0:00

Sasha hated sand, the way it stuck

0:02

to things for weeks. So

0:05

when Maddy shared a surf trip on

0:07

Expedia Trip Planner, he hesitated. Then

0:10

he added a hotel with a cliffside pool

0:12

to the plan, and they

0:14

both spent the week in the water. You

0:17

were made to follow your whims. We

0:20

were made to find a place on the

0:22

beach with a pool, and a waterfall, and

0:24

a soaking tub, and of course a great

0:26

shower. Expedia. Made

0:28

to travel. Momentum

0:31

is building to oust Johnson from his

0:33

House speakership. But Johnson's not going down

0:35

without a fight, folks. He went on

0:38

Fox Business over the weekend to remind

0:40

Republicans that he has the backing

0:42

of the parties, dear, later. I spent

0:44

hours with the president on Friday. He's 100% with me.

0:48

Well, that settles it. Trump is

0:50

100% with him. Isn't

0:52

that right, sir? He's going to protect King

0:54

and John's family. Well, we'll see what

0:56

happens with that. That

1:02

is a dose of classic Trump loyalty. He's

1:04

got your back so he can push you under

1:06

a bus. Speaker

1:10

Mike Johnson pushing forward with a

1:13

series of foreign aid bills despite

1:15

growing pushback within his party. How

1:18

much will he need to lean on

1:20

Democrats to get the funding passed, and

1:23

will it cost him the

1:26

speakership? Plus, the Senate dismisses

1:28

the Articles of Impeachment against

1:30

Homeland Security Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas.

1:33

Very quickly. That was fast. We'll

1:35

show you how things played out on Capitol

1:37

Hill and why Mitch McConnell said it was

1:40

not a proud day in the history

1:42

of the Senate. And what

1:45

to expect today when jury selection

1:47

picks up again in former President

1:49

Trump's hush money trial. They

1:51

went pretty fast in the first couple of days.

1:53

We already have seven jurors seated. Trump's saying they're

1:56

moving too fast. Oh, they're rushing

1:58

it. Okay, good morning and welcome.

2:00

Good morning, Joe. It is Thursday,

2:02

April 18th along with Joe, Willie

2:04

and me. We have former White

2:06

House Director of Communications to President

2:08

Obama, Jennifer Palmieri. She's co host

2:10

of the MSNBC podcast with Claire

2:13

How to Win 2024. Chief

2:16

White House correspondent for the New York

2:18

Times, Peter Baker is with us this

2:20

morning and MSNBC contributor and author of

2:23

the book How the Right Lost its

2:25

Mind. Charlie Sykes is with

2:27

us this morning. We have so much

2:30

to get to talk about. And in a few

2:32

minutes where we were going to talk about

2:34

Speaker Johnson in Ukraine, I must say, he

2:37

has had a conversion. You

2:39

know, it's like a

2:42

Christmas carol that the ghost of the

2:44

Republican Party past came to visit him

2:46

in the middle of the night and

2:49

said to him, well, and

2:52

he said, Yes, sir.

2:54

No, listen, what

2:56

do I say about conversion? I'll take them. I'm

2:59

a Baptist. Yeah, we love

3:01

deathbed conversions. We love midlife

3:04

conversions you want to convert.

3:07

Just as I am and waiting

3:09

night to cleanse my soul of

3:11

one dark spot. Well, okay, we'll

3:13

take speaker Johnson, who

3:16

sounds like Ronald Reagan.

3:18

And I will say in defense of some

3:20

of the leaders in that house GOP, like

3:23

some of those leaders that run important

3:25

committees, they felt like they're actually concerned

3:28

right about China, Iran,

3:32

and Russia. And this

3:34

might literally be a political deathbed conversion

3:36

for Mike Johnson as the threats to

3:38

his job continue from that faction. But

3:40

Joe, Speaker Johnson invoked Ronald Reagan's name

3:42

finally her head out loud. That's something

3:44

we've been talking about for months now

3:47

in the show the party of Ronald

3:49

Reagan turning its back on Ukraine in

3:51

a fight against Russia. Speaker

3:53

Johnson said yesterday, I'm a child of the 80s.

3:55

I'm a child of the Reagan era, we have

3:57

to do what's right here. We have to give

3:59

you Ukraine what it needs. Where

4:02

was that over the last couple of months?

4:04

Unclear. But he's come around, the

4:06

question will be have enough other Republicans come

4:08

around to that position to clear

4:10

this funding and get it to Ukraine. Perhaps as

4:12

early as Saturday night when Speaker Johnson says there'll

4:14

be a vote. And-

4:17

Oh, say Democrats step up. Maybe he'll go

4:19

to the floor. No. And

4:21

maybe he'll say- Listen. MTG.

4:25

Tear down that wall. I mean, there's

4:27

so many options now. Yeah, there's a

4:30

lot to say. He can borrow so

4:32

much from Ronald Reagan.

4:34

Yes, he can. And he's going

4:36

to be doing so. Yeah. And

4:38

I will say that,

4:41

you know, Reagan always figured out

4:43

how to be conservative ideologically,

4:46

but it compromised, but

4:48

moderate temperamentally. And

4:51

I think Ronald Reagan would be shaking his head

4:53

right now if he saw what was happening in

4:55

the state of Arizona. Oh my God. You

4:57

actually had Republicans going back to 1864

5:02

for a ban that

5:05

actually allows, well,

5:09

forces, young rape

5:11

victims and young incest victims

5:14

if from Phoenix, from Maricopa County, from

5:16

Tucson, from across the state, if they're

5:18

raped by an uncle or if they're

5:21

raped by, well,

5:23

like in the Ohio case, an illegal

5:25

immigrant, that there's going to be a, the

5:28

state is going to have a forced birth for

5:30

that 10 year old or 11 year old or 12 year old. And

5:33

it's happening. It happens

5:35

across America. And this

5:39

is what the Republicans in Arizona are

5:42

forcing on their people. Yeah. Are

5:44

there women on their children? Makes sense. Since

5:46

the guy who came up with the law,

5:48

raped children, forced them to have children. Arizona,

5:52

you've done it again. For the second time in

5:55

two weeks, Republicans and Arizona

5:57

state legislature have rejected. attempt

6:00

to repeal a near total abortion

6:02

ban from 1864. It's

6:04

a it's a people will you're running into

6:07

a burning house. And they're

6:09

saying, hey, we got an exit, we

6:11

got you can run off the back

6:13

door and not be engulfed

6:15

in flames. And come with

6:17

us. You can save all these women. Now

6:19

we're fine. We're fine. We just can keep

6:22

them in the house burn, let it burn

6:24

down. We're totally cool. Not about you don't

6:26

go out the back door. The second time

6:28

now, that Democrats and

6:30

tribes and save Republicans from

6:32

their own worst

6:34

1864 instincts. And

6:36

what did they do, Willie? They go, nope, we're good.

6:38

We want to stick with the 1864 law. Yeah,

6:42

I mean, even if you hold the reprehensible view,

6:44

that someone who is

6:46

raped must deliver the baby because you

6:48

said so. Do it for

6:51

the politics. How about that? Do it

6:53

for cynical political reasons that most people

6:55

in your state think this is appalling.

