0:33

Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast.

0:33

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0:38

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0:48

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0:56

All right, let's begin Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast

1:04

today, I have the pleasure and

1:08

the privilege of bringing

1:08

Meredith Fogg Liebross to the

1:12

show. I have an Instagram link

1:12

for if you want to follow her

1:16

and check her out. See some

1:16

pics. It's at

1:19

@meredith_fogg_liebross. And

1:19

thank you for joining me,

1:28

Meredith, it was such a pleasure

1:28

to speak with you. She's a yoga

1:31

teacher, as Ashtanga yoga

1:31

teacher out in Los Angeles,

1:34

California. And she teaches with

1:34

Pranidhi Varshney, who I had a

1:39

chance to have on the podcast as

1:39

well. Check back a few episodes

1:42

ago and have a listen. It's

1:42

really cool actually to speak to

1:45

two different teachers that work

1:45

in the same studio and to hear

1:50

the dynamic from both sides. And

1:50

also to hear the appreciation

1:53

from both of them for each other

1:53

about how much they do to kind

1:57

of hold the space together. So

1:57

go ahead and have a listen to

2:01

this conversation. You're here.

2:01

Now obviously, you get to

2:03

listen, and then check out

2:03

before a couple episodes with

2:07

Pranidhi Varshney. It was such a

2:07

pleasure to meet both of them.

2:10

And the next time you're in Los

2:10

Angeles. And if you love

2:13

Ashtanga yoga, go check them

2:13

out. All right, let's get

2:17

started. Meredith. I'm so happy

2:17

to have this opportunity to meet

2:21

and speak with Meredith Fogg

2:21

Liebross. Meredith, you are in

2:27

Los Angeles. Do I have that

2:27

correct?

2:31

You do. I'm currently in Ojai.

2:31

But I'm in Los Angeles and Ojai.

2:36

But my time how far away is that

2:36

I teach in Los Angeles? About an

2:40

hour and a half. Yeah. Wow. So wait, when you teach in

2:42

LA that means you drive an hour

2:46

and a half to get to the studio? No, well, occasionally. I mostly

2:48

spend my time in Venice in LA.

2:54

But my family and I have been

2:54

renovating a like a little ranch

3:00

up in Ojai. So we come on the

3:00

weekends, and sometimes.

3:05

Tomorrow's a moon day. So I had

3:05

extra time. So I came up here

3:11

after dropping my kids at

3:11

school. My husband, I

3:13

occasionally trade just so that

3:13

we can get a little nature, you

3:17

know, get out of LA. So it's

3:17

very different up here. It's

3:20

ranch lands. So I'm fortunate

3:20

that I get to be in both places.

3:24

But I teach in LA and North me

3:24

and my kids are in school in LA.

3:28

So I'm normally there. Cool.

3:31

I appreciate Ron. Ed introduced

3:31

me to you teach at her studio.

3:36

Yoga. Shallow West. That's

3:36

correct. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. Nice.

3:41

And how long have you been a

3:41

yoga teacher? Huh? Decade. Cool.

3:50

Nice. That's a good solid amount

3:50

of time.

3:53

I never really timestamp the day

3:53

like the data switch was

3:58

flicked. The switch was fired

3:58

about a decade.

4:00

Yeah. What is one of the

4:00

stereotypes that you think exist

4:04

around that switch flip in

4:04

relation to being a yoga

4:09

student? And now I am a yoga

4:09

teacher? Is there anything that

4:14

you find interesting about that? There's a lot that I find

4:17

interesting about that. I don't

4:19

know if it is necessarily a

4:19

stereotype I feel like

4:25

or something that's really like

4:25

it's a strange

4:27

choice. I feel like choosing to

4:27

become a yoga teacher is a very

4:30

strange choice that people make.

4:30

And then I don't feel like I

4:35

made and I don't think

4:35

historically that was like a

4:38

choice that people made it was

4:38

more or less of a choice that

4:43

was made for them. So it means

4:43

stare. Yeah. The the decision to

4:53

teach yoga, as though it's like

4:53

a career decision. Always kind

4:58

of baffled me because it's not

4:58

In a great career, in a lot of

5:02

ways, I feel like those who do

5:02

it, it's because they can't not.

5:08

It's a bit of a dharmic poll.

5:08

Yeah, those who do it for, you

5:13

know, the long run, I think

5:13

there's a lot of students turn

5:18

teachers, because they are made

5:18

to believe that if you feel the

5:24

need to do to connect more to go

5:24

deeper, that that's the next

5:28

step. And I think that's,

5:28

unfortunately, the result of

5:32

the, like a business model, you

5:32

know, teacher training business

5:36

model that tells people that you

5:36

should become yoga teachers,

5:39

when really all you should do is

5:39

just become more dedicated

5:43

students. It's great. Yeah, so I

5:43

don't know if that's the

5:47

stereotype. But the, the, when

5:47

that flip was switched for me, I

5:52

didn't know it in the moment. I,

5:52

I sort of kept trying not to

5:57

teach yoga. What was the situation like you

5:59

were practicing? And your

6:02

teacher said, Can you I'm going

6:02

to be out of town? Would you be

6:05

willing to hold down the class?

6:05

You seem like you know, what

6:07

you're doing? Or was it? Was it

6:07

a situation where somebody said,

6:11

you really should do teacher training, you should do a teacher training, and then you

6:13

took a training and then decided

6:15

to start teaching? How did it evolve for you? Um, well, it evolved for me, I

6:19

was really, you know, I did a

6:26

formal teacher training, I was

6:26

just very lucky to have done it

6:30

with a woman who I think is I

6:30

still to this day, have a

6:36

relationship with and think

6:36

incredible woman named Annie

6:39

Carpenter, who, you know, she's

6:39

an in old school integrative

6:43

teacher who's rooted in more

6:43

than one traditional lineage,

6:50

and has just a unique ability to

6:50

integrate them and then innovate

6:54

on her own. So I had exposure to

6:54

traditional yoga through her.

7:03

And that was a very valuable

7:03

training experience. And I

7:08

think, put me in a really good

7:08

position to kind of understand

7:14

my own practice in more ways.

7:14

And that led to, you know,

7:19

teachers that then became

7:19

mentors, and that shaped my

7:23

practice. I wouldn't

7:23

necessarily, necessarily say

7:28

shaped my career, because I

7:28

never really meant for it to be

7:31

a career. I feel like, every

7:31

time I stepped away from that

7:40

path, I got pulled back into it.

7:40

And this last round was there.

7:44

You know, pruning, and I just started trading off during maternity leaves, basically. So

7:46

we have five small children,

7:50

between the two of us. And we

7:50

kind of just kind of stumbled

7:54

into a situation that you for a

7:54

minute or room doesn't always

7:58

work to have alternate two

7:58

teachers that alternate within

8:02

the same program. But it just

8:02

worked so well for us. And yeah,

8:07

so it's been, it's a bit of a

8:07

dharmic poll to do what I do.

8:11

And I feel even more so about

8:11

that, teaching my sore for the

8:17

years that I taught in like lead

8:17

style classes, you know, was

8:22

never quite the right fit for

8:22

me. Because I was always, you

8:28

know, really drawn to the

8:28

teaching and the connection with

8:33

the students. And I wasn't

8:33

particularly good at the

8:36

performative aspect of, you

8:36

know, a pop yoga situation where

8:42

you have different 30 or 4034

8:42

people in the room and different

8:46

every day. But I'm not I was

8:46

kind of wandered from your

8:52

original question, but and yours

8:52

teaching roughly and taught,

8:58

sort of integrated Hatha style.

