0:02

This is the Head Gun podcast. While.

0:06

Enjoying craig believe the joy of

0:08

discovery is crucial to enjoying any

0:10

well told tail. They will not

0:12

shy away from spoiling specific story

0:14

beats when necessary. Plus. These

0:16

are books you should have read by now. Everybody.

0:41

Walking to Overdo it's a podcast

0:43

about the books you've been meaning to

0:46

read. My name is Craig, My

0:48

name is Andrew. Happy New Year Everybody

0:50

Happy New Beer Every new bear Everybody

0:52

in the new. A

0:55

good at all their i hear yeah in

0:57

with the or out. Out.

0:59

With the old in with the new Bear

1:02

here on over. do a podcast for each

1:04

week. one of us reads a book and

1:06

tell the other person about it and that's

1:08

not changing this year. No, not this year.

1:10

Maybe next year. maybe next year. Or get

1:12

our our stuff together and come up with

1:14

a different idea how to. Another

1:18

were looking for one is just you

1:20

know you never know. I've always kind

1:22

of a movie like sharks we are

1:24

podcast sharks always move forward, keep popping

1:26

pills and nobody her will die now.

1:28

So Andrew we are celebrating! January.

1:31

Twenty Twenty Four. With.

1:33

Two weeks in a row we're going to cover.

1:36

Works. That have recently entered

1:38

the public domain. Who the

1:40

Public Domain you say? Yes

1:42

Yes! My favorite domain. It's

1:44

sort of like a T

1:46

A and Internet Town Square.

1:49

But. His for ideas a somebody

1:51

should make the app yeah her

1:54

her weird. And.

1:56

we figured we would kick it off with one

1:58

that is at the top of a lot of

2:00

the like here's what's coming in

2:02

the public domain this year list and

2:05

we're gonna talk about the house at Poo

2:07

Corner mm-hmm

2:10

you know if it's AA Milne or AA

2:12

Milne I believe it is AA Milne cool

2:14

all right great AA Milne has a nice

2:17

like poetry to it

2:19

but I can accept that it's

2:21

not pronounced that way that's why a guy

2:23

named Milne is carrying stuff but it looks

2:25

very precarious AA Milne oh we first

2:31

you read the book this week Andrew I did read the

2:33

book I read the house at Poo Corner by AA Milne

2:35

okay and I'm glad I'm glad that you said the thing

2:37

so I didn't have to take a crack at the name

2:40

pronunciation before we could talk about it

2:42

no problem we talked about

2:44

Winnie the Pooh ten years

2:47

ago so long ago that

2:49

that podcast episode may be ready to enter

2:51

the public domain maybe in fact I said

2:54

that to you yesterday and you said not

2:56

until we die baby yeah

2:58

but it depends on the

3:00

country there are countries

3:02

that have a like X number of

3:05

years after the author's death sure way of doing it

3:07

which is not how the United States does it that's

3:09

true episode 17 Wow back before back before a lot

3:15

of things back before a lot of

3:17

things including kind of the

3:20

shared research labor that we now do easier

3:23

to say like what we were doing rather

3:25

than list like it

3:27

was still a podcast about books essentially was that

3:30

yeah that's what that was that's the part

3:33

we're still doing so we are

3:35

covering this one because it's in the public

3:37

domain and I have never read this you

3:39

had ever never you know

3:42

about poo I know about

3:44

me universe yeah we're people in the universe

3:46

a lot of the early like those early poo

3:48

cartoons were adaptations of stuff from the first

3:50

two books and then later they did I think

3:52

in the 80s or 90s they did that

3:55

new adventures of Winnie the Pooh cartoon yeah it

3:57

was Yeah I did watch a

3:59

lot. Okay, the don't have a

4:01

lot to do with like be specific

4:03

stories. Gabi up the pool and league.

4:05

The first poo book and all characters

4:08

in it entered the public domain in

4:10

Twenty twenty two. Correct yes. But to

4:12

the big thing about this one is

4:14

that one. All these stories are in

4:16

the public domain fine. But also now

4:18

the character Tigger is in the public

4:20

domain shows well yes and I don't

4:22

know if you need advancements is a

4:24

clue. The illustrations I believe if he

4:26

if you. Need. A bouncy tiger

4:29

in your work and then you can

4:31

do at now without fearing suits. Yes

4:33

yes and we're going to with agree

4:36

with the within within certain parameters which

4:38

will talk by yeah we're and Zagreb

4:40

dangerous credit. talk about that. So let's

4:42

cover Milan. Ah. briefly. Hear

4:45

his voice. eighteen eighty to Ninety

4:47

Pippi Six. I. Studied at

4:49

the Westminster School and Trinity College

4:51

Cambridge. I just love it when

4:53

someone's career is like got a

4:55

degree in mathematics. I'm going to

4:58

pursue freelance rush things and join

5:00

a glamorous magazine. ah of the

5:02

side of Love and respect it

5:04

so much He starts writing for

5:06

Punch in Nineteen O Six points

5:08

he did serve in We're We're

5:10

One. Despite being a pacifist, he

5:12

was like a signaling officer cause

5:15

we didn't see combat. I don't

5:17

think. Really like

5:19

didn't wield where I don't know

5:21

whatever he was just are due

5:23

to illness, illness and he did

5:26

serve and will work to. He

5:28

wrote some passages critiquing. Pg

5:30

Wodehouse, who I think when we talk

5:33

about him all the while ago he

5:35

did some broadcast from captivity in Berlin.

5:37

Oh boy at you know was like

5:40

still critiquing Germany. But you know what?

5:42

he's getting pushed back for. Even.

5:45

Talking. To them at all, I guess. Alamo. known

5:48

wrote some place i won't even go

5:50

to a texas roadhouse because i and

5:53

so offended by this because broadcasts anything

5:55

this It's

6:01

gonna be a good year. I can

6:03

tell. He

6:05

wrote some plays Milne did, one called

6:08

Mr. Pym Passes By. I, in high

6:10

school, I think we did a short play of

6:13

his that was an adaptation of

6:15

The Ugly Duckling. I

6:17

was just like, oh yeah, I'm doing an AA

6:19

Milne play. That's kind of neat. He wrote a...

6:21

Bring it back, HCA too. Nice. Oh

6:23

yeah. He wrote a detective novel called The

6:26

Red House Mystery in 1922, which among other things got

6:29

included in that essay Raymond

6:31

Chandler wrote about which mystery stories

6:33

are bad. So that's

6:35

cool. He does

6:38

start writing light versus for children,

6:41

poetry and such. The first collection was

6:43

When We Were Very Young, published in

6:45

1924. And

6:48

that's kind of where I think

6:51

through mostly poo,

6:53

we now think of this as what

6:55

Milne was up to. Right,

6:58

fanciful whimsical tales and turns

7:01

of phrase and this

7:04

little magical kid's world

7:07

that he wrote Winnie the Pooh in 1926,

7:09

House of Pooh Corner in 1928. There

7:12

was another thing called Gallery of Children in 1925. And

7:17

that's about it for like this style of writing

7:19

for him. Yeah, and he died in what, like

7:21

56, 55? In the mid-50s.