6:57

And yet you're standing by it. In

6:59

fact, only two Republicans joined all the

7:02

Democrats in the House Chamber in Arizona,

7:04

the vote to repeal the Civil War

7:06

era ban House Republicans later voted to

7:08

adjourn until next week. They did this

7:11

last week as well, leaving a path

7:13

for repeal of this bill unclear. Democrats

7:15

in the state house blasted their Republican

7:17

colleagues. The

7:20

message for today is clear. Arizona

7:23

Republicans voted not once but twice

7:25

to uphold the draconian 1864 abortion

7:27

ban. That

7:30

includes absolutely no exceptions

7:32

for rape and no exceptions for

7:34

incest. Our voices may

7:36

not have been heard today. But let

7:39

us be clear, we will be heard in November.

7:42

So Jen, the Republicans in Arizona keep running back this

7:44

playbook. They did it last week where they didn't want

7:46

to take a vote on it. Yeah. So was it

7:49

just going to dismiss themselves adjourn for a week and

7:51

do what I don't know, because they came back after

7:53

a week this time and did the same thing all

7:55

over again. Again, only two

7:57

Republicans in the Arizona House

8:00

voted to repeal a law that would force a

8:02

woman who was raped or is a victim of

8:04

incest to deliver the baby. Yeah, and if

8:06

Democrats were being political, they could have voted against it

8:08

too, right? They could have said, hey, if Republicans made

8:11

this mess, let them, you know, let them deal with

8:13

it. Or, you know, I said, let's just pass something

8:15

on the state ballot initiative and not give them a

8:17

lifeline. But I have, you know, two

8:19

takeaways from this. One, it's just how

8:22

destructive Donald Trump's presidency has been,

8:24

right? Just how destructive this has

8:26

been for women. And when Republicans

8:28

are in charge, they

8:30

will take the most extreme position when

8:32

it comes to, you know, women's rights

8:35

on the state level. And,

8:37

you know, Trump, you

8:39

know, he's trying to say

8:41

that he said, Arizona will overturn this. Well, they

8:43

didn't, right? You leave it to the states, we'd

8:45

love to assist it. This is what's happened. He

8:48

may be trying to moderate his position, but he's already done

8:50

the most extreme thing because he took away

8:52

the fundamental rights that women have. And brags

8:54

about it. And brags about it. He said it was

8:57

incredible. He said it was amazing. He said people were happy.

8:59

One of the state representatives that was part of

9:01

this debate yesterday, one of the

9:03

Republicans said, talked about how, you know,

9:06

pregnancies don't have to be picture perfect.

9:09

Meaning, you know, suggesting that

9:11

it's OK if pregnancies come

9:13

about by rape or incest. They don't need

9:15

to be picture perfect in order for

9:18

a woman to need to have

9:20

that child. My

9:22

God, I mean, the hypocrisy of that,

9:24

of course, they say that generally

9:27

if it comes into their own home, it happens

9:29

in their own home. If their 10 year old

9:31

daughter were raped by an illegal immigrant, they'd be

9:33

the first to say, OK, we're going to take

9:35

care of it. They'd be the first. So

9:38

the hypocrisy is just staggering. And, you

9:40

know, Charlie Sykes, Jim's

9:42

right. Donald Trump has

9:45

been just absolutely terrible and destructive

9:47

for the rights of women, for

9:49

the rights of rape victims, for the

9:51

rights of incest victims. And you move

9:54

it to politics so destructive.

9:56

And we've said this before because we're

9:58

really kind people. And we're

10:00

trying to help Republicans, we're

10:02

trying to help them find their way back

10:04

to where they can actually win an election

10:06

once in a while. They just won't listen.

10:08

They just keep losing. And you

10:11

live in a state where this is

10:13

again, I think it's one of the great examples.

10:15

We're talking about Kansas, we're talking about Kentucky for

10:17

good reason. But I keep

10:19

going back to that Wisconsin Supreme Court

10:22

election that should have

10:24

been a slug fast.

10:27

And instead, it was a wipeout. Why?

10:30

Because they were clinging to a

10:32

150 year old abortion ban. And

10:36

it cost them the Supreme Court in

10:39

Wisconsin. They don't care. Yeah,

10:42

well, it did. And you've seen this in one

10:44

state after another. Look at all the politics here

10:46

are absolutely fascinating. You have

10:48

Donald Trump last week thought he

10:50

was going to neutralize this issue,

10:53

kind of throws the pro-life movement

10:55

under the bus, even though he's

10:57

responsible for Roe versus Way being

10:59

overturned. Kerry Lake flip

11:01

flops on the issue. And as

11:03

you point out, in Arizona, they have a law

11:05

on the books that probably has the support of

11:08

less than 10% of the

11:10

electorate. They have an easy way out.

11:12

And they've chosen not to do it. And

11:15

so you see this dynamic here, where at

11:17

the very moment, the Republicans are saying, hey,

11:19

can we moderate our position on this? Is

11:22

there some sort of an off ramp? The

11:24

Arizona Republican Party is basically saying,

11:27

no, we're completely comfortable with this,

11:29

even though it's probably going to

11:31

cost them the control of the

11:33

legislature, may cost them the US

11:37

Senate seat, and probably

11:39

is going to tip Arizona over in

11:41

the presidential election. But this is

11:43

one of the, again, part of

11:45

what makes this fascinating is

11:48

kind of the trick box that

11:50

Donald Trump has put Republicans in,

11:52

where he says, OK, I

11:54

am the pro-life president. We

11:56

have overturned Roe versus Wade, but it's

11:59

completely now up. to these states,

12:01

states' rights, except that look what the

12:03

states are doing. So while he's trying

12:05

to sound moderate, he owns every one

12:07

of these extreme draconian laws and Republicans

12:10

are not backing off. But that was

12:12

an amazing scene yesterday in Arizona. Unbelievable.

12:15

I just don't understand why the women of

12:17

Arizona are going to have to go through

12:19

the process of showing politicians

12:22

what these abortion bans will mean to

12:24

their lives. And you mentioned rape victims,

12:27

incest victims, people with

12:29

fetal abnormalities. And that's

12:31

a lot of people. But

12:33

women who just want regular health care, who

12:35

might need a DNC, who might need an

12:37

abortion-like procedure won't get them. It's

12:40

going to have an incredible

12:42

impact on women and families

12:44

across the state of Arizona if this

12:46

ban stays in effect as extreme as

12:49

it is. By the way, we're still

12:51

waiting to see. I mean, we're so concerned

12:53

because Clarence Thomas, of course, in overturning Roe

12:55

v. Wade, wrote in a

12:57

concurring opinion that we have to look

12:59

at not only things like same-sex marriage,

13:02

also have to look at the right

13:05

to contraception. And

13:07

then you have IVF in Alabama,

13:09

the Senate in

13:13

Washington, the US Senate. Republicans

13:15

are blocking an attempt to make

13:17

IVF protected. So again,

13:20

this is impacting women's health

13:22

care. And

13:25

for women who consider themselves to

13:27

be pro-life, who miscarry. And

13:31

yeah, it's just really terrible.

13:33

All right. So much to

13:35

get to. Last night, Speaker Mike Johnson

13:38

released the details of his proposed foreign

13:40

aid package, which includes four separate bills.

13:43

One is roughly $61 billion for Ukraine. Another

13:47

provides $26 billion for Israel. The

13:49

third Is $8 billion for

13:51

the Indo-Pacific allies. And The fourth

13:53

is aimed at combating US adversaries.

