0:17

This is intercepted. Welcome

0:34

to Intercepted. I'm Jeremy Scahill and

0:36

I'm Murtaza. The saying. Mother.

0:39

Saw as always, a lot to

0:41

talk about today regarding the situation

0:43

in Gaza Some of the latest

0:45

news that we're hearing out of

0:47

the Biden administration. After months of

0:50

saying ah, leaking stories to the

0:52

press and messaging that Biden is

0:54

losing patience with Netanyahu and that

0:56

the administration is concerned about the

0:58

mounting death toll and suffering of

1:01

Palestinians. The latest news now is

1:03

that Biden is talking about something

1:05

along the lines of a red

1:07

line if Netanyahu decides. To do

1:09

a full scale invasion of Rafa that

1:12

I'm just wondering your thoughts miles on

1:14

that Those developments in a very skeptical

1:16

of for the by new mistress

1:18

in this very lately profess the reservations

1:21

about these really operation it's so many

1:23

people die by this point which is

1:25

obviously a tragedy and sticking as

1:27

a given but Biden made a very

1:30

notable comments a in when you've made

1:32

this redline com and saying that three

1:34

thousand more passing it's can't Die

1:36

which is such a bizarre. You. Know

1:39

framing to discuss what could happen

1:41

going forward. I take his recent

1:43

comments about. Israel. And

1:46

Netanyahu and expressing some sort of

1:48

more as as being sort of

1:50

an effort to. Portray.

1:53

Himself as an opponent of his

1:55

own policies or opponent of his

1:57

own enabling of the Israeli government.

2:00

Hurry up his operation. Obviously the

2:02

operations very divisive inside the United

2:04

States including the Democratic party. It's

2:06

Biden. has to think of an

2:08

election year He loved his the

2:10

Past conflict. And many, many

2:12

months before the election comes. But.

2:15

He can't seem to let go of

2:17

Israel in this situation and even way

2:19

saying that can Red Lines are backing

2:21

down on funding the Iron Dome another

2:23

defensive capabilities Israel has which are very

2:25

very important to enable defensive capabilities because

2:27

it needs to be able to turn

2:29

people who would retaliate against it for

2:31

debating Gaza. So when he says red

2:33

line these and get into specifics. I

2:35

really don't take. this is a very

2:38

sincere are genuine sort of opposition or

2:40

restraints on Israel. and it's more an

2:42

attempt to restrain people united States by

2:44

making them think that somehow. He

2:47

is not endorsing very policies as

2:49

implementing. Let's remember too that Joe

2:51

Biden and Netanyahu by Bidens own

2:53

accounts have been very good friends

2:56

for some forty years. So that

2:58

this isn't like you know, Biden

3:00

was a young politician who ascended

3:03

to the presidency and is just

3:05

dealing with Netanyahu for the first

3:07

times. In fact, when Biden was

3:09

vice President under Obama, he often

3:12

ran what amounted to defense for

3:14

Netanyahu. Because of that are reported

3:16

hostility. Between Obama and Netanyahu. but the

3:18

other layer of the smiles, It's it's.

3:21

somehow this line reminds me a bit

3:23

of how the Democrats explained away their

3:25

votes in favor of the Invasion of

3:27

Iraq and their promotion of the mess

3:30

that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass

3:32

destruction be Both Biden who voted for

3:34

the War in Iraq and Hillary Clinton

3:37

who voted for the War in Iraq.

3:39

I'm asserted that the Bush Administration had

3:41

had sort of misled them, given them

3:43

inaccurate information, and that actually it's there.

3:46

It's their fault. That they voted a

3:48

odds put it was Bush's fault that they

3:50

voted for the war in Iraq and in

3:52

a similar way. The emerging line from the

3:55

Democrats is that this was all Netanyahu's fault

3:57

and that this isn't actually about the Israeli

3:59

state. The Actions: This isn't actually

4:01

about the entire intellectual, cultural, political

4:04

military apparatus in Israel supporting this

4:06

arms. It's it's actually about this

4:08

one bad actor Netanyahu. And I

4:10

think that this is yeah, it's

4:12

It's not just about the Us

4:15

election, but it's also about the

4:17

power of narratives. And I think

4:19

that's what we're seeing now is

4:21

what the Biden team sees as

4:23

their off ramp, which is to

4:26

load all of the badness of

4:28

this on to Netanyahu and. And

4:30

try to separate Netanyahu from the broader

4:32

Israeli state which is completely morally ethically

4:34

et intellectually dishonest. It was funny when

4:37

things I would bidens own personal perspective

4:39

whenever he's asked about Israel he brings

4:41

up when you go the mire personally

4:43

would shows how a difference his worldview

4:46

is from average. you're younger people, younger

4:48

generations in the Nazis or else with

4:50

spices a new hurtful personally or the

4:53

Maccabees personally. but the you've basically signaling

4:55

he's coming from a very very older

4:57

perspective of Israel. You can see the

4:59

Palestinians. Even as a factor in the

5:01

decision making me can see universe human

5:04

level disregards girl and suffering while feeling

5:06

very intense by fifty for is really

5:08

suffering I think said it's not going

5:10

to worth the strategy are plenty of

5:12

the A Netanyahu because even a political

5:14

opposition in Israel opposed to sit solution

5:17

opposes made things a D V D

5:19

with says he would like to happen

5:21

They brought many guns in to the

5:23

U S recently to talk to him

5:25

he echoed may save you the Netanyahu

5:27

and is our people in the Israeli

5:29

political. Servicemen who speak differently but they

5:32

don't have the majority popular support to

5:34

implementing policies that he was says it

5:36

would like to see going forth. So

5:38

I don't think the strategy if using

5:40

Netanyahu was a sacrificial lamb so to

5:42

speak is going to work. And

5:45

I think bed than by demonstration, simply

5:47

trying to kick the can down the

5:49

road and help people forget about this

5:51

period. But I think they're gonna be

5:54

mistaken about that. Things can be very

5:56

decisive and definitive moment in history people

5:58

will not forget. But. That the

6:00

biden emission took irrespective of the

6:03

attempts. Now to sort of. As.

6:05

I said portray itself as an opponent

6:07

towards doing. Can. Of course I'm

6:09

Ramadan. Mars has just gotten underway

6:12

and arm and an incredibly it

6:14

comes it incredibly dire moment for

6:16

the Palestinians of cause I and

6:18

today we're going to be focusing

6:20

on the health consequences of Israel's

6:23

Us Fact Scorched Earth campaign What

6:25

very clearly is a and intended

6:27

or starvation campaign And it's not

6:29

just that's Palestinians in Gaza are

6:31

at risk of starvation There there

6:33

is starvation and there already are

6:36

deaths said have been attributed. Ah

6:38

straight. Up to starvation and we're joined

6:40

now by Doctor Yara. Rcc is an

6:42

assistant professor at the University of Central

6:45

Florida in the School of Global Health

6:47

Management. Ah, she's also the Code Director

6:49

of the Palestine Program for Health and

6:51

Human Rights at Harvard University. and she

6:54

has a new book out called how

6:56

War Kills the overlooked threats to Our

6:58

health. Doctor Yara Rc thank you so

7:00

much for being with us here on

7:03

intercepted. Thank. You for having me. Let's.

