0:08

This past week, two

0:10

congressional representatives claimed the New

0:12

Testament condemns all Jewish people

0:15

as Christ killers. How

0:17

should we understand this anti-Semitic charge?

0:20

Stay with me. We'll talk about

0:22

it in just a moment. Hello,

0:24

friends. Welcome to Open Line

0:26

with doctor Michael Ray Zelnick, Moody Radio's

0:28

Bible study across America.

0:30

My name is Michael Ray Zelnick. I'm the academic

0:33

dean and I'm a professor of Jewish studies

0:35

and Bible at Moody Bible Institute.

0:37

I'm so glad to be sitting around

0:40

the radio kitchen table with you,

0:42

talking about your questions about

0:45

the Bible, God, and the spiritual

0:47

life. If you have

0:49

a question today and you'd like to call,

0:52

here's the phone number (877) 548-3675.

0:58

That's (877) 548-3675.

1:04

Tricia McMillan is our producer. Handling

1:06

all things technical is Bob Morrow

1:09

answering the phones? Is Laura.

1:12

Now again the number (877) 548-3675.

1:20

Time to get your cup of coffee, get your

1:22

Bible, open it up because we're going

1:24

to study the scriptures together. But before

1:27

we get to your questions,

1:29

let's talk about who's

1:32

responsible for the death

1:34

of the Lord Jesus. This

1:38

past week, the House of Representatives did

1:41

some good. It passed a bipartisan

1:43

bill defining anti-Semitism,

1:46

and it was based on the International

1:48

Holocaust Remembrance Alliance definition

1:51

of the world's oldest hatred.

1:53

Most of the legislators who

1:55

oppose the bill came from the political left,

1:58

objecting to the Ihra's

2:01

definition because it

2:03

correctly equates the delegitimization

2:06

of the State of Israel as inherently

2:08

anti-Semitic. On

2:10

the other hand, two right

2:12

wing representatives oppose

2:14

the IHRA definition

2:16

because they claimed it was contrary

2:18

to the Bible and the Gospels,

2:21

specifically objecting to the definitions

2:24

denial of collective Jewish responsibility

2:26

for the death of Jesus. One

2:29

congressman tweeted that he would vote

2:31

against the bill because, quote,

2:33

the gospel itself would meet

2:36

the definition of anti-Semitism

2:38

under the terms of this bill.

2:40

End quote. He further contended

2:42

that the Bible is clear there

2:45

is no myth or controversy

2:47

on this when referring to the

2:49

Jewish people as collective

2:52

Christ killers. The

2:54

other representative tweeted that the bill

2:56

could quote, convict Christians

2:58

of anti-Semitism for believing

3:01

the gospel that says that Jesus was handed

3:03

over to Herod to be crucified

3:05

by the Jews. End

3:07

quote. Are these

3:10

congressional representatives correct?

3:12

Does the New Testament actually teach

3:14

the DSI charge, which is

3:17

that all the Jewish people for all

3:19

time are guilty of knowingly

3:21

murdering the Lord Jesus, and

3:24

therefore they're guilty of murdering

3:26

God? This charge has

3:28

been the basis of nearly 2000

3:30

years of anti-Semitism, and

3:32

it's glaringly false. What

3:35

does the New Testament actually teach

3:37

about human responsibility

3:40

for the death of Jesus? Well,

3:44

first of all, on a

3:46

historical level there was a

3:48

conspiracy of guilt. Just look

3:50

at the words of the Lord Jesus in

3:52

Mark 1033 and 34.

3:54

Here's what he says. Listen,

3:57

we are going up to Jerusalem.

3:59

The Son of Man will be handed over

4:01

to the chief priests and the scribes,

4:04

and they will condemn him to death.

4:06

They will hand him over to the

4:08

Gentiles, and

4:10

they will mock him, spit on him,

4:13

flog him, and kill

4:15

him. And he will rise

4:17

after three days. The

4:19

early church understood this. An

4:22

unnamed disciple in acts 427

4:24

said, for in fact,

4:26

in this city both Herod,

4:28

who was a Jewish king, and

4:31

Pontius Pilate, a Gentile

4:33

Roman governor. With

4:35

the Gentiles that refers to the Roman

4:38

soldiers and the peoples of Israel,

4:40

that refers to the Sanhedrin and the

4:42

crowd assembled together,

4:45

or better translated, conspired

4:47

together against your holy

4:49

servant Jesus, whom you

4:52

anointed. It wasn't just the Jewish

4:54

people, but some Jews

4:57

and some Gentiles who

4:59

together planned and carried

5:01

out the death of the Lord Jesus.

5:05

On a theological level, there

5:07

was a divine plan. Just

5:10

keep on reading. Acts 427

5:12

into 428. Here's what 428

5:14

says there, the unnamed

5:16

disciples states that the human conspiracy

5:19

of guilt accomplished whatever

5:21

your hand and your

5:23

plan had predestined to take

5:25

place. The Messiah's death

5:27

didn't take God by surprise. The Lord

5:29

Jesus was the lamb slain before

5:32

the foundation of the world. That's why

5:34

in John 1018 he himself

5:36

said, no one takes my

5:38

life from me, but I lay it down

5:40

on my own. If

5:43

the Lord Jesus had been born part

5:45

of any other people.

5:48

Not Jewish, Italian,

5:50

French, Native American. I don't care

5:52

whatever anyone that

5:54

people would have participated in his death

5:57

but would not have been solely guilty.

6:01

Third, on a human level, the

6:03

Bible teaches we're all guilty.

6:05

The Lord Jesus died because

6:08

all people are sinners.