7:23

Yeah, in the mid-50s. And

7:26

yeah, this is by far what he's best known

7:28

for. I think he considered

7:30

it kind of a blip in his career

7:32

and was sort of frustrated by the fact

7:34

that he got pigeonholed as a children's author

7:36

after he became super famous. And

7:40

I also am given to understand that his son,

7:42

who Christopher

7:44

Robin in these books is modeled on, was

7:47

pretty, at best,

7:50

had a difficult relationship with this

7:52

character and with his

7:55

fame as relates to the

7:57

poo, the poon-a-ver. The

7:59

Poon-a-ver! Oh. Man

8:03

come out swinging this

8:05

year! How of the

8:07

yeah he'd dislike. Even

8:10

leading up to who like

8:12

he'd. Never. Wanted to do

8:14

the same thing for too long. like

8:16

it's why he is. You know he

8:18

starts writing in a humor magazine and

8:20

then he's writing a mystery novel and

8:22

then he's writing guild resume only why

8:24

he'd studied mathematics, the I started writing

8:26

and a half raises interested in different

8:28

things and he can't I can't do

8:30

that anymore. After after Poo takes off

8:32

I'll I'll circle back and talk about

8:34

his illustrator each separate who's also a

8:37

critical to where you know our modern

8:39

idea of who comes from. Yeah, but

8:41

yeah, this, these whole books. they're based.

8:43

On you know, Christopher Robin is based on

8:45

his son whose name was Christopher but they

8:47

called him billions. The nickname. Poo

8:50

is purportedly based on a bear

8:52

that they saw in the London

8:55

Zoo named when a Peg and

8:57

also a swan at their neighbor's

8:59

property named Poop Non. When.

9:01

They combined it and then the

9:04

visual reference for Winnie the Pooh

9:06

was actually a toy bear that

9:08

the illustrator each shepherd son had

9:11

an. I guess you can go

9:13

to the spot in the woods

9:15

where they used to walk around

9:17

that is no hundred acre wood

9:20

as soon as down forest in.

9:22

England. You. Could go there. There

9:25

coordinates I mean on of out of yours.

9:27

They are not but. You.

9:29

Know. I hope he's okay

9:32

us like he needs. A

9:34

lie Help? Yeah. But

9:37

I'm mentally. I. Found an article

9:40

called a a Milne and the Curse

9:42

of Pooh Bear from Twenty Six T

9:44

in the by some and I'm sorry

9:46

sir this isn't like guy that slasher

9:48

film. There is no odometer. When you

9:50

agree with a loaded gun he would

9:52

like Obama Who Blood and Honey look

9:54

at I think a a Milne and

9:57

the Curse of Who episode or sound

9:59

like. Yeah, so that's where

10:01

B B C N C car about what

10:03

you were alluding to, Andrew, You know. he

10:05

wrote seven novel, five nonfiction books, thirty four

10:07

plays, humor, stories, and articles. He was a

10:09

screenwriter, and here he is. He's the man

10:12

who wrote Winnie the Pooh that all he

10:14

is known for. Damn, he said in an

10:16

inert introduction to his play, The Ivory Door.

10:18

It seems to me now that if I

10:20

write anything less realistic, less straightforward then the

10:23

cat sat on the mat. I am quote

10:25

indulging in a whimsy. I

10:28

should be accused of being whimsical about. Cats Not

10:30

a real cats but just a

10:32

little make believe pussy such as

10:35

the author of Winnie the Pooh

10:37

invent so charmingly for a delectation

10:39

his son Chris Robin has made

10:41

very very famous was put in

10:43

a lot of photographs, was made

10:46

to make like phonograph recordings of

10:48

the books. Performed for parties with

10:50

hundreds of guests. Ah and when

10:52

he was at school like people

10:54

tease him and played the records

10:57

like at him. essentially what seems

10:59

really mean. And. then when

11:01

he left university he was try to get

11:03

a job and like he couldn't escape. The.

11:06

Shadow of of Winnie the Pooh? You

11:08

have. What? Did Milan

11:10

say I feel that the legal Christopher Robin

11:12

has already had more publicity than I want

11:14

for him? I do not want See Milne

11:17

to ever wish that his name were Charles

11:19

Robert. Ah, and then.

11:22

What Christopher Robin said in pessimistic moments

11:24

when I was trudging London in search

11:26

of an employer wanting to make use

11:28

of such talents as I could offer,

11:30

it seems to me almost that my

11:32

father had got to where he was

11:34

by climbing upon my infant shoulders that

11:36

he had filter for me my good

11:38

name and had left me with nothing

11:40

but the empty fame have been his

11:42

son. That I mean, I, I. I

11:44

won't say I understand what that feels

11:46

like. I'd I am. I can empathize

11:49

with that. I'm sure it must be

11:51

frustrating. To feel.

11:54

Like. you are say miss without having

11:56

sought it out or or asked for

11:58

it yeah I do think

12:01

that's a little hard on all AA.

12:03

I think it probably. I mean, especially

12:05

when parenting today

12:07

is exploiting the seven

12:09

kids you had on YouTube for ad money.

12:11

Like, I don't think

12:14

that you can really. You

12:16

did not know what the exploitation was.

12:19

I don't think by today's standards. I

12:21

don't know. It's certainly gotten worse and

12:23

easier for more people to do it

12:26

in a way that is public, rather

12:29

than just private exploitation. But yeah.

12:32

It seems like it was rough. Seems like it was

12:34

a bad time to be Chris Robin, which

12:39

is a bummer, because people. Yeah, it's too

12:41

bad. I think people love these books. And

12:43

it's a. These are very sweet books. And

12:45

it's really too bad that the people who

12:48

are most closely associated with them had such

12:50

complicated relationships with them. The

12:53

illustrator E.H. Shepherd, Ernest Howard, who

12:55

was born in 1879, died in 1976. He

13:00

went to the Royal Academy schools. He was having

13:03

illustrated editions published in the early 1900s,

13:06

and then was working at Punch, which is

13:08

where he was connected with Milne

13:11

in the 1920s. And

13:13

that's where they collaborated on When We

13:15

Were Very Young. And he

13:17

also later in his career was like, I

13:19

did other stuff than draw that silly bear.

13:22

But I guess I'm

13:24

glad that Milne gave me a cut of

13:26

the royalties, because it defined this

13:29

character for it. Yeah. And

13:32

speaking of royalties and rights, as

13:35

we transitioned to talking about the public domain, who was

13:38

it? Steven Schlesinger is

13:40

the guy who got all the

13:42

initial merchandising rights and commercialization rights

13:44

to Winnie the Pooh, and

13:46

would wind up licensing it to Disney

13:49

for many, many years. And

13:51

then when Milne dies, she sells the

13:53

rights to him, as

13:56

do other people. To him being? To

13:59

Schlesinger. I am.

14:01

And then. Slashing.

