0:00

What I am allowing my brain to

0:02

think about becomes the nature of my

0:04

reality. From a very basic psychological perspective,

0:07

thoughts impact feelings and feelings impact behavior.

0:09

Well, we're not our thoughts, they're just

0:11

things that we're experiencing, but we're not

0:14

trained to work with them, they can

0:16

seem overwhelming, or they're just running the

0:18

show without us even being aware of

0:20

it. And without them being regulated or

0:23

without us focusing our attention, we're just

0:25

going to be reactive as opposed to

0:27

responsible for our thoughts. So,

0:32

have you ever felt like your mind is a

0:34

bit of a runaway train of incessant thoughts and

0:37

worries and self-doubt that never stop?

0:40

You are not alone. For so many

0:42

of us, the relentless chatter of overthinking,

0:45

it just robs us of precious energy

0:47

and joy and the mental clarity to

0:49

create our best lives or just to play and

0:52

relax and enjoy the moment. But

0:54

what if I told you there are a

0:56

simple set of powerful ways to take back

0:58

control, to befriend that overactive

1:01

voice and transform it from a

1:03

daily terror into an ally for

1:05

mental peace? My guest

1:07

today, longtime friend and collaborator Amelia

1:09

Jivatovskaya, or as we often call

1:11

her, easy, has cracked the code

1:14

to really dial down the incessant taunt

1:16

of overthinking. Amelia is the CEO

1:19

and founder of the Flourishing Center

1:21

and the creator of the Acclaimed

1:23

Certification in Applied Positive Psychology program.

1:26

With a master's degree in positive psychology

1:28

from UPenn, she's devoted her

1:30

entire career to really empowering others

1:33

with tools for resilience and vitality

1:35

and crafting lives of profound thriving.

1:38

In this conversation, Amelia breaks down

1:40

what's really happening when our brains

1:42

start to run rogue with chatter

1:44

and overthinking. She reveals

1:46

the five core forms of unhelpful

1:49

mental chatter that drive

1:51

most of our overthinking and

1:53

rumination and self-sabotaging internal narratives.

1:55

But more importantly, she

1:57

also shares specific, simple, and effective mental

1:59

health. actionable tools and techniques

2:02

to disarm each form of chatter,

2:04

turning it from an energy vampire

2:07

into a force that motivates you

2:09

towards growth and resilience and just

2:11

straight-up peace. If you're

2:13

tired of being drained by the overthinking

2:15

monster then this conversation is

2:17

a must-listen. Amelia's insights rooted in

2:19

science and her own powerful personal

2:22

journey, they provide a really

2:24

insightful roadmap for taking back control of

2:26

your mind and life. So

2:28

excited to share this conversation with you. I'm

2:31

Jonathan Fields and this is The Life Project.

2:41

When it comes to your finances, you think you've

2:43

done it all. You save, you research, you invest

2:45

it all that you can. Now it's

2:47

time to take those investments to the

2:49

next level by using the brand behind

2:51

every great investor, Yahoo Finance. As America's

2:53

number one finance destination, Yahoo Finance has

2:55

everything you need whether you're a seasoned

2:57

trader or just dipping your toes into

2:59

the market. Join the millions of

3:01

investors who trust Yahoo Finance to guide them on

3:03

their financial journey. For comprehensive

3:05

financial news and analysis,

3:08

visit Yahoo finance.com, the

3:10

number one financial destination, Yahoo

3:12

finance.com. Cool fact!

3:15

A crocodile can't stick out its tongue.

3:17

Also, you can get health insurance for

3:19

a month or just under a year

3:21

in some states. UnitedHealthcare short-term insurance plans,

3:23

underwritten by Golden Rule Insurance Company, offer

3:25

flexible, budget-friendly coverage for you. Learn more

3:28

at uh1.com. Good

3:32

Life Project is sponsored by the ADHD

3:34

Aha podcast hosted by Laura Key. So

3:36

I've been kind of amazed at how

3:39

many conversations I've had lately with people

3:41

later in life who are wondering if

3:43

they have ADHD. It can be hard

3:45

to understand what ADHD is by looking

3:47

at a list of symptoms. So in

3:50

each episode of ADHD Aha, you'll

3:52

hear heartfelt interviews about the

3:55

unexpected, emotional, even funny ways

3:57

that ADHD symptoms service for

3:59

adults. Like the recent episode

4:01

with ADHD coach Emily Weinberg, which

4:03

really resonated with me, her story

4:05

about how she was thinking she

4:07

was quote, just lazy before her

4:10

diagnosis because she wasn't hyperactive really

4:12

struck a chord. Her feeling frozen

4:14

and stuck ruminating on mounting to

4:16

do list is just so relatable

4:18

for so many people. It's really

4:20

validating to hear others articulate those

4:22

experiences. Each episode of ADHD Aha

4:24

features candid tales of realizing that

4:26

your loved one has ADHD. People

4:29

hear the unexpected emotional ways

4:31

that it manifests in adults

4:33

through heartfelt interviews. ADHD Aha

4:35

captures the authentic human experience

4:37

of ADHD. So

4:40

if you want a fresh personal

4:42

perspective that embraces the messiness, listen

4:44

to ADHD Aha. Search

4:46

for ADHD Aha in your podcast

4:49

app. That's ADHD Aha with Aha

4:51

spelled A-H-A. It's an

4:53

Aha moment you won't miss. Okay,

4:58

so we're diving into a topic today

5:00

that I have been hearing so

5:02

much about. I have been reading so much about.

5:04

I have been having so many conversations about and

5:07

I feel like this is not new, but

5:09

maybe people are just more comfortable sharing

5:12

how much angst it's causing them in their lives

5:14

these days and maybe the level of stress or

5:16

anxiety or whatever has been going

5:19

on that's made it so much

5:21

more heightened is just it's causing a lot

5:23

of suffering and the overarching

5:25

theme for this conversation then is

5:27

this thing that we kind of

5:29

generally call overthinking. But

5:31

I know overthinking is a word that a

5:33

lot of us just use in every day

5:35

to describe what's happening when we're experiencing it.

5:38

But there's actually a lot of science

5:40

underneath this. There's a lot of structure underneath

5:43

it. There are different names when you get

5:45

into actually what's happening and there

5:47

are different strategies that

5:49

we can embrace to help

5:51

really deal with this and maybe even turn

5:54

that thing that causes so much suffering in

5:56

us into a bit of a superpower. We're

5:59

going to dive into this. And I think,

6:01

dear friends, long time collaborator

6:04

to dive into this with. So Amelia, you

6:06

have been living in this world where when

6:08

we first met a million years ago, you

6:11

were actually in school doing your master's in

6:13

applied positive psychology at UPenn, spent

6:15

a chunk of years coaching and consulting, and

6:18

for many years now have literally been training

6:20

the next generation of people to go out

6:22

there and really help

6:24

others in the world and industry

6:27

individually. How often does

6:29

this phenomenon that we're talking about come

6:31

up in the work that you've

6:33

done, in the client work that you've done in the

6:35

past and what you hear coming back to you from

6:37

the people who you have trained to go and help

6:39

so many people? Thank you, Jonathan. I

6:42

can literally say in just about every

6:44

single session, some aspect

6:46

of learning to control your

6:49

thoughts, redirect the

6:51

stories that you're telling yourself or have

6:53

mastery over your mind can

6:55

apply to just about every conversation. There

6:57

isn't a trigger that we work through

6:59

that doesn't have some aspect of what's

7:02

going through your mind in the heat

7:04

of the moment. There isn't a project

7:06

that you're trying to build or an

7:08

idea that you want to build to

7:10

fruition that you're not gonna encounter your

7:13

brain stories that it creates around it. And

7:15

as stress levels go up, a lot of

7:18

the stress that people feel, so whether we're

7:20

trying to navigate our day-to-day stressors

7:22

and trying to fall asleep at night and

7:24

then not being able to because your mind

7:27

is just going, going, going, going, especially

7:29

in our world that is constantly

7:32

changing. And there's so many things

7:34

that people are making decisions about

7:36

and there's a space to constantly

7:38

be overthinking your decisions. I decided

7:41

to do this, I launched this, I posted

7:43

this, should I have done that? Was I

7:45

too much? Was I not enough? The constant

7:47

ways in which chatter and your mind is

7:50

impacting your feelings, impacting the things that

7:53

you do is always present, but

7:55

it's such a present thing that very

7:58

rarely do people realize that this. source

8:00

of their suffering, the source of their overwhelm, the

8:02

source of their stress has to do with the

8:04

stories that they're telling themselves or what's going on

8:06

in their mind. And then

8:09

because the sound of your own

8:11

mind chatter or your thoughts sounds

8:13

like your own voice, it's very

8:15

hard to separate apart what's chatter

8:17

and what's things that I can

8:20

actually reframe and redirect. And

8:22

so it leads to this swimming in

8:24

this stew of just like asking a

8:27

fish what is water, it doesn't even

8:29

occur to us that the cause of

8:31

our stress or our overwhelm has to do

8:33

with the way that we're thinking or the

8:35

things that we're telling ourselves about the situation.

8:38

So I think it's ever present. And

8:41

it's also rarely taught

8:44

or trained or that we're rarely ever taught

8:46

or trained, how do we actually redirect our

8:48

thoughts, take control of our chatter, and not

8:50

just make the chatter stop. Because there's a

8:52

reason your mind is telling you these things,

8:55

it's trying to get your attention. But we're

8:57

often just passive recipients of what our thoughts

8:59

are giving to us. And it doesn't even

9:01

occur to us that we can do something

9:03

about it, or that we should do something

9:06

about it. Hmm, it's like there's

9:08

actually some data or value, there's some

9:10

Intel in those things. But

9:12

when you're sort of like mired in the

9:14

spin cycle, it sounds like that gets

9:16

lost. Yeah, I'm curious also as you're describing this,

9:19

what you feel if any, the

9:22

role of technology and social media

9:24

has been in the level of

9:27

overthinking or self talk or chatter

9:30

that we have, especially I would imagine

9:32

because for so many people,

9:34

this phenomenon is related in some way

9:36

to their sense of self

9:38

perception, and especially their sense of self

9:41

in comparison to others. And

9:43

I wonder, so I wonder whether you have a

9:45

take the role of tech and

9:48

social media in overthinking. Yeah, I

9:50

think that just all of these levers that

9:52

we have inside of our body, given

9:55

the world that we're in right now, they're all

9:57

in hyperdrive. Social comparison is

9:59

something that we're all evolutionarily wired

10:01

for, that used to be a

10:03

really useful strategy. When life was

10:05

simpler, when life wasn't happening at

10:07

this rapid pace, it is

10:09

the signals that go up in your body that

10:12

go, oh, maybe I should reevaluate

10:14

my life. Maybe I'm not doing something right.

