0:00

I'd like it, and you have a great manicure. I'm keeping

0:02

my hands out of side like oh I'm and I'm

0:04

getting them done today. They're like little,

0:07

they're good. You know what. I

0:09

went to high school in New Jersey. I

0:11

know you will. And by the way, that's

0:13

a good thing. Like if it shows in your hands that you

0:15

grew up in and you went to high school in New Jersey, that's

0:17

the right place for it to show up. Exactly

0:21

every now and then. I just need a little dose my

0:24

Jersey hears. I also have man

0:26

hands, so anything anything

0:29

that makes them look I love your hands.

0:31

They're beautiful. Palm of basketball. Yeah,

0:34

totally. A friend of mine said

0:36

he saw my hands, it goes Christ he

0:39

goes last time I saw hands that big.

0:41

They had a Super Bowl ring on him. Hello,

0:46

I'm Mini driver. Welcome to Many

0:49

Questions Season two. I've

0:51

always loved Prut's question that it

0:53

was originally an nineteenth century

0:55

harleg game where players would

0:57

ask each other thirty five questions aim

1:00

at revealing the other player's true nature.

1:03

It's just the scientific method

1:05

really. In asking different people

1:07

the same set of questions, you can make observations

1:10

about which truths appeared to be universal.

1:12

I love this discipline, and

1:14

it made me wonder, what if these questions

1:17

were just the jumping off point, what greater

1:19

depths would be revealed if I asked

1:21

these questions as conversation starters

1:24

with thought leaders and trailblazers

1:26

across all these different disciplines. So

1:28

I adapted prus questionnaire and I wrote

1:30

my own seven questions that I personally

1:32

think a pertinent to a person's story. They

1:35

are when and where were you happiest?

1:37

What is the quality you like least about yourself?

1:40

What relationship, real or fictionalized,

1:42

defines love for you? What question

1:45

would you most like answered? What

1:47

person, place, or experience has shaped

1:49

you the most? What would be your last meal?

1:52

And can you tell me something in your life

1:54

that's grown out of a personal disaster? And

1:57

I've gathered a group of really

2:00

arkable people, ones that I am

2:02

honored and humbled to have had the chance

2:04

to engage with. You may not hear their answers

2:06

to all seven of these questions.

2:09

We've whittled it down to which questions

2:11

felt closest to their experience or

2:13

the most surprising, or created

2:16

the most fertile ground to connect

2:19

my guest today is actor, author,

2:22

entrepreneur, and model Brookshields.

2:26

Brooke evolved from Child's

2:28

superstar to Princeton alum

2:30

to having a successful career in TV,

2:33

and I don't think many people have negotiated

2:36

four decades of being in the spotlight

2:38

with such grace and humor. It

2:41

was an absolute pleasure to have this conversation,

2:43

and I'm really happy to share her insightful

2:46

answers to my big questions. I

2:49

do want to point out in the first minute or

2:51

so of the third question of the episode, Brook

2:54

discusses a friend of hers who took their own

2:56

life. So take care while listening,

2:58

and please feel free to give a had if

3:00

you so choose, When

3:09

and why were you happiest. I

3:12

have to say that I remember

3:14

one specific moment. I

3:17

had just gotten married to

3:19

Chris. I had gone

3:21

to New York to do cabaret and

3:24

nine eleven happened and

3:27

he couldn't get to me. I obviously

3:29

couldn't get out of New York. And it was

3:32

this very fraught period of time, and we were

3:34

the first show to go back, and everything

3:36

was just fraught and scary and sad.

3:39

And when my run ended, I

3:41

went back to Los Angeles and

3:44

we went to someone's house in Malibu and

3:46

the weather was perfect, and I walked down

3:48

to the beach and I just started

3:52

dancing, just free dancing. My

3:54

husband was my new husband. My

3:57

mom wasn't either

4:00

in jail or in the hospital, and I

4:02

was I wasn't getting a phone call like that.

4:04

That's I lived in that. You know, Oh

4:06

my god, at any moment, something's going to happen.