14:03

To Die Than Than His widow cells all the

14:05

rights to Disney. And other beneficiaries

14:07

sell their stuff to Disney. So now Disney

14:09

has like all of the pool rights except

14:11

the ones that are in the public domain.

14:14

The guess. It

14:16

is worth noting that the British copyright extend

14:18

for another few years. so if you're in

14:20

Britain, Go. Wait, He. Is

14:22

Britain's one of the death of the author?

14:24

Yeah Countries yeah. I think Nine Nine in

14:26

like that. The metaphorical. Like

14:30

analytical way, Bed The Dead are the

14:32

author's discuss. The Now in the in

14:34

a way is literally mathematically related to

14:37

the year. the heat as if it's

14:39

for you or talk about public domain

14:41

Andrew Why this a little busy? New?

14:43

Yeah. because Okay, so the I'm the

14:46

most recent. Adjustment To Copyright Law

14:48

and United States. That Li said, that

14:50

goes what we can talk around here.

14:54

Is Ninety Nine Days Copyright Term Extension

14:56

Act is also sometimes known as the

14:58

Sonny Bono. Acts. Or the

15:01

Mickey Mouse Protection Act. Sonny Bono was

15:03

use a congressman later in his life.

15:05

He actually died in Ninety Ninety Eight

15:08

before he could vote for this, but

15:10

he'd sponsored similar legislation before and it

15:12

was named for him. Yeah, example he

15:15

has yet says. Spouse.

15:17

At a time like took his seat or something like

15:19

that, Mary Bono, his widow.

15:22

Yeah, and then there's a sunny sunny of Sonny and

15:24

Cher. the hundred I if you don't know I said

15:26

if the I think. Of

15:28

the very very short version is

15:30

a at length and copyright two

15:32

ninety five years after the date

15:34

of publication up from seventy five

15:36

years previously. Answered

15:40

so that the relationship between the

15:42

public don't let the public domain

15:44

and copyright is interesting. Copyright exists.

15:47

Like with. Let's give

15:49

it the benefit of the doubt I

15:51

guess and say that copyright exists. To.

15:54

incentivize people to come up with new ideas

15:56

yeah and so they can like so they

15:58

have a nice cushion of time to benefit

16:00

from the new thing that they have created.

16:03

And then eventually, it passes

16:05

into the public domain where other people can

16:08

then build on it. And

16:11

the way that it works in the US is just

16:13

like there's a very, very long gap between when something

16:15

comes out and when it becomes public domain. And for

16:18

many years, it was just extended over and

16:20

over again. Mickey

16:22

Mouse is a big reason why that

16:24

happened. Obviously, Disney lobbied a lot for

16:26

that to happen. They weren't exclusively the

16:28

reason why this bill passed. There were

16:30

a lot of other corporate interests involved

16:33

in continuing to extend

16:35

copyright. I

16:37

think Mickey is usually the avatar of it. And the reason

16:39

why 2024 is a big one in public domain is

16:44

not this poo thing, though. Winnie the

16:46

Pooh's great. But it's the

16:48

year that the very first Mickey Mouse

16:50

cartoons, namely Steamboat Willie, and I think

16:53

one other one. Plain crazy. Yeah, OK.

16:56

And also the characters of Mickey and Minnie

16:58

Mouse themselves enter the public domain for the

17:00

first time. So symbolically, it feels

17:03

like both a celebration

17:05

of the public domain and maybe just

17:07

like, boy, our

17:09

congressmen can't even, our congresspeople can't

17:12

even get it together for long

17:14

enough to protect corporate interests anymore.

17:18

It's a little bit of both. I

17:20

breezed through an article on

17:22

the University of

17:25

Duke University. Oh, is this the Jennifer Jenkins

17:27

one about Mickey? Yeah, no, this is a

17:29

good one. Mickey Disney and the Public Domain,

17:31

a 95-year love triangle by Jennifer Jenkins, director

17:33

of the Duke Center for the study of

17:36

the public domain. And the thing that I

17:38

found that helpful in understanding

17:40

is obviously the ways in which

17:42

copyright is not trademark. And trademarks

17:44

can go on forever. But

17:47

there's been some interpretation of copyright law

17:49

that makes sure that you can't use

17:51

trademarks to extend copyrights forever. Yeah, and

17:54

there's a good, on that page, there's

17:56

a good Mickey Mouse-shaped diagram of what

17:58

does and does not become law. Legal

18:01

when steamboat Willie goes and enters the public

18:03

domain and you may borrow as we record

18:05

this today as you're listening You

18:07

may notice that in a lot of

18:09

the current like Disney animation stuff whenever

18:11

they do their logo There's like a

18:13

little steamboat Willie that plays I saw

18:15

this when I watched the movie frozen

18:17

Yeah 13 for the first time and

18:20

I I think that you can still use

18:22

the images and stuff from steamboat Willie But

18:25

like it it further muddies the waters on

18:27

purpose to make sure that you

18:29

don't use it for any branding purposes Yeah,

18:32

like you know the biggest things

18:34

are one you cannot create the

18:37

Impression that Disney had anything to

18:39

do with like creating or sanctioning

18:41

your work So if for

18:43

example in our public domain Smash Brothers style

18:45

fighting game that we're gonna do. Yeah We

18:49

could include Mickey Mouse now, but

18:51

we could not include Walt

18:53

Disney's Mickey Mouse. All right, I don't think like that would

18:56

be I don't even know if

18:58

we can let him have gloves It's

19:00

it that one's a little tough because

19:02

this this gets into the muddier waters

19:04

So like the version of Mickey in

19:07

the public domain is like the weird

19:09

little rat boy steamboat

19:11

Willie and not like the Fantasia

19:14

version. No not like the

19:18

Red pants version who I think is like

19:20

the modern model for Mickey Mouse. I think the

19:23

Fantasia one is 1940

19:26

so 17 or 16 years

19:28

from now. Okay, wait a man exciting. Yeah, I

19:30

can't wait to chop up those arms similarly

19:32

is like Winnie the Pooh with the shirt

19:36

So that's that's yes. So so Winnie

19:38

the Pooh is depicted in these books typically

19:40

is just a naked bear. Yeah, and It's

19:44

only later in the more

19:47

Disney five versions of him that he

19:49

goes sort of porky pig shirt no

19:51

pants But

19:55

I mean there is some debate as to

19:57

whether Like,

20:00

is it copyrightable to put like

20:02

a bright shirt on

20:05

an animal? Is it copyrightable to say

20:07

that this mouse speaks with a high voice?

20:10

Like it is, I

20:12

think if you were being too aggressive about it

20:14

and doing it too publicly, yeah, like Disney would

20:17

probably try to take you to court and with

20:19

the courts the way they are now, like, who

20:21

knows? Who knows? Yeah, yeah. What

20:23

would happen? A

20:26

lot of the stuff that the Jenkins says

20:28

in this Duke article are like,

20:30

yeah, most people will probably play it safe

20:32

and not do like public domain Mickey with

20:34

like red pants with yellow buttons on him

20:37

or whatever. Like you would just,

20:39

you'd probably proactively avoid that so as

20:41

to avoid Disney trying to bring that hammer down

20:43

on you. Yeah. But

20:45

it's not necessarily illegal to do that. Nope. You

20:48

know, we mentioned there was a Winnie

20:51

the Pooh horror film called Winnie the

20:54

Pooh Blood and Honey that came out

20:56

recently where Christopher Robin abandoned Pooh

20:58

and Piglet and then they became

21:00

mass murderers or something. I watched

21:02

the trailer at Pooh Boy.

