Episode Transcript
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0:07
It's time now for another edition of Pats from
0:09
the Past podcast. Matt Smith, Paul
0:11
Prolo and please to be joined by former
0:13
Patriot quarterback Brian hoy Or.
0:15
Brian.
0:15
Thanks for coming by, man, Thanks appreciate you on guys. Yeah,
0:17
we asked this of everybody. So I
0:19
think people who are football
0:22
fans, Patriot fans know, is Brian gonna
0:24
play?
0:24
Is Brian not gonna play? What's what's going on with Brian
0:26
Hoyr these days?
0:27
Man, I don't know. I think it would take a great opportunity
0:29
to come along for me to do that. Obviously,
0:31
I was in Las Vegas last year. I know I
0:33
can still play because I beat the Patriots
0:36
last year, one of the most tooche, one of the most It's
0:38
on my list, Brian, one of the Twitter sweet moments
0:40
of my career. So we'll talk about that later. But you
0:43
know, so I know I can still physically do it. But
0:45
at thirty eight years old, my kids are getting older.
0:48
You know, I think it would take a really great
0:50
opportunity for me, you know, to come along,
0:52
for me to to kind of look and
0:54
see. But so I know I can still do it. Body
0:57
feels relatively healthy, and you
1:00
know, so we'll see. It's always open. People
1:02
always say, you know, if someone's
1:05
offering you an opportunity to play and you feel like you could
1:07
do it, you know, you know, I remember a
1:09
former teammate saying, play till they tell you you can't.
1:12
So definitely capable of
1:14
it. It's just got to be I think, the right opportunity
1:16
at this point.
1:16
You know, idiots like us sit there
1:19
and oh, you know, you can play, or it's time to
1:21
go, and everything like that. But I don't think the
1:23
lay people realize what's
1:25
it like to make that decision as a family.
1:28
Yeah, when you have a.
1:28
Wife who's supported you cross
1:31
country trips, taking kids back
1:34
and forth, at some point in time,
1:36
her decision or her opinion, while
1:40
always valued, you got to really listen
1:42
to. That's got to be hard, like from a as a
1:44
family standpoint, like at what point time
1:46
do I need to devote my time to them?
1:48
Right? And that's a huge part of the decision making.
1:50
So that's why I said, like, it have to be the right opportunity
1:52
and all those things, because you
1:55
know, deciding to go to play in Las Vegas last year,
1:58
it was not an easy choice. It was an easy choice because
2:00
it was Josh in my relationship with him. But
2:03
it wasn't an easy choice in the regards of what
2:05
does this mean for my family? And thankfully
2:07
we had a great school here that allowed our kids
2:09
to kind of virtual school with the help of
2:11
a tutor out there. But it
2:13
was rough. It was it was a rough transition and
2:17
they were all happy to come back once the season was over.
2:19
And so now my son, he's going into seventh grade. He got
2:21
accepted as Avarian brother. So you
2:23
know, those are all things that you have to take into account,
2:25
Like I want to watch him play football at of course he's
2:28
watched me play for a long time. So maybe it's times,
2:30
you know, for a role.
2:31
Reverse when you have when
2:33
you came out of Michigan State, I mean, you
2:36
didn't get drafted, yep, And I don't know what your
2:38
expectations were heading in, but to
2:41
then have what a fifteen year career
2:44
off of that, what were your expectations sort
2:46
of when you arrived here in two
2:48
thousand and nine, what were you hoping for.
2:51
I was just talking about this with my son the other day and
2:53
I said, listen, when I didn't get drafted,
2:55
you know, I kind of thought Okay, the Patriots
2:58
are going to sign me. I'll learn for Tom
3:00
Brady. Obviously, I grew up I watched Bill
3:03
coach in Cleveland, so I always kind of had
3:05
an affinity to him, and obviously him being
3:07
a great coach, I thought it was a great opportunity
3:09
to go learn. And I thought, you know, maybe i'll make the practice
3:11
squad if I get released. At least I'll learn
3:13
from these guys. And then sure enough, I
3:15
kind of worked my way up the ranks,
3:17
ended up being Tom's backup my rookie year. And
3:20
you know, the things that I learned in those first four years
3:22
were so invaluable to me that
3:25
when I finally got some opportunities to play,
3:28
you know, you put those in motion and then you just keep
3:30
stack in years, stack in years, and and
3:32
you know the thing about the quarterback position is if you're
3:35
relatively competent and you're a good guy,
3:37
and you make some connections, you know, you just extend
3:39
your career, extend your career. That's I mean, when
3:42
I look at last year, if if Josh
3:44
isn't the head coach in Las Vegas last year,
3:46
then you know, maybe my my my career
3:48
ends there. But you know. Luckily for me, I've
3:50
met a lot of great coaches, played with a lot of
3:52
great players, and made a lot of great connections
3:55
which allowed me to do that.
3:56
That's a little bit unorthodox Brian as
3:58
a rookie, Now you're back up Brady,
4:00
who's, by the way, is coming off a knee surgery at that point,
4:02
Tom, and you're the only backup quarterback
4:04
your rookie year. That was the same way in twenty
4:07
ten, you're the only backup court.
4:08
Like, not a lot of teams did that.
4:10
Well, how did that? What was your thought
4:12
process in that? Like you want to talk about literally
4:15
next man up into your one pitch away, Yeah, you're
4:17
one pitch away at that point.
4:18
I think I was too naive to even understand that at
4:20
that point. You know, now looking back, when you realize,
4:22
like Tom's coming off of major knee
4:25
reconstruction, had you know, some hiccups
4:27
along the way. Man
4:30
if I had had to play that year, I don't know how ready I
4:32
would have been. Obviously, Bill believed in me, and
4:34
Bill O'Brien believed to me, and and so
4:36
I'm sure it would have you know, worked itself out. We had a
4:38
really good team. So I think I would have relied on those guys
4:40
around me, But you
4:43
know, at that point, you're
4:45
just I was just thrilled to be an NFL
4:47
football player, and now I'm going to a
4:49
meeting room every day with Tom Brady and soaking
4:51
up what I can I can learn from him. And then
4:54
you know, that went for four years and then until
4:56
I got released in twenty twelve. So I
4:58
mean, those years, like you, those are kind of
5:00
like, you know, the years
5:02
you're building your foundation of your career, and I couldn't
5:05
have done it in a better place.
5:06
So I wanted to ask you a little bit about that rookie
5:08
season. You were part of
5:10
some really good teams, and you know, ultimately
5:13
you were part of a champion in eighteen,
5:15
but you know, you had that great year in twenty
5:18
ten, twenty eleven, you go to the
5:20
super Bowl in two thousand and nine. You probably didn't
5:22
recognize it at the time, it's your rookie year,
5:25
but do you kind of look back and say, there was a little bit
5:27
of something amiss in two
5:29
thousand and nine. That's sort of the way it's
5:31
kind of viewed here. That was kind of a reset
5:33
year, and we're very spoiled
5:35
because we've been right of a lot of when I didn't know any better
5:38
TENNISI is going to the playoffs and all that stuff is
5:40
not.
5:40
I thought it was great. I'm like, man, I'm a great
5:42
But did.
5:43
You did you sense any like sort of dysfunction
5:46
at the time, or you know, maybe looking
5:48
back at it, do you feel like that wasn't the
5:50
same as some of the better teams that you were on.
5:52
Definitely wasn't the same. I think looking
5:54
back now, knowing what I know and being on some great
5:56
teams, it wasn't. There was definitely
5:58
some learning curve, There was some adjusting
6:00
to new I mean, that was Bill O'Brien's first year as a
6:03
coordinator here, you know, so now I know how
6:05
important that is, you know, being a quarterback. When
6:07
you're learning, even if you're keeping somewhat
6:09
of the system intact, you're working with someone new and
6:11
and that was you know, so those were kind of I guess you
6:13
call growing pains. But I thought, like, man, we're
6:16
going to the playoffs, like we're this is I'm on the
6:18
Patriots. This is like a Super Bowl organization.
