0:00

I was a smoker

0:00

in the 80s when I started

0:03

anchoring and I used to have a

0:03

cigarette going during the show

0:07

it'd be sitting just off camera

0:07

in you know an ashtray. And

0:10

every once in a while I'd hear

0:10

the director would say to me

0:12

through my your move the

0:12

cigarette, the smokes, you know,

0:15

wafting into the shot.

0:28

Welcome to the

0:28

100th and final episode, at

0:32

least for a while, have mostly

0:32

money and wanted to have a

0:35

special guests for this send off

0:35

show and I don't think I can

0:38

talk who offered to help me out.

0:38

You know, when people say our

0:42

next guest needs no

0:42

introduction. Well, that is

0:46

actually true. In this case. He

0:46

is a Canadian icon, a

0:50

broadcasting legend. When this

0:50

guy walks into a room, time

0:54

stops. And let me tell you, it

0:54

really is an honor that the one

0:58

and only Peter mansbridge is my

0:58

special guest today with 50

1:03

years at the CBC culminating in

1:03

the top job, anchor of the

1:07

national for many of those

1:07

years. He's seen a lot. And I

1:11

wanted to ask him a bit about

1:11

what life is like inside a major

1:14

network news department. But

1:14

also wanted to tap into the

1:18

stories behind the stories of

1:18

some of the big financial events

1:22

in Canada, past elections

1:22

budgets for story behind how the

1:26

GST was introduced and more.

1:29

Without further ado, the one and

1:29

only Peter mansbridge.

1:50

This is mostly money. And I'm

1:50

your host Preet Banerjee. And on

1:54

the show today, I have the most

1:54

impressive guest that has ever

2:00

been on this podcast and

2:00

apologies to all previous guests

2:02

who are listening. But no one

2:02

can talk this guy. During his 50

2:06

years at CBC Peter mansbridge

2:06

anchored coverage of basically

2:11

every single big news event, you

2:11

could imagine the fall of the

2:14

Berlin Wall, the 911 terrorist

2:14

attacks 13 Olympic Games every

2:20

visit by the Queen since 1973

2:20

Royal weddings to rule of

2:25

funerals, and he's covered every

2:25

federal election since 1972. And

2:31

anchored all 10 since 1984, even

2:31

after retirement came back as a

2:35

special contributor for the 2019

2:35

election. Now...

2:40

Now I feel

2:40

really old I feel really old

2:43

breed after all that

2:45

I don't know if you know this, but you actually are really old

2:50

That's true.

2:54

He's conducted

2:54

in estimated This is mind

2:56

blowing 15,000 interviews with

2:56

the who's who of the world. And

3:04

I'm so delighted to have him as

3:04

a guest on the mostly money

3:08

show. Peter, welcome to the show.

3:10

Hey Preet,

3:10

thank you for this, you know,

3:12

you know, I've been a big fan of

3:12

yours for a long time. And it's,

3:16

it's nice to be on the other

3:16

side of the microphone for

3:18

change.

3:20

Well, you know,

3:20

it's not intimidating at all. I

3:22

mean, this is my 100th episode.

3:22

And as I was prepping, I'm

3:26

thinking wow, 100 episodes now,

3:26

I'm not a prolific podcaster by

3:29

any stretch of the imagination,

3:29

but I was very proud of the fact

3:33

that I've gotten to 100

3:33

episodes, I wanted a super

3:35

special guest. I made the call

3:35

to you. Then doing my prep, I

3:39

thought, Wait a second, this

3:39

guy's done 15,000 here. Oh, God,

3:44

I feel like such a schmuck in

3:44

comparison.

3:47

It's It's

3:47

funny, you know, when you when

3:49

you start adding them up, the

3:49

total gets, I think it's upwards

3:53

closer to 20,000. Now, but they,

3:53

you know, they add up pretty

3:58

quick and over 50 years.

4:02

They really add up fast. Yeah,

4:02

no kidding. And you know, some

4:06

of them are worth remembering.

4:06

Most of them are not worth

4:09

remembering.

4:11

Oh, that's interesting. Yeah, that's interesting. With so many I

4:12

mean, these are all better than

4:17

every interview Preet Banerjee has done.

4:19

I doubt it. I

4:19

doubt it very much. I don't know

4:22

about you. But what I've found

4:22

in my in my interviewing time,

4:27

is that the ones you tend to

4:27

remember obviously, you remember

4:31

the kind of celebrity interviews

4:31

the the big names, you know,

4:34

President Obama, you know, the

4:34

you know, presidents of various

4:41

countries and prime ministers

4:41

and, and you name so

4:44

many that you can't even

4:45

Yeah, exactly.

4:45

I mean, you remember those, but

4:49

the ones that actually really

4:49

make a difference where you

4:52

think you've actually learned

4:52

something, and your audience has

4:56

learned something, or often with

4:56

those who aren't the celebrity

4:59

interviews Because for the most

4:59

part, they kind of repeat the

5:02

same thing to whomever is

5:02

interviewing them. Whereas the

5:06

the the non celebrities are

5:06

usually people who have never

5:10

been interviewed before. But

5:10

they're they're willing to tell

5:13

their story and their to their

5:13

stories involving something, you

5:17

know, extraordinary that's

5:17

happened to them. And you find

5:20

I've found those people that the

5:20

most fascinating really when you

5:23

get right down to it?

5:25

Well, yeah, because they don't have the handlers. Right. And one of the

5:27

things that I think a lot of

5:32

people have noticed, especially

5:32

lately, because now every

5:36

interview, every question that

5:36

gets asked of a politician, you

5:39

can find it in seven different

5:39

social media platforms,

5:41

different news websites, and you

5:41

can ask them 30 different

5:45

questions, and you'll always get

5:45

the exact same answer, even if

5:48

it has nothing to do with the

5:48

question. So yeah, no, that's an

5:53

interesting observation about

5:53

the different interviewees. Now

5:58

I wanted to sort of give some

5:58

some background of how we met.

6:02

And it was all because of the

6:02

bottom line panel on CBC, which

6:06

was a panel talking about

6:06

finance and economics. And I

6:11

remember I got an email out of

6:11

the blue from Lera Chatterjee,

6:15

who is a producer of that panel.

