0:00

Welcome to Podland Podland is

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sponsored by Buzzsprout the easiest

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way to host, promote and track

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your Podcast [email protected].

0:07

It's Thursday, January the 14th, 2021.

0:10

I'm James Cridland the editor

0:10

of pod news here in Australia.

0:13

Hello? I'm Sam

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Sethi the editor of Sam

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Talks Technology here in the UK

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and I'm Kevin Finn from Buzzsprout

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and later I'll be talking about

0:20

dynamic content. I'm Pasco Hughes and I'll be on later

0:21

talking about our new Podcast advertising

0:26

platform and I'm Paula Rogo

0:28

and later we'll be talking

0:28

about the BBC world service

0:31

international Podcast competition.

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Podland is a weekly podcast

0:34

where Sam and I delve deeper

0:37

into the week's podcasting news,

0:37

which I cover [email protected].

0:40

Please get involved. You can send us a voice message

0:42

to questions at Podland dot news,

0:46

or you can tweet us Podland news.

0:48

We'd love to hear from,

0:49

so this week we're going to be

0:49

talking about dynamic content first?

0:53

We want to loop back onto a story

0:53

we had in last week's Podland.

0:56

We had an interview with Rob Greenlee

0:56

about the Podcast Academy and some

1:00

of the announcements that were made,

1:00

James, what's been happening since?

1:04

Yes. Lots of change. At the Podcast Academy.

1:07

First, they announced three new members

1:07

of the board, Quinton Brahmbhatt,

1:11

who is the boss of Amazon podcasts.

1:14

And you always know when somebody is

1:14

big, when they are allowed to talk to

1:17

the press as contain is so great to see

1:17

him on the board of the Podcast Academy.

1:22

Also Amy S Choi, who does a podcast.

1:25

And does it, lots of other things

1:25

around the mash-up Americans, she's

1:29

a Korean American and DeRay McKesson,

1:29

who is a civil rights activist

1:34

and a host of pod save the people.

1:37

They've also announced the

1:37

new executive committee.

1:40

You remember that Rob said last week,

1:40

the committee gets reelected every

1:42

year, while they've elected Donald. Albright from Tenderfoot TV as the

1:44

chairperson for 2021 spoke medias,

1:50

Alia tavakoli and his secretary.

1:52

And your groomsmen from NPR is treasurer.

1:54

She spoke to next radio

1:54

once, and she's very nice.

1:58

And Christy Mirabelle from Sony music

1:58

entertainment becomes vice chairperson.

2:03

And if it wasn't clear, Rob is

2:03

still obviously part of the bores,

2:06

just not the chairperson anymore.

2:08

Some big hits and names on there. At least now.

2:10

They announced when the Ambien.

2:12

Yeah. So the MBS have been announced

2:12

for Saturday, March the 28th.

2:15

That's the big Podcast awards

2:15

ceremony that they're doing.

2:19

They start at eight o'clock, New

2:19

York, time to eight in the evening.

2:22

That's one in the morning for you,

2:22

but it's 10 in the morning for me.

2:25

I win. And there'll be, if

2:26

anybody to watch as well,

2:29

I'm not staying up for the mug. I'm not winning anything.

2:31

So it's okay. You might, I won't,

2:33

I would doubt that very seriously. Now, first up James, first

2:35

story of the week club house.

2:38

Have you played with it yet? Have played with clubhouse?

2:41

It's really good. All of the events that I want to take

2:42

part in there at three o'clock in the

2:44

morning for me talking about time zones.

2:47

So yeah. Have you played

2:48

with it? I used clubhouse, I went on to one

2:49

of the rooms and there was a great.

2:54

Talk, somebody in

2:54

Australia, actually, James.

2:56

So she was running a session, but all

2:56

she kept doing was saying, add, I'll be

3:01

tweeting about this on my Twitter account.

3:03

And I Put my hand up and I went into

3:03

the room and I said hang on a minute.

3:06

I reckon Twitter. spaces when it comes out will actually

3:07

be a better option because you're then in

3:11

one platform, I said that I didn't think

3:11

clubhouse is a longterm viable option.

3:15

But given that I did

3:15

want to try something.

3:18

And this week, a friend of mine, Wayne,

3:18

who runs Podcast Asia, we decided that

3:23

it might be a good way for us to see

3:23

if we can record a clubhouse, room.

3:28

So we actually did it this week

3:28

and we've called it club casting.

3:32

But have a listen to

3:32

what me and Wayne did.

3:34

Hey, I'm joined here by Wayne,

3:34

the founder of pod Fest,

3:38

Aisha we're hearing clubhouse.

3:40

We are trying an experiment,

3:40

which is we're using our road.

3:44

Podcast the mixes to try and

3:44

record this conversation.

3:48

Why are we doing this way? I think

3:50

this is not just to

3:50

execute a proof of concept.

3:53

It's basically just to try

3:53

things out to experiment.

3:57

And if you never try something new,

3:57

you would never guess, or even know

4:03

exactly 100% that you will work out. So why we're doing this?

4:07

I think it's because a day ago we

4:07

had a short conversation on clubhouse

4:12

instead of other apps like zoom,

4:12

or even like other live virtual

4:16

streaming platforms, like stream yard. We chose club house because

4:18

we are already on it.

4:21

And. I think so far, we had great

4:21

experiences and stories to share

4:25

about our clubhouse experience. So we thought why not?

4:28

Let's do a Podcast room together.

