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A. a A listener note this episode

0:12

contains adult content and is

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not suitable for every Please.

0:16

Be advised. In.

0:25

Greek Mythology It was believed

0:28

that a person's life was

0:30

pre determined. There. Were

0:33

three divinities who control the

0:35

humans life. They

0:37

were known in the

0:39

Ancient Greek language as

0:41

the More Right which

0:43

translates to allotted portion

0:45

or share. You might

0:47

know them as the

0:49

Fates. The

0:52

fates would we web and

0:55

each read would represent a

0:57

human's life. But this did

0:59

not mean there was not

1:02

free will. Their actions and

1:04

choices were predestine, but how

1:06

they chose to react to

1:09

them were not. The

1:12

fates. Would watch each person

1:14

and would take their response

1:17

to any situation into consideration

1:19

as they continued to. We.

1:22

The three sisters each had their

1:25

own role in deciding that course

1:27

of a person's life. The

1:30

first was close though. Known

1:33

as the spinner. She.

1:35

Would begin each person thread when

1:37

they were still in their mother's

1:39

womb. After cloth those

1:42

started the thread she were handed

1:44

off to her sister. Lack assess

1:46

the a lotta she determined the

1:49

obstacles a person faced in their

1:51

life and how long a human

1:53

would live. And.

1:56

Last. But not least was at

1:59

your post. The inflexible.

2:02

I proposed held the sheer

2:04

is that cut each person's

2:06

thread seat shows how each.

2:08

Person would die if they

2:10

would have an easy death

2:12

for a violent one. So

2:16

it is fitting that one

2:18

of the most dangerous poisons

2:21

in the world is named

2:23

for her. A Troll photo

2:25

Donna also known as Deadly

2:27

Night Shade More Deaths Cherries.

2:30

Is. Extremely toxic.

2:33

All parts of the plan

2:35

from it's roots to it's

2:37

flowers and berries can lead

2:39

to extreme illness and dust.

2:43

Atrophied is derived from the

2:45

night shade family. It

2:47

is used for some medications

2:49

five drops for example, and

2:52

some people use it recreationally

2:54

because it can have hallucinogenic

2:56

side effects, but after thing

2:58

can be fatal when one

3:01

takes it in. Large quantities.

3:04

This is a fact that

3:06

gloom Young only fourteen years

3:09

old, new, well from his

3:11

extensive. Research and to poison

3:13

and he put that knowledge

3:15

to use when he decided

3:17

to poison. His. Entire

3:20

thing. Mind

3:25

of a Monster. The podcast

3:28

from Id is back and

3:30

this season they're covering The

3:32

Butcher Baker. In the eighties

3:34

over twenty women go missing

3:36

in Anchorage, Alaska women turning

3:38

up dead in the woods

3:41

and others are kidnapped, but

3:43

their stories are not taken

3:45

seriously by the police. Even

3:47

though these crimes all point

3:49

to one man on this

3:51

podcast uncover house serial killer

3:54

Richard Hanson he arrest. for

3:56

over a decade and here from

3:58

the victims along with the. Leaf

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and Alaska State Troopers who were

4:02

there on the ground investigating this

4:05

case. Listen to Mind of a

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4:45

From wondering and tree fort media

4:47

I'm Candace a long and this

4:49

is the third. Season. I

5:13

was a psychiatric nurse. And.

5:15

Then an F B I criminal

5:17

profiler. In. The. Five

5:20

decades I've spent studying

5:22

people's minds either interview

5:24

countless murderers, including many

5:26

serial killers. Why did

5:28

they do it? Together

5:31

satisfying answer. We have to

5:33

dive deep into their focus

5:35

to figure out what made

5:37

them do what they did.

5:41

This episode is Graham

5:43

Young, the teacup poisoner.

5:48

In. Nineteen Sixty One thirteen

5:50

year old Graham Young was

5:53

an avid reader and the

5:55

fan of books about poisoners.

5:58

He was also very. knowledgeable

6:00

about chemistry and he

6:02

would often experiment in his home. But

6:06

it was not enough. He

6:08

wanted to experiment with human

6:11

subjects. The

6:14

first person to start feeling

6:16

the symptoms of his poisoning

6:18

was Christopher Williams. Williams

6:21

was a classmate of Graham who

6:23

was also only 13 years

6:25

old at the time. Graham

6:28

added small amounts of toxins to

6:30

his food until he

6:32

got so sick that he could

6:35

not attend school anymore. But

6:38

once he left school, Graham

6:41

could not observe how his

6:43

experiments were affecting his subjects.