6:10

Isaiah wrote, we all

6:12

went astray like sheep. We all have turned

6:14

to our own way, and the Lord has punished

6:16

him for the iniquity

6:19

of us all. Isaiah 53

6:21

six Paul reminds us that

6:23

all have sinned and fall

6:25

short of the glory of God. Romans

6:28

323 and that's why

6:30

Jesus died for all of

6:32

our sins. So in a sense, we're

6:34

all guilty of his death.

6:37

Now some people misunderstand Matthew 2725

6:40

when the crowd says, his blood be upon us

6:42

and upon our children as creating

6:44

some eternal, special,

6:47

perpetual guilt for the Jewish people

6:49

alone. But just remember,

6:51

in the same passage, Pilate washes

6:54

his hands and says he will not

6:56

accept any guilt for the death of Jesus.

6:59

That did no good. He was still

7:01

guilty of crucifying an innocent man.

7:04

Just as Pilate couldn't exonerate

7:06

himself, the crowd couldn't condemn their children.

7:10

But truly in some mysterious

7:12

way, when the Lord Jesus poured

7:14

out his blood, it was

7:16

for their children. It was for all of

7:18

us. The first verse I ever

7:20

learned reminds us that God so

7:23

loved the world, that he gave his

7:25

one and only son, that whoever believes

7:27

in him should not perish but

7:29

have everlasting life. John

7:31

316. Agatha

7:35

Christie was the queen of mystery.

7:38

One of my favorites that she wrote

7:40

was murder on the Orient Express.

7:42

Maybe you've read it, or maybe

7:44

you've seen the movie. Here's

7:46

a spoiler alert if you haven't.

7:49

As in all her mystery novels,

7:51

a group of people seemed to be guilty

7:53

of a murder, this time on

7:55

a train. At the end.

7:58

Hercule Poirot, the detective

8:00

investigating the murder, discovers

8:03

that all the suspects conspired

8:05

together. They were all guilty

8:07

of the murder. When

8:09

we discuss the death of the Lord Jesus,

8:12

we need to remember his death wasn't caused

8:14

by a uniquely Jewish sin.

8:16

We're all sinners. We're all

8:19

responsible. Let's not blame

8:21

the Jewish people, but instead blame

8:23

ourselves because we're all guilty.

8:26

Let's also remember that God raised him

8:28

from the dead. And if we'll believe

8:30

in him, we'll be forgiven

8:33

and have life forever. Now

8:42

I'll tell you this I did not post

8:45

on Facebook that opening word,

8:48

but I did post something special

8:50

on the Open Line Facebook page.

8:52

Uh, when the movie. The

8:55

Passion of the Christ came out. This issue

8:58

was in the news of who really killed Jesus,

9:01

and I happen to write a booklet

9:03

for discovery booklets,

9:05

The Day of the Daily Bread folks,

9:08

and it's still available online.

9:11

This little booklet, it was called They Called Me Christ

9:13

Killer, and that

9:15

booklet is still available. And

9:17

I took the link and I posted it

9:19

on our Open Line

9:22

Facebook page. So if you'd like to read a little bit

9:24

more about why this is such a serious charge

9:26

and also what the Bible

9:28

actually teaches about it and a little bit more depth,

9:31

just go to our Open Line Radio

9:33

Facebook page and you'll see the

9:35

link there. I think you'll,

9:38

you'll if you want more information that will be helpful

9:40

to you. Well, we're going to go

9:43

right to the phones now. Uh,

9:45

and we're going to talk with Robert

9:47

in Tampa, Florida, listening

9:49

on WLKY's. Welcome

9:52

to Open Line. Robert. How can I help you today.

9:54

Well thank you thank you. Hi, doctor.

9:56

Uh, yeah. Well, I got a couple

9:58

of verses I've kind of been bugging at me.

10:02

Uh, one I just read today having to do with,

10:04

um. If a person was looking

10:06

at it, it would seem like you could get

10:08

salvation in some way other than

10:11

faith in Christ. And

10:15

one is Romans 213.

10:19

Pardon me, says, for

10:21

the hearers of the law are just

10:23

before God, but the doers

10:26

of the law shall be justified.

10:29

And then the other verse

10:31

has to do with the sovereign

10:33

James. James 214.

10:35

Let's just stick to Romans 213

10:37

for now. How's that? Is

10:40

that okay? That's.

10:41

That's okay.

10:42

Uh. Thank you. Romans

10:45

213 is basically saying

10:47

this. It's

10:50

saying that basically we have to if

10:52

we're going to be declared righteous before

10:54

the law, we have to do

10:56

it perfectly. Okay.

11:01

Uh, I see.

11:02

And now the

11:04

problem with that. Is.

11:08

The passage goes on to say

11:10

that none of us, uh,

11:13

keep the law perfectly. You

11:16

who preach. You must not steal. Do

11:18

you steal you who say you

11:20

must not commit adultery? Do you commit adultery?

11:24

Uh. And the

11:26

point he makes. He continues on to

11:28

say that. Um.

11:33

That they that those

11:35

in Romans 323. Uh.

11:39

For all have sinned and fall short of the

11:41

glory. And that's what he's saying. The Jewish people

11:43

who have the law. Gentiles who don't

11:46

have the law, they violate their conscience.

11:48

Uh, pagans. It just doesn't matter.

11:51

We all disobey God. Uh,

11:54

also if you continue reading,

11:56

if you continue, if you continue reading

11:58

in Romans three. It

12:01

says. Do

12:03

we then cancel the law through

12:06

faith? Absolutely

12:08

not. On the contrary, we

12:10

uphold the law's teaching.

12:13

Basically, we uphold the law. What he

12:15

means is the law is teaching. Uh,

12:17

do we then cancel the law

12:19

through justification by faith?