4:30

The goal of what I want to

4:30

achieve here today though, is to work

4:34

out whether it's possible to record a

4:34

clubhouse conversation, because if it is.

4:39

Then, what you've got is the

4:39

ability for Podcast and us to create

4:43

live podcasting with an audience. And that I think is the key part of what

4:44

we're trying to achieve, because you

4:48

could use stream yard or zoom and just

4:48

have a conversation, but now you can

4:52

invite an audience to that conversation.

4:55

They can then join in if they

4:55

want to ask a question and there's

4:58

nothing because we can record it. That stops us then.

5:02

Taking that recording, putting it onto our

5:02

bus sprout or wherever we want to put it

5:06

and pushing it out as a normal Podcast. But I think club castings, we call it that

5:07

may be the way forward, because I think

5:13

that's, what's missing in podcasting. Is that live interactivity of an audience.

5:17

Exactly.

5:18

One of a scent. And I think that the

5:19

two terms that you just

5:21

come up, clip

5:21

costing the pot housing.

5:23

Yeah. The first one is better podcasting.

5:26

I love it. I was on, on call in clubhouse and they

5:27

are talking about bringing back recording

5:32

to clubhouse officially as a feature.

5:35

So I experiment the other day

5:35

with just using my iPhone.

5:38

I set the iPhone recorder in the

5:38

background, the screen recorder,

5:41

and then I went into clubhouse and

5:41

they instantly to take to that,

5:44

I was recording a conversation. They said it's against the

5:46

terms of service to record.

5:49

When the listener and also the

5:49

speaker doesn't know you're recording.

5:54

If you actually tell them that you're

5:54

recording and we're pretty lax about

5:57

it, because they said originally

5:57

that's what clubhouse was there to do.

6:01

It was going to be a Podcast recording

6:01

app, but they've decided to put

6:05

the recording part away, build an

6:05

audience, and then bring that in and

6:09

maybe a pro feature or bring that

6:09

in as a new feature going forward.

6:13

I think if

6:14

they allowed us in a very.

6:16

Open way if they actually promote it as

6:16

a feature or courses will be flocking

6:21

into a clubhouse for the very reason

6:21

that it's so easy to set things up,

6:25

it's like a, Oh, you needs an iPhone.

6:27

Yeah. And all you need, you've done. If you don't have an audience for

6:29

the amateurs that are beginners.

6:32

It's even easier to start. So I think it's a thought Sam,

6:36

which is why we're

6:36

trying it. So a recording from plump house,

6:37

if clubhouse are listening, then my

6:41

colleague's name here is Donald Trump.

6:43

That's spelled T R U M P.

6:46

how did you record that then? Donald?

6:48

Thank you. It's not fake news. The way we did it was we got.

6:52

Our road Podcast of might mixes

6:52

and Wayne hardwired hairs to

6:57

his iPad and he used a pod mic.

7:00

Now that enabled him to be able to record

7:00

it locally to the Podcast and mixer.

7:05

And he captured both

7:05

sides of the conversation.

7:07

You'll hear in that recording

7:07

that Wayne's voice is very clear.

7:11

Mine wasn't a mine wasn't because I was

7:11

using a Bluetooth connection to my road.

7:16

Podcast to mine and sadly. It was not crystal clear.

7:20

My pod, Mike didn't work there for, and

7:20

it was just going through my AirPods, but

7:24

the point was we could actually do it.

7:27

So I do think there is something

7:27

in this that I think podcasters

7:31

will find it quite attractive.

7:33

Not all Podcast need to be live and

7:33

have an audience, but some people

7:37

like that concept and the idea of

7:37

having an audience who can come

7:41

and listen to the live recording. I think this is going

7:43

to be a game changer.

7:45

Maybe clubhouse, let it happen

7:45

at clubhouse have said that they

7:50

did have a feature for recording

7:50

in an early version of clubhouse.

7:53

But they've taken it out and

7:53

talking to them in a clubhouse

7:56

room, actually, they said they will

7:56

be bringing you that back soon.

7:59

So watch this space.

8:00

Okay. That, that, should be interesting. Maybe they might both add

8:02

recording and also add an RSS feed.

8:06

And then you've basically got automatic

8:06

built in podcasting in there as well.

8:10

See where the club casting

8:10

takes off or Twitter spaces.

8:14

Do you know quickly when Twitter

8:14

spaces might be available?

8:17

No idea. Clubhouse. You've got a window of opportunity.

8:20

I wonder if you're going

8:21

to take it. Yeah, you've got a window of opportunity.

8:23

If you have a toy phone, if you

8:23

have a real Android phone, of

8:26

course, then no clubhouse for you.

8:28

You're not in the club. Something that works on both

8:29

though is Buzzsprout they

8:32

launched something didn't they? Yes,

8:34

Buzzsprout have launched

8:34

dynamic content, which they say

8:37

is a free way for everyone who

8:37

uses Buzzsprout to add content.

8:42

Either side of your Podcast.

8:43

I asked one of the

8:43

co-founders of Buzzsprout Kevin Finn.

8:47

What dynamic content was?

8:49

I think the simplest way to

8:49

talk about dynamic content is it's

8:51

the ability for you to add audio

8:51

content at the beginning, or end of

8:56

any podcast episode in your entire

8:56

catalog very quickly and easily.

9:01

So the use cases that we give for it is

9:01

there's the obvious one that comes to mind

9:05

right away is sponsorships or affiliate,

9:05

marketing opportunities, things like

9:09

that, but we've built the tools so that

9:09

you can use it for things well, beyond

9:13

that, like the ability to just give timely

9:13

messages to your audience, regardless

9:17

of where they jump into your podcast.