4:09

She had been was in a facility where

4:11

she was taken care of, so I didn't have to worry about

4:14

her. And I just started dancing

4:16

up and down like an idiot on

4:18

the beach, and I just remember

4:20

thinking, this is

4:23

freedom, this is happy, and it's funny

4:25

because I don't particularly love

4:29

l a and you know, I didn't have a job

4:31

normally that makes me panic, and

4:34

I had just finished a job and

4:36

I was so depleted physically and

4:38

emotionally. But to just be able

4:40

to feel the breeze and have my

4:43

feet in the water and just dance

4:45

down the beach, it was I just remember

4:48

thinking, Wow, this is a gift.

4:50

Remember this, because this is what peaceful

4:53

feels like. Oh my gosh,

4:55

how that's quite. I'm just going

4:57

back to a sentence that you said that, you know, I

5:00

was feeling good. My mom wasn't in jail,

5:03

and she was taken care of. Like just the

5:05

thought that you know that that's a barometer

5:08

for a person in their life is quite intense.

5:11

Well, that she she wasn't on the side

5:13

of the road. She wasn't she

5:15

hadn't just had a stroke. She hadn't. It was like

5:18

everything in my life had been gauged

5:20

around her being alive,

5:22

and the responsibility that was mine

5:25

in my mind to

5:28

keep her alive. I mean the irony

5:30

of also that is my version of

5:33

finding peace and joy

5:35

has to have come from nine

5:38

eleven. That's what I was just, that

5:40

was it. That was My

5:43

next question was is happiness

5:45

predicated on this

5:47

idea that really hard

5:49

things have to have happened before you can

5:51

feel that freedom and allow yourself to feel

5:54

happy. Earn it? It's

5:56

like I have to have earned it. Where

5:59

that come from is so so

6:01

deep. It's probably the

6:04

alcoholic mother. It's a child

6:06

actress from such a young age. And

6:08

what I did was I crafted

6:11

things that I knew would be

6:13

there for me in spite of

6:16

being an actress or famous or a celebrity

6:18

or whatever whatever, And I

6:20

knew that I needed to go to university.

6:23

I knew that I needed to find

6:25

my husband that was

6:28

grounded, that we could build a life

6:31

that had healthy children. That it

6:34

was not on the West Coast. There were sort

6:36

of these markers, but actual

6:39

just relief and joy

6:42

just always seemed

6:44

that it would only it could only be possible

6:46

after drama, trauma,

6:49

lots of pain, lots of hard work. And

6:52

that's from my own psyche, you know, interesting

6:54

like I think that's why I asked this question, because

6:56

I think it is such a tub in an interesting

6:59

wit area, this notion of happiness.

7:01

When I'm happy, there is a period of

7:03

enormous anxiety because I am

7:06

absolutely certain that something bad has

7:08

to happen because I'm happy and

7:10

I can't last. But so maybe

7:12

all we can do is literally know that about ourselves.

7:15

I don't know, I've been well. I feel like I've been working on that

7:17

particular thing, like my whole life, I

7:19

think, so I think I have to. I mean, that's why

7:21

I sort of had this other checklist,

7:24

so that I could at least say

7:27

like, no, no, no, no, that's you're happy there.

7:29

Yeah, you love your children, children love

7:31

you. I I feel like there's going to be a

7:33

price to pay, yeah,

7:36

for being happy, and then it's inevitable

7:39

that it can't last. I think that's trauma.

7:41

I really think that has all the hallmarks

7:43

of trauma, just in the therapy I've done,

7:45

all the books that I've read. The idea

7:47

that there must be payment for it comes

7:49

from a young person's mind

7:52

of going these bad things happened

7:54

because I was happy, or the

7:56

norm is the hard things happening.

7:58

But I do think it's associated with trauma. I

8:00

mean, I remember that every time I would have a

8:04

a plan that we were excited about,

8:07

I never believed it was really going to happen

8:09

because it would change because I'd get a job,

8:11

and so I sort of lived in this

8:13

sort of like just be at the ready

8:16

all the time because you're just going to have to spring

8:19

into action in some way. And you

8:22

know, that's also I think the trauma

8:24

of living with an alcoholic mother

8:27

is that you never know really what you're

8:29

going to get, what you're going to get, and

8:31

how long the good part is going to last.