7:05

Begin with the their big picture

7:07

situation of what the U S

7:10

is currently doing. On the one

7:12

hand, the by the administration is

7:14

not retreating from it's full support

7:16

our in arming Israel, providing political

7:19

defense for the scorched Earth war

7:21

against the Palestinians of Gaza. And

7:23

on the other hand, you see

7:26

President Joe Biden and Vice President

7:28

Kamala Harris increasingly trying to talk

7:30

about the suffering of Palestinians. and

7:33

Biden has put a lot of.

7:35

Political weight on the notion

7:37

that the Us is now

7:39

directly trying to get a

7:41

so called aid to the

7:43

Palestinians of Gaza initially in

7:45

the form of or air

7:47

of food and other supplies

7:49

and now this construction of

7:51

a ports off the coast

7:53

of Gaza that Biden himself

7:55

said i'm will be protected

7:57

quote unquote by Israeli forces.

7:59

Your real shin to. This.

8:02

Us policy of simultaneously giving

8:04

American weaponry to Israel and

8:06

now saying, oh, we're gonna

8:08

facilitate the direct delivery of

8:10

humanitarian aid to the Palestinians

8:12

of Gaza. So. There

8:15

is a a long scholarship and

8:17

critique of humanitarianism across contacts, but

8:19

it is kind of hard to

8:22

imagine a more potent example of

8:24

the failures of humanitarianism than what

8:26

we've seen in Gaza really since

8:28

the beginning, let especially for five

8:31

months. and at this point. The

8:34

President, the Vice President were really starting

8:36

to see a shift in their language

8:38

simply because I think. At. This

8:40

point that the level, the

8:42

scope of suffering is completely

8:44

unavoidable. They can no longer

8:46

pretend. That. This is just

8:48

targeting some ass of this is

8:50

just affecting some ass at This

8:53

is just affecting people who didn't

8:55

flee the North. You know Israel

8:57

has has made quite clear that

8:59

they plan on invading the parts

9:01

of Gaza Strip and Nasa where

9:03

people had fled to people who

9:06

cannot leave. When they announced this

9:08

an airdrop plan. And I

9:10

am deeply ingrained in like the

9:12

humanitarian discuss. and there was not

9:14

a humanitarian agencies or actor in

9:16

the world who thought this was

9:19

a good idea. The reality is,

9:21

Gaza has multiple land entry points.

9:23

a say soda which is what

9:25

Well continuing to talk about, but

9:27

many across the The Strip and

9:29

in the Gaza Strip aside from

9:32

the Mediterranean is essentially completely enveloped

9:34

by Israel, with that little tiny

9:36

bit of Egypt in the south.

9:38

And so if. Humanitarianism is getting

9:40

aid and especially in the North

9:43

where it's most needed was a

9:45

concern. The U S could push

9:47

these land openings, The U S

9:49

could force Israel to stop blocking

9:51

aid, The Us could force Israel

9:54

to do something about these Israeli

9:56

citizens who are sitting at the

9:58

ruff Us border. Probably.

10:01

Bringing. Their families to block

10:03

ajax airdrops is seen as

10:05

kind as a. Not

10:08

even a last resort. Something that you

10:10

read that really in the Twenty Twenty

10:12

Four should not be done, should not

10:15

be needed. There's videos that showed the

10:17

pallets dropping into the sea. So now

10:19

you have this visual of the starving

10:22

com a ties Displaced people including children

10:24

are running into the Mediterranean Sea. And

10:26

then of course there was this story.

10:29

I just in early March about

10:32

some of these airdrops falling on.

10:34

People in Gaza people has had

10:36

survived this you know so far,

10:39

who including children who have had

10:41

airdrops fall on them and have

10:43

killed them. Then this was followed

10:46

up with this you know announcement

10:48

of this poor. It's interesting that

10:50

the administration does not. Bring.

10:53

Up like Gaza does not already

10:55

have a seat for. Gaza is

10:57

a it city on the Mediterranean

10:59

in a very. traditionally.

11:02

Trafficked route by traitorous. Historically

11:04

Gaza had a seaport, Gaza

11:06

has always wanted a sustainable

11:08

sea. Israel has present has

11:10

prevented them from building that

11:12

light as guys are not

11:14

have an airport Israel. Bombed.

11:16

The airport that they built several

11:19

decades ago and has prevented building

11:21

of a new one so now

11:23

kind of trying to command then

11:25

patch these significant. Gap. Of

11:28

mean, with what are really

11:30

essentially very performative efforts said,

11:32

if you really consider the

11:34

humanitarian mean you would recognize

11:36

immediately. I mean, this poor

11:38

idea is going to take

11:40

weeks if not months to

11:42

build. We have people starving

11:44

today, dying today. It's going

11:46

to require Us military involvement.

11:48

And then as you noted,

11:50

this idea that. Still,

11:52

Even though this is a port

11:55

built to circumvent Israel, blocking aid

11:57

from coming in the land borders.

12:00

Israel is still going to be

12:02

able to inspect and control and

12:04

quote unquote secure. This poor. It's

12:06

really farcical, I think. Many

12:09

western actors who have seen that the

12:11

stance that they took. In

12:13

October and maintained is no longer

12:15

sustainable and they're trying to scramble

12:17

at this point to look like

12:19

they. Genuinely care about

12:21

Palestinian life here, but.

12:24

I. Can't see that that's the

12:26

reality when we know that there's so

12:29

much more that can and should be

12:31

done. Number one: Starting with a permanent

12:33

cease, but even just looking at getting

12:35

aid and there are much better and

12:37

more effective ways to do that that

12:39

already exist and. Pressure. Can

12:41

and should be. Applied on Israel to facilitate

12:43

that. and the fact that it's not

12:46

shows that this is not truly a

12:48

concern for Palestinian life. And

12:50

jaws would the concepts which are describing

12:52

to the deliberate strategy but the Israeli

12:54

government uses starvation into provision of food

12:57

other necessities of life as a weapon

12:59

of war which is very medieval sort

13:01

of tactic of siege which the Us

13:03

nuclear sues to in the twenty first

13:05

century year was the map in real

13:07

time one thing that happens is you

13:09

boats and I'm sure that is an

13:11

expert and public health you up as

13:13

well to. Are. The implications of

13:16

your deprivation of food and water

13:18

most into civilian population for long

13:20

time, including short and long term

13:23

health implications of that. Jews

13:25

was you been thinking watching this and.

13:28

The. Implications happy for the thousand published

13:30

in the Were were often. What? May

13:32

be happening that were not aware of is likely

13:34

given the circumstances. Yeah, this is

13:36

a great tests and so I

13:39

think it's really important to start

13:41

with the pre October Seven

13:43

context of the Gaza Strip, which

13:45

was already a site as blockade

13:48

occupation and significant deprivation which manifested

13:50

in multiple outcomes high poverty, hi

13:53

suit and security, high rate

13:55

of water borne illness, dust, and

13:57

children and so Basil is already.