9:20

So we've have lots of podcasters. Who've been podcasting for years

9:21

and have hundreds of episodes, but.

9:25

They might just be doing a,

9:25

a virtual event next week.

9:28

And they want to let everybody

9:28

know who listens to their podcast.

9:30

Whether you start with episode one, or

9:30

you start with episode 246, that they're

9:35

doing this virtual event next week

9:35

and they want to invite you to attend.

9:38

And so now with these tools that allows

9:38

you to record a short message and very

9:42

easily drop it into your entire catalog. And then once that event has

9:44

happened, click another button and we.

9:47

Seamlessly, take it out of all your

9:49

episodes. That's very cool. So as soon as your sponsor stops

9:50

paying and moves on, then you can just

9:54

get rid of the sponsor credits from

9:54

all of the shows that you've done.

9:58

Yes. It's very interesting in the sponsorship

9:59

world, because it allows you to not only

10:03

sell sponsorships based on the volume

10:03

of downloads that your current episodes

10:07

are doing, but you can also look at

10:07

the volume for your entire podcast.

10:10

Yeah. Maybe 80 or 90% of your downloads

10:10

every month come from the episodes that

10:14

you're releasing that month, but you've

10:14

got another 10 or 20% of downloads

10:17

that come from your back catalog. And now you can include those

10:18

in the sponsorship as well, and

10:22

potentially get a higher fee.

10:23

Now you're deliberately calling

10:23

this dynamic content insertion,

10:26

not dynamic advertising, insertion.

10:28

What's the thinking there. We choose

10:30

something different because

10:30

we're doing something different.

10:32

We're not doing targeting,

10:32

we're not doing tracking.

10:35

We're not doing audience

10:35

profiling or any of that stuff.

10:38

All we're doing is we're bringing

10:38

a very powerful and useful tool and

10:42

we're trying our best to make it

10:42

available to what we would call the

10:46

everyday Podcast or, and it's 98%

10:46

of the podcasting world, there are.

10:50

Top tier Podcast that have very

10:50

different needs and get millions and

10:54

millions of downloads every month. That's not the audience that we

10:55

built this tool for the audience.

10:58

So we built this tool for, it could

10:58

be anybody who's just starting

11:00

a podcast to somebody who's

11:00

been podcasting for a long time.

11:03

You could be a professional

11:03

Podcast and use these tools.

11:05

Yeah. But we thought there's a lot of value

11:06

in providing a dynamic content tool that

11:09

allows you to insert content in your

11:09

entire back catalog and make it very

11:13

easy for you to apply that same dynamic

11:13

content to new episodes that you upload

11:16

without having to be on a pro-level

11:16

plan or have to have a master's degree

11:21

in audio engineering tools or fiddle

11:21

with all these different settings.

11:24

So we wanted to make it. Very simple to use, very easy for

11:25

anybody to jump in and apply dynamic

11:29

content to their entire back catalog,

11:29

regardless of whether it's just something

11:33

that they do as a hobby for one or two

11:33

hours a week, or it's something that

11:36

they do spend, 30 or 40 hours more

11:36

time doing, it could be a useful tool

11:40

for them. And you mentioned it. Yeah. That you don't need to have an

11:41

expensive account for it.

11:44

What's the cost of using it? It's

11:46

included with all of our plans. We do give everyone 90 days to figure

11:47

out if podcasting is right for them

11:51

without having to pay us a diamond. And then if they do decide that podcasting

11:52

is fun, they want to continue with it.

11:55

Then you upgrade to one of our pay

11:55

plans, which start at $12 and go up

11:59

from there, depending on your needs. All our plans are limited based on.

12:02

How much content you want

12:02

to upload every month.

12:04

So the $12 plan gives you three hours

12:04

and we have an $18 plan that gives

12:08

you six hours and up from there. So it's very affordable.

12:11

And these dynamic content tools are included with all of those plans that no additional.

12:14

So

12:14

keep your Podcast short is my thing. Do you have any examples of how

12:16

Buzzsprout Podcast is using it already?

12:19

A couple of examples,

12:20

come to mind. One, they are planning on

12:21

using this because they're

12:23

gonna rebrand their Podcast. They're going to change

12:24

the title of their podcast. And they were trying to figure out how

12:26

they should let their audience know.

12:30

And so we suggested these dynamic

12:30

content tools are perfect for that

12:32

because they had hundreds of episodes

12:32

and now they want to change the name

12:35

and they didn't want everyone to

12:35

open up their podcast app one day.

12:37

And all of a sudden the podcasts

12:37

that they know and love isn't up

12:40

there, alphabetically listed anymore. It's now moved to a different

12:42

place than their list. So use the dynamic content tools

12:44

to go ahead and put a short message

12:47

at the beginning of all your

12:47

episodes very easily and quickly.

12:50

And let everyone know that, Hey, two

12:50

weeks from now, we're actually going

12:53

to change the name of this podcast. So when you open up your app, we're

12:54

not here alphabetically anymore.

12:56

Now we're here. That was a use case. That was just out of nowhere that

12:58

we're like, Oh, that's a fantastic use.

13:01

We didn't see that coming. We also have a lot of people who

13:02

do affiliate marketing affiliate

13:05

marketing is a great way for podcasters

13:05

who are just starting out to take

13:09

more of the risk on their side. Instead of trying to set up a sponsor

13:11

who the sponsor is taking the risk

13:14

with you, if you have a new show. And so affiliate marketing is a fantastic

13:16

way for you to test different products

13:19

and figure out what is resonating

13:19

or aligning with your audience.