6:20
Like okay, one year, you know, we
6:23
didn't win the Super Bowl and I'm like, oh, we'll win it next year.
6:25
I mean, I think that that's kind of the expectation you
6:27
have when you come into that organization.
6:30
And I've always said this, I've always
6:32
looked at it. When Tom Brady was the quarterback,
6:34
I never went into a game thinking we're not gonna
6:36
win. Ever, there was never And when
6:39
I've been on other teams, whether I was the quarterback
6:41
or someone else is the quarterback, and I'm like, man, I
6:43
don't know how much a chance we have this Sunday. And
6:46
I can honestly say every game that I ever played
6:48
here backing Tom up, that there
6:50
was I never had that feeling. And obviously
6:53
a lot of other players around that. But you
6:55
know, when I talk with a lot of my old teammates, I think
6:57
that that feeling was very you know,
6:59
similar.
7:00
Bring it up because it's
7:02
again that's why I preface it by saying
7:04
we're spoiled. You know, when that's considered
7:06
a quote unquote down here. But you
7:09
know, Bill infamously said on that
7:11
documentary, I just can't get these guys
7:13
to play there.
7:13
I was playing in that game at the time,
7:16
Tom standing I'll get rushed
7:18
by New Orleans Lewins, and I think I remember thinking
7:20
to myself, like, wow, I'm playing in a Monday night football game.
7:23
You know, like, okay, one back game, we got
7:25
crushed, but I'm playing in a Monday night football game. That's
7:27
pretty cool. And you know, you see
7:29
that and you really and then having been on champion,
7:33
champion team and teams that went to Super Bowls, you
7:35
realize like, we probably didn't have a chance to go
7:37
to the super Bowl that year.
7:38
Right, And then you have that off season,
7:40
which I think is a very sort of important
7:42
offseason. Ye kind of
7:44
springboards the second run of the Dynasty.
7:47
You get Devine, you get
7:49
Gronk, you get Adan Hernandez. Did
7:51
you sort of sense like, wow, we're going to be a lot
7:53
better you sort of get into training
7:56
camp in twenty ten.
7:57
I think what I realized, you know, going into my second
7:59
year is a is like, wow, we added these two
8:01
tight ends. You add Devin who
8:04
you know clearly was a great player run off the
8:06
batom, he's returning kickoffs for touchdowns.
8:08
You know, a first round pick like you
8:10
added, and those are you know, I'm just
8:13
as young as them. So it's kind of like, wow, we got like some
8:15
really good players. We had Chung the year that I came.
8:17
Yep, Julian was coming, you know, kind of
8:20
creating his way. And I
8:23
mean, look, I whether it was night
8:26
being naive or I thought I
8:28
was on the greatest team with the greatest quarterback
8:30
and the greatest coach, I'm like you were, and
8:32
I was you were looking back. I understand
8:35
like you guys say, you're spoiled, But there was kind
8:37
of a lull in the action and having watching the
8:39
Dynasty myself, you know, I didn't do a
8:41
ton of research on the Patriots like what was
8:44
before I came, But it was kind of cool for
8:46
me to see like what happened, you
8:48
know, prior to when I was here, and
8:50
then kind of see the years that I was here, my
8:52
first stint and then it kind of ends
8:54
with my second stint here as kind of the end
8:56
of that show. But it was kind of cool to see
8:59
some of the stuff that I didn't experience, to see
9:01
you know, tie log and interviewed and kind of making
9:03
fun of Tom and and you know, see these
9:05
guys and like NuGen and stuff, and
9:08
and so for me that was kind of cool to kind
9:10
of see the part that I didn't really live right.
9:12
You were fourteen and two your second year, Tom was the
9:14
MVP. The backup
9:16
quarterback's job is to always be ready because
9:18
you're one snap away, one play away. And
9:21
I assume, but I want to ask you you prepared
9:24
as such? I need to be I need to be ready
9:26
to go. Was there ever anything in your mind?
9:28
And I understand he's coming off major surgery, need
9:30
reconstruction. Was there every time
9:32
you go? This guy's not missing any snaps? You
9:36
know what, They're gonna have to drag like the bone's
9:38
gonna have to be visible in
9:41
order for me to get in unless there's a blog because he's
9:43
not missing snaps.
9:44
Yeah, there was a There was a game my rookie
9:47
year down in Miami and
9:49
on Friday, probably I'll never forget this. On Friday
9:52
practice, we're
9:54
kind of just we're winding down like there might be
9:56
one offensive period left in practice,
9:58
and Isaiah Standback was playing
10:01
scout team gunner and he's coming down
10:03
the sideline and he was a kind of a quarterback slash
10:05
receiver and Tom's kind of
10:07
messing around, goes to grab him. His finger gets
10:09
caught in his jersey and he breaks his middle finger
10:11
on Friday with one period to go in
10:14
practice, and I'm like, oh God, like, I'm
10:16
gonna play this. I'm gonna I haven't practiced
10:18
all week.
10:19
This is just throw.
10:20
This is throwing him, and I'm
10:22
gonna have to play in this game. He broke his middle
10:24
finger and so of course
10:26
he goes and he sees Alex, and Alex is working
10:28
his magic and and he gets
10:31
a I'm pretty sure he got like a
10:32
a block, you know, like a
10:35
injection to block so he wouldn't feel it.
10:38
He's like, if I don't feel it, my body will just naturally
10:40
do what it does. And he throws
10:42
for like three hundred and forty yards and
10:45
I was like everyone knew
10:47
because he had to be added to the injurroom
10:49
sure, and people are like, oh, what is it? What? His middle
10:51
finger was broken? Right, And as
10:54
a rookie like, I'm you know, I'm nervous because
10:56
I haven't. It'd be one thing if you get a whole week of
10:58
practice and you know you're gonna play. It's literally
11:01
like I got like the last drive of practice on Friday,
11:04
and then it was like a constant monitoring process
11:06
of like where's he at? Where's he at? And we'd be doing I
11:08
was at BC the other day with Bill O'Brien watching practice
11:11
and we were talking about this story. I'm like, he's
11:13
like, remember we were going over to call sheet and Alex is
11:15
just like working on his finger, working on his finger. And I
11:17
mean that was the point I realized, like, this guy
11:20
is. I mean, for all we know about him
11:22
as a great player, the toughness
11:24
factor, I mean, the things that you saw
11:26
that I saw him play through and the toughness
11:28
was I mean, it's incredible. You could do a whole
11:30
documentary on that.
11:31
Well, talk about like Paul saying, what were
11:33
spoiled?
11:34
I think one of the things that we,
11:38
you know, loosely associated with the organization and
11:40
fans take for granted is
11:42
it's the line about availability, right, you
11:44
know, and you know better
11:46
than anybody, you know, if you're available
11:49
to play, you play. If you can't, you're
11:51
sort of discarded. Yeah, and you're out of sight,
11:53
out of mind. And I think the fact that
11:55
he told the line every
11:58
single week, regardless of what's going on. Great
12:00
player and everything like that, But I think that
12:02
that gets overlooked a lot of times when you talk about
12:04
him.
12:05
Yeah, he stepped up. He was there, ready to
12:07
go.
12:07
In all the years that I backed him up, I never had
12:09
to enter a game for his injury, which I mean,
12:11
that's amazing. I've had to do it multiple times other
12:13
places, oddly enough for two other Patriots
12:16
guys, Jacoby and Jimmy this past year.
12:18
But in all the years that I backed him
12:20
up, all the big hits that I saw,
12:22
I remember, I remember him taking a hit my rookie
12:24
year or second year by Elvis Dumerville.
