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what stage you're in. This

1:41

is iFanboy Pick of the Week 913, brought

1:43

to you by iFanboy listeners just

1:46

like you. They're

1:56

gonna rip it off. I'm

2:00

taking that time right behind my back

2:04

And I'm talking to my poor

2:06

phone now because I can't forget

2:12

I can't hold you, my mind behind

2:14

the cigarette And

2:20

I'm missing you, my heart

2:22

will take it along Hello, my

2:24

name is Connor Kilpatrick and sitting in for my

2:27

co-host Josh Flanagan is Dr. Ryan Haupt. Hello,

2:30

knowing in this podcast can be construed as medical

2:32

advice. And welcome back to

2:34

our fanboy pick of the week episode, this is

2:36

episode 913 And

2:39

Ryan, welcome back to the show. Happy New Year. Thank

2:41

you. Happy New Year as well. We

2:45

were meant to get you on earlier but the scheduling

2:47

thing had to flip-flop and now here we are. Right

2:50

at the beginning of February. So

2:53

welcome back. Happy to have you here. Every

2:55

week one of us reads all their comics and they pick their

2:57

favorite book from the stack. They call it the pick of the

2:59

week. We talk about that book the rest of

3:02

the book is from the week. The patron pick, listener mail, and

3:05

here are your spoiler warnings. This is your

3:07

blanket spoiler warning for the episode. There

3:10

will be some probably. So exercise some caution. For this week Ryan, you

3:12

had to pick and it was a fifth week despite

3:14

the fact that last week's fourth week felt like a fifth week.

3:18

They were both very similar. I'm sorry. Does

3:20

the audience know exactly what a fifth week means? Are there

3:23

people out there that need the concept of a fifth week?

3:25

I assume. I don't know.

3:27

There are many week points in two?

3:30

Well, I mean, comics were on a monthly schedule

3:32

at one point and there were four weeks

3:34

and a month. And every once in a while

3:36

because of, I don't know, math, there's a

3:38

fifth week. And usually

3:40

that's when like the straggling books come out. Like

3:42

the books, you know, there's just like, it's

3:45

usually a really small week. A lot of annuals. A

3:47

lot of annuals in the fifth week. Yeah. It

3:51

doesn't really change that much even that comics are on

3:53

like a double biweekly schedule. It's still the fifth week

3:55

is usually pretty light and pretty, pretty dark. Pretty,

3:59

mostly bleak. but it could be rough,

4:01

it could be rough. How did

4:03

you have it? Yeah, and so I

4:05

wasn't super encouraged by my

4:07

stack. I

4:10

would say, you know, there were a couple of

4:12

books I was looking forward to, and the books

4:14

I was looking forward to ended up being the

4:16

ones that were in contention for pick

4:18

of the week, and the pick this

4:20

time went to Duke number two, part

4:22

of the Energon universe.

4:25

Story by Joshua Williamson, Art by Tom Riley, Colored by

4:27

Jory Belair, and Letters by Russ Wooten. Before

4:30

we jump in, A, it's important to

4:32

note that we are officially changing this to G.I.

4:35

Joe of the Week. But

4:38

have we ever talked about your

4:40

G.I. Joe or non-G.I. Joe? Not really,

4:43

because I'm a little younger than

4:45

you. Slightly

4:47

less, just slightly younger. Right,

4:49

so I think what we have talked

4:51

about before is the sort of temporal

4:53

overlap where you and

4:55

Josh seem to straddle the G.I. Joe

4:57

to Ninja Turtles. Realm,

5:00

I straddle the Ninja Turtles to Power

5:02

Rangers Realm. Correct, you're one standard deviation

5:04

away from G.I. Joe. Yes,

5:08

I did watch the cartoon some growing up, but I never

5:10

read any of the comics or anything like that growing up,

5:12

and I wouldn't call myself, I would not call myself a

5:14

G.I. Joe super fan, or even really a fan.

5:18

But you've been reading the Energon books, or at

5:20

least Transformers-wise. Have you read the, did you read

5:23

Cobra Commander? Did you read, I assume you read Duke

5:25

number one? I did read Duke number one, just

5:28

because I was interested enough in the concept and the creative

5:30

team, and I thought, we talked about

5:32

that moment in the first Transformers book where the

5:34

pilot gets slapped by, was it Starscream or One

5:36

of the Flying? Yeah, Starscream. And

5:38

I was so taken aback by that moment, and then when there

5:40

was a little Easter egg that the guy who was riding

5:43

with him was Duke, I was like, okay, I'm in,

5:45

that sounds cool. And yeah,

5:47

I read the first issue, and I really liked

5:49

sort of rogue soldier man

5:51

on the run. This is,

5:53

again, I'm not as familiar

5:56

with Duke as a character, but this feels like a

5:58

bit of a new interpretation of. the

6:00

G.I. Joe characters and I just I

6:02

don't know this this book this issue in

6:05

particular Duke's on the run

6:07

from the government he goes to his buddy clutch who's supposed

6:09

to be able to you know build him a car and

6:11

get him out of a jam and clutch has got like

6:13

a sexy girl and I can't remember her name and he

6:15

pulls the slugs out and then they get attacked and there's

6:17

like a great car chase sequence and the

6:19

Energon books you know both Transformers

6:21

and Void Rivals and this one the

6:24

action choreography I feel like is so

6:26

reinvigorated from what we normally get in

6:28

comics and I just find these panels

6:31

propulsive in the what's happening and

6:34

how exciting they are and

6:36

I just had a ton of fun reading

6:38

this even though I'm not as familiar with the characters

6:40

and what they're building yeah this this

6:42

book is terrific I mean this is this was my pick of the

6:44

week easily even though there was some there were some very good books

6:47

this week even on a light week but

6:49

Duke number one over the holiday break that we didn't

6:51

talk about was amazing this was really

6:53

good it's funny it's called Duke I mean

6:55

Duke's the main character but as we're unfolding

6:57

into this issue and it is a miniseries

6:59

these are just this is

7:01

a GI this is GI Joe there

7:04

isn't a Energon GI Joe book GI Joe

7:06

Real American Hero takes place in a different continuity this

7:09

is so this this feels like the GI Joe

7:11

book that they could have just called GI Joe

7:13

as we we add so the first issue was

7:15

just Duke and Hawk I believe it's

7:17

been a while and then this issue we

7:20

had Duke and Hawk but then we added in clutch

7:22

we added in Roadblock and Stalker who are brought in

7:24

by Hawk to subdue

7:26

Duke who is as you said on the

7:28

run on Rogue no one

7:30

no one believes him that a robot killed his his

7:33

his buddy they all did he's he's sort

7:35

of become a fringe lunatic he

7:37

goes to like a conspiracy theory gathering

7:39

like a fox molder type yeah in

7:41

the last issue uh no one believes

7:44

with his giant robots and so he's

7:46

on the run from the

7:48

government I don't believe so I

7:51

could be wrong I could totally be wrong I don't think GI

7:53

Joe is a thing yet in

7:56

this story so when he's captured

7:58

he's taken two the pit, which

8:00

is, as we all know, is the

8:02

GIGO base, but is a decommissioned former

8:05

base. It has been decommissioned since the 8th, which

8:07

is a nice little joke. Yeah, I like that.

8:09

That was also getting a cutaway. When I got

8:11

the cutaway of the base, I was like, oh,

8:13

that's a tick in the column. That was terrific.

8:15

And then he gets thrown in prison

8:17

or the brig in the

8:20

base by Stalker and rock and roll, they

8:22

leave him behind, only to find

8:24

that in the cell across the

8:26

way or next to him, I can't tell which is

8:29

the barrenness. And so

8:31

by the time I got to that page,

8:33

I was like, awesome.

8:36

Now it's important to note, I've never

8:38

really liked Duke as a character. He's

8:41

never been amongst my favorite GIGOs. I

8:43

mean, he's a Joe, so I respect him obviously. But

8:47

he's sort of a Fuddy Duddy. In the

8:50

previous incarnations, not this one, he's sort

8:52

of the Fuddy Duddy. He's the cyclops of the team.

8:55

The Leonardo. Can we keep it in

8:57

the Teenage Mutant Ninja Room realm for

8:59

my hot sake, please? Even as

9:01

a kid, I always resented the fact

9:03

that on the cartoon, he took Snake Eyes as

9:05

storylines. He took Snake Eyes as girlfriend. They

9:08

made Duke the blonde-haired blue-eyed

9:12

Duke the hero of the team in the cartoon, where

9:14

in the comics it was Snake Eyes. Who's

9:16

also blonde-haired blue-eyed? But he was

9:21

just always kind of boring. He was the leader. He

9:25

was always reprimanding people for doing things. So

9:28

I wasn't super psyched when they announced Duke as one of

9:30

the books. But as

9:32

you said, this is sort of a rougher

9:34

Duke. He's like the super soldier of the army, right?