6:46

So he switched his sights to

6:48

those who he would always have

6:50

access to. His

6:52

family. By

6:55

the summer of that year, members

6:57

of the Young household

6:59

began experiencing waves of

7:02

nausea and stomach cramps.

7:05

His father Fred Young suspected

7:08

his son's chemical experiments

7:11

immediately. But it never

7:13

occurred to him that his son

7:16

might be poisoning them intentionally.

7:20

Graham Young himself was also experiencing

7:22

the same symptoms as the rest

7:25

of the family. Fred

7:27

thought he was just being careless

7:30

with his hobby. One

7:35

morning in November of 1961, Graham

7:38

served his older sister her

7:40

usual cup of tea. She

7:43

took a sip, but it tasted very

7:47

sour. So she put it

7:49

down and did not finish it. On

7:53

her way to work, she felt ill and

7:56

I mean very ill. So

7:58

she went to the hospital and was there,

8:01

the doctors found she had

8:03

been poisoned by Belladonna, also

8:06

known, as I mentioned, as

8:09

Deadly Nightshade, and just

8:11

a little too much of it can

8:13

kill you. After

8:16

his sister's brush with death, Graham

8:19

turned his attention to his stepmother

8:22

Molly. For

8:24

months, he slowly poisoned

8:27

her tea with

8:29

increasing amounts of antimony.

8:32

But despite multiple dosings, by

8:35

the spring of 1962, Molly had not died. So

8:41

Graham switched poisons and

8:43

put phallium, another

8:45

highly toxic heavy metal, in

8:47

her tea. Well,

8:50

it must have been a whopping

8:53

dose, because that afternoon, Fred

8:55

Young stepped out to the family's

8:57

back garden to find his wife

9:00

on the ground, rising in pain,

9:03

as his son sat in a chair and

9:05

watched. He

9:09

rushed Molly to the hospital,

9:11

where after hours of agony,

9:13

she mercifully died.

9:16

The doctors ruled her cause of

9:19

death to be the prolapse of

9:21

a spinal disc. Why

9:24

in the world they

9:26

thought a slipped disc, which

9:28

is never fatal, by the

9:30

way, would be the cause

9:33

of death of an otherwise healthy woman,

9:36

is beyond me. Nevertheless,

9:38

that is what happened. His

9:44

stepmother's death did not slow

9:46

down Graham's rapidly growing compulsion

9:48

to poison people. In

9:51

fact, at Molly's wake,

9:54

believe it or not, he poisoned

9:56

a male relative by lacing a

9:58

jar of mustard. with

10:00

antimony. Shortly

10:03

afterwards his father became

10:05

seriously ill again and

10:07

was hospitalized but this

10:10

time he was correctly told

10:12

that he was suffering from

10:14

antimony poisoning and was

10:16

only quote one

10:19

dose away from death. Around

10:23

the same time a couple

10:25

of Graham's classmates also became

10:28

ill with the same symptoms.

10:31

His science teacher Spidey Stamps went

10:33

on full alert and so she

10:36

decided to go snooping in his

10:38

desk and what did

10:40

she find? She discovered

10:43

several bottles of the

10:45

poison as well as

10:47

books on infamous murderers.

10:52

Both she and the headmaster

10:54

devised a very clever trap.

10:57

They arranged for Graham to be interviewed

10:59

by a psychiatrist who would

11:02

be posing as a

11:04

career advisor and

11:06

he asked Graham about his

11:08

interests. Not

11:11

surprisingly Graham revealed

11:13

his extensive knowledge of

11:15

poisons. In fact

11:17

he couldn't talk about it fast

11:19

enough and why not? He

11:22

was very proud of his knowledge.