10:16

Maybe someone's doing something better than I could

10:18

be doing it. But in a

10:20

world where the amount of input that you have

10:22

access to is millions of

10:24

people from all over the world doing

10:27

thousands of different things, giving you so

10:29

much information, there's this aspect where

10:31

we have access to more opportunities to

10:33

compare ourselves socially just by the number

10:35

of people we know. For

10:38

thousands of years, the average person maybe had

10:40

a network of like 150 people or the

10:43

people you lived next to and you're in

10:46

proximity to. Now we have

10:48

access to way more people than ever

10:50

before, so many more opportunities to socially

10:52

compare. We have so much more

10:54

uncertainty on a very different kind of scale.

10:56

I know every single generation could say that

10:58

they had fears and that they had uncertainties

11:00

and they had wars and

11:02

they had unknowns, but the nature of

11:04

how it's actually showing up is very

11:06

different. And this ability, given

11:08

the fact that noise has been a

11:11

big factor of our world, just how

11:13

we're constantly stimulated, even just

11:15

being able to find that sense of calm,

11:17

I think a lot of people would agree

11:19

that they would want to hear their intuition

11:21

or find that inner voice

11:23

that sometimes they can refer to, that

11:25

voice of knowing, that voice of confidence

11:27

of what do I need to

11:29

do next or yeah, I made the

11:31

right decision, I did the right thing, that

11:34

they're able to hear and feel that, but in

11:36

a world that's so loud, the actual conditions that

11:38

are required in order to ground in that way

11:40

and trust in yourself, we're just in a very

11:42

different world. And so one way of thinking about

11:44

it is that the thing that

11:46

we're talking about, this chatter, this

11:50

overthinking, this rumination that we get ourselves

11:52

into, it's almost like an alarm that

11:54

goes off in the house. It's an

11:56

alarm that's going off in your brain

11:59

and it's supposed to... at all emotions and

12:01

all mind chatter meant to try to get

12:03

your attention to pay attention to something. But

12:05

what happens is, is we're not taught how

12:07

to turn that chatter off. And so the

12:10

alarm just sort of is going in the

12:12

background all the time, there's this constant worry

12:15

or this constant rumination or this constant thing.

12:17

And we just sort of drown it out

12:19

a little bit, but it's there. And so

12:21

I think the nature of our world is

12:24

actually hit taken all of these buttons that

12:26

were evolutionarily wired for that are natural, healthy

12:28

responses. It kicks them into overdrive.

12:30

And then we are not trained

12:32

with the skills of, oh, just

12:34

quiet your mind or just think about

12:37

something else, or just calm yourself down.

12:39

And we're not actually trained in any

12:41

of those things we hear we say

12:43

these words all the time, like, go

12:46

relax, you know, that's easier said than

12:48

done when you are in a hyperdrive

12:50

in a tendency to just be going,

12:52

going, going. Yeah, I mean, that

12:54

makes so much sense. That gets back to what you

12:57

were saying earlier in that there is information in whatever

13:00

it is. The problem is

13:02

that we hit spin on

13:04

this, and there's a cycle that

13:06

just spins and spins and spins. And then so

13:08

often, what became the early signal

13:10

that had some important information for us, we

13:12

not only spin it and just can't let

13:14

it go, but then we start to layer

13:17

different stories on top of it. That

13:19

may be doom and gloom stories or things

13:21

or what all these what ifs, and not

13:23

what ifs in terms of amazing possibilities, but

13:26

what ifs often in terms of worst case

13:28

scenarios. And then it just

13:30

kind of paralyzes us. When

13:32

we think about this phenomenon, you've used

13:35

a couple different words for it. I

13:37

shared overthinking you said chatter rumination. Do

13:40

we know what's actually happening

13:42

on a brain level on

13:44

on a neurophysiological level that

13:48

gets us stuck in this? Or is it

13:50

really more a behavioral thing? On

13:52

a neurological level, thoughts are just

13:55

firing signals throughout our brain. Our

13:57

brain is firing signals for every

14:00

from keeping your heart beating to keeping

14:02

you salivating to keeping you blinking

14:04

to keeping your organs moving

14:07

and your body digesting. Our

14:09

brain is signaling off these molecules and

14:11

these firings so that we can be

14:14

alive and thinking is just not any

14:16

different than that. It's the combination of

14:18

the fact that our mind is constantly

14:20

making sense of the world around us

14:23

that has different types of thought patterns, different types

14:25

of chatter that we can have. There could be

14:27

the what time is it? Where do I need

14:29

to be right now? What am I

14:31

going to eat? Oh, I didn't have any food in the

14:33

fridge. I need to go to the grocery store. Oh, the

14:35

grocery store is going to take me 10 minutes to get

14:38

to you. Can I make it there and back before I

14:40

come back to my appointment? So all

14:42

of that is just the chatter that's going on

14:44

inside of our mind. And on

14:47

a neurological level, they're just thoughts

14:49

and they're thoughts that can occur

14:51

at different frequencies. We can hook

14:54

a person up to an EEG

14:56

and watch those thinking patterns be

14:58

transmitted as different areas of

15:00

the brain firing for different things. But

15:02

we definitely can't map a thought and

15:05

there is this difference between what is

15:07

the brain and what is the mind.

15:09

So in some ways, thoughts are signals

15:11

that are going off inside of our

15:13

brain. And then our mind is making

15:15

sense of these it's creating

15:17

a story, it's creating a story about who

15:19

we are. And so the way to start

15:22

to navigate this is to just understand also

15:24

that we are not our thoughts. And I

15:26

first got exposed to this, if I can

15:28

just share a quick story because this

15:31

fundamental skill is what

15:33

I would say transformed my life when I

15:36

first learned this work. And it was actually

15:38

even before I got my master's in positive

15:40

psychology, I came to the master's degree in

15:42

positive psychology at UPenn with a desire to

15:45

go deeper into this very thing because I

15:47

wanted to study resilience and

15:49

understand what separates people who are

15:51

resilient and able to bounce back

15:53

when they face adversity and stressors

15:55

versus people who don't because of

15:57

my own journey with how I had to personally. navigate

16:00

obstacles and navigate my own life.

16:03

And earlier, before I even came to positive

16:05

psychology, I had had a mentor named Dr.

16:07

Shri Kumar Rao, who introduced me

16:09

to this idea of mind chatter. And

16:12

he would say, your thoughts create your

16:14

reality. And sometimes we hear that

16:16

word from a pop psychology place. And sometimes we

16:18

hear it from a neurological

16:21

perspective, from a psychological perspective. If

16:23

we talk psychological perspective, we know

16:25

that our thoughts create attention biases

16:27

that what you're thinking about, you're

16:30

going to see more of our thoughts

16:32

create self fulfilling prophecies that our thoughts

16:34

become beliefs. And when he first introduced

16:36

me to this idea of mind chatter,

16:38

it was like all of a sudden

16:40

I became aware of this voice inside

16:42

my head that was happening my whole life. But all

16:45

of a sudden it was like, was

16:47

so loud. And the exercise was was to

16:49

just notice what I was thinking about. And

16:52

at the time I had been grappling with an

16:54

eating disorder that had started when I was 14.

16:57

And as you know, Jonathan, my had

16:59

a series of traumas as a child, but one

17:01

of them was that my brother died in an accident

17:03

when I was 14, and he was 24. And

17:07

in over the course of those years, I

17:09

started to obviously use the best resources I

17:12

could as a child to start to navigate

17:14

my world. And in this

17:16

process of becoming bulimic or having a

17:18

disordered body image and a disordered relationship

17:21

to food and other things and control,

17:23

it was crazy to me

17:25

how much I realized my mind chatter

17:27

was constantly fixated on things like

17:30

how much am I eating? How many calories?

17:32

How many grams of fat? What time am

17:34

I eating? I realized I'd be eating breakfast

17:37

thinking about what am I going to eat

17:39

for lunch? It's like someone

17:41

opened up the doors to this maddening

17:43

world that was my mind. And

17:45

when Strychomar said your thoughts create your

17:47

reality and even suggested this possibility of

17:50

tuning into thoughts and that I

17:52

could actually choose the thoughts that I was having.

17:54

And if I was thinking a thought and I

17:56

didn't want to think it that I could redirect

17:59

it. was absolutely mind blowing

18:01

to me. And so what I started to

18:03

do was, and some of the exercises we'll

18:05

talk about today have to do with being

18:07

able to catch the different thoughts require different

18:09

tools. Just the same way that if you

18:11

had you opened up a carpenter's belt and

18:13

you have a hammer and a screwdriver and

18:15

the drill and these different things, you wouldn't

18:17

use a hammer when you need a drill.

18:19

We actually have different tools for different types

18:21

of thoughts. And so I was, I

18:24

was brought into awareness about just

18:26

how messed up my mind was,

18:29

you know, that I couldn't eat

18:31

a meal without in peace thinking about the meal

18:33

I was going to have and how much I

18:35

was walking around, assuming that other

18:37

people were judging me and what I looked

18:39

like because I was judging them. And so

18:41

for the initially it was like

18:43

a cacophony of sound, but actually taking those things

18:45

in the time to start to drill

18:48

the thoughts apart and actually dissect

18:50

them and take them to court

18:52

little by little, I started to

18:54

change how I was feeling. I

18:56

started to change. I was relating

18:58

to myself, to food, to exercise,

19:00

to my body started to find

19:02

more compassion and understanding why I

19:04

think these things. But for me,

19:06

it was that fundamental place. And

19:08

it started with just being able

19:11

to understand that what I'm allowing

19:13

my brain to think about becomes

19:15

the nature of my reality from

19:17

a very basic psychological perspective. Thoughts

19:19

impact feelings and feelings impact behavior.

19:22

And so when thought when I was thinking

19:24

thoughts that, you know, kids will sometimes say

19:26

I have bad thoughts or adults will kind

19:28

of feel ashamed of the thoughts that they

19:30

have. Well, we're not our thoughts. They're just

19:32

things that we're experiencing, but we're not trained

19:34

to work with them. They can seem overwhelming,

19:36

or they're just running the show without us

19:38

even being aware of it. And so as

19:40

became aware of these behaviors I was taking

19:42

on are these things I was saying to

19:45

myself, things that I would never say to

19:47

somebody else, I'd be cruel to myself in

19:49

a way that even saying out loud what

19:51

I just said to someone else would have

19:53

been unheard of, I would never call someone

19:55

fat and gross and disgusting and who's ever

19:57

going to love you or want to be

19:59

a part of it. you or any of

20:01

these things, I was saying them to

20:03

myself. And so I know your question

20:05

was around the neurological basis of it and just

20:07

wanted to throw out that it

20:09

is the difference between psychology, which

20:11

is the awareness of our cognitions,

20:13

awareness of our emotions, awareness of

20:15

our behaviors, and then a

20:17

very physiological level. It's

20:19

just a whole bunch of

20:21

zaps of neurons firing inside

20:24

of our brain that are just innocent.