12:27
There's a great clip where he's exactly and I'm
12:29
like, my chinstr I mean, he got
12:31
up, and you know, he talks about it. He's like, I took
12:33
pride in showing people that they weren't going to hurt me. And
12:36
I mean, you go to the
12:38
AFC Championship game in twenty seventeen
12:40
when his thumb gets all, you know, messed up. I'm
12:43
like, I'm playing this game. There's no way. I
12:45
just saw like his hands split open. There's
12:47
no way he's playing. And sure enough
12:49
he you know, he wears his red gloves out there and
12:52
we kind of messed with the media a little bit, but you
12:54
know, he through the work and commitments
12:56
he had to play. He played,
12:59
you know.
13:00
But you mentioned it, so let's
13:02
bring that up right there at that point in time
13:04
that was Was that Wednesday of the week or Thursday
13:06
of the week, was it?
13:07
I mean it was Wednesday because I end up
13:09
practicing all day Thursday Friday.
13:11
You're talking about not getting any reps. You had
13:14
reps at least mentally at that point time. You
13:16
wouldn't have been surprised if if Josh comes
13:18
up to and goes by the way you're up.
13:20
I fully expected to play until
13:22
I would say Sunday morning, you
13:25
know. And that was the I had just gotten back
13:27
like seven weeks prior to that, you know. And
13:30
I remember thinking to myself, well, you were the starting quarterback
13:32
in San Francisco at the beginning the year. This is where you wanted
13:34
to be. You're a starting quarterback in the NFL, Like
13:36
this was your goal anyway. So and
13:39
I'll never forget like that happening,
13:42
and everybody kind of just standing around, and
13:44
i''m like, all right, come on, like we gotta we
13:46
gotta move on, like we got to I gotta practice.
13:48
And I was the only quarterback, so I had to do every rep
13:50
on offense and every rep on scout team the remainder
13:53
of the week, and you know, I
13:55
just remember having so much confidence in the guys around
13:57
me that I was like, I feel good, I
13:59
know, plan really well, and I'll
14:02
be ready to go if need be. But sure
14:04
enough, Sunday morning rolls around and he
14:07
puts some you know, Canisio tape on it, and
14:09
I think the biggest thing was could he take a snap?
14:12
And once he figured out that, he was going to, you know,
14:14
power through that. I mean, some of the
14:16
plays he made in that game were incredible. How winning
14:19
the one to Amandola down the middle of the field.
14:21
I mean to throw that with the injury
14:23
that he had in his thumb, I don't even know how you
14:25
physically do that.
14:26
How about the game winner on the back of the line
14:28
that there's only one place to balkns right,
14:30
So in that situation, Brian, like, at
14:33
that point time you've seen him do all these different
14:35
things.
14:35
The Miami gave me a rookie year.
14:37
Are you beyond to mazed at that point or he just goes,
14:39
oh yeah, yeah, that's Tom.
14:40
I mean, there was there was really three times
14:43
in my career where I felt like that was going to
14:45
be the case. So we talked about the two and then the one.
14:48
I think it was in twenty eighteen after we lost
14:50
to Tennessee. He hurt his knee at the end of that game,
14:53
and I didn't really know the extent. It
14:55
was the week of Thanksgiving, and I think we had like a longer
14:57
for whatever reason, we had Thanksgiving off, but we practiced
14:59
on Wednesday, and he practiced the whole
15:01
day Wednesday, and so I'm like, all right,
15:04
he's good. And then I'll never forget,
15:06
like cooking my turkey outside.
15:08
I had like a big green egg. I'm smoking the turkey for the
15:10
first time. He calls me like, hey, babe, I
15:12
don't think I'm gona able to I don't think I'm gonna
15:14
be able to place on him. Like what are you talking about. You just practiced
15:17
the whole day. He's like, yeah, this
15:19
nee really like swoll up on me. And you
15:21
know, I'm gonna see what Alex can do. But you know, he's
15:24
like it just he's like I'm as a friend,
15:26
like I'm just telling you be ready to go.
15:27
It's interesting.
15:28
So I remember being like, all right, where's the playbook?
15:30
Like we got to put the extra time in and
15:33
that was a Sunday morning where me, Josh
15:36
and Bill are all waiting for Tom to come down to be
15:38
like are you are you gonna go?
15:39
What is it?
15:39
And in my in my mind, I'm
15:42
like, if he's walking down
15:44
here, he's gonna say I'm gonna play. But it's
15:46
just there was really three times in my career
15:48
where I was like, all right, you're probably gonna
15:50
have to play, and then sure enough, you know, it came
15:52
to the time for him to play, and he was good to go.
15:54
Do you have up the turkey?
15:56
It got a probably a little overcooked.
16:00
Oh oh yeah, A look,
16:03
so how about some of the times that you did
16:05
you did get to play some of the memories of that. Do you remember
16:08
the first game? I mean, I'm sure you do. Yeah, first time
16:10
you got in.
16:11
Well, that was the snow game in October against
16:13
you know, the Titans, which they had the
16:15
oilers uniforms. I mean, that was
16:17
one that was one of the great UNI games of all time. Yeah,
16:20
and I had just gotten engaged to my wife
16:22
that week and my birthday. It was a few weeks.
16:24
It was a great October was a great month my rookie
16:26
year, and you know, so we were killing
16:28
those guys and I got to go in and
16:30
it was in the snow. And you know that's
16:33
for me growing up in the in the north,
16:35
like in Cleveland, when it snowed, you went outside
16:37
to play football in the backyard because you can get tackled,
16:39
it's not going to hurt. And so to me, that was
16:42
kind of like the welcome to the NFL moment,
16:44
Like here I am, I'm playing a game, it's snowing.
16:46
I scored a touchdown on a quarterback sneak and
16:50
you know, so I'll never forget that. And then really, the
16:53
next time I really played like an extending amount
16:55
of time was the following year. I think it was the last game
16:57
the year against Miami, who touchdown past
16:59
Brandon Tate there you go, yeah, and got crushed.
17:01
It was it was I got crushed on the play.
17:04
They actually called it rough in the passer play, but
17:07
I was kind of happy. My first touchdown was like a bomb,
17:10
you know what I mean?
17:10
Do you show that one to your kids to say, hey, hey, why don't
17:12
you look at dad stay in the pocket here and get
17:16
his.
17:16
Head kicked in the touchdown pass.
17:18
That was one of the routes that we called the pistol route
17:20
that they talked about in The Dynasty with Randy.
17:23
When Randy came, he's like, listen, I'm just gonna go
17:25
where the open places. And so, you
17:27
know, I got to go in and they call a pistol route, and it's like you can
17:29
go either way and you're only supposed to
17:31
make like one cut and then go the opposite.
17:34
And Brandon's like boom boom. So I'm like and
17:36
then finally I see which way he's going, and I just I launched
17:38
it. And you know, that was a pretty good feeling
17:41
to throw, you know, fifty yard touchdown pass for your
17:43
first touchdown pass.
17:45
In eleven I
17:47
think you attempted one pass.
17:48
Yeah, it was Gronk's record.
17:50
What's the go So let's let the fans know about
17:52
what destroy because I don't I don't necessarily
17:55
remember that. Maybe that's just because I'm old and the
17:57
passage of time.
17:58
Yeah, but I don't have to go with the CT no.
18:00
No.
18:00
But but like that was a
18:02
at the time, that was a big deal.
18:03
Yeah, so it was that was the last game
18:05
of the season. It was Gronk and Jimmy
18:08
Graham. I think we're kind of battling
18:10
like for the yardage record right for
18:12
tight ends for a season, I think, and
18:14
they were kind of going back and forth and their
18:17
game ended, and and I think we realized
18:19
on the sideline that Jimmy Graham had like four yards
18:21
more than Rob. So we go
18:23
in and I just so
18:27
I remember going in, we were just gonna run the clock out,
18:29
and then Bill Grass me He's like, look, Kronk
18:31
needs like five yards to
18:33
break the records. So like we'll just put him outside
18:36
and throw a hitch. Well, like a hitch
18:38
is like a five six yard route. Catch the ball,
18:41
but we have a conversion if they press you.