11:25

Needless to say the

11:28

police were notified. In

11:31

May of 1962 Graham

11:35

Young was arrested. He

11:38

confessed to poisoning his sister,

11:40

father, a classmate

11:43

and fatally killing his

11:45

stepmother. Something he

11:48

had not been suspected of. Unfortunately

11:51

they were never able to

11:53

forensically tie him to his

11:56

stepmother's death since she'd

11:58

been cremated and and therefore

12:00

he was not charged with her

12:02

murder. A

12:06

very learned psychiatrist diagnosed Graham

12:08

when he was only 14 as

12:11

having, and I quote, a

12:14

psychopathic disorder rather

12:16

than a mental illness and

12:18

had failed to develop a normal

12:21

moral sense. That's

12:24

a very kind and clinical way of

12:26

saying he's a heartless killer who

12:29

hasn't yet and never

12:31

will adhere to societal

12:33

norms. He

12:35

also stated it was extremely

12:38

likely that Graham would

12:40

re-offend. Graham

12:43

was sentenced to 15

12:45

years at a maximum-security

12:48

psychiatric hospital, and

12:50

at only 14 years old he

12:53

was among the youngest inmates.

12:58

But did being incarcerated

13:01

stop his criminal compulsions?

13:04

No, it didn't even slow them down. Not

13:07

one bit. Shortly

13:09

after arriving, one of

13:11

Graham's fellow inmates died

13:14

of cyanide

13:16

poisoning. It

13:18

turns out that a particular shrubbery

13:20

that grew around the hospital, if

13:23

treated properly, could

13:26

be extracted from it. On

13:29

another occasion, a nurse found

13:31

a toilet cleaning substance in

13:33

her coffee cup, and

13:36

another nurse found a missing

13:38

packet of toxic soap in

13:40

the tea urn. I

13:43

could go on and on, but

13:45

it's important that you see how

13:47

overwhelming his compulsion to poison people

13:50

was. He

13:52

was not insane, not at all.

13:54

He knew exactly what he was

13:57

doing, but even being found guilty of it

13:59

was a good thing. poisoning people and

14:01

locked away from society as

14:03

punishment, he would not

14:06

or possibly could not stop.

14:12

It is true serial killers and

14:14

other types of psychopaths do not,

14:17

well, what we would call learn, they

14:19

don't learn from their mistakes by going

14:21

to prison, meaning they don't say, Hey,

14:23

you know what? I shouldn't have done

14:25

that. I'm never going to do it again. No,

14:27

that doesn't happen. If

14:30

they're released, if they are, they're likely

14:32

to go back to their old ways,

14:34

but they'll just be careful not to

14:36

get caught. But

14:38

the garden variety serial killer once

14:41

incarcerated does not kill

14:44

others around him. They

14:46

play nice in the prison sandbox. They

14:50

are ideal inmates and it's

14:52

all a part of their

14:54

plan to trick the guards

14:56

and parole board into thinking,

14:58

Oh, they've been rehabilitated and

15:00

are therefore now a safe

15:03

person to live among us. But

15:07

Graham, despite his high

15:09

intellect, could not even

15:12

control himself while incarcerated.

15:15

And what does that tell me? His

15:17

compulsion to kill by poisoning was

15:20

uncontrollable, at least by

15:22

any internal control,

15:25

meaning he could not put the

15:27

brakes on poisoning. Now

15:32

here's something. After only three

15:34

years of a 15 year sentence,

15:37

he applied for early release

15:40

at his parole hearing. His

15:43

own father and sister advised

15:45

the board that none of

15:47

his relatives would house him.

15:50

And Graham's own father told them,

15:53

quote, he should

15:55

never be released. Graham's

15:58

application was. denied

16:00

this time. Five

16:03

years later, a different

16:05

psychiatrist actually believed that

16:08

he had cured Graham

16:11

Young. This is what he

16:13

actually said to the parole board. Graham

16:17

was no longer obsessed with

16:19

poisons, violence, and

16:22

mischief. And he

16:24

is no longer a danger to

16:26

others. I'm not

16:28

kidding. This psychiatrist referred

16:31

to poisoning people to

16:33

death as mischievous.

16:37

What? You're kidding me, right?

16:40

You cured a psychopathic killer?

16:42

How did you do that?

16:45

Obviously, this shrink doesn't know

16:48

when he's being lied to. In

16:53

the 10 years I was in

16:55

clinical psychiatry, I worked with a

16:57

lot of truly great psychiatrists and

17:00

a few crackpots who, in my opinion, were

17:02

in the wrong line of work. But

17:06

among the great ones, we

17:08

always had one psychiatrist who,

17:10

no matter what the pre-admission

17:12

behavior of their patient was

17:14

accused of, even murder,

17:17

they truly believed that they

17:19

and they alone could

17:21

cure their patient of whatever

17:23

ailed them. I called

17:26

it the these-hand

17:28

syndrome, meaning if

17:30

I lay these hands upon

17:33

you, you will be cured.