8:35

You know, I used to say, I wrote this in my book. I said,

8:37

you know, I remember saying to my mom once I

8:40

wish I just only knew you in the mornings,

8:43

because in the morning hours

8:46

she was peppy and up and we would get

8:48

our coffee and our role with butter

8:50

and we laughed. I mean, and by the time three

8:52

o'clock came, I knew. I'd

8:55

look at I'd look at the way her lipstick looked,

8:57

and I thought, oh God, okay,

9:00

it's already hitting the sauce. So let's see,

9:02

let's see what's let's see what's going

9:04

to unfold. And I think you're always living

9:07

at the ready and doing to the

9:10

movie like Pretty Baby. When I was

9:13

was just trauma. Even

9:16

as a child, I knew that you were going to have to

9:18

somehow survive that beginning.

9:21

I knew that you were going to make it out the other side.

9:23

I remember just being so impressed

9:26

knowing you and knowing just how

9:29

warm and generous and interesting

9:31

and interested you are in life. When

9:33

I think about the impact of that, your image

9:36

in advertising and in the movies, like

9:39

it was so kind of it was so iconic and

9:41

distant, but I never forget. It's so

9:43

funny. I really always from I always remember when you

9:45

went to school. I always remember hearing that and

9:48

really feeling like there's something else

9:50

beyond being appreciated

9:52

for how beautiful or but

9:54

how marketable or how big a movie

9:57

star someone is. That there is this there's

9:59

this other world, and it felt it

10:01

felt important to remember

10:03

that. I mean, I think I knew that I

10:06

in order for me to be whole

10:08

and to survive, but really

10:11

survive, like thrive na survive,

10:13

you know. I remember thinking

10:16

this will be the one thing that can't be taken

10:18

away from you. I thought

10:20

I was going to be heralded

10:24

and welcomed back into this industry,

10:26

that I was not only an actress, but I was now in

10:28

an religion actor, I was a scholar.

10:32

And that clearly was not

10:34

the way it happened. But I remember

10:36

thinking, if I don't cultivate

10:39

my intellect and have it be a

10:42

tool for me, I'm not sure

10:44

I'm emotionally prepared to

10:47

continue in the spotlight

10:49

in this world. I needed

10:51

something that was just mine. And

10:53

of course the whole industry took

10:56

it as a threat. I was,

10:58

all of a sudden threatening to them exactly.

11:02

Yeah, so that's what is interesting. What

11:17

is the quality that you like least about yourself?

11:20

Oh that my insecurities

11:24

surrounding my talent still

11:27

pop up that I

11:29

still pine

11:32

for recognition, for

11:35

actual talent. It's

11:37

still a journey that I have to go through

11:39

to not compare myself

11:41

and say, but do they think you're talented?

11:44

I'm in these meetings, I'm a CEO, I'm

11:47

I'm all of this, I'm my phrase children.

11:50

I have to remind myself daily that

11:52

I am good enough. Do

11:54

you think there's two things going on, which is sort of the

11:56

external impact of it

11:58

and the way that you're so think

12:01

about it. I think it

12:03

is most definitely too prompt.

12:05

I think that from a very early

12:08

age, I was so constantly

12:10

criticized. Oh my god, I thought

12:12

you were going to say. I was so constantly

12:14

told how great I was, and

12:17

it was on such a public level, and

12:20

everything had a disclaimer, not

12:22

but she's pretty, But it was always sort of, well,

12:25

she's not a vocal powerhouse. If I

12:27

was singing work, she's no somebody.

