0:00

Coming closer . That's

0:02

a good way to start the podcast off . Welcome to Married

0:04

to Growth .

0:05

Come closer honey , I

0:07

miss you .

0:08

I'm a vlogger now .

0:10

You are a vlogger . You're vlogging

0:12

away . You're still not in your own vlog , though

0:14

.

0:15

I'll get there , all right .

0:16

Anyway , welcome to another episode of Married with

0:18

. To Growth . Married with . Married

0:21

with .

0:21

Married with . Married with .

0:22

Married with Perry , married

0:25

to Perry and accompanied by

0:28

Kat . Don't worry , who is

0:30

joining us from Washington DC

0:32

. She is a sell

0:35

it like Sir Hand , director and

0:38

Badass . Branding Badass

0:41

.

0:42

I love that title . Yeah , I'm going to update my business

0:44

card .

0:44

Maybe I think you like it Because you like a little bit .

0:46

Actually , you're the third person to describe me as a branding

0:49

badass , so I think that there's something there .

0:51

Yeah , I mean , while you coach people on building

0:53

brands . Yeah , I do .

0:54

And the Andy Rebeck . I'm like let's get you out there . Yeah

0:56

, Thank you .

0:57

I thought we could see things though . You've

1:00

got a team , Perry , that's growing . You

1:02

lead a team . I am growing

1:05

a team to lead .

1:07

All phases of the growth , all phases of team . You

1:09

lead the family team , babe .

1:11

I do lead the family team , like Grace

1:13

the dog culture , the human culture

1:15

, and I thought we'd talk about building culture

1:17

, which now I

1:20

like . I said what I hate when people say you

1:22

don't build culture , you have

1:24

culture , correct , and you kind

1:26

of conform it and mold it

1:29

and cultivate it . That's a good word

1:31

, I like that verb .

1:32

It's a Wisconsin word because we have a lot of cultivation

1:34

in Wisconsin , a lot of farmland .

1:36

You guys do yes yeah .

1:37

And you're cultivating culture and

1:39

how you cultivate it into a culture

1:42

that people want to be a part of , because

1:44

you can also cultivate a toxic culture

1:47

. You could , yeah . So

1:51

what are your guys's thoughts on a cultivating

1:55

culture ?

1:58

How do

2:00

you see culture

2:03

being built as like a team scale

2:06

, like a small team to ?

2:07

big team right .

2:07

So like as you go from solo Pannu

2:10

or to your first employee to

2:12

a team of 10 . And

2:14

I think you said , Sir Hans , out like a team of 50 . How

2:17

do you like ? Culture

2:19

needs to shift and change over time , I

2:21

think , as the team scales

2:23

too so how do you see that

2:26

like playing out ?

2:28

Well , how big was , sir Hans ? When you started , I

2:31

was employee number six .

2:32

Okay , another 50 .

2:33

Ryan was the first one .

2:36

Well , kyle , technically .

2:37

So , like Kyle Scott is our president .

2:41

He founded Ventures together

2:43

with Ryan and then Sydney

2:45

Sherman , who you know . Sydney , she's

2:48

fantastic Personal trainer . Yeah , you've met Sydney . Community

2:52

builder and trainer . Yeah , so Sydney was employee number two

2:54

. She's now

2:56

Ryan's personal CRM Customer Relationship Management Like that is

2:58

literally her title . He has a human CRM . And

3:02

then there was RAF , who's employee number three

3:04

, and then a few other folks , and I think it was six or seven . John

3:07

Sean , who was our social guy for quite some time , and

3:10

now he's actually an agent in production

3:12

on our Elsa's Soon's team .

3:14

I started when it was just . I joined that

3:16

community when it was

3:18

just Kyle

3:20

RAF and Sydney . Yeah , my

3:22

like branding pro call was the three

3:24

of them .

3:26

So let's do this how

3:30

have you experienced the culture change

3:32

? Yeah , and how have you experienced the culture

3:34

change as a client side ? I

3:36

love that question .