17:36

Oh, if it were only

17:38

that simple. Now,

17:42

after being told he was being

17:45

discharged after serving only half of

17:47

his original sentence of 15 years,

17:51

Graham said the following to a

17:53

nurse, and I quote, when

17:56

I get out, I'm going to kill

17:58

one person for all. Every

18:00

year I've spent in

18:02

this place. Hard

18:05

to believe he was still released and

18:07

yet he was. I'm

18:09

gonna go out on a limb here and say

18:11

that the nurse. Didn't report it but

18:13

that she was ignored. Graham.

18:18

Left the psychiatric hospital in nineteen

18:20

seventy one when he was twenty

18:22

four years old. She.

18:24

Did not return home? no

18:27

surprise there. He ended

18:29

up staying in a hostile looking

18:31

for work and making occasional trip

18:33

to London. To. A

18:36

stop on chemicals. Was.

18:39

I said that. Within.

18:42

Only a few weeks of being discharged

18:45

from eight years of confinement. He

18:47

tried to buy send exotic

18:49

poisons but he was denied.

18:51

So what does he do?

18:54

He. Went back to his old standbys.

18:57

And. To moaning. Know

18:59

there were so that the

19:02

hostel who suffered signs of

19:04

poisoning consistent with Graham's other

19:06

victims stomach cramps and vomiting.

19:08

No. One died. And. Poisoning

19:11

was not suspected. He

19:16

was soon hired as an assistant

19:18

storekeeper at a photograph of supply

19:20

company. Soon.

19:22

After he started working there,

19:24

Grams Boss an older man

19:26

about fifty nine years old.

19:29

Named Bob. Started having

19:31

valves of stomach cramps

19:33

and dizziness. Four

19:36

months his illness would fade when

19:38

he took time away from work,

19:41

but then they'd worse than again

19:43

when he returned. Them

19:46

in July of Nineteen

19:48

Seventy One, Bob became

19:50

desperately ill and died.

19:53

The official cause of death

19:55

was listed as pneumonia. After

19:58

plots guess. Other employees

20:00

at the lab started having. Stream

20:03

symptoms such as stomach.

20:05

Pains hero loss and

20:08

for some of the

20:10

man impotence. In

20:14

November, about four months after, Bob

20:16

died. Another worker

20:18

died. By. That

20:21

point, over seventy employees

20:23

had reported unexplained illnesses,

20:26

and so the company

20:28

began investigating possible leaks

20:31

of chemicals or even

20:34

radiation from their equipment.

20:37

To reassure the staff

20:40

the labs on site

20:42

doctor held an informational

20:44

meeting. During

20:46

the meeting. Graham publicly

20:48

challenge the doctor asking

20:50

why is a company

20:53

was in not investigating

20:55

for sally and poisoning

20:57

since the chemical was

20:59

commonly used in the

21:01

photographic process. Now,

21:04

why in the world would he do

21:06

that? Challenge the doctor

21:08

and bring attention to himself.

21:11

Good. Question. And here's the

21:14

answer. He did it

21:16

quite simply because Graham

21:18

saw himself as the

21:20

supreme arbiter of, well,

21:22

Everything. That could make

21:25

someone sit. In

21:27

challenging the learned doctor remarks

21:30

Graham was playing with him

21:32

a kind of catch me

21:34

if you can use stupid

21:37

stupid man. And. I'm

21:39

sure it made. Glam. He'll.

21:42

Kuwait. However,

21:45

it would turn out to

21:47

be not only. His greatest

21:49

in the States for

21:51

also his undoing. Graham's

21:56

in depth knowledge of thought

21:59

the college she made doctor

22:01

suspicious and he reported Graham's

22:03

remarks about the sally him

22:06

to the police. They

22:09

executed a search and sure

22:11

enough found evidence of foul

22:14

liam poisoning of many employees.

22:17

And it wouldn't be long

22:19

before they found out about

22:21

Graham's previous conviction for multiple

22:24

poisoning at the age of

22:26

fourteen. Graham

22:30

was arrested three days

22:32

later and officers actually

22:34

sounds samples of sally

22:36

I'm in his pockets.

22:39

Yes, he actually had is a

22:41

weapon of choice on him. Makes.

22:44

Sense though. To me

22:46

anyway. Valley him was

22:48

his one true lox and

22:50

he kept it near. And

22:53

dear to his heart's. They.