21:04

Hope you had fun if you watched it.

21:06

Flasher movie and it, like

21:09

it's the laziest possible thing

21:11

to do with the characters I think

21:13

but it did achieve some morality on

21:15

the internet. They're already planning Blood and

21:17

Honey 2 because of Tigger so I'm

21:19

gonna send you a photo of the

21:21

Tigger images, the Tigger image that has

21:23

been released. Come on, he just looks

21:25

like a dog. He looks like a

21:27

mean dog. Got blood on him, he's

21:29

a man in a Tigger mask. Yeah,

21:31

I mean they can't, did they, you

21:34

can't kill Christopher Robin again, can they? I

21:37

don't know. Yeah. That seems

21:39

weird. All right, well. But Jenkins I think I

21:42

just wanted to get this in here and summarize

21:44

as well the relationship because

21:46

we talked about this in our

21:48

Snow Queen episode which may or may not be up

21:50

on the main feed that I don't remember but we

21:52

also talk about some public domain and Disney

21:55

stuff in that. So hence the

21:57

triangle she says, Disney is both an emblem

21:59

of turning extension and its erosion of the

22:01

public domain and one of the strongest use cases

22:03

in favor of the maintenance of a rich public

22:05

domain. Mickey is a symbol of both

22:07

tendencies ironies abound. It may not be exactly the

22:09

same as an oil company relying on solar power

22:12

to run its rigs, but is definitely in

22:14

the same massive irony zip code. All

22:18

of this makes the year when copyright finally expires

22:20

over Mickey Mouse highly symbolic love triangle between Mickey,

22:22

Disney, and the public domain is about to evolve

22:25

and perhaps even resolve in real time. So

22:27

just just saying you know Mickey was built

22:30

on like Charlie Chaplin and a bunch of other

22:32

yep stuff that is just kind

22:34

of entered the culture. Yep. And

22:37

Disney has done that a bunch with

22:40

you know traditional fairy tales. Mm-hmm. And

22:43

yeah, it's it's good. It would

22:46

be good if other creators were allowed

22:49

to then take ideas

22:52

where Disney left them and carry

22:54

them on into something else if they want

22:56

to. Yeah. I mean

22:58

I'm sure what we will see is like

23:01

Mickey like Mickey porn or something that's like

23:03

just just whatever the whatever

23:05

the easiest broadest

23:08

attention-grabbing-est 2024 internet version. Have

23:13

you ever been to Google.com? Well,

23:15

yes, I mean like

23:17

maybe theatrical release Mickey

23:19

porn. Okay.

23:23

I want to say there's no like

23:25

fairy Mickey Mouse. We have to save

23:27

the movie theater somehow Andrew. They're dying

23:29

out there. Yep. Yep. Yep. Taylor Swift

23:31

concerts and Mickey porn. That's what's gonna

23:33

do it. Yeah. Let's take a

23:36

quick break and then you can tell me about the House of

23:38

Pooh quarter. Craig,

23:47

this podcast is brought to you by

23:50

Squarespace. Glad to hear it. You know

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what's not imaginary like the creatures in

23:54

the 100-acre wood? Oh, they're imaginary. Um,

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no, what else is not imaginary? Websites. They

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25:46

to undertake me to this little

25:48

bears house that was operated in

25:50

nineteen twenty eight or so you

25:53

read many many years ago oh

25:55

boy so long ago the i

25:57

didn't remember whether i had This

26:00

one yeah you so you read the original

26:02

way to the poop book do you remember

26:04

anything about it? Just this weird off the

26:06

top of your huffle lump Huffle

26:09

on half a lump, huh? Searching

26:12

for half a lump hanging out with Do

26:15

you remember anything about like the qualities of the

26:18

pros or just like your general takeaways? No,

26:21

I don't know that I couldn't I could quote it

26:23

to you like poo as we probably discussed ten years

26:25

ago Like I did not I grew up

26:28

Watching those like classic

26:33

Disney cartoon adaptations like the blustery day

26:35

which I think they actually include some of

26:37

the stories from this book Whatever

26:40

whichever one tut-tut looks like rain is in yes.

26:42

Yes Tigger obviously

26:44

big hit I was a big

26:46

piglet fan as a kid and

26:49

like everybody likes piglet the the quality that

26:51

I remember from Winnie the Pooh is like

26:54

sort of the There's

26:57

it's whimsical. It's poetic

27:00

it eat all of the Sadness

27:04

is like confined to

27:06

the Eeyore mostly As

27:08

opposed to something like Charlie Brown where like

27:10

everybody's sort of sad Yeah,

27:13

just like every child is depressed. Yeah Winnie

27:15

the Pooh is very like there is Characters

27:19

do have bad feelings, but everything is

27:21

so kind of floaty and dreamy and

27:23

so little like sticks with yes Characters

27:26

that they don't really no one

27:29

really inhabits bad feelings except for

27:31

Eeyore who is the whole deal

27:33

is bad Yes, yes,

27:35

and who honestly kind of seems

27:37

happy there sometimes like paradoxically. Yeah

27:40

So what is this collection like Andrew

27:43

was it like it's so I I

27:45

read the first one like

27:47

as a as Next I could

27:49

talk about any like stylistic differences because these

27:52

are it like you you'd said there was

27:54

that other small collection of things But when

27:56

that was not all pooh like they're like

27:58

a story in it or something. Yeah Like,

28:00

but these are like the bulk of

28:02

the text upon which the Pu Empire

28:04

has been built. Yeah. And

28:07

yet there's this, I

28:11

liked House at Pu Corner. I

28:13

will say I don't think, I

28:17

don't think there was anything in it I liked quite as

28:19

much as some of the stuff that I liked in the

28:21

first one. Like there are always, so

28:23

here's a bit from the first book that I,

28:28

that I think is hilarious on like three

28:30

different levels, including

28:32

the word play, okay, the word play level.

28:35

Sure. This is about Piglet and the house he

28:37

lives in. Great. Next to his house was

28:39

a piece of broken board which had Trespasser's W on

28:41

it. When Christopher Robin asked Piglet

28:43

what it meant, he said it was his

28:45

grandfather's name that had been in the family

28:47

for a long time. Christopher Robin said, you

28:50

couldn't be called Trespasser's W. And Piglet said,

28:52

yes, you could, because his grandfather was. And

28:54

it was short for Trespasser's Will, which was

28:56

short for Trespasser's William. And his grandfather had

28:58

had two names in case he lost one,

29:00

Trespasser's after an uncle and William after Trespasser's.

