0:03

From Outside Magazine this is the

0:05

outside bad catalyst. Throughout.

0:13

Time they've been these epic

0:15

battles between man and beast.

0:18

You got St. George in

0:20

the Dragon, Moby Dick and

0:22

Captain Ahab. And.

0:24

Then in New York City you have

0:26

Mayor Eric Adams versus the rats. Many

0:28

of us live in communities where rats

0:31

think they run the city every day.

0:33

Employees: I hear all the time I'm

0:35

on a trays of walking the streets

0:38

people stop me is say he know

0:40

we will doom and we hate those

0:42

damn rats. Rats.

0:46

Are serious business? They

0:48

get and car engines and homes

0:51

they cause illness, steal food, bite

0:53

children. A few

0:55

years back, federal government sued New York City

0:57

for out of control rats and public housing.

1:00

Mayor Adams himself gonna find for rats

1:02

at a building hand. It's

1:04

a tough problem is many rivers

1:07

that the to see a rat's

1:09

you have to build dams in

1:11

every area. And Twenty Twenty two

1:13

Mayor Adams decided to really try

1:15

and solve the problem to give

1:18

someone real power to coordinate department's

1:20

like sanitation and housing. The thinking

1:22

was that might actually make a

1:24

dent so we needed someone that

1:27

was that was going to put

1:29

all the pieces together and all

1:31

the players together to coordinate of

1:33

this entire symphony. Of fight

1:35

we needed a maestro. A.

1:38

Maestro cross with a pirate. Mayor.

1:40

Adams put out a job description that

1:43

called for a swashbuckling attitude and a

1:45

general or a bad ass hurry. The.

1:48

Position would become known as New York's

1:50

Rat Tsar. Eventually.

1:53

He found her. Kathleen. Karate,

1:55

There's a new sheriff in town.

1:58

And with your help. Sonos wrath

2:00

packing or the Reds might

2:03

prefer a staycation. In

2:05

the past, the city's finest efforts

2:07

and rak control have included innovations

2:10

like offering mint flavor, trash bags,

2:13

Spreads don't like meant so they won't eat through

2:15

them to get to the trash. right?

2:17

The missing and at work.

2:20

In a randomised minty fresh breath and eight

2:22

or garbage inside. The best. This. Is

2:25

rat exterminator Matt dear dato if

2:27

they were not all once and

2:29

he is not exactly optimistic about

2:31

trying. To strategy so

2:33

far centers unwrap proof trash cans.

2:36

Basically. Was garbage means less

2:39

food? Massoud, Mean sewer

2:41

rats. In the

2:43

meantime, exterminators like Matt are also doing

2:45

their part. Of. And by guessing the

2:47

rats in their burrows we know New York we

2:49

know then they talk and talk a dog at

2:51

not do much be at the two things on

2:54

our own or us. nothing's getting it done. Still

2:56

at least the city is trying. Because.

2:58

Rats aren't the only passed in New

3:00

York City. We have the German cockroach,

3:02

we have the Oriental, we have the

3:04

brown bed, smokey browse, the American, and

3:06

then there's this test people don't even

3:08

com out to come get rid of.

3:11

Fact: Tons of us keep them in

3:13

our hearts on purpose. But

3:16

like rats, these animals have a big

3:18

impact on our health, our wallets, and

3:20

on the environment. Talking

3:23

about cats. New

3:26

York based reporter make deaths as a

3:28

story. It's

3:31

just about the coldest say of the

3:33

year, and I'm in a parking lot

3:35

in Queens New York sitting in a

3:37

classic kidnapper than light. Rusting,

3:40

With a woman named Cressida

3:42

Samuel, she spends most Saturday

3:45

mornings processing. Not.

3:47

Like that. I mean sing

3:49

for cats. At least that's

3:52

what the still like she

3:54

perhaps states she sets traps

3:56

and see what. Today

4:03

Proceed It is trying to catch a grey

4:06

cat with a her paw. She

4:08

already trapped him to come to that

4:10

and got em all shield up. But

4:12

now the paw his ancestor. Of

4:18

him. Or

4:21

her. Was

4:24

in that bag of the further delay or.