22:56

Also searched his home

22:58

where they found a

23:00

journal documenting the poisonings

23:02

in detail. Now

23:04

you might say, why in the

23:07

world would he keep a journal

23:09

of his crimes? How stupid is

23:12

box. You're right, of

23:14

course, But it's also

23:16

very common among compulsive offenders

23:18

of any kind. Poisoners.

23:21

Arsonists and especially child molesters

23:24

say write things down and

23:26

keep the notes or. Diaries

23:29

the because it helps them

23:31

and he lived the experience.

23:34

And in grams case the

23:36

it helped him keep track

23:38

of how much of this

23:40

or that he days and

23:42

to whom. see David. Of

23:46

course for the police and prosecutors.

23:49

It. Was a gift. Graham

23:51

Young was charged with two

23:53

counts of murder, two counts

23:56

of attempted murder. And

23:58

two pounds of administering. He

24:01

was convicted. And sentenced to

24:03

life in prison. He was

24:06

twenty four years old, We

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I O S an Android. Okay,

26:09

so that's what we know about Graham from

26:12

the time he was 13 up

26:14

to finally being in prison for good when he

26:17

was 24. But

26:19

what happened before that? Graham

26:23

Frederick Young was born in Madsen,

26:25

North London on September 7, 1947.

26:31

When he was just three months

26:33

old, his mother died of

26:35

tuberculosis. When

26:38

she passed, Graham's father was

26:40

overcome by grief, leaving

26:42

his infant son to be raised

26:44

by his aunt Winnie and

26:47

his older sister to be raised by

26:49

their grandparents. When

26:52

he was two years old, the

26:54

Graham family was reunited after Fred

26:56

married a new woman named Molly.

27:00

But all was not well, and

27:02

being separated from his aunt, who

27:04

he had bonded to as a

27:06

primary mother figure as soon as he

27:09

was born, had a

27:11

very detrimental effect on

27:13

Graham's development, as well

27:15

as his social skills and

27:18

relationship with his new stepmother.

27:21

It is entirely possible the

27:24

sudden separation from his aunt

27:26

Mummy caused lasting

27:28

damage to his personality.

27:31

We know now that sudden

27:34

maternal deprivation and at such

27:36

a tender age, two years

27:38

old, can cause

27:40

irreparable damage to a child's

27:42

psyche and the development

27:45

of normal attachments to other

27:47

people. Graham

27:51

was not a sociable child.

27:54

He would rather read than make friends. Why

27:57

is that? Well, children.

28:00

Supper maternal deprivation such as

28:02

Graham did may never learned

28:04

to trust people. While.

28:08

Because of the intense pain and

28:10

subsequent. Damage from losing their

28:12

original loving parent. Damage

28:15

to their psyche. As

28:17

a result, They fail to

28:20

attach and bond with any

28:22

other would be loving caring,

28:25

nurturing feel. It. And

28:27

that means grams stepmother, Molly, never

28:29

had a chance with him. Children.

28:34

That fail to attach to apparent.

28:36

well there's a name for it.

28:38

It's called. Detachment Disorder. And

28:41

it's a mental disorder that

28:43

limits the child's ability to

28:45

both seal and express feelings

28:48

and sentiments. It also in

28:50

peace their ability to connect

28:53

with the outside world. Hence,

28:55

the excessive love of reading

28:58

and avoiding playmates. Books

29:00

The receipt. The child does

29:02

not have to interact or

29:04

respond to a book right.

29:06

They can get lost in

29:09

the stories. Fantasize Daydream These

29:11

days you could switch out

29:13

the word book for video

29:15

games. Any. Solitary

29:17

activity that is engaging

29:19

will do. But

29:22

to relate to other kids?

29:24

well, that's a whole different

29:26

challenge and nowhere near as

29:28

satisfying. The

29:31

detached child social skills

29:33

suffer or they may

29:35

not develop out all

29:37

the child pines. Little

29:39

or no. Satisfaction being

29:41

with other kids so they

29:44

become their own. thus. From

29:46

an engram case that

29:48

was a very dangerous

29:50

situation. During

29:55

his childhood, Graham develop

29:57

a fascination with both.

30:00

Non fiction accounts

30:02

of murderers especially

30:04

poisonings, And Adolf

30:07

Hitler phone he later claimed

30:09

was. Misunderstood.