3:38

Okay , yeah , so here's what I'll first say about

3:40

culture , because I think it is so

3:42

important yet it is so . It

3:45

is such a term that is haphazardly thrown

3:47

around , especially since COVID , and

3:49

I want to bring some more intentionality and responsibility

3:52

and ownership , like an ownership mindset , one of your

3:54

values , perry to it , and

3:57

I think , like you were saying , alitha

3:59

, you don't build culture , you have

4:01

it and it's just cultivating awareness around

4:03

it , because I think culture is a co-creation

4:06

process . The culture of

4:08

SirHant when I joined was

4:10

a certain way , because there were legitimately

4:13

six or seven of us . Any

4:15

time , you bring in a new personality , new

4:18

energy , new experience , new

4:20

traumas and triggers and new

4:22

biases all of these things . It

4:24

influences the environment and it influences

4:27

the culture . So to think that , as

4:29

a leader or a CEO , you

4:31

wrote a culture statement five years ago

4:33

it's not a static thing , it's

4:36

a living , breathing thing , and I look at it as very

4:38

similarly to and this just literally came through

4:40

as I was like listening to you intro

4:42

that the way that I look at brand

4:44

. Everybody has a personal brand . You

4:47

just may not be aware of

4:49

what personal brand is being assigned

4:51

to you by people , because you are unintentionally just

4:54

going about your life and going about your business and you're not

4:56

talking about just entrepreneurs having a personal

4:58

brand , like literally everyone has a personal

5:00

brand , absolutely . Because personal

5:03

brand can be synonymous with personal reputation

5:05

, personal impressions . Like you , you

5:08

describing me as branding badass I

5:10

didn't tell you to say that , you said that because that was

5:12

your impression of me or

5:14

are you like the girl who

5:17

is the one to , like , plan all the parties ? Are

5:19

you the guy that , like , knows how to plan the guy's

5:22

trips Right ? Like you're the one

5:24

who , like everybody , has a personal brand and everybody

5:26

has a

5:29

culture . Like you've got a personal culture , that how

5:31

you are with yourself , your values , your framework

5:33

, and then , the moment you get two people in

5:35

a room , you've got a co-creation process

5:37

around culture . And I think it's

5:39

this thing that is

5:42

very subtle and

5:44

very nebulous , but very powerful , and I think

5:47

it constantly invites

5:49

an opportunity to examine

5:51

it , to foster

5:54

it , to nurture it , to cultivate it . It's not a static

5:56

thing , and I think that that's where people

5:58

miss the mark . They think that if they write

6:00

a culture statement , or a mission statement on their website and

6:03

, as they grow from six employees to 40

6:05

something that we have now that it was the

6:07

same when it was just like Kyle , Raff

6:09

and Sidney in the basement of Serham Ventures at

6:11

. Zoho HQ . Like no , you have

6:13

so many other personalities influencing

6:16

and co-creating that cultural environment that

6:19

it requires

6:21

, or would be beneficial

6:23

, to always do like a checkup

6:25

on it and a maintenance and a tune

6:27

up .

6:29

And I think , if you are and

6:31

this is something I've taken into consideration a lot more

6:33

as I bring people onto my team not

6:35

just hiring for the

6:37

person , the role , the job

6:39

, but are they a good fit

6:41

for where we see our culture going

6:44

?

6:44

Right .

6:44

It allows you to be a little bit more , a lot

6:46

more intentful with the

6:49

path that you're on .

6:50

Absolutely . And Well , you're cultivating

6:52

, right , yeah , so it's like fertilizer .

6:57

And I wonder , when I got hired to Accenture , were

6:59

they looking at me at a culture fit

7:01

? Like , are they at a company at that size

7:04

? You know they had what 300,000 employees probably

7:06

when I got hired , like , are they like , oh , this

7:08

peri guy , he's a good culture

7:10

fit . Or is it like

7:12

a sense of feeling that my boss just

7:14

had ? It's curious

7:16

because , you know , when I was hiring my

7:19

first a couple of employees

7:21

, it's like I like them as a person . I

7:23

wasn't looking at them . Hey , this is , they're

7:26

gonna be a good part of our culture a few years down

7:28

the road . But now that I'm at that point

7:30

where we have a team

7:32

it's not two or three people , we

7:34

have five people in our

7:36

core business Now it's like , okay , I wanna make sure

7:39

that they're also good fit culture-wise

7:41

. Do you find

7:43

that you work with a bunch

7:45

of different businesses ? Do you find that people kind of

7:47

shift in and out of hiring for culture

7:50

dependent on size ?

7:52

That's a really good question . I think

7:55

, as organizations

7:57

grow like if it's just the founder

7:59

or the CEO or the leader doing the hiring

8:01

directly , I think there will be an element

8:03

of gut instinct of

8:06

intuition , of like yeah , like automatic

8:08

culture check , because it's just in their background at

8:10

the break , because it's just two people . There's

8:12

my values , framework and my vision for

8:14

the company to consider . And then there's like do

8:16

I like you as a person ? You're married

8:18

, you're a dog person , you live in Milwaukee

8:20

. Like we have shared common

8:23

ground and values , like we can vibe right

8:25

. I think as organizations

8:28

grow and this is my parents

8:30

were career CEOs and they're public servants . They

8:32

worked for the government at a county level

8:34

what I've noticed from

8:36

them and what I've noticed from other larger organizations

8:38

, is that as you grow , the senior

8:40

leadership , the

8:43

circle that reports directly to the CEO

8:45

or the board or whatever it is it's really

8:48

important . Those are your most important hires

8:50

Because they're the ones

8:52

that are managing the team and if your senior

8:54

leadership are excellent , culture

8:56

fits . You know that they're only going

8:59

to hire people that are

9:01

aligned with how they see things . And if

9:03

your senior leadership is aligned with the culture , it

9:06

will trickle down Not always

9:08

, because everything's not perfect and human beings

9:10

are imperfect . But I

9:12

think the challenge is

9:14

, as organizations

9:17

grow I've seen it

9:19

become very quickly a house of cards

9:21

when you are constantly hiring

9:23

from outside and you're not hiring

9:25

from within . You use the word cultivate . I

9:28

love success stories and I see a lot

9:30

of successful organizations where you

9:33

hear how they started as a customer service

9:35

rep and then they became a manager and then

9:37

they became a director and then they became VP and

9:39

the stability of

9:41

bringing people in and

9:43

nurturing them Like they're the right energy fit

9:46

, the right culture fit . We can teach you anything . We

9:48

can't teach you attitude . We can't

9:50

teach you values .

9:51

Well , I think too that it's

9:53

almost an insurance policy for culture

9:55

when you hire from within , absolutely

9:57

Because you've already put them through

9:59

essentially the test run in another position

10:02

Exactly that they know

10:04

where the company's headed , they know what's tolerated

10:06

, what's not tolerated , what kind of toxic

10:08

, what toxic means to that organization

10:11

, because it can mean different things to different

10:13

organizations . And so hiring

10:15

from within kind of

10:17

ensures that you're

10:19

not all of a sudden gonna put this linchpin

10:23

in there , that's gonna . You're

10:26

pulling out the linchpin and everything's unraveling

10:28

because now you have this one person in there . That's toxic

10:31

and not in line with

10:34

the core values and the core culture

10:36

of the company

10:38

. Because I also think that hiring

10:41

is so difficult , especially

10:43

for organizations as they get larger and

10:45

more known , because

10:48

it is very easy to peruse

10:50

a company's Instagram and

10:52

what they're posting and then

10:54

be able to emulate

10:57

and kind of fill

10:59

in that this is what's important

11:01

to you during an interview versus

11:04

living . It is totally different

11:06

. And so when you hire from within , you've

11:08

already essentially watched

11:10

that person live those values

11:12

and you know for sure that that's

11:15

gonna continue . But interviewing

11:18

someone and having that person and I've done this

11:20

with the team of like I have a really

11:22

one of my core values is

11:24

growth and learning . I'm

11:27

a very learning based human and

11:31

I've interviewed agents that are like , oh

11:34

yeah , I'm always listening to podcasts . Then

11:38

I come to find out no , that's just , they're just

11:40

saying that because they know from my Instagram that that's

11:42

important to me .