29:03

Yeah. Heck

29:08

yeah. So first, you know, a

29:10

sign that obviously said, used to say

29:12

Trespasser's Will be shot or something on

29:14

it. Being

29:18

transformed into this like misunderstanding about our

29:20

grandfather name. And then the, you know,

29:22

he was named after his uncle and

29:25

then the word William physically comes after

29:27

the word Trespasser's. And just like seamlessly

29:30

doing that kind of weird, Yes.

29:33

Like floaty, whimsical wordplay

29:37

is most of what the book is. Like

29:39

it's most of what makes it enjoyable to read.

29:41

I mean, all the characters are very cute and

29:44

there's a lot of good like, just like childhood,

29:46

like Calvin and Hobbes kind of stuff in here.

29:49

But the reason to read it now

29:51

is mostly because all of this prose just

29:53

kind of owns. So what's coming

29:55

back to me is like, it's the quality

29:57

that really makes it sing is

29:59

like. Christopher Robin, who is a

30:01

child, is also

30:04

encountering child-like behavior

30:06

and ways of thinking through

30:09

his animal friends that are, you know, they're all

30:11

his stuffed animals, but they have their lives in the

30:13

forest and he learns about them. And

30:15

so you get the dual kind of

30:17

like the kid or the adult

30:19

reading the book to the kid gets to

30:22

talk through some of this fun kid logic, but

30:25

like you tell me, I have

30:27

met four and five-year-olds who have said wilder

30:30

stuff exactly like that to me

30:32

and it's really fun to engage

30:34

with. Yeah, okay. But

30:36

you found is like what is the, is

30:40

there a deep step down for

30:42

Pooh Corner or is it just, you know? No,

30:44

no, no, not a deep step down. Like if

30:46

anything, it's very consistent and it's just like how

30:50

when you are eating like you're, when

30:53

you're getting toward the end of like a

30:55

third or fourth piece of pizza, you're not

30:59

enjoying the pizza on quite the same

31:01

primal level as you were the first

31:03

time you took the first

31:06

piece of pizza. Sure,

31:08

okay. You know, we can't, sophomore albums are

31:10

tough, man. That's like

31:12

a well-known thing. Sure. So

31:15

yeah, this is like, this is all good. It's

31:17

just, it's, you know, if you're going to read

31:19

one of them, obviously you read the first one

31:22

and this has Tigger who is like an indelible

31:24

character and especially became like the Urkel of the

31:26

franchise. You

31:28

did, you're right. Starting in like

31:30

later animated adaptations in

31:33

so far as he kind of took it over. Sure.

31:36

If you don't understand what Urkel-ing something is. Yeah, yeah,

31:38

you're right. You're not a hundred years old like we

31:40

are. So

31:44

yeah, it's a collection of 10 stories. They're

31:46

kind of told in chronological order, like

31:48

things that happened in previous stories are

31:51

remembered, including stuff that happened in the

31:53

previous book. Great, okay. But, you know,

31:55

you kind of start from, you

31:59

start from knowing. Like the basics of what these

32:01

characters are about at the beginning of each story. And

32:03

that's all you really need to know to enjoy them.

32:06

Um, so the first story is, uh,

32:09

chapter one in which a house is

32:11

built at Pooh corner for Eeyore and

32:13

it's pretty, pretty, pretty straight forward. But

32:17

the, the way that the story

32:19

unfolds is very, is very Pooh because

32:22

Pooh and people are hanging out, they

32:24

decide they want to build a house on

32:26

Eeyore. And in

32:28

doing so, so they, they go and they find a

32:31

big pile of, just a big pile of sticks, there's

32:33

a big pile of sticks over there would be perfect

32:35

for a house. And it becomes

32:37

clear later, as we, in a

32:39

separate scene with Eeyore and Christopher Robin, that

32:41

Eeyore has, has a house and

32:43

he's lost it. And

32:46

it turns out that Pooh and Piglets, like pile of

32:48

sticks was Eeyore's house. And they just like took it

32:50

down and rebuilt it somewhere else, like trying to do

32:52

a nice thing for Eeyore. Eeyore.

32:56

And they build the house there and Pooh

32:58

decides that this place should be called Pooh

33:01

corner and Piglet helps by finding sticks.

33:03

And Pooh says, thank you Piglet. What you've just

33:05

said will be a great help to us. And

33:08

because of it, I could call this place Pooh

33:10

and Piglet corner. If Pooh corner didn't sound better,

33:12

which it does smaller and more like a corner.

33:16

I could just hear, I don't know when you,

33:18

when you just say it out of context like

33:20

that, Pooh sounds like way more of an egotist

33:23

than I remember. I could just hear that kind

33:25

of. Like, he doesn't mean anything by it. And

33:27

Piglet will ultimately agree. Like, yeah, you're right. Pooh

33:30

corner is a better name for a

33:32

corner than Pooh and Piglet corner. I

33:34

just like listening to my mind's image

33:36

of his voice saying, you know, putting

33:39

down Piglet, Pooh Piglet, you

33:41

sound better as Pooh corner.

33:44

Yeah. Voice actors Sterling

33:46

Holloway did like the old, like

33:49

blustery day and Wayne and the Pooh and the Honey Tree shorts.

33:52

Sure. And then since

33:55

1988, Jim Cummings has

33:57

been the voice actor. Yeah. Hard to know.

33:59

Yeah. I've not listened to it side by side

34:01

of their two voices, but as

34:04

happens once a character's voice

34:07

is established in animation, probably subsequent voice actors

34:09

are just doing their version of

34:12

whatever the original guy was doing. Yeah, because we were

34:14

worried about what Chris Pratt was going to do to

34:16

Mario. He

34:19

blew all our minds with something we never could have

34:21

imagined. Whatever it was he said in that interview. It's

34:26

going to be, you've never heard it before. Okay,

34:30

so they built a house for Eeyore. They built a

34:32

house for Eeyore. That's the first story. The second story,

34:34

here he comes. It's Tigger. Tigger comes

34:36

to the forest and has breakfast. Okay. Where

34:39

did he come from? The jungle? He just shows

34:41

up. This happened in the first book too, like

34:43

midway through, Kanga and Roo

34:45

just kind of appeared. Yes. It's

34:47

done in a way. Christopher Robin knows the

34:50

toys there. He

34:52

never heard the animal or whatever, however you want to think

34:54

of them. He's never surprised by

34:56

the presence of a new character in this wood.

34:58

It is only the other characters who have to

35:01

meet the new

35:03

animal. So

35:06

it is very much in a ... The

35:09

first book had a little

35:11

bit more of a frame

35:13

where there was somebody named

35:16

Christopher Robin who was being

35:18

told stories by an unnamed

35:20

narrator who's loosely implied to be the

35:23

author. I remember that. There's

35:26

not really anything of that in

35:28

this. In

35:31

both cases, it has

35:34

the quality of a kid

35:36

bringing a new toy home from somewhere for the

35:38

first time. Yes, and you've got to integrate it

35:41

into the lore. The other

35:43

toys like meet the new

35:45

one sort of one at a time as it comes

35:47

up. This happens when Henry gets a new stuffy. Yes,

35:49

sure. Is it going to be a basement stuffy, a

35:52

bed stuffy? Is it going to migrate from one to

35:54

the other? Where is it going to rank? Brown

35:57

and green turtle, obviously. The king. replaceable

36:00

but there have been others who have come and

36:02

gone. The Emperor Turtle. Right

36:04

now Simon has a animatronic

36:06

penguin that is

36:08

the first thing he's really carried around with.