30:12

This. Is probably not the first time you've heard

30:15

about a serial killer being a fan of

30:17

killer. A man generally

30:19

regarded as one of the

30:21

world's great villains. So

30:23

what's up with. Well,

30:26

in broad strokes, both Hitler

30:29

and the Nazi regime symbolize.

30:32

Domination. Control.

30:34

But most of all, power.

30:37

Power over the masses.

30:40

Power. On people they looked

30:42

down on. Hitler

30:45

wanted to rule the world. And.

30:47

Was pretty successful for a time

30:50

and I think serial killers are

30:52

drawn to that because a big

30:54

part of their killing fantasy is

30:57

to have ultimate power over their

30:59

but some the god like power

31:02

to either let them live. Or.

31:04

Take their lives. The

31:08

very idea of one person taking

31:10

the life of another took on

31:12

a very powerful meaning for the

31:15

young and impressionable. graham. Noon

31:17

and it became an

31:19

obsession. See.

31:23

Began to fantasize about what it

31:25

would be like to have power

31:27

over some and kill them. Soon.

31:30

Enough, the way he wanted to

31:32

kill them did as well. And

31:35

poison became his weapon

31:38

of. Choice. Why

31:41

poison? Know

31:43

there are several reasons why

31:45

many killers cereal and otherwise

31:48

use poison, and most of

31:50

them are practical reasons. First.

31:54

Of all there was no

31:56

face to face confrontation such

31:58

as their been eating. or

32:00

choking. It's not

32:02

hands-on. It's not messy

32:04

and there is no blood involved as

32:07

there would be, like say,

32:09

in a shooting. The

32:11

only thing necessary is that the

32:14

killer have two things, access

32:17

and proximity to

32:19

the victim. And best

32:21

of all, if done

32:23

properly, the victim will

32:26

never know what's happening to them

32:29

until it is too late. Graham's

32:35

obsession about poisons would

32:38

become a hobby of sorts. By

32:40

13 years old, he

32:42

had developed an encyclopedic

32:45

knowledge of chemistry and

32:47

toxicology. He

32:49

used this knowledge to

32:51

convince a local chemist

32:53

that he was a

32:55

17-year-old university student purchasing

32:58

chemicals for research. Yeah,

33:01

he fooled a professional

33:03

chemist. That is how

33:05

knowledgeable he was. He

33:08

got his hands on substances

33:10

like antimony and

33:12

arsenic, both of which

33:15

are very toxic poisons.

33:17

And that is when he

33:20

began his experiments on

33:22

humans. We've

33:26

talked about Graham's early poisonings,

33:28

including his stepmother, followed

33:31

by his eight years in a

33:33

psychiatric hospital. But is there

33:35

anything else we can learn about him? Oh,

33:38

yes, there is much, much

33:41

more to learn about his murderous

33:43

psyche after he was

33:46

discharged. He

33:48

definitely was not

33:50

cured. A

33:53

deeper dive into his second round of

33:55

killings at his job at the photo

33:57

processing lab offers fascinating

34:00

and revealing insight into

34:02

just what made Graham

34:05

Young sick. His

34:09

victim list started out with his

34:12

supervisor, Bob, a 59 year

34:14

old man, a nice guy,

34:17

and he treated Graham well.

34:20

Nevertheless, Bob

34:22

was marked for extinction.

34:25

But why? Was there a

34:27

reason Graham chose him or was

34:30

it random? I

34:32

think Bob represented someone else to

34:34

Graham, someone he liked to

34:36

kill, but could not

34:39

his father. Why

34:42

do I think that? Remember his

34:44

father recommended to the psychiatric

34:47

parole board that his son,

34:49

and I quote, never be

34:52

released. Now think about

34:54

that for just a minute. Can

34:57

you imagine recommending to

34:59

a governing body about your

35:01

17 year old son,

35:04

who once was a cute little boy

35:06

who sat on your lap, poddled around

35:08

your house, sat at your dinner table,

35:11

played on the floor with his toys,

35:14

came to you for guidance, showed

35:16

off his report card to you, that

35:18

you would recommend that about

35:20

him. But before

35:22

your son is even out of puberty, he

35:25

poisons your wife to death

35:28

and watches her die in

35:30

agony. And then

35:32

goes on to poison several

35:35

others, including relatives and classmates.