11:43

They don't actually live that .

11:44

Yeah , and so I think when you hire from within

11:46

, you've already ensured that that person is living that

11:49

and the risk that you're taking is

11:51

far smaller ?

11:52

Yeah , yeah , that's a great

11:54

call out . I didn't even think about that , um

11:57

, but it's like similar to dating , right ? You can

11:59

only pretend to be somebody else for so long and

12:02

the more public facing you are as a

12:04

company , the more likely you open yourself up to

12:06

those situations . And

12:08

I think when I was

12:10

saying , like culture is a co-creation process , like , and

12:12

you do hire from within , you know you already have

12:15

the relationship but the person has

12:17

that relationship with the company . They also have

12:19

relationships with everybody . So you just

12:21

think of it like from a visual , like if you've got somebody down here

12:23

and they're building all these relationships and then

12:25

you you elevate them to

12:27

a manager or a directorial and then you elevate them , you're

12:29

like literally pulling people up from entry

12:33

level to senior level and it's just creating

12:35

this beautiful like . I almost think

12:37

we should make like a graphic for that , but like it's rising tide

12:39

, right , we were talking about that . You

12:42

are investing in your people and like rewarding

12:45

them for the work that they've been

12:47

doing them being culture advocates . The

12:50

other thing , too , is that and I think this is why

12:52

it's so tricky and maybe why people kind of turn away from it is

12:55

that you can't fake

12:57

culture . No , it's

13:00

, it's like trying to like fake it on a first date . Like

13:02

people can smell it from a mile away , and it doesn't work

13:04

.

13:05

I mean , we all know those companies that are like we're

13:07

family here . It's like culture

13:09

, toxicity 101 . If

13:12

you have to say it , you're not , you

13:14

know , like you don't meet a family

13:16

in real life , an actual family

13:19

, that's like , oh , we're a family . No shit , you're a family

13:21

. I know because you're a family Right .

13:22

You show through action .

13:23

Right , we have a great culture . We

13:26

have a culture like when you're advertising

13:28

your culture , it's probably smoking mirrors

13:30

. When you're living

13:33

your culture , it's people

13:36

flock to you , people flock to you and it's inert

13:38

and it's so much part

13:40

of you know , the culture is so ingrained

13:43

in the values and and how

13:45

the company operates that you're not advertising

13:47

it because you on paper , because

13:49

you're living it , you know , you're

13:51

living it out . You walk

13:53

into the office and people are , you know

13:56

, are always smiling and excited . You

13:59

can feel you know when you walk into it and

14:01

somebody's having a really bad day and you , they don't even

14:03

need to tell you they're having a bad day . When

14:05

you walk into a company with a bad culture

14:07

, nobody needs to say it . They can have

14:09

all the values posted on the wall , but

14:12

you can just feel it the

14:14

minute you walk in where the

14:17

companies that have really I feel . I think the

14:19

companies that have really great culture don't

14:22

necessarily advertise the values

14:24

in the culture . You just feel it because

14:26

everyone's living it .

14:27

There was a moment it was sometime

14:30

last year , like late last year , and I

14:33

there's a member on my team that I

14:35

I was meeting with them weekly because they were full-time

14:37

, we just hired them a few months ago and

14:40

we hopped on our weekly Zoom and I

14:42

had an agenda right and I

14:44

and I always invite whoever

14:47

I'm meeting with if I'm managing them , like not

14:49

managing them , you manage problems , not people . If I'm

14:51

like working with them to add

14:53

stuff on the agenda , I want it to be collaborative . But

14:55

we hopped on and I could just immediately tell

14:57

there was something off . Like

15:00

I started in on a few things but I I like

15:02

stopped the meeting like a few minutes and I was like I

15:04

was like what's wrong , I was like what's going on ? I was like because you're

15:06

not here . I was like and I'm concerned and

15:08

you're normally not like that , because their work ethic

15:11

is incredible , which I have massive respect for and

15:13

they ended up sharing something

15:15

very personal that they were going through and

15:18

months later and I didn't think anything

15:21

of it , I was like I canceled the meeting . I was like we're

15:23

going to reschedule , yeah , take

15:25

the rest of the day , do whatever you need to do to

15:27

get done today , and then just leave it for the rest

15:29

of the week . And then I

15:31

remember , like months later they

15:33

brought that up and they were like that was

15:35

the moment that like I became like your soldier

15:37

, like like the loyalty was cemented

15:39

because you didn't give a shit about the agenda

15:42

. You saw them as a human , I saw

15:44

them as a human and I sensed that like something

15:46

was off and I was like if you're off , like

15:48

selfishly as a leader , if you're off

15:50

, you're not in it , You're not going to enjoy

15:53

doing it , your work is going to suffer , You're going to be

15:55

miserable , You're going to be resentful and hate it and like I

15:57

don't want to be in that type of environment . Right

15:59

, Um , and I do that now , like there

16:01

it's every now and then , like I'll

16:03

get on a meeting and I'm like like what's going on ? Cause

16:06

we're remote . Right , I've always been remote

16:08

with surhand , so I feel that

16:10

in a remote world , hybrid

16:12

world , whatever you want to say like it's easier to

16:14

feel culture more viscerally

16:16

in an office setting .