36:11

He's got a very like my

36:13

first friend my enemy relationship with this penguin

36:15

though from the footage that I've seen of

36:17

him interacting with it. Yeah he bonked his

36:19

face on that penguin by accident and then

36:21

put his foot on that penguin's neck while

36:24

he made it sing a song. So eye

36:26

for an eye penguin. Kid

36:28

was born with a strong sense of

36:30

justice. Yeah so Tigger just like shows

36:32

up outside of Pooh's door

36:35

just like making noise and Pooh goes out

36:38

and he says hello in case

36:40

there's anything outside. Hello said whatever it was.

36:42

Oh said Pooh hello. Hello oh

36:45

there you are said Pooh hello. Hello said the

36:47

strange animal wondering how long this was going on.

36:49

Pooh was just going to say hello for

36:51

the fourth time when he thought that he wouldn't

36:54

so he said who is it instead. Yeah. Me

36:56

said a voice. Oh said Pooh well come here.

36:58

So whatever it was came here and in

37:00

the light of the candle he and Pooh looked

37:02

at each other. I'm Pooh said Pooh. I'm Tigger

37:05

said Tigger. Oh said Pooh for you

37:07

never seen an animal like this before. Does Christopher

37:09

Robin know about you? Of course he does said

37:11

Tigger. Well said Pooh it's the middle of

37:13

the night which is a good time for going to sleep and

37:15

tomorrow morning we'll have some honey for breakfast. Do Tiggers

37:17

like honey? They like everything said Tigger

37:20

cheerfully. This sets up the

37:22

crux of this book where Tigger insists

37:24

that Tiggers love everything or Tiggers

37:27

like everything except honey and

37:29

every time Pooh tries to find Tigger

37:31

a new food for breakfast Tigger

37:34

eats it considers it and

37:36

is like Tiggers like everything except all

37:38

the stuff that you've just tried to get me for

37:41

breakfast. Good yes

37:43

Tiggers very bouncy and rambunctious. He does

37:46

not look he looks

37:48

a bit more Tigery than the like

37:50

he does not take on the visage

37:53

of like the Disney Tigger in this

37:55

book. Sure who is classic. Yeah

37:58

he's a well-designed And

38:00

like a more explicit like his tail is

38:02

more explicitly spring-loaded. I think in the Disney

38:04

version Yeah, he like bounces a lot, but

38:07

it's not I Don't think

38:09

he is bouncing on his tail like a

38:12

pogo stick. No in this book

38:14

He's like like a cat around a lot

38:16

because cats jump. Yes. Yes. No, he is

38:18

not like yes. He doesn't have a You

38:21

know spring attached to his butt in the same way

38:24

that the film Tigger does

38:27

Does any sort of wonderful the wonderful thing

38:29

about Tiggers? That's an invention of a film at some

38:32

point. That's not in here Is it it's not in

38:34

here? No, there's no like most of

38:36

the the the Poetry making and the song

38:38

making is done by poo. There's no great.

38:41

Okay, there's no there's no wonderful thing about

38:43

Tiggers There's no I T. I double good

38:45

earth stuff It's

38:47

very much in the vein of this character. Like I

38:49

think there is a lot less distance between The

38:53

Milne characters and like the modern

38:55

Interpretations of them than there are

38:57

between like steamboat Willie Mickey and

38:59

yeah modern Mickey. Sure. Yep But

39:03

yeah, there's still some still some stuff I assume

39:05

you could get in trouble if you used in

39:07

a public domain work with those characters in it

39:11

Yeah, just poo brings ever like in trying

39:13

to find what Tigger eats. He introduces

39:16

him to everybody else Tigger

39:20

Hits it off with rue who is

39:22

Kangas kid. Mmm, cuz they both are

39:24

sort of childlike and they both enjoy

39:26

bouncing around. Yeah And

39:31

What's the thing that he

39:34

eventually ends up finding that

39:36

Tiggers like best is extract

39:38

of malt. Yeah malt extract

39:41

Yeah, which it's like what we

39:44

use for brewing beer. Yeah, but

39:46

like we've Tasted

39:50

Straight malt extract like just just to see

39:52

what it was like and

39:54

I would not You

39:57

figure it's not unlike eating

40:00

It's sort of a savory molasses like yeah,

40:02

yeah, yeah, that's exactly what it is

40:05

No, thanks, but more for Tigger.

40:07

I got bigger loves best. I guess it was like the

40:10

1920s. So they ate all kinds of stuff Sure,

40:13

yeah because of the war They

40:16

couldn't get anything. I feel like I need

40:19

to stop trusting Wikipedia pages that make that

40:21

of that Like

40:23

I don't know the characters in this book were eating

40:25

weird stuff because of war it was because of the

40:27

war They didn't have a good sugar. They had just

40:29

had to take vaguely sweet things wherever

40:32

they could get So

40:34

what are the other stories kind of covering we got

40:37

the other stories? It's

40:41

So the blustery day story is in

40:44

here. Okay, cool. Um, owls house blows

40:46

over and They

40:48

have to find him a new house. Okay, how

40:51

was how was the funny character in here because

40:53

it's like He

40:55

kind of is knowledgeable about things

40:58

and He can kind

41:00

of read and kind of spell He's

41:02

almost an adult like the big the

41:05

big marker of how smart owl is

41:07

that characters come back to over and

41:09

over again? Is that he can spell Tuesday?

41:13

Rabbit who is one of the other smart characters?

41:15

Yes Christopher

41:18

Robin depends on me He's fond of poo and

41:20

piglet and Eeyore and so am I but they

41:22

haven't any brain not to notice and he respects

41:25

owl because you Can't help respecting anybody who can

41:27

spell Tuesday even if he doesn't spell it right,

41:29

but spelling isn't everything There are days when spelling

41:31

Tuesday simply doesn't count And

41:34

then this comes back. There's a later

41:36

section where before I think I

41:39

don't remember if this is where his house blows over

41:41

It doesn't it doesn't matter but he's thinking about it

41:44

how smart he is himself He Could

41:47

spell his own name Wol and

41:50

he could spell Tuesday so that you knew it

41:52

wasn't Wednesday and he could read quite comfortably when

41:54

you weren't looking over His shoulder and saying well

41:56

all the time It's

42:04

like smart with qualifications. He

42:06

always has something to say. Him and Rabbit both.