4:30

The Grey Cat. Is not too interested in receipt

4:32

of pile. Of. But

4:34

there's also this long haired

4:36

orange tabby, justice. The

4:38

ginger cat comes closer than snacks.

4:40

Chopping one of them will almost

4:43

certainly scare the other one. Away

4:45

with from degree one course, going

4:47

to school with the World War.

4:55

I didn't know about New York City's kitten

4:57

pa collapse. And so my housemate brought home

4:59

two kittens. They. Were named

5:02

Turntable and Tangerine. They.

5:04

Were very cute and she was

5:06

fostering them at Select. Upset. That's.

5:09

A little bit longer than expected because these

5:12

days there are just more slots available. The

5:14

people who can take them in. New.

5:17

York, like many cities, has plenty of stray

5:19

cat and the first thing you need to

5:21

know about New York City Cats is that

5:23

they aren't going to solve. The Rap Problem.

5:26

Lox the rats or big okay

5:28

because prefer food. That of sight. So

5:32

the cats and rats live next,

5:34

not Utah. By four cats laying

5:36

bare. Sit in the sun and

5:38

you'll see rap burrow with dozens

5:40

of six feet away purple. And

5:43

so instead of to problems. That

5:45

salt each other. York has

5:47

a rat crisis and a

5:49

growing cat crisis. So.

5:52

We we can see a prices cummings.

5:54

Couple. Of summers ago and we knew

5:56

them. If nothing changed. The

5:59

some twenty twenty three was gonna be a

6:01

disaster and in. This

6:04

is John One Freeman. For. Advocate for

6:06

New York City suppressed works. And

6:09

she says the current kitten popular with several

6:11

years and the making. First

6:13

that's closed during the pandemic.

6:16

Of your Casket sexed up Matt

6:18

Moore Kittens. Plus.

6:20

Private investors took over many of New

6:22

York's that clinics. We've also got that's

6:24

private equity takeover of a lot of

6:26

that clinics in New York City with

6:29

she contributes to the problem to have

6:31

some partly as a result of corporate

6:33

takeovers that those have ballooned nice and

6:35

most. Veterinarian, Pay

6:37

has come down, so has

6:39

morale. And now there's a

6:41

nationwide such as So there's

6:44

that. Then the pandemic struck.

6:46

Again, this time by ending at least

6:48

on paper. That. Meant fewer

6:50

food and health care subsidies and the end

6:52

of money of section for toxins. And

6:55

then interests. Or. Poverty for

6:57

families or can must sell the

6:59

know that the current crisis a

7:01

New York is also an income

7:04

inequality brutal. Last summer, New

7:06

York City's animal shelters hit their limits

7:08

and temporarily stopped accepting tops from pet

7:10

owners needed to give them up. It's

7:13

hard to know exactly how many extra. Cats run

7:15

the streets As a result. But.

7:17

There are plenty of people going to extreme lengths

7:20

to try to get that number. Which

7:23

brings us back to proceed as trying

7:25

to learn a great shot with a

7:27

her paw into her trap for getting

7:29

more interest. From an orange one. Of

7:32

Trump and his kit. but it's or if I

7:34

trust him to the haven't that. Preceded

7:36

shops cats to get them spayed

7:39

or neutered and ideally fostered and

7:41

adopted. The one that doesn't work

7:43

out proceed as alternative is catch

7:45

and. Release. Spay. Neuter.

7:48

Back on the street is into. This

7:53

trap neuter release. Approach to stray cats

7:55

called t and r for sort

7:57

is pretty palatable for most. it'll.

8:00

The kittens Your cats know killing.

8:03

And it attracts a lot of volunteers.

8:06

For Sita has collected a whole web of.

8:08

Support. People. Who pay

8:10

the that sells? people who post cats on

8:12

social media to get them adopted. Even.

8:15

An admin assistant, Or negative other

8:17

than is too much is this is

8:19

like a terrible thing with the by

8:22

city has i feel like i'm some

8:24

people do right leg of the lawyer.

8:27

Finds a like some. People have a

8:29

has a cast of the house and they

8:31

did. He and I was hurt and in

8:33

know a kit. Yeah greasy to have a

8:35

full time job as a social worker and

8:37

she doesn't have a hundred cats in our

8:39

house. But she does have ten

8:41

that she's trying to find homes for. Plus.

