0:24

Welcome back

0:32

too missing. I am Tim here today with Lance.

0:35

Lance, how are you today? I'm doing fantastic

0:37

today, Tim. I love it when we have these episodes

0:39

where we can reintroduce one of the

0:41

cases that we spoke about, a cold

0:43

case. This one is one that we

0:45

go into quite a bit of depth on.

0:47

But before we get to that

0:49

Tim, I wanna get into how you're

0:51

doing today? I'm doing great.

0:53

I am excited to play this episode

0:55

again. I'm with you on that, Lance.

0:58

We first aired this one back in the spring

1:00

of twenty twenty and then even

1:02

spun it off into its own podcast feed

1:05

called missing Trenny Gibson, and if you wanna

1:07

hear all those episodes, you can do so

1:09

there or you can scroll back in the missing

1:11

feed and find them as well. But the

1:13

reason we're doing this, Lance, is because Thursday's

1:16

episode of missing is brand new

1:18

about Trenny Gibson's disappearance. We

1:21

speak with Laura Risty who has been

1:23

investigating Trenny disappearance for

1:26

about twenty years. And she

1:28

was a very big part of the series

1:30

we did on Trenny Gibson. And so

1:32

this episode coming up on Thursday

1:35

is going to add to that series.

1:37

And we just spoke with Laura about the disappearance

1:39

of Polly Milton last

1:41

week. So feel like this is a good time to

1:44

bring the subject of Trenny disappearance back.

1:46

You know

1:46

what else? People love Tim, our social media,

1:49

but there are surprisingly some people who don't know

1:51

where to find that. Well, they can find us

1:53

on social media at missing CSM.

1:56

Okay? Here's twenty twenty Tim and Lance

1:58

introducing the episode about Trenny

2:01

Gibson. Thanks a lot for listening. And, Lance,

2:03

for this episode, we have a really mysterious

2:06

disappearance case out of nineteen

2:09

seventy six in the Great Smokey

2:11

Mountains National Park in Tennessee.

2:14

A young woman named Trenny Lynn

2:16

Gibson went missing from

2:18

a school field

2:20

trip. Trenny Mel, our researcher

2:22

who puts together this information for us.

2:25

She communicated with a few people and

2:27

and searched the information online

2:29

and came up with a document that had the statistics

2:31

and some of the details. And it seems like the

2:33

Trenny would have been a unique young

2:36

woman she would have, as Jen said,

2:38

she marched to the beat of her own drum. Who

2:40

knows what this young woman would have become?

2:42

She was sixteen when she went missing and

2:45

there was very little indication

2:47

that she had made an enemy out of

2:49

anybody. And she went missing on a

2:51

field trip. She ducks in the woods and she's gone.

2:53

Okay, everybody. Well, I hope you enjoyed the

2:55

episode. Please rate us five stars

2:57

if you like what we've been

2:58

doing. Thank you very much for listening.

3:09

Before we begin today's episode, you're about

3:11

to hear a word from our sponsors. These

3:13

ads make our show possible. However,

3:15

we do offer an ad free version

3:17

of this show on missing and crawl

3:19

space

3:20

premium. And you can subscribe to missing

3:22

and crawl space premium for ad free listening

3:24

bonus episodes and early access

3:27

to all

3:27

episodes, you can subscribe by going

3:29

to missing dot supporting cast.

3:31

F m or click the link in our

3:34

bio to sign

3:35

up. Use code missing for one free month

3:37

on supporting cast. And for you Apple Podcast

3:39

listeners, you can also join directly on

3:42

Apple Podcasts by clicking free

3:44

at the top of the

3:45

feed. Now, a word from our sponsors.

3:48

I'm Andrew Beckgrace, cohost of the

3:50

NPR Podcast, White Lies. They're not

3:52

being held because they're charged with a crime. These

3:54

people are being indefinitely

3:56

detained. You can't just keep these people in

3:58

jail until they die. On the new season

4:00

of White Lives, a story about immigration, definite

4:02

detention, and the search for a secret

4:04

list. Listen to the White Lives podcast

4:07

from NPR.

4:08

This podcast is supported by Sondremind.

4:11

Hey, your mental health is important, just

4:13

as important as your physical health. If you need

4:15

help, Sondermont can connect you with a therapist

4:17

who takes your insurance and is available now.

4:19

Visit sonder mind dot com to meet with a therapist.

4:22

Therapy works.

4:33

Welcome back to missing Laura Murray,

4:36

Jen Amel. How are you today, Jen?

4:38

I'm

4:38

doing okay. How are you guys?

4:40

Oh, we're doing very well. Yeah. Yeah.

4:42

I can't complain. So

4:44

here we are today to talk about your

4:47

research into the case

4:49

of Trenny Gibson. Okay. So let's

4:51

get into the disappearance of Trenny

4:54

Lynn Gibson. She

4:56

was born August seventeenth nineteen

4:58

sixty. She was sixteen

5:01

years old when she went missing from

5:04

the great smoky mountains National Park

5:06

in Tennessee

5:07

She's female, she's white, she's

5:10

53A hundred and fifteen

5:12

pounds. And when she went missing,

5:14

she was wearing a blue blouse, blue

5:16

and white striped sweater, a borrowed

5:18

brown orange slash plaid heavy

5:21

jacket, which comes into play later

5:23

on as well. Blue jeans, blue Adidas

5:25

shoes, and a diamond and star sapphire

5:28

ring, and a sapphire necklace. And

5:30

again, Trenny went missing on October

5:32

eighth nineteen seventy six from the Great

5:34

Smokey Mountains National Park in Tennessee.

5:36

And Jen, this is one of

5:38

the cases that I was

5:40

reading about you gathered all the information

5:43

for that is it kinda creep me out little

5:45

bit. I don't know if it did for the two of

5:47

you. Yeah. It did. It was it

5:49

definitely a haunting story, and it

5:51

reminded me a lot about the Maury

5:54

case. Yeah. I think because of the

5:56

the geographic location and the fact

5:58

that it was sort of in between a couple

6:00

of mountains, and you had the the past, like, the

6:03

road that went through, and then her sent the

6:05

dogs lost her sent. Pretty much

6:07

like it hit a wall and and

6:09

lost lost her scent

6:11

apparently. Yeah. It has a lot of

6:14

more Murray indicators. Yeah.

6:16

And she also went missing in the midst

6:18

of, like, many people who had to

6:20

all turned away within

6:22

a couple minutes.

6:24

Right. It's not like someone claimed

6:26

they saw her get snatched up or

6:28

something like that or even walk

6:30

away. It's like she's on the trail. She kinda

6:32

ducked off the trail, and that's it. No one ever

6:34

saw her again. So Jen, you

6:36

spoke to this woman, her name's Lara

6:38

Rist, and she runs a blog called Canadian

6:41

girl seventy seven and that's girl,

6:43

GURL77

6:46

dot com. Tell us about your conversation

6:48

with her.

6:48

Yeah. I had an excellent conversation with

6:51

Laura. Laura's not a private investigator,

6:53

but she's been looking into the case, into

6:55

Chinese case for going on seventeen

6:57

years now. And she's had the opportunity

7:00

to interview family members of Chinese

7:02

and those directly involved with the case

7:05

such as some of the classmates that were

7:07

there that day that Trenny went

7:09

missing.