12:30

And then they'll pick the person who just won the Academy

12:32

Award or somebody. And you know, every

12:34

time I had an interview, you could feel

12:37

the tone. And I was so young,

12:39

and then later on I read all of it

12:41

and I was so raked over the coals

12:43

for for not being talented

12:47

that it was. It was always sort

12:49

of like, she doesn't have to be because she can

12:51

just look that way. And that's

12:53

also why I wanted to go to university, is because

12:55

I thought I'm so much more than

12:58

all of this. When I was

13:00

invited two purely

13:03

do comedy, that was

13:05

the first time that I ever really

13:08

understood where my talent

13:10

was unique. And it was so natural

13:12

to me. I mean, you know, comedic actresses

13:15

are not as sort of brilliantly praised

13:17

the way drama is. And and that's

13:20

you know, it's fine. That is not something I covet

13:22

doing. The purity and comedy

13:24

to me is just is where I find a

13:26

great deal of joy. There was a movie on the

13:28

other night and it was a comedy with

13:31

two women, and my kids were watching it, and

13:33

I had loved the movie, and I

13:36

started going down the rabbit hole saying,

13:39

my kids don't know that I can do that, And all of a sudden,

13:41

this was like this insecurity just wafted

13:44

over me, and I thought, Okay, you

13:47

have got to get your ship together. I don't know why

13:49

you're doing this, but I think you're

13:51

right. I think a lot of that comes from

13:54

trauma from

13:56

childhood. This profession

13:58

being an actor is there

14:01

were just so many schisms in it, like

14:03

faulted people make really good actors.

14:06

It's like we're trying to fill a

14:08

bit of a void. And it's not enough that you

14:10

think you're good. It's not enough that one can sort

14:12

of self generate. You have to have other

14:15

people also during the kool

14:17

aid. Like I said in my book,

14:19

I said, it's not you know, you're not expected to

14:21

win the lottery once you're expected to

14:23

win it over and over again, and then

14:25

you're also punished when you

14:28

don't win the fucking lottery. Even

14:30

though I didn't have the same experience of you, I

14:32

was not a child actor

14:34

or model or icon, but that same

14:38

feeling of whereas the next job,

14:40

if no one's hiring me, your self

14:42

worth can be around your feet

14:44

if you let it. It's endemic in this

14:46

in this industry as well. I mean, it's funny

14:49

because I used to to say, I

14:51

mean I would I went to the Academy Awards

14:53

when I was a baby.

14:55

That was just nirvana

14:57

to me, and I coveted it. I

15:00

coveted it, covered it, covered it, and

15:02

finally my therapist

15:04

said she's like why and I said,

15:06

you know why, because of other opportunity

15:09

And that's all it was about for me. Really,

15:11

someone would probably want you to

15:14

do another movie, and you feel like, yes,

15:16

do another reacy that that never goes

15:19

that that never goes away. I mean, I'm sure

15:21

there are people for whom

15:23

it does. I don't think Tilda Swinton is

15:25

worrying about like her next No.

15:28

I think it's very hard to carve it out there,

15:30

like if you've got to make a living. I don't know. I've

15:33

spoken to more actors who feel this way,

15:35

and then I think there are these these creature

15:38

like bird like anomalies

15:41

who who can who can kind

15:43

of apparently conjure it out of nowhere.

15:46

I've always had to be basically,

15:48

I've always been a brand, you know. I've always been

15:51

right nurturing something so that we could pay

15:53

our mortgage, or if you did

15:55

this movie, we got a car. Everything

15:58

was basically transactional. So

16:00

there was never a plan to

16:03

to concentrate on craft. You

16:05

know. My mother, I mean, she wasn't a manager. She just

16:07

she was like like, as long as they're talking about you keep

16:10

your right and that was okay.

16:12

Because I got very rewarded for

16:14

it. I was liked and I

16:17

went to a good school. So to me,

16:19

it was just how do you make a living just

16:22

being you? Yeah,

16:25

that's that's that's exactly, That's exactly

16:27

it. That has always been my approach as well. What

16:35

question would you most like answered?

16:39

Oh, the ones that

16:41

we've loved to have died, Where

16:45

where do they go? Where

16:47

are they? I lost my

16:49

best friend. He was sort of

16:51

just like an extension of me. And

16:54

when you lose someone like that, so so

16:56

young, and he took his own life and I

16:59

can't reconcile it to this day,

17:01

you know, and it's you know, twenty

17:04

years ago, and those are the answers I

17:06

would just love to know, you

17:08

know, and have it be beautiful.