14:00

The. And a. Sub

14:02

standard stay in our what

14:04

political economist Sarah Roy has

14:07

referred to as d development.

14:09

It's not just under development,

14:11

they don't have enough resources,

14:13

they don't have enough fast

14:15

food. It's artificially d developed

14:18

by the conditions of occupation

14:20

blockade and so. When.

14:22

You layer of that with

14:24

the multiple. Forms.

14:26

Of attack on life we've seen

14:29

in the past five months. from

14:31

you know, the siege. Starting on

14:33

day one, we started to hear

14:36

reports of hunger and thirst and

14:38

medicine deprivation. Almost immediately we have

14:41

reports now have at least two

14:43

dozen, perhaps people who have starved

14:45

to death. Undoubtedly that number is

14:48

much higher, just under reported because

14:50

many people are displaced. Your situation

14:52

is so fragile right now. We.

14:55

Are to the point in the

14:57

Gaza Strip where a permanent cease

14:59

fire the second would not stop

15:01

the majority of suffering For most

15:03

people, most people have no homes

15:05

to go back to, and most

15:07

hospitals and health facilities if not

15:10

destroyed or heavily damaged. I think

15:12

the World Health Organization has recently

15:14

said less than ten. Hospitals.

15:16

In the Gaza Strip remain functional and

15:19

in some capacity, Most of them have

15:21

been reduced to offering trauma care. So

15:23

let's say you're a cancer patient. Let's

15:26

say you require dialysis or even just

15:28

an asthma inhaler. You're not getting any

15:30

of that. None of those people are

15:33

getting care that only cancer hospital in

15:35

the Gaza Strip they could offer chemotherapy

15:37

services Shut down in early November because

15:39

of lack of fuel. Still, if you

15:42

have cancer and we see that, please

15:44

from people on twitter My grandmother. My

15:46

mother I need to get out

15:48

of Gaza to get my chemotherapy.

15:51

You are. Getting no treatment whatsoever,

15:54

Let. Alone if you have cardiovascular disease,

15:56

any other number of health elements

15:58

even prior to Oct. Said and

16:00

many of these conditions required.

16:03

An application for a medical permit

16:05

issued by Israel to leave the

16:07

Gaza Strip to either enter Israel

16:09

to receive the care that she

16:11

needed or even to go to

16:13

the West Bank or East Jerusalem,

16:16

which are also Palestinian territories you

16:18

require an Israeli permit for this.

16:20

Israel had consistently delayed and denied

16:22

permission before. Now. Are

16:24

the World Health Organization has said,

16:26

this entire system has been shut

16:28

down. People are not being able

16:30

to leave for medical reasons consistently.

16:32

Whether it's because of trauma or

16:34

because they haven't, you know, high

16:37

risk pregnancy or again, insert any

16:39

other health element here. The consequences

16:41

long term are. A measurable,

16:43

especially because as we have this

16:45

conversation, this is ongoing. I'm just

16:47

looking at starvation, especially in children.

16:49

This can cause stunted growth that

16:52

can never be recovered. Even if

16:54

these children survived this and are

16:56

able to get back to normal,

16:58

you know, caloric intake and nutritional

17:00

needs. A Much of the Aids

17:03

it's distributed in terms of food

17:05

aid is not nutritionally sound. It's

17:07

a lot of flour and rise.

17:09

It's not. A lot of protein, fresh.

17:11

Fruits and Vegetables. The

17:13

scale and scope of

17:16

this starvation has. Astounded,

17:18

even scholars of mass starvation and

17:20

famine on. And so while we

17:22

can kind of extrapolate from past

17:24

settings a siege and starvation as

17:27

a weapon of war which has

17:29

unfortunately been a consistent feature of

17:31

of our humanity, we don't know

17:33

what this will look like For

17:35

all these people in the Gaza

17:37

Strip, you know, half of whom

17:39

are children most assume have nowhere

17:42

to return to and will probably

17:44

remain in some displaced state for.

17:46

Weeks. Months years? we don't know undies

17:49

shelters that there and are these tent

17:51

cities that they're living in? Very.

17:53

Under served As you can

17:55

imagine, very crowded, very prone

17:57

to spread of infectious disease.

18:00

There's an low access to

18:02

clean water, clean food. You

18:04

know, sometimes it's hundreds of

18:06

people sharing one bathroom To

18:08

these conditions are just absolutely

18:11

horrific, completely inhumane, and so

18:13

I think what we're seeing

18:15

now. As. Horrific as

18:17

it is will pale in

18:19

comparison to what when were

18:21

finally able to look back

18:23

at this comprehensively retrospectively. The.

18:25

Tales that will come out. A single hunt

18:28

us. For a very long time. Let.

18:30

Us not forget that

18:32

Israel has systematically attacked

18:34

hospitals. Health Clinics. Arm

18:37

has killed many scores of

18:39

health workers. They abducted some

18:41

doctors and tortured them to

18:44

try to get them to

18:46

confess that their hospital was

18:48

in fact housing or masking.

18:50

What about it to like

18:52

a Hamas Pentagon underground and

18:54

so many of the charges

18:57

That's Israel has leveled against

18:59

causes Hospitals have them later

19:01

been proven false or wilde

19:03

exaggeration. So you're course of

19:05

Many people are familiar. with

19:07

the I'll See for hospital, but this

19:10

was replicated to the point where of

19:12

the three dozen or so actual hospitals

19:14

that existed in Gaza, almost none of

19:16

them are fully functional right now, and

19:19

there's only a few of them that

19:21

are able to do any sort of

19:23

of servicing of of a large populations.

19:25

We've had doctors that have been on

19:28

the ground in Gaza, including American doctors

19:30

in Canadian doctors who have described some

19:32

of the scenes that they've witnessed, including

19:35

a doctor who some weeks ago wrote.

19:37

An op ed for The Los

19:39

Angeles Times describing how he saw

19:41

a number of small children that

19:43

he asserted appeared to have been

19:46

killed by a single bullets fired

19:48

by a sniper weapons. And you

19:50

have a lot of people who

19:52

are suffering from gunshot wounds, shrapnel

19:54

wounds of having been under the

19:57

rubble who are being treated with

19:59

out and. Sort of anesthesia

20:01

ah or pain management or painkillers

20:03

that to mention your what happens

20:05

after if there is a set

20:08

a successful surgical procedure but I

20:10

wanted to ask you have also

20:13

in this context about the specific

20:15

cases of. How this war

20:17

and Israel seeds and the destruction

20:19

of the medical infrastructure is impacting

20:22

pregnant women. Your. I read

20:24

a testimony over the weekend from a

20:26

Gaza resident who said that when the

20:28

food started to run out they started

20:30

using animal feed to make bread arm

20:32

And I also have read not just

20:35

reports from aid organizations and medical organizations

20:37

about how this is impacting new mothers

20:39

who are trying to breastfeed but also

20:41

testimony from women who say I essentially

20:43

up to make a choice between drinking

20:45

salt water. Or. Poisoned

20:47

water, Dirty water. There's a shortage

20:50

of formula women are not able

20:52

to breastfeed because of the health

20:54

consequences to their bodies, And then

20:56

you have the issue of inadequate

20:58

menstruation products and other things. But

21:00

this is particularly affected women, and

21:02

in an extremely a cute way.

