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This week, the United Nations Conference of

1:24

the Parties on Climate, or as it's

1:26

better known COP28, kicked

1:29

off in Dubai. I pray

1:31

with all my heart that

1:33

COP28 will be another

1:36

critical turning point towards

1:39

genuine transformational action

1:42

at a time when already,

1:45

as scientists have been warning for so

1:47

long, we are

1:49

seeing alarming tipping points being reached. Over

1:52

the next week or so, leaders from

1:54

around the world, senior ministers, and officials

1:56

from 198 countries will come together. to

2:00

hash out deals and compromises

2:02

with the intended goal of

2:05

tackling the climate emergency. But

2:07

there will be one big

2:09

name missing from the attendees

2:11

list. President Joe Biden. Vice

2:14

President Kamala Harris will lead the

2:16

American delegation, including US climate envoy

2:18

John Kerry. Earlier this week, the

2:20

White House announced President Biden is skipping the

2:22

event. Biden pledged

2:24

to make the fight against climate breakdown

2:26

one of his top priorities. And so

2:28

folks, we've got to listen to the

2:30

scientists and the economists and

2:33

the national security experts. They

2:35

all tell us this is code red.

2:37

But the news of his absence from

2:40

this year's conference has frustrated activists. So

2:43

what message does it send to Americans

2:45

and to people around the world that

2:47

the president of the United States is

2:49

not going to cop? With US oil

2:52

and gas production set to

2:54

reach record highs this year, has

2:56

Joe Biden done enough to tackle

2:58

the climate emergency? And for

3:00

the second time in as many months,

3:02

has Biden angered enough younger voters that

3:04

many will abandon him? I'm

3:07

Jonathan Friedland, columnist at The Guardian,

3:09

and this is Politics Weekly America.