13:55

The Fight Now heads to the

13:58

Rules Committee this morning, where Speaker

14:00

John... and will likely need democrats

14:02

to support the measure after several

14:04

republican said it would vote against

14:06

some democrats a beer inclined to

14:08

approve. The Package after President Biden guess

14:11

his full support yesterday and of by

14:13

the way to go to vote against

14:15

the package which is a job as

14:17

as leaders of their visit their top

14:19

committees are saying republicans are saying about

14:21

the Republicans their day of net, their

14:23

dupes or maybe even worse. Are

14:26

useful idiots? or even worse, their

14:28

parenting. Vladimir. Putins talking points

14:30

were tearing the talking points of

14:32

the Russian invaders is that's happening

14:34

in the United States Congress down

14:36

And so so yeah, they're They're gonna

14:39

push back on any attempt. To.

14:41

Find freedom fighters and despite.

14:43

The threats and has republican

14:46

colleagues. Johnson is pushing forward.

14:50

Going. To stand for Freedom and make sure that

14:52

Vladimir Putin doesn't marched through your we're an exceptional

14:54

nations were the greatest nation or on the planet

14:56

and we have to ask what and we have

14:59

to projected Huuhtanen and G and and Iran and

15:01

North Korea and anybody else that we will defend

15:03

freedom and doesn't mean boots on the ground when

15:05

other world's policeman smoke but we're going to do

15:07

the right thing and I think the Congress is

15:09

gonna take an important stand here. Are.

15:12

You going to have to rely on Democrats

15:14

to pass the rule in order to bring

15:16

these bills to the floor and also the

15:19

legislation itself? Well, I hope not. I hope

15:21

it or Republican colleagues are standing Other stick

15:23

together on this. I think we understand. Look,

15:25

I'm I'm a child the eighties. I'm Amber.

15:28

Regard myself as a Reagan Republican. Understand the

15:30

concept of maintaining peace through strength. That's one

15:32

of our guiding principles. It's it's really important,

15:34

philosophy. And it's It's a big part of

15:37

our pardon and in our worldview and us.

15:39

I think here is an opportunity to make

15:41

that stand. At a really critical time and

15:44

world history of. I

15:46

mean I this is like a movie for

15:48

married. I went to sleep last night. And.

15:51

We were living in the age of trump. And.

15:54

I woke up this morning. And.

15:56

Now where the edge of break

15:58

and again weightlessness. A

16:00

peace through strength. Heart. Attack.

16:03

On it. And. You know,

16:05

couple days ago a kind of time

16:07

to get heated up about how Republicans

16:09

hate on America so much or said

16:12

about how horrible America. I said America's

16:14

greatest country in the world and I

16:16

need to start saying it was a

16:18

speaker said where the greatest nation or

16:20

good on him Like we don't hear

16:22

this from Republicans, We certainly don't hear

16:24

that we have to actually find people

16:26

who are fighting against Russian aggression much

16:28

these days. Of. A Except

16:30

from again, those responsible leaders when you're

16:32

talking about. Chairman. Of the

16:34

Intel to maybe or the Chairman of

16:37

Foreign Affairs, many people were actually talking

16:39

like grown ups. But I gotta say

16:41

give credit where credit is due and

16:43

credit is doesn't really do with Speaker

16:45

Johnson. Talking. Like a

16:47

rag and republican talking about the need.

16:50

To to protect freedom. Or.

16:53

In despite bad that. Between.

16:56

Western Democracy and and what's going

16:58

on and Russia Peter Baker com

17:00

maybe you can help the help

17:02

us out here. I'm absolutely fascinated

17:04

by the relationship with My Johnson

17:06

and Joe Biden. to say know

17:08

so little about it by. I

17:10

used here from time to time

17:12

to talk to each other. Ah,

17:14

they taught. Ah, I guess a

17:16

couple of days ago when this

17:18

package came out of President Biden

17:20

was extraordinarily optimistic about and hey,

17:22

I'm strongly supportive of this. It

17:24

sounds like. They. Had a

17:26

talk to tell me about this relationship

17:28

and how we got. From.

17:32

Speaker Johnson being his his

17:34

foreign policy being shaped by

17:36

Marjorie Taylor grain. Of. Salt

17:39

and Georgia. Or tell my loves.

17:41

I. Am A how it went

17:43

from that to been shaped by Ronald

17:46

Wilson Reagan. The I

17:48

saw the present by your right to say

17:50

he doesn't really have a relationship with Speaker

17:52

Johnson. They spoke and a number of times,

17:54

but not very much and not for a

17:56

long. They didn't know each other obviously. Ah,

17:58

for Johnson became Speaker. Hi video and

18:00

bit different than the present understands better than

18:03

most how Congress worse. He understands that you

18:05

can't get something ah to the floor if

18:07

you're a in are able to command your

18:09

own was yours or he has some sympathy

18:12

I think for the problem the Speaker Johnson

18:14

has but he doesn't trust the sugar Johnson

18:16

has given us a surly deliver ah for

18:19

sticker Johnson. They have wanted to make the

18:21

case that Biden as with that's where they

18:23

came off of last weekend's are around and

18:25

attack on Israel try to make the case.

18:28

It only happened because ah President Biden. Was

18:30

weakened. didn't deter around. As hard to make

18:32

the case about by to be week. If

18:34

you're not supporting Israel yourself with the funding

18:36

that they have asked for it will it

18:38

at my business mention the gray. As for

18:40

the funny to Dave, ask for the Ukrainians

18:43

are in desperate straits. They did their out

18:45

of ammunition in a lot of cases. They're

18:47

looking at a situation where they were on

18:49

the cusp of winnings and now suddenly looks

18:51

like they could be losing. all because they

18:53

don't have the resources that they had been

18:55

promised velocity. Really? sixteen? seventeen months since his

18:57

congress took office. So the President is what.

19:00

Has been going to give Street or Johnson a

19:02

lot a rope student very patient with them but

19:04

there's a i sort of about mobile. since arriving

19:06

at this point in the attic the president's gonna

19:08

be watching to see was bigger Johnson can not

19:11

to pull it off. You.

19:13

Know it's fascinating Peters, you've you

19:15

have republican said are still running

19:17

around complaining about the border. yet

19:19

they killed the strongest Border Policies

19:21

bill ever. Ah, because Donald

19:24

Trump told them to. They complain

19:26

that Joe Biden is weak and

19:28

yet they won't provide funding for

19:30

Taiwan, Ukraine, or Israel. Now it

19:32

looks like they may be doing

19:34

that. Do. You sense that? Perhaps

19:36

that and I've been waiting for the

19:39

influence. Of. Chairman Mccall and Chairman

19:41

Turner and some of these. These.

19:43

Other Reagan Republican said are running.

19:46

These. Committees do think. That.

19:48

Over time their influence

19:50

their poll. May. Have been

19:52

that. May. have been too

19:55

much for bit of speaker johnson the

19:57

ignore or or or did he decide

20:00

that it was in his best interest to use

20:02

them. So, you know, Republicans won't be

20:04

accused of not only botching a

20:06

border deal, but also losing, possibly

20:09

losing Ukraine to Vladimir Putin. Yeah,

20:12

that's a good question. I can't get into his

20:14

head. I'm not a congressional reporter, but I do

20:16

think that you're right to say that, you know,

20:18

that the establishment part

20:20

of the Republican Party that traditionally

20:23

believes in peace, strength, the Reagan

20:25

slogan has finally lost

20:27

its patience with the far right of the

20:29

party, which has been blocking this for so

20:31

long. I think that they realize that they

20:34

look bad publicly, that they're taking away an

20:37

issue that they could have against President Biden.