21:04

Pregnant women or new mothers and

21:06

their children. Yeah. Absolutely. And

21:08

ironically, you know we're having this

21:11

conversation just a few days after

21:13

International Women's Day and said the

21:16

silence on the suffering as causes,

21:18

women and girls by much of

21:20

the last has been particularly appalling.

21:23

In an ideal circumstance, a pregnant

21:25

woman has multiple prenatal visits, see,

21:27

has a skilled medical professional at

21:30

the birth, she has a clean,

21:32

private space to give birth, and

21:34

she has. Opportunities. For

21:37

a post natal care for having

21:39

in l help with breast feeding

21:41

on you know women need special

21:43

diets. None of that. As possible,

21:45

you know they're hearing from pregnant

21:47

women giving birth and shelters surrounded.

21:50

By hundreds of people know says this and

21:52

around with you know there have been citizens

21:54

to have been giving C sections of know

21:57

anesthesia. In some

21:59

ways. The. Her. My.

22:02

Seen by some as not just.

22:05

An attack on Gaza today, but

22:07

an attack on Gaza's future. So

22:09

Gaza is a very young population

22:11

has more tens of thousands of

22:13

women were pregnant. Before this, they're

22:15

worth an estimated one hundred and

22:17

eighty women giving birth per day.

22:19

At a certain point in an

22:21

infant mortality has increased, rate of

22:24

miscarriage and stillbirth has increased not

22:26

just because of the physical stress,

22:28

trauma, lack of food on the

22:30

women, but also the shop on.

22:32

So we've seen some women who

22:34

were able to successfully. Give. Birth potentially

22:36

to a premature baby. But. Because

22:38

of the sound of bombings, the

22:40

baby is unable to even latch

22:43

to nurse. So even if the

22:45

woman is trying on, you know

22:47

we're seeing babies. Are that

22:49

have starved and will starve All babies

22:51

that are being born there have been

22:54

born in this or not receiving vaccinations.

22:56

It's really horrific. I mean this is

22:58

this is not due to lack of

23:01

technology or lack of advancement. Gaza has.

23:03

Health professionals that are willing

23:06

and able. This is purposeful

23:08

human made policy to ensure

23:10

that every one from the

23:12

most vulnerable, pregnant women and

23:14

cents on and everyone else

23:17

is suffering. He just as

23:19

much for. Inexplicably.

23:21

Reasons and this is a place

23:23

where we should be at least

23:25

seeing some urgency. some you know

23:27

it will. Going back to the

23:29

earlier question, if were really concerned,

23:31

hear about humanitarianism and helping people

23:34

survive. This is a no brainer

23:36

supporting pregnant women and their their

23:38

newborn babies and children. And yet

23:40

we are seeing them having to

23:42

experience the same conditions on seeing

23:44

them having to flee for their

23:46

lives on foot. Seeing them, you

23:48

know there was the story. Very.

23:51

Early on in this about the

23:53

premature babies that elsa another hospitals.

23:55

Who were left behind by medical

23:57

staff with assurances that they would

24:00

be the evacuated and instead they

24:02

were abandoned in the hospital and

24:04

when workers returned a. Frankly,

24:06

Sound their decomposing bodies. This

24:09

was months ago and this

24:11

did not. Sparked. Any.

24:14

Sense. Of urgency or need of

24:16

intervention. So coupled with the health

24:18

needs of the specific population, the

24:21

lack of response shows I think

24:23

the depravity of the situation and

24:25

the willingness of much of the

24:28

world to really let Israel. Do.

24:30

Whatever it wants to whoever at once

24:32

in the Gaza Strip. You're.

24:35

Sort of the war they were

24:37

series of for many ruby disturbing

24:39

statements made by current former Israeli

24:41

government and military officials but what

24:43

they expected to have happened in

24:45

Gaza and would be hoped engineer

24:47

there and very notably are there

24:49

was some statements specifically saying that.

24:52

He's. Really government should pursue a

24:54

strategy aimed at spreading disease epidemics

24:56

in Gaza. Or this one

24:58

seems to grow. Speaking of at the start of

25:00

the war, a former Major General. Jura

25:02

a land said. Quote.

25:05

The international community is warning us

25:07

against a severe humanitarian disaster and

25:09

severe epidemics. We. Must not

25:11

shy away from this after all. severe

25:13

epidemics in the south of Gaza will

25:16

bring us closer to victory and called

25:18

and the same as as he endorsed

25:20

by a bit zealous Modric was currently

25:22

went part of the these really dumb

25:24

and dumber senior level to speak a

25:27

bit about what is really done since

25:29

the war started that would likely generate

25:31

these disease epidemics. And how

25:33

that ties into a strategy that they

25:35

have identified of could sitting out the

25:37

population and speeds by means sort of

25:39

direct use of violence and bombed shooting

25:41

and so forth. Again, you know, just

25:44

to set some context, it's important to note

25:46

that. Play. Saying. Quote.

25:48

Unquote pressure on the population

25:50

has been Israel strategy since

25:52

the beginning of the blockade

25:54

in two thousand and seven

25:56

ensuring deprivation, ensuring a dependency,

25:58

ensuring that P. Cannot attain

26:00

their full physical and mental health

26:03

and capacity in education or and

26:05

work or in any other sector.

26:07

This has been. The. Policy

26:09

You know this? Whole idea of

26:12

mowing the grass that we heard

26:14

and past wars or calculating the

26:16

calories And that's why I think

26:18

these statements were such potent evidence

26:21

in South Africa as genocide case

26:23

against Israel Because here we have

26:25

Israeli government ministers including the national

26:27

minister. the foreign minister basically saying

26:29

yes, that is the strategy makes

26:32

us population suffer. And sure

26:34

there's surrender and for some of them

26:36

and sure that they can never return

26:38

to this land so that we can

26:40

have it and build our settlements you

26:43

know, on the beach. And this is

26:45

why in the genocide case ah, this

26:47

destruction of the health system played such

26:49

a potent role. Because the argument was

26:51

yes. Third, the bombings. And the

26:54

snipers in the tanks pose one

26:56

form of threat to life and

26:58

threat to you know, forced displacement

27:01

of such us. But we cannot

27:03

assume that these secondary consequences of

27:05

starvation i think being most prevalent

27:08

right now, but also the spread

27:10

of infectious disease is not part

27:12

and parcel of Israel's approach to.

27:15

Induce. Surrender

27:17

to forced displacement to weaken the

27:20

population just as much as the

27:22

other aspects of it's Alex Deval

27:24

who is a very well known

27:27

mass in of starvation and famine

27:29

Experts said an aunt and interviews

27:31

several weeks ago you can bomb

27:34

a population by accident. You.

27:36

Can not starve a population by

27:38

accident and I would take that

27:41

further and say you cannot induce

27:43

this level of infectious disease spread

27:45

by accident. This is kind of

27:48

epidemiology. One on one you have

27:50

a weekend malnourished population sheltered in

27:52

overcrowded conditions. Lack

27:55

of access to. The

27:57

most basic. Of. Metal.