3:15

The climate crisis feels like someone's writing your future for you

3:17

and that you don't have an option and don't have the

3:19

ability to breathe clean air in

3:22

a sense because this is Jerome Foster, climate

3:24

activist who a couple of years ago became

3:26

the youngest ever White House adviser. I was

3:29

looking at like a landscape painting and a

3:31

lot of older people were thinking about it

3:33

and thinking about nature as a refuge in

3:35

a place for escape and where time feels

3:38

endless. But for young people, the environment doesn't

3:40

feel that way anymore. And as a young

3:42

person, I felt that very deeply and understanding

3:44

that nature felt like something that was a

3:46

ticking time bomb. And for like every moment

3:48

I had to grab onto because maybe it

3:50

won't be here next year. And that

3:53

is a very scary feeling growing up. And I think that

3:55

is what sparked my generation

3:57

to say that we can't live like this

3:59

anymore. Jerome's journey to the

4:01

White House started unusually with him

4:03

standing outside the building with a

4:05

placard following in the footsteps of

4:07

the likes of Greta Thunberg. On

4:10

my first Friday it was pouring down raining

4:12

like it was flooding up to my ankles

4:14

and then right after I ended my strike

4:18

the sun came right out. At the time there

4:20

was only 10 to 20 young people that were climate striking and

4:23

after a few weeks I realised that this was something

4:25

much bigger than I realised and that it wasn't just

4:27

me that was feeling these emotions but it was a

4:30

large percentage of my generation. With

4:33

the fact that we were skipping

4:35

school we're saying our education is

4:37

on the line and that we

4:39

will forego our future and our

4:41

careers for making a statement

4:43

like this it allowed us to be able

4:45

to as a generation show the

4:47

world that we that the world has to do

4:49

something about this and has to do something with urgency and

4:51

decisiveness. So after striking

4:53

for over a year what

4:56

happened exactly in 2021 that brought you

4:59

inside the White House. During

5:02

the climate strikes during the the time in

5:04

which Greta Thunberg came to Washington DC to

5:06

join I had launched an

5:08

organisation called One Million of Us in which

5:10

we worked on the goal of mobilising one

5:12

million young people to register and to vote

5:14

by the 2020 elections and

5:17

we had an entire coalition with other

5:19

organisations in which we stopped at every

5:21

presidential stop on every presidential candidate's way

5:24

through the country and said you need

5:26

to prioritize climate justice and from that

5:28

we were able to mobilize over 1.8 million

5:31

young people across the country to turn

5:34

out and to really show that we

5:36

will put our votes where

5:38

our words are and not

5:40

even two months later I got a call from the White House

5:43

that they wanted me to be a part of the

5:45

Environmental Justice Advisory Council and I was 18

5:48

years old and I was just leaving

5:50

a class from college and they said

5:52

we would actually be working to provide

5:54

recommendations to the whole of government of

5:56

all federal agencies and working on what

5:58

we could do to to advance environmental justice

6:01

in a way that isn't just about renewable

6:03

energy, but it's also about looking and restoring

6:05

the past damage that the climate crisis has

6:08

already wrecked. And it was

6:10

something we've been fighting for since 2016. I

6:13

feel like for young people to actually be taken seriously

6:15

in political spaces. And for us to not just be

6:18

something that they mention in a speech, but something that they

6:21

have accountability to within an

6:24

advisory council like this. And it

6:26

was a moment of joy and also a moment of

6:29

hope in a sense that we could do a

6:31

lot more. What a phone

6:33

call to get. And in that moment, you

6:35

became the youngest ever advisor at the

6:37

White House. As you've said, you were just 18 when that

6:40

call came. Just briefly explain to us

6:42

what that entails, what work you

6:44

do on the White

6:46

House Environmental Justice Advisory Council.

6:48

And we should obviously stress here that you're

6:50

not speaking to us today as a spokesperson

6:52

for the US government. These are just your

6:55

own views. But what does it mean to

6:57

be on that council? What work do you do? Yes,

7:00

I cannot speak on behalf of the White House

7:02

itself, but I am a private

7:04

citizen advisor. And what that means is the

7:06

first month that I joined in, I think,

7:09

March of 2021, we

7:11

were working on the Justice40 initiative,

7:14

which means that 40% of investment benefits go

7:16

to frontline communities and disadvantaged communities that are

7:18

being impacted by the climate crisis. So

7:21

what that meant is that we had to

7:23

do a lot of structural work to make

7:25

sure those 40% investments. When those

7:27

communities were, you

7:29

could actually identify what a disadvantaged community

7:31

is on a very concrete level. And

7:35

we had very short timelines of sometimes two

7:37

to four weeks where we had to write

7:39

a 40-page recommendation sheet. And it turned into

7:41

100 pages in referencing and then talking to

7:43

friends who were in the environmental movement about

7:45

what recommendations we should send and

7:47

how they should send that money to communities so that it

7:49

actually reaches them. And

7:52

it was sometimes nine hours

7:54

of meetings that we'd

7:56

go to. My professor was very mad at

7:58

me for not going to... class, but it

8:00

was something that I thought was very important to

8:03

do. And basically every

8:05

month from that March of 2021, we've

8:07

been sending in recommendations on

8:09

what they should do with regard to funding

8:11

communities, making sure that they aren't investing in

8:13

and continuing to perpetuate the climate crisis. And

8:16

people will have an image of being a White House

8:19

advisor. I'm sure you get this from friends a lot,

8:21

where they just assume you stroll into the Oval Office,

8:23

have a quick word with the president. Do

8:26

you ever speak to President Biden directly? I

8:28

think your laugh is telling me that no,

8:30

you don't. I've never had a

8:32

conversation with President Biden. A lot of our work

8:34

is just the paper. Like a lot of our conditions manifest

8:37

their ways into paperwork

8:39

and what the president will see and review. And

8:41

we'll be on the kind of first paragraph that

8:43

he'll read about what actions we recommend he should

8:46

take. Through that work that you're

8:48

describing though, that things do get down.