8:58

Ashtanga younger, blended, and

9:05

then full on my sore for the

9:05

past three years or so

9:09

nice. I also, can you tell us a

9:09

little bit about I've heard so

9:14

many good things about Annie

9:14

Carpenter, can you tell me a

9:17

little bit about what is it

9:17

about her that you enjoy

9:21

studying with her? I've seen

9:21

pictures ever ever since I

9:24

started practicing and Yoga

9:24

Journal books and magazines and

9:27

she just looks amazing. And I've

9:27

seen so can you just share a

9:31

little bit about why you love

9:31

her what you think is amazing

9:35

about her you kind of already

9:35

did but I'm just Yeah, I'd love

9:37

to know more. Yeah, and of course, and he's rad. I mean,

9:38

any set me on a path towards you

9:43

know, Mati is a teacher I'd

9:43

studied with her up until she

9:47

passed for so many years. And so

9:47

I credit both of them. And as

9:52

well Chuck Miller, who I spent a

9:52

little bit time with, not as

9:54

much as Mati And then a lot of

9:54

our younger teachers in LA that

9:59

I Um, I miss my younger

9:59

teachers, they kind of

10:03

disappeared in COVID times, but

10:03

um, Annie is just a uniquely

10:10

talented teacher in the sense

10:10

that is outside of the yoga

10:18

world, like she can command a

10:18

room have that charisma. So

10:24

she's, you know, clear

10:24

communicator, and she has this

10:27

background of Shiva, Nanda, a

10:27

yin gar Ashtanga. And she was a

10:33

Martha Graham dancer and

10:33

choreographer. So she has like a

10:37

wide array of just movement,

10:37

background, and has, she has the

10:47

experience it takes to decide

10:47

what part of which lineage is

10:54

useful for her. And then she

10:54

passes that down through to her

10:58

students, which I think is the kind of thing that only a few people really qualified to do.

11:00

Because when everyone gets in

11:03

there and starts doing that,

11:03

then we've lost the lineage and

11:07

the tradition altogether. So I'm

11:07

not generally a fan of like, the

11:13

way that modern vinyasa yoga has

11:13

adapted to becoming something

11:18

that doesn't have any foothold.

11:18

Yeah, but she's a unique example

11:23

of someone who can teach a

11:23

Vinyasa class that feels like

11:30

it's in the stream. She's also

11:30

just fun and funny. And like a

11:38

general educational experience,

11:38

right? She's someone who knows a

11:42

lot about anatomy and physiology

11:42

and offers, and she offers a lot

11:46

of trainings that aren't

11:46

necessarily teacher trainings

11:49

were like workshops, people who were just kind of like the geek out about things. So there's a

11:51

little bit of me that like just

11:53

the geeking out part. academic

11:53

inquiry. So she's, she's for

11:59

students who are a little type A

11:59

and into the academic aspect of

12:05

their practice. She's kind of a

12:05

fun person to spend some time

12:07

with, cuz she knows, she knows

12:07

at all. That's cool. And she

12:11

loved me, you know, in the

12:11

direction that I went from

12:13

there. Nice. And you mentioned Maddie is

12:15

rowdy and Chuck Miller. Were you

12:18

practicing the original

12:18

YogaWorks in Santa Monica when

12:22

they had that studio? I practiced and taught at the

12:26

original Yoga works in Santa

12:30

Monica, but not while they had

12:30

their Mysore program. My Yeah, I

12:34

mean, I entered the Ashtanga

12:34

world kind of through the back

12:36

door, which I feel great about.

12:36

Mati I spent several years up

12:46

right up until her passing,

12:46

spending some, you know, intense

12:49

intensive periods of time with

12:49

her at least every year, if not

12:52

more than once a year. Or, you

12:52

know, she'd come for weeks at a

12:55

time. But it was in the period

12:55

between 2011 Up until she passed

13:06

and what was that like?

13:06

2000 22,018. Right? If my memory

13:12

serves, so a good chunk of time

13:12

with her. And that period where

13:19

she was it's very interesting.

13:19

She meant she was similar as

13:22

Annie. She was teaching

13:22

integrative yoga, she had kind

13:26

of she was not adhering to like

13:26

what you would see now in

13:32

Mysore. But she's still teaching

13:32

Ashtanga. She was just teaching

13:36

Ashtanga that was infused with

13:36

felt like she was spending time

13:40

in Pune. So it had kind of it

13:40

was not the Mysore style

13:48

education that came later for me

13:48

like being what it was like to

13:52

be really immersed in Mysore

13:52

room, because it was mostly let.

13:57

So I spent a lot of time with

13:57

Mati, but it's a different

14:00

version of Mati than the people

14:00

that were with her. You know, I

14:04

don't even know how old I would

14:04

have been when she was doing

14:06

like her 4pm classes for years

14:06

on Montana. It's probably a

14:10

teenager does miss out on that.

14:10

Yeah. So yeah, it was just a

14:14

second phase of her teaching,

14:14

which is, which is unique. It's

14:17

unique, like I have such a close

14:17

bond and relationship with her

14:23

in the second half of her life, but she was a different teacher then. Then when she was, you

14:25

know, working on Mysore program

14:28

full time. And I've spent some

14:28

time with Dina Kingsburg says,

14:32

still kind of trying to find

14:32

those teachers for me those old

14:34

school teachers that have you

14:34

know, they're within Ashtanga

14:39

lineage but you know, I'm pretty

14:39

religious person. And if you're

14:47

pretty far from any dogma

14:47

moment, I sniff it out. So it's

14:52

kind of new. I look. It's great.

14:52

I love it. I mean, the irony of

14:58

that in the end, The more senior

14:58

and you know older not to use my

15:06

senior but more senior teachers

15:06

you kind of find the less

15:10

dogmatic they tend to be because

15:10

they don't feel via don't feel

15:14

the need to defend something

15:14

that doesn't need defend it.

15:19

Good point do you made I love

15:19

the way that you made the

15:23

analogy like when you sniff out

15:23

dogma? Can you think of ways

15:27

that that's helped you in your

15:27

yoga practice? And maybe even

15:30

possibly a way where it might

15:30

have detracted in some ways?

15:35

Does that make sense? Like

15:35

sometimes I, I'm extreme, I'm

15:37

like that too. Like, I have like

15:37

a cold tachometer that like soon

15:42

as I get this feeling on my

15:42

other way. And then but

15:46

sometimes that keeps me so

15:46

skeptical that I wonder if that

15:53

if I'm the scowl on something by

15:53

my skepticism. What have you

15:57

noticed with that experience in

15:57

yoga product? Yeah,

15:59

I mean, that's a great point. I

15:59

mean, cynicism is a defense

16:04

mechanism. A lot of the times

16:04

and I'd probably it is very

16:11

possible that my aversion to

16:11

dogma, perhaps comes from not

16:18

understanding necessarily the

16:18

tradition, the way that I would,

16:23

if that had been like entry

16:23

point one.

16:28

However, I really feel that I'd

16:28

benefit from an astronaut's view

16:32

of the larger project that we're

16:32

participating in, and dedicating

16:38

our time to as practitioners and

16:38

life to as teachers. Because I,

16:44

I, I don't see these

16:44

distinctions. And I don't like

16:52

very fortunate for that. The

16:52

radar has provided me a very

16:58

good sense of when you know what

16:58

you see it, like one of the

17:03

Supreme Court Justice Potter,

17:03

you know, that was sustainless

17:08

quote, about the obscenity act

17:08

of like, when you know it, you

17:11

see it, because it's an

17:11

intangible thing. So when you

17:14

when you when you, when you when

17:14

you see or experience something

17:20

real, you know it, and when you

17:20

see or experience something that

17:25

is has veered off in some way.