7:09

And how long has she been doing

7:11

this for? Seventeen years. She's been

7:13

looking into Trinity's case for seventeen

7:15

years, that's that's pretty impressive.

7:17

So she must have a a pretty substantial

7:20

amount of information on this. Correct? Absolutely.

7:22

Yes. Yes. She she

7:25

had hours worth of information

7:27

when we just talked on the

7:29

phone, I think it would warrant

7:31

a a good follow-up episode with her. A

7:33

little bit about Trenny. She was born in Fulton

7:35

County, Georgia, and moved to Knoxville, Tennessee.

7:38

And that was around nineteen sixty seven,

7:40

nineteen sixty eight. She was junior at

7:43

Beard in high school at the time of

7:45

her disappearance, and all of this information that you're

7:47

hearing is taken from Jen's research. She

7:49

was skilled at drawing and reading, Trenny

7:52

like to help her mother cook, look after

7:54

her little brother. She was friendly with her classmates.

7:56

But apparently she didn't have a lot close friends aside

7:59

from her older brother, Bob. And

8:01

when interviewed, one classmate said

8:03

she wasn't particularly remarkable She

8:05

was Trenny, but not the prettiest. She was smart,

8:07

but not the smartest. And she

8:09

apparently kept mostly to herself, was

8:11

independent. AND SHE

8:14

WAS NOT THE MOST SOCIAL AS

8:16

FAR AS HER SIPELINGS WERE CON CONCERNED

8:19

HER SISTER TINA was more social

8:21

than

8:21

Trenny. So she just sorta kept herself.

8:24

Is that good assessment? Yeah. It

8:26

seems like she she was an interesting

8:28

girl, a quiet girl. She really enjoyed

8:30

reading. She's a bookish. She

8:34

seemed very independent. Like,

8:36

she sort of walked to the beat of her own

8:37

drum. 373 reminded me of me of high school,

8:40

honestly. And Trenny worked

8:42

in Westtown Mall

8:44

in Morrison's cafeteria. 373

8:46

was saving her money to attend the University

8:48

of Tennessee. And

8:50

her family was tight knit and loving. They attended

8:52

local Baptist Church and her family

8:54

is her mom is hope, her father

8:57

is Robert, her older brother, as mentioned

8:59

previously, is Bob, younger

9:01

sister, Tina, younger brother,

9:03

miracle. Trinity had a particularly

9:06

close relationship with her older brother, Bob.

9:08

He had graduated high school in May

9:10

that May and had joined the Navy,

9:12

but he arrived home on leave that Wednesday

9:15

before Trinity

9:15

disappeared. And Trenny was excited

9:17

about seeing him because he had been

9:19

gone since July.

9:21

So he came home on Wednesday and

9:23

she disappeared just a couple of days later on

9:25

Friday as that Correct?

9:27

Yeah. That's right. Okay. And her mom

9:29

hoped drove Trenny to school. Apparently,

9:32

it was raining. The weather wasn't

9:34

promising. She was going

9:36

on a field trip with horticulture class,

9:38

and then she wasn't sure if that was still on because

9:40

of the weather. So she stopped a classmate

9:43

to ask and found out that the Field

9:45

trip was still going

9:46

on. She left her books and her purse

9:48

and her mother's car. And

9:51

I think that's likely one sign

9:53

that she didn't run away on her own.

9:55

I think that kinda you know, and obviously

9:57

we'll get more into this, but that's why

10:00

we're bringing that up now. You know,

10:02

this is a sixteen year old young

10:04

woman, you know, like young girl. Really, this

10:06

is a

10:07

this is not a likely candidate for someone

10:09

to have run away. On their own.

10:12

Yeah. It's also important to mention

10:14

that her family was like super religious,

10:17

and they were very I guess strict

10:20

especially with the girls and the family.

10:23

They couldn't really bring friends over. They didn't

10:25

go on trips and it

10:27

was mentioned that Trenny had never really

10:30

been away from home for an extended

10:32

period of time without any of

10:34

her

10:34

family. So this field trip was

10:36

a really big deal for her. And here's

10:39

a part that really starts me

10:41

scratching my head because once they get

10:43

on the bus, the teacher missed Dunlap, announced

10:46

then that the horticulture class would be

10:48

going to the great smoky mountain national park.

10:50

So apparently, none

10:52

of the classmates knew the destination

10:55

of the trip until that day, until he surprised

10:57

them on the bus that morning,

10:59

or or did did some of the students

11:01

know, Jen? I think it was

11:03

a surprise to most people, if not

11:06

all, I found this to be a very strange

11:08

little detail as

11:09

well. It's an hour and a half drive.

11:12

Yeah. I mean, this is an all day

11:15

trip that I would

11:17

be pissed. You know, as as a parent, I would be

11:19

absolutely furious. And he's the

11:21

only

11:21

chaperone. Mhmm. I

11:22

gotta I gotta say, I I'm a I'm a little bit

11:24

older. I'm in my seventies. So Now

11:28

this this was just a different time. I don't

11:30

really find that this detail to

11:32

be too odd even

11:35

though it it would happen in the seventies and my example

11:37

is not from the seventies, I do remember my older

11:40

sisters not knowing where they were going

11:42

when they had their permission slip signed by our

11:44

parents. It was either because they

11:46

had a few options like the teachers, the

11:49

faculty had a few options on where the field

11:51

trip was going to be and they hadn't decided yet

11:53

or they wanted to make it a surprise for

11:55

the students. So I don't know if it

11:57

happens today anymore, but I

11:59

do know I experienced

12:00

that, like, kinda secondhand. No.

12:02

It it definitely didn't happen when I was a kid growing

12:04

up in the eighties. That

12:07

sounds dangerously unsafe. And

12:09

there were about forty kids. Is that right,

12:12

Jen? Forty kids in one chaperone.

12:14

The bus driver could not go in

12:17

into the park. He had to stay with the bus.

12:20

So this is one teacher, decide happened

12:22

to decide on a whim that morning. Oh, let's

12:24

go an hour and a half away. I

12:26

can understand a little bit more if it was

12:28

local. I do understand that it's a different

12:30

time and I'm sure the the teacher is not involved

12:33

in this

12:33

disappearance, but come on guy. Yeah.

12:35

I mean, it's it seems weird. It

12:37

seems weird. But I think I

12:39

think Lance kinda hit the nail on my

12:41

head. It was it is the seventies, like, toddlers

12:44

could smoke cigarettes? In hospitals.

12:48

In hospital. So

12:50

the the Jack kinda comes into play a little bit

12:52

as well. Tim, you had mentioned that her

12:54

leaving her purse and her books

12:56

in her mother's car was an indicator

12:58

that she didn't run away. And also she

13:00

didn't even bring a jacket. They were going

13:03

on a field trip. I don't know how much they knew about

13:05

the field

13:05

trip, but she obviously nothing.

13:07

Right. Obviously, there's

13:08

another reason why I was stupid. I do. Right. She didn't

13:11

even bring a jacket. So that

13:14

that led her to borrow her

13:16

brother's Trenny jacket, her

13:18

brother's friend is Robert Simpson, and

13:21

her brother had asked Robert to look

13:23

after Trinity during the field trip

13:25

because, like you said, Jen, she hadn't been anywhere

13:27

without her family ever

13:30

for the whole day. So they knew they were going

13:32

away for the whole day. She didn't

13:34

know if it was happening. It was raining, and she

13:36

was so unprepared. She didn't bring a jacket.