6:15

And she invited me to be on and

6:21

when I came to the set, and the

6:21

first time that I met you, I

6:24

think you came into the makeup

6:24

room. That was the first time I

6:29

really was like, starstruck,

6:29

where I'd like, Man, I'm

6:34

starting to feel cotton in my

6:34

mouth, I was getting so nervous

6:37

before the lights went on. But

6:37

luckily, you carried me. And

6:41

they invited me back for some

6:41

reason. And we ended up doing

6:44

that panel for about eight

6:44

years. And it was the highlight

6:48

of my career. Because as soon as

6:48

the panel aired, my inbox would

6:55

get flooded, my tweet mentions

6:55

would get flooded. And I'll tell

6:59

you, I'll tell you this funny

6:59

story. So my first time I showed

7:01

up in my suit and tie. And then

7:01

after about two years, I'd sent

7:06

an email to learn, I said, you

7:06

know, lira, I don't normally

7:10

come across as the suit and tie

7:10

guy like, I don't normally wear

7:13

a tie every day, and I try to be

7:13

more relatable to the average

7:17

household and distill some of

7:17

this information to eye level, I

7:20

feel it, you know, wearing a tie

7:20

is off brand. You know, do you

7:23

think I could maybe not wear a

7:23

tie? I was expecting just a

7:27

simple yes or no, you know,

7:27

whatever. And then she she

7:30

writes back, and I feel like I

7:30

should whisper what she wrote is

7:34

like, I think you should go for

7:34

it. I'm like, wow, this makes it

7:38

sound like it's a way bigger

7:38

deal than I thought it was gonna

7:41

be. And so I show up, and I

7:41

don't wear a tie. And that

7:45

night. So normally what happens

7:45

for the listeners understanding

7:49

is we pre tape at seven. And the

7:49

panel airs at 930 on news

7:54

network, and then on the main

7:54

channel at about 1030. About

7:57

1035, I started getting flooded

7:57

with emails, and they basically

8:01

all said, Listen, son, if you're

8:01

going to be talking with Peter

8:05

mansbridge, you better be

8:05

wearing a goddamn tie.

8:11

You were at

8:11

the you were at the front line,

8:15

sort of the leading edge of the

8:15

change in television and in the

8:20

you know, in appearances,

8:20

because now it's like, perfectly

8:23

normal not to be wearing a tie.

8:23

Right. Right. Right. And, and

8:28

you were sort of right out

8:28

there. I can remember when you

8:31

walk in the studio that day

8:31

without a tie the first time I

8:34

thought, jeez, should I offer

8:34

him one of my 250 ties in my

8:40

dressing room? Because he

8:40

clearly forgot his will listen,

8:46

we loved you on that panel.

8:46

Because you You brought a common

8:50

sense to a lot of the

8:50

discussions that we were having.

8:54

And you know, it was a great, it

8:54

was a great panel and I you

8:58

know, I'm you know, I'm sorry

8:58

for the fact Yamuna CBC

9:02

obviously wanted to change after

9:02

I left, and they you know,

9:04

they've, they've made a number

9:04

of me, you know, great

9:07

decisions, but I thought one of

9:07

the decisions that wasn't so

9:09

great was that they, they

9:09

dropped out of things like the

9:12

bottom line. And the foreign

9:12

policy panel, you know, those

9:17

were great discussion points,

9:17

and people did rely on them to

9:20

get a better sense of the world

9:20

they were living in whether it

9:23

was about the economy or foreign

9:23

affairs or what have you. But

9:27

you were unload luck and luck

9:27

launched your career. Look at

9:33

you. Best Selling Author, best

9:33

selling podcast, you name it,

9:38

you're all over the place.

9:41

Yeah, I know a lot of people will come on and they'll say yeah, I'm a national

9:42

bestseller. I think I can make

9:45

the claim that a municipal

9:45

bestseller for sure. I don't

9:48

know about national but

9:50

it's the big.

9:50

Yeah, as you know, the book

9:52

business is funny. I mean, you

9:52

you try to get on the bestseller

9:57

list. And that's one you know,

9:57

one part Have your branding. And

10:00

then if you can get to number

10:00

one, even for like half a week,

10:05

you're always a number one best

10:05

selling author.

10:10

Well, you know,

10:10

speaking of books, right, one of

10:13

the reasons that I had the idea

10:13

to sort of celebrate my 100, by

10:18

asking you was because I saw

10:18

that you had just announced that

10:21

you have a new book that is

10:21

coming out in pre sales are

10:24

available now. So before we get

10:24

started, maybe you could just

10:28

tease the book a little bit and

10:28

tell us what is in this book

10:32

that is being released? I think

10:32

it's in October, right?

10:35

It's an

10:35

October October 5, called off

10:37

the record. And as you know, as

10:37

you would know, when you say

10:41

you're out for dinner with some

10:41

friends or something and you end

10:43

up talking about a story you

10:43

covered, the odds are the story

10:48

you tell it that dinner is not

10:48

the one you reported on here,

10:52

right, there was something else

10:52

happened about that story that

10:55

made it that interesting to you,

10:55

you would actually bring it up

10:58

at a dinner. Well, that's what

10:58

this book is. The book is a lot

11:02

of the stories behind the

11:02

stories that I covered over my

11:05

50 years. And the publisher,

11:05

Simon Schuster wanted to call it

11:11

a memoir, but it's not really a

11:11

memoir. It's it's really a

11:15

series of anecdotes, 50 or 60 of

11:15

them, that I weave into a couple

11:21

of, you know, more substantive

11:21

chapters on journalism on the

11:26

country. But mainly, it's these

11:26

anecdotes that give you a

11:31

snapshot into what my life has

11:31

been like as a journalist who's

11:37

traveled around the world and,

11:37

and obviously, around the

11:40

country, and some of the stories

11:40

that I love to tell that I never

11:44

told on the air. So that's what

11:44

it's about. And I think the

11:48

early indications are from those

11:48

who have, you know, done a read

11:52

to you know, how they obviously

11:52

sense these books out to get

11:56

blurbs on them. You know,

11:56

somebody famous writes something

11:59

about the book. They're, they're

11:59

really good, the people seem to

12:04

enjoy it. So it'll be out.

12:04

October 5. I was very lucky.

12:09

Last year, I wrote a book with

12:09

Mark Begich called extraordinary

12:13

Canadians, which was a look at

12:13

17 Canadians who have faced

12:19

certain challenges in their

12:19

lives. And, and come out the

12:23

other end really well, that

12:23

those book that book have

12:28

actually turned out to be a

12:28

number one national bestseller.

12:32

So hopefully, with any luck, go,

12:32

this one will be somewhat the

12:37

same.

12:38

I have a feeling no luck will be involved whatsoever. I am definitely

12:40

going to make the pre sales and

12:44

I'm sure you will probably pre

12:44

sell more books than I've ever

12:48

sold when my books have been on

12:48

sale.

12:52

But your books

12:52

do extremely well as they

12:54

should.

12:56

Alright, so I

12:56

wanted to bring you on. And of

12:58

course, this podcast is called

12:58

mostly money, which I think is

13:02

apropos because it's mostly

13:02

about financial stuff. But it

13:05

doesn't have to be specifically

13:05

about finances. But I did want

13:08

to sort of talk to you about

13:08

some of the big events,

13:12

financial events that have

13:12

happened in your career covering

13:17

the biggest events in the world.