16:17

Yeah .

16:18

Right , even if it's like an open bullpen setting whatever

16:20

remote . It's even more

16:22

important because people are just in their homes all

16:24

day on zoom .

16:25

Mm-hmm oh right . And

16:28

I think that's where you know there's all

16:30

these companies right now that are like well

16:32

, you need to be back in the office because you , you know , so

16:34

we can build culture . You fucking have

16:36

culture , whether you have it Zoom

16:38

. If people are excited to log in

16:40

and they're , you know , they're logging on their Zoom call

16:43

five minutes early that means they're excited

16:45

to reconnect with the people that they they

16:47

are engaging with at work . You do

16:49

not have to be in person to to have culture

16:51

, you just don't .

16:52

Well , it's like you

16:55

know , I think a lot of the lacking culture ends

16:57

up coming around just voice

16:59

, only calls .

17:00

But there's no lacking culture . There's just

17:02

a more toxic culture

17:04

than there is a positive culture . There's always a

17:06

culture .

17:07

Yeah , but I still think it

17:09

leads from the top of like then always have your camera

17:12

on . It's like , hey , it's

17:14

our , it's our company's policy of like cameras always

17:16

on right Because you can

17:18

. You can see someone's energy way better than you

17:20

can hear it and you can feel it in person better than

17:22

you can see it .

17:23

So that does help the connection

17:25

points , for sure you can see if their

17:27

baby's crying and you know the nanny called

17:29

, or the dogs freaking out like , and

17:31

it's yeah , or there's a dog fight in the background

17:33

. That happened once on one of Paris Coulson , oh my

17:35

.

17:36

And one that was exciting .

17:38

Yeah , so I'm working

17:40

on a Kina right now . I shared this with you guys , right ? We've got an

17:42

upcoming massive event in Miami and

17:45

I met with our live producer last week

17:47

and we're just like spitballing and brainstorming about

17:49

what I want to make you know what to be

17:51

about and I'll , like you know , I told you

17:53

guys give you a little hints , but I'll , I'll leave the audience waiting

17:56

. But the one quote

17:58

that I did want to include in it is from one of my

18:00

favorite leadership speakers

18:02

, simon Sinek , which , if you've not heard

18:05

, of Simon Sinek I know you guys have

18:07

in like everybody listening . Like please

18:09

go watch him on Diary of CEO

18:11

with Steven . Go read his book YouTube

18:13

, Like YouTube . Yeah , YouTube shorts . It

18:16

was so fantastic . So one of my

18:18

favorite more recent quotes from

18:20

him was he was doing one of his last public speaking engagements

18:23

, like in London at the Four Seasons Leadership

18:25

Conference and Four . Seasons is one of those brands , like

18:27

Dior , that has been around for a long

18:29

time and they've been able to adapt

18:32

and elevate and evolve and still attract a younger

18:34

generation and still show growth and profit

18:37

. Like culture does have an ROI , by the

18:39

way , for the CEO's listening Like um

18:41

, and the quote that he said that

18:43

I really enjoy is that he's

18:45

like I meet with leaders all day long and they at

18:47

the number one question that I hear that just makes me grate

18:50

my teeth is that they ask how do you

18:52

get , how , simon , how do we get the most out of

18:54

our people ? And he's like using it . You

18:56

guys can't see me , but he's like using his hands , like like he's

18:58

ringing out a towel ? Yeah , Like this is a human

19:00

being . You're trying to ring out like giving blood from

19:02

a stone .

19:03

Yeah .

19:04

And he's like that's the wrong question . He's like ask the better question . And the better

19:06

question is how

19:08

do you create an environment ? Cause culture

19:11

is an environment that allows

19:13

people to want to show up as their

19:15

best selves , that inspires them without

19:18

pressuring them to do amazing

19:20

work to find purpose and to like

19:22

live their calling . And

19:24

that's , that's the power of culture

19:26

, that it's the invisible glue . And

19:29

, if you want to talk about from an ROI or a

19:31

P , a POE standpoint , yeah

19:34

, that's right . As you said , yeah

19:36

, prevention of expense

19:38

. Prevention of expense . The

19:40

average statistic is that it takes four

19:42

to five X any given employee's salary

19:45

to replace them .

19:46

Well , and I think that's where so I'm quoting

19:48

this we're putting it out in public that Pete

19:50

, the phrase POE prevention of expense started

19:52

with Alitha . Champagne is the equivalent

19:55

, that the opposite of ROI

19:57

. Right , you have a you , you spend money to get

19:59

a return . The other thing is is

20:01

you can not spend money

20:03

. Essentially , you know you

20:05

, by by failing to invest in your people

20:08

, you're actually causing a great

20:10

expense . So the

20:12

goal is not just to increase your

20:14

ROI , but also to

20:16

prevent an expense . And

20:18

, like you said , it costs so much more money

20:20

to replace somebody , so much more known

20:23

this for years . Yeah To

20:25

replace somebody than it does to

20:27

retain and invest in that

20:29

person , and I think that so many

20:31

people go into the well , if you don't like

20:34

it here , just leave , okay

20:36

. Well , as a leader , it's your job

20:38

to ask why do my people not like

20:40

it here and how do I change

20:42

it ? Because if , if your people

20:44

leave , the next people will

20:46

also leave , and if they don't

20:49

, then it is likely that they fall

20:51

into the same toxicity that is

20:53

your environment that you've created and

20:55

it's probably not going to . It's going to end up

20:57

decreasing your ROI , as

21:00

opposed to self-reflecting

21:03

as a leader , asking why your people

21:05

are wanting to leave , asking why they're

21:07

you know , they're even broaching

21:10

that issue with you and

21:12

and saying , okay , how can we , how

21:14

can I prevent the expense of replacing

21:17

you and rather

21:19

invest into you ? Because if

21:21

your people are leaving , your culture is not great

21:24

. I mean , it's end of story

21:26

.