12:21

Are we nullifying it? Are we

12:23

getting rid of it? And the answer

12:26

is no. We're actually upholding

12:28

what the law teaches. The law actually

12:30

teaches justification by faith. Where

12:33

he goes on there should. There's an

12:35

unfortunate chapter break there. If

12:37

you look at chapter four, it says, what

12:39

do the scriptures say from the law?

12:41

Genesis 15 six

12:43

Abraham believed God, and

12:46

it was credited to him for

12:48

righteousness. So what

12:50

does the law teach about how we are credited

12:52

or declared righteous? It

12:54

is belief, faith.

12:57

That's what the law teaches. Okay,

12:59

what's your follow up?

12:59

I didn't get I didn't get that. I didn't get that gist.

13:01

But yeah, I can see where he would get

13:04

that from that one. First though, if

13:06

you just isolate that verse, it seems

13:08

seems like it's a big, big time problem.

13:10

But but here's the problem, Robert,

13:12

should we ever read verses in isolation?

13:17

I would say no.

13:18

Yeah. There we go. That's it.

13:20

But if I just run this last.

13:22

Can I just. I'll remind everyone something that I learned

13:24

when I first came to faith. A

13:26

text without a context

13:28

is a pretext text.

13:31

That's it. I've heard that before. Okay, but here's

13:33

one. That's a really a big problem for me

13:35

is James 214

13:38

where it says, what does it

13:40

profit? My brethren, though a man say had

13:42

faith and had not works.

13:44

And it seems like he kind of rhetorically

13:47

says, can faith save

13:49

him? It's almost like he's saying, come on guys,

13:51

if you just have faith and no works,

13:53

well, you're not saved. Mhm. Well

13:56

that seems like that comes screaming off the page

13:58

to me. So I have a problem with it.

14:00

Well well you shouldn't Robert. Again

14:03

we have a context. The context

14:05

is the whole Bible. But what

14:07

he's talking about here is

14:09

someone who has a superficial

14:12

faith, one that does not

14:14

hold mind, heart and will. Uh,

14:17

and it says

14:20

uh, basically what he is saying is if someone has

14:22

genuine full faith, it will

14:24

result in works. And

14:26

he. Here's why I say that,

14:28

because he says even in this

14:30

context, he says even demons believe.

14:34

And yet they. That doesn't save them.

14:37

Uh, what good is it, my brothers,

14:39

if someone says he has faith but does not

14:41

have works? The way

14:43

the rest of that should be translated is, can

14:45

this kind of faith save

14:47

him? The faith that doesn't result

14:49

in works? No, that kind of faith

14:51

can't save. A genuine faith

14:54

will lead to works.

14:56

That's what this means. It is not

14:58

the root of our salvation, but

15:01

works are the fruit of

15:03

our salvation. And

15:05

I thank you, Robert, for your call.

15:07

Remember context, context,

15:09

context, the three keys to

15:11

biblical interpretation. We're

15:13

going to come right back with more of your questions

15:16

in just a moment. You're listening to Open

15:18

Line with Michael Reed Zelnick. Our

15:20

number. Uh, (877) 548-3675.

15:25

Call with your question. Stay right

15:27

there. More questions coming up.

15:29

In just a moment.

15:42

Welcome back to Open Line.

15:44

My name is Michael Ray

15:46

Dolnick, and I'm so glad to be with

15:48

you. Looking at what the scriptures have to say about

15:50

your questions. Uh, if you'd

15:52

like to call (877) 548-3675,

15:57

it's a great time to call early in the program.

16:00

Get your question in. We're

16:02

before we take our first call, this

16:04

segment, I want to mention

16:07

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16:09

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16:11

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16:14

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16:28

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You know. Listen. As

16:35

I've been saying, sometimes this stuff gets really

16:37

silly. And

16:39

an eclipse is just an eclipse. And

16:41

that's all it is. But

16:44

that said, unfortunately, because of all

16:46

the sensationalism that people are

16:48

bringing up, I think it brings

16:50

it discredits. It brings shame

16:52

to what we say about biblical prophecy,

16:55

because it's being presented in this

16:57

really super sensationalist

16:59

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or open line radio. Org

18:06

let's Talk with Mike in

18:08

Northwest Angle Minnesota listening on

18:10

KBS. Welcome to Open Line. Mike,

18:12

how can I help you?

18:15

Hi. Good morning. And, uh,

18:17

I love Paul's introduction in Galatians,

18:19

but acts 16

18:21

three I'm reading in

18:24

English Standard I it appears

18:26

Paul probably circumcised Timothy,

18:28

but did Paul circumcised Timothy

18:31

because he was Jewish through his mother.

18:33

And just to keep the peace

18:35

for Timothy when they went on their

18:37

journeys together.

18:40

Well, that's there's two views.