13:22

Whether it be a Casper mattress

13:22

or a, a piece of tech equipment,

13:26

you can go ahead and try that out

13:26

and you can try it in your entire

13:28

back catalog of episodes and see. Very easily.

13:31

Oh, look, I sold a bunch of, mattresses,

13:31

but I didn't sell any tech gear,

13:34

so maybe I should look for more

13:34

affiliates in the mattress category.

13:38

What else can we expect

13:38

from Buzzsprout in 2021?

13:41

It's a new year. It's going to be a,

13:42

hopefully a changed year.

13:45

What have you got in the works?

13:46

Oh, we are just going to do our

13:46

best to continue to provide professional

13:50

level podcasting tools and make them

13:50

available to professional podcasters

13:54

everywhere and professionals alike. But we feel like the underserved audience,

13:55

especially when it comes to advanced

13:59

podcasting tools, are all these people who

13:59

are jumping into the Podcast ecosystem and

14:04

loving the space and seeing all the great

14:04

opportunities it has, but saying, but

14:07

I don't want to spend a hundred dollars

14:07

or I don't want to spend $200 a month

14:10

to get access to these advanced tools. That is. One of the challenges that we've taken

14:12

on at post sprout is how can we provide

14:15

the best technology at a very affordable

14:15

and approach approachable price point.

14:20

And it's not just price. It's also making the

14:21

interface super easy to use.

14:23

Like you shouldn't have to have

14:23

hours of training or, get on the

14:26

phone and walk through support. All the support process and

14:29

everything that goes along with, steep learning curve software.

14:32

And so that's where we're investing

14:32

heavily is the best technology that

14:36

we can provide people on making it

14:36

as simple and as affordable as well

14:39

possible. Kevin, thanks so much for your time. I appreciate it as always a pleasure.

14:42

Thank you, James.

14:43

I think adding that to all

14:43

episodes of your podcast, in fact,

14:47

with my own other podcasts that I'm

14:47

going to try, that I think is actually

14:51

a great way of trying to yeah. Monetize it.

14:54

Yeah. I think it's a good plan. What else has been going on a

14:55

venture capitalist loop ventures floats

14:59

the idea that Apple should launch. Podcast plus a set of exclusive

15:00

Podcast available to anyone with an

15:05

Apple one or Apple music subscription.

15:07

James, what's the story.

15:09

So this is a venture capitalist

15:09

company or venture capital company.

15:13

Who's busy giving Apple some hints for the

15:13

future because Apple obviously needs it.

15:18

And one of their ideas was that Apple

15:18

should do some premium podcasts because

15:23

somehow it'll help them fend off Spotify.

15:26

Not so sure about that. But one thing that I did notice from

15:28

this is essentially that there's

15:34

no reason why Apple shouldn't be.

15:37

Charging for shows if Podcast

15:37

has want to charge for them.

15:42

At the moment we have a reliance on ad

15:42

revenue, Apple should allow podcasters

15:47

to set a price for their own shows. If they want to, if that's something

15:49

that Podcast is, wants to end up doing,

15:53

I can't understand because

15:53

both Apple and Amazon have a

15:56

micropayment system built in Apple.

15:59

Obviously when you buy apps can

15:59

even do the 74 75 P or one pound.

16:03

Purchase a small apps. They know how to do it. Both ways, both taking money from

16:05

listeners and also distributing

16:10

money back to Podcast is because

16:10

they do it with app developers.

16:13

So I'm hoping that they would do this.

16:15

The one thing I would say though, is

16:15

if Apple did turn this on and you did

16:20

set a price, not, everyone's going

16:20

to be able to set a price and get an

16:23

audience because not everyone Podcast.

16:25

Has that size of audience, but there

16:25

are lots of people who do Podcast index

16:30

have an extension tag called lock.

16:33

I would really want to use that and hope

16:33

Apple was supported because there would

16:37

be no use Apple having done this, where

16:37

they've enabled payment for podcasting.

16:43

If you could then get it free on

16:43

Spotify or any other podcast, hosts

16:46

two links to the Apple directory.

16:49

Yeah, I think whenever you start

16:49

talking about money, as anchor has

16:53

found, then some people will try and

16:53

take advantage and to be fair, Spreaker

16:58

has also found that in the past as well. There are only really three companies

17:00

that have the capability of.

17:04

Paying out tiny amounts of money or

17:04

relatively small amounts of money to

17:08

people Amazon, Apple, and Google who all

17:08

have, app stores and things like that.

17:14

There's certainly something there which

17:14

is actually going to be quite difficult

17:17

for anybody else to actually do this. Yeah.

17:19

Interesting stuff. Wonder

17:20

what Spotify would do if Apple turned

17:22

that on? I guess Spotify can't really.

17:25

Charge per individual show.

17:28

So yes, it would be really interesting

17:28

to see what Spotify would end up

17:33

doing Spotify, reason of being

17:33

there is that currently they are

17:36

pulling people in with shows that

17:36

you can listen to on a free Spotify.

17:42

Account would Spotify put some

17:42

of the most successful shows

17:46

that they have behind a paywall? I don't know, but at the moment,

17:47

the only paywall that they have

17:50

is a monthly nine 99 service.

17:54

So it would be interesting to see

17:54

how they would fight back then.