21:26

If it , yeah , if it's more , and like my

21:28

, my rule is that like if it's a one-off

21:30

, okay , it's a one-off .

21:31

Obviously . There's always , you know , but there's always the people

21:33

that think the grass is greener for sure , or the

21:35

money's greater , or something .

21:37

But if there are and I am very much

21:39

like honed in on noticing patterns

21:41

and trends like I , you know , overseeing the program

21:44

at Serhant , we have 200

21:46

plus clients at any given time like coming

21:48

into the program during the headlights , they get into

21:50

emotion and it's amazing , or they're leaving

21:52

the program , and trends

21:55

and patterns like pay attention , like your people

21:57

are telling you exactly what you need to hear . It's just are

21:59

you being , are you able to be humble

22:02

and self-aware and

22:04

curious enough to not take it personally

22:07

and then to truly be like

22:09

no , I , I started this whole thing

22:11

, I got all these people here like you take ownership

22:13

of it . And it's like why are multiple people saying

22:16

the same pieces of feedback ? What am I here to learn

22:18

? Because that's like

22:20

to take it back to . Like our favorite motto rising tide lifts

22:22

all ships . Those are like holes in the ship and you're taken on

22:24

water and you're going to be weighed down and you're

22:26

not going to grow , you're not going to move forward .

22:28

And it's far more expensive to repair the ship than

22:31

it is to keep it afloat in the beginning . 100%

22:33

, yeah , I think

22:35

. I think , like

22:37

you said in the beginning , culture is such

22:40

a buzzword now since COVID , because everyone's

22:42

like how do we maintain culture when

22:44

people are at Zoom and how do we , you

22:46

know , like , how do we make this hybrid work environment

22:49

or let you move to

22:51

DC when we're based in New York and we

22:53

don't have to be ? You know , how do we like

22:56

the culture , culture , culture , and it's like , like

22:58

I said when we were talking offline

23:00

, culture exists in every

23:02

organization . It's not

23:04

something that you build as

23:06

the second . You know the

23:09

individual person , right ? When Ryan

23:11

Serhan was an individual human

23:13

, he had his own values and morals

23:16

and compass and things like that . The second

23:18

, he brought on a second person . Those

23:20

values then become a culture immediately

23:23

, because it's essentially the exchanging

23:26

of values and the

23:28

alignment of values between

23:30

people . And so when

23:32

you have a toxic culture , it's

23:34

because people's values are at

23:37

war with one another and

23:39

so hiring becomes so

23:42

specific when it comes to hey

23:44

, these are our values and this is how we live them

23:46

. And also , I just taught a class with new

23:48

agents saying you need to know

23:50

your mission , vision values as an individual

23:52

agent . If you're on a team , you need to know

23:54

your team's mission vision values , because

23:56

of your vision and values of

23:59

where you live today , which is

24:01

you know your values and where you

24:03

want to be in five years , are not in

24:05

alignment with your team . You are on

24:07

the wrong team and that culture

24:09

then will be at war and

24:12

your business will not thrive . Their

24:14

business will not thrive and

24:16

you know . I think it's so important

24:18

to understand that

24:21

it's .

24:21

it exists , culture exists regardless

24:24

of whether or not and Perry , you

24:26

do an excellent job of this , like

24:28

you were showing me your kind of like

24:30

your core document

24:32

, that you put so much thought and intention

24:35

into it and you give it to everybody right

24:37

.

24:37

Everyone , everyone like members

24:39

, members and and staff

24:42

and coaches .

24:42

Oh , I didn't know it does go to our members , but it goes

24:45

to our staff , our coaches , our partners

24:47

.

24:48

You were . You were working on putting it all up on

24:50

an art piece , weren't you All the

24:53

core values and stuff I was on ?

24:55

the mission and all that stuff I'm going to put up somewhere

24:57

in the academy . I just need to find the right , aesthetically

24:59

pleasing spot to put that .

25:01

Yes .

25:02

So I was actually just at a conference

25:04

in Tampa where it was extra

25:07

humid .

25:07

I'm sure the other week , and welcome to .

25:09

Florida . I'm having an aha right

25:11

now around the

25:13

presenters and my business coaches were talking about how we have two different

25:15

types of relationships transactional and transformational . I was just sitting there and figuring out

25:17

how to vote that I can go as highway or gas or a mile or a mile or four such or and or a long search

25:19

of what I might as well . And I'm thinking

25:22

about like this whole culture thing and really a what

25:25

I'm gonna say what most people want to see

25:27

out of a Good culture

25:30

and we'll use that as a broad term is

25:32

the relationships amongst

25:34

your team to be transformational versus

25:36

transactional yeah and I

25:39

think with , without

25:41

being in person , it's

25:44

more challenging to

25:46

be that , to have those transformational

25:49

Relationships across the

25:51

organization . You might have them with like one or

25:53

two people Right , like the person you

25:55

have one-on-ones with or your

25:57

direct team , but it how

26:00

man , it's so challenging

26:02

that how do you Cultivate

26:05

it ? So there are more transformational

26:08

relationships versus Transactional

26:10

relationships within your organization . Culture

26:14

, to me , is one of those things where it's a very

26:16

Abstract

26:19

totally like you can't just hey

26:21

here my steps one , two , three , four , five on how

26:23

I do it . But what are some of your

26:25

favorite ways to Build

26:29

culture and ways that you've seen

26:31

? You know , sir hand , to build culture

26:33

amongst . You know the teams

26:36

in the groups .