9:36

He's like the best soldier he could do in or

9:39

do it all. But when he

9:41

goes rogue and when he starts espousing that there's giant

9:43

robots out to kill us, he

9:46

falls out of favor and subduing

9:48

him is very difficult. I thought

9:50

this was great. And this Duke

9:52

is incredibly fun. It's a little unclear

9:55

why everyone has nicknames. If there's no G.I.

9:57

Joe, why is Clutch called Clutch even though

9:59

he's got... You know, a name, uh, why

10:02

is rock and roll called rock? Like

10:04

it doesn't really matter, but I always

10:06

thought those were their GI Joe names, not just

10:08

nicknames everyone has, but it also

10:11

doesn't really matter. Ultimately. And

10:13

the Tom Riley art is really terrific.

10:15

It's really, really good. Yeah.

10:17

I don't think I've seen Tom Riley before, but

10:22

the Jordan, Jordan Belairs colors are great.

10:24

They're nice and flat. They

10:26

don't, they, they, there's a nice

10:28

color palette where it's a lot in

10:31

this issue, especially, there's a lot of

10:33

Browns because they're in clutches, junkyard, and

10:35

they're running around with army fatigues, but

10:38

every once in a while, there's pops of color

10:40

that really draw your eye to the action. Um,

10:44

Tom Riley is terrific. It's kind of

10:46

cartoony, kind of realistic. It sort of lives in that

10:48

middle ground. I mean, it's,

10:52

it's becoming a cliche on the show, but these

10:54

interjuan books. And the G. I.

10:56

Joe book, which I'm, it's not

10:58

part of the interjuan, but still calling it part

11:00

of the whole, the same thing has really reignited,

11:02

um, my love of G.

11:04

I. Joe, Josh's love of G. I. Joe. These

11:07

are my favorite books. It reminds

11:09

me a lot of, it reminds me of

11:11

the art in the, the, I hate this place. Book

11:14

the Kyle Starks series, a little less cartoony than

11:16

that. It's a little less, but I think that's

11:18

appropriate. Like I think it pushes

11:20

it, pushes it a little

11:23

bit in the, the more straight and

11:25

narrow in a way that an army

11:27

book feels appropriate, but like still has

11:29

really dynamic, you know, well-defined figures and

11:31

dynamic, um, movement and action and,

11:34

um, yeah, just solid storytelling. But

11:36

you're right. I'm looking through the middle part. So that's a rock

11:38

and roll shows up. Duke

11:40

and Fletcher at clutches. Maybe it's just cause rock and roll

11:43

looks like Dante Howitzer that I'm making that connection. You

11:46

know, so Duke and Fletcher, he's hiding out at

11:49

clutch's garage and, uh, rock

11:51

and roll shows up and there's just this great splash

11:54

page of him firing off his M 60,

11:57

um, and, uh, it's just,

11:59

it's just. And with the boom, boom, boom

12:01

in the background, the handwritten sound effects,

12:05

like it's just a wonderful looking book. And

12:09

as a Joe fan, it's incredibly fun. I'm

12:13

curious what they're gonna do overall, because like I said,

12:15

these are just mini series, both this and Global Commander.

12:17

So does that mean there's gonna be

12:20

like a series of minis telling the story, which is

12:22

totally fine? Or is there

12:24

gonna be, is there gonna eventually be a GI Joe

12:26

book after this is all established?

12:29

I'm very curious to see how this goes moving forward, but

12:31

this seems to be quite popular.

12:33

I just saw that Void Rivals

12:35

is in its fifth printing now. So, wow,

12:37

I mean, these books seems

12:39

to be hitting a button in

12:43

the zeitgeist. And so I

12:45

don't want them to expand too quickly. I don't want them to lose

12:47

the quality they've

12:49

got going, but I would like to, it would be interesting

12:51

to see how they're gonna move forward with a ongoing

12:55

GI Joe series, if that's the plan, or if it's just

12:57

gonna be a series of character minis, which

12:59

is whatever, cool. And

13:02

it's all relatively, it's not new, new. Like

13:04

I know the characters, this

13:06

does feel like a breath of fresh air relative

13:08

to what I had growing up.

13:10

Well, it's also, I guess it's a testament to the

13:12

quality, if you're loving it too. Yeah.

13:16

And someone, you're not like me and Josh who have this

13:18

ingrained in you. I mean, right now, geez, we're

13:21

so deep in it. I've got volume three of

13:23

the classic GI Joe in my nightstand right now.

13:25

I'm flying through the original series. Josh is doing

13:27

that and watching the original cartoon. And

13:30

we're reading this. I'm GI

13:32

Joe up to my eyeballs right now. And

13:34

I think what this means, go ahead. No,

13:37

I'm just saying, if you're also enjoying it, that just

13:39

means I think it's a really solid and good comic

13:41

book, all these books are. Which

13:44

I think means that when I tell

13:46

you and Josh that the Power Rangers

13:48

book really is pretty good. I

13:50

mean, I think you gotta try it. You gotta take my

13:52

word for it. Yeah, I

13:56

mean, maybe. Anything's

14:00

possible, Ryan. Thank you. I'll take

14:02

that. Did you read Cobra Commander

14:04

or you just read? I have not. It's all

14:07

my digital stack, but no, I didn't

14:09

get to it yet. Curious if it's good. It's

14:12

hard to say because my problem

14:15

with it was more about the fandom

14:17

aspect and the quality of the actual

14:19

work. Interesting. I think you will

14:21

like it because it's well-made and art's really

14:24

good, but my problem is it

14:26

just explores an area of view I always disliked.

14:29

And so I was hoping it wouldn't make an appearance in

14:31

this world. But

14:33

it did. And that's fine. They're not made

14:35

for me as much as it feels like it.

14:39

I think, like I said, I think that was also my pick of the week,

14:41

but if it

14:43

was a close runner-up if I had the

14:45

pick would have been Alan Scott to Green

14:48

Lantern number four. I think this is quietly,

14:50

maybe DC's best comic? It's

14:52

really good. Sure, if not, it's certainly

14:55

in the top discussion. It's

14:57

a mini-series, so it's only

14:59

one issue left. But they put

15:01

out a bunch of Justice Society minis together. They

15:04

did Alan Scott. They did Jay Garrick

15:06

and they did, what's

15:08

his name? The Sandman, one we love. What

15:11

is his name? Wesley Dodds. Wesley

15:13

Dodds. Wesley Dodds is terrific, really good.

15:16

Jay Garrick, not so great. But

15:18

what's got has been wonderfully

15:20

emotional. It's written by Tim

15:22

Sheridan, it's art by Ty and Tormey. And

15:25

it's exploring, you

15:28

know, a superhero deeply in the closet

15:30

in the 1940s and what that means. And

15:32

then the big twist has been that his

15:34

new nemesis was his boyfriend in

15:37

the war. Who was also a deep cover. Who

15:39

wasn't really even his boyfriend, well, kind of

15:41

was. But he was a Russian, it was

15:43

revealed this issue, Russian spy who was

15:46

specifically sent to infiltrate and seduce him to get,

15:48

you know, because he was in charge of this

15:50

project to harness the red fucking

15:53

flame energy or whatever. But it

15:56

was, this whole series has been terrific.

15:58

We've talked about it every... almost every issue.

16:01

And one of them I think was Pick of

16:03

the Week or should have been. I don't remember if it

16:05

was. My brain is mush. But amazing.