20:26

They're not trying to keep you up

20:28

at night. They're not trying to make

20:30

you so stressed out that you can't give

20:32

your presentation the next day. They're just doing

20:34

their thing. And without them

20:37

being regulated or without us focusing

20:39

our attention, we're just going to

20:41

be reactive as opposed to responsible

20:44

for our thoughts. No, that

20:46

makes a lot of sense. Want

20:52

flexibility? Take yoga. Want flexibility with

20:54

your health insurance? Check out UnitedHealthcare

20:56

insurance plans. Underwritten by Golden Rule

20:59

Insurance Company, they offer flexible, budget-friendly

21:01

medical, dental and vision coverage that

21:03

may be right for you. More

21:05

at uh1.com. Hi,

21:08

this is Craig Robinson from Ways

21:11

to Win and support for this

21:13

podcast comes from Invesco QQQ, the

21:15

official ETF of the NCAA. The

21:18

future isn't scary, not realizing its

21:21

potential however could be. Just

21:23

like on the recruiting trail, I've seen

21:25

potential come in many forms as a

21:27

coach. Learn more

21:29

at invesco.com/QQQ. Let's

21:32

rethink possibility. Invesco

21:35

Distributors Inc.

21:37

The Good

21:41

Life Project is sponsored by Loomie. So listen,

21:43

we have all had those awkward moments where

21:45

BO strikes at the worst possible time. I'm

21:47

often actually out in nature when I'm exercising,

21:49

so I don't even notice it when I'm

21:51

out. And then I walk in the door, kind

21:53

of start to wrinkle my nose. And then I'm like, oh, wait a minute. That's

21:56

actually me. That is why I'm so

21:58

thankful. I discovered Loomie. body deodorant.

22:00

This revolutionary product, it was actually invented

22:03

by an OBGYN who wanted a solution

22:05

for her patients struggling with private odor.

22:07

But Lume doesn't just work quote down

22:09

there, it provides incredible 72 hour protection

22:11

for your entire body using Mandelic Acid.

22:14

I kid you not, this stuff is

22:16

a game changer. Lume is safe and

22:18

effective for pits, for feet, you name

22:20

it. And as someone who's tried it,

22:22

I can attest that it seriously works.

22:25

The fresh scents are just an added

22:27

bonus. So if you're ready to say

22:29

goodbye to BO for good, try Lume

22:31

Starter Pack. It comes with a solid

22:33

stick deodorant, cream tube deodorant, two free

22:35

products of your choice like mini body

22:38

wash and deodorant wipes and free shipping.

22:40

As a special offer for our listeners,

22:42

new customers get $5 off a Lume

22:45

Starter Pack with the code goodlife

22:47

at lumedeodorant.com. Don't miss your chance

22:49

to experience the relief of true

22:51

full body freshness that equates to

22:53

over 40% off your starter

22:56

pack when you visit lumedeodorant.com

22:59

or just click the link in the

23:01

show notes and use the code goodlife. Good

23:05

Life Project is sponsored by Quinns. So

23:07

my wife actually originally introduced me to

23:10

Quinns because she loves their clothing and

23:12

I have been hooked ever since. I

23:14

literally lived in their Mongolian cashmere ribbed

23:16

beanie and pullover hoodie pretty much all

23:18

winter. And as the weather warms up,

23:20

I wanted more breathable summer pieces without

23:22

overpaying and Quinns has just the super

23:24

high quality items like linen shirts, performance

23:26

polos, activewear at 50 to 80% less

23:30

than similar brands. Quinns partners directly

23:32

with top factories cutting out the

23:34

middleman to pass savings to customers. I

23:36

actually just ordered a new European linen

23:39

long sleeve button down shirt. Super excited

23:41

to get that. And I'm always just

23:43

so amazed at how they can keep

23:45

their prices so affordable while the quality

23:47

remains really high. So if you're looking

23:49

to upgrade your wardrobe, I highly recommend

23:52

you try Quinns. Go to quinns.com/GLP for

23:54

free shipping on your order and a

23:56

365 day return. to

24:00

get free shipping and 365 day returns.

24:07

quince.com/GLP or just click the link in

24:09

the show notes. Trust me, your wardrobe

24:11

will thank you. So

24:15

if so many of us experience this and

24:18

so often it has really negative

24:20

effects, it affects our state of

24:22

mind, our psychology, our physiology, our

24:24

feelings, our behavior, it basically

24:27

can bring so much suffering to us. Beyond

24:29

the fact that it also consumes so

24:31

much of our just

24:33

cognitive and emotional bandwidth, it takes

24:35

up so much time and space

24:38

that we could be used doing

24:40

amazing things, thinking amazing thoughts, building

24:42

amazing relationships. I think so many of

24:44

us have felt this, the spin cycle

24:47

in my head is taking up so much

24:49

of my time. Like I don't

24:51

have as much left over to do the things that

24:53

I wanna do, to feel the way that I wanna

24:56

feel. And by the time that I do, I'm exhausted

24:59

from this spin cycle of overthinking and all I

25:01

wanna do is sit on the couch and binge

25:04

the latest Nealek episode of whatever it may be.