26:37

So one of the things well , two

26:39

, two initiatives that I kind of like started with

26:41

Ryan's former executive assistant

26:43

at the time . Shout out to Kelly , if you're listening to this is

26:48

Two things . We launched an

26:50

internal kind of training series called

26:52

amp hour , where it was only

26:54

for full-time Employees

26:57

on the ventures and the brokerage side , because

26:59

ventures is separate from brokerage . But I look at all

27:01

of us as a team like I don't distinguish

27:03

between You're a W2 employee or

27:05

even 1099 , like I treat , I

27:08

treat our contract . They're part of the team you're , you're

27:10

helping us grow and like serve clients

27:13

and do good and make money . So like you're a team

27:15

member regardless of your tax status . But

27:17

amp hour was specifically open

27:19

to full-time employees on both sides

27:21

and I had just had

27:23

this epiphany and I was talking to Kelly . So

27:26

, like back in December , I was like we have an insane

27:28

amount of talent . Ryan's

27:31

vegan , building his brand

27:33

and using it as a way to attract

27:35

and retain talent is Unlike

27:38

very few other individuals

27:40

that I have seen . I was like and yet we

27:42

are also focused all the time of pouring

27:45

our talent into our external

27:47

initiatives . We're also focused

27:49

on sales . We're also focused

27:51

on the customers the customers always right

27:53

. The client is always right , and while I do like my

27:55

hospitality background , I do prescribe

27:58

to that . I was like let's let our

28:00

team pour into each other .

28:02

Mm-hmm .

28:02

So we launched a monthly amp hour where

28:04

we would choose one individual . It would be kind of like

28:06

you could nominate or volunteer , whatever you

28:08

are you saying and or amp

28:11

, amp , amp , like amplify because

28:13

amplify together is one of our core

28:16

values at SirHant , and so

28:18

we would . We would line up talent

28:21

and they would put together like just a simple presentation

28:23

but it's like what is your superpower

28:25

and how can we share your superpower

28:27

across the organization ? And and

28:30

like invite people

28:32

from all different departments to

28:34

attend and soak up your genius . Yeah

28:36

and also be like hey , the next time

28:39

you are you are struggling with like energy

28:41

management or productivity . We literally

28:43

have a PhD in performance science . She

28:45

has worked with D1 athletes , world

28:48

leaders , yeah , military generals , like maybe

28:50

reach out to her for some strategies because she knows her

28:52

shit . And every

28:54

single time we host that , people are like I had no

28:56

idea that they had a background , I

28:59

had no idea that they like had that

29:01

talent . Like I've never talked to that person . But then

29:03

I came to amp hour and I was like damn

29:05

cool , we have an amazing team

29:07

. So that was one initiative and then

29:09

the other one which was like takes a little bit less

29:11

production but is no less fun . It's

29:13

just a monthly virtual happy hour . Once

29:16

a month half an hour , like it's like at

29:18

five Eastern on Thursdays , which is fun for our West

29:20

Coast team , but

29:22

you can just come , you can drink an NA beverage

29:25

, you can drink an alcoholic beverage , but it's

29:27

just like we just hop on , shoot

29:29

the shit . We like talk about work and

29:31

then we like give shit and say you have to , like you

29:33

know , contribute money to the next virtual happy hour if you talk

29:35

about work at happy hour and

29:37

it's fun , you know . And so those

29:40

are two things that we have done , mm-hmm

29:42

. And I would say the other thing too and

29:44

, like peri , you know I've talked about this I I'm

29:46

in the process of developing a CRM

29:49

that works for me to maintain my relationships , not

29:51

to build my sales pipeline , not to like do that

29:53

, and I think like just doing a

29:55

random surprise text message or

29:58

surprise gift card , like I'll do that sometimes

30:00

, like send an Uber Eats gift card or a Starbucks

30:02

gift card . It's like a digital surprise

30:04

in the inbox and I was inspired to start doing

30:07

that because our new director , anissa

30:09

, sent me Random

30:11

gift card for gold belly like just we've

30:13

had a really challenging week and we're

30:15

just we're going through a lot of like restructuring

30:18

and changes to make the program better , because we're

30:20

like adapting and and she

30:22

just sent it on a Friday afternoon . She

30:24

was like just want to know that I love and respect you and

30:26

I'm so like proud of like all the work

30:29

that you've done . Like treat yourself and

30:31

I was like , holy shit , that's super cool . Yeah

30:33

, so it's just little , little things

30:35

like that , little cues and little signals

30:38

that seem small but are super impactful .

30:40

Well , and that goes to kind of you know a gratitude

30:42

thing too . Yeah , it's like

30:45

I think if , if you don't have

30:47

some level of gratitude for your people

30:49

Mm-hmm , as when if you're

30:51

at the helm of the ship , you're

30:53

you will have a toxic culture because

30:56

people won't feel if your

30:58

people don't feel appreciated .

31:00

Mm-hmm .

31:00

They're there's one foot out the

31:03

door , 100 because , the grass

31:05

will be greener no matter what

31:07

, even if it's astroturf

31:09

, because they're just going

31:11

. People , humans want to be appreciated

31:13

. Seen , yeah , seeing her under

31:15

that is basic biology , Mm-hmm

31:17

you know and so if you're you know , and

31:21

it's simple it's like I tell coach

31:23

new agents on this all the time of like just

31:25

sending a birthday card , it doesn't need a gift card in

31:27

, it doesn't need Starbucks if you're a new agent with no

31:29

you know , with no funds , people just

31:31

want to be like wow , they thought of me on

31:33

my birthday . It's just that note of appreciation

31:36

which is such a simple act

31:38

but goes so deep when

31:40

it comes to building a culture of positivity

31:43

and growth .

31:43

I think and you're really good at that .

31:46

I I try to be . I mean , that's something that

31:48

I think I've always , that's one

31:50

of my core values is Kind

31:52

of helping others . Whether

31:55

I was it , whether I'm a business owner or not , it's

31:57

always been something that's just in your DNA

31:59

.