16:07

Tell me what you think about it because I think this

16:09

is a terrific comic. I haven't got a chance to talk

16:11

about it on the show yet. I think

16:14

it's really strong. I

16:16

really like how it's doing

16:19

a, you know, golden

16:21

age superhero story, but with a

16:24

modern sensibility where, you

16:26

know, Alan Scott is closeted, but very

16:28

clearly is aware that he himself is

16:30

gay and is dealing with trans people

16:32

and trying to like, you know, it's

16:34

written, feels authentically written as like a

16:36

1940s person struggling with the concept of pronouns,

16:39

but trying to be kind about it rather

16:41

than judgmental. And, you know, I

16:43

thought issue three with the specter, where the

16:45

specter kind of gives him his perspective as

16:47

somebody who talks directly to God of just like,

16:49

yeah, I don't know why all these religious people think

16:52

who you are in this way matters. So

16:55

it's a little heavy handed, and I could see

16:58

people pushing back against that. But I think it

17:00

actually really works for when this

17:02

story is set and who the characters are and

17:04

what it's about. And then I

17:06

kind of just, I thought I

17:08

wouldn't like it. I thought I would

17:10

groan at the idea of like, okay,

17:13

Jeff Jones created a bunch of other colored

17:15

lantern cores. Yeah. And now we're kind of

17:17

doing that with the Alan Scott Green Lantern

17:19

world. But you know, they built it up

17:21

in such a way where I'm just like,

17:23

Yeah, this makes sense. This works. I'm in

17:25

I'm digging it. It's cool. I

17:27

think you're 100% right. When I initially saw

17:29

their day, they're gonna give him a red

17:32

lantern like that's weird. But the

17:35

that's almost secondary to the

17:37

emotional betrayal, right? So like,

17:40

you know, he's the red lantern, and he's got the red

17:42

flame, and he's a Russian. There's a lot of on the

17:45

nose stuff there. But it's also

17:47

this guy that Alan is deeply in love with

17:49

at a time he couldn't do that publicly. And

17:51

it was such a lifeline for him. And there's

17:54

a wonderful scene here where this

17:56

is the issue where the bad guy lays out. This

17:58

is what's been going on the whole time. This is who I am. This has

18:00

been the plot and so you know, it's a standard comic

18:02

book trope But there's

18:04

a layer of emotion to it Because

18:07

these guys or at least one at least well, they

18:09

were in love ostensibly one of them for sure the

18:11

other one we're not sure but

18:14

then there's a you know, he's got Alan trapped in

18:16

this red bubble and Yeah,

18:18

there's a great scene where they're leaning against

18:20

it. Alan's got his back to him he's

18:22

leaning against it so the other guy turns around and leans against him

18:24

and they

18:26

have a wonderful sort of heart to heart and

18:31

You know, you can see there what

18:34

is his name the red lantern cracking,

18:36

you know Right,

18:39

maybe I was actually in love and then

18:41

deep cover name But yeah, right Then

18:44

there's a wonderful moment where Alan talks about how he bought the house

18:46

They used to go off to and he's like

18:48

wow you hated that house. That's the moment where he cracked, right?

18:51

Like it wasn't all deep cover

18:54

And then but Alan uses that as a way to

18:56

you know to break through the red bubble bubble and

18:59

you know Attack it just was a really well done

19:02

Issue and on top of a really well done series.

19:04

I'm this has been terrific I don't I don't you

19:07

know, I don't know what their plans for the Justice

19:09

Society are the main Jeff Johns book keeps getting later

19:12

and later and later But

19:15

I would love for them to keep exploring the Justice Society.

19:17

I don't know how these sell I don't know how popular

19:19

they are but and the cliffhanger at the end of this

19:21

issue is Alan uses the

19:23

red lantern to power up his ring So now he's

19:25

got a green lantern ring powered up by a red

19:27

lantern. What is that? Right? He was out of juice

19:29

That's why he was trapped Which

19:33

you shouldn't have the costume anymore whatever it is make it

19:35

but nothing makes sense doesn't matter but This

19:38

book and Sandman there's this I mean, obviously

19:40

there's something there was just a society terrific

19:42

characters, but there's got to be a way

19:45

we can get The

19:47

ongoing I'd say ongoing golden age adventures of

19:49

the Justice Society don't need to bring them

19:52

forward Just tell a story in the 40s

19:54

of these guys all young guys and

19:57

and women, you know figuring it

19:59

out becoming here I was becoming the templates for

20:01

everybody else. Like I'd love to see a Golden Age

20:03

book you know with

20:05

with this version of Alan

20:07

Scott and him, you know becoming buddies with

20:09

Jay Garrick and and You

20:12

know bringing Wesley dot like just let's just do it.

20:14

Come on Like let's get a miniseries

20:16

going if it's popular to make it an ongoing like I

20:18

just think it's there's so much here How

20:21

do you think you'd do in a deep cover? Situation

20:23

where you had to be in a relationship with somebody could you

20:25

could you keep your world separate or would you fall in love?

20:28

Um, I mean, there's not the classic question

20:30

for every deep cover agent in every piece of fiction like

20:32

you know I'm

20:35

sure it's very difficult But

20:39

I guess it depends on what kind of a fanatic I

20:41

am so you're basically asking me if I'm a Kerry Russell

20:43

I'm a Matthew Reese from the Americans because they both handled

20:45

very differently. Mm-hmm And

20:48

then ironically got married in real life You

20:52

know, I I think it's

20:54

interesting because it's so difficult right if he just

20:56

was like You were just like

20:58

you were just a mission for me then that's one thing

21:00

but adding in the wrinkle of

21:02

him having those feelings Just he's if

21:05

he's not gay at least by in the fall Well, they

21:07

definitely they hinted him being gay when he's raised it

21:09

rising through the ranks of the Russian army If

21:12

not gave in then opportunistically willing to

21:15

sleep with a man to get ahead

21:18

Right, so they don't make it clear, but there's lots of ways

21:20

you can King it you can take

21:22

it and so that makes it interesting too. I just think

21:24

this is terrific It's been out of nowhere. I'm hoping people

21:26

are checking it out because it's really good. I

21:28

agree Last issues pick of the

21:30

week or two weeks ago. It's pick of the

21:33

week was Avengers Twilight book one. This is book

21:35

two It's coming out on a

21:37

biweekly schedule. So this is gonna be done pretty quick Book

21:41

two Dzudarsky and a Kunya what you what have you thought

21:43

of this so far? I really liked

21:45

the first book I've always been a fan of the

21:48

sort of I don't want to say

21:51

fully nihilistic But like the the sort of future

21:53

story where the heroes are maybe one generation removed

21:55

from their prime and can see that their Efforts

21:57

didn't work out. And now what do they do?

22:00

Similar to like Earth X and Kingdom Come. So

22:02

this is sort of like, yeah,

22:04

so this is sort of scratching that itch. Um, I,

22:08

I like Chip Zdarsky

22:10

sensibility being brought here

22:13

because he's good at the, he's good at the,

22:15

you know, the big Marvel stuff. He's good at

22:17

writing the fascist regime. And then I liked that

22:19

in the middle, there's a moment where Steve Rogers

22:22

gets to give the big speech, right? And

22:24

the plan hasn't gone perfectly, but they've been

22:26

able to break through the fascistic news controlled

22:28

media and Steve gets to talk to the

22:31

people again. And it gives this rousing

22:33

speech and nothing happens because

22:35

a rousing speech is not good enough

22:37

to break through how messed up the world is right now.

22:40

It also wasn't a very good recipe speech. And

22:43

I thought that while I was reading it, I was like, this is

22:45

not like, this is not like the best I've

22:47

seen of the Steve rousing speech and then the fact

22:49

that it like, it wasn't, it didn't

22:51

work out. It, you know, I was like, Oh man,

22:54

I'm glad it didn't. Cause cause as it was happening,

22:56

I was like, this isn't going to work. Cause this

22:58

is not a very good speech. And also I thought

23:00

they were going to show evidence. Like you're just going

23:02

to say, Steve's just going to go on their way to

23:04

say, Hey, your government and your media are controlling you come with

23:06

me and break free. And I was like, that's it. That's

23:09

not going to work. And it didn't. So I'm, I'm

23:11

glad they didn't have it work because it wasn't enough.

23:13

I think this is really fun. I liked the first

23:15

issue, the hell of a lot. This issue slightly less,

23:17

but still enjoyed it. This, he goes to Kamala Khan

23:20

and says, uh, help join

23:23

the, join the defenders. It was called themselves

23:25

the underground team, Luke Gage. And

23:27

she says, I got a family. I got kids. I can't be doing

23:29

this. And she sh she shunned him,

23:31

which is now spoiled by the next issue. Cover.

23:34

Yeah. The cover kind of kind of put it

23:36

clear that that's not a lot. I

23:39

don't know why they call hero day the

23:41

day everyone died. Yeah. I

23:43

mean, I'm wondering if the, hoping there's some explanations to

23:45

why that is being used. We learned that the bad

23:48

guys, the ultimate bad guys that are trying to, to

23:50

keep the heroes from coming back in the world and

23:52

are manipulating Tony Starks

23:54

and Janet Van Dine's son are red skull

23:57

and Ultron. Right.

23:59

So we met. We met Jarvis's

24:01

son earlier who was, you know,

24:03

the butler of Tony, not Tony,

24:06

Tony's son, whatever his

24:08

name is, but turns out

24:10

he's not actually... James, James

24:13

Stark. He's not actually Jarvis's

24:16

son. He's actually red skull in disguise. His disguise, by

24:18

the way, looks a hell of a lot like Jim

24:20

Staranko. But

24:25

you see them in the White House basically running the country,

24:27

they're telling the president what to do in terms of how

24:29

to deal with Captain America. I like that

24:31

theme. That was fun. The president's merely a figurehead

24:33

for this guy, Jarvis, who's

24:35

running things and they have

24:38

this figurehead sort of like,

24:40

almost like a ecstatic style

24:42

Avengers team that does missions

24:47

for publicity to keep the people in line but doesn't actually

24:49

do any good in the world. And

24:51

so that's what they're up against. And Steve,

24:54

who has a very, very big jaw in this

24:56

book, just the rousing speech doesn't work. And so

24:58

he's gonna have to figure a different way to do this to save

25:00

the day because it's not gonna happen. But he doesn't even know. He

25:04

doesn't even know that it's red skull. That's gonna be even

25:06

worse. Yeah. I feel like Steve needs a haircut too. Steve

25:10

looks like he needs a bath. Yeah. But

25:13

maybe not even a haircut. It just needs to be styled

25:15

a little better. I know it's under a helmet sometimes but...