18:43
So like if the guy comes up and pressed, you really can't
18:45
run a hitch. So he runs a fade
18:47
and and to be honestly, I kind of forgot that because I
18:49
was like, all right, I'm gonna take three step drop, I'm gonna throw
18:52
a five yard hitch. I don't even know if I looked out there
18:54
and I dropped back and I'm like, oh my god, he's running
18:56
a go route. And so I remember lofting
18:58
the ball up to him. He gets the record,
19:01
and then it was kind of questionable whether his feet
19:03
were inbound so we had to run like a quick play to make
19:05
sure that it's it's sat. So that
19:08
was a pretty cool memory too.
19:09
I love those kinds of things, though, because they're always
19:12
telling us like, oh, that's
19:14
a great well that game.
19:15
You know, that game was in the bag, and I think that mental
19:17
he obviously Rob, but also to Bill,
19:20
like, that's a huge record to break, and
19:22
Rob will always joke you know, I threw
19:25
him that pass to break that record, but I also threw
19:27
him his first touchdown pass, although it was in a preseason
19:29
game in Atlanta that year, remember,
19:31
so yeah, you know he yeah,
19:33
that's pretty impressive. Yeah, yeah, I do.
19:36
Remember, because I mean, like I
19:38
can only imagine what you guys thought on the
19:40
field. Talked about this a little
19:42
bits. No, no,
19:44
but no, but the fact, like all
19:46
of a sudden, these new weapons come in, we've
19:48
got to revitalize the offense.
19:50
We need to do more.
19:51
I mean, you guys must have like, oh,
19:53
my goodness, they're rookies, they're green and everything
19:56
like that. But the ability to see what
19:58
these guys could do in the field, yeah, was certainly
20:00
eye open.
20:00
Funny.
20:01
I do remember Bronk dragging some guys
20:03
against the Rams I think, yeah, that was here yep
20:06
into the end, and I remember thinking that kind of stuff.
20:08
I don't remember.
20:09
I think we all I think we all noticed. I think we
20:11
all realized like, oh my god, these
20:13
guys. I mean, he had never really
20:16
seen a pair like this before. And
20:18
I think Tom realized it early. And I know Rob
20:20
jokes like he thought Tom hated him. But Tom.
20:24
Tom would have those guys stay after practice and
20:27
we would throw to him, and we would have Dane
20:29
Fletcher I don't know if you guys really and
20:31
like, hey, Dane, can you come cover these guys because we
20:33
only just want to throw routes on air, I mean, and
20:35
we'd be like, all right, Dane, play uh play
20:37
cover five, which is like inside leverage two
20:39
man, and then we just run outbreaking routes to teach
20:42
them like when you get this coverage, you got to win your
20:44
leverage, and and so poor, you know, Dane was
20:46
like a little puppy dog. He'd be like, all right, we want to cover again,
20:48
and he'd be covering both guys back to back.
20:51
But you know, those were you know moments
20:53
where I looked at like Tom was building chemistry
20:55
with these young guys. And then the season
20:57
rolled around. In it, I think it showed like, I
21:00
don't think anybody in the league expected, you
21:02
know, this matchup nightmare
21:05
because the reality was and looking
21:07
back, I know more now, but as a second
21:09
year player, you don't understand like the
21:12
matchups that it created on teams.
21:14
It was, you know, usually you put two tight ends in a
21:16
game, the defense is gonna
21:18
put three linebackers in the game and four
21:20
dbs. Well, once they realized
21:22
we were thrown with these guys. Now they're putting two
21:25
linebackers in the game and five dbs, and
21:27
we were like, well, screw it. If they do that, we're just gonna
21:29
run the ball because both of them were great blockers.
21:32
And it was this constant mismatch
21:34
like, okay, we put that. We called it Detroit personnel.
21:37
Two tight ends, two receivers, and a half
21:39
back. You put that person on the field and you
21:41
just wait to see what the defense does. All right,
21:43
did they put regular defense, which is like
21:45
the four down lineman, the three linebackers
21:47
and the four dbs. All right, well, now we're gonna
21:49
spread them out. We're gonna throw it because one of those
21:52
linebackers is gonna have to cover one of these
21:54
tight ends, and so we'd put you know, Rob
21:56
on these seam routes, Aaron would be on these little routes
21:59
underneath, and it became a mismatched
22:01
nightmare. And then immediately when they would sub
22:03
in the nickel defense, they take a linebacker
22:05
out. Now we would just put them down and run
22:08
we called outside zone, you know, with
22:10
the full back slash tight end blocking
22:13
the extra linebacker which is now a dB,
22:15
and they would just block till the cows came home.
22:18
And I think that was the unique part of
22:20
it was they were both great pass catchers, but
22:22
they both could block, I mean, just as
22:24
well as you know, any other tight end
22:26
in the league.
22:27
Paul, you've historically
22:29
always talked about the games that the Patriot
22:31
should win that they weren't in. But one of the great what
22:33
ifs that I don't think it's a lot of attention here
22:35
in New England is on that eleven
22:38
team, what if Gronkowski
22:40
doesn't get hurt in the AFC Championship game. You
22:42
know, look, I'm surprised because I don't
22:44
think that was no disrespect to great Patriots
22:46
team, which stunned that they were actually
22:48
favored against the Giants.
22:50
Who beat you in.
22:51
Foxborough that year. But a
22:53
healthy Gronk, with a healthy
22:55
Welker and a healthy Hernandez
22:58
that that game was so close
23:00
that a healthy Gronk I think, don't you think?
23:03
Yeah?
23:03
I totally do. And to
23:05
you a point, like all the stuff that Brian's talking
23:07
about offensively was why
23:09
that team was in the correct The Super Bowl was one
23:12
of the weaker Patriots defenses,
23:14
Yes, certainly of any of the Super Bowl era,
23:16
right, And you
23:19
have to think if if you have Gronk and it took the
23:21
Giants a little while to figure out
23:24
he wasn't himself, right, you know? I think you even
23:26
hear that in one of the one of the micd ups.
23:28
You know, he's just a decoy out there. If
23:31
Rob is healthy, you know, how does that? How how
23:33
different does that?
23:34
I mean I look at Rob as clearly
23:36
you know, to me, having played with them, maybe
23:38
I'm a little biased, but the greatest tight end of all
23:40
time, not only because of his size, speed
23:44
and when you think of tight end's ability to run routes
23:46
and catch, but because he was such a great blocker.
23:49
The teams had to honor that. And I think
23:51
that's what made him so dynamic was you
23:53
know, we look at Travis Kelcey today, phenomenal
23:56
tight end, but clearly Travis isn't blocking anything.
23:59
Rob would blow like he was the right tackle,
24:02
and so that allowed you to do so many
24:04
things that you could put eleven
24:06
personnel in the game. But really it was like, you
24:09
know, and eleven personnel is one tight end
24:11
through receivers and a half back, but
24:13
really you're still kind of in you
24:15
know, a full back mentality,
24:17
tight end mentality blocking and you could run
24:20
which a lot of back then, a lot of teams weren't running the ball
24:22
from those formations. And so Rob,
24:25
I mean really changed the game in that matter
24:27
because he was aligneman who
24:29
was the premier pass catcher at the same
24:31
time. So you know, him being healthy
24:33
in that game and being able to threaten
24:36
their defense with the vertical passing game, you
24:38
know, probably would have helped. I
24:40
never liked to look back and say what if, because there's
24:43
you know, so many plays in a game, so many players playing,
24:45
but Rob obviously was you know, a
24:48
critical part of that team. Question.