18:42

One is that Paul

18:44

circumcised? Timothy. Just

18:47

as a cultural, uh, peaceful

18:50

thing, uh, when he took

18:52

him around, you know,

18:54

and didn't want to have trouble when

18:57

he went into the synagogue. On

18:59

the other hand. Paul

19:02

refused to circumcise

19:04

Titus. And

19:06

if it was just a cultural adaptation,

19:09

certainly Paul

19:11

would have circumcised Titus. But

19:13

in the book of Galatians he

19:15

refused to do that. He says,

19:18

well, why? Also,

19:20

don't you think it's interesting that this circumcision

19:22

of Timothy takes place in acts 16

19:24

on Paul's very first trip

19:26

after the Jerusalem Council,

19:28

where they say Gentiles need not be

19:30

circumcised. I mean,

19:33

what's going on here after

19:35

Paul has this great victory

19:37

as a result of his, you know, first missionary

19:39

journey, the way the sequences

19:41

you have, the first missionary journey

19:43

in acts 14, Paul gets

19:45

to Antioch, the southern

19:48

Galatian provinces. There,

19:50

Lystra, Derbe those areas where Timothy

19:52

actually comes from, that's Galatia. They

19:54

immediately get into this whole thing about

19:57

you've got to be circumcised to

19:59

be saved. And all these Gentiles

20:02

are pushing, uh,

20:04

justification. It's actually

20:06

some Jewish believers or alleged

20:09

believers came and were pushing circumcision,

20:12

and all these Gentiles were responding to

20:14

it. Paul writes the letter from Antioch

20:16

between acts 14 and 15. He

20:18

writes them a letter, Galatians,

20:21

telling them, you know that

20:24

this is useless, that a

20:26

man is justified by faith or

20:28

a woman, but a man is justified by

20:31

faith alone. And circumcision

20:34

is not not only not necessary

20:36

that they were doing something wrong by going about

20:38

this conversion. And then

20:40

they have the Jerusalem Council to see if Paul

20:43

is right and.

20:46

Paul actually wins. That's what

20:48

the apostles decide. No, uh,

20:50

circumcision. Not necessary. And then Paul

20:52

goes and circumcises. Timothy. What

20:55

was he thinking? What was he doing?

20:58

The answer is Galatians is condemning

21:01

circumcision of Gentiles

21:04

as a mark of conversion to Judaism,

21:06

of adopting the Law of Moses.

21:09

However. Circumcision.

21:12

Never, ever, ever

21:14

was considered a mark of salvation

21:17

for Jewish people. It was just an outward

21:19

sign. An

21:21

outward sign of the Abrahamic Covenant.

21:24

It was an outward sign. It was

21:26

not conversion.

21:28

Obviously an eight day old baby

21:30

wasn't converting. It was just the outward

21:32

sign that they were part of the covenant. One

21:34

of the most important messages that Paul gives in Galatians

21:37

three is that the Abrahamic

21:39

Covenant continues. No

21:41

matter what. Uh, and

21:44

so Timothy, who had a Jewish

21:46

mother and was considered Jewish but was uncircumcised,

21:49

Paul had no problem

21:51

circumcising him because

21:53

it was just the outward sign of the Abrahamic

21:55

covenant, had nothing to do with conversion,

21:57

had nothing to do with justification.

22:00

It was only what Galatians

22:02

prohibits is circumcision

22:06

for ritual purposes and conversion

22:08

purposes, not for health purposes, but

22:11

of Gentiles. That's

22:13

what it forbids. And

22:15

Timothy, on the other hand, was

22:18

Jewish, so it wasn't it doesn't even

22:20

apply to him. Does does that help, Mike?

22:23

It helps tremendously. I took notes,

22:25

I agree with you. I will explain that

22:27

a little bit more in depth to our

22:30

local fellowship.

22:32

The reference to Titus and Galatians,

22:35

uh, really nails it down.

22:37

I like to use the word wedding

22:40

rings. It's a symbol that you're married.

22:42

The wedding ring doesn't make you married.

22:44

Exactly.

22:44

You're upon conversion.

22:47

There's a lot of non-baptised people

22:49

in heaven, but baptism is your

22:51

outward sign to

22:53

your community and your fellowship and levers

22:56

that you're walking with the Lord.

22:58

But baptism isn't

23:00

necessary to get to heaven. It's

23:02

just your outward sign. But you explained

23:04

it fully.

23:05

So circumcision is just the outward

23:07

sign. Uh, circumcision

23:10

is just the outward sign of being Jewish. It's not even

23:12

related to baptism. Hey, I wanted to mention

23:14

something to you, Mike. Uh, the

23:16

the moody Bible Commentary.

23:19

Uh, takes the view that I did

23:21

in the book of acts on acts 16.

23:25

Uh, and it's I

23:27

think it would be real helpful for you. So what I'm going

23:29

to do is I'm going to have you hang on. And,

23:32

uh, Trish is going to get your number

23:34

and your address, and we'll

23:36

send you a copy of the Moody Bible Commentary.

23:39

Uh, I think this is a really helpful resource. I'm

23:41

really grateful. You know, I spent

23:43

six and a half years working on it with my

23:46

co-editor, Michael Vanlandingham.

23:48

It was written by the Moody faculty, 30

23:50

faculty members. Uh, wrote

23:53

this commentary. It's a really,

23:55

really helpful tool on questions just

23:57

like this. Mike, we tried to answer

23:59

the questions that we thought people would have

24:01

when they read the Bible, not questions that

24:03

were just, oh, this is interesting or theoretical.

24:06

It's the real questions that people have.

24:09

Uh, and anybody can get it. I found,

24:11

uh, I was in a major

24:14

secular bookstore the

24:16

other day, and I looked up at their Bible

24:18

section, and there was the Moody Bible Commentary

24:21

recommended by one of their staff members.

24:23

And I was so happy I took a picture of it. But

24:25

you could pick it up there. Uh, or

24:27

you could pick it up in a, uh,

24:29

on on your, uh,

24:31

at your local Christian bookstore or your favorite

24:33

online, uh, book distributor,

24:36

whatever it is. Or you can go to Moody publishers.com

24:39

and find your own copy, but we're

24:41

going to send Mike, if you hang on a copy

24:44

of the Moody Bible Commentary.

24:46

And, uh. Well,

24:49

when we come back, we're going to try

24:51

and take, uh, more questions,

24:53

because when we come back, it's

24:56

time for the Febc mailbag.

