0:01

Jimmy, you have two heads and one of

0:03

them is Italian. Yes. That's a good

0:05

title. Jaco's here. They're both

0:07

kind of Italian, aren't they? No, that's

0:09

true. Good point. Welcome,

0:12

Jaco. Italian and Irish. So,

0:15

I have. Welcome. Hello.

0:19

Hi, everybody. This is Jaco's here, by the way.

0:22

I guess it's possible. It

0:25

seems weird to me, but I guess it's possible

0:27

that there are people that could be listening or

0:29

watching who don't know who you are. Oh

0:32

yeah, that's very possible. You kind of checked out

0:34

for a little bit. Yeah. But

0:37

you want to tell us who you are? Tell them I

0:39

know who you are. You want to tell them who you are? I'm

0:44

Jimmy's daughter. I'm

0:51

Jaco. I'm Italian. And a

0:53

few years ago, like, I don't know how many years ago,

0:56

I went to Jimmy and I asked his permission

0:58

to make videos. He

1:01

didn't need it, but he has. So,

1:03

I started making videos because

1:05

my previous company was like an internet

1:07

thing, I was doing virtual stuff. And

1:11

then at one point, I really wanted to make stuff with

1:13

my hands, but I

1:15

didn't know how to do anything, so I started

1:17

watching YouTube videos. So you guys, mostly

1:20

Jimmy's in the beginning. Thanks, John.

1:23

And so yeah, the more I was

1:25

watching videos, the more I was making things and the

1:27

more I was making things, the more I wanted

1:29

to like share what I was learning. So

1:32

I started making videos too. And

1:35

I was like, okay, I'm going to put this

1:37

5,000 euro when I finish them. I'm just

1:39

going to, you know, find again, a new

1:42

real job to do. If they say 5,000 euro

1:44

was your initial investment, if it works, it works.

1:46

If not, it doesn't. Yeah. I bought all the

1:48

tools and stuff. So I had to be very

1:50

creative not to finish those 5,000 euros. And

1:54

that started like a whole thing where

1:56

I'm still here trying to make stuff.

2:00

Do you remember when that was? I mean we can

2:02

go to your very first video where you put the

2:04

paper burn. Yeah. I'll look forward to it. I'm really

2:06

bad with dates but it must be

2:08

like six years ago? Seven years

2:11

ago? No, I'd say nine. Really?

2:14

I'm that old? Yeah. Because

2:16

I've been up here for it. I've been up here

2:18

in this house full time since 2017.

2:22

So that's going on six and a half,

2:24

seven years ago. So it was at

2:26

least a couple years before that. Wow.

2:30

It's always like, yeah, a couple of years

2:32

ago in my mind. Yeah. I'm

2:34

still here. But yeah, so I'm

2:36

still here making things and then I kind

2:40

of did like when

2:42

I started making videos like I

2:44

decided that that would be my startup. I

2:48

always had the idea that I

2:51

wanted to make products because I

2:53

thought normally when someone makes like

2:55

a new product, then you have

2:57

to figure out who to show it to like

3:00

what's the market and everything. Right.

3:02

And I felt like that was already what I

3:04

was doing, like filtering people that like what I

3:07

was making. So I was like, for

3:10

me, it's the most, it's

3:13

the best thing to do. Just like try

3:15

to make some products and see if people like

3:17

it. But you have a captive audience

3:19

that likes you. Yeah. And

3:22

I feel like YouTube is amazing because whether

3:25

you like it or not, you're just

3:27

connecting with people that has

3:29

your same sensibility, your same like

3:32

the same things. Like

3:34

every time I meet someone that watches my

3:36

video, we have so many things in common,

3:40

which is like a dream for like

3:42

a marketer, like someone that wants to

3:44

normally you have to find it afterwards.

3:46

Like this was already happening. So

3:50

I started with the maker knife where

3:52

Bob made my voiceover. Do

3:56

it now, Bob. Do it right now. I

3:58

don't even remember what the. Mine was... It

4:01

doesn't open but it will. In

4:06

the hand of a maker. I still

4:08

carry my maker knife every day. This

4:10

is like one of my favorite things. By

4:12

the way, nine years ago was your oldest movie. I know

4:14

there was a movie before that. Yeah,

4:17

I debated. So this

4:19

was in January of 2015. Wow. So

4:22

imagine a kid that nine years is like

4:24

an adult, right? Yeah. It's

4:27

like a real bird's eye. I've had young kids by

4:29

now. Wow. That's amazing.

4:31

So you did make your

4:34

knife. You've done the

4:37

kinetic driver. Yes, that

4:39

was COVID. Yeah.

4:42

What else? The dark... Well,

4:45

I made like little stuff in

4:47

the between, like in between. The

4:49

calendar? Yeah, the calendar. Yeah, the

4:51

sharp edge. You have the

4:53

only orange sharp edge in existence. That's

4:58

like a shell for

5:00

the Sharpie, right? Yeah, yeah.

5:02

It's pretty good. And then the

5:04

dark fade, which is a nightmare.

5:12

I'm interested to hear about this because I

5:14

mean, like, so I'm a supporter of dark

5:17

fade on Kickstarter and

5:19

it's been a while and

5:21

I know that that's how it goes. It doesn't

5:23

bother me, but I'm curious to hear from you

5:25

about like what that's been like. So

5:28

in this project, I did one thing that

5:30

I've never done before and it's been really

5:33

like a

5:35

huge error of mine. Because

5:37

normally, even if I'm not good at

5:40

something, I kind of know,

5:42

you know, the just of it. Like

5:44

for this product, which has

5:46

electronics, I know like 0.5% of

5:50

what you need to know. So

5:53

what I did was like trusting someone

5:55

else to make that part, which

5:58

is a big part in a flashlight. and

6:00

that created huge problems. Obviously,

6:05

I couldn't know in the

6:07

beginning, but we didn't have the same mindset,

6:09

like the same way to do stuff with

6:11

this electronic guy, who

6:14

is amazing, like he's super skilled,

6:16

like he knows everything even too

6:18

much probably. But

6:21

the point is that it wasn't coming out

6:23

the thing that I wanted. Like I could

6:25

never really get what

6:27

I wanted, like

6:29

a very dark fate to be. Because it was

6:31

all like inspect, everything was like super

6:34

safe, everything obviously.

6:37

But I

6:40

think that guy was too strict

6:43

for the way I tried to do things.

6:45

Like I really wanna push the envelope,

6:47

like try things that nobody done before,

6:50

like you know, but obviously

6:52

because my knowledge in electronics is very

6:54

low, I have to trust someone else,

6:57

which is something that I'm

6:59

never gonna do again. But

7:01

now, like it's been, I don't know, one

7:03

and a half years something after

7:06

the Kickstarter. And first

7:11

of all, like this last two years has

7:13

been like the very worst of my life,

7:16

like for many reasons. And

7:19

that was one because like it's very, very

7:21

stressful. Having

7:23

like people that put their money for

7:27

a product and me struggling, like having all

7:29

kinds of problems, seeing like money going away.

7:33

Because everything you do, even like a

7:35

month where you don't get what you want,

7:38

it's like money that I spent, because I

7:40

have expenses and everything. It's

7:42

like super, super stressful. And on top of

7:44

that, I had like a couple of really

7:46

bad, like personal problems. And

7:49

I know it's like ridiculous

7:51

to say, nobody should say that. I

7:53

had like periods in this last two

7:55

years That I was

7:57

actually thinking like, The

8:00

being dad is not that the as a

8:02

whole I'm an underserved like a it's it's

8:04

it's that that? Like, I never thought about

8:07

doing anything but it was like wow. I've

8:10

lived through the pressure was pushing

8:12

down on general much. I can

8:14

talk about this now because like I'm

8:16

getting out of it of like Darth

8:18

Vader swell I've I met like a

8:21

new electronic guy who is like absolutely

8:23

incredible. Like seriously, like I

8:25

don't know who sent it to meet

8:27

someone did. I was in a maker

8:29

faire and I met this guy. Is.

8:32

He had like his own, like Ellie the

8:35

stuff. And luckily it was

8:37

while I was there. A lot of people recognize

8:39

me and Osmond for Celsius and stuff. so he

8:41

was I Who is this guy? Is

8:44

pretty serious? Yeah and they say that

8:46

is the research and. And

8:49

then contact me again and we became

8:52

really good friends and he south and

8:54

meet a lot like time. I

8:56

don't. I don't think I would be

8:58

able to finish started without him for

9:01

that. That's how important is. You

9:03

can you briefly talk about what's

9:05

special about? Talk about a great.

9:08

So this do things that I wanted

9:11

our fates of have left in the

9:13

beginning. just one. Which.

9:15

Was I hate? Like flipping through

9:17

a modes in in flashlights. like

9:19

when you want to change the

9:21

brightness. And.

9:24

I did feel like I was

9:26

imagining like I'm. Invisible

9:29

volume knob like something. they didn't sound

9:31

like that so went when you keep

9:33

the button pressed of Dartford and you

9:36

movie like this in the air, rotated

9:38

the. You. I'm. You

9:41

change the brightness like with a very nice

9:43

resolution. Like could feel like you're moving a

9:45

knob. And

9:47

because of that, the way

9:49

the Vm. Gyro.

9:53

And what's the other thing missing?

9:55

The main vs none of the

9:57

and accelerometer? Yeah. Exam on. work,

10:01

you need to know the orientation the object

10:03

is when you turn it. Because otherwise, like

10:05

if you have it flipped and you go

10:08

clockwise, it does one thing. If you

10:10

flip the dark fade, you go clockwise,

10:12

it does like up

10:14

instead of down. You know, the rearrange is what is

10:16

expected. So that was

10:18

like a difficult problem that well

10:21

before the Kickstarter that I had to solve.

10:24

And at one point, I sold

10:26

it with hardware instead of software because

10:28

it was impossible. So I made the

10:30

head 45 degrees angle.

10:35

So when you take it, you don't want to you

10:37

don't want to flat like you obviously hold it

10:39

like kind of a gun. Yeah. So

10:41

you know, you know which way it's facing. Yeah.