24:49
So you go to Cleveland in twelve,
24:52
right, yep, thirteen, Uh, okay,
24:54
yep. At
24:56
some point time as you're apprenticing
24:58
under Tom. You're learning all this, it's
25:00
got to be in your mind. It's time for me
25:02
to see if I can start. Sure here gets your
25:04
opportunity to do that. We're talking about
25:06
what is and should have and stuff like that, as far as we'll h
25:10
in that Super Bowl?
25:12
Do you think at all about what is and should is?
25:14
You guys are rolling a.
25:15
Little bit before the Pittsburgh game. Yep, you
25:17
know, does that one come? You know, if
25:19
I don't get hurt?
25:20
Ye, I wonder if Yeah, that's
25:22
that's probably when I look back at my career
25:25
and even more so being a Cleveland kid
25:28
who grew up and getting
25:30
finally a chance, you know, like you said, back
25:32
up Tom for three years, go to a
25:34
super Bowl, don't win the Super Bowl, you know, get
25:36
released the next year, out of football for ten weeks, and
25:39
then now here I am on my hometown
25:41
team, get a chance to start, win
25:43
two games. There's a night game, big
25:45
game, you know, there's a lot of hype and tear
25:48
my aco. I think that's probably if I
25:50
look at back at like if I could say, there's one
25:52
huge what if? Now, granted I end
25:55
up rehabiting and coming back and being the starter again
25:57
there the next year, but you know, you just Tomember
25:59
like our coaches got fired after that year because we didn't
26:01
win another game. And you
26:04
know, so for me, that's probably like when
26:06
I look back, like you know, we talk
26:08
about like branch realities and multiverse
26:11
and all that stuff, like maybe somewhere in some you
26:13
know reality, I didn't get hurt and ended
26:15
up staying there and maybe don't go to nine
26:17
different teams. But you
26:20
know, if everything works out for a reason, if I was still
26:22
playing there, then I went and came back here in seventeen and
26:25
won a Super Bowl.
26:25
So what do you consider
26:28
your best season?
26:30
Oddly enough of me playing you
26:33
know, when statistically looking, you probably look at Houston
26:35
as my best year. It was that I only
26:38
ended up playing like nine full games due to injury
26:40
and actually.
26:40
Getting benched nineteen touchdowns.
26:42
Yeah, and so that was great. But I look at the stretch
26:44
I had in Chicago, and that
26:47
was with a guy offensive coordinator,
26:49
Dallala Loggins, who had a little influence
26:51
from this tree, the Patriots tree,
26:53
but also he was with me in Cleveland with Kyle Shannan,
26:56
and he kind of melded those two systems together.
26:58
And I think I had four or five games in a row three hundred
27:01
yards passing at least two touchdowns in every game.
27:03
And then of course again of what if break
27:05
break my forum on a Thursday night game. Those those
27:07
Thursday night games weren't very very.
27:10
There's no injury problem here,
27:13
We're going to change the kickoff, Matt.
27:15
So you know, that was probably my best
27:18
stretch, I think statistically, you know,
27:20
Houston was a crazy year because I start
27:23
Week one and then somehow
27:25
after, you know, battling for the job on
27:28
hard knocks, you know, I get bench for a Ryan
27:30
Mallet and then it doesn't work
27:32
out with him. I come back in, we go to the playoffs,
27:34
and then self admittedly play like the worst
27:36
game in my entire athletic career, going
27:38
back to like first grade. You know, it was just
27:40
one of those days things weren't working and
27:42
then that was it. And I think that's
27:45
the reality of like a guy like me in the NFL.
27:47
You come in undrafted, you don't have a lot
27:49
of hype behind you, and anytime you
27:51
falter, they're like, well that's why, that's why.
27:53
And so I'm thankful that I was able to have
27:55
the career I have. But you know, if you're
27:57
a first round pick, you're gonna get multip
28:00
opportunities because that's why you were a first
28:02
round pick. So I mean, that's just the way the
28:04
cookie crumbles and you learn how to work
28:06
the business side of it. But yeah,
28:08
probably Houston was probably my best year, which that
28:11
was reuniting with Bill O'Brien in this system
28:13
and knowing you know, kind of that.
28:15
Brian you talk about you talked earlier about
28:18
parent your son's in seventh grade,
28:21
you know, maybe has a little bit more of a realization
28:24
about what it was that you were doing, what you were going
28:26
through, just from a parenting and a
28:28
teaching standpoint. The fact that you
28:30
were in Pittsburgh, Arizona,
28:33
San Francisco, Chicago, three
28:36
tours with New England, Like, is
28:38
that a good teachable moment for your kids? Like, who
28:40
knows what they're gonna do. But you know what got'd
28:42
be resilient in life, babe.
28:43
Yeah, I know. That's the thing. Is what I try to relate to
28:45
them is you know, you
28:49
said resiliency,
28:51
you know, dealing with adversity and
28:54
look, I know I'm talking about playing in the NFL. I
28:56
know that people have a lot of different, you know, things
28:58
that.
28:58
They deal with, but those are Mary Pratz.
29:00
Right, those are yeah, but my kids, I mean they've lived
29:02
in the military, right, so
29:06
but I think, you know, it teaches you that, you
29:08
know, things aren't always going to go your way in life, and
29:10
you have to figure out how to you know, work
29:12
your way through those times. And you
29:14
know, I was always grateful that I always had
29:16
the opportunity to come back here because after
29:19
being in all those places, I craved the culture
29:21
of New England. I craved the tough
29:24
we're gonna make We're gonna do everything we can to win. And
29:27
sure were there days that were miserable that we
29:29
all kind of came in after practice
29:31
and was like like I don't want to go to this meeting. Yeah,
29:33
but I also after being on teams that
29:36
you know, it was fun on Wednesday, it was fun on Thursday,
29:38
it was fun on Friday. But Sunday rolled around and
29:41
you got your butt kicked. Like I was
29:43
thankful to come back to this culture and be around
29:45
guys that you know, I kind of started
29:48
my career with and now they had become like the leaders
29:50
of the team, like the mccordy's obviously
29:52
Tom was still here, but you know, Julian high
29:55
Tower, you know, guys like that, David
29:57
Andrews, you know the guys who you
29:59
know they got it and it was I
30:02
was excited to be back. So you know, you never
30:04
know what path you're going to take. And you
30:06
know, everyone always jokes like success is kind of like always
30:09
upward. It's it's up and it's down, and you
30:11
know, so just like my career, there's highs and lows,
30:13
and you know, I wouldn't change a thing I think
30:15
along the way. I always tell my agent this, like, you
30:18
know, at every fork in the road, I always felt like we made
30:20
the right decision.
30:21
That's great. I hope I am not screwing
30:23
this up. One more kid question.
30:26
When you were traded back here was
30:28
that Halloween?
30:29
It was Halloween night. I remember being there.
30:31
You got this isn't I mean we want
30:33
to talk about we're dad's you know, you
30:35
remember going out trick or treating with your kids.
30:38
Okay, he's in the NFL.
30:39
It's a little bit different, but at the end of the day, still
30:41
a dad. You're traded back to
30:43
Hey, we're going back to New England.
30:44
This is great.
30:45
Tell us a story. So I remember
30:47
leaving the facilities
30:50
in San Francisco that day and I was like, all right, see
30:52
tomorrow, Kyle, see tomorrow. And
30:55
I think might have been the day before Halloween because we had to go
30:57
get the costume. And so I got home, took my
31:00
son to like the Spear Halloween store, get
31:02
his costume, get to the checkout line, get to the
31:04
car, and Kyle calls me back
31:06
and he's like, Hey, we're
31:09
going to trade you back to New England. And I was like
31:11
what He's like, Yeah, they offered
31:14
to trade us Jimmy, and as part of the deal,
31:16
like they need a backup quarterback, so like,
31:19
you know, we're going to trade you back to New England. And
31:21
I just remember being in shock because you
31:24
know, I thought i'd seen it all at that point, but I'd never been
31:26
a part of a trade. And the
31:29
way it worked out, it wasn't like they
31:31
agreed to release me and I could sign here and because
31:33
of comp picks and things like that. But I
31:35
remember having to like go home and like break that to my
31:38
wife because we had moved,
31:40
but we had never moved in the middle of this season, and
31:42
I was like, all right, so I'm gonna have to go to New England
31:45
on Tuesday night. And then I remember
31:47
it was the bye week here, so I practiced, stayed
31:49
an extra day, met with Jerry Schaplinski, who was the quarterback
31:51
coach, met with Josh a little bit. All the players went to
31:54
their you know whatever they were doing for the bye week.
