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Music.

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Glatzel and you are listening to the needy podcast.

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Here at needy we are devoted to sharing Frank conversations and true stories about what it means to meet your needs consistently messily and sustainably.

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To get more information about today's episode please visit the needy podcast.com now on today's show.

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Music.

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Hello everyone welcome back to the knee podcast.

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Today I'm going to be talking about my I was about to say one of my favorite topics but the truth is it is one of my least favorite.

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Experiences it's something that I've really been not just struggling with but like,

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of just really bowled over by over the course of the last year although if I trace it back I can definitely see the roots of this unraveling coming in earlier stages and you'll understand what I mean when I dive into it.

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But it is one of my favorite things to talk about because I think there is.

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So much freedom and so much spaciousness once we begin to divest from,

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some of the ways that we are keeping ourselves closed off the places where we might be telling ourselves yeah sure that whole Humanity thing is good and well for all those other people but not for me right that terminal specialness of,

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I am somehow other than what I would wish for for other people.

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So what were specifically talking about today is the way that Perfection and perfectionism becomes interwoven with professionalism.

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Basically this white supremacist capitalist idea patriarchal idea that.

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Showing up and doing a good job looks a certain way and success looks a certain way,

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and that those definitions are by Nature at odds with our needy sweaty bloody little human cells

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this is a topic that is.

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Inherently important for us and you know I've been cracking up lately because there's this kind of overwhelming conversation happening right now about quiet quitting which,

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I am laughing personally because this is something that I have been telling people to do and coaching people to do for well over a decade

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but I obviously needed a really cute name for it I love that idea of quiet quitting,

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and not just quiet quitting our jobs but also facets of our relationships,

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anything that we might be doing in a way that we're holding ourselves to an unbeatable standard or expectation.

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So back to Perfection and professionalism the the way that this has shown up for me over the course of my life is that what it means to do a good job is to be perfectly prepared kind of like well quaffed when you arrive for the gig.

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Having been well rested you know having that being well resource to having that presence of Mind you'll see a lot of people who,

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are doing similar kinds of work on social media talking a lot about being well resource before you do something filling your own cup before you,

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serve others and,

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those are all ideas that I believe in you know I was conditioned in this Society to see doing a good job in a certain way to define success in a certain way in a very narrow scope.

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And the less I'm able to meet those definitions the more over the course of the last year that I have,

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been calling them into question.

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Because what does it mean to carry a definition of doing a good job that you couldn't possibly meet that couldn't possibly include you what does it mean to carry a definition of success that you don't actually want that doesn't actually resonate with you.

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And so in today's episode we are going to have pull apart that,

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terminal specialness where even when we might be buying into these ideas like yes human first yes more space rest yes needs yes.

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All of the things yes yes yes but secretly secretly,

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saying but not you Maura you have to be better than that you have to be more put together than that you have to be somehow other than you are.

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And so your failure.

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And you know I've been talking about this a lot this season how our best and most creative efforts are held hostage,

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by these ideas of perfectionism and how it has to be perfect in order for us to do it then we're never going to do it but if we relax some of those expectations then we may be able to create something magnificent.

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But for this case in particular I want to talk a little bit about what has been going on in my life over the course of the last

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here because this feels like a specific kind of trial that was custom-tailored to for me,

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have you guys watched the good place but it's like this isn't,

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I have been in a very specifically tailored bad place scenario for my own brand of perfectionism and so I have been.

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I asked / forced by my life to contend with these issues in a very real way over the course of the last month's.

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So I've talked about this before but over the course of the last year my partner has been.

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The primary caregiver for a friend of theirs who is significantly ill

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and much of that work have them living outside of our home and I was at home with my two kids who are 6 and 3.

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And during that time of being there sole care provider.

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Also you know the person who runs everything in my house and make sure that you know all of the things both physical labor emotional labor all of those things are well tended to that was all me,

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in addition to which, I have been working on my book which is now close enough that it is available for pre-order anywhere that you buy books which is pretty exciting so if you want to get your hands on needy ASAP,

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Samsung over and Google me up and find a place to scoop up your pre-ordered copy that would be fabulous but what I've been working on this book.