8:50

So let's dive into that a bit.

8:52

Some of the policies that the Biden

8:54

administration has implemented.

8:57

Can you just give us two or three

8:59

examples of actual policy changes you and your

9:01

colleagues on the council have actually implemented made

9:03

happen, thanks to being there? One

9:06

thing I can really point to is the climate

9:09

and economic justice screening tool, in which I talked

9:11

about the Justice for the Initiative, in which we're

9:13

making 40% of investments go to frontline communities. We

9:15

have to first identify what is a

9:18

disadvantaged community so that federal agencies can't

9:20

distort that. So it continues to go to

9:22

wealthier and wider communities that have historically received

9:25

funding for the climate crisis to

9:27

be able to be insulated from it.

9:29

Really what it's supposed to be is that

9:32

if you log onto a website, you can

9:34

see in your zip code where the funding

9:36

is going. There's more examples of that within

9:38

how we've asked the federal government to

9:40

cap old oil wells that have been in indigenous and

9:43

in black communities that have been sitting there for sometimes

9:45

50 to 70 years. We're

9:47

also been working with communities on

9:50

making sure they have cleanup projects

9:52

within military industrial sites, which have

9:54

had chemical spills in communities at

9:57

highest risk of cancer because of

9:59

the government. lack of care for

10:01

their cleanup and caring for the

10:03

environment. And

10:11

what's fascinating here is that in what you're

10:14

explaining there that is environment is as you're

10:16

defining it in the there in the White

10:18

House is not just a matter of bringing

10:20

down carbon emissions it touches on all these

10:23

other kind of justice issues including poverty including

10:25

as you said discrimination with you know minority

10:27

areas that have been less well-served but a

10:29

lot of attention has gone on big policies

10:32

like for example the Bill that Better

10:35

Act and famously the Inflation Reduction Act.

10:37

The Inflation Reduction Act is also the

10:39

most significant investment ever in

10:41

climate change ever. Lower

10:47

utility bill, taking an American

10:49

job, leading the world to a

10:52

clean energy future. These are the

10:54

big flagship pieces of legislation of

10:57

the Biden administration and several of

10:59

them have incorporated elements

11:01

to address the climate crisis.

11:04

And Joe Biden himself talks about them a lot

11:07

in that context. Can you give us just a

11:09

couple of examples of how those big set piece

11:11

pieces of legislation particularly the Inflation

11:13

Reduction Act have helped in terms

11:15

of climate and environment? Thinking

11:18

about the climate crisis in three main ways of the

11:20

past, present and future is something that's very crucial in

11:23

the work that we do. And understanding that when we look at

11:25

the future a lot of what the

11:27

legislation like the Inflation Reduction Act and the

11:30

other big legislations like that do is oftentimes

11:33

in tackling ways in which

11:35

we can decarbonize our

11:38

existing infrastructure and

11:40

giving subsidies for people to be able to

11:42

transition to electric vehicles and speed up that

11:44

transition to reach a very

11:46

equitable timeline in which it

11:48

is realistic for us to be able to reach that 1.5

11:51

degree target that we must reach. And

11:53

that's the future aspect of it. But

11:55

within the climate crisis and understanding solutions to

11:58

it we have to think about the past

12:00

and the present. And that for

12:03

us to have gotten here as a society,

12:05

we had to have certain mechanisms in our

12:07

economy that allowed us to be able to

12:09

prioritize the

12:11

exploitation for profit over

12:14

the existence of nature. And

12:16

we've come from a society

12:18

in which slavery was the beginning

12:21

mechanism in which we thought about

12:23

exploitation, where we could think we

12:25

could exploit people and cultures limitlessly

12:27

with no cost. But now we're

12:29

explaining nature limitlessly and thinking there's

12:31

no cost and thinking that the

12:34

forest is only valuable for the wood that

12:36

it produces, but not for the oxygen that

12:38

it gives us. And thinking

12:40

about that the world has something greater

12:42

than an economic value, but a social

12:45

and health and wellbeing value that we

12:47

don't take into account often at all.