20:39

You know, the essence of the case that

20:41

they want to make against President Biden on

20:43

foreign policy is one of weakness. They want to

20:45

go back to the Afghanistan withdrawal. Again,

20:48

it's really hard to make that case if you

20:50

yourself are the ones holding

20:52

up the aid. You can't sit there

20:54

and complain, well, gosh, you didn't give the right weapons to Ukraine,

20:58

which is a completely legitimate argument that

21:00

people have made, including some Democrats against

21:02

President Biden, when you're not willing to

21:04

provide any kind of

21:06

aid whatsoever to them. So I

21:08

think the politics of this have just finally come around to

21:10

the point where he felt the pressure to move

21:13

forward. Now, it's not easy. He can only

21:15

afford to lose two votes because of vacancies

21:17

in the House. He's the slimmest majority, practically,

21:19

that you could have. And he looks

21:21

like he's going to have to rely on

21:23

Democrats. That means he could stay as Speaker.

21:25

But if you're a Speaker who relies on

21:27

Democrats, that's a position of weakness in your

21:29

own party. No Republican Speaker wants to be

21:31

Speaker because Democrats saved him. And that's

21:35

a prescription for a lot of real churning

21:38

volatility going forward. And add to that

21:40

intrigue that Mike Gallagher, the Republican from

21:42

Wisconsin, is scheduled to leave his job

21:44

every stepping down on Friday, the day

21:46

before a planned vote. Maybe he'll stick

21:48

around. We'll see. Let's bring in

21:50

the conversation. NBC News Capitol

21:52

Hill correspondent Allie Vitale. So,

21:55

Allie, let's start first big picture of what Peter

21:57

was just talking about and why this changed. change

22:00

in rhetoric, change in tone, perhaps

22:02

even change in policy from Speaker

22:04

Johnson. Why did he come around to this? Yeah,

22:07

it is striking. And I actually think it's

22:09

important that Joe talks about the role of

22:11

people like Chairman McCall, who is all over

22:14

this legislation. He's the person who I believe

22:16

is the sponsor of the repo act, which

22:18

is one of the key planks of the

22:20

fourth bill about combating foreign adversaries that would

22:22

effectively allow Putin to pay

22:24

for what we aid Ukraine with

22:26

by using leveraged frozen Russian assets.

22:29

So that's one plank of this

22:31

piece of legislation that we've seen.

22:33

I do think that as Speaker

22:35

Johnson has been a different person

22:37

than he was as just a member of

22:39

this Republican conference, though it has been striking

22:41

to see. And I think this week, especially,

22:44

it came into really clear focus with the

22:46

ways that he's basically challenging his conference at

22:48

various points to say, hey, this is important

22:50

enough that I'm not going to worry about

22:53

losing my job over it, though certainly that

22:55

is a worry and a concern, if not

22:57

from Johnson explicitly, than from most rank and

22:59

file Republicans who I talk to who definitely

23:02

do not want to spend the spring finding

23:04

another speaker. I candidly don't even know who

23:06

would want that job at this point,

23:08

but it would be a real problem

23:10

for them to have to find somebody

23:12

else. So we are watching that closely.

23:14

But I think when you look at

23:16

the landscape writ large on this legislation,

23:19

it's important to point out that it's

23:21

the same, same, but different as the

23:23

Senate supplemental that passed several weeks ago.

23:25

The reason why you're seeing Democrats speak

23:27

in support of this is because the

23:29

numbers are largely the same for Ukraine,

23:31

for the Indo-Pacific, and for Israel. It's

23:34

that fourth bill that's going to be interesting here

23:36

because it has a lot of things in it. And

23:38

Congressman Jake Auchincloss and I were just talking about this

23:41

on way too early. It has a lot of things

23:43

in it that Democrats want to see passed. Things

23:46

like the TikTok bill that would at

23:48

least force ByteDance to change its ownership.

23:50

The fact that we now have Senator

23:52

Maria Cantwell saying that she likes the

23:54

changes in the legislation that she sees

23:57

could only ensure a better reception on

23:59

the Senate. Senate side of this building, the

24:01

fact that it has the repo act in it that

24:03

we were just talking about, there's going to be a

24:05

border provision in there. And I think that's the thing

24:08

that Democrats are really looking for. But

24:10

look, by and large, this is something

24:12

that can be passed in bipartisan fashion,

24:15

even if it's a different vehicle for doing it than

24:17

the Senate supplemental. So Ali, Speaker Johnson suggested

24:19

he could have a final vote of passage

24:21

on these supplemental bills on Saturday night. But

24:23

before he gets to that, it's got to

24:25

clear the Rules Committee where several Republicans have

24:27

said they will not support it. So he

24:29

may have to reach out to Democrats just

24:31

to clear the Rules Committee to get to

24:33

that vote. How does that look to play out

24:35

here? It's just really rare.

24:38

And I think that it's important that we spotlight

24:40

this. I know that the Rules Committee feels like

24:42

this arcane piece of Congress

24:44

that doesn't deserve much attention, but it is

24:46

the very vehicle and the committee that gets

24:48

things to the House floor. Typically

24:51

for the party and the majority, to

24:53

have to use members of the other

24:55

party to pass a rule is really

24:57

rare. And it's absolutely stunning that that

24:59

could be the position that Speaker Johnson

25:01

is in on this piece of foreign

25:04

aid legislation. He has several people, including

25:06

Chip Roy and Tom Massey, who are

25:08

on the Rules Committee who have openly said that

25:10

they are questioning whether or not they're going to

25:12

vote for this rule. We're going to

25:14

watch that very closely this morning. If Democrats come

25:16

along and come together on this, yes, that gets

25:18

them to the House floor. But then

25:21

the full House has to vote on the rule. And

25:23

the way that you can think about the rule is

25:25

it's like they're the bouncer to the bar of the

25:27

legislation is the best way for us to put it

25:29

at this point. You can't get into the bar without

25:32

going through the bouncer. And so the full House has

25:34

to work on actually passing this before they can vote

25:36

on each of these four pieces of legislation. That's

25:38

going to be really important, too. All

25:41

right. Good update still ahead

25:43

on Morning Joe, despite his past criticisms

25:46

of Donald Trump, former

25:48

Attorney General Bill Barr now

25:50

appears to be effectively endorsing

25:53

him. Shocked. Shocked. Plus,

25:56

the two top lawmakers on the House Oversight

25:58

Committee get into a pretty... pretty heated

26:00

exchange over the Republican-led push to

26:02

impeach President Biden. We'll show you

26:04

that moment, or at least a

26:07

part of it. It went on

26:09

for quite some time. You're watching

26:11

Morning Joe. We're back in just

26:13

60 seconds. The

26:18

UN Refugee Agency, or UNHCR,

26:20

responds to emergencies and provides

26:22

long-term solutions for refugees. They

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provide aid in over 130

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and Sudan, where people are

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and persecution at their greatest

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moment of need. UNHCR helps

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and protects refugees by providing

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other life-saving essentials. The agency

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life-saving aid for refugees

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whenever and wherever emergencies

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occur. Donate to USA

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for UNHCR by visiting

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unrefugees.org/donation. We

27:21

have another about face from a

27:23

Trump ally turned critic. Harsh critic.

27:26

Very harsh. Turned ally

27:28

again, despite previously warning that a

27:30

second Trump term would

27:32

be, quote, chaos. And

27:35

let me just say this correctly,

27:37

a horror show. You're not saying

27:39

this. No, I'm not. Who's saying this?

27:41

Bill Barr. That's right. Chaos. He said

27:44

it'd be a nightmare. A horror

27:46

show. A nightmare. So yeah, so

27:48

yeah, I'm sure he's going to be campaigning

27:50

for President Biden to try to stop this

27:52

matter. To try and avoid a horror show.