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The only way that I have been able to produce is really kind of by the skin of my teeth.

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And that has meant that I have had to contend with these ideas of.

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What does it mean to have this opportunity to write this book and you know this has been a dream of mine for my entire life and here I am,

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three years in the making having gone through you know multiple editing rounds over the last couple of months and each of those times.

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Once I had covid another time my partner almost inconceivably had,

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leave us overnight and I was you know stuck without any childcare during the summer when there's also no school and a big deadline,

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and so this biggest work most exciting work of my life was being done,

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in the night after I had been with my kids all day for 12 hours and gotten my kids to bed and for those of you who have kids you understand

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you know how challenging it is to put two brain cells together on the less be the final word on these edits and the pressure of that

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was a thing but you know the real thing of it was the expectations that I had of myself of what it meant to do a good job and how.

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If I were to get really honest with myself the conversation that I was having around what a good job looks like didn't leave room

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for me as I was for my Humanity for the circumstances of my life beyond that it was,

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an example of productivity that if we look at it and patriarchal terms is rooted in,

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what a white man is able to produce who has a wife at home who takes care of all of his things for him and so even

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summer right I have so many beloved teachers in my life and I'm so glad that they get to have

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a break in the summer I think that you know the work that teachers do during the school year is incredible and challenging and I am so happy for anyone who gets to have any bit of break

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from that so that it becomes even just a little bit more sustainable and also.

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Even the way that the year is set up that there are these three months where your kids are home and,

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you may or may not have access to childcare you may or may not have access to extracurricular activities you may or may not feel safe in a pandemic accessing either of those things.

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Even if you have the resources to provide them for you so the way that this whole thing is set up is that there is.

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A wife and a mother at home who does that caretaking during the summer months when you know presumably somebody's working and that's the dude so.

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I have no tits in my life and you know during this this summer season I at many times was the only adult in my home doing all of the things myself while also,

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running my business while also working on this book and Beyond just that.

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You know while also cooking all the meals and staying up with my kids sometimes one than the other than the other than the other than the other all night long and.

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The actual brain space that I had available for me for my book for my calls of my clients for my work was.

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Less I was less resource than I have been at other times in my life certainly and it is incredibly challenging not to

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get lost in the discomfort of that gap between what you expect of yourselves and what you are humanely able to provide

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and Beyond just discomfort

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I think that the reason I wanted to navigate this conversation today is because of how much shame is in there,

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how much shame exists in am I squandering this opportunity,

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am I taking good enough care of myself to deserve what I have,

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to be able to do a good job for a job that I care about so so incredibly much that

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you know I'm about to be full-time 10 years my business,

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I care deeply about the work that I do and so had has felt many times over the course of the last year lousy to not have more to offer it.

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And also I've been.

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Calling bullshit on some of these ideas in the privacy of my own mind because I'm able to see how.

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This choke hold of perfectionism has snuck in here and if left untended to it has the capacity to choke my most.

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Beautiful and desired contributions.

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So I was in my front yard at my gate talking to a friend of mine the other day and she said something to the effect of,

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you know I saw your book was open for pre-order and congratulations and,

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you know I'm so excited for you and I can't even believe that you are able to create this during this I mean the year that you've had this year certainly but the years prior I just it just astounding that you were able to do this,

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and hearing her say that unlocked something in me that I think I had been carrying for quite some time and that was this belief that.

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I could have and I should have done better that I could have or should have somehow written a better book and.

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That part of me that knew you know if I did if I lived in an isolation chamber and I had nothing but time and space available to me.

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And I wasn't using some of my vital creative effort to raise my children and feed myself and feed the things that give me joy and pleasure outside of my work then,

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yeah I mean could it have been better I think better is relative could it have been more perfect by literary definition that I was taught yeah certainly but,

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I couldn't have written it any differently I couldn't have done more.