25:07

Beyond the fact that, as you said, each

25:09

one of these different things has a seed

25:11

of something that has information that is important,

25:13

that does matter to us, what

25:16

is your sense of why so many

25:18

people, what's the underlying why here, why

25:20

we tip into, oh, there's something

25:22

that just came into my mind, it's something

25:24

I need to think about or consider, maybe make

25:26

a decision about. What's the

25:28

why behind why so many people then

25:30

go from that place and

25:32

start to escalate it and circle it up and up and

25:35

up and up and up until it

25:37

becomes all-consuming? Is there sort of

25:39

a common underlying mechanism

25:41

that makes us do that or is it really

25:43

just unique to the individual? I

25:45

think the mechanism is just being

25:48

human. And what I hear

25:50

you saying is, what's happening that there's

25:52

a couple different aspects of it. One

25:54

is the snowball thinking, which we sometimes

25:57

refer to as catastrophizing, where it's like

25:59

one thing. leads to another leads to

26:01

another leads to another leads to another and

26:03

next thing you know you've taken a molehill

26:05

and you turn it into a mountain and

26:07

it becomes this big thing in your head

26:09

to even just the idea of

26:11

well how what happens when I can't let

26:13

it go and a lot

26:15

of it is because we think that

26:18

we need the chatter in order to

26:20

solve the problem so sometimes

26:22

if you just say to a

26:24

person just clear your mind just let it go

26:26

let that story go that without

26:29

understanding that there's different types of chatter it

26:31

becomes a little bit more complex but I'm just

26:33

going to keep it all together for a moment

26:35

so let's say you took the time and you

26:37

wrote an email to your colleague and there

26:39

was something that was happening that was upsetting you

26:42

they did something that just didn't feel so good

26:44

they spoke over you in a meeting and

26:46

you needed to get something from them so you

26:48

write this email and you decided to be a

26:50

little bit vulnerable and you were a little

26:52

bit vulnerable and you hit send and now the

26:55

email is sent you

26:57

know at some point you're going to get

26:59

a response on this email may

27:01

not be tonight it's the end of the work

27:03

day it could be tomorrow and now here you

27:06

go it's already sent you can't undo it you

27:08

could probably try to remove it from the inbox

27:10

but then they'll see that you removed it and

27:12

that the message was deleted and then you start

27:14

the whole chain of thoughts well if I delete

27:16

it and they could see that it was removed

27:18

and I have to send a follow-up email explaining

27:20

why it was removed and should I have said

27:23

that and da da da and then your significant

27:25

other comes and just goes let

27:27

it go Jonathan let it go you already

27:29

sent it you'll cross that bridge when you

27:31

get there however they react but the brain

27:33

just fixates on it and so there's different

27:36

types of chatter that we have it's like

27:38

what happens when we think we've made a

27:40

mistake which is regret chatter I should have

27:42

done this I could have done that what

27:44

happens to the what if type of chatter

27:46

well what if this happens and what if

27:49

that happens or the chatter where

27:51

you're trying to get yourself to motivate yourself to

27:53

do something okay I need to do this I

27:56

have to do this and

27:58

why the brain fixates on it It

28:00

is often just habitual and it's often

28:02

just dopaminergic. It's just your brain is

28:04

kicking up dopamine. It's trying to motivate

28:06

a behavior to get you to do

28:08

something different because the brain isn't wired

28:10

for an email that someone is

28:12

going to read that you can't undo. The

28:15

brain isn't wired for a picture

28:17

that you posted on social media. The

28:19

brain isn't wired for what are people

28:21

going to think of this brand

28:24

that I've just put together. They've known me

28:26

of running a company under this brand. Suddenly,

28:28

I want to offer this new thing and

28:30

what are people going to think about me? It's

28:33

just trying to problem solve. Often the reason

28:35

that people aren't doing something about it is

28:37

one, they don't realize what's happening because it

28:39

just sounds like their mind chatter. They don't

28:41

think they have control over it. There's

28:44

this little tiny bit where

28:46

we think we need the chatter. We

28:49

think we need the worry in order

28:51

to problem solve. Research shows

28:53

that high-level worriers don't problem solve in the

28:55

same way that people were able to get

28:58

into a calm state and look

29:00

at the problem. We really need to

29:02

treat both the chatter and

29:04

the emotion as just signals within

29:07

our body that are meant to get our

29:09

attention. If we aren't controlling

29:11

it, if we don't have the reins

29:13

over our thoughts, then it's just

29:16

like there's a lot of play with this

29:18

metaphor of the rider and the elephant. The

29:21

elephant is running amok and here we are trying

29:23

to control this massive thing. We

29:25

can call it the monkey mind. The

29:27

monkey just goes running around all over

29:29

the place in our mind. Becoming

29:32

a master of your mind, being able

29:34

to actually redirect your thoughts and to

29:37

work with your chatter is

29:39

a level of personal mastery that we can

29:41

all aspire to. We just

29:43

haven't been taught. We just

29:45

wind up in this doing as we've been

29:47

doing. There's so many

29:49

reasons why when we are having the

29:51

thought, even when they're doom and gloom

29:53

thoughts, it's very known that

29:55

the brain doesn't truly know the difference

29:58

between what it is. imagines and what it

30:00

sees. And if you want, I can even walk

30:03

us through a little magic trick exercise

30:05

right now where I can even prove this

30:07

to you. So can I ask

30:09

you to close your eyes for a second, Jonathan? Because

30:11

it's gonna help that those of you who listen to

30:13

the Good Life Project podcast while driving, keep your eyes

30:15

open, but do this with us. You just practice your

30:18

visualization. Okay, so Jonathan, I'm gonna invite

30:20

you to take a deep breath into your body and

30:23

a slow breath out. I

30:26

just wanna acknowledge your shoulders just dropped as

30:28

you did that. That's because you're a well-trained

30:30

breather and do this a lot. And

30:33

I want you to imagine that you are

30:35

standing in your kitchen and look around your

30:37

kitchen for me for a moment and just tell me some

30:39

of the things that you see around your

30:41

kitchen. I

30:44

see a stove,

30:47

water purifier, sink, table,

30:51

plants, dishes, cabinets,

30:53

refrigerator, floor, windows,

30:56

trees and greenery outside of the windows when

30:58

we keep going or something. That's a good

31:01

start, beautiful. So I want you to

31:03

now imagine that you see on the surface of

31:05

your counter a cutting board and

31:08

imagine a cutting board with a

31:10

bright yellow lemon on it and

31:13

a cutting knife. So I'm gonna

31:15

invite you to walk on over and take the

31:17

lemon and place it onto the cutting board and

31:20

then use the knife to cut the lemon in

31:22

half. And as you

31:24

cut in half, maybe you notice a little bit

31:26

of the zest or the little explosion of

31:29

juice that comes out of it. And

31:32

then lay flat down and cut it one more

31:34

time until you have a quarter of a lemon

31:36

in your hand. And then

31:38

imagine bringing that quarter of a lemon

31:40

up to your nose and

31:43

just take a gentle smell. Maybe

31:45

you could even imagine yourself smelling

31:47

that lemon zest. And

31:50

then imagine opening your mouth and

31:53

squeezing the lemon juice

31:55

into your mouth. And

31:58

Notice what's happening inside. In your mouth

32:00

right now. And. The city listening

32:02

notice what's happening. And.

32:05

Then when you already. Have.

32:07

In your eyes and where. Did you notice on

32:09

it and. I. Noticed my

32:11

tongue pulled back and I also noticed

32:13

that my shoulders pulled up to my

32:16

ears like in preparation. Your mouth the think

32:18

it moved a little. That know my chin can

32:20

pull back a little bit. All says. You notice

32:22

any more Saliva City seal yourself salivating

32:24

a little bit north. Probably.

32:26

A tough yes. So dizzy.

32:28

I've done this with thousands and

32:30

thousands of people. Send those suicide. People

32:33

will pursue their lips, little pluck their

32:35

lips and they will start to actually

32:37

start salivating a bit more and what

32:40

you experience there and try to resist

32:42

physical response. Say there was no lemon

32:44

who just imagining yourself squeezing lemon

32:46

ensure mouth and your body braced for

32:49

it. I've done this so many times

32:51

they just as I start biting people

32:53

through the visualization I say take out

32:56

the lemon. I'd start salivating. And I

32:58

might have to like suspect my own

33:00

spit. So don't settle up at the

33:03

mice. So the reason for this is

33:05

your body doesn't actually have a lemon

33:07

in front of that exists imagining it

33:09

and in that imagine atari process is

33:12

preparing yourself for receiving something citrusy and

33:14

something target and it's search releasing saliva

33:16

with Emily senate seat in start to

33:18

break down the sugar it's getting ready

33:20

and fact one of the best things

33:23

he can do for artists good health

33:25

and nutrition in terms of diet is.

33:27

actually take a moment to pause and appreciate

33:29

your food because digestion certain the brain most

33:32

people think digestion starts when you put food

33:34

in her mouth insert to to it but

33:36

actually starts with your eyes it starts by

33:38

seen the food neither example of this as

33:41

you can find yourself in a restaurant in

33:43

are like yeah yeah i'm not hungry advance

33:45

a waiter waitress come fly with the player

33:48

food and all of a sudden you're just

33:50

like home brews i him of greece a

33:52

i kind of not happen so quickly to

33:54

saw food and i kicked up your digestive

33:57

system that said oh we gotta get ready

33:59

to digest Now, the same thing

34:01

happens with our brains. When

34:03

we start to imagine the worst case scenario

34:06

about something or we just get into like,

34:08

hey, what if this happens? So what if

34:10

I put this program out there? What

34:13

if nobody registers for it? Then

34:15

in that moment, I'm imagining that actually happening.

34:17

What would that look like if nobody registered

34:19

for it? My brain is actually

34:22

creating a mental simulation. Even if I

34:24

can't visually see it, it already starts

34:26

to imagine it. Then

34:28

what if nobody registers for

34:30

programs in this next season?

34:33

Then what if I run through the savings

34:35

that I have in my business of paying

34:37

payroll and all my expenses? Then

34:40

what if I need to take out a loan and I

34:42

can't get one? Then what if I can't

34:44

pay my bills? What if I become

34:46

late on my mortgage? What

34:48

if, what if, what if? So the snowballs start to

34:50

happen. The key is that

34:52

at any given step, so

34:55

many things that need to happen in order

34:57

for states step seven to happen. One,

35:00

two, three, four, five, six, seven. We're

35:02

so not there right now, but the

35:04

brain almost imagines that it's possible because

35:07

at each step it created a

35:09

simulation of it actually being plausible.

35:11

So we can go from these things

35:14

that have absolutely no basis in

35:16

reality. They're not likely to actually

35:18

happen, but because we're creating

35:20

these stories and we're imagining

35:22

it in some ways seems plausible.

35:25

And research has shown this with even

35:27

things like having a person hold

35:30

up an object and look at an object

35:32

and they'll run a scan of

35:34

the areas of the brain that light up when

35:36

they're actually seeing the objects. And then they would

35:38

have them close their eyes and now recall the

35:41

object or imagine seeing the object and they take

35:43

a look at what areas of the brain are

35:45

lighting up. And there can, there tends

35:47

to be a 60 to 80% overlap in terms of

35:49

the areas of the brain that light up. And

35:52

athletes use this all the time. That's

35:55

why they use mental simulation where they

35:57

will rehearse themselves going through routine, imagining

35:59

them. themselves in the moment, going through

36:01

the steps, step by step, so that when

36:03

they are actually ready to do it, they

36:06

just take action. So this is a natural

36:08

healthy part of our brain. But when it's

36:10

going to these doom and gloom places, or

36:12

it's telling ourselves these stories about ourselves, we're

36:15

imagining these things, they start to feel as

36:17

though they're real. And particularly about the ones

36:19

that are related to worry, when

36:22

your brain sees something or imagines something

36:24

that it's like, what if this bad

36:26

thing happens? Your body is going

36:28

to be flooded with stress hormones that are

36:31

wired to make you take action.

36:33

They're supposed to propel you to

36:35

when you feel scared, run

36:37

away, fight back or freeze.

36:40

And oftentimes, you need something to run

36:42

from. There's no actual threat, but we're

36:45

left with this elevated heart rate. We're

36:47

left with this amygdala that's overfiring, or

36:50

this cortisol that's being released in our

36:52

body, making it a little harder to

36:54

concentrate, making it a little harder to

36:56

fall asleep. And then we

36:58

find ourselves in this cycle, particularly

37:01

if we then look

37:03

at just how, you said these thoughts can

37:05

become really depleting. I'll give you just a

37:07

quick example of a client I recently worked

37:09

with. She had just come back

37:11

from a breakup. And so it was like

37:13

a really intense heartbreak for her. And

37:15

she's trying to clear her mind and not think

37:17

about the breakup, but she's trying to just get

37:19

back to focusing on her business. And

37:22

here she is trying to make a decision

37:24

about whether or not she shares kind of

37:26

more intimately and vulnerably about what's been going

37:28

on on social media. And does she post

37:31

on this one on this platform? Does she post

37:33

on that platform? And and

37:35

all of this weight around like, what's going

37:37

to be the right decision or the wrong

37:39

decision? And we looked at how just this

37:41

layer of chatter takes this thing that she

37:44

could just go and do, which is just

37:46

put a post together, put a post together

37:48

first, and then see which platform you might

37:50

want to put it in where it's best

37:52

suited. And she's just finding herself

37:54

paralyzed to being able to even take that

37:57

first step. And the reason for

37:59

it is because this. mind chatter just weighs

38:01

down the very basic thing that

38:03

we need to do or motivation

38:05

chatter when it's like you have something that

38:07

you might really enjoy doing like sitting down

38:09

to write or sitting down to create something

38:11

new that you actually legitimately do enjoy doing

38:14

when you do it. But all of this

38:16

thought of like, I have to do this,

38:18

I need to get this done. I should

38:20

have done this by now. Why didn't I

38:22

get this started? Then feeling guilty for doing

38:24

other things rather than doing the thing. All

38:27

of a sudden this thing that was just

38:29

pure and innocent, a very pure and

38:31

innocent action is now heavy

38:33

and loaded because of

38:35

what we've done to it with our mind. And

38:38

so we talked about stripping the chatter of trying

38:40

to figure out the right or wrong thing to

38:42

do with the thing. And we're like, what if

38:44

you just made the thing first? What if you

38:46

just made the post, enjoyed making the

38:49

post and then thought about what's the right or

38:51

wrong way to place it and it's such

38:53

a simple thing, but just catching how much of

38:55

her chatter was around? What if

38:57

I do the wrong thing and already being

38:59

so sad and heartbroken and just kind

39:01

of trying to get her mood boosted

39:03

anyway, just put it all together into

39:05

like making the simple thing harder for

39:08

herself. And then when she just freed

39:10

herself of the chatter of the, what's

39:12

the right way to do it? What's the wrong

39:14

way to do it or having to figure it

39:16

all out and just went back to taking it

39:18

one step in front of the other, she's able

39:20

to do it and feel lighter. And so this

39:22

is like our thoughts can make things heavier, harder,

39:24

way us down in ways

39:27

that we usually don't even realize. Yeah,

39:29

that resonates so much. You've

39:32

mentioned so far in a

39:34

conversation without really defining them,

39:36

what are different types of chatter? And I

39:39

know you have this sort of taxonomy

39:41

of chatter, where you look at it and

39:43

you say, well, it's not all just one

39:45

thing, but there are these five different types.

39:48

So I think it would be helpful to

39:50

maybe walk through the five different types and

39:53

just, so we can have a

39:55

sense for what these are and how to distinguish them. And

39:57

then maybe we'll talk about some of the tools that

39:59

would be relevant for each. So maybe we'll go

40:01

one at a time defining and describing what

40:04

each of these different types of overthinking

40:06

chatter rumination are. Yeah, yeah,

40:08

absolutely. And I should say that the

40:10

way that this model got created is

40:12

that we're looking at the five types

40:14

of chatter that need changing.