8:43

Six of her own. You.

8:46

Don't feel like you. Know.

8:50

How to do a set of.

8:54

No, I don't know that I. Proceeded.

8:58

Chops Cats. Every week she's gotten whole

9:00

cat colonies spayed or neutered. But the

9:02

problem with Trump Need a release is

9:04

that it takes a lot of work

9:06

by a lot of people to keep

9:08

up. With the current top problem. Which.

9:11

It turns out didn't start with called it.

9:14

Generally not a pandemic problem,

9:16

this is a an ongoing

9:18

crisis that has been agree

9:20

and United States for many

9:22

years to grant Sizemore from

9:24

the American Bird Conservancy and

9:26

unless we take some very.

9:29

Drastic steps to correct it

9:32

will continue and and get

9:34

worse as we move forward.

9:39

Those pretty dire. The

9:42

thing is, the Cap situation is

9:44

getting tired and just for

9:46

decades, the Us population doubled and

9:49

then triples. No one

9:51

is really counting. the back of Armful of

9:53

Mass says there may be a million cats

9:55

and New York City alone with as many

9:57

as half of them. Stray or several.

10:00

An attack crisis is a crisis for

10:03

cats. It's. A crisis or people.

10:05

It's. Also, a crisis for America. We

10:11

like to think of America as this

10:13

place of abundance. Of

10:16

hundred birds, abandoned cars

10:18

and he sat. Sep.

10:23

We have a lot fewer of all of those animals.

10:26

Than we did forty years ago. We've.

10:28

Lost about three billion birds in the

10:30

United States and Canada over the last

10:32

fifty years or so. We we are

10:35

losing birds even com and birds are

10:37

becoming less common. With. Last one

10:39

out of every size. birds. Almost

10:42

a third of our bugs. And.

10:44

Many many baths and frogs. thanks

10:46

in both cases to devastating Pentium.

10:50

On the flipside, Who

10:53

do have more time? And

10:57

in North America they are an

10:59

invasive species. tens of millions as

11:01

invasive. Cats wandering around

11:03

outside. Eating sins

11:06

of billions, Birds. Lizard

11:12

and me every year.

11:15

Old his him to know. What's that?

11:17

I have now stumbled into. A polarizing

11:20

debate. Are we

11:22

talking about birds? is those

11:24

are you are watching into

11:26

that Conservationists vs can't rescuers.

11:29

Over. The years that alliance have been

11:31

drawn and philosophy nerds might recognized as

11:34

as. A classic trolley problem. To

11:37

oversimplify, you can save one chance,

11:39

but then many birds will die.

11:41

Or you can save the birds.

11:44

But. That might mean killing a

11:47

cat. Either way, you are

11:49

responsible for both deaths and

11:51

there's actually a right answer.

11:53

Definitely not one everyone agrees

11:55

on. People can't

11:57

even agree on mother feeding sauce on the

11:59

street. so. Or hurt. Because.

12:02

Leaning. Outdoor cats like preceded as

12:04

probably means they don't eat quite

12:06

as many birds. Unfortunately,

12:08

it doesn't turn off their kill Insects

12:10

and cats kill for sport more than

12:13

you might think. Many

12:16

people will say well my kettle he kills

12:19

one bird. A. Month or something.

12:21

You really need to multiply that by four or

12:23

five to at the true and back to that

12:25

cat in the environment. And.

12:28

Okay, this is dark but hear me out.

12:30

If you hop cats live longer. They

12:33

eat more birds the like Central

12:35

Park for example is a major

12:37

stop over point four migrating birds

12:40

birds that are are traveling thousands

12:42

of miles they need this place

12:44

to stop over a long journey

12:47

to refuel. Arrest ah you know

12:49

get their bearings and having passed

12:51

from those surrounding environment infiltrating Central

12:54

Park in other areas where these

12:56

birds my stop over on can

12:58

frequently result in the death of

13:01

those birds. In February the

13:03

Un put out. A report on

13:05

migratory species. Sauce. Are

13:07

in decline. Twenty percent

13:09

says extinction. For.