24:59

Uh, and some of you have actually mailed some

25:02

things in. I think the best way to get

25:04

to the mailbag, uh,

25:06

is to go to Open Line Radio.

25:09

Org Open Line Radio.

25:11

Dot org has a link there. It says Ask

25:13

Michael a question. And.

25:19

When it says ask Michael

25:21

a question, you click on that

25:23

and you can, uh,

25:25

load it up, uh, with,

25:27

with your question and it gets sent to you,

25:30

uh, when it gets sent to you,

25:33

uh, the, uh, I'm

25:35

sorry it gets sent to Tricia. Tricia puts

25:37

it in the mailbag, and we'll be taking,

25:40

uh, in just a moment. We come back with the Febc

25:42

mailbag, and I've got a special

25:45

treat. Next hour, the

25:47

president of Febc will be joining

25:49

us, so we'll get to talk with Ed Cannon.

25:51

Stay with us. We're coming right back on

25:54

Open Line. Well,

26:06

what do you know? Here comes Tricia McMillan

26:08

with the Phoebe. Phoebe

26:10

C mail bag. We're so grateful

26:13

that the Far Eastern Broadcasting Company

26:15

is partnering with Moody Radio to bring you

26:17

Open Line. You can get a

26:19

much deeper perspective on how the gospel

26:21

is advancing in the world's most unreached

26:24

countries through the Febc

26:26

weekly podcast called Until

26:28

All Have Heard. Uh, featuring Ed

26:30

Cannon. Uh, Ed's a really

26:32

great friend. Used to be the CEO

26:35

and vice president at Moody Bible Institute, but

26:37

now the president of Febc. We

26:40

love Ed so much. He'll be joining us second

26:42

hour. Uh, at

26:44

the at this segment at the bottom of the hour,

26:46

we'll be talking with him. And

26:48

it's going to be fun to

26:51

hear about the ministry of Febc.

26:54

Uh, but you can learn more by listening to the podcast

26:56

until I've heard you can find it by

26:58

going to Febc.

27:01

Org. That's febc.org.

27:04

Well, Tricia, how are you?

27:06

I'm doing well, thanks.

27:07

That's good. Yeah. Well, uh,

27:09

you know, I do want to mention one other thing

27:12

I appreciate so much. Here we are,

27:14

face to face live.

27:16

Mhm. Uh, and how many years

27:18

now? I think we missed mentioning it.

27:20

How many years has Openline

27:23

been on the air? Do you remember 12,

27:25

12 years in April?

27:27

I figured out how long I've been working

27:29

with it the other day. And I was like, oh no, do I remember

27:31

that one? But yes, it was 12 years last month.

27:34

And how many years have you been with me?

27:38

Eight, eight.

27:39

Years. I can't believe it. Yeah, yeah.

27:42

Uh, how old is your youngest now?

27:44

My youngest is seven.

27:45

Yeah, and it was about a year in after you

27:48

joined the program that you had to go on maternity leave.

27:50

It was. It was actually my.

27:51

That's how I keep track of how long you've been with the

27:53

program.

27:54

Well, that would probably be an easier

27:56

way to do it. My middle

27:58

was nine months old

28:00

when I started. Yeah. And so I do

28:02

math backwards from him. And he will

28:05

turn nine next in a couple

28:07

of weeks. And so I go backwards. I was like,

28:09

okay. So he was he was just under

28:11

one. So nine minus eight. Yeah

28:13

I mean nine minus one.

28:14

Yeah. That's it. So anyway but

28:16

that's great. And you know, it's I feel

28:18

like it's just been such a great partnership

28:20

because you have such a great

28:23

background in radio,

28:25

which I didn't when I came on

28:27

this program that, you know, there was the

28:29

the main question of everyone in Moody Radio is

28:32

him, why him? And I understand

28:34

it. I felt the same way. And I am really grateful

28:36

that that you're with me, helping me

28:39

actually know what to do on

28:41

the radio. It's partnership and

28:43

that's what I value. I value every listener.

28:45

They partner in this program because they

28:47

actually call up with their questions. And

28:49

of course, the the really

28:52

important partnership that we have is with our

28:54

kitchen table partners. And in

28:56

addition to these other partnerships, our

28:58

kitchen table partners commit to give monthly

29:01

to open lines so that we can be on the

29:03

air weekly ministering to God's people,

29:05

helping them understand the Bible better. And I'm

29:07

so grateful for our kitchen table partners

29:09

and you and I, we have the fun of producing

29:11

the Bible study moments, uh, every

29:14

other week. Which is

29:16

a brief Bible study designed exclusively

29:19

for our kitchen table partners, and they can get

29:21

it in their email, click on it and listen to a little

29:24

Bible study. And that's what we've

29:26

been doing that for a number of years to now. And that's

29:28

a lot of fun. But, uh, if you're interested

29:30

in becoming a kitchen table partner, all you have to do is

29:32

go to our website, openlibrary.org,

29:35

and look up where it's what it says about Kitchen

29:37

Table Partner. Or you can call

29:40

(888) 644-7122.

29:44

That's (888) 644-7122.

29:47

I'd like to promise you that you would if

29:49

you call that number, you'll talk to Trisha. But you won't.

29:51

You won't talk to someone else. But,

29:54

uh, it's always fun to get, uh, when when

29:56

you call the program, you get to talk with Trisha usually.

29:58

And so that's that's great fun. Okay,

30:01

Trisha, why don't we answer some questions here?

30:03

All right. Our first question, um, is

30:05

from Todd, who wrote us on social

30:07

media and

30:10

wants to know. I think this is a great

30:12

question. Um, he said,

30:14

can you help me understand who Israel

30:16

is in Genesis 12 three? So

30:18

let me read that real quick. It says, and I will bless those

30:20

who bless you and the one who curses you I

30:22

will curse. And in you all the families

30:24

of the earth will be blessed. So

30:26

it's part of the Abrahamic Covenant. Um,

30:30

okay. So he wants to know. Who

30:33

is it that God wants us to stand with?