17:25

You know, it and I don't think

17:30

that that necessarily lines up

17:30

with doing things exactly

17:35

according to the way that any

17:35

one particular lineage or

17:37

tradition. That's good, you

17:37

know, yeah, just that you do. I,

17:45

in my, I mean, in my practice,

17:45

I've benefited immensely because

17:48

I feel such a strong, intuitive sense

17:50

of what I'm, what I'm doing,

18:01

over how I'm doing it. And I

18:01

feel as though I offer my

18:07

students the

18:11

space to develop that for

18:11

themselves. So that I'm teaching

18:16

them rather than just

18:16

instructing them. Yes. And I'm

18:20

not even convinced that yoga can

18:20

be taught.

18:25

And well, that's a good plan.

18:25

Can yoga actually even be

18:29

taught? will try to teach people

18:34

like, on the same level of like,

18:34

how do I teach happiness?

18:41

Yeah, right. Like,

18:44

you're either happy or not, but

18:44

how do you teach someone to be

18:46

happy? So you feel yoga has that

18:46

sort of instinctual element

18:51

that? Okay, I have a question

18:51

for you, then if imagine you're

18:57

on a deserted island. And you

18:57

like one thing, when I started

19:02

doing some Buddhist style

19:02

meditation courses and trainings

19:05

and retreats and stuff, there

19:05

was this concept that Buddha

19:08

taught that anybody can achieve

19:08

awakening. And that you know,

19:15

it's something that any human or

19:15

you know, anyone has the option

19:19

to do. And I loved that idea

19:19

that potentially your eye or

19:24

somebody, someone can sit under

19:24

a tree or something along that

19:28

lines and, and have an awakening

19:28

experience, regardless of our

19:33

background, our history, our all

19:33

these different things. We could

19:37

go down classifications, but

19:37

then when I think of something

19:41

like say, if I was on a deserted

19:41

island, and someone's and I had

19:46

this idea, I want to learn

19:46

Spanish or a foreign language. I

19:52

wouldn't really be able to learn

19:52

it unless I actually came in

19:57

contact with someone that did

19:57

know that language Like, I don't

20:01

know that I'd be able to pull a

20:01

foreign language out of thin

20:04

air. Maybe someone argue with me

20:04

like some super high Rishi

20:07

person would be like, No, you

20:07

actually can't do that. But do

20:11

so I guess what I'm trying to

20:11

get at is do you think a teacher

20:14

is necessary for yoga? Or do you

20:14

think it's more important or to

20:18

get more legitimate or authentic

20:18

that we just really have to seek

20:23

within to figure it out? Or good question. I do think a

20:27

teacher is necessary. Right. And

20:32

I've been a little bit teacher

20:32

lift myself for some time now.

20:34

So I do you think the teacher is

20:34

necessary? Yeah. I feel, I guess

20:43

the way that I think about that

20:43

is strange, I guess I think

20:50

about it in a strange way. I was

20:50

a political consultant for about

20:54

10 years before I started

20:54

teaching full time. So I still

20:57

kind of think about things in

20:57

terms of like persuasion.

21:01

And I kind of pause you, you're

21:01

a political consultant. Is that

21:05

what you said? Yes. Can you describe the media

21:06

consultant? Do you define what a political

21:08

consultant does?

21:12

Yeah. Well, I worked in

21:12

Washington, DC and La time, and

21:20

I will I provided the strategic

21:20

framework for issues, campaigns,

21:31

advertising, messaging, and then

21:31

it was also causes that weren't

21:37

a political nonprofit. Gotcha.

21:37

Like the Gates Foundation, the

21:41

United Nations. You know, when

21:41

if campaigns like, the United

21:46

Nations had Nothing But Nets,

21:46

campaigns and anti Malaria

21:49

campaign, things like that

21:49

providing like messaging

21:53

strategic framework. Thank you.

21:53

I was a writer of copywriters,

21:57

stuff like that. A speech writer

21:57

in general, strategic Media

22:01

Communications. Consultant

22:01

operative work. Wow.

22:07

Straight Yeah, you didn't have to, like a serious

22:08

job project. A little bit what I

22:12

mean, when I'm like, I did not choose this this token. These are two seemingly

22:15

different paths. But all right,

22:18

I don't want to interrupt you.

22:18

But I just wanted to make sure I

22:21

was on the right page. Yeah. Well, I mean, they are

22:22

very different paths in a lot of

22:25

ways. But some, the same

22:25

compulsion that I had. Not not,

22:31

I'm not naive enough to think

22:31

that working in politics is

22:34

pure, but the same compulsion

22:34

that I had to help and

22:39

participate and engage and

22:39

progress and do something. If

22:47

they, to me feel like it feels

22:47

like a theme urge within me, in

22:52

a lot of ways, somewhat of a

22:52

fire to, you know, elevate the

23:00

vibration. Yes, yes. And in the

23:00

within that you found an

23:04

individual level now, which in a

23:04

way is, you know, less

23:07

prestigious, socially, but a lot

23:07

more impactful to me. And to

23:12

them, I think, in the long run,

23:12

working with one person at a

23:16

time, helping one person at a

23:16

time, letting them help me the

23:23

collective healing that goes on

23:23

how we're all moving down this

23:28

path together and pass it is,

23:28

you know, this is our path that

23:32

isn't on everyone's path, but

23:32

they don't seem that different

23:34

to me in terms of just getting

23:34

to know myself, and were the

23:38

things that have always driven

23:38

me. But they are very different.

23:42

And I get a lot of funny looks

23:42

when I say that. That's what I

23:45

used to do. Yeah, but yeah. That

23:45

was a tangent. I was answering

23:52

your question, which is, which

23:52

is fine. I'm coming up, you're

23:56

interested. We can talk more

23:56

about that. But I'll bring in

23:58

your question about needing a

23:58

teacher and the desert island, I

24:00

suppose. I just feel as though

24:00

when I look at my practice, the

24:08

Ashtanga lineage. And my role as

24:08

a teacher I see most of what

24:15

we're doing to just be tech like

24:15

tactical. I see the hoses and

24:22

the sequence to be backticks in

24:22

the project of Ashtanga Yoga to

24:31

be the strategy and you need

24:31

teachers for those things,

24:38

right? You need lineage for

24:38

those things. That's kind of

24:41

like the that's the that's the

24:41

container that those things

24:44

provide. But the you know the

24:44

objective Ahmadi leads to the

24:51

the goal is ultimately you know,

24:51

ego death and non dual like

24:55

those things when you're when

24:55

you're really when you've taken

24:58

the framework and the content

24:58

Mirror, which is really just

25:01

this gigantic experiment and

25:01

observing the nature of that all

25:04

things are always changing. When

25:04

you you need a teacher for that,

25:12

yeah. When you've superseded

25:12

those things, that's where I

25:17

don't know that you can be

25:17

taught, like, I don't know that

25:20

you can be taught anything past

25:20

the, the, you know, the tactical

25:26

and strategic framework, but

25:26

those things require teachers,

25:29

and they require teachers who

25:29

have some sense of what comes

25:36

after that, even if they've

25:36

never, you know, Lamoni, just

25:39

some idea of where we're headed,

25:39

and why we're headed in that

25:43

direction. And that's why I

25:43

think these things are just not

25:46

interchangeable. But you know,

25:46

Ashtanga is one method. It's a

25:50

good method. It's not the only

25:50

method. Yoga is one method. It's

25:55

a good method. It's not the only

25:55

method. So I guess I don't see

26:00

any of this as the answer. Good answer. Yeah, I think that

26:03

was a really good answer. I like

26:08

the way they kind of pointed out

26:08

the tactic and the strategy.

26:11

Yeah, that can be taught.

26:11

Definitely someone can help you

26:14

with that. But the deeper inner

26:14

workings, that makes sense, do

26:19

the framework has to be taught Absolutely. Yeah. And

26:20

pass down, you know, that's,

26:23

then it's a semantical

26:23

distinction, right? Like, the

26:27

role of the teacher like, well,

26:27

it's just, I'm just a conduit.