31:56
I flew back to California. We
31:58
got the biggest suitcase I because, by the way,
32:01
Bill's like, hey, we're playing in Mexico City in two
32:03
weeks, so I hope you have a passport,
32:05
and did you? Yeah? I did, And
32:07
so I packed as much stuff as I could, took
32:10
the red Is on Saturday night, came home or
32:12
came here Sunday, landed Sunday morning,
32:14
went and saw three different houses, picked
32:16
one went to her to school and being
32:18
the school that my kids still go to this day. And
32:22
you know, it was a whirlwind, you know week. But that's
32:24
I mean, look, like I said, I know that we're
32:26
privileged. This is the NFL, so not
32:29
comparing it to other people's situations, but that was
32:31
a week that took a huge toll in my family and
32:33
my wife and and you know, I couldn't
32:35
have done the career that I
32:37
had without her and her support. And thankfully
32:40
we were you know, we met when we were in high school, so we
32:42
had a strong foundation and and you
32:44
know, but in a way it made our kids, you
32:47
know, kind of mature and deal. And so
32:50
my son we went out to Vegas last year and he goes to
32:52
baseball practice with a bunch of kids that he doesn't know, and
32:54
by the end they're all laughing and he's he's immediately
32:56
so he knows how to adapt. And so there's positives
32:59
and negatives to all sides of it.
33:01
Did you get to trick or treat?
33:02
No? No, Well, I remember being
33:05
like waiting for the deal to be worked out and Bill
33:07
calls me. He's like, look, are are you gonna get here or what.
33:09
I'm like, Bill, I'm just waiting for like the airline ticket.
33:12
I got a bagpock in my car. I was at
33:14
the kids like Halloween party at school, and
33:16
I'm like, I'm just waiting for like the ticket.
33:20
That's so I'm not going to ask you the question
33:22
about the Eagles Super Bowl in
33:25
seventeen.
33:26
We'll gloss over that not only anyone knows anyways.
33:28
Okay, So in twenty eighteen.
33:30
Obviously you're part of your
33:32
championship season. For you,
33:35
I want to go before that to the Kansas
33:38
City game in the AFC Championship game
33:40
and just what it was like because for Matt and I,
33:43
you know, again there's you know, that same
33:46
theme of us being around. Sure, we've both been
33:48
around for all of these Super Bowls, so we've gotten a
33:50
chance. That one stands out for us.
33:52
That Kansas City AFC Championship game was one
33:54
of the greatest games that I've seen,
33:56
and I just want to know what it was like from your perspective
33:59
watching that overtime drive.
34:01
Yeah, I mean me, I think that's my favorite
34:03
game as a Patriot ever. Love to hear that
34:05
because in a way, looking
34:08
back, that really was the Super Bowl in my
34:10
in my opinion, I know, we had to go the
34:13
next week and beat the Rams, and the defense played
34:15
an incredible game, but to go into
34:17
Kansas City, it's like, you know, minus
34:19
five degrees, no one's given us
34:21
a chance to win. And the
34:23
effort that everybody put in that week
34:25
to that game to then get, like you said,
34:28
get to this overtime win, I think,
34:30
and you see it on our faces running on the field
34:32
I think it was kind of a true, like we're
34:35
getting goosebumps talking about it, like a true like us
34:37
against the world moment. No one was there to
34:40
support us other than the guys on that sideline.
34:42
No one in this everyone in the stands, you know, wanted
34:44
us to lose. Really, everybody kind of wanted this
34:47
changing of the guard. Here's Mahomes, you
34:49
know they're going to beat the Patriots, and it
34:51
was kind of like against all odds type thing, and
34:54
so fittingly comes down to this two minute drive
34:56
where here's Tom and the famous
34:59
you know Julian quote or too old at
35:01
his age, and you know, methodically
35:04
drives us down and win with a touchdown.
35:06
I mean, it's to
35:08
me, it was like the ultimate team
35:11
win. And when I always think of my
35:13
time with the Patriots, it was always the best teams
35:15
that I've been on. And I'm not just saying because we
35:17
were the most talented or had the best coaching
35:19
staff. I'm talking about the group of men that were
35:21
in the room, and
35:24
we were so close knit as a team. And
35:26
like I said, I think you see that when you see on the field, and I think
35:29
it's I'm right behind Kyle Van noy and Tom's
35:31
jumping into Kyle's arms, and it was like it
35:33
was like this moment, like this is this
35:35
is we have to go win the next week because
35:38
this game was so important
35:40
and so critical to that and
35:42
the belief that it gave I think everybody
35:45
in that team and.
35:46
Look fortunately for the rules
35:48
and everything like that coin toss.
35:50
You win, you know you're getting the ball
35:53
as you're sitting there and you're seeing you know, the
35:55
personnel, everything like that, Is there any doubt
35:57
in your mind? You guys are going down and scoring At that point
35:59
in time.
36:00
It was kind of like a member. It was kind of like a back
36:02
and forth. You were just hoping you got
36:05
the ball. And I think at that point it
36:07
was like the thing that always I
36:09
always looked back was they I couldn't imagine.
36:11
I couldn't believe that they couldn't cover Julian because
36:13
really we ran the same play from both sides and
36:15
we had this little motion and kind of and you
36:18
were like when they when he hit those two plays, You're like,
36:20
man, we're in the driver's seat. We just
36:22
got to go and not make any mistakes. And you
36:24
know, we had I think we had running
36:26
with Rex ye, a touchdown.
36:28
So but three third and tens.
36:30
Right, and you
36:32
know, it was a play called China, and it meant
36:34
like a shoot and an inn the
36:36
ch for shooting and in and and I'm
36:39
like, all right, well it worked once and usually
36:42
sometimes as a quarterback you kind of like get
36:44
to the point where like, all right, we just ran that play like there's
36:46
no way it's going to work again. And
36:48
you know that was just Tom basically, you
36:51
know, dropping back seeing the coverage and here
36:53
comes Julian. You know, several times I
36:55
think, I don't know if Hogan had a great catch on that
36:57
drive, but had right
37:00
regulation, Yeah, it was kind of a similar play.
37:02
But clearly, you know, this is the greatness
37:04
of Tom and Josh and all those guys working together.
37:07
They were having trouble cover in the middle of the field
37:09
and so just continue to expose it until
37:12
they fix it. And you know, they didn't fix it
37:14
in time, and luckily for us, you know, I
37:16
was able to take us down and win that
37:18
game.
37:19
So Paul brings up and I think
37:21
a lot of Patriot fans would agree, spoiled,
37:24
Yes, first world problems. What's
37:26
the best game? Interesting to hear that you say
37:28
that, but you got to go when you got to beat the Rams in
37:31
Atlanta, And I'm
37:33
not sure that fans quite know
37:36
the role that you played that week
37:38
and your experience with McVeigh
37:41
and that system. Talk a little bit about
37:43
what how you saw your role that week
37:45
as getting ready to.
37:46
Play the Rams.