13:11

Migratory birds, invasive species

13:13

like cats. Are a top three

13:16

threats. And it's not

13:18

just cats eating birds. Just

13:20

seeing a cat can make some

13:22

birds abandon their nests. They

13:25

get spooked. They stopped eating their checks.

13:27

They stop playing eggs. And

13:29

he birds to smith fit for this kind of

13:31

stress. That makes sense.

13:33

Historically New York would have supported a

13:36

few sea lions total. Not

13:38

tens or hundreds of thousands of them. Of.

13:41

Course, it's not just the cats fault that

13:43

birds are dying. But. Cats make

13:45

an already bad situation worse. It's

13:48

death by thousand cuts, free species that are

13:51

just struggling to survive. Worldwide.

13:53

Tops of made dozens of animals

13:55

go extinct. Cats and rats together

13:58

have caused more sting sense. Than

14:00

any other invasive. Species. Pointless

14:03

island birds like The Key. We really

14:05

don't do well with cats around. The.

14:08

Kiwi his New Zealand's national

14:10

bird and so they're the

14:12

cat. Management includes concerned citizens.

14:14

Shooting starts with twenty two

14:16

millimeter rifle. That

14:18

doesn't sit well with my cat. Lovers. Obviously.

14:24

In the lower forty eight, we don't have any

14:26

flightless. Island. Birds. And as far

14:28

as we know, House cats also have accented

14:30

any species to extinction. Yet.

14:33

But extinction isn't the only metric for harm.

14:36

Yes, A birds are an integral

14:38

part of our ecosystem. Fewer

14:41

humming birds can be bad for flowers,

14:43

for example, Even. If the humming

14:45

birds don't go totally extinct, I think.

14:47

Many. People look up in the sky,

14:50

they just say oh yeah, there's birds

14:52

com But until you really start to

14:54

identify different bird species, a bird of

14:57

bird bird and that's really not. The

14:59

case. Extinction is also pretty.

15:02

Hard to predict. And happens

15:04

gradually than all at once. Consider

15:07

the humble New York City pigeon. I

15:10

have some living on my roof care of the neighborhood.

15:12

Sit a guy. That

15:15

America used to be known for a very different.

15:18

Stuff has. Or

15:21

of millions of the flu in

15:23

science class. The take our days.

15:29

Then settlers started searching for something

15:31

happens and his and commercially. And

15:34

eighteen sixty, They think fine. Six years

15:36

later, they were to six. Our

15:39

most sense of for. Americans

15:44

don't hunt for food as much as

15:46

I used to accept. Still, And

15:49

after habitat loss, cats may be the

15:51

second biggest threat to many birds and

15:53

the Us. That's not to say that

15:56

black birth. Or sparrows are going

15:58

extinct. Just that. Handler

16:00

putting more pressure on species already

16:02

under a pretty decent amount of

16:04

pressure. On a

16:06

farm cats do isn't confined to

16:09

their hunting. They also spread. Disease.

16:12

There's. A huge impact for for

16:14

the transmission of parasites and diseases

16:17

from cats to wildlife, from cats

16:19

to livestock and other domestic animals

16:22

and from cats to people as

16:24

well. Think. About the Doc reaches

16:26

the will pilot plague and like that half of

16:28

Europe at into fights sitting on the site. That

16:31

has this. This thing. About it

16:33

that a rat is this dirty

16:35

filthy creatures. It's really not. I

16:37

mean arrest Three. Clean as grooms

16:40

itself. It lives in a family

16:42

type setting. It. You know it

16:44

does all the other thing that every other creature does,

16:46

but you know humans, like everything else, gives it a.

16:49

Reputation. You. Know. We.

16:52

Think of cats as clean and rats

16:54

as dirty. The. Cats carry

16:56

many of the same diseases that Rossdale.

16:59

Including the bonnet plague. Here.

17:01

Just as likely to be the next

17:04

penguins sparking the next endemic. And

17:07

that may sound way overblown until you

17:09

remember that cats do host this one.

17:11

Very weird parasites so a

17:13

task is a definitive host

17:15

for the parasite. Toxoplasma. Gone.