17:12

I just want to know that they're okay. I mean, you

17:14

know what I mean, like, yeah, I want to

17:16

know that he doesn't

17:19

regret his decision. I

17:23

never was afraid of death until

17:26

recently. For some odd reason,

17:30

I had a youthful attitude about

17:32

it. Just live every day with gratitude,

17:34

I really do, and I I

17:36

can find joy. I mean, you

17:38

know, it was spiking and there was a little

17:41

boy with a nanny I think,

17:43

and their dog and she was walking him too a

17:45

playdate or something like that, and he stopped

17:48

and he said hi, and

17:50

he must have been like five six,

17:53

and I could tell that the nanny was trying to

17:56

shuffle him away, but he was very

17:58

forward and wanted to engage and talk

18:00

with me, and of course I stopped and I

18:03

engaged with him, and I said, look to look at this color

18:05

of this bike. It's yellow, and

18:08

isn't it a pretty color? Yellow? And he's like, we're

18:10

going to Frenchie's house or something like that,

18:12

and I said, oh, that's wonderful. I said,

18:14

you just have the best time. I don't know his

18:16

name, I didn't know anybody that we're all strangers,

18:19

and he said, you have

18:22

nice like time, and

18:24

I was like, I just

18:27

thanked him, and I went on my way and

18:30

I started crying. I was like like

18:32

a blubbering idiot because it was

18:34

so pure. I find

18:36

such joy, and then in recent

18:39

times I've started to fear

18:41

losing it. Everything is moving so quickly

18:44

and you just start thinking, oh God,

18:47

I'm gonna I'm gonna die

18:49

one day, you know. And I

18:53

didn't plan for this, and

18:56

I'm bugging on yeah, facing my

18:58

mortality when I really just want

19:00

to be having interactions with small,

19:03

pure little kids.

19:06

Have spy time, have

19:09

nice by time, don't die have

19:15

The irony would have been I got hit by a truck, right,

19:17

that's all right? Turned away. The

19:19

nanny would have been the only person who could recount

19:22

the story. Oh my god, she

19:25

would have moved on in

19:40

your life, what person,

19:43

place, or experience most

19:46

altered it. I

19:48

had a very

19:51

bad accident just over

19:53

a year ago. I was in hospital

19:55

for a month and I

19:57

got a staph infection and a blood clos

20:00

and nobody could visit me because

20:02

it was COVID. I think it was the most

20:05

alone I'd ever felt, and

20:08

I was really scared, and I realized

20:10

that I just was so much more

20:12

of a fighter and a survivor than I

20:15

probably ever really gave myself credit

20:17

for. And it's

20:20

when I decided full on to

20:22

start my own company and sort

20:24

of create this movement for women

20:27

over forty and really sort of harness

20:29

that energy to make a difference

20:32

for women. It just felt like,

20:34

Okay, he didn't die, so

20:36

what are you gonna do now? I mean, I'm so sorry

20:39

that you were hurt. It's

20:41

so interesting how to look at that, like when you've

20:44

had a kind of near death experience,

20:47

and yet out of that comes this

20:50

clarity and this decision

20:53

and this strength and this idea

20:57

of what this next chapter is going to be. I

20:59

think only thing that I could do was

21:02

learn how to walk. And I had to learn

21:04

how to walk again, which was so bizarre.

21:06

I had to tell my brain to tell my

21:08

leg to keep to move and

21:11

and I thought, Okay, you're gonna

21:13

walk faster than anybody has ever walked

21:16

with this injury. You know. I made them

21:18

give me p T twice a day. And

21:20

it was funny because people, lots of people were like,

21:22

why do you think it happened? You know, were you moving

21:25

to my life? Did you need to

21:27

find more gratitude? I was like, no, sh

21:29

it happens. It was an accident.

21:33

The accident itself didn't

21:35

come from the universe to slow me down

21:38

in my pursuits or whatever.

21:41

It just happened. But how

21:43

I responded to it

21:45

was going to be the defining factor.

21:49

It was just an important time. I mean, I

21:51

remember one other when I lost

21:54

my first child. I lost a

21:56

lot of my my youthfulness.

21:59

That next day, like by that next day.

22:01

I remember thinking, oh, you're

22:03

an adult. Now you're you're different.

22:06

How old we when that happened. I

22:09

was thirty

22:12

one, and

22:16

you know, I immediately went to my fault.