13:38

So I don't think that that I think

13:40

that's so telling as to her not running away.

13:42

She would have to decide in a moment's

13:44

notice to run away completely unprepared.

13:47

So Robert gave Trenny his plaid

13:50

jacket

13:51

because she he was told to look

13:53

after her and and she didn't bring one.

13:55

Yeah. He was told by her brother,

13:58

by Trenny brother, Bob. So this Robert

14:00

Anne Trenny older brother, Bob,

14:02

were friends. They were a year apart in school.

14:05

Robert was a senior, and Bob had

14:07

already graduated And

14:09

Bob asked Robert to look out for Trenny

14:11

during this trip. And so he lensed tranny

14:14

his jacket.

14:15

And I completely blame blame mister

14:18

Dunlap. For her not bringing

14:20

the jacket. You hate

14:21

me if I didn't drive that point home enough. I'm

14:23

I'm really upset at mister Dunlap. So

14:26

the bus parked at clingman's dome

14:28

parking lot And as per regulations

14:30

at that time, as we mentioned, the bus driver had to remain

14:32

with the bus. So students were to hike

14:34

to Andrew's Bald and back, meeting

14:37

back at the bus at three thirty. They

14:39

were not to take any side trails or

14:41

pick or gather anything. Only

14:43

observe mister Dunlap. Did

14:46

hike with various groups of students during

14:48

the

14:48

trip, but he again, he was the only adult

14:51

and I'm gonna pull my hair out. Let's

14:53

talk about Kligman's dome and mister

14:55

Dunlap hikes with various students during

14:57

the trip. I think what I've what I've read

15:00

looking at the Kligman's dome hiking

15:02

path up to the observation

15:05

tower takes about an hour. I don't know

15:07

if that's about the same time, you know, when you're

15:09

hiking with bunch of students. So let's just say an

15:11

hour and a half to get up there and then

15:13

probably they have lunch and then they hike

15:15

back. So, yeah, around three thirty seems

15:17

to be seems to be right. It

15:19

does seem a little bit unsettling

15:22

that there's only one adult on this trip.

15:24

And apparently, the

15:26

the students kinda went off on their own,

15:28

and he made the decision who he was

15:31

going to accompany on the on this

15:33

hike. And Trenny started

15:35

off on the hike with Robert Simpson, her brother's

15:37

friend, and they hiked all the way to Andrew's

15:39

Ball. They ate their lunch along

15:41

the way. And this is where something may

15:43

have happened between Trenny and Robert at that

15:45

spot. Jen, what's

15:48

some of the loose speculation

15:50

about what might have

15:51

happened? Because things changed after that. I

15:54

mean, I just speculated myself. This

15:56

is not like any rumors that were passing

15:58

around by any of the players in

16:00

this case. But I was thinking

16:02

that maybe Robert had made a

16:04

pass at Trenny or maybe

16:06

told her he had feelings for her,

16:08

something like that, or it could have been

16:10

something even less innocent than that.

16:13

And he tried to kiss her or

16:14

worse.

16:15

Do we know if Robert had a crush on Trenny

16:17

or anything?

16:18

I don't know.

16:21

Okay. So that didn't come up anywhere

16:23

in the research? No. I

16:25

think Laura mentioned that Trenny

16:27

Lake Robert, but he was

16:29

only a in her eyes.

16:31

Okay. So Trenny decided

16:33

to depart Robert and start back

16:35

to the parking lot. After

16:37

they had, I guess, ate their lunch and

16:40

maybe something had happened. And Robert claimed

16:42

that they separated amicably,

16:45

and Trenny wanted time to head back, and

16:47

he left the trail

16:49

to, quote, track a

16:51

bear Yeah. This is another

16:53

weird part. Track a bear.

16:56

Yeah. Sorta like a mister mister Dunlap

16:58

thing. Whereas that's not really suspicious.

17:00

It's just inferiorating. This

17:02

is like a little head scratching. That's

17:05

not a that's not reality. You don't?

17:07

No. That's not reality. I'm not from

17:09

Tennessee, but you don't wanna actually find

17:11

a bear.

17:12

Are you

17:12

that dumb? Yeah. Like, you're that dumb,

17:14

you're you're if you did something and you're lying

17:16

about it, Why why say

17:18

say track something

17:19

else? Like, no one believes that you went

17:21

to go track a bear.

17:23

He's doing man stuff. Maybe

17:26

maybe just freaking a bear.

17:29

Well, you know it's the seventies. Maybe the bears

17:31

were like

17:32

Maybe that bears were a little bit more laid

17:35

back. Yeah. They're Trenny. They're on

17:37

TV with Smokey, the Bear.

17:39

And so according to

17:41

various groups of classmates, Trenny

17:44

was hiking at a faster pace than

17:46

others and seemed to be walking on a quote unquote

17:48

mission. And when

17:50

she met another small group of classmates hiking

17:53

the trail, one student said she stopped

17:55

suddenly just ahead of them She ducked

17:57

her head slightly to her right,

18:00

crouched down at one point, then stepped off

18:02

the trail, she was never seen again. And

18:04

this student said she was forever haunted

18:07

by that moment.

18:08

Jen, how far away was she from the

18:10

other students? Yeah. So this

18:12

is really strange. So

18:14

she was hiking away from Robert from

18:16

Andrew's Bald where they stopped to have lunch,

18:19

and she had passed couple groups of

18:21

students So she would have been, like,

18:23

right in the middle of her class though they were

18:25

staggered down the trail. And so

18:27

when she stepped off, she was in the middle

18:29

of, like, a bunch of people. So

18:31

everyone had to look

18:33

away at the same time for her

18:36

to disappear during this time. And it says,

18:38

what we have Mora's case.

18:40

Yeah. It does seem like she saw something

18:43

to the right because she looked to the right.

18:45

Or was avoiding something. Yeah. But

18:48

it seemed like she saw something and walked towards

18:50

it. Do we know where Robert

18:52

was at this point? Do we

18:54

was he behind her or in front of her?

18:56

We don't know where he was. Tim,

18:58

he was tracking a bear.

19:00

Right. So he was unaccounted

19:02

for. Yeah. In fact,

19:04

he was unaccounted for this whole time until

19:06

he reappeared at the bus at three

19:08

thirty. So nobody saw him. This

19:10

is the part that freaks me out. She she's

19:13

amongst her her classmates. It

19:15

you you say it's small group of classmates,

19:17

but still there's a a few people around

19:19

her. And she's she's seen

19:22

stopping suddenly. Someone remembers

19:24

this so so distinctly. They

19:26

remember her looking to her right. And

19:29

she's crouch she crouches down. She

19:32

stops, looks to her right, crouches down

19:34

like she's trying to not be seen.

19:37

And then she steps up the trail. Tim, you

19:39

said she was walking towards what she

19:41

saw, but I don't know if that was if that's

19:43

specifically the case. It

19:45

seemed like it's me. It did seem like it

19:47

until you said that, and then I was thinking, oh, well,

19:49

maybe she maybe she stepped off the trail

19:52

in the other direction trying to get away from something.