13:17

And before we get get started,

13:22

there's two things I want to do.

13:22

One is I want to share with you

13:24

a comment that the listener sent

13:24

in ahead of this recording

13:29

because they knew that you were

13:29

going to be a guest. And then

13:32

And then second is also to talk

13:32

about your origin story, which

13:35

I'm sure you're sick of telling,

13:35

you know how you were

13:37

discovered. So you know, the

13:37

Coles notes is fine. But I had a

13:41

listener who sent in a comment.

13:41

This is from listener Claire.

13:46

And she said one of the great

13:46

joys in her life, was working

13:52

alongside the great Tony

13:52

mansbridge.

13:55

Yes, Tony was

13:55

great. I remember Tony. I

13:59

patterned myself after Tony

13:59

watching how he did things and

14:07

yes.

14:09

So that that's

14:09

kind of an inside joke. That was

14:12

Claire Martin, who was a chief

14:12

meteorologist or senior

14:18

meteorologist at CBC for a long

14:18

time and pink

14:23

wall. Did you

14:23

know that Pink Floyd the wall

14:27

the video she was in she was in

14:27

you know that's I do vaguely

14:32

remember this? Because I know

14:32

Claire personally, and someone

14:37

had told me that story she

14:37

hates. I used to bring it up

14:41

occasionally on the air and she

14:41

hate me for it saying that, but

14:45

it's true. And if she's gonna

14:45

call me Tony, I need to remind

14:50

everybody about things.

14:52

Well, I'm going to include that clip because there is a clip of Claire, you

14:54

were throwing it to Claire and I

14:59

guess she As the meteorologist,

14:59

she's talking to, you know,

15:03

local anchors as well as the

15:03

National acre. And I think she

15:06

would just been talking to Tony

15:06

Parsons. And so when you threw

15:09

to place it all thanks, Tony.

15:09

And then I remember coming back

15:13

to the studio, you held up a

15:13

sign that was either it's either

15:19

said, Peter, to reminder what

15:19

your actual name was, or Tony,

15:23

Peter, back to

15:23

you. Thanks very much, Peter.

15:26

Thanks very much, Peter. Thanks very much, Tony.

15:27

Beautiful day for the beautiful

15:30

game in three parts. Tony, oh, I

15:30

keep calling you the wrong name.

15:35

She was mortified by that. Okay, so for people who don't

15:38

know, you were discovered

15:43

because of your voice. Is that

15:43

correct?

15:45

Yeah. The

15:45

Coles notes version is pretty

15:48

simple. I dropped out of high

15:48

school. So, you know, I never

15:54

went to university, I ended up

15:54

and after, you know, I'll keep

15:59

it short. I ended up in

15:59

Churchill, Manitoba, working for

16:02

an airline called trans air. And

16:02

I was basically a baggage

16:05

handler occasional ticket agent.

16:05

And I was 19 years old. And one

16:12

day, they were really busy at

16:12

the counter, and they asked me

16:15

to announce the flight over the

16:15

PA system, which I did trans Air

16:19

Flight 106. Thompson upon

16:19

Winnipeg now already for

16:22

boarding. Gate, one only had one

16:22

gate, church.

16:28

Why did they number it?

16:30

Just because

16:30

it sounded really good. Yeah, it

16:32

sounded like, Hey, we're a big

16:32

airline. And there was a guy in

16:38

the terminal building who came

16:38

over and said, hey, you've got a

16:41

really good voice. Have you ever

16:41

thought about being in radio?

16:43

And I said, I've never thought

16:43

about being a radio. He said,

16:46

I'm the manager, the CBC

16:46

northern service station here in

16:49

Churchill. I have a shift late

16:49

at night. I can't get anybody to

16:53

work it everybody I approach

16:53

that is not interesting. Would

16:57

you be interested? I said, Sure.

16:57

I mean, there wasn't exactly a

17:01

lot to do in Churchill at night.

17:01

Other than what you can imagine

17:05

you do at night in Churchill.

17:05

And so I worked during the day a

17:10

translator, and I worked in the

17:10

evening at the CBC for about a

17:13

year until they decided to offer

17:13

me a full time job. At which

17:19

point, I switched the news

17:19

because I was terrible at me. I

17:22

was a DJ that first year. But

17:22

they didn't have a newscast. So

17:27

I said, I think we should have a

17:27

newscast. And they agreed. And

17:31

let me start one with no

17:31

training, no idea of what to do

17:34

or anything. But that's, that's

17:34

what we did. And that's how it

17:38

started. So it was a total

17:38

fluke. But as, as is the case,

17:44

in so much of life, it's you

17:44

know, every once in a while

17:47

something will come your way.

17:47

It's pure luck. But it's what

17:52

you what you do with it. How you

17:52

how you make it work for you.

17:58

Yeah, well, you

17:58

definitely took that opportunity

18:00

and make the most of it as your

18:00

career you were 50 years at CBC.

18:07

I mean, you're the guy. Like

18:07

you're the guy of news, when

18:11

people think about, you know,

18:11

anchors. When did you discover

18:16

and I'm, I'm guessing here, I'm

18:16

making the assumption here. When

18:20

did you discover your passion

18:20

for covering politics? Because

18:23

it seems like you really enjoy

18:23

covering politics. When did that

18:27

transition happen from you know,

18:27

hosting that that radio show to

18:31

them becoming a parliamentary reporter.

18:36

You know, I

18:36

grown up in a family that we

18:38

always talk politics around the

18:38

dinner table. At night, we

18:43

always had supper together. My

18:43

dad was always home for supper.

18:46

We grew up in Ottawa and

18:46

politics in the late 50s. And

18:50

early 60s was a pretty

18:50

interesting game in in Ottawa.

18:54

And so we talked about it a lot.

18:54

So I there was always part of me

18:57

that was interested. But after I

18:57

left church, I went to Winnipeg,

19:02

and then Winnipeg to Regina,

19:02

this is all with the CBC and

19:05

different roles and they offered

19:05

me a job as parliamentary

19:07

correspondent in Ottawa. And I

19:07

didn't really want to go,

19:12

because I like their wide open

19:12

spaces and more general

19:15

reporting than then being kind

19:15

of pigeon holed in one area,

19:19

which was political. But within

19:19

two weeks of being an Ottawa, I

19:22

thought, My gosh, I love this.

19:22

This is great. And, and so it's

19:28

been a part of me ever since

19:28

being interested in in politics,

19:33

and you know, I have a podcast

19:33

now competing with yours. We

19:39

call it a competition. Yeah,

19:39

it's a competition and there's

19:43

obviously is a lot of politics

19:43

in it and there will be a lot

19:46

more this summer and fall as we

19:46

head into a likely election.