27:54

A horror show. Who wants chaos in a

27:56

horror show in the White House? Former Attorney

27:58

General Bill Barr. Barr now

28:02

says he plans to vote for Donald Trump in November.

28:04

What? Wait, but. Do

28:07

these guys know that? I don't understand.

28:09

Anyhow, in a Fox News interview yesterday,

28:11

Barr was asked about this

28:13

year's general election choices. Here's

28:16

what he had to say. Given

28:19

two bad choices, I think it's my duty to pick

28:21

the person I think would do the least harm to

28:24

the country. And in my mind, that's, I

28:26

will vote the Republican take and I will support

28:28

the Republican take it. I think

28:30

the real danger to the country, the real danger

28:32

to democracy, as I say, is the progressive agenda.

28:36

And while Trump, and I said Trump

28:38

may be playing Russian roulette, but

28:40

continuation of the Biden administration is

28:43

national suicide, in my opinion. You

28:47

know, that's just such a lie and he knows it's

28:49

a lie. And this is Charlie, we're

28:51

going to play some clips in a second, but I just have

28:53

to stop. We've got to stop

28:56

and call out the lies. When these

28:59

people know that they're lying, Barr is

29:01

playing, I guess, for a Fox News

29:03

audience because he wants to keep giving

29:06

speech. I don't know why he's doing

29:08

it. He doesn't believe a word he

29:10

just said there because he knows how

29:13

chaotic Donald Trump is. He

29:16

knows, as he said, that him

29:18

being in the White House again

29:20

would be a horror show. He

29:22

also knows, listen, Bill Barr, you

29:24

and I, we all agree on

29:26

the progressive agenda. We're

29:28

not supporters of it. We

29:30

also know that Joe Biden has

29:33

spent his presidency feeling

29:37

pressure from progressives because they say

29:40

he's too moderate. This

29:42

guy from Delaware, who again

29:45

is not some left

29:48

wing wacko, and Bill Barr knows

29:50

that, but he would rather have

29:52

chaos and a horror show, he

29:54

says. That guy's going

29:56

to vote for, listen, I've been through

29:59

this before. people that

30:01

talk that way on TV. And

30:03

afterwards, I asked him who they vote for. They only

30:05

voted for it. You know, he's going to

30:08

vote for Joe Biden, because he

30:10

knows that the national suicide doesn't

30:13

come from Joe Biden. He may not

30:15

like all his policies. It comes because Donald

30:17

Trump has said, you know, terminate

30:20

the Constitution, he's going to be a

30:22

dictator from day one, he's

30:24

going to use SEAL Team Six to execute his

30:26

political opponents if he wants to, and nobody can

30:28

do anything about it. I can go down the

30:31

line. Barr knows this guy

30:33

can't be president again. So

30:37

he knows it. And this is a choice. I mean, this is

30:39

one of those WTF moments where

30:41

you have, you know, Donald Trump

30:43

waging this campaign to undermine the

30:45

rule of law. Bill Barr knows

30:47

all of this. And he's decided

30:49

it's a binary choice, because in

30:51

his world, in order

30:53

to stay relevant and viable, he

30:56

has to he has to put

30:58

party over country. I mean, literally,

31:00

when he uses the phrase literally

31:02

Russian roulette, when he uses the

31:04

term Russian roulette, he knows the

31:06

danger he poses. He doesn't have

31:08

to do this. Look, you know, what

31:10

is extraordinary is the contrast between what

31:13

Bill Barr is saying and what

31:16

the former Secretary of Defense Mike

31:18

Esper is saying. There you go.

31:20

President Mike Pence is saying, yeah,

31:22

I'm not going to endorse him.

31:24

There are exit ramps. You are

31:26

not required to look at Donald

31:28

Trump and say, OK, because I

31:30

don't like student loan forgiveness. I'm

31:33

going to put a man who

31:35

is clearly unhinged, who clearly, you

31:37

know, tried to overthrow the government, called for

31:39

terminating the Constitution. In fact, we could spend

31:41

the next 10 minutes just walking through all

31:43

of the things. Somebody who has been found

31:45

liable for rape, put

31:48

them back in the Oval Office. But I

31:50

do think it is interesting, the contrast between

31:52

Bill Barr and much of the rest of

31:55

the Cabinet. And we need to remind

31:58

ourselves that never before in America. American

32:00

history has so many people who work so

32:02

closely with the president taken

32:05

the position that, you know, don't do this

32:07

again. We've seen him. He is unfit for

32:09

office. You do not want him back in

32:11

the Oval Office. The fact that Bill Barr

32:13

reminds us that he is a political hack

32:16

is, of course, interesting. But

32:19

also realize what he and people like,

32:21

you know, Governor Sununu are going to

32:23

have to defend. They're basically going to

32:25

have to say, and this is radical.

32:28

I mean, we ought to continue to be surprised by

32:31

this. No, up until like five minutes ago, nobody

32:34

in America would say that a convicted

32:36

felon should be elected president of the

32:38

United States. Now they are all saying

32:40

it up and down the ticket. They

32:42

have to defend what Peter Wiener calls

32:45

the kaleidoscopic, the kaleidoscopic corruption of

32:47

Donald Trump. And this is not just

32:49

Chris Sununu. It's not just Bill Barr

32:52

up and down the ticket. They're going to have

32:54

to explain that, yeah, we don't care about this

32:56

man's character. We don't care about how deranged he

32:59

is. We don't care about his crimes

33:01

or what he intends to do as

33:03

president. And the fact that Bill

33:05

Barr says that it's Russian

33:08

roulette for the country to put

33:10

Donald Trump back in the presidency.

33:13

And he's OK with that. What a remarkable

33:15

moment. What a remarkable moment. And

33:17

you're right. They own it. He owns it.

33:19

Chris Sununu owns it. You know, a judge

33:22

said Trump is a rapist. Said

33:26

he's going to terminate the Constitution on

33:28

day one. Said

33:31

he's going to be a dictator on day

33:33

one. Of course,

33:35

January the 6th, continuing to praise people

33:37

that beat the hell out of cops

33:39

and were ultimately responsible for the death

33:41

of four police officers, according to their

33:43

families. I mean, they own

33:46

all of this and so much more,

33:48

Mika. Barr is just the latest

33:50

in a long line of Republicans who found

33:53

the courage to stand up to Donald Trump,

33:56

only to then come crawling back

33:58

again. Take a look. We're

34:01

tired of the Donald Trump drama. We want real

34:03

Republican drama. Donald Trump's not a Republican. We want

34:05

real Republican drama. You want Trump. If he is

34:07

off the teleprompter, he can barely keep a cogent

34:09

thought. You support him for president, even if he's

34:11

convicted in classified documents, you support him for president,

34:14

even though you believe he contributed to an insurrection,

34:16

you support him for president, even though you believe

34:18

he's lying about the last election, you support him

34:20

for president, even if he's convicted in the Manhattan

34:22

case. I just want to say the answer to

34:24

that is yes, correct? Yeah,

34:27

me and 51% of America. He's

34:30

a race-baiting, xenophobic, religious

34:32

bigot. He doesn't represent

34:34

my party. I'm for Donald Trump because I

34:36

know what I'm going to get. We

34:39

need somebody that on day one can get

34:41

this country back on track. Please help President

34:43

Trump. If you can afford five or 10

34:45

bucks, if you can't afford a dollar fine,

34:48

just pray. If you got any money to

34:50

give, give it. There is no

34:52

way we are going to allow a con artist to

34:54

take over the conservative movement and Donald Trump is a

34:56

con artist. You said it would be an honor to

34:59

be offered a spot on his ticket. Really? Yeah,

35:01

I think anyone who's offered the opportunity to serve this country

35:03

as vice president should be honored. I think the

35:06

country and the world was a better place when he was president. And

35:08

I would love to see him return to

35:11

the White House. I think really there's a

35:13

sophomore equality that is entertaining about Mr. Trump,

35:15

but I am worried. I'm very concerned about

35:17

having him in charge of the nuclear weapons

35:19

because I think his response is his visceral

35:22

response to attack people on their appearance.