19:54

I don't know. The

19:56

thing that really freaks me out is, Jen,

19:58

you you you stay in this research document.

20:01

The student who saw her do this was forever

20:03

haunted by that moment. Was there any

20:05

follow-up by that student? Did they did they

20:07

go maybe call her name into the

20:09

woods or something, like, oh, hey, where are you going?

20:12

Was she that? It's sort of, like,

20:15

nondescript, like, oh, there goes I

20:17

THINK HER NAME IS Trenny. SHE JUST WALKED OFF

20:19

THE OF THE

20:20

PATH, LOOKS LIKE SHE WAS DUCKING DOWN

20:22

FROM SOMETHING. NO ONE WAS CONCERNED. I

20:25

THINK Maybe

20:27

the the sense of haunting came

20:29

after the fact in retrospect looking

20:32

back. I didn't think anybody was

20:34

really that concerned. Yeah.

20:37

I mean, wasn't looking

20:39

like she was hiding or anything. She just kind of,

20:42

like, slowly crouched down and

20:44

looked to her right and I believe she walked

20:46

to the right toward the

20:47

thing. Yeah. guess that would be part of the description

20:49

if she looked panicked or was,

20:51

you know, running or something like that.

20:53

I mean, I guess the only quote we have here

20:56

is she was on a mission at one point and then

20:58

there she stops. So, yeah, it is awfully

21:00

peculiar. Indeed.

21:03

So when the students arrived back at the bus at three

21:05

thirty, roll call was taken and it was

21:07

discovered that Trenny was missing. Robert

21:09

arrived breathing heavily, which wasn't

21:11

really notable because he was kinda heavy

21:13

set. He seemed annoyed though rather

21:15

than concerned about Trenny being

21:17

late. Do you know who that came from, Jen?

21:20

From various classmates who reported

21:22

on him. But this strikes me as especially

21:24

strange because Trenny

21:26

brother, Bob, had specifically

21:29

asked Robert to look

21:31

after Trenny and make sure nothing happened to her.

21:33

So wouldn't you be more concerned if

21:36

your charge was suddenly missing?

21:38

Yeah. Exactly. I would think so. I

21:41

mean, maybe maybe him

21:43

being annoyed was, you know, thinking

21:45

that she was going to come back and she

21:47

didn't. Yeah. I mean, at the

21:49

time, you know, maybe he was

21:51

he was annoyed. I don't know where the hell

21:53

was he too? Mister Dunlap then sent

21:55

a student named Danny John into search back

21:57

up the trail for Trenny while he himself went

21:59

to search double springs to see if Trinity

22:02

had gone off trail or taken the wrong

22:04

one. And when the search did not turn

22:06

up, Trenny, mister Dunlap, sent the bus

22:08

home with the other students, so this was a good decision.

22:11

He then called the National Park Service

22:13

at four PM. So he really didn't waste any time

22:15

there. He it was only a half an hour after

22:17

he took roll call and realized She

22:19

wasn't there

22:20

initially. And a Ranger came down and he helped

22:23

mister Dunlap search again. Yeah. And it actually

22:25

seems like they got everything together

22:27

pretty quickly. Couple hours later,

22:29

at six thirty, the National

22:31

Park Service gathered nineteen volunteers

22:34

to search the area. And when the bus

22:36

arrived at

22:37

school, Trenny mother, Hope was told

22:39

that her daughter was missing. That's a terrible

22:41

thing to hear. Yeah. That'd

22:43

be horrifying. And

22:45

and especially because she maybe had to spend

22:47

the night, I I think it got around

22:50

the thirties that that evening. So that's

22:52

very dangerous. I can't imagine. Anyone in

22:54

the Gibson family got any sleep that night.

22:57

And we'll be right back after a quick word

22:59

from our sponsors. Lance,

23:02

I've been in a couple of car accidents.

23:04

Never really got too injured.

23:07

How

23:07

about you? been in several car accidents

23:09

and all of them were weather related.

23:12

So there was no real need to

23:15

sue anybody in those

23:16

circumstances. Tim, was there any

23:19

need to sue anyone in your circumstances?

23:21

If

23:21

anyone was gonna get sued

23:23

in my circumstances, it would have been

23:25

me. Well, if you are ever injured in

23:27

an accident, whether you slip and fall in

23:29

a store or whether you were

23:31

hurt at work, you

23:34

should definitely check out

23:36

Morgan and Morgan. Morgan and

23:38

Morgan is America's largest injury

23:41

law firm They have over a one hundred

23:43

offices nationwide

23:45

and more than eight hundred lawyers. Everyone

23:47

knows about Morgan to Morgan. Well, everyone

23:50

should know about Morgan and Morgan. They have a

23:52

proven track record. And with over

23:54

fifteen billion dollars recovered

23:56

for their clients, they continue

23:58

to fight to get you full and

24:01

fair compensation. I said fifteen

24:03

billion with a

24:04

b. And that is accurate. And

24:06

submitting an injury claim with Morgan

24:08

and Morgan is so easy. It's

24:10

more like using an app than hiring

24:12

a lawyer. You order some takeout food

24:14

from time to time while submitting a claim to Morgan

24:17

to Morgan is more like ordering takeout

24:19

food than hiring a lawyer. With Morgan

24:21

and Morgan, you can submit a claim without

24:24

ever leaving the couch. In

24:26

eight clicks or

24:27

less, you can submit a claim right to Morgan

24:29

and Morgan. It's that easy. So if you're

24:31

ever injured, you can check out Morgan and

24:33

Morgan. Their fee is free

24:36

unless they win. For more information,

24:38

go to Ford, the people dot com slash

24:41

missing or dial pound law,

24:44

LAW. That's pound 529

24:47

from your cell phone. That's F0RV,

24:51

people dot com slash missing

24:53

or pound hashtag

24:56

law pound 529

24:58

from your cell.

25:00

Every night, I was with this stranger

25:02

who I was suddenly married to. The

25:04

higher

25:05

up you were, the more likely people were to wanna

25:07

have sex with you.

25:07

We were NORD, we were isolated. Nobody cared

25:10

about us, and bad shit happens.

25:12

We're back, everyone. A new season

25:14

of the Webby winning podcast, was

25:17

I in a cult? More crazy cult.

25:19

More wild stories. And more

25:21

of us. Each incredible tale

25:23

told firsthand by the individuals who

25:25

experienced

25:26

it. Some of these cults you guys, holy.

25:29

Even we were shocked that they existed.

25:31

The place that he considered to be

25:33

his home was the star occurrence.

25:36

My brother must have followed me and

25:38

told the pastor and that was it.

25:40

You might even find yourself

25:41

asking, wait. Was

25:43

a high end account?

25:44

The threat of death. They they made that clear.

25:47

We kill Bruceley. We'll kill you. A new

25:49

episode of Wasaiana cult drops every

25:51

week, starting March sixth on Spotify

25:53

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get

25:55

your podcast.

25:59

I'm sure you've heard the old adage

26:02

that you should learn something new every

26:04

day. It's good advice, but with so

26:06

much to do? Are you making time to

26:08

learn and stay curious about our world?