31:59

It's in my DNA , yeah

32:03

and I'm the worst at it , not the worst

32:05

, but you're learning it was just not

32:07

something I I think about . Right

32:09

, it's not something I'm like what

32:13

can I get for this person ? I don't know , it's just

32:15

not like , it's not in the forefront of my

32:17

brain for me to remember Like I need to really

32:19

think about it . We're like she , it's always front

32:21

of mind for well , that's , that's why you guys are perfect together

32:23

.

32:24

Yeah , it's funny .

32:25

It's . You know , he he's like

32:27

even on the culture of our marriage

32:29

, right , is ? He's one of those people that's

32:31

like give me a list of of

32:34

gifts that you would want and I will pick from

32:36

the list . Yeah , and I'm the person

32:38

that's like if I'm just out in the world , I'm like

32:40

, oh , so-and-so would really appreciate this

32:42

Mm-hmm . Or oh my god

32:44

, I period went once Christmas , or

32:46

you know whatever . Yeah um , I and

32:49

yeah , it's funny , I think I need to do a

32:51

better job , but just kind of training

32:53

you for me , but really for your people

32:56

.

32:56

Yeah Well , like it legitimately . Gift

32:58

buying legitimately stresses me out .

33:00

Yeah , it does Like makes me anxious

33:02

.

33:02

Up like are they gonna like it ? Is this the right thing ? And

33:04

then I get in my mind and then it's just like the overthinking

33:07

Too much for me , yeah .

33:09

I just had an epiphany so

33:11

I think cause you had asked an earlier question

33:14

, perry , about as organizations

33:16

grow like , how do you

33:18

maintain the ship right ? Like proactively

33:20

address , like the holes in the ship that could leak money

33:23

, time and energy of your people and even leak people

33:25

. I think

33:27

one thing that they could do is

33:30

bring in something as simple as like

33:32

knowing each of their employees'

33:34

love languages and understanding

33:37

how to reward them or acknowledge

33:39

them through the lens of their love language . And this

33:41

is something that people apply naturally

33:44

in romantic relationships or even

33:46

friendships . Like we were talking about love languages yesterday

33:48

, mine is words of affirmation

33:50

, so followed by acts

33:53

of service and so like . The random text message

33:55

throughout the day is like a warm hug

33:57

to me , whereas my

33:59

partner's primary love language is quality

34:01

time . So , even though I would love to outsource

34:04

grocery shopping to Instacart , we go every

34:06

Sunday , we go to Whole Foods . I walk

34:08

the aisles , I deal with the crowds and the people and this and that

34:10

, yeah , but that fills his cup . It

34:13

absolutely loves it . So I think if you just even

34:15

know something as simple as Perry

34:17

haven't talked to him in a few weeks . I know he's in the other department

34:20

. His love language is acts of service . Maybe

34:22

I'll see if there's something I can go and help him with . Yeah

34:24

, take something off his plate , right , and then

34:26

he'll just be like , oh my God , I feel so loved and seen

34:28

right , I actually literally have , I mean physical touch is

34:31

a love language that maybe I wouldn't .

34:33

I mean , you're in jujitsu , but you know we do a lot

34:35

of physical touch .

34:36

I know , but I don't know if I would reward our , like

34:38

you know hey , here's a slap on the ass

34:41

probably an HR violation . That's

34:43

a good call .

34:44

That's a good call . I am HR , I didn't

34:46

think about that .

34:47

I know Shit Okay . So we would need to adapt

34:49

physical touch to be appropriate in a professional

34:52

setting .

34:52

If you're loving , what's your other love language ?

34:54

So I literally have Literally what's

34:56

the second one ? And then I'll address that one , my click

34:58

up list of reminders and stuff I

35:00

literally have . What does appreciation

35:03

look like to one of my employees ?

35:04

Boom , that's what that is . What about your ?

35:05

wife . Oh

35:07

, this got awkward my employees Because

35:10

, like I literally and I was

35:12

talking to another one of our teammates about it and it's

35:14

like we literally don't like

35:16

he wants to we can tell

35:18

he wants to feel more appreciated and I've tried

35:20

everything I can think of from

35:23

and it's just falling flat . Yes

35:25

, and we've even done like

35:27

a little employee , like about me things

35:30

you know , of like

35:32

you know , like what are your goals , what are your

35:34

ambitions , what do you want to be

35:36

, how do you like to be recognized , and stuff like that

35:38

. And I have all that I've tried . I'm just like

35:40

he's falling flat .

35:40

He might not know .

35:41

I think he probably doesn't know Like I

35:43

, men specifically are not taught or

35:45

programmed to like learn these things about

35:47

themselves Right . They're

35:49

like no tough love .

35:50

never let him see you sweat Like I'm now coming

35:52

back to like my dad being my coach and telling me that

35:55

you should have him read the five love

35:57

languages . I'm sure he has

35:59

, I don't know . I feel like that's not you

36:01

haven't .

36:02

I have .

36:03

Really . Yeah , I feel like that's not one of those

36:05

books that like a lot of like single mentors picking

36:07

up and being like I'm going to read this , but

36:10

like you know like and then have him

36:12

. I've done it with my , I've done

36:14

it with agents of like . You need to spend

36:16

the next three days of jotting down what fills

36:18

you up and what drains you , because

36:21

what fills you up are the things

36:23

that you can keep on your plate . I love writing in

36:25

MLS . I love writing . So an MLS description

36:28

or my Instagram it's visual

36:30

, it's textual . I like that . That

36:32

fills me up . But you

36:35

know , client

36:37

follow ups , like I need a CRM to kind

36:39

of literally like yeah like it

36:41

doesn't fill me up , unless it's , like

36:43

you know , a birthday , like a little

36:45

filling that person up and doing

36:47

something to bring joy . But

36:50

yeah , he might not know . Should

36:53

have them do that exercise of like for the next

36:55

five days jot down what makes

36:57

you happy and what drains you , because I

36:59

think , I think everyone needs to know

37:01

what , what does fill them up , in order to

37:03

be seen

37:06

and heard and appreciated .