10:44

So you would always face it like that. And

10:47

you got your water. And

10:49

that made like

10:51

the feature that I love the most because I never

10:53

seen 45 degrees angle

10:56

has in flashlights. I mean,

10:58

you have like the big ones that you can

11:00

move and stuff like that or the 90 degrees.

11:03

But 45 degrees is amazing because

11:05

you like you put it

11:07

on the floor. You want to work

11:09

on something on the wall, for example, it

11:12

always shines, you know, where

11:14

where you want it to be. Or like you

11:16

put it here in your in your chest and

11:18

it always, you know, it's

11:21

nice when you walk. It's a lot better for

11:23

me than a headlamp, for example, like, you know,

11:25

the thing that you put here. So

11:28

those are the two features I was banking

11:31

on. But now with this new

11:33

guy, some things are secret

11:36

and some things are like, for

11:38

example, we put on red

11:40

LEDs to

11:43

maintain your vision, you know, the night vision,

11:45

for example. And

11:50

like the the century mode it

11:52

has, which is like you

11:55

keep it somewhere like on

11:58

a bag or something, if someone moves it. It

12:00

starts flashing and making a noise. Oh, wow.

12:02

Yeah. You can even use, like,

12:04

if you go camping, you don't want, like, animals to go.

12:06

You can put a string and you put that in. If

12:10

an animal comes, you know, starts peeping and

12:12

stuff like that. Oh, cool. Oh,

12:14

wow. Yeah, and the sensory mode

12:17

in the old version was like you could have

12:20

it, like, for six hours. Now

12:23

you can have the dark fit with this new guy.

12:25

You can have the dark fit in sensory mode for,

12:27

like, a year. And the battery

12:29

doesn't. Yeah, it's ringing. That's

12:32

the level of, like, how better

12:34

the electronic is now. Yeah.

12:38

That's crazy. So

12:41

this, I know this has been, like,

12:43

a publicly long project. You said a

12:45

couple of years. But I

12:47

was there, I was in Italy in, when was that,

12:49

2019? Maybe?

12:53

Something like that. He said he's bad with dates, like, you need to

12:55

call. I'm pretty sure it was 2019. So

12:57

a long time ago. And we were in your

12:59

shop. And I remember you showing us, like,

13:02

a first prototype or a really early prototype

13:04

of this and getting feedback on it turning

13:06

and stuff. And

13:08

obviously, you'd already been thinking about it long

13:12

enough to have a prototype. So

13:14

that's, I don't know, it's encouraging to me

13:17

to know that having

13:19

a product, which is something I'm still struggling with

13:21

and something I still want to do and all

13:23

that, that the process

13:25

can be really long and still

13:27

be productive. And

13:30

I know you're not done with it yet. I know

13:32

you're not through it all yet. But the fact that

13:34

it's, like, it hasn't died

13:36

in that time. It's continuing to

13:38

be moved forward. That's encouraging to

13:40

me. Yeah. I

13:43

kind of feel like it

13:45

should be long. Yeah.

13:49

Because the first time you put it out, when you put

13:51

a product out, the moment, the absolute second you put it

13:53

out, that's going to be the

13:55

worst version of that product. Yeah. Because immediately you

13:57

have millions of minds

13:59

looking. Like for instance, this Google,

14:01

the Google, the Apple screen,

14:04

what is it called? Vision Pro? The Vision Pro, Jaco

14:06

has it, he brought it here and we're playing with

14:08

it. And everybody, Marques, whoever else, Jerry

14:10

Rig, everything, everybody that's talking about it online

14:12

is all saying, this is the worst version

14:14

of the most incredible product that's out there

14:17

right now. Because it's gonna immediately

14:19

begin to be picked apart,

14:21

improved, changed, but

14:24

that's the risk you gotta take. And you're saying that

14:26

you need more time to make sure that you hit

14:28

the ground with the best opportunities. As

14:31

a brand, you also do that because

14:33

you wanna make sure that you have the opportunity to secure

14:35

all of those assets under

14:37

your brand umbrella, whether it's legally

14:40

or just emotionally with the fan base.

14:43

Plus, I mean, the moment people

14:45

starts using it, you discover so

14:47

many things that even if you do all kind

14:49

of tests, like you even make like machines that

14:52

simulate, they use whatever, you

14:55

discover so many things that you would

14:57

never have thought before. So

15:00

because this is an electronics thing and

15:02

there are many more points of failure,

15:06

are you doing testing like that? Are you

15:08

doing like beta testers of people handling it?

15:11

So we're gonna make 25 Dark Fate this

15:14

year, like

15:17

in the next months that we're gonna give

15:19

to some people, like some backers, obviously, to

15:22

try it out. But I also

15:24

have another advantage with this guy

15:27

who's like the new electronic that a

15:29

lot of the electronic that we're using,

15:31

like the system that we're

15:33

using, he's been using it in his own

15:35

products. So he makes little

15:39

lights that they go like in

15:41

the Vatican, they

15:44

use them in the Uffizi, in the

15:47

museum in Florence. So

15:50

his lights are like the best. And

15:53

the thing is that now Dark Fate is

15:55

like an improved

15:57

version with battery of his own lights.

16:00

Hmm gotcha. So like the

16:02

light quality everything is like absolutely amazing

16:04

He is real life. I like I

16:06

don't know 200 euro for just one

16:08

LED and they use them like in, you

16:10

know Scientific labs and

16:13

stuff like that dark fade is gonna

16:15

be dead level with battery which I

16:18

can't believe this happens, but honestly yeah,

16:21

so even though like I'm

16:23

probably losing money on the On

16:26

the campaign, but I'm so sure it's gonna

16:28

be so nice and so amazing that

16:31

obviously afterwards That's when I'm gonna make

16:33

money you can continue to sell it. Yeah

16:36

Is there technology there where you you own

16:38

it like for instance patenting for life? Well,

16:40

it's very hard because you know how patent

16:42

works like even if you do something that

16:45

nobody done before But if it's like a

16:48

combination of things that exist you can really yeah,

16:50

everyone can do it But we're gonna

16:52

protect it in other ways and the

16:54

design and the angle that's that's we're

16:56

trying to partner that We have like

16:59

some design buttons Have

17:02

any of your products been ripped off? Yes

17:04

the kinetic driver Like

17:07

I ripped off before it even came out, right They

17:11

were quicker than I but

17:15

Luckily all the versions that are out

17:17

there are super super bad like they're

17:20

First of all, they're like this small like what

17:23

is this? It's no like three inches Yeah,

17:26

like they are half the size and

17:28

some of them don't even work as a screwdriver Like

17:33

I bought one that like the

17:35

middle turns so if you turn

17:38

the Handle yeah the

17:40

handle it just stays stationary For

17:45

anybody anybody watching this is what we're talking

17:47

about. Yeah this is a Ceramic

17:49

bearing on the back. Yeah, and so

17:51

you can Yeah,

17:54

you can it just spins forever. It's

17:56

great beautiful to have

17:59

if you're a knock-off artist and you see a

18:01

picture that you might assume that barrel that's in the

18:03

middle of the thing are Yes,

18:05

a bearings, but they're not so

18:08

they might knock it off visually and put bearings

18:10

there and then you turn the bearings It's really

18:12

actually a stationary handle. Yeah, which that would be

18:14

completely useless if this was the bearing The

18:21

one thing I One

18:24

thing we have to contend with and it's

18:26

really more huge aqua cuz when I put our products I

18:28

just thought on Instagram. I don't really start any

18:30

sort of campaign, but what's

18:33

happening Now more and

18:35

more even with guys that just flip used equipment They

18:39

do a beautiful photograph or a beautiful campaign

18:41

and then the knockoff people just take that

18:43

and use that in their own Yeah,

18:45

they just use your photographs your media For

18:49

their own. Yeah, they use my picture even the

18:51

video they use and that confuses everybody because everyone's

18:53

like you're working Why would you work with this

18:55

company that knocks people off and you go they

18:57

just took it? They have no shame. Yeah, and

18:59

then you have to explain it to everybody So

19:01

these days this day and age with the internet

19:03

is it's a little difficult for it There's a

19:06

scam going on with the blacksmith

19:08

community. It seems to be prevalent

19:10

where Andrew and Chris

19:13

cash and these guys their pictures are being taken

19:15

and put on Facebook market as

19:17

advertising and then somebody somewhere is like

19:19

Yeah, I made this thing and you know something

19:21

that Chris cash might have spent a lot of

19:24

time in energy making an anvil stand You know

19:26

combining antique tool bases and making this thing and

19:29

it's a one-of-a-kind work of art that this guy's

19:31

trying to sell for Thousands

19:33

of dollars and he's like oh, yeah, but before I

19:35

can take your payment you're gonna have to pay me

19:37

something so I can secure the the shipping and Then

19:40

they get them then the people and then Chris gets the message.

19:42

Okay, what happened on my base? He's like I don't know what

19:44

you're talking about So yeah,

19:47

we just have to be careful of scams And

19:50

that's the case with everything. I mean, I think we

19:52

talked about did we talk about this last week? Yeah

19:54

We are remember using the same example. Yeah,

19:56

it's the same same thing with car parts, you know

19:58

the photo. Oh, that's right and

20:00

stuff. Yeah, it's

20:04

weird. Looking in the

20:06

groups, the Facebook groups about car stuff right

20:08

now, basically everybody is

20:10

like, just don't buy from marketplace.

20:13

And so because Meta's

20:16

not trying to, I don't know

20:18

how they would fix it, so I'm not saying that, but because

20:21

they're not really making an effort to verify

20:25

sales and stuff, they're kind

20:27

of killing their own marketplace. Because people are beginning

20:29

to run away from it knowing that eBay is

20:31

the safer way, at least there's some protections built

20:33

into the system and stuff like that. Anyway,

20:38

we jumped right into Jaco,

20:41

which is great, but we haven't talked about

20:43

what anybody else has been doing. So

20:46

let's take a break because I

20:48

actually have a question for you about the future of

20:50

your product stuff, but I want to hear from the

20:53

other guys about what they've been up to. I've

20:57

been making these whiskey boxes, I've been talking about

20:59

them a little bit, and I'm just

21:01

trying to jam through that. And the other day, Jaco,

21:05

my laser works perfect, but then when someone shows up, I'm

21:07

like, oh, look at how good my laser works. And Jaco

21:09

goes, oh, it doesn't work. They're going, no, it's working fine.