28:00

Supplies health needs.

28:03

Masks you know, antiseptics, cleaning supplies,

28:05

and little access to bathrooms. Obviously

28:07

there's no trash disposal, so people

28:10

are just kind of disposing of

28:12

trash in big piles in the

28:15

middle of camps sometimes close to

28:17

where water is being stored. The

28:19

likelihood of contamination is, of course,

28:22

very high. None of this is

28:24

new information we have. Studied.

28:27

This exact phenomenon over and over

28:29

again. So when you force the

28:31

population into those conditions again reminding

28:33

your audience that people in Gaza

28:35

cannot leave right now without paying,

28:38

you know, actors in Egypt at

28:40

the Egyptian border. Thousands and increasingly

28:42

tens of thousands of dollars to

28:44

do so. They are not choosing

28:46

to stay in these conditions. Most

28:48

of them, many of them wish

28:51

to leave and be a while.

28:53

Some have stayed in the North

28:55

for because they cannot fully. Because

28:57

they choose not to flee, whatever

28:59

the reasons may be forcing people

29:02

into this tiny little space in

29:04

the southern part of the Gaza

29:06

Strip. In these conditions, of course,

29:08

we're going to see an increase.

29:11

Infectious disease. This was predictable on

29:13

October seventh itself. Basically, nothing is

29:15

being done about the Infectious Disease

29:17

Angle and the World Health Organization.

29:20

With the data that it's been

29:22

able to collect, Surprise Surprise is

29:24

seeing significantly increased rates of diarrhea.

29:27

Bloody diarrhea, skin diseases and

29:29

respiratory infections. Flu cove. Id

29:31

at it. It's winter time

29:33

where it was just winter

29:35

time when these diseases spread

29:37

diseases that are especially dangerous

29:39

for young children like diarrhea.

29:42

On again children that are on

29:44

vaccinated. You know we saw outbreaks

29:47

of Polio and Syria and very

29:49

rural on vaccinated communities. We're very

29:51

fearful that will start to see

29:53

even those kinds of outbreaks among

29:55

the population in Gaza. So yes,

29:58

I mean this is a recipe

30:00

for disease outbreaks. We saw some

30:02

actual soldiers Israeli soldiers who had

30:04

been deployed in Gaza having to

30:07

be sent back because they themselves

30:09

had some sort of gastro intestinal

30:11

infection or something. So just imagine

30:13

what it is like in these

30:16

conditions. There was a period one

30:18

every one I knew from Gaza

30:20

was reporting coughing and feeling flu

30:22

like symptoms with no ability to

30:24

be diagnosed, no ability to get

30:27

any medication, no ability to even

30:29

rest and hydrate. Which is kind

30:31

of the basic saying you're supposed to

30:33

do in these circumstances, it is causing.

30:36

Unnecessary. One hundred

30:38

percent preventable death and disability and

30:41

this is very well known by

30:43

Israel because it was already in

30:45

L partially the case before October

30:47

seventh and again this is the

30:49

Ces major round of military campaign

30:51

in the Gaza Strip and so

30:53

this is. This is no surprise

30:55

and so I think I'm it

30:58

does us know service to act

31:00

surprised that this happens and so

31:02

is it really. Is bad

31:04

faith efforts I think by many

31:06

Western leaders who are suddenly now

31:09

expressing shocked at what health and

31:11

humanitarians were warning about five months

31:13

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settle filing fees. well heck food service

32:01

I'm from out of of terminated at any

32:03

time. You're.

32:17

I want to ask you about

32:19

some of the a dehumanization narratives

32:21

that Israel has employed as it

32:23

seeks to justify the unjustifiable scorched

32:26

Earth attack against the people of

32:28

Gaza. And in a, we've done

32:30

a lot of reporting on this

32:32

at the At The Intercept I'm

32:35

Aljazeera Investigative Unit has a new

32:37

film out this week looking at

32:39

Israel's targeted campaign of misinformation and

32:41

this information. You're just to remind

32:44

people that in the immediate aftermath

32:46

of October, Seventh, you had

32:48

a very swiftly assembled propaganda

32:50

operation put into place and

32:52

various actors from Israeli society

32:55

were deployed in this efforts,

32:57

primarily people from the private

32:59

so called rescue operations that

33:01

are ultra Orthodox like Zoc

33:04

Us. They offered testimonies to

33:06

the world about what they

33:08

claimed to have witnessed as

33:10

they operated in The Cupboard

33:13

Seem and other areas where

33:15

Hamas and other groups. Launched

33:17

their attacks on the morning of

33:19

October. Seventh Day promoted the completely

33:21

false assertion that there were beheaded

33:23

babies at time, saying they were

33:25

forty beheaded babies. Eli Beer, who

33:28

is the head of another Are

33:30

Orthodox rescue organizations claim that I'm

33:32

a Hamas had placed on an

33:34

infant in an oven and bake

33:36

to the in fan and that

33:38

they personally witnessed and took out

33:40

this child later. This didn't happen,

33:42

They claim that they are. They

33:45

saw a pregnant woman who. Had

33:47

a fetus cut out of her body

33:49

and the fetus was stabbed and then

33:51

the mother was killed. Know pregnant women

33:53

have been documented to have died on

33:55

October Seventh. The Israeli government is not

33:57

validating that a pregnant woman was killed

33:59

on. The Southern up there was

34:01

a pregnant woman who was an

34:03

Arab that was shot as she

34:05

was on en route to the

34:08

hospital. Doctors were unable to save

34:10

her baby. but see lived these

34:12

stories that became part of the

34:14

official narrative. And then you had

34:16

Joe Biden on multiple occasions repeating

34:18

the beheaded baby story but also

34:20

claiming he had seen confirmed images

34:22

of Hamas operatives be heading the

34:24

babies. The White House had to

34:26

walk that back and Biden continued

34:28

to say it nonetheless. Anthony Blinken

34:31

testified before the senate. Told.

34:34

A very gruesome story about

34:36

Hamas militants coming in and

34:38

topping body parts off of

34:40

a family and than sitting

34:42

down at the table and

34:44

eating their breakfasts. This also

34:46

has been thoroughly debunked. and

34:49

in November you had this

34:51

intense campaign being run by

34:53

the Israeli government with the

34:55

direct participation of health officials

34:57

in Israel to allege that

34:59

Hamas had come in with

35:01

a pre meditated plans to

35:03

commit. And weaponize sexual violence.

35:06

And. To do so in a

35:08

widespread manner targeting Jewish women

35:11

and children. On October seventh

35:13

and you had the group.

35:15

ah, the Israeli group Physicians

35:17

for Human Rights Israel put

35:19

a report out in November

35:21

claiming that there was ample

35:23

evidence to suggest that there

35:25

have been widespread rape and

35:27

sexual violence. And then the

35:29

Netanyahu government, with assistance from

35:31

the White House, starts promoting.