26:10

Well, with everything everywhere daily,

26:12

you can easily make that goal a

26:14

reality. Everything everywhere

26:17

daily is one of the world's most popular

26:19

daily education

26:20

podcasts. In about ten minutes, you

26:22

can learn something new every day

26:24

on the podcast. The show covers history

26:27

science, geography, mathematics, and

26:29

technology as well as biographies from

26:32

some of the world's most interesting people.

26:34

One listener says the show ruling

26:36

makes my day more enjoyable and

26:38

entertaining. Another says the host

26:40

Gary has the rare talent of making

26:42

you genuinely interested In a topic

26:44

you would never have known would appeal

26:46

to you. Fans of the show are so passionate

26:48

they even work to join the Completionist

26:51

Club. The group of dedicated listeners

26:53

who have listened to all nine hundred plus

26:56

and counting

26:57

episodes. Tough to come up with a favorite

26:59

sowed, but one of the ones that really stands

27:01

out for me is the one

27:03

that is titled what were the first and

27:05

second reichs. Tim, you've heard of the third reich

27:07

Aidolf Hitler came to power in nineteen thirty

27:09

373. His new regime was to be called the

27:11

third Reich. What were the other two Reichs? When

27:14

were they? And what exactly is a

27:16

rake? I don't know, but I wanna find out too.

27:18

I like the one why are there no

27:20

flying cars? Isn't that something that

27:22

you expected when you were growing up

27:24

in the

27:24

eighties? It's like flying cars are right

27:26

around the corner. Well, they're still not here. What's

27:28

going on with that? I'm not sure, but I think Marty

27:31

McFly lied to us. SO GO

27:33

AHEAD AND LEARN SOMETHING NEW EVERY

27:35

SINGLE DAY WITH EVERYTHING EVERYWHERE

27:37

DAILY. TIM, WHERE CAN PEOPLE FIND

27:39

THIS? They can find it on Apple Podcasts Spotify

27:42

or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks

27:45

to our sponsors, and now we're back to the program.

27:49

And the next day the Gibson family along with

27:51

tracking dogs and volunteers went back to search,

27:53

and they found a beer can and

27:55

cigarette butts in the area where

27:58

Trenny was last seen. And

28:00

so we don't really know that that's connected to

28:02

the case, but we do know that that's

28:04

where Trenny went off the

28:06

trail and then they're there.

28:08

So that's again peculiar.

28:11

I would have to say that is probably

28:13

related in some way.

28:15

Yeah. I mean, I don't know. I don't know if that was an

28:17

area where a lot of people would go and just, you

28:19

know, smoke a couple cigarettes and have

28:22

have some snap some beer. I have

28:24

no idea what to make of that. I do know the dogs

28:26

tracked Trenny sent from the base of

28:28

clingman's dome tower to

28:30

the place where she went off the trail and

28:33

then lots the scent at Collins Gap

28:35

in the middle of a paved road. It's

28:37

like an in between road

28:39

sort of it really does remind me of

28:42

of the Route one hundred and twelve where

28:44

Moore went missing. All of the tracking dogs

28:46

were different breeds and all hit on Collins

28:49

Gap. And Chinese uncles also

28:51

helped with a search bringing their own dogs.

28:53

And those dogs had the same result as

28:55

well. Yeah. So the speculation sort of being

28:57

that Trenny got into a vehicle

28:59

at that point or was taken

29:03

into a vehicle perhaps. I'm not

29:05

not really sure, but it would

29:07

seem to point that there was some interaction there

29:09

on that

29:10

road. Jen, is this information that you

29:12

received from Laura, that this

29:14

is exactly where the dogs lost

29:15

there? Lost her scent?

29:18

Yeah. Yeah. That's exactly what Laura said.

29:20

And she was, like, pretty adamant

29:22

on saying that there were different breed dogs and

29:24

that they'd all lost the scent at the

29:26

same place. Some of them hid on

29:29

the place where she allegedly went missing

29:31

on the trail. But all of them

29:33

hit on Colin's gap. So

29:35

this makes me think that she definitely got

29:38

into a car and she was either taken

29:40

farther into the park or outside

29:43

of it

29:43

somewhere.

29:44

And Laura believes the same thing?

29:46

Yeah. Yeah. With those dogs, it is

29:48

good to know that several different breeds and several

29:50

different kinds of dogs, you know, and

29:52

a lot of different dogs were used because

29:55

that is one thing that we hear over and over

29:57

about dogs. It's like, you know, they're

29:59

only as good as their their

30:01

trainer and, you

30:02

know, you know, you know, you can't really trust them until you

30:04

have several data points. And

30:07

so as far as the investigation goes, there

30:09

were a lot of authorities involved, the

30:11

National Park Service being won, the

30:13

Knoxville Police Department, and the

30:15

FBI later got involved. And

30:18

Laura, the woman that you spoke with

30:20

there, Jen, she is vehement in saying

30:22

that a proper investigation was not conducted

30:25

and tell us

30:26

why? So she says that too much

30:28

weight was put on the assumption that Trenny

30:31

had run away. And this was common

30:33

of the seventies apparently, especially

30:35

when dealing with some missing teens.

30:38

And also because no trace of

30:40

her could be found in the

30:41

park. It was thought that she left the

30:43

park of her own will, maybe hitchhike

30:46

somewhere. And

30:46

there was a rumor that she ran off because she had

30:49

secret boyfriend? Yeah. I

30:52

Yeah. I don't know how true

30:54

that could be. I mean, Chinese

30:56

came from this, like, very conservative family,

30:59

which doesn't mean to it she wouldn't try

31:01

to rebel. Like, I do know she smoked

31:03

cigarettes and stuff, which was not condoned by

31:05

her parents. But

31:07

that's a far cry from, like, finding

31:11

a boyfriend and running off with him.

31:13

And,

31:14

like, the boyfriend wasn't reported missing.

31:16

Like, who is this person? Right. Right. So if

31:18

it goes back to the more merry thing, if there was somebody

31:20

who, Laura, went missing with

31:23

who helped her to escape her life, that

31:26

person hasn't come forward nor has

31:28

anybody heard about, you know,

31:30

a specific person coming forward. This

31:33

is a this one is just as interesting

31:35

because exactly if there was

31:37

a secret boyfriend that no one knows about

31:39

that she was dating and then planned

31:41

this this

31:43

this escape from what seems to be

31:45

a a kind of a strict environment, but nothing

31:47

worse. Right? I mean, her her home life wasn't

31:50

anything worse than strict that you know of.

31:53

Where's this other

31:53

guy? Where's this other person? Why

31:56

hasn't that person come forward in in so many

31:58

years?

31:58

Exactly. I mean, Trenny didn't even know

32:00

where she was going that day.

32:01

Yeah. And

32:02

it's not like she had a cell phone in her pocket

32:05

saying like, hey, babe, pick me up. Right.

32:08

Right. Yeah. I think that's important detail

32:10

that we didn't know.

32:11

Right. Exactly. And she also smoked

32:13

cigarettes, you said? Yeah. I

32:15

think that was, like, one little

32:18

thing that she did in order to rebel.

32:20

But it was the

32:21

seventies, remember, so it's not that bad.