42:08

And that's the energy they

42:10

bring. Yeah. Big smart

42:12

guy energy. Okay. What

42:15

other recognizable stories? So

42:18

there's blustery day. There's one where Tigger

42:21

gets stuck up in a tree with

42:23

Rue because he's saying, you know, Tigger's

42:26

can do everything. Much like he was

42:28

saying, Tigger's love to eat everything. Yeah.

42:31

And he climbs halfway up a tree, realizes that Tigger's

42:33

do not actually climb trees. Oh no. And

42:35

he gets stuck up there for a

42:38

while. Oh. And

42:41

then there's like, I don't

42:43

know, like what, I want to talk

42:45

about the last story. Okay. It

42:49

knows it's the last story. Like Milne isn't leaving

42:52

the door open to do another collection of

42:54

these. I think in real life, you

42:56

know, his real life

42:58

son Christopher was growing up and

43:01

he was sort of moving

43:03

on and also, you know, to the extent

43:06

that he did get inspiration

43:08

from his children as many, many, many

43:10

authors we've read have done, you know,

43:12

we've read tons and tons of books

43:15

that allegedly started as like

43:17

bedtime stories for kids, like

43:19

their kids. Yeah. He

43:22

just, he just was not going to have like this story

43:25

engine to work off of anymore.

43:29

Probably the, if, if

43:32

the real life Christopher Milne's like

43:34

sense of exploitation came from

43:37

anywhere, I think that's probably it. It's just like, you

43:39

know, I thought I was playing with my dad or

43:41

I thought I was telling him this weird story about

43:43

a thing I did, or I thought I was just

43:45

like saying something to him and he took it and

43:48

he put it in a book and now everybody's following

43:50

me around. I'm talking about it at me. Yeah.

43:54

Yeah. All right. Well, yeah. Close

43:56

it out. I don't, you know, I'm sure there are things

43:58

from the cartoons that I might recognize. But I don't I

44:01

don't know that to bring it up sure and yeah

44:03

The you've already answered the question I was going to

44:05

ask which is just kind of like in

44:08

your You know

44:10

your cultural just understanding of these characters It

44:12

seems pretty true to how they appear in

44:15

the stories Which is always kind of fun

44:17

to encounter you know 80 years

44:19

hence or yeah, everybody everybody is

44:21

pretty fully formed Even if there

44:23

are specific, you know copyrightable

44:26

catchphrases Sure

44:32

Chapter 10 is called Christopher Robin in which

44:34

Christopher Robin and poo come to an enchanted

44:36

place and we leave them there. Oh so

44:39

very yeah, and it's they

44:43

All the animals have become aware that Christopher

44:45

Robin is going away That's the first line

44:47

of the of the thing Christopher Robin was

44:49

going away. Nobody knew why he was going

44:51

nobody knew where he was going Indeed no

44:53

one nobody even knew why he knew that

44:55

Christopher Robin was going away But somehow or

44:58

other everybody in the forest felt that it

45:00

was happening at last. This is worse than

45:02

Toy Story 3 3

45:05

like the toys are like somewhat conversant in human

45:07

life and can be like well, he's got to

45:09

go to college Yeah, right.

45:12

There's there's like systems where we like go

45:14

in the attic and then we get passed down Yeah,

45:17

and there's an earlier story in here where

45:19

nobody knows what Christopher Robin does in the

45:21

morning and it's I like it And it's

45:23

that he is going to school and getting

45:25

educated and they eventually like figure it out

45:27

But they don't really know what that is.

45:29

Oh, that's so cool. Okay. Yeah, but yeah,

45:31

it's it's time for him to go away

45:34

So all the animals get together and sign

45:36

a resolution r

45:38

is s o l Ut I

45:40

o n one of many like, you

45:43

know minor like intelligible Misspellings

45:45

that's like played up for comic effect.

45:47

Yep. Yep. Yep all the animals sign

45:49

it and They

45:53

give to Christopher Robin and all as

45:55

he's can as he's reading it. They

45:58

all kind of drift away. Not not in a

46:01

like fading into a snap way.

46:04

Yeah, they didn't really exist like that fake Calvin

46:06

and Hobbes comic kind of way, but they all

46:10

just kind of drift off until it's just Christopher

46:12

Robin and Pooh and they're walking around in the

46:14

wood. And

46:16

Christopher Robin says, what do you like doing best? And I

46:19

can read all of this because his book's in the public

46:21

domain now. What

46:26

do you like doing best in the world, Pooh? Well

46:28

said Pooh what I like best and then he had

46:30

to stop and think because although eating honey was a

46:32

very good thing to do, there was a moment just

46:34

before you began to eat it, which was better than

46:36

when you were, but he didn't know what it was

46:38

called. And then he thought that

46:40

being with Christopher Robin was a very good thing to do

46:42

and having Piglet near was a very friendly thing to have.

46:44

And so when he thought it all out, he said, well,

46:46

I like best in the whole world as me and Piglet

46:49

going to see you and you saying, what about a little

46:51

something and me saying, well, I shouldn't mind a little something.

46:53

Should you Piglet and it being a humming sort of day

46:55

outside and bird singing. I

46:57

like that too said Christopher Robin, but what I like

46:59

doing best is nothing. How do you do

47:02

nothing? Asked Pooh after he had wondered for a long time. Well,

47:04

it's when people call out at you just as you're going off

47:06

to do it. What are you going to do Christopher Robin? And

47:09

you say, oh, nothing. And then you go and do it. Oh,

47:12

I see said Pooh. This is a nothing sort

47:14

of thing we're doing now. Oh, I see said

47:16

Pooh again. It just means going along listening to

47:18

all the things you can't hear and not bothering.

47:20

Oh, said Pooh. And

47:22

later, Christopher Robin says,

47:25

I'm not going to do nothing anymore.

47:27

Never again. Well, not so much. They don't

47:30

let you. And

47:33

it's just a nice

47:35

and like heartbreaking little

47:38

summation of what growing up is.

47:40

It's just like they don't let you do

47:42

nothing anymore as much. Oh,

47:44

no. And

47:47

they both sort of promise each other

47:49

that they'll be there. And Christopher Robin

47:51

said Pooh, said Christopher Robin earnestly. If

47:54

I'm not quite, he stopped and tried again.

47:56

Pooh, whatever happens, you will understand. Won't you

47:58

understand what? Oh, nothing. He'll have to jump

48:01

to his feet. Come on where said poo anywhere said

48:03

Christopher Robin So they went off together But

48:05

wherever they go and whatever happens to them on their way

48:07

in that enchanted place on the top

48:09

of the forest a little boy And his bear will

48:11

always be playing and so like implying

48:13

that Christopher Robin is gonna try to come back But

48:16

maybe he's not going to Yeah,

48:18

and and maybe he knows he's not going

48:20

to get to yeah, but you

48:22

know somewhere these characters are off doing their thing

48:24

still Yeah hanging

48:27

out. Yeah, I don't Sad

48:29

little twice. I had no idea that

48:31

this story was here. That's like yeah I didn't

48:33

I didn't know like I knew

48:35

that he hadn't written any poo stuff after

48:38

this but I had I Guess

48:40

assumed that there was other poo stuff Maybe

48:42

or just or just that it was you

48:44

know a second collection done without you know

48:47

Maybe he didn't know was ending or he

48:49

wanted to leave it open for other stuff

48:51

or he just didn't want it to You

48:55

know not not to put a period on the end

48:57

of the of the sentence Yeah, because I guess that's

48:59

the impulse of everybody who's doing creative Stuff

49:02

now is why would you why would you

49:04

close the door to the further lucrative opportunity?