20:33

Yeah, and when

20:33

you started covering you know,

20:38

the the political beat

20:38

Eventually, you worked your way

20:41

to the anchor desk, and you're

20:41

covering. And in fact, you were

20:46

the editor in charge of the news

20:46

for CBC. So when that started

20:52

when you first got the call to

20:52

say, hey, do you want to anchor

20:55

the national? You know that

20:55

first time? Did you have any

21:00

nerves about it? Or were you

21:00

season at this point? To the

21:05

point that you're like, yeah,

21:05

this is a great opportunity. I'm

21:07

champing at the bit to do this.

21:07

What did it feel like for you?

21:11

Because from the outside looking

21:11

in, it feels like, there's

21:14

nothing like, you know, you'd be

21:14

like Teflon, nothing would phase

21:19

this guy. But what's it really

21:19

like? What was it really like

21:23

for you at that time? At the

21:23

beginning? Well, first

21:25

of all, you

21:25

know, I, when I was even back

21:28

when I was in Churchill, I used

21:28

to dream that my goal was to

21:33

read the national that I wanted

21:33

to be the chief correspondent of

21:37

the CBC. And I never told

21:37

anybody because they would have

21:40

laughed at me. But that was my

21:40

goal. And I set out a pattern

21:48

and kind of agenda of different

21:48

jobs that I would have to get to

21:53

first before I could get to this

21:53

one. So anyway, it comes along,

21:57

and I first newscasts. The first

21:57

national that I did was on a

22:01

Saturday night in, I think

22:01

november of 81, I think. And I

22:10

was in there filling in for

22:10

George McLean, George McFly and

22:14

I was a great voice from back

22:14

then. And he was away on

22:19

holidays or something I came in.

22:19

And my heart was pounding all

22:24

day at the thought of doing and

22:24

then when I was sitting in the

22:27

chair, waiting for the 11

22:27

o'clock, which was what time we

22:31

were on in those days. To come,

22:31

I was sure that if anybody was

22:35

looking at me, they could see my

22:35

heart pounding through my suit

22:39

jacket. So I was pretty nervous.

22:39

And it slowly that got away,

22:46

what I've always found is

22:46

there's always a bit of nerves,

22:50

no matter what the broadcast is,

22:50

at the very beginning. And if

22:54

you get through those first 10

22:54

seconds, and you know, things

22:56

are, things tend to be okay. But

22:56

I learned that from you know, I

23:02

was co anchoring sort of the

23:02

color guy on the 72 election

23:07

broadcast out of Winnipeg,

23:07

Manitoba. So that was the

23:11

federal election, but we had

23:11

these local inserts. And the

23:14

main anchors a guy, a fella by

23:14

the name of Bill guest who was a

23:18

terrific bit of a legend icon in

23:18

in Manitoba broadcasting. And he

23:24

was sitting there and I was the

23:24

young kid from Churchill, who

23:27

was sitting beside him. And, you

23:27

know, we come up to 30 seconds

23:32

for air and I was feeling pretty

23:32

nervous. And I look over at bill

23:37

and he looked great from the

23:37

waist up. But his hands were

23:40

under the desk, and they were

23:40

just shaking. And I can see them

23:44

shaking. And I looked at him. I

23:44

said, Bill, you're not nervous,

23:47

are you? And he looked at me. He

23:47

said, Listen, kid, today, you're

23:49

not nervous. For a big show like

23:49

this. Today, you should get out

23:54

of the business. I always

23:54

remembered that. And you know,

23:57

he was right. And bingo, you

23:57

never would have known it

24:00

watching him. He was like, cool

24:00

as ice. But it gets the gets the

24:06

energy going inside. And and you

24:06

recognize that what you're doing

24:11

is important. So you better do

24:11

it. Right.

24:15

We know this is fascinating, because this ties into kind of, you know, with

24:17

your book The what happens

24:21

behind the scenes. And so I know

24:21

that one of your favorite movies

24:27

is anchorman. And add during the

24:27

time of the bottom line panel

24:35

was around the time that Aaron

24:35

Sorkin showed the newsroom was

24:38

on. And I want you to give your

24:38

take on and I know anchorman is

24:43

a comedy but in terms of the

24:43

things that they got right. Or

24:49

in the newsroom for people who

24:49

don't have a view to see what

24:53

happens. You know, behind the

24:53

cameras and all the people

24:57

involved in the flurry of

24:57

activity leading up to the show

25:01

like the stress. Can you talk

25:01

about what it's like in a

25:05

newsroom and how accurate the

25:05

newsroom was? Or if there's

25:08

anything that from the anchorman

25:08

that people say or you would say

25:12

to people you have no idea how

25:12

being on accurate that one thing

25:15

is you think that's a joke, but

25:15

that actually happens?

25:18

Yeah, I

25:18

wouldn't say that. I thought

25:23

anchorman was very funny movie.

25:23

But that's kind of the end of

25:26

it. You know, it probably

25:26

relates in some area to the

25:32

truth in certain certain not all

25:32

but certain local stations. I

25:38

mean, it's a carry on from The

25:38

old Mary Tyler Moore Show where

25:42

Ted Knight was a bit of a you

25:42

know, he was just a face and a

25:47

voice. And not too many smarts

25:47

and they made fun of him all the

25:51

time. And that was the case in

25:51

some local operations,

25:58

especially in the States, but in

25:58

some in Canada as well. Aaron

26:02

Sorkin shows the newsroom as

26:02

opposed to the old newsroom show

26:06

that used to be on CBC many

26:06

years ago. Aaron Sorkin show is

26:10

a pretty good reflection of what

26:10

happens and the tensions that

26:13

exists within within a major

26:13

network newsroom. Because it is

26:20

stance and the responsibility

26:20

and the accountability that goes

26:24

with it is is serious. And you

26:24

know, when when when things

26:31

happen and big stories hit.

26:31

There's a lot of activity in our

26:38

newsroom and a lot of action

26:38

when something goes wrong. As in

26:44

the case of the first year of

26:44

the newsroom when they you know

26:48

there was issues surrounding the

26:48

sourcing. That's a huge problem

26:55

within a newsroom and and you

26:55

challenge each other and that's

27:00

all part of the process of

27:00

accountability. So I thought

27:05

Sorkin's portrayal of what

27:05

happens in a major network

27:10

newsroom was pretty accurate,

27:10

you know, a few things get

27:14

picked over but for the most

27:14

part I was really good. And the

27:19

relationships that develop in a

27:19

newsroom all of that was all you

27:24

know, a very accurate in my

27:24

view, portrayal of what happens.