32:23

Do we happen to know if the cigarettes that were found

32:25

were the cigarettes that

32:27

Trenny smoked? Did she have a particular

32:29

brand? I didn't get any information

32:32

in that regard. I don't know which brand

32:34

she smoked or even if she had a brand,

32:36

I think it was like she would accept a

32:38

cigarette from people who were passing

32:40

by or her brother

32:41

you know, something like that. And I

32:44

guess it's kinda hard to determine whether

32:46

or not those cigarettes that were found,

32:49

had, you know, were smoked by

32:51

Trenny and Robert. And even if they were

32:53

found, like,

32:54

what's the what's telling about that,

32:57

that they had a couple of cigarettes while they were

32:59

hiking? But here's one thing that I

33:01

that I find even more curious is

33:03

is the beer. So someone

33:07

if it was a student's beer, a student

33:09

brought that beer from home

33:11

and

33:12

just, like, what put his pocket or

33:14

something? Or

33:14

they had in his lit his backpack or something?

33:17

They had backpacks, I guess, because they packed a lunch.

33:20

It's possible. I mean, yeah.

33:22

I wonder if they collected this

33:24

evidence because even though they didn't have

33:26

DNA testing at the

33:28

time, they could have you know, lifted prints

33:30

from it?

33:30

Yeah. would hope so. I

33:32

mean, maybe they did run prints and

33:34

nothing came back. Yeah. Or

33:36

maybe they ran prints and it came back and even

33:38

if it's Robert, what what

33:40

does that do? Robert would just say,

33:43

yeah, you know, arrest

33:45

me for not being

33:47

of age to drink a beer. It

33:49

really doesn't say anything.

33:51

I think the damning thing was that the beer

33:53

was found where she stepped off

33:55

the trail. Mhmm.

33:57

So, like, who was there?

34:00

Who was signaling to her? I mean,

34:02

you have a pretty clear indication

34:04

that, like, it might be connected if it

34:06

was, like, at that point in trail. So that's

34:08

that's also a really creepy visual

34:10

to have. Right? Somebody is

34:12

having a couple of beers and smoking cigarettes

34:14

and

34:15

waiting. Like watching and waiting?

34:17

Yeah. I mean, there we do know that

34:19

about Israel Keys. I don't know about the cigarettes and

34:22

beer part, but Israel Keys would wait in the woods

34:24

for people. I do believe there were others.

34:26

The Appalachian Trail, which is where this

34:28

is, has had several unsolved

34:31

murders, kind of that kind of fits

34:33

that type of profile actually?

34:36

Actually, like a couple years ago, I

34:38

went camping in the Smoky

34:40

Mountains in Katy's

34:41

Cove, which was like maybe

34:43

twenty minutes away from where went

34:45

missing? You're

34:46

just bringing this up now. Sorry.

34:52

How long have we known you?

34:55

So I went camping there and the

34:57

week before I

35:00

arrived there. There was a young boy

35:02

that went

35:02

missing. Oh, no.

35:04

Did you know about that before you went?

35:06

No. I didn't. There was, like, signs

35:08

up all around at the campsite. Well,

35:10

national parks are sort of a hotspot

35:13

for missing people. Here we go.

35:15

You know, it's probably not

35:17

anything more sinister

35:19

than they're just

35:21

like the terrain is rough in a

35:23

lot of naps national parks and

35:25

there's woods and, you know, there's a lot of places

35:28

to get lost. But I do

35:30

know there is a popular series out there called

35:32

missing 411 that deals with this. And

35:34

I think they speculate about well, I I wanna

35:36

say David Pley to speculate about anything,

35:39

but he sort of lets

35:41

the audience speculate and but really

35:43

kinda pushes you towards bigfoot or aliens

35:45

or

35:46

something. Yeah. Aside

35:48

from Big Foot and Aliens and

35:50

Robert Simpson, were

35:53

there any other suspects yeah,

35:54

there's a crazy story that happened a

35:57

year before. And when I first heard

35:59

about this, it was like, well, of course, this

36:01

guy did it somehow. So Kelvin

36:03

Bowman was another student at Bearden

36:05

High School, and he was one of the few

36:07

black students, year previously

36:09

almost to the date Kelvin showed

36:12

up at Gibson house drunk and

36:14

calling for Bob. Hope watched

36:16

him through the upstairs window and said he

36:18

hunkered down in front of Trenny window

36:20

by a planter box. He

36:23

stuck out his foot, so Hope shot

36:25

him in his foot. After

36:27

he was shot, Kelvin broke Trenny window

36:29

and still tried to break in. So

36:31

this guy got shot and then still tried to

36:33

break in and attempted to drag Trenny,

36:36

our missing woman outside. And

36:38

Trenny actually got away though and went for her mother.

36:41

Kelvin came down the hall, arms raised,

36:44

and it was determined that he was drunk

36:46

and what happened

36:49

what happened after that? So he he gets

36:51

he gets arrested. He calls the cops, he gets

36:53

arrested, and and he's sent to

36:55

juvenile

36:56

corrections. Is that is that accurate? That's

36:58

right. Yeah. Yeah. And

37:00

after he got out, he threatened to get

37:02

even, quote unquote, with the Simpsons.

37:05

And he would constantly heckle Trenny

37:07

at

37:07

school. So how about that?

37:09

Okay. And there were rumors that a car was following

37:11

the bus the day of the field trip and many

37:14

believe this car belonged to Kelvin. However,

37:16

Kelvin did not own a car. Some

37:18

other stories suggest that Kelvin was driving

37:20

Robert Simpson's car but it

37:22

is not substantiated if they were even

37:25

friends and the principal of the school attested

37:27

that Kelvin was in class that

37:29

day. What's your thoughts on all of this, Jen?

37:32

think it's a crazy story, but

37:34

my gut feeling is that Kelvin

37:36

had nothing to do with her disappearance. Nobody

37:39

knew where the bus was going that day

37:41

like, it's it's it would be so strange

37:44

for someone to plan a kidnapping or

37:47

a murder and, like, follow

37:49

a bus to an un undisclosed location

37:52

and, like, commit a crime

37:53

there. And he didn't even have a car.

37:55

This was the seventies. You mentioned that he was

37:57

one of the only black kids in the school,

38:00

and he was probably prone to a

38:02

lot of undue suspicion in a

38:04

lot of

38:04

cases, and especially on top of the

38:06

the break in. Right. Yeah. I think

38:08

that's definitely fair. But what was

38:10

he gonna do with Trenny if he got her outside?

38:13

no idea. I think he was just wasted.

38:16

So Kelvin was the was the only

38:18

other suspect aside from Robert

38:20

Simpson who apparently

38:22

was never totally honest about what happened that

38:24

day AND IN SUBsequent INTERVIEWS WITH

38:26

THE GIVSON FAMILY HE ACTED K

38:28

G. AND COME TO FIND

38:30

OUT HIS FATHER WAS THE ASSISTANT DISTRICT

38:32

ATTORNEY IN NOXVILLE, TENNESSEE

38:35

AT THE TIME AND COUNCILED ROBERT

38:37

AND TOLD HIM NOT TO TELL THE POLICE ANYTHING.

38:39

ALSO THE FATHER REMINDED THE POLICE

38:41

They had no evidence that his son had been involved

38:44

in any crime and they could not hold him

38:46

in

38:46

custody. The police ceased questioning

38:48

him after that. So pretty convenient that

38:51

Robert has a dad who's the assistant district

38:53

attorney in Knoxville, Tennessee. It's definitely

38:55

convenient. And here's a

38:57

big clue. Trenny comb

39:00

was found in Robert's car.