17:17

The I that causes toxoplasma

17:20

says, and so a single

17:22

cat can excrete nfc. He's

17:24

up to hundreds of millions

17:26

of these tiny infectious eggs

17:28

called Osha's into the environment

17:31

where they remain infectious Four

17:33

months to years. you may

17:35

have heard of this. This

17:37

is that disease that turns

17:39

rats into zombies. essentially reprogramming

17:42

ma'am to follow cats instead

17:44

of running away. We.

17:46

Can to taxa to? That's I. Pregnant women

17:48

aren't supposed to scoop cat litter. The.

17:51

For us dirt tests and treatments,

17:53

other animals aren't so lucky. I

17:55

think it's about sixty percent infection

17:58

rate among white tailed. Here

18:00

in northern Ohio. Livestock and

18:02

dear also get sucked so and

18:04

with rising temperatures. Hoxha rates are going

18:06

up. Oh. And

18:09

then it rains and acceptable losses

18:11

into the ocean. That. Feces

18:13

that is deposited with the toxoplasma

18:15

gone to Ios is flows through

18:17

the tressel environment into the marine

18:19

environment and subsequently insects. Hawaiian Monk

18:21

Seals which are a federal endangered

18:24

species. There are only about three

18:26

hundred ah the I'm pulling monk

18:28

seals left in the main Hawaiian

18:30

islands and this is the top

18:32

disease concern for the conservation of

18:34

Hawaiian monk seals. Seals.

18:37

Dolphins. Wales sea

18:39

otters, Often. Die from

18:41

talk so. Even. If

18:43

you only value animals for the cuteness

18:46

and don't really care about birds, Sea.

18:48

Otters: A cute and cuddly and smart.

18:51

They. Hold hands these tools,

18:55

A Cats are not morally culpable for their

18:57

deaths. But. We might be if we

18:59

don't do anything. And

19:01

that makes it feel a little uncomfortable that

19:03

we've given cats the special place in our

19:05

society. You look like sweet. My

19:08

my grandfather always had cats and I remembered

19:10

his kitchen head of a little thing that

19:12

said cats are people to do so because

19:15

of this unique. Location:

19:17

Within the psyche of people, I think

19:19

cats have fallen through the gaps a

19:22

little bit in terms of. Management.

19:24

In our responsibility for them and

19:27

to them and in managing the

19:29

impacts that they can have in

19:31

the environment. Legally

19:35

are companion animals. Not.

19:37

Wildlife and yet feral cats lined

19:39

up, slinking through all sorts of

19:41

legal loopholes. Thing. Is

19:44

even the cat people agree that we

19:46

need to do something. About the kitten

19:48

apocalypse. The. Problem is. There.

19:51

Are two very different camps with two very

19:53

different ideas of what we should deal. With

19:58

a break. The Do. When.

20:13

It comes to feral an outdoor cats the

20:16

New York City and across the country. Just

20:18

about the only thing everyone I talked with

20:20

agreed on is that we need to do

20:22

something. Moment. My my position perfectly

20:25

clear. In an ideal world, we'd have

20:27

zero outdoor cat. This. Is John

20:29

one frame and again. The. Advocate for

20:31

kit rescuers. And she says

20:33

the only real way forward here is

20:35

to try to decrease talk numbers slowly

20:37

by sterilizing cops finding homes for them

20:39

as you can. Put. Him in

20:42

bet on the street as he can't gina.

20:46

Gershon. The gets goodbye and the

20:48

com feet or that lady who

20:50

knows where all the cats in

20:52

the neighborhood ours is more. Help

20:54

me to collaborate with you is

20:56

she knows you're trying to help

20:58

excess fat and same You interrupt

21:00

the feeling reproductive cycle in the

21:02

next generations and and you gradually

21:04

gets us aging out of of

21:06

these outdoor felonies. tnr keep them

21:08

are cats and being euthanized. Sit

21:10

still not enough. It gives

21:12

a lot of cap a lot of time to hunt

21:14

birds. And spread disease. And

21:17

especially without a big coordinated efforts. And.

21:19

May not reduce cat populations much at

21:21

all. The. A very

21:24

bad policy. It's is misguided.

21:26

It's going to be counterproductive.

21:28

Bomb. It's just bad policy.