27:31

Yeah, and of course it's you know, it's a it's made for TV, there's some

27:32

some dramatic licenses that are

27:35

taken. So you're suggesting

27:35

that, you know, there's a scene

27:39

where mill will McAvoy

27:39

accidentally eat some edible

27:43

marijuana brownies before going

27:43

on the air he's completely baked

27:47

so you're saying that's never

27:47

happened to you

27:49

know that

27:49

happened quite often. I don't

27:55

recall that ever happening but

27:55

you know I was there long enough

27:58

that smoking was smoking

27:58

ordinary cigarettes was

28:04

perfectly all right in the

28:04

newsroom guys used to smoke

28:07

cigars and pipes and all that

28:07

stuff. And I was a smoker in the

28:11

80s when I started anchoring and

28:11

I used to have a cigarette going

28:16

during the show it'd be sitting

28:16

just off camera in you know an

28:19

ashtray and every once in a

28:19

while I'd hear the director

28:21

would say to me through my your

28:21

move the cigarette the smokes

28:25

you know, the wafting into the

28:25

shot. There were there were that

28:30

was that was a potential Bravo.

28:30

Oh, wow. Yeah. But Wow. No, I

28:35

don't think so

28:36

wild even think

28:36

about today. Oh,

28:39

I you know,

28:39

they I can never, never got

29:22

baked, ready for a show. But

29:22

maybe I should have tried that

29:26

on some show. Never had.

29:33

Okay, so. So now

29:33

I want to ask you about a couple

29:36

of news items that you would

29:36

have covered in your career,

29:39

just to get a sense. And you can

29:39

go as wide and deep or not as

29:43

you want on any of these issues.

29:43

But when it comes to the federal

29:47

budgets. There's two things I

29:47

want to ask you. One is can you

29:51

explain to people what is the

29:51

budget lockup procedure for

29:56

journalists covering the budget?

29:56

And why is that Institute in the

29:59

first place?

30:02

Well, it's

30:02

sort of a hangover from the from

30:04

the past, things have changed

30:04

somewhat in today's world. But

30:09

the whole idea behind the

30:09

lockout was the, to give a

30:13

chance for journalists to

30:13

understand, you know, what was

30:18

in this sometimes three 400 page

30:18

document, and what some of these

30:23

measures actually meant. And

30:23

they were locked up because they

30:28

didn't want them, you know,

30:28

running out and spilling the

30:31

beans on the air before,

30:31

especially before the markets

30:34

closed at four o'clock. And

30:34

that's where I budgets are

30:36

usually right after four

30:36

o'clock. And but, you know, that

30:42

was the main process. So it got

30:42

more and more sophisticated as

30:46

time went on. When I when I was

30:46

doing budgets in the in the 70s.

30:50

It was pretty straightforward. A

30:50

lock up, it would run four or

30:54

five hours. There would be a

30:54

couple of people in there who

30:57

were available for briefings on

30:57

as to what, what certain things

31:02

meant and the reporters would

31:02

line up in there today, or at

31:07

least the last time I was

31:07

involved with one, you could you

31:11

could go in there with your

31:11

experts with your pre banner

31:13

G's, who would also you know,

31:13

look at the document. And, and

31:19

help you frame questions for for

31:19

either during the briefings that

31:25

were taking place in the lockup

31:25

or afterwards for the interviews

31:28

with the finance ministry. And

31:28

so you had a pretty good idea

31:34

when you came out as to, you

31:34

know, how to best describe this,

31:40

you know, complicated stuff to

31:40

an audience who were interested

31:46

in knowing how they would impact

31:46

them, but by doing so in in such

31:51

a way that they'd understand,

31:51

which is always a challenge with

31:54

with budgetary items. It was bad

31:54

enough that the reporters half

31:59

the time didn't understand the

31:59

some of the stuff, but then to

32:01

have them being the the people

32:01

who were explaining it to

32:07

consumers. That was always a

32:07

challenge. And some budgets are

32:12

bigger than others, you know,

32:12

like I, you know, I remember the

32:15

ad budget with McCracken and

32:15

Alan McKenna was the finance

32:18

minister was the National Energy

32:18

Program was in there. And, you

32:23

know, trying to figure that one

32:23

out and realizing it was gonna

32:27

cause a huge national unity

32:27

crisis with Alberta. And then

32:33

again, two years later, after

32:33

that, McGann brought in a budget

32:37

that was dealing with a form of

32:37

wage and price controls, with

32:45

limits on both wages and prices

32:45

that were lower than the

32:51

interest rate was at the time.

32:51

So I mean, it was, it was a

32:54

really challenging time to try

32:54

to explain these issues, and for

32:58

consumers to try and figure out

32:58

what the heck was going on. I

33:02

mean, people are so used to low

33:02

low interest rates right now

33:06

that they have no idea what it

33:06

was, like 30 years ago when

33:09

interest rates, I mean, I

33:09

remember getting a mortgage at

33:12

12%. And thinking, I got a deal.

33:12

You know, because they were

33:19

ended up going as high as like,

33:19

1819 20% interest rates on

33:23

mortgages, which is the, you

33:23

know, the big fear right now,

33:28

the inflation is starting to

33:28

track higher, and how high could

33:34

it go on? What impact could it

33:34

have? I mean, God forbid, we

33:37

should ever face interest rates

33:37

like that before, but there's a

33:40

lot of people who are right on

33:40

the edge in terms of what

33:43

interest rate they are paying on

33:43

their mortgages. They gotta be

33:46

really careful

33:48

when you talk

33:48

about contentious budget,

33:52

budgets, period. So you know, in

33:52

the 80s, in the National Energy

33:56

Program, another one that I

33:56

think would have been

33:58

contentious, and maybe you can

33:58

give us the background of what

34:01

was going around this time was

34:01

the introduction of the GST in

34:04

1989. And so now, it we take it

34:04

for, you know, as it is

34:09

accepted, yes, we have this GST

34:09

that we have to pay. But when it

34:13

was introduced, I think if you

34:13

ask someone today, you know,

34:17

like, say someone under 35, a

34:17

word to ask them, who do you

34:20

think introduced it? which party

34:20

Do you think introduced it? And

34:24

where do you think the

34:24

opposition came from? I didn't

34:26

know if that would line up with

34:26

what actually happened back

34:29

then. So can you walk through

34:29

the introduction of the GST?

34:33

Well, it's interesting because it kind of flew under the radar in many

34:34

ways at the time. First of all,

34:38

it was one of those things that

34:38

nobody could understand, you

34:40

know, GST replaced another tax,

34:40

which was similar, but wasn't

34:48

called the GST. And where the

34:48

money ended up going was, was

34:52

perhaps a little different. But

34:52

the thing that was happening

34:56

through 88 when the GST was

34:56

introduced in Parliament the

35:03

main topic of conversation

35:03

wasn't the GST it was free trade

35:06

bill. Right. That's what we had

35:06

all the attention. And this did

35:11

kind of slip under the radar.