40:16

These are the five types of overthinking

40:19

and ruminating or the types of thoughts

40:21

that people could have that

40:23

if you don't learn

40:25

how to navigate these types, they're

40:27

gonna be more problematic. There

40:30

are some types of thoughts that we have that are

40:32

just factual thoughts like, I'm

40:34

hungry, I have to pee, how

40:36

much time is left in this podcast? What do I

40:38

need to go do next? You don't

40:40

need to train yourself because those types of

40:42

thoughts, even if you're having them at the

40:44

very least, all they'll do is stop you

40:46

from being mindful. Then there's

40:48

sort of dreaming thoughts like, oh, where

40:51

could we go for vacation this year?

40:53

Or I've heard that Bali's beautiful this

40:55

time of year, all of

40:57

that type of chatter. Just thoughts about the

40:59

future, it's sort of innocent. In fact, it's

41:01

great to daydream and get creative and think

41:03

that. So those kinds of thoughts are fine.

41:06

Again, the worst that they'll do is stop

41:08

you from being in the present moment, just

41:11

being really aware of what you have right now, empty

41:14

mind, blank mind. But the five

41:16

types of chatter, these are chatter

41:18

that we want to be able

41:20

to learn to work with because

41:22

they can lead to weighing you

41:24

down, stressing you, or some

41:26

of them could put you, if you don't learn

41:29

to challenge them, at risk for depression or at

41:31

risk for anxiety. And if you look at what

41:33

are the highest maladies that people

41:36

struggle with nowadays, it's some aspect

41:38

of generalized anxiety disorder or

41:41

some aspect of depression or the

41:43

two going together, we

41:45

could actually help quite a lot

41:47

of people navigate these two major

41:49

ailments that they're experiencing by teaching

41:51

them this chatter. So

41:53

I Call it the mind over

41:55

chatter approach and we start with

41:58

the idea of worry chatter. The

42:00

judgment chatter regret shatter

42:02

mindset, shatter and motivation.

42:04

Chatter so. Worry.

42:07

Chatter is any time

42:09

your mind. Has

42:11

thoughts about the future that has

42:13

a flavor of protection or fear

42:15

so could be worried. Shudder to

42:18

be excited. Chatter And what's great

42:20

about this approach and actually treating

42:22

it as a system is if

42:24

you can hear the beginning of

42:26

white, your mind is saying of

42:28

what your the ruminating over thinking

42:31

about. When you can patch that

42:33

beginning part, you can know which

42:35

chatter to apply to it or

42:37

which way of reclaiming it. So

42:39

worried. chatter is anything. That starts

42:41

with white if it's anything going into

42:43

the future. So what if I don't

42:45

get this job? What if I make

42:47

a fool of myself? What is they

42:50

think that I don't have what it

42:52

takes? What if they call me out

42:54

on it would have been on the

42:56

since me? What if I do get

42:58

it so it's any time that we're

43:00

having that thought of what if something

43:02

bad is going to happen or it's

43:04

anything future oriented it excels to be

43:06

like ended a mess this up. I'm

43:08

going to I will. I'll end up.

43:10

I'll never. Any of these future

43:12

oriented thoughts and a key about mind

43:14

over worry chatter is that we want

43:16

to first start by having compassion for

43:19

our mind as to why it's doing

43:21

this in the first place. The only

43:23

reason you're worrying is because there is

43:25

the saw it as a potential threat

43:28

which is not very likely when your

43:30

brain is trying to protect you from

43:32

it. So the way to work with

43:34

worry chatter is always first to say

43:36

thank you, bring you know you're trying

43:39

to protect me and work with the

43:41

worry. And in order to work with

43:43

the worry we have different processes that I'll

43:45

give you some sort cuts to it the

43:47

first one you can use his understanding that

43:50

the think that you're worried about we're not

43:52

actually worried about, you're not worried that something

43:54

will happen to your house, You're not worried

43:56

that you will lose your home or your

43:58

job or your. Freedom are all

44:01

these other things. Were worried that these

44:03

things would happen and that they would

44:05

crush us. They would stop us from

44:07

being able to move forward in a

44:09

what if I make a mistake you

44:11

not actually afraid of whatever that mistake

44:13

as you're free that you'll make this

44:15

mistake and you will not be able

44:17

to recover from it. Sitting people to

44:19

work with their worry. We work with

44:21

the helping them understand that they have

44:23

handled it. The topic sentences

44:25

to who would if this happens When

44:28

that happens the short p is that

44:30

you say to yourself, it handles it.

44:32

Before. And I'll handle

44:34

it again. Or you catch yourself going

44:37

to those worst case scenarios. And sometimes

44:39

we take a process where we actually

44:41

less the brain go worst case scenario

44:43

and you just go okay and then

44:45

what happens and know what happens and

44:48

know what happens and actually get others

44:50

catastrophizing thoughts out and then go to

44:52

the unrealistically best case scenario. So what

44:54

is the positive opposite happened? So it

44:56

goes from and looking for a job?

44:59

haven't been able to find a job.

45:01

I nail my ideal job right out

45:03

the gate. And then you go

45:05

down this unrealistically best case scenario. So that

45:07

isn't get to what's most likely gonna happen.

45:10

Because in that place of worry, we're not

45:12

able to problem solve. So it's really important

45:14

to be able to kill them apart. And

45:16

as you said earlier, Jonathan, you're like, why

45:18

don't we just do away with us, Why

45:21

don't we just stop Or there's nothing like

45:23

telling a high level where years that they

45:25

shouldn't worry. When you tell them that they

45:27

shouldn't worry, they just worry more that you're

45:29

not worried as much as they are. They

45:32

worry for you that you're not wearing. and

45:34

else and so they just take their

45:36

heels even more into their need for

45:38

worry so rather than working with the

45:40

worry we want to understand that the

45:42

worry was just there to get your

45:44

attention so that you could work with

45:46

the chatter so that you could problem

45:48

solved so that it's these god forbid

45:50

things can happen that you have a

45:52

plan so okay thank you brain for

45:54

telling me about these worst case scenario

45:57

things that can happen i believe i

45:59

will handle them So let me take a

46:01

look at them. What if this happens? Can I actually

46:03

plan for this thing? No, I

46:05

can't. There's only so much I can plan

46:07

for something that might happen 10 years out into

46:09

the future. What if something happens to me in

46:12

retirement and I don't have enough money for retirement?

46:14

What can I do about it today? Is

46:16

how we work with worry chatter. And

46:18

all those future thoughts can all be handled very

46:21

much in the same way so that you're able

46:23

to reframe it, catch yourself going, what if this

46:25

happens? What if that happens? And you can say,

46:27

if it happens, I will handle

46:29

it. Or you take the thought and

46:31

you digest it. You write it down and you

46:33

go, okay, can I actually do something about this

46:36

in this moment? If so, great.

46:38

What can I do to prevent it from happening?

46:40

But it's like with the banana peel. The banana

46:42

is the thing you want to eat. The peel

46:44

is the worry. And most people

46:46

don't understand that they can separate the

46:48

feeling of worry, the

46:51

heartbeat, the ruminating from the actual

46:53

problem solving. So that problem solving

46:55

is what you want to do.

46:58

But if you just stay in the worry and

47:00

the ruminating about it, you're not going

47:02

to be able to problem solve this effectively. And

47:05

that makes a lot of sense to me. One of the things

47:07

that I'm curious about as you're describing this is, does

47:10

this get easier with repetition? Because

47:12

what I'm thinking about, especially with

47:14

the worry type of chatter scenario,

47:18

you're looking at a new job opportunity. I don't know, will

47:20

I be good at it? Will I get it? Will I

47:22

not get it? What are they thinking? You get the job,

47:24

right? The minute you accept

47:26

the job, you show up the first day, and then

47:28

the chatter just rolls into, what

47:31

if I mess up? What if I lose the job?

47:33

And then you get to the next day, you get

47:35

a really good project, and then you're given something more

47:37

complex, I'm not ready for this. If I screw this

47:39

up, then there's even more riding on it. So

47:42

it occurs to me, especially with the worry type, that

47:45

there's probably no end to the cycle. So

47:49

what I'm wondering is, or the

47:51

interventions that you're talking about, they're fairly straightforward. You're

47:54

not ready for them, that you can do them yourself. Is

47:57

it the type of thing where the more we

47:59

do these things, The more we sort of

48:01

like build the muscle or the habit of noticing

48:03

what our thought is and then

48:05

actually like, you know, doing these simple interventions

48:07

that you described that it

48:10

becomes more habitual that we default to

48:12

these pattern interrupts. And that

48:15

not only does it make it easier for us

48:17

in the moment, but does it over time start

48:20

to help us not go

48:22

there in the first place? Yeah, such a

48:25

powerful question, Jonathan. It is

48:27

more like whack-a-moe, where you

48:29

whack the thought and you get it and then it's

48:31

like, it's no longer worrying about this and it's going

48:34

to find the next thing to worry about. And

48:36

then it's like you worry about not getting the job and then

48:38

you worry about the fact that now you have the job and

48:41

now you have to fulfill on the thing and now the pressure

48:43

comes and it does get easier.

48:46

If you can over time see

48:49

the pattern and zoom out the lens

48:51

and actually befriend the worry. We

48:54

want to befriend this part of ourselves. We actually want

48:56

to love this part of ourselves. And

48:58

this is where the best tool that

49:00

we can actually implement is some aspect

49:02

of self-compassion that we are not our

49:04

thoughts. I am me having a thought.

49:06

I can't be the thing that I'm

49:08

observing. I'm the observer and there's

49:10

a part of me that's having a thought.

49:12

So separating that out and then

49:14

when you see those patterns, we can

49:16

understand that it is

49:19

just this one thing that's

49:21

got this loyal job to do, which is

49:23

to keep you safe and protect you. And

49:26

so that when the habit, when the thing

49:28

comes on and it does, you can just

49:31

go, oh, how sweet, how

49:33

sweet you are. You're part of myself that's

49:35

trying to protect me. You know,

49:37

you're done worrying about this and now you're looking

49:39

for the next thing. And literally is that when

49:41

I work with clients all the time, they can

49:43

literally feel that now their brain

49:45

is looking for the next thing because everything

49:47

is okay right now. It's

49:49

got to be something to worry about. I'm

49:52

worried that I'm not worrying about something. And

49:54

when you can just see that it is a

49:56

tendency that will always be present and we don't

49:59

want to lose it. Because you to

50:01

will at some point in your life

50:03

neither part of you that's going red

50:05

alert. There is real danger and so

50:07

think it is removed as part of

50:09

you you wouldn't want to. But we

50:11

do need to start to be friend

50:13

it especially when it's as habitual and

50:15

being able to understand that it is

50:17

just how it is manifesting from one

50:19

worry into another. Nut said seems and

50:21

and seeds or rather than just even

50:24

trainers latham away we'll see think you

50:26

can. He keeps me going to the

50:28

same thing. Think you bring your trying.