30:35

Who are we supposed to bless and not

30:37

curse? Mhm. Um, is this the descendants

30:40

of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob?

30:42

Is this any Jewish person worldwide?

30:45

Is it a person who actually lives in

30:47

the physical country of Israel?

30:50

He wants to give and support Israel as God's

30:52

words. God as God's Word guides us

30:54

to do. Um, and so

30:56

often I will

30:58

hear this used interchangeably, like

31:01

support Israel is the same as

31:03

support Jewish people like you can support

31:05

Israel by talking to your Jewish neighbor and

31:07

telling them you're supporting Israel,

31:09

but they're not the same.

31:12

So? So who is it that that

31:14

this is referring to when

31:16

we're supposed to?

31:16

So far, there is no Israel in Genesis 12

31:18

three. It's the promises are made

31:20

to Abraham and his seed. Right.

31:23

Okay. Yeah.

31:24

Uh, and then it narrows further.

31:27

Uh, not Ishmael, but Isaac.

31:30

And then the Abrahamic covenant narrows

31:32

further. Not Esau,

31:34

but Jacob. Jacob

31:37

has his name changed by God.

31:41

He gets a second name. Israel.

31:43

Prince of God.

31:45

Um.

31:46

And then, uh. The

31:49

sons of Israel,

31:51

the 12 tribes of Jacob. Yea, yea,

31:53

yea, the sons of Jacob. Israel

31:56

is is Jacob's new name. Right?

31:58

Right. And so the 12 tribes. And so the

32:00

Jewish people are descended

32:02

from the 12 tribes

32:04

of Jacob, and they are Israel. So

32:07

one way that the word Israel is used,

32:09

it's the people of Israel, the the

32:11

Jewish people worldwide. Okay.

32:13

All Jewish people are really part

32:15

of Israel, uh, the

32:17

people of Israel, that's what they are. But,

32:20

uh, and so sometimes when we talk about

32:22

Israel, we're not talking about a political entity

32:25

in the middle. We're talking

32:27

about the people of Israel. However,

32:29

when God gave the land

32:31

of Israel to the Jewish people

32:34

and they entered under Joshua,

32:37

the the land was renamed.

32:40

Israel. So it's not

32:42

only the people of Israel, but

32:44

the land which God gave to Abraham,

32:47

Isaac and Jacob becomes known

32:49

as Israel. And that's

32:51

the name of the land. And of course, it

32:53

divides after Solomon,

32:56

and it becomes Judah and Israel.

33:00

And that's where we get you from the word

33:02

Jew from Judah. Okay. Yehuda.

33:05

Yehuda. Is

33:07

is, uh. Is

33:09

Judah. Yehuda is a judite

33:12

a person.

33:13

And so it got shortened to to

33:16

Jew. Okay.

33:17

And that's where we get. Uh,

33:19

Jew from from Judah. Okay,

33:22

okay okay, okay. And so but

33:24

they're still descended from Israel, from

33:26

Jacob. And so they

33:28

are the people of Israel. The land becomes

33:30

known as the land of Israel. Eretz

33:32

Yisrael, the land of Israel.

33:35

Uh, um Yisrael, the people of Israel.

33:38

Okay, okay. So those are the terms

33:40

that are used in the Bible or the sons of

33:42

Israel. The children of Israel. Bene.

33:45

Israel. Okay. I'm giving you Hebrew

33:47

words and that's that's how

33:49

it extends. So we're and then when the

33:51

modern state of Israel was reborn,

33:53

they no one knew what they were going to name it.

33:55

A lot of people thought the name would be Zion.

33:59

Um, and instead, in

34:01

fact, when President Truman recognized

34:04

the State of Israel, when it was

34:06

first declared on May 14th,

34:08

1948, what did

34:11

he do? He he

34:13

actually, uh, this

34:16

is kind of remarkable. Uh, he he

34:18

tried to find out. What country are

34:21

we recognizing because he didn't know if it was going to

34:23

be Zion or something else. And it turned

34:25

out that it was named Zion is just

34:27

a name for Jerusalem. So the country

34:29

was named Israel after its biblical name,

34:31

the the land of Israel, uh,

34:33

Eretz Israel. And so it

34:36

took that ancient name, but it does

34:38

not when we're talking about the people,

34:40

it's all Jewish people all over. We're

34:42

talking about the land, the

34:45

state of Israel today, the political entity.

34:47

And then, of course,

34:49

they're Israelis. Israelis are

34:52

Jewish and Arab citizens

34:54

of the state of Israel. Okay,

34:57

okay.

34:57

So so when you tell

34:59

us we should support Israel.

35:03

Who are you talking about?

35:05

Yes.

35:05

Okay, all.

35:07

All of those.

35:08

Yeah, I would say.

35:09

First of all, you know,

35:11

it's one of the reasons believers need to stand against

35:13

anti-Semitism, which is hatred

35:15

of the Jewish people. This is the longest

35:17

we've ever taken on a question, but it's a really

35:20

important question.

35:20

It is, especially in light of current events. Yeah. Like

35:23

to understand. Yeah.

35:24

Uh, the the land of Israel,

35:28

uh, the people of Israel, when we talk about

35:30

standing against anti-Semitism, we're saying stand

35:32

with the Jewish people, the people of Israel,

35:35

uh, wherever they are, Costa Rica,

35:37

uh, Ukraine, it doesn't matter.