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I couldn't have met those expectations I couldn't have met those steaks.

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And if that was the litmus that was what was required of me in order to put this book out into the world I wouldn't have been able to do it.

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And if we expand out from there you know my work with my clients,

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my work in my courses all of the ways that I teach and lead and guide and share

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if.

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Perfection were necessary.

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I wouldn't have been able to do any of it and there's a huge loss to that that would mean no one will be able to read my words that would mean no one will be able to take my classes or work with me one-on-one.

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That would mean none of this existed,

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rather brought my podcast during this time part of the reason the podcast was on Hiatus for so long was because.

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I was grappling with my own understanding of how to do this perfectly and if I couldn't do it perfectly I didn't want to do it at all.

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And so we can see how our perfectionism leeches in and holds those contributions hostage.

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And the Very premise of what our ideas of doing good work being were they being successful are built on these outdated.

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Models and power structures that Center something I don't honestly want to be a part of.

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I don't want to judge myself against a white man's ideal I don't want to hold myself unjustly accountable.

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To a standard that would enable me to be a mother to my children to be flexible to give care and to support the people who are around me too,

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not just be working all of the time but to also enjoy my life to be asking these questions of who and what is my life for.

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I recently was talking to somebody about my business and.

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He was kind of like asking me numbers like oh how many hours a week do you work how much money do you make oh wow so if you you know I work about 20 hours a week.

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If you worked 40 hours a week or 60 hours a week imagine what would happen to your income.

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And I couldn't make him understand that I don't want to work 40 or 60 hours a week now a caveat.

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There are times certainly recently with the book also with permission loves company this big project that I'm creating for the fall

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where I have worked 40 hours a week but by and large my desire is,

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to work while my kids are in school and to be off when they're not and to be living my life and to have part of the.

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Benefit be the time and space that my business a lots me,

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you know I see that as value different certainly than the financial gains and rewards of this business but valuable nonetheless.

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And so it made me laugh that you know he immediately thought oh well you know if you do this much more than you'll make that much more money was like well I don't.

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Want to make more money I don't need to make more money I don't want to live that way,

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and so even as I was cognizant of my own my own definition of success which includes time and space includes,

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what I need to be able to create,

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in as best and most enjoyable way possible to serve my clients in a way that,

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doesn't deplete me completely to parent my kids in a way that has me you know generally resource and well-equipped to handle the 1 million mama mama mamas all day long.

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And so. Even while I had been creating this new vision of what definitions of good work hard work success would look like for me.

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I was noticing where this perfectionism had snuck in,

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and where I was feeling ashamed for not being able to meet those expectations that I have been conditioned to hold.

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So I recently taught a workshop about burnout.

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And what was hilarious about that Workshop about burnout was that I was pretty burnt out when I ran it.

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And I remember thinking afterwards how you know the audacity the audacity of a person do you teach a class on burnout when they themselves are feeling burnt out,

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and sort of just kind of over the course of a couple weeks that I was,

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sharing but not that Workshop was coming up just kind of wrestling with that like who am I to teach this Workshop but,

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when I realized was first of all burnouts not a moral failing so you know the point of this work the point of that Workshop the point of all of my work is not to never become burnt out again because there are times that are.

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Deeply stressful there are moments that we really struggle.

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With the grief that were carrying with gosh just life circumstances things happen,

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and so you know that idea that it's bad to be burnt out but it is good to be not burnt out again it's kind of a bullshit concept just to begin with.

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And part of my work is to teach people that.

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When we build a relationship with our bodies we can have this more nuanced and generous understanding of what we need to yes certainly be less burnt out in the future absolutely but,

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to care for ourselves when burnout arrives on our doorstep.

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So here I was relatively crispy mid-august having been you know 24/7 alone with my kids for three weeks,

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plus and is that this that like the audacity of teaching this Workshop but.