12:49

It's about rebuilding the communities that have

12:51

been impacted by natural disasters. And the

12:54

federal government has done nothing to rebuild

12:56

them in a meaningful way. And

12:59

indeed people talk about the fact

13:01

that the Inflation Reduction Act invested

13:03

or invests around $340

13:06

billion in investment and tax

13:08

breaks, which could meant

13:10

to make the USA world leader

13:13

in making the stuff that leads

13:15

to renewable energy and

13:17

clean energy. And so that's, you

13:19

know, many people say that's a

13:21

game changer in the business of

13:23

getting the whole world into cleaner

13:25

technology. Now, what about those decisions

13:27

that the Biden administration has made that

13:30

maybe you don't agree with? I'm thinking here

13:32

about, for example, the Willow

13:34

Project and just explain to our listeners what that is

13:37

and why that was something you wished had

13:39

not been passed. Yes, so the

13:41

Willow Project is a project that President

13:44

Biden approved earlier this year that would

13:46

be equivalent to increasing the

13:48

US's emissions by 4%. And

13:51

with the US committing to getting to

13:53

net zero within the next few decades,

13:56

it is completely counterintuitive to their

13:59

actions. And the oil product has

14:01

been the largest oil and gas leasing on

14:03

US federal land. My strong inclination

14:05

was to disapprove of it across the board.

14:09

But the advice I got from council

14:11

was that if that were the case, I

14:13

may very well lose in court and

14:17

lose that case in court to

14:19

the oil company and then

14:21

not be able to do what I

14:23

really want to do beyond that. There was

14:25

a massive backlash. If young people using social

14:28

media to basically state why

14:30

they are mad about president Biden continuing

14:32

to be on the side of fossil fuels

14:35

and only really paying lip service and

14:37

giving cheap talk to what he promises

14:39

to do. There's a massive

14:41

groundswell of people on TikTok who showed their concern.

14:43

And then in the council, we said, why don't

14:46

we use that power and send the letters to

14:48

the president? This isn't what we should be doing.

14:50

We should be changing our actions and we should

14:52

be changing that status quo, not continuing in ramping

14:54

up, going into that with the fossil industry that

14:57

has led to a decrease

14:59

in the size of the Willow project,

15:02

but we don't want that. We want to complete

15:04

an utter reversal of their action to permit this

15:07

oil and gas project, because it's so insidious

15:09

in thinking that you can have it both

15:12

ways in which you can go into the

15:14

fossil industry and then go and make a

15:16

speech about how the climate crisis is distorting

15:18

entire communities. You have to be on what side? And

15:21

the question to Joe Biden is what side are you

15:23

on? And what do you make of this decision

15:25

by Joe Biden not to attend COP28

15:28

in Dubai? Of

15:30

course, other U.S. officials will be there.