21:12

It's not cutting through. I'm like, no, it isn't. And

21:14

then of course, it wasn't. And then he's like, he

21:16

looks because your mirrors look like they have ceramic on

21:18

them. And I

21:21

never cleaned the laser since I got it. And then I

21:23

opened it up and I pulled out the tube, the barrel

21:25

that has the pointy corner. I

21:27

was pretty sure you were going to say a

21:29

rat, but anyway, go ahead. And I look into

21:31

it and I'm like, is this how it's

21:33

supposed to look? It looks like a crater on

21:36

the moon. It looks like

21:38

someone took a plastic

21:41

lens, if you would imagine, a plastic lens

21:44

about the size of a quarter, heated up an

21:46

ice pick and then melted it directly through the sensor

21:48

of that lens. Oh, that's what the

21:50

lens of my laser looked like. And Jaco and I

21:52

both couldn't decide whether that was bad or not because

21:54

we didn't know. And then he goes, no, no, definitely

21:56

it's not good. And then there's also crack. I'll send

21:59

you guys a picture. And I got

22:02

on the phone with Derek, because I know Derek was always

22:04

diagnosing this type of stuff, and he said, call this guy.

22:07

And I'll look up his name. I'll say he

22:09

was very helpful. He was super nice. He's a

22:11

laser expert. And he's in Florida.

22:13

Some laser nerds will probably know who I'm

22:15

already talking about. And he right

22:17

away said, this is what your problem was. And

22:19

the lens has condensation on it. And when the

22:22

laser hits it, it boils the water. And the

22:24

water burns off the protective coating. And then the

22:26

laser melts through the lens. And

22:28

that must have happened the night before, or

22:30

at least might be back to the critical point the night before.

22:33

I was probably doing some work on it for a minute. Because

22:36

I was able to cut some leather the night before. And now

22:38

here it is 24 hours later, and it wouldn't work. Anyway,

22:41

so now I know I'm smarter with lasers. But I

22:43

had the full spectrum. So yesterday we were able to

22:45

use that, which works good. And

22:48

so I'm working on the whiskey boxes. But then I'm also

22:50

putting out a special project

22:53

this weekend with DFM

22:55

Toolworks and I collaborating

22:57

on a project. And when the

22:59

video comes out, you'll be able

23:01

to buy a product from us when the

23:04

weekend's video comes out. So you'll see that

23:06

video. I don't want to give it away.

23:09

And so I'm just going to be working on that. And

23:12

it's a machining thing. So I'm going to be on the lathe. I'm

23:15

going to have brass chips in my teeth for

23:17

the next three weeks. I'm going

23:19

to have to build a shield. Because I cut some last night when you went

23:21

to bed. And this

23:23

box get in your earlobes. And

23:25

when you cut brass, it

23:28

turns into almost like sawdust fibers. But

23:31

brass. You really expect

23:33

sawdust fibers. You just got to just rub it in. It's fine.

23:36

Just fades into the fabric of your skin

23:38

and your clothes and your lungs. But not

23:40

brass chips. They don't fit away as easily.

23:42

Fabric of your lungs. I

23:47

turned some aluminum something.

23:51

I don't even remember what it was. But it did that.

23:54

These little spikes. And I think

23:56

it wasn't this shirt. But it was a

23:58

shirt like this. And

24:00

I walked away and they were just everywhere just stuck

24:02

in and I tried to wipe them off and

24:05

they wouldn't wipe off and they Were embedded in the shirt

24:07

and then I was like, all right. I'll just wash it

24:09

that'll get them all out Nope, like three washes later. There's

24:11

still like little metal things like sticking out of it They

24:14

look very good on you It's

24:18

my glitter So

24:21

I'm working on that and Jaco is Tinkering

24:24

around the shop It's funny

24:26

when someone's around Jaco's is Do

24:28

you have springs? And

24:31

I'm like for a second. I go. I know

24:33

I have spring somewhere and then I let the

24:35

intuitive internal Navigator

24:41

guide me like divining rods to

24:43

a drawer and I pull it open and

24:45

boom I had no idea what's in the truck with springs around

24:47

there And

24:50

my old age everything just goes I go

24:53

You're gonna laugh when I travel down to Nashville and I came

24:55

home and I stopped at Knife City I

24:57

bought two whittling knives because I was working with Ann

24:59

and she gave me a beautiful whittling knife And I

25:01

said I gotta I got a whittle more so I

25:03

saw whittling knives available So I bought two of them

25:05

one for me one for Patrick. I Got

25:08

home and I was like, I'm gonna put these in a safe place About

25:12

four hours. I was like, where did I put those? Completely

25:15

since then so that was in the beginning of

25:17

January. I could not remember where I put

25:19

these two whittling knives I bought yesterday. I accidentally found them

25:21

in the big toolbox Like I

25:24

just now now my routine is okay, that's

25:26

missing I'm gonna stumble at my future self

25:28

will stumble upon whether I pass self

25:30

with it Because I know

25:32

I didn't I definitely didn't throw it away. It's me

25:35

in some bookshelf somewhere I put it in a

25:38

place where past Jimmy would know where future Jimmy

25:40

would want him and I'm

25:42

coming to the conclusion of my old age. It's like if I

25:44

can't find something It's gonna

25:47

be right in the spot where I left it yesterday. We were

25:49

looking for the calipers This digital star

25:51

calipers and I said I used them

25:53

a couple days ago And I was like don't put them back in

25:55

the toolbox because I'll just leave them right here for the next time

25:57

I need them and all day yesterday. I

26:00

I have no idea what that is. He

26:02

also has like 10 different shops. Yeah.

26:04

That's true. There's

26:08

that, there is that. I also

26:10

found the vise that you just

26:12

bought. We

26:14

went to the Hall of Afraid the other day and I bought a drill

26:16

press vise and I hear him bark from the

26:19

other corner of the room and he's holding up the one that I

26:21

couldn't find anymore. It was in a pile of sawdust. For

26:23

some reason on the back side of the band saw and

26:26

he goes, this is what you just bought. I

26:28

said yeah. You know

26:31

I have extras in case I lose them what I just bought. Yeah.

26:37

David, what about you? I

26:39

just wanna show everybody how easily

26:41

influenced I am. Jimmy mentioned springs

26:43

and I watched some creator on YouTube

26:47

two, three years ago and

26:49

this first one was like, you have to

26:51

have, you just have to have springs on

26:53

hand. So you need to go and you

26:55

need to get a box of a variety

26:57

of springs. And so. Yeah, Hall of

26:59

Afraid sells them too. I did. So I have

27:01

this container and it's got all these different

27:04

springs in there. I have never

27:07

opened it up. I have never used it. And

27:09

I don't even know if I had a need

27:11

for springs before that video. I was just like

27:14

somebody said I had to have springs. So I did. And

27:17

then I wanted to make

27:19

sure I was backing Darkfade.

27:21

So I log into Kickstarter. I'm like, oh,

27:23

I am backing

27:25

that project. And oh,

27:28

I also bought no shortcuts. All you need to

27:31

know to start your own company. I'd never, I

27:33

backed that, but this is

27:36

another Jaco product. I

27:38

backed it and then I totally forgot about

27:40

it and then never did anything with that.

27:42

I never, I don't know if there's videos or

27:45

if it's a book or whatever, but I

27:47

just, I'm easily influenced. If there's somebody that

27:50

I like that says I need something, I

27:52

just buy it. Yeah,

27:55

I agree. I'm gonna let you

27:57

finish, but I actually, I

28:00

just got an email from Katz

28:03

Moses Tools saying that my universal

28:07

box joint jig that they just

28:09

put up for pre-sale just shipped. And

28:11

it's the same situation. I already have one. I have the

28:14

one that we've talked about a million times that we have

28:16

to look up the video on how to use. And

28:18

I saw his and I'm like, hey,

28:20

that looks great. I like that guy. I want to help.

28:23

I want it to exist. And

28:25

yeah, yeah, anyway, go

28:28

ahead. You just you follow

28:30

people that you trust. And when they say this and

28:33

you get excited when they release a

28:35

product. So anyway, I

28:37

am still working on the record player

28:39

stereo stand. This is like

28:42

the third week in a row. And I'm

28:44

worried that I'm building it up too much because it's

28:46

not it's not a month long project. I'm

28:49

just taking it really slow. And I've shot

28:51

a couple of videos in between. And one

28:55

of those videos was I shot another laser

28:57

video. There's this laser called we

28:59

create vision. And it's a

29:02

smaller laser, but the

29:04

whole top of it moves up and down.

29:06

The lid was up and down. It's

29:08

got a camera button there so you can put different size

29:10

things in there and it takes up less space. Anyway, this

29:12

is a laser. I got a video

29:15

coming out, I think this weekend on that

29:17

guy. And then I'm going to go

29:19

back to the record player stand. And

29:22

I've decided I've made a decision

29:24

like when I'm working on projects

29:27

that I'm excited about that

29:29

I'm really going to slow down. I'm going to

29:31

make sure that I do it right because a

29:33

lot of times I'll get excited about something that

29:35

I'm making. And then I'm

29:37

like I need to get this video out. And so maybe

29:40

I don't stand as well as I should or

29:42

I'm not putting in as many layers of finish

29:44

on there as I should. And

29:47

this one I mean this is going to be at

29:49

the rental house and I'm encouraging

29:51

people to look at it, judge it, pick it

29:53

apart. And

29:55

so I'm trying to just take

29:57

my time and make it real.

30:00

I got to get back to slowing down. Yeah.

30:05

Yeah, I think that's a smart move. Do you guys find

30:07

yourself rushing projects at the end to get a video out? Every

30:10

time. Oh yeah. Sometimes

30:13

it's a deadline with a sponsor, but

30:15

sometimes it's, I'm excited about the video.