49:07

Yeah, if you didn't have to with stuff

49:10

like this I always especially like you know

49:12

characters that have endured for so long I

49:14

always expect to like, you know Lift up

49:16

the log and find a whole other column

49:18

like with like Wizard of Oz like most

49:21

of us only encounter that as the movie And

49:23

then you find out there like 20 books 20

49:25

and odd looks like what are we doing? Yeah

49:28

I thought there was just a lion a witch in a

49:30

wardrobe. What do you mean? there's a prince and then you

49:32

know chair and Horse

49:35

and a boy and then the one girl can't go

49:37

to heaven or something Yeah, cuz you put too much

49:39

because you like boys too much. Yeah, I don't know

49:42

And so it's kind of refreshing to

49:45

encounter this and I think there's some

49:47

of that with Why

49:49

people revere like Bill Watterson for Calvin and

49:51

Hobbs just because of how we've we've referenced

49:53

that a few times this episode just

49:56

like Bill Watterson

49:58

did not exploit. I'll have to prove

50:00

that six the you know as part

50:03

of the success of this franchise. and

50:05

I guess you know lessened are also

50:07

responsible for how popular poo got in

50:09

in. A multi media way as

50:11

well. Of course Milne signed off on

50:13

that, but yeah, Yeah,

50:16

well you know something about

50:18

poo. This. Isn't this is match.

50:21

Think about. Like. When.

50:24

You would encounter cartoon characters on

50:26

Facebook with like some mouthy quote

50:28

attached to them. Relax, you know,

50:30

like Sassy Tweety Bird merchandise? Sure,

50:32

Sassy Garfield Merchandising? that. Hamels with

50:35

attitude. I feel like there's no

50:37

poo character who really got. Like.

50:39

Mass Market printed on like a plain

50:41

white tee shirt. Like making

50:44

their Dreamworks face threats like yet

50:46

daring. meat is to think about

50:48

how subversive and sassy they are

50:50

in no I actually as the

50:53

I've encountered, there's a book. Is

50:55

least one or two books I've read

50:57

one of them called like the Dow

50:59

of Poo where they take like they

51:01

read they write a bunch of Winnie

51:03

the Pooh stories or story like things

51:05

that map to like Taoist principles like

51:07

people are riffing on pool in a

51:09

different way. Are you obviously Disney's is

51:11

Kamala? Fight It but I don't think

51:13

you have the same like. You.

51:16

Know when they need. Every twenty years the

51:18

need to find out what to do with

51:20

the Looney Tunes again and most an imprint

51:22

t shirts that map to whatever the popular

51:25

culture is. Ah no I don't think I've

51:27

seen. Your.

51:29

Talking about dank memes or I'll update

51:31

the original rabbit would be the one

51:34

to tell you Get on the Grind

51:36

said I think yeah I guess he

51:38

build them for grind sex and guy

51:40

from. Yeah no I mean of

51:43

it's do we know for a fact that

51:45

our from Winnie the Pooh is now I'm

51:47

doing his own coup? It's too weird. Like

51:49

mike I'm paying video Sundays. ago

51:56

mya i'm worried anaheim most

51:58

bang channel I'm

52:00

not sure that that's not owl from

52:03

Duolingo now. Yeah, it might be him. We don't

52:05

might be him I mean he's in the public

52:07

domain now. So hey, I think

52:09

that owl has a specific name though. He's like

52:11

bingo or the owl or something What

52:17

website you used to search about the dueling oh

52:19

his name is duo You

52:23

can take another swing at that guys if you want yeah,

52:25

I mean duo will be when did the app first

52:27

come out Well, yeah,

52:30

I don't know I don't know when duo enters the

52:32

public domain But he is a separate character gonna be

52:35

a while gonna be a while him and flow will

52:37

you know? Enter the public domain or on the same

52:39

time. I'm sure me flow

52:41

from the progressive ads. Yeah Okay

52:44

duo the owl is from 2010 so in 2105

52:49

great Will be

52:52

able to use the original Duo

52:55

design which had a D

52:58

as the left eye The

53:00

you as a beak and an O as the

53:02

right eye whoa. He's not even green yet. He's

53:04

not green until 2011 look at him so

53:09

Yeah, we'll be able to use the original duo

53:11

the owl and 21 21. This is like a

53:13

FedEx logo I

53:16

don't think I know They

53:19

abandoned that idea, but it's not cool.

53:21

Yeah anyway. Thanks for telling that this

53:24

book Andrew you're welcome And

53:26

about all kinds of stuff is a little bit of a

53:28

rambly episode, but I think that serves

53:30

the energy of the book Yeah,

53:32

pretty well. Yeah If

53:35

you the listener Have thoughts on

53:37

poo the bear or you

53:39

want to talk to us about the public domain you can

53:41

send us an email Over to

53:43

[email protected] or hit us up on social

53:45

media We're on all number of

53:48

platforms these days because some of the old

53:50

standbys or Hmm

53:54

Over to pods is where you find us shout

53:57

out to Cheyenne Becky Morgan

53:59

Jeff Sarah Cole and

54:01

many more for reaching out in the past

54:03

few weeks. Our

54:05

theme song is composed by Nick Lourandis. Andrew

54:07

folks want to know more about the show. Where do they go?

54:10

overduepodcast.com is our internet website up there. We have

54:12

the list of books that we have read and

54:14

the ones that we are going to read. I

54:16

think we'll be ready with our January scheduled soon.

54:18

Yep. I believe I'm the reason why it's not

54:21

ready yet. I can

54:23

tell you what to read, but that's less fun. Yeah.

54:25

But what are you reading? Oh,

54:28

we're doing another public domain

54:30

banger. One of our patrons

54:32

choice poll winners. Lady

54:35

Chatterley's Lover by DH Lawrence.

54:37

Nice. Okay.

54:39

We also have a Patreon

54:41

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54:44

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54:58

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55:02

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55:04

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55:06

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55:09

I think that's most of it. You get

55:11

our Oh, and the long reads shows. We just finished

55:14

up Sam by me on the public feed. Yep. And

55:17

on the private feed, we are a few episodes into

55:19

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55:21

Wilson's The Iliad Translation. So join us for that.

55:23

Yeah, check it out. And I think that's it. Right.

55:27

Yep, that is okay. All right, everybody. Thank

55:29

you so much for listening. Happy

55:32

2024 to everyone. We're going

55:34

to make it. Yeah, just white knuckle this thing.

55:36

Oh boy. And until we talk

55:38

to you next week, please try to be happy.

56:00

That

56:06

was a Head

56:10

Down Podcast.