35:25

Short, tall, fat, ugly.

35:28

My goodness that happened in junior high. Are we

35:30

not way above that? And would we not all

35:32

be worried to have someone like that in charge

35:34

of the nuclear arms? I'm proud of the job

35:37

Donald Trump has done as president. I don't always

35:39

agree with him, but our

35:41

occasional policy differences are far outweighed

35:43

by our significant agreements. But

35:46

more important than simple agreement is accomplishment.

35:49

President Trump gets things done. The

35:52

president bears responsibility for Wednesday's attack

35:54

on Congress by mob riders. He

35:58

should have immediately denounced the mob. when

36:00

he saw what was unfolding. Can he count on

36:02

your support? Yes. That's an

36:04

endorsement. I will support the

36:06

president. I will support President Trump. Would

36:08

you be willing to serve in a Trump cabinet? In

36:11

the right position. If I'm the

36:13

best person for the job, yes. I

36:15

don't want to claim this guy. Donald Trump,

36:17

if we're going to be honest, is a

36:19

progressive. He supports eminent domain. He

36:22

supported tax increases before. He's donated $300,000

36:24

to Democratic candidates. So

36:27

the fact that the Republican Party is now

36:29

having to claim him is both unfortunate and

36:31

to me, inauthentic. I want my daughter to

36:35

grow up in President Donald

36:37

J. Trump's America. Oh

36:40

my goodness. Kayleigh McEnany there who

36:42

became the White House press secretary

36:44

after all of her criticism.

36:46

I mean, Jen, you just, Joe

36:49

and I talk about this a lot, but

36:52

how those people look themselves in the mirror

36:54

as their souls escape their bodies through their

36:56

mouths while they make this conversion. I want

36:58

to add into, because this all started with

37:00

Bill Barr. He's been extraordinarily

37:02

critical of Donald Trump in the last

37:05

couple of years, calling the attempt to

37:07

overturn the election a grotesque embarrassment. Saying

37:09

a vote for Donald Trump is like

37:11

playing Russian roulette with the country. He

37:15

has been supportive of the DOJ in

37:17

its pursuit of these trials against Donald

37:19

Trump saying there is no weaponization. This

37:21

is the Department of Justice doing its

37:23

job. He was impressed by Jack Smith's

37:25

indictment and famously said, if

37:27

half of what's true in the indictment of

37:29

the classified documents case is true, Donald Trump

37:32

is quote, toast. And yet here

37:34

he is saying, he's got my vote. I

37:36

am shocked. You know, it's like, we feel like, oh,

37:38

we shouldn't be shocked. Like of course, it's like the

37:40

least surprising thing ever is of course Bill Barr comes

37:42

back around and supports Trump. But it is, I

37:45

really thought given all of the cabinet

37:47

that has walked away from him, which is

37:49

historic in its own right, I really thought

37:51

that Bill Barr would actually, would

37:53

not support him this time. I thought that we could

37:56

count on that. And it is, I mean, it's just

37:58

poor Willie had to live through all of my just.

38:00

stations of outrage and watching

38:02

that last clip of all

38:04

of these cowards that eventually

38:06

went its way. I will

38:09

never understand this, Willie. I will never

38:11

understand this. I will never understand it's

38:13

not that great being relevant. You know,

38:15

it's not, it's not, I will never

38:17

understand how it is worth it

38:19

to them. And it's interesting when you

38:21

contrast that with what is happening with Mike Johnson

38:23

who seems to really take into,

38:27

take in hold on him that he is the Speaker

38:29

of the United States House of Representatives. You

38:31

know, that meeting he had with President Biden,

38:34

Mitch McConnell and Hakeem Jeffries and Chuck Schumer

38:36

and Vice President Harris, they really gave him

38:38

the business about like, I'm not sure if

38:40

you understand what we're doing here, but we're

38:43

the United States of America and we stand

38:45

up to Russia when they're being adversarial in

38:47

this way. And

38:50

you know, maybe there's a new reckoning company for

38:52

Republicans. That would be great, but I will continue

38:54

to be shocked by the cowardness

38:56

and hypocrisy when you see it like that.

38:58

To be clear, Speaker Johnson did spend the

39:00

weekend at Mar-a-Lago. So he's having a moment.

39:02

Yeah, that's true. Peter Baker, want to read

39:04

one more quote. We could do this all

39:06

morning from Bill Barr, which may be the

39:08

most important of the quotes for the man

39:10

he says he's voting for. He said this

39:12

very recently about Donald Trump. Trump

39:14

already has shown he cannot forge that

39:16

kind of decisive victory at the national

39:18

level. He is a three time loser

39:20

and I think he will clearly lose

39:22

again on the national level. A quote

39:24

from Bill Barr about Donald Trump. Barr

39:27

now says he will vote for the three

39:29

time loser. Yeah, I think

39:31

we forget that Bill Barr is actually a

39:33

pretty ideological guy. He has a very kind

39:35

of moderate mean and moderate demeanor. And so

39:37

therefore people have mistaken him over the years

39:40

for somebody who is a little bit more centrist. He's

39:42

not. He's a very ideological person. If you

39:45

read his book, if you read his memoir,

39:47

as much as he's criticizing companies, he's also

39:49

criticizing progressive left. He has very strong conservative

39:51

views. And I think

39:53

this is, you know, this is about partisanship

39:56

ultimately. You know, in the end, people come

39:58

home to their parties. They

40:00

can tune out the clips

40:03

that you just played and say, well, that

40:05

was then and this is now and I'm

40:07

going to go for my party over

40:10

what I said before. But you're right that

40:12

Bill Barr is a striking example of this

40:14

because there's probably no witness

40:17

against Trump who has been more powerful

40:19

in some ways than Bill Barr who

40:21

testified before the January 6th committee that

40:24

he told the president, then the

40:26

president, President Trump, that his claims

40:28

of an election theft by Joe

40:31

Biden were BS, he used

40:33

the full word. He

40:36

made very clear that when former President Trump,

40:38

when then President Trump was going out and

40:40

telling the country that the election was stolen,

40:42

that he knew it wasn't, that he knowingly

40:44

went and told the country that the election

40:46

was stolen when he had been told by

40:48

people like Bill Barr that it wasn't. And

40:50

therefore, when he was trying to overturn an

40:52

election and hold on to power, to hold

40:55

on to power that he had

40:57

been denied by the voters in

40:59

a reelection, according to Bill Barr,

41:01

we know that that was something

41:03

that Donald Trump understood was not

41:05

true. And so, of course, it's

41:07

striking to see somebody who is

41:10

as powerful a witness toward

41:12

the case that Donald Trump

41:15

tried to illegally and unconstitutionally seize

41:17

power, then turn around to endorse

41:19

him for reelection, says a lot

41:21

about the pull and power of

41:23

partisan identification these days. Well,

41:27

it is something that John

41:29

Meacham regularly says is

41:31

one of the great challenges on whether we

41:35

survive as a republic after this election, if

41:37

Donald Trump wins, you have all

41:40

these people that have said that,

41:42

again, Russian roulette, this

41:44

is Russian roulette if Donald Trump gets

41:46

in there again, and now

41:48

he's endorsing him just out of

41:51

blind partisanship. We could go

41:53

down the list, though, of people who

41:55

serve, who are conservative, who

41:57

have conservative

42:00

their entire life, starting

42:02

with me, Charlie Sykes.