30:17

Like, I'll be excited about the project,

30:20

but after a week or two of working on it, I'm

30:22

like, I'm over the project. Now

30:25

I want it. Now I'm excited about the video, and so I

30:27

rush the end of it to get the video out. I

30:31

think for me, it's usually more

30:34

about like a deadline, and it's

30:36

often self-imposed. I mean, it's not like people are holding

30:39

me to a whole lot, but it's

30:41

usually, the closer I get to it, the more

30:43

I'm just like start to get, ah,

30:45

it's like the wall is right there. I'm getting

30:47

closer to the wall. I've got to start speeding

30:49

up and, you know, just paying

30:52

less attention and things like that, but yeah,

30:54

that's something I don't want to do. I

30:57

think slowing down is a smart thing to

30:59

do for stamina and for just overall enjoyment

31:01

of the thing. The

31:03

thing being the thing we do, like not

31:06

just that particular project. Even

31:08

my brother who helps film,

31:10

he's like, you're really taking

31:12

your time with this, and you're worried about

31:14

the details. I'm like, yeah, I really want

31:16

to be proud of this thing when

31:19

I'm done, and so I'll

31:21

probably be talking about it next week when you're asking

31:24

what I'm doing. So

31:27

that slowing down and that like

31:29

attention to those

31:31

details and stuff, do you think

31:33

that is this moment

31:35

in time? Do you think that is

31:37

these things that go in the house?

31:39

Do you think that's everything going forward?

31:41

Do you have any idea about that?

31:45

I was telling Daniel,

31:47

like, I hope I

31:50

want to slow down for all

31:52

these projects moving forward. Maybe

31:54

you even see a little bit of slow down in

31:56

the way the video is edited because I am not

31:58

trying to get this thing. out in a day. We'll

32:02

see. I always say I'm going to

32:04

do one thing and then something

32:07

changes and I do another. But right

32:10

now I'm just trying to tell myself

32:12

to take it easy and fuss

32:14

about the details because that's who I used

32:17

to be. My

32:21

degree is in graphic design. I talk about how

32:23

I was a web developer but for

32:26

a while I was a graphic designer and that's what I

32:29

went to school for. There

32:31

were basically two professors that ran the

32:33

whole graphic design department at the school

32:36

and every day it was

32:38

just like it's about the details.

32:40

It's about the presentation. The details

32:42

is what sets you apart. I

32:45

think about those two professors saying

32:52

that all the time and

32:54

it's always in the back of my head. So that's who I

32:56

used to be and I've just found over

32:58

time as I'm trying to rush to get these videos out

33:00

I've lost that. I'm just trying to get back to that.

33:05

Yeah, that's the

33:07

student observation of being

33:10

a creator. The

33:12

last thing you said is yes. Well

33:16

let's see for me I am

33:19

kind of rushing. Today I actually write

33:21

as soon as we're done I have to start making

33:23

a thing that I should have started last

33:25

week and now I'm kind

33:27

of like having to compress. It's

33:30

the first time in a while that

33:33

I'm having to compress the design and

33:35

build of something into a smaller space

33:37

than I feel good about. I feel

33:40

comfortable with and I

33:43

woke up at like I don't know 230 this morning.

33:47

Laid back down and went to the bathroom

33:49

laid back down and immediately started going wait

33:51

but how am I going to put this

33:53

thing together? How am I going to lay

33:56

there for an hour thinking

33:58

about a linkage? And

34:01

it was weird because I

34:03

haven't had a lot of that pressure for a while

34:05

You know it's been like yeah, I can think about

34:07

it tomorrow because I've got a couple of weeks It's

34:09

not a big deal, but I knew

34:11

that today. I was gonna have to hit the ground running And

34:14

so my brain just would not Avoid

34:17

trying to solve some of those problems in

34:19

the middle of the night which was super

34:21

obnoxious, so shut up brain But that's

34:24

the way it was you know so I am

34:27

kind of up against that And I'm gonna try to

34:29

figure out a way in Between

34:32

finishing this and this podcast and starting that

34:34

project I'm gonna try to figure out a

34:36

way to build that into the story So

34:39

that there is a deadline But

34:41

I want to make it like a challenge to myself

34:43

rather than a pressure to myself You

34:46

know I mean mm-hmm, so I'm trying to figure out how

34:48

to do that, but basically I Have

34:50

a laptop This

34:52

company sent me a laptop to They

34:55

wanted me to like tear it apart and rebuild

34:57

it using their instructions to prove how good their

34:59

instructions are and they are good But

35:02

that's not that's like a terrible video for me, so

35:05

instead I'm gonna upgrade it and then I'm gonna

35:07

make like a sci-fi wall

35:09

panel with this laptop

35:11

built into it and Weather

35:15

it and make it you know have a bunch of

35:17

unnecessary buttons and stuff like that So make it like

35:19

an installation that is a dashboard for my smart home

35:21

stuff And then you can open it up and pull

35:23

the laptop out and take it if you need to use it So

35:26

I think it's a cool idea and it's

35:29

generally like oh, yeah, that's no big deal It's just

35:31

a bunch of it's a box

35:33

and some details and some paint

35:36

But then when you get down to the specifics of it It's like well

35:38

it has to be able to open has to be able to hold this

35:40

it has to be you know It has to have to have to and

35:43

so now I'm at a point where I can't avoid those Those

35:46

things can't be general anymore. They have to be Specific

35:49

and I'm up against the deadline kind of

35:51

so Anyway, that's

35:53

what I would be doing this afternoon But

35:57

I am actually kind of excited about getting back to to

36:00

doing some sort of a sci-fi thing. It's been

36:02

a while since I've weathered something

36:04

and added unnecessary LEDs and

36:06

buttons and greeblies and you

36:08

know, so

36:10

I'm hoping I can use that fun,

36:14

interesting part of it as a way to make

36:17

the time crunch not as big of a deal.

36:20

I don't know. We'll see how that works,

36:22

but. Being a creator is

36:24

all about tricking yourself. It

36:27

is. That's, yeah.

36:29

That is true. You

36:31

should implement, now they make like

36:33

super small smoke machine, which are

36:36

actually vape machine bigger. You

36:39

should implement one of those. They're so nice. There's

36:42

a bunch that make them. They're

36:44

like this small battery operated. They

36:47

make like nice. I wanna

36:49

do something with that. I've seen those in props and stuff. People will

36:51

put them in, you know, costumes and things

36:53

so that they smoke from their armor

36:55

or whatever. Yeah. Unfortunately,

36:58

I don't have time. There are a bunch of things

37:00

like that that I would like to be able to

37:02

buy to put into it. I don't have time for

37:04

them to get here. Like I've got a, I

37:07

got like three days. Okay. So

37:10

I just gotta design and

37:12

build and film and all

37:14

that stuff like very quickly. You know, you

37:16

could do, you can find someone that vapes

37:18

and just put a couple of rubber tubes in it.

37:20

So for the final shot. Yeah,

37:23

you have like a guy that likes to live

37:25

his pizza that also vapes. And

37:28

you do the job. Excuse me, could you come

37:30

in here for just a minute and just put

37:32

the dominoes right over there. Come here. So

37:35

actually, I bought a small smoke machine, a

37:37

battery powered smoke machine years ago and it

37:40

wouldn't work for this one. But the reason

37:42

I bought it is you've seen those vortex

37:44

cannons that people make where it's like

37:46

they take a big trash can and they put a membrane

37:48

over it with a hole in it. They shoot a circle.

37:51

And they shoot a circle of smoke, right? So they fill up this

37:53

thing with smoke. So I wanted to

37:55

do a little handheld one. That

37:57

was like a gun. And

38:00

I found this little tiny battery powered smoke machine,

38:02

it's about this big, and I

38:04

wanted to make it the handle so that

38:06

you could pull the trigger and it would

38:08

squirt smoke into this little canister and then

38:10

you could pull back the rubber

38:12

band and shoot a ring and it would be just a

38:14

tiny version of one of those. And

38:17

I bought this little smoke

38:20

machine and I was like, cool, I think

38:22

this will work. And I put it in a box and

38:24

that was like, I don't know, eight years ago or something.

38:26

So never actually made the thing. But

38:29

now they're a lot smaller than that. Like the

38:31

one that I've been looking at, they're this big,

38:33

what is this? It's

38:35

like two by four inches. Yeah. Maybe

38:40

for the next project. I

38:44

never converted metric as often as I have this week. Yeah,

38:50

and it sounds really precise too, because you're just like,

38:52

it's about two by four. As

38:54

we walk through the story, it holds its hands up, and it goes,

38:56

how much is this? Remember

39:00

that was when we were talking about doing

39:02

the Making a Podcast tour and that was

39:04

gonna be one of the crowd participation games

39:06

is how long is that? Yeah,

39:09

I forgot about that. We were gonna still, we should try

39:11

and do that this year. I forgot all about that. We

39:15

should. So

39:17

many things that we should do. Yeah.

39:20

So Jaco, I have a question about your product stuff.

39:23

Going forward, I guess this is public.

39:26

If it's not, tell me. But on this trip,

39:30

one of your goals was to finish

39:32

the design for Maker Knife 2, the

39:34

mechanism. Did you get it? Yesterday

39:37

I got super excited and Jimmy knows it,

39:39

because the thing that I tried, it

39:42

looks like it's working very, very nicely. Like

39:46

I don't wanna spoil it, because in case it's

39:48

not actually gonna work, but I've

39:50

tried something yesterday and it feels like

39:53

it's working. So the next

39:55

Maker Knife is gonna be exactly the same

39:57

design, like very similar, meaning

39:59

that. if you see it you know it's a

40:01

maker knife but the internal is

40:04

gonna be different way

40:06

different yeah way different and hopefully a

40:08

lot better because even

40:10

that like that was my first and

40:14

when I when

40:16

I did before I did the Kickstarter all

40:19

my quotes were like for 200 pieces

40:23

and it turned out to be like a product for 30,000 pieces

40:27

well and obviously it

40:29

wasn't ready for that like there's

40:31

like it's not a knife for

40:33

everyone for sure because it has like

40:35

some things that you need to tweak and stuff

40:38

like this one I want it to be super

40:41

reliable in the mechanism and I have some

40:43

little feature more and also

40:46

my goal I don't know if I'm gonna be able to do it but

40:48

I would like to have the

40:50

website where you can kind of design

40:52

it like choosing what screws you want

40:54

what plate what you know what what

40:56

clip so you design it

40:59

in the website and then you have

41:01

that it's because because making it alone

41:03

isn't complicated enough you need

41:06

right I think you enjoy the stress of

41:08

new products you know what I enjoy

41:12

is making things that I want like that's all

41:14

I want like I want I want to have

41:16

things that I want to use every day and

41:18

it excites me so much that I can make

41:20

it where

41:24

are my gold screws yeah no

41:27

but that's so exciting and then I

41:29

regret it when the stress comes and

41:31

when you know problems come but as

41:33

long as I'm super excited I'm gonna

41:35

treat those decisions like

41:38

a drug habit yeah that's

41:41

what it is yeah everybody else is

41:44

on Adderall, Jaco's on Kickstarter. Well

41:49

after we record I want you to tell me the mechanism.