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What was so powerful about that workshop and about that time was that,

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I was being forced to really use my tools in a way that was,

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incredibly powerful for me personally because you know it offers you this intricate understanding of while these practices really do work and I've worked with enough people to know that they don't just work for me that they work for other people as well,

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and that over the course of Our Lives we vacillate in terms of what we need and when and,

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their times of higher needs and times where we're able to kind of batten down the hatches and like get stuff done and that it's more of a dance than it is,

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destination we're like oh I'm gonna get to there the land of,

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being in perfect whatever until the end of time that doesn't exist sorry if you're looking for that you're not going to find it here.

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And not because I don't want it to but because it does not exist and so what are we left with instead.

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We're left with this audacious tenacity of being our authentic selves.

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And showing up as we are for the things that we care about and doing

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asbestos job as we can which is different than doing the best job or hitting an a standard or expectation set out by somebody else

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and providing these models of.

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You know Laverne Cox talks about possibility models and you know each and every time I think about that a lot each and every time I go out to.

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Teach and I say you know I'm feeling a little scattered today my kid was up all night last night teething or sick and.

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You know I'm here in front of you and I'm just going to do the best that I can.

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Every time I allow myself to be authentic in that way and I just want to caveat to say that you know authenticity has become such a buzzword and.

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By and large it's a little bit nauseating but I am using it here because this is the right word for the job,

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um so you know whenever I allow my authentic self the fullest expression of myself to be present,

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in front of other people in front of a group of other people the message that I am,

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quietly delivering is I think that I'm valuable enough in my imperfection to be worthy of your time and your energy and your attention.

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And that's a struggle for me but it's a good struggle,

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it stretches me in ways that feel so profoundly uncomfortable but I have learned that being uncomfortable does not mean that I need to quit doesn't mean that I'm doing a bad job it just needs look here I am up against this rule that I've told myself that if I'm going to teach a class I have to have a

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good night sleep and a perfect breakfast then you know

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two hours of meditation and my walk and all of these things all of my ducks just lined up in a row that that and if I don't have those things that I'm not as valuable or as worthy as if I do.

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But when we allow our fullest expression of self to be seen when we say hey.

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You know I'm a parent

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or I'm chronically ill or I'm a caregiver or you know I'm having an experience that is stretching me and changing me and

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forcing me to show up in a way that's really different than I may have been taught is right and good.

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There is such a profound value.

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Not just your inner self though that is certainly valuable but for everyone else who gets to Bear Witness.

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And so when I set a boundary when I ask for what I need,

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when I have to change something in my calendar because I don't have childcare when I you know feel more scattered than I would like before I start something.

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When you know I complete the edits for my book in the tiny minutes between everything.

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Doing the best that I can and letting other people see me.

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Reinforcing for myself it's enough it's enough it's enough it's enough it's enough and how do I know that it's enough because it is all that I am capable of genuinely,

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and not like all that I'm capable of as in.

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Flattened myself out completely give myself nothing treat myself horribly beat myself up but it's all I'm sustainably capable of it's all I'm willing to give.

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Without going into enormous energetic debt borrowing against myself was a Surefire path to burnout.

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So this Audacity Of Being who and how you are out loud and in front of other people.

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And to regard yourself as being worthy of that to craft your own definition of Hardware craft your own definition of success and live in accordance to that,

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instead of paying homage to this ideal that you were socialized to carry that was.

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Created in a world that was never going to be for you ever.

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So what does that feel like I mean it feels uncomfortable for sure we've mentioned it targets that shame place.

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But there's also incredible freedom

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that's possible when you free yourself from the rules that you've been telling yourself about who and how you have to be in order to be worthy and give yourself permission to be who and how you actually are.

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And I don't know about you but I'm much more interested in hearing from those people you may feel soothed and safe by interfacing with somebody who you know has it all together.

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There may be a part of you that finds this whole conversation a little bit hard to swallow,

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in you know absolute transparency there's a part of me that's like I don't tell people that you finish this book on like a wish and a prayer.