35:33

This. Notion that feminist

35:35

organizations had been silent in the

35:38

face of this overwhelming evidence that

35:40

there had been widespread sexual violence

35:42

deployed on October Seventh? You that

35:44

had the New York Times at

35:47

the end of December publishing it's

35:49

piece Screams Without Words that claim

35:51

to have to be providing new

35:54

details that there was a weaponization

35:56

of sexual violence from Hamas and

35:58

in recent we a number of

36:01

independent news outlets are users on

36:03

social media Us have pointed out

36:05

information about the authors of that

36:08

New York Times piece, including a

36:10

filmmaker who had no reporting or

36:12

investigative reporting experience, someone who had

36:15

served in the Arab Israeli Defense

36:17

Forces in an intelligence units who

36:19

was essentially put in it your

36:22

as the lead researcher investigating these

36:24

claims. And then all of this

36:26

culminates with the Israeli government denying

36:29

access to an independent. Un investigative

36:31

body who wanted to go to

36:33

Israel to investigate these allegations. Israel

36:35

implied that it's members were anti

36:37

semitic, an anti Israel and so

36:40

that instead they got from Ill

36:42

up. Paton, who is an envoy

36:44

of the Secretary General who has

36:46

no actual investigative mandates to come

36:48

in and then see Some days

36:50

ago released a twenty four page

36:53

report and that report has been

36:55

promoted in the media as the

36:57

United Nations has uncovered evidence that

36:59

there was widespread. Sexual violence in

37:01

Israel committed by Hamas and other

37:03

groups. But if you actually read

37:06

the Port report which I did,

37:08

the word evidence is mentioned a

37:10

handful of times, but exclusively it

37:12

is man sent to explain that

37:14

they weren't dealing in evidence, they

37:16

were dealing in information and that

37:18

it's that they were relying almost

37:20

entirely on information provided to these

37:22

this Un groups by the Israeli

37:24

government. Itself Within this reports,

37:26

the U looked at some of the

37:28

of the cases that have received widespread

37:31

a ten cents and said that they

37:33

didn't sign grounds to be able to

37:35

declare that these were valid assertions of

37:37

and no one is denying you know

37:39

that there should be. There should be

37:41

a very thorough investigation and I know

37:44

as a way or form of war

37:46

reporters, a lot of sexual violence takes

37:48

place in War Arm. I wouldn't be

37:50

shocked if it did on these are

37:52

serious charges particular if you're saying it

37:54

was a premeditated programs. But my read

37:57

of it and I'm following this very closely to

37:59

is that the. Overwhelmingly majority of

38:01

the so called evidence that

38:03

is being presented is coming

38:05

from. Non. Scientific experts,

38:07

people with no forensic where

38:10

medical are relevant medical credentials,

38:12

people who are not legally

38:14

qualified to determine rapes, and

38:16

most importantly, people who have

38:19

repeatedly promoted assertions about atrocities

38:21

that later were proven to

38:23

be false. Your. Thoughts

38:25

on this whole tapestry

38:27

of this. Campaign.

38:29

That is a very deliberate

38:32

one. That. Israel

38:34

has now. Found. A way

38:36

to get the United Nations to launder are

38:38

or at least allow it to be vague

38:40

enough that media outlets and lazy is a

38:43

individuals our minds to now declare our hearts.

38:45

The Un has come in and set it.

38:47

Everyone who questioned this is a rape denial.

38:50

That there's a lot there. So let me

38:52

try to. Start at

38:54

this core classes and as

38:56

dehumanization of Palestinians and what

38:59

purpose does that serve, right?

39:01

So if you're. Israel

39:03

and your claim is we

39:06

don't. Kill All

39:08

Of them. We only kill

39:10

terrorists. It's just so happens

39:12

that almost all of them

39:14

are terrorists. Then you can

39:16

justify. A Lot and

39:18

you can get the world on

39:20

your side for a very long

39:22

time. Again, looking

39:25

prior to October Seventh, this

39:27

has been the playbook. Palestinians

39:29

are inherently dangerous. Whether they're

39:31

a child or an elderly

39:34

person, they are all deserving

39:36

of this collective punishment. This

39:38

over securitizations. this you know,

39:40

in the West Bank checkpoints,

39:42

this blockade of a full.

39:45

Civilian. Territories all as

39:48

the is inhumane practices

39:50

that. Him. Agencies like

39:52

the Un has been tracking

39:55

and arguing about, and you

39:57

know increasingly that the conversation

39:59

has. Has come to this

40:01

question as. Well. What is

40:04

the purpose of this For Israel and

40:06

for many? The answer is they want

40:08

Palestinians off the land. And

40:10

they want the land Now We

40:12

have seen the sake many different

40:14

forms. Over. The.

40:16

Past century and I think this

40:18

kind of goes to this question

40:20

of who is worthy of speaking.

40:23

And being believed. And

40:25

who is. Questioned.

40:28

And who is not trusted

40:30

to narrate their own lived

40:32

experience? You know you've mentioned

40:34

Joe Biden earlier and very

40:36

early on. One of the

40:38

first indications aside from the

40:40

full throated support and that

40:42

he was going to go

40:44

fully along with this was

40:46

when he questioned the Palestinian

40:48

death toll because it had

40:50

been captured by Palestinians Ministry

40:52

of Health and of course.

40:55

They. Can't be trusted right?

40:57

So however, all of these

40:59

various Israeli actors good face

41:02

is the assumption. Rights.

41:04

You start with good faith and

41:06

then maybe after a while of

41:08

investigation you know we can say.

41:10

Well, there are questions. Oh, we

41:12

can walk back statements. they even

41:14

walked back or tried to quell

41:16

the death toll thing. But once

41:18

something is said and it's out

41:20

there, especially by the President, the

41:22

Secretary of state, somebody like this,

41:24

you can't put that back in

41:27

a box. So this the recent

41:29

Un statement that you know you

41:31

know the the coffee. I swear

41:33

it's has. To put it

41:35

mildly, were so remarkable that it

41:37

was really shocking that it was

41:40

released in this form. No, I

41:42

completely agree with you. Let's do

41:44

a full investigation of all parties,

41:47

right? Justice must be served by

41:49

for this Un report with only.

41:52

And of hearsay evidence to

41:54

suddenly be the foundational report

41:56

for what happened on October

41:58

Seven. The same

42:00

time that dozens, if not

42:03

hundreds of Un reports tracking

42:05

Israeli apartheid, referencing Israeli Settler

42:08

colonial aspirations, tracking Israel's stealing

42:10

of Palestinian water. it's you

42:12

know, rationing Palestinian electricity? I

42:15

mean, I. I. I could

42:17

spend the rest of this

42:20

time just referencing violations that

42:22

the Un and other actors

42:24

have documented. Sexual Assault against

42:27

Palestinian women who including prisoners.

42:29

yes, Is a sexual assaults against

42:31

Chelsea women prisoners and in one case

42:33

of have a child. This was a

42:36

case that was referred to Defense for

42:38

Children International Palestine. They documented the testimony

42:40

of this child and. None.