50:30

To protect me a moon when see

50:32

do get that. Also at these tough

50:34

topic sentences I hear the what if

50:36

this happens my go to his across

50:39

that bridge when I get there. Or.

50:42

I'll handle it. And. So I is.

50:44

I hear my brain and repetition and the same

50:46

thing for the other types of chatter that fire

50:49

like it is your quick little numonyx and over

50:51

time you're welcome A wing. Seltzer.

50:54

And you get more time in the

50:56

relapse where there is nothing to hold

50:58

on to see where this familiar relationship

51:00

you hide with beating up on yourself.

51:02

You can't just stop beating up on

51:05

yourself because when you're trying to not

51:07

do something and of just thinking about

51:09

doing it more was so with the

51:11

over thinking and us that over ruminating

51:13

and his sake you catch yourself like

51:15

beating up on yourself being so hard

51:18

on yourself you would get someone else

51:20

greece that they messed up that speech.

51:23

It's okay, they did the best they

51:25

could but you know you had to

51:27

be perfect and so you're catching mess

51:29

and cycle. How do we stop this

51:31

habit of beating up with myself for

51:33

being so hard on myself. Really hard

51:36

to do by the more you have

51:38

compassion. Little by little by little by

51:40

little you just he doing it and

51:42

overtime that relationship that you had to

51:44

it's taking. Storm does chef and becomes

51:46

more habitual and you talk back to

51:49

it faster. The boys becomes not as

51:51

loud becomes not a strong doesn't. Mean

51:53

it's on. It's ever gonna go away that has

51:55

all of these things are just trying to protect

51:57

you. Know. That makes less sense. Mom

52:05

deserves the best and there's no

52:07

better place to shop for Mother's

52:09

Day than Whole Foods Market. They're

52:11

your destination for unbeatable savings, from

52:13

premium gifts to show-stopping flowers and

52:15

irresistible desserts. Start by saving 33%

52:18

with Prime on all body care and candles.

52:21

Then get a 15-stem bunch of tulips for

52:23

just $9.99 each with Prime. Round

52:26

out Mom's menu with festive

52:28

rosé, irresistible berry shantilly cake

52:30

and more special treats. Come celebrate

52:32

Mother's Day at Whole Foods Market.

52:36

Flexibility is great. That's why there's

52:38

yoga. Flexibility for your insurance coverage

52:40

is great too. That's why there's

52:42

UnitedHealthcare Insurance Plans. Underwritten by Golden

52:45

Rule Insurance Company, UnitedHealthcare Insurance Plans

52:47

offer flexible, budget-friendly coverage for medical,

52:49

vision, dental, and more. One

52:51

of these plans may be right for

52:54

you if you're, say, between jobs, coming

52:56

off your parents' plan, turning a side

52:58

hustle into a full hustle, or even

53:00

missed open enrollment. Want more flexibility? Find

53:02

out more about UnitedHealthcare Insurance Plans at

53:04

uh1.com. The CLAWD3 model family from

53:06

Anthropic is your one-stop shop for enterprise

53:08

AI. With models at every

53:11

point on the price-performance curve, you no

53:13

longer have to make tradeoffs between intelligence,

53:15

speed, and cost. CLAWD3 Opus

53:17

sets new industry benchmarks for

53:19

intelligence. SONNET strikes the perfect

53:21

balance between skills and speed.

53:24

HYCU is the fastest and

53:26

lowest cost model on the

53:28

market, perfectly designed for high-volume,

53:30

high-speed use cases. Join the

53:32

thousands of enterprises who trust

53:34

Anthropic to keep them at

53:36

the frontier. Visit anthropic.com/CLAWD today.

53:39

Mom deserves the best and there's

53:41

no better place to shop for

53:43

Mother's Day than Whole Foods Market.

53:45

They're your destination for unbeatable savings.

53:47

From premium gifts to show-stopping flowers

53:50

and irresistible desserts, start by saving

53:53

33% with Prime on all body care and

53:55

candles. Then get a 15-stem bunch of tulips

53:57

for just $9.99 each with Prime. Round

54:00

out mom's menu with festive rose,

54:06

irresistible berry, shantily cake and more special

54:08

treats. Come celebrate Mother's Day at Whole Foods

54:10

Market. Let's walk

54:12

through the other four. Great. So from Worry

54:14

Chatter, we can go to Motivation Chatter.

54:17

Motivation Chatter, I might have said this in a

54:19

different order but let's just don't go to Motivation

54:21

Chatter. So Motivation Chatter is any

54:23

time that your mind is weighing you down

54:26

with, I have to do this, I need

54:28

to do this, I should do this. And

54:31

one would think that this is just perfectly innocent,

54:33

just having the thought, I need to do this,

54:35

I have to do this. But what it turns

54:37

into is too much of that

54:41

chatter makes you feel like you have the

54:43

weight of the world on your shoulder.

54:45

You feel burdened by everything you have

54:47

to do and you need to do.

54:49

And one of our core needs as

54:52

human beings is for agency and autonomy.

54:54

So we don't realize that every single time we're thinking

54:57

like, I need to pick my kids up from school

54:59

and I have to make dinner and I need to

55:01

call this person back and I have to do this.

55:04

That if it's just like, gee,

55:06

I have to do this, it would be fine.

55:08

But most people when it's ruminating and their mind

55:10

is just going, it's on a set cycle. And

55:13

I don't do enough and I should be doing

55:15

more. So the reason we're having that chatter, you

55:17

should do this, you need to do this, you

55:19

have to do this, don't forget you have to

55:21

do this is because your brain is

55:24

trying to motivate you to take action. But

55:26

what often happens is it

55:28

doesn't motivate you, it just makes

55:30

you feel like you are overburdened

55:32

or you do eventually do it.

55:34

But when it's overthinking and ruminating

55:36

about it, it's just an overkill.

55:39

It's like, I wrote down, I wrote

55:41

this down on my to-do list, I

55:43

will get to it eventually, I don't

55:45

need to think about it. It's a

55:47

misuse of energy to keep letting my

55:49

brain ruminate about it. And so there's

55:51

a quick turnaround for this. The first

55:53

is just to remove the burden and

55:55

reclaim agency. You don't have to pick

55:57

your children up from school. You

56:00

want to pick your kids up from school because

56:02

you don't want them stranded at school by themselves. You

56:05

don't have to do the laundry. You

56:07

choose to do the laundry because you would

56:09

prefer to wear clean underwear. You

56:11

don't have to return your email. You

56:14

want to return your email because you'd like to

56:16

get back to people that are waiting for you.

56:19

You don't even have to pay your bills. Really, you

56:21

don't have to pay bills. And

56:23

I would imagine that you would like to keep your Wi-Fi

56:25

in your heat and your house and all these other things.

56:28

But even that, it's like you don't actually have

56:30

to. Without the control

56:32

over the motivation chatter, it just starts

56:35

to feel heavy and you just feel

56:37

burdened by everything, by the world, by

56:39

this world you've created, even when it's

56:41

a really good thing. Like, I

56:44

have all of these things that I

56:46

want to do. They're all so good,

56:49

but they're not actually motivating you to

56:51

take action because there's just too many of them. So

56:53

with that one, the quick one is you go from,

56:55

I have to, I need

56:57

to, or I should, to I

57:00

want to, or I get to, or I choose to.

57:04

Or you can take that choose to, to

57:07

I choose to blank because blank. I

57:09

don't have to go to work. I choose to go to

57:11

work because I like collecting a

57:13

paycheck. I don't have to go to

57:16

the gym. I want to go to the gym. But

57:19

sometimes you don't want to go to the gym.

57:21

And then you could just say, I want to

57:23

want to go to the gym, but even I

57:25

want to want is better than I have to.

57:28

So this is one of the ways that in

57:30

our mind, we don't even realize it. We zap

57:32

ourselves of our power. We zap

57:34

ourselves of our agency because

57:36

of the way in which we're

57:39

overthinking these things. Where the

57:41

only reason your brain is saying it in the first place

57:43

is because it wants to motivate you to go to

57:46

the gym because it's good for you. Pick up your kids.

57:49

So motivation chatter, catching it

57:51

and then replacing it. I

57:53

get to, you don't have

57:56

to make dinner. You

57:58

get to make dinner. Little shifts

58:00

like that can take something from it

58:02

feeling like a burden and you

58:05

can't turn your chatter off Can't

58:07

turn your mind off just just going going to

58:10

feeling grateful for the thing that you get

58:12

to do and this you can not just

58:14

introduce Yourself but it's really helpful to introduce

58:16

your family to this idea or your colleagues

58:18

to this idea My team says

58:20

this to me all the time. I'll be on a meeting

58:22

and I'll say okay I have to go teach class right

58:25

now and they'll say do you have to or do you

58:27

get to? And I'll be like

58:29

you're right. I get to go teach class

58:31

right now because no really I do. I'm

58:33

so honored That's the thing when

58:35

they say it. It's like yeah, I do I

58:37

get to I'm grateful that I get to but

58:40

so often We forget that right

58:42

and so that's motivation chatter. Got

58:45

it. No, I love that reframe Also, what I

58:47

love about like these interventions too is the

58:50

interventions themselves are not heavy It's like they're

58:52

not adding burden or complexity. They're straightforward. They're

58:54

simple it's just a matter of getting

58:56

into the practice of Noticing

58:59

and then using them on a regular

59:01

basis. We talked about motivation.