21:32

Seating. Outdoor cats taking them says

21:34

that Giving them salter crap pointed out

21:36

is nice for the cats. But.

21:38

It also means their population will never

21:40

had a natural limit. We

21:43

could be sitting around waiting for their

21:45

population to decline forever. They. Don't

21:47

think oh dang are you know another cat let's

21:49

let's get outta here They say okay let's throw

21:51

some more food on the ground and make sure

21:53

that cats okay to is a what you end

21:55

up doing is is continuing to add more food,

21:58

more few more resources to the environment. Which

22:00

increases the carrying capacity. which is

22:02

just the you know an ecological

22:04

term for the number of animals

22:06

they can exist within a given

22:09

area. Remember Cressida? Never runs

22:11

out of compassion for the cats and her

22:13

neighborhood. While. People.

22:15

Take advantage that think he would dump a

22:17

test their. The

22:20

knows that. Oh.

22:23

You get food here, some.

22:27

Even when people aren't something unwanted cats

22:29

and colonies, there is still a basically

22:31

endless. Supply of cats. Near.

22:33

The Cedar, for example. there is a

22:36

local meat and seafood warehouse that won't

22:38

sterilized. It's Mousers. right?

22:41

So. As. Soon as

22:43

I get like six months to feel was the.

22:47

Start his own says. Thanks

22:50

to the Warehouse preceded deals with a

22:52

constant influx of black and white kittens.

22:55

And finding homes for all these cats can be

22:57

hard. And that's just the cats

22:59

and the few blocks that she feels responsible for.

23:02

There. Are plenty that no one is even trying to

23:04

take care of. On

23:06

the way home, Cressida and I pass apart.

23:11

It isn't very far in his Us. Hundred

23:14

over here to exercise or what

23:16

is the. Lack

23:19

of her place. We drop off the orange cat

23:21

in the grass. And

23:23

we got stairs to the cap room

23:25

for a kitten dashes out the door

23:28

of. Our.

23:32

In addition to three indoor cats

23:34

and three outdoor cats proceed are

23:36

also has a rotating heard of

23:38

Cats You. I keep spotting more

23:40

of them carrying out from drawers

23:42

and staring down from south. Of

23:45

how many. Other

23:48

his. Head. Ten

23:50

counts including the three greasy that seeking to

23:52

an adoption says she's not taking more because

23:55

she's not sure if still get chills and

23:57

I don't. Make much

23:59

sense. Travel. Probably.

24:01

Russell the cats and a cat carriers and load

24:03

them into the car. Along

24:06

the way to proceed a picks up a cat that

24:08

needs a ride to a foster. Home. And

24:11

she sings by to Grab a France. Oh.

24:14

My. God. Over here. Then

24:17

we pick up some cat food

24:20

from a donor hygiene and downstairs.

24:22

Oh, let me out And she

24:24

drops off the foster. Kitten And would

24:26

you be secured by the fact. That.

24:32

This is a pretty typical Saturday. The.

24:34

Endless supply of cats means that

24:36

for see the chopping, seating and

24:39

transporting cats is almost another. Full

24:41

time job. Finally,

24:43

We pull up in front of a big fan

24:45

parked on a busy street and downtown Brooklyn. The.

24:48

Vibe is like come on in kids

24:50

impulse adopt a cat. Thrall

24:53

wearing little bowls was bios taped on

24:55

the cages. Cressida drops off for

24:57

three minutes. See this is a desperate. Situation.

25:00

Is. It needs. To

25:02

be about the city going to come in a community to show you.

25:06

Have a cat, It's yeah. I guess. If

25:10

any of these cats are adopted, proceed assholes

25:12

and do home visits. Just like she

25:14

would and her day job as. A. Social Worker. I'll

25:16

go to the home soon in our

25:19

to follow. Okay okay as arts I

25:21

do come from placement of children yeah.

25:25

I do that ottawa a make sure that

25:27

the gets okay as. Except for my

25:29

second later, she tells me that none of

25:31

the three got adopted. That's. The

25:33

other problem with Tnr. There.

25:36

Aren't currently enough forever homes for cats

25:38

that need them? I

25:40

know. Everyone take a big.