42:42

Of that bore anything. Any

42:45

fruit is a few brought it up

42:47

to any official it was. You know

42:49

we don't want a pre suppose anything

42:52

so and that will a common the

42:54

way of a two state solution. and

42:56

we really think unilateral moves and overtly

42:59

criticizing Israel as a hopeful are constantly

43:01

hearing that. That's not helpful. But the

43:03

reports. That. Indict. That.

43:06

Accuse. That. Confirm this

43:08

narrative that Palestinians are dangerous and that

43:10

is why it's okay to do these

43:12

things to them, even the children because

43:14

their children now. But they're gonna grow

43:16

up to be adult Palestinians. And their

43:18

dangerous. So you know, do the math.

43:20

It's so disheartening. Now, As a Palestinian,

43:22

this is something this kind of. Dehumanization.

43:26

It's baked into your. Existence

43:28

the it's your experience but to

43:31

see it be leveraged in this

43:33

way and what the I Cj

43:35

has called at this plants a

43:37

plausible genocide which has required South

43:39

Africa to. Just. Last week

43:42

go back to the I Cj

43:44

and say. You. Know that those

43:46

provisional measures you asked Israel to do,

43:48

they're not doing any of them. In

43:51

fact, they're doing less than you ask

43:53

them to do. Things are exponentially worse.

43:55

We require immediate intervention. I don't even

43:57

remember that really being significantly covered in

44:00

Western media. While this again this Un

44:02

report that you referenced with kind of

44:04

seen as we close the book on

44:07

this is what happened. So to me

44:09

this is about. Narrative.

44:11

And who can be trusted And

44:13

who is taken in good faith

44:16

in a Why? Is it always

44:18

that. What?

44:20

Israel does is credible and in good

44:23

faith and yes there are. They make

44:25

mistakes of their a democracy and and

44:27

they're worth defending. And yet any accusation

44:30

against Palestinians as seen as well yes

44:32

that's that's what they do, that's how

44:34

they act. Of course that child that

44:36

was killed in the street had a

44:39

nice even of course this and prisoner

44:41

who was killed and his jail cell

44:43

with killed for purpose for reasons of

44:46

course this Palestinian American journalist who was

44:48

reporting from a refugee camp was killed.

44:50

In the crossfire. initially we remember by

44:53

Palestinian militants that was the story move

44:55

weeks later that story unraveled and of

44:57

then idea was like well actually if

45:00

it was awful we didn't mean. To.

45:02

You referring to sorry not block

45:04

Law who's a dual Palestinian and

45:06

Ah Us citizen Arm and the

45:08

Biden Administration has actively tried tried

45:10

to the word arm and and

45:12

F B I investigation to determine

45:14

who killed her and Aljazeera and

45:16

others have a document a quite

45:18

clearly that it was almost certainly

45:20

an Israeli sniper that killed her.

45:22

A. Threat? Yes. But the initial

45:24

story and let ran for a

45:26

long time was that she was

45:29

caught in the crossfire between Palestinian

45:31

militants, which from the get go

45:33

made no sense. I'm so every

45:35

time there is a situation where

45:37

Israel is accused of wrongdoing, they

45:39

are permitted to investigate themselves and

45:41

they are permitted to find themselves

45:43

not guilty of anything they have.

45:46

Consistently. For decades. This.

45:48

Allowed in international investigators Un

45:50

investigators from entering the Gaza

45:52

Strip from entering the West

45:55

Bank to conduct independent investigations

45:57

I sit sit here and

45:59

this list. Countless times when

46:01

there was an incident, Israel's initial

46:03

narrative was one way and then

46:05

a new. Even sometimes the New

46:07

York Times investigation or a Washington

46:10

Post investigation or to Cnn forensic

46:12

can own investigations have shown that

46:14

Israel's narrative was incorrect. but by

46:16

then the narrative is out there.

46:19

So even when the investigation some

46:21

later, it's never as loud, it's

46:23

never as as loudly received. This

46:25

was I think, just the most

46:27

kind of potent and largest example.

46:30

Of this and again with the

46:32

caviar, that full investigation on what

46:34

happened on October Seven need to

46:36

be made of all parties, but.

46:39

To. Use these accusations

46:41

to justify. What? Appears

46:44

to be the attempt of who

46:46

have of mass extermination of a

46:48

civilian population with no pushback, no

46:50

questioning even if you're If you

46:52

ask for evidence or ask questions

46:55

you are. Called

46:57

anti Semitic, you are called the Hamas

46:59

supporter. Are you know any of these

47:01

things? It's it's something we don't see

47:03

and any other context in the world.

47:05

You're just briefly two point about selective

47:08

attention Now reads on Sabrina Juvenile mean

47:10

you discuss the past with the On

47:12

Seven on T V when. Office.

47:14

Super High Commissioner for Human Rights

47:16

issued a press release which is

47:19

very very notable. Food served claims

47:21

that they been significant social thoughts

47:23

against Palestinian women in detention including

47:25

to reported rapes, espousing women, threats

47:28

of rapes other the humiliation from

47:30

degradation and are reported uploading of

47:32

photos of for passing women under

47:34

degrading soup senses are the Israeli

47:36

military online as seen very little

47:39

to no follow from powerful institutions

47:41

or with the ability to press

47:43

you enemies. Accusations, attention or interest

47:45

and so forth at the stark

47:47

contrast cannot be more glaring. Made.

47:50

Really highlights your point about this a

47:52

selective it even more with somebody who

47:55

treat the subject know I was as

47:57

you one last question just to conclude

47:59

of you right as a public health

48:02

expert an expert in the impact on

48:04

conflict on civilian populations regimented you also

48:06

passing Americans and the obviously you invest

48:08

in the subject you your tax dollars

48:11

of mine that in Germany's also contribute

48:13

to what's happening in Gaza today I

48:15

was curious your own view. Of.

48:18

The. Biden and Miss Ration specially heading

48:20

into election year as a passing

48:22

American and how you know it's

48:25

kind that his rhetoric and it's

48:27

policies the subject have impacted your

48:29

view of. You know this administration

48:31

and. You. Know the Democratic Party what stands

48:33

for in this context. Is

48:35

for someone who was elected

48:37

as this and the sizer

48:39

and she's. Quote Unquote

48:42

with a many ways. In.

48:44

Which this administration has demonstrated.

48:47

how cheap Palestinian life is

48:49

is really something I'm still

48:51

processing as a Palestinian going

48:53

up in the U S

48:56

Iraqi man very quickly that

48:58

the U S is. And

49:00

probably always will be on Israel's side,

49:03

right? We have never had this kind

49:05

of benefit of having. Western.

49:07

Power in our corner. We've always

49:09

had bastards. Power is always had

49:12

support of other liberation movements and

49:14

other oppressed people. They have always

49:16

got it. And that in terms

49:18

of the Us government which let's

49:21

remember Israel is the number one

49:23

recipient of Us foreign aid. I

49:25

far you kind of signed at

49:27

a I did kind of found

49:30

a way to make peace with

49:32

Sat in that you know yes

49:34

Ah Israel as of is a

49:37

bad. Actor in many ways and

49:39

the Us is supporting this and

49:41

I will use my perch here

49:43

to speak out against this and

49:45

I will you know, find ways

49:48

to push policy plus legislation, etc.