39:02

And that's Trenny's hair comb that was

39:04

bought by her mom. Her mom bought

39:06

her and her younger sister Tina.

39:10

Hair hair combs. And this comb

39:12

was a very personal object to

39:14

Trenny, but it was found in Robert's

39:16

car later. Yeah. This is a really strange

39:18

detail to me. In order for this

39:20

comb to have appeared in Robert's

39:23

car, he hadn't brought his car in

39:25

this field trip. Right? So he

39:27

would have if say say Trenny

39:29

gave him the comb for safekeeping

39:31

when they were going on this hike, he would

39:34

have had to take the comb all the way back

39:36

on the bus with him, back to school,

39:38

even knowing Trenny was missing, and

39:40

then put it into his car, all without

39:42

telling anyone he had it or trying to return

39:44

it to her family at any point, he just

39:47

kept it. And that seems to

39:49

me like a kind of Trenny thing.

39:51

Because this was an important

39:53

thing.

39:54

It sure does. Yeah. He used to comb

39:56

his hair with it.

39:57

Yeah. It's just super creepy. Some

39:59

of his hair strands were found in the comb.

40:02

Do we know where where Robert Simpson

40:04

is today? I mean, with the Trenny

40:07

comb and him using it for his own

40:09

personal his own personal

40:11

use. Like, this is sort of

40:13

like telltale signs of of

40:15

something deeper going on

40:17

here. Is he is he around? What's he what's

40:19

he doing? He is around.

40:21

I'm not sure exactly where he is living currently,

40:23

but he is around. He's alive. And

40:27

he has never spoken to the authorities further

40:29

aside from what he gave to the police

40:32

initially, and he refused

40:34

to speak to Laura. When

40:36

she asked him.

40:37

Wow. And speaking of Trenny

40:40

belongings, some of the students

40:42

had some of Chinese

40:43

jewelry, her sapphire necklace and

40:45

a diamond star sapphire ring

40:48

were found in the possession of one girl

40:50

who refused to provide information on how

40:52

she obtained it. And according to Robert,

40:54

they were at the parking lot, Trenny went into

40:56

a washroom and gave it to one of the girls

40:59

to hold. And the girl who was

41:01

said to have been asked to hold onto

41:03

Trenny jewelry was not the same girl

41:05

who had it later on after Trinity's

41:07

disappearance. Alright.

41:08

What do what do we make of this?

41:10

Well, I think the the word Trenny again.

41:13

So Robert takes the jewelry.

41:16

I I'm so confused by this. Robert

41:18

takes the jewelry and then gives it to a

41:20

girl. It kinda reminds

41:22

me of Gary Jean Grant Lance

41:24

from our friend detective, Uncle

41:26

Floyd Stiggers -- Lloyd. -- Lloyd. Yeah. Yeah,

41:29

Seattle's forgotten serial killer that we

41:31

covered on an episode of crawl space because

41:34

Gary Jean Grant stole a victim's

41:37

watch and then gave it to another woman

41:39

as a

41:39

gift.

41:40

Well, this passed between, like, at least

41:42

two other girls, some of her jewelry.

41:46

Did they say how they got it? No.

41:48

They refused to answer, and the

41:50

police just was, I guess,

41:52

were fine with

41:53

that. don't know.

41:54

Yeah. That sounds that sounds eerie.

41:57

Robert could have threatened them not to say

41:59

anything that he gave it to

42:01

them. Well, what kind of poll does Robert

42:03

have anyway? Why this

42:05

is why I'm confused by this. It's a bunch of students

42:07

and and a teacher who, even

42:09

though Tim doesn't like him, he seemed like

42:11

he got his act together when he realized one

42:14

of his students was missing. This information

42:16

doesn't get back to him or it does get back

42:18

to him and he just doesn't

42:20

I know what his follow-up would have been. You know,

42:22

like, this must have been strange for people

42:24

who are involved. Yeah. Maybe

42:27

you know, it wasn't really confirmed for

42:29

a while that it was Trenny, but it seems

42:32

like it it was definitely Trenny.

42:34

And So the the young women who had the

42:36

jewelry, I mean, their motivation to

42:38

keep it

42:38

might, you know, might have just been that. They just wanted it,

42:40

you know. And and maybe they didn't know anything more.

42:43

Yeah. And and, Jen, your

42:45

your communication with Laura is that she

42:48

said she's convinced that a handful of people

42:50

in the class of nineteen seventy seven

42:52

And to a lesser

42:54

degree, the class of nineteen seventy eight know exactly

42:56

what happened to Trinity.

42:57

I mean, that's what Laura said. And

42:59

they know what happened to Trinity and what were

43:01

they they were trying to cover it to claim

43:03

she couldn't handle things at

43:04

home, and she had too many restrictions, and

43:07

they covered it by saying she ran away. Yeah.

43:09

Yeah. There was rumor to the sort that she had

43:11

run away. I know there was one girl who

43:14

attested to the fact that she was, like, planning

43:16

to run away. But more

43:18

more than, like, a point in the favor of

43:20

the runaway. Like, it seems

43:23

that maybe more than one student

43:25

were either involved with Chinese

43:28

disappearance

43:29

or that they heard

43:31

something about it after the fact.

43:33

And we'll be right back after a quick word

43:35

from our sponsors. Hey,

43:38

listeners. This is Tim and Lance here. Have you

43:40

about missing and crawl space premium.

43:42

We offer a premium feed of this show

43:45

that is completely ad free that includes

43:47

bonus episodes and early access

43:49

to all episodes. Go to

43:51

missing dot supporting cast dot f m

43:53

or click the link in our bio to

43:55

sign

43:56

up. You can

43:56

use code missing for one free month

43:59

on supporting cast. And Apple users

44:01

can subscribe right in the Apple Podcasts

44:03

app by clicking Trenny free

44:05

right at the top of the

44:06

feed. We hope to see you there. Thanks

44:08

to our sponsors, and now we're back to the program.

44:11

What I find really weird about

44:14

what Robert did was after Trenny

44:16

went missing, Robert took it upon himself to

44:18

go into the Gibson house and screen

44:20

calls from the press and from

44:22

police. And the family asked

44:24

him not to do this after that. So

44:27

he he voluntarily put himself in

44:29

charge of answering the phone and

44:31

and speaking for the family. He he became

44:34

the family's spokesperson even

44:37

though the family didn't ask him to do

44:39

so. That's interesting.

44:41

Yeah. I think it's important to mention

44:43

that the family was not at home at the

44:45

time

44:45

-- Right. -- that they were near

44:47

the National Park. Like, assisting in

44:49

the search for Trenny, so he broke

44:51

in. I mean, he was

44:53

best friends with Bob. The

44:56

brother?

44:57

Yeah.

44:57

There wasn't any charge apparently. No.

45:00

It wasn't a break in or anything. I think

45:03

Maybe they chalked it up too. He was just trying to

45:05

help. But, yeah, he was in

45:07

the house at at sometimes and, like,

45:09

releasing statements to the press and to the

45:11

police.