26:31

I'm a conduit of AI, it runs

26:31

through me, and there's

26:33

something unique in my

26:33

experience that I have to offer,

26:36

when I pass it on it, my job is

26:36

to take something that I got

26:40

from someone, and then find

26:40

another way to get it to someone

26:45

else. Yes. Maybe that's

26:45

teaching. But maybe it's just

26:51

sharing like that. Filtering?

26:56

I don't know, do you think we

26:56

could change the terminology

27:00

yoga teacher training to like a

27:00

yoga sharing training? Would

27:04

that be a good way? Like, if we were to try to look for a different? I keep thinking about

27:06

this all the time. We, I

27:10

personally, my wife and I, we

27:10

have a studio, we do yoga

27:14

teacher trainings, and I know

27:14

there's like so much to talk

27:16

about just that whole idea and

27:16

concept. But and then when I

27:21

think well, what if we change it

27:21

to say, a yoga sharing training,

27:25

I just don't know that anybody

27:25

would show up. So I get caught

27:27

in this little, like quandary of

27:27

like, I've got to call it that,

27:31

because that's what everybody's

27:31

been trained to look for. You

27:35

know what I mean? Yeah. That's

27:35

like the the buzzword that what

27:39

I really want to invest my time

27:39

in something that's like a yoga

27:42

sharing program, or a yoga, you

27:42

know, what I mean? Like, how you

27:45

keep the doors open? I'm sure there's, there's

27:47

definitely there's that that's gonna come,

27:48

you know, no, no shade. That's

27:51

how that is the that is the

27:51

structure is it's a it's a, it's

27:56

a bit of a flaw in, in the

27:56

setup. Yeah. And that's not, you

28:02

know, that's, that's no one

28:02

studios responsibility to solve.

28:07

Yeah, unless you have some angel

28:07

donor. Pay your bills, you know,

28:13

that I don't know, it's, I could

28:13

talk through what I think some

28:16

sort of ideal would be, but it's

28:16

not. We don't live in an ideal

28:20

world. And also, it's so I don't

28:20

I don't know, I don't know, like

28:24

Judith last or someone who has

28:24

just for years been really

28:30

advocating for, like a very

28:30

formalized educational system,

28:38

akin to bachelor's, master's,

28:38

PhD. Yeah. Yes. teaching

28:45

classes, bachelor, you need that

28:45

much education. When you're

28:49

dealing with therapeutics, things like that. Those are specializations. I understand

28:50

that instinct. But something

28:54

about that is also very

28:54

sanitary. I mean, this is not

28:57

dental hygenist work. In order,

28:57

it's something also about the

29:02

way that if you look, I don't

29:02

you know, you could share with

29:08

me if you want teachers that

29:08

have really embodied whatever it

29:13

is about them that spoke to you

29:13

that I don't feel like most of

29:17

these people, like, went to a

29:17

career fair and decided like,

29:22

this is what I want to do and

29:22

then paint by numbers. I'm going

29:25

to do this I'm going to set up

29:25

my I'm going to get myself my

29:29

name out there. I'm gonna watch

29:29

you know, now I don't this is

29:34

not a criticism of the people

29:34

who invest money in a training

29:40

for a trade and then have to try

29:40

to turn that into something

29:43

that's the world that we live

29:43

in. That's how any other trading

29:47

training system would work. You

29:47

do it for a job. But there's

29:52

something about that that

29:52

eliminates that whatever it is

29:57

that like the people who T It's,

29:57

it's because it's their dharma.

30:03

You know, it's because their

30:03

practice became something that

30:07

they, like they just had to or

30:07

had some unique ability to

30:12

disseminate. Yeah, that's a good

30:12

point. So I don't I don't know.

30:15

But that doesn't leave. That

30:15

doesn't leave anyone with any

30:20

answers. I agree. And I think, I don't

30:21

know, I think a certain level of

30:24

maturity that comes with wisdom

30:24

is that we kind of understand

30:28

that there won't be an answer. I

30:28

tried to get per needed to solve

30:32

an answer. I knew there's no way

30:32

we're gonna get to the answer.

30:34

But I do like trying, you know,

30:34

and even though I kind of know,

30:39

I know, we're not going to get

30:39

there. Or maybe we will maybe,

30:43

maybe, maybe we will, maybe we

30:43

will. You know, when I first

30:46

came across, the stronger and I

30:46

had been, I had taken yoga

30:50

teacher training with Bikram in

30:50

La Cienega Boulevard, oh, my

30:53

gosh, back in 2001. And that was

30:53

like, torture chamber. And so

30:58

then I took an easier path and

30:58

went to Mysore. Just joking,

31:02

that was an easier and when I

31:02

got to Mysore, I saw this system

31:08

of where there was no teacher

31:08

training, and it was like you

31:10

just came and you practiced, and

31:10

eventually, if you seemed

31:14

worthy, you'd be authorized or

31:14

you know, certified. But then,

31:19

and I thought, Oh, that looks

31:19

like a very great way to do it.

31:22

But then I started hearing other

31:22

people are like, Yeah, but man,

31:25

I've been going to India for

31:25

like 15 years, and I keep doing

31:28

everything I'm supposed to do.

31:28

But they just don't like me. And

31:31

so they just won't let me they

31:31

won't give me that piece. And I

31:33

thought, well, that doesn't

31:33

sound so great either. You know

31:36

what I mean? So I like I see. I

31:36

will seek if somehow those two

31:40

things could be merged together.

31:40

And I do think they are merged

31:43

together. Because I feel like

31:43

like what you're doing, you're

31:46

teaching from your heart, you're

31:46

teaching what you've learned,

31:48

and you're just teaching and you're not really worrying about, oh, I've got this piece

31:50

of paper and this accreditation

31:53

at this point, you're just like,

31:53

let me just get involved with

31:56

these folks and help them out as

31:56

best I can. Any thoughts around

32:01

those ideas? Well, I think at two to two

32:04

thoughts, I'll work in reverse

32:07

order. I think any, any wisdom

32:07

tradition of any kind, within

32:15

yoga, or any faith based

32:15

tradition. It sits on a layer of

32:25

ignorance. The wisdom is there.

32:25

But nothing is pure, that there

32:33

is so much wisdom to a system

32:33

that invites people to just come

32:38

and to come enough that they

32:38

then are qualified. Yeah. But as

32:44

you point out, there's there's

32:44

ignorance to that there's so

32:46

much wisdom to a six day a week

32:46

consistent, Ashtanga practice.

32:54

There's also quite a bit of

32:54

ignorance to that. And I think

32:57

both are okay. I think both are

32:57

okay. I think it's okay to be

33:01

okay. With. Yeah, that the blind

33:01

spots too. It's, it's good to

33:07

acknowledge them. I think you're

33:07

you get in trouble. I mean,

33:09

that's when the dogma comes up.

33:09

Right, like a dog dog was an

33:12

autoimmune disease. It's just

33:12

killing the thing it's trying to

33:15

defend. Just killing what it's

33:15

trying to protect.

33:19

I heard that before. Well, I have no immunity. So

33:21

maybe I just thought it that.