35:38

And all that time, you thought

35:41

he was a budding scientist who

35:43

one day would use his advanced

35:45

knowledge of chemistry to

35:47

help all mankind. And

35:50

now you are saying

35:52

essentially, my son, this

35:55

young man before you is

35:57

a menace to society and did

36:00

not live among us. His

36:03

father's words probably

36:06

caused an indelible

36:08

wound that would

36:10

never heal. And

36:12

what emotion frequently follows being

36:15

hurt by someone? Anger.

36:20

It's quite possible, even

36:23

likely, I'd say, that Graham

36:25

saw Bob as a father

36:27

figure. He

36:29

was an older man, as I

36:31

mentioned, fifty-nine. He was

36:34

in a position of power and

36:36

authority over Graham, like his father

36:38

had been. In

36:40

Graham's twisted psyche, that

36:43

meant Bob had to

36:45

go. And let's not

36:47

forget, Graham was

36:49

already a serial killer and really

36:51

didn't need an excuse to kill

36:53

anyone, even Bob, no matter how

36:56

benevolent he had been to

36:58

his young protege. And,

37:00

by the way, it certainly would

37:02

not be the first time a

37:04

serial killer targeted someone they knew

37:07

because they

37:09

symbolized someone else they

37:11

hated or nearly

37:13

annoyed them. And therefore,

37:16

that person deserved to

37:18

die. For

37:22

the next few months, his poisonings

37:24

were limited to small doses of

37:27

antimony in his coworker Diana's tea,

37:30

usually, according to Graham, quote,

37:32

when she annoyed me. Found

37:36

in his diary was the following,

37:39

quote, Die irritated

37:41

me yesterday, so I

37:43

packed her off home with an attack

37:45

of sickness. I only

37:48

gave her something to shake her up. Now

37:50

I regret that I did not give

37:52

her a larger dose, capable

37:55

of laying her up for a few

37:57

days. Oh,

37:59

how I did. do love a

38:01

good confession. And

38:03

that's the kind that can and will

38:06

put you on death row. But

38:09

are there clues to his psyche found

38:11

there? I think so.

38:15

That statement tells me that whoever

38:17

wrote it is very sadistic,

38:20

a sadistic killer.

38:23

He enjoyed his victims

38:25

suffering. So a quick and

38:28

painless kill was not what he wanted.

38:31

He knew down to the last

38:33

milligram how much poison it would

38:35

take to make his victim mildly

38:37

ill or kill them. For

38:41

the poisoner, everything short

38:44

of a lethal dose is

38:46

a little murder.

38:51

Poisoning is what we call a

38:54

passive aggressive type murder. Unlike

38:56

other killers who may get the ultimate

38:58

thrill by killing with their own hands,

39:01

poisoners are content to just

39:04

set the scene and walk

39:06

away knowing the murder

39:08

will eventually travel in their

39:10

wake, kind of like

39:12

disabling someone's car brakes, then

39:14

just walking away. No

39:18

doubt in my mind, the

39:20

very thought of the victim's

39:23

agony pleased Graham immensely. Just

39:26

thinking about what they were going through

39:28

was enough to put a smile on

39:30

his face. Here's

39:34

another example of his emotional sadism.

39:38

A 56 year old man was

39:42

so disabled from a salient

39:45

poisoning that his central nervous

39:47

system deteriorated to the point

39:49

that he could not speak,

39:52

had trouble breathing, and

39:54

his skin began to peel

39:56

off. To

39:59

check on Graham's him, Graham frequently called

40:02

his wife right at

40:04

his bedside, but not

40:06

out of concern for his colleague. Oh

40:08

no, he did

40:10

it because just hearing about

40:13

it would have pleased and

40:15

excited him. And

40:17

the power, just hearing

40:19

the details, underscored the power

40:21

he had. And that

40:24

feeling, the power is

40:27

his reward. And the

40:29

reward for his success reinforces

40:32

the behavior, all of it.

40:36

Preparing the deadly concoction, putting

40:38

it in someone's tea, even

40:41

watching them drink it. That

40:44

all reinforces the criminal

40:46

behavior of the poisoning.

40:50

As a result, that behavior

40:52

becomes compulsive. And here's

40:54

the thing about poisoners, they do

40:57

not stop until they

40:59

either get caught or die

41:01

themselves. An

41:05

earlier victim, a young man

41:07

named Bette, was

41:09

severely poisoned, but

41:11

he survived. However,

41:15

his hair fell out and the

41:17

poisoning made him suicidal. Only

41:20

he recovered, but he was left

41:23

impotent. In

41:25

his diary, Graham wrote that he

41:27

felt some remorse for poisoning him.