59:03

We talked about worry Let's

59:05

walk through the the other three. Yeah, so the

59:07

next one that's good to know about is

59:09

mindset chatter And the reason I call this

59:11

mindset chatter is it's intimately tied to the

59:13

idea of fixing growth mindset And

59:16

we know that research shows that people

59:18

who hold more of a growth mindset

59:20

are more successful They're better able to

59:22

handle stress persist in the face of

59:24

setbacks growth mindset is something

59:26

that's really essential for resilience and This

59:30

is when you hear your brain thing

59:32

say things that start with I can't

59:35

or I don't I don't know

59:37

how to do that. I can't do that. I

59:39

don't have what it takes for that and Again,

59:43

that might actually be accurate in

59:45

that moment But there's a deflated

59:47

feeling when we just say I

59:49

can't or I don't and If

59:53

it's just like oh, yeah, I know I can't do

59:55

that tomorrow. I'm not free at that time. That's fine

59:57

But what we're talking about is the one that actually

1:00:00

into a mindset like I

1:00:02

don't have what it takes to do this if

1:00:05

we add the word yet to

1:00:07

the end of it like I can't

1:00:09

speak I'm learning to speak Hebrew I

1:00:11

can't speak fluent Hebrew yet I

1:00:15

can't bake a cake

1:00:17

from scratch yet I

1:00:19

don't know how to launch

1:00:22

online marketing ads from

1:00:24

scratch yet I don't

1:00:26

know how to drive a car yet

1:00:30

any of these things that we can by

1:00:32

adding the word yet to it is just

1:00:34

a simple one where we can start to

1:00:36

catch mind-tire it's always really good for kids

1:00:39

like I can't do this I

1:00:41

can't do this math problem to

1:00:43

help them hold the growth mindset we

1:00:45

could say you can't do it yet

1:00:47

and what that conveys is that change

1:00:50

is possible so just in the same

1:00:52

way that autonomy and agency is really

1:00:54

important for motivation for human basic needs

1:00:57

the belief that things can change a

1:00:59

sense of optimism for the future is

1:01:01

also really important so you want to

1:01:03

be strategic around where you need this

1:01:05

but it's just if you can catch

1:01:07

where you start saying yourself I

1:01:10

don't do this well enough or I can't

1:01:12

do this it's same to I'm not that

1:01:14

kind of person I'm not

1:01:17

someone who can do that I'm not

1:01:19

like that person those are the types

1:01:21

of thoughts that have this underlying mindset

1:01:23

that may be more of a fixed

1:01:25

mindset around I'm not smart enough

1:01:28

or I can't do those things and so

1:01:30

just adding that yet at

1:01:32

the end of it is a simple

1:01:34

mindset chatter hack that takes something that

1:01:36

would otherwise be a period I don't

1:01:38

know how to do this period and

1:01:40

it just makes it a comma it

1:01:43

just opens up the keeps our ourselves

1:01:46

open to change is possible change is

1:01:48

always happening and that's an important way

1:01:50

to deal with that type of chatter

1:01:52

to get it to stop to get

1:01:55

it to stop from it ruminating that

1:01:57

makes a lot of sense to me also because What

1:02:00

you're talking about is acknowledging the

1:02:02

reality of your current moment. You

1:02:05

know, you're not deluding yourself to say, oh yes you

1:02:07

can, maybe you don't have the skill yet, maybe you

1:02:09

don't have the experience yet, maybe you don't have the

1:02:11

resources or whatever it may be. So

1:02:13

rather than asking you to

1:02:15

step into some sort of delusional mode and

1:02:17

say, yes I can, but everything

1:02:20

inside of you is screaming, but you know

1:02:22

you really can. And the reality is that

1:02:24

you can't. It allows you to

1:02:26

acknowledge the fact that in this very moment, maybe

1:02:28

you're not ready or you're not equipped or you

1:02:30

don't have what is needed to do

1:02:32

the thing, but that means that's

1:02:34

just a snapshot. Like that's not the

1:02:36

movie, that's not the projection down the

1:02:38

road. It allows you to acknowledge the fact

1:02:40

that, okay so this is my reality in the current moment and

1:02:43

there's possibility on the other side of this. Like

1:02:45

then you get to ask the questions, well

1:02:47

what skill would I need to acquire? What

1:02:49

resources would I need? So

1:02:52

that now you can put yourself into this mode

1:02:54

of instead of ruminating when I can't,

1:02:56

I can't, I can't, and then it goes

1:02:58

to an identity level, I'm terrible, I'll never,

1:03:00

but you know now you're like, I can't,

1:03:02

okay that's reality yet, so

1:03:05

what would I need to make happen so

1:03:08

that I could actually make this thing happen?

1:03:10

So it puts you into this possibility mode rather

1:03:13

than this shutdown mode,

1:03:15

and it acknowledges your reality rather than asking you

1:03:17

to step into something that you know in your

1:03:20

heart is not true and just

1:03:22

try and repeat it enough times so that

1:03:24

you fake your way into making it a

1:03:27

truth which you will always know is actually

1:03:29

not true, and that creates that cognitive

1:03:31

dissonance which just you kind of know it's

1:03:33

not right. I love that simplicity.

1:03:36

Talk to me about the final two types and how you handle

1:03:38

them. And just to layer onto that

1:03:40

what you just said is you're in

1:03:42

doing that, in staying solution focused and

1:03:45

actually generating ideas around what you do,

1:03:47

you're actually using the chatter and

1:03:50

the thoughts for what they're trying to get

1:03:52

you to do. But without knowing

1:03:54

how to, they're just on loop. It's

1:03:57

like they're on loop to try to get you to

1:03:59

take them do something with them, but you

1:04:01

don't know how to take them down from the cloud

1:04:03

and do something with them. So they just keep going.

1:04:06

Whereas when you catch it, you start to

1:04:08

become creative. Okay, well, what can I do

1:04:10

about it? It opens up problem solving. And

1:04:12

at the end of the day, that's what you want. You want

1:04:14

that problem solving. So the next one

1:04:16

you actually just mentioned, it then becomes an identity.

1:04:19

And when it becomes an identity, that

1:04:22

identity, whether it be positive or

1:04:24

negative, becomes some aspect of a

1:04:26

judgment. So the next type of

1:04:28

chatter is judgment chatter. Whether

1:04:30

the judgment is positive or negative, it can

1:04:32

still be a judgment. And so what is

1:04:34

that form? What firm does that take? This

1:04:37

is chatter that starts with, I'm

1:04:40

so, I always, I'm,

1:04:43

she's a, he's a, he

1:04:45

thinks, she thinks. It's

1:04:47

any time that we are judging

1:04:50

ourselves, judging others, or

1:04:52

judging the situation. And

1:04:56

that type of chatter, judgment

1:04:58

chatter requires us to take

1:05:01

our brain to court. Because

1:05:03

when we can take on a positive

1:05:05

identity that serves us, like, I

1:05:07

am hardworking, I figure things out. So

1:05:10

in that case, that's great. You're hardworking.

1:05:12

You don't need to challenge that. But

1:05:14

I'm not good enough is

1:05:16

the kind of thought where I am, and then

1:05:18

fill in the blank. Oh, let me catch that.

1:05:20

Well, how do I handle that? How do I

1:05:23

get myself to stop thinking that? You

1:05:25

can just say, stop it, stop it. What's wrong with you?

1:05:28

You shouldn't think that. Well, all that does is just

1:05:30

makes you ignore it for a little bit until you're

1:05:32

trying to fall asleep at night and then

1:05:34

pop all the thoughts, keep going again. But

1:05:36

instead, we actually want to zap it. We

1:05:38

actually want to transmute it. And that's what

1:05:40

the talk backs do. And so we begin

1:05:42

to say, okay, if my brain wants to

1:05:45

judge myself, others or the

1:05:47

situation, I need to say, where's the

1:05:49

evidence? Where is the evidence?

1:05:51

What does it mean to be not good enough?

1:05:54

We Literally want to take our brain to court.

1:05:56

So If you walked into a court of law

1:05:58

and you were the defendant on a case and

1:06:00

they said you know you stole the money the

1:06:03

church with say. Prove. It whereas

1:06:05

the of his seat owns his ears,

1:06:07

get away with these accusations. You have

1:06:09

to back them up with evidence. So

1:06:11

we start to look for evidence for

1:06:13

or evidence against. It's actually be taking

1:06:15

her brain really seriously starting to ask

1:06:17

it can I know that to be

1:06:20

certain? where's that evidence and then you

1:06:22

can talk back to it. He literally

1:06:24

concise. That's not true because or another

1:06:26

way of seeing that is Soon I

1:06:28

was healing for my eating disorder. I

1:06:30

would touch my brain saying things like

1:06:33

verse. So far your. So ugly years

1:06:35

so gross. You're so this in

1:06:37

an associate that such for you

1:06:39

or another we're seeing that is

1:06:41

not feeling so great in my

1:06:43

body right now. but I'm not.

1:06:45

the scenes and so the talk

1:06:47

baths I'm not smart enough or

1:06:49

see same way they think I'm

1:06:52

an idiot. Who. Can I

1:06:54

know that? To be certain? Can I have

1:06:56

seen know what they are thinking? No, Actually,

1:06:58

I can't And so it's sights. Basically, you're

1:07:00

seeing your brain anatomy. You get away with

1:07:03

that. And thought process consists

1:07:05

start with touching at any time

1:07:07

easier there are I'm ah he

1:07:10

thinks she thinks this is in

1:07:12

out then he didn't catch it

1:07:14

in he said say can I

1:07:17

knew that to be certain or

1:07:19

where's the evidence for that and

1:07:21

he started challenger brains and then

1:07:23

we start to choose a better

1:07:26

feeling sought to them are useful

1:07:28

thought I thought that's not constantly

1:07:30

looping and we framing that. Prospectus.

1:07:34

So. They make so much sense It is really

1:07:36

similar. a lot of ways to buy or entities

1:07:38

in the worst where you really awesomely is is

1:07:40

right? Is it true He like was show me

1:07:42

the evidence of I saw us and we never

1:07:45

go there like we just let her brain tell

1:07:47

us as it is. And if it's

1:07:49

something that's constructive and builds you up and like,

1:07:51

the i actually like is positive really. Cool.

1:07:54

Because all roles that. but when it's

1:07:56

taking you down there, I love the

1:07:58

idea of them to. It to court

1:08:00

and that makes so much and smith which

1:08:03

brings us to the final want the final

1:08:05

device? This. Final and I think is accept

1:08:07

that crux of what you're asking about about

1:08:09

over think it. Because.

1:08:11

This is regret Shatter. So a

1:08:14

lot of over thinking is actually

1:08:16

regret shatter. This is where you

1:08:18

just can't let it go and

1:08:20

your the actual regret is I

1:08:22

could else. I. Should us.

1:08:25

What if I had? and so it's

1:08:27

acidic or whatever. and what is it

1:08:29

about it is a part of you

1:08:32

that still trying to get your attention

1:08:34

to say. You might have made

1:08:36

a mistake. And would it's putting you

1:08:38

through is a replay of for what if

1:08:40

you mean to be sick, what if he

1:08:42

made him sick when if you few mistakes

1:08:44

but it just sounds like different things you

1:08:46

know I shouldn't have written die or how

1:08:48

are they can receive that? So this is

1:08:50

regret chatter and the talk back to regret

1:08:52

chatter. Is really coming to peace

1:08:54

with your penis? It's an element. Of

1:08:57

self forgiveness to the talks back

1:08:59

to it is I can't change

1:09:01

the past actually saying thank you

1:09:04

Breen. He Are you saying

1:09:06

that? I should have said this differently,

1:09:08

but I can't change the past. Here's

1:09:10

what I will do moving forward because

1:09:12

the regret shatters trying to get your

1:09:15

attention so that next time you don't

1:09:17

do the same thing or you don't

1:09:19

do it similarly and so being able

1:09:21

to say thank you. The. Past

1:09:23

is history. The best thing

1:09:26

I can do for myself as hold onto

1:09:28

the lesson and let the let let the

1:09:30

rest go. So even saying what's the lesson

1:09:32

what can I do it can also sound

1:09:35

like I wish I hadn't or I can't

1:09:37

believe I. Those are places that if you

1:09:39

can if you hear the beginnings of those

1:09:41

sentences very likely that you're going to be

1:09:44

on a loop. Can't believe I did this

1:09:46

and such an idiot to there you have

1:09:48

regrets. Shattered Judge when solder. What if they

1:09:50

all think I'm a complete bozo where each

1:09:53

outer space but you can say to catch.