33:25

It's true that if you do you do have

33:25

autumn? Yeah. Oh, wow. Yeah,

33:30

yeah, I have a bunch of. So I'm always kind of

33:31

fascinated by that idea. Oh, so

33:35

glad you mentioned the body of

33:35

my body is killing myself trying

33:38

to not killing myself that

33:38

really hyperbolic my body is in

33:44

attempt to try to protect

33:44

itself, it's creating all sorts

33:48

of aggravations. And that that

33:48

is how I see dogma in any system

33:53

is, tensions are in the right

33:53

place, but it is killing the

33:56

thing it's trying to protect, or

33:56

suffocating it or something, you

34:00

know, or not allowing it to

34:00

flourish in its fullest. Maybe

34:02

you're not killing it. But so

34:02

yeah, so I guess I feel like

34:06

there's there is, there is no

34:06

right way. Which, you know,

34:12

reverse that to your original

34:12

jumping off point about trying

34:17

to get answers. Where, you know,

34:17

there are no answers. I have

34:19

this theory that practitioners

34:19

can be broad or we can speak

34:25

specifically to the Shang like

34:25

Ashtanga practitioners, which I

34:30

do think is different when we're

34:30

talking about the modern yoga

34:32

world. There's a very big

34:32

difference between an Ashtanga

34:35

practitioner and a very devoted

34:35

practitioner of another kind

34:38

because there's this really

34:38

heavy burden on the student this

34:43

when this is your practice,

34:43

because the word practice really

34:47

does mean a different thing

34:47

within the Ashtanga tradition,

34:51

as it does in the other yoga

34:51

lineages. And I am convinced

34:56

that anyone who start and

34:56

continues down that path is not

35:03

actually looking for answers.

35:03

They are 100% comfortable with

35:07

questions for the sake of

35:07

questions. Because you couldn't

35:13

be someone who needs an answer,

35:13

you wouldn't keep coming.

35:18

Oh, that's a great point. I've

35:18

been thinking about this a lot

35:21

lately. That's a really good point. And yeah, if you're

35:24

in it, it makes perfect sense.

35:30

It's like, yeah, if you walked

35:30

out and you saw a bunch of

35:34

people in a field, digging

35:34

holes, and then they went home,

35:38

and they came back, and the next

35:38

day, they're digging the same

35:40

hole again. And then the next

35:40

day, there's like a few more

35:43

people and then digging that dig

35:43

and dig and walk by and they

35:45

would say, what are they doing?

35:45

They must be looking for

35:48

something. What's under there,

35:48

they're looking for something

35:51

clearly, and they start asking him, the people digging the holes every day, you know the

35:53

answer on their terms, because

35:56

you know, you keep digging long

35:56

enough, you're gonna hit your

35:59

spring a while you're gonna

35:59

strike gold, you're gonna find

36:02

oil, things are gonna happen.

36:02

And then you can answer this.

36:05

Well, this is why I'm doing this

36:05

is why I'm doing this. Those

36:08

people who don't under the oh,

36:08

there's a reason there's a

36:10

reason they're digging, they're

36:10

digging because of XY and Z. But

36:14

the people who keep digging on

36:14

some fundamental level, they

36:18

know the only reason they're

36:18

digging is just to get a little

36:20

deeper. Because once they've

36:20

struck gold, they don't stop.

36:26

You just keep digging, you're

36:26

gonna hit a root. And then

36:29

you're gonna, you know, fight

36:29

like it just it's but but it's

36:34

but it's so hard to explain that

36:34

to people who don't have that

36:37

same need for no answer for no.

36:37

You know, that whatever that

36:42

person's the pursuit of that

36:42

practice that absorption and the

36:47

infinite, like, what are you

36:47

doing? What are you taking for,

36:50

like, you're digging to get

36:50

deeper? That's the answer. But

36:54

it's not satisfying. So we put

36:54

it in the terms of the world and

36:58

productivity, you know, things

36:58

happening with meditation

37:00

practices, like you better

37:00

sleep, you know, clarity of

37:04

thoughts, like we were trying to

37:04

put, we're trying to design the

37:09

reasons that people do these

37:09

practices. When people who do

37:11

these practices on some level

37:11

they know, they just do them to

37:14

do them. There's something

37:14

there. It's just not an answer.

37:20

Oh, my gosh, Meredith, that is

37:20

so cool. I have never had that

37:26

visual painted for me like that.

37:26

And I think like, even if we

37:30

just got off to the conversation

37:30

right now, I got enough to like,

37:33

just dig in my own like

37:33

thinking. Yeah, right. That is

37:39

so great. Because like when I

37:39

when I think about this jungle

37:42

room, and you see people, we

37:42

just keep going in there over

37:45

and over and over and doing it

37:45

and doing it. And you're right,

37:48

like, what, what are we doing,

37:48

but I do think that personally,

37:52

I definitely am extremely drawn

37:52

to. I'm going to dig because I'm

37:57

going to find something. So

37:57

wait, let me just make sure I

38:00

have this right. So are you

38:00

thinking that

38:04

I'm just riffing. So this is

38:04

good. I said, Good. Clean the

38:07

metaphor. All right. All right. Cool. It's

38:08

positive that if you were if we

38:12

Okay, so two different ways we

38:12

could dig one, I can dig just

38:16

simply to dig or two, I can dig

38:16

because I'm digging for

38:21

something. And so I did I get

38:21

that you're thinking that we

38:25

have to be digging for a reason,

38:25

or else we just won't dig. So

38:29

then I wonder what digging

38:29

without?

38:31

I think there's I think the

38:31

reason is because every time you

38:35

dig, you go deeper. Yeah, it's the deeper the depth,

38:37

deeper.

38:40

What are you? Why are you

38:40

digging to go deeper, go deeper,

38:42

not necessarily looking for gold

38:42

for a root for Samadhi for non

38:46

dualism, but you'll hit those things you'll

38:47

get there. But you know, those

38:50

are fleeting, even Samadhi is

38:50

not a permanent state. One day

38:55

you go back the next day. Yeah.

38:55

Thinking about doing the

38:59

laundry. She didn't stop going.

38:59

You didn't stop going. You know,

39:05

try to try to narrow the the

39:05

target so that you pass through

39:10

it more often and stay for

39:10

longer. I

39:13

know where I'm gonna end up when I keep digging. China I don't know that you were

39:16

a kid. I still think that if I

39:22

was such a nice that was an 80s

39:24

thing. Like you're just you if

39:27

you dig down you're gonna get to

39:27

China. Like it was gonna say

39:30

that and then I was like, that's weird. No, no, no, what I'm talking exactly what I was just

39:32

thinking when I was saying I was

39:35

like which is a really that's a

39:37

really interesting point, right?

39:40

Because I mean, we are going to,

39:40

we are going to, oh gosh, this

39:48

is gonna push buttons but I mean

39:48

if we that's a whole nother

39:51

subject that the world's

39:51

superpowers we're all going to

39:55

either a collide or be coalesce

39:55

some way or both will be combo

40:01

of collision and cold

40:01

coalescing. But that might take

40:05

us more down. I don't think

40:05

that's political. Another

40:08

question since you mentioned that you're a political correspondent. How can how can

40:10

it okay, you're a yoga teacher

40:15

and so you know how heated

40:15

everything is. And so, let's not

40:19

like let anybody know what our

40:19

politics are. No one has to know

40:22

what we think about any of that.

40:22

But how as a teacher, do you

40:26

approach keepings equanimity? In

40:26

the yoga Shahla when politics

40:37

comes up being a political

40:37

correspondent thinking you had

40:40

to have dug in deep, I can't

40:40

even say digging in deep

40:43

anymore, because we're gonna

40:43

keep going to that analogy, but

40:46

weird my. I love it. I love that

40:46

was awesome. What? How do

40:50

you married to a man who doesn't

40:50

understand any of this? So he's

40:53

always like, What do you mean?

40:53

was saying things like were you

40:57

running to? I saw that funny joke. Like, the

40:59

only reason I would run is like,

41:02

who's chasing me like, wow,

41:02

yeah. Well, what do you want?

41:04

What do you say that to my students

41:05

all the time, whenever they're

41:07

like, tripped up at they want to

41:07

pose too much. Or whenever fear

41:12

or aversion comes into the asana

41:12

practice, I say nothing to run

41:16

to nothing to run from. Like,

41:16

that's what I tell them. Anyway,

41:21

Politics does not come up in our

41:21

shot. It doesn't. It's an

41:23

interesting question, for sure.