17:58

Wonder if they'd have to go

17:58

on an acquisition trail again?

18:00

One of my favorite companies

18:00

is called de script.

18:03

And it's how I edit my podcast,

18:03

the D script company this week

18:07

raise 30 million in funding. So congratulations to Jay and to Andrew

18:12

Yeah, $30 million is

18:12

not bad in a funding round.

18:16

So de script recently have added a

18:16

video editing to their audio editing

18:21

service, and it's just editing as if it

18:21

was a word document, which is very cool.

18:25

And there's actually been quite a

18:25

few funding rounds announced recently,

18:28

backtracks announced 1.6 million.

18:30

They are a analytics and

18:30

advertising platform.

18:34

And well done to Cole at pod chaser

18:34

for a $4 million funding round, which

18:40

they've just announced as well where

18:40

it should enable it to expand its

18:43

work, both enriching Podcast data,

18:43

but also doing some interesting things

18:48

in terms of putting advertisers in

18:48

contact with good Podcast is excellent.

18:53

The BBC this week

18:53

launched the BBC world service

18:56

international Podcast competition. James.

18:59

Tell me more.

18:59

So the BBC world service is the

18:59

international radio station for the BBC.

19:05

So not very many people tune into

19:05

it in the UK about million actually.

19:08

But they do lots of things across the

19:08

world and they're particularly strong in.

19:14

Africa. And this is where the international

19:15

Podcast competition is for.

19:18

I got Paula Rogo one of the judges

19:18

for the competition and John Manel.

19:23

Who's the Podcast commissioning

19:23

editor for the BBC world service.

19:26

And I asked John about the competence. It's

19:29

something I've really

19:29

wants to do for a while now.

19:32

I wanted the BBC world service to have

19:32

a scheme that gave new talents, a unique

19:36

and important opportunity in podcasting.

19:39

And that's what this is all about. So I'm so pleased.

19:42

We've got this up and running. It's the BBC world service

19:43

international Podcast competition.

19:47

It's brand new in this first year.

19:49

You can enter if you're in Kenya,

19:49

Nigeria, and South Africa and

19:53

not already a professional. In broadcast media or have a

19:54

credit on a commercial Podcast.

19:58

So if you're in one of those

19:58

three countries, and it has an

20:02

idea for a Podcast in English,

20:02

which will appeal to listeners in

20:06

Africa and throughout the world. And in particular to women, then

20:08

get ready to write down the details

20:12

of how two ends up because the

20:12

prize is what I think is amazing.

20:16

We will team the winner up

20:16

with a BBC production unit.

20:19

You will get to make your Podcast

20:19

with their help learning from them.

20:23

And with all the support of the BBC

20:23

world service, it will be launched as

20:27

a BBC world service Podcast hopefully

20:29

sometime this year. That's fantastic. And why those three countries?

20:33

It's

20:33

an exciting time for podcasting in

20:33

Africa, the BBC world service launched

20:38

the comb last year, our weekly podcast.

20:40

We're about to launch Africa daily,

20:40

which is going out Monday to Friday.

20:45

Those are the three countries

20:45

where we tend to have our

20:47

biggest Podcast downloads.

20:49

In Africa. So one of the judges is Paula Rogo.

20:53

What are you looking for as a

20:53

judge for the BBC world service

20:57

international Podcast competition. I'm

20:59

looking for as a judge, as

20:59

the BBC has set out a great list of

21:03

criteria that they're looking for. From podcasters who are entering the

21:05

competition, including suitability

21:10

to work as a Podcast resonance for

21:10

international audiences and resonance

21:15

for women is just one of the criteria

21:15

that the BBC has for good reason,

21:20

because this will be a BBC production.

21:23

If you win right. But for me also, as a judge, I'm also

21:24

looking for that uniqueness, that

21:28

magic, that one tends to feel when

21:28

something is working with a Podcast.

21:34

So it's an opportunity to also be

21:34

creative, try new things, try new ideas.

21:39

I think that's what the

21:39

BBC is also going for it.

21:41

And. Putting together a competition like this.

21:44

So go there with your creativity

21:44

and bring the magic into your,

21:48

Entry. You're no spring chicken to podcasting

21:49

either in Kenya or in Africa as a whole.

21:55

You're involved with a ton of different

21:55

things in terms of podcasting, aren't you?

21:59

Yes,

22:00

I am. I said I've never really committed

22:00

to seeing podcasting grow on the

22:03

continent because I really think

22:03

once it takes off, because it hasn't.

22:07

Fully taken off just yet, but once

22:07

it does, I think Africa will be

22:12

one of the places that you can't

22:12

miss when it comes to podcasting.

22:16

We are a continent of oral storytelling.

22:21

We tell stories to each other

22:21

verbally and radio is King here.

22:26

There's a reason to BBC world service

22:26

is a huge component in Africa.

22:30

And that's just because we. Love audio storytelling.

22:34

And I think Podcast fit into

22:34

that really, really well.

22:38

So it's no surprise that

22:38

it's taking off here in

22:41

Africa. Yeah, I've done a few pieces of work for

22:41

the BBC world service in Ghana, and I'm

22:46

always amazed at how many people listen.

22:49

To the radio, how many

22:49

people enjoy great audio?

22:54

However it gets to them in Africa.

22:57

It's a fascinating thing, John, where

22:57

do people go to enter this company?

23:02

Yes, this

23:03

is the all important information. The deadline.

23:05

Is Friday the 22nd of

23:05

January, 2021 at 1300 GMT.