35:40

Uh, Israel.

35:42

Uh, Brooklyn, United States. Yeah, yeah.

35:44

It doesn't matter. Uh, and then

35:46

on the second. Is

35:49

the, uh, the idea

35:51

that. There's

35:53

a modern state of Israel, which

35:56

we don't always agree with. Uh,

35:58

the reason I say that is I have cousins who are

36:00

Israelis, and they don't always agree with the state

36:02

of Israel. But we need to

36:04

make sure that we keep the perspective

36:07

that they're we don't

36:09

deny the right of Israel to exist.

36:12

Uh, we stand with Israel when

36:14

attacked. Uh, we

36:17

and we lovingly criticize

36:20

Israel. If they need something,

36:22

there is something that needs to be criticized.

36:25

Uh, so I'm not saying that we always

36:28

agree with Israel about everything,

36:30

right?

36:30

So in the.

36:31

Same way that in the country

36:33

that whoever's listening lives in, you probably

36:35

do not 100% agree with your government's leadership

36:38

100% of the time.

36:39

Yeah, I love the United States. I'm a United States citizen.

36:42

Sometimes I disagree with my government. So.

36:44

Right. That's it. Okay. Uh, anyway,

36:46

so that's it. Let's do one question.

36:48

I'll do it quick. One more. Yeah.

36:49

Well, on a related note, June in Florida

36:51

listens to Wqrz and wants to know if Gaza

36:54

is the same land today that

36:56

is mentioned during she says during the time

36:58

of Moses. But it's.

37:00

Mentioned more during the time of.

37:02

David. Yeah.

37:03

So is Gaza when we see

37:05

it in the Bible. Is that the

37:07

same Gaza today, or

37:09

is that, I mean, is it the same location

37:11

or is that different?

37:12

Okay. It's, uh, Gaza

37:15

is on the coast of

37:17

the land of Israel.

37:18

The.

37:19

Mediterranean coast.

37:20

Mediterranean.

37:21

Coast. And it

37:23

was an area that the Philistines came

37:25

and conquered and had

37:27

their five cities Gath,

37:30

you know, Ekron, they had five

37:32

cities of the Philistines, okay.

37:34

Gaza being one of them.

37:35

And was it was um,

37:38

uh, Goliath.

37:40

Goliath came from from Gath.

37:41

Okay. Okay. So some of these might sound familiar.

37:43

Okay.

37:44

So this this will show that there

37:46

you have that that little coastal area and,

37:48

and it really was a part of the land grant that

37:50

God gave to Israel. However,

37:52

the Philistines came there, uh,

37:55

and they were constantly battling, as we can

37:57

read in the stories of David and Saul and all

37:59

that. Uh, and

38:01

in fact, when the Romans

38:03

conquered, uh, Israel

38:06

and established

38:08

in there was a great Jewish revolt

38:10

in the the second Jewish revolt that

38:12

was defeated by the Romans. And 135

38:15

Hadrian got so mad.

38:18

Right at the Jews that he wanted

38:20

to take the Jewish, uh, name

38:22

Israel out and Judah out

38:25

of the land. So he renamed

38:27

the land. Are you ready after the Philistines,

38:30

the ancient enemies of Israel.

38:33

And stick it to.

38:34

You kind of.

38:35

Thing? Exactly.

38:36

And that he named it Syria

38:38

Palaestina.

38:40

Hmm.

38:41

That's where we get Palestine from.

38:42

Okay.

38:43

It was. It's not in the Bible. It's a

38:45

post-biblical. And many

38:48

modern Arabs who lived in the land of Israel

38:50

today, uh, claim

38:53

Palestinian identity

38:55

because of that name from they weren't

38:58

there during the time of the Romans. But

39:00

that's where it comes from. That's where the name Palestine

39:02

comes from. And the strip there, the Gaza

39:04

Strip that, uh, was

39:06

part of the Philistine, uh, conquest

39:09

and battles. That's where it comes from.

39:11

Okay.

39:12

All right.

39:12

Thank you. Yeah.

39:13

It was in the War of Independence.

39:16

The Egyptians took it in 1948,

39:18

1967. Israel

39:20

took it back. And

39:23

then, uh, in 2005,

39:26

Ariel Sharon turned it over to the

39:28

Palestinians. And

39:30

there is no Jewish. There was no

39:32

Jewish government there or or

39:35

occupation.

39:35

Okay, okay.

39:37

All right. So history matters.

39:39

Yeah. Yeah. Understanding all the biblical

39:41

history and all of the modern history. Modern

39:43

history. Okay. It's all.

39:44

Related.

39:45

Well, those are really interesting questions.

39:48

Uh, I'm glad I'm a Jewish studies professor.

39:50

To me to remember.

39:52

Some of those. Okay, well, we're going

39:54

to come back in just a moment with more of your questions.

39:56

Thanks for pulling those together. Tricia McMillan.

39:58

And I'm Michael Ray Danyluk. Stay with

40:00

us. You're listening to Open Line on Moody

40:03

Radio. Welcome

40:15

back to Open Line. I'm Michael Radulovic. I

40:17

was just talking with Tricia McMillan on

40:19

the break, and I mentioned

40:21

that in four days, it's the 79th

40:24

anniversary of both my

40:26

mom and my dad being

40:28

liberated from concentration camp

40:30

by Russian troops. They were

40:32

in the Gross-Rosen concentration camp.

40:35

It was a complex of concentration camps.

40:37

And there was

40:39

a woman's camp that my mom survived,

40:42

and a men's camp that my dad survived.