41:23

I'm trying to think just

41:26

academically about how I would

41:26

handle it. It hasn't very much

41:30

for me. Or might what might be

41:30

true is I might be very ignorant

41:35

to that it has and because most

41:35

of the people in Los Angeles and

41:38

most of the people in a yoga

41:38

community are assumed to have

41:44

alignment that maybe it does

41:44

come up and it's like explaining

41:49

water to a fish. Maybe I'm not

41:49

aware when it maybe I'm not

41:52

aware of what it would feel like

41:52

to someone who might not be of

41:54

the same persuasion. Because to

41:54

me, I'm like my answers like it

41:58

never happened. But maybe it has

41:58

and maybe maybe it hasn't maybe

42:02

it hasn't been good answer. That's cool.

42:03

Acknowledged. That's cool.

42:06

I feel like it's a little bit

42:06

more right now with global

42:10

politics that seemed a little

42:10

bit stickier. Just because we

42:15

are, we are a truly diverse

42:15

challah. In all of the ways

42:19

like, that's not. Yeah, I love

42:19

to hear in every way you can

42:25

imagine the word diversity being

42:25

defined, we fit that bill. So

42:32

there might be a little bit more

42:32

tension. I feel like right

42:34

around that, but it hasn't come

42:34

up. And I don't know of anyone

42:38

who has felt like they are not.

42:38

Welcome. Cool. As a result. You

42:43

didn't go there? We're not We're

42:43

not activists. Yeah.

42:47

Yeah. Smart. mean,

42:50

I don't even know promising. And I have the same thing in politics. That's awesome. Which

42:52

is, which I kind of like, right,

42:55

like we're very in addition to,

42:55

you know, being colleagues,

42:59

we're very close friends. We

42:59

talk every day we talk about

43:04

okay, like everything, but we

43:04

don't talk politics. So I'm not

43:07

I can't even be certain that we agree. I like that. That's really cool.

43:09

Yeah, it's a safe space. It's

43:12

like, look, let's just focus on

43:12

what we're here for currently.

43:16

You know what I'm finding

43:16

interesting, because for those

43:18

of you listening, if you haven't

43:18

listened to the, it's like,

43:21

maybe, I don't know, like eight

43:21

or so episodes back, Bernie de

43:24

Varshney. And so that's,

43:24

Meredith, you teach at the same

43:29

studio. So that's how I got a chance to meet you. Because I asked her if she could recommend

43:30

somebody. And she said, Well,

43:33

actually, I can. America is

43:33

amazing. You got to talk to her.

43:36

So um, but it's really cool to

43:36

hear two sides of the story from

43:40

the same place. Um, enjoy. I

43:40

think that's a neat and I think,

43:45

Nick, when, like you said,

43:45

sometimes programs operate

43:48

better if there's like, one cook

43:48

in the kitchen. And you it

43:52

sounds like you both had been

43:52

able to have two cooks in the

43:55

kitchen. What else? What else

43:55

are you observing in your

44:01

studio? What works with totally

44:02

different background?

44:05

Styles to like, yeah, pretty remarkable how

44:07

well it works. That's cool. The

44:07

common thread being of children,

44:10

it sounds like I know, there's probably a lot of common threads, but you both are

44:12

attempting to raise your

44:15

children, young children and be

44:15

yoga teachers at the same time,

44:18

which is a challenge. Parenting

44:18

and working, I think any job

44:24

full time or just working

44:24

period, as a parent is

44:27

challenging. So let me take you

44:27

down that track. What as a

44:31

parent, what what are you

44:31

noticing these days raising

44:35

children? What are some of the

44:35

things you've bumped up against?

44:39

In terms of challenge and or

44:39

joy? Or both?

44:45

What is it there's a book a

44:45

parenting book? Maybe five or 10

44:49

years old now? I think that the

44:49

title was all joy and no fun.

44:58

That was the title. Oh joy. Listen for that. That's

44:58

good. It's a lot of joy.

45:06

Oh, joy. That's great. It's a,

45:06

it's a pretty good way to talk

45:11

about parenting because it's debates are joyful, but

45:13

it's not fun. I have no

45:18

relationship with fun on my life

45:18

right now.

45:21

Children How old? Two, four and seven.

45:25

Holy Moses. Yeah. Two forms.

45:25

Yeah, yeah.

45:28

Yeah. So they're each about two

45:28

years apart. My oldest two are

45:33

about a little over two years

45:33

apart. So I had three children

45:37

within four years. And it was

45:37

straddled the pandemic. It was

45:41

wild. Which the pandemic went on

45:41

for a long time in LA.

45:47

Yes, yes. I'm really,

45:50

very, I think when we're very

45:50

close family, because of it,

45:53

like very tight knit the five of us. That's yeah, yep.

45:58

Amazing. So yeah, so what, I'll

45:58

throw one at you, and then that

46:03

you come back with something I,

46:03

my son is 17. My daughter is 10.

46:08

And my wife yesterday, flew up

46:08

to take care of her mom who had

46:14

an injury recently. So she's

46:14

helping out for weeks. So this

46:16

is my first official week alone

46:16

with the kids now granted my

46:21

son's 17 And my daughter's 10.

46:21

So that's, there's a amazing

46:25

dynamic that keeps progressing

46:25

here has you know, but I would

46:29

say it's a little easier for me

46:29

than if you if you're, if you

46:32

left the three of them with your

46:32

husband. Today. like it'd be,

46:36

it's a different story. We have

46:36

a two year old 217 year old but

46:39

and so I, my wife did a great

46:39

job of like, getting all of the

46:46

food for each day for each lunch

46:46

packed up neat and nice. And she

46:51

made up a list of like, okay, on

46:51

Monday, this is happening and

46:53

make sure she remembers this.

46:53

And on Tuesday, he has that make

46:57

sure you got this and she got a

46:57

bunch of meals ready, like so.

47:00

She set me up for major success.

47:00

Right? So yesterday was my like,

47:05

official first day and my

47:05

daughter last night was

47:08

definitely, you know, crying and

47:08

emotional and really missing

47:12

mom. And so there's a little bit

47:12

like, I really appreciate that

47:16

because I think Mom, mom is mom,

47:16

like how can you can't I'm not

47:23

saying I compete to be on equal

47:23

level with mom. So she was

47:27

crying, saying, Dad, I'm so

47:27

sorry that I'm crying and I'm

47:29

making you feel bad because I'm

47:29

saying I miss mom. And it's

47:32

because I kept saying like,

47:32

Well, I'm here. I'm here for

47:35

you. I'm here for you. And and

47:35

so, uh huh. Oh my gosh, you

47:40

know, joyful because I love him

47:40

so much. But, and I wouldn't say

47:45

it was like, super challenging,

47:45

but I definitely you know, it

47:50

pulls the heart in such a way

47:50

that it's just, it's just

47:54

amazing. You know, it's

47:54

challenging and amazing at the

47:56

same time. I don't know if that

47:56

got your wheels to spin any

48:00

direction. Like you get you going on

48:03

something amazing.

48:10

I mean, I feel beholden to my

48:10

children in the way that I never

48:14

have or would have expected or

48:14

wanted to be beholden to

48:17

anything in my life. And I feel

48:17

like that is a great gift. And

48:20

also something I'm sometimes

48:20

very resentful of. Because even

48:23

when the world allows me to take

48:23

space, I don't want to and don't

48:30

know how to and as someone who's

48:30

done a very good job of trying

48:35

to, you know, be both within the

48:35

world, the of the world and not

48:42

in the world and of the world.

48:42

And sort of like not, you know,

48:45

I've never get back to our

48:45

bullshit sniffing out thing.

48:50

Like, I've always kind of been a

48:50

little bit of a freedom fighter

48:53

wanting to kind of like, No, you

48:53

know, no one I'm coming, no one

48:58

I'm going maintain that.