25:42

Steep. Because.

25:44

We've arrived at the other option. The.

25:47

One that doesn't get a lot of by in.

25:50

Horror Story and Feral Cats.

25:52

whether it equality or not,

25:54

Farm V really need to

25:56

be removed from the landscape.

26:00

Removed from the landscape doesn't necessarily

26:03

mean killing them. At

26:05

Means keeping your cat on your

26:07

property. Say don't become strays or

26:09

produced. Grant. Has

26:11

an indoor cat. Amelia the deal yet

26:14

we left outside. On a leash. Tap

26:17

his senses are caddy else

26:19

or of. Although

26:22

in a city like New York's most humans don't

26:24

have the on patios let alone. Space for

26:26

a cameo and then the other

26:28

ways to to physically remove them

26:30

from the environment Law rehabilitate them,

26:33

give them the opportunity for habituation

26:35

if they're not already habituate it's

26:37

and adoption into loving while life

26:40

long homes or otherwise placement, any

26:42

long term holding facility likely cat

26:44

sanctuary and if no other options

26:46

are available than euthanasia com but

26:49

again, never releasing those cats back

26:51

out onto the streets were there

26:53

can continue to be exposed. To

26:55

injury and disease and cause a variety

26:58

of different arms to wildlife and for

27:00

public health. In

27:02

other words, Trap. The cats. New.

27:05

To the cats and as I can't be

27:07

adapted. Kill. Them. Twist

27:09

The cat people are like go ahead

27:11

and try to set that up. They

27:14

don't see that going over well like

27:16

the Pr campaign they would have to

27:18

wage. On trapping kill I would

27:20

love to see it like it's not.

27:22

that weren't we are too invested interest.

27:25

Killing. As is not only unpopular. It

27:28

does not come with volunteers eager to donate.

27:30

Their time. But then

27:32

again, neither does killing rats. I

27:34

would never kill a rat or mouse or creature

27:36

even in my own house. I would take probably

27:39

take it outside. Let it go because I don't

27:41

feel I should be killing anything but. If.

27:43

You pay me to do it. It's my job and how

27:46

I put kids to school and pay mortgages and all that

27:48

have a soft it becomes a job. It's. I.

27:50

Have. Nothing against these crew to be ugly. little

27:52

we all have to live in is plotted and

27:55

nominees but. It out yet pay

27:57

me to do it. I. Have. To do

27:59

with what my. My traded have done nothing

28:01

also my life as I can. eighty four.

28:04

When. Trapping kill has been a

28:06

sectors and reducing populations it's usually

28:08

been in places for cats dramatically

28:10

threatened a well loved local species

28:13

like New Zealand's Kiwi. Even

28:16

so, it's often less carrot and more

28:18

stick. In Brisbane, Australia,

28:21

seating charts king some with jail

28:23

time. So.

28:30

Save. Them all. Remove. Them all. Time

28:33

to think through which animals deserve care

28:35

Makes me very aware that I am

28:38

also an animal. With my own

28:40

diocese. I prefer other

28:42

mammals. I definitely prefer ones that

28:44

per. It takes effort

28:46

to care about little chirpy birds are

28:48

to think about all the ways our

28:51

choices hurt ecosystem. And

28:53

I don't like being reminded that even my

28:55

best marlins things. Like saving

28:58

cats might have unintended

29:00

consequences. And.

29:03

The. Way people have carved out camps

29:05

and nothing can make the Cat Crisis

29:07

feel as doomed as any other culture

29:09

war. Grants Organization

29:11

the American Bird Conservancy successfully

29:14

opposed New York State legislation

29:16

from directly funding Tnr for

29:18

and and kids. Meanwhile.

29:21

Cut nonprofits have downplayed environmental

29:24

harms even when cat colonies

29:26

were threatening endangered species in

29:28

New York State parks. It

29:31

feels intractable. Except

29:34

for one thing. That absolutely everyone

29:37

I talked to agreed on. Whatever

29:40

else we do, pet cats should

29:42

be sterilized. So. Essentially

29:45

the house is flooding when you to turn off

29:47

the top. One. Way to make

29:49

shutouts get sterilized is to make it

29:51

illegal not to get your cats sterilized.