37:47
Yeah, I mean as a backup quarterback, you always
37:49
prepare to play. We talked about that earlier,
37:51
but the reality is, like, you know, Tom's
37:53
healthy. I mean, could something happen in the game, yes, But
37:55
you know, for me, I always think like how can I
37:58
you know, especially at this this,
38:00
you know, the last game of the year
38:02
of the Super Bowl, Like what am I going to do to contribute to
38:04
the team to help them win? And because
38:07
I was a veteran guy as a backup and
38:09
had played in a lot of places, I always had great conversations
38:12
with Devin and Jason and high Tower
38:14
and Gilmore, And you know, when I would
38:16
we would play a team that maybe it was a system
38:18
that I was in and I'm running the scout team,
38:21
I'm like, hey, listen, this is how they're teaching these quarterbacks,
38:23
this is what they're looking at. And I'll never
38:25
forget, like get into the hotel in Atlanta,
38:28
and you know, you practice a week before you travel, and
38:30
I'm like, all right, some of these plays are similar to what I
38:32
ran with Kyle, who obviously influenced
38:34
Sean. And I
38:36
remember, you know, being in the hotel room. I'm
38:38
like, because you have to have an off day, even though
38:41
you're traveling there for the super Bowl, it's an off day and
38:43
you know your family's not there yet, and so you kind of hunkered
38:45
down in the hotel. And I
38:47
saw a thing on like Yahoo. It's like here's
38:50
and it's like kind of they did like a hard Knock show,
38:52
but it was on Amazon. And here's like some clips
38:54
from the year that the Rams did,
38:57
you know, miked up and and I'm listening
38:59
to like the play call that they have on
39:01
these clips from training camp, and I'm like, well,
39:03
I know that play. I run that play before.
39:05
And as the week went on, I kept
39:07
watching more and more of their film and being like, I know the
39:10
offense that they're gonna run and having meetings
39:12
with Bill and Map and was Matt
39:14
still.
39:14
There or was it flow this flow yeah.
39:16
And being like listen, I know, you know,
39:19
they don't really have an answer for this they don't really
39:21
have. You know, if you bring this pressure,
39:23
you know, they have to throw hot things like that,
39:26
and you know, so I took a lot of pride
39:28
in that. And one of the like my prodest moments
39:30
was after the Super Bowl Devin and Jason kind of talking
39:32
that to the media and being like we were on
39:35
it. We we had a great feeling because Brian
39:37
gave us a great look. He sat there and talked about,
39:39
you know, their their offensive system, and you
39:41
know, that was a way for me to feel like I actually contributed
39:44
in some way because I never stepped on the field, but
39:46
you know, you got to do whatever you can to help
39:49
the team win. So, you know, something
39:51
that I was proud of and fortunate of having
39:53
been in those systems. I could relate that to those
39:55
guys.
39:56
So when you show your kids your Super Bowl ring, yeah,
39:58
any kid goes, oh, that's a nice RNK deb But you didn't play.
40:00
Well, hold on for a second, you're right, I
40:02
didn't play.
40:03
That's the one I came up with a defensive game plan.
40:05
However, however, and like
40:08
that's that's the power of team, right,
40:10
isn't it.
40:11
Yeah, And that's what I would always say about the Patriots. We
40:13
always had the best team. And I'm
40:15
talking about the relationships closeness.
40:19
There's nothing ever been comparable to
40:21
the locker room that I had, especially as
40:24
I got older. I mean it was great as a young guy, but
40:26
as an older player, you appreciated
40:28
even more. And you know,
40:31
they did a great job. In seventeen eighteen
40:33
nineteen, we did these things in the offseason
40:36
called like the team of Teams, and it was a way for you
40:38
to bond with other players on the team. And
40:40
so there'd be like two offensive players, two
40:42
defensive players, maybe a special teams
40:44
player, a coach, a trainer, a
40:47
football ops guy. And we did these like challenges.
40:49
So like we'd have field day out on the out on the field
40:51
and be like the egg toss or the frisbee throw
40:53
or you know, a sack race, or one day
40:55
we went down to Fenway. I remember we did this
40:58
great like baseball challenge and one day we'd
41:00
paintballing And it was a way
41:02
for you to connect with guys that you're
41:04
not always sitting there every day with in
41:06
the meetings. And that's where I felt like you had this closeness.
41:09
You know, I go in and sit with the dbs
41:11
at lunch one day, and the next day I'd sit with the linemen,
41:13
and you had these relationships with guys
41:16
where in all, honestly, it was almost closer
41:18
than some of the college's college teams, where
41:20
you're spending all this time with these guys because we all
41:22
go home to our families, but when you
41:24
came in here, it was like your second family in true
41:26
you know, and I'm not just saying that like as clichey.
41:29
See he glossed over that. Do you see what he did there before?
41:32
The whole thing. Bill doesn't deserve
41:34
the credit.
41:35
For that, right right, right right that he gets right
41:37
right, this guy right right When
41:40
you came back again third time in
41:42
twenty twenty, was
41:45
there a hint of disappointment
41:47
when they end up signing Cam, Yeah, definitely.
41:49
I mean, well, that whole scenario is
41:52
so in twenty nineteen, you
41:54
know, Bill comes to me, obviously that was Sidham's rookie
41:56
year, and he says, look like, we got
41:58
to manage this roster a little bit. Are
42:01
you okay with like kind of waiting, you know, we'll
42:03
let you go and we'll resign you after the first week.
42:05
And I was like, sure, like, you know, I love, you
42:07
know, being a part of this organization. And
42:11
and all of a sudden, my agent calls me. He's like, hey,
42:13
Indianapolis is offering you a great deal. And
42:15
I was like, I felt torn, but it was
42:18
an opportunity that I looked at like.
42:19
In the long run, this will pretty good money.
42:21
Yeah, yeah, great.
42:21
It was a great deal. And
42:24
so in a way, I kind of thought like I never really
42:26
left, you know, so like Thirdston, I was gone for four
42:28
months and then I was right back, and with
42:31
Tom moving on, I'm like, wow, this is
42:33
my opportunity. And so I remember training
42:35
like the hardest, and this was during COVID and
42:37
and trying to train on your own and trying
42:40
to be as prepared as I could. And
42:42
you know, so obviously I was disappointed
42:45
when they signed Cam because that
42:47
was like something I had always dreamt of. You know, I had
42:50
started for all these other teams, but I had never really
42:52
played for the Patriots, the one team that I kind of
42:54
considered myself that was the team
42:56
that was my team. So it
42:59
was it was disappointing, but like I said, you know, it's
43:01
not something that I had never lived through before. And
43:03
you try to navigate it the best you can.
43:06
I mean, obviously people will look at when
43:08
Tom left and there's clearly a void
43:10
on the field.
43:14
You saw some of the ups and downs that
43:16
happened after that. It
43:19
wasn't just on the field where that
43:21
void was felt. I assume that that was
43:23
felt in the locker room, and it probably
43:25
was difficult and challenging.
43:27
For someone like you.
43:28
By Paul mentioned this earlier, you
43:30
saw when things were going really well, so
43:33
a Devin, So it Matt. People like that when
43:35
things aren't going well and
43:37
you guys are some of the leaders and everything, like how
43:40
do you try to sit there and recapture
43:42
what you know is the right way to do things? You
43:45
know what winning football is, and
43:47
yet that's not happening on the field. Yeah,
43:49
that had to be just tremendously frustrating.
43:52
It was, and I think twenty twenty was such a unique
43:54
situation because of the COVID year, because
43:56
of like what you were allowed to do. Obviously,
43:59
you know, cam in late
44:01
and there's no real training camp, and it
44:03
was just it was a it was an odd year all the
44:05
way around. And so you know, next year
44:07
it was like, Okay, we're getting back to like what you
44:10
know, at least to me, felt
44:12
similar to what it was obviously was different with our
44:14
team routine routine, and
44:17
and then Matt comes in and I remember
44:19
thinking, like, God, they have to be like telling the
44:21
guy, like where what to do out here a practice
44:23
because he was learning so quickly that
44:25
I was like, I've never seen a rookie pick
44:28
up a system like this. And it became
44:30
pretty apparent that he was going to be the starter.