42:05

But let's talk about the people who served with

42:08

Donald Trump, the vice president of the United States

42:10

who served with Donald Trump, said

42:12

won't be endorsing him and for good

42:14

reason. He said he

42:16

deserved hanging, basically. You

42:19

have the chief of staff of

42:21

Donald Trump, General Kelly, who served,

42:23

who talked about how it's

42:25

sickening about what he says about

42:28

young men and women who gave

42:31

their lives to America in service

42:33

of this country, that Donald Trump

42:35

believes that they're suckers. General

42:38

Kelly, obviously, who lost his son

42:40

serving America at war, will

42:42

not be supporting Donald Trump. You

42:44

have his secretary

42:46

of defense, Mad Dog

42:48

Mattis, as Trump loves to

42:51

call him, will not be supporting Donald

42:53

Trump. You have one

42:55

of the last secretary of defenses,

42:57

Secretary Esper, who said he will

43:00

not be supporting Donald Trump.

43:02

I mean, we could go down the list.

43:07

Secretary of State, you

43:09

know, is ambassador to the United Nation. They

43:13

understand. And by the way, you

43:15

know, they understand that

43:17

Donald Trump's not a conservative. That's the

43:19

thing. She's a Mackelmane or

43:22

whatever. I mean, give me a

43:24

break. She runs around calling everybody

43:26

progressive and left wing. Well, she

43:28

called Donald Trump a progressive, too.

43:31

And how talk, I mean, all these people,

43:33

con artists, Marco calls them con artists. And

43:35

I was like, yes, I'd love to serve

43:37

a religious bigot, Lindsay. Well, you know, Lindsay,

43:40

I mean, you just get you go down the

43:42

list and it's just it's

43:46

this reverse. It's

43:48

this harsh partisanship, actually, that

43:50

is one of the great threats to our country. And it's

43:52

coming. It's coming from these

43:54

people who know we're bad for

43:56

America. And yet they're going to support

43:58

him. Not like they're privy to some. huge secrets

44:00

we saw January 6th. We

44:03

see what's happening with the documents and

44:05

honestly might be nice to

44:07

go back to the day where it's shocking where

44:10

somebody lies multiple times about

44:12

using campaign money to pay

44:14

off somebody to keep quiet.

44:16

It would be refreshing but

44:18

that'll never happen. Peter Baker and

44:20

Charlie Sykes thank you both very

44:23

much. Coming up on Morning Joe,

44:25

Steve Ratner joins us with charts

44:27

on Major League Baseball's efforts to

44:29

renew America's pastime. Morning Joe,

44:31

we'll be right back. Today

44:36

and every day Planned Parenthood is committed

44:38

to ensuring that everyone has the information

44:41

and resources they need to make their

44:43

own decisions about their bodies, including abortion

44:45

care. Lawmakers who oppose abortion

44:47

are attacking Planned Parenthood, which means affordable

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right to control our bodies and get

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stolen from us. And now politicians in

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nearly every state have introduced bills that

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would block people from getting the sexual

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and reproductive care they need. Planned Parenthood

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believes everyone deserves health care. It's a

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human right. That's why they fight every

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day to push for common sense policies

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to protect our right to control our

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own bodies and against policies that

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your support now more than ever.

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can reclaim our rights and

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protect and expand access to

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abortion care. Visit Planned parenthood.org/future.

45:34

That's Planned parenthood.org/future. Never

45:38

hit a walk off home run. Until now

45:41

maybe, keep right

45:43

field, Cedric Mullins!

45:46

Good night! The announcer

45:48

speaking it into existence. Cedric Mullins a two-run

45:50

home run lifting the Orioles to a 4-2

45:53

win over the twins for the

45:56

O's fourth straight victory. They stay

45:58

now a half game. behind the

46:00

Yankees who stopped the three-game skid

46:02

with a comeback win last night up in

46:04

Toronto over the Blue Jays. Aaron Judge breaking

46:06

a 4-4 tie in the ninth was that

46:08

two-run single with two outs. Yankees

46:11

avoiding the sweep for the six-to-four

46:13

win. Meanwhile in Boston, Major League

46:15

Baseball saw its fastest game in

46:17

almost 15 years. Red Sox

46:19

starter Tanner House drew just 94 pitches, 69

46:21

of his

46:23

strikes to finish the first complete game of his

46:25

career. The 2-0 Red Sox win over

46:28

the Guardians lasted one

46:31

hour and 49 minutes marking the

46:33

fastest nine inning game in the

46:35

majors since June of

46:37

2010. Now that's the pitch clock Joe, that's

46:39

the new pace to play in the big

46:42

leagues. Red Sox tied for third

46:44

now only three games back in the Yankees. It's all

46:46

happening for you. So yeah it's

46:48

all happening all as we've foreseen. We

46:50

were prepared to

46:54

finish safely in last place after breaking

46:56

the hearts of Red Sox fans. Now

46:59

I think no they look they look

47:02

they're starting pitching has been really great.

47:04

We had no good quality starts last

47:06

year. We got young pitchers

47:08

that are doing that right now. Defense

47:12

problems with our defense but

47:15

yeah Sox in the middle there all

47:17

packed up but I'll tell you what

47:19

Jack and I saw the Sox game

47:21

because it went so fast. I'm usually

47:23

asleep by about the fifth inning but

47:25

that thing flew last night in Tanner

47:27

House extraordinary control

47:30

but we also sat and watched the

47:33

last two innings of the Yankees Blue Jays

47:35

game and yikes. Hard

47:38

to watch for a Red Sox fan but

47:40

Aaron Judge finally

47:42

kind of getting out of his swamp

47:44

and having game-winning hit. So anyway the

47:46

pace of play is Willie said it's

47:48

picked up across the league since we

47:50

had that pitch clock change last season.

47:52

Let's bring it right now a

47:55

man who can put a chart to

47:57

just about anything Steve Ratner. He's

48:00

looking at the impact of baseball's new rules.

48:02

And Steve, I must say, watching a baseball

48:04

game is completely different this year than last

48:06

year. And I'm dead serious. You see a

48:09

pitch, especially in a Red Sox Yankees game,

48:11

then I'd walk downstairs. I'd go, hey, Mika,

48:13

how's everything going? She goes, going pretty good.

48:15

I go, what are you doing? Not

48:18

much, just, you know, on the phone with my kids.

48:20

I said, all right, I'll be right back. Then I

48:22

walk upstairs. Next pitch. You

48:25

know? Then I'd walk downstairs. I go, you have

48:27

any plans for tomorrow? Like, it was so slow.

48:30

Now it really does. It

48:32

comes at you just like that. You look down

48:34

for the second. Oh, wait. Baseball's

48:37

moving fast. It's so much easier to watch

48:39

now. Yeah, Joe, now you've

48:41

got 15 seconds if there's nobody on base, 20

48:43

seconds if there are people on base to go

48:45

get that beer. And not every game

48:47

is going to be the way it was last

48:49

night. But let's talk about what has happened. So

48:52

if we take a look over here at average

48:54

game length, you can see it was creeping up.