40:45

But on the same day, May 8th, Russian

40:47

troops came. My mom survived

40:49

because the

40:52

SS, the Schutzstaffel, the

40:55

guards at the camp, got

40:57

every woman that was strong

40:59

enough to walk and put them on a

41:01

forced march to get them out before

41:03

the Russians came and and

41:05

marched westward. And every one

41:07

of the women that marched. Actually

41:11

died on a forced death march.

41:14

On the other hand, those who

41:16

were not able to walk were just left behind

41:18

in the camp. My mom was so weak

41:21

that she couldn't walk, and so she

41:23

was left behind. And that was the

41:25

reason she was able to survive

41:27

the Holocaust, because

41:29

she was not put on that that death

41:31

march. And she was liberated by Russian

41:34

troops and she weighed

41:36

less than £70, if you can

41:38

imagine that when she was liberated,

41:41

uh, and had no hair,

41:43

it had all fallen out because of

41:45

the malnutrition that she faced.

41:48

Uh, amazing that she survived.

41:50

But, you know, it is what

41:52

it is. And in this day of anti-Semitism.

41:57

Where it feels like 1938

41:59

all over again. Uh, I

42:02

think it's important that you get a copy of the book

42:04

that Chosen People Ministries is offering.

42:07

It's called Never Again The Holocaust, remember?

42:10

Uh, remembered. It's a collection of stories

42:12

from Chosen People Ministries, archaic archives,

42:15

detailing the courage, bravery

42:17

and grace found in the midst

42:20

of the unspeakable tragedy

42:22

of the Holocaust. It reminds us

42:24

that the Lord was still at work during those difficult

42:26

days, and encourages us to

42:28

stand up for the Jewish people and to pray

42:30

for the peace of Jerusalem and oppose

42:33

the growing anti-Semitism of

42:35

today. If you'd like a free copy

42:37

of Never Again, all you have to do

42:39

is go to our website, openline.

42:41

Radio org. Scroll down.

42:43

You'll see a link that says A free gift

42:45

from Chosen People Ministries. Click

42:48

on that and you'll be taken to a page

42:50

where you can sign up for your free copy

42:52

of Never Again The

42:54

Holocaust remembered.

42:56

And we're going to talk with Michael

42:58

and Tellico Plains, Tennessee, listed on Wmw.

43:01

Welcome to Open Line. Michael. How can I help

43:03

you?

43:05

Ah. Thank you. I had a question.

43:08

Uh, Michael, about, uh, legacy

43:10

standard Bible. I've been reading it. And

43:13

in the Old Testament there

43:15

is the Hebrew word abed. I

43:17

think it is a lot

43:19

of the times it's translated slave.

43:22

And a lot of times it's translated

43:24

servant. And it

43:26

seems like when the psalmist or one of the prophets

43:29

would be praying, they'd say, Lord, I am

43:31

your slave. But

43:33

the majority of the time it's translated servant.

43:36

I don't I'm a little confused

43:38

on that. Why is that?

43:40

Well.

43:41

Because it can mean either servant or slave.

43:43

Sometimes a servant, uh,

43:46

was not just a servant, but was also

43:48

a bond servant,

43:50

and that was a slave.

43:53

And so sometimes the word should be translated

43:55

in context as slave, and

43:57

sometimes it means servant,

44:00

like, for example, if Yahweh

44:03

is a word that's used

44:05

in. The

44:07

book of Isaiah is used of the Lord

44:09

Jesus. Uh, the Messiah

44:11

is not. He is obviously

44:14

the Messiah, but it's a prediction of the Messiah,

44:16

the servant songs of Isaiah.

44:19

Uh, the. And he's the servant

44:21

of Yahweh, or the servant of the Lord.

44:24

Behold my servant, uh,

44:26

will prosper. It says in

44:28

Isaiah. And so that

44:31

is, uh, it just depends

44:33

on context.

44:35

Okay? Okay. All righty. Thank you.

44:37

Great.

44:38

Thanks for your call. Uh, we're going

44:40

to talk with Pat Crawfordsville,

44:42

Indiana, listening to Wagner.

44:44

Welcome to Open Line. Pat, how can

44:46

I help you today?

44:48

Oh, good morning, Doctor Riedel. Nick, thank you for

44:50

taking my call. Um, my question

44:53

is about the timing of events

44:55

in Ezekiel 38 and 39.

44:58

Can we know about

45:01

do they occur during before the tribulation?

45:05

Um, during the tribulation?

45:07

As for the time of the invasion,

45:10

and it looks to me like it's all Islamic

45:12

countries, I'm presuming it will be an Islamic

45:15

invasion when you, you know, you see, it's

45:17

the eastern stand states

45:19

of the former Soviet Union. It's,

45:21

uh, eastern Turkey, Persia,

45:24

Libya, Sudan.

45:26

I mean, they're all, uh, Islamic

45:28

States today. So it looks like an Islamic invasion.

45:31

Great scholars have differed. One

45:33

scholar named Arnold Fruchtenbaum, he

45:35

says that sometime before the tribulation,

45:38

uh, my teachers, like John

45:40

Walvoord that I had and

45:43

I think Charlie Dyer put it right

45:45

near the middle of the future tribulation.

45:48

And Charles Feinberg, in

45:50

his book on Ezekiel, puts it as

45:52

part of Armageddon, the

45:54

campaign of Armageddon at the end

45:56

of the tribulation. So a lot

45:58

of thinking people think a lot of different things.

46:00

And I'm for the thinking people. But I

46:02

think if you were to ask me where I

46:04

align, I would put myself,

46:07

uh, sort of near

46:09

the middle of the and near

46:11

the middle of the tribulation. That's where I

46:13

would put it. Well, I hope that answers

46:15

your question, Pat. Thanks for calling, everyone.

46:18

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46:21

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46:23

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