45:12

And apparently, after Trenny went missing,

45:15

Robert said that if Kelvin

45:17

had her that he would have killed her,

45:20

So he was trying to their cast blame

45:22

upon someone else. And then he said,

45:24

if not

45:24

Kelvin, then she went off with, quote,

45:27

some horny hitchhiker, unquote. K.

45:30

That seems very convenient. I wonder

45:32

if he ever found that bear that he was tracking.

45:34

So so Jen, from from your position

45:36

here in in your

45:38

your hatch, What what are some of the

45:40

theories that are running through your head?

45:43

So there's there's lots of possibilities here.

45:45

I'll tell you which one I think is most

45:47

likely at the end. But

45:50

one of them was that Trenny was obstructed by a

45:52

stranger and taken out of the park. Another

45:54

one was that Kelvin followed the bus

45:56

and some kind of car and abducted

45:58

Trenny and killed her.

46:00

Another is Trini and Robert had an

46:02

altercation at Andrew's Bald

46:04

Trenny walked away, but was intercepted later

46:07

by Robert. They had a fight and Robert

46:09

Willeer accidentally killed her.

46:11

And, of course, it being a national park.

46:14

Some people think Trinity got lost and

46:16

died due to exposure.

46:18

Right. That's a pretty popular theory

46:21

whenever someone goes missing in the national

46:23

parks that they die of exposure or,

46:26

you know, their torn

46:28

apart by the the wildlife

46:30

there. Things they they

46:32

searched with a lot of people out there Trenny

46:35

close to when she went missing and

46:37

we can't forget that the dogs lost her

46:39

scent in an apparent way that it suggests

46:41

she got into a car

46:44

which brings the other theory into play

46:46

did she get into to a car to run away from

46:48

home? Had she ever done that? Had

46:50

she ever tried to run away from home

46:52

in the past? know she had a

46:55

strict home, but that doesn't make much sense to me

46:57

either. She didn't even know where she was going on

46:59

that on that field

47:00

trip.

47:00

Yeah. She was so ill prepared.

47:02

Yeah. She didn't run away from home. I think

47:04

we can completely cross that off because

47:06

she didn't know where she was going. Yeah. It

47:08

it would be such a ridiculous plan

47:11

to try to enact at that

47:13

at that moment. She didn't even have a jacket. So

47:16

so Jen, I think your your theory of

47:18

choices that she walked into another

47:20

dimension.

47:20

I mean, if if this were twin peaks Potentially.

47:23

Can I add an unlikely theory? Sure.

47:26

Mister Dunlap had someone

47:28

meet meet the bus in the parking lot?

47:30

And that's someone, you know,

47:33

they they organized making

47:35

Trenny Go missing together. I realized

47:38

how Farfetch that is, but human

47:40

trafficking ring. I don't know. That's what comes to mind.

47:42

I mean, again, a lot of Dunlop's actions

47:44

are just so stupid for

47:46

lack of better word. I'm still

47:48

mad at him, but he probably

47:51

didn't do anything. I I don't think that's what

47:53

happened. Yeah. He was definitely a suspect

47:55

for at least a little bit of

47:57

the investigation, but he was ruled

47:59

out, I believe, in the end. K.

48:01

And

48:01

so what is your what is your theory that you're

48:03

going with? I really think

48:05

that Robert had something to do with

48:08

Chinese disappearance. I think that

48:10

he killed her and that he maybe had

48:12

the students of another student

48:15

or he talked about it with

48:17

another

48:17

student. Do you think that when they

48:20

separated after

48:22

they hiked together, had

48:24

lunch, something happened, they

48:27

separated, She was

48:29

on the path trying to get away from him.

48:32

Do you think that she saw him in the woods?

48:34

Or do you think that she like, do you

48:36

think that's where it happened? Was he in

48:38

your opinion, going off

48:40

trail

48:41

to to maybe interceptor? I

48:44

think what makes sense is that when

48:46

they were at Andrew's ball together, something

48:49

happened between them in which Robert made

48:51

a pass at Trenny and because she comes

48:53

from this very conservative background may have

48:55

freaked out a bit it could have been a very innocent

48:57

thing. Like, he tried to hold her hand or

49:00

whatever. And she wasn't running

49:02

away from him. She was just kind of walking

49:04

at a fast click. You know, down

49:07

the trail. Yeah. And I think that

49:10

maybe Robert would have panicked

49:12

that she was gonna go tell mister

49:14

Dunlap what had happened.

49:17

And so he went

49:19

off trail trying to intercept her and then signaled

49:21

her from the side. And because

49:24

it wasn't maybe that serious of

49:26

an of an incident. Maybe she was like, okay.

49:28

Let me talk to him. Maybe

49:31

we can just figure this out together and then something

49:33

like an altercation happened and

49:35

he accidentally

49:37

killed her. Yeah. definitely think

49:39

that Robert is the most suspicious person

49:41

here, and I don't believe she

49:44

ran

49:44

away. Yeah. III

49:46

look towards Robert. Yeah. I do too.

49:49

Up until where

49:51

the dogs lost her scent. So

49:54

he must have had someone else pick

49:56

her up or or is it possible

49:58

that She was trying to

50:00

get away from him because of whatever happened

50:02

at Andrew's Bald, and she

50:04

made it out to the road and someone else picked her

50:06

up. Don't think she's alive today because

50:09

that wouldn't explain, you know, why

50:11

she wouldn't go back to her family. But

50:14

an altercation could have carried into

50:16

that road or even beyond that

50:18

road. I'm not sure how much they

50:20

searched beyond that, but

50:23

So there's also thing like

50:25

like if even if the dogs tracked her scent

50:28

to this parking lot and then lost

50:30

it further down the road doesn't mean that

50:32

she was even alive when she was in that

50:34

parking lot? I mean, Robert

50:36

could have killed her. Stash

50:38

the body somewhere. I mean, it is the wilderness

50:41

and then came back later with his car to

50:43

pick her up.

50:44

There you go. That makes sense. Yeah.

50:46

That's good thinking.

50:48

Maybe? Where he had somebody

50:50

help him dispose of the body?

50:52

Like his dad? Yeah. I mean,

50:54

any other help seems kind of unlikely

50:56

to me just because it is a high school

50:58

and I think it's probably

51:01

really easy to get caught if you're talking

51:03

about illegal things that you did in

51:05

high school? Yeah. Well, I think it's

51:08

part of the reason that nothing ever

51:11

came out of Robert's mouth about this case

51:13

is that his father is an attorney. He's

51:15

a ADA. Like, he would counsel his

51:17

son to just, like, shut up and not say a

51:19

word. So where this occurred actually

51:21

is on the the Tennessee and North Carolina

51:24

border. So you don't have to travel very

51:26

far to put a body in another

51:28

state at that point. guess that's why the FBI

51:31

was involved, but

51:33

whoever did this has already got a leg

51:35

up on on a search. By involving

51:38

a second state. Okay. So if anybody

51:40

has any information on

51:41

this, who do they contact? The

51:42

investigating agency is the Tennessee Bureau

51:45

of Investigation and you can call them at

51:47

6157444000.

51:51

And

51:52

if anybody wants to contact Laura, how

51:54

do they go about doing that, Jen?

51:55

I believe through her website.

51:57

Canadian girl seventy seven

51:59

dot com. That's girl with a u.

52:02

Yeah. There's also a space on that site to make

52:04

comments and Laura is pretty good about responding.