41:52

I'll send you a video cool

41:54

also you let me know if that idea

41:56

is like something that people would like mmm

42:01

Cool. Well, what else is, do

42:03

you have anything else in the pipeline? Like that

42:05

you're, I mean, there have been a bunch of

42:07

products. Yeah. And I

42:10

know those are two that you're like

42:12

currently, the Darkfade and Maker Knife too

42:14

are currently in development in some different

42:16

stage. But is there other stuff that

42:18

is in other stages?

42:20

Yeah. So what I'm going to

42:23

try to do this year, like this

42:25

is going to be the year of the Maker

42:27

Knife. Like obviously the Darkfade as well. But as

42:31

a new product, I want the Maker Knife to

42:33

be out. And,

42:36

but I want to try to make more

42:38

collaborations. Because, you know, like my

42:40

brand is Jocko. It's where like

42:43

the Kickstarter products are like on

42:45

the Jocko brain. But I also

42:47

have the website where I sell things,

42:50

which is placed atoms. And

42:52

I want to make more collaboration there because

42:56

I've been, I've done a couple of

42:58

collaborations and I really

43:01

like working with someone that

43:05

it's basically a multiplier of

43:08

what I can do alone. So

43:11

making like little projects, little things with

43:14

someone that either has an idea but

43:16

doesn't know how to make it or

43:18

he's really skilled at something that I'm

43:20

not, you know, making those

43:22

collaboration and make maybe

43:25

little products on

43:27

placed atoms in collaboration with someone else.

43:29

And I did one, I did

43:31

a collection of things for

43:34

organizing your desk with

43:37

an Italian YouTuber, like a tech YouTube, it's

43:39

like the Marques Brownlee of Italy. And

43:42

we made those little projects for just,

43:44

you know, it was

43:46

exactly what we wanted for our desk. And

43:50

we did a pre-order, no Kickstarter, we did,

43:52

we just did pre-orders. And

43:54

it went very well.

43:56

I'm very happy. And I want

43:58

to do more of that stuff. So

44:01

I'm talking to you Bob. I

44:06

would love to do something like that too. I think, and

44:08

we've talked about, the three of us have talked about this

44:10

many times, but I get

44:13

stuck on when it comes to I want

44:17

to do products, I feel

44:19

like I should be a person who has

44:21

those ideas, but when it comes to

44:24

the actual, here's

44:26

the improvement on the pen, here's

44:29

the improvement on the tape measure. I

44:32

get kind of stuck there and I'm like

44:34

anything that I think, and

44:36

it may be a self-confidence thing, but anything I

44:38

think that I could improve about this feels not

44:40

enough. It feels like it's not quite enough of

44:43

a thing that anybody's actually going to want. I've

44:47

shown these guys many times, or several times at

44:49

least, these little trays. I

44:51

started just modeling, and it was more of

44:53

a modeling experiment than anything else, with these

44:55

little trays that nest, and then

44:57

I started working on a little clip that you

45:00

could put them on your desk and

45:02

clip them together, and so you could

45:04

kind of build out a little divider

45:07

system on your desk. It's all just 3D

45:09

printed stuff. Very simple,

45:11

and a lot of people started asking

45:14

for the files for these, whether I sold them

45:16

or gave them away or whatever, and

45:18

it's stuck right here on my desk, because

45:20

right now it's just a tray. It's

45:22

a set of trays with a little

45:24

clip, and there's nothing that really elevates

45:27

it to better

45:30

than another tray that's out there or whatever.

45:34

That's the place I always get stuck, but then

45:36

next to this on my desk, I also have

45:40

this little conversion chart,

45:43

and this is from Aaron Draplin.

45:47

There is nothing unique about this other

45:49

than the design. It has the

45:51

exact same numbers on it that

45:55

this sticker, also on my desk, has

45:57

from Chris Zep. Yep.

46:01

Exact same stuff. Different

46:04

use case. You know, this is like an aluminum,

46:07

really nice looking, well designed plate. Like

46:09

I want to stick to a tool.

46:12

This one is a sticker and I have these all over the

46:14

place. They're both valuable. They

46:17

have the exact same stuff on them. And

46:20

I could make my own version of this, but

46:22

I wouldn't ever do that because it's not like

46:24

a step up. It's not an improvement. So I

46:26

guess... April Madeline, remember April Madeline? She

46:29

was seeing them at a material

46:32

for like the shop wall so they were bigger, like 17, 18

46:34

inches large. And

46:37

so when I compare stuff like this, which I

46:39

mean I paid for this, so it's not like

46:41

this is not sellable. You know,

46:43

he sold one too to me. But

46:46

when I think about this and then I think

46:48

about your products, which are like a level up,

46:51

a serious design and function

46:53

level up to the screwdriver, to

46:55

the knife, to the sharpie, those

46:59

feel like very different things as

47:02

someone who comes up with ideas for things.

47:04

And I think I personally get stuck. Do

47:07

you have any suggestions there as someone with a

47:09

lot of experience in this about what's

47:12

worthwhile maybe? Yeah, I

47:15

think the trick there is to be

47:17

very clear in your mind when you

47:20

start what's the purpose of what you're

47:22

doing. Because like even like you guys

47:24

are real YouTubers and videos

47:27

are your products. So those are products

47:29

too. And I think the

47:31

YouTubers that are

47:33

successful are the ones that have clear

47:35

in mind whether you want

47:37

to do videos for

47:40

entertaining or for

47:42

teaching, like having people learn. I

47:45

think those are the two categories of like

47:47

videos that you can put out. And the

47:50

YouTubers that have that very clear

47:52

in mind, they are the ones that are

47:54

successful. Same thing with products. You

47:57

need to know if you want to have like I

48:00

think that it's better because of the

48:02

design, like something that just looks better,

48:05

or it's like an invention that needs to be

48:07

very useful. And so

48:10

far I focused on taking like

48:12

normal things and it's

48:15

kind of what happened in the past. Like the

48:17

thing that really inspires me is like

48:20

my grandfather had like a sewing machine,

48:23

like a singer sewing machine. And

48:26

it was so beautiful, right?

48:28

It was like super nice with

48:30

like all kind of decoration and

48:32

stuff, but that was a working

48:34

tool. So what I have

48:36

in mind now is like taking the normal things

48:38

that are like close to be

48:40

just... Utilitarian.

48:43

Yes. And make

48:45

them nice again, like something that can

48:47

inspire you, just as

48:49

the singer thing. So having that in

48:51

mind, like if I have exactly what's

48:54

the focus, then you

48:56

don't get stuck because you have really

48:58

clear what's your goal. And

49:00

for me, it's taking something normal

49:02

and make it like different, like something that

49:05

can inspire you. Like that kinetic driver, I'm

49:07

sure if you take like a two Euro

49:09

kinetic driver, you can unscrew screws. But

49:12

that one, I feel like I'm

49:15

having it, I have it on my desk because

49:17

it's nice. It makes me wanna use it. Like

49:19

there's something about the design and the weight that

49:21

makes you feel better when you're using it. So

49:25

my why I do things is

49:27

exactly that. So

49:30

I think as any

49:32

product, you need to

49:34

be first of all, very

49:36

clear of what's the goal, like what you wanna

49:39

achieve. So,

49:42

and that's the main secret to

49:44

me. Plus, if you

49:46

wanna make something that you are sure you're gonna

49:48

use, like something that you're looking forward to use,

49:51

it works a lot better. Because those things

49:53

like the measurement things, you probably

49:56

bought it more as a support than

49:58

you needed it. I guess. So

50:01

that's probably the third category

50:04

in the design things. But

50:06

if you want to make something that it's actually

50:08

useful, you

50:11

need, it's basically an invention, which

50:14

like you can't plan

50:16

to have. Like normally, unless you

50:19

want to fix like a specific

50:22

problem, but it's very difficult

50:24

to like plan like this month I'm going

50:26

to have an invention. Like I'm going to

50:28

have a brand new thing that's never existed

50:30

before. The purpose has to come first. Yes.

50:32

That's very important. So

50:36

you don't get stuck because as soon as you get

50:38

stuck, you go like, okay, well, what was my purpose?

50:40

Am I going that direction? Yeah,

50:45

it's not trivial. Like I guess a lot

50:47

of people say that, but it's so trivial

50:49

that people don't think about it. Right.

50:53

And another distinction I think is you

50:57

could make it. So the screwdriver that I'm holding up

51:00

was expensive. Yeah.