25:19

I did wonder because in the last issue they got

25:21

him a new super soldier serum.

25:23

They sort of concocted one and he's got

25:25

it back now. And I

25:27

was kind of wondering like how that works.

25:29

Like, he's like, oh, I still

25:31

got a trick knee. He's like, well, shouldn't the trick knee not

25:33

be a trick knee anymore if he's got super soldier serum in

25:35

him? And you know,

25:38

like it either works or it doesn't.

25:40

Right? Like, I'm sure... Well,

25:42

that was like, I remember when they, you know, I

25:44

remember when they were doing the Falcon and the Winter

25:46

Soldier show on Disney Plus. And

25:48

there was like a thing they mentioned about how

25:50

like they fixed the super

25:52

soldier serum. So now that when you take

25:54

it, you're not jacked because obviously not every

25:57

actor in that show could end up looking

25:59

like like... Chris Evans and Sebastian

26:01

Stan and I was like wait, how is that

26:03

fixing it? Because if I take a super soldier

26:05

serum, I want to look jacked. I don't Don't

26:08

want to look like myself anymore. Right? I

26:10

like I like some ABS, please Yes, I you

26:13

I just you know, I figure young Steve had lots

26:15

of physical ailments the super soldier sort of fix So

26:18

I feel like it should also fix his bad knee

26:20

and other things maybe give him all his hair back

26:22

but I mean if Dark

26:25

Knight Rises taught us anything. It's that you get the

26:27

right knee brace. You can kick through bricks. So movie

26:32

so Enjoyable not as good

26:34

as issue one, but enjoyable and it were you

26:36

know, we're a third of the way

26:38

through the story now So that's the only problem with

26:40

these short Stories

26:42

like shortish stories like this, right? You have to

26:44

really kind of fly through the plot because yeah

26:47

I feel like this type

26:49

of world-building that Zdarsky is doing here would benefit

26:51

from a longer I think like an 8 10

26:55

Maybe even 12 12. Yeah, all of

26:58

is the right if this is a big prestige

27:00

stories Zdarsky and Dan Konya Konya hasn't done art

27:02

in forever like you know do

27:04

12 and really

27:06

sort of Let's learn

27:08

about this world. But what six you really

27:10

got to move quick and

27:13

so it's a bummer but that's fine So,

27:16

there you go Let's take a

27:18

quick moment to thank everyone who supports the show You

27:21

know, we are listener supported. We are only able to

27:23

do all these shows that we do if we do

27:25

at least six a month Because

27:28

of you the listener and we thank everyone

27:30

who does that we appreciate everyone thinks that hey I'm enjoying

27:32

this show enough or I enjoy all these

27:34

shows enough. They make my comic book

27:36

life more fun my just my general life

27:38

more fun and I they deserve my support

27:41

We thank everyone thinks that way and it can

27:43

be so you don't have to even do any of these things You could

27:46

just you can just will tell you at the end So

27:48

patreon.com/I fanboy is a main way of supporting us. We

27:50

have lots of great patrons They hopefully get lots of

27:52

great things out of this out of being a patron

27:54

other than just subverting the show They get to be

27:56

part of a great community on

27:58

discord and Facebook There's the monthly patron

28:01

hangout that we do and

28:03

they get all kinds of great exclusive merchandise

28:05

depending on their tier of support And

28:07

we thank them very much I found about

28:09

third list commas our t-shirt store You can get

28:11

those designs and all kinds of things not just

28:13

t-shirts, but we mainly are on t-shirts 13 different

28:15

designs You can find it there Femba

28:18

comm slash support is our PayPal tip

28:20

jar which is that's where you can go if you don't If

28:22

you like the show is a lot of fun you want to support it You

28:24

don't want to be a patron you wanna buy a t-shirt. That's where you can

28:26

go You can drop in a buck or two to say

28:29

thanks. We appreciate that. I want

28:31

to come Amazon is our shopping page That's

28:33

where you can find a general shopping link for Amazon. You can

28:35

also find links to our books below books We get a piece

28:37

of all those sales It doesn't come

28:39

out of your pocket, comes out of Amazon. So we thank you very much. bookshop.org

28:42

is our partner to help support local bookstores. If

28:45

you order books through Bookshop, then they

28:47

will be fulfilled by local bookstores, which are the

28:49

lifeline and the heart of the country.

28:52

And we thank everyone. you know,

28:54

if if you can only support in one

28:56

way or no way whatever you do can

28:58

help us We appreciate that we

29:01

are here because of you. We thank you very much Let's

29:03

move on to another book. I think it's

29:05

one of the best books Coming out, but

29:07

doesn't get talked about a lot Yeah, local

29:10

man number nine created and written

29:12

by Tony Fleek's and Tim Seeley who also

29:14

trade off art duties so Tony Fleek's does

29:16

the art in the modern day and Tim

29:19

Seeley does the art in The

29:21

90s style but it's actually kind

29:23

of expanded to doing other kinds of comic

29:25

book styles It's just

29:28

been fascinating this book I I

29:32

Don't know that it's quite ready

29:34

to go to the rarefied era of Astro City,

29:36

but like it's building to that level of like

29:39

its own sort of Fleshed out

29:41

well thought through comic book superhero

29:43

universe. Yeah. Yeah, I wouldn't I mean

29:45

I wouldn't there's hardly any books that are in that That

29:49

air but it's It's

29:51

way more interesting than the initial plot suggested. It would

29:53

be which is This

29:56

Character from the 90s, you know, sort

29:58

of extreme era of image. Goes.

30:01

Back home. And. Is

30:03

is is a washout. He's lost the ability

30:05

to use his his identity. So.

30:07

He goes and he. Helps.

30:10

Fight Crime is tiny town in a ski

30:12

mask and. Resources. Powers.

30:15

And you think that and that was initially this of the

30:17

pitch of this of the book right? and then it sort

30:19

of expanded. There's. Been murders.

30:22

There's a conspiracy he's on. He's

30:24

a uncovered. The person behind it

30:26

was was shocking and surprising. And.

30:29

It's it's each dose that is kind of

30:31

over my this book but internet previous aren't

30:33

you got dose of Lsd by some hippies

30:36

and a commune without realizing it And so

30:38

he thought he was just. it's just like

30:40

crazy vision Quest where he was right. That

30:42

was one of the more convincing portrayal of

30:45

a high person in comics and like he's

30:47

bumping into the panel boundaries and he's like

30:49

seeing his own a thought balloons. It is

30:51

really really well done and then. Something

30:54

that this book is doing. you know he sort

30:56

of a Hawkeye type of the when a cap

30:59

shield where he is really good. Amy never misses

31:01

and so he's realising can use his powers and

31:03

kind of interesting ways because like if you never

31:05

misses than even if he doesn't know exactly where

31:07

he's aiming he should still his target was able

31:10

like find solutions to problems in interesting ways using

31:12

his power like that which is interesting to watch

31:14

Blossom and I think his boss me in part

31:16

because he got really high. other than the him

31:19

that you are some of like a car neck

31:21

plus hawkeye or little that yeah yeah I can

31:23

kind of. But he he he gets

31:25

arrested his escape from jail he says sort of

31:27

sees how we can get the keys the floor

31:30

yeah something that I grabbed it is almost like

31:32

he. In a. Hideous

31:34

target is this is a wider theme and

31:36

just throwing a pencil the same since that

31:38

was interesting was just a lot. people have

31:40

a story then it in are the most

31:42

or ended and the team that he was

31:44

on when he was a younger man before

31:46

getting promoted to the big leagues you know

31:48

they were called to serve introduced as to

31:51

sort of a generic nineties hardcore. A.