44:32
And I truly, you know, my time
44:34
with Cam was was great. I came to you
44:37
know, really know him and appreciate him
44:39
for what he was, and he was hilarious and he was
44:41
great in meetings and and so I know, like
44:43
his time here was kind of you know, looked
44:45
at like it wasn't really you know, a
44:47
success, but he he impacted
44:50
a lot of guys and we would there was things that Cam
44:52
did and sayings that he would say that carried with
44:54
us after even he was not here anymore.
44:57
And so, you know, I really enjoyed and I've
44:59
had a lot of experiences like that, like kind
45:01
of these polarizing figures, you know, Cam
45:03
Newton or when I was in Chicago with Jay Cutler, people
45:06
were always like, well, what was that like? And I was like, I really
45:08
enjoyed it because you got to see a personality
45:10
of someone who from Afar you don't really
45:12
know, like what's the deal. And so being
45:14
in a room with Cam for a year and a half really
45:17
it was always made me smile. So it was it
45:19
was that was kind of cool opportunity about that.
45:21
But you know, you get to twenty twenty one
45:24
where you know, Mac ends up winning
45:26
the job and and you kind of get back to like
45:28
what I thought was really, you know what we had
45:31
always done the Patriot way, and I
45:33
mean, for lack of a better term, but
45:35
but there was also a new energy with some of the newer
45:38
guys like Kendrick Bourne, Judaon Mills,
45:41
Hunter Henry and so it kind of was a new
45:43
flavor. And really that was one of my more
45:45
enjoyable years playing here because it was kind
45:48
of like in a sense of changing of
45:50
the guard, but we were still playing good
45:52
football.
45:53
So Cam was great with us, by the way, Yeah
45:55
he was. Also he was it was you know, on field
45:58
obviously probably not up to you
46:00
know what he had become accustomed to.
46:01
It seemed like a good teammate.
46:03
Yeah, Well, he was great gat It was great to deal
46:05
with and we all joke about like the nicknames and stuff,
46:07
and like some of those nicknames lasted with guys
46:09
well passed fantastic when Cam was gone. He was
46:11
a great to night and a great, a great guy.
46:13
So you got a chance to play again
46:16
the following year. I was at twenty two
46:19
when I got twenty against So again
46:21
it's like this kind of blessing curse
46:23
at the same time, great career and every
46:25
time you sort of get a chance to get it in
46:28
the spotlight, something happens. It just has to
46:30
be we did.
46:31
That was rushed. I mean I remember being emotional
46:34
about that one because it was like, you know, I
46:36
got to play a chance to play in twenty twenty. But
46:38
that was the.
46:38
Whole like co COVID, that was a mess.
46:41
We found out on Saturday, then the game got
46:43
plays flew in on the day of and
46:45
not making excuses, it was just
46:47
it was odd. It was one of the most odd experiences
46:50
I ever had. And so this time in
46:52
twenty twenty two, you know here
46:54
it is like Max Hurt, You're gonna play full
46:56
week of practice, have a really good drive
46:58
to start the game. Things going well and
47:00
then boom, you're out. And that
47:03
was to me was like, man, that was probably
47:05
my last chance to really play for the team
47:07
that I love, and so that was that was a
47:09
a tough.
47:10
One, last one for me.
47:11
Here, Brian, is I hear you say
47:13
that the team that I love, and we talked
47:15
about, you know a little bit about some of the other places you
47:17
want and everything like that.
47:19
We call this the Patch from the Past podcast. Do
47:21
you identify as a Patriot?
47:23
Yeah, one hundred percent. I was kind of thinking. I figured
47:25
you'd ask me this on and so I was thinking, you
47:27
know, I was here some former fashion ten years
47:30
out of my fifteen, which is kind of crazy
47:32
to think when you hear like, oh he was on this many teams,
47:35
but you know, nine to twelve and
47:37
a training camp and then seventeen eighteen, nineteen,
47:39
twenty, twenty one, twenty two. I mean,
47:41
so my kids are from here.
47:44
You know, we've kind of made this our home. And
47:47
you know, when I look at my career, although
47:50
I played the least on this team, I
47:52
also kind of look at myself like this is that's
47:55
who I am. And I had
47:57
a lot of great memories other places, but I've
47:59
had the best memories here.
48:00
So I do want to ask you about
48:02
coming off the bench last year, you
48:05
know, in Vegas, and what that was like too.
48:07
So to rally the troops after Jimmy.
48:09
Went down, Yeah, that was a I'm
48:12
thinking to myself, of all the times to get
48:14
thrust into a game, this is the one.
48:16
And and Jimmy
48:19
got hurt, like right before halftime and kind of toughed
48:21
it out a little bit, and I'm
48:23
like, oh, kind of similar, like he
48:25
got hurt, but then he went back out. He played a few snaps
48:27
like oh, he's probably okay, and then they take him
48:29
in They're like, listen, we got to tame him the hospital. I'm like, all right,
48:32
here we go. And and you know, of all teams
48:34
to go against, I'm like, well, I know this team, I know this
48:36
defense, and I know our offense
48:39
really well. And so I was like, all right, I'm
48:41
just gonna go out.
48:41
There and I'm throwing a bomb.
48:42
Well, that play we
48:45
developed against our defense in training camp
48:47
a few years because there was a lot of times where we call
48:49
play and Devin had seen it so many
48:51
times that they would teach him to rob the
48:54
guy who which was Julian at the time,
48:56
our number three receiver running a speedo
48:58
and so I'm like, oh God, here we go. This is the play,
49:01
and we made adjustment to put the outside guy
49:03
on a deep route in case they did that. So
49:05
I remember getting the snap. I kind of knew
49:07
that down a distance it could be that defense,
49:10
and all I watched was Peppers, and
49:12
as soon as he went down, I don't even know if I looked
49:14
to Trey, who I was throwing the ball to, I'm like,
49:16
I know that area of the field is exposed, and
49:20
sure enough, that kind of got the jitters out,
49:22
and then you just go play football. And then you
49:24
know, as the game's going on, I'm realizing, like, just
49:27
don't screw it up, you know. I mean, we're winning,
49:30
we're kicking some field goals, that our defense is
49:32
doing pretty well. But
49:34
I remember the feeling I had after
49:36
that game of like just bittersweet
49:39
because I remember going up to my team and the guys that
49:41
I love, the guys that I consider brothers, and I could just see
49:43
how dejected they were. I know, I knew, you
49:45
know, based on staying in touch with them, how tough
49:48
of a year it was. And so I was elated
49:50
because it was kind of vindication
49:53
for me to come back and beat
49:55
the team after being told basically to go retire.
49:58
And I felt great, but I also it
50:00
hurt my heart to see
50:02
these like I'll never forget David Andrews just being
50:04
like exhausted and you
50:07
know, beaten down or Slater and
50:09
and all those guys, and so it was kind of like a
50:11
mix of mixed emotions and looking
50:13
back, I should have just you know, been done after that game
50:15
and been like, all right, you know, I did my part, you
50:17
know, because the rest of the year for us was
50:19
it was downhill. But it's
50:22
something that you know, it goes down as
50:24
like a as a great memory, but also like
50:26
a bittersweet one too.
50:27
I mean, he said it. We're
50:30
professional athletes. I'm not looking for anything specially
50:32
anything like that. But let's not forget.
50:35
They're human beings too. Yeah, they're human
50:37
beings, and to and.
50:38
To hear like, wow, this is great
50:40
for me individually.
50:41
Oh shoot, you know, these.
50:43
Are my guys and they're going
50:45
through a tough time and I just helped extend
50:47
that tough time.
50:49
You know.
50:49
Really interesting, Fran, Thanks for the time, great, Thank
50:53
you for downloading this podcast, Subscribe
50:56
on Apple, Google Play, and everywhere else
50:58
you listen. Like the show, please rate
51:00
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51:03
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51:05
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