48:58

Fluidity for my own experience

49:06

and things like I've lost that

49:06

entirely. With my children. I

49:10

don't have any. I don't have any

49:10

sense of separate self around

49:15

them. But I think that's a

49:15

season, right? My kids are very

49:19

young, and getting less young.

49:19

And I think that it'll be

49:25

actually a rough transition.

49:25

It's just been so intense for so

49:28

long. It's just the kind of it

49:28

is kind of the season that I'm

49:31

in and I just have my children

49:31

later, like so many, you know,

49:37

millennials have done and that's

49:37

great. I don't I certainly don't

49:44

like encourage people to have

49:44

children younger because I don't

49:46

think that anyone knows how just

49:46

how hard it isn't how much life

49:51

experience maturity you need.

49:51

But there is something that I

49:55

think is somewhat unique to

49:55

people in my little slice of

49:59

volume. This is when my children

49:59

are done being young and needing

50:03

me. I am like, on middle lane.

50:03

Like, there's not sort of like

50:11

No, like everyone's looking

50:11

towards retirement at that

50:13

point, like the idea of like,

50:13

starting a larger project, which

50:17

I've always kind of, like I was

50:17

upgrading projects and, and

50:21

things going on that I'm like, I

50:21

don't know, Are these real

50:25

things? Are these tinkering

50:25

things? Because what, when they

50:28

truly don't need me around the

50:28

clock like they do? Like, I

50:33

don't know, I'm kind of tired. I

50:33

want to relax a little bit. Yes,

50:39

but you know, I don't know, I

50:39

really I would teach more, I

50:43

would teach a lot more. That's

50:43

what I will do I have to do,

50:46

we're adding to that, you know,

50:46

not yet announced but we're

50:49

adding we're gonna pilot an

50:49

afternoon Mysore program was

50:52

trying to add some things to

50:52

offer our community more

50:55

opportunities to practice

50:55

because now my kids are at the

50:57

age where I can bring them with

50:57

me, give them little Sesame

51:00

Street and we run like didar

51:00

Charlotte is very family

51:03

friendly. So if we need to bring

51:03

our kids we want our kids this

51:06

the only way it works. So we

51:06

really have like a community

51:09

center vibe and that way. So

51:09

things are starting to like free

51:13

up and that's good. That's good

51:13

for everyone involved. I feel

51:19

like parent I feel like

51:19

parenting. In these times. I

51:27

think in your your opening you

51:27

just asked for like, you know, a

51:32

unique challenge. I am

51:32

constantly feeling the I took I

51:39

want to say this all the time

51:39

and no one. I don't know if

51:42

anyone else feels this way or if

51:42

anyone makes this connection.

51:46

But this video, the pressure to

51:46

be present with your children is

51:56

is is under assault every 30

51:56

seconds, because I am on 25

52:03

group text chains. I have a text

52:03

chain. I have text chains that

52:08

are like preschool moms, then

52:08

three different groups of text

52:12

chains within the preschool

52:12

moms. And then I got another one

52:14

started today. That's for one

52:14

kid. In addition to work stuff,

52:20

family stuff, all the friends

52:20

from down the street to

52:27

childhood. And then the only one

52:27

that can't seem to keep up with

52:32

us. I swear I'm the only person

52:32

if I after this, I will send you

52:35

a screengrab of my phone. I

52:35

think I have like, my husband

52:41

was the type of person who's

52:41

like, he's very project manager

52:45

type, like he can handle 1000

52:45

things that come to him in a

52:47

day. No big deal. And I'm like,

52:47

I just want to sit around like

52:51

think all day. I'm like a big

52:51

picture. Big picture, visionary

52:56

type. I'm not very good at

52:56

implementing things. But I feel

53:01

like I'm under assault all day

53:01

long. With the with the

53:05

expectation of staying in

53:05

contact with people. And I find

53:11

it to be impossible. And I get

53:11

flack from all of my friends.

53:17

They sometimes play games where

53:17

they will text and then they

53:21

will set bets on how long it

53:21

will take for me to text them

53:24

back. Oh my god, like I like I

53:24

get punked by them all the time.

53:27

They're like play like I'm so

53:27

bad. So I don't know how people

53:31

are staying on top of it and

53:31

also trying to be present with

53:35

their children. So that seems to

53:35

me like a unique. It's not,

53:41

maybe it's not a problem for

53:41

everyone. But I actually I

53:45

conjecture that it is and they

53:45

just don't feel it. As much as I

53:49

feel something about it. I feel

53:49

so oppressive to me. And I don't

53:53

feel like it's real connection.

53:53

But I'm a little bit of a social

53:58

introvert. Like I have lots of

53:58

friends and I like seeing my

54:00

friends. But I get very

54:00

overwhelmed very easily. So not

54:03

that surprising for someone who

54:03

likes to go to a quiet room for

54:06

most of my day with my phone out

54:06

of the way. And I just find it

54:09

to be like a really unique

54:09

challenge today in parenting

54:12

where there's no there's no

54:12

space for solitude, or there's

54:18

no time when you feel like you

54:18

aren't needed by someone else.

54:24

Or in another place. It's it's

54:24

probably an age old problem. It

54:27

just seems to be on steroids.

54:27

And I can't Yeah, I can't I feel

54:32

like I'm constantly falling out

54:32

of the loop. And that doesn't

54:39

feel great. You know, I don't

54:39

feel like I like to be like a

54:41

reliable, dependable person that

54:41

knows what's going on in

54:44

everyone's life. But I don't

54:44

know. That's really the biggest

54:47

challenge for me is not it's not

54:47

even like a larger criticism of

54:50

media like I don't have, you

54:50

know, I let my kids watch little

54:54

TV like I don't have a problem

54:54

with technology in general. It's

54:59

something about the way III that

54:59

we're all communicating in these

55:01

really fractured ways that has

55:01

left me falling further and

55:07

further and further and further

55:07

behind the curve. But, you know,

55:12

I guess when it's all over, I'd

55:12

still rather just hang out with

55:16

my kids when I can. Yes. But if

55:16

my parents listened to this,

55:20

they call me back. For

55:20

voicemail, they're just coming

55:27

in on this. Why are you doing a podcast with

55:28

this guy? You don't even know.

55:31

And you haven't answered your

55:31

voicemails yet.

55:35

But see, this is the

55:35

conversation. No, I'm just

55:38

having fun. With five people. I

55:41

met you today. And I would still

55:41

rather to, you know, that's

55:46

particularly hard for me parenting, I really appreciate you being

55:47

extremely, very honest about

55:51

that, and taking the time to lay

55:51

that out, because I definitely

55:55

feel that too. And I know, those

55:55

of you listening are feeling

56:01

that as well. I'm sorry. I mean,

56:01

it's moving at a speed that is.

56:06

I mean, I'm I'm 50. So, you

56:06

know, I grew up in a totally

56:12

different technological realm.

56:12

And it's crazy to me how

56:16

different it is now. I'm trying

56:16

to embrace it. But at the same

56:20

time, I hear you Maranatha here,

56:20

it's It's wild. I mean,

56:24

personally, at the end of the

56:24

day, I mean, I'll get so tired

56:28

that the thought of like, I

56:28

think I just want to like do

56:30

something with my kids. But I'm

56:30

so exhausted, I just want to I

56:33

have to just lay down, like I

56:33

just have to lay down and so I'm

56:40

with you. I know it's

56:40

challenging. It's a big one.

56:42

It's a real big one. But I guess

56:42

you I know, you know this, and

56:47

I'm not saying I'm out of the

56:47

woods yet. But I guess I was

56:51

gonna say it gets easier. But

56:51

I'd be lying to you. It doesn't

56:55

really get easier. My son. I

56:55

mean, he's driving and oh, my

56:59

gosh, it's a whole nother level

56:59

of like, so, but it does get

57:05

easier. I do think so it's just

57:05

a different type of problem.