31:53

Team Team. and

31:55

what you realizes that that each of their

31:57

powers if leverage by agree to corporation could

32:00

profitable. So like there's a person who can generate

32:02

flame and they can use that for heating and

32:04

cooling, this person who can control water, they can

32:06

use that for hydroelectric dams, there's a person who

32:08

can just produce like slime and jelly and they're

32:10

slippery and you can make petroleum products. And like

32:12

so realizing that the way

32:14

they built this team out all have economic,

32:17

there's economic value in that team beyond just saving

32:19

the world, I thought was like, well, that's, that's,

32:21

you know, in the words of Butcher,

32:24

that's diabolical. And I think

32:28

one of the fun things with the

32:30

book is, as you said earlier, the flashback

32:32

second part where, where Tim Seeley

32:35

draws it where you see the original team back

32:37

in the sort of early 90s style, but

32:39

it always gives context and flavor to what's happening in the

32:41

main story. I think this is a really good book. And

32:44

he did a book, Charles Byrne, Black

32:46

Hole style to start the transitions into

32:49

the 90s. Yeah, it's interesting. I think

32:51

it's always exciting. I

32:53

read it in a lark originally because I

32:55

like Tim Seeley's work, not

32:58

always, but I always think it's interesting. And

33:00

I picked it up and I thought that was pretty

33:03

good. And it's gotten better with each issue. I think

33:05

by now, right now at this point, now it's just

33:07

created really interesting stories happening. And if you were thinking

33:09

about getting caught up on it, I believe this issue is

33:11

the last one of the arc, and they're going to take

33:13

a short break. So now would be a good time to

33:15

get caught up. That's good. All right,

33:19

so I'm really enjoying Batman off

33:21

world. This is Jason Aaron's Batman miniseries

33:23

with Doug Monke's art. And,

33:26

you know, I love Batman in a... I

33:29

think you and I keep talking about the same books, but I

33:31

think you and I talked about off world, but I

33:34

love Batman in a sci fi

33:36

setting, having to survive. Yeah, we

33:38

did talk about issue one together. Not being able to

33:41

fall back on his usual tricks, having

33:43

a Tamarian sort of love

33:46

interest who can't crack through

33:48

that Batman show. I

33:52

Couldn't help but laugh at the retcon. So It's

33:54

like, okay, so now it's Dick and Bruce both

33:56

had little Tamarian foot flings. But. I

34:01

just think it's incredibly fun. I mean it's

34:03

the monkey is a are some always liked

34:05

but he really gets to go on with

34:07

all these aliens. his his bat as Consul

34:10

having a site. That. He had versus

34:12

around sort of like this. In. A

34:14

Gladiator Editorial Planet in. The.

34:16

Night on the run from all these crazy look in aliens

34:18

in the system. Really fun! He had to. Crashes

34:21

Of A New Costume. To

34:23

Zola got destroyed. A

34:25

set as bad as to marry sidekicks who.

34:28

Is. helping him but when I was got about

34:30

a space will psychic. To

34:32

he team to Space wolf. Is

34:34

just diving is is great? I mean was audible.

34:36

I thought about this and action council for out

34:39

If you notice there's a lot of fun things

34:41

right now. He. Feels like it's in his

34:43

in his ticket. You. Know period. he

34:45

denounces didn't change in circles. As.

34:48

Hard as another book for it as also in that

34:50

vein as they have announced announced yet. In.

34:52

And just seems be doing what he wants to do. having

34:55

fun doing it. Misses his as a really great fun little

34:57

masers sort of out of continuity of the worry about it.

35:00

And. I like a kind of it. Me:

35:03

To. So. The

35:05

next within talk about is sort of a.

35:08

A bonus patron pick. So this

35:10

wasn't the patron pick, but. Many.

35:13

Of the patrons and discord, a couple

35:15

of them actually the one one particular

35:17

really was curious what this book and

35:19

enough because it's this is a seven

35:21

dollar. Like. Sixty page book.

35:24

And enough, he wanted to drop seven dollars on a

35:26

on a book so his he was hoping you talk

35:29

about it as I read it. And.

35:31

Ah, Our. Analysis: I'm only

35:33

press called Zealand the killers number one. It's

35:35

a crime book. But a bunch

35:38

of high school girls solving a murder. And.

35:41

Ah, Speed that. Is. Pretty bad.

35:43

So that's your from Forty

35:46

four for the seven dollar

35:48

book. The

35:50

arts Okay. The overall stories okay, there's some.

35:52

There are some clever and funny bits they

35:54

do here, but for the most part. the

35:58

main characters annoying of the

36:00

other girls speaks like a medieval

36:02

knight for some reason all

36:04

the time. That's really annoying. Things

36:07

seem to happen with no connective tissue. It's almost

36:09

like there's a bunch of story beats. They just

36:11

wrote them out without

36:14

thinking about how the beats should work together. This

36:16

is not a problem that

36:19

is just this book.

36:21

I see this a lot in a lot of new TV shows

36:23

where they just sort of things happen very quickly. I don't know

36:26

if they worry about everybody's attention

36:28

span or what. There seems

36:30

to be no connective tissue anymore to a lot of stories

36:32

I'm seeing. It just

36:35

was kind of a bummer

36:37

because the main character we spend

36:39

all the time with is so

36:41

mind-numbingly awful and

36:43

annoying. Then her friend who also speaks like

36:45

a knight is annoying. Then the other

36:48

things just sort of happen. Also it

36:51

was really distracting the

36:53

coloring by Warnia

36:55

K. Sahawati. That's

36:58

not right. Sahadui and

37:01

Rebecca Nalte is distracting because for some reason they color

37:03

the main character as if she's a Tamarian. She's

37:06

got gold skin and almost red

37:08

hair which does not match her father

37:10

at all. I don't know

37:12

why they gave her that color scheme. It was very very distracting.

37:14

I was

37:17

looking forward

37:19

to it because it was a

37:22

crime book. This just may not be

37:24

for me which is fine. I just think

37:26

it's not a lot of fun. That's

37:29

too bad. It's a bummer. There you have it. Those

37:31

are the comics we're going to talk about in a

37:33

very light week. As always we

37:35

have a Patreon pick. patreon.com/fnboy. Every patron gets a vote

37:37

to add a book to the rundown. This

37:40

week the winner was Moon Man number one from

37:42

Image Comics. Written by Scott

37:45

Kidcudi Muscudi and Kyle Higgins.

37:47

Art by Marco Lacatti. Colors

37:50

by Igor Monti and letters

37:52

by Hassan Osmani Allahu. And

37:56

again Ryan, last time we talked

37:59

we Had. The Holy Rollers.

38:01

Which. Was. Very. Much a

38:04

pitch book for Andy Samberg and this

38:06

appears to be. A

38:08

textbook for a kid. cudi. As he used

38:10

Mentor for the book. To. Slay like

38:12

kiss somebody. I know nothing about him other than

38:14

he was in the. Ah Bill

38:17

and Ted movie over the over there.

38:20

And I was a rapper and another man. But.

38:23

To make as well I'm using it was

38:25

an axe that eight. I think it's a

38:27

twenty four to sort of slasher porno horror

38:29

movie set in the seventies of tax you

38:31

know actor. He's an actor musician heat but

38:33

he looks exactly like the main character and

38:36

the main character has his middle name as

38:38

names as Crilly. Him

38:40

and I own a problem with that. Like their systems

38:42

pointed out, That. Lots of your I talked with that

38:44

We had a very similar bug in the Holy Roller. He.

38:46

Answered all, A is whether that's economists. get

38:48

it in today. And.

38:51

She could even that little thing that Mack said he

38:53

has a long time comic sans of us also makes

38:55

sense, but. He. Seems

38:57

like a cool guy like I did a

38:59

few lot of he didn't I guess fall

39:01

in Brooklyn Nine Nine. He was on Comedy

39:03

Bang Bang for a while I got. You

39:06

know, I've seen him in various capacities and

39:08

I actually just generally enjoy what he's doing.

39:10

I'm. I will admit

39:12

before we start discussing this that

39:14

I have. One. Of

39:16

like I don't have. You have is gonna wear

39:19

their like signal specific sub genres the you always

39:21

are drawn to. Okay, A

39:23

one of my hyper specific Some John or as

39:25

is a Lonely Astronaut story. says.

39:27

Momma Momma Astros are lonely.

39:31

I'm donna why, but as kind of

39:33

I went I went into this. sort

39:35

of hoping we were getting. A. Kid

39:37

Cudi inspired low aswell store in this wasn't

39:39

quite what that was. No,

39:42

it's almost more of a fantastic four.

39:44

Rest were yes, there is a Mission

39:46

to the moon is seems like a

39:49

for elon musk kind of situation. For.

39:51

Japan, what's your billionaire astronaut Rocket ship

39:54

companies and something happened? This is after

39:56

the mission something happen on the mission.

39:58

They were missing person the minute. And.

40:01

They came back and he was a big. Enough.

40:03

Story controversy, scandal situation and

40:06

leaving the astronauts have been

40:08

in. Quarantine.

40:10

Have been given testing them for our lawn instances,

40:12

the mission to find out that we know what

40:14

happened to them while they're up there. And.

40:17

Of course is the main guy, Ramon, who

40:19

is sort of the main leader of the

40:22

as soon as he he is now superpowers

40:24

from the. Wherever. Happened to

40:26

them up there. And. Think okay

40:28

it's a it's a response and ask for husain

40:30

like den mother things are recent. Other things. But.