29:53

I would love. It is nice but

29:56

city have that law because rescuers and

29:58

so much time. I'm trying

30:00

to convince people to say it to let

30:02

them stay in it or they're animals. They

30:05

would be so easy. it's that kind of

30:07

diplomacy was taken off their shoulders and they

30:09

could just go to someone and say. Feign

30:12

Interest Law. I'm here to help you

30:14

and with the it. Another way to

30:16

do it would be making it more

30:18

affordable for pet owners. Every

30:21

household have about price. Have

30:25

a cat signs of so.

30:28

If. We never

30:30

thought I'd say this, but. Maybe.

30:32

Pets need affordable health care. Maybe.

30:35

It's also a matter of treating cats more

30:38

like we treat dogs. So

30:40

these policies could be as simple

30:42

as changing the existing. Code

30:45

Ordinances wherever he says dogs, adding and

30:47

cats. I mean, we're not talking about

30:49

anything revolutionary here. we're talking about elevating

30:52

the level of care of responsibility for

30:54

cat to the level that we already

30:56

provide for for dogs. You.

30:59

May not remember this. But. New York

31:01

City use a half packs of dogs

31:03

roaming around. And. We don't anymore. Because

31:06

it a certain points we decided that owning

31:08

a dog came with the responsibility of getting

31:11

at sexed and not letting it from around.

31:14

But. That false a cultural says

31:16

and policies asked. Which.

31:18

Means that actually solving the kitten pa

31:20

collapse is not a job just for

31:22

volunteers. It. Might be

31:24

a job for someone like Kathleen. Karate.

31:27

As cities flush buckling, rats are.

31:30

I will bring a science and

31:32

systems based approach to reducing New

31:34

York City's rat population. Karate

31:37

As a woman with a budget, a

31:39

staff and the authority to coordinate a

31:41

class apartments to deal with. Been.

31:44

Out. For. Yeah and I

31:46

see was were like lies all his

31:48

attention on that end us cats or

31:50

something people actually care about lot more

31:53

than rats Were having a crisis in

31:55

New York wire any resources being allocated

31:57

to that. Ensues.

32:00

The city is taking advantage of

32:02

private citizens like proceeded to dodge

32:04

what is arguably a public responsibility.

32:07

We. Have a rats are. Maybe

32:10

we need a cats are to?

32:12

We allocate more tax dollars to

32:14

a bag of garbage on the

32:16

sidewalks and we do to someone's

32:19

abandoned tests. I think most New

32:21

Yorkers would say they they care

32:23

more about this homeless. Ah,

32:26

abandoned animals. New.

32:28

York City does have animal. Shelters they

32:31

are. Arguably under funded,

32:33

it has the Mayor's office

32:35

for Animal Welfare also underfunded

32:38

and understaffed. According to everyone

32:40

I spoke with, of course, Tough

32:42

On Rats is an easy political

32:44

when. Doesn't Cats? doesn't

32:46

have quite the same ring to it. If

32:51

we did get a cats are they

32:53

would inherit a political next. To

32:55

make a dent or cats are might

32:57

need sar like powers. Political.

33:00

Autonomy. Influence across

33:02

departments and with lawmakers. And

33:05

a vast budget. Preferred.

33:08

Qualifications: Catholic ability to

33:10

tread lightly around political

33:13

and means independent stinks

33:15

like com and not

33:18

Judy. Must make

33:20

people feel included and help

33:22

warring Saxons his and make

33:24

up. The ideal

33:26

candidate will be persuasive. Able

33:29

to change the minds of people who

33:31

might not want their minds changed. At

33:35

this job. The. Easy part is

33:37

hurting cats. Make

33:44

Does is a New York based science

33:46

journalist. Over

33:48

the last two months all three of the

33:51

cats casita try to get adopted did finally

33:53

find homes. The grey

33:55

cat with her paw. Still out

33:57

there. This

34:01

episode was written and produced by Meg Does

34:04

with editing by me Peter for great. Music

34:07

and sound design by Robbie Carver. Stay

34:10

Outside Podcast is made possible

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by our Outside Plus members.

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Learn more about all the

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benefits. Membership at Outside online.com/pod

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Plus.