51:03

And but it's really nice, right? And I was willing

51:05

to pay that money because I knew it would be

51:08

nice because I trust you as a designer. I trust

51:10

the attention to detail you have and I enjoy and

51:12

I think it's worth the money that I spent on

51:14

it. But you

51:16

didn't make this to get

51:19

a screwdriver in the hand of every

51:21

person at the cheapest possible price. And

51:23

I think that might be one of the, maybe

51:27

it's an audience thing. It's like who are

51:29

you making it for and what is

51:32

that group of people require? Do they

51:34

require a nice thing, a cheap thing,

51:36

a fast thing, a replaceable thing, you

51:39

know, what maybe what that is? And

51:42

that's something I've never

51:45

even, I've never put that

51:47

into a consideration when I'm thinking

51:49

about any of the things that I'm trying to

51:51

turn into a product is, you know, it's

51:53

okay if it's difficult to use if it's

51:55

this or it's okay if

51:57

it's easy to use or cheat. if

52:00

it's this to meet these

52:02

people, not everything for everybody all

52:04

the time. So

52:07

I don't know how you decide. I mean I

52:09

guess it's just a priority thing. The priority for

52:11

you on the screwdriver was that it was something

52:13

you would want to use, right? And then you

52:15

just find people that think the

52:17

same? Yeah, I mean yes, that's

52:19

one thing. But it's also

52:22

like if you want to start a company that makes

52:24

products and you want to start by

52:26

making something cheap, you're going

52:29

to fail. There's

52:31

no way around it because making

52:33

something that is very affordable

52:37

is super expensive. Like

52:40

imagine if I had to make the

52:42

kinetic driver like the same, exact same

52:45

thing for half the price, I

52:48

would have to have sold ten

52:50

times the number I

52:53

actually sold. Because making

52:55

like obviously

52:57

the economic of

52:59

scale is something that you know,

53:03

it's real. But even

53:05

if we think about I

53:07

want to make a trash bag, right? And

53:10

you take a trash bag and it's like I

53:12

don't know how much this is worth, five cents.

53:15

Can you imagine the kind of infrastructure

53:19

that you have to make a

53:21

trash bag company? It's

53:24

insane. So

53:27

I think if you want to

53:30

start, you need to start with something that's premium

53:32

so it has other qualities. Because

53:34

if you raise the price, you can afford to make

53:36

less of them. Even

53:41

if I made like just one thousand, well

53:43

just that would be good, but one

53:46

thousand kinetic driver, I could

53:48

afford to make them. Maybe I wouldn't make any money,

53:50

but I could afford to make them. If

53:53

I needed like two million

53:55

dollars to make it, like just make

53:58

the first trash bags. I

54:02

wouldn't be able to do a Kickstarter about that.

54:04

So having something premium allows you

54:06

to make less of them and still make a

54:08

little bit of money to make more stuff. That's

54:10

exactly the same theory behind the leather bag that

54:12

I've been making. I sell them

54:14

for hundreds of dollars, and they're

54:17

paying the hands to make,

54:20

quite literally. But

54:23

they are fun. There's something very

54:25

rewarding about putting in the

54:27

rivets. I like the

54:29

process. Lately, when it

54:31

comes to making products, sometimes what I think is I

54:33

go to myself, if I

54:36

sell 1,000 of these, maybe I'll make $25,000. But

54:41

the amount of time and energy it takes to make

54:43

1,000 of those things, because I'm also not really using

54:45

factories as much, I think to myself,

54:47

$25,000, even $40,000. It's

54:51

a lot of money, but it's also a tremendous amount of

54:53

work. And I back off, and I'd be like,

54:56

let me make five for my friends. And

54:59

then I'll make that money doing something for the liquor brands

55:01

or whatever. And that's kind

55:03

of where I've been falling. If you guys can

55:05

look at my arc, I come up

55:07

with these things and make $75,000 for the website or $200 for the

55:09

website, $300 for

55:11

the website. And then they'd fall off and

55:13

get interested about something else. And

55:17

that's because I realized, unless it's

55:19

selling out Walmart, which I tried that path

55:21

too, and that was too complicated, it's

55:25

more fun just making content in

55:27

general. And the bags that I've been making, this

55:30

is a concerted effort to get back on track

55:32

to actually really focus. But

55:35

me and Jaco were talking last night, for me, things

55:37

don't sell unless I talk about them, and you've got to

55:39

constantly talk about them. I haven't sold

55:41

a bag in about a week, because I haven't

55:44

shown anything on the stories. And

55:46

when you think, oh, if

55:48

you're going to just blab out some information on

55:50

the stories, you're like, I don't want to do

55:53

this anymore. So please don't ask me.

55:55

And then you'll get 30 people asking you the same

55:57

question, that story is one

55:59

little drop. in the ocean

56:01

that just a couple thousand

56:03

people might see, maybe even a few hundred and that's

56:06

it. But you think because you've uttered it, now

56:08

the whole world will see my poster

56:10

stapled to a telephone pole in San

56:13

Francisco. The whole world's going to see it.

56:15

But a fraction of

56:17

a fraction of a percent of people see that. So

56:20

the point of making it is when you make a product,

56:22

you've got to constantly keep reminding your audience that you have

56:24

it. To the detriment

56:26

of annoying the few people that actually pay

56:28

close attention more often because those

56:31

guys are like, enough already with this product. I

56:33

got one. I don't need to keep hearing about

56:35

it, but you've got to keep pushing. You've

56:37

got to keep pushing. I don't know. I made

56:39

a few points there. Once in a while, there's products for

56:41

me. It's the Maker knife that it

56:43

sells itself. People use

56:45

it and it's so different

56:49

that people ask, what is that? And then

56:51

they want it. Like every time,

56:53

like if I sell today, if I sell 10

56:56

Maker knives, tomorrow I'm going to sell 20 just

56:59

because of the people that have it and show

57:01

it to other people. Also, it's an EDC thing,

57:03

so you actually take it out. The

57:06

kinetic driver is a little different because you

57:08

don't have it around with you. It's just

57:10

people that are in your shop or

57:12

whatever. The Maker knife

57:14

has a huge potential

57:16

because it makes

57:19

you ask questions. You see it and

57:22

I saw it so many times, so many people

57:24

told me they take it out and there's

57:27

always someone like, what is that? I

57:31

couldn't plan to make that. I just learned it

57:33

afterwards. It's just so nice

57:35

that it happened. It's

57:38

really important. Another part of product

57:40

development is always leave room

57:42

for those surprises. You

57:45

just always expect to be something that's good

57:47

or bad that you just

57:49

can't anticipate whatsoever. So

57:52

that's a thing that I learned with the Maker

57:54

knife. So now I try always, if

57:56

I'm designing something, I try

57:58

to think what can be done. be that even

58:01

the kinetic driver, obviously you don't take it

58:03

out as much, but if you

58:05

look at it, you think it's like a projectile

58:08

or something. It makes you want

58:10

to ask you what does it do. And

58:12

just someone asking the question, it's

58:15

already closer to making

58:17

a purchase in that moment. And

58:19

I hope the dark trade

58:21

is going to do the same because it's so

58:23

different than other flashlights that you want to ask

58:25

what's special about it. You

58:28

might like it or not, but you're still

58:30

closer than, I don't know, just like this

58:32

one, if I don't show you the brand, you

58:34

don't know what it is, right? Like

58:37

that one is going to have something

58:39

different to ask questions.

58:41

The shape is a trademark. Yeah. So,

58:44

that's one aspect that I try to think

58:47

about, like what is like the X

58:49

factor or whatever. Yeah.

58:52

Yeah. It's

58:55

weird that you were talking earlier, Jimmy, about the

58:59

content is more fun. I can't remember how you said it, but

59:03

I hadn't really thought about it in

59:05

this way until just now, but the

59:07

profit margin on making content is so

59:10

much higher than making products. It

59:13

is. And it's me and Jack

59:15

open there. We've been talking

59:17

about that. The trade-off is that it requires

59:21

you. Like it is an active

59:23

one for one. You have to make

59:25

the content for that margin to

59:27

be there, which I mean, makes sense. Whereas

59:32

a product can be offloaded to

59:34

other people, even if it's partially

59:36

or it can be scaled in

59:39

a factory or with other hands

59:41

or whatever. And

59:43

so, that's an interesting thing to think about

59:45

because I think I've known that and that's

59:48

been a consideration with going back

59:50

and forth between trying to come up with a product, trying

59:52

to make content. The margin

59:54

is always so much higher on content

59:57

just because the economy around content is

59:59

totally different. than it is around physical

1:00:01

things. Yeah. Well, in

1:00:03

the short term, yes. But

1:00:06

if you build a product company, you're

1:00:08

actually building a value that goes

1:00:11

parallel to the actual income. Because

1:00:14

now, like, if in a few years

1:00:16

I decide to sell the company, you

1:00:18

got to value the assets. Yeah. That's

1:00:21

a whole, you know, bag of

1:00:23

assets that have patterns, you know, design

1:00:25

things. Even

1:00:28

the know-how, like, knowing what

1:00:30

companies to use, like, that's

1:00:32

value for other companies. And

1:00:34

this is all money that's, like, invisible right now,

1:00:36

but it can be, not that I want to

1:00:38

sell, but it can be a thing in

1:00:41

the future that the video probably has a

1:00:43

lot less. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

1:00:45

that's a good point. That's why, I mean, parallel

1:00:48

to the YouTube content, I'm always trying to develop

1:00:50

something. I'm obviously working with Howard on lots of

1:00:52

stuff. We just had a big meeting

1:00:54

about the website. I've kind of let the website languish

1:00:56

because what's going on with, you know,

1:00:58

the Walmart thing kind of put us off in

1:01:00

a two-year diversion to try

1:01:03

and develop this factory that we're working on. But

1:01:05

we're going to get back to doing products on the website

1:01:08

and maybe even potentially putting the leather bags on

1:01:10

the website. But that's another

1:01:14

thing for 2024, another goal. But

1:01:19

yeah, it's nice to have products that bring

1:01:22

in mailbox money. I

1:01:24

have one of your products, Bob. You

1:01:26

do? Yeah. Oh, the push stick?

1:01:29

I can't say. What? The

1:01:31

push stick? Oh, no, you have the other, the

1:01:33

unreleased product. Yeah. The secret?

1:01:35

The secret thing. Yeah.

1:01:38

Is this a product you developed, Bob, that didn't make? Yeah,

1:01:41

we got, it was right

1:01:43

before COVID, we got it just about ready to

1:01:45

go. And then the

1:01:48

cost of the electronics that were

1:01:51

necessary went through the roof and

1:01:53

just completely destroyed the possibility.

1:01:55

And they still are up there.