48:56

I started going to the Polo Grounds in 1962,

49:00

and games were about two and a half hours. And they

49:02

got all the way up to three hours and 10 minutes,

49:04

and then they put in that change. And

49:06

boom, games went down to two hours and 39

49:09

minutes last year. And it basically hung in there at around

49:12

two hours and 41 minutes this year. And

49:14

this is all, we're living in a TikTok

49:16

age, and people want things to move faster,

49:18

especially sports. And this has been one of

49:20

baseball's problems. We'll talk in a minute about

49:22

some others of baseball's problems. So

49:24

let's move on to your next chart, and that is a 10, oh,

49:27

you got another element there. Go ahead. Sorry, sorry.

49:29

The other change, one of the other changes that

49:31

made Willy, as you know, is they made the

49:33

bases three inches larger. Yes. And they were trying

49:35

to create more stolen bases in order to, again,

49:37

make the game a little bit more exciting in

49:40

today's world. And so you can see it actually

49:42

also had that effect. Total bases stolen

49:44

last season went up to 3,500, the

49:47

second almost tying the record, of 3,590 games

49:52

set back in the 80s. So that

49:54

also has made the game a bit more

49:56

exciting and, of course, as you know, they

49:58

eliminated the designated a. expanded

50:00

the designation, excuse me, across both

50:02

leagues and so forth.

50:04

And so they're trying to get this game

50:06

back in front of more Americans. Yeah. And

50:09

the larger bases only marginally, but makes them closer

50:11

to the next base, which is the

50:13

hope is more action, more people stealing. And

50:16

as you said, with the DH more hitting,

50:18

more action in baseball. So what does it

50:20

mean for attendance, the major league baseballs? We

50:22

go to your next chart. Steve is hoping

50:24

that the young generation, which perhaps is a

50:27

little impatient with the pace of old major

50:29

league baseball games, hoping to bring in

50:31

some new fans to the game.

50:33

How's that going in terms of attendance? It's

50:35

actually showing some signs of improvement. Baseball attendance

50:37

grew way back to the 1940s, World War

50:39

II, but it peaked right before the financial

50:41

crisis in 2007 at 80 million fans in

50:43

a year. And

50:47

then it dropped and obviously had COVID in here, which

50:49

destroyed it all, but you can see it dropped pretty

50:51

consistently. And then last year it

50:53

did bounce back to 71 million. So

50:55

we got some more fans back. The

50:58

quality of the teams, the competitive nature of

51:00

the games, which teams are winning, and

51:02

so forth, plays a big role. But

51:05

what's also interesting economically to watch economics

51:07

actually work is that baseball did increase

51:09

its ticket prices pretty substantially all through

51:12

these years. This

51:14

black line is the one to focus on.

51:16

This is the ratio of ticket prices to

51:18

people's incomes. In other words, how affordable is

51:21

baseball to the average American? And you can

51:23

see baseball essentially was kind of pricing itself

51:25

out of the market. But

51:27

once attendance peaked and the teams realized

51:30

they got to get fans into the stands, you

51:33

can see that they cut the prices, not

51:35

in actual terms, but they've cut them in

51:37

relation to incomes. And

51:40

so they've made baseball more affordable. What's

51:42

not on this chart is

51:44

that they have not made hot dogs more affordable. They've

51:46

actually made hot dogs less affordable. So in a way,

51:49

you can go to the game on a more affordable

51:51

basis, but those hot dogs are going to cost you

51:53

more. You still got to get the hot dog. I

51:55

know the prices are up to beer. It's outrageous. You

51:57

got to do it. It's a part of the experience.

52:00

Let's move to your last chart in

52:02

terms of television ratings as Joe said and I share

52:04

it is you sit down with your kid for a

52:06

705 game. It used to be, well, this

52:08

thing's going to go to a 1005, 1030. Why

52:11

even invest early on? Now if it's 9 o'clock,

52:14

930, that's more manageable. Are they seeing that in

52:16

the ratings? You have

52:18

not quite seen that in the ratings yet, but

52:21

let's take a look at what has happened. The

52:24

Super Bowl always did really well against the World Series,

52:26

even all going all the way back to the

52:28

early 70s. You can

52:30

see again the popularity of baseball and what

52:32

happened. Super Bowl up, up, up, up,

52:34

up and of course this year Super Bowl being

52:36

so extraordinary, even my wife watched it and

52:39

baseball going kind of down, down, down, down,

52:41

down and then you finally sort of hit

52:43

almost rock bottom here with the Rangers versus

52:45

the Diamondbacks where even the final game, this

52:47

little triangle didn't even attract many

52:49

more viewers than the series as a whole.

52:52

This is the cubs winning the World Series for the

52:54

first time since 1908 and this is the

52:57

Dodgers versus the Yankees, highest rated World Series

52:59

game and of course you got two marquee

53:02

teams. But all of this actually has

53:05

an effect because without as many viewers

53:07

on television, television rights get affected, the

53:09

profitability of the team gets affected and

53:11

this is interesting because there have been

53:13

three recent deals in major sports and

53:15

let's look at the differences. Baltimore

53:18

Orioles owned by Peter Angelos for 30 years, over

53:20

20 years, he made a 7.7% annual return

53:25

on his investment. He bought it for

53:27

about 193 million dollars and sold it

53:30

to David Rubenstein for about 10 times

53:32

that amount but the stock market he

53:34

would have done even slightly better if he had just

53:36

left his money in the stock market, contrary to what

53:38

people think. The Washington Commander

53:40

is owned by Dan Snyder, not a

53:42

beloved figure in sports, was sold

53:45

to Josh Harris, also he owned it

53:47

for about 25 years and you

53:49

can see he way outperformed the stock market.

53:51

And then lastly, the Dallas Mavericks, Mark

53:54

Cuban selling it to Miriam Adelson, knocked

53:56

the cover off the ball, no pun

53:58

intended, in terms of the return. markets

54:00

work and the sports that are successful

54:02

have been more successful for the owners

54:04

financially as well in attendance

54:06

and other measures. Yeah,

54:09

you know, I mean, you

54:11

look at the attendance

54:13

and everything's good. The

54:16

ratings go down. But

54:18

Willie, let me just say, as

54:21

much as I love baseball, I

54:23

didn't see a pitch of the

54:25

Rangers Diamondbacks. It is dead. And despite

54:28

hating the Yankees for good reason and

54:31

not really caring for the

54:33

Dodgers, if it's the Yankees Dodgers,

54:35

I, along with everybody else, will

54:37

be watching that World Series because of

54:39

all the superstars on both of those teams.

54:41

I mean, it does depend on who's in

54:44

the series. It does for sure. But

54:46

even by that, with a good matchup or

54:49

a matchup with big markets, it's a tough comparison

54:51

to the Super Bowl, which is effectively a national

54:53

holiday. And Taylor Swift stands and you got Usher

54:55

have all the things that come with that. So,

54:58

but I think I agree with you, Joe, the

55:00

new rules from last year were seen again this

55:02

year. The games are moving. There's more action. There's

55:04

a lot of base stealing like you and I

55:06

used to watch in the 80s. So the game

55:09

is not a good trajectory. Steve Ratner, thanks so much

55:11

for the charts. As always, we appreciate it. Sasha

55:14

hated sand the way it stuck to things

55:16

for weeks. So when

55:19

Maddie shared a surf trip on Expedia

55:21

trip planner, he hesitated. Then

55:23

he added a hotel with a cliffside pool

55:26

to the plan and they

55:28

both spent the week in the water. You

55:31

were made to follow your whims. We

55:33

were made to find a place on the beach

55:36

with a pool and a waterfall and a soaking

55:38

tub and of course a great shower. Expedia

55:42

made to travel.