40:34

The. As of this is this was a solid. I didn't

40:36

love it, I didn't but I thought it was. I

40:38

enjoyed it. A resident I had fun reading it as

40:40

of the art from. Michael. A

40:42

caught was really. Interesting and

40:44

atmospheric, he was a couple of times or

40:46

tripped up on the storytelling. Was

40:49

gonna come about that as well. In the use of

40:51

the powers was a little confusing as a would actually

40:53

was happening, but. The

40:55

character work was good. It's a very sort of

40:57

that. It's not realistic style,

40:59

but it is kind of so realistic in

41:02

a very soon impressionistic way. Am.

41:05

I said it was. Said it

41:07

was good I didn't lot of a sort

41:09

of get I I. I don't know that

41:11

I liked this as much as I wanted

41:13

to going in and I have them with

41:15

the same issues with the the pacing of

41:17

a storytelling that you did. I felt like

41:19

you know. The characterization: These

41:22

are the main characters it took to

41:24

talk like the youth. It was just

41:26

a felt like is more vibes than

41:28

learning about the actual character accuses not

41:30

giving you an attitude rather than like

41:32

an actual. Feeling. Figures

41:34

One instance where I feel like the

41:36

Arbroath the one eighty role. Which

41:39

is I'm not in on, I'm not at all

41:41

have your background and in cinema and so. It

41:45

it just felt like because I went to the

41:47

character to switch places. I'm. Yes,

41:51

Yana, I have. I

41:54

mean it distorts. The main character was interesting. I thought

41:57

he was he was. it is. You know, of

41:59

and a fun new character, his brother, it's

42:01

just him and his younger brother, they live in

42:04

Cleveland. There

42:06

was, you know, I believe

42:09

if I'm Ohio has produced more astronauts in

42:11

any other state. Interesting.

42:14

Because the joke as a person who used to live in

42:17

Ohio, I can make this joke because sometimes the fastest way

42:19

to get out of Ohio is to go straight up until

42:21

you just reverse entirely. So, you

42:23

know, there's a there's a protest

42:25

outside the company that runs that ran the mission

42:27

because they're also like that the

42:29

biggest employer in the state to sort

42:31

of run the state. And the

42:33

you know, the cops show up to put it down. And so

42:36

this guy shows up and that's his powers manifest and he is

42:38

the same as brother who's in the middle of the protest. It's

42:41

all very familiar. But

42:43

I think the strength

42:45

of the main character and

42:48

the art even if there were problems

42:50

with it really kept me interested in

42:52

what was happening. It's I'm interested enough

42:55

to check out this. It's the second issue. I don't

42:57

know. You know, we'll see. We'll see

43:00

how it goes. But I thought

43:02

it was I thought it was solid. I didn't think it was

43:04

great. But it was solid. I don't

43:06

I truly don't know if I'm interested enough to

43:08

pick it up, pick up the second issue. I

43:10

think it might just depend if it's another light

43:12

week or not. This is

43:14

also I you know, we talked about this

43:16

in the just like right so

43:18

name of the earth and made a brain trust show. This

43:20

is also one that I was like trying to read on

43:22

my iPad and Cal was very interested in like, trying

43:25

to you know, put like he likes if I'm like lying on the

43:27

couch trying to read a book, he likes like put his head on

43:29

my chest directly blocking my view of the iPad and be like, what's

43:31

going on? What are they going to do? And I'm just like, I

43:33

can't I really can't tell you because you're blocking my view. Okay.

43:37

But he was very interested in trying

43:39

to read this one with me. And sometimes if it's

43:41

like a fun light superhero book, I'll try to like

43:43

read him some of the dialogue. But like, in the

43:45

scene where it's him and his brother, you know, debating

43:47

the corporate strategy of protesting versus working for the man,

43:49

I was just like, I don't think you're gonna be

43:51

engaged by this, bud. Yeah,

43:54

a little over your head at the moment. So yeah,

43:58

I think this is gonna live or die with me the second issue. So I'll

44:00

check it out. So that's your that's your answer your question whether

44:02

or not we're sticking with it I am yes, and you are

44:04

maybe yeah, and

44:07

let's so let's do ratings on it ratings is Out

44:12

of five I'm gonna give it a I'm gonna give it

44:14

a solid three.

44:16

Yeah three three sounds right Well,

44:19

there you go patreon.com slash

44:21

a fanboy Every patron to vote out

44:24

a book to the rundown But if you

44:26

give at a five dollar or higher level you get a

44:28

patron power live in the show and Ryan's gonna handle out

44:30

today and this

44:32

week's patron power goes to Someone

44:35

that I've known for years and very excited to

44:38

be the one that the power is funneled

44:40

through and that is Dana Daska Phil Dana

44:42

has Dana and I've corresponded Several

44:45

times over the years and I actually spoke to

44:47

her science class It's like a Skype a scientist

44:49

with her her students a while back and I

44:51

always love doing those things It's super fun to

44:53

get to engage with students. This

44:55

was a pre-covid Skype a scientist We did

44:57

it just because of the logistical convenience not

44:59

because of the world being shut down So

45:02

in that vein Dana has the

45:04

amazing awesome ability to blind people

45:06

with science Blind

45:10

them with science, how does

45:12

that manifest? I

45:15

think if you know if she needs to take

45:17

away someone's sight if she and this

45:19

is like an active power This is not something

45:21

that passively happens anytime. She sciences at a person,

45:23

but if she if she willfully like Put

45:27

put science in front of them. You can use it

45:29

to blind. Maybe they just go blind Yeah,

45:32

like if you know if they're like someone's being

45:34

annoying and she like quickly scratches out the Krebs

45:36

cycle on a sheet of paper Goes ha Krebs

45:38

cycle. They're like, I can't see Wow Yeah,

45:42

what happened? So so it's

45:44

is it it's a power she has to activate

45:46

So she just so it's not like she can't

45:48

teach science anymore because she'll blind all of her

45:50

students, right? Exactly It's not like an

45:52

area of effects power. It's like she has to actually

45:54

activate it. Yeah. Yeah, she has to use it

45:56

as a weapon Okay, that's at least that's

45:59

good for her job You didn't

46:01

just make her

46:03

unemployed. Yeah, that was not my

46:05

intention, but I just felt like her

46:07

ability to funnel science into

46:10

the ocular nerves of people is so powerful she

46:12

can temporarily disable them. And it's a temporary blindness.

46:15

The sight will come back. I just

46:17

want you to know, Dana, I was looking out for

46:19

you when Ryan was trying to take away your income.

46:22

I don't think she would agree with that

46:24

characterization. patreon.com. Thanks for being a patron, Dana.

46:27

Anyone who gives the $5 a hour level gets a super power live

46:29

in the show. Hey, look, it's early. It's

46:33

early in the show, so we got to do at least one

46:35

email. Let's

46:37

see. Justin L. from

46:39

Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania writes, says, Marvel

46:42

and DC and their readers have been stubborn in that characters

46:44

don't seem to age or progress through their major life milestones.

46:48

I would submit that in order to

46:50

generate new stories, retcons are a necessary

46:52

evil. There seem to be only a finite number

46:54

of stories that are being told. A simple

46:56

counter argument is that writers could simply write new

46:59

stories, but it seems their new stories are either

47:01

not possible, not happening, or not popular. The

47:03

publishing directive seems to aim to bleed dry

47:05

all nostalgia and willpower from its aging dedicated

47:08

readers to cycle back to the stories

47:10

they remember, but maybe with a new retcon twist. Agree

47:13

or disagree? Bonus question for which

47:15

retcons you felt were necessary. I've been

47:17

thinking about this question since the heated discussion

47:19

about retcons. I don't remember having a heated

47:21

discussion about retcons. I think all our discussions

47:23

are fire. I'm not

47:25

saying we didn't, I just don't remember having one. I

47:30

assume it's because Josh is constantly confusing

47:32

retcons and reboots. That's probably why

47:34

he just... That's

47:36

probably my guess. He constantly calls

47:39

retcons and reboots. And I

47:41

mean, this question almost, you could reframe it as

47:43

a reboot versus retcon question as well. Jeez,

47:46

Justin. Justin feels very

47:48

down on everything. Do we

47:50

agree or disagree that retcons are necessary

47:52

because new stories can't be told? I

47:56

mean, we're just talking about Localman,

47:58

Astro City, the Invincible Universe. I

48:00

mean, maybe, you know, you have to create... Well, that's kind of Marvel

48:03

and DC. He's talking specifically about that. Yeah. I

48:07

don't think it's impossible to tell new stories. I just

48:09

think they've been telling a lot of them, so it's

48:11

really difficult. They've been doing these...