57:09

It's just the challenges and the

57:09

problems are just there. They're

57:12

just different and unique. And that's, that's that is that is

57:16

the that is the devotional

57:20

element of the practice, right?

57:20

Is that it to the nature of

57:24

change? It's always changing.

57:24

Like, yeah, it's, it's, uh, you

57:28

know, that, like, change doesn't

57:28

always mean progress. It's gonna

57:33

get harder, it's gonna get easier. It's gonna get harder and easier. I yeah, I've mostly

57:34

just opted out of staying in

57:39

contact with a lot of people, to

57:39

be honest. Thank you. Yeah. And

57:44

I feel like I talked to my own

57:44

my mother who raised us and then

57:49

we were very small, like a small

57:49

mountain town in Colorado. And

57:53

that I'm sure had its own

57:53

isolation and challenges, but I

57:56

like to have this very, like a

57:56

fantasy fair fantasy about. Oh,

58:05

tell me again about how you'd be

58:05

snowed in for months.

58:08

Oh, gosh, right. Oh, gosh, no,

58:08

just just take me to that place.

58:12

Just take me there. My story on

58:12

PTS. I mean, I'm one of those

58:18

people that your point. Truly, I mean, she's more a

58:20

little bit more social than me

58:23

and doesn't you know, but she

58:23

Oh, I'm sure I'm sure was like

58:26

the worst. But for babies in

58:26

blizzards. And I'm like, Oh, my

58:31

God told me. Oh, yeah. Yes,

58:38

I am. My life is good. I have

58:38

far fewer challenges. Than then

58:43

pretty much anyone in any point

58:43

in history. So fine, I hear ya.

58:48

And I get to do you know, I get

58:48

to do this. I get to do this,

58:51

which is not nothing. Oh, my gosh. So on that note, Meredith,

58:53

I know, we're getting really

58:55

close to our hour. So I'm just

58:55

gonna throw one more thing at

58:58

you. Just because I thought it

58:58

was so great. I went on your

59:01

Instagram today, which everybody

59:01

listening. It's Meredith

59:04

underscore Fogg underscore

59:04

Libras. And I'll have that in

59:08

the link. So it'd be easy. You

59:08

can click on it. And two things

59:11

that I love one, you're teaching

59:11

a workshop called a knee Yama

59:16

workshop, but you spelled Ni k n

59:16

e dash Yama, and I like, love

59:21

it. That's creative as heck. So

59:21

classic, a workshop about the

59:25

knees. But then the other little

59:25

meme that you have, there's two

59:28

little cartoon characters and

59:28

one says to the other, what's

59:31

your dream job? And the other

59:31

one says, Why would I dream of

59:34

labor? And they both stare at

59:34

each other? And then the person

59:38

starts walking away and the one

59:38

says, Where are you going? And

59:40

the other one says, to rethink

59:40

my life. And I just cracked up

59:44

because like, yeah, when you're

59:44

overworked, you're like, my

59:46

dream job. What pardon me is

59:46

gonna be dreaming about working

59:50

my butt off every day. So

59:53

if you look underneath that one

59:53

with my my coffee, my caption, I

59:58

gotta read. I think it says No

59:58

one to no one in particular

1:00:01

posting with no one specific

1:00:01

person in mind at Libras yeah

1:00:05

so very passive aggressive side

1:00:05

of my workaholic husband haha

1:00:13

there's more to the story more.

1:00:13

Oh yeah there's so much there's

1:00:16

so many layers I wouldn't I did

1:00:16

not pick that up I when I read

1:00:20

the caption below I was like I

1:00:20

don't get it that's what she's

1:00:23

talking about but I didn't click

1:00:23

like I didn't click on his his

1:00:26

profile so now the thinking on my husband every

1:00:28

time he goes you know no one understands anything. You're

1:00:30

like us you're very funny but no

1:00:33

but it's not but no one understand that's not what Instagram is for. I was like do

1:00:35

it for me. Like as we started

1:00:39

out like I have a you know, it's

1:00:39

a personality traits flash maybe

1:00:44

defense mechanism? I don't know.

1:00:44

But I am definitely peddling

1:00:48

humor. Like that's how I engage

1:00:48

with the world is how I engage

1:00:51

with people. How I handle

1:00:51

anxiety, social anxiety,

1:00:54

anything is just like being

1:00:54

witty, funny, kind of silver

1:00:59

tongue. So that's like, that's

1:00:59

just how I process everything I

1:01:04

have to have like, a little bit

1:01:04

of tongue in cheek. Well,

1:01:07

then my attitude. My My last

1:01:07

question for you though is how

1:01:10

do you get your friends back

1:01:10

that punk you with the bets

1:01:14

about how long it takes? There's

1:01:14

gotta be a good comeback.

1:01:17

There's got to be something you

1:01:17

could do to comedically respond

1:01:22

to the bets. How long is it

1:01:22

gonna take? It's gonna take her

1:01:26

two days, I'll give up that 20

1:01:26

bucks. It's gonna take her two

1:01:28

days. There's got to be

1:01:28

something I'll try to think of

1:01:31

it when I know when I know they're doing

1:01:32

it. I text back immediately. And

1:01:39

they know they know that I'm

1:01:39

messing with them because

1:01:41

exclamation mark at the end are

1:01:41

like two two exclamation. Kids.

1:01:50

Exclamation marks. So yeah.

1:01:54

This is great into the mind of

1:01:54

there's there's a lot here. I

1:01:58

might have to do a follow up a

1:01:58

follow up podcast with you.

1:02:00

There's I barely scratched the

1:02:00

surface. But But thank you,

1:02:05

Meredith, so much for taking

1:02:05

time out of your busy day. I

1:02:09

know you got away from the city

1:02:09

or the country now. And so

1:02:12

hopefully you have a awesome

1:02:12

moon day tomorrow.

1:02:18

No, it's great. I'm heading up

1:02:18

to Santa Barbara to practice

1:02:20

with Steve dwelley. He's a good

1:02:20

teacher up there. Old school

1:02:22

teacher. So great day and adult

1:02:22

conversation. This has been

1:02:27

a fascinating talk to you. Well,

1:02:27

thank you, Meredith. I have

1:02:35

family out there. So next time I

1:02:35

come out, I really want to visit

1:02:38

your studio. So I really look

1:02:38

forward to it. And once again,

1:02:42

thank you so much, and I will be

1:02:42

in touch.

1:02:46

You should absolutely come we

1:02:46

have the best thing going there

1:02:49

and it's all organic. We don't

1:02:49

we don't really market or

1:02:53

promote or anything and we wind

1:02:53

up just it has just worked and

1:02:57

that is the price credit for

1:02:57

eight. You know, I've been with

1:02:59

her for the past three years or

1:02:59

so. But Shahla is a very

1:03:03

uniquely, it runs on integrity.

1:03:03

It really does hurt her

1:03:10

contribution to the community is

1:03:10

incredible. And I'm just it has

1:03:16

changed my life to get to be,

1:03:16

you know, there and doing the

1:03:21

thing, but I can't seem to quit

1:03:21

teaching yoga. Yeah, we would

1:03:28

love to have you. Thank you so much, Meredith. All

1:03:30

right. I'm gonna make a call to

1:03:32

do it. All right. Have a great

1:03:32

have a great practice tomorrow.

1:03:36

Thanks. Bye bye. Native yoga taught cast is

1:03:46

produced by myself. The theme

1:03:49

music is dreamed up by Bryce

1:03:49

Allen. If you liked this show,

1:03:54

let me know if there's room for

1:03:54

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1:03:58

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1:04:02

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or topics, please send us your

1:04:07

thoughts to info at Native yoga

1:04:13

center. You can find us at

1:04:13

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1:04:17

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1:04:17

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