we wrap up, where can

32:21

people continue to follow along on your journey?

32:24

Our Instagram is at boyslie.

32:26

Our website is boyslieofficial.com and

32:30

yeah, follow us on TikTok also. It's just

32:32

that boyslie. Sweet. Okay, well

32:34

thank you so much. Thank you. Thank

32:40

you for listening to my chat with Tori and

32:42

Leah. If you loved this episode and want to

32:44

hear more from them, check out Boys Lie Podcast

32:46

where they dish on all things pop culture, relationships,

32:49

and spicy story time. And come back

32:51

next week for another episode of Girl Boss Radio. In

32:53

the meantime, please rate this episode or leave a comment

32:55

to let us know what you thought. As

32:57

always, this podcast is produced by Liz

32:59

Guber and Victoria Christie and edited by

33:01

Diego Domine. Until next time, keep blooming.