37:08

In my experience , like people that are kind

37:10

of like in ruts like that , or they're

37:12

just down or they're in depression and obviously I'm not talking

37:14

about people who have like serious , like mental illness , like

37:16

that's precluded , but just like in a rut

37:18

, you could be saying all

37:20

the right things but he's just not hearing it

37:22

. So maybe if you give him a tool or something that could

37:24

just cultivate a little bit of awareness and

37:27

like shine a little bit of light , and you're not like forcing

37:30

it as his boss , you know , because there's like that unconscious

37:32

pressure too , you're just kind of inviting

37:35

him to like maybe learn something

37:37

new about himself and people love

37:39

. We're all programmed to be self interested too

37:41

, so like play into that a little

37:43

bit .

37:44

Well , I think that goes to you know , okay

37:46

, for those that are listening that are like , okay

37:48

, I want to build a culture of growth and positivity

37:51

and whatever . I think giving

37:53

your people room to self

37:55

explore is

37:57

, you know , whether that be , you

38:00

know , two downloads

38:02

a year for Audible , or you

38:04

know , maybe in having insurance

38:07

cover , a coach or you

38:09

know a stipend for a therapist or something like that . Having

38:12

the giving your people

38:15

the leeway to self discover those

38:17

things . Once they know it , they

38:19

can ask for it . If they're asking

38:21

for it and you're filling that up , then

38:24

they're going to be happy with their job

38:26

. You know that their performance will inevitably

38:29

increase because those that are happy in their

38:31

environment don't have to be forced to

38:33

like help you .

38:34

You know no one's bringing out the towel right

38:36

.

38:36

Just you know they're filling the bucket .

38:38

Yeah , on their own . That

38:40

then , all of a sudden , you have a culture

38:42

of positivity , of growth , of you

38:45

know , of of productivity

38:47

and collaboration versus

38:49

one of negativity . and you know

38:51

, the water cool , cooler gossip and

38:53

things like that , because of that is culture

38:56

too , and I think that's what people so

38:58

frequently put . Culture equals positivity

39:01

. No , there is toxic culture

39:03

. There is , you know , not necessarily

39:05

a lack of culture , but there's just a spectrum . It's

39:08

a huge spectrum , yeah

39:10

, and it's just kind of . You leaders

39:12

need to constantly checking in with

39:14

themselves and their values

39:16

and where they are , you know where they

39:18

fall in the spectrum , because that's inevitably

39:21

where their people fall in the spectrum . And if your

39:23

people are on , you know the opposite end of

39:25

the spectrum that you want to be on . What

39:27

do you , as a leader , have to do in order

39:29

to get , you know them willing

39:31

to kind of shift to the other end of the spectrum

39:33

?

39:34

And recognizing , too , that there

39:37

are things that are completely out of your control as

39:39

a leader . Like that team member that I met

39:41

with late last year , he was going through

39:43

something that I had

39:45

no idea that had nothing to do with work , it

39:48

had absolutely nothing to do with his job description , it had

39:50

nothing to do with , like our vision save it any of that

39:52

but it was affecting him which means it

39:54

was affecting his work . And so

39:56

you know , taking that time

39:58

and recognizing that if you

40:00

do want to cultivate

40:02

a positive culture , it's not just all work

40:04

either because you're dealing with humans

40:06

, it's holistic . It is . I love that

40:08

word .

40:09

People are who they are both

40:11

inside and outside of work , and I've

40:13

worked in some toxic environments where I

40:15

leave work . I love the drive to work and

40:17

the minute I pull into the parking lot and like your body

40:20

is just like why are we here ? Yeah

40:22

, and that is and that's

40:24

, and then I go home to my

40:26

people at the end of the day and I don't have any

40:28

of me left to give . It is holistic

40:31

and understanding that what happens

40:33

to your employees outside of work , outside

40:35

of those walls , is inevitably

40:37

coming to work . And the leaders

40:39

that think like , oh , that's , you know , it's like

40:41

a Berlin wall . Check that at the door

40:44

. You know we need to focus on work . And there's

40:46

, you know , elon Musk is a great example

40:48

of leaders like you

40:50

will work , you will drain yourself , you will whatever

40:52

, that will crash and burn and we're watching

40:55

it in real time . We are I mean we are watching a toxic

40:57

.

40:57

What's a stock price right now ?

40:58

Like yeah , we're watching a toxic . What was

41:00

a positive work environment and

41:02

, you know , a great culture

41:04

of collaboration , became a

41:06

culture of no collaboration

41:08

. Do as I say . You are

41:11

not a human crash

41:13

and burn in real

41:15

time very quickly too . So

41:18

, yeah , I

41:20

mean rising tides If

41:23

you have culture of other , you know , and

41:26

there are people that wanna work

41:28

for leaders that just

41:30

say , hey , this is your instruction

41:32

manual , do as I say in nine to five , and

41:34

that's okay too . That culture works for them

41:36

. Correct , exactly , it's

41:39

just being knowing who you are as a

41:42

person and what environments you thrive best

41:44

under , and knowing who you

41:46

are as a leader and what environment you

41:48

are , you know , is in line with your values

41:50

, and living those values , I think

41:53

, is what inevitably bring like

41:55

builds either a toxic or a positive culture

41:57

.

41:59

Yeah , cool , those

42:02

are our three cents , six

42:04

cents if we each have two cents , a few hundred

42:06

cents . I think we shared a lot today and

42:09

building culture .

42:10

Awesome , well , thanks for joining us

42:12

on another episode of Married to Growth , also

42:15

known as Mary to Perry .

42:17

Mary to Olitha .

42:19

Thanks , kat , thank you .