22:18

Of course, it had to be my fault, and it was really

22:20

important for me to learn that it's

22:22

actually an unviable

22:25

pregnancy, that is nature taking

22:27

care of that for you. I

22:29

didn't take too many yoga classes or I

22:31

didn't didn't do anything wrong. You

22:34

know, it wasn't a fault of mine, and that

22:36

was kind of that. I grew up

22:38

a lot from that um.

22:41

But this last, this last sort of experience

22:43

just sort of brought me into

22:46

my next chapter. I

22:50

I mean, I think that actually answers one of my other

22:52

questions is in your life, can you tell me about something

22:54

that has grown out of a personal disaster? And

22:56

I think that that would be the

22:59

loss. Yeah, well both actually

23:02

well also when I lost that first baby,

23:05

I had had a very very invasive

23:07

surgery years earlier

23:09

and actually couldn't even get

23:11

pregnant naturally, had to do IVF

23:14

and that baby was implanted

23:16

through my belly button. Actually it's odd

23:19

I could argue I was still a virgin. I guess but

23:22

so that was the pregnancy that took

23:25

and then I lost that pregnancy.

23:27

But in the loss of it,

23:29

it actually changed

23:33

my physical being in

23:35

a way. I had a lot of scar tissue,

23:38

and the miscarriage was sort of so

23:40

violent that it actually

23:42

created space so

23:45

that I was able to then get

23:47

pregnant naturally.

23:49

You know, that was definitely a change

23:51

in a gift. So you

23:54

don't always know the reason for things that quickly.

23:57

That's really really amazing.

24:00

I've talked about it a little bit on here, that I was told

24:02

I couldn't have children, like flat out when

24:04

I was eighteen, so just it

24:07

was never it was never something I thought was

24:09

going to happen. So when I

24:11

when I got pregnant, it

24:13

was so interesting, like wondering

24:16

whether it was the psychosomatic

24:18

idea of you know, this old

24:20

patrician doctor who had said you're never

24:22

gonna get pregnant, or whether there was

24:24

something physiological as I grew old, or just your

24:29

things move around and change. I mean, you

24:31

had something, you had an actual you

24:33

know, surgery which which

24:36

helped it. But I wondered so much

24:38

about that. We just put a lot of emotional

24:40

judgment on on all these

24:42

things. That happen in life. But it's really just life,

24:44

life thing. It is just life.

24:47

We always want to find meaning and

24:50

yeah, the poetry in it and and

24:52

sometimes it's just it

24:55

just is. You know, I think it just is.

24:57

I think life just life's and you

24:59

you kind touched whatever meaning you choose

25:01

to all of it. It's amazing to

25:04

me, Like all these things that have happened to you, I

25:06

think you've been blessed

25:08

with a really big life, big

25:10

hands, big life, Brook grabbing

25:13

it in, grabbing, grab onto

25:16

it like a bed, really

25:20

iconic Koala.

25:26

You can hear more from Brooke on her podcast

25:29

Now What with Brookshields from My

25:31

Heart Radio, Brook interviews

25:33

guests about the most pivitual moments in their life.

25:36

Previous guests include Patton Oswald and

25:38

Gina Davis, with new episodes released

25:40

every Tuesday. Also be

25:43

sure to check out Beginning is Now, which

25:45

is a global community Brook started for women

25:47

over forty to celebrate strength, wisdom,

25:50

optimism, and humor in each other. Find

25:53

out more at the Beginning is now dot

25:55

com.

25:58

Many Questions is hosted and written

26:00

by me Mini Driver, supervising

26:02

producer Aaron Kaufman, producer

26:06

Morgan Lavoy Research Assistant

26:08

Marissa Brown. Original

26:11

music Sorry Baby by Minni

26:13

Driver, Additional

26:16

music by Aaron Kaufman. Executive

26:18

produced by me Mini Driver. Special

26:21

thanks to Jim Nikolay, Will

26:24

Pearson, Addison No Day,

26:26

Lisa Castella and Nick Oppenheim

26:29

at w kPr, de

26:31

La Pescador, Kate Driver

26:33

and Jason Weinberg, and for

26:35

constantly solicited tech support Henry

26:38

Driver,