41:30

Quote, I feel rather

41:32

ashamed of my action in harming

41:35

Bette. That's interesting,

41:38

but I don't believe it

41:40

for a minute. Why? Because

41:43

it didn't bother him enough to

41:45

stop, did it? Perhaps

41:48

he identified more to that

41:50

young man than other older

41:52

victims because they were age

41:54

mates. And of course,

41:57

there's always the chance that he

41:59

was lying. when he

42:01

said that. And I'm just going

42:03

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rocketmoney.com/Wondery. rocketmoney.com

43:01

slash Wondery. Graham

43:16

was smart and

43:18

good-looking, so the world

43:21

was his oyster. Or

43:23

perhaps I should say it could

43:25

have been. Clearly,

43:27

had he been more careful,

43:30

more circumspect about killing people

43:32

so close to him, he might

43:34

have gotten away with his murders. But

43:36

that would not have turned him on, would

43:39

not have satisfied his sadistic need

43:42

to see and hear

43:44

about his victims' suffering.

43:48

In contrast is the Tylenol

43:50

murderer of 1982. That killer

43:54

created the poison capsules, put

43:56

them in Tylenol bottles and boxes,

43:58

then distributed them. treated them

44:00

at various stores in suburban

44:02

Chicago. Then he left.

44:06

He could not possibly have known who

44:08

would buy the tainted pills or who

44:11

would consume them once they left the

44:13

store. Unlike Graham, he

44:15

was not a witness to his

44:17

victims death. He did

44:19

not need to see them suffer. Why?

44:23

Because his motivation to poison

44:25

strangers was very complex

44:28

and vastly different from

44:30

Graham's. By

44:32

the way, we covered the Tylenol murders

44:34

in season one of Killer Psyche. Graham

44:40

pled not guilty to each crime

44:42

he was charged with. He

44:45

was confident that because his previous conviction

44:47

could not be used against him in

44:49

court, he would be acquitted. He

44:53

was wrong. After

44:55

reviewing his crimes in light of

44:57

his previous conviction at the age

44:59

of 14, the British

45:02

Home Secretary launched an

45:04

inquiry into the rehabilitation

45:06

process and monitoring of

45:08

released dangerous individuals.

45:13

The inquiry led to the

45:15

formation of the British Advisory

45:17

Board on Restricted Patients, which

45:20

monitors the release process. I

45:24

truly hope for the safety of

45:26

the 67 million plus people living

45:28

in Great Britain today that

45:30

the advisory board's policies work

45:34

and that they now prevent

45:36

future Graham Youngs. On

45:39

June 29, 1972,

45:43

Graham Young was convicted on

45:45

all counts and received

45:47

four life sentences for his

45:50

crimes. On

45:52

August 1, 1990, at 42 years old, he died

45:54

of a heart attack. Well,

46:01

that's what's on the record anyway. Rumor

46:04

has it that it was not

46:06

a heart attack at all, but

46:09

rather a lethal dose of

46:11

poison concocted by a group

46:13

of inmates and guards who

46:15

were afraid he might poison

46:18

them. If true,

46:21

this rumor might actually

46:23

make me believe that karma

46:26

is a real thing. For

46:43

Wondering Entry for Media, this is

46:45

Killer Psyche. I'm your host,

46:48

Candice DeLong. This episode

46:50

was written and produced by Lisa

46:52

Ammerman and Julie Burke. Additional

46:55

writing and director of research is

46:57

Anne Liu, mixed and

46:59

sound design by Joshua Morales, head

47:02

of audio, Tom Monaghan, with

47:05

audio assistants from Katie Corpe and

47:07

Matt Dyson. Jada

47:09

Williams is our production coordinator.

47:12

The executive in charge of production

47:14

for Treeport is Oscar Guido. From

47:17

Amazon Music and Wondering, the

47:19

producer is Stephanie Wachneid, and

47:22

the co-executive producer is Julie

47:24

Burke. Lastly, our

47:27

executive producers are myself,

47:29

Candice DeLong, Kelly

47:31

Garner, and Lisa Ammerman for

47:33

Treeport, and Marshall Louie

47:35

and Erin O'Flaherty for Wondering.

47:38

Series is produced by Wondering and

47:40

Treeport Media. Hi

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listeners, I'm Donnie Dust, and I'm here to

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