1:09:55

them altogether but they started now be

1:09:57

familiar and now they're just parts of

1:09:59

you coming together, feeling

1:10:02

bad over things that right

1:10:04

now you can't change. But what you do

1:10:07

have control over is can you

1:10:09

learn the lessons and can you let go of

1:10:11

the rest? So a lot of

1:10:13

regret chatter is being at peace with your

1:10:15

past. A lot of it is about forgiveness.

1:10:18

One of my favorite definitions of forgiveness is letting

1:10:20

go of hope for a different past. Right.

1:10:23

The past is over. It's already done. Toping

1:10:26

that the past could be different isn't going to really

1:10:28

help you. Catching the chatter

1:10:30

and saying thank you brain somehow

1:10:33

flagellating myself about this and beating

1:10:35

myself up over it, making

1:10:38

myself hurt through my stress

1:10:40

or feeling bad isn't

1:10:42

helping me. It's not going to

1:10:44

help me prevent this from happening in the future. What

1:10:46

can I do differently? So I should

1:10:48

have, I could have, what if I had, I

1:10:50

wish I had it, I can't believe I. That's

1:10:53

all a form of regret

1:10:55

chatter. And talking back to

1:10:57

it by coming to peace with it. That

1:11:00

is done. And I

1:11:02

can't do anything about it, but I can take the

1:11:04

lessons. And in doing that,

1:11:07

I embrace more of that growth mindset,

1:11:09

that learner path thinking, all of which

1:11:11

will make you more resilient. But

1:11:13

without the ability to catch the thought, pull

1:11:15

it down from the cloud, be like, uh,

1:11:18

I'm going to dissect you. I'm going to

1:11:20

talk back to you. Then it

1:11:23

feels like it just, these thoughts are all swirling

1:11:25

around and they seem like they just happen without

1:11:27

you being able to do anything about it. But

1:11:29

actually learning how to talk back to them in

1:11:31

real time, what it does is it just, it

1:11:34

just shuts them up, especially when you take your

1:11:36

brain to court. It's like, all right, I

1:11:38

guess I can't get away with calling you a bozo

1:11:40

anymore or an idiot. And then it

1:11:42

might show up in another form and then you'll

1:11:44

say thank you. And you quiet it down. And

1:11:47

over time, it does shift the relationship

1:11:49

to thoughts. Yeah, that

1:11:51

makes so much sense. I mean, the five

1:11:53

different types And the interventions

1:11:56

that are appropriate for each, but I do want

1:11:58

to circle back to one. These are

1:12:00

you just said Which is sort of. I catch it. And.

1:12:03

Pull it down from the cloud because it seems like.

1:12:05

That. Sort of The met a skill. That.

1:12:08

Binds all of them like before. You

1:12:10

can actually say. Oh like which are

1:12:12

the five is this and then had my talk

1:12:14

back to and how do I bring it to

1:12:16

court Like what is appropriate response. You've.

1:12:18

Gotta first had the ability to serve say. Oh

1:12:21

this is happening soon And let me pull it

1:12:23

down so I can actually see what's happening in

1:12:25

and seek out what. What's. Appropriate

1:12:27

is that right? Absolutely hate those. Starting

1:12:29

place for all of this. My

1:12:32

capacity to have your mind be controlling

1:12:34

the chatter is to be about it.

1:12:36

Be aware of your think age and

1:12:38

this is actually one of the things

1:12:40

that makes humans the unique animals in

1:12:42

the whole animal kingdom is that we

1:12:45

have met a position we have the

1:12:47

capacity to time travel in a way

1:12:49

that other animals don't. We can think

1:12:51

about the peace we could be thinking

1:12:53

about the future. See can be walking

1:12:55

down the street and one would think

1:12:57

that you are actually they are now

1:13:00

that it's all your body. that's their.

1:13:02

Down your mind has tanked, hobbled into

1:13:04

the pastor into the future and the

1:13:06

capacity to catch you're thinking and to

1:13:08

actually think about thinking decided that met

1:13:11

a cognition that makes us unique. The

1:13:13

him and sets I call this the

1:13:15

most empowering, the most important skill that

1:13:17

we all have the capacity to master.

1:13:19

It's could just have been tried. It

1:13:22

and many practices such as meditation and

1:13:24

mindfulness prepare you to be able to

1:13:26

slow down your thoughts and to create

1:13:28

the states actually be the witness and

1:13:31

here in an answer that fights meditation

1:13:33

does make you a chat. I have

1:13:35

your mind so that you hit it

1:13:37

starts to hear those things and then

1:13:39

being pro active with them sometimes is

1:13:42

cashing the thought of writing down the

1:13:44

thought that you're having. It's also is

1:13:46

enough to make it go away what

1:13:48

I'm than giving us like icing on

1:13:51

the key to send you just like

1:13:53

karate chop it up and it just

1:13:55

no longer exists. A lot of people

1:13:57

find relief from the over thinking. The

1:14:00

and from the ruminating just by writing

1:14:02

it out to say getting it out

1:14:04

of their mind. and in many ways

1:14:06

that's literally what we're talking about with

1:14:08

the sausages they are trying to get

1:14:10

you to pay attention. Don't forget, Don't

1:14:12

forget. You might mess up. Don't forget,

1:14:14

people might charge you. Don't forget, you

1:14:16

may be ostracized, whatever that may be.

1:14:18

And so when you write it down

1:14:20

here like okay, I got the memo.

1:14:22

I'm not going to forget that he

1:14:25

turned off the alarm, otherwise it's just

1:14:27

that beeping going on in the bath

1:14:29

and it depletes. You and it takes away

1:14:31

from you've been. You're fully vibrant self or

1:14:33

as happy or is excited or is energized

1:14:35

as you could be because literally your brain

1:14:38

can weigh you down and it can also

1:14:40

tire you out if you ever had them

1:14:42

away or just like I'm just so tired

1:14:44

of think sensors to sir tired of hearing

1:14:47

this to loop in my head. It's like

1:14:49

it's like is though you are some riots

1:14:51

I guess the some kid got some a

1:14:53

really annoying sun setting your head to be

1:14:56

as I'm so tired of hearing that song

1:14:58

are your kids are learning a song on

1:15:00

the violin and they're just playing. It. Over and

1:15:02

over you get Dirk. Okay, okay if I did. Not bad

1:15:04

at enough. Looks. Like that. but it's

1:15:07

your own voice and how do you make

1:15:09

it stop? You make a stop. Eye catching

1:15:11

it, writing it down, working with it, and

1:15:13

then if you want you can. Then we

1:15:15

applaud them. Back to the cloud. Changed.

1:15:18

With these new talkback sentences,

1:15:20

I get. To. Do my work.

1:15:22

I. Get to figure this out. The

1:15:25

most likely outcome is we would be okay

1:15:27

and we'd figure it out that then you

1:15:29

put it back in the cloud and you're

1:15:31

being conscious of creating reality, conscious of the

1:15:33

thoughts that you want to be. thinking.

1:15:35

Instantly wanna show up and. Since

1:15:38

anyone wants to learn more about this mind

1:15:40

over chatter approach and how to work with

1:15:42

thoughts and get a few more skills is

1:15:45

other types of shudder that can also be

1:15:47

considered. I queued sneaky chatter that you want

1:15:49

be aware of the i have a full

1:15:51

course that I would love to. Just said

1:15:54

the Good Life Project community. It's usually a

1:15:56

hundred and twenty. Two years. But if. You

1:15:58

go to the flourishing Sen. Read

1:16:01

my spare time he can get free access

1:16:03

to the mind over chatter course which will

1:16:05

walk you through the whole process from start

1:16:07

to finish and has a bonus section on

1:16:09

different types of sneaky fact that we didn't

1:16:12

get a chance to cover today. So

1:16:15

helpful and in the sir time to

1:16:17

really actively practices things myself so they

1:16:19

get good place for us to come

1:16:22

full circle and our conversation as well.

1:16:24

So in this container of deadline project.

1:16:27

If I offer up the for his to live again

1:16:29

nice with tons of. Deliver.

1:16:33

Their lies means to live

1:16:35

a life of alignment on

1:16:37

who you are. And.

1:16:39

What you see only keep input

1:16:41

here to do surrounded by people

1:16:44

that you love that make you

1:16:46

feel like you belong and that

1:16:48

you matter and with the vital

1:16:50

health to be able to execute

1:16:52

on that line purpose of what

1:16:54

you've been put here to deal

1:16:56

and to enjoy it with the

1:16:58

people that matter most. Think

1:17:01

you see said the person. Some of

1:17:03

that. And. Paid

1:17:06

before you leave. If you love this

1:17:08

episode safe bet you'll also have. The

1:17:11

conversation we had was even cross about

1:17:13

exploring. Sadder you'll find a link is

1:17:15

episode in the Senate. This episode of

1:17:17

Their Life Project was produced by executive

1:17:20

producers Lindsay Fast and me Jonathan Feals

1:17:22

editing held by Alejandro Ramirez, Christopher Quarter

1:17:24

of Crafted our theme music and special

1:17:27

thanks to Sell Dell for her research

1:17:29

on this episode. And of course if

1:17:31

you haven't already done so please go

1:17:33

ahead and follow. good life project in

1:17:36

your favorite listening and is you found

1:17:38

this conversation interesting or inspiring or valuable

1:17:40

and chances are these days since you're

1:17:43

still listening here would you do me

1:17:45

a personal favor seven second favorite and

1:17:47

share it may be on social or

1:17:49

by text or by email just with

1:17:52

one person just copies away from the

1:17:54

app are using and tell those you

1:17:56

know those you love those you wanna

1:17:58

help navigate this scene cause like a

1:18:01

little better so we can all do

1:18:03

it better together with more ease and

1:18:05

more joy. Tell them to listen. Then

1:18:08

even invite them to talk about what

1:18:10

you've both discovered because when podcasts become

1:18:12

conversations and conversations become action, that's how

1:18:14

we all come alive together. Until next

1:18:17

time, I'm Jonathan Fields, signing

1:18:19

off for Good Life Front.