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You know they're not going to think it's any good they're not going to buy it because they're going to think like you didn't put your best effort into it.

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Hear me when I tell you hear me when I tell myself you put your best effort into it.

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And that is different.

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Then being perfect or doing it perfectly perfect was never an option for me,

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it was just this ideal out there in the sky that I was using to beat myself up about and feel horrible about it was never something that I was actually going to be able to embody.

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And instead what's available is doing the best I can.

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Matt is doing the best I can and you know not just doing the best I can because there are times in my life where.

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I you know it's very it varies what are quote-unquote best looks like,

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but doing the best that we can in that time in that place in that space under those life circumstances that we're not afraid to.

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Be seen as being imperfect in order to bring our Visions in our dreams to fruition it takes,

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no small amount of Bravery,

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to show up each day and say self I hear you telling me it's not enough I hear you telling me it's not good enough I hear you telling me that I should you know pack this up put it away never let anyone see it

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but I'm not going to do that. And here's why and so it's possible for you on the other side of it is this incredible Freedom this openness of knowing that.

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You are the person who defines your value it's my job.

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To write that book it's my job to do my best my job to teach that class it's my job to show up for that call.

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And there is a value in letting myself be seen in process even if it's uncomfortable because I like you have been taught that nobody wants to see that.

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That my messiness devalues me that I'm never going to succeed in the world,

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if I don't play by their rules but what's happened to me over the course of the last year that I think has been the most grading is I have not had the capacity to play by the rules,

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and so what's available for you on the other side of that and there have been a couple of moments for me like this,

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you know after both of my kids were born while I was struggling with postpartum mood issues when I broke my ankle shattered my ankle was non-weight-bearing for six months and pretty deeply depressed,

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you know there have been these times where life presses you to the edges and you quite literally cannot do the things that you once did.

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To present that curated version of yourself to the world around you and I think those moments can be so scary.

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And there can be so much shame wrapped up in it,

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but I wanted to record this podcast for that version of you so you know keep this tucked in your back pocket for when that moment comes and hear me when I say that we still want you,

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we being the world we still want you.

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We're still interested in your best even if it's not perfect we're still interested in what you have to offer even if it's overwhelming.

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And vulnerable to share it knowing that.

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There's a part of you that's conditioned to believe that it could and should be better.

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When we think about why we perfect ourselves in order to belong in order to meet our need for safety.

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In order to control are messy and real Humanity or feed the illusion that we can control it because we can't.

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We have this belief that if we can just perfect ourselves then things will be easier,

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we'll be able to keep ourselves safe we'll be able to belong but on our own terms right will be able to be the version of us that other people want instead of the version of us that we are on any given day.

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And we imagine that this perfectionism is going to get us closer to other people,

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is this is in a relational perspective we think it's going to get us closer to that person we want to be in relationship with,

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if it's in a professional perspective we think it's going to get us closer to that end games that success point that were working towards but that perfectionism Keeps Us.

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Lonely Keeps Us isolated and separate.

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Keeps us other so if what we really want is to belong that Perfection keeps us from the emotional intimacy that we are aching for,

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from being seen from being known from being cherished.

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And so I'm not saying that any of this is easy because it's not.

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It takes a lot of Bravery a lot of tenacity as I said before a lot of vulnerability but what we get for that Relentless tenacity.

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Is the freedom of knowing that

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our only job is to do our best our best.

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The best that we can with the tools that we have on hand at the time.

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Not the capital th e best capital B but our best in that moment.

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And not only is that good and worthy enough but when we allow ourselves to be seen in that space.

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We give other people permission to do the same.

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Music.

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For listening to the needy podcast with Mara glatzel.

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If you'd like my support and learning how to nourish your needs dance on over to the needy podcast.com if you love today's episode Pretty Please leave us a review on iTunes and join us next week.

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And as always permission loves company so if there's a human in your life that you think can benefit from this conversation I would be so grateful if you shared it with them.

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Music.