48:13

They've been Batman stories since 1939, and so

48:15

it's difficult to find a new twist on

48:17

Batman. It's all in

48:19

some way an echo of what's come

48:21

before. That's kind of what

48:23

happens in serialized storytelling. Some

48:25

soap operas are breaking new ground every

48:27

week with new stories. It's basically rifts

48:30

on what's already happened because

48:33

it's hard to tell an ongoing story of a

48:35

character who's been around for 80 years

48:38

without, you know, going back to what's

48:40

happened before telling a variation on it.

48:43

So in that sense, I

48:45

agree with Justin that retcons can be necessary

48:47

to... Well, I don't think

48:49

retcons are necessary to tell new stories. I

48:52

think retcons can cause new stories, which is

48:54

why I think writers probably like them.

48:57

I think it's sort of like...

48:59

You know what? There's those

49:01

jellyfish that are functionally immortal

49:03

because they can return to their adolescent

49:06

stage and grow through adulthood again. I

49:10

didn't know about them, but I'll take your word for it. Yeah.

49:12

So it's this type of jellyfish that's able

49:14

to basically go back to

49:16

being a teenage jellyfish and then go

49:19

through its sexual maturation over and over

49:21

again. As far as

49:23

we know, it can do this forever. And

49:28

that's almost what we're talking about here. Every once in

49:30

a while, you need to take mid

49:33

to late 30s married with kids Peter Parker and

49:35

you need to morph him back into a teenager

49:37

somehow and start telling stories of a

49:39

younger person and their struggles. And

49:41

I think one of the things that I

49:43

find that you and Josh being old men

49:46

comment on a lot is that the writers

49:49

almost seem to dictate some

49:51

of that because as a cohort of

49:53

writers sort of ages into middle age, I think

49:55

we see some themes of

49:58

their lives entering. the

50:00

characters on the level. 100% happens. And

50:03

they've said it. They've at least admitted it back

50:05

in the 90s. That's why originally Peter Parker got

50:07

married in the first place, is because the writers

50:10

were no longer in their 20s and they wanted

50:12

to tell stories relevant to their own lives. And

50:14

they did that and they chucked how

50:16

comics work out the window and made a big mess

50:18

of things. This is why we're here to mess

50:21

now. And I

50:23

love everybody making comics I love. And

50:26

I'm a big fan of most of the people who are

50:28

still writing, but they're the same people who have been writing

50:30

for 20 years and they're 20 years older. They're

50:34

not kids. Comics

50:36

used to be a place where people in their 20s

50:38

went and told crazy stories and showed

50:41

the world what was possible in the medium. Where

50:44

Grant Morrison and Garth Ennis and

50:46

Neil Gaiman came in in their 20s. And

50:48

Garth Ennis was writing Hellblazer when he was 23. Like

50:52

that used to be the thing. And now there's

50:54

a lot of guys in their 40s and 50s

50:56

writing these characters still. And so it's

50:59

hard to be in touch with the fire of

51:01

youth when you're that age and you end

51:03

up sort of gravitating towards stories that make

51:05

sense to you, which means making

51:07

the character seem older and you

51:10

know. So you end up with a local

51:12

man, a middle-aged superhero comes back to his

51:14

hometown. You end up with Avengers Twilight where

51:16

it's all characters are dealing with no longer

51:18

being relevant, you know. Right.

51:21

And so again,

51:23

I just think what

51:25

Jace Justin is saying is true

51:29

that it's hard to tell those stories, but

51:31

retcons aren't always the way that – I

51:33

mean retcons are not always happening. They're relatively

51:35

rare in the

51:38

grand scheme of things. The amount of comics that are coming

51:40

out, the amount of stories being told, retcons are not always

51:42

happening. But they can be very

51:44

helpful. I mean if he wants –

51:47

his bonus question for retcons were necessary. I

51:50

don't know if they're necessary, but it would have been good. The

51:53

Bucky Winter Soldier retcon opened up

51:55

a whole new vein of really

51:57

awesome stories, which when

51:59

it first announced – I was not in favor of

52:01

bringing Bucky back, but they brought the retconned

52:04

to say that he didn't actually die on

52:07

the plane. He was – he survived the

52:09

explosion and was captured by the Soviets and

52:11

became an assassin. That

52:13

opened up all of the Winter Soldier stuff that's happened

52:15

since then. That was a really good retcon. Hal

52:18

Jordan, he wasn't really evil.

52:21

He was possessed by Parallax. It was a

52:23

great retcon. It saved the

52:25

character, but at the

52:27

same time, it didn't devalue what

52:30

had come before. It's hard to thread

52:32

the needle with a good retcon. Those are two

52:34

off the top of my head that really worked and opened up

52:36

a whole new area of storytelling. It's all just storytelling.

52:39

These guys – comics never stop.

52:41

They're like the male. They don't

52:43

go on hiatus. They got to have a Batman story every month,

52:46

no matter what. It's

52:48

hard. It's hard when there's been 80 years of

52:50

them through hundreds of

52:53

titles. How do

52:55

you feel about the – I think another

52:57

one of the more famous retcons is Magneto

52:59

being Scarlet, which is a

53:01

silver spot. That's been retconned and then

53:03

de-retconned and then re-retconned. Making

53:06

him the father was a retcon. Then making him

53:08

– not the father – was a retcon of the retcon. I

53:11

prefer him as their father, but it

53:14

was taken away because of

53:16

the whole fucking fox. I

53:18

could pull a motor-hating fox with the buckle. I'd

53:20

love that to be fixed again.

53:22

I think they're more interesting characters with him as their dad.

53:24

I think he's more interesting having these characters

53:27

as his kids. But that's

53:29

– I mean, it is what it is. It's

53:31

on my mind. Would you call – I

53:34

pulled up a couple of lists of famous retcons and

53:36

they're claiming that the return of Captain America to join

53:40

the Avengers is a retcon

53:42

because they're saying that Cap died

53:44

at the end of

53:46

World War II. Did the comics say he

53:48

died? I guess if they did, then it's a retcon. Him

53:52

being back – like, any time a character comes back to life – well,

53:55

not any time. That's not true. Not every time. It's

53:58

not always a retcon. Retcons – Hold

54:01

on, by the way, we never said what retcon

54:03

was in case there's listeners who don't know. Retroactive

54:05

continuity. Right. So the thing, it's

54:07

basically summed up as the thing you thought you

54:09

knew was true was not. The

54:12

thing you thought you knew was true was false. And

54:16

it's, you know, it's a

54:18

great storytelling tool done correctly. Would

54:22

you agree that the creation of DC's

54:24

multiverse with the Flash of Two Worlds

54:26

was a retcon where previously

54:29

Jay Garrick was a comic

54:31

book character that Barry Allen read? And

54:34

then I guess the retcon there is that like the comic

54:36

books written on Barry

54:38

Allen's world were being channeled

54:41

psychically of artists and creators. Technically, I

54:43

guess, yeah, that was a retcon. Yeah.

54:47

I think we, I mean, yeah, I think we all know that

54:49

Carmine and Fantino just drew a funny cover and then they had

54:51

like a cover of the issue. I mean, I think that's real,

54:53

right? He just drew a cover of the issue and said, deal

54:55

with that, writer. Make that story

54:57

make sense. And the multiverse was born. Allen

55:01

Moore retconning Swamp Thing

55:03

into like a forest or the spirit

55:05

of the green. Yeah.

55:10

I mean, sometimes the difference between a retcon and just

55:12

a character development. True. A retcon

55:14

is the thing is always been that way. You

55:17

just didn't realize it. Not the

55:19

character has changed. And I don't know enough about that one to

55:21

know if that's a retcon or not, but. Well,

55:24

I mean, I think the thing Allen Moore did was I think

55:27

Allen Moore, I mean, it's almost, it's a retcon

55:29

very like straightforwardly in terms of we

55:32

all thought we, all of us paying attention

55:34

to Swamp Thing in the late

55:36

seventies and eighties, we all thought that Swamp Thing was

55:39

Alec Holland getting caught in like a chemical explosion in

55:41

a swamp where really the

55:43

swamp thing is like this primordial

55:45

force. Yeah. That's a

55:47

retcon. Yeah. I've

55:49

never read those books in forever. It's been like 15 years since

55:51

you're in the Swamp Thing books. Anyway, I

55:54

love a good retcon when done well, but if

55:56

they're not necessary, they just

55:58

are a good tool. toolbox. And

56:02

I think we can all agree that our favorite

56:04

retcon to ever be introduced into comics and one

56:06

that we're all glad has persisted into this day

56:08

and is now returned as a new series the

56:10

century. Not

56:14

a cynical marketing ploy, not a retcon

56:17

in my book. Let's

56:19

do Ken Jay from the Great White North. As

56:21

seen in Batman in 140, there's a

56:24

plethora of Elseworld bat-bans,

56:26

Batman's, Batman, Batman-me out

56:29

there. What are your favorite ones? I

56:33

wanted to ask you because I feel like you read more Elseworlds

56:35

than Josh has. I did

56:37

read a lot. I really liked Elseworlds growing up. I

56:40

think the one my

56:42

head goes to immediately is Russian

56:44

Batman from Superman Red Son. It's

56:47

only because he's got the fuzzy hat and I

56:49

just love that fuzzy hat with a little batter

56:51

set onto it. I think it's the greatest thing.