1:01:59

Well, I have one. So yeah,

1:02:02

and I really enjoyed it by the way. Yeah.

1:02:04

Oh good good I think it's cool and

1:02:06

I would love to make it happen at some point, but I don't

1:02:09

know if it ever will or not David

1:02:12

you've been kind of quiet. Do you have any other questions

1:02:14

about product stuff? I Real

1:02:18

my interest in products isn't

1:02:22

My interest really is in the content

1:02:24

creation and the making stuff for myself

1:02:27

I have a tape measure idea. Oh He's

1:02:31

got good ideas for that. You guys should I

1:02:34

have to go have to go to load a truck

1:02:36

So you guys might have sure go to the after

1:02:38

show without me, but you're cool. So a couple years

1:02:40

ago. I'm good place. Oh, I started

1:02:45

Designing and by designing I mean just

1:02:47

writing down words in a document

1:02:49

of my ideal

1:02:51

tape measure and I Came

1:02:54

up with a whole list of things and

1:02:56

I've talked to three companies I talked to

1:02:59

and there was all like non-disclosure agreements and

1:03:01

everything. I talked to Rockler I talked

1:03:03

to another tape measure company called Co melon

1:03:07

I think that's how you say it and then another one called

1:03:09

perfect tape measure and they were all Like

1:03:12

this is a little Ambitious

1:03:14

you might want to start with something

1:03:17

a little less like

1:03:21

None of the ideas that I have for the tape measure

1:03:23

are like Amazing

1:03:28

but they're cool and then when you

1:03:30

add ten cool things to it it

1:03:32

becomes this high-end

1:03:36

Ideal tape measure for somebody like me and I

1:03:40

realized like I just don't have the

1:03:42

time or the desire to really pursue

1:03:44

this this is gonna take Weeks

1:03:47

of just sketching weeks

1:03:50

and then the experimentation I'm like I

1:03:52

would just rather make a video about

1:03:54

making a record player stand because that's

1:03:56

only gonna take me four weeks and

1:03:58

then I'm gonna Have this beautiful record

1:04:00

player stand that I made in design and

1:04:02

a record, a document, a video documentation

1:04:05

of me making this thing. And that just

1:04:07

sounds so much more

1:04:10

rewarding to me. One

1:04:12

day I'll revisit the tape

1:04:14

measure, but it's just not right now.

1:04:18

Is it a situation where you could patent

1:04:22

the ideas that make it unique

1:04:24

and then license those patents to

1:04:26

someone to physically,

1:04:28

you know,

1:04:30

create the thing? Possibly.

1:04:34

Possibly. The,

1:04:37

I really like to take ownership in the things that I

1:04:39

make. Like this is, this is mine.

1:04:41

I made this. I did this by myself.

1:04:44

And the idea of like taking

1:04:47

this thing and doing the

1:04:49

patents and the ideas and then hand it

1:04:51

off to somebody else doesn't really

1:04:54

appeal to me because then it doesn't feel like it's mine

1:04:56

anymore. Maybe I just need to get over that. But

1:04:59

if it's only yours in your head and it's never

1:05:01

a thing that other people see, then is it yours?

1:05:03

Right. As well? Then

1:05:06

you get to this like, oh,

1:05:09

well, what happens when you accomplish your dreams?

1:05:13

Then what do you do? So there's,

1:05:16

I like the idea of having dreams and

1:05:19

something to work for because

1:05:22

the idea of dreams appeals

1:05:25

to me. But you know, I

1:05:27

don't know if this is coming out the way I want it to

1:05:30

come out of my mouth, but I

1:05:34

like the possibilities. But

1:05:37

then when you get past, when you

1:05:39

reach those goals, what's

1:05:41

next? You know, you have

1:05:43

to come up with new possibilities. I'm

1:05:46

probably not explaining it correct,

1:05:49

but I have a

1:05:51

lot of mental barriers. We'll just say that. Gotcha.

1:05:55

Yeah. I mean, a lot valid, you

1:05:57

know. But one thing.

1:06:00

curious to know like what you

1:06:02

have cooking but one thing that

1:06:04

I can say because I heard you saying

1:06:06

like I have like there's nine cool things

1:06:10

one thing that I'm really trying to do is to

1:06:13

have been very clear what's

1:06:15

the one thing that you wanted to be

1:06:17

perfect I can make

1:06:19

the example for the maker knife which is like obviously

1:06:21

the thing that taught

1:06:23

me the most when

1:06:28

I was looking at like other knives on

1:06:30

Kickstarter they always had

1:06:32

like something else like a bead

1:06:34

holder the the bottle opener all

1:06:37

that stuff but I I was

1:06:39

I took

1:06:42

the risk to just focus on one thing and I wanted

1:06:44

to make a knife to be the quickest thing to you

1:06:47

know to develop to deploy so

1:06:50

that was the only goal I had like and

1:06:53

then not having a bottle opener obviously

1:06:57

it became like marketing because the

1:06:59

Bob's voiceover that said like it

1:07:01

doesn't open bottle that became like

1:07:04

kind of the the fun

1:07:06

thing about it because it's

1:07:09

very like that there's a thing it's called

1:07:11

even like in digital products which is

1:07:13

called like feature creeps like

1:07:15

you think you're making the product better

1:07:17

by adding things but

1:07:20

I think they become those gadgets do

1:07:22

you know like those cards that like

1:07:24

metal cards they look like business cards

1:07:26

and they have like bottle opener a

1:07:29

little not like they have a billion

1:07:31

things have you ever used one

1:07:33

like for the things like you even know

1:07:35

what they make those

1:07:37

are what the things that I call

1:07:39

gadgets so while I'm designing things and

1:07:41

we start like putting more things in

1:07:43

I'm like wait wait wait this is

1:07:46

becoming a gadget that we want let's

1:07:48

focus on the thing that we actually

1:07:50

want this to be

1:07:52

really good at so I

1:07:54

don't know your ideas and I'm I would be very

1:07:57

happy to hear I don't know what your

1:08:00

ideas are for the tape measure, but if it's

1:08:03

like what I can say, make sure it's not

1:08:05

just many

1:08:08

things. Yeah, just crammed in together.

1:08:11

Yeah, that doesn't make it better. Most

1:08:14

of the time. That's

1:08:18

interesting because I mean, that could be a way forward

1:08:20

to simplify that they said it was ambitious,

1:08:22

you know, like maybe simplifying

1:08:24

actually helps in two ways. Yeah,

1:08:28

and ambitious and

1:08:31

probably not a market for something

1:08:33

so high end, right? Because a

1:08:35

tape measure is a disposable item

1:08:38

for the most part. You don't hand down tape measures to

1:08:40

your kids. Yeah, but

1:08:42

so is a screwdriver and so is a utility

1:08:44

knife. I would have

1:08:46

said the exact same thing, but I'm sitting

1:08:49

here with both of these things like at

1:08:51

my disposal all the time and they are

1:08:53

not cheap. They are not, you

1:08:55

know, like nobody is going to go to

1:08:57

Lowe's and buy this knife. But

1:09:01

man, I would try to convince anybody I

1:09:03

know to buy this knife, you know, so

1:09:06

I agree with you. Like it's weird when you,

1:09:09

Jocko is really good at taking things that should

1:09:11

be kind of disposable. They should be Walmart

1:09:14

level. It's not worth paying a lot

1:09:16

for this thing, but then these

1:09:19

particular ones are worth paying a lot for. And

1:09:22

where I might buy these, I might

1:09:25

buy a really nice tape measure because I would use

1:09:27

it all the time. You know,

1:09:29

other people I know wouldn't because it sits in

1:09:32

their garage and they never actually use it. I

1:09:35

think that's one of the realizations I had

1:09:38

when we were talking earlier is that picking

1:09:40

who you're going after, it doesn't

1:09:42

have to be everything for everybody at the same

1:09:44

time. So

1:09:47

yeah, that's weird. Yeah,

1:09:50

I try to imagine what would people

1:09:53

say when they ask them what

1:09:55

does it do? Because

1:09:58

if the tape measure is like... like

1:10:00

okay, let me, do you have 10 minutes? I'm gonna

1:10:02

tell you all the things that this thing does. That

1:10:05

doesn't happen. But for example,

1:10:07

for the maker knife, I'll show

1:10:09

you. Chick, you hear the noise

1:10:11

and it's out and you're like yeah, I want

1:10:13

that. So it's that quick. You get it right

1:10:15

away, right? Yeah. So

1:10:18

that's all like things that I try

1:10:20

to, and the feature creep thing, I

1:10:22

learned it obviously while I was developing

1:10:24

like digital stuff. Because I found

1:10:26

myself like yeah, we can add this. Let's

1:10:28

add this. Like the deadline was always

1:10:31

moving forward because I was adding things

1:10:33

that probably no one used. But

1:10:37

I had the idea that that made it better,

1:10:39

but it actually makes it worse. So luckily I

1:10:41

learned that in digital products where you can make

1:10:43

a little bit more mistakes because you can take

1:10:45

them off afterwards. But like

1:10:48

in products that you can't go

1:10:50

to their house and change it,

1:10:53

you need to be very sure about what you

1:10:55

really want it to have. Yeah,

1:11:00

and that, you just saying

1:11:02

all that stuff probably makes me think

1:11:04

like yeah, there's maybe too many things

1:11:06

about this. There needs to be the

1:11:08

one. Like the

1:11:11

thing that you see it and you get it

1:11:13

right away. Like oh, that's why I need

1:11:15

that. I don't know what those

1:11:17

things are, but just listening to what you

1:11:19

say, I have that feeling. That's why I

1:11:22

said it. Awesome.

1:11:25

I think that's a good spot to stop. If

1:11:27

you want to explain any of that in the

1:11:30

after show, I would be curious as well, but

1:11:32

it may not be after show appropriate. I

1:11:34

want to thank our Patreon supporters. I want to thank Jocko for

1:11:37

hanging out with us. Thank you. Thank you. I want to thank

1:11:39

you guys. I'll thank our

1:11:41

Patreon supporters because they're awesome

1:11:43

and they're here whether Jimmy's here or not.