15:33

We know that there'll be attending meetings,

15:35

there'll be giving talks, but not the

15:37

president himself. And we've yet to see

15:40

an official explanation as

15:42

to why he's not going. There have been some

15:44

rumors that it's because he needs to focus on

15:46

the ongoing conflict in the Middle East. But

15:49

then there's another adviser saying that wasn't the case. Whatever

15:51

the reason to you, Jerome,

15:54

how does it look that Joe Biden is not going

15:56

to be there? It's very disappointing

15:58

for the- US president

16:00

who has is representing a country that

16:02

has historic responsibility for decarbonizing because they

16:05

have been the largest emitter for so

16:07

many years, even though the second largest

16:09

emitter, they have been the first for

16:11

so long. And I

16:14

feel like it's a moment of understanding

16:16

that he has a responsibility

16:18

at COP 28. Would it ever

16:20

lead you this decision would ever lead you to

16:23

say it's best for you to resign your place

16:25

on the White House Council? No,

16:28

the White House Environmental Council

16:30

is very nationally focused. And

16:32

I think the US has good intention

16:34

within the individuals that work within

16:37

the country. And I think actions

16:39

like the Willow Project and him not attending COP

16:41

28 and him continuing to lease oil

16:43

and gas, that is something

16:45

that we have to continue to fight against. And if

16:48

we're not in these rooms, then we're back at the

16:50

position which we're quite striking in front of the White

16:52

House and begging for them to listen to us. But

16:55

now we have real kind of leverage to be

16:57

able to demand change. That is

16:59

something we haven't had before. I think

17:01

that is why I have to continue

17:03

pushing, continue to be loud and aggressive

17:05

within our ask for them to really

17:07

be the climate president like he said he will

17:10

be. It's shaping up that he isn't being that

17:12

if he continues down this path. Our

17:19

focus on this podcast is all in the politics

17:21

of these things. And there is

17:23

real politics here because a crucial

17:25

constituency in Joe Biden getting elected

17:28

in 2020 was young

17:31

voters. Young voters may in some ways

17:33

made the difference. And yet

17:35

there's research now from the Pew Research Center

17:37

polling of Americans. Taken

17:39

earlier this summer before the blow, as it

17:41

may be seen of this decision not to

17:44

go to COP 28, where a

17:46

majority of Democrats age between 18 to 29,

17:48

that's right, the group that you fall into, saying

17:51

that the Biden administration could be doing

17:53

a whole lot more on climate change

17:56

as an issue. One

17:58

suspect they will now say that in even bigger

18:00

numbers now that he's staying away. In terms

18:03

of the political price that the

18:05

president will pay for some of

18:07

these decisions, like choosing to

18:09

stay away, Jerome, what do you think? Do you

18:11

think this decision of

18:13

the president will ultimately hurt him? And

18:16

I mean it particularly in terms of

18:18

your age group. This

18:20

will hurt his political ambitions

18:22

because young people are

18:25

very keen to understanding that it's

18:27

not just about giving a

18:29

speech, it's about the actions that he makes. And

18:32

it feels very hurtful

18:34

for our generation. It feels like it's a deep cut because

18:37

we put our trust and we put our vote into him.

18:39

A lot of us went into the first time like myself

18:41

in a president that said he would do something. And

18:44

this is a heavy political toll

18:47

because he should be doing a lot

18:49

more. All their calls to actions have gone

18:51

ignored and they continue to go

18:54

ignored even though he had

18:56

countless years to do something. I think

18:59

over this next year we'll really see what

19:01

happens and we'll see that he must fulfill

19:03

in his promises. I think that's the one

19:05

thing that any president must do is fulfill

19:07

their promises and give the people

19:09

a sense of assurance that he has

19:11

their back. And young people don't feel like

19:13

that at the moment. I think that is what has to radically

19:15

change is him showing

19:18

some authenticity within his actions. We

19:20

mentioned on the podcast a couple of weeks back

19:22

that he was paying a price with younger voters

19:24

for his position on the current

19:26

Middle East conflict. You've now told us why

19:29

there is a price to pay for not

19:31

seeming to do enough on

19:34

the climate. Is it your sense that

19:36

there will be enough younger voters disenchanted

19:38

by all this that

19:40

they will even consider, well

19:42

you tell me, but voting

19:44

Republican backing potentially Donald Trump

19:47

or someone like Jill Stein who ran in the past

19:49

for the Green Party. There are other third-party

19:52

independent candidates, Cornel West. Do

19:55

you see younger voters not just perhaps staying

19:57

at home and that could cost Biden dearly.

22:00

Next by the producer is Daniel Stevens,

22:02

the executive producer this week, Max

22:04

Sanderson. I'm Jonathan Friedland. Thanks

22:07

as always for listening. This

22:14

is The Guardian. This

22:24

episode is brought to you by Progressive.

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at scalp.health. That's

23:30

scalp.health.