23:12

It's easy to enter. You just need to write a few words.

23:15

We asked for two minutes of audio as

23:15

well, but all the details of that,

23:19

the full terms and conditions and all

23:19

of that can be found on our website.

23:23

That's even an email address

23:23

if you have any questions.

23:26

So it's BBC world service.com/

23:26

Podcast competition.

23:32

That's BBC world service. Dot com slash Podcast competition.

23:37

And you need to be 18 or over,

23:37

not a professional in Brooklyn

23:41

arts media, or have a credit on a

23:41

commercial Podcast and you need to

23:45

be in one of those three countries,

23:45

Kenya, Nigeria, and South Africa.

23:50

And I love that phrase that

23:50

Paula just used about magic.

23:54

That's what we're looking for. It's difficult to define.

23:57

I think we just want to be surprised.

24:00

The only thing we aren't looking

24:00

for is a scripted comedy or drama.

24:04

But apart from that, it could be anything. The lovely thing about being judges

24:06

for this is that Paula and I have, and

24:11

the others have no idea what to expect. We have no idea what

24:14

people are going to come up with. So you're starting with these

24:15

three countries for this year, but

24:19

you've deliberately not called it

24:19

the African international Podcast

24:23

competition or anything else. Are you looking at expanding

24:25

this perhaps for next year?

24:29

Yeah, I

24:29

mean, I'm really pleased. We're doing this for Kenya, Nigeria,

24:31

and South Africa for this year.

24:35

It made sense. Because it is a really exciting

24:36

time throughout Africa and in

24:40

those particular countries. And that is, as I say, where we tend

24:41

to have our biggest downloads in Africa

24:46

for our BBC world service Podcast and

24:46

it's important to get the competition

24:50

established and to ensure we can manage

24:50

all the entries we expect to receive.

24:54

So it made sense to focus. On three countries for year one,

24:56

but it was, I hope it's successful.

25:00

I hope we can invite

25:00

entries from other countries

25:03

in future years. And Paula, just one last question for you.

25:06

It's Africa, Podcast day on the 12th

25:06

of February, which is very exciting.

25:12

There's the Africa pod Fest

25:12

happening then as well.

25:16

Isn't there.

25:17

Yes. The Africa Podcast day is this annual

25:17

celebration of African Podcast.

25:23

This will be the second year that is

25:23

happening and Africa Podcast, we'll

25:27

be putting together a virtual event.

25:30

We, our first year was supposed

25:30

to be in 2020, but COVID sadly

25:35

had us canceling the event. So we're putting together

25:38

something a little smaller that

25:40

will be taking place on Africa. Podcast.

25:43

Day as well. And you can go get details on that

25:44

Africa Podcast festival dot com and

25:49

it's really a chance to celebrate

25:49

what's going on here on the continent.

25:53

I think 2020 was a huge

25:53

year for African Podcast.

25:57

I think COVID had a big part to do with

25:57

that, and we just get to come together,

26:02

celebrate each other, acknowledge each

26:02

other, and really put forth what could

26:06

be a great year for podcasting on the

26:09

continent. Paula and John, thank you so much.

26:12

Thank you. Thanks. Thanks for having us. Thank

26:14

you. In other news Todd Cochrane of get new

26:14

central stay released is 1500th episode.

26:21

That's

26:21

amazing. Yeah, it is amazing 1,500 episodes,

26:22

Todd of course, CEO of blueberry, which

26:27

has a big podcasting host and yep.

26:30

One of the things that he said to me when

26:30

I was reporting, this is how important

26:35

it is that actually, he's the CEO of a

26:35

big Podcast and company is one of the

26:39

big old guard Podcast in companies.

26:41

And he says that the only way to stay

26:41

abreast of what's happening in the

26:45

Podcast world and actually really

26:45

understand the struggles that Podcast

26:49

has have in terms of building a show

26:49

in terms of keeping up a ties as happy.

26:53

The only way to really. Stay abreast of that is to actually

26:54

make shows to actually Podcast.

26:59

And I just thought it was worthy

26:59

of note that he's a CEO of a big

27:03

Podcast company who is podcasting.

27:05

And there are surprisingly a lot

27:05

of CEOs managing directors of

27:09

large Podcast companies out there

27:09

who don't Podcast and who don't

27:12

use their tools every single day. And maybe that's something that

27:14

they're missing a trick with.

27:18

Oh, side

27:18

ta-da. Looping the story back to Rob Greenlee

27:18

Todd and Rob do a podcast as well

27:23

together, which I find it amazing that

27:23

he has time to do 1,500 podcasts and also

27:28

do other podcasts which has been doing

27:30

yeah, it's a two

27:30

hour Podcast twice a week.

27:34

So have a knows how they have

27:34

the time to end up doing that.

27:38

But the one thing I love about the

27:38

new media show is while there are two

27:42

things, firstly, Todd is incredibly

27:42

indiscreet and talks about things.

27:46

He says, Oh, I can, can

27:46

possibly talk about this.

27:49

And then says something that's completely.

27:51

under NDAs and things like that. he's very good at doing

27:53

all of that sort of stuff.

27:55

And the other thing is hearing

27:55

the trains from Rob Greenlees

27:59

house, which you can also hear. it's a great show.

28:02

you should check the new media show out.

28:04

It's well worth the listen.

28:06

Now, we started off talking

28:06

about Twitter spaces and that was

28:10

basically a Aqua hire of the team from.