35:11

There were some who were who

35:15

were upset about it. It was

35:15

introduced by the Mulroney

35:18

government. I think Mike Wilson

35:18

was the finance minister at the

35:24

time. And the liberals, under

35:24

john Turner, were so focused on

35:31

free trade, they didn't really

35:31

get into the debate around the

35:35

GST from what I recall, because

35:35

I can remember, you know,

35:39

Turner, and I had a really

35:39

fascinating relationship over

35:43

2030 years. And, and I liked the

35:43

guy a lot. I learned a lot from

35:49

him. But I can remember in 88,

35:49

they tried to dump him in the

35:53

middle of the campaign and I, I

35:53

broke that story. And it was

35:57

very controversial, but it never

35:57

affected our relationship. And I

36:01

can remember after the campaign,

36:01

because he made a comeback in

36:05

the debate in ADA. It looked

36:05

like it was going to lose almost

36:08

every seat the liberals add they

36:08

ended up winning 80 which was

36:12

double what he'd won in 84 and

36:12

small running. But anyway, I can

36:15

remember saying to him at Lunch

36:15

afterwards. Why didn't you push

36:18

the GST? You needed a second

36:18

front, you'd made the case on GE

36:22

on free trade. It basically won

36:22

that debate and scared the hell

36:27

out of the conservatives and

36:27

Mulroney. And if you'd open up a

36:31

second front on GST, it was a

36:31

natural. He said, just didn't

36:36

just thought I had to just keep

36:36

going after free trade. So I was

36:42

sitting there as an issue, and

36:42

then it kind of people, you

36:45

know, were mad about it, but

36:45

they accepted it. And then

36:49

Harper was smart enough to

36:49

realize, if I promised to drop

36:53

the rate, that's going to be a

36:53

winner. For me, and it was in

36:58

2006 election. It's one of those

36:58

arguments about politics that

37:04

the simpler you make the

37:04

promise, the more impact it can

37:09

have you remember Doug Ford with

37:09

bucket beer. And Harper with the

37:15

I'll drop the the GST rate one

37:15

point or two points. And people

37:20

understand what that means. No,

37:20

yes. They don't need a degree in

37:24

climatology to understand the

37:24

carbon tax issue. Right. So

37:32

that's, that's the little I

37:32

recall about that time that it

37:36

kind of slipped under the radar

37:36

wasn't the issue that it could

37:38

have been, perhaps should have

37:38

been, and might have made a

37:44

difference in that campaign, the

37:44

ADA campaign, it came in to

37:49

effect January 1 89. So people

37:49

weren't actually dealing with

37:53

it. In the campaign, like

37:53

consumers, they didn't have to

37:57

worry about it. It was something

37:57

off in the distance. But then

38:01

when the distance arrived, that

38:01

they got it or, you know, right

38:05

between the eyes.

38:08

Yeah, I was

38:08

doing a little bit of reading up

38:10

on it, because this was, at the

38:10

time I would have been 12. So I

38:14

wasn't covering or even thinking

38:14

about, you know, the business

38:17

news at the time. So I had to

38:17

read up on on this history a

38:19

little bit. And it seemed like

38:19

it was quite a contentious thing

38:23

behind the scenes, because it

38:23

was originally proposed that as

38:27

a 9% tax. It was proposed by the

38:27

Mulroney government. And it

38:35

ended up that the liberal

38:35

controlled senate refused to

38:42

pass it. And then I think they

38:42

ended up filibustering until I

38:46

think Mulroney brought in eight

38:46

more senators to get the thing

38:51

passed. It just seems like what

38:51

a fascinating thing that happens

38:55

behind the scenes. And like you

38:55

said, most people probably

38:58

didn't sort of tune into that as

38:58

much because the talk of the

39:02

town was all free trade free

39:02

trade Free Trade Agreement.

39:06

Yeah. Which was a huge

39:06

undertaking, certainly through

39:09

that 88 election.

39:10

That was that

39:10

was what the talk was about

39:12

after the election. As you got

39:12

closer to implementation date on

39:17

GST and unneeded Royal Assent.

39:17

Then you saw all that activity

39:21

in the Senate and was raised

39:21

something to watch.

39:24

Now, speaking of

39:24

elections, the election night

39:30

coverage is that like the Super

39:30

Bowl for a news broadcaster?

39:37

I think it is

39:37

I've always, you know, I grew

39:39

up, I you know, I can remember

39:39

sitting there this is long

39:43

before I ever thought I'd be end

39:43

up in journalism, but I can

39:45

remember, you know, watching 58,

39:45

the election, the deef sweep of

39:50

58 watching the limited

39:50

television coverage that existed

39:54

then through elections in 63 and

39:54

65 and 68. Through the 60s, a

40:01

heavily dominated election

40:01

scheduled during those years and

40:07

and it was the big deal it was

40:07

the broadcast that defined

40:13

people defined networks and they

40:13

would throw everything at it

40:19

their big budget nights because

40:19

there's a lot involved in in

40:23

trying to cover an election

40:23

night and and you know, you have

40:27

you're taking a huge gamble on

40:27

how well your your computers and

40:31

your graphics presentation and

40:31

all that are going to work

40:34

enormous pressure over the

40:34

executive producers who were

40:38

involved in those you mentioned

40:38

Laura earlier as the person who

40:42

found you she's she's the

40:42

executive producer of cbcs

40:45

election coverage for the last

40:45

couple of elections and

40:48

including whatever it's gonna

40:48

happen this year.

40:54

The conversation

40:54

with Peter mansbridge continues

40:57

in just a moment. Now, as

40:57

regular listeners know, during

41:01

the mid show segment, I work my

41:01

way through all the listener

41:04

comments. I am sorely behind and

41:04

I won't be able to give everyone

41:08

a shout out as this may be the

41:08

last episode for the show. But I

41:12

just wanted to thank you all for

41:12

spending your time with me over

41:15

these 100 episodes means a lot

41:15

to me. Now, I may relaunch the

41:20

show again after a short break.

41:20

But right now, I have just a few

41:24

too many projects on the Guild,

41:24

many of those are actually

41:26

wrapping up by the end of 2021.

41:26

But I may enjoy some downtime

41:30

for a bit, and then sit down to

41:30

give a think about what I want

41:34

to do with the podcast in any

41:34

future content creation. Now,

41:38

stay subscribed to the podcast,

41:38

if you are subscribed. And if I

41:42

do relaunch it, you'll be the

41:42

first to know. And if I don't

41:46

relaunch it, well, you're not

41:46

going to notice anything. Before

41:51

I get back to the interview with

41:51

Peter, I should point out that

41:53

his laptop died at this point in

41:53

the interview. And he switched

41:57

to a different computer which had a different microphone. So the audio quality changes a bit.