56:54

But you know, we recently did the animated version

56:56

of Gotham by Gaslight and what was the other

56:58

one we did that was the 20s. I

57:04

was setting it set in the 20s. I

57:07

don't know anymore. Gotham by Gaslight is the Jack the

57:09

Ripper one and then there was the one we did

57:11

that was like more steampunk-y.

57:13

I can't remember. Well,

57:16

that's the thing that happened. I'll remember. I'm

57:18

a big fan of Holy

57:21

Terror, which was Batman if the US had

57:23

lost the Revolutionary War and the

57:26

US remained the colony of England. That

57:28

was a really good one. That was an Alan Grant, Norm Brayfogle.

57:30

It was definitely Norm Brayfogle. I think that's Alan Grant. They

57:34

did one where Bruce Wayne

57:36

got the ring from Abensur, not Hal Jordan. I thought

57:38

that was a really fun one. Yep.

57:41

As you said, the Red Son Batman is

57:43

terrific. I mean, I love Elseworlds. I love

57:45

variations on- It was Batman the Doom that

57:47

came to Gotham. That's the one. That

57:51

wasn't an original story, wasn't it? Oh no, it wasn't.

57:54

That was based on a Michael Nielle story. Oh

57:58

yeah, I didn't see it. That's why. Anyway,

58:00

that meant terrific. And those are my favorites.

58:02

I think I think holy terror is my

58:04

favorite one Cuz it's it's

58:07

you know, I like an elseworlds where It's

58:10

all about the little change and it makes it really

58:12

interesting tail But the end of the

58:14

day, they're still the same person. They're still deep down that

58:16

same character. That's sort of the The

58:18

all-sorts is the best for me So

58:21

I think my my my favorite's the Russian one then

58:23

followed probably by a coffin by gaslight and then Bruce

58:26

Wayne is Green Lantern That's a

58:28

good one Isn't that who

58:30

did the Mantern one? No, that's uh,

58:33

Mike Barr Mike Barr Jerry

58:35

Bingham, that's right. Jerry

58:37

Bingham and Mike Barr also did Batman

58:41

Son the demon which introduced the concept of Damien

58:45

Which is what can't Morrison mined for Damien was

58:47

where Talia and Bruce have a baby, but

58:49

she puts up for adoption And

58:51

also this is not like this is a pretty Straight

58:54

forward down the line Elseworlds

58:57

Batman, but I still think the JLA the

58:59

nail is one of the best. Oh,

59:01

yes world. Yeah But back in

59:03

it. Oh Terrific

59:05

Alan Grant and Alan Grant Alan

59:07

Davis doing what if what

59:10

if Pa Kent

59:12

got a flat tire and never never

59:14

found cow. It was that's

59:17

the best kind of story So it's just a

59:19

little tiny thing that changes everything. That's really good

59:22

So thanks Ken for writing and thanks Justin for writing

59:24

contact ifm boy comm it's how they wrote in you

59:26

can do so, too We've been getting some great emails keep in common

59:29

We're making a concerted effort to not skip them even

59:31

if we're running long Thank you

59:33

for writing. You also write it for a media split show but

59:35

media split the subject if you're writing within

59:38

the next week we're recording the

59:40

media split I think in in a week's time and

59:42

I think this I think we might need some emails

59:45

for that one because The

59:47

subject is probably not long enough

59:49

for an entire episode But we'll see but if you have

59:51

media split episodes were adamant media split emails

59:53

right even for contact at fm boy comm out

59:56

now as Ryan

59:58

just mentioned our crisis on infinite earth So

1:00:00

Justice League Crisis on Infinite Earth part one

1:00:03

the animation brain trust reviewed that and that's right behind the show

1:00:05

on the feed You can check that out. It's one of

1:00:07

part one of three so I'll

1:00:09

be talking about Crisis on Infinite Earth this entire year and Then

1:00:12

right behind that show on the specialist and

1:00:15

feed you'd find our books But review of classic GI

1:00:17

Joe real American hero volume one which Josh I took

1:00:19

a look at the first ten issues of GI Joe super

1:00:22

fun Super GI Joey

1:00:25

and as I said before You know, we're

1:00:27

deep it we're deep in it right now We're deep in it eventually we'll

1:00:29

come out of it or deep in at the moment and

1:00:32

then later this month as I mentioned We'll have our

1:00:34

media split show that's gonna come out I think in two weeks

1:00:37

and then at the end of the month you'll have Josh's talks

1:00:39

blood show and We'll let

1:00:41

you know we'll know more about that one as it happens.

1:00:44

How's science sort of going to Ryan? I've

1:00:46

actually been in discussion with folks of how we're gonna

1:00:48

resurrect it here in the new year So we've got

1:00:50

some episodes ready or get ready to record some

1:00:53

more. So Nothing firm yet,

1:00:55

but you can expect more science sort of

1:00:57

in 2024. So it's coming back from the

1:00:59

dead from the science dead. I Wouldn't

1:01:02

call it dead. It was a stasis.

1:01:04

It was in cryosleep in hibernation a vegetative

1:01:06

state. But we're doing hiatus Yeah,

1:01:09

it's a but not officially unfortunate I mean, you

1:01:11

know It's that I always intend to work on

1:01:13

it and then just work and life

1:01:15

and all that stuff gets away from me But I'm

1:01:17

not trying to make any excuses. I'm just trying to

1:01:19

get some content out there. So I actually wanted to

1:01:21

plug Another show if

1:01:23

I could not even one that I'm

1:01:26

on sure just cuz Connor. I

1:01:28

think you might enjoy it There's this podcast called

1:01:30

newcomers with Nicole Byers and Lauren lap kiss Mm-hmm,

1:01:33

and they pick each season they pick like a

1:01:35

series of movies that they've that neither of them

1:01:37

have never seen because they're not Like super geeks

1:01:39

about anything really pop culture related So they did

1:01:41

an entire season on the MCU movies that an

1:01:43

entire Lord of the Rings season They did entire

1:01:46

fast and the furious season and this current season

1:01:48

that I think they're about a third Maybe it

1:01:50

halfway through is they're doing all the Batman movies

1:01:52

in order starting with 1966 and

1:01:54

working their way up through the marriage So they're

1:01:56

not doing then the films from the 1940s then

1:02:00

No, no, but they do do basket of phantasm and

1:02:02

they have a different guest on each week to talk

1:02:04

through the movie with them And it's quite enjoyable. All

1:02:07

right. Well, maybe maybe the next time they'll be more comprehensive

1:02:12

Try not to yeah try not to mask your try to mask your You

1:02:15

can find our library of shows We've

1:02:18

got over 1,300 of them and counting over

1:02:20

at a family calm You can find all

1:02:22

of our shows there either on the website or on our

1:02:24

podcast feed It's all there a lot

1:02:26

of shows if you need something to listen to Yeah,

1:02:29

1,300 of them. It's a lot. It's a lot

1:02:31

to deal with You can also follow that I stand by

1:02:33

comments on Instagram Find out what the pick of

1:02:35

the week is before the show comes out and also sometimes for the best weekend

1:02:37

panels Individually, we are CS

1:02:39

Kilpatrick on Instagram. Jay Flanagan

1:02:41

on Instagram Ryan helped on

1:02:43

Instagram. Are you still helped on X?

1:02:46

I mean, I haven't deleted it, but I'm not gonna do

1:02:49

anything with it I do I think literally what I need

1:02:51

to do at this point is go post one of those

1:02:53

I'm no longer on this platform tweets and then just leave

1:02:55

it from there. So Have you

1:02:59

They're not pretty sure they're called X's don't start

1:03:01

to move don't start with me One

1:03:04

thing that folks can do

1:03:06

is subscribe on the YouTube's at

1:03:08

youtube.com Slash a fanboy we will

1:03:10

find all our old video shows and we

1:03:12

post this show there every week If that's

1:03:14

your preferred format for getting your podcast Please

1:03:16

consider writing us review or leaving us a

1:03:18

star rating on Apple podcast Spotify or wherever

1:03:21

you get your podcasts Thank

1:03:23

You Ryan for stepping in when Josh had

1:03:25

an unexpected work trip for

1:03:28

sure and always enjoy having you on the

1:03:30

show and thank you out there for listening everyone who

1:03:32

listened this week and Until

1:03:34

next week. I am Connor and

1:03:36

I am Ryan. Thanks for having me. Stay

1:03:39

safe I.