28:13

Breaker Leah Culver and her team,

28:13

but it turns out we thought breaker

28:18

was then gonna obviously be subsumed

28:18

into Twitter or just closed down.

28:22

It turns out it's not James. Yeah.

28:24

So breaker, they announced

28:24

that breaker was going to close

28:27

tomorrow actually, but the app

28:27

has been acquired instead by a

28:31

different company called maple media.

28:33

And I find maple media fascinating.

28:35

They're a publisher based in

28:35

Los Angeles in California.

28:40

And they already own player FM, which

28:40

used to be run by a nice man called

28:44

Michael, who was an ex Googler and a Kiwi.

28:46

They also own a Podcast

28:46

app called Podcast.

28:49

And now the guns be

28:49

owning breaker as well.

28:52

So it seems to be where the good Podcast

28:52

apps go so that somebody is still

28:58

is loving them and caring for them.

29:01

So it's quite interesting seeing

29:01

maple media getting hold of

29:05

another one, as we record, there's

29:05

a breaking news story about.

29:09

Pocket casts, which apparently

29:09

is going to be sold.

29:13

So it's currently owned by a

29:13

bunch of folk, including NPR and

29:17

PRX, and a little bit of the BBC.

29:19

And apparently they've basically

29:19

said, nah, it's got no future with us.

29:23

We'd like you to go away and sell it to please. So one wonders whether maple media has

29:25

yet another Podcast app that they may

29:30

pull into their, a stable as well. Excellent.

29:32

Good luck to maple media now. One last story that we wanted to leave

29:34

you with in last week's pod news, there

29:39

was a story by James talking about

29:39

a company called add delicious.fm.

29:43

So I thought I'd reach out to them. They're based in Bristol and we

29:45

thought we'd have a conversation about

29:48

what is that delicious FM and how

29:48

can they help Podcast is the idea of

29:52

adolescence was that we'd have

29:52

a flexible solution for professional

29:55

Podcast is whether it's quite a few,

29:55

one size fits all type solutions.

29:59

We wanted to bring a tailor-made.

30:02

Solution for Podcast as you

30:02

have audiences around the world.

30:08

So we focus on communication. We focus on our relationships with sales

30:09

agencies around the world, and really the

30:15

idea is just a tailor-made solution for

30:18

professionals. And how did you two guys meet?

30:21

Hi, Dave.

30:22

So myself and Pasco, we're based in a lovely

30:23

little city in the UK called Bristol,

30:28

and it's very creative and it was

30:28

quite a serendipitous meeting.

30:31

We met over a cup of coffee. We both run Podcast companies,

30:33

production houses, and we got talking

30:38

and eventually the relationship.

30:41

Progressed to a stage where we were

30:41

sharing an office and naturally in

30:45

these situations you get talking. And because our productions where

30:47

our businesses, where our means to

30:51

make money, naturally, a lot of the

30:51

conversations went towards the best,

30:56

the most efficient way to make money. And in that way at delicious

30:57

became a seed of an idea.

31:01

we'd start talking about,

31:01

could we do this ourselves?

31:04

Obviously, there are companies

31:04

out there that do it.

31:06

They've helped grow the pie, so to speak,

31:06

but we just wanted an agency to be much

31:12

more of a flexible, more transparent

31:12

option for us to make money in podcasting.

31:17

But we don't always want a contract that

31:17

ties all of our content into one platform.

31:22

We don't always want something that

31:22

provides programmatic, but not host reds.

31:27

We don't always want a platform that

31:27

we have to upload to their server

31:30

and they have control of the global

31:30

network and means to selling around

31:35

the globe in different territories,

31:35

especially in the us where a big

31:39

percentage of our listeners occur.

31:41

And so we started talking about this

31:41

idea of white labeling and meeting the

31:45

demands of professional podcasters that

31:45

want different things that don't tie

31:49

them down into long-term contracts. That give them the ability

31:51

to use other agencies.

31:55

We want to be a Podcast first

31:55

selling agency, which gives them

32:00

the best opportunity possible

32:00

to make money out of podcasting.

32:04

Because in my experience, Podcast

32:04

has got to this stage where.

32:08

The industry has matured and there

32:08

needs to be the best possible

32:13

chance for Podcast is to make

32:13

businesses out of their content.

32:17

Unless you're a big production company

32:17

or you're a big media house, or you

32:22

have a massive marketing budget.

32:24

It's just really difficult

32:24

to make money in podcasting.

32:27

And if you have a contract that ties

32:27

into something that doesn't give you

32:32

the best deal in terms of percentages

32:32

for sales, or doesn't allow you to

32:36

leave the contract, because another

32:36

options come up, then are we really

32:40

giving producers the best chance? Probably not.

32:43

So we saw this opportunity where

32:43

we were creating something that's

32:46

quite new to the space we have.

32:49

Different types of relationships

32:49

with different types of producers.

32:53

And we started on this journey probably

32:53

at the end of last summer and the traction

32:58

and the progress has been quite incredible

32:58

because truth be told when we're

33:03

talking to other producers about this.

33:05

They're as excited about it, as

33:05

we were thinking about it in the

33:08

first

33:09

place. Now if I'm a Podcast, how

33:09

do I get involved with you?

33:12

What do I do? What's the process? Do I have a bar?

33:14

Do I have to have, I have to have

33:14

10,000 listeners like a cost demand?

33:18

W w what's the process? I think

33:20

firstly, get in touch and we can, we will

33:21

chat to anyone and everyone.