41:59

And you know, the voice like his

42:04

heat, sound good talking into

42:04

it, tin can with a string. And I

42:09

don't know about you, but I

42:09

really miss hearing his voice on

42:12

a regular basis. But you know

42:12

what, there's a solution for

42:15

that, you can subscribe to his

42:15

podcast, the bridge. And now

42:20

back to the conversation with

42:20

Peter mansbridge.

42:38

I'll just think it's the most important night of a any broadcasters new

42:39

schedule is the election, you

42:45

define yourself as a network.

42:45

The people who are, you know, in

42:51

the front row of your news

42:51

coverage, they define STEM

42:55

careers are made or broken on

42:55

election nights. And, you know,

42:59

it's more than just people it's

42:59

resources, and if the networks

43:02

don't put behind their people,

43:02

the kind of resources they need

43:07

for an election night. In other

43:07

words, money. You know, it can

43:14

damage you and I fear at times

43:14

that some of the networks don't,

43:19

you know, have forgotten that or

43:19

think that we've passed that,

43:22

that that's, that's a sort of,

43:22

you know, a part of our past as

43:27

opposed to a part of our present

43:27

or future. I think the most

43:31

important night in a cycle is

43:31

election night, it's when

43:34

democracy plays its role in in

43:34

our society. And this decision

43:40

of the people is, is paramount.

43:40

And we should be there to help

43:45

guide through to the finish line

43:45

in terms of coverage.

43:50

And I know that,

43:50

you know, it's been a few years

43:54

since you anchored. You know,

43:54

the news, let alone the election

44:00

in the last federal election in

44:00

Canada, you came as a special

44:03

contributor. What was it? What

44:03

was it like being not the anchor

44:08

that night?

44:10

Well, I you

44:10

know, it's hard to get used to

44:14

that role. It's also liberating

44:14

in a sense, because they wanted

44:18

me there was an analyst and Bob

44:18

Ray and I were sitting together

44:21

and people were set up to look

44:21

like those Muppets in the

44:25

theater. But, but it was fun

44:25

because I you know, I got drawn

44:30

to certain experiences I had to

44:30

do explain what I thought about

44:35

the way things were unfolding.

44:35

So I enjoyed that. But uh, you

44:39

know, obviously, it wasn't the

44:39

same as the anchoring. Rosie

44:43

Burton did a terrific job as

44:43

anchor that night and, you know,

44:46

time moves on and I, you know, I

44:46

understand accept them.

44:50

And do you feel

44:50

that you will come back with,

44:53

you know, in an analyst role do

44:53

you feel that you have, like you

44:57

said, you're much more liberated

44:57

in what you can say, do you feel

45:01

like there's a significant

45:01

change versus being the anchor?

45:06

Sure. I mean,

45:06

you're everybody's anchor, when

45:09

you're the anchor, that's,

45:09

that's what it's supposed to be

45:12

you know, and say on election

45:12

night, any party, any party, any

45:16

supporter of any party should

45:16

feel comfortable with you. In

45:21

that role in terms of your you

45:21

know, you're not one sided or

45:25

bias, you're just telling the

45:25

story. As an analyst you can,

45:29

you can show a little more kind

45:29

of flair about what you think

45:32

about certain things. And I've

45:32

enjoyed doing that with the

45:36

podcast. I still hold back, you

45:36

know, a fair amount but uh, but

45:42

I have I have moved on from my

45:42

my anchor position in terms of

45:48

what I end up saying and doing.

45:50

Now. Now,

45:50

speaking of your podcast, there

45:54

is I don't think it's every day

45:54

but you have a smoke and mirrors

45:57

edition of the podcast. Is that

45:57

correct? Can you explain what

46:00

that is?

46:01

Well, we're trying to do is separate the smoke and mirrors from the

46:03

truth. Right. And so every

46:07

Wednesday and through the

46:07

summer, that's the only one I'm

46:10

doing. I'm doing one day a week

46:10

until the elections called and

46:14

so we do smoke mirrors and the

46:14

truth with Bruce Anderson, who's

46:17

a longtime friend of mine

46:17

pollster, he's worked for all

46:21

the parties at one time or

46:21

another, especially the

46:24

conservatives and the liberals.

46:24

And so he has a wealth of

46:27

experience. And we tried to, you

46:27

know, talk in that general sense

46:34

of, you know, separating what's

46:34

true from what's just, you know,

46:40

or they're trying to pullo pull

46:40

the wool over your eyes on some

46:45

things. And we try to explain

46:45

that and we have a lot of fun

46:49

doing it.

46:50

But you know,

46:50

it's, it's such a, it's so

46:54

enjoyable to listen to the two

46:54

of you banter and talk about

46:57

things because there's such a

46:57

wealth of experience between the

47:00

both of you, and like you said,

47:00

Bruce is experienced being a

47:04

pollster and working for both

47:04

sides of the aisle. And in your

47:08

experience with, you know, five

47:08

decades of coverage. Phenomenal.

47:12

So for anyone who's listening,

47:12

you know, I really highly

47:16

recommend Peters podcast. Okay,

47:16

the last thing I have to ask you

47:21

about is Trump. And that is only

47:21

because you know, as of late,

47:29

you know, he just made an

47:29

appearance and it looks like he

47:32

is looking to build support for

47:32

getting the the party's

47:35

nomination for the next

47:35

election. And I think some

47:37

people thought, No, Trump's done

47:37

now. But does he ever go away?

47:42

Does his influence in politics

47:42

ever change at this point?

47:47

You know, I

47:47

I've been a believer all along

47:50

that he will go away, that the

47:50

last person the republicans

47:57

really want is Donald Trump

47:57

again. Now you run that up

48:03

against the fact that you know,

48:03

there are a lot of people still

48:07

believe in anything, he says, no

48:07

matter how bizarre or unhinged,

48:13

it may sound. And those are the

48:13

people who are sick and tired of

48:21

what they perceive as the normal

48:21

kind of BS that's come out of

48:27

Washington for decades. And, and

48:27

they believe in conspiracy

48:34

theories and a lot of other

48:34

things, because they've been put

48:38

in the position of having to

48:38

believe them, because they feel

48:42

they haven't been served in any

48:42

reasonable way. In the past.

48:47

Now, I think what surprised us

48:47

is that there are more of those

48:51

people than we ever thought

48:51

there were. I mean, that the guy

48:55

could get whatever it was 70

48:55

million votes in the last

48:58

election, considerably less than

48:58

Biden, but still a hell of a lot

49:02

of votes. does tell you

49:02

something. Now, I think the

49:09

republicans are going to go

49:09

through hoops to try and figure

49:12

out a way that he isn't their

49:12

representative, I guess, if

49:17

they're hoping anything, so he

49:17

ends up in jail. Before before,

49:23

more that he ends up ruined or

49:23

broke as a result of the various

49:27

actions that are being taken

49:27

against his companies. But I,

49:33

you know, I don't know I've

49:33

given up making predictions. I

49:38

never thought he could win the

49:38

nomination, let alone the

49:41

presidency in 2016. I can

49:41

remember being at his

49:48

inauguration. And I was in

49:48

Washington, and when I I covered

49:57

that in the within 24 hours, he

49:57

was lying about the crowd size.