49:50

I think this past. Past

49:53

year has sickened many of

49:55

us. We

49:57

can literally post. Pictures. Our

50:01

starving babies. Are.

50:04

There. Decomposing bodies. I mean the

50:06

number of horrific stories that have come

50:08

out of this it individual stories. Set

50:10

aside those the aggregate numbers which are

50:12

terrible. I mean just just stare. Read

50:15

about this desk man in Gaza who

50:17

had been told by Israeli soldiers to

50:19

do something. His death. He didn't hear

50:21

them. He was besieged in his home.

50:23

They saw him and killed him. Always

50:26

just like what were his last moments.

50:28

Like in our fear, you know this

50:30

is an elderly man. He was light

50:32

and perhaps even displaced in. Forty Eight,

50:35

who knows, you know, has lived

50:37

of this lifetime of of dispossession

50:39

and trauma. And to. Have.

50:44

Nothing. Nothing for that. You know

50:46

nothing when blend Palestinian suffering as

50:48

discussed as you know the suffering

50:51

is unbearable. It's very abstract. It's

50:53

just suffering broadly speaking Me you

50:55

know. And then I remember when

50:58

the The Hundred A statement was

51:00

released by the White House and

51:02

it completely focus just on the

51:05

planet of the hostages. The Israeli

51:07

hostages did not mention how many

51:09

Palestinians had been killed, did not

51:12

mention the thousands of Palestinians. Illegally

51:14

detained by Israel. Did not mention the

51:16

settler pogroms that have occurred in the

51:19

West Bank. That the West Bank right

51:21

now is essentially close. You will really

51:23

don't. I can talk about the West

51:25

Bank because what's happening in Gaza is

51:27

so bad. And what does Biden do

51:29

about the West Bank? He put some

51:32

sanctions on a few individuals settlers, let

51:34

alone the fact that they. Are being

51:36

cheered. On very loudly by the

51:39

National Security Minister of the country

51:41

himself. You know in Twenty Twenty

51:43

one when Biden was President and

51:46

Israel Cern bomb in Gaza. Reporting

51:48

indicated that it ended because bite

51:50

and had kind of told. Netanyahu,

51:54

That were out of runway here. That

51:56

has to stop. And a thin. So

51:58

that leads me to say. If this

52:00

is still happening, This. Is

52:03

with. The. Implicit and

52:05

explicit approval and support of

52:07

the United States. And We

52:10

are bending over backwards. To.

52:12

Justify this when you see

52:15

the State Department's State Department

52:17

spokespeople. For. The White House Press Secretary,

52:20

Or John Kirby or any of these people.

52:22

Speaking. The.

52:24

Verbal gymnastics that they go

52:26

through to avoid. Overtly.

52:29

Emphasize emphasizing with Palestinians or

52:32

acknowledging their suffering or. Overtly.

52:35

Criticizing is real and saying yes this

52:37

was wrong. It's always we know we're

52:39

we're talking to our Israeli partners and

52:42

will get back to you on that

52:44

or were conducting investing. It is. It's

52:46

never just we saw this video. It

52:48

was wrong. You know we've seen videos

52:51

of Israeli soldiers looting Palestinian homes you

52:53

know, posing with children's toys and women's

52:55

lingerie. There was one of a man

52:57

of As and Israeli soldier and his

53:00

full bar in a pretending to take

53:02

a nap and a child's play pen.

53:04

Disgusting. Vile behavior you can even call

53:06

the were all saying this on social media

53:09

and if I'm saying it I'm pretty sure

53:11

the United States government as they able to

53:13

see it. I think that's how it works.

53:15

The fact that none of this is worthy

53:17

of comments. None of this is where the

53:20

of attention. None of this is worthy of

53:22

the saying. Drop. Everything This

53:24

Has To Stop. Even

53:27

if you support Israel, even if it,

53:29

as Biden himself has said, is a

53:31

Zionist. At what point

53:33

do you say? This.

53:35

Has this that? I think

53:37

many Palestinian Americans, Arab Americans, Muslim Americans,

53:40

and our allies because I think one

53:42

thing the by the administration has done

53:44

wrong as to pretend that this is

53:46

just an issue that matters to Palestinians

53:49

are Muslims, that they're doing just outreach

53:51

to Palestinian Americans, are Muslim groups or

53:53

whatever. and I have heard from many

53:55

non people who have no skin in

53:58

this game who are absolutely does. That's

54:00

dead and appalled that they live

54:02

in a country where there

54:04

is a famine happening imposed by

54:07

a Us ally that receives

54:09

billions of dollars in military aid,

54:11

unprecedented diplomatic cover at the Un

54:14

Security Council and any other

54:16

number of international bodies, and. The.

54:18

Best that we're told is we don't like

54:20

it, but there's nothing we can do to

54:22

stop it. I. Don't. Think that

54:24

people are accepting this narrative anymore

54:27

and I think it's causing many

54:29

people to question not Joe Biden

54:31

and his administration because you know

54:33

you can go back into his

54:35

history. He has been a long

54:37

term supporter of Israel and has

54:39

seem to demonstrate some pretty apparent

54:41

anti Arab racism, but. If.

54:44

Is this country cannot intervene and

54:46

the Democratic Party is still? It's

54:48

just a smattering of voices just

54:51

calling for a ceasefire. We're not

54:53

having serious conversations about stopping military

54:55

aid. I'm feeling very disillusioned In

54:58

general. I'm very disappointed with even

55:00

the so called progressive than this

55:02

country. Very few of whom I

55:05

think have spoken very loudly about

55:07

this. I think these are positions

55:09

that will age very, very poorly

55:12

and I. Think. That

55:14

the Biden administration ignores.

55:16

These. Please for.

55:19

Intervention. As. Their own

55:22

peril. And we saw the Sienna

55:24

with the huge, uncommitted vote. And

55:26

I'm. Many. States over the past

55:28

couple of weeks. Ah, we've heard indications

55:30

that they're assuming the by election time,

55:32

especially if Trump is on the ballot.

55:35

People will forget I have seen and

55:37

heard things I will never forget, can

55:39

never forget and it will it. It

55:41

has really. I will never see. The.

55:44

United States and this is the West. Any of

55:46

it in the same way again and I know

55:48

I'm not the only one. Who. Yara

55:50

we're gonna be with their thank you so

55:52

much for all of your work or we

55:54

encourage people also to have to pick up

55:56

your book him and read it couldn't be

55:58

unfortunately more relevant com than this. And thank

56:00

you very much for being with us here on intercepted.

56:02

Thank you so much for having me. That's.

56:04

Doctor Yar Aussie author of How

56:06

War Tells the overlooked threats to

56:09

our health. And

56:14

that does it for this episode

56:16

of Intercepted Intercept that is a

56:18

production of The Intercept Lara Flynn

56:21

produce This episode require mixed are

56:23

soaked Legal Review by Sean Musgrave

56:25

and Elizabeth Sanchez This episode was

56:27

transcribed by Leonardo Fireman's A Theme

56:29

Music as always was composed by

56:31

the Taste. If you want to

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support work you can go to

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56:57

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