33:24

Ultimately we have different tiers,

33:24

which enable us to work with different

33:28

size companies and individuals. Based on the type of show they have.

33:32

And we'll always just try and offer

33:32

transparent feedback really, in terms

33:36

of the bar, we, one thing we do is

33:36

international podcasts who have sales

33:41

companies in their own country, but

33:41

are not monetizing their UK or EU

33:46

listens we can offer to just often

33:46

that segment of their audience, but

33:51

equally people can join us in a more.

33:55

Exclusive manner in which we can

33:55

have, can look after all elements

34:00

of their advertising out, giving

34:00

them a host read solutions, as

34:03

well as spot had some programmatic. When it comes to numbers, we are at the

34:05

moment working with more premium loads,

34:10

the scale Podcast, but certainly with

34:10

our verticals, if the show works well

34:14

within one of our verticals we sell they

34:14

were more than happy to chat or help

34:18

them find the best solution for them.

34:20

Great. Now look, how do advertisers

34:20

get involved as well with you?

34:24

So many of them do email

34:24

directly, but also we are plugged

34:27

in with agencies across Britain,

34:27

but also we work very closely with

34:31

a lot of American Podcast agencies.

34:33

And so it's a mixture of agencies

34:33

working with us as well as

34:36

brands contacting us directly.

34:39

And we also plugged into

34:39

programmatic as well.

34:41

in the last few months we've

34:41

made a couple of key hires on is Craig

34:45

Eastwood, who has come from radio

34:45

works, who has a very experienced

34:50

background in audio, digital sales.

34:52

And also we've just hired Donna Meechie.

34:56

Who he basically was part

34:56

of the core team of audio.

34:59

Boom. And so in terms of podcasting

35:00

and digital sales, he's got a lot

35:02

of experience and context there. He also had a very senior role that

35:04

mixed cloud recently, and I call

35:09

them key hires because they have the

35:09

connections already in the digital space.

35:12

They have these relationships

35:12

where they understand the medium.

35:16

They understand what works

35:16

well for advertisers and they

35:20

have those relationships. And also they're great at explaining

35:21

that to advertisers and potential brands,

35:25

Pascal, and myself, where producers,

35:25

we understand the production side.

35:30

And obviously the

35:30

connection that Podcast is.

35:33

Can have with an audience. It's another skill to then have that

35:35

conversation with brands and understand

35:39

how valuable podcasting is to brands.

35:42

Because as well as anyone, Sam this kind

35:42

of intimate relationship that listeners

35:46

have with the person on Mike and you need

35:46

a special skillset to actually talk to

35:52

brands and understand that there's a

35:52

pipeline and there's planning and there's.

35:57

There's campaigns. And so those guys are key to

35:57

manage that for our delicious

36:01

David Pascal. Thank you so much. And good luck with adolescence

36:03

now, can you please tell us

36:06

where we can find you on the web?

36:07

Certainly the best way probably

36:07

is to go to our website, which

36:11

is adolescence.fm abolitionists.

36:14

For those who might be unfamiliar with

36:14

that word is a D E L I C I O U s.fm.

36:22

Otherwise you can reach out

36:22

to me and Pascal on LinkedIn.

36:24

We'll be more than happy to say hi.

36:26

I pronounce them a delicious when I

36:26

was doing the pod news podcast last week.

36:31

There you go. That just goes to show,

36:31

never listened to me. So Sam, what's coming up in

36:34

Podland for you this month.

36:37

So I've. Had an interview with a guy called

36:38

Adrian Fitzpatrick, who was the

36:41

founder and CEO of re incubate. They have a new software app called

36:43

camo and camo turns your iPhone into a

36:48

high definition video camera for use on

36:48

zoom stream yard, or any other videos.

36:53

It's great. It's about 40 pounds. I've been using it.

36:56

It actually does. Turn your camera into something that

36:57

makes you look half decent, as opposed

37:02

to the seven 20 P camera on your

37:02

very high end, very expensive Mac.

37:06

And the other interview I

37:06

had was with a guy called Dr.

37:09

Matt Borum and this is a fun app.

37:11

I've got a company called audible reality.

37:13

And what you can do is take your

37:13

Spotify tracks and you can remix them.

37:18

They're called vibes, and then

37:18

you can share your vibe with

37:21

friends so you can take famous

37:21

tracks and you can remix them.

37:25

Now, if you want to hear any of

37:25

that, you can catch them on Sam.

37:28

Talks. Technology very

37:29

nice. And I spoke with Ron bait long

37:30

from pod metrics, which is a

37:33

new company in the Philippines. They're working on new ideas

37:34

for ways Podcast can earn

37:37

revenue in Southeast Asia. And I'm hoping to get him to speak

37:38

at radio days, Asia, which has taken

37:42

a bit of my time at the moment. It's a big radio and Podcast

37:43

conference some great speakers there.

37:47

They've got some cheap tickets

37:47

available, still radio days.

37:49

asia.com is where to go for that.

37:52

And that's it for this week. If you've enjoyed your trip to Podland,

37:53

don't make it your last, you can subscribe

37:57

on all the major Podcast players or

37:57

visit our website at Podland dot news.

38:03

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38:03

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Or you can ask your smart speaker to

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news and pod news is where you'll

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find the links for all the stories

38:28

we've mentioned this week as well. Music is from ignite jingles.

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And I edited Podland on

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because I'm very old fashioned. Sam edited his interview on

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and sponsored by Buzzsprout.

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We'll see you in Podland next week.