50:02

All the people he said out, I

50:02

this is crazy. You know, I mean,

50:05

no, like crowd size, who cares?

50:05

But if this is this guy's

50:08

President of the United States

50:08

if this is an indication of what

50:11

it's going to be like, and I

50:11

tweeted, on, I was fly fly to

50:17

Washington on 6am flight on the

50:17

Sunday morning. He was

50:20

inaugurated on the Friday, I

50:20

flew out on the 6am. On the

50:24

Sunday morning, I wrote

50:24

something like you know, I've

50:28

never felt so unsettled as I

50:28

pass over the White House. In a

50:35

way when a president is people

50:35

lie. And I use The L Word lie. I

50:42

you know, it crumbles. Oh, you

50:42

know, an important pillar of

50:46

democracy. And I took so much

50:46

heat on that by calling it a

50:52

lie. Right, including from the

50:52

CBC. Really? You're not supposed

50:59

to say anything, Peter,

50:59

certainly not. Know what, I'm

51:05

sorry, this, this is a rageous.

51:05

Anyway. It was six months or a

51:10

year before the mainstream media

51:10

in the sites started using The L

51:15

Word. They You know, covered it

51:15

up and they felt they couldn't

51:19

say lie now it's like lying is

51:19

in every sentence attributed

51:24

home thing about Trump. But we

51:24

saw it right from the beginning.

51:28

And quite frankly, we saw it

51:28

throughout the guy's career. You

51:32

know, I, you talked to more

51:32

business people, and I do but

51:35

I've talked to a number of

51:35

business people in Toronto, who

51:39

were involved a different levels

51:43

with Trump on a projects that he

51:43

was doing in Canada, and they

51:50

all backed away from it said,

51:50

there's nothing about this guy I

51:54

can trust. And I don't want anything to do

51:56

with him. And this was, you

52:01

know, the this is based on

52:01

events before he ran for the

52:04

presidency. And I remember

52:04

hearing those stories early on

52:08

and thinking man, can that

52:08

possibly be true? And, you know,

52:12

if it's true, why isn't anybody

52:12

in the states figure this out

52:15

yet? So I listen, I'll tell you

52:15

one thing about Trump. You know,

52:23

he always used to say if I lose,

52:23

or if I'm gone, you guys in the

52:28

media gonna miss me?

52:30

Is Right. Yeah.

52:32

He was right.

52:32

They miss him. And they're

52:36

finding it awfully hard to do.

52:36

Just your basic normal

52:40

legitimate stories ago

52:40

government. Clown show going on.

52:48

Right. Listen, they certainly

52:48

listen.

52:52

Well, you know,

52:52

I'll tell you. We miss you.

52:56

anchoring the news? I certainly

52:56

do. But I know that people can

52:59

get their hit of Peter

52:59

mansbridge on his podcast. At

53:03

the end of every episode on this

53:03

podcast, everyone gets a

53:07

commercial. unabashedly promote

53:07

anything that you want. We

53:11

talked about your book in your

53:11

podcast, but feel free to talk

53:13

about those again or anything

53:13

else that you want to promote

53:15

the floor is yours.

53:18

Well, I listen, I would promote information, real hard, true

53:19

information. And I would try to

53:23

encourage people to demand it of

53:23

their their information sources

53:30

and make them accountable. Call

53:30

for more transparency on the

53:35

part of all journalistic

53:35

operations in terms of the way

53:39

they're doing their jobs and the

53:39

decisions they make. On a

53:42

personal note, obviously, I

53:42

would like people to listen to

53:47

the bridge when they're finished

53:47

listening to Preet Sprott

53:50

podcast. And you can find out on

53:50

any podcast platform on or on

53:56

Sirius XM channel 167. Canada

53:56

talks. They buy the rights to

54:01

the podcast, so it's up on their

54:01

normal, you know, satellite

54:05

radio service before it is then

54:05

pushed out on as a podcast the

54:09

same, the same program. Very

54:09

successful book last year in

54:14

extraordinary Canadians that I

54:14

wrote with my friend, Mark

54:17

Bowditch, which reached number

54:17

one as a national bestseller and

54:22

this fall, October, as Preet

54:22

mentioned, I'm coming out with

54:26

my new book called off the

54:26

record, which is more personal.

54:30

And I think, I think if you're

54:30

interested in the kind of the

54:34

behind the scenes stories about

54:34

news, you'll get a lot of them

54:38

in here plus my own thoughts

54:38

about about journalism in

54:42

general, and where we are today,

54:42

in that profession, and also my

54:48

thoughts about Canada and the

54:48

challenges we still face because

54:53

of anything. The last few months

54:53

have reminded us that we're not

54:57

there yet. We're a great

54:57

country. There's a lot of good

55:00

about it. But we're not where we

55:00

want to be and, and we need we

55:08

need help and a push to get

55:08

there. So that's my that's my

55:14

free promo.

55:17

Well, Peter,

55:17

it's it's been an absolute honor

55:20

for me to have you on this

55:20

podcast. I look forward to

55:24

sharing some stories off the

55:24

record over over a tipple maybe

55:29

some whiskey at your place in

55:29

Scotland. I think it is right.

55:33

So I'm going to be I'm going to

55:33

be across the pond as well for

55:35

the next couple of years. So

55:35

hopefully we can Yeah, share a

55:40

few drinks. But yeah, thank you

55:40

again, so much. highlight of my

55:44

career was being on the bottom

55:44

line panel for eight years and

55:47

meeting and working with you.

55:50

That's very

55:50

kind of your pre and you know, I

55:52

enjoyed doing those and you were

55:52

always a mainstay on it. So good

55:57

luck and in the challenges add

55:57

and I'll be listening

56:16

Well, that is it

56:16

for mostly money. I would love

56:19

to stay in touch though you can

56:19

visit my website Preet Banerjee

56:23

calm and subscribe to my email

56:23

newsletter. I haven't published

56:27

content there for a while. But

56:27

while the podcast might be

56:30

ending the website will be

56:30

relaunching in 2022, maybe a

56:34

little bit earlier, as they do

56:34

feel the urge to start blogging

56:37

again. Maybe I have to think

56:37

about that. In any case, I will

56:42

continue to create more

56:42

financial content in different

56:44

media at the very least. So if

56:44

that is of interest, please do

56:48

sign up and when I do have stuff

56:48

to share, you will be the first

56:52

to know until then it's been an

56:52

honor and a privilege.