1:11:46

That's really cool. So big thanks to

1:11:49

everybody over there. Especially the top supporters.

1:11:51

They do go above and beyond. So big

1:11:53

thanks to Crabtree Creative actually who got with

1:11:55

me about the car wrap after I mentioned

1:11:57

it last week. So that was really great.

1:12:00

Thank you for that. Michael Menegin, Warren

1:12:02

Works, Jeff at the New Janky

1:12:04

Workshop, Scott at Dad at Yourself DIY,

1:12:07

Sean Beckner, Odin Leather Goods, Rich

1:12:09

at Low End Designs, Chad's Custom

1:12:11

Creations, Chad from ManCrafting, Works by

1:12:13

Solo, Alberts Woodworks, Cory Ward, and

1:12:16

Nick Ryan. But also

1:12:19

people like Seal Leather

1:12:21

Goods. There's a lot of

1:12:23

people that support us, and we're grateful for all

1:12:25

of them. And they all get the after show, no

1:12:28

matter what level they support. I don't know what we're

1:12:30

going to talk about today, but it's usually secret stuff,

1:12:33

other stuff that doesn't fit the

1:12:35

show. So if you want to get that, you

1:12:37

go to patreon.com/making it and

1:12:39

help us out. We would be very grateful. So

1:12:42

since Jimmy's not here to give a recommendation,

1:12:45

do you have anything cool that you want

1:12:47

to recommend other people check out, Jaco?

1:12:49

Me? Videos? Yeah.

1:12:52

Videos, books, anything that's interesting to you right now? If

1:12:55

you go first, I'm going to try to think about it. I

1:12:58

wasn't prepared. Okay. David,

1:13:00

you got anything? Yeah, so this is

1:13:02

a YouTube channel called YC Imaging. He's

1:13:06

a creator. He's very

1:13:09

into beautiful video.

1:13:11

He makes music videos, but

1:13:13

he documents the process. Sometimes

1:13:15

he talks about equipment or whatever. I

1:13:18

just... He's

1:13:23

just got good style, that's all. So

1:13:26

if you're into cinema

1:13:29

stuff, beautiful video, this is a good channel

1:13:31

to check out. Awesome.

1:13:36

I just started following... So the other day

1:13:38

I was asking people on Instagram about graffiti.

1:13:42

And I'm not necessarily going to start doing graffiti.

1:13:44

It was more of one of those like, how

1:13:47

does somebody learn how to do that? How

1:13:50

do you practice that? Where does that come from? Not

1:13:53

the vandalism part, the art part. And

1:13:56

so I asked people about it and I got all

1:13:58

these responses. from people, all

1:14:01

different things. Like some people were

1:14:03

art teachers, some people were graffiti

1:14:05

artists, some people watched graffiti artists. And

1:14:08

so I got all these recommendations of channels. One of

1:14:10

them was really cool and I started following it and

1:14:12

I cannot remember what it's called. I'll have to look

1:14:14

it up. I'll put it

1:14:16

in the show notes. But a

1:14:19

lot of the other response was, if

1:14:22

you're thinking about getting into painting, like

1:14:25

spray painting graffiti, you have to start with

1:14:27

letter form and pencil. It

1:14:30

was really cool. I had several people tell me this exact same

1:14:32

process. You start with a pencil

1:14:34

and paper, start drawing letters, and

1:14:36

then start realizing what you like about the

1:14:38

way letters are shaped and how you can

1:14:40

change those to make them what you want

1:14:43

with a single

1:14:45

line pencil. And

1:14:48

then once you find shapes that you like,

1:14:50

then you start adding in like

1:14:53

a thicker pencil or you start shading so that you

1:14:55

have drop shadow. And then you just take the same

1:14:57

letter forms over and over and you add drop shadow

1:14:59

to them, start to get the dimension to it. Then

1:15:02

you move up to pens that have variable width

1:15:04

and then you start, and then

1:15:06

you move to this and then you move to this and then

1:15:08

you move to paint. And it was really

1:15:10

cool hearing people who knew what they were talking

1:15:13

about answer a question like that. And like, yes,

1:15:15

this is a very long artistic exploration to get

1:15:17

from learning how to create

1:15:20

letter forms that you like all

1:15:23

the way through building up on that to be

1:15:25

able to do a mural of those letters in

1:15:28

an artistic way. It was really cool. So

1:15:30

great feedback from people. Thank you for that. All

1:15:33

that to say, I don't remember what the

1:15:35

name of the channel is. I can't really

1:15:37

give you the recommendation. So instead, I'm gonna

1:15:40

recommend, excuse me, I'm gonna recommend this

1:15:42

book by our friend

1:15:44

Andrew Huang. Make Your Own

1:15:47

Rules. He's an incredible musician and creator.

1:15:49

He makes awesome videos. He makes like

1:15:51

sound plugins and apps and all sorts of stuff.

1:15:54

And he wrote a book about

1:15:56

his experiences. And I am very

1:15:58

excited, very excited. Whoa,

1:16:01

he has a quote on

1:16:03

the back of it. There's

1:16:05

a quote right there about

1:16:08

this book from JJ Abrams.

1:16:10

And BT. That's wild. Good for

1:16:12

you, Andrew. Anyway, I'll put a link to the book.

1:16:14

There's audiobook and printed and all that type of stuff.

1:16:16

Go check it out. I have a

1:16:18

recommendation. Okay. What you got? So,

1:16:21

you know, we all know chat GPT,

1:16:23

right? Now

1:16:26

they put out like basically

1:16:28

apps. I think they call them GPTs. And

1:16:32

there is one that it's called like

1:16:35

the name is consensus, which

1:16:38

basically like makes

1:16:41

the knowledge base of chat GPTs

1:16:44

of the AI makes

1:16:46

it scientific papers. So

1:16:48

when you're talking with chat GPT, the

1:16:51

knowledge base is scientific paper. So you can ask all

1:16:53

kinds of things like you want to know what

1:16:58

studies are out there that people done

1:17:00

about like a specific thing and

1:17:03

it search all the papers and it

1:17:05

gives you just, you know, a

1:17:07

little brief about it. And you

1:17:09

can ask a question about those things. And I'm

1:17:11

super obsessed. Like in the last two months,

1:17:14

that's like the app I'm going the most like

1:17:17

my doom scrolling. I do it in there.

1:17:19

Like I just asked a question about things.

1:17:22

It's so nice. Like it's

1:17:25

really about everything. Like

1:17:28

lately I've been obsessed with like vitamins,

1:17:31

like taking the right vitamins for

1:17:35

things like to feel better and all that stuff. And

1:17:38

I'm like I

1:17:41

go there for like hours reading papers

1:17:43

and asking questions because normally when you're

1:17:45

reading papers, they're like super bad. They're

1:17:47

not even formatted like they're they're paying

1:17:49

to read. But now you

1:17:51

have like the AI to ask question like

1:17:53

if you don't understand something and then you

1:17:55

start knowing other things. It's so, so nice.

1:17:58

It's really exciting. You

1:18:00

talking about Home Depot? Yeah. A

1:18:06

guy came to pick up those blue bars that I

1:18:09

made over the last several months and

1:18:11

showed up right now. So I had to go help him load the truck.

1:18:15

So that's your recommendation, having a truck? Yes.

1:18:17

Oh, the recommendation. What's

1:18:20

my recommendation? I thought I had a good one. Let

1:18:23

me take a quick look. I'm sorry, guys. I

1:18:26

actually just struck through your name in the show

1:18:28

notes and just put Jocko so you don't even

1:18:30

have to come up with one. Okay, that's actually

1:18:32

probably better. Yeah,

1:18:35

so if you can come up with somebody,

1:18:37

you can tell everybody in the aftershow about it. We'll

1:18:39

go ahead and do that. Okay. All right, you talking

1:18:41

about me? Yeah, yeah. Jocko,

1:18:44

thanks for hanging out with us. I was

1:18:46

going to recommend, check out the video, the

1:18:48

shop tips of my dad. It's a beautiful

1:18:50

video. Yeah, thank you. I've

1:18:53

been getting so many compliments on it. I've

1:18:56

been collecting tips, and in fact, I left so many

1:18:58

out just because I got kind of wrapped up in

1:19:00

the idea of the ultimate video. I

1:19:03

started collecting shop tips on my dad and putting them together,

1:19:05

and on Saturday, I started shooting them. In

1:19:07

the beginning of the day, I was like,

1:19:09

this video is going to be so fast

1:19:12

and rather boring. And it occurred to

1:19:14

me that I have all this footage of my dad for the

1:19:16

last year or two. Every time I hung out with

1:19:18

him, I just put the camera on in the car. He

1:19:21

had no idea I was filming. He's

1:19:24

pretty unguarded anyway, even when he is being filmed. So,

1:19:27

it was just really, I

1:19:29

thought it would be a nice idea to just put these

1:19:31

clips of him in between. It set off the whole tone

1:19:33

and it changed the whole tone. It

1:19:36

was really nice the way it came

1:19:38

together, and I'm really proud of it. It's

1:19:40

funny, I showed Rachel and she was just

1:19:42

like totally in tears, and then I started

1:19:44

getting emotional about it. And

1:19:47

then as I tweaked it, I got more

1:19:49

emotional, but right up until I saw how

1:19:51

it was affecting her as the first person to see

1:19:54

it. I was like, wow. And then I've

1:19:56

been getting some really beautiful notes about people who can

1:19:58

identify. in one way or another. So

1:20:01

thank you all for watching. And if you haven't seen it, go take a

1:20:03

look. Yeah, go watch it. It's fantastic.

1:20:05

I keep fiddling with the thumbnail, just to try and

1:20:07

get more views. So like one minute it might be

1:20:09

a picture of a hammer. The next minute it's a

1:20:11

picture of me and my dad. So

1:20:14

who knows? Nothing works. Word

1:20:16

of mouth. Yeah, that's you too. That's

1:20:19

it. Cool. That's my

1:20:21

recommendation, me. Yeah. Excellent. All

1:20:25

right, cool. Well, thanks for listening everybody and

1:20:28

